The Porsche Cayman is a sporty car with the engine placed in the middle, which helps it drive really well around corners. It's like a smaller, more affordable Porsche that still feels fun to drive. People talk about it because it's a good mix of speed and control.
The Porsche Cayenne is a big SUV that drives smoothly like a comfy couch but can also handle twisty roads well. It's good for everyday use and fun to drive.
The BMW 3 Series is a small fancy car that’s fun to drive and feels fast. The M340 is a special version that’s even quicker and handles really well on twisty roads. People like it because it’s both comfortable and sporty.
The Porsche 944 is a sports car made by Porsche with the engine in the front. It was popular because it handled well and was easier to get than other Porsches.
D 90 rims are the original wheels that came on some Porsche 911 cars from the early 1990s. Many people change them to different wheels, but some think they look really good.
The Ford Taurus is a big car that many families used to buy because it’s roomy and comfortable. It’s a regular car you might see on the road a lot. People talk about it because it was very popular in the past.
The 3.6 liter engine means the engine has space inside its cylinders to hold 3.6 liters of air and fuel. This size helps decide how strong and fast the car can be.
The Porsche Boxster is a sporty car you can drive with the roof down, making it fun and exciting. It has the engine in the middle, which helps it handle well on the road. People talk about it because it’s a great mix of fun and style.
The Porsche 911 is a famous sports car that’s been around for a long time. It’s known for being very fast and having a unique shape with the engine at the back. People talk about it because it’s one of the best sports cars ever made.
EV crossovers are cars that look like small SUVs and run on electricity instead of gas. They are good for people who want a roomy car that is also better for the environment.
The electric vehicle market is about cars that run on electricity instead of gas. Sometimes more people want them, and sometimes fewer, depending on different reasons like price or how good the cars are.
The Porsche Panamera is a fancy car with four doors that’s built to be both fast and comfortable. It’s like a sports car that you can use every day and take more people with you. People discuss it because it’s different from Porsche’s usual two-door sports cars.
The BMW 1 Series is a small, stylish car that’s fun to drive and easy to park. It’s like a little sporty car that you can use every day. People like to customize it to make it look and sound even better.
LIVE
I'm recording I'm recording we're live Andy Gawnes.
James how I am a man not bad I mean it's like officially happy new year isn't it but we have spoken.
Of course we have yeah just a couple of weeks ago on the nine works podcast which I'm looking forward to talking to.
Can we not plug nine works within the first three seconds this is this is ridiculous I'm going to tell everyone about this kind of weird crush you're getting on least simply at this point.
Oh it's Andy to look at him with his little beard and his is his sz.
Anyway so much to talk about today I want to talk about that we want to talk about engine rebuilds we're going to talk about the box during Cayman platform what the F is going on with that it's all ahead in today's episode.
Welcome to Kerbin Canyon.
You teed me up perfectly there mate long longer pause than I was hoping for that's the beauty of editing I'm just going to cut that right out.
Yeah beautiful beautiful so it's good to see you if I'm honest I wish I wasn't doing this today why what's wrong with you.
Well I am supposed to be at this very moment in Tasmania tearing around the roads that make up the target Tasmania stages with my friends.
By Tasmania do you mean that place called Tassie that you and your mates refer to.
Yeah we're Australian mate we abbreviate everything.
Absolutely we got Tassie Rocco Choco what was the name of the mate you were talked about in the pod the other day.
Come on it was the phrase phrase please tell me you've got a mate called Dazz as well.
That would just really I do.
Of course you do.
Why aren't you in Tasmania.
So I've had well I've had some health issues to be honest and it's the joys of getting old and without going into any real detail it just meant I couldn't go.
So I had to play I was gutted and I made the call a couple of weeks back I thought you know what it's it's it's got to do with me just experiencing a lot of pain.
And it's particularly prevalent if I sit down for long periods of time and if you're going to be spending seven to eight hours a day in a 9-11 driving that's the exact setting that's going to create it so I made the call.
I made the call a few weeks out because I thought I'm going to spend a couple of weeks thinking about it and trying to decide if I'm okay to go or not and I thought you know what I'm just not I need to make the call now.
So super super disappointing but I'm sorry for you I'm sad I'm sad.
I've got two recommendations for you one sex when because at your age the bed is not helping you at all.
Recommendation number two you need a Cayenne as a daily driver that things like a sofa on wheels so you maybe could have participated in a Cayenne.
What do you know what I did consider I actually consider what in fact two things.
First of all the last time we went to Tassie my mate Sam took his Cayenne and dude on the tight twisties.
Yes he was not as quick as everybody else but on the open stuff he was out of there you've never you could not believe the way this guy was hauling a Cayenne around the roads of Tasmania unbelievable so massive.
I think he destroyed the bushings on all four corners of the car but still he had a cracking time but I did consider.
I did consider still attending but taking my dare I say my other German non Porsche car because that car is actually what that car is actually great on the twisties my BMW M340 it's actually super quick.
So I could have taken that but either way I the symptoms that I have I still have even when I'm in that car so no I had to make the call.
Well I'm glad you didn't do that that would be like one of my mates showing up to you know my Liverpool football club birthday party in a man United shirt.
We bury him in the backyard basically I'm glad you didn't take that whatever it is your other German car which I'm not going to mention.
But so you you organize your you organize your rallies using WhatsApp or a similar tool right.
I imagine you guys going to be sharing content and that sort of thing does that does that help you feel plugged into it even just a little bit or is that actually just you know not going to help because you'll feel like you're missing out.
Well we do yeah we do use WhatsApp and we create groups for you know whenever we're planning a rally and so yes theoretically it would be a good way to be sharing content but.
PJ who organizes the Tasmania trips is.
How should I say this without throwing PJ under the bus do it.
PJ under the bus he is savage he is savage so I think I messaged him and said listen mate I'm so sorry I have to pull out at this stage and then.
I was thinking I might I might jump on the chat and just tell everyone hey I can't come I go to the chat and it just says PJ has removed you gone.
No PJ you dirty dog.
Dirty bastard is so he was he like.
No he is known for being savage on the chat anytime anyone pulls out of a Tasmania trip boom they're gone and yeah I was I was on the receiving end but look thankfully actually I think.
I think everyone's just decided to keep sharing photos and the like just on the regular chat so I did see yesterday some some incredible shots from from the roads down there it looks like the guys are having a great time.
Actually I was going to ask is someone surely is set up a WhatsApp group including all of them and you but not PJ that would be the thing to do.
I can neither confirm nor deny.
Show him who's really the boss exactly exactly as things in your world.
Yeah pretty good it's been a long week I went to DC this week for a conference my boy Luke has been playing basketball recently and I'm his basketball coach.
He's had a couple of games and life's been full on but with all that usual stuff on top I've managed to spend a little bit of time in the garage.
I took my 911 out for a spin the other day we had a couple of days where the snow and ice melted away got out on the road.
Just man I mean as a 9-11 owner or Porsche owner day to day it's usually in the back of my mind and it gives me a certain level of satisfaction knowing that my dream car or equivalence closest I'm going to get to my dream car is sat in my garage.
But it's not until you get in it after being away from it for a few days or a few weeks that that realization of oh my God I've got this car and it's absolutely amazing and it's just as good if not better than I can remember.
I had a couple of days it just you know I'm just going to I've got a break for half an hour I'm going to get in that car and just drive circles for 20 minutes and then get back to it.
Yeah so I got in I got in the car a couple of times and then I'm planning for my next auto amateur video I'm going to do a session on or you know video on bore scoring.
And it's come up in a couple of different conversations recently my mate Patrick is going to give me his 997 and I'm going to get inside that with a new tool that I've got I've got a bore scope.
So I kind of just want to test out the bore scope frankly and see if it's any good good excuse to get inside the cylinders and bore scoring is like a topic you know particularly with the 996 is that I get asked about a lot.
I've never tackled that kind of job so that's going to be a fun job I'm going to try and tackle next week and then that'll be my March video sorted.
So amazing and can I just I need to make a shout out to the guys from Driver's Lager who sent me a merch I don't know what I'd call it care package this week.
These guys are so cool they've come up with this non alcoholic beer and there's so many non alcoholic beers I don't know if you if that's the case in the States but certainly here in Australia there's been a real real growth in non alcoholic beers and some are good and some are really bad.
Yeah these guys have developed this great non alcoholic lager and said hey let's make it about drivers because they're the ones who are going to have it and so they're all their whole branding everything kind of harks back to.
So historic motorsport it's just super super cool and they sent me sent me a bunch of stuff I'm wearing the drive Drivers Lager hat t shirt the bees great I actually had one last night after mowing the lawn and it was great so yeah shout out to those guys think nice nice.
Do you think this might be a silly question given that it's non alcoholic but do you think you get away with driving around drinking one of those just like you would a can of pop.
Oh in the car yeah does it look like a bear does it smell like a bear.
No it looks and smells like beer it's like if you have like a honey can zero or something it's kind of yeah yeah it's it's it's supposed to approximate having a beer and and and it does actually.
Yeah I don't mind them as a rule and these ones I love I think the guys have done a great job with the formulation because it is hard right it's difficult to get.
A non alcoholic beer to actually taste any good and some are some are bad or some just taste like they've they've disguised the fact that it's non alcoholic by also making it not taste like beer.
Yeah yeah just like something else so anyway these guys have done it these guys have done a great great job.
You know actually this is one for the audience if anybody has been pulled over drinking non alcoholic beer in their car let me know what the reaction was at the copper the pulled over was like what are you doing drinking a beer non alcoholic.
Surprise that was in an ad I think that was in an ad I think heineken did an ad for it.
Good old Heineken hey so a couple weeks ago we got to sit down with the nine works radio guys that was pretty fun right.
We did yeah we did I've been.
I've been hoping we were going to get an invite to be perfectly honest for a while dropping hits every now and again because I speak to Lee every once in a while and you know Lee as well.
I speak to Andy and I've dropped a few hints and then they were like yeah come on guys let's do this and it was great.
I really enjoyed it in fact I've listened to that pod twice maybe three times including the time I've listened to it on the way back from DC this week.
If you know if we blow our own trumpets I thought that was a great episode lots of great banter we tackled some some really interesting topics I like to.
Yeah same and actually it was great being let's say in the room with those two guys even though we were doing it digitally obviously because I love how they've both got a very distinctive style in between one another I think they feed off one another so well.
You know Andy Brooks is so casual and laid back really locked in on his opinions knows what he likes we certainly worked out we know what he hates including.
For us right but you know so he's got that view and then you've got Lee who's up for a laugh but also just has this encyclopedic knowledge of the brand and yeah it was it was good to try and to get involved with that it was great fun.
Yeah yeah definitely yeah you're right they are two very different people but they it just works it works really well kind of like how I'm the cool one and you're not and that plays off each other really well.
Okay so on the back of that I might might as well tell you guys that there was a WhatsApp group set up to organize this to organize this particular.
Swaray that we had on their podcast and honestly the level of control that James is trying to exert at this point he's trying to mount some sort of hostile takeover of nine works radio and as I said to Lee yesterday it's entirely possible he's going to try and take Lee's YouTube channel.
Mind you Lee did respond by saying that's okay you could do with your subscriber count so you did okay out of that but I know right yeah yeah it was but it was good fun it was good fun.
So on the nine works pod we talked a lot about Porsche design right that was really the the key topic that we were discussing and I was thinking about it in the in the week following because one of the questions that the guys posed was.
Is there a particular item at one thing in the Porsche world of design that that you think just really stands up as as something great and I thought about our answers to that question and first of all you didn't understand the question.
So that was a problem and then second of all it was afterwards I thought oh man there was so many other things I could have said because my answer was the was I think the rear tail light bar on the nine nine six C four S yeah which which I which I still think stands up but but I thought.
I did have some other thoughts but I wondered if you'd had the opportunity to a spend some time understanding what the question meant.
And be had come up with an answer.
Um.
Yeah I have reflected on that a couple of times because I've now listened to the pod a few times and you know still don't understand the question.
Yeah can you tell me it again.
No I think I would still stand behind my answer but I really like the way.
I think it was Lee was talking about his era in the 80s where the sort of the design language of Porsche started to really kind of evolve and at least pronounce itself.
Where you know the nine six four and the nine two eight and the nine four four rule kind of coexisting and the transactional cars were new but you could still tell they were Porsches.
I really like that answer so if you know if I'd have come up with that that would have been my answer.
Well mine on the question of kind of the specific one thing as I said I'd set that light bar and I was thinking about it over the week and I thought I love an underdog and something that I think does not get near enough credit and I really wish I'd set it because I think they might have appreciated this.
Is Porsches D 90 rims which came out on the nine six four they are the most underrated and they are the stock rim everyone.
It's the first thing everyone swaps out on their nine six four when they buy it immediately those wheels go really 100% they're also on nine four fours.
And what most people would do is swap them out for a set of cup ones which by the way also I just think of one of the most stunning design wheels ever I love those wheels but there is something about a nine six four on D 90s that I just think looks so good and my buddy Gerard.
Who also has a nine six four he's swapped out various wheels over the journey he's had cup ones he's had roof wheels but I love that car when he has it really beautifully stamped on D 90s it just.
It has this ice kind of sleeper look to it it's very very cool so I wish I'd said D 90s.
You know I don't think I've seen those on a nine six four before I've seen them on other models like non nine eleven models but yeah interesting.
Yeah like I said they are literally they're the most boring wheels I mean they look like they could be on a Ford Taurus but they're really quite lightweight and I don't know they just they just look they just look great.
Yeah I honestly can't get on board with you that's been.
No I knew you wouldn't I knew you wouldn't.
I appreciate you might as well start talking about Rikario seats.
Sorry what did they go bust in the end.
What seats.
Rikaro seats whatever they call Rikario did you just say what did I say Rikario.
Well what is it.
Rikaro what is it what are they.
You call yourself an enthusiast whatever the fuck.
Oh Jesus Christ.
This is why this is why this pods going to hell.
Yes absolutely and it's got nothing to do with the fact that we hardly ever get.
This is why I hardly get together with you.
I'll share some notes with you.
Well let's talk about notes.
What's happened to the really nice show notes on the letterhead that you send over.
Curb and Canyon and it looks really professional.
Now I've got a dig amount of a text message chain.
I mean come on man sit up straight.
Let's do this.
Cry me a river.
What do I get from you donuts and frosting.
You got this gold this gold.
Yeah do you know what it was.
I was lying there this morning and I thought shit we got the pod and I knew I had it in
the back of my head what what I thought we could we could discuss so I just quickly texted
them to you.
I promise you next time I will send over a care package with the Curb and Canyon letterhead
perfectly crafted show that the whole the whole bag and Kaboodle moment because this
is it and let's let's put this out there for the listeners who are loyal if nothing
else for sticking around waiting weeks and weeks if not months like last year for a
new episode.
I think we can do it.
I think we can do I think we can commit to one episode a month because that gives us
a couple of opportunities to bail if we you know somebody wants to sleep in.
I know we can do it.
I know we can do it.
Let's do it.
What you can't see is Andy giving me the finger over face high right now.
Let's do it.
Otherwise I'm going to replace you with Daz and then fras and maybe PJ.
I wonder what PJ has got to say.
Let's get him on.
Let's get him on.
Are you drinking Dr. Pepper Diet Dr. Pepper if you don't mind.
Come at me so let's do it.
Now let's do it one one a month.
I think we can absolutely commit to we're doing it here ladies and gentlemen on this
very episode.
We need to do one a month.
So you listen.
Is this the February episode or the March episode.
I guess it's going to be the March episode right.
It'll be the March episode.
So the next time we'll be out is September because that gives us a long runway because
we can wait till the back end of April to do one.
It's like hey it's been eight weeks.
Exactly.
Brilliant.
That's exactly what let's do it.
Let's let's let's let's commit to every four weeks.
Well like I tell you one thing to round out the the topic of the nine works pot and I
know we moved on slightly and talked a little bit about design which we can come back to
is I really am excited to see Lee get little Irish back on the road and like I don't know
like and you know just for a bit of inside baseball I suggested a little Irish video
for video the week which got knocked back just viciously by my co-host my co-host here
saying we should be selling I lovely t-shirts because we keep giving him shots.
Exactly it's getting too much and Lee I love you but you know.
There's something about there's something about his dedication to that car that really
hits me because you know I wasn't quite in his position but when I had my own 996 project
car and that new transmission I put in failed it was heartbreaking and then to discover
that the freaking engine casing and the block that's just absolutely absolutely devastating
and looking at how Lee's approaching it now in a completely professional way like stripping
the engine down figuring out exactly what's going wrong really intentionally thinking
about what the best rebuild option is I went on eBay and found the cheapest replacement
donor engine I could which didn't look like it had been in a train wreck and basically
rolled the dice.
That's what you did in Bluey.
That's that I mean not quite like that but yeah pretty much I got a donor engine I was
rolling the dice I got Porsche Minneapolis to not strip it all the way down but certainly
to give it a good look they checked the bearing they checked the seals they did sort of I wouldn't
say an invasive inspection but they they inspected it as best they could without fully taking
it apart but I was still rolling the dice that could have blown up straight away but Lee's
not taking that approach and I'm like I'm really impressed really impressed that he's
going.
So given you are the number one ticket holder of the Lee Sibley fan club can you tell me
what approach he is taking?
Well let's talk about it yeah I mean so he's talking to an expert I did not do that so
that's number one he's taken his car to a independent Porsche specialist with a guy who could probably
rebuild engines with his eyes closed he seems to really know his stuff and he's done a bunch
of these he took his engine out of the car together they stripped it down or at least
Lee was watching and holding the camera while the fella stripped it down they took like
everything down to the crank you got to see the inside of the cylinders you got to see
the timing chain you got to know almost with like 99.9 degree certainty of what the issue
was and it was a broken timing chain I mean as an enthusiast just to sit and watch that
for like I think it was half an hour 45 minutes absolutely fascinating I've seen the TV shows
where you see a Porsche get built sort of end to end and you maybe see 10 seconds of what
the timing chain looks like and you know you get a very little bit of insight into what
it looks like but that was popcorn for me just absolutely brilliant watching that video
watching him strip it down so that was one and then he's thinking about you know how
do we do we rebuild what I have do we just replace some of the parts that are broken
do we go and buy a brand new short block from Porsche do we do this do we do that multiple
options on the table Andy Brooks is helping him with all the parts list and spreadsheets
and he's got like you know hundreds of lines in the spreadsheet and he's looked at Porsche
genuine parts and aftermarket parts and the cost difference and there's a lot of planning
and thinking going into this and considering this is all free content by the way you know
which we've got to remember we're not paying for this content I think it's phenomenal so
yeah I am number one in the least simply fan club no doubt good job son and so if this
were you if it were your car and the timing chain breaks and grenades the engine what
and I want to pose this question to both of us what would you I suppose what would you
want to do in terms of rebuilding it and what would you realistically probably do well I
think I've probably answered that already because I was faced with a similar challenge
but the one thing I maybe didn't talk about is I think with Bluey I always knew at some
point I was going to sell it yeah or I was just going to move on and I didn't really
care you know how I sold it and who picked it up I just wanted to be done with it at
some point and move on so with that in mind putting 10 grand into a salvage engine that
gets you know checked out relatively superficially by the pros versus what Lee's looking at which
is you know anywhere from 24 to 30 grand in a full rebuild my decision definitely cost
was a massive factor in going cheap Lee wants to keep this car and like I think it had 180,000
miles on it he wants to do another 180,000 miles he wants this car for the long term you
know this might be sitting in a stable when he's 60 years old who knows so I think he's
approaching it the right way for him for me if that had happened timing chain blown and I was
looking at 25 30 grand I probably would have just moved on interesting so this is the part where
traditionally you would say and Andy what about you what the listeners might have suspected but
don't know is I'm like dealing with a really bad cold at the moment so so for once you sound as
nasally as me oh my god I'm not quite as I'm not quite as on the ball as I usually should be but
Andy what would you do that's a great question Jones I'm glad you asked thanks very much look I
mean the reason I posed the question to you on the basis of what would you want to do and what
would you likely do and I appreciate your response actually because I think you make a really good
point if the car I think the response largely depends on whether you intend to hold the car
long term as Lee clearly does or whether you intend to just get it back on the road and move it on
so obviously the decision you made with bluey that makes a hell of a lot of sense given the
plan was always to move the car on for me if it happened if I blew up little green well I mean
what I would want to do is create the engine over to Jeff Gam Roth that Roth sport and have him
build me a four liter four liter engine and ship it back and put that thing in there I would look
I would certainly explore the option of going to a 3.8 and actually rebuilding it as a 3.8
there's a lot involved in that and it is incredibly expensive but it could possibly budget for it
everything's apart anyway it's always going to be an expensive proposition to rebuild an engine
regardless so the kind of baseline cost and I've had some very preliminary discussions about
rebuilds and top-end refreshers and all that sort of stuff over the journey they the price list on an
air-cooled car adds up incredibly quickly as does the labor cost as you can imagine really yeah
yeah it's it's an extremely expensive exercise relatively speaking compared to water cool cars
or just in general I might make my reaction to that is if you look in the back of an air-cooled
car there's a whole load of space there's not a whole lot of stuff where you look in the back of a
water-cooled car it's like chock full of do you know what though it just seems to be more mass and
more it really depends on the age of the air-cooled cars because certainly the the early cars the
early 70s cars 60s cars yes that engine bay is there is a lot of space in it but if you look in a
964 it is an incredible exercise in Tetris the way they actually cram everything in it's yeah
there's a lot in there but it look either way I would this is what I would do I would explore the
option of pushing out to a 3.8 liter because I I would like to do that and yeah that would be the
ultimate goal but ultimately it would come down to budget and I would have to consider what is the
percentage leap in just doing a rebuild versus rebuilding and going to 3.8 liters if I could if
I could make the stretch I'd want to go 3.8 and I know I know that yeah there's a consideration
around the idea that that's gonna change the character of the car you know it's a 3.6 that's
how they came out of the factory and I get all that I understand all that but you know what the
kind of driving I do torque is everything and so to get the extra torque of a 3.8 I think would
just be unreal so that would be that would be my hope I'd probably just end up doing a 3.6 because
I couldn't afford the 3.8 but that's all on the presumption that you're gonna be into a little
green for life you're never gonna sell a car you're into that. Well I'd say into it for the
long term let's say yeah and okay yeah you know I mean you know me James I'm constantly considering
what's next and constantly thinking about do I sell a little green and get something modern
yeah I haven't done it yet though right I'm eight years in and I still I've still got the damn thing
and it's just it's it's in my blood yeah yeah well listen speaking as the number one Andy Gaunt fan
one make some more videos for fuck's sake the last rasp videos are needed and number two
I like that you're into little green for good I think that is one of the literally the most
attractive Porsches around it's beautiful absolutely beautiful the color the setup the wheels
maybe something to do with the photoshopping you do of your surroundings to make it look even
better I don't know what but that makes me very happy your number one fan I'm glad to hear it thank you
so we don't we don't do a lot of news on the pod but I want to kind of dig into something a little
bit it's news slash rumor whatever you want to call it right now we all know that Porsche have killed
off the 718 boxer and Cayman right and for a few years now they've been promising an all electric
replacement which was actually supposed to drop sometime in 2026 the launch of that has been anything
but smooth you've had battery supply drama you've just got this real challenge of slowing luxury EV
demand and Chinese EVs really flooding the market and and buyers really not embracing the idea of
an electric sports car right so it's thrown the whole program into chaos and and so much so that I
think Porsche have actually looked at it and said we we're not sure we can be profitable with this
right so now we're hearing that they've scrapped the EV only idea altogether and and gone back to
drawing board there's rumors of either there'll be a pure EV option but then there'll also be
an internal combustion engine option perhaps even a hybrid version we don't know it's all rumors so
far but the challenge is that this car has been designed from the ground up to be a pure EV
and that means you build the battery into the structure of the chassis right you're building
the battery into it so just trying to jam a an internal combustion engine or a hybrid system
onto that chassis that's not simple dare I say impossible let alone the fact that I'm sure at
this point they've invested in all of the tooling the factory layout the whole thing to actually
start production on this EV version so where does that leave us because Porsche Cayman and
Boxster are they dead are they stillborn are they just massively delayed because as a brand
I look I went into and I heard them talking about this on collecting cars I went into a
Porsche dealership two weeks ago and you've gone from this brand that is primarily and
fundamentally at its core a sports car brand but when you go into a dealership now you've
gone from having 911s and Boxsters and Caymans and then KNs and other things to now you have
one sports car surrounded by large SUVs EV crossovers and EV sedans it actually changes the
feel of the brand it's now a mobility brand that happens to have an iconic sports car in
the mix right this is a real problem for them so my initial reaction to this is surely this has
something to do with Porsche's financial results last year where they talked about you know an
80% reduction in was it either revenue or profit I think it was profit I can't remember which but
it was massive and it's you know it's like a fortune 500 company whose stock price suddenly
tanks you start selling your liabilities you know like entire divisions are just sold off and
everything below a certain line on a spreadsheet just like clear it out doesn't matter who's
performing well who's not you know I don't want to have a discussion about it get it off the books
I kind of feel like it's a bit of a knee-jerk reaction in some respects to that
um and yeah okay the EV market slowed you were thinking about going forward and putting
you know making these the boxer Cayman fully electric but there is a huge demand for combustion
engine vehicles and particularly the boxer Cayman I mean I'm a 911 lover but I know just as many
people who are passionate as passionate or more about the boxer Cayman line as the 911s
I just it doesn't make any sense to me I can't I just can't quite comprehend it but I think the
EV piece has got a big part of it but just kill the EV line continue thinking about um combustion
engine surely they must be thinking about that somehow how could we introduce but I've got two
other thoughts one is um why the fuck didn't they kill the Panameras if you're going to chop a bit
of the business out to make room you know and adjust financially or what have you kill the Panameras
who cares about the Panameras I think they're dead and I don't think they're selling very well
either I don't know are they officially dead because I keep seeing them on the road and they look
pretty modern sorry so just to be clear by killing them you meant actually take every existing one
off the road but you know what I could know like Panamera you know that that would be the product
line I would kill I can still configure a Panamera on the website I'm looking as we speak like just
get rid of those I mean at least make a choice between the Panamera and the Taken yeah great
and pick are you going to go hybrid or or full EV with one of those just take one of those sedans
off the table and and think about the Boxter Cayman um the other thing I'm wondering is
does this give Tobias whatever his last name is the new design chief does it give him something
to cut his teeth on because you can imagine coming into Porsche they're 9-11 flagship
their iconic design you got this super car guy who's come from Bugatti and Aston Martin maybe
they're absolutely terrified of him coming in and making radical changes to the 9-11 we need
somebody with his kind of skill set let's take Boxter Cayman off the table and let's give him
a mid-engine car to come up with and we'll call it something else I'm wondering maybe
is that the strategy giving him that to to sink his teeth into first okay so there's a bit to unpack
there right on on the business model component it's an interesting point I think the challenge
with all of this everything we're discussing is that in automotive worlds a pivot is slow right
these are these are you think about what has to go into a pivot like this you're talking about
everything from retooling factories going back to the drawing board on design then engineering
then testing over you know 18 months or so to actually make sure the cars deliver
everything they need to deliver it's it's a lot and so meanwhile you have this challenge where
the consumers are left waiting I I get why they made the move they did right I get why they felt
they needed to have an EV sports car play because the fear was we are Porsche if somebody does it
before us and better then we've we've not lived up to our our our brand promise so to speak I was
always concerned about the fact that they chose the Boxter and the Cayman to be that EV solution
because yeah because in my mind as you just said they are both enthusiast cars already
and if you look at the reaction from the media and well not consumers at large so much but certainly
enthusiasts when you look at the reaction from enthusiasts to the first slew of 718s that were
turbocharged four cylinders they yeah they resoundingly rejected the car because it just
didn't sound very good so if if if that's the case if we're that fickle and fussy about about
the car having to be perfect then how could they expect that enthusiasts were going to embrace
this EV version of it I think it was I think it was the wrong call again I understand why they
made it the other thing I think they couldn't have quite anticipated was their luxury EV sales
going off a cliff particularly throughout Asia Chinese models just flooding the market and
taking so much market share I mean there's a there's a brand I see here I can't remember if I think
it's Geely and their SUV looks like a cayenne coupe from the back it is it is really identical it is
literally as though they just copied it and well so it is an incredibly difficult time for them and
you've got all of a bloom who came out last year and said our business model which has served us
well for decades no longer works in its current form that's a that's a clarion call for massive
change right so yeah yeah and then to your final point around you know does Tobias come in design
a new mid-engine platform first of all I think I think they'd be mad not to continue the lineage
of Boxter and Cayman I think if you're going to have a mid-engine platform you might as well
continue that those those two nameplates because they're they're storied in their own right now
but the other problem is if he let's say let's say that the brief to him is do you know what
enthusiasts are worried about how much flair you're going to put on the 9-11 and I mean look the
truth be told we've just had a facelift on the 9-11 anyway I imagine that in the background
there's already designs being pinned for what the next 9-11 is going to be yeah but so if if they
said to him okay clean slate start on a new mid-engine platform whether we call it Boxter
Cayman or not that we're talking about six years and so again what happens in the interim
because suddenly they're just they're an SUV brand that makes an iconic sports car now you
know what I mean it just yeah yeah it leaves them in a real hole and and I think the challenge is
that it's just not that exciting you go into a dealership and it's like yeah cool there's the
9-11s but I always like seeing a oh wow there's the new GT4 or they've they've done a here's the
Cayman GTS or here's the Boxter Spider Cayman and Boxter not only create an overarching theme of
we are a sports car company but they create more opportunities for special exciting models
that we just don't have now it's just gone gone yeah well is this is this a worrying sign for
Porsche as a as a company long term it's why I keep talking about BMW on the pod
we're gonna need to find another brand to jump ship too soon yeah I don't know it's a
it's a head scratcher for me for sure and you know what's funny I'd literally just recently
got into a 718 for the first time the first ever Boxter Cayman I've ever gotten into in
Trove and really enjoyed it it's funny that I wanted to ask you about that because I think
have you ever have you ever sat in a 981 to the previous gen I tried to get in it I couldn't
get in it between the headroom and the space around the steering wheel just could not get
inside it even with the seat all the way back I'd love to hear from listeners because because I
always thought the 981 and the 718 the the fundamental cabin architecture was the same other than
you know some some cosmetic tweaks so that that's that's interesting what I was really surprised
about was how once I was in the car with the door closed the the cabin experience the look
and feel and the dimensions of it were pretty identical to my 991.2 they are very similar
very similar yeah like the everything from the positions of the like the armrest on the door
the amount of space I have for my shoulders the headroom the space around the steering wheel
the distance between the bottom of the dashboard and the top of your knees
the the the the amount of space when you put the seats all the way back
and I was even worried about maybe the seat being too upright you know because of the
where the cabin ends and the engine starts but I've had the seat in the sort of typical position
I would have the seat back in my 911 I was I was really really surprised and it was a manual
and I was able to drive it just really comfortably I've I've not driven I've driven a 718 GT4 I've
not driven the gts 4-liter Rocco I don't know why you've never offered me a go but that's on you
I'm fascinated by those cars I think they will become particularly as we have this moment right
now right where where there is some flux around the Boxter and Cayman platforms that
gts 4-liter seems such a sweet sweet spot yeah yeah it really does I hope they if they're not
going to continue the the Boxter Cayman line and and I think I was always a little bit uncomfortable
about the Boxter and the Cayman being the same you know Boxter slash Cayman whether you have a
convertible or not you know it's like keep them separate if they're going to be separate I really
do hope though that they fill that spot because you're right you know an SUV company with a sports
car that feels a bit weird for Porsche is that is that just is that just hyperbole on my account
like is that I don't think so I'm overstating it it feels that way two SUVs two sedans um I'm
missing anything and the 911 yeah you know I just does this play into it at all um I've seen hints
in media and I think you've said it you know a couple of times and uh I know my friends have
that um almost the Boxter Cayman was proving itself to be the better car in terms of you
know um ring lap times and um you know you start getting into the specifics of
thrust to weight ratio and feel of the car and you know um that yeah lap times and that sort of
thing that the Boxter Cayman was almost showing up the 911 in some cases I think I think Porsche
have always done a really good job at uh at nerfing the Boxter Cayman just enough
to keep it to keep the pecking order right and they and actually what I really like is that
towards the end of the 718 run they said do you know what let's let's actually give this platform
what everyone's always asked for let's give it the GT3 engine and and give people that experience
and uh you know still it's still still the Nurburgring times and all that sort of stuff
the 911 is still king and I think uh I think that to me it seemed as though they actually
finally got comfortable with the idea that you could make the Boxter and the Cayman the best
versions of themselves without having to nerf them and that wouldn't necessarily cannibalize the 911's
sales and and I'm glad I'm glad they did that and I don't know whether the whether the figures
support what I just said or not um I think there is absolutely space in the lineup for both
I genuinely do yeah and and I don't know I also think as consumers
look I'm not to go on a kind of boomer rant but I think as consumers we've let ourselves
start to perceive Porsche's non-GT cars as a bit pedestrian you know what I mean we get so excited
about GT3's and GT4 RS's and anything less it's like yeah it's just a base Carrera or it's just a
Carrera S those cars are still phenomenal absolutely phenomenal yeah and and for most of us
and for most of us in terms of our use case they are probably dare I say it better I don't know
as a 911 enthusiast I feel quite comfortable about my future but yeah you know my side of
Porsche's future but um yeah interesting I just I want to hear what's next like come on Porsche
that's it you see us all over the world asking like what's your strategy lay it out for us yeah
100% and that because that's the thing it's it's what's the next thing that we're gonna say oh wow
imagine seeing that on the showroom floor and I know there's talk of a uh a kind of ST convertible
you know speedster there's there's a there's a speedster thing coming apparently so that's cool
but what I think the problem with that is that right now the things to get excited about from
Porsche are the exciting new releases of cars we will never be able to afford nor ever be
able to get an allocation for them right so yeah I love that they're gonna do in the ST that's
really really cool but yeah like I say that's that's may as well be on another planet for me
whereas if I see oh hey there's a new Cayman GTS 4-Liter or they've done this new Boxster with a
4-Liter those sorts of things you say okay that's that's something that at some point I might actually
consider buying yeah that's something that could live in my future and therefore I can get excited
about it I can look at it in a dealership and think hey you know what maybe maybe that's maybe
that's where I want to head and we're missing it yeah yeah well it'd be interesting to know what the
like I say yeah just lay out the strategy and like what is their target market now
because you know we you and I think about cars and chances are we'll buy I don't think I don't
think I'm ever gonna buy a brand new Porsche ever even if it's the base Carrera I don't think I'll
ever buy a brand new one but they've they've got a profile in mind and you know I just I want to
know what the strategy is tell me I don't want to wait anymore just like what's the next Star Wars
trilogy gonna be for god's sake Disney just tell me tell me I'm not getting excited about anything
Disney has to offer on Star Wars yeah well look so I need to go and take some more day
quill because I am dying here let's do video of the week you've picked a relatively okay one for
us okay so all right I must confess on this that I've I'd seen this video a long time ago
and I loved the car and so this morning it features a 996 C4S and when we're on the
Nine Works pod the other day other than Andy Brooks who he's very strong in his dislike of the C4S
I was gonna say he's not he's not on board so this is for him the rest of us were really really
positive about the 996 C4S I must confess I've never driven one I've heard the driving dynamics
are a little bit but whatever I just think they look great so I'd seen this video ages ago
and I just love the car so I sent it to you this morning and then I did watch it afterwards and I
was like oh okay if I'm honest it's not an amazing video but it's a really cool car it is it's a
really cool car so it's a nice video it's a nice video it's a nice video let's not turn everybody
off it's it's just it's a minute or two long and I think the the first minute is actually just
the cold start and listening to it sat there and reverse out of his driveway and it sounds
absolutely exceptional I don't know I think I feel like it's running a fister because I've heard
it's very nice yeah I've heard I've heard C4S's 996 C4S with fisters before and it sounds a lot
like that it's interesting actually because the way this video is color graded is such that it the
car doesn't look guards red and I always thought it was Zanzibar which is kind of this great orange
color but I think that's just the color grading and it's funny because I'm just scrolling through
the comments and someone has actually said this is not guards red at Zanzibar so I'd love to know
if it's just the color grade or if it is that if it is a Zanzibar color because because that's
what I always loved about it the first time I saw it I thought that's what it was I mean
so just to give you guys a bit of a sense it is a red C4S with gold BBS E88 on it perfect stance
perfect sound you just see a lot of a lot of kind of rotation shots of the car a lot of beauty
shots some nice rollers it's not going to blow your mind but I think it's actually really nice
and I think the car looks and sounds stunning and I would I think that is one of the best looking
996's I've ever seen it's very nice it's a really nice 996 yeah and I like how we've you sort of
you know built off the all the 996 love we gave in the in the nine works part because we talked
about that a lot or at least I did so yeah the other thing I think which is going to get people
to go and click the link and watch this video did you notice the faux pas the driver made towards
the end oh he drives he blasts through a stop sign no yeah he just blasts straight through a stop sign
come on man I did I was watching at this point I thought hang on did he just run through a stop
sign yeah I noticed that straight away I thought I'm getting all thank you master great video of the
well gang thanks for checking in for another curbing canyon I apologize for my horrible
horrible nasal voice this week but it is what it is you have three kids and they bring germs into
the house and yeah the joy of young kids exactly but join us again soon because Andy we're going
to be recording April's part in the next couple of weeks and you know I'm gonna I'm gonna report
back because tomorrow morning I'm going to it's a big weekend in Melbourne it's the weekend before
the Formula 1 Grand Prix and every year on that weekend there is the most amazing Porsche cars
and coffee where they close off an entire street just really the city and it I don't really love
cars and coffees but this one is always really really great and I'm gonna go check that out
tomorrow morning so I shall I shall report back yes let's get some content from you come on last
rough video let's do it all right thanks gang cheers guys see you in the next pod soon see you soon
About this episode
The hosts dive into Porsche-related banter covering topics like engine rebuilds, the future of the Boxster and Cayman platform, and a famous 996 'Little Irish' engine failure. Andy shares his disappointment about missing a rally in Tasmania due to health issues, while James talks about his recent garage time and upcoming bore scoring video. They also discuss a fun collaboration with the Nine Works podcast, Porsche design, and a shoutout to Driver's Lager non-alcoholic beer. The episode blends personal stories, technical insights, and community updates with a relaxed, humorous tone.
Welcome back to Curb and Canyon! The podcast for Porsche enthusiasts made by Porsche enthusiasts who love talk all things Stuttgart and don't mind getting a little swear'y as they do it - but then what do you expect when you give an Australian and a Brit their own show and just let them have it...?!
Join us in this episode where we talk about a recent guest spot we enjoyed on '9 Werks Radio', the Porsche podcast we hope to be when we grow up, with Lee Sibley and Andy Brooks. We're also talking about the apparent demise of the Boxster / Cayman line of sports cars which is a shocking piece of news for many Porsche enthusiasts, we try to answer the question "what would you do if you're car's engine blew up?", video of week and much much more.
