Episode 101: Advanced Driver Aggravation Systems
Tired: The Car Podcast For People Who Understand That Cars Are Bad
Episode 101: Advanced Driver Aggravation Systems
Annotations will appear as you listen
0:00
54:52
Car
Volkswagen Beetle
The Volkswagen Beetle is a small car that looks a bit like a bug, and it's famous for its unique shape. It was really popular a long time ago and is still loved by many people today.
Car
Toyota Land
The Toyota Land Cruiser is a large SUV that is great for off-roading and has a reputation for being very reliable and comfortable.
Term
turbo four hybrid setup
A turbo four hybrid setup means the car has a small four-cylinder engine that uses a turbocharger to boost power, along with an electric motor to help save fuel and reduce pollution.
Car
Mercedes-Benz G-Class
The G-Class, or G-Wagon, is a fancy SUV made by Mercedes-Benz. It's known for being tough and stylish, making it popular among people who want a luxury vehicle that can also handle rough terrain.
Concept
luxury SUV
A luxury SUV is a big vehicle that is comfortable and has nice features. It's designed to be both stylish and capable of handling tough driving conditions.
Car
Lexus LX 600
The Lexus LX 600 is a fancy version of the Toyota Land Cruiser, designed for people who want luxury and comfort while still having a powerful SUV.
Concept
platform
A platform in cars is like a base that different models are built on. It means they share the same basic structure and parts, even if they look different on the outside.
Car
Lexus 300 series
The Lexus 300 series is a group of luxury cars made by Lexus, which is Toyota's premium brand. They are designed to be more comfortable and stylish compared to regular Toyota trucks.
Car
Lexus GX 550
The Lexus GX 550 is a fancy SUV that is built on the same base as the Toyota Land Cruiser, which means they have a lot in common but are designed for different buyers.
Car
Toyota Land Cruiser Prado
The Toyota Land Cruiser Prado is a smaller SUV compared to the full-size Land Cruiser. It's designed for off-road driving and is known for being tough and reliable.
Car
Toyota FJ60
The Toyota FJ60 is an older model of the Land Cruiser, known for its sturdy build and off-road abilities. It's popular among fans of classic SUVs.
Car
Lexus GX
The Lexus GX is a luxury SUV that is built for both off-road adventures and comfortable driving. It's similar to the Toyota Land Cruiser but focuses more on luxury and comfort.
Car
Chevrolet Bel Air
The Chevrolet Bel Air is an old-fashioned car that many people think looks really cool. It was popular a long time ago and is now a favorite among collectors who love classic cars.
Car
Rivian
Rivian is a company that makes electric trucks and SUVs, focusing on outdoor and adventure use.
Car
Toyota Corolla
The Toyota Corolla is a small car that many people like because it's dependable and saves gas. It's a popular choice for everyday driving.
Car
Mazda Cx5
The Mazda CX-5 is a type of SUV that is popular for its good looks and fun driving experience. It's a family-friendly vehicle that many people like to drive.
Term
throttle
The throttle is like a gate that controls how much air and fuel goes into the engine. When you push the gas pedal, it opens this gate to let more air and fuel in, making the car go faster.
Term
Nürburgring lap times
Nürburgring lap times are how long it takes for a car to go around a specific racetrack in Germany. It's a popular place for car companies to test their cars and show how fast they can go.
Term
Apple CarPlay
Apple CarPlay lets you use your iPhone in your car. You can see maps, listen to music, and make calls without having to touch your phone, making it safer to drive.
Brand
Geolander
Geolander tires are made by Yokohama and are designed for vehicles that need good performance on both highways and rough terrains. They are often used on SUVs and trucks.
Term
all season tires
All season tires can be used in different weather conditions, like rain and light snow, making them convenient for everyday driving. They don't perform as well as winter tires in heavy snow, but they are a good all-around option.
Term
center lock button
The center lock button helps your car's wheels work together better when driving on rough or slippery surfaces. It makes sure that power goes to both the front and back wheels equally, which can help you get out of tough spots.
Term
four wheel low
Four wheel low is a special setting in some cars that helps them drive better on really rough ground. It makes the car stronger and helps it go slower, which is useful when climbing hills or driving through mud.
Part
bottle jack
A bottle jack is a tool that helps lift heavy things like cars. It's called a bottle jack because it looks like a bottle and is often used to change tires or fix parts under a car.
Term
recovery gear
Recovery gear is stuff you keep in your car to help you get out of trouble if you get stuck. It can be things like a shovel or a tool to pull your car out.
Part
hand winch
A hand winch is a tool you can use to pull something heavy, like a car, out of a tough spot. You turn a handle to make it work.
Term
base model
The base model is the simplest version of a car. It has the basic features but doesn't include extra options that might cost more.
Term
MSRP
MSRP is the price that the car maker suggests you should pay for a new car. It helps you know how much the car is worth when you go to buy it.
Term
Out-the-door price
The Out-the-door price is the total cost you pay when buying a car. It includes the price of the car plus taxes and fees, so you know exactly how much you need to spend.
Car
Mazda MX-5 Miata
The Mazda MX-5 Miata is a small sports car that is very fun to drive. The NA is the first version of this car, made in the late '80s and '90s, and it's known for being light and easy to handle.
Car
Mazda Miata
LIVE
Did we do just the pod today, yet?
Oh yeah, what is this?
I'm gonna get a cup of coffee
and listen to you guys for the birthday.
Okay, all right.
The pod is tired.
The car podcast for people who know that cars are bad
with your friends, Rory and Maddie and Peter.
Everybody have a great Christmas.
Or, or Hanukkah.
Happy Hanukkah today.
On zero, whatever you do.
Or did you successfully just ignore all of the above
and just have the best holiday season
that you can possibly have by just escaping it entirely?
I was fondly remembering some holiday seasons of your,
the handful of times in my life
where I've just completely dipped out.
And it was like some of the fucking,
some of the most treasured memories
of just being alone on Christmas
and just having the best time.
No, it's so real.
Like you just kind of, after a point, it's like,
oh man, wouldn't it be nice to spend this entire 24 hours
like in a little cocoon that my family is not in
with no merriment or festivities
or seasonal cheer, not my thing.
I don't prefer it.
Yeah.
Yeah, hopefully everyone has had a,
as as minimally psychically painful a holiday as possible.
But, how did Rory's holiday go?
I can't say, I've never done a Christmas by myself.
I've always had like, I think I've always been home.
This may surprise you,
but I have some very fun cousins and aunts and uncles.
And like, I've always really dug
being around like 100 people at Christmas.
It's, we do like a big Christmas party
for a bunch of my first cousins
and it is extremely fun.
We like, this year we set up a fryer outside.
My cousin TJ and I were like,
frying various fish and chicken strips
and all kinds of, and like a huge fucking blizzard
whipped up like halfway through us.
Like he and I were like out there.
And this is snow hitting the oil
and just like exploding basically.
It was so, like a storm ripped up.
And it was like, I looked over at him.
It was like, we're on the deck
of the Edmund Fitzgerald out here.
I was like, oh boy, like, we're in a jackpot.
And it's like, you know, you have
whatever 30 gallons of 300 degree fry oil
at your ankles.
And it was like.
You just got to throw a fucking tarp over that, man.
Or what do you even do?
You just need like a piece of sheet metal
just to drop over it.
I like the visual aid here of also
it's so cold in Rory's house.
The steam coming off of his coffee,
his drinkable like temperature coffee
is visible on the webcam.
Oh yeah.
Nice.
Yeah, it is very cold in the house
because the office has been shut up the whole time.
But yeah, anyway, I don't know.
I enjoy seeing everybody and getting.
I mean, that's a nice thing about being where you are,
like in Traverse City, like in the place
where you grew up.
That's the thing, like, I mean,
I have a lot of extended family who that I totally love,
you know, and love hanging out with and love seeing,
but it's like, but they're all in Massachusetts.
You know, I see them like every few years, you know,
and usually like in conjunction with a funeral or something.
Yeah.
And so it's not quite as fun.
But yeah, it's, yeah, I don't know.
Like I said, I've never, I've never done it by myself.
It does sound very appealing to do it by myself,
but it's not likely in the offing.
You kind of have to, yeah, you have to have the right mindset.
It's just, it's just like a few times in my life
where the stars have aligned in that way,
and usually for like unfortunate reasons, but it's the thing
of just kind of like, you know.
That's your home alone.
You're literally Kevin McAllister,
and your family forgot you behind,
and you're just Peter by yourself.
Exactly.
Defending your house from burglars,
watching movies, eating a huge tub of ice cream.
No, exactly.
It's like, what can I do to like make this awesome,
and then make it like really awesome,
and it just being like, dude, this rules.
Oh.
I had to build a fire because the heat has been out
since the day before Christmas.
Jesus.
Furnace?
Fun.
The thing?
Yeah, the furnace is, when we were building the house,
I remember going to the guy and saying like,
hey, don't buy a furnace or like any major appliances
until you talk to me,
because I want to like do some research
and figure out what I want in the house.
Yeah.
And they did not do that, obviously.
The furnace, I remember being like,
you know, I don't know anything about these,
like I've never heard of this company before.
And he's like, oh, don't worry, these are really good.
We work on them all the time.
And I was like, what?
Like, it seems like if they were really good.
Good for you.
Yeah.
Like, yeah, you wouldn't ever,
like you would install them
and not know anything else about them.
Right.
But...
It's like that diagram with the plane,
with all the places they came back with,
the bullet holes for the...
It's like the Maytag Repairman thing.
You know, the old commercial where like,
the guy is just bored because he has nothing to do.
Our guy is not bored.
He's here all the time working on the furnace.
Bummer.
Hate to see it.
And it's...
Yeah, so it's broken in the same way.
Several times.
And this time it just needs a bunch of parts thrown at it,
which are gonna be really expensive.
We had to, I had to replace our furnace,
a few like COVID era.
Like maybe it was just time or,
or I can't even remember how it,
it was just like,
like when we were just spending a shit ton of money
on our house.
You know, just fixing all the deferred shit
that we inherited.
And,
and I don't know anything about furnaces,
but I know that just like from having lived here forever,
that there's like,
there's a couple of just local heating places
that have been around like for decades, you know?
And like one of them, and I, you know,
it's not the first time I've bought a furnace
for a fucking janky old house.
And so I just called these people and, you know,
they came out and, and, you know,
$4,500 later, whatever the fuck it was.
But like they give you the whole spiel of like,
yeah, you know, just have us come out, you know,
every year at the beginning of winter,
we'll just, you know, we do the, the free maintenance on it
and just keep it, you know, it's like, oh, okay, cool.
Have I done that once?
Yeah.
I have not.
Have we had a single problem with the furnace?
Have not.
Maybe, yeah, I should call your guys,
have them drive up here.
Yeah.
I, the furnace in our Detroit house
was literally from like the 60s maybe, early 60s,
and had one failure the entire time we lived there.
And then the furnace in the carriage house,
there was cast in 1911 and was faultless.
Like it was a, it was a cold,
like yeah, it was a cold furnace
that had been converted to fuel oil
that had been converted to gas.
And it was like, it was unstoppable.
Like it was, I mean, it was the size of,
you know, it's probably half the size of a Volkswagen Beetle,
but yeah.
It's funny, the first house that I lived in,
in Rochester was heated by, by fuel oil.
And I didn't even know what that was.
Like I had never heard of it coming from California.
I'm like, what the fuck does that even mean?
You know, like they give us like the number
for the people to call and I'm just like, what?
What is this?
You know, and then, and then like you call them
and they come out and there's a big fucking tanker truck
pulls out in front of your house and,
and you know, they unspool it, like a hose or something
and attach it to the side of your house.
And it's just like, what the fuck is even happening?
It was the most alien, funny thing.
It feels, I mean, it's like a East Coast or New England thing,
but it feels very like British to me,
to have like the fuel oil, man.
We don't, I've never seen one of those in person here.
But we also, yeah, we also have like the furnace
in our garage and my shop just like, I turned it off.
I flipped the switch off in the spring
and I flip it out in the winter and it runs perfect.
It's like this, I don't know.
You hate to be like, man, all this new stuff,
fucking sucks, but it does suck.
It's true.
I'm sure it's like more efficient and safer
than any of the old furnaces that I'm talking about.
But boy, the number one thing that you want
in a furnace to me is that it heats the house,
would be like, verse.
But here we are.
Got to, got to.
Well, I mean, luckily, it seems like a pretty mild winter
so far for everybody and.
Definitely has this note every day.
It's like, man, the thing that I was talking about yesterday,
it's like, it's not just that they weren't salting the roses.
Like there weren't even any fucking plows.
That's crazy.
Like, I mean, nothing.
Like nobody, you know, like I think I saw one.
Like I had to go pick Natalia up from the mall,
which is, you know, like 25 minutes away,
like on the freeway, on the inner, you know.
And it's like, I think I saw one.
And it's like, what the fuck are we doing?
And you had all day, you know, it's like,
everybody knew this was coming, you know?
The supermarket was just like, you know,
that thing where you get there half an hour too late
and just like all the shelves are bare
because everybody's in just, you know,
fucking Armageddon mode
for like a one day's, you know, event or whatever.
Yeah, minor show store, yeah.
Mass psychosis at the Wegmans, yeah.
But yeah, I mean, you know, it's like, and it didn't,
like I said, you know, I went out walking yesterday,
you know, because I knew the snow was coming
and it's like, and sure enough, by the time I get back,
it's like one o'clock and it's like,
oh, it's starting to snow like a tiny bit.
And then like half an hour later,
it's just complete white out, you know?
It's like an inch every hour or whatever.
And then it's like, come on guys,
wear the fucking plows, you know?
It's like, we used to do this.
Yeah.
It used to be like.
The process or response.
It's like, eh, it's fine.
You're on your own, no plows, no services,
just figured out.
Yeah.
Don't go anywhere.
Just go hoard everything at the grocery store
and stay in your home because you can't leave
because there's no plows service.
But it's good.
It actually, yesterday we went out to Frankfurt.
I have the new Toyota Land Cruiser,
which is a car I was really like excited about.
Yeah.
And it looks great, I think,
and like the interior is kind of perfect.
It's like, it is like coarse and buzzy.
It's that little like turbo four hybrid setup.
And it's very, it's very buzzy and coarse,
but it feels trucky, like a kind of, you know,
if you didn't know it was like a very complex setup,
you'd think like, oh, this is a really like
kind of rough and tumble type of powertrain, but.
Right.
That's what I've heard about it just in general,
is that it's not like a generic, you know,
like kind of SUV or whatever.
Like it actually feels like it has character
and it feels like a truck and, you know,
in both good ways and bad.
Yeah, I mean, I think the Land Cruiser in the States
had kind of gone through this like metamorphosis
of like being very kind of utilitarian
like it is in the rest of the world,
but also being like very reliable and capable,
but like all American, the foreign cars in America
that are sold out on the higher end,
like the G-Wagon and all the Jeeps
and you know, the Waggingers and all that stuff,
just kept moving more and more upmarket
until like the last one that was sold here,
the 200 series was like a full blown luxury SUV
with all the off-road stuff still in it.
So like, you know, in the rest of the world,
you could get a much lower spec Land Cruiser
that still did all the off-road stuff,
but didn't have like the, you know,
$100,000 cars type of interior or whatever.
The same with like the G-Wagon, but...
It's like the way that like Mercedes, you know,
used to be taxis all over the world
and like here it was like a luxury.
We only got the luxury versions.
Yeah, and it's like, eventually,
like that's just Mercedes's proposition
is that it's like it's all a luxury car,
but like the Land Cruiser was a weird spot,
like the 200 series, I think was like a $90,000 car roughly.
And interestingly, like those last 200 series Land Cruisers
which are now like three or four years old,
those are still $90,000 cars.
Like they haven't depreciated much at all.
And they're still like very overbuilt and very like,
but also like very luxurious.
And so the idea with this one,
which I actually, I think makes a ton of sense
is to like import the current Land Cruiser 300 series,
which is in the rest of the world, just the new Land Cruiser.
And they make that into a Lexus, which I had two weeks ago.
That's the Lex 700 and 600.
And is the difference between the Lexus and Toyota ones,
is it just like trimmings
and the way it's like outfitted like interior-wise
or is it like a different substantially different vehicle?
Yeah, so they're all the same platform.
They look the same, right?
Well, until you see, so the platform is the same
for all of the new Toyota truck stuff.
But the Lexus is the 300 series.
So it's bigger and longer.
It's way more mysterious inside.
Is it just longer wheelbase?
Yeah, same platform, but it's longer wheelbase
and like longer overall.
There's the GX 550 Lexus, which is the same,
almost the same as the Land Cruiser.
So like that's the same platform,
but also like the same, roughly the same bodywork.
They look, I mean, superficially,
they look similar because of the same size.
The bodywork is actually different.
All the sheet metal is different.
The interior is different.
And that's like actually, I think like,
that's the one that I had two years ago
that I was like so blown away with, that was so nice.
And so like, so capable.
But the Land Cruiser, so like those would both be,
if you're doing like rest of the world,
like the full-size Land Cruiser 300 series is the LX.
The Land Cruiser that we get in the States
and the GX 550 are both Land Cruiser Prado,
which is like my old GX,
like which is just like one size down
from the full-size Land Cruiser.
So shorter wheelbase, you get two rows instead of three.
Okay.
And it's like the Land Cruiser is like,
I would say like more like kind of spiritually aligned
with like a FJ 60.
So like, which is like, I think great.
Like I think that that's a better position for it.
I think like Toyota Land Cruiser should be
a little bit more utilitarian
and like the Lexus should be like the nicer version of that.
So like the GX.
Anyway, I was really really into this car.
And I think like the one that I have is like a really nice
gold with a silver roof.
I mean, this is a car that's kind of high on your list
of like potential-
Yeah, replacements for-
Carol, family, family haulers.
Yeah.
And I think like,
I do really like it.
It is like, they do start at $50,000.
And I think like my appetite for spending any money
on a new car is pretty low.
But the, it does have like,
it has a thing that detects if your eyes are on the road.
Oh, fuck, come on.
Which my eyes are, you know, I tend to look around a lot,
like not just look straight ahead,
but I tend to look outside windows
and just kind of like look kind of where I'm going.
Yes, responsibly, like a responsible driver does.
Is it disableable?
Well, so I drove for several days like this
and it was beeping at me most of the time.
And then we went on a night drive up to Bel Air, Michigan
and you can't see it on cam,
but I have somewhat long, luxurious eyelashes
and it kept thinking that my eyes were closed
and I was getting a warning that my eyes were closed.
This is anti-Irish discrimination.
Yeah, I agree.
So anyway, I ended up having to pull the car over
and turn it off to get back on the road.
But like it was just beeping incessantly the entire time.
Does it stay off or do you have to return it off every time?
It's been, it's been good since then.
Okay, I mean, that's the thing.
If you can disable it permanently, I'm fine.
You know, that's not a deal breaker.
If it's fucking, if it's coming on every time
you get back in the car, forget it, no fucking way.
Absolutely 100%, just put gun to roof of mouth at that point.
I would not, I couldn't.
I could not do it.
I mean, the whole idea of it is annoying to me,
but like you said, if you can turn it off, fine.
Like there's stuff in the Rivian
that I've just kind of disabled and turned off
and it's like, I remember it's there.
Yeah, same with my car.
And also, I mean, one of the things,
I mean, I recently, I can't remember what it was
I was watching recently where, you know,
somebody reviewing some Toyota product
and they were talking about the lane assist
or whatever, the safety stuff,
which like normally any sane person just turns the fuck off.
But they were commenting on the fact that it was like,
it was so unobtrusive that they didn't feel compelled
to turn it off and it like, I remembered,
like I flashed to like, oh, that totally jibes
with my experience like with that Corolla
that I had in Australia.
And I remember thinking the exact same thing.
It was like, wow, this is the most like gentle lane keeping thing
I've ever felt like where I wasn't even sure
if it was happening or not.
Like it was like, it was just,
and whereas like when I felt it like, you know,
in like my wife's car, the CX-5, you know,
like it drives me insane.
Like it's just like the first time I feel it,
it's just like, oh fuck you, you know,
because it's tugging at the wheel.
You know, it's like, it's making me swerve
in ways that I don't want to swerve.
Like I'm fucking, yeah.
It's like, I'm driving the car.
I know what, I'm doing this on purpose.
It's because I'm avoiding something.
You fucking idiot.
Oh my God, that's the worst.
When you're trying to get around something
and the lane is just like, oh, let me help you with that.
It's like, no, no, no, no, no, no.
Yeah, no, exactly.
God, I hate it.
There is like a, so this experience
and then like a few other kind of like techie experiences
I've had recently is it's like the,
there used to be a kind of very simple heuristic
or rubric or heuristic, I guess,
for like whether something is good and working
and it's like, does it do what you expect it to do?
Right.
And that's it.
Like that's the question.
And I think like, in so many cases with this stuff,
the kind of like unpleasantness comes from the fact
that you push a button and nothing happens
or you try to turn and the car does not turn
in the way that you expect it to.
And it's like the basic lizard brain satisfaction
of operating a thing is doing the input
and having the expected result.
Yeah, totally.
And your lizard brain does not like it
when you do the thing and the result is unexpected.
It doesn't really even really matter what it is,
but it's like so much stuff now.
It fails that most basic, that's the test, right?
Like it's like the simplest, it's like,
is this, does this do what I expected to do?
And it's like, it does not.
It's like, that is the.
Well, because there's all this processing going on
between, you know, it's not like, you know,
it used to be there was a literal wire connection, yeah.
You know, connecting your, you know,
the pedal that you're pushing, you know.
And it's not a wire like an electrical wire,
a fucking cable, you know.
It's like when you put, when you mash your foot
on the gas pedal, that's like, that's pulling on a cable
that is pulling on the throttle that is opening this valve
that is letting air and fuel into the engine.
You know, it's like a purely mechanical thing.
And that has been.
That has been satisfying.
Right, exactly.
And it's like breaks, same thing.
Transmission, same thing, you know.
And so it's like, but all of those things
have been severed by electronic interfaces
and then severed again by processing.
And so you have these, you know, these minders
just kind of like second guessing, you know,
oh, well, based on, you know, these 5,000 variables
and the thing that the driver is inputting,
what do we, you know, what's the best output here?
And so you just, you end up with this kind of
non-linear, non-predictable thing that like, you know,
I mean, if it's done well and if it's invisible,
you know, I mean, it's the reason that you have,
you know, $100,000 cars that can turn
nirburgring lap times, you know, that are faster
than a, you know, F1 car from the last time,
F1 cars raced on the Nordschleife.
But it's also, you know, the reason that like,
you know, most of the time I get in a new car,
I'm just driven to fucking distraction
and it just makes me angry.
Yeah.
It's everything now.
What the fuck are you doing?
Yeah.
No, I ran into that earlier today with everyone's best friend,
Windows 11, because I had a process hanging
and I was like, open task manager, get in there.
And I'm like, end task.
And it's like, now why would I do that?
Now why would end task make me, and I'm like, okay,
you know what, that's, I was like, that's fine.
That's, I'll go, I'll go around you.
Windows button R, nothing.
And I'm like, what do you mean?
Is it, okay, function Windows button R, types in R.
And I'm like, you're, you're not pulling up the run dialogue.
We're not doing that.
We're not going to pull up the run dialogue
so I can put in the CMD and go and go around you.
I have to hard reboot the laptop.
Really, you're going to make me enter the computer
physically because the software doesn't work.
Like it makes me insane.
It renders me insane.
I had to get up and walk around.
That's literally just like, I'm going to unplug this.
Right, I'm just going to unplug it.
This is going in the yard fast at high speed in the air.
Yeah, I was going to say, that's the,
that's the really reasonable response.
The other response is just, I'm going to smash it.
Yeah.
I was looking at it and I was looking at a heavy book.
It's like, I just bought this big book on Herman Melville
and wouldn't it feel so nice to just,
but that's the, yeah.
The, and I do, I like, I have this column going
and I haven't finished it.
I don't know that I will, but it's like,
it's about this stuff and just like the experience of like,
it's really about Apple and really about like Apple CarPlay,
which like, I have hated CarPlay for years.
And it's like, I read so many car reviews that are like,
oh, and it, you know, it connects to your phone
so it has Apple CarPlay.
So you don't have to worry about whatever it's like.
Apple CarPlay fucking suck.
Like the experience of using Apple CarPlay,
the experience of using Apple products at all
is so offensive in so, so much of this experience
where it's like, what, why doesn't it do,
why is it, you know, like, I've complained about it,
but yeah, and I think I've talked about the column
before on the podcast, which tells you how long
it's been sitting in my drafts,
but it's like, but it, it is just like an endless
kind of like succession of like these types of,
of issues and frustrations.
And it's like, the idea, I think, you know,
yesterday I was thinking about it too,
and it's like, I think a lot of car executives
don't think a ton about that stuff.
They're like kind of probably passive users of their,
their phones and users of their computers and stuff.
If at all.
And I think they also kind of defer to tech company leaders
because they're overpaid, you know,
because they get paid so much.
It's like, oh, these guys must be doing stuff
better than me because they work at Apple
and they get, you know, a million dollars
or 10 million dollars a year or whatever.
And it's like, they're actually not.
And I think like, you know, to the Rivian thing,
like the Rivian setup is so much better than CarPlay.
And it's so much better than, like use it,
like for all the frustrations that I've had
with the Rivian overall, it is much better
than any of the Apple products that I own,
like on a UX UI basis.
And it's like the idea that you would just constantly defer
to the makers of a device that I imagined myself
overhead spiking through the floor several times a day.
It's like, especially for a car, like,
but anyway, digression to complain about tech
as I do every single episode.
But the, so last night we had the...
Yeah, I want to get circle back to the verdict
on the Land Cruiser.
Yeah, so this is prefaced by saying,
this is really any car that you buy.
It's kind of,
upper levels of performance are going to be defined
by the tires that are on the car.
And this car has some whatever Geolander
kind of all season tires, which is like,
I can spot, you see them in the parking lot
and you're like, oh, this is not good.
You don't want those.
There was such a good shake of Peter's head
on the Google Me when you said that.
That was not communicated to the listeners,
but was very funny.
Well, just all season and the fact,
I mean, it's a press car with Texas plates on it.
And it's just like, well, you know,
for Northern Michigan in Czech's calendar, December 27th.
Yeah, so yesterday it was so,
it actually had warmed up a little bit.
And it was one of those situations
where there was like half an inch of glare ice
on every surface.
And so like, you know, the car in the driveway,
you just put it in the driveway
and it just slides all the way down the driveway
with brakes on, does not.
He's just crazy.
Good, so.
Great.
Which was fine, I got around fine.
But last night we were coming home
from Family Christmas in Frankfurt, Michigan.
And as I like to do, like out there,
between Frankfurt and Traverse City,
Frankfurt is like a little town on the coast
of Lake Michigan, kind of like probably
40 minutes south of Empire.
But there are all kinds of like unpaved
and kind of like back woodsy routes
to get back to Traverse City.
That aren't really a lot slower
than just going on the highway.
So I kind of started nosing into those
and I was getting some shit about.
So wait, so those pictures that you sent us last night,
like I was just imagining this was just you
off hooning in the woods by yourself.
But you were actually driving home from the event
with your entire family.
Oh yeah, yeah, yeah.
But like this is like, you know, like I said,
this is kind of like.
Adventures with Rory.
Yeah, well it's like part of why you're,
you know, like I did this shit with my dad
when I was a kid and it's like, it's fun.
It's like, it's also to me an important part
of growing up where you have like these little mishaps
and adventures that you have to like solve a problem.
And it's like, you don't freak out, you don't melt down.
It's like, this is how you get yourself out of this.
This is how you deal with the situation.
So it's like, if you're gonna continue
to get yourself into dumb situations,
you have to figure out how to get out.
So anyway, we were kind of like nosing through
and I was like, oh, you know, I know what I'm doing.
Like you're in good hands.
Like don't, you can just relax.
You gotta, I can feel.
What are your ladies doing?
They're just like shaking their heads.
Oh, the kids were fine.
Kids in the back seat.
They're just like, oh no, here we go again.
They were listening to Fantastic Mr. Fox on their Yodo player.
But so we're driving down these little back roads
and I think like at some point we got into like a dirt road
which like, it's a dirt road with six inches of snow on it.
Like this is not, I would not hesitate to take
like the Lexus on snow tires,
like would not have even been a second thought.
Like, and it connects to like some bigger
kind of back roads that were paved.
But I was like, I will just run through this little short jog
to get to like a bigger twisty road.
And as we're going through, like in the back of my head,
I could feel kind of like the tension
coming from the passenger seat.
And I was like, you know what, I'm gonna just turn around.
We'll let the, we'll just admit
that this is too much to kind of do.
Which like, in my experience,
like driving through the deeper snow in the woods,
like you kind of just have to keep your momentum up.
It's a moment, I was just gonna say, man,
it's just like driving in the sand.
It's a momentum game.
You did the one thing you can't do is second guess yourself.
And say, maybe we should turn around.
Yeah.
So I found a big open spot to turn around
and immediately the car just fucking planted in.
Oh.
In like, this is when you look at those tires
and you're like, man, fuck you.
Like, they had no hope whatsoever.
So like, you're sitting there and then it's like,
you know, in the GX,
it's like pushing the center lock button
activates the center locker, but everything else is a lever.
It's like, we're in four wheel low
because there's a lever that is connected
to the transmission and I put it in four wheel low.
Right, yeah.
And it like, this thing, you know, there was like,
I had to literally get the manual out
to figure out how to lock the differentials
and like, I had to like, could not get the thing.
Anyway, it kept getting.
Is it like a menu thing?
Do you have to go through fucking menus to do it?
There's three different knobs to like select drive modes.
Which like, one of the, like the crawl mode
that's like for deep snow was not,
it was just like crawl mode unavailable, C manual.
It was like, not really explained what or why that was.
And then there's-
You had to pay the subscription fee?
Yeah, yeah.
There was like two different levers,
or two different buttons for lockers,
but like the lockers wouldn't activate,
center one would, the rear one wouldn't probably
because they hadn't pressed, you know,
some other, whatever setting wasn't right
to get to the rear locker,
but I finally got all the lockers going,
but again, by then it was like, this thing was so buried.
So I went through the whole process of like,
and at this point, like it warmed up enough,
like I was in a T-shirt,
the kids are listening to Fantastic Mr. Fox,
just goofing around, like it was like, fine.
Like it was like very-
Nobody's panicking.
No one was panicking, you know,
sensing some annoyance from some quarters of the car,
but I think overall like, you know, we were fine.
And then, so I get the car, you know,
put some rocks kind of wedged closer to the wheel,
couldn't get them to bite.
Again, this is like a tire issue.
So then I was like, okay, I'm gonna,
I'll lower the tire pressure in the back,
drop the tire pressure.
No, nothing, no change whatsoever.
And the car is just like laying on its kind of frame rail
on the passenger side.
This is Christ, it's dug itself that deep.
Yeah.
And it just like really just from sitting,
like, you know, as we were sitting there,
like it's kind of sandy ground with a layer of snow on it.
And I also kind of made the mistake of like, okay,
I will let this dig a little deeper than I normally would
because I know there's sand down there
and I know the snow is not that deep.
So it should at some point be able to grab that sand
and push us out, which was not the case.
But eventually I was like, you know,
I got to the point where I was like, okay,
I'm gonna have to find a downed tree
and like kind of lever this car out of the ground.
And I was like, that's gonna take forever.
Also, my other option was to crawl underneath the car
and just with my arms remove all the snow
and dirt from under the car,
which I've also, I've done that a few times.
And it was like, that's like your last resort
because it is unpleasant.
You're like, you know, on your stomach,
just digging like a mole underneath the car.
So then I was like, okay, I'm gonna,
I will find the bottle jack in this car
and use the bottle jack to like get,
get like an inch of clearance
and then wedge some shit underneath the tires
and see if we can avoid me having to dig.
Found the bottle jack immediately,
could not find the little arm or whatever
that you like turned the bottle jack with.
The crank, yeah.
Yeah, and it was like, I looked in the manual,
there's no, there's like two places where it said it was,
it was not in there in either place.
And it was like, it was not clear like how much
you had to remove to get to it.
Cause it was like, it was just an image of like,
oh, here's a highlighted area where it is
and you'd open it, it was just like an empty container.
And it was like, so was it underneath this container?
Like, do I remove this piece to like,
so I ended up pulling all of the trim
out of the back seat of the car around the trunk of the car.
That's what it looked like.
I couldn't tell what was even going on in the picture.
I was like, did you have to fucking take apart the car
to fucking buy the jack or whatever?
I took all the trim out
and then found it in a place that was not indicated
that it would be.
And then, yeah, so found the little bottle jack,
found the little handle and then that worked.
I just jacked it up, you know,
the three inches I could get it off the ground
and immediately just drove out and it was fine.
But, you know, if that, so like that has kind of like
soured me on the car, but it's also like,
if that was my car, it would have proper tires on it
in the winter time and I would have some basic recovery gear.
I'd have a shovel in the car.
I would have, you know, a hand winch and some,
you know what I mean?
Like I wouldn't be just raw dog
and any backwards adventures.
So it's like, maybe fine, but it's like that
plus all the beeping and all the sensors and stuff.
It's like, maybe my thing is just to not have a modern car.
You know what I mean?
Like maybe that's just.
Maybe there's an easier way not to spend a minimum
of $50,000 and not have a bunch of shit that you don't want.
Yeah, it's like, yeah, but I probably will just end up
buying like a $10,000, 200,000 mile Lexus,
like the last one and like that, that'll be the end of it.
It's just like, I, again, I really liked this car
and I like really it was, I think it looks awesome
and like it feels like a good fit
where it's like nice enough, but it's not fancy, you know,
but yeah, and I mean, this one too is like 50 grand
is like for the base model.
This one is like $72,000, which is like.
Yeah, no, that's a thing.
I mean, 50 grand, like that's the, you know.
Seems like a lot.
Well, but that's the absolute bare minimum.
You're not gonna buy one for $50,000.
No, it's like, it's gonna, even just like with taxes
and title and delivery and everything,
like, you know, that ends up being 55
and then like with, you know, the handful
of minimum options that get tacked onto it.
You know, now it's 60 and it's, you know,
there's no such thing as the actual $50,000.
Yeah, and I also, I mean, it's like whatever I could order
one I could do, but it's like the stuff you're paying for,
like the stuff that's included in that cost is like,
like you said, it's just mostly like stuff that I wouldn't,
like I would pay to remove from the car.
You know what I mean?
It's like, I don't want a screen.
I don't want any of the eye tracking stuff.
I don't want lane keeping.
I don't want any of the sensors.
Like, yeah, so, I don't know.
It's, it, yeah, like it's like if you kind of wonder
like at what point am I like not suited to do the job
of car review or where it's just like,
I just don't like this shit.
You know what I mean?
It's like, it's like a question to say.
That's been the thing that I've thought about it
for years now.
It's like, you know, like what would happen
if you sent me on a fucking, on a Mercedes junket, you know?
No, it would just be like taping just sheets of paper
to the fucking dashboard so that I don't have these,
you know, this fucking Las Vegas skyline thing
of fucking screens.
Like, I can't even imagine fucking driving
one of those cars.
Like it would just, it would fucking kill me.
Like the fucking migraine that I would have after 30 seconds.
Yeah, so I don't know.
Like it's, like I said, I mean, yeah, it's just like I don't,
again, like I would love to be more kind of amenable
to that stuff or more like less sensitive to it.
But it's just, yeah, it's just like,
it's just not, maybe not for me.
That's too bad.
Which is weird too, because like that, the Lexus,
I'll have to revisit this because there's something about,
like that GX550 that I had,
the Lexus version of this car has all the same stuff,
but it did not register to me in the same way.
You know what I mean?
Like it did not.
And maybe it's just that I didn't get the Lexus stock.
Maybe that's just the, you know what I mean?
Like I just don't have the same,
like I didn't have the same.
Yeah, it could be.
I mean, just like in normal, just, you know,
daily non-winter use, you don't notice that shit as much.
It is funny.
I mean, I was thinking like even just yesterday,
you know, going to the supermarket
and sliding around and shit in my car, you know?
And just thinking about how weird it is that,
like, it was really up until,
like I've gotten so acclimated and so used to just like
relying on like the backup camera or whatever.
Or, you know, and just thinking about the fact that like,
that for years, you know, I mean, I lived in this climate,
I drove a fucking Miata, like year round, you know?
Like an NA, you know?
Yeah.
On snow tires, you know, in the winter,
but like, but it was totally fine, you know?
There was no screen.
There was no, you know, no driver assist.
There wasn't ABS on the fucking car, you know?
It was like the most, and then like,
and then for years after that drove like an even older Saab.
You know?
And just the fact that, I mean, I was,
that was my daily up until like 2018,
which, you know, I guess at this point
is kind of a long time ago,
but it doesn't feel like it's that long ago, you know?
And like, and it's like, you know, it's like,
we got along just fine without all this bullshit.
Yeah.
Like, how did we do it?
How, you know?
Right.
And it just like, it makes me really want to go back.
Like it makes me just want to fucking have like an old car
just to demonstrate to myself that it's like, you know,
even if it's just like a 90s crown Vic or something,
just to fucking, just a beater that has like,
just a classic winter beater.
Just to demonstrate that, yeah,
like a fucking 30 year old car on snow tires is all you need.
You don't need any of this garbage.
I feel like a lot of this driver assist stuff
is like the ultimate incrementalist solution
to the idea that like driving has historically been dangerous
and that like people are less attentive
and like we do need fewer people in cars all the time.
And like driver assist is part of the,
part of like the bad solution of like,
well, we should let more people be in cars all the time
on the road, filling up the road with cars
who are not paying attention,
but like we'll solve that problem
with like bad driver assist tools that you also hate.
Like it's, when really we need to be putting more people,
just like we just need,
either just needs to be 10 bus routes in your town.
There's, we need bus.
No, literally.
I mean, that's the thing.
And driver assist, I mean, it's just,
it's the kind of like intermediary measure
in the push toward autonomy, you know,
this thing that we've sunk fucking,
you know, billions, if not trillions of dollars into.
And, you know, I mean, there's an easier version
of an autonomy of a car that you don't have to drive.
It's a fucking bus, you know, or a train, you know.
It's like, yeah, man, you just get on the thing.
You get on the bus and it comes.
And you don't have to do anything.
You get on the bus and the bus goes.
I took the bus for so long, it's fine.
There's a little guy up in the front
and they just drive you around.
God's perfect angel takes you to where your bus goes to
safely and all the time and it's great.
It works perfectly.
And because there's so many more people on it,
that means that there's that many fewer vehicles
competing for the same amount of space and, you know,
and it's like, yeah, man.
Dedicated bus lanes, oh baby.
We actually solved this problem so many years ago.
We did it, we did it already.
We did this one.
There are trolleys and buses and street cars
and trains above ground and trains below ground
and you go on them and they go places.
Solve this several times over, actually.
It's fine.
I know why we don't because we have all this stupid
individualist propaganda if you're mongering
about public transit in places where they have it.
I know, I know, big system, but like we solved it.
It's so stupid.
It's very stupid when you look right at it.
I know, but it's very stupid.
I, yeah, I, I don't know.
I think like the unavailability
and like the, like obviously like that's just never going
to be the case in a lot of the country.
And I think just like the, the vigilance problem
that's kind of created by the car that kind of drives itself.
Just like, it's hard to fault really like, you know,
but car companies are building the stuff
that they think will be desirable to consumers
and like that will be of benefit to consumers.
And like that they think, you know,
that the consumer will help them sell more cars, whatever.
Like that's the incentive structure there.
But I don't know.
I mean, I, it's almost, it just feels like the whole thing
is just like, and beyond the fact that the, like, yes,
obviously they're overthinking the train bus solution.
It's like they're overthinking the, the basic operation
of the car solution.
I think like, you know, the Toyota too,
like the other day I had a lot of times you guys kind of know,
we sit on the corner of a, corner of a big intersection.
And a lot of times, like if I have an off-road car
or if I have my own, my own cars would have brought,
instead of driving around to the driveway,
I'll just like blow through the intersection
and drive up the side of the hill.
And then everybody freaks out
cause it looks like you've just lost control of the car
and you're driving off the road.
And then you just disappear over a little hill.
But anyway, doing that, the Toyota cut power,
like cut power to the wheels,
cause it thought that I was like in an accident or like in a,
so like I'm halfway up this little hill.
And it was just like, oh no, you know, like cut,
like I hit the accelerator and nothing happened.
It was like, again, that's, that's fucking.
Oh God. Yeah.
It's like, you could put the car in off-road mode
and it wouldn't do that.
Like it would know what you were doing.
Yeah, but still, like, I know.
You're going to do that one year in the middle
of a situation, you know?
I know, maddening.
It's like, fuck off.
But it's like, that was, I think that was also too,
like what put it in my head this,
that thing of like, does the product,
does the device do what I expect it to do?
And it's like, you don't tell me when,
when the power goes out.
Like I, there's a lever for that that I'm pressing.
Like, but yeah, I don't know.
Overall, good car.
I'll probably buy it in a second.
Cool.
Cool.
All right.
Stay tired.
Stay tired, everybody.
See you again soon.
Bye.
About this episode
A lively discussion unfolds as the hosts share their holiday experiences, with Rory recounting a chaotic Christmas cooking adventure in a blizzard. The conversation shifts to Rory's recent test of the new Toyota Land Cruiser, highlighting its unique features and quirks, including a frustrating driver assistance system that misinterpreted his eye movements. The hosts debate the merits of modern car technology versus classic driving experiences, ultimately expressing nostalgia for simpler vehicles without intrusive tech. The episode blends humor with relatable automotive frustrations, making it a reflective listen for car enthusiasts.
Original notes
We don't try to make episodes about new technology, it's just what life puts in our laps. Rory brings us the trials & travails of adventuring in not-quite the right vehicle, Peter identifies two very different kinds of lane-assist, and Matty hangs onto his Windows 10 machine for dear life.
You can support Alloy with a membership here: https://alloymag.com/sign-up/
Get Peter's new record Half-Staff Blues here: https://peterpeterhughes.bandcamp.com/album/half-staff-blues
Your producer pal Matty, who writes these, has nothing to plug. support my wonderful co-hosts ty ty ty ˖⁺‧₊˚ ♡ ˚₊‧⁺˖ p.s. for our Patreon subscribers: this was half of one recording session, and you will get the rest very soon! (Matty is editing and trying not to get Flu A from everybody else in his house.)
Tired: The Car Podcast For People Who Understand That Cars Are Bad
Tired Podcast (Free Feed)
0:00
54:52