225: Programming Tips for Multiple Module Replacement on Stellantis Vehicles

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Hey, what's going on?

Automotive world Welcome to another episode of the automotive diagnostic podcast.

My name is Sean Dipping.

I'll be your host once again for today's episode.

Thank you so much for joining me.

I got another case study here for you today, along with a helpful tip when programming modules on Dodge, jeep, ram, fiat, stalantis whatever you want to call it vehicles nowadays, especially when replacing multiple modules at one time.

We'll get into that.

Before we start, I do want to give a shout out to a few different people and an organization that is the Florida Auto Care Alliance.

Last weekend I was down in Orlando and I presented my first professional level full length class.

Right, I've done stuff at the college.

I've done tech talks where it's 15, 20 minutes for a presentation, but this is a full three and a half hour class and a really cool experience.

I was super nervous.

I think I got into the swing of things after about five 10 minutes, but it was really cool to get an opportunity to present and share some material with my peers.

That was really fun.

But the event was awesome too.

They did an excellent job of putting it on and got to meet and hang out with some awesome people Notable.

We went out to dinner on Saturday night Alan and Edwin they're from down in Miami and it was fantastic to meet those guys.

They were a riot and really, really cool guys too, so I'd like to give a shout out to them, but it was a really great experience.

So, if you're in the area where you're considering training, hopefully they're going to put this on next year.

This was the first version of this exact event put on, but I see some big things in the future, so definitely would recommend it if you're looking for some training in the Florida area.

Anyways, with that out of the way, I'll get into the case study here Again.

This is interesting enough on the vehicle and I'll get into why.

But then also, I want to share something that I feel is a really helpful tip and if you're not aware of it or you haven't utilized it to its full potential, this is a great, great resource that's available within Service Info.

Right, read the surface info.

Maybe I could just say that would be done, right, and we always read every single detail of service information, don't we, all of us?

Yeah, okay, anyways, here's the vehicle.

It's a 2016 Dodge Ram 2500 with a 6.7

liter diesel.

Customer of mine actually purchased this from an auction and it was a flood vehicle, and he had called me on this, actually texted me a few times saying, hey, I got this flood truck and I need you to make me a key for it.

And when I bought it from the auction, it didn't come with any keys.

And he did mention it was a flood truck and I'm like, all right, I can make a key for it, but if this was a flood truck and, of course, depending on how high the water got up in this thing, you're going to need a lot more than a key.

He's like yeah, I kind of figured, but I figured I would get a key program to it and then kind of sort out what I needed from there so I could at least turn the ignition on.

I'm like, dude, you're probably not going to be able to turn the ignition on.

I went to a Honda CRV earlier this summer.

That was the same situation.

They just and they didn't inform me correctly on the phone they just said hey, can you come make a key for this Honda CRV that this customer bought from the auction?

And I get there on this thing and, of course, completely dead.

And you jump the battery and it's still completely dead.

And I'm looking in this thing and there's that little area in the instrument cluster where the actual gauges are, and then there's a like plastic film.

Right there are casing over the cluster that like houses the cluster and there was sand Inside that area.

And I went talk to him like, um, I think this is gonna need more than a key, guys, and that was a flood vehicle too, it's like.

And the customer ended up not being interested in sorting through all of the like everything.

I mean the water was up to the instrument cluster.

This thing was completely underwater, so Start with everything and we'll go from there, right, so kind of the similar situation in the Dodge.

He's like well, how do I know what to replace?

Okay, well, that's you know, you bought the vehicle.

You kind of have to figure that out.

But I'm like you should figure out how high the water went in this thing, because that's gonna determine what components were failed and sounded like this.

That's got all the way up to the dashboard.

Based on, you can see remnants of it in the metal of the vehicle.

Right, it'll start to rust the those interior metal components very quickly because they're not protected by anything and that it was clear that the water was pretty high up on this thing.

And so he's like okay, well, I'll start to sort through stuff, see what I can find.

He's like what important modules should I be looking for?

As far as you getting a key working for this thing, I'm like well, you got the body control module for sure, that's gonna be exposed.

Based on what you're telling me, I was like you need to check out the RF hub on this which is behind the rear seat, and the keyless ignition node in the dash as well.

Although that's not a module Per se, right, there's no programming it does relay the key data to the RF hub, so that's gonna have to work.

And then I told them to I'm like, hey, just understand, before you get into this, a flood car, especially one that's Really deep underwater, is gonna need way more than you think it needs off of the initial inspection, right, and maybe we get this thing to a point where a key is up and you're gonna find 20 more things that need to be fixed.

You're gonna find connectors all over the place that are corroded, all kinds of issues.

And I just was telling them this to let them know, like, hey, I don't know how much you paid for this thing, but it might not be worth Sinking the money into because it's gonna be an endless avalanche of different problem after different problem when it comes to the electrical components in the car.

But, hey, you can lead a horse to water, right, and I told them what I was gonna tell them.

I'm not gonna diagnose the thing for him over the phone.

I gave him the helpful information that I could, and I don't hear back from them for about three months.

Actually the original Conversation happened a while ago.

Well, just recently I get a call from them like hey, remember that dodge?

Yeah, okay, well, I think I got everything sorted out.

I replaced the BCM, I replaced the keyless ignition node, I replaced the RF hub, I replaced a bunch of connectors and wires and fuses and All right.

And this guy's pretty competent, like obviously I don't know the decision-making process that went into purchasing this vehicle and taking on this project, but when it comes to the repair and Getting vehicles back to a working state, he's done a pretty good job.

And I've worked with him for a while, done a lot of key stuff for him and module cloning, that sort of job that he's just not able to take care of.

But it's like, alright, well, I'll come out there, we'll give it a shot, as no guarantees I'm going to be able to do this.

Now I know I'm gonna have to provide a key for this thing because he doesn't have one.

So you know, we're kind of starting with an all keys lost.

But here's the other part of it is, we've got a brand new BCM and we've got a brand new RF hub.

Now, if all of those communicate and function correctly, which is an if.

I'm starting to think as I go out there, I'm trying to think on a 2016 Ram.

Have I done something with both new key?

Well, with all new keys new BCM and RF hub on I should mention, I asked them, I have some more than once.

I'm like is this new?

New or is this junkyard new?

Is this used?

New because I don't know what it is.

I, you know, we do a lot of module cloning, programming, whatever, and when shops call and they say, hey, I've got a new blank, that doesn't always mean new, I'd say a lot of the time it means that it's used.

And so I will say on the phone is it a new?

New?

And I was like, yeah, it's a new, new.

And I get there and it's got you on care writing.

I'm like you said it was new, well, it is new to the vehicle.

I'm like no, no, no.

And that's been a frustration of ours that my admin guy is fighting through now as he's answering the phones, but I was very clear with him Like these are brand new from the dealer.

He's like, yes, brand new from the dealer RF hub and BCM and keyless ignition node and I'm going to be supplying the key for this thing.

Okay, cool, we can at least give this a shot and see what happens.

So I get to the vehicle and again I'm kind of thinking about, like, where do I start with this?

Do I program keys first?

Do I program the BCM first?

Do I program the RF hub first?

Who's going to communicate?

How's this going to work?

And I hadn't been in that situation exactly like this before.

Okay, where do I go?

This is kind of where I want to point out something really useful in service information that pertains to these Stalantas vehicles.

So we'll just go with that.

I usually say Chrysler, that's my default.

But whatever, this is a RAM in service information, and this has been true for a number of years.

This goes way back into the early 2000s.

I don't know when it started exactly, but for a lot of different Chrysler vehicles, if you are replacing multiple modules or you're replacing a module and keys at the same time and there's a lot of different reasons and scenarios where you might be in that situation it is important to at least take a little bit of time to consider which module you should do first and in what order you should program the new things

in, not only for successful programming, getting the vehicle working, but there's, in a specific situation, a potential where you could create a scenario where now you've got to get another used module for one reason or another.

Right, and we want to avoid that.

So, within service information, this is something that I've utilized before, but sometimes there's just so much that we're trying to remember I kind of forget this is there.

If you go into whatever service information you're using and I was using all data for this one, but you could do it in Identifix, I'm sure this obviously comes from the factory service information.

It's probably in Mitchell too If you go to the search bar of whatever service information you're using and you search Replacement and Programming Order Guide, it's going to come up with an extremely useful chart that is going to break down hey, if you're replacing these components, here's the order that you're going to program that man or set them up in, here's the steps

that you take based off of what you're replacing, okay, and this is set up on a chart and so in the vertical column it's gonna show you the module right.

So for this particular 16 RAM, in the vertical column on the left side of the chart, I have RF hub, bcm, fabex which are the keys and PCM.

Okay, so, four different components I wouldn't say modules, because the keys aren't modules, but four different components that you're replacing.

And the horizontal chart across the top is a series of conditions, numbered one through 15.

Okay, there are 15 different conditions.

Now here are the conditions.

If you go down the chart and you look over, it will say new or existing for each of those four components.

Okay, so, for instance here, right, our vertical column, rf hub, bcm, fabex, pcm.

Condition one is we are putting a new RF hub in, but the BCM, the FABEX and the PCM are existing, meaning we're not changing them, they're original, the vehicle, okay.

Condition two RF hub is existing, it's original, the vehicle, but the BCM body control module is new, the FABEX and the PCM are existing.

Condition three RF hub and BCM are existing.

We're putting new keys in, but the PCM is existing as well, all right, and so on and so forth.

Right, any combination of new component replacement that you can imagine and I mean this is useful too for just replacing keys, or just replacing a PCM, or just okay, whatever you're replacing, you can look at this chart.

But here's where this really becomes useful is if you're replacing multiple components at the same time.

Okay, now, if you go down the list from each condition, it is gonna give you an order of what you need to do as far as steps for setup and programming, depending on what new components that you are putting in this vehicle, and this really changes.

I mean, look this up and look through the chart and depending on what new components you're putting in, in what combination, this completely changes the steps that you're gonna take to program into the vehicle, right.

And so when I pulled this up, I'm like, oh, okay, sweet, this is what I do.

I just follow these steps.

Okay, and I'm looking at this chart and here's what I have on this vehicle new RF hub, new body control module, new keys and an existing PCM.

Right, he didn't replace the PCM and I guess that didn't get wet.

I mean, it worked.

So I didn't look at the module myself here, but the PCM was functional.

But with those three new modules and a functioning PCM, I am in condition 14, so I've almost gone to the end of the chart.

And if I go down from condition 14, with those three new modules and an existing PCM, I have four steps that I am supposed to run the first one.

It says run restore vehicle configuration and it should enable this is in parentheses it should enable PCM and RF hub.

Okay, meaning that our restore vehicle configuration is somehow pulled from the data in the PCM or it's using the data in the PCM to pull it from Chrysler server.

However that works.

The next step is to program the keys.

The third step is, once the keys are programmed, run the restore vehicle configuration again to write the full configuration.

And then step four in the RF Hub run the RF Hub Replace function.

That's it.

Those are my four steps to do if I'm replacing these three components, which is exactly what I was doing Now.

I followed this.

I did it.

There was one additional step.

I had to remove the BCM from shipping mode, which is a function within the BCM.

Simple enough to do.

I'm using YTECH for this.

The other thing that we ran into was, after I ran the first run restore configuration, I tried programming keys in.

I wasn't able to.

I found I wasn't able to communicate with the RF Hub the RF Hub you should be able to talk to, even with the key off.

I wasn't able to.

This is what I was expecting when I got into this.

I'd be surprised if all of this works.

He's like well, hey, I got the RF Hub exposed because you told me that this might be the case.

Can we check to see if we got everything to it?

I can talk to my BCM, I can talk to my PCM.

I cannot talk to the RF Hub.

Sure, let's grab a test light and see what we got.

We had power, ground and comms.

We unplugged this thing and you could tell hey, the water's been in here.

We've got corroded terminals.

We pulled a little red I guess you call it a holder for all the pins out.

We cleaned out a bunch of green stuff.

The positive terminal was really spread out.

We took a pick, we pushed it together.

This isn't permanent fix, but hey, they'll work for right now.

Put this thing together and the RF Hub powers up, starts talking.

Actually, we had the key on.

At this point, the wiper started running and everything.

At this point I can continue with my process.

That was a little bit of a blockade, that, of course, this chart can't foresee.

But now we got the RF Hub online.

I actually ran the restore configuration which you have to do with Y-Tech.

I don't know of another tool that will do that, because this is different than a proxy alignment.

Aftermarket tools will do proxy alignments.

This is a restore configuration which pulls data from Chrysler's server or Stellantis' server to bring that vehicle back to the factory options based off of the VIN.

I run that even though I already did it.

I wasn't sure with the RF Hub offline if that made a difference.

I did that.

Then I was able to program a key.

I could communicate with the RF Hub which stores the key data I added in a new key.

Cool, I did exactly what it said.

I ran the restore configuration a third time.

Then I went into the RF Hub, ran the RF Hub replace function and that was it.

No, granted, this truck didn't start.

It sounded like it had no compression, but that's not my problem.

The keys were programmed, the remote worked, all of my modules that I was programming were communicating and it actually did crank over the engine.

The rest was on him.

He was happy, as a clam, to be to that point on this thing, because he said he only spent like three grand on this truck.

He's really hoping to get it together and sell it to some sucker, I don't know.

Anyways, the rest of it is on him.

Luckily I don't have to worry about that.

But that worked.

Would I have been able to get to that without this truck?

Probably, maybe would have been a roundabout way of me just hitting buttons seeing what happens.

Yeah, definitely that's how it would have been.

I've been there and I've done that.

I still do that from time to time.

But, man, this is a really helpful tool and I wish every manufacturer had something like this.

They don't.

Sometimes you have to sort through it yourself.

But if you're working on a Chrysler Salinas vehicle, check out this module replacement guide.

That's the name of the chart.

Again, when I searched in service information, I just do replacement and programming order guide.

That's definitely the way that you can find it in all data.

It's also under the programming and re-learning chart.

But yeah, really, really helpful.

So check that out and hopefully that'll get you through.

One thing I should note is if you're doing use control modules, you can kind of throw some of this stuff out the window.

The chart is based on you putting a new control module in place of whatever it's listing Not necessarily used, not to say it won't work, but the accuracy of the steps might be different.

You may have to, I'd say, in a lot of cases, especially newer stuff, you're going to have to do additional work in order to get this to happen.

And let's say, you're cloning a module.

Well then you might not have to do some of these steps.

So this is, of course, with new control module replacement.

But I found it extremely helpful for me today to use this on this particular vehicle and, even though I didn't hear it run, I was actually pretty impressed that we got to the point where it was.

Now I would not recommend getting into flood vehicles, man.

It is a disaster.

I think you're better off going with the lightning strike myself.

You could probably find all the components easier with the lightning strike as opposed to a flood vehicle.

Again, depending on the water level, man, you're replacing everything and if you don't, whatever you don't replace, you're going to have issues with it later.

So luckily, I'm up here in Minnesota and we don't get a ton of them, but they do filter through in the auction.

So here and there, but we don't get too many floods up here in the Midwest unless you live right on the river.

That's about it.

But other than that, just a lot of snow and rust to take out the vehicles and, yeah, sometimes rust can be bad, but not quite as bad as flood vehicles.

So that's what I wanted to share with you today.

Again, thank you everybody out there for listening to the show.

Thank you for everybody I met, get to hang out with at the Accelerate event in Florida Really cool.

Well, with that, all the way, let's get out there, start fixing the world, one card at a time.

225: Programming Tips for Multiple Module Replacement on Stellantis Vehicles

Dodge Ram

Honda Crv

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