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Before I was competitive, me and Tim used to be best friends.
It all revolved around money.
It didn't matter how fast I was, and I'm as happy as I've ever been.
Here I'm sitting with Kevin Harvick doing a podcast.
Oh, gosh, I'm going to tell the story.
My wife's going to kill me.
Welcome to Kevin Harvick's Happy Hour, presented by NASCAR on Fox, and today we have a short
track legend in our seat over here, Burt Meyers.
Thanks for taking the time to make the journey down here to be in studio.
Yeah, yeah.
It's my pleasure, man.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah.
Well, it's, we talked a little before the show.
We've tried to kind of mix up our guests on the show to really help the, I guess
everybody who watches the show understand more about the grassroots system of our
sport.
But for you, it's a livelihood of what you've done.
Just how did, how did your journey start as far as your family has a deep tradition in
short track racing and NASCAR racing and well tied to the sport?
But how did the journey start to get you in the driver's seat?
Well, you know, it's cliche, but the old saying is, is not if I race, but when
I race.
Yeah.
You know, I knew it was coming.
I guess the first time I drove, we, we, my dad bought me a Dotson 510 4-cylinder, right?
So it had to have a new body put on it.
And I can remember being sunburnt.
I'm talking 16, 17 years old and I can remember my face being burnt from
tack welding, the new body on.
And I mean, that's just, you know, yeah.
So, but I mean, that's what we had to do if I wanted to race, that's what
came next.
And I ran a season of 4-cylinder at Bowman Gray and I ran a few, I ran
a caraway in a few places like that, but the same, I guess it's sort of the same
path that Slade is taking right now is it was easy for me to get into the
modified because that's what we had.
Yeah.
And that's what we were doing.
My dad was doing.
So the very next year, my dad built a car and building a new car back then
was a little different than building a new car now.
Like when I say we built a new car, I'm talking about
chassis, we built the body and then you took parts that you had laying
around.
Yeah.
Excuse me to put together.
So we put a car together and he didn't like it.
He drove it a couple of times and didn't like it.
And he said, if you want to run this car, there it is, but you're going to keep
it up.
And I remember at the end of the year, I had to take out a loan to pay the
tire bill off.
Really?
Yeah.
So that's kind of how it started.
And then I guess the rest is history.
Well, it's evolved into, what is it, 28, 29 champions?
Yeah.
I think so.
Total, yeah.
Yeah.
And so you've built this, this legacy and you've continued the family
tradition.
You're going to pass that on to Slate and the things that you guys are
doing.
It's obvious that, and fun.
Yeah.
As dad is fun.
And I think for me, it's been as much fun in racing.
But did you ever settle into it's a business side of it?
Because for me, it took Keelan to start racing and going back to the
Go-Kart track to remember why I loved racing.
So I'm not quite, it is a, as far as that transition was
Slate, I'm not, that wasn't yet for me.
What was it for me is when I drove for Philip Smith, I drove for my dad.
Okay.
First of all, I drove for my dad.
Well, my dad, let me just back up.
So when I first started and it modifies, my dad was still driving his
own car.
Philip Smith was driving his own car.
So when my dad, Philip Smith decided to retire.
So when he retired, my dad started driving for Philip in the one car.
So when my dad moved on to drive for Philip, I drove for my dad in the
four car.
So then my brother comes along, he's racing a little bit.
My dad decides to retire.
Philip says, I want you to drive for me.
So now I'm in Philip's car, the one car.
My brother moves to the four car.
So that's kind of how it all started.
Well, I had always, I think I'd always known in my mind that I wanted
to own my own stuff and drive my own stuff.
And when you build it, it's hard not to be as meticulous.
And so whenever, whenever I was driving for my dad, it was a
little different because it's your dad.
So then I started driving for Philip.
Well, Philip's got a car.
So then we put a car together, together.
So I'm putting it together.
I've got all the sweat and all the blood and all the hard work in it.
But Philip's paying the bills on it.
I said, man, I want all my own stuff.
So in 2010, unfortunately, Philip's wife got breast cancer.
And he said, I just don't know how much more I'm going to be able to do.
I said, if you'll let me take it over, I'll do it.
I'll do it all.
And Philip's still heavily involved.
Yeah.
And I think then kind of when it started transitioning and then
when me and my wife, Kim, got married and you write the checks
out of Burt Myers racing account and I race for a living.
I'm one of if not the only Southern modified racer that races for a living.
And I'm blessed to be able to do that.
But at the same time, there's a lot of responsibility because it's not
just as much fun anymore.
Yeah, it's we got to perform because we got bills to pay.
We got checks to write.
I think that's kind of when that transition took over for me.
Now that I'm still racing.
So even though Slate's racing too, it's not.
I haven't made that transition because I haven't quit yet.
Yeah. I'm not ready to quit yet.
Yeah. So how are you?
I'll be 50 in December.
Oh, man, we're the same age.
I'll be I'll be 50.
I knew we were right there.
Yeah, it's interesting because as your kids get older and they start,
you just think differently.
And when you own your own stuff, I started off kind of the same way.
We had our own stuff, built it with dad.
Banged heads and, you know, went and did my own thing.
And now you're back and we had our own go-kart teams and things.
And then, you know, you learn a lot about a lot about what it's doing.
But, you know, I think that the interesting part with the family piece
of it, having it for so long, you have your brother involved, too.
And you guys battle it out on the racetrack.
And so is there is is there any point where it's been like family,
found a little bit of family tension because you're running each other?
You guys good at solving those problems.
Believe it or not.
There was only one time I can remember that we butted heads.
My dad was still driving for Philip.
I was driving for my dad.
And then my brother was also driving for my dad.
And we had a race at Caraway.
And Jason argued this.
I pinned him in behind a lap car and he made it three wide instead of
taking his medicine because I pinned him in and ended up causing a spin or
whatever. Yeah, I think we both got turned around or something.
Yeah. And I remember calling him a squirrel.
I said, man, you're a squirrel.
So that was really about the only time, believe it or not, as long as we've
been racing and we do go head to head at Bowman Gray every week.
And now with Slate, there's three of us, not going wood.
We've been pretty fortunate to not have that scuffle or anything.
It's been pretty good.
So do you do anything else outside of racing?
No. Nothing.
Nothing. It's all racing.
And that's tough because when you're writing all those checks,
there's no extra income.
I mean, obviously we're great partners like Citrusafe and we do our
Arms Bumper podcast.
Do you do that?
Do you sell all the sponsorship and you do it all?
Yeah, that's awesome.
So our acquired Pinnacle financial partners last off season, they came
on board at the clash and then stayed with me through the modified season.
So yeah, that's basically I have to kind of do it all.
If the way I look at it is like this, the difference in me and I
guess what drives me is there's times that my wife will say, you
know, there's X amount in the racing account.
Yeah.
But if I want to keep racing, I have to go hustle and we have to
make it happen.
Right. And you mentioned the cup race.
I think when, when NASCAR and we'll get to Bowman Gray in a minute
because that's its own story on its own.
When you mentioned the NASCAR race and I saw that you were going to
run that, going to run that race, that to me was exciting.
And that's somewhat of what we've kind of gotten away from as we go
to some of these local tracks.
Like when I was, when I was racing cup every Saturday, when I
first started, I'd get on a plane and we'd go somewhere nearby.
I'd go with Jimmy Spencer and Ken Schrader and whoever was going
that weekend and we'd go race.
But to me, the local guys being in the show matters, but two
questions on, on the, on the cup thing.
Are you going to do it again?
I guess it's three questions.
Are you going to do it again?
But what was the, what was the reception from the locals about
the cup great race?
Because and you being in it, but what was the overall
perception of what they thought?
Because it was a way better race than I thought it was going to be.
Yeah.
I know that's a, there's a few questions in there.
Yeah.
They're, uh, yeah.
On that point, uh, I even said it with Joey Ditto, which on
our thing last week, our podcast, I thought the race would be terrible.
Yeah.
I said, there's the track screen, um, big heavy cars.
It's just, it's going to be hard to pass.
And it was the racing was actually really, really good.
Yeah.
It really was good.
Uh, as far as me doing it again, I'm trying my best.
I'm working hard and, and obviously I want to do it again.
Yeah.
Uh, it's just a matter of logistics and trying to put all the pieces of the
puzzle together.
The response from the fans that I saw on my side was amazing.
Um, and it may have just been because they were, you know, fans that
kind of related to me and me being in the show, excuse me, I think that,
um, me and Tim together being in there, I mean, who could write a better story
than the two top winners and champions at Bowman Gray.
As normal, you wound up around each other.
Yeah, I told somebody.
So that one, when I passed him for last, I said, that was the
most talked about last place pass in history.
Um, and Joey talked about when they were in the booth and the crowd
went nuts.
Oh yeah.
And everybody else just sighed by, or nose to tail and they're like,
what's going on?
It's a Burton Tim, Burton Tim.
So it's pretty cool to be able to be a part of it.
And to back it up with going to Martinsville and getting to do an
actual points race.
Um, it's like I said before, I know I don't have a cup career
ahead of me.
So any boxes I can check at this point in my life is just a bonus for me.
What was it like to drive it?
Well, I mean, what did you expect?
Well, you know, I talked to you a little bit, I talked to you a
little bit on Sunday.
I think that there was a point where we had to get the car
where I could make changes in the seat that mattered.
So me making changes in the seat and the car not being what
it needed to be, it was for nothing.
It didn't affect anything.
And one of the things I took away from it is what you told
me about my braking.
You asked me if I was braking it like a modified and I was.
But when I went back and tried it again, without the car
being where I needed it to be, it didn't really matter.
Now, when Tony Jr. kept tweaking and got the car better, I was
like, man, this is pretty good.
We were actually pretty good.
I was expecting it to be.
I've driven a few late model races here and there and they're
just lethargic.
That's the best way to compare them modified.
But it wasn't that way.
It had good horsepower, had grip.
I mean, it was really a lot of fun to drive.
Yeah.
And when you look at the, when you look at Bowman Gray,
you think bottom of the racetrack and all of a sudden
those cup cars started moving into that second groove.
It's like, oh, there is a second groove at Bowman Gray.
And they didn't put anything on the racetrack.
They don't really put anything on the racetrack anymore, do they?
So, you know, I think that that was, I think that was
probably the biggest surprise of the gear.
It was cool that you guys were both in that race because
of your history at that racetrack.
But I think it was way cooler that it kind of knocked the
stereotype of cup cars can't race at a quarter mile
racetrack and put on a good show.
But it was a good show.
Yeah, it was a really good show.
It didn't snow.
So we can, we can pass on a, you know, on our 100 lap nights
we draw and then we have the choose cone.
Yeah.
So there's a night, you call us on the pole, we draw dead last.
So you have to make the outside work because you can't just
bulldoze your way through the field or you end up, you know,
pissing people off and they're going to retaliate.
So I had to make a career of trying to figure out
how to pass on the outside.
So it was very refreshing to see the cup cars run inside
by side.
Yeah.
So Bowman Gray, I mean, that's really, I mean,
it's the biggest mystery to race promoters in the whole
country, right?
Because of what it is.
I've been there, I've been there one time.
Obviously I watched the Madhouse episodes and everything
that I wish you guys would still do because it was
exciting and entertaining.
It was fun.
Entertaining is the keyword.
Yeah.
Entertaining is the keyword.
And you, you witnessed it from a young age of,
of what Bowman Gray is.
But what, what, what's it like to be in the middle of,
of all of that?
Because I mean, it's, it's feuds, it's competition.
It's weekly happenings.
It's fans flipping you off and cheering and all those
things above.
I mean, you've, you've lived your whole life around that.
So what's it like to live in the middle of what I
would call somewhat of a soap opera?
It is, so I tell people, even when the race is not
good, you will be entertained.
Yeah.
Okay. And so that's why I say entertainment is the
keyword.
And I think the formula that Bowman Gray has created
is a formula for entertainment, the draw races,
the inverts.
You're racing around a flat quarter mile.
It's around a football field.
So when you qualify last and draw first and I
qualify first and draw last, when I get to you,
something's got to give, right?
And so they know that.
You know, I don't, Kevin, I think that I just
sometimes don't realize it because I'm so used to it.
I'd mentioned this on the podcast last week that
I've seen drivers who are, you know, great drivers who have
won all over the place come in to Bowman Gray and
they kind of have that look of awe.
Like, oh my gosh, man.
Yeah.
And I'm like, it's just Bowman Gray.
It's the fear of getting out.
I guess.
In case they pass off on the locals.
But it's just, I think it's just, I take,
maybe I do take advantage of the fact that I
don't realize it is a spectacle.
It really is a spectacle.
And when you think about it's, we call it 30 minutes from
anywhere, there's a full field in every division.
It's $12 a head to get in.
You can bring a bag of snacks and a cooler in
and you get paid cash at the end of the night.
Yeah.
You know, that maybe that's the winning formula.
Maybe that's the winning formula.
But Bowman Gray is one of the few tracks that
really doesn't even have to advertise.
They used to have one little clip in the,
in the, in the wisdom journal.
They have one little square ad in the paper
because they didn't have to because everybody knows
about Bowman Gray.
The Madhouse show obviously did,
did a lot for the getting national attention.
But the thing I always said about that is,
is there's thousands of drivers across the country
that are in the same shoes I'm in.
We were just fortunate enough to be on TV.
But that was fun.
I wish, I wish that hadn't ended.
That was really cool to be able to do.
And Bowman Gray has been, you know,
kind of in the fabric of the NASCAR system
for, for a long time.
And I think it's, you know,
when everybody has really started to try to
figure out how to re-engage those grassroots fans,
I don't know how many of those people
actually go to a NASCAR race.
But I mean, a lot of them left after the modified race
last year, you know, and went, it went on
and didn't stay and watch the heat races and,
and qualifying.
So, you know, that is the show.
But I think when, when you look at it,
and a lot of people say, well, you know,
you'll put a quarter mile or something on,
on a, on a touring schedule on the bear.
I don't want to go tear my shit up.
Right.
I don't want to do this.
And then you go to Bowman Gray, it's like,
well, I just fix my stuff every week
because that's what I do.
And then you get, you get good at, at working on a car.
But, you know, so when do you think that,
I mean, Bowman Gray always has,
seems to have been established in the community.
And, you know, I think when you look at that,
that network of, of racetracks, you know,
you've got Karoway, you've got Bowman Gray,
you've got Southern National up in Raleigh,
you've got all these racetracks all around the area
is, is, is the short track system broke
or it broken as far as the promoters
and the racers and the people,
or is it Bowman Gray has just been so established
through those years from a short track piece of it.
And because you talk about what they've created
for an entertainment value,
instead of just trying to say, okay,
we're going to open the back gate
and, and we're going to have a race this weekend.
It's okay this week,
we're going to invert the whole field,
we're going to draw.
And it doesn't feel like a lot of the other racetracks do that.
And, and you talk about that show,
has it always been that way?
It's been that way as long as you remember.
Yes, as long as I can remember,
we were drawing for 100 Lappers.
And you know, I don't know if the world knows this,
Bowman Gray is who created the Choose Con.
Really?
Bowman Gray, during the Bad House show,
Bowman Gray come up with the idea
of being able to choose.
I can remember being at a banquet.
We were, you know,
we always go to the banquet
for the Myers Brothers family stuff.
And the, at the time it was the luncheon.
And we were in the little media thing next door.
And the rumors were that
Cup was going to have a con, Choose Con.
And I heard rumors of no one, no, we'll never do that.
We'll never do that.
Well, I think that they embrace the fact
that it's entertainment.
It's entertainment.
It really is.
We are in the entertainment business.
It's entertaining.
You know what I mean?
If you don't,
if you don't give them something to watch,
they're not going to watch.
It's real simple.
Yeah.
And just like the race at Martinsville.
The race at Martinsville, the last 30 laps,
40 laps was some of the best racing you'll see.
Right.
Side by side.
Guys leaning on each other,
but still respecting each other.
That's what we do every weekend is,
is it's full contact.
It is full contact.
And how many of the announcers are saying,
Oh, this is my favorite race of the year.
This is my favorite race of the year.
We do it every Saturday night.
Right.
So I will say what you asked me
about Bowman Gray.
This just came to me like what it's done for me.
Bowman Gray helped me
whenever I went to some, another track.
So if you can just imagine,
when you're at Bowman Gray,
how keen your senses have to be,
your closing rates, your throttle, your braking,
everything happens so fast.
So when I go to a half my track,
my brain is working twice as fast as my surroundings
because I'm so used to the close quarters
of racing at Bowman Gray.
And I think that helped me.
I think it helped me when I move away
from somewhere else.
And I go somewhere and there's a wreck up here.
It's like it's almost in slow motion
because I'm used to it happening so fast.
Right.
So that's one of the things
that I think racing at Bowman Gray,
Bowman Gray's got a terrible reputation
when it comes to certain things.
People say you go to a fight and a race breaks out.
Yeah.
Okay. Well, that's cause you did a hundred great things
and the one bad thing is what made YouTube.
Yeah.
And I think that that's a part of the entertainment part of it.
Yeah. And you talk about those, those,
I'm going to call them, well, you said fights,
but I'm going to call them rivalries.
And this, this is just a question for the fans
because I know the, I think I know the answer,
but is your, is your biggest rival,
has it always been Tim Brown?
Yeah. Well, back in the day,
so Junior Miller back in the day was,
was him and my dad went head to head.
Okay.
And I can remember watching
Junior basically bully everybody around.
And I don't know why maybe because I was a young punk,
I just got it in my mind that I'm not going to let this happen to me.
And I didn't.
And it cost me about four championships and a bunch of money
because I was just,
my goal was to stand up for myself and not be bullied around.
Once I got competitive, it was Tim Brown.
It's been Tim Brown.
We've got 20, 23, 24 championships out of the last 27 years between us.
He's got 105.
I've got 102 wins.
The next active driver is my brother at 44.
So if that gives you an idea,
and I'm not trying to boast, but it means it just tells you the history
and how long we've both been doing it.
And we've been able to be pretty successful.
And when you, when you, I mean, my rivalries off the racetrack,
some of them were, I'm not speaking to that guy.
And I just want to, every opportunity I get,
I'm going to put him in a bad spot or whatever it is.
Has it changed through the years as you guys have gotten older?
Yes.
So I don't want to ruin anything for the fans to show up next year.
No, well, I don't think that's a, that's not a threat.
But man, Tim, a lot of people know this man.
Tim used to be best friends.
This was before I was.
I didn't know that.
Yeah. Before I was competitive.
Him and his ex and me and my ex would go ride go carts,
go to eat, go to movies, go golf.
Like we hung out.
We were really good friends.
But when I started getting competitive, obviously the nature is
that's going to kind of fizzle out.
And I always, the one thing I can say about Tim is I always,
I respect Tim because of how much he puts into his racing.
It's his whole life.
And now to a fault sometimes, I think you have to be careful
there, especially when you get our age, what's really important.
Now on Saturday night, when I put my helmet on, there's only one
thing I can think of that's important is that's the rest of your brain.
It does. It really does.
And then you hear people say that we put the helmet on.
He's a different person.
When you get our age, you start thinking about away from the racetrack.
You know, was what I did or what I said, was that really important?
And so I think that's affected us just a little bit, but
YouTube has as well.
Yes, YouTube has.
At least with my son.
It's like, Dad, why'd you do this?
Yeah.
Well, let's talk about that.
It's funny.
We were at the trunk of treat at Triababdus in our church
and this couple came up, didn't know the first thing about racing.
And she saw the name on the side of the trailer.
And she's asking questions in the dad and, oh, I'll look you up.
Oh boy.
Oh boy.
So that's the one bad thing over the hundred good things
is always shows up.
But you know what?
I've always said this.
The things on YouTube that make me look like an idiot at the time.
I can't.
Yeah, I did it.
Yeah.
I did it.
They didn't manufacture that.
Nope.
And so I learned from it.
And I think with you and Keele, and you probably the same way
with me and Slade is, all right, you see what I did here.
Let's don't repeat this.
Yeah, it definitely, it definitely leads to some interesting
conversations because you're like me.
You've been there, done that, right?
And you've done a lot of wrong.
But that's what's led to the, to the great moments.
Those bad moments, people ask me all the time.
They're like, well, what if you to, you know, left RCR earlier
and gone to, you know, SHR Gibbs or Hendrick or I said, I don't,
I just don't think I'd be who I am without going through
all those moments of looking like an idiot or running bad
or running good or whatever it was because you mature in life.
But if you can go through those moments and have to deal
with the adversity of all those things,
it just makes you a better person.
If you're willing to learn and progress in life,
it makes you a better person.
So it sucks when they pull it up on YouTube,
but you can always say, well, I learned from that moment.
So is there any good stories like after the race,
what's the best story, the best war with Tim Brown
after the race with the crews and people?
And it's the one that sticks out.
Me and Tim never really, there's been a few times
like post-race stuff with me and Tim, but not for the most part.
There was a lot of stuff with Junior Miller back in the day,
some brawls and some, one of his fans tried to walk out
in front of my truck, was beating on my hood.
I mean, you know, there's, it was one of the,
the crazy thing about that is,
is we had gotten into it that night
and I'm like, look, let's just get out of here.
So we load up, I'm backing up to leave.
Well, at Bowman Gray, when all the races are over,
the fans can come down to the pit.
So I couldn't get out of there fast enough.
And she walks right out in front of my truck,
like daring me to run over.
And she starts beating on my hood and there's a chance
that my foot slipped off the gate of the brake,
just a tad and maybe rolled a couple of inches.
And she wanted to take me downtown
and they wanted me to come downtown Winston Salem.
And I said, well, just so you know,
I'm driving this truck with the Dooley
and the trailer and everything else.
And I'm gonna bring about 30 witnesses with me to,
you know, all right, all right,
we'll, we'll forget about it.
Yeah.
There's been, there's so many of that stuff, Kevin,
that's, that doesn't even register anymore
because it felt so normal at the time.
And that's how, I remember when I was growing up,
like I used to sit in the grandstands as a kid
and you'd be sitting up there
and there'd be some controversy on the racetrack.
Next thing you know, you'd see a swarm of people
in a fight and, you know, when I turned 16
and got in the middle of all that,
I mean, you can come up with,
I've had death threats of wrecking the,
wrecking people on the racetrack and people pour,
go pee in a cup and pour it in your seat.
I've never had that.
That's pretty rough, man.
That's a, well, I grew up in Bakersfield, California.
So it's very, it's not, it wasn't as rough
as Bowman Gray on the racetrack,
but it was pretty, pretty intense.
And, and I think that's what,
that's what gets those, those fans to, to come back.
So you've gone through all the stuff
with, with the competition at Bowman Gray.
Was there ever a moment where you went and said,
okay, I want to go drive late models
or I want to go drive a truck
or try to take a different path in your career?
Absolutely.
And, and it all revolved around money.
Yeah.
Every bit of it.
I got, I got invited to do a test for Roush
in 01 at Lakeland, a truck test and.
Now was that part of the gong show stuff
that they were doing?
No, I think it was.
That was just an individual test.
I think this was after that maybe.
I don't, my dates are kind of fuzzy,
but that was in 01.
And it was me, a late model guy
and a girl that was running late models.
And I was within two tenths.
They brought Mark Martin in.
I just told this story the other day.
They were, they brought Mark Martin in,
put a set of stickers on the truck.
He goes out and runs a 2152.
He runs 10 laps.
He comes in, I get in the truck.
I run a 2171.
I was thinking, man, all right, it's Mark Martin.
Hey man, you know, and I'll tell you,
I'm not, I'm not, at this point in my career,
I can tell this.
I was the best of who was there that day.
And I was really happy with how I performed.
And it just tells you a little bit
about the industry, maybe.
I talked to a friend of mine later
who said he ran into the guy,
one of the guys that was there
representing the team.
And he said, I think my buddy,
Burt Myers, tested with you guys.
He said, oh, you mean the cowboy
that showed up with the open face helmet
and no head and neck restraint?
So at the time it was, you know,
they were, it was a little bit more tight-knit.
Yeah.
It was a little bit more business,
where it didn't matter how fast I was.
But yeah, I've always wanted to progress
and climb the ladder.
And you know, I ran that truck race
at Martinswood 09, driven some late model stuff.
I've won some late model races.
But I think one of my things
that's probably my one worst enemy is
once you get them modified,
there's nothing like a modified.
And so nothing else satisfies that taste
for what a modified can give you.
I was willing to sacrifice that
to be able to move on.
There's been several opportunities
I've had and money was always the end of the stop sign.
But I always said,
just like you said a while ago,
about going through things in your life.
I used to, I've said this to me in times,
but I used to pray and say,
God, just let me make it.
That was my prayer, okay?
Young, naive, just let me make it.
And in some ways I have made it,
just not how I had envisioned it.
But God has definitely blessed me and my family.
And man, I get to race for a living.
You know, I'm not rich.
I've got, there's going to be food on my table tonight
and a roof over my head and I get to go racing.
So my make it and his make it
were kind of a little bit conflicting.
But at the same time, Kevin,
I wouldn't have met my wife, Kim.
We wouldn't have slate together.
There's just so many things that guided me
that I didn't know what was happening at the time.
But here I'm sitting with Kevin Harvick doing a podcast.
I'm a local modifier.
You're happy doing-
Man, I'm as happy as I've ever been.
You're happy doing what you love to do.
I'm happy as I've ever been.
And, you know, especially in this part of the country,
you're one of the few in the modifies.
But I stand in that late model stock garage
and I look around and there's a lot of people that,
their teams itself, there's not a,
like I love Ryan Millington because of the fact that
it's just, he's over there just digging on his car
all the time.
He's got two guys there with him.
And, you know, he's, they're putting the thing together.
And that's, you see that in this part of the country,
people that are maybe not doing it for a living,
but you're capable of doing it yourself.
Right, if you had to, right?
Yes.
And, you know, our late model stock championship
happens to drove for our team,
Lion and Lewis this year.
Kid can build the whole car
and do all the things, sell the sponsorship.
I didn't know that until I watched him
till I saw him on the podcast.
I mean, the only reason he ran that car this year-
And at young age, that's-
But there's just not many of those kids
that do that anymore.
And it's just, it's not the end of the world,
but it's just, it's different than it was
when you and I came through because your dad said,
well, there you go.
If you want to build it and you can go race it
and you can take care of it.
And you learn a lot along the way
and you learn a lot driving up and down the road.
And it's like I told you earlier,
we tell Keelan all the time,
it's more important to be a good person
than it is to be a fast race car driver.
Because in this sport,
you have the ability to learn about life.
It'll teach you a lot of things about life.
If you want to learn how to balance your checkbook,
I had a checkbook when I was in the fourth grade
because dad said, all right,
you're going to know how much this costs.
So you're going to handle the checkbook.
But it, there's so many things
that you can learn about life and racing,
even if you don't make it.
And just that drive and passion
and all the things that come with it.
When you watch racing,
when you watch racing now,
do you watch any other forms of racing?
If so, like, I mean, do you watch F1?
Do you like F1 NASCAR?
What do you like to watch when you're not racing?
Or is it just flow?
I like it.
Well, honestly, I'll be the first to tell you,
unless I win or perform very well,
probably won't watch the replay.
Yeah.
I just,
It's the same way.
And maybe that's a good thing,
a bad thing, I don't know,
but that's just because I don't,
I put it behind me, you know,
and you learn from it.
But at the same time,
why do I want to, you know?
Why do I want to watch a lot?
If I just stuck my toe on the hearth,
why would I want to go do it again, right?
Right.
So, you know, I watch,
I watch Truck and Xfinity and Cup when I can.
The Martinsville race,
like I said, was pretty entertaining.
And the trucks really put on a good show.
But I'm so old school that
I don't know a lot of these drivers anymore.
Yeah.
You know, the Earnhardts and the Elliotts
and the Wallace and all that.
And then even when you guys,
and there's not many of guys our ages
are doing it anymore.
They're all,
you know, Denny's what, 44?
Yeah.
It won't be long.
He's going to be done.
So, you know, you're looking at 20-year-olds
that are out there doing it.
And sometimes that's hard for me to relate
because I am so old school
when it comes to that mental thinking.
But at the same time,
I appreciate what they do for the sport
and the show that they do put on
and the talent that these kids now.
I really, I think a lot of it we relate to.
And you've probably been there,
you've been on a road trip
and the kids in the back seat,
you hand them a phone or you hand them an iPad.
Just here, here, here.
Well, guess what?
At three years old,
they know how to navigate an iPad.
And then they're playing these video games
that have 18 different buttons on them.
I remember the Atari,
that had the joystick with the knob button.
I had it in television before the Atari.
Okay, well, then,
and then you got the PlayStation
that's got like five buttons.
That's what I can do.
And I can remember Slate one time
playing some kind of video game.
He's like, here, you try it.
I couldn't do it
because there's like 18 different buttons.
And I think that these kids now are so prepared
or mentally prepared,
they're hand and eye coordination
at such a young age.
I think that shows up on Sunday on the racetrack.
So when did you put him in?
When did you put Slate in the car for the first time?
So Slate ran when he was five and a half,
I think he did one season of go-karts.
He drove Luke Phillips grandson.
He drove his go-kart for a season.
He said, what do you think about this?
And Slate loved it.
That off-season,
Slate gravitated more to basketball.
He loved basketball.
And I always said,
I wasn't going to be the dad that pushed him.
When he got about 12 years old,
I decided in my mind,
and I talked to Kim, I said,
what if we push a little bit
just to see if he's interested or not?
And I don't know if I should tell this or not,
but we went to Caraway
and a guy wanted me to come shake his modified down.
And I said, hey, can Slate just kind of
ride around, make a few laps?
And he let him.
And I think that's kind of when it,
the light bulb went off as,
hey, this is pretty cool.
Were you nervous?
Not a little bit.
A little bit, but not terrible.
I don't know why,
but it doesn't really bother me.
I don't really think about Slate,
unless there's a caution.
I say, hey, how's Slate doing?
But I don't,
like it's not my mindset.
Now, his mom's a whole different story.
They turned into a basket case.
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
But I think Slate ran his,
I don't know if I should say this either.
Slate is actually on paper a year older.
Then he actually is.
If you follow where I'm going with that.
So he ran his first race at Bowman Gray.
Well, he was trying to think of the year.
If I tell the year,
then that might not get in trouble.
Oh, we don't need to tell the year.
But either way, very young.
Very young.
He ran his first race at Bowman Gray.
He's been hooked ever since.
Obviously he wants to progress.
We've talked to some late model teams
and because it's money,
it's all about money.
And we're working hard to try to get him.
I want him to have better than I did.
How old is he now?
17.
He's 17.
He turned 17 in August.
Okay.
Yeah.
So,
if you had a roadmap, what would you do?
Well, a cars tour, obviously,
I think is a perfect avenue
to kind of filter through.
I think if money wasn't an object,
I think he'd get right to ARCA.
I think he could go right to ARCA
and then through the trucks.
It's interesting right now
because we've had a lot of the kids
landings going to the trucks.
He's run some ARCA races.
He got Butterbean,
who came through the late model stocks.
You got Carson Guapo.
You've got
a lot of people who came through
Carson Guapo.
You've got all these guys
that have come through there now.
And they go to the ARCA for a very brief time
and then they go on to trucks and Xfinity.
It's crazy how much that that late model stock
prepares them to be ready
because it's a lot like what you guys do
on a weekly basis with modified stuff.
It's the most competitive thing in the country
to race from a late model standpoint
to prepare them.
And I think that it's like you said,
they're so prepared because of eye racing
and the generation that they live in,
you hear all the fans say,
wow, he's too young or he's this.
They don't understand.
It is not.
So I'll just tell you
because this is personal for you.
Keelan's 12 years old.
He ain't got no business race car.
Yeah.
And he just won a race.
I say, well, you try it.
Now, I'll be the first to tell you
I'd love to drive that 62 car.
I'd love to get in that thing one time
but what I'm getting at is
is people will make comments
about drivers,
whether they're age or they don't think
they're capable.
Well, that guy's in a good car.
He should be doing better than that.
And my thing is,
is you have to have some level of talent,
period, to drive a race car.
Whenever you see somebody like Keelan
who has had the success he has at the age he has,
I don't care how good his car is.
There has to be talent there.
So, and me and you probably look at it
different than a lot of people do
because we have been there
and we have done that.
Yeah.
And you would never come and go.
You would never put Slade in a car
if you watched him practice and you're like, ooh.
Right, right.
And I know I'm biased
and I think the biggest compliment for me
is when I hear somebody else brag on Slade.
Of course, I'm going to brag on him
but when I hear somebody else say,
man, he's got great car control.
Slade's biggest problem right now
is he's a little too aggressive.
But just like,
so Jason's his crew chief on the smart tour
and he said,
I'd rather have a driver that's too aggressive
than not aggressive enough.
100%.
To drain them back is a lot easier
than to try to kick them.
And Slade from day one,
when he was running 602 mods,
just over driving the car.
So that's when we were right in the tour mods
because you can hustle a little tour mod
a little better than you can to 602.
But cars tour would probably be our next step
if that door opened.
Yeah.
Well, that'd be great.
That'd be a wonderful addition to the car.
Big good story.
It'd be a great story.
And you guys,
maybe you could race against each other
in your first outing.
Do you never know?
That would be pretty fun.
That would be fun.
So last question,
when you go back,
what was your first car that you drove on the street?
My first street car,
so I have to give you the back story to this
because I told this to somebody one time
and they said,
wow, must be nice or something like that.
So my dad was a body man,
grew up doing body work.
And he bought a 1986 Alfa Romeo convertible,
black on black,
five speed.
And it was hitting the side
and he fixed it.
My mom drove it for a couple of months.
So when I turned 16, they gave it to me.
So it was pretty cool.
Riding into school with fresh license,
riding around in a little convertible,
black convertible, Italian sports car.
That might sound a little bit
not so macho,
not so macho,
but at the time I was a cool kid on the street
with my little black convertible.
Did you sell it?
Wreck it?
What'd you do with it?
Oh gosh, I'm going to tell the story.
My wife's going to kill me
because she makes fun of me all the time.
I actually,
my dad and his uncle would go to Atlantic City
once a year.
Whenever the kids and whatnot
would get old enough,
when you turn 21,
they take you to Atlantic City.
So it was my turn coming up
and I was broke.
And I'm like, man,
I want to go to Atlantic City bad.
I actually sold the car
for probably a lot less than I should have
to go to Atlantic City.
So you had some gambling money.
So I'd have some gambling money
to go to Atlantic City.
And my two of my wife said,
she's a good idiot.
I said, yeah, I was.
I was.
So did you come home with more or less money?
I think I came home.
Obviously less money.
I didn't come home broke,
but I came home with less money
than what I took.
Yeah.
Well, that's exactly how it goes.
That's why these casinos
don't look the way they do
because people win all the lights.
The lights burn for a reason.
And that's because they are making money.
But that's right.
Well, Bert, I appreciate you taking the time today.
It's fun to introduce the fans to people
that have been such an
integral part of the short track system.
And you've been a great person
to fill one of those roles
through the years
and very entertaining to watch.
But you're still doing it.
So good luck with the rest of your racing
and have fun with it.
Thanks, man.
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