Constellation's multi-million pound losses in detail, and was 2025 the year of the Chinese car? – with Tim Atkinson, episode 238
Car Dealer Podcast
Constellation's multi-million pound losses in detail, and was 2025 the year of the Chinese car? – with Tim Atkinson, episode 238
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Company
CarGurus
CarGurus is a website where you can buy and sell cars. It helps you find good deals and compare prices from different sellers.
Company
CarWow
CarWow is a website that helps you find the best deals on new cars. You can see offers from different dealerships and choose the one that works for you.
Car
Jaguar F-Type
The Jaguar F-Type is a high-end sports car that looks great and drives really well. It's known for being fast and fun to drive, with different engine options to choose from.
Car
Jaguar Type Jaguar
Jaguar is a brand that makes fancy and fast cars, and the F-Type is one of their sports cars that looks really cool and drives very well. People often buy Jaguars for their luxury and performance, and they are seen as a status symbol. When someone talks about getting an F-Type, they are usually excited about owning a high-quality car.
Car
Jaguar XKR
The Jaguar XKR is a powerful version of the Jaguar XK sports car. It has a strong engine and is designed for people who want a fast and stylish car.
Car
Jaguar XFR
The Jaguar XFR is a faster version of the Jaguar XF, which is a luxury sedan. It has a powerful engine and is built for better performance and handling.
Car
Jaguar XKRS
The Jaguar XKRS is a sportier version of the Jaguar XK, made for people who want a faster and more exciting car. It has better performance features than the standard model.
Car
Kia Sportage
The Kia Sportage is a small SUV that's good for families or anyone needing extra space. It's known for being reliable and has many useful features.
Term
EV
An EV, or Electric Vehicle, is a car that uses electricity to run instead of gas. This makes them better for the environment because they don't produce exhaust fumes.
Term
auction fee
An auction fee is the money you pay to take part in an auction. It helps cover the costs of running the auction.
Car
Nissan Primera
The Nissan Primera is a type of compact car made by Nissan. It was popular for being reliable and practical for everyday use.
Brand
Porsche
Porsche is a well-known car brand from Germany that makes fast and stylish cars. They are famous for their sports cars, especially the 911 model.
Brand
Maserati
Maserati is an Italian car brand that makes luxury sports cars. They are known for their beautiful designs and powerful engines.
Brand
Aston Martin
Aston Martin is a British car brand that makes luxury sports cars. They are known for their classy looks and fast performance, and they often appear in movies like James Bond.
Car
Volkswagen Ups
The Volkswagen up! is a small car made for driving in cities. It's easy to park and saves on gas, making it a good choice for city dwellers.
Car
Volkswagen up
The Volkswagen up is a small car made for city driving. It's easy to park and great for getting around town without taking up too much space.
Car
Renault Modus
The Renault Modus is a small family car that is designed to be practical and easy to drive, especially in cities. It has a lot of space inside for passengers and their belongings, making it a good choice for families. People might talk about it when discussing how companies design their products to meet people's needs.
Term
Dealerway
Dealerway is a website where car dealers can buy and sell cars from each other. It helps them find good deals and manage their car sales better.
Car
Kia Picantos
The Kia Picanto is a small car that's great for driving in the city. It's easy to park and uses less gas, making it a good choice for city living.
Car
Tesla Model
The Tesla Model Y is an electric SUV made by Tesla. It has a long driving range and is packed with technology, making it popular among those looking for eco-friendly vehicles.
Brand
BYD
BYD is a car company from China that makes electric cars and batteries. They are becoming popular for their eco-friendly vehicles.
Car
Alpine A290
The Alpine A290 is a new electric car that is designed to be affordable and practical. It's a hatchback, which means it has a rear door that swings upward, making it easy to access the trunk.
Brand
Polestar
Polestar is a brand that makes electric cars, and it started as a company that modified Volvo cars to make them faster and sportier. Now, they create their own line of electric vehicles.
Brand
Honda
Honda is a car brand from Japan that makes reliable and fuel-efficient vehicles. Some of their popular models are the Civic and Accord.
Brand
Jeep
Jeep is a car brand famous for making tough vehicles that can go off-road. The Wrangler is one of their most popular models, known for its ability to handle rough terrain.
Term
electric vehicles (EVs)
Electric vehicles, or EVs, are cars that run on electricity instead of gas. They are better for the environment because they don't produce exhaust fumes.
Term
plug-in hybrid
A plug-in hybrid is a type of car that can use both electricity and gas. You can charge it by plugging it in, which helps save on fuel.
Brand
Audi
Audi is a car brand from Germany that makes luxury cars. They are known for their stylish designs and high-tech features.
Brand
Nissan
Nissan is a car brand from Japan that makes many types of vehicles, including sedans and SUVs. They are popular for their reliable cars.
Brand
Mercedes-Benz
Mercedes-Benz is a well-known luxury car brand from Germany. They make high-end cars that are known for their comfort and performance.
Brand
Ford
Ford is a well-known car company from the United States that makes many types of vehicles, including popular trucks and sports cars.
LIVE
The Cardiola podcast is sponsored by Autotrader.
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Welcome back to the Cardiola podcast, where we pick our favourite stories of the week
and ask an industry guest to choose which were the best.
I'm John Ray and joining me in this lovely first of the new year podcast is, of course,
James Banger in his boiler cupboard. James, lovely to see you.
I'm glad the new year has rung in changes with your intros, John. That's very nice to hear.
But happy new year to you. How are you?
I'm very well. I woke up this morning thinking, is this the first podcast?
It sort of feels like we're halfway through the new year already.
Oh, it is.
There wasn't really enough news to talk about last Friday, so we didn't do it.
Well, it was. It was just I was the only one working, wasn't I?
Yeah, well, it would have been a lonely podcast for me.
It would have been. Very boring for our poor listeners, so yes.
But yes, lovely to see you, John. I'd like to see that you once again in my house.
So I mean, I suppose at this point you are classed as a lodger, aren't you?
Yeah, you shouldn't have given me a key, really. That was the first one.
We have a strange relationship, John.
Don't say like that, Jesus.
Anyway, what's been going on in your business, James?
What's been going on in my business?
Well, what we heard, you were stocking up for the January rush.
I mean, in your dealership for the last five days.
And well, I mean, the phone has not stopped ringing, James, has it?
Yeah, it has been a slight slow start to the new year, I would say.
We sold a few over Christmas, like that post Christmas week.
We probably got three out the door, which is amazing, but it tops up December.
We actually had a really good December.
I think Joe said it was our fourth best month for the year, which is pretty amazing, really,
considering it was supposed to be really quiet.
But as you say, we're properly stocked up.
We had something like 15 cars advertised.
I think as of today, we've got 15 cars advertised.
But it hasn't really kicked off in the way that I thought it was.
Last January came back and it was absolutely gangbusters straight away.
And it carried on all the way through January, February and into March for us.
This year has been a little bit slow.
And I can't quite put my finger on why that is.
We're getting leads, interestingly, from places like CarGurus and CarWow.
We've had a lot from those guys.
And we have sold some cars this week.
I think we've got four away this week.
But I was sort of hoping that it was going to be an everyday phone ringing.
And it hasn't been like that.
And just chatting to some of the dealers that I have been over the last week.
So they're saying some similar things.
So it's nice to know that we're not on our own.
But yeah, I'm hoping this January rush happens at some stage in January.
You've got about 20 days left.
So fingers crossed.
Yes.
But yeah, I've got a week off next week, which I'm very much looking forward to.
Handing the reins to our young Luke, who is going to be looking after the place.
So I'm sure we'll come back from our holiday and everything will be sold.
I mean, he looked mildly terrified when you told him that he was running it.
He certainly did.
He certainly did.
Anyway, shall we introduce our lovely guest?
Yes, let's do that.
So our guest this week is founder of specialized or specialist used car dealer sports and touring is Tim Atkinson.
Tim, thanks for joining us.
I'm very glad to be here.
Thank you for inviting me.
Nice to see you, Tim.
Before we get into your business, I mean, what did you think of what I was saying there?
Is it similar with you as well?
I mean, how's the start been for you?
Well, it's interesting.
You know, I came into this business with no motor trade experience about five and a half years ago.
And I'm really glad I didn't bring any experience with me because I have just had to accept the landscape as it is with no preconceptions.
And people I talked to who are used to, you know, selling a lot of cars in particular months of the year have seen that turned on its head.
And yeah, you know, we again, we had a great December, actually.
It's a slow start to January.
That's partly because we've not got very many advertised at the moment.
It's also down to some other factors, which maybe we'll come on and talk about.
But the notion that that you can predict where the workload is going to be and where you'll sell, I think is a is a false notion.
We used to say in my previous world, randomness comes in clumps.
You know, you'd look at a data set and and say, that doesn't make sense.
You know, why have we suddenly got all of these happening?
And the answer is that randomness comes in clumps.
Yeah, I find I have found that quite frustrated.
If I'm honest, I've talked about in the podcast before, they're just the kind of the unpredictability of retail car sales, just never knowing when it's going to happen.
And I find it just so hard to plan.
I talked to other dealers and it's kind of say, how do you manage it?
And they I don't think anybody does.
I mean, you might have lots of data over the last few years, but it doesn't it doesn't point to what's going to happen in the next week.
Is it?
No, I think you have to be dynamic and ready to respond and and try to keep quality control where it needs to be.
You know, because I'm sure we've all been in situations where you suddenly have a rush of things that need to be done.
And the risk is that they're done, but they're done badly.
And that that is one of the biggest challenges.
Tim, let's talk about your business then give give those people listening and watching this on YouTube.
It's a bit of an idea of what you do, what you sell.
Yeah, so we're in a farm shed in a village in Hampshire, basically, and started out as the name of the business sports and touring suggests as kind of a generalist prestige and performance dealership about.
But the second car I bought into stock was an F type Jaguar.
And I went and collected it myself.
And by the third bend on the way back here, I was just hooked never driven one before.
I thought it was tremendous in every respect.
And for the first three years, we kind of always had one or two around maybe three.
We started to get to know them a bit.
We started to get involved a bit in social media on them.
And then I did a SWAT analysis for those not familiar.
That's a strengths, weaknesses, opportunities and threats analysis on the business.
And a message that came out very clearly was that F type Jaguars and some of the performance Jaguars were really good news for us.
And we decided to dig in very firmly.
And so of the vehicles we've got in stock at any moment, I say about 80% are F types.
We do some X KRs, X KRSs, X FRSs, the other, you know, quite rare and very powerful Jaguar stock.
And it suits us for all kinds of reasons.
So you haven't always been a car dealer, have you?
You've had quite an interesting past.
Tell me a little bit about what you used to do and then why you decided to swap that for selling precious used cars.
Yes, so well, I left school early and ran a business back then.
But then I got into aviation first as a hobby and then I decided to make a career of it.
And I trained as a pilot, professional pilot, hit the early 90s recession and trained as an air traffic controller and did that for a few years to put bread on the table.
And then got into the airlines in the kind of mid-late 90s.
And I was an airline pilot and then moved into management and into what's generally known as safety but which I prefer to call risk and became an investigator and manager.
And that led to a really interesting career in roles in which I tended to be doing a bit of flying.
I've done a huge amount of flying in various aircraft of different kinds, fixed wing and rotary wing.
And then I ended up at the Air Accidents Investigation Branch and did 12 and a half years there as an investigator, a senior inspector of air accidents, as we were called.
And that was a genuinely fascinating thing to do.
I was very fortunate that I worked on some very big cases.
So the Air France aircraft which crashed in the North Atlantic, for example, the 737 of Turkish Airlines that crashed at Amsterdam and some other significant cases.
But that kind of also wore me down a bit.
And I left there, went consulting, ticked another box and became an examiner and instructor on the 737 series, which is something I hadn't done before.
And then decided, well, I'd like to do something totally new.
And we looked at all kinds of possible routes to go down and one that presented itself was motor retail.
And that came about partly because I'm a big petrolhead and have always been interested in cars.
And partly because it seemed, and my word is an insider powerful thing, to be a good area to go into.
Needless to say, I wouldn't dream of doing it again, knowing now what I didn't know then.
But, you know, it's been an interesting journey.
We've had ups and downs.
Of course, it's never quite the business hasn't yet delivered what it needs to deliver largely because although we came in as a disruptive force,
seeking to do things genuinely differently and genuinely better than many of the less reputable dealers do,
we nonetheless suffer from, for example, the difficulty of finding access to working capital at a reasonable cost and with reasonable terms attached.
And that's the big challenge the business has at the moment.
I like to describe that we've built a machine which is presently running at idle RPM.
We know that we can rev it up to three or four thousand and it'll deliver.
But we need to put fuel in the tank and it's getting that fuel that's proving to be extraordinarily challenging.
Yeah, I mean, getting hold of capital when you're in this business is hard work.
I mean, a lot of the banks don't realize motor retail, do they?
It's not just the banks.
And this is something I hope will come on and talk about presently.
One of the things that surprised me and delighted me.
In fact, when I started getting involved in, for example, social media groups where motor dealers talk,
I was very pleasantly surprised that there were people making suggestions about doing things that weren't maybe right.
And they were jumped on frequently by a number of dealers who clearly were doing the right thing.
I won't embarrass people by naming them, but a few individuals in particular really struck me with what they were doing and how well they were trying to run their businesses.
And the motor trade suffers and the more that you try to be disruptive and be really excellent and do an exquisitely fabulous job,
the more you suffer from these expectations.
I mean, I try not to listen to a program called You and Yours on Radio 4, but they did an episode on the 9th of December and it's worth,
if you're in this industry, it's worth listening to that because the motor trade was taken into the boxing ring,
put up against the ropes and punched stupid for 53 minutes with no one speaking up for it, really,
and with no one presenting the alternative. It's like car reliability or warranties, isn't it?
Very few people buy a car, keep it for three years, and at the end of the three years go online to review the warranty company who were fabulous,
although they didn't pay out because nothing went wrong.
Very few people will immediately go into the social media groups and say,
I've had this car for three years, it's been brilliant, I've serviced it, but it's never put a foot wrong at all,
hasn't cost me any unexpected money. Whereas, of course, in the siloed world of social media,
someone who's unhappy and happens to be a bit of a keyboard warrior will just be all over the misery.
It is hard to do things properly in this industry, I really do find it.
I think you've just got to stick to your guns. We certainly do it in our business.
This week, for example, we had a Kia Sportage come back to us, the customer had been complaining,
it had been using too much oil. If you look into it, Kia says using a litre within every thousand miles is actually fine
and within tolerances. I mean, it sounds ridiculous, that's a lot of oil.
She was a local customer, a local person who had trusted us, we just bought the car back.
We gave her her money back and said, don't worry, and she bought another car from us to be fair.
We swapped her into something else which she'd paid more money for and we'll get rid of that car somewhere else.
We might spare her repairs or decide to trade it on and explain the problems.
But it got me thinking, there is a lot of dealers out there that just wouldn't have done that,
who wouldn't have bought that car back. I just think that you do have to try and look after the customers
like you'd like to be looked after yourself, which is hard, isn't it, when the margins are so slim.
Absolutely. Now, we reap the rewards of that, particularly being so specialised,
that because we've got a really excellent reputation, nothing but five-star reviews,
which I know people will tell me it's wrong, I should be at 4.7, but I just can't push that across the line.
I've thought about trying to mildly upset somebody, so I only get a risky game to play.
But the other takeaway from that for me is that you didn't design or build the Kia Sportage,
you didn't specify the materials from which the engine is made,
you didn't determine what the manufacturing tolerances would be.
And we do carry an extraordinarily heavy burden through the CRA, for example, the Consumer Rights Act,
but also in terms of customer expectation.
And I actually see this crystallising in coming years even more,
because if that had been an EV with a significant battery problem, there isn't a route to parting it out.
There isn't a route to dropping another engine in without massive expense and so forth.
And I do think that we are very unreasonably exposed to the actions of others for which we become responsible,
and that's a real difficulty.
And of course, when you do the right thing and take a car back,
you've got to sell at least one more car, probably two, just to cover the loss already.
And then you've got to see what you do with that Kia that you now can't retail,
you can part it out, but you'll get a fraction of what it's worth and so forth.
Yeah, it is painful.
I mean, you have been vocal on those Consumer Rights, the fact that you think it is unfairly weighted.
I think there was a story on Cardinal Magazine, you were chatting to my colleague,
Jack, and I think you said the rules were written around fridges and televisions and not used cars.
I just wanted to ask you about that, because I agree with you.
I think a lot of it is unfairly weighted towards the consumer,
especially when you're selling 10 to 15 year old cars.
It actually makes selling older cars really, really difficult as a dealer.
It does. And I mean, you know, we've just sold a 16 year old XKRS convertible,
which happens to be utterly fabulous.
And I have no qualms at all about seeing that drive off with its new owner,
partly because, and I don't want to give away all the secrets,
but Jaguar reliability is just really very good if you know what you're doing with them.
But yes, the CRA is not designed for the motor trade.
The motor trade copes with it, but it's again, it's not just that.
It's, you know, in the UK we have statute law and we have case law.
And again, and again, you see judgments which appear to,
and I'll try to be kind to the judiciary,
that there may be a flavour amongst those decision makers on the bench,
that they don't hold the motor retail trade in the highest regard.
And instead of looking and saying, OK, well, a balanced decision has been arrived at here.
Sometimes there is a lack of balance to the decisions.
And of course, once case law is with us, it's very difficult to shake off.
But I do think from the point of view of the motor retail sector,
it's overdue time, at least for a very sensible conversation about this,
if not for some legislative change.
And yeah, I'll take the conversation there then.
One of my concerns is that we don't have a voice,
that there are a couple of organisations which you can join
and which would perhaps say that they speak for, in particular, the independent motor retail sector.
But really they don't.
And that's something that's at the very forefront of my mind at the moment.
And you're planning to put something together on that front?
I am, yes. Not just planning to, but actively doing so at the moment.
This came out of the whole auto trader piece that we've been living through, of course.
But I've got a mind map in front of me on one of my other screens here.
I'm a great mind mapper.
And as I started to put down areas where we should at least be talking,
if not acting and representing ourselves, you know, you look at the franchise dealers
and they have quite a powerful and effective voice with full-time office staff
who are out there, for example, talking to government, talking to trade organisations
and representing what they're doing.
We don't have anyone doing that.
There are some who are talking about doing it, but without being unkind,
I'm not sure they've got the skill set and the ability to flex into some of those landscapes
and some of those conversations in a way that I know I can.
The roles I've had in aviation, which has included running an airline and that kind of thing,
have left me very well able to talk to a government minister to go on.
I do a bit of media work still around air safety.
Now, when there's a crash, you'll see me on Sky and the BBC.
I had a lot of media training, so I can put forward a case.
I can represent a point of view and so forth.
And I think we need someone doing that.
I'm very happy to be the person going forward to do it.
And what we're looking at now, I'm looking with a small team of people,
we're talking regularly, about the mechanics behind that
and how we form an organisation and so forth.
I'll come onto the automated piece in a moment,
but just on this organisation front and your ideas behind it,
where do you think the independent motor retailers need the representation?
What are the big things?
I mean, we've mentioned the consumer rights.
I mean, where else do you think it could help?
Well, everywhere.
We are under pressure from a number of monopolies, including auto trader.
I would also say BCA.
We don't buy from BCA,
but if you look at the conversations from people who do,
my word, some of it is deeply shocking.
And then you've got, for example, car well and motorway.
You've both come into the industry to disrupt.
The effect they are having is that it is becoming harder and harder
for the retail customer to buy a good car from a car dealer,
because we are all having to pay far too much.
I saw an F-type go through.
I think it was motorway a couple of days ago for 800 quid below retail benchmark.
Now, that is so far from being sensible.
And that's before you put in their 500 quid fee for auctioning you the phone number
of the person who owns it.
And again, a pressure which appears to be on the industry,
but actually on the retail customer as well,
because the guys who seem to be winning through at the moment
are the ones we were talking about a short while ago.
Buy it, wash it, photograph it, stick a warranty on it
and hope that cover all the things you didn't look for in the workshop
and hope for the best.
Tim, let me just play devil's advocate,
because I've had a very similar conversation with the likes of motorway and car well
and said very similar conversations about cars going for 500, 800 pounds under retail.
And they would say to me, there's a dealer out there buying that car
and there's a dealer out there making profit on that car in some way, otherwise it wouldn't sell.
So sometimes I look at it.
I mean, for example, there was a Nissan Prime area that went for a motorway auction this week
that was up for 1200 pounds.
It was 20 years old.
It was up for 1200 pounds reserved and the front end was absolutely stoked in.
I mean, it looked like a cat end.
I mean, there was just, I was thinking, I wouldn't give 100 pounds for it
and then the scrap man would probably not want to take it, but yet they're asking 1200 quid.
And it's just, I think there's January is part of this.
January is obviously a hard time to buy cars, but also there are people out there buying these cars.
So what would you say to that?
There are and they are delivering poor value for money to their customer.
I'm going to make some sweeping generalizations.
So please, please understand that these come with that caveat.
You know, look at a supermarket, which is going to load up an unnecessary and very expensive and very poor value products
and just use that metal as a vehicle for selling things that people don't want,
which have massive profit margin across them.
That's bad for the retail customer and no one is flagging that.
And Motorway and Carwell, you know, there are organizations who talk about trying to be good
and trying to do their best and all that, and they're not.
They're being disruptive, of course, but they're being disruptive in a really damaging way.
And they're making it very difficult for us to run dealerships properly
and for customers to buy cars, which are good because yes, people are buying that.
And if I was a lazy buyer for a car supermarket operation,
I can sit there and buy cars with 800 quid across them all day long through those mechanisms.
And if my operation is of such low quality that we can work with an 800 quid margin on the metal,
then, you know, the business, I suppose, is going to succeed.
Sorry, Tim, what I just wanted to say on that front.
Motorway and Carwell are not going away.
And to be fair, we buy a lot of cars from both of them.
But do you think with these margins being squeezed like they are,
there is a future for independent motor retailers like us?
Have we got a future? Or is it going to be the point where the margin gets squeezed so much
that the people who want to do it properly just can't?
I think you've got to be...
I'm not going to reveal the recipe of one of the secret sources that makes sports and touring what it is.
But I think if you look at how you're running your business
and how you can work without those organisations, I'll go on then.
About half of my stock is offered to me and doesn't come through any channel
because we have our reputation, we have our name and an F-type buyer or owner rather
who is in the F-type forums and on the Facebook pages
and is thinking of selling is quite likely to think,
need to sell the car, oh, that guy sports and touring, I'll give him a ring.
And he gives me a ring and we have a sensible conversation and we go and see the car.
We always travel to them, we don't ask them to come here.
And we bring great vehicles into stock that way which are not accessible to other dealers
because they don't have that position in the space where people are coming to them.
And that was never ever part of specialising and it has just come as a delightful surprise along the way.
And when I started the business the idea was that we would copy and paste
and end up with four or five businesses.
I don't kind of sense that that's going to happen because it is just too difficult being in this business.
But I would now be doing similar things in social media with maybe Porsche, Maserati, Aston and so forth
with a long game in mind that will establish those same criteria in the public perception
and that will then deliver in the unexpected way which it has.
It's a bit more exciting than the automatic Volkswagen ups I've got in stock.
I'm mildly jealous I must say.
But there's a business in Andover just down the road called DA Cars
and the guy who founded that very cleverly a long time ago set up Facebook groups
called for example by cars in Andover, by cars in Bath, by cars in Bristol and similar things
and he ended up with hundreds of thousands of people in Facebook groups.
And yes, automatic Volkswagen ups amongst them, people who were in those groups
and just knew oh I can stick my car up here.
Now of course he was moderating all of the posts and he was able to
oh right, Mrs Smith would like to advertise her Volkswagen up.
I'll just send her a messenger message and we'll have a chat about it.
All of us have got a car in stock.
Very smart, very smart.
Let's just, in our final few minutes, let's just touch on the auto trader thing.
You came to prominence off the back of the changes that they made, the deal builder introduction.
They have obviously made some changes to that since.
I'm interested just to get your take on that and why upset you so much?
I have a very profound sense of right and wrong
and from my first engagement with auto trader it felt wrong
and I got to know their corporate psychology, their modus operandi and so forth
and it was quite familiar actually.
It was something I'd seen because when I was accident investigating
you know when you're dealing with something like the Air France crash which I mentioned
it doesn't all happen in the flight deck of the aircraft.
It reaches back into the design of the aircraft and the design philosophy in Toulouse at Airbus.
It reaches back into the boardroom at Air France and decisions made there about pilot training and recruitment
and operating principles and so forth.
And I had seen a certain kind of corporate psychology which is around a perceived excellence
which actually is entirely false.
And auto traders think that they are just fabulously brilliant at everything they do
to the point that they're in a real emperor's new clothes situation
where they can't even begin to think of the possibility of a question being asked about their brilliance
having any validity.
This is a company which is so nuts
not only did they decide they would bolt some cars upside down in a corridor in their offices
they had to build a fake corridor to do it in.
That's what we're dealing with here.
Tim, do you advertise with them?
I do, yeah, yeah.
Advert performance has crashed recently.
Your performance has crashed is it?
Who else do you advertise with and who's your best performer?
I'm just interested how it tallies to us.
I don't know who our best performer is
and that landscape has changed very rapidly in the last couple of months.
We've gone down to Starter from Ultra a couple of years ago
that'll perhaps be part of it
but that's partly because I know my audience.
We get rid particularly through YouTube
and anyone who's using YouTube
dig into the analytics on YouTube
because they are fantastically granular.
Now I know that the people who walked through my door
and I regret this actually because having been an aviation
which is an incredibly diverse industry
and worked with all kinds of people from all over the world
and loved that.
My buyer is between 50 and 70 years old
is white middle class British
and on the occasion we get someone who isn't.
It's an absolute delight
but we know that granularity
and we know that to them
the place you go and buy a used car is Auto Trader
and that's why when this thing kicked off
my position was and is
and will continue to be
that we should be able as an industry
to lean on Auto Trader.
They've built an enormous presence
as a marketplace.
They are without doubt the largest marketplace.
They have a monopoly
but we're lucky enough to live in a country
which has quite clear
and quite stringent laws
about how you must behave if you have a monopoly
and Auto Trader are just ignoring them
and there was quite a body of opinion
towards well we'll just
cancel our subscription with Auto Trader.
That's great. You put a fresh clip in
you take the safety off, put it on full Auto
aim at your feet and hold the trigger.
All you've done is deprive yourself
of talking to 80% perhaps
of your audience
and I was about no that's not right
you shouldn't be bullied into that position
even if it's for good reasons.
You should be able to use Auto Trader
but you should be able to use Auto Trader
on reasonable terms
and it's very clear that their terms
aren't reasonable, weren't reasonable
they then of course introduced Deal Builder
which was the final straw
and all of a sudden the camel
is just lying there in the desert with its back broken
and
yeah without that
I'm glad they did that with Deal Builder
because we needed
you know we needed someone to strike a match
Auto Trader obviously not here to give their right
reply but in
two weeks time Nathan Coe the CEO
is coming back on the podcast
he was on it just before Christmas
and he's going to come back on
what question would you like me to ask him?
I'd be delighted to do a double header with him
I really would
what question
would I ask him
the big question to me is
are they doing this
knowingly
do they have really excellent
in-house counsel
who are talking to them and saying
yeah yeah we're getting further
and further into what we shouldn't be doing guys
and maybe
someone is saying yeah but are we going to get away with it
and the council are saying
yeah
very close to the wind now
very close to the wind
and they're saying yeah okay close
to the wind but we haven't yet
crashed shived
and
and I don't think that's the case
because
when I look at aviation safety
aviation risk is all about data
the way
autotrader have got a fantastic
body of data
the amount of data they have
and yet they just have no
competence in analysing it and working with it
and I'm afraid my opinion is
the same on this front
I just think
it's likely that
they're just
plowing their own furrow sorry I'm using lots of analogies
all of which are getting mixed up here
and there's a thing
which we call
in the risk world you call drift into failure
and where it's
a procedure
or an organisation
becomes slightly deviant
and it reaps the rewards of that deviancy
and the deviancy develops
and goes from being tactical to strategic
and
you reach a point where suddenly you realise
you've drifted into this awful situation
where everything is wrong
and that I think is what's happened with autotrader
Tim let's park it
and we'll give them their right of reply
in a couple of weeks time and you can come back to me
once you've listened to that one
I'll look forward to that very much
let's try and end our chat on some
new year positivity
what are you looking forward to this year
oh gosh
when I think about
the things that worry me day to day there's nothing to do
with motor retail at the moment
there to do with the world which has turned on its head
I used to say to people
if you told me when I was 14
that at my present age
of 58 I wouldn't be able to fly on a supersonic aircraft
and there'd be a war in the middle east
I wouldn't have believed you
and that's looking like a very very low bar now
we've got an amazing incredible world
to navigate
I don't think we've seen the effect of that
on the motor trade yet
and maybe I hope we won't
because there's actually a bit of me that some of my customers
coming along at the moment almost with a
you know the world's just gone so terribly wrong
I just like a big fast car on the driveway
that looks great
and you know there seems
there's almost a kind of
hopelessness sometimes
but what else am I looking forward to
I'm particularly looking forward to seeing
the new Jaguar
I was with Easyjet for five years
in the early days
my desk in the office was not far from
Stelios's desk
and he was a massive believer in no such thing
as bad publicity
and last year we saw
probably the best advertising campaign
I have ever seen
from Jaguar
they didn't push people's buttons
they tweaked people's nipples
if that's not too far
and they
exquisitely
upset their audience
and started the most
massive conversation
I've spoken to someone who's driven the new car
and
we're starting to see reviews coming out now
I was delighted
was it
I can't remember which publication it was
which said not only is it great
but it's a Jag
and I thought
that's what we need
we need a fabulous
electric grand touring car from Jaguar
and people will be
down to the mill in us
for a fresh supply of hats for dinner
in a way
that
will surprise and I hope to light a lot of people
so that's my big hope
for 2026 in the motor train
I hope you're right
I hope you're right
I also hope they use that on their marketing
Jaguar here to tweak your nipples
let's
let's move on
Tim
thank you very much for joining us
thank you for giving us your forthright opinions
on all of that and please stick around
for some stories but John we should probably do some of those
now
a quick word from one of our sponsors
John have you ever wondered why
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but when I do get stuck
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John guess what
oh god
you bought more ducks haven't you
no ducks John wrong there
I've actually got a new habit
I've signed up for Dealerway alongside more than
two and a half thousand
other rated and vetted car dealers
to sell my trade part exchanges
the site is designed for dealers
to sell their part exchanges for more money
quickly and easily
there's no sellers fees
and buying a car costs just £99
one of the cheapest around
and when I haven't got the time to list the car myself
I can even watch out them the details
and they do it all for me
that sounds awfully familiar
so are you selling all your stock there now
not exactly John
but if I do have a sudden influx
of Kia Picantos
I know where to send them
dealers can find out more at
dealerway.co.uk
now back to the podcast
so James and I are going to run through our favourite
stories of the week and at the end
Tim gets to decide which one of us
chose the best ones and therefore
who is the winner
slightly complicatedly James I looked back
at our last proper podcast
and it was a draw
unprecedented draw
so I'm going to let you start
as a new year I mean you did win
by your own rules the Christmas quiz
so let's start this as a new
series
and I will actually write down the scores
whatever that means a new series
sure new series excellent
okay thank you John I'm going to start with
some news
excuse me that came out in that
quiet period between Christmas
and New Year which wasn't
so quiet for Companies House
because they had to deal with
Constellation Automotive Group's
huge businesses
accounts and their annual
reports and those included
We Buying a Car
Cinch, Marshall
and also their
whole business Constellation Automotive Group
so this is a massive
business John as you know
we've talked about it many many times
before it's got what
most people would assume
is the perfect motor
trade business you know they've got
We Buying a Car that acquires cars
from members of the public
the ones they obviously buy them under
trade prices as we well know
those that they don't
want they put in their auctions
BCA which they obviously
own and they make money on the
car and also make money on the fees
they also can cherry pick
the ones that they do want to retail
they can put those into their Cinch
used car dealerships
or if they're really good
onto their Marshall 4 courts
so they've got this perfect
business really this perfect circle
of used car
retailer, new car retailer
acquisition channel
and trade disposals
but for some reason they're not making
it work so I looked into this
in a lot of detail
in 2025
they turned over
£9.5 billion
but yet still
turned a profit of
£130 million just shy
of £130 million
and that comes because of many
different things but most
importantly Cinch cars
if you look at their accounts in particular
now remember this is the business that
launched during Covid at the height of the
the kazoo fame
wanting to sell
online cars
exclusively delivering them
to people's homes
and since then it has
changed lanes quite dramatically really
it does still offer home deliveries
but at the accounts point out
they no longer do that free of charge
they're charging people to deliver to their homes
but it has also
opened a number of
of dealerships
ironically in a lot of former
Kazoo ones as we know
Are they calling them dealerships James
or are they calling them customer handover?
Well I think there's a little bit of both
but actually I think they are sort
you can go in there and buy a car
which in my mind is a dealership
but yet still
Cinch cars in particular
lost a huge amount of money last year
it clocked up losses of just over
£100 million
so you've got this business here that
is struggling
and just
focusing on the Cinch front
I sort of wonder quite why that is
they had a lot
of expense when it comes to marketing
that business they were like Kazoo
on front of shirts and all sorts
of football teams
that has all since come to an end
but yet still they are making
a very very heavy loss
that has weighed heavily on the group
overall BCA
on the other hand made
£152 million EBITDA
profit so
they are a profitable business that was up
a third
on the year before we buy any car
meanwhile added
£61.5 million of profit
to the group
they bought half a million cars in
2025
which is a staggering amount of cars
512,000 cars to be exact
but the biggest problem this group
has is its financing costs
and Tim mentioned
the problem with capital during our chat
their account show
£210.4 million
of financing fees
during that year with a one-off
finance cost of
£23.6 million
I mean that's quite an overdraft
so yeah very very heavy
financing cost there
if you look at it on an EBITDA
level and
you've got to be fair to them
I think we look at car dealers on an EBITDA
level
they made a profit of £360.5 million
but
this is a business that is
heavily leveraged
that is a lot of money that they're paying
in financing costs and it does make it
very very difficult to run
so I just found
these accounts absolutely fascinating
I created
a couple of videos for the Cardinal Magazine
YouTube channel all about them
go and check those out
I've written about it in my substack today
in my newsletter because they are
one of the biggest companies
in our industry
and it's very very interesting to see how they're performing
what do you think John?
I've got a couple of takeaways I suppose
I mean the cinch thing is interesting
because that's predominantly the only thing that
Constellation are doing that's making no money
really
it's almost a bit of a
bit of an anchor dragging them down
and you just think why is it
why is it not working is it just
that
that model is flawed
and it just doesn't work anymore
you know take a look at car supermarkets
car supermarkets some have
been up in 2025 I think
and towards the end of 2024
but it's a difficult
market to operate and you've got to be very
well as YouTube both know
you've got to be very on it on every single car
in terms of pricing
and preparation and everything you can't
really do things on mass anymore
in quite the same way and I think that's
probably part of the problem for cinch
the other part of the problem as you say is marketing costs
which are enormous and yet
I don't think
they're as well known as they perhaps like
to be in some ways I almost
think they should have bought the kazoo name off kazoo
because that's you know combined at least
you know throw a couple of million at
whatever that brand name would cost
and at least you would cover the entire
we are the online
director consumer
sales channel
the other thing I thought was interesting
is the figure for we buy any car
the number of cars they sold is up
you know it's up modestly it's 512,000
cars rather than 487,000
cars but in the times
where you know we're looking at
car wow and motorway
getting bigger and bigger every year
every month it seems like there's more cars in
those auctions there are not more used cars
dramatically appearing in the market
like I thought they'd have made more
of a dent in we buy any cars
yeah I just in figures
totally agree with you on that front I went
along to film some footage for these
videos I went along to the local
we buy any car centre and it's based in a
car park not far from
where I live and I just found
and obviously it was sort of their car park
so all of the cars were the cars that they bought
and I found it absolutely fascinating to see
the sort of things that are in there
stuff like Tesla Model Y
to really cheap Kia Picantos
the sort of stuff that they probably gave them
pennies for really
but there's still this large amount of people
out there who just
who don't want to have to sell not a motorway or car wow
and just are happy with
that terrible price
they notoriously get from
we buy any car yeah that's very true and I think
you know having spoken to a few people
recently well actually strangely
chatting away to I think it was like the
manager of the venue of our used car
was she was sort of she was a bit frustrated
with I can't remember where she sold a car on motorway
or car wow but she was frustrated
by how slow the process was because she'd
in her mind she'd sold it
her lovely car that she was very proud of
and it had been a week and nobody had come to get it
she was sort of like well I kind of want it gone now
you know and that's
the one positive thing you can say about
we buy any car is you take your car along
it's gone yes that is true
that is very very true it's instant
isn't it I just yeah interesting
stuff Tim did you check out any
of this what's your take on it
well I'm actually going to say some
words in favour of we buy any car
because you're here to disrupt
today Tim aren't you I am yeah
two or three times a year
we will have
a customer who's got a part exchange
and we buy any car
we'll make a stellar offer
for it and I
presume it's driven by you know they particularly
want that make model for Cinch
or for BCA
certainly offer way more you know
I've seen well you know
thousand two thousand pounds more than we
can offer as a part exchange
price and
I know the guys that we buy
any car and hand over
I think it's a little bit unfair that they
they have a reputation
for for chipping
people but I've said to people
this is only what anyone will do
a competent private buyer
will go around your car very thoroughly
and see the things that are wrong and talk to you about
putting them right I would
do that if I'm taking a car in part exchange
we buy any car just happen to
be in the window for this
they're where the public see this happen
and the guys in hand over certainly
are scrupulously fair
and indeed work
to lower numbers on the repairs than we
do therefore if we're looking at a part X
that needs a door panel doing
I have a figure in mind
which is considerably more than they do
and so as I say
two or three times a year I'll have a customer
and say to them take your car to we buy any car
they're only a mile and a half away
I'll come and pick you up once you've transacted
there we'll stick you in your new Jaguar
and you can drive off
I use them all the time
I say to every single customer
have you had a we buy any car price
for your car and they
invariably either say yes or no I'm
yet to do it I say we'll take it along to
them find out what they'll give you
once they've seen it and I
will definitely beat it
and I often buy their car as a result
okay so you're playing this a different way
around interesting right
okay you see I don't
want stocks that isn't Jaguar basically
no true
so that's
that is interesting yes I think
it is a fascinating
story you're dealing with
a behemoth organization here
and how the people
who sit in the boardroom even have
the vaguest idea what's going on at shop
floor level is a
tremendous
mystery and
if their performance isn't great
then that's where I would probably
with my investigators hat on
start and I'd say
it's just a dilution
of message from
top to bottom and
and a lack of
understanding and transparency
of cost
and profit from bottom
to top
but equally you know if you're running
a company of that size and you're making
money that I think
is quite a quite an achievement
and
you're employing people people are buying
cars people are selling cars there's good
stuff happening you know
it's not
I
I don't think business should
only exist to create
more and more wealth for fewer and fewer people
right John
over to you
I'm going to this is a bit
of a like we're rounding up all the things from
last year in a way but I'm going to talk about the
manufacturer winners and losers of
2025 as you have
called it James Banger in your
very informative article
thank you thank you
thank you for that performance review
pay rise
so lots of
the big winners for this I mean you've
helpfully categorized all these for me but the big
winners are unsurprisingly
two Chinese brands
so BYD
51,000 registrations
mid-table but that's a
485.1
percent rise on 2024
which is
well staggering really
number two a moda
up
447.1
percent again
so that's 19,000 registrations
I mean the rest of them are all well the rest
quite interesting actually Alpine I didn't
expect to see in third but of course it's
still a modest number of registrations like
1,700 but that's been
increased dramatically by
the new A290
affordable electric hatchback thing
Polestar also doing well
Alfa Romeo surprisingly doing well
Cooper, Peugeot, Jeep
Renault and Mazda the other ones in the top
10 and there was
another enormous riser which you've sort of
slid under the radar haven't you
which is JQ because they've not
they you know they sold maybe two cars
in 2024 because they haven't really
started telling them so they had something like a
13.5 percent
13.5
thousand percent rise sorry
but it's not really a fair bit of accounting
that
but the thing that I just wanted to
talk about JQ in a moda and BYD
really because not just the percentage
rises because I mean percentage rises
are slightly fallible
but the sheer number of cars that they've
shifted from a standing stars
and where they've ended up in
this table now so
JQ particularly is now bigger than
Seat, Honda, Citroen
Porsche Alpine
Suzuki, Lexus, Jeep
Fiat you know all these
pretty solid brands
it's overtaken I mean Citroen
really is the big one I'm surprised they've
overtaken but maybe that's more telling of
where Citroen is now in this table
and BYD I mean BYD's
creeping towards the top slightly
bigger than Mini, Cooper
Mazda, Dacia and all the ones
I've just mentioned so
incredible changes really
you know they're not
these are not the best selling brands yet
in the UK they are
what you would say mid-table aren't they really
at the minute but that has to be sort of caveated
with the fact that
BYD has predominantly been
EV until most I don't know halfway through
last year they sort of started introducing
more plug-in hybrid stuff
and I mean JQ
JQ had one model
pretty much until let's say
September
and even then the second one it
introduced was you know partially electric
as well so I just think it's an incredible
performance and this is not
news really in the sense that we've been talking
about this for a year that they've
just sprung out of nowhere and done
incredible number of sales
but
yeah it's interesting to see the
hard facts of what they've actually managed to achieve
in 2025. Yeah definitely
I mean I think the other side of this
story is where it
come from you know that's a
if you look at it in cars
that's a hundred thousand cars
that had to come from somewhere
else and it's the
the second part of that story is
the brands that have suffered, the BAF
down 71%
Fiat down 38%
SEA down 37%
and I wouldn't say they are
directly affected by the Chinese but
you know brands like Audi
they dropped out of the top three
best-selling cars they were down 9.2%
last year Nissan
down 10.3%
and Mercedes down 13.1%
they are all brands
that have got cars that
the Chinese probably are
rivals to
these much cheaper
SEVs that are available at ridiculous
PCDP prices
when people are finding it tough
and the cost of living has been hard
for the last couple years they're going to go for the cheaper
option you know I think I liken it to that
that Audi little
supermarket you know people like
to think they're getting a bargain
and I feel the Chinese have tapped into that
the other thing
that really struck me with these figures John
is Ford
Ford in fact in the top three
for the first time in quite some time
they sold a hundred, just shy
of 119,000 cars last year
which I
I think we discussed it didn't we, it's like well why
have they sold you know because they've got fiesta
anymore so Puma has clearly gone very well
they're ending the run on focus
maybe that was it, maybe it was buoyed by
the end of focus, everyone going and buying a focus
I don't think that's what happened, the other thing is
Puma Jenny came along
and Puma Jenny although I'm a little bit skeptical of it
I think actually
it's quite a good value for money
I think I've seen one on the road though
no I still haven't, I still haven't
but anyway that's a, that's not really a
what's the word, that's a
the legalese has gone out of my head because it's
nine in the morning
and I've been caught
would it, I've not seen one yet
so they can't be selling any
but fascinating figures
I just love the yes men
two figures in January looking back at
who's won and lost the year before
and it's clear last year was the year of the Chinese
and I think this year
we're going to see some very very different things
I mean a lot of people are saying
sorry John
I was just going to say a lot of people are saying
they think this year we could see
some major casualties and I wouldn't be
surprised if that's the case
well I feel like I was right to say 25
was the year of the Chinese, I know some people say
it will be this year as you said
I think you're right, it's the year that they really took a
foothold, I think this year we'll see them
accelerate big time
the other story I just wanted to roll into this
before I come to Tim for his opinion
is
my cause and his thoughts
on these figures
and particularly
he's sort of, or at least the story we've written
has been around
EV discounting and there's just a figure
in this story that I thought was incredible
he reckons
manufacturers discounted new EVs
by a total of 5.5 billion
pounds in the UK last year
which is the equivalent to an average
of more than 11,000 pounds
per car sold
just incredible amounts of money
off and when you think okay this is spread
across the whole car industry
and there are plenty of Chinese manufacturers
who I'm sure are discounting heavily
and have lots of margin to work within
but lots of manufacturers
like you Ford's and your Vauxhall's
and Renault's and so on aren't making that much on EVs
in the first place to be lopping that much money off
so I can see why he describes it
as unsustainable
over to Tim
Tim, what did you make of these
well, the Chinese MT figures
well it's amazing
how we flex
in order to save money
you know
China is a state
which is
a huge threat
to
to us
and to other democracies around the world
a human rights record
is appalling
it is a
communist state
where
the average person
I think it's fair to say
is not treated well
and
we put all that to one side
and buy a cheap Chinese car
and you know
morally we're not making a great job
of being the human race at the moment
wherever you look
the thing that has always worried me about the Chinese
is
if they get quality control right
we're finished
and I'm hoping they haven't
but I remain to be convinced
I think they probably have now
they've done it by stealing our technology
if you research
the manner in which China
has been gathering
information and knowledge and expertise
in the UK and in America
and in other developed countries
that is terribly frightening
they are hoovering up
what we do and how we do it
in the most
distressing way
and
I'll mention
we've heard a lot about tariffs
in fact goodness me
I look back on times when we heard about tariffs
as the golden age of
modern living
because that whole thing's gone
in an appalling direction
where is
the protection of our industry
the obvious thing to do is
wax some tariffs on these Chinese goods
and give
our native manufacturers
well I was going to say in Europe
we had Brexit
with the illiterate voter to burn down the library
didn't they
so maybe it's fair enough that all the European manufacturers
are kicked in the dirt
I don't think it is though
I think we've got so many things
terribly wrong and we continue to get them
more and more wrong
and
yet people are so
selfish
and so
disinterested in doing what's morally right
that this has happened with
with those Chinese numbers
and yeah I mean it's
it's a fascinating time
I wonder what are those vehicles going to be like
in four years
well that is a very good point
and to be honest
well I've got a couple of
I mean you could lay out concerns about
Chinese cars or new cars for about an hour
couldn't you on a podcast but
the ones that I've driven
have they feel like
they've been rushed to market a little bit
or certainly rushed to this market
put it like that you know
let's say they perhaps function very well
in China or Europe or whatever but they
don't quite understand how UK
works work at this point with their lengthy
persistence on it just seems to be completely insane
things like the infotainment
not really fully resolved
yet which actually
considering you have to control everything through the touch screen
should be a bit better than it is
all that sort of stuff and yeah
you're right I sort of think
I don't think this is a problem
unique to Chinese cars though
if you were to say you know there's a new
let's say a cherry coming out with a brand new engine
that's supposed to be well-renowned and it's very clever
and it's very thermally efficient etc
how reliable is that going to be
we should probably ask the same about
Ford EcoBoosts when they first came out shouldn't we
is very difficult
yeah I do agree
with you I think the difficulty is
that
the lines are so blurred aren't they what we're really
talking about is Chinese brands coming here
in a way or Chinese car manufacturing
versus I think the argument that's put forward
a lot is look around your house and try and find
something that isn't made in China yeah and we've
been buying those for 30 years you know
computers or TVs or radiators or whatever it is
you know why does the buck stop
at cars it's a
it's a difficult one to answer
that
their march has been insidious
and as you rightly say
in
large part unseen
there's an old adage that
sorry excellent
is the enemy of good enough
but conversely
we've seen some
organisations and I think Tesla are
problem this is only my take on this okay
Tesla
are absolute masters
of just good enough
in their early days
my comprehension is
that they were going to go bust if they continued
refining and they simply had to start
selling cars and they sold cars
which were a long way from where
they should have been I mean interior
you know
and they got away with it
because they got cash flowing in
and it's kind of
it's not a Ponzi scheme
model but think about
the expansion of low cost airlines
in Europe
and the world it's great if you're an airline
that's flying 100 flights today
and you're selling tickets
for 200 flights in six months time
that on the balance sheet
looks sensationally good
but it falls apart
when Covid comes along and suddenly
tomorrow you're not flying anywhere
and when the expansion
stops and what's fueling that expansion
and what's going to sustain your brand
and if
it does turn out that these
novel machines from
novel manufacturers
are problematic in the medium to long term
again going right
back to a conversation at the start of this pod
whose shoulders will that be on
that'll be on our shoulders
when we're selling a four year old
bid which has
got a battery problem coming up shortly
and a customer whose expectation
is
that it's going to be perfect
Well at least we've got something to look forward to, Tim
They've taken all the sharp things out of my office
you know
I'm glad they have
John, I mean we've sort of
we've run out of time, we've done a
two big story double header there
haven't we, you know
maybe we should just commit those to the house
and see how we get on
I think so, so Tim
before I ask for your verdict on those two stories
are there any
stories you think we should have covered but we didn't
I mean there's quite a few
we didn't have time to cover
My goodness me, where would you start
No, I think you've
focused on exactly the
exactly the things that have
kind of caught my attention
Constellation, you know Marshall Jagger in Newbury
who've done our servicing
I have the most amazing
deal with
Marshall Jagger in Newbury, as an independent
specialist
the things they were doing for me
were unbelievable
and were such an enabler of my business
and that huge facility
is now closed
and you know
next year's Constellation
accounts might be even more interesting
and it's good
to have a hobby, James
You know
Keeps me busy
I'm sure it does
I think for me if I had to choose between the two
it's the
the march of the Chinese in the market
If for no other reason
than that, if
three years ago we'd all sat here
and challenged each other to come up with
what's going to be the significant thing in 2025
I don't think any of us
would have dreamt
would have seen figures like that
No, I don't think so
That's a good win for me
if at the expense of the European car industry
On balance
It's all over the street
That's lovely
Well Tim, thanks for joining us today
all the stuff we'd say is thank you to you for coming on
and chatting to us about your business
and your very interesting background
I must say
It's been really enjoyable, thank you very much indeed
for having me
Lovely to see you Tim, thank you
Best of luck this year
Yeah, fingers crossed
Absolutely, thank you as well to James
for turning off his boiler for the
duration of the podcast
and thank you for listening
We'll be back next week with another episode
James won't because he'll be skiing down a slope
so make sure you're subscribed
so you can be notified when that goes live
If you want to check out the stories you mentioned today
take a look in the show notes below
or head to CardiTheMagazine.co.uk
Thanks for listening and goodbye
About this episode
Tim Atkinson, founder of Sports and Touring, joins the Car Dealer Podcast to discuss the challenges facing the automotive industry, including Constellation Automotive's significant losses and the rise of Chinese car manufacturers. Tim shares insights on his journey from aviation to car sales, emphasizing the unpredictability of retail car sales and the impact of consumer rights legislation. The episode also explores the competitive landscape, with a focus on how independent dealers can adapt to market changes and the importance of maintaining quality in customer service.
Original notes
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