CarCast+Edmunds - New Kia Telluride, Corvette Grand Sport, Porsche Cayenne EV and driving the Genesis G90
CarCast
CarCast+Edmunds - New Kia Telluride, Corvette Grand Sport, Porsche Cayenne EV and driving the Genesis G90
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50:39
Car
Genesis G90
The Genesis G90 is a top-of-the-line luxury sedan from Genesis. Here they’re talking about how comfortable it is for long trips, especially in the back seat.
Car
Mercedes-Benz S-Class
The Mercedes-Benz S-Class is Mercedes’ top luxury sedan. It’s often associated with very comfortable, chauffeur-style driving.
Term
massaging seats
Massaging seats are seats that gently vibrate or move to help you feel more relaxed. It’s a comfort feature you usually find in higher-end cars.
Brand
Edmunds
Edmunds is a car website that reviews vehicles and gives awards. They’re using Edmunds’ ratings as evidence that the Palisade hybrid did really well.
Car
Kia Telluride
The Kia Telluride is a family SUV with three rows of seats. They’re talking about it because it’s competing with other popular three-row SUVs from Hyundai and Genesis for the same buyers.
Term
Alcantara headlining
Alcantara is a soft, suede-like material used in some cars to make the interior feel more luxurious. They’re pointing out that even the roof lining is upgraded.
Term
60 grand
“60 grand” is shorthand for about $60,000, used to discuss whether the vehicle’s features justify the price. The speaker frames it as “a lot of money” for this trim, while also arguing the equipment and comfort make it feel worth considering.
Concept
tuning
In automotive terms, “tuning” is how engineers calibrate the vehicle’s behavior—engine response, transmission logic, and hybrid control strategies. Even with similar hardware, different tuning can change acceleration feel and overall drivability.
Term
all wheel drive
All-wheel drive means the car sends power to all four tires. That usually helps it grip better on slippery roads like rain or snow.
Term
ground clearance
Ground clearance is how high the car sits off the ground. If it’s higher, it’s usually easier to drive over bumps, ruts, or snowy slush without hitting the bottom.
Concept
charging over MSRP
“Charging over MSRP” refers to dealers selling vehicles for more than the manufacturer’s suggested price. This often happens when demand is high, but the segment highlights the consumer fairness debate and the reality that some buyers still pay it.
Concept
$15,000 markup
A markup is extra money the dealer charges on top of the normal price. If you see a big markup, the car can cost thousands more than you thought.
Concept
inventory left
If a dealership still has cars left over, they may be more willing to discount them. That can help you get a better price.
Brand
Kia Hyundai
Kia and Hyundai are two related brands that have been making cars that feel nicer inside. The speaker is saying they’re doing especially well lately.
Concept
quarter mile
The quarter mile (1/4 mile) is a drag-racing distance commonly used to summarize straight-line performance. It’s typically reported as an elapsed time (e.g., “runs nine seconds”) and sometimes trap speed. The speaker is using quarter-mile figures to reinforce how extreme the car’s acceleration and top-end pull are.
Concept
EVs
EVs are cars that run on electricity from a battery instead of gasoline. The point here is that Porsche committed heavily to electric cars, and the hosts think the timing and sales results may not have matched expectations.
Car
Porsche Cayenne
The Porsche Cayenne is Porsche’s SUV. They’re saying Porsche didn’t plan to keep it around for as long as it has, but it’s still part of the lineup while Porsche figures out its EV strategy.
Term
0 to 60
“0 to 60” is shorthand for how quickly a car accelerates from 0 mph to 60 mph, commonly used as a performance metric. The hosts mention it to contrast performance expectations between different luxury EVs and Porsche’s sporty image.
Term
win on range
“Win on range” is the idea that the main competitive advantage for an electric vehicle should be longer driving distance per charge. The speaker says the car doesn’t win on range, implying that range is a key buying criterion for this segment. It also connects to the earlier discussion about needing 350–400 miles to be compelling.
Concept
touchscreen controls over the air vents
Instead of turning knobs or directly adjusting the vents, the car uses a screen to control airflow. Some people may find it annoying if you want to quickly change the air without navigating menus.
Term
LS
“LS” is GM’s popular V8 engine family. A lot of people choose it because there are tons of parts and it’s easy to build for different power goals.
Concept
limited edition car
A “limited edition” car is made in small numbers, so it can become harder to find later. The point here is that GM is saying this won’t be a tiny one-time run.
Concept
sticker
“Sticker” is shorthand for the car’s advertised price, typically MSRP. The speaker suggests that if you wait and order the way you want, you might avoid dealer markup and pay closer to sticker.
Term
garish interior
“Garish” just means the colors look too loud or flashy. They’re saying the interior might be a bit too much visually.
Term
overdone
They’re saying the design uses too much of the red. When it’s everywhere, it can feel like it’s taking over the whole dashboard area.
Car
Volkswagen Atlas
The Volkswagen Atlas is a big family SUV with three rows of seats. It’s made for people who need room for passengers and cargo.
Term
spare
A “spare” is the backup tire in your car. If you get a flat, you can swap to the spare so you’re not stuck on the side of the road.
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Hello, welcome to the Invents Cardscast Podcast.
I'm Matt, the moderator, D'Andre, here with Alistair Weaver.
How are you?
I'm good, thanks, Matt. Yeah, end of a long week.
A little tired, a little grater if you're watching on YouTube, but, you know, hanging on in there.
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Yeah, we took a little quick trip to Vegas.
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Real quick, so I got into a little bit of this on the Shift and Steer podcast.
I don't think I did it on CarCast this week, but that trip to Vegas, I think I mentioned to you before we headed out, is we, we grabbed, I grabbed the Genesis G90 for the road trip.
And I think it's the Black Signature Edition.
Now, this one was kind of interesting because I think it only comes in all black or white and they sent the black one, again, not the best press car.
But the advantage of it was is once, because you have, when you have a car, we stayed at a place where I had some free parking and I had a car there.
So, and we were out with a bunch of other people.
So, I was kind of doing this thing where you're like, okay, you know, I'm going to drop you off at this hotel and I'm going to go grab somebody at the restaurant.
Then we're going to meet up here and having that car available.
And I, I got into this thing of like texting people going, I'm going to pull up to the hotel, but I don't want to jam up the valet lines.
I'm going to pull to the side of the hotel.
But because this thing is all black, like black wheels, black, everything, and it's got the sunshades that roll up in the back.
No one was kicking me out of like the fire lane or whatever, because it just looks like I'm supposed to be there.
Like I'm in an Uber, like a black car, like a car service that people just want.
Like somebody pulled up behind me in a white van and the guy was waving and was like, you can't park there, you can't park there.
But in the all black, long wheelbase, like nice G90, you know, the big full-size sedan, nobody gave me any static about it.
So it was fun.
And then I did try it on the way home.
I told Tammy, it's like, listen, it was a long weekend.
I'm going to catch a quick nap, but I'm going to sit in the back and I'm going to hit that chauffeur mode and it moves the front passenger seat forward.
And the back seat goes back and the footrest comes up and it reclines and the massage seat, you can put that on.
So it was just like, just taking a little power nap reclined in the seat, little dogs on my lap, everybody was comfortable.
And then, you know, after a while, I was like, all right, that was nice.
Let's switch.
She's like, all right.
So then she sat at the back and I don't know, except she was watching March Madness the whole time on her phone and I was not.
It's a nice way to troll.
I still love big sedans.
Nobody buys them anymore.
Maybe apart from the S class, people still buy the S class chauffeurs and stuff.
But that Genesis, I mean, I think they're big for kind of career and executives in Seoul.
I'm not sure they sell too many here in America, but I love those big comfy sedans.
I'll tell you, I mean, it was equipped with just about everything you can think of, right?
Like power, sunshades and massaging seats and great, you know, audio system and everything seemed to work well.
It was comfortable.
You know, the diamond stitch interior and at 105,000.
I don't even think there was options on it when you get that black.
When you compare that to an S class, which is 30,000 dollars less money.
Yeah.
You know, so I have seven series BMW.
Yeah.
I'm not a big fan of the sale.
It's pretty in the seventh series as well, which also helps.
Yeah.
I like it because it's kind of a bit of a sleeper car as well.
You know, you don't really like an S class is a statement.
Isn't it?
It's like, I'm a, you know, I'm a, I'm a C suite.
I think the, the, the Genesis kind of slides on the radar, a bit more comfortable in your own skin.
And I know part of our plan for this show is to talk about the, the telluride.
So I spent the week in one of those and, you know, obviously the Genesis is on, on top of that.
And one of the things I spent sitting in the Kia was like, where does Genesis go?
Cause this is so nice.
Yeah.
And that's one of the big challenges.
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Let's, let's get into this.
Let's talk about the telluride because we've been speaking so highly of the Hyundai Palisade.
Yeah.
Right.
Um, especially the hybrid version, it took the overall, it took the, you know, as a category winner,
I guess the overall winner for the Edmunds top rated.
Yeah.
Edmunds top rated best of the best.
Best of the best.
And when we were going through that, yeah, we were talking about like, what does Genesis do?
How do they revamp their, their higher end SUV lineup going, you know, for $60,000,
you got a Palisade Hyundai calligraphy with every nice option you can imagine in three rows
and decent gas mileage and, you know, it seemed to do well.
And then we were talking about before it's like, we're starting to get a little competitive
between the Kia, the Hyundai and the Genesis lineup of vehicles.
And I think we're, you're seeing it more with this new Kia telluride and the Hyundai Palisade.
You, you are.
And I think, you know, they are so closely matched.
I mean, we did a comparison test and, you know, we always try and pick a winner and there
was a couple of little nuances why we get a Palisade, but really they're so closely matched
that you're buying it on which do you prefer the look of, which do you prefer the interior
of?
And I think what they've done a good job is really distinguishing the two.
If you go back the last generation Palisade and telluride, they were kind of, it was harder
to distinguish here.
You know, they look so very different, particularly inside the Palisades, all this kind of Art
Deco vibe.
The Kia is, is, is much more kind of, you know, much more contemporary is almost the
wrong word, but it has a very different feel.
It's a bit more open, but they, but in terms of the things like the material quality choice.
So this was the SX prestige, which is, it is kind of at the top of the range, but my wife
works for L'Oreal in makeup.
So she's very kind of tuned into product development and marketing and everything else.
She's just got in and so this is fantastic.
And we always play this game of like, how much is it?
And you know, it's hard to believe it's, it's 60 grand Alcantara, headlining, great technology,
really nicely, nice resolution screen, super responsive, loads of technology, you know,
massaging seats and this and that.
You get in there and you think like, this is, this is not far off a Range Rover.
And I don't say that likely.
You know, this, this feels like a luxury car and 60 grand in this trim is a lot of money,
but it's an awful lot of car for 60 grand.
Yeah.
So what are the, what are the differences between the Palisade and the Kia?
Cause one of the things I was reading up on the, on the, on the review you guys posted
was the same powertrain, roughly the same weight, maybe the Kia is even a little heavier,
but the Kia ended up being quicker.
Yeah.
I mean, they, you know, it's, it's all on the, it's all on the, all on the margins and
the way that they do these cars well and the way that they're able to manage the cost is
because you, you know, they share as much componentry that you can't see as possible.
And then they have the, you know, then they do all the styling and the development and
the tuning, the tuning themselves.
So it's, it's, it's mainly down to our aesthetic choices.
And of course that impacts things like weight, depending on how the, you know, how it's been
styled and everything else.
I think what is interesting about this generation, we now have the hybrid.
So two and a half liter turbo for two electric motors.
I've just spent the week and this is not, you know, you don't just buy for the fuel economy
and knocking around LA.
I've been seeing 25, which is pretty good for a vehicle of this size.
And of course that's six bucks a gallon.
That suddenly means a lot more than it once did.
But it's also just got that really nice, easy punch that you get from a good hybrid system.
So, you know, it's a big, heavy vehicle, but you pull away, you get that kind of effortless,
you know, effortless acceleration while the turbo spools up and the, you know, the gas engine,
you know, comes to life as well.
So six speed also cause all wheel drive.
I mean, the official figures are like 31 combined.
So, you know, me seeing 25 around LA kind of makes sense to me, you know, 5,000 pounds.
It's not, this is all these are all figures, 5,000 pounds.
It's not a, it's not a light car.
But when you think about how heavy a lot of the EVs are, that's, that's not crazy anymore.
Zero to 67 seconds, which, you know, it's a family car, right?
That's probably, it's not fast buying modern standards, but it's fine.
Is there, is there more of a, of a sort of off-road version of it?
Is that the SX trim or is that a different trim?
No, they've now set up, they're now sending, they're trying to set up a bit of a sub,
almost like a sub brand.
And now I'm having a complete brain fade of what it's called, something pro.
Google it quick.
XRT, you know, because Hyundai's is XRT and Kia's is.
But it has, yeah.
So there's the, the bit, the car I was in was the more the kind of road.
It's like the pro X-line, is that it?
X-line.
X-line.
Is it the X-line?
Yeah.
Just Google tell you right quickly.
We'll pretend that we know we're talking about.
I'll keep going on this.
So you've got two distinct model groups.
You've got ones that are more kind of look, luxury orientated with one I was driving,
which personally I prefer to look off.
And then you've got more of a kind of off-road, not an off-roader,
but more of a sort of chunky, tired, kind of outdoorsy type vibe.
And interesting talking to some of the Kia team a couple of weeks ago,
they were saying that internally there was a lot of debate about, you know,
do you just put a bunch of badges on it and call it a kind of, you know, an overlander?
But they were adamant that they'd gone, you know, they've tried to introduce,
you know, better tires and actually give it some integrity.
Yeah.
So it's the X-line.
They have X-line versions.
And then when you get more expensive, it's X-pro.
That's right.
The X-pro.
So the X-pro is kind of like Honda, you know, Honda Passport trail sport.
Right.
It's kind of most of the brands now are trying to do these kind of like slightly more alpha versions.
Yeah.
Which also maybe makes sense if you're in the snow belt and things like that.
You've got a little bit more, a little bit more from the tire, a little more versatility,
sometimes a little bit more ground clearance, that kind of thing.
So I can understand if you're up in Michigan or something trying to deal with the weather
and then a bit of, you know, around the lakes in the winter, in the summers,
it probably makes a lot of sense.
But the other thing we should talk about on the score is if you remember when Telluride,
the first generation came out, they were charging market,
or dealers were charging markets, we seemed unbelievable on like a debut Kia 3-row.
And we talked about this in a previous show, I was going down,
I went down to Kia dealer last night to look at an EV6 for my wife and possibly an EV9.
And there was a bunch of Tellurides there and I kind of drove in in a Telluride,
which confused everybody, but...
You drove into the new one that they probably don't have yet?
They do actually.
They do have it.
I was a bit like that.
Am I going to turn up?
I'm not going to think, who the hell is this?
Because we haven't even got these.
But no, we...
And they go, I was like, why have you bought that?
Or I was like, well, I'm kind of on loan.
I wanted a mystery shop a little bit.
I don't like, you know, I kind of like to go in and sort of...
Yeah, it didn't have an admins license plate in the front, like the...
No, it was Kia's own car.
For photography.
Exactly.
Yeah.
Okay.
But what are you doing?
Are you selling a lot of Tellurides?
Are they MSRP?
And certainly down the road, they were selling...
They were selling anything up to 15 grand over MSRP.
And, you know, there's always this debate about, like, is this fair to the consumers?
But at the end of the day, you know, they're charging over MSRP and people are willing to pay it.
But it is extraordinary that, you know, you've got this great family car.
But, you know, suddenly, I mean, I know internally Kia's had this big debate.
Do we undercharge for this vehicle?
Because if the dealer can charge 15 grand more for it.
15 grand more for a hybrid and probably about 8 grand more for a non-hybrid.
And then on the flip side, the EVs really struggling to sell.
And of course, this is LA.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's kind of tough.
So if you want an EV9 at the moment or an EV6, they're a bargain.
I obviously have, for a long time, had strong opinions on the markup and for something like this,
which isn't a limited edition vehicle and there's no real need for the markup.
It's a deal killer for me.
I would just find another dealer or shop around and, you know, get the vehicle or wait a little longer.
Like, as much as, you know, I get it, people get so emotional about getting a new car.
I do as well.
It's very exciting and I want to get it and you see it and you drive it.
And so, you know, but for me, it's like, I'm not going to.
It's just money you're going to throw away.
And it's not something I'm a fan of.
But I struggle with it.
I struggle as well.
Apart from, you know, although part of me says it's kind of market forces and if people willing to pay.
Right.
But it is difficult.
But if you don't pay it, they'll go away.
Yeah.
Market store go away.
You know, it's classic market market forces.
But I do think the advice to consumers is, you know, wait.
You know, I don't, there's not always going to be a $15,000 markup on one of these cars.
You know, we've seen it across the market.
You know, I remember when the CR one came out talking to the guys there, like, are you going to have big markups on these?
And they were like, maybe, but then, you know, it's not a limited edition run.
So if people are willing to let it to wait, you know, be surprised if there's a big markup, you know, year two years down the line.
But I also understand people want a shiny new thing and maybe build it into financing.
But it also probably means that the residual values on this car are going to be strong.
And I think that's the problem with the V market.
People, particularly if you're buying one, people are like, what's this thing going to be worth in three years time?
With a telluride, you know, in three years time, one of those with, you know, 20, 30,000 miles on it, maybe, you know, it's going to be a very desirable car still.
Now, the one you're talking about is technically a 2027 model.
But there's the.
Yeah.
20.
Yeah.
It's pretty.
But they sort of make up when it's 2027.
I mean, I was like down there yesterday, they got 2025 EV6.
I was like, why have you got 2025?
And he was like, well, I guess we haven't sold them.
So we're like, there's still 25s.
And I said, when are you getting 26s as well?
Like when we sell these, you know, it's 2027.
This new version of the telluride is the 27, but there's nothing wrong with the 26 or 25 or whatever.
So if there's any inventory left on those and you get that for better than below sticker price,
you know, especially if you're just going to lease it for a couple of years, you know, that's still a great buy.
I mean, for me, if somebody said get a 2027, I know you want the new flashy, shiny thing,
but it's 15,000 over sticker or maybe you negotiate it down.
It's still 7,500 out over sticker or you get the previous version, which was perfectly good.
And you get it for, you know, two grain under sticker.
Yeah, I would just save my $10,000 or so and get the previous one.
It is an interesting conundrum because we're shopping for the lens car at the moment.
And, you know, we want an EV on the few consumers left that actually positively wants an EV.
And, you know, you're trading off, you're trading off like what you kind of want an Aspire to versus just mega deals.
So it's like, you know, we're comparing in a Cadillac optique with a Kia EV6 because the deals line up,
even though one is a luxury car, one is more the mainstream car.
And then, you know, and then an EV9 because the cost of an EV9 on a lease is similar to an EV6.
So you end up in this kind of strange market where, you know, they've been incentivized so heavily that everything kind of merges into one.
And then, you know, you have to play this game, you know, like we loved our GV60.
But I like, well, what would it be to lease a new one?
About 700 bucks a month, Cadillac's 325.
So why am I, you know, maybe I prefer the GV60, but the GV60 is like two and a half times as much.
So, you know, it's never going to be worth an extra 500 bucks a month to me or something.
Is there, I didn't check, but is there a markup on the Hyundai Palisade hybrid?
Well, there's a stop sale on the high trims that I remember.
But I think it depends on, I mean, some of this is geography as well.
You know, like we're in LA, affluent audience, you know, it's a popular family car around here, you know,
and that whole shopping out of state thing, I know there's various challenges with it and, you know,
logistical and everything else.
But, you know, that's the thing is where do you, you know, where you live in the country can have quite a big bearing on things like that.
That does as well.
And again, if you're looking to get the newest vehicle right away and you don't want the markup,
there is a little bit of a trade-off.
You could probably find it elsewhere in the country and figure out some sort of like,
do you want to take a road trip or you're going to have it shipped?
Now, if you're going to have it shipped, that could be a couple of grand.
But, you know, if the markup is 10 or 15 grand and the shipping is two grand, you know,
sure, you're losing money either way.
Or do you want to, you know, catch a Southwest flight for, you know, 150 bucks and drive it back and have a little road trip out of it?
Which, by the way, I've done intentionally going, hey, I'd like to buy the car,
but also like it would be more fun to like also get a little bit of a road trip going on.
So why don't we just buy one, you know, someplace else and drive it and make a few stops?
So if you have the opportunity to do that, that's not a terrible idea.
I don't think there has to be any particular loyalty to your local dealer.
It's not like you're going to ever take it in for service or something and go,
well, you don't get priority because you didn't buy it here.
No, I mean, it's always nice to have a like a relationship.
But, you know, as you say, there's a value on everything.
And I'd quite like a relationship with a dealer, but it's probably not worth 15 grand to me.
So, yeah, I had a friend who bought a doctor who lives locally and bought a 911 GT3.
And he literally rang every dealer in America and he found like a mom and pop store in,
I think it was Philadelphia or something, who just basically told him his story,
said he'd always wanted one of these. It saved up.
It was a big, you know, there's a big narrative attached to it and, you know,
didn't end up paying the market.
He said, I literally just, I just picked up the phone and I got the list of all of the portion dealers in America
and start at the top and went my way down.
And so, yeah, if you're willing to put the effort in, it's, you know, it's interesting.
But tell you right, even honestly, even at 75 grand, the 15 grand markup, this is still a really good car.
You know, they throw in the, you understand the expression, throw in the kitchen sink.
Does that work in America? Kitchen sink? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
Okay. That works here. That works here.
But, you know, like you said, other than the temporary stop sale on the Hyundai,
if you go and you can't find a telluride locally that you want and because of the markup,
check Hyundai Palisade because that's also gorgeous and it's very much a lot of the same thing.
It's not like one is super ugly. Like they look different, but they both look good.
Yeah. I mean, for my mind, I don't have the telluride just because it appeals to me aesthetically.
But yeah, I mean, you're not, they're both great products.
And, you know, we talked about this a lot, Kia Hyundai are the brands on the roll at the moment.
And, you know, you look around at some of the, you know, some of what other people are doing,
particularly things like the interior quality and the fit and finish is, you know,
there's a lot to be, there's a lot to be learned there. And it's interesting, you know,
another way they're structured as a business allows them to be a bit more long term as well.
And of course, the telluride is built in America so they don't have the tariff problems that others do in places.
So, okay. There's a little bit more. There's Porsche Cayenne is finally out with their electric Cayenne.
But let's take a quick break and then we'll get into a few more things.
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The Needle in the Haystack.
Okay.
Okay. Let's talk for a minute about the Porsche Cayenne EV.
Now, I don't think you've had an opportunity to drive it yet.
Reese, who's been on the show, drove it because he won the lottery pool, I guess,
and went to Barcelona.
Barcelona's lovely. You've been to Barcelona in Barcelona.
I have not.
And I know when you said he was going out there, you were like,
I can't go on all the nice trips. So Reese is going out to that one.
You mentioned specifically that was a good one.
Barcelona is a beautiful city and nice driving modes around there.
Yeah. I mean, we come back to the EV conundrum that is any, you know,
the big question is, is anybody going to buy it?
You know, Taycan sales started really strong now.
They fell off a cliff.
I think Taycan was the worst performing Porsche in terms of sales last year.
Macan EV were not massive fans of.
We think, you know, it's the packaging isn't good.
There's not enough space. There's no interior.
It's a little bit disappointing. Drives great.
But, you know, there's a lot of things.
So this, this is a kind of big, big opportunity.
You know, this was the big play by Porsche that, you know,
but, you know, and the thinking when they commissioned this was by now,
everybody would maybe transitioning to EVs and, you know,
2030 be coming around them in a more gas engine.
So what are you going to do?
You're going to have to, to bet everything on EVs.
And of course, it's a, it's a different world now, particularly in,
particularly in the U.S.
And this thing is expensive starts at 112 plus inevitable Porsche options,
130 for the Cayenne S, 166 for the Cayenne turbo electric.
You know, so realistically, you're going to be paying anything from sort of 120 to 200.
It's a, it's a lot of money.
And, you know, it's, it's, I mean, I have a chat to him as well.
And, you know, you read the piece and, you know, he, it's a,
it's a really appealing piece of kit from a, from a, from an engineering perspective.
I mean, the turbo has got like 1100 horsepower.
I think it's got more power than the nine 18 spider.
I think most powerful pot.
I think it's the most powerful electric EV probably to loose.
It does a, does, does a, does a, there's a claim in zero to 60 and 2.4 seconds
and it runs nine seconds, like high nine quarter miles, like 99 quarter miles.
Like the thing's insane.
And it, it looks good.
I definitely like it better than the McCann, you know, the proportions are a little bit better.
It doesn't look quite as chunky.
Depending on the trim model, the front ends a little weird.
They had one down at the Porsche center in LA when I was visiting and it's a,
there's a lot going on with the design.
You know, I like the gas Cayenne cause it's actually quite, quite simple.
You know, this, I think with all the aerodynamics and everything else is quite a complex design again,
but the interior, the interior is bigger, well, obviously bigger than the McCann,
but also I think the material choice and things like that is a little bit better.
It's quite a busy interior.
You know, it's not that kind of EV simplicity, but I, I just, you know,
particularly in America, the point of these cars is to go long distance.
You know, this is your car to go skiing in and not all the rest of it.
This is your family road trip car.
And, you know, that's where EVs to some extent start to fall over.
And, you know, I just wouldn't, I just wonder how big the market is over here.
Yeah.
I wonder, see the Porsche audience is a particular audience for sure.
Right.
It is Porsche trying to win new customers with things like McCann EV and Cayenne EV
or, or they trying to say, you know, come in, get one of these,
maybe even lease one of these because you've got your, your 911 that you use on the weekends,
your cars and coffee or occasional like, you know, into work a day or two a week or something.
But they're saying this is the one you should be driving.
The problem is, is I don't think that strategy is really resonated with Porsche owners.
And when Taycan came out, a lot of Porsche owners at first, yes, there's that opinion going,
it's not a real Porsche.
It's electric.
I don't want to do it.
But then people started getting into them and didn't necessarily love it.
That was the thing.
Like there was an opportunity to get in to the first electric Porsche and have it be so great
where people are like, well, you can't argue the numbers.
Like this is, you know, it's comfortable.
It's fast.
It's great.
It's works.
It's intuitive, you know, like if it, if it absolutely crushed all of those things,
then I think people would have a different opinion about it.
So now there's a little bit of catch up, right?
Now they're going, well, Taycan didn't debut the way we wanted to.
The sales aren't really there, but we still got to do EVs.
Now we got to kind of make up for a lot of, for a little bit of like sour taste.
We left with, you know, with, with hardcore owners.
I mean, I think the Taycans, it's a little bit harsh on the Taycan.
I think like they kind of enjoyed the Taycan.
And I think they always liked the, the cross-tourismo as well.
You know, I think the, the wagon version.
So I think it, I think the product, the product was strong.
It's just where people kind of ready for, you know, a lot of the Porsche,
it's a bit like, you know, people wanting to buy a quartz version of a Rolex, probably not.
So now I think, you know, that, that whole engineering aspect of a Porsche and the noise
and the kind of visceral sensations, all the subjective stuff is still really important.
And, you know, I think they bet on the EVs because they thought the whole world was turning EV
and they're not the biggest company in the world and they couldn't really hedge their bets.
So they wanted to, they wanted to go all in on EVs and that bit like Volvo.
And that now just seems like a terrible business decision and one that they're desperately trying to reverse out of.
So we, we see, we're hearing that, you know, the Boxster EV and the Cayman EV, are they ever going to appear?
You know, they're trying to re-engineer them.
Same with the, you know, McCann EV, you know, the old McCann is now as old as the Hills, it's kind of soldiering on.
The Cayenne wasn't supposed to kind of continue this long, but, but will.
So they've now got gas cars, which are old, but they're trying to, you know, trying to update, which isn't easy.
They've got brand new EVs that arguably aren't selling.
So it's a, it's a mess and that the share price reflects that.
And yeah, it's a commuter car.
If you live, you're on an affluent type in LA and you've probably got a fleet of cars and, you know, you're doing your daily commute to the office.
This would be a lovely way to, to commute. No question.
Does that, is that enough to get some, you say, no, I'm going to spend 150 grand a one or do they walk in and say, well, kind of like the hybrid Cayenne.
And then I can take it skiing and I don't have to worry about recharging it and stuff.
And I'm going to buy this instead.
I'm not worried about residuals.
You know, that's the other thing is like you buy one of these.
So I think everybody will lease one.
And then the danger with that is if the residual values aren't very good, Porsche is just going to lose a ton of money.
So yeah, it's hard.
And Porsche is in a, in an interesting situation with something like this, because it has to perform and it has to be fast and it has to be able to go around the track because it's a Porsche.
But yeah, if it is, you know, a road trip car as well, you kind of have to win on range.
And we just don't have the technology there yet to win on both of those things.
Like do you want 1100 horsepower in 060 in 2.4 seconds?
Or do you want 400 miles of range?
And you just can't get both of those right now.
And you can't in a gas car, you know, if you're going to do 0 to 16 in three seconds, you're going to burn gas and you got to stop more.
So it's not like the physics has changed.
And actually, like, like, do you want to do 0 to 16 in two seconds?
You know, I've done 0 to 16 in two seconds.
It's actually pretty, you know, it's actually pretty extreme experience.
You do it once to show off.
And then after that, you don't really do it anymore because it's quite painful.
I don't know.
I haven't driven it yet.
You know, obviously from everything I'm reading and speaking to Rhys, it's a great product.
And I think we always thought it was going to be a great product.
And also, there isn't really a rival at that price.
The gravity, losing gravity is significantly cheaper.
There's a three row Rivians, a three row Range Rover EV, which is supposed to be the rival isn't here yet.
So actually, it has got the market to itself.
So if you've got 150 grand to spend on a luxury electric SUV, this is kind of your choice, which is interesting.
So there is a big opportunity.
There's some clear space for them to operate in.
It'll be really interesting to see how it goes and what the lease rates are because some of the, you know,
some of the lease rates on Taycans are still really high.
So let's see.
Lucid gravity was proposed with a little bit longer range than it actually is getting.
That was one of the ones where they're like, yeah, we're going for 400 and it didn't quite get 400.
I didn't know a range test, but it does.
I mean, the Lucid's always, the thing with the Lucid's or the technology's been good in the range is, you know,
they make these claims and even if they miss, which they did with some of the air models, they still go a long way.
But that car seems to be a little bit unloved.
You know, I think Rivians done a better job of defining their brand.
That gravity is a bit, you know, I just don't see them.
On paper, it was interesting, but it just kind of looks a little more minivan-ish and a little less SUV-ish.
Yeah, and the Porsche looks like a proper, you know, fairly sporting SUV.
The most interesting product of all these big companies is potentially the Range Rover.
Because first of all, it has to look like a Range Rover, right?
Because that's Range Rover.
Yeah.
And it doesn't have to do 0 to 60 in two and a half seconds because it's not competing with Porsche.
But honestly, I really think an electric Range Rover, especially the big version, if that's the one they're definitely doing,
it has to be 350 to 400 miles of range.
I know it's big and it's nice.
And around here, everyone in Beverly Hills and LA drives a big Range Rover and that's all they do.
So they probably don't need the range.
But there's just something about that car, like you said, just getting out of town or going skiing or whatever.
It's the big comfortable luxury SUV that everyone in LA seems to want.
And for good reason.
It's nice.
And you remember, I drove it.
I drove it in Sweden in the Arctic last, you know, about this time last year.
And now they're still honoring what to do with it.
I think the problem they had and I spoke to some of their leadership team about this is, you know,
they had to commit to how many batteries they were going to do.
And, you know, because all of the supply issues and, you know, they just don't know where the market's going to be.
And, you know, it's going to be really, I think it is what my experience of it is what you described.
They're not trying to do zero to 16, two seconds because it's not where the customer is.
You know, they're trying to create a really nice Range Rover and everything I saw and drove of it.
I thought, well, this is this is that car.
Super, you know, it's quick, quick without being stupid, super refined, comfortable, responsive.
The off-road stuff works well because you've got more electronic control.
You know, but if it's going to be 200 grand, you know, again, are people willing to pay a premium from Electric Range Rover?
And I think that's where the why the problem lies.
If it wins on range, because we all know.
Which it's not because the only way to win on range is to either have some, you know, innovative technology that frankly doesn't exist.
It's on the Range Rover platform.
So you haven't got like something bespoke where you can optimize for range.
And the only other way to do it is to do it the GM way and sticking an enormous battery at which point the price goes through the roof and the weight goes through the roof.
And you haven't got room for the battery anyway.
So yeah, it'll be competitive on range.
And that's the that's the thing.
So I think where it will sell to is people who've got, you know, three or four Range Rovers.
And crazy though, it seems there's plenty of people in LA that have multiple Range Rovers.
Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Okay.
So Cayenne EV, it looks good.
The interior is a big upgrade over the McCann EV released functionally and whatnot.
And then there's a couple of little quirks.
I think I read in Reese's report saying that it's got another one of these vehicles that has like touchscreen controls over the air vents.
So you can't just get in and flick an air vent if you're, you know, it's a little it's a little weird, but because we don't need that.
Nobody's asking for that.
You know, we brought that up many times.
Is it going to sell?
Is Porsche customers going to resonate with it or are they going to bring new customers to the brand?
And that's, that's going to be a tough question.
I hope it sells.
You know, I think, you know, I, you know, I hope it sells for them because I like innovative products and, you know, it seems like a really interesting piece of engineering.
So I hope it does.
Will it bring new customers?
I don't know.
Will it appeal to, you know, I don't, I wonder where they come from because they don't exist at the moment.
You know, it's not like everybody's driving, you know, coming out of another luxury EV.
So are they just coming across from what?
I mean, I'm trying to think of other EVs, you know, the SUVs at that moment, you really are talking about Range Rover.
You know, it's a bit cheaper than a Bentley.
It's more expensive than something like a, you know, GLS Mercedes.
So yeah, you're going to get Range Rover customers coming into this.
I don't see it.
So you're going to take traditional Porsche customers and put them into this.
Maybe.
Yeah, I don't know.
And that's the, I think that's the realization that they have.
I'm looking forward to driving it though.
I think, I think it's going to be a nice way to, it's going to be a nice way to travel.
Yeah.
Okay.
So moving on off of that, let's talk a little bit about Corvette Corvette Grand Sports.
So there's a new Corvette coming out the Grand Sport, which they've done several versions of in the past.
So there's definitely some legacy here.
There's some history there.
The ones you'll see in all the hero shots or the blue with the stripes and the,
and it's to me, Grand Sport has always been a pretty cool car in the Corvette lineup.
The way GTS has been in the Porsche lineup.
It's, it's, it's usually got some really good options on it.
It's not the most expensive thing.
It's not the cheapest thing.
It's got the right amount of performance options in it.
And it's usually priced pretty well because of the standard features.
And this one is following that same formula.
I think it's very cool, but also it is the debut of the new 6.7 liter engine,
which I think is significant for, for GM as a whole, right?
Now, this engine could potentially show up in trucks and SUVs and things like that,
but moving away eventually from the, what's 6.2 liter, the LS6 and moving into this,
sorry, this is the, the LS6, right?
And then replacing the LT2, I believe.
Yeah, I think this is the thing.
I like the, I think the Stingray is going to continue,
but this is the engine that will be in the Silverado,
expecting to see a new Silverado this end of this year.
So it's funny, isn't it?
We've liked Leap from Mackayen, Electric Cayenne,
which is supposed to feature now, what is GM launching?
6.7 liter V8, which will, you know,
which will be the bedrock of most of their top selling cars,
including the Silverado.
So it's, it's not the flat, I knew you, just to talk,
go back through the Corvette lineup.
So you have the Stingray, which is V8 495 horsepower.
Then you have, which 6.2, isn't it?
Then you have this at 6.7, which is the, the sort of latest iteration,
which hasn't got that much more power.
What is it, five?
Those are my notes.
500 and 525.
Yeah.
So it's not like a massive leap in power, but there's more,
and talk, and obviously,
535.
So 535 horsepower and 520 pound-feet of torque versus 495 and 470.
Yeah.
The talk things kind of probably going to be the bigger difference.
So, and so then this is going to sit in between Stingray and Z06.
Yes.
And by the time you get this Grand Sport optioned up,
if you want to put track packages on and that sort of thing,
then you're going to get pretty close to the Z06 price.
So it is the portion allergy I think you made is really strong because it's,
it's like the GTS versus the GT3.
You might, you might aspire to the Z06, you might think, oh, the Z06,
but the Z06 is more kind of track focused and a bit more hardcore.
This is a kind of a great compromise of an everyday Corvette.
And there's a hundred.
Well, also like it has like appearance-wise,
it has the wider fenders of the Z06.
So it does distinguish itself from the Stingray, from the base model C8.
Obviously, there's a couple of other features and things that they're,
they're changing it up a little bit on this thing.
So, and Kerr makes a good point in this, like, you know,
we're saying it's like probably going to be 90 to 100 grand.
But then when you look at like what everything, you know,
what, what, what everything, how expensive everything else has gone.
I mean, you can't go 911 for 100 grand anymore.
Yeah.
You can't get, you know, you're talking about M4 CS is that kind of money, the BMW.
So it is a lot of money, but everything's just got so expensive now that,
you know, it's not a, it's not a 911 rival, really.
It's a used 911 rival, perhaps.
But, you know, it's 90 grand or, you know,
the convertible will be a little bit more.
And then they're going to do an X version, which is,
there's E-Ray is dead and it's now going to be a Grand Sport X,
which is an E-Ray with a different engine, basically.
So they're going to stick the hybrid in this.
Right.
So that's, that's kind of interesting.
So first of all, you can get this in the standard hardtop Targa.
You can get it in the convertible.
You can get it in the rear wheel drive, naturally aspirated 6.7 liter,
or you can get it in the all wheel drive,
electric motor on the front axles, X version of it.
You still get the 6.7 liter.
Yeah.
But with the extra power from the electric motors,
and then that ups it to 721 horsepower.
So naturally aspirated rear wheel drive, 535 horsepower,
Grand Sport X, 721 horsepower.
So if you think about-
And of course four wheel drive so you can deploy it.
That's going to be the critical thing.
And I think the E-Ray, again, like this whole,
like the politics and everything else,
E-Ray always like sounded like the hybrid Corvette.
And I think, you know, going down the bar,
it's like, no, I've got a Grand Sport X.
You know, I think there's just the psychology of it.
And they spend a lot of money on the marketing,
but the psychology of that is different.
And I think the E-Ray is massively underrated.
I think it's fantastic car to drive.
So I suspect that the Grand Sport X is going to be the choice.
So what also caught my attention was, again,
on the new engine, the 6.7 liter engine,
and the power that it's making.
And by the way, they said the packaging of this whole thing
with the new engine is only about a 20 pound difference.
So it's about 20 pounds heavier.
But also the Grand Sport has forged internals.
Like this is a built motor.
It's got 13 to one compression.
So it's an interesting engine,
especially with that horsepower and those torque numbers.
But I'm looking forward to also seeing this show up
in the Chevrolet Performance catalog
as an aftermarket crate engine.
We've, you know, we have so many different variations
of their crate engines.
And LS still shows up at SEMA cars across the board.
But if you want the latest and greatest,
this is potentially a really, really cool crate engine.
Yeah.
It's, you know, as I said,
with the mainstay of the trucks going forward
and everything else.
So we haven't driven it yet.
When we got the copy invite to the event,
I think everybody thought it was a drive
and then it turned out not to be.
So I think it was a degree of disappointment.
But we are looking forward to driving it.
I think it's going to be, you know,
Corvette has that nice niche where it's just sort of cheaper
than most of its obvious rivals,
but, you know, obviously far from cheap.
We loved our Stingray and the guys obviously,
oh, we love the Stingray.
Do you think we can get one of these?
Like we can buy one of these for the fleet.
I was like, I think that might be a bit of a stretch,
but we'll see.
But listen, I agree with you what you were saying earlier.
Don't sleep on the Z06.
I know it's maybe not selling quite as well.
And for that reason, you can get it for sticker
or maybe even under sticker.
Yeah, I think there's some deals on Z06.
Again, depends where you are in LA.
This is the thing in LA.
I think there's deals on Z06.
There's maybe if you're elsewhere in the country
where it's a bit more kind of Corvette central,
maybe the deals aren't as good.
So I know ZR1 and ZR1X took the spotlight off of it
and you look at it and go, oh, ZR1 collectability,
where it's going to, you know,
it's going to sell for a ton of Bear Jackson down the road.
But that flat plane crank, the way it sounds,
you know, to just sort of the more analog,
raw performance of it, you think about it.
The way that thing winds up, the way it sounds,
rear-wheel drive, all motor, like Z06 is awesome.
Oh, I think it's a fabulous car.
I mean, we had it at the Edmunds U-Drags
and it performed amazingly well.
And then I've driven it on the road as well.
And it's a really visceral experience.
But again, like the ride quality is good.
I mean, the Z06 is, it is quite extreme,
but you know, I'm not sure it's as extreme
as the latest GT3 911 because the ride quality is actually,
you know, Chevy's done a really good job of, you know,
even the Z06, which is supposed to be more extreme.
It's very livable with, and of course,
it's still quite practical and I like it.
I'd have a Z06 in a heartbeat, to be honest.
The Grand Sport, I was going to imagine,
other than the engine and some of the revisions they made,
it also does come with the latest versions of things
like their Magna Ride suspension, more fine tuning.
So presumably even better than, you know,
the ones that are out on the street.
But I think the Grand Sport's cool, man.
I think it looks cool.
I think there's some collectability to it.
Now, there's talk of, you know, again, on markup,
is it going to be markup or not?
But GM is saying this isn't necessarily a limited edition car.
No, this is going to be a, like, full-on part of the motor range.
And to be fair, they've said that about all the cars.
They've said that about the ZR1, you know, ZR1X.
We're not going to, you know, it's not like this is a kind of 250
and we're done.
These are production cars and we'll build them as long as,
you know, there's a market for them and, you know,
the legislation allows.
Yeah.
Which is good.
So if you take your time, you probably can just get one for
for sticker, which is, you know, maybe you order it the way you want
and wait a little bit and get it.
So yeah, it's cool.
It's by the red interior.
Still has that slightly, you know, that slightly 80s.
I know the 80s is kind of back in and Baywatch is coming back
and all the rest of it, but yeah.
They're filming it all over here.
You can get a pretty garish.
You can get a pretty garish interior on this.
I'm not sure about the blue and red combo myself,
but yeah, it's a cool thing.
I'm excited about it.
The blue and red stands out.
I'm going to go back to the picture real quick,
but the blue and red, the problem is it often gets overdone.
Like there's too much red.
It's too much red and also you got red on top of the dash.
And if anybody's ever driven a car with a light dashboard
top or like a red, all you see is red when you're driving along.
Yeah, it's a bit, it's one of those cars.
It's great for sort of launching it because it gets some attention,
but yeah, like a nice black interior with that kind of racing blue.
It's a, yeah, that bit with the stripes that would be more to my case.
At least they did a black steering wheel because the red steering wheel
is too much, but it needs black dash.
It needs black steering wheel.
It probably needs a little bit more black on the center console
in the armrest areas.
And then you could, you can get some of that red in.
And it's not bad, but yeah.
It's a bit eight is kind of, yeah.
Yeah.
I think, I think we've got it all done for today.
Did we? Yeah.
Friday afternoon now.
It's a Friday afternoon.
Now it's time to run out, hit up happy hour.
Yeah.
I've taken a four year old to swimming practice.
So, you know, as happy as I get these days.
That's your happy hour.
Yeah, you could bring your, you could bring your thermos
that's spiked a little bit on the inside.
Who knows?
There's a lot of dads where I live that have like their little, you know,
their little Yeti, you know, the little Yeti cup has a, you know.
The flask is out.
You're not allowed to walk around the streets and openly drink.
You know, you're not supposed to kind of, you know,
carry a can of beer with you.
So yeah, you go down the beach, everybody's got a year.
And it's like, oh yeah, don't give that to the kids.
Yeah.
Yeah, that's not, that's not for the kids.
All right.
So what else is coming up?
I'm off to New York.
New York Auto Show next week.
I debut the Volkswagen Atlas.
Okay.
There's a couple other things.
Hyundai, Kia there, Kia are there.
So, you know, it's going to shake some pores and see some new stuff.
So I'll be there Monday to fly back, fly back Thursday.
Okay.
Then I've got a little vacation.
Looking forward to that.
Yeah.
You're going to go in and play some fun.
Without the kids.
I'm going to Mexico to dodge the cartels.
When it all kicked off, I was like, oh, God,
this is like the one vacation I get without the kids a year
and it's not happening, but it seems to be, seems to be okay now.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, have fun with that.
But we'll probably be able to have a chat when you get back from
New York Auto Show before vacation, maybe.
Yeah.
We'll fit something in New York at the beginning and then a
short vacation.
Very much looking forward to going to Mexico.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, that sounds awesome.
Have a great time in New York and we'll see you guys next week.
And until then, keep the air and the spare and the bag of the wheel.
The sun shining birds are singing and all feels right in the world.
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In fact, one in five people experience some form of depression
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About this episode
The hosts kick off with a road-trip tale in the Genesis G90, praising its chauffeur-style rear comfort and “sleeper” luxury vibe. The main automotive focus is the new Kia Telluride versus the Hyundai Palisade, highlighting how closely matched they are, the new hybrid powertrain, and the ongoing reality of dealer markups. Porsche’s electric Cayenne EV sparks debate about EV demand at $120k+, while the Corvette Grand Sport gets attention for the new 6.7-liter V8 and the return of a hybrid “Grand Sport X” option.
Original notes
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