Oil and Whiskey with Roadster Shop Mar 30, 2026

Buddy Hale & Crew of Type One Restorations

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Company

Type 1 Restorations

Type 1 Restorations is the restoration shop being discussed in the episode. For listeners, this matters because restoration shops often specialize in particular makes/models and have specific approaches to sourcing parts, authenticity, and workmanship.

Car

Buick Grand National

The Buick Grand National is a performance car made by Buick. The podcast mentions a specific one with a “split window” look, which is a distinctive design feature. It’s brought up because it was shown or discussed at a shop event.

Brand

VW

“VW” means Volkswagen. The episode is talking about restoring and building Volkswagen cars, which are popular with hobbyists and restorers.

Concept

fit and finish

“Fit and finish” means how well the body panels line up and how nicely the work looks and feels. Great fit and finish is what separates a quick repair from a high-quality restoration.

Concept

chassis

The chassis is the main frame of the car. It’s the part that holds everything together, so when people take it apart and rebuild it, it’s usually to fix issues and make it solid again.

Concept

machinist

A machinist is a skilled tradesperson who makes or modifies parts using precision tools like lathes, mills, and CNC equipment. In a Type One restoration shop, partnering with a machinist is often how custom or hard-to-find components get fabricated to exact tolerances.

Company

Haas

Haas makes CNC machines—computer-controlled tools that cut and shape metal accurately. Getting a Haas usually makes it easier to make parts quickly and consistently.

Concept

COVID

They mention COVID because it changed the schedule. It gave them extra time to work on the car when events got canceled or delayed.

Concept

all hands on deck

It means everyone on the team was working together. Big car builds often need that kind of push when the car is close to finishing.

Concept

billable hours

“Billable hours” means the time the shop spent working that they charge you for. The more detailed or time-consuming the work, the more hours can add up.

Concept

body style

“Body style” just means the car’s outer shape—what it looks like from the outside. Different years/generations of the same model can look very different, even if the mechanical parts are similar.

Concept

silhouette

Silhouette just means the car’s overall shape—how it looks as a whole. In shows, people judge whether the car’s proportions and stance look “correct” even before you notice the small details.

Concept

detail standpoint

“Detail standpoint” means how carefully the car was finished—like how clean and well-done everything looks. In car shows, that kind of detail can make a car stand out even if the overall car is similar.

Term

brake bleeders

Brake bleeders are little valves on the brake system. Mechanics use them to push out air so the brakes work smoothly and consistently.

Term

machine the bolt

Machining a bolt means making it more precise or customizing it instead of using a standard one. People do this on high-end builds when they want everything to fit perfectly and look right.

Term

machine the washer

Machining the washer means making the washer to a specific shape or finish instead of using a generic one. It’s the kind of detail you see when the goal is top-tier presentation and precision.

Term

plate everything

Plating means coating parts with another metal. It helps protect against rust and can make the hardware look cleaner and more uniform.

Term

sheet metal

Sheet metal is the outer body panels on a car. When someone says they did sheet metal work, they mean they reshaped or replaced those panels to change how the car looks or fits.

Term

fenders

Fenders are the panels above the wheels. People modify them to make room for wheels/tires or to change the car’s shape and appearance.

Company

PPG

PPG is a company that makes car paint and clear coats. Using “100% PPG” usually means the painter used matching products from the same paint system so they work well together.

Term

400 grit

Grit is the sandpaper “roughness.” 400 grit is relatively medium-fine, used to smooth out scratches and prepare the surface for the next step.

Term

Buffed

Buffing is the polishing step that makes the paint shine after sanding. It helps remove the dull look and makes the surface look smooth.

Concept

black paint job

Black paint is notoriously unforgiving because it strongly reflects surface imperfections, making orange peel, waviness, and sanding marks more obvious. That’s why the discussion emphasizes coat strategy, leveling (“knocking it down”), and careful cutting/buffing.

Term

blasted

“Blasting” is when they use an abrasive to clean the metal. It helps remove old paint and rust so the next coating can stick better.

Concept

cash purse

A cash purse is the total prize money for the event. Then it gets divided up so the winner and the top finishers each get a share.

Concept

American Museum of Speed

The American Museum of Speed is a car museum venue. Saying it’s happening there helps you picture the event as tied to automotive history and culture.

Brand

Volkswagen

Volkswagen is a car brand with its own big fan scene. The hosts are basically saying their kind of build doesn’t fit the vibe of Volkswagen-focused events.

Concept

V8 swapping

A “V8 swap” is when someone takes out the original engine and puts in a bigger V8 engine instead. It usually makes the car feel much stronger, but it also takes a lot of work to make everything fit and run correctly.

Brand

Ring Brothers

Ring Brothers is a shop known for building and restoring cars to a very high standard. If they’re mentioned as a comparison, it usually means the builder wants it to look and perform like a top-quality custom project.

Term

drive a stick

“Drive a stick” means operating a manual transmission (using a clutch and gear lever). The comment is used to argue that some people didn’t actually know how to drive these cars, even if they were associated with them.

Brand

General Motors

General Motors is the big company that owned Pontiac. The point is that Pontiac wasn’t really independent—it was part of GM.

Brand

Pontiac

Pontiac was a well-known American car brand (part of GM). People remember it especially for its performance cars.

Term

cassette

A cassette is an old-school way of playing music using a tape. They’re mentioning that the car’s stereo was a cassette deck.

Concept

low rider

A low-rider is a vehicle that’s customized to look and ride very low. It often includes suspension changes and flashy styling, and sometimes it can even raise and lower.

Term

OBD2

OBD2 is the car’s built-in computer that watches for problems. A mechanic can plug in a scanner to see what’s wrong and why the check-engine light might be on.

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The bleeders I think are the thing that all the builders noticed.

Like my eye went right to them.

That's the thing that none of us would have thought to do.

Like a break bleeders, a break bleeder.

That's the part that just has to be there.

It's like tires.

Oh, so they're rubber?

Oh, of course they are.

What'd you do for the air and the tires?

Shaking up the industry a little bit.

Making some friends, making some enemies, I'm sure.

But it was the talk at the show.

I'm like, is a bug?

Like how bad asking this bug?

It was either start a drywall company, which I probably should have done.

I would do money-wise.

Or do this thing that I loved.

You know, I was at a job site at four o'clock in the morning one day,

and I'm like, I'm out of here.

This left all my stuff there and left and never looked back.

This car was ahead of its time.

Oh, it was.

You know?

Definitely.

Listen, listen, listen.

I would probably just shut up at this point.

No.

Fuck it.

Let him talk.

So like this was the American Ferrari,

and what they were saying about the Kraming Wheel.

Welcome back, another episode of Oil and Whiskey.

This week we have Buddy Hale of Type 1 Restorations and crew.

I'm going to say and crew because I'm going to be honest with you.

There's a lot of guys.

And I didn't remember everybody's name and ladies.

Shannon, right?

Yes.

All right.

I got one of them.

Hey, Seuss.

Carlos.

Yeah.

Dennis.

The most important one I forgot.

I thought I had it there for a second.

I got cocky.

He's the one that paid for everything.

Yeah, I know.

That's why I said most important.

That's the most important guy.

He paid you.

I'm sure you remember his name.

Oh, yeah.

Guys, it's absolutely amazing.

You can come out here.

You've ridden on quite a little high,

making, shaking up the industry a little bit,

making some friends, making some enemies, I'm sure.

For sure.

Yeah.

Hopefully making friends so we don't want to make any enemies.

Quite the, quite the showing.

I was excited to do this because I,

we don't know each other, right?

This is, we're getting to know each other here.

And full transparency.

This is how it went down, right?

I'm just going to be honest with everybody.

So everybody knows behind the scenes.

Okay.

Let's hear it.

We became aware of your shop,

not you, just your shop with the green split window

at Grand National two years ago, three.

2022.

Okay.

I never saw it at Grand National.

And I finally caught up with it at the,

where were we?

Triple crown.

Yeah.

But it was the talk of the show.

Yeah.

I'm like, is a bug?

Like how bad asking this bug?

It's all the way badass.

All the way badass.

I saw it.

So absolutely.

Fucking amazing.

I thought that thing that was, what started,

what's the name of that?

Turn oil.

Right up my alley.

We're going to talk about it.

I'm sure I love that vehicle.

So much.

And it was so cool that it was done in,

you know, that high level and it was there for Sloan.

So super cool.

Awesome.

Saw the blue one that you did at triple crown.

Oh, that same guy.

That's fucking sweet.

Yeah.

Saw that.

I know Alan picked that for his.

Well, he picked the split.

He picked the split.

Okay.

Yeah.

So then we are at Barry Jackson just recently and Mikey from DrivenSpeed.

Right.

He's talking to you guys.

Was he?

Right.

He's like, oh, I'm going to tell you what.

You better be.

Like he's a good cheerleader.

Oh yeah.

He's great.

He goes both ways.

I love that guy.

He's awesome.

You got to see this thing.

It's going to be something.

And he's telling me.

It's like, yeah, I know the guys.

It's up.

If you're saying it's me.

No, I'm telling you.

They're pulling out all the stops.

He's like, I'm not supposed to show you this, but look at that.

Shows me like a little detailed picture.

I said, we're going to be there next week.

That's fucking awesome.

Yeah.

And then we got to the show.

And we weren't even there five minutes, right?

In the first, like three people we talked to, oh, you guys got to check out the Carmichael.

Oh my God.

You're not going to believe.

Oh man.

And then also like, check out the Vintag.

You need to check out the Vintag.

Go see that Vintag.

Yeah.

That was a popular little attraction there.

So then we had to have you on the podcast.

So this is where we're at.

Yeah.

I can't thank you guys enough.

We're in shock.

You won us on here.

So it's amazing.

You guys did the work.

That's what matters.

So before we get into recent events and current builds, we'll go back in time just a little

bit.

We're probably not going to spend as much time on the beginning because much like the

level of detail on that build, that's a lot to talk about.

We're going to have to go in depth and in detail on that build.

So I want to be able to make sure we have the time to do that.

How long have you been in business?

Shoot.

It's 1999.

Okay.

Yeah.

And I started in my garage, kind of like everybody.

Doing VW restoration and builds?

Yeah, just painting cars.

That's how I started.

I mean, I initially started off with painting cars and just wanted to learn.

I do paint jobs just for material.

Someone drop a car off.

You guys pay for material.

Just to do it?

I'll just do it.

Kind of like what you were saying.

I fucked a lot of stuff up just in the process of trying to figure everything out.

You're doing it full time out of your garage?

No, I did.

I was doing drywall at the time.

I was doing construction.

But I knew I kind of, I love cars and I just knew I didn't want to be doing construction

forever.

And, you know, and I finally got to a point to where, you know, I was, it was either start

a drywall company, which I probably should have done money wise, but, or do this thing

that I loved.

And, you know, I was taping and taping and taping.

Texturing.

Oh, that's the body work was easy.

You came right into it.

That's how we got started.

And, you know, I was at a job site at four o'clock in the morning one day and I'm like,

I'm fucking out of here.

Fuck this.

Yeah.

Left all my stuff there and left and never look back.

Yeah.

The, you were painting anything that you could paint?

It wasn't specific, both wagon or anything like that.

Anything I can get my hands on because that's ultimately what I wanted to do.

Yeah.

And, you know, as, you know, as I was painting these cars and getting a little bit better

every time, you know, customers were bringing their stuff back all jacked up because they're

putting it together.

And yeah.

And then I'm like, you know, maybe I should just start assembling them.

And it kind of started landslide and just one thing after one thing after another.

When did, what was the first moment that you're like, Oh, this is a full, full time deal and

I can actually make a living doing this.

Oh man.

It's probably still thinking that we're still thinking that.

That's a crazy question.

I was asking myself that about 30 minutes before I walked up to this podcast.

Enough to make the decision to do it.

Yeah.

It was probably probably five years into it to where I felt kind of comfortable enough

to, to, to walk away from a steady paycheck and, you know, you were married.

Yeah.

At the time.

Yeah.

I wasn't married to Shannon.

Oh no.

Edit that part out.

She's part.

I was going to ask how she felt about it, but I guess the story writes itself, doesn't

it?

We've been together for 20, 20 years.

So she's been through all the ups and downs, you know, even now she's still, it's, you

know, it's, it ain't easy, you know, doing this car.

It was not easy.

I bet.

So as you start doing it, how did the Volkswagen thing come about?

How did you find that niche or that niche find you?

I've been in love with that.

Those cars since like the third grade, you know, as long, as long as I could remember

there was a car across the street getting built, you know, at recess, I would just go

and stare at this car getting built in this driveway for years.

And, you know, I made friends with the kid and couldn't stand him, could not stand this

kid, but I wanted to be friends with him because when he turned 15, I just wanted to ride in

the car.

Got you.

Nicely done dude.

It's a long play there.

Oh, I waited it out.

It's a funny story.

Like when we were, I got my first ride in there and a week later I beat the living shit out

of him.

Really?

All of that frustration.

Finally experienced it.

I'm done with this.

Finally.

Yeah.

All the torture he put me through, I'm like, oh, just pay back.

I rode that car now.

Yeah.

And I was just hooked, hooked on that every sense.

What was the first big build that came through?

So that was probably, what was it, 2000?

Your 2000 probably.

And yeah, we had a customer come in and it was just...

Just do it?

Just do it and didn't question anything.

Did he have the ideas or you have the ideas?

That particular customer, you know, he had the ideas, but he allowed me to like expand

on his ideas.

So that was pretty awesome.

But from that build forward, everything that came in was just, it's pretty much, you know,

they just drop them off and we just do, they just allow them to get done that way.

Well, the body work in fit and finish is second to none.

Like it's absolutely amazing.

Yeah.

That's Carlos.

And that's...

Nice work, dude.

Yeah.

Nice work.

Absolutely amazing.

And that's, it's funny when you talk about, you know, a Volkswagen bug and, you know,

Karmic Geassom, the Volkswagen, those early Volkswagen's in general, they're...

Yeah, they're hard.

They're...

They weren't really...

They're so...

It's almost like a Model A. They're not...

Yeah.

They're not made to fit.

These areas of them that aren't finishable, like you would finish like a...

Not as refined, right?

Yeah, right.

As a muscle car or a truck or a 60, 70s American car.

Yeah.

But with that, even harder is the fact that they are so simplistic and lacking a lot of

highlight lines or a lot of things going on.

So you really can't hide anything.

It's...

The beauty is in how simple it is.

So, you know, you've...

Back to a jam thing, right?

Those jams gotta be good.

Like it's such a, you know, a small...

The fender wells underneath the trunk.

You see all that.

You see everything.

Yeah.

The...

Tell us about the turmoil.

How did that build get started?

Well, that was in 2018.

We were contacted.

I think Kevin Doyle contacted us for...

Because they were doing like the Volkswagen's.

They had the Volkswagen's that year in those building.

Right.

Building number four, I think.

And they contacted us.

And so we sent photos of that car to them.

And they're like, well, you should, like, consider this Saloniker class.

And, you know, that car, we were literally probably two months from finishing.

And I'm like, there's no way we could take this car to compete there.

You were two months away from finishing, but when was the show?

Well, it was 2018.

We were two months away from delivering that car to the customer.

Okay.

So they saw pictures of it.

And I'm like, there's no way...

We got a lot more work to do.

And then so when they contacted us, we actually tore that car back apart.

Well...

Tore the chassis back down.

I mean, there's no body mods on that car.

And so once we did that, you know, we already had the color and the chassis was pretty much kind of done,

but we changed the color on the chassis.

And then we just started adding everything, you know?

And, you know, we have a...

I hooked up with our machinist and, you know, this was his first...

Basically go at it.

I mean, he got this machine and he learned how to decode it and figure it out.

And, you know, Evan Okinson and we've been together ever since.

And I just turned him loose on everything.

I had all these ideas in my head and I'd go, can you make this?

And he's, I'll try it.

And it's just started landslide.

And I mean, the guy, Evan, and you know, these guys will tell you, Evan, he's a genius.

He's a mad scientist.

Yeah, he's a mad scientist.

Yeah, it's...

Well, it's cool when somebody gets something like you're saying he bought the machine and he started figuring it out.

Yeah.

Somebody like that, he doesn't know the limitations or what it can't do.

Nobody told him what it can't do.

Yeah.

That's better.

You know?

So it's like, oh, hell yeah.

Yeah, why not?

And so, you know, like that pedal assembly right there, you know, that was the first one.

And he, that was his first go at it.

And, you know, I just gave him a factory pedal assembly and he kind of looking at it and re-engineered it.

And, and yeah, he just...

He's totally self-taught.

He's totally self-taught on everything.

Yeah.

So he had this, I think it was like an 1985, like just caveman CNC machine he made all that stuff on.

Yeah.

And, you know, over, you know, as we were going, you know, we stepped up and got the Haas.

Yeah.

You know, and he literally got that Haas, had that thing up and running in a day and often running machine in parts.

Well, didn't the old one break?

No, he's...

Yeah.

No, it never broke.

How did that...

How did you...

Back to where you said, okay, we're going to take it for Slonaker.

Yeah.

What was the pitch to the customer?

We're going to take it to Slonaker and...

Hang on, dude.

Hang on.

And, yeah, he was a longtime customer.

We built probably six or seven cars for him, Gary Stell.

Yeah.

And, you know, he's like, listen, I'm in, but this is, this is political because he's a hot rod guy too.

Okay.

And so he's like, this is really political avenue you're going down.

So, and you're bringing a Volkswagen to this.

Yeah.

And, you know, so from him, I'm like, okay, we really got to step everything up and...

But he was good to go with, like, let's do it.

Yeah, let's do it.

Yeah.

He supported us.

He supported us for a long time.

And the name Turmoil came about because that car was such a bastard to build towards the back end.

And, you know, we're just screaming and we're like, we were in constant Turmoil building that car.

And that's one of the guys just said, fuck it, name it, name it Turmoil.

That's, they should just call the industry that though.

So you get the thing dialed where you want it to be.

Yeah.

You work through the Turmoil pun intended.

Yeah.

And you come in to Grand National.

Yeah.

For Sloanaker.

Yeah.

What's the...

And don't go...

Don't...

Let's not go fast.

Go through the emotions.

Okay.

First of all, there's the emotions like, okay, it's actually...

We can't...

We don't have any more time.

It has to go.

It has to go right now.

We...

Luckily that was COVID.

Okay.

So...

You got an extra window.

Two years.

They canceled it, you know.

And so, you know, a funny thing and we're building that car.

You know, me and Jesus were...

We were in the thick of it.

Me and him were pretty much on that car every day.

Carlos was on the other side doing some other stuff because, you know,

we got shops got to make money and this really wasn't a moneymaker,

you know, at the end of the day.

And, you know, so we were just hammering down on that thing.

And my main goal was I just didn't want to embarrass ourselves.

And, you know, I had no idea what was coming.

We never heard of Sloanaker.

The only two guys I knew was Radrods by Troy and Pinkies.

That's...

That was it at the time.

Pinkies I've heard of is another guy.

Troy.

He comes up every now and then.

Yeah.

And I just, you know, for me...

Farmer, I think.

For me, I've been following that guy for so long and I just...

My whole driving force behind that car, I just...

When he saw it, if he saw it, I didn't know if he would or not.

Right.

I didn't want him to be like, this thing's a joke, you know.

So for me...

Yeah.

That was the driving force for these guys.

It was the Ring Brothers, you know, and that's...

They couldn't get close to that.

The wheelchair.

It's not a wheelchair accessible.

So it's...

Mike's got to be right up on that fucker to see, too.

Oh, yeah.

And so when we were building that, the Ring Brothers were doing the Volkswagen at the same

time.

Okay.

And we didn't know what was going on and so I'm building it and, you know, and I told

my ring the story, too, and we're just building it and building it and, you know, Carlos kept

coming up and I'm like, oh, yeah, but the fucking Ring Brothers, yeah, but the Ring Brothers.

And he was just not led up about the Ring Brothers and finally one day I snapped.

I'm like, fuck the Ring Brothers, man, this is what the fuck we're bringing.

Get the fuck out of here.

So we're fighting in the middle of the shop, you know.

And, you know, I'm not having any clue of, you know, what the response was going to

be from the industry.

So you get there and it's, you know, it's ready to go through the paces.

It's ready to go.

When you get there and you can see it, as we talk about this a lot, you're like, all

you're seeing is all the things that you don't like.

Oh, yeah.

Right.

All you're seeing is the things that, man, you wish you could have done this.

You see, you're not seeing it with fresh eyes like everybody else is.

What, at what point are you starting to be like, okay, I'm, I'm, we're all proud of what

we brought.

That was probably what, what day was it?

This is a cool story too.

What day was it?

Because we got there on Wednesday.

Carlos didn't even come because he's like, dude, we're going to get our ass kicked.

I ain't even going to show up.

Well, but he was, he was doing another job.

The whole thing was what this show, we didn't know what we're getting ourselves into.

Like I had never heard of the show before.

Okay.

So like, I didn't know what, like, like, I didn't know what any of it was about.

I didn't know, like, you're not supposed to show any of the cars or like everything's

like, that's a debut show.

Yeah.

So, and like to go back a little bit is like, you know, when we're talking about the ring

brothers, because they would had posted that they were doing a bug.

We heard that there was another bug in that same class.

And we thought for, for a minute that it was them.

Oh, yeah.

So I was like, I was like, I don't know, man, like these, these are going to be high end

cars.

But his, he was so worried that he's like, I don't know, like, are the people going to

like the car that we built?

Did we build this car to a high enough class that we're going to get a positive reaction?

Yeah.

So I'm sure you've realized it now.

Did you like the car?

No.

You didn't?

No.

He always thought that there was, there was more that we could do to the car.

Okay.

Yeah.

Well, that's always going to happen.

There's always more as long as there's time.

Yeah.

Time and budget.

That was like, the car was already done.

Yeah.

And when he said, Hey, like this show got canceled and he's like, we got to tell the whole

car to park.

And I'm like, dude, are you serious?

Like the whole car is going to come down.

Like, I don't know.

How did that conversation go versus just like building another one?

What's the beauty?

Is it still a Volkswagen?

You can, you can tear that thing down and what, like when, when I called the customer,

you know, and he's like, is it going to be bad?

I'm like, no, it's not going to be that bad.

Because I, you know, we had no clue of what that was going to turn into.

And Evan at the time, we had no clue of what he was going to become.

And so, you know, Evan just was like, like you said, like, and that's probably what catapulted

him because he had no limits, no expectations.

And so gloves were off at that point.

You know, and, you know, he was working for a friend of mine.

And when he was building that car, so we went to lunch one day and I said, Hey, man, if

you ever quit, I didn't steal them.

You know, I talked to my buddy.

I'm just, if you ever quit or you ever want to go somewhere else, this is what we can

do together.

And like two months later, he was, he opened up a shop, like 10 doors down from us.

And he just started, we started going.

Hell yeah.

Yeah.

So when you're there, like, when does it start to sink in that you probably, you probably

brought something pretty damn clear?

Thursday.

Yeah, Thursday.

That's when all the buzz started happening, like, you know, and then we found out Troy

Lad was shitting his pants and we, you know, and we were just there not to embarrass ourselves.

So there was no pressure for us.

And, you know, that was at the end of it.

That was a fun experience.

This last one was a fucking nightmare.

But, you know, because you got that expectation.

You know, this one, yeah, you're, you were, you just wanted to be a part of something,

you know, you just wanted to have the correct tucks on for the party.

And you were happy enough to be there.

I was happy to be there.

Yeah.

But then now you, so once you set the expectation, things are different.

So with the Troy Lad thing.

So what, how did that go there at that year, that show?

Well, right off the bat, they were like talking shit right off the bat.

Like we're setting up our display and it was really high off the ground and they're like,

Oh, what are you guys building a high rise?

And, you know, so they just started like giving a shit right off the bat.

And, you know, you know, we had no clue of what was going on.

We had no clue.

We were that close to them, like right out, right out the gate.

And so it was kind of like some chatter from them.

It was fun.

We were cool.

We were laughing.

We were having a good time.

And, you know, just over, over time, these guys, Carlos and Jesus drink with that dude,

get him hammered all the time.

And we just became friends.

And so that's, that's mainly what it is.

He just, he gives a shit all the time about losing.

And that's how that plaque came, came to.

He always, he always, every time he saw us, he always says, Oh, here comes a second

placer.

I can't believe anybody would be that horrible to say.

Yeah.

He calls us the littles.

You guys get the littles.

I'll take the bigs.

You guys get the littles.

You think like they got fifth place, maybe.

We've got similar relationships.

We fuck around with Jesse Greening a lot.

Yeah.

He's got a few Riddler awards under his belt.

So we joke about him eating cereal out of all his Riddler bowls and shit.

And then Jesse's always like, what do you do with you?

You eat out of years.

Oh, that's right.

You guys don't have one.

That's the beauty about having two.

You can eat whatever you want out of each one of them.

Yeah.

That was the, that was probably one of the first things we machined on that car.

It was that plaque.

Really?

If people look at it, you know, we, I put first place in Salonica.

That was, we machined that two years out and you look at the data on that.

That was first place.

I mean, we, it was all, you know, just, just thinking and.

So after, you know, staying on this car, after this car, you know, you did,

obviously what it did, did really, really well.

And you were, I mean, at least from our side, you were accepted into the, you know, the

building community.

It's like, holy shit, I don't care what you're building that, like you built it that detail.

That's amazing.

And it's always, it's always a breath of fresh air to see something like that that is

outside the box.

It is different, right?

Instead of seeing the same whole thing.

You go to triple crown, right?

Completely different experience, I'm sure, than what you're used to.

Yeah.

You know, those types of cars and show obviously did great then.

Yeah.

And at that point in time, was the Carmen be a, Carmen get build started?

Yeah, it was right in 2000.

But it wasn't going to be what it was, what it is, what it turned out to be.

It was just going to be a driver.

Well, that was in the beginning, but when we got back from Salonica and me and Dennis,

we went to lunch and we told him about the show.

And so, you know, he's looked, he's kind of like, I can see it.

I can't, he's, his gears are turning, you know, and he's like, Hey, we can do this.

And is that how it went down?

Yeah.

These guys built a of all things a 63 Falcon for me.

Ford or really?

Ford or.

Okay.

You can believe it.

And they did such a remarkable job.

I got to see the, the, the atmosphere in the shop and what, how they did work.

And I said, buddy, let's, let's do something together.

But I want to be a part of it.

And I don't want to do a bug.

So I sat down and said, let's do a Carmen gear.

So we found one in California.

Didn't start working on it diligently till 22.

And buddy right from the get go told me, we're going to win this thing.

Yeah.

I mean, from the first day, he said, we're going to win.

Yeah.

It was a statement.

I got to respect the confidence.

That's the same thing.

Like you were talking about the machinists or whatever.

You don't know it.

You don't know what not to say.

Yeah.

Like you don't need to just say it.

Absolutely.

Yeah.

Get his mic just a little closer.

You just grab it and pull.

There you go.

How's that?

Yeah, that's good.

Good.

So at that point, first of all, back to the four door Falcon, that had to be a family

history.

Yeah, I had one when I was.

Okay.

That was an enthusiast deal.

It's like, you know what I've always wanted.

Like I said, it was a lark.

It's a lark.

But it was nice.

It was very nice.

If we do this, it's going to look, we did a really good job on it.

Yeah.

In spite of being a Falcon, they did an incredible job on it.

Yeah.

And that's what got my juices flowing to do another one.

And after I saw what they did and the bug, I said, you know, we've got to do this.

What, when you start talking about the, the stylistic, you know, and I like, you know,

this can have this theme, we're going to do this stuff, you know, be sure to get into

the parts thing.

What do you, what's, what are you thinking?

What do you, what are you all vibing off of back and forth on?

Well, I got to tell you, this was Buddy's vision.

You know, I participated in the color scheme and a couple other things, but I knew best

to let him have his, his way with it.

And he did.

And I mean, the way it turned out was, was incredible.

The only thing was it had to be better than turmoil.

Yeah.

That was a driver.

That's obvious.

Right.

It's, it was, I'm sure, and at least it, you know, at least it does to me.

I'm sure it does to you guys.

You can tell that the thought process was the one thing we're going to do is we're

going to touch everything.

Yeah.

Right.

We got to, we have to, we have to do it all.

Well, then once you make that decision at the beginning, before you do anything, that's

a, that's a slippery slope.

It's slippery slope.

And then it will just never stop.

It never stops.

Because then it's, I mean, and how many times throughout that build?

Well, you know, you know, it would be cool.

Well, if we're going to do this, we ought to, you know, we ought to do this.

Well, if we're going to, it's just, it's like a, what's the, what's the little Russian

dolls that, that stack together?

It's like that, but of Pandora's boxes.

It's just, you open up another Pandora's box and there's another Pandora's box and there's

another Pandora's because it just keeps on because it's you, even on fastener stuff,

you learn like, well, we did, you know, machine these.

Well, you got to carry that theme throughout the deal.

And fasteners and Sarah coding are two things.

It's like, once you ring that bell, where do you stop?

You can't.

You just keep going.

Like, what are you going to just do the fender bolts, like the tops of the fender bolts?

It's either like you only put the little billet hood adjusters on and just say, that's it.

That's it.

Well, this one's getting right.

Or you do every single damn fastener on the entire car, you know?

And it's, yeah, that gets, that's a monumental.

And then when it comes to like, guess what, the 12 points aren't that aren't good enough

for us.

And just like, maybe counter like mill in the head and facing the 12 point.

That's not good enough either.

We're just going to make fast from scratch.

Yeah.

And that the fasteners came into play because, you know, we, I'm a good friends with ARP Bob

and Nick is such a good guy and, you know, he hooked up with, he hooked us up with one

of his guys and, you know, to kind of make us some, some 12 points and they never got

back to us.

And so, you know, me and Evan are sitting there one day and we're like, fuck it.

Let's just make our own.

Yep.

Why not?

Yeah.

What's the worst that could happen?

Right.

And you can get them to the exact size you need and everything at length.

Yeah.

Yep.

And have one guy polish and I'm 15 years old.

We have a young kid at the shot, Jacob, and that's all he did.

Oh, that's all he did.

He just down to nubs.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Where do you drawing influence wise?

Up of the car.

Yeah.

That just all came from my head.

You know, we just kind of, I just kind of broke every part down and that's another car

we're working on.

That's another car we're working on.

And, you know, that's just that stuff came from my head and, you know, and like I said,

Evan and the guys and, you know, and everyone just stepped up.

Yeah.

It's interesting.

You say it came from your head.

Usually you can look at something you can always sort of pick.

There was, you can find the inspiration.

Like there's something that's preexisting that somebody drew from.

Yeah.

This thing's just like just just cool.

Easy.

Yeah.

It's all fresh.

So you can't even like really describe like the style.

Super fresh, innovative stuff.

It's a color contrast on everything and the finishes and the sericodes and the different

levels of gloss.

I think that'd make my head explore.

The wild thing is that level of detail.

When you have touched every little thing and added that many fasteners and that many facets

and that many paint lines and that many edges and so like that for it to still be clean.

Yeah.

And not be gaudy.

You know, is very, very difficult.

That's a, you know, how you just touched on that because I was reaching a point and I'm

like, is this too gaudy?

Like, because you, you go down that rabbit hole and you're just, I'm going crazy.

So I don't know what is real.

What's that?

It's like tunnel vision.

Tunnel vision.

You got to zoom out every now and then you got to turn it to 1x instead of being on 36x

or whatever.

Because you see some cars that you're just like, whoa, that's way, way, way too much.

Or they just went off and left field with it.

And I didn't want to do that.

And so that was one of my big worries going into the show.

I'm like, did we do too much?

Because you can't, you know, you can overdo shit.

Right.

To be able to touch everything and do as much as you did and as elaborate as everything

is and it's still, at a glance, it sort of blends in.

I mean, obviously, once you get up on the car, it's just grief.

I tell you, city, but it's steering links and shit.

Yeah.

And Evan made that from the steering wheel all the way down to that steering box.

He made all that stuff from scratch.

Machine that figured it out, figured the dimension.

And then, you know, that's another thing to him.

You know, we just didn't like take factory stuff.

I mean, we've lengthened it, shortened it to make it drive better.

And, you know, I have about, I don't know, about 10 miles on this car so far.

And it's working pretty good.

So we're going to, we're going to road test it some more.

But, you know, and that's the big thing with this too.

It's just, I just wanted to make it to where everything works, you know, and, you know,

and Jesus and Dennis and, you know, Carlos putting this car together is very important

that everything works and everything be finished when we finish the car.

How did you all work assembly on this?

Was that, you know, throughout normal process of work or was this, you know, after hours planned?

No, it was, it was 24-7.

Yeah, I mean, that's pretty much for the last, when we picked it up from the interior shop in November,

it was all hands on deck.

I mean, we were working 120 hour weeks.

When you said that, you know, he had the, it was his ideas, you know, and he started telling you about the show.

And you're like, you know what, let's do, I want to see what you can do.

At what point through the build did you start seeing that I think he, he might be on to something?

I believe him now.

You know, I believe them right from the get go.

I just, I just saw the dedication and the vision he had.

Well, when somebody says, I'm going to go win that show, like there's always, there's got to be a doubt because that's quite the statement.

Well, you know, I believe that.

He never seen me waver, but there were some tough days and my wife, she, she knows how bad some of the days were,

but I'd lean on him a lot.

I'm just like, dude, I don't know, man.

And he's like, we're winning.

You know, I'm like, I just need you to keep believing that and telling me that.

Because, you know, when you like walking around this shop, my mind is blown.

I can't believe what you guys do here.

It's unbelievable, unbelievable.

And for me, this, this was new.

So I didn't have anything to compare it to.

This was the baseline, you know,

He started off at the top.

Yeah.

His buddy goes, dude, you just won the Indy 500 first time out.

I told a friend of mine a couple years ago, I'm building a Carmen game.

He goes, I fucking Carmen.

I said, yeah.

And he came with us to the show and he, he was blown away.

You're supposed to start with just like a little puff every now and then,

not like the main line in heroin, right into the carotid.

Like you just went straight.

We got this dude hooked on heroin.

Yeah.

That's bad.

But once, once he's, because he was working at the shop doing a lot of prep work and stuff.

Yeah.

But once he saw everything going to color, it was, it was a different game.

Once we got everything in the color.

I wasn't sure about the colors.

I had to admit.

But once I saw them together, I just thought, man, this is genius.

The colors are good.

Couldn't be better.

What all did you do?

You sent him a prep work.

What all did you have a hand in on the car?

Which is a rare thing for.

Oh, fuck.

All the suspension stuff.

At the end of the day, you're paying the bills.

Fuck, this sucks.

I'm not doing this shit anymore.

Fuck.

I want to talk to the clock in because those are billboards.

Do you ever see some pops up on the bill?

Dude, I fucking did that.

That's what Jesus goes.

He's like, these are billable hours, dude.

We need to start billing this guy.

Admittedly, it was all grunt work.

But I enjoyed everything.

Yeah.

Do you have any background in anything like this?

Hell no.

Just figured it out.

Yeah.

These guys taught me.

It's a, that's quite the story and quite the experience to have with.

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On this level.

Yeah.

They were very patient with me.

They, you know, and I told them, I said, guys, I'm here to help.

If I'm fucking up, you tell me.

And they did.

Yeah.

You know, buddy would say, this, this is no good.

This isn't, do it again.

Yeah.

Do it again.

That's where it's going to be pissed.

Yeah.

And, you know, the cool thing about him was there was, there was a couple of times where

some, some parts got machined wrong and we were kind of in a pinch and he actually,

he's driving home and he calls me.

He's like, Hey, what if we just do this to fix it?

And so he went from not knowing anything to figuring it out, figuring it out.

You know, and, you know, this one time in particular, I was like really stoked.

We'd just finished the rear calipers and I'd left some writing on the top of the

calipers and I show him, I'm like, what do you think of this?

And he's like, they're going to see that inside.

I'm like, fuck.

Now we got to strip this down, start over again, but I'm driving home and like,

Another set of eyes.

He gets it.

Yeah.

He gets it.

And so that was a turning moment too for us.

Blind squirrel.

When, uh, when you got to the show, you know, and experienced that experience and stuff,

what's going through your mind and you're looking at other vehicles, right?

Cause y'all been entrenched in this thing, right?

And you're looking, you know, like you said, down a microscope on stuff.

Um, like the emotions of that of like, wow, this, that was a lot of hard work,

a lot of money.

We feel really confident in what we've built.

I'm looking at other stuff that other guys do.

Are you getting inspiration or be like things?

Or is it just what everybody goes through different stuff?

I'm looking at other cars and thinking, you know, I love this 58 vet.

It's beautiful and another 56 Chevy.

It's great, but it's, it can't compare to the detail that was put into our car.

You know, and they were, they were great vehicles.

I'd be happy to be a part of it, but not the detail that we put in.

If, uh, what did you guys tell yourselves in preparation for?

If it didn't go the way you wanted it to go.

I never, these guys never wavered.

It was the only one outcome.

He never wavered from the, from the get go.

He says, we're winning.

I said, let's go around and look at all the cars.

So him and I went around, looked at all the cars, came back.

So what do you think?

He goes, we're winning.

We're going to win this thing.

That's due to Baker scared me a little bit.

The student Baker was the one.

Honestly, like I'll openly talk about it.

Nothing against the way it was built.

I just don't like the car, that body style, but the, the execution was cool.

Shit on it.

Really, really good.

Like detail wise.

Yeah.

That was a really well executed car.

Scared me too.

The Chevelle just has to look dude.

I mean, the Chevelle, the tough thing about it is that I don't know that everybody got it.

Like there's a shit ton of detail and a lot of work in that car.

There's a lot of changes.

That car is slanted.

And what Eddie did to it, that is like the look.

It's in the end, if you can, like I'll sort of look past all the details for the silhouette

and the overall finished product when it's good.

And that was really done well.

I would have took that car out of there.

That would be my pick.

Zach's car too.

Zach's 56.

Zach's 56 was cool.

I think it's, you're challenged a little bit with the 50, like the tri-five just because

they've, yeah, it's a tri-five.

They're always at sort of the forefront of everything and one just won the Riddler.

Yeah.

Right.

But Zach's car is well done.

Yeah.

Very, very well done.

I honestly had it between you guys in the Chevelle and you guys detail wise.

I mean, it was so above and beyond what anything else there was.

I mean, it was definitely stood out from a detail standpoint, no question about it.

And I'm looking at cars and thinking, how come these guys did this as opposed to what

we did?

You know, not knowing.

Yeah.

And, you know, just to me it was obvious that we had it.

Yeah.

I mean, what's interesting is the, you guys like relentless obsession and push to win.

Like there probably wasn't other guys doing that behind, like guys were working hard.

It takes, there's no question about it.

All those dudes work their asses off to get those cars done.

We've had conversations with all these builders.

I've never really heard anybody.

Never.

That has had the mindset and the drive like you guys that it's like this team effort of

we're winning this dude.

And it sounds like that was from day one and it was the push all the way through, which

is pretty damn cool.

Yeah.

It is cool.

And it shows in the, in the finished work.

Yeah.

Which is also like that's should be frightening to some of these like sort of big name, not

to discredit you guys, but there's some guys been around a long time and have some huge

names that built some amazing award winning cars.

They might be coasting a little bit, not knowing that there's guys like you guys there behind

the scenes, fucking live in, breathe in, and all you're thinking about is winning, winning,

winning.

That was the whole thing.

And that's cool.

Well, it was like, when we showed up, we didn't know what we were getting ourselves into.

And then when, you know, you know, talk here and there throughout the whole, you know,

the week and the weekend, and they're like, Oh, you guys might have a real shot at winning,

you know, and I'm like, Holy shit, dude, like we might have this.

Yeah.

And then, you know, when we did it, it was kind of devastating.

And when he told me, he's like, dude, we're going to go back, we're going to do this,

we're going to do that.

And like, we're going to go back and we're going to do it for it.

We're going to build a car for that show, you know, from the beginning.

So I told him, I was like, if I go back, I'm not going back to lose.

That's it.

Yeah.

You know, I'm not going to go.

That's cool.

I'm not going for a second place.

As the owner, I saw what Buddy did.

My question was, what, what do these guys do?

And after working with them, they were as driven to perfection or more than Buddy was.

They would not skip or.

That's what it takes.

Yeah.

Exactly.

Absolutely.

Because I'm on the back end too, because I'm, I see the invoices, right?

I'm like, holy fuck.

Yeah.

That's a break caliber.

We already bought, we already bought, we paid good money for the break caliber to get it

here.

And then there's four of them.

And so when you're like, you know, when you're like, I think he wants to refill over there.

Sorry.

When you're, you know, pushing that invoice across the desk and, and, and, and you're,

you're barely, barely touching the surface of parts are not even close to being done.

Well, I think that's that goes in hand in hand with what Jeremy was just talking about is

what is many conversations as we've had.

You know, we're, we're four seasons in on this podcast and, you know, another 20 something

years in this industry of having these similar conversations, a couple of things.

Generally, the conversation with the customer and the builder is we're going to build something

really, really nice.

We're going to build what you want to build.

We're going to build what we want to build.

We're going to build it the way we want to build it, right?

As nice as we know how to build it and then go, okay, this show lines up.

We're going to go debut it at this show.

Um, when you set out to say, we're going to go win that award, it takes a special customer.

Yeah, absolutely.

To want to do that.

Yeah.

Because that, just like you've been, I mean, it's fresh.

You know, when you decide that you're going to go win that award that, that sets very specific

guardrails.

Um, and none of those guardrails are on the spending side of things, right?

It's, it's, we had some emotional discussions, but we, we overcame them.

Then that's, but that's the hard part of you mentioned, you know, like why, why do these

guys not do this kind of stuff?

Well, it gets to that point of like money.

I wanted the, I wanted the car.

I wanted a really nice car, right?

And I want to go enjoy it or I want to look at it and slide that.

But like, if this is what it takes to guarantee a bit, like the, I was going to find the picture,

the, the fucking brake bleeders, right?

Amazing.

Little pieces of jewelry.

Fucking awesome.

There's very few customers that would be like, hell yeah, absolutely we should do that unless

you're dead set on building the thing to win an award because then it makes sense.

It's like, okay.

And people are on the majority of stuff.

It's like, dude, come on.

Like, you know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

But that's the difference that the problem is when somebody puts that much effort and

build into a car and like, well, yeah, I'm planning on driving.

I'm not going to machine the brake bleeders, blah, blah.

If you don't like this car, but if it doesn't win, you know, it's like, well, what about

all the other hard work I've done?

That's, but then that's when you get into the thing of the show thing.

You guys are rare instance where it said whatever it takes from start to finish, we're doing

it to win this award.

I don't think there was one corner cut on this car.

No.

Everybody agrees on that.

Not one.

Yeah.

There was a point, you know, because we would talk about budgets and we were obviously

going over budgets and.

No.

How do you even do that?

Because where do you like, how do you establish the time just looking at these bolts on the

screen right behind you?

I mean, to sit down there and figure out what it costs to machine the bolt, machine the

washer, paint the washer, then remachine the washer, then plate everything.

The bolts and the washers are all, it's all one piece.

Oh, is it?

Yeah.

Okay.

But that fastener in isolation, if you just sat down and said, I'm only building this one

fastener.

That's a $2,500 faster.

Oh, all day long.

Like just the one.

At least.

Yeah.

I mean, you break it down like that and that's, you know, but also to Evan's credit, he's

fast.

Yeah.

And he doesn't, when he's, when he gets after it, he's going and he, I mean, he was cranking

out parts so fast for us.

It was unbelievable.

Were there things that went the other way where you had input and you're like, dude,

we need to pump the brakes on this.

It's getting a little bit too much.

Never one time.

No.

Him coming up with ideas and you were being the voice of reason.

No, no.

That's just, that's a bunch of crack heads with a bunch of crack.

Do more.

I'm crazy.

But at the end of the day, he's crazier than I am.

I found out.

Yeah.

Whoa.

That was a lot.

I got to a point where I just didn't give a shit.

It's the last us all weekend.

Five minutes later.

You got to, you got to sort of get to that point, right?

Like you got to sort of hit the all in point where it's like, dude, we're like, we're fully

pregnant and we're having this kid.

Yeah.

Like let's, let's start painting the fucking bedroom like this is happening.

It's a button that says fucking.

Exactly.

Yeah.

Right there.

That's the bucket button.

The button that says fuck it right there.

That's the fuck it button.

And that was one of the doubt that came like later.

Later.

That was one of the things towards the end.

Yeah.

And I was like, you know, like you said, we've touched everything on this car.

And then when he said, oh, we're going to machine the bleeders.

I was like, well, we already did the bleeders.

He's like, no, we're going to do the little screw on top because we did the bottom sides

first.

Yeah.

And I was like, fuck, man, I can't believe we didn't even touch those.

Yeah.

And then, yeah, there you see evidence, you know, manual lathe and the CNC and the

bleeders, I think are the thing that all the builders noticed.

Like my eye went right to him.

That's the thing that none of us would have thought to do.

Yeah.

You know, you know, just like a brake bleeder is a brake bleeder.

That's the part that it just has to be.

It's like tires.

Oh, they're rubber.

Oh, of course they are the little, little, you know, rubber cap that's on the

bleeder.

It's like, oh, that's that's where the brake fluid gets bled.

You know, it's tires are black and round and rubber.

And you just take it for granted.

Yeah.

What'd you do for the air in the tires?

Yeah, that's that's the one that the guy that makes his own tires that finds

somebody that will cast molds and pour, pour his own fucking tire molds.

Like, that's the dude that.

Yeah, because that's the limitation for all of us.

If like wheels have become it's whatever you want to dream up.

But you're constrained to tires.

Why couldn't you 3D print?

Maybe you could.

You could 3D print the correct durometer.

Rubber.

Probably good for show car.

Show car.

Oh, yeah.

That's all that anybody's going to make their own tires.

It'll fall apart after 30 miles an hour.

We're 3D printing some tires.

You know, and that was a good thing, too, because we had to be exact copy of

an entire quarter inch.

We had that car painted a year out from, you know, this last show.

So and my whole goal was to get it done early enough to where I'm like, OK,

if we can go back and I had my little wish list and and that was one of the

things that was on that wish list and, you know, to the guys and they busted

their ass on it and and and we get, you know, even though it was kind of last

minute, we got it done the weekend before, we still had it done in plenty

of time.

We got to get Carlos in and talk about body work.

OK, I'll say real quick.

That's a pretty cool way of building a car that I don't think anybody in our

industry has ever done before.

Get it done and then have a list of things that if there's additional

time, you're going to go back and do.

Yeah, yeah.

And a little wish list, you know.

We only we didn't happen to us once because we COVID helped.

We're getting ready to hit a debut car at SEMA.

It got kicked back a year.

So you had.

We were still cutting it close on the next year to get it there.

But it gave you that sort of reset to stand back, look at it, touch the

things you wanted to touch that you didn't the first time.

Right.

It helps big time.

I remember one day a buddy showed me this 300 pound piece of aluminum.

He said, this is your steering wheel.

And I said, OK.

You're throwing away 70.

And that's having, you know, that's, you know.

Yeah, that's that is cool, man.

On the exterior of the body, like I don't know Carmen gives well from like

the proportions and stuff.

How much was done sheet metal wise is the car.

Yeah, we highly modified.

It wasn't a lot.

I mean, it was a lot.

You know, Carlos changed a lot of the body lines.

And we, you know, we blew out the fenders a little bit.

And the rear fender rolls for the rear.

Yeah, we just opened up.

And that was the biggest thing going into that stuff, too, is because

we didn't want to, we didn't want to, we didn't want to make it look

like it was cut up, you know, and, you know, Carlos, you know, the

tail light section and he did all that and the fit and finish and, you

know, the front fenders modified and, you know, all the body lines were

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Picture this.

A curve in the road.

A change in plans.

Well, what do you say?

With the all-new Audi Q3, the answer is always yes.

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I would just went back to that.

Tell me about this picture.

How does that door draft at the trim?

Yeah, it just opens.

It just does.

How exactly is a positive traction on the rear of the car?

It just does.

It in swings enough and that's wild.

It would be the other way.

Don't get too close to it.

Do not get too close to that.

Those fucking edges.

They got it.

They got all of us.

Got him.

Got me.

I was the first one.

We first put those on.

They stick it on the door as well.

I got up and I barely touched it.

I just cut me.

We got to go back.

That's one of the things we got to change.

I don't want you to crawl that in.

Just softening it.

Just getting a lawsuit.

I can't even get into that.

What's the badge?

Genuine hand built?

Hail built car.

Hail built car is cool.

That's my last name.

You got to get Carlos over here and talk about the pain body.

Yeah, those wheel houses.

Wheel houses must have been fun getting in there and finishing them out like that.

If you ever want to have fun, just come on over.

Run the buffer up inside there.

Hello, hello.

Well, thanks for joining us.

You're the guy that made this thing ultimately present the way it presents.

Your pain body?

Pain and body.

Cool.

Big with buddy.

I think it was 2008.

Long time.

Long run, man.

But yeah, everything.

We did everything on this car.

It was a journey.

But we tried to do every single car that we do, just as nice for pain and body.

It's not just because it was a Saloniker.

Every one of our cars that we do is finished to this level.

The finish.

Yeah, the finish is crazy.

Crazy, crazy.

I mean, those cars, they show well because they're very curvy.

It's got a little bit of everything.

It's got like the door gaps, like a muscle car.

Right.

It's got the roundy stuff, like a forties, like big, you know, fat fender.

It's got a little 300 SEL in it.

It's got all the good stuff wrapped up in one.

What material y'all spray or paint?

I think this one was 100% PPG.

Right?

Yeah, it was 100% PPG.

Everything.

2021 clear.

What's your process on your color sanding buff?

It depends on the vehicle, but this one, this one I started with 600.

600 grit, flat, really hard block, you know, only one fold on the paper.

Cut it as flat as I can.

Guide coat it.

Get rid of the scratch with 600, 8,000, you know, 2,000, 2,500, and then I go 3,5 with the D8.

That's a, yeah, the paper fold thing and edges and stuff like that is something that people really overlook and not realize how knife sharp a fold is or the corner of a piece of paper is.

You ever seen anybody cut anything dry with 400 on wet sand?

What color sand?

I've been reading a lot about it lately.

I haven't seen it done.

I've done it.

We had a guy here.

It's not good.

I could dive it Elliot, man.

It's Australian dude shows up.

Knockout stripes under clear with it.

Probably one of the best painters like I've ever had the privilege of working with.

And dude was like, came in, runs the show, right?

Big fucking muscular, badass guy.

And it's like, you're doing it his way.

And he's telling me about how he's going to cut this thing with 400 dry.

And he's like, yeah, man, we fucking, if you block it with a straight block, you fucking put the 400 on it and you cut it down.

And he's like, I'm like, I'm like, dude, if you fucking up, you're repainted.

So go ahead.

Takes a giant, you know, a fucking four foot long block with a sheet of 400 grit and down the side of this Mustang, just hogging on it, man.

And this fucker turned this car around.

Like I'm telling you a body tub.

Two days start to finish.

Buffed.

Wow.

The most beautiful thing I've ever seen.

I mean, he jumped from what he jumped.

He'd skip.

I think he went, don't like, quote me, don't go ahead and do this in your shop.

But I think he jumped to 800.

And he's got a whole idea.

He explained it to me once about how like the, you know, the tooth of the scratch and this and that.

And that was jumping over.

Yeah.

So he went from four, from four to 800.

Yeah.

Dry and just fucking laser straight.

I would have wanted to do that just because of dust.

You know, I want to suck.

I can't.

I've only done it on, on knocking down, you know, doing graph or graph.

And as great as a razor blade for that.

But knocking down a big, heavy clear line under graphics or whatever, you know,

if you've got some of that, but I can't stand to do it because it's like nails on a shock board.

It's like, it's like, I don't like touching cardboard here.

It's like a weird thing for me.

And this is the same thing of like dry sanding clear.

It's just.

So this guy's OCD.

That's why he's been able to establish what he's got going here.

Yeah.

Pretty much.

We're all got a little fucked up problem.

You're the drug addict in the room.

Give me.

Give me shit.

Tell her standing above them.

I mean, getting underneath this thing with all that beadwork and looking at the bottom of that car with all that detail.

That's.

You just can't be scared.

I guess.

What do you, I mean, you stacking clear on the bottom.

There's a lot of clear on there.

There's at least five coats.

Yeah.

It was double clear.

The thing I've always said, I've never been scared of anything because I was it.

If we fuck it up, we've got to fix it.

It's not going to leave it.

You know, so whatever.

Just a little more work.

You got to do, you got to do what you got to do.

How long are you letting that stuff sit before you start sanding on it?

As long as we can.

At least a month sometimes, right?

Or more.

But in Arizona, it's a lot hotter.

Oh, yeah.

He got no problem there.

Spreading mud.

You got to be fast.

Yeah.

You got to see, but still.

Just don't use any hardening or hardening itself.

Yeah.

And I just forgot about the Arizona slow hardener for mud.

Yeah.

I just found this out.

Just just a little window there.

Yeah.

When you're double clear, you're saying, so you're cutting it, you'll go back what,

like 600 and then clear it again.

Yeah, sometimes.

Yeah.

And then how many coats, when you do that, what's the process?

Like, what do you put down?

And then what do you stack in on the second go around?

A lot of times we don't really double clear, but when we do do it.

We'll do, like, let's say four or five coats heavy.

Then we'll cut it as flat as we can.

We got to site it and make sure there's no air.

Yeah.

Nothing.

It's got to be as perfect as possible.

And then we'll go back and maybe do three more coats.

Okay.

And that three coats is plenty most of the time.

That's true.

Once it's already super flat.

Yeah.

That used to be, you know, you always hear all these different stories, like the different

inner coats.

Yeah.

And how to get like what you do at the black paint job.

And like we had dudes that are talking about like mixing clear with single stage.

And then, but then the knocking it down, clear it again.

That's always the instant illusion of it is that it lays down beautifully and it looks

great.

Look the same.

The confusion has always been like you have fewer coats to clear the second time around

and you can ring it up, right?

Like cutting back through it.

You burn it.

Yeah.

You don't need to be saying it.

Like, yeah.

Your body would be as close to perfect as possible to get a super flat paint job.

If not, you're going to cut through on your wave or something.

And you paint, you spray and you're doing the sanding buff.

I do everything except for the painting.

Okay.

That guy right there.

Yeah.

I figured because that's usually, there's always the painter likes to lay it down and

then just step out of the fucking.

And then that's how Alan Palmer was breaking my gun.

Alan Palmer was painting us for years and he's a great dude.

Yeah, it does great work, but there was always like he would go back and forth between here

in California and there's always a reason to go back to California when it came time

to cut and buffing.

Oh, yeah.

It's like the fucking clear is on.

Yeah.

I did my job.

Oh shit.

What time is it?

I want somebody to do.

I want somebody to do an AI meme because of painters because it literally should be like

F one umbrella girls like holding the paint suit where they just step in somebody.

He's like, yeah, somebody hands him the gun and it better be dialed into the correct pressure.

And I mean, just a little come out with the martini.

Yeah.

I have now done my job.

Every time I go in there, how'd it come out?

There's a runner too.

Okay.

Yeah.

There's plenty of clear on there then.

Yeah.

Thank God.

That's your job.

Yeah.

I float it out.

We usually know how it goes if you don't hear a fuck.

All right.

And you're good.

We see spray guns go flying across the shop.

We've seen it.

We've seen stuff like that.

It happens, man.

Your process, I mean, start to finish just because this, I feel like this is a helpful.

Never gets talked about enough.

Yeah.

It doesn't get talked about.

There's a lot of Italian guys out there that do talk about it.

But you're start to finish process.

Are you epoxy over bare metal?

Are you bare metal straight to filler?

We do a lot of our timeblaster offers in epoxy primer.

Okay.

A powder coat.

A powder coat prime.

Okay.

So we do that a lot, especially on the high end builds.

And then we'll scuff it up, start mudding over that.

Well, how do you handle, do you do that right at the tail end, like you get the car?

You fab it all and then take it to that process.

Yep.

So that's sort of the shell.

You're not having to grind back.

A lot of times we get them blasted twice.

We'll get it blasted when the car first comes in.

Once we're done with it, handprints everywhere, oils in there.

Sure.

We send it back.

They reblast it.

Powder coat, prime it.

Yep.

Comes back.

A lot of times, like there's been a couple of times we asked the blaster to just dust

blast the primer.

To etch it?

To etch it.

Okay.

That way every single square inch gets it.

Because a lot of times you just got to go and do it by hand.

It sucks and everybody misses something.

So that's where it starts failing.

So they just barely dust it.

Yeah.

It's still on there, but everything's etched.

That's a really good idea.

Yeah, that is clever, man.

So we'll do that.

Mud it, everything.

Polyester, you know, primer.

Polyester is straight to paint, probably.

Polyprime and paint.

Polyprime.

Yep.

Cool.

We've been using a lot of a squeegees primer as well.

Yeah.

His epoxy.

That's good stuff.

Yeah, squeegees.

Dude, I gotta tell you, that fucking truck, it has blew my mind.

That thing was crazy.

That was one, the Dodge.

Yeah, the A100.

That thing was insane.

I didn't know paint could do that.

Like when you stare into the metallic on that thing, I'm like, holy fuck.

It sucked you in there.

It looks so deep.

Yeah, he's it.

Yeah, I licked it.

Dude, I've been full of disclosure.

I'm like, I wonder what this tastes like.

I'm sorry, dude.

There's an AI.

His intrusive thoughts beat him.

I need that snipped right now.

That'd be the first time we hear that.

I was happy I didn't enter our class.

Dude, that thing was nuts.

He did what?

I licked it.

You have to agree.

Yeah, it was candy.

It's wild.

Yeah.

Yeah, whatever he says.

If he's got primer, if he would.

Yeah, I'll use it.

Yeah, it's good stuff.

Oh, you got to spray it naked?

Fine.

Yeah, that's where it comes out.

Shit, yeah.

It's illegal.

It's illegal in 50 states.

All right, fine.

Yeah, we'll come pick it up.

How much can I buy from you?

It's things like hell, but it works.

Yeah.

Can I leave the country to do it?

If anything sprayable stinks that bad,

you know it's about to be good.

Dude, it's so bad.

You know it's about to be good.

Yeah, because that's all the shit.

They don't want you to use it anymore.

So if it stinks like that.

That's all epoxies were.

And then they took all the good stuff out of it.

And that's why they suck.

Temperamental, yeah.

The good thing is that we're in Arizona.

So when it says that it causes cancer in California,

we're good, you know?

Yeah, we're not in California.

Yeah, exactly.

You're all good.

You didn't adhere to the standard sticker

that you got to put on everything

that you can't do.

Yeah, that's why they do that.

Now we figure it out.

Somebody sit there and I'm like...

See, that's what got you in trouble.

It seems like that's not the first time you've

licked something that's...

I'm glad you picked up on it.

I don't know where that's been,

but I'm gonna give it a go here.

You're just saying what everybody else is thinking.

Yeah, I walked right into that one.

I backed right into it.

That's funny.

That could be dangerous.

Oh, yeah.

We need another bottle of booze.

Yeah, we do.

We need to get another one.

Yeah, why don't we find another bottle of booze

and maybe I'll take a piss break.

Take a little breather?

Yeah, real quick.

You're doing Chicago World of Wheels this weekend.

That's why you're here.

Yep.

I mean, obviously you came for the podcast,

but while you're here, you're gonna do that.

We came for the podcast.

It just so happened.

That makes sense.

I appreciate that.

There's probably a bunch of guys over at that show

the same scenario.

You're also doing the Wheel Hub event here

and coming up.

Yeah, cool.

Summertime.

Yes, sir.

That's gonna be a pretty...

Yeah.

You've ever been there?

No.

It's a cool show.

Great event and they are rolling out the cash.

A lot of dough.

This year.

The Wheel Hub Cup.

How much cash?

$100,000.

I think it goes, what, $30,000 to the winner

and then like $10,000 to the next seven places?

Yeah, really.

It's funny.

You should mention that I actually have notes right here

that has it laid out.

Drop it, Joe.

Judged awards competition during the Wheel Hub Live

event weekend.

$100,000 in total cash purse.

The largest in history.

Yep.

That's quite the statement, but possibly.

Nonetheless.

$30,000 grand prize payout.

Remaining $70,000 paid out to the top seven finishers.

May 21st through 23rd.

American Museum of Speed.

Museum of American Speed.

I read that.

Dixlexic.

Yeah, completely backwards.

May 21st through 23rd at Museum of American Speed.

You've never been there?

I've never been.

We're excited.

It's absolutely awesome.

That's worth the trip by itself.

We're bringing three cars out there.

Yeah, we're going to bring the split, the blue one,

and the Gia.

Hell yeah.

Make it tough on folks.

Make it tough.

Cool.

We won't be there for the money.

I heard there's a cup or a bowl.

If you win it.

Yeah.

Rob, Stephen, Rodney, those dudes, good dudes,

friends ours, Wheel Hub crew, they put on a hell of event.

That whole place is unbelievable.

Speedy Bill Smith from Speedway, that's his palace.

The hot rod history, the stuff there, it's mind-blowing.

It's a cool ass event.

You know part of that's got to do 160 mile cruise.

Get that thing ready to ride.

That's what we're bringing the blue one for.

We're going to take that blue one on that cruise.

Rapid green.

Nobody will know that.

They all got to do the cruise for the cup.

Oh, do they really?

Oh, shit.

We got to get ready.

Just drive it.

You got to drive the car.

You got to get ready, Dennis.

Better snug those brake bleachers down.

Are they going to do a feature on that car in Wheel Hub?

Yeah.

That's going to be a pretty crazy shoot.

Detail on that thing.

Yeah.

Robert's a good guy.

How do you like him?

You just stand back enough and you get on the detail in one shot.

The wide angle lens.

Yeah, just zoom in.

That would be a good feature.

You know, you did the split at Sloanicker.

You know, you did Triple Crown.

You've been doing stuff.

You're making waves.

You're coming into this side, the hot rod side of things.

What's your takeaway?

All three of you guys.

What's your takeaway being in this side of it now?

Well.

You guys have been building badass cars for a while.

You've just kind of been doing them for a customer and doing your thing.

A couple shows and they disappeared.

But, you know, we were having a conversation last night and we'll have it again here.

But, you know, for me, it's like, I've been following Troy Chepania forever.

And so every car that I do.

Everybody's been following him forever.

Yeah, right.

It's old as shit.

He's the top and then you can start talking about the other guy.

I mean, there's so many good people in the industry, but, you know, it's just been amazing,

you know, going over to his shop for the first time.

I never dreamed that I'd be able to step foot in that guy's shop.

Well, Adam's all the talent.

Like you obviously met Adam.

Sorry.

That guy's an alien for sure.

Yeah.

Troy's just the pretty face.

He's a mouth.

He's the mouth.

Everybody's a front man.

You know, and just, you know, meeting them and hanging out with those guys, him and Adam

and the Ring Brothers for these guys and just everybody, just everybody.

Troy from PBT and you guys, it's just, it's unbelievable.

You can't even describe it.

You know, it's like a dream come true for sure.

Are you getting Troy?

Troy is getting from BBT is getting pretty fucking good, dude.

Yeah.

Like Troy is the body of ours.

Yeah.

But you know, I see stuff coming up on Instagram and you're like, Jesus.

Yeah.

Fuck Troy.

He's fucking angel.

Yeah.

Really cool thinking.

I mean, we talk a lot, but like I got to give him a lot of credit, man.

Like just looking at the, you see the Chevelle is doing like the interfender

stuff and the way the panels are coming together.

It's pretty cool.

I mean, with their mirror stuff, Troy is kind of like good stuff going.

Oh yeah.

Yeah.

He might not be Troy light for too much longer.

Troy medium now.

Yeah.

He's Troy medium now.

Yeah.

That Impala, man.

Yeah.

Really good striking car.

Really good car.

Stunning.

Love it.

Yeah.

That's a whole different animal body.

Yeah.

One of them pictures.

See, and like, like listening to that dude, cause we'll talk to him and then I'm like,

I'm like, dude, that, that Impala is like fucking nuts, dude.

It's insane.

And then like, we were at SEMA and I was like, looking at him.

He's like, Hey, don't look too close.

You know, but it's like, dude, I'm like, like everybody knows where their flaws are.

Yeah.

But that's not what we're looking for.

We're just, you know, appreciating all the fucking work that's been done to these cars.

Yeah.

And like for us, it's like, Holy shit, dude.

How do you get there?

And then he comes over and then he tells us the same thing and he's like, what the fuck

dude?

It's like, you know,

When I go look at what he shows me to show me how flat the clear is, he shows me the reflection

of his abs.

In the clear, did he do that?

No, no.

I think he showed everybody his abs at the roadster shop party.

I think his shirt was off.

Insert and I licked it.

Please.

You can have a field day with AI on this.

Oh yeah.

Making special requests.

No, but that's where like, you know, at least for me, it's like, I start to learn where

it's like, you know, like I look up to these guys or I admire these, you know, this person's

work or whatever.

And it's like, they tell you the same thing.

And it's like, you don't feel that way because like, I don't know if I mean, it goes both

ways because you grow so numb to the vehicle.

Like, you know, the gear, it's like, yeah, like I, you know, I really like what I did.

I'm proud of my work.

And but it's like, you know, I, it's just, I've been seeing this car for a year straight

every day.

And it's like, okay, it's like whatever.

But, and then I go see everybody else's work and I'm like, holy shit, dude.

But then they, when they tell you the same thing and it's like a hundred percent.

They're like, you know, yeah.

And like for me, like one of the biggest things like for me, like when turmoil was done was

when Mike Rain came up to our booth and he's like, Hey, like they told us that I had to

come see this bug.

And that, like, you know, I've always wanted to talk to him, but I was like, because I've

always like looked up to that dude.

I'm like, holy shit.

Like that dude's always built better shit.

I'm like, there's no way that they can top this shit.

And year after year after year, they come up with even better shit.

I'm like, holy fuck, dude.

Like, how the fuck do you keep doing this year after year?

And like you keep coming up with like different ideas, this and that.

And then like, I, like, you know, for a guy like him, you know, for me, it's like so crazy

that he, he, he would, he would tell me he's like, he's like, yeah, these cars are nice.

But he's like, I can't build what you built.

And I'm like, what are you talking about, dude?

Like, look at what you did.

Like, look at that car.

We feel that's the same way about those guys and that, you know, the industry of insecure,

really talented.

It's kind of like bodybuilding, right?

Yeah, I think the, you know, I would say we're all definitely the same.

Like everybody that builds something, all you do is see the flaws.

And I think we all sort of appreciate all those people.

It's, it's probably the people that don't see the flaws that are ones that we don't all

jive with, you know, because when you build something and you're so fucking proud of it

and you don't, and in your eyes, it's perfect.

It's probably not.

No, yeah.

But it's crazy because like you build something, you like, you work, you work, you work day after

day, week after week, month after month and like, you work and then like, you like, if

you fuck something up and there's like, sometimes like, there's like, fuck man, I can't go back

and redo this because then I have to go redo this.

Like I have to tell the whole thing apart, like fucking like, it's going to take like,

it's going to send me back three months for two weeks worth of work, you know, and it's

like, fuck man, like what do I do?

But then you're like, all right, I'm going to like, there's something like a lot of stuff

that's minor, like, okay, I'm going to live with it.

And then like, eventually, eventually, like two weeks, like two weeks before, like you'll

go back and fix it and you're like, fuck, I should have just fixed it from the beginning.

But sometimes you don't like, you know, especially if it's like super minor shit, but to you,

it's something huge.

Yeah.

You know, and then like, when you go to the shows and everything and everybody's like,

Oh, dude, this car so like, all of that goes away.

Like all the imperfections, all the flaws like that you like, that's all you see.

Yeah.

But everybody else, they don't see that.

And it's like, how the fuck do you not see that?

And it's like, sometimes it's like a mind fuck, you know, it's like, like it fucks with you

the whole time.

But then like, nobody ever says anything.

Nobody, like, I don't know if nobody notices or nobody just, they probably just don't say

nothing.

You know, it's too pretty.

It's a little bit of both.

Because like I said, like, like Troy from BBT, I told him, like, I would get like close.

I was like, I'm looking at this, looking at that.

And then he's like, Oh, don't get too close.

Like, don't look too close into it.

Cause I was like, I don't know.

Maybe there is something there, but like, I don't see that.

You know, I'm just like admiring, you know, the entire work, like all of the work that's

been done to that car.

And it's like, Holy shit, man.

Like this is badass, dude.

You know,

Yeah.

It's Jeremy's point.

Like it is a little bit, but it's mostly the fact that you're, we're seeing it.

You know, the builders are seeing it for the first time.

Right.

So we're enamored with all the things, right?

And you're just looking at all.

Nobody's ever looking at, you don't go into it.

Like you said, of like, let me go judge this thing and pick out the many, how many fucking

flaws they've got.

No, you're just, the reason you walked up to it is because it caught you.

Right.

Exactly.

So you're going to walk up to it and look at it.

So you're looking at things.

If by happenstance you do come across something that you're like, ooh, that doesn't line up.

Nobody's, at least I wouldn't.

I know you wouldn't.

Most of the people we hang out with wouldn't, you're not going to go up and be like, Hey

dude, I caught that little edge right there.

It looks like that thing's not lining up.

Who the fuck's going to say that?

Right.

We all have friends that do that.

It depends like if it was.

Yeah.

I think if Jesse brought a car out, I'd probably tell him.

Yeah.

Right.

Shut up.

Just because he wins so much, you know, yeah, I get it.

But I mean, like, I've never been like that.

Like I hate, I'm not a big fan of that.

Like people that go to like just find flaws on cars.

Because first of all, you don't know how hard somebody worked to get that car to where

it's been, you know, you don't know how much money, like not even the money, you don't

know how much time and sweat and tears that they spent on that car.

Maybe that's the best that they could do.

Yeah.

You know, but like you should never like judge.

No, but you know, it's going pick and like, I get it, you know, like for like big

competitions like high end, like competitions like this, like those judges.

Yeah.

That's what you signed up for.

So yeah, go.

Like they're the ones that are, you know, with scrutiny, like, like, okay, you know,

this is where you fucked up.

Okay.

So now I know, like, if you tell me now, I know where to improve, you know, and like,

that's like when I tell these guys, like I tell these guys a lot of time, like, hey,

if I fuck something up, let me know.

Because if you don't tell me, then I'm going to keep repeating, making the same mistakes

over and over again, because nobody said, hey, hey, this is how you, this is, you know,

you should, you probably shouldn't do this like this.

Right.

Because if you think that you're not doing anything wrong, you're going to keep doing

it, you know, but if you sit down, you'd be like, Hey, how about like, that's not right.

Let's do it like this.

See if we can make this better.

And then now you know, like, okay, that's fucked up.

Let's, let's fix this.

Yeah, you just got to have the attitude where you're willing to, you know, accept that.

You got to, the criticism, it's, it's, you got to be accepting of that.

It's how you build a good car, you know, at least give it to the next day and then be

accepting.

You can be pissed off about it in a moment, but then think about, think about it that

night.

And then you're like, yeah, you know what, you're right.

That is kind of fucked up.

I need to fix that.

Oh yeah.

You mentioned the party.

We're at the road to your shop party.

Oh, hold on for a second.

Hold on.

When we leave here, you got to give me an opportunity so I can get some tickets for these guys.

Okay.

Cause these motherfuckers sneak into your party.

No.

Bullshit.

One ticket from somebody.

You can.

Sounds like we don't need to do anything.

These fucking guys have been sneaking in for the last five years.

Sounds like they got it handled.

No, no harm, no foul.

All we need is one ticket.

They got four buddies and they're like, they're perfect.

They're getting in.

So yeah.

Don't have to tell these guys.

We helped Mikey get that scout three done last year and he got done.

I'm like, Mikey, can you please just get us some tickets, two tickets for these guys.

So they're not sneaking in this fucking party.

That was, I probably gave him to him.

He's such a good dude.

He is a good dude.

He is.

He hooked him up last year, but yeah, we got to get these guys some tickets and get him legit.

Yeah, absolutely.

It's like we take turns doing a list of stuff to get in.

Just pay attention.

I'm getting really good at rock, paper, scissors.

Just pay attention to social media.

They'll be going up for sale again.

It's funny some of the comments and some of the arguments for people that didn't get tickets.

We do a pretty good job, I think, of putting it out there as far as when they're available.

There was three weeks worth of time to get tickets last year, three whole weeks.

The first time it sold out in an hour or something like that.

But then, hey, we put them out again.

And you got a couple of days and then you put them out again.

He's got to be on it.

Reach out to say, hey.

We're not on it.

Just say, hey, man.

We wouldn't be either if we were trying to get tickets.

We'd be like you guys like the day of.

I'm on it the day of.

The party's today.

It's today.

All right.

We just need one pass.

Josh did say the leg was cut.

I also said, put me on that chair.

Make sure you don't cut that out.

We actually did have a little bit of an argument over that meeting.

Josh leading up because Josh is very structured and very organized.

I just roll, you know, and it's the same.

Josh couldn't understand why I felt we needed an extra surplus of wristbands.

Yeah.

At the actual parties that we've put it.

I'm like, dude, it's the hot rod industry.

Like nobody plans for shit.

Right.

So we're going to have at least 30 like key customers that like need to take that are

like, oh, dude, I never I didn't even know you guys were having a party.

And it.

Yeah.

It could be difficult.

There you go.

We're getting.

We're sort of.

There's always the extras.

That's not the problem.

We're sort of improving.

It's kind of fun sneaking in.

Yeah.

I'll tell you what you can't.

You cannot sneak in if you're underage.

They are really good at that.

Yeah, they are.

There's been a few like, you know, customers have had some, some of their kids and stuff.

We're really a teenage kid, 18, 19, 20.

They lock that down, man.

Well, it's the the event and the liquor license is tied to the is tied to the gambling license.

So they're not having it.

They're not going to let one kid in no matter how important they are because of a billion

dollar mistake.

Yeah.

And I've had some people ask you.

I'm like, dude, I'm not.

Yeah.

We're not.

You don't understand how important it is.

He's like, yeah, fuck you.

We got the gambling license.

That's what makes our money.

So who cares?

His birthday.

His 21st birthday is one two weeks.

Yeah.

Come back two weeks.

Yeah.

Also, don't bring.

If you're a staffer, don't bring your wife because.

He was the one.

Oh, Stafford.

Yes.

We didn't really go into much detail.

No.

She told us not to really talk about it.

So we can't now that they're always this.

Is this an opportunity to go back and revisit?

I mean, we can.

Absolutely.

Why not?

It's already been done.

I forget what.

But there's a lot that goes on those nights and you catch like little bits and pieces

and there was somebody was extracted.

Yeah.

She got she got kicked out.

I think two years ago at the.

Old.

The one the Aria.

And it was something that was to do with like a bathroom attendant or something like that.

I think they're cleaning a bathroom and then maybe she just went and used the bathroom

and they didn't like it.

And then there were some words exchange.

It really wasn't anything on her fault.

Yeah.

So much.

They don't let you do drugs on those bathrooms.

I don't think so.

I think there's signs.

Yeah, there's signs.

There's signs in every stall that says we will kick you out if you're doing.

They also.

Josh can tell you the stories about what happens to if you pass out in a Vegas bathroom.

They don't like that either.

No, they give you significantly longer time than you would think they give you.

But sooner or later, once the time limit is up.

I figured it'd be more comfortable to pass out in a booth in the bathroom.

No, they don't like that.

Well, now where was it?

We are at the hotel in Florida that Scott's old man passed out will fell asleep.

Oh, yeah.

They weren't having that.

No, they weren't.

That's like, you know, I'm in a fucking wedding here.

He could sleep on the bar.

Yeah, he wants to.

Yeah.

Sorry, sir.

I didn't like that.

But yeah, they people don't like.

Yeah, there's something about you.

You know, you can always tell you can always tell it's like the people that didn't take

their Vegas snap, you know, like after the show, like, you go back to room to the nap

and like, all right, where are we going out?

You know, I know.

We keep thinking.

Everybody's got their own idea of what time the party should start.

Yeah.

So we're going to, I don't know.

Do you think it should move earlier?

I don't.

I don't know.

I don't think so.

Just go later.

I think you should just let it go on even later.

Let it go on even later.

Yeah.

No, no earlier.

Brick Brothers are the ones pushing for like a 430 start.

Ooh, and room service to feel like.

Because at Hilton, hospitality feels like...

Your cabana's ready.

Would you like fresh towels?

It matters where you stay.

Book now at Hilton.com.

Hilton, for this day.

They were doing fine.

I don't think, I think that this year, this last year, this last year at the new venue

with a little bit of fresh air and just the vibe and everything went.

I don't think anybody was complaining about how late it was at the end of the night.

I'm surprised that nobody took a dip in that pool.

Yeah, I'm shocked.

That's a big shout out to the whole industry.

It's been said like 15 times now.

Yeah, we're all getting way more mature.

The first year we did this, at the time it was called the SLS.

And it was the same setup just in a much smaller venue.

It was around a pool and I'm like, dude, somebody's going in this motherfucking pool.

I know our people, our community.

Somebody went in the pool.

Okay, first year somebody went in the pool.

This year we were a little concerned about it.

We had them tighten it up a bit so it didn't go all the way out, but nobody went in the pool.

Everybody's...

Maybe a lot of people didn't know there was a pool there.

You could get out there.

Well, tickets will be handled.

You're in the know now.

VIP.

I got the know.

Just two.

When you see the...

You got a whole crew.

I'm like the Ring Brothers.

I'm in bed by six.

Feels good.

Not that night or not.

I'll tell you, when you do that in Vegas, though, that's a wise decision.

There's usually one or two nights.

We're there for like 10 days.

It's something to be seen.

I mean, these guys know that this last, especially this last year when you've got, you know, Alan and Angie Johnson,

you've got Bobby and Cindy Allaway, you've got Troy and you've got them, and it's been done.

Like the party's been over.

Been over for a while and they're up on the tables dancing and it just keeps going.

It's a very unique thing of the industry where you can have that many, you know, high-end builders, manufacturers, basically the who's who.

And it's just like letting it go.

Having fun.

Because there is no...

Nobody's competing against anybody for anything.

It's just like, hey, we've all kicked ass this whole week.

Yeah, we've got to go to the show tomorrow, but it's Friday. Let's face it.

It's not the same.

It's almost, you know, I'll let people use their imagination.

But if you know anything about the Olympics, there's a lot of pressure going into it.

And they have a certain issue once you get to the Olympics, you know, all the athletes.

I don't think that's the same issue.

Yeah, but everybody's under a lot of pressure.

Everybody's fucking working their ass off.

And it's like you're under so much pressure and stress constantly that it's finally...

Prior to SEMA.

Yeah, prior to SEMA, right up to that point.

We're right at the tail end and it's like, finally, you can sort of let loose.

I tell you, we've never...

This is somebody, while I'm thinking about it, we have the opportunity to...

I know you did a good job of thanking all the staff at the party from the Roachershop staff that helped put everything on.

I forgot Chris and Elliot.

You forgot Chris and Elliot, but that's fine.

Yeah.

It's all handled.

I don't know if we've given enough credit to the sales staff that does that amount of work during the day,

then that amount of work for the setup, and then parties, but then supposedly...

I guess we need to be there the next morning to see if anybody shows up,

but supposedly they're there the next Friday morning working the booth.

Yeah.

And that's a difficult...

Well, we definitely need to give Will props for his ability to lay down flooring.

No.

No, we don't need to give Will any props because for any ability to lay down flooring.

We found what Will can't do that's lay down flooring.

What could Will do?

Will can do a lot of things just not lay down flooring.

We had a new booth this year, and we had a new flooring to put down.

And it doesn't seem like a big deal, but then when you start laying out the space,

you're like, holy shit, this is big, right?

It's massive, and it chooses big.

I don't think anybody was looking to the flooring one, you know, the appealing one.

But the flooring had to be put down still, right?

So as we're...

We did the first row, it's snapping together.

We're like, man, this thing's going quick.

We're going to be doing it in no time, like six hours later.

We're still going.

Yeah, it was a 10-man crew six hours long.

And then we had the guys from Adam's Brothers, I mean, Adam's Customs.

You had so many people coming to like...

Terry Rosen.

Yeah, Terry Rosen stuff.

Some random people just showed up.

He should have just hired some professionals.

But everybody, even guys walking in off the street, just, hey, I'll help put some floor

down, somehow managed to snap some flooring together.

However, Will...

That's an interesting take on it.

Right?

Will's a great sales guy that works for us, and he was there from the first click, right?

He needed to go down.

He was there.

And for some reason, he had always grabbed a bad tile, right?

And it was funny because we're laughing, we're going through and we had a system, right?

You'd lay tiles out and you'd combine and you'd snap them down, right?

And you just click together stuff.

And Will was like, oh, this is a bad one.

Oh, this one's bad too.

Oh, yeah, and this one's no good.

Yeah, this one's not going to work.

It's like, what do you mean they're not going to work?

What are you doing?

And it's like the snapping together is like breaking the tabs.

And you can have a guy that just worked two brothers that just built two vehicles that's

worked for two weeks.

They come together and they just, they don't even ask anything.

They just grab things and start clicking together.

I'm like, is it the bad tiles or is it Will?

Will.

I just don't think that you can handle...

Not qualify.

Oh, yeah, here's another bad one.

They're not bad.

It's bad now.

You broke it.

Was it bad before you grabbed it?

It was bad after you grabbed it.

It's bad now.

Where are we going next?

Okay.

Talked about Will Hub.

We talked about this industry.

What is your takeaway now coming into more of this industry?

We've talked about it on the hot rod shop side.

What's a car that you would like to build that you haven't done yet?

It's probably just a mini American car.

Something.

Yeah.

The Amber.

Yeah, an Amber.

Oh.

Yeah.

You want to do an Amber car, something like a Model A, something kind of small.

Something to challenge us a little bit.

I don't think we'll ever do a Volkswagen to this level again.

I feel like a Model A is very applicable to this.

When you glance at this picture, you can quickly glance at that.

Proportions are Model A.

Same.

A lot of the sort of ideology, the style could very much be applied to.

I'm a Model A fan.

I love Model A's.

Yeah.

It'd be cool to see you guys do one.

Yeah.

The one Andy did a couple years back was a blue one.

Yeah.

A lot of the kind of crazy machine parts.

The thing was cool.

Oh, yeah.

How does this do at Volkswagen shows?

We don't take them there.

They're kind of frowned upon, to be honest with you.

It's just not.

Really?

Well, Volkswagen people are very cheap and never mind.

Especially people.

I'll leave it at that.

Yeah.

They look at that car and they're like, oh, you could do whatever.

If we had that kind of money, we could do that.

But no, you couldn't.

It's not just the money.

No.

You got to have everybody in.

It takes the money, but the money's not what did it.

The passion, the heart and the ideas and not stopping.

Not stopping is a big thing.

Do you guys hear any of that along the way?

We talked about this on one of the recent podcasts about people just making sort of

snide comments about things.

Do you ever encounter that just like the must be nice sort of attitude?

Yeah.

All the time.

Yeah.

I think it's pretty cool to come into this world with something foreign.

And I'm not just saying something like a foreign car.

I'm just saying something completely different.

Right.

Out of the box.

And at this point, we've done cars for Volkswagen shows for people that are into

Volkswagen enthusiasts.

But it's like, like I said, those are special people.

Those are their own entity.

But to come in here and bring our style into this world and to be accepted like this

and just like, holy shit, dude.

Like, you know, it's been awesome.

Yeah.

It's been like crazy.

Yeah.

And like, you know, it kind of speaks for itself.

Right.

Yeah.

And like, like, I watched one of the earlier podcasts and I think it was the Ron Jones

one.

Yeah.

And he's like, oh, it was nice to see a Volkswagen went for one, you know, and it's

like, and, you know, and then, you know, talking to everybody, I didn't know that there was

this many people that were that were into Volkswagen.

Yeah.

You know, like the hot rod people sort of secretly into him.

Yeah.

You know, like if you're a hot rod or you've got a like, you sort of like, I dig the shit

out of bugs.

Yeah.

I want one.

I'd love to have one.

I'd love to have a badass hammered bug.

I'd love to see my wife bombing around town and one.

I want notchbacks.

Yeah.

Notchbacks are cool.

It's a little one.

It's like the first hot rod.

Yeah.

Like for me, I was never into like, what are you into Jesus?

So like growing up, I was, I always had like, for me, it was like C 10s.

I was always been a truck guy.

And then like, I was always in, uh, uh, Fierro's too.

Yeah.

He's been talking about this for probably five years and the whole time I thought he

was joking.

He showed me the picture for the first time last night.

Yeah.

I'm a fucking Fierro guy.

Are you serious?

No, dude.

So like, I'm not, I'm not into a Fierro enthusiast.

I would buy a Fierro with a five speed to just bomb around town.

Dude, don't do it.

No.

Uh, I mean, like, I got some.

It's like a mini super car.

So two weeks you'd be at crossroads.

He can be a super car.

Yeah.

I've gotten, I've gotten convinced.

Are you going to, are you, are you not?

Is it like, you've had one?

He's had one for a fucking long time.

He's had a view.

I thought he was kidding the entire time.

I thought he was bullshitting me.

And we would laugh cause I thought he was joking.

He's been serious the whole time.

You've got like V8 swapping on them.

Uh, oh, fuck man.

Where does the windshield hit you?

Like here?

It's modified, dude.

I did not see that coming.

I wouldn't have guessed that.

It wasn't on my big go guard.

I wouldn't have guessed that on first car.

Do we have another three hours?

If it's about Fierro's, no.

Start wrapping it up.

I'm your support group here on the Fierro.

I got you, dude.

So we'll, we'll make a separate podcast.

I got you.

No, but yeah.

Please.

You know, I got something in the works for sure.

It's like, you know, and it's along those lines.

And it's like, you know, and this is how it gets treated.

You know, like, you know, this is the reaction when you tell people

something about a fucking Fierro.

What the fuck, dude?

Like, you know, it's like, yeah.

What do you, I mean, honestly, laugh all you want about a fear

of fear is maybe it's already got a reputation.

Here we go.

You can modify a fucking Fierro.

Yeah.

Like give ring brothers do a fear.

Oh, fuck.

Are you laughing?

Yeah.

Yeah, you could build anything.

Well, yeah.

Right.

No, not anything.

Anything you could build.

So it's funny you say that because I, it has,

there's enough good going for it.

Yeah.

I talked to Mike ring about it.

Yeah.

So I told him about it and he is like, he was like, oh, yeah, dude,

like, like, what the fuck?

He's like, you know, he was like, all excited for me.

And I was like, man, this is fucking cool.

Like, this is like, you know, it's crazy.

So I told him, like, I want to build a fucking, you know, how they

build that.

That Aston Martin.

Like it's like along those lines where

I'm going to tell you something.

I don't think Pontiac would have the same troubles.

I told him that, you know, I told him that and he was like, he

didn't like shut me down or like joke about it like anybody else.

He wasn't hurt.

He wasn't an asshole.

Like, yeah, it's a, it's a completely different conversation.

If you're like, Hey, I've got an idea to build a wild and crazy

Fero than it is.

I'm just really into Fero.

That's completely different.

It's you.

They're two completely different conversations, right?

Cause we can have the conversation.

Like, man, let's, let's find some weirdo cars to push the envelope.

If we had that customer to build some crazy shit.

Dude, I'm down.

Let's talk about this.

I've wanted to do here.

You want to hear a crazy one?

I wanted to do a Marlin AMC Marlin, right?

Rear engine, you know, like crazy hemi under glass kind of style,

but in the backside do a crazy.

Yeah.

You could build something.

You could build something wild.

This is the first time he's saying this is like a safe space note.

Trust.

This is our trust tree.

I put tea tops on it.

My point to that is.

Can you brush a Marlin on the side and make it look like a Marlin?

A crazy, a crazy concept for a weirdo car.

For a weirdo car is a conversation that's very different than says,

you know, I tell you what, I've always been into those AMC Marlins.

That's a car.

I'm an enthusiast.

You made a great point there.

I agree with you.

There's weirdo stuff you can come up with.

You prefaced it with like, I've always been into Fierro's.

And I'm going to have to say you haven't.

You haven't been into many Fierro's.

Now you have got a great idea to build a Fierro.

Now let's talk about cool shit like that.

But you're not a Fierro enthusiast, please.

He said he's had multiple Fierro's.

In preparation for this big build, please.

I thought he was joking up until the point of last night.

Troy from BBT texted me this clean Fierro like three weeks ago.

I'm looking at it and I'm like, what the fuck?

Troy texted you that because he's been wanting like a 308.

Because he's been talking and then I find out he's been talking to Troy.

A 348 and a Fierro.

You can turn the Fierro into.

Or a Kuntash or a F40.

Yeah, fuck that, dude.

That's where I went when you were modifying a Fierro.

Yeah, but the thing is, I want to build this car.

Like I said, I told Mike about it.

Mike Ring, I told him, I was like, hey, when this car comes out, I want people to say.

Because they're not going to know who the fuck I am.

I built Volkswagen's with these guys.

Dude, who the fuck are we?

You come out with a Fierro, people are going to know who you are.

In short time.

We came out with a Karmic Gea and a Bug and people know who we are now.

What's the engine?

What's the power plant?

Well, it's going to be a GM power plant.

But the thing is like, my point with this car is, you know, I've always believed that this is, this car was ahead of its time.

I would probably just shut up at this point.

Let him talk, let him talk.

I always believed that this car.

People were telling Steve Jobs when he was talking about this.

He's like, it's going to be, it's everything is going to be on it.

Yeah, that's right.

You're crazy.

Same.

I always believed that this car was the ultimate American sports car.

We're just going to say things.

I've always thought I could fly.

Put a parachute on him.

The outlandish, outlandish statements.

Tell me another American, tell me another American car that's ever like another mid-engine car.

Just a Pantera.

It's not fully American.

Right.

A what?

A Vega.

A Chevy Vega.

They're like, everybody sit on that car today.

Yeah, that's for a reason.

A Corvair.

There you go.

Well, the Corv, I mean, hey, that's a good.

For stylistic wise.

The Corv is a beautiful car.

Exactly.

It's like mechanically not real good, but yeah.

What?

I mean, some guys doing some cool shit with them right now.

Classic car studios doing a wild, wild Corvette.

I talked to the customer that owns the Corvette.

A very similar deal.

Like a classic car studio is building a really bad ass Corvette.

Yeah.

You know what?

Very similar deal.

So see, you know what?

That guy's just like, do it.

This is how strong I feel about a Fero.

I'm glad we're getting to it.

I don't think we've touched the surface.

You 100%, I'm with you.

I swear.

Being serious.

A Fero would be an amazing, wild platform to build a crazy vehicle out of.

If you were just going to go balls to the wall.

However, however, it's not the fact that it's like everybody's overlooked it.

Right.

And it's the American.

Just say it's a weirdo car that could be really, really cool because the Fero.

If you see a stock Fero.

If you saw, if you see a name sounds cool.

No, it's made, it's made after fire.

It caught on fire.

Magnesium block caught on fire.

Fero.

It's not a magnesium block.

I'm pretty sure.

No.

Feros wish they had a magnesium block.

The original engine that was in it was called the iron Duke because it was made of iron.

Here we go.

Fact checking.

Fact checking right now.

Josh was thrown off when he said ultimate American sports car.

I bet you guys had no idea that this was going to go here.

To get back to my point, the thing is, I want to build this car.

They killed this car off for the wrong reasons.

And I want to build this car.

I want to build this car to, I want to make it to what the potential of what this car could have been.

And when I build this car, I want people to say, like I said, people don't know who I am.

And I want people to say, when they see this car, they're like, what the fuck, did the ring brothers build this car?

I want it to be like to that caliber.

Here's my offer.

Like how they built that Aston Martin.

I'm with you 100%.

And here's my offer.

We opened this podcast with him talking about painting cars and how he did it for the cost of materials.

And he did it to put the fucking work in.

Well, it takes the customer to identify that talent.

I'm your customer.

I'm the guy that's identifying that you're passionate about Fierro's and you have the talent.

Now let's build one for just sheer cost.

Of materials.

And I will fund it at cost.

And we're talking about you're going to build pure.

You're going to build it on a pure passion.

Labor free.

Right.

Just because you love the Fierro.

You're doing this for the passion of the Fierro.

And we're going to create the ultimate question right there.

So like, I think it's done.

Shake.

I think you should shake on it.

Wagner will probably do the motor.

Paying for materials is a big fucking deal.

Yeah.

And then we'll build this fucking.

Shake on it.

Shake on it right here.

Let's fucking do it now.

You better shake on it right now.

Yeah, let's do it.

Fucking license plate says I licked it.

Fucking put it on there.

You just lost an employee.

You guys got to lick it.

Where I was going with that, I was going to finish it up again.

Where I 100%, I think this is going to be, I'm, I'm like,

literally can't handle the excitement of what this is.

That's what Pontiac was all about.

We build excitement.

Great time.

To shake.

When I see a picture of a stock Fierro, right?

If I see that standard, like the red with the gray on the bottom of it,

Pontiac, you know, magazine logo, I mean, magazine ad.

I see that.

I, it looks like Murray faffs rendition of a third gen Camaro.

It's like Murray faffs take on a third gen Camaro.

We're throwing daggers.

Is where you got to tell me about it.

Look at the front of a Fierro.

Okay.

And.

Firebird more.

Firebird.

Right.

Firebird.

Sorry.

Third gen.

Do you shorten it?

Is it your enthusiasm?

Is it a GTS?

Was that the like the high end one?

The GT.

GT.

Look up the white, like a white GT.

They, I'm telling it.

Tell me you wouldn't, if you.

Look, look at that.

That's your car right now, dude.

If you found a clean.

You got an ND 500 car.

All right.

A clean.

That's a formula.

Go go go to the fastback.

This car.

The one in the corner on the left.

This car pops up.

Cheap.

No reserve.

Bring a trailer.

Yep.

2,500 bucks.

You're like, everybody's sleeping on it.

Low mileage, five speed.

You're not.

The one Troy said.

Low mileage.

Okay.

You don't think that would be fun to bomb around it.

Not as fun as a probe.

You know, it performs a probe, dude.

You're crazy.

Probes world renowned for their handling.

Everybody knows that.

Look it up.

Yeah.

Look what happened to yours.

All right.

I think this guy's just credited.

He's giving me shit.

Look at that.

You're talking about fucking pro.

You're honest.

You're making yourself sound stupid right now.

Fero or MR2, Josh?

No, the Fero destroys the MR2.

The Fero.

MR2 was a higher performing vehicle.

However, it also was a little more.

Maybe boring in your wheelhouse.

The MR2 also came out.

No, that's all those.

Clear knockoff.

Exactly.

Here.

Del Sol, MR2, Fero, all for chicks.

All chick cars.

No.

Chicks didn't drive the Fero.

Chicks did not drive the Fero.

You didn't know how to drive a stick.

They sat passenger.

Yeah.

Dudes that want to be chicks do.

We've experienced that.

Yes.

We've experienced that.

Google F40 LS3 Fero Swap.

So the F40 is the G8, the transverse gearbox.

So you can six speed swap these with an LS.

There's one on sweet.

And dude, it is a great fucking package.

You know what?

Fero's are about to fucking skyrocket in price.

After this podcast, they're going to skyrocket.

Yeah.

I would advise to buy them up.

Yeah.

Buy them up while you can.

Hey, if we're going to do this, you've got to be fucking kidding me.

Look at the drivetrain.

Look at that.

Look at how compact that trans is.

It doesn't matter.

Look at the outside of the vehicle.

It's gross.

There's nothing even kind of like.

No.

Yeah.

I agree.

You're going to have to chop the whole thing up.

You have to chop every car up.

No matter what.

I can't believe this is where we went.

What?

I know.

That's what I'm telling you.

Fucking Fero.

And here's the thing.

Dude, I've been coming up with so many ideas for this fucking car.

And then we just came back from Rad Rides and he's building a third gen Camaro.

It looks like a Fero.

Exactly.

Can we let that out?

I don't think we can let that out of the bag.

Dude, and I was like geeking out.

I was like, holy fuck, dude, like imagine if I applied all this shit on the fucking Fero.

Yeah, imagine.

Fucking hate her.

Hey.

Hey, I'm with him.

Hey, two D1 haters right here.

You got to block out the noise.

If you guys would have told somebody.

Look at that.

Look at that right there.

It's gross.

When you went out and you're like, hey, we're going to build a Carmen Guilla and win the Sloan.

And people are like, okay.

Yeah, okay.

Exactly.

So you're saying this is gross.

So like this was the American Ferrari and what they were saying about the Carmen Guilla.

The Carmen Guilla was a poor man's Porsche.

This is a fucking American Ferrari, dude.

I think I did read an article that said exactly that.

That's what I think.

Didn't Ferrari make Pontiac stop building them?

Just if you look to the left, there's a couple of American Ferrari.

Look at the one on the far left.

Okay.

Now the one on the right there.

That's pretty badass right there.

Okay.

So who do you hold to a higher standard?

You know what would even be better than that?

Enzo Ferrari or Fernan Porsche?

A Beretta.

Build a Beretta.

I don't know.

Now you got something.

Build a Beretta.

That's a tough one to answer.

Yeah.

Who do you hold up to a higher standard?

Fernan Porsche or Enzo Ferrari?

I don't know.

There was never a question.

Who has anything to do with Fero in that statement?

Who is it?

Or like Dan Pontiac.

Who is behind the Pontiac name?

Fero.

Does anybody know?

Who builds more excitement?

Josh Michler is going to love Dan Pontiac.

No, but the Fero, was it the Fero?

Who is behind Pontiac and drove the Fero, the design of the Fero?

Wasn't the Fero a DeLorean?

No.

I don't remember it was long gone.

Yeah.

He was locked the fuck up.

There's somebody.

The DeLorean didn't have nearly enough room to cram it full of cocaine.

What are you typing at?

Who's, uh...

Who designed the Fero?

His name was Hoski.

Designed it.

What was his name?

Hoki.

He knows it.

Right there.

See?

Hoki.

He seems American.

This is not good.

I told you this is not good.

Who's...

We have lost all credibility now.

See, that was the problem.

That was where I was trying to get to the beginning.

If he would have just said,

I got this crazy idea to build it.

He's truly into him.

He is into him.

Big time.

I thought he was kidding.

I've been around him for ten years.

I thought he was joking.

Josh is long.

I've known this guy for a very long time,

and when I met him,

he had a Fero.

And I knew that.

I never knew.

Holy shit.

The P-Car.

Project Pegasus.

I had one for the weekdays for work,

and then I had one for the weekends.

Taking the lady out.

Yeah, exactly, dude.

Three hundred and something episodes.

I'll tell you one thing.

I parked it at the Scottsdale Ferrari.

Leave the keys in it with the windows down.

I promise you ain't got nothing to worry about.

Well, yeah, it's Scottsdale.

Who's gonna steal anything?

It's a Fero.

But nobody knew the difference

between the Fero and the Ferrari.

What makes you say that?

Because I had motherfuckers making me offers.

You know what?

You sold me.

I got the pictures to prove it.

Who's behind the Pontiac brand?

The Pontiac brand doesn't exist anymore.

No, but who was the driving force

who created the Pontiac brand?

Did it ever exist independently

outside of General Motors?

No.

It was always a subset of that.

Well, maybe back, way back in the day.

No, we should know.

We should know.

Well, we're about to find out.

Pontiac brand.

GM was behind it in 2600.

It did.

And then it came on along with Buick and.

That was just a subsidiary.

Welcome to Sephora.

I'm looking for a perfume that's not too perfuming.

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Serum Moisturizer or Moisturizer Serum.

Let's get into layering.

My concealer is making me look worse.

Sounds like the wrong shade.

Let's get you meshed.

There's only one store that really gets

what you're going for.

Get Beauty from People Who Get Beauty.

Only at Sephora.

Hi.

Let's get you a basket.

Kayak gets my flight, hotel, and rental car right.

So I can tune out travel advice that's just plain wrong.

Bro, sky coin.

Way better than points.

Never fly during a Scorpio full moon.

Just tell the manager you'll sue.

Instant room upgrade.

Stop taking bad travel advice.

Start comparing hundreds of sites with Kayak.

And get your trip right.

Bad advice.

You talking to me?

Kayak.

Got that right.

Well, there's, if you're Googling that, there's some good designers.

There's some good Pontiac cars.

That's your boy, dude.

Freaking Reynolds with the Trans Am.

Pontiac made him.

You know what?

Pontiac.

Yeah, right there.

John DeLorean, influential GM leader who directed development

like Pontiac Performance Models.

John DeLorean.

He didn't start Pontiac.

No, no, no.

Yeah, he was influential.

The Firebirds and some of the Performance Pontiac stuff.

Back in the GTO, right?

To the GTO.

The GTO, there was Jim Wangers.

A part of the GTO.

Interesting, his name doesn't come up.

All right, moving on.

Let's just leave it at...

They ain't leaving it at nothing.

Y'all just shook on a fucking build.

You guys shook on a build.

You guys shook.

Look, you're out $3,600.

Easy.

And a chassis.

Easy.

That's just a deposit.

No shit, huh?

What's that get you a mint, like 12 mile, one owner?

They'd go for a few bucks.

A few?

Yeah, seriously.

I think the one Troy sent me was like $5,500.

No, Joe.

Go on, bring a trailer right now and look it up.

Because some, like, clean example,

they'll go in the upper 20s.

20s?

Do you think folks on bring a trailer

are confusing them for Ferraris too?

Yeah.

Hey, Jesus.

I know you'll find him.

I bet you'll find him commenting.

Do it real quick.

Most people on bring a trailer are delusional.

How much is your fear of Jesus?

It's priceless.

That's the right answer.

Yeah, it is.

That is the right answer.

But I have filed a few of them on there.

And look them up, because there's a few good examples.

Low mileage, survivor type units.

Like for an Indie Fiero.

Oh.

Look at the chart.

Look at the rise of the chart.

Yeah, there's one at $35,000.

I'll keep you.

These are, I mean, it's average.

These are project cars.

8,200 bucks.

These are project cars.

8,200 dollars.

It's 24,000 miles.

That's an Indie Pace car too.

Yeah, for 6,600 bucks.

Dude, it's a four-speed car.

Yeah, it's in Canada.

Look, this one is a Ferrari.

That's where the confusion comes in.

Oh, now I can get behind it.

I didn't know they made those.

Dude, stop it.

Just find it.

I was just, this was an honest, but just find a clean example.

There's 10,000 miles, 13,4.

Just click on one of the higher, go up in the chart, click.

Click on the one that was 60 grand.

See what that's all about.

Yeah, dude.

Don't try to fuck us, man.

All right, 32 Gs.

See?

417 miles.

Wow.

417 miles?

Looks like a smurf.

See?

You know they're reliable if it goes for 417 miles.

Even the dude that bought it, brand new, was like, yeah, fuck it.

I can't do this anymore.

He got double his money.

I'll put it in the garage.

Let's see what 60 Gs gets you.

A custom one.

That's a Diablo.

Diablo conversion.

Yes.

Oh my God.

I've never seen anybody.

I've seen it.

It's sold for 60,000.

That looks like it's in the neighborhood behind our shop.

It's sold for 60,000.

North Aurora, right?

That's right in our backyard.

At the end of the day, it's still a fucking theater.

It's sold for 60,000.

That's just a hint.

It was too many.

There's a couple of Countashes.

Those are going just for just as much as a low mileage one.

If not more.

17.

Countashed out.

There's a 39255.

Let me ask you a serious question.

I'm dead serious.

I'll shoot you straight.

I'm with you on a crazy build.

Could be cool.

He's going to do it.

He shook on it.

I know.

Just follow my train of thought.

Okay.

You're going to get lost.

You have said that this was a well renowned mid-engine American performance car touted

across the lands of its performance prowess.

Thank you.

You've talked about it's a well handling car.

You even made the statement that it out handled the probe, right?

Yeah.

That was more of a hurtful comment towards you.

I don't have anything to back that comment up.

However, if it's a fairly decent mid-80s General Motors performance vehicle that everyone's

like, oh man, that thing could be really cool.

Serious going.

Would it not be also just as cool or cooler to have a Countash bodied Fiero?

And if I were to purchase that, you could not give me shit about it.

Because I've got the best of all worlds.

I've got a Countash body on the performance of a Pontiac Fiero.

You've got to fake Countash.

I've got a different direction for you.

I thought you were going.

Okay.

You actually have a really good Countash because it's on a Fiero.

Well, yeah.

Platform, dude.

So you can't give me shit.

I guess you're right.

I can get a Countash.

I like this thinking.

That was good thinking.

I was just wondering how many Countashes, F40s, Testeroses, Diablos.

Fieroslops.

Indefieros.

Yeah, none.

Okay.

That's 100% none.

Hey, those people didn't do it for, you know, the price-wise.

They did it for the performance.

Yeah.

You know?

Yeah.

They started with a performance platform.

They're like, I've driven a real Countash and it just didn't handle as well as a Fiero one.

We've figured out-

I've driven a real Countash and it just doesn't handle as well as a Fiero one.

That's also somewhere around here.

Oh, damn it.

You're right.

You're right because you can go buy a Diablo.

Yeah.

Anybody can buy a Diablo.

Yeah, they're everywhere.

But imagine buying a Diablo on a Fiero chassis.

That you can just pile the miles on it.

Exactly.

Imagine.

Make this three miles.

Yeah, exactly.

And say the thing that has only 30,000 miles.

You're going to be like, holy shit, I still got another 200,000 miles.

I thought that this was going to be all for naught.

Turns out I'm getting a Countash.

On a Fiero chassis.

But it's a Countash and you now have gone on record that you cannot say shit about it.

You have to admire it for the performance vehicle that it is.

I truly would.

It's only performance if it's on a Fiero chassis.

No, I like weird shit.

If you did that, you know I would support it.

You know I would.

He'd have a Ferrari and a Countash.

I would support that.

I would give you less.

That's horrible.

What's wrong with that?

That's the same shifter.

I would give you less shit for that than having a C8, honestly.

At least it's not like you're not trying to be something you're not.

So you see the...

You're taking a Fiero.

Like I said, the Fiero was ahead of its time.

The C8 is behind its time because I don't know if you realize this,

but the Corvette was supposed to be mid-engine for the C6.

16.5 right there for that.

That proportions actually work on that.

We're making a podcast purchase.

All right.

So here it is.

If you, if anybody know, if you're like, I don't know if there's,

if people are still posting stuff on Craigslist.

If you know of a...

We lost him at Fiero.

If you know of a kit car bodied Lamborghini Ferrari,

and a quality re-bodied Fiero, send it in.

It's just got to be right though.

Yeah.

We're not looking for junk.

No.

He said quality.

We're not looking for junk.

Quality and Fiero.

Send it in and we are purchasing it.

You're going to get so much shit.

We're purchasing it.

We're purchasing it and we will drive the shit out of it.

Josh is going to take his wife out to a nice dinner.

He's in a ballet.

And you better tell him, don't scratch it.

Well, obviously, I mean, he's going to know.

Like you said, they can't even differentiate him, right?

The best thing in the world is taking a shit box to a really high-end ballet.

Yeah.

And telling him, don't scratch it.

Don't scratch it.

I can't give him a five-spot.

I cannot believe we found ourselves here.

Yeah, that's what I said earlier.

Keep the change.

It's standard questions time.

First up, standard questions.

I'm throwing off now, but we can't even go first car.

He's got cameras on the mind.

We'll start.

You're psyched out, but let's hit him with first car.

Yeah.

We're going to get some information to see.

I'm psyched out.

I don't even have anything in my head.

No, we always, full disclosure, we always struggle with West Coast people.

Western.

What part of Arizona were you born and raised?

Phoenix.

Okay, Phoenix.

And what year did you graduate high school?

I didn't.

Okay, what year did you get your driver's license?

Shit.

Ballpark.

I don't know.

How old are you now?

88.

58.

56.

52.

Wait, what?

So 74.

84.

Yeah.

So you would have graduated in 93.

94.

Okay.

Yeah.

You're my driver's license.

Yeah.

That's why you would have been 18.

So 91.

91, yeah.

What kind of driver's license?

16.

19.

90.

Oh, 1990.

Okay.

90.

That's close.

All right.

90.

Hand me down car, family car, something you...

Lusted for.

No, don't say what it is.

Don't say what it is.

Something you lusted for and saved up and purchased or...

Yeah.

Was this a gift?

Was it a hand me down?

Did you buy it?

Did you save up money?

I bought it.

I saved up my car.

And you wanted it?

Well, I didn't want it.

Don't say what it is.

We're gathering information.

Sorry.

I got it.

Well, I got what I'm thinking.

I'm just...

90?

Yeah.

A Fiero.

No, a Suzu...

90, a Suzu two-wheel drive pickup truck.

I was going to go Toyota pickup truck.

I swear.

I feel like it's a small pickup truck.

I was going Toyota pickup truck.

It was a European.

It was a Buick Riada.

Was it really?

I was going Toyota pickup truck.

That's another car that was I have its time to...

Was it a bug?

No.

You got something?

Oh, wow.

Were you always a Volkswagen fan?

Yeah.

That's a golf.

Yeah.

Really?

What was it?

76 Camaro.

Fucking.

76.

See a little bit of the mullet flipping.

Yeah.

I had a mullet too.

100%.

And a knee track.

With the big back tire.

You had hair?

All right.

So 76 Camaro, you get that at 16.

You run it through its paces.

Now it's the first night, right?

You're headed out.

Sun ain't fully set, but it's the night on the town, right?

What's...

What are you listening to?

What's the first thing you're listening to?

Oh, shit.

And that's a cassette, right?

Oh, shit.

That's a cassette, dude.

I don't remember.

You better remember.

I don't...

I can...

90?

I couldn't try the nirvana.

Okay.

Oh, hell yeah.

It's pretty nirvana.

It's Beastie Boys.

In 90 were you...

90...

No, 90 wouldn't have been Disc Man era, right?

Like, you weren't...

No.

90's too early.

No.

90's still tight.

Yeah, tight.

Because that was nirvana.

That was nirvana, for sure.

I was mid-90's and I was adapting the cassette into the CD player.

CD player.

Because it was skipping like a motherfucker.

So it smells like Teen Spirit.

Rate me.

Was that 90?

Yeah.

What about you don't say the car?

Was your first vehicle a gift or something you purchased?

I purchased...

Okay.

And was it a mode of transportation or is it something you wanted to have?

It was a mode of transportation and after I got it I was like,

this son of a bitch is sick.

Okay.

It was a Chevy S10.

Oh.

It was clock radio.

I bought it from a guy that put a lot of money into it.

It was a low rider.

Okay.

What year did you graduate?

What year did you get your driver's license?

I don't remember.

Was this square body S10 or rounder?

Oh, square body?

Yeah, I don't remember.

Yeah, I got it.

But the guy was into the lucid things, you know?

Yeah.

And it was a low rider truck.

Elicit things make the best low riders.

Yeah, that was done.

Aren't they all based on that?

Yeah.

It was a square body S10 truck.

Square body S10.

That I bought for 800 bucks.

It had a lot more money into it at the time.

Yeah, if you filled the gas tank it's already there.

You doubled it?

No, it was sick dude.

It was a, I bought a low rider truck when I was 18 basically years old.

From, how do I say this, somebody that needed to get off of it quick.

Yeah.

Yeah, and didn't care about the money.

Dude, I get it, right?

We've been around the block a few times.

Music on that one?

Yeah.

What year was that?

How old are you now?

I'm 43.

Okay, so you graduated in 1996?

No, I was supposed to graduate.

But you got your driver's license in 1994.

That doesn't change.

And yeah, I got the truck from the guy.

Oh, that's when I graduated.

It was done.

But he wrecked it away before before I bought it.

Did it have stereo in it?

Yes.

All right.

What are you bumping?

Cypress hell.

Oh, good fucking pull.

I was bumping everything.

Anything that was good.

SPM.

South Mexican.

South Park, Mexican.

You all said it like we would know that.

You should.

I forget where we're at.

We're in a white state, you know.

But I was listening to a lot of Chicano rap at the time.

Oh, Kid Frost, maybe you guys know Kid Frost.

No, but I went through a phase where I was big time into the

Chicano rap CD covers and like all of the outfits and

something like that.

I just thought it was really fucking cool.

I don't know anything.

This is the guy that thinks that those Mexican blankets are comfy.

Yeah, they're not.

They're not Mexican blankets or blankets.

Yeah.

Do you think it's comfortable?

No.

They're scratchy.

Or are they itchy?

Yeah, they're itchy.

It's a shit blanket.

Yeah, nobody wants it.

It's just it's a tourist thing.

We had this.

This was an interesting conversation.

Vinnie from Vinnie's Hot Rods.

Vinnie's one of our good buddies, Mexican dude.

And we're talking to him about, you know, we call them Mexican blankets,

right?

Everybody does.

And Vinnie's looking.

He's like, fuck you guys talking about.

And he's like, it's a blanket, dude.

It's fucking blanket.

Is it just a blanket?

It's a blanket.

But it's a very shitty blanket.

He said, hey, you want to go get some American hamburgers?

That's a point.

Fucking blanket.

They're itchy.

They suck.

But they do their purpose.

You obviously, you, there's no way that the fear was the first car.

Nobody had to have that on the first car.

You had to have something to.

You had to set your sights on something to work for.

First car was something.

Let's get age.

Let's get age first.

Family car.

Something you purchased.

Something.

Give us a little background.

Don't give us the car.

I already told you about it.

I think you guys.

We might have forgotten.

You guys, you guys, you guys really like it went over your head because.

C10.

You said you're big in C10s.

Is that was the first one?

Yup.

What year?

Right.

Square body.

I had an 84.

Okay.

86 and 82.

Nice.

I saw my C10 get taste.

400 fucking dollars.

Yeah.

And I saw.

What year?

Tico was a.

God.

What year was that?

Square body.

I was like 2008.

What year was that?

Shit truck.

No.

Year of the truck.

Not year he sold it.

No.

I'm trying to think of a truck.

I think it was the 77.

No.

It was later than that.

Was it?

Yeah.

Cause I liked headlights.

80.

Quad headlights.

400 bucks.

That's all that fucking.

I should have learned.

I should have learned from video.

We should have done through Vasis.

I fucked up too.

And the thing is that I fucked up.

I fucked up because.

I should have learned.

When I started with SEMA.

I take the blame.

I sold my truck just to go to SEMA.

Damn.

And I took him to the kitchen for the first time.

And I fucked up.

And I sold the truck for less than what the wheels were worth.

That sounds like somebody.

And I had.

I had.

This fucking chair.

This poor guy we fucking sabotaged.

You guys put me in the shittiest chair ever.

I had an OBD2.

I told you at the beginning.

I had an OBD2 C10.

Like my whole truck was OBD2.

Like the whole thing was like transmission, engine and everything.

It was not good.

And I had built this truck when I was in high school.

What do you got there?

Next.

Next question.

So the C10 is gone.

We went through the vehicles.

What were you?

You were listening to the same music?

What?

That depends.

Thank you.

All right.

Let me go through a scenario.

My music is really diverse.

Okay.

I'm going to give you a scenario.

And you tell me in this particular scenario.

What the music you're going to listen to.

Okay.

So it's Saturday night.

Not Friday night.

Okay.

Very specific.

Right?

Saturday night when you're a teenager.

It's a different feeling than Friday night.

Right?

Friday night after school.

Yeah.

Saturday night you've had the day.

You probably did a little work and you done this.

Saturday night you head out on the town a little earlier.

In the evening than you would on a Friday.

Right?

Saturday night sometimes you get on the road at 4.30.

Five o'clock.

Go meet some friends.

Sun ain't down yet.

Right?

But it's evening time.

Right?

Right.

You're a fucking barber also.

Spanish music.

I'm getting excited.

Yeah.

I'm getting excited.

100% is Spanish music.

You said what year was this?

This was 90.

What?

90.

We went through the years.

I'm trying to get that thing.

I'm trying to get the cologne.

So this is you've overdosed.

Your car.

You overdosed in your car.

Right?

Maybe cool water.

If it's something special.

Right?

Maybe half to the half.

So then there's you.

It's generally you hit the interstate and then it's like I got it.

You know, I got a few exits to go blah, blah, blah.

Let me find something that's going to put me in the zone that I need to be in.

What is it?

What's it go to at that point in time and that in your in your life at that age?

The music wise.

Yeah.

It depends on what I was driving.

What were you driving to see 10?

Oh, my seat 10.

Oh, it's definitely Mexican music then.

Okay.

What other vehicle would you be driving and what music would be listened to in that?

Oh, well, if I was driving my Fiero because I did drive it to parties.

I got into the party car.

It was literally like a Ferrari.

No, listen.

So I got really big into the 80s.

Miami Vice soundtrack.

Fucking loop.

I'm thinking this is Marvin Gaye.

Let's get it on.

No, no.

This is this is Bill Collins.

Set in the mood.

Yeah.

So I bought my my first Fiero that I bought was a first year Fiero was which was an 84.

Okay.

And here and get this.

I'm not.

God, I can't believe we got here.

Fucking music.

You made a place of music.

I'm going to get back to it.

All right.

But the thing is like so recently one of my friends was like, Holy shit.

Because I've always, I've always loved escalates.

Like escalates are like, Holy shit.

They're like, and those escalates like the same thing is like year after year.

Like how the fuck do you top off and escalate?

And it's like, they always like when they come out with a new one is like, Holy fuck.

They heard you like escalates in Fierro's.

We put a Fiero in your escalate.

No.

escalate.

Remember, you escalate the front clip on the Fiero.

Yeah.

But hey, I have an escalated front clip.

Any fucking Silverado.

I'm not that fucking like, you know, but anyways, so it's like, you know, like they've

always done like, you know, they've always like pushed the envelope.

I'm like, Holy shit, like let's make this shit better.

Yeah.

They've always done that.

Yeah.

For sure.

And like at the time what the Fiero when I got it, like when I bought my Fiero.

So to get back to it, like the whole thing to tie it in my friend told me he's like,

dude, do you know the new escalate has speakers in the headrest?

Like, are you fucking retarded, dude?

Because back in 1984, the fucking Fiero.

That gets us a demerit right there.

The fucking Fiero had speakers in the headrest.

I'm glad we got there.

What was playing to those speakers?

It's like, you ain't telling me nothing new here.

Like you're telling me that escalate is coming out with something.

Get the fuck out of here, dude.

Like the Fiero came out guns blazing the fucking speakers in the headrest.

It was the only spot they could put them.

Not only because it was the greatest American sports car that I was ever built.

What else are you going to fucking put speakers in a fucking sports car?

Learn more at microsoft.com slash M365 Co-Pilot.

I don't know if you know real sports cars, but real sports cars.

We know them now.

Real sports cars don't have speakers in the doors.

What music was playing in that real sports car?

Like I said, the first Fiero that I bought was in 1984.

It was the first song you played in that car.

Name of the band.

So that fucking car still had a fucking CD or a cassette.

A motley crew cassette.

Of course it did.

So I will never fucking...

There's worse cassettes to be stuck in there.

Fuck no dude.

I live in the east valley of Phoenix and I bought this car way west.

And I'm pretty sure this cassette was stuck in there since 1990.

Because the car was still running when I bought it.

I bought it for 400 bucks.

What song kicked on as soon as you...

It was Girls, Girls, Girls.

He was headed to party.

Let's fucking go dude.

I can visualize it right now.

This is when I first bought the car.

Windows down.

I first bought the car.

And then I drove the car into a gas station.

And I didn't even know how to open the gas door in this fucking car dude.

It had a release probably?

Yeah, it was right behind your head.

You can't let anybody just be fucking with your gas.

You gotta lock that up.

But like I said dude.

So imagine Molly Crue, Girls, Girls, Girls.

In a Fero.

Right.

Like two inches behind you.

Oh my god.

It's like literally Vince Neil singing in your fucking ear.

Right.

Yeah.

I can't imagine.

So like I said, if it was the C-10, it was Mexican music.

Like full blast.

What's the jam?

If I want to listen to a fucking badass Mexican song.

Mexican rap.

Is that where it's at?

It wasn't even Mexican rap dude.

But right now, what's the song?

Oh fuck.

Back then it was.

Back in 84, I had a Fero.

And that was the thing.

That was like dude, whatever.

Call me whatever the fuck you want.

But I had an 84 Fiero and I had an 84 C-10.

So I would sit in my front yard.

I was still living at home with my parents.

And I was like man, this is so sick.

Imagine if I was fucking, if this was 84 right now.

Then I'd have to grab fucking brand new C-10.

Brand new fucking Fiero dude.

Like I'm the fucking king right now.

They're like what the fuck?

Like you know.

Who am I?

And this is like 2009.

In the castle baby.

2009 when I was still in high school.

Guess he's not sneaking in the party this year.

No he'll be there, he's not sneaking in.

Yeah I know, he'll be there.

Your D won't be there.

You're getting your own tickets.

You're gonna come in.

Dude I want to.

Dude I got you.

Do they make those kids beds in the Fiero?

I want that as his booth.

Hey, in General Motors?

Dude it'd be cheaper just to buy the Fiero.

That's what let us in.

Not after this podcast it won't be.

Is this cheaper to buy the Fiero and helicopter out there?

So look, we talk a lot about bringing trailer on this podcast.

Yes we do.

I think this is a good opportunity.

Look at that graph, look at that chart.

Look at that chart after this podcast.

I think you're gonna see a spike.

I think you're gonna see a drop.

I think it's gonna be a good one.

I think you're gonna see a drop.

The cool part is this chart.

This chart you can see in $10 increments.

Okay, okay.

You're not gonna see this bike.

So you say you're into like weird cars, right?

Probes.

Sobs.

What are you into again?

Ford probe.

Apart from this build, I also have a side build for one of my best friends.

I don't know if we've got enough time for that.

I just want you to tease it out there.

Okay, so this is my friend Gabe.

And he has a Mazda Repu.

It's a rotary truck.

Oh, that's a sick truck.

It's a mini truck.

You know the Ford Corrier?

Yes.

Yeah, that's like the one from Leaming the Cube.

But it's got a Winkle engine.

A rotary engine.

Those engines are stupid.

Winkle.

That's who didn't fit in there.

The rotary engine.

The Winkle.

Winkle.

So you're gonna do that.

You're gonna do that one.

You already shook hands with him too on the build.

Oh, yeah.

That sounds cool.

Yeah, so that.

So he's more like, you know, he's really performance wise.

And he's really like.

It sounds like it.

Those Winkles are stupid.

But I told him, I was like, dude, let's build a little hot rod truck.

Because it's a mini truck.

It really is a mini truck.

But with the Winkle engine.

Who the fuck?

This is like all new to me.

Never heard about a Winkle engine.

Really?

It's a rotary.

It's a rotary motor.

We got a customer.

So we built, we built an RX-5.

Yeah, we got, yeah.

Those RX-5s are cool.

Not as cool as a 510.

But you're building a 510, aren't you?

What the fuck?

Better than a 510, dude.

Oh, 510 is way cooler than an RX-5.

Dude, it's a rotary engine, bro.

Rotary.

Show me a 510 that runs up to 10,000 RPM.

How many rotary swaps were at Grand National?

How many rotary swaps happened

into things that the rotaries didn't come into?

They didn't know about that.

And what you do is just stack more rotors on there.

All you do is take something that was rotary powered.

Nobody makes something that wasn't rotary powered, rotary powered.

Let me ask you.

That's because the Gerber brothers haven't invested in that yet.

What's the negative with the rotary engine?

I don't know much about it.

There's no negative.

It's positive.

Everything's positive.

They sound wicked.

There's one in the Goodwood.

There's some fucking crazy...

Have you seen that thing?

Some mid-engine race car

that's got some wild ass rotary.

A good compound turbo 5 rotor

is absolutely nuts.

10,000 horsepower.

Yeah, it's stupid.

There's not a negative.

It's just not for

horsepower to dollar ratio

and size and all the other kind of stuff.

There's other options out there.

Yeah.

RX-7 is a cool ass car.

I always felt they were like mini vipers.

Oh, yeah.

I love one of those.

Love a clean ass.

Many vipers.

If you've been an interior of RX-7, it's cool.

It's like a refined bike.

The thing about the RX-7 is

it's got a unique sound.

When you hear a rotary engine,

you know it's a rotary engine.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Wow, this has been

quite

quite something.

You want it?

Like I said, I got my own

side builds there.

Dude, we're clicking.

Why don't you throw the Instagram up there

just in case any of these people are out there?

There's probably folks out there just like,

you know what?

I've been waiting for the guy

that has the same vision.

I got the money. He's got the vision.

Let's do this.

Let's bring it on. Let's do it.

What do we got up next?

Favorite car movie.

Favorite Corvette Summers.

Corvette Summer? Yeah.

Okay.

Good.

I don't remember the name of that fucking thing.

LaBamba.

Training Day.

He loves the lowrider.

Training Day is fucking great.

Maybe I'll tell a story about it.

That's my favorite lowrider car

that you tried to buy in Facebook.

I vented to Josh about it and he set me straight.

That's my favorite lowrider.

You needed to be set straight.

Josh scolded me for it.

Don't tell the story.

Then I felt bad.

No, I think it's good because it shows.

It doesn't reflect well on me.

After I told

Josh, I was like,

oh, okay.

That kind of makes sense.

I'll let you tell it.

Maybe we shouldn't.

We'll do a quick cliff note.

It's not quick at this point.

I love that car.

We've been talking about lowriders for a while.

He wants the Monte Carlo from Training Day.

Dude,

my old man was in the body shop business

and I grew up around

all body men and everybody was in the lowriders.

I fucking love lowriders.

It's just something

I want like a

legit badass fucking lowrider.

I want a 63 hard top.

The 79 Monte Carlo

is always just, it's hit it for me.

I love the body lines.

The Training Day one is fucking rad.

I don't want to deal with the hydraulics

and all that bullshit,

but I'd like something on bags

with just some big valves,

some big airlines that you can drive,

you can have some fun with.

Maybe you can throw some nasty

sway bars on it, three wheel that bitch.

Something.

I love the look of that car.

That's the whole thing with me.

I've never been a big lowrider guy.

I love lowriders.

He loves lowriders.

For me, my whole theme

with everything

has always been a nice clean look.

That car is one.

I can guarantee that we will never be invited back.

I'm having a good fucking time with you.

You got a fucking bad motherfucker.

Boom!

It takes taking away from me.

That fucking car is

so simple.

It's clean.

That's my thing is that I love simple cars.

It's one solid color.

It's on fucking wires and hydraulics.

That's it.

I said that about that.

But if I was to have a fucking lowrider,

it would be the fucking lowrider from training day.

That makes me feel good.

But I would have that motherfucker

on 20's in the front,

22's or 24's in the back.

That's not the car from training day.

It's just a cool S.

It's got to be on wires.

It would be on wires.

Bad motherfucker.

I love the Dayton's.

Phil sends me one on

fucking Marketplace.

And I'm like,

Dennis, get in here.

Dennis wants to get in here.

We're going to the bullpen.

Come on, Dennis. I'll give you my seat.

Phil sends me one on Marketplace.

79 Monte Carlo.

It is a

fucking spitting image of the training day car.

This thing's like 13 inch

Dayton's fucking

bad ass.

It's got Acura in the back.

Big ass tanks.

Two pumps.

It's got the fucking look.

Guy was asking a lot of money.

First of all,

the price that he listed

and he says

cash money.

In the Facebook Marketplace

ad, it says cash only

with a cash emoji

with wings on it.

No further conversation

to be had about that.

I forget the town but

basically, Gary, Indiana.

Right? Just outside Gary, Indiana.

That's down

in south Chicago.

So now I'll fast forward to me coming in Monday morning

and telling Josh about this. I'm like,

this motherfucker blocked me on Facebook.

He wouldn't answer me. I've reached out to him.

He blocked me. Then he tells me.

I reached out to him and said,

hey man, I'm super interested.

I'd like to buy the Monte Carlo.

I know you said cash money.

Is there anything you can do?

Can you give me some information on like a wire transfer

or anything like that we can do?

I also said money order certified check.

Money order certified check.

If you didn't get it, that's probably

where you fucked up.

He helped me understand that.

I told him, the dude

is selling a little rider and he says cash.

So the only other conversation

that needs to be had is,

when can we meet? When can I come look at it?

That's it.

You just got to tell him

when can I pick it up? That's it.

So I didn't.

You didn't pick it up.

And his response was

something like,

if you were serious about this car,

you'd be down here looking at it

and then blocks me.

Then you see the little thing blocked.

It fucking pissed me off.

I'm going to buy it.

He's asking too much money for it.

Nobody's going to buy it for that.

I was prepared to buy it

because I just liked it so much.

I guarantee it's still listed

because nobody's fucking paying that.

So he fucked up.

He wants fucking 30 Gs for it.

Dude.

It's worth 30 Gs.

I bet you it's sold.

30 Gs for a car is not bad.

But I guarantee

you it's not going to sell to somebody.

That's how the G-men get you, man.

He ain't going to do no wire transfer

and do all that kind of shit.

I guarantee you it's not.

I bet you it's still on there.

I guarantee you it is.

Josh lights me up.

He's like, what the fuck did you think was going to happen?

I'm like, well, I don't know.

I thought he'd like come back

and be like, sure.

Let me give you my routing number

and you can sit there.

Josh's like, you fucking roll down there

with fucking 30 Gs

fucking cash and you buy that thing.

I'm like, dude,

I'm not rolling down

to Gary, Indiana

with 30 grand in a fucking shoe box.

I said, tell me when.

Sounds like a good time.

Are you kidding me?

That's an excuse to get strapped.

Dude, I'm rolling down

with 30 grand

and I'm coming back

without 30 grand and no fucking low rider.

You show up with 25 grand

and then you tell him

I only got 20.

Is that the trick?

Let's see.

You got to talk to the other side of the mic.

Alright, we got it.

Hold on, let's see.

Before we get too far.

I'm not going to say much.

Phil can attest that this was...

It was a great car.

But you should have just said, when are you available this week?

Dennis, why are you laughing so much?

Dennis is having a great time.

Look back there, dude.

Look at Dennis.

I can't see anything.

I was probably blinded.

Oh, message request.

This is lightning round.

Let's do it. Let's get this over with.

He's had a lot of fun.

If you could have anybody else

build you a vehicle

for you.

No budget, right?

What car is it and who's building it?

Ring brothers.

This is one at a time.

First of all,

fuck the ring brothers.

They ain't building shit no more.

They're building my car.

We'll get to you in just a second.

I would say Radrides and whatever they wanted.

Whatever they wanted for sure.

All this part is getting cut out.

Fuck the ring brothers.

Fuck Troy.

What do you have in ring brothers build?

They're bad son of a bitch.

I know, but what do they got to build for you?

The ring brothers?

The ring brothers just want to get

on me and Jeremy's Fiero.

Yeah.

We don't even have to answer.

I wonder what Troy would build if you just told Fiero.

What Troy?

BBT Troy or Radrides?

If you told Troy to just build this.

I wonder what you think he'd pick.

I wouldn't care.

If it was Troy Treprania or Tom A.

to build me a land speed record Fiero.

Oh man.

That's the gift that keeps on giving.

That's the thing.

His vision.

You wouldn't have to worry about it.

I'd be curious though.

We never talked to Troy about that.

What's the car he wants to build, did we?

I don't remember.

I don't think so.

Probably an airbag in his paint booth.

Yeah.

I'd be curious about that.

Maybe we'll do a special.

Have you seen his paint booth?

I haven't seen it back up.

No, his paint booth.

It would be interesting.

It would be.

We'll have to reach out.

We'll do a special with Troy on that.

Tell him about this day.

I'll tell you.

I've done a lot of.

The Fiero.

I think.

That's one.

I love.

I love how Jared was like.

Yeah, we click.

I love you, Dennis.

Josh is psyched out on the Fiero.

I just see buddy over there.

You just see us in a couple of years.

Oh my God.

Just pulling the cover off at Seymour.

Crashing and people just like.

Crashing and fucking burned.

Whatever.

Whatever happened those dudes that built that badass gear.

Gone.

What gear?

He's going to be eating pro, dude.

Well, we're a male.

Well.

I think we go do.

I'm going to be like, hey dude, where's that pro bat?

Well, where's that pro bat?

Where's the Fiero?

Dude, the pro had a back seat.

I remember.

You know why a Fiero don't have a back seat?

You got a.

What do you hear?

There's so many opportunities.

I see like.

I see this car going to Nuremberg ring.

Oh.

On top of that.

We'll see you again next week.

I can't take any more than nonsense.

Honestly.

It's over.

You know what my other plan is with this car?

I know.

I don't.

It can't be any more things than it is.

It's already been 15 things.

It is.

There's no other things than it can be.

It's been a party car.

It's going to win every show.

It's a Fiero.

It's going to be a tractor pull car next.

It's also going to be a pike speak.

We can do that.

But the one thing I can see.

You turn into a boat.

It's an amphicar.

It does.

West Palm Reynolds.

Oh, is that a Fiero?

No, it's a jet ski.

Did you guys know?

I fucking love boats.

Hey.

Just say you guys.

Stop it right there.

Just say you guys know.

I like turtles too.

Just say you guys know.

He's been trying to sell a boat for six years.

Before we go,

I will say this, guys.

Is this straight?

It actually is a pretty sick boat, dude.

We should have let his mic be broke earlier.

It's a...

It was broke from the beginning.

But...

Hey.

You guys have broken it.

It's a broken boat.

Hey.

I love it, dude.

Can you see why we achieved perfection?

Yes.

I can.

Now I see the attention to detail.

It all makes sense.

Dude, honestly, before we let you guys go,

I've got to say,

I had a fucking blast with you guys.

And honestly,

talking to you guys through the beginning of this podcast,

we had a lot of fun.

We fucked around with Fieros and stuff.

But I'm fucking blown away with your guys' passion.

Thank you.

Your guys drive for building cool shit.

It's been a pleasure hanging with you, dude.

Dude, I'm super stoked to see what you guys do in the future.

Because to see guys that came out of

what I would consider absolutely

nowhere,

and blow everybody's fucking minds.

And your...

Your name, the name of your shop

was in everybody's mouth.

All I heard from people

for years now, Bobby Allaway,

and, you know,

you name it, fucking

everybody who's...

Anybody who's everybody

has talked about the stuff that you guys are building.

You guys are fucking kicking ass

and I want to see what you guys continue to do.

It's been a pleasure. It's been awesome fucking hanging with you.

You know, dude,

add on that?

There's no add on.

You know,

Toby Allaway.

Yeah.

Toby's not of the Allaway family.

We just call him Toby Allaway.

Yeah.

Well, Toby's part of the family.

He's not of no relation.

Toby.

Well, either way, like...

But he's a good dude.

I love that dude.

Like, Toby Allaway is fucking awesome.

Yeah.

We'll see you again next week.

No, that...

About this episode

Buddy Hale of Type 1 Restorations and his crew walk through how a garage-born VW restoration shop became a show-winning fabrication team. The conversation spotlights their obsession-driven builds—especially the “Turmoil” Volkswagen that was torn down, rebuilt, and pushed into Salon-style competition—plus the later “Carmichael” project and the obsession with details like custom fasteners and even brake bleeder caps. They also cover paint/finish process, machinist culture, show politics, and the team’s move into the hot-rod world, ending with a wild Fiero future pitch and shop-party stories.

400 grit all hands on deck American Museum of Speed billable hours black paint job blasted body style brake bleeders Buffed cash purse

Buick Grand National

Original notes

This week on Oil & Whiskey, we sit down with Buddy Hale and the crew from Type One Restorations. And it gets WILD. Strap in 😂From starting in a garage doing paint work for material costs to building some of the most talked-about cars in the industry, Buddy shares the path, the risk of walking away from steady work, and what it really takes to bet on yourself.We get into the builds that put Type One on the map, including the cars that had everyone talking at major shows, and the level of detail and execution that’s helping them make serious noise in the industry.There’s also a real conversation around what it takes to compete at the highest level. The right team, the right customers, and the kind of mindset where nothing gets skipped if you’re trying to win.If you’re into custom builds, shop stories, and what it actually takes to grow in this industry, this is a good one.

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