Episode #193 - Automotive Hot Takes

In a world with entirely too many shows about cars, this is another Pointless Automated Podcast.

So then I says to Mabel, oh, hey, I didn't see you there, Mabel, Mabel, wonderful, wonderful

cow.

Oh, she was, she splendid.

Was that Bessie?

They both are.

I think they both are.

Yeah.

Those are both cow names.

Welcome back to another Pointless Automated Podcast, Chadwick and Frank joining you again.

It's been a week and we missed you dearly, so we're ready to jump right into something

fun.

I don't know.

Is it fun?

Fun?

Maybe.

Maybe it's fun.

Annoying?

Yeah, we're annoying.

We're also unqualified, which is the more proper segue for this.

Deeply unqualified, yes.

Horribly.

Don't look into our backgrounds.

But hot takes, man, I think, you know what's funny, original takes, hot takes on subjects

are what make them exciting.

Everybody regurgitating the same thing gets old, right?

Like we get it, you know, we all feel the same way.

All of us.

But I wanted to air out some hot takes, Frank, I wanted to take some time for us

to go back and forth and talk about how we feel about automotive, automotive, we'll

keep it automotive.

Keep it automotive.

Next week is politics and religion, so tune in for that one.

Yes.

Very great, great.

Yeah, all the ANTIFA gear I've ordered has not arrived yet, so we've got to punt that

episode till next week.

Nice.

And my clan mask is at the dry cleaners.

Dry cleaners, yeah, I did.

It's really hard to get feces off of that material.

I'll just say that.

Yeah, well, I'm not going to say if it's my feces or someone else's, but we

just leave that.

Well, yeah, I mean, when you're into clan play, you know, it's kind of, you

know.

Sorry, you were saying?

Either way, I didn't think I could get any harder.

No, we quit doing that, remember?

That's right.

We are team flaccid for light.

What is it?

Flastoberfest.

Exactly.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

No, let's go.

Keep it limp.

My first hot take, guys, and it might be fine.

It might be fine.

It depends how they're being used or who they're being used on.

The new Supra, guys, and I'm not going to sit around with it.

It isn't that new.

I still call it that.

Right.

The Mark 5.

Yeah, we're not going to talk about, I don't want to just, because everybody approaches

this, oh, it's really a fucking BMW, and you're like, no, shit, really?

And you try to have that shocked face.

I don't want to go there, man.

That's been beaten to death.

It's unrecognizable at this point.

I want to just tell you that I don't give a shit about it.

I don't know what it is, Frank.

I expected more.

We all expected more.

It didn't, it didn't really do that.

Does it make you limp?

It does.

It's not any more limp than I already have.

No.

It's a little limpness, but it's just, I don't know, it's a, it's a capable car.

It's a fast car.

Do I like how it looks?

Not particularly.

It's okay.

I don't, do I think it has a lot of longevity, like the Mark 4?

No.

I don't, I don't think it will last that long.

It doesn't have enough Jay-Zs, if you ask me, which two is the correct amount.

I believe, last time I checked.

But I, I see one in the wild, I don't really care.

I don't think they look that attractive.

I don't get excited.

Like I said, it doesn't stir my loins.

That's what I got.

The new Supra is meh.

Yeah.

I can't get, I can't get excited about it, man.

I think I largely agree.

You know, I mean, you're right though.

They are fast.

I've never driven one.

Absolutely.

Very capable.

I'd love to see time in one.

Yeah.

Just because they, they have no Jay-Zs doesn't mean they can't rock a fella.

But they still, I don't know, I'd like to get some see time in one.

My thought is always, and you're right, like when it launched, the whole talk was like,

well, it's actually, you know, it's actually really a BMW, really a Z4, which I, I give

some credence to that.

Sure.

Because every Supra before it was always a 100% Toyota product.

But in my mind, like the real Mark V Supra was actually the Lexus LC.

I like that take.

And, you know, if they had a less luxurious option, badge as a Toyota, and it was just like

a little, yeah, the hottest take.

And more of a, I don't know, like if they down marketed, right?

And so instead of being starting at almost $100,000 for the LC, right?

It was whatever, $75,000 or whatever a Mark V cost knew now.

Yeah.

Like maybe that would have been a, maybe that would have been a better Mark V Supra.

And I know the Supra purists would be like, well, it's always got to have a turbo six

cylinder.

That's how it always is.

Well, yeah, only, only the Mark III and Mark IV ever had a turbocharged six cylinder.

The other ones were just NAs.

It was always a four, four seat GT car.

True.

Inline, inline six too.

Right.

Like we should call it.

Every, always an inline six.

Yep.

Um, so I get why in that regard, the BMW powered, and that's a stout motor.

You can modify the, but Jesus, except, except, well, the rest of the car fall apart.

Maybe I don't know.

Yeah.

Of course.

They offered two liter turbos.

Right.

Remember that?

So they discontinued that.

If I remember correctly.

Yeah.

So they had to play to scoop up those dirt sheep in like 10 years, two liter turbo Supras.

God, the four cylinder.

I don't, I don't know.

I don't know if I've ever seen one.

Like I don't know how to, I don't know the visual cues to tell the difference if I'm

being honest.

I bet they're 75 pounds lighter.

Think of that, dude.

It's effectively a Lotus at that point.

It is.

No, I just, I don't, I don't know, man.

The same.

Like they don't, they don't grab me.

And I was always like, you know, I mean, for the ever, right?

The new Supra.

Right.

I was always grabbed.

But no, like forever, the Mark V Supra was like the half life three of the automotive world,

right?

Yeah.

It's never going to be here.

There's always like chatter about it.

And like it's a, it's around the corner and we're a year away from being a year

away.

And then it would just, so the fact that it exists is great.

But it is, you're right.

It never quite grabbed me the way I wanted it to.

Yep.

Even if it was a V8 instead of a turbo six owner, turbo inline six specifically, I think

it could have been, if it was the LC, but just Toyota affide, I don't know.

I could embrace that.

I would have embraced that.

It could have been better.

But who knows?

Maybe we'd be having the same exact conversation and be like, they could have done what they

did with Subaru and partnered with a, someone else to make it a, you know, a real Supra

with a turbo inline six, you know, and multiple JZs or whatever you want to call it, right?

So I don't know.

I'd be curious if they ever make it a Mark six and how they would do that.

That would be, that would be really interesting.

That's a moderately hot take.

We start off mild and we get a little more wild as we progress.

Progress or fall apart mentally.

Here's one.

Um, not all, certainly not all, but most, most Porsche 911s are lame, dollar for dollar.

This is my hot take here.

And I've driven a bunch.

I've driven, I haven't driven a 992 and the only 964 I've only, I've driven was

like the worst possible example.

It was a, it was a tiptronic C four cab with a bunch of miles on it.

That is the worst.

I haven't really driven.

I have, look, I have nothing.

I'm kind of respecting the nine, nine, nine, six, uh, cabs, but not in four, four wheel

drive guys.

I'll take it in two wheel drive with a manual.

I think, I think that's still a pretty compelling sports car.

That's the most like legit fun, affordable for the money.

Yeah.

When I think about it and, and, and I say most, and when I say most, I'm saying not 95%

I'm saying like 60% of nine 11s.

Okay.

And by that, I mean every generation, there's some cool stuff.

And depending on an individual car, it could be cool.

Right.

Like I don't want to sit here and be like everything, but except for 99 threes.

Sure.

Right.

Or except for early air cooled cars or the GT cars.

But just at large, right?

If you, if you go like, okay, your typical boilerplate, G body, nine 11, right?

So let's say a 1986 Carrera, red over tan, garage, red over tan, 165,000 miles on it.

Right.

In, in good, good condition, maybe it's had a couple of bits repainted, right?

Like what's insane is that's like a 60 to $60,000 car all day.

Yep.

And for 60 to $80,000, in my opinion, that is maybe the most lame way to spend

that money, not because it's a bad car.

I'll take it.

I'll take that over a new Supra.

God, I suppose.

But like, maybe, but there's a lot of parallels.

They're so different though, like all, all nine 11s are very capable machines, right?

Like right now, base Carrera now is incredibly quick.

All right.

And they always know they're still handling, you know, right, competence.

But like you're saying, there's no soul to the, to some of them, right?

They're just, they're checking that is kind of, well, here's my thing.

So that's a car that is a very.

So in my mind, is that a good car?

Yes.

Is it a good car for, say, $70,000?

I think it's a terrible, dreadful use of $70,000.

And the way I say that is it's a, it's a good machine.

Like it's a cool, it's an interesting object, but to a group of car people.

It's it's in my mind, for me, anyways, it feels super ho hum.

Like nobody gives a shit about that car out of cars and coffee.

It's not that fast.

It's built well, but it's some of the care and feeding could be expensive.

And like it's kind of it's kind of like what a dentist would have bought in 1986.

They did buy that and they made a lot of them and they're not, they're not uncommon.

But but at the same time, you take that same 86 C2 Carrera

and if it was mechanically really tight, but had 320,000 miles

and heavy patina on the outside, but ran really hard.

And you bought it for 30 grand, 28 grand.

Now that OK, that's that's a cool 9-11.

But that's not most 9-11's.

Most 9-11's were they've always been

kept up to a certain extent

and had money put in them to a certain extent

because I've always maintained some value, even when they weren't worth a ton of money.

And they were always kind of different.

So they saw special mechanics that looked up to it and like

they just I don't want to say they don't do anything for me

because there are really cool examples, bizarro colors or whatever.

But most of them aren't that.

And so you can do that.

You can draw that same line for, you know, a 9-9-1.

For a, you know, there's different generations that like are a little different,

but like, I don't know, like most 9-11's are like an overpriced.

Over.

Overly talked about appreciated thing.

And I like them, but like dollar for dollar,

it's not at all how I'm going to be spending my money.

Like I just I am not unless I get something bizarro and it's cheap.

And because it's been used heavily or it's some bizarro,

you know, teal over teal color combo, I don't know.

But like the average boilerplate 9-11 just is just like, cool, bro.

I'm with you.

There are worse uses of money because they do hold their value, right?

That's the argument, right?

You buy you buy a 9-11 if you buy it well.

Now, if you buy something that's misrepresented or a piece of shit,

that's on you, but they do hold their value.

So there is that kind of play like over time.

Like, it's probably going to appreciate it a little bit.

Yeah, which is nice.

But yeah, I agree.

Like especially the prices, they're asking air-cooled stuff.

There's so much on my list that I would put above securing like a base

Carrera, you know, sure.

But even a lot of that, like I'd almost rather have a base Carrera

than some of the, you know, turbo cars or whatever, maybe.

Yeah, the thing that I can use and feel good about using.

I just I don't know.

They don't they don't stir me.

I've driven a bunch of them and it's like they're nice objects

are put together well, usually.

I'm with you like the Cayman, the Cayman and Boxer exists.

So the Cayman and Boxer just like, yeah.

If you're going more modern stuff, like engaging, you want to drive

the shit out of it.

Yeah, engaging, fun to drive, dynamically interesting.

Yeah, I like those cars.

Yeah, I don't know.

9-11 overrated.

Oh, yeah, I'm with you on that one.

Nissan 240SX overrated.

I want one so fucking bad right now, Frank.

I've just been eye fucking the shit out of them as 13 or as 14 as 13.

It's the way I want to go.

OK, I don't care about notch back.

I actually prefer the fastback for the notch.

Most people, most people will say the notch back's the cooler one.

I think the fast side of it.

I thought I thought the community, which I don't really play in.

I've never really notch backs fetch a premium.

They're more sought after. I think they're rarer.

I actually like I love how the fastback looks.

Fuck the drift tax.

I'm not paying 10 K, dude, for an automatic swap to a manual,

partially finished build, welded diff.

Every panel mismatch hasn't been registered in five years.

Won't pass smog bullshit that's clapped out.

And it has a truck motor, still has the OEM truck motor in there.

I'm not paying over 10 K on that eBay turbo on it with no supporting mods.

God, I want one so bad still.

But I want to I want to find I need to cool.

They're not that good of a car, though.

You see, in my mind, that that car is the anti 9 11.

I think to where I think so cool level is really high.

But the value like the way they drive compared to the price.

Is I think you're wrong.

I think and I've driven a few.

I've driven modified.

I've driven stock S13's.

I very much like how they drive out of the box.

I think the chassis was way ahead of the game for the price point.

I it's not an expensive one.

These came out.

These were not expensive cars.

I think the S13 like straight out of the factory was a great handler,

great chassis balance, like as a Canyon ripper.

I love them and they take to mods so well, whether you drop like

a SR 20 turbocharged motor in there, redo the suspension, grippy tires,

whatever you're going for.

That car can be catered to be a drift car, can be gated to be a grip car.

It's just a great chassis.

That's just Nissan Nissan, right?

However, yeah.

What like I used the example of the 165,000 mile clean, maybe one painted

panel, but mechanically tight stock.

G body 911.

I use that as example, just speaking about my bullshit.

What does one of those say a 93 S13 fastback?

Same condition stock clean.

It's going to be like $17,000.

No, no.

On marketplace, you can find like 12 to 12, 13.

I even though, let's say 13 for an S13.

That's a lot of money for what you're getting.

Like I don't God, they're very cool.

They're very cool.

They will never make something like that again.

We keep saying that I in the potentials there, if you get one

and you do it right, it's going to increase in value.

Those are never going to depreciate.

It is it just, I don't know.

To me, it's iconic.

It's a lightweight front engine, rural drive car.

That's just got an absolutely storied history.

Just waiting for an engine swap, you know, that's the big thing

you got to do or just do it.

I look, I would personally love to do a stock restoration.

You cannot find anything even close to factory.

That's what I'm looking right now.

I'm trying to find.

I'm just popped on cars and bids to see what I can find.

Oh, you you have that sold.

You literally have to find one that's been sitting in a field.

Someone doesn't know what they have, which is the closest one.

Five speed, ninety three.

Oregon, one hundred and twenty four thousand miles, red hatch.

Yeah, sold for eleven.

Yeah. And, you know, but I want to find that one.

I want to find that one that hasn't run for a while.

I'm actually cool with doing that, as long as it's not been fucked over.

Like you said, well, the diff and all that kind of drifty boy stuff.

And you want a dual cam.

You don't want the earlier piggy to tell you the truth.

I'd probably just say I'm crazy and put an SR 20 DT on it.

I think that would because like the chassis demand, you're going to do that

to a stock car. No, no.

This is if I find one that's been like disused and sitting for like three,

not clap city, but you know what I'm talking about?

Those ones that were kind of nice at the time and something went,

whether it was the motor, which you can get a discount on, or the trans or

something, and they just parked it and it kind of sat there for five years.

That's what I would do to one of those.

Now, no stock, I do a full stock rust, though.

But if I find that one that was pretty clean and just had to like go fast mods

and just something happened and it got set aside and I could scoop it

for six or seven, that's the kind of car I'd love to modify and have

like an absolute, like think of that thing on rallies.

Think of that thing on track days.

Think of that thing just in the canyons.

Yeah, it's a car you can like use for everything.

And once you get it sorted, those things are dead,

and that's reliable tons like aftermarket supports there.

I don't know. I fucking love them, man.

And I think that drift tax is way too goddamn high.

And the prices like get on marketplace, these fucking kids.

Yeah, and they've all got camber kits and yeah, they're like HKS graphics.

And maybe maybe I am the guy that gets a clean auto and does the swap

because you do see the autos tend to be quite clean.

I love them. I love how they look, man.

I've always been a fan.

I remember passing on them when they were four and five K.

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

And now I'm just like, fuck me.

Now they're three times that at least for a good one.

I think they're killer.

So my hot take is they're way too fucking expensive.

What what people are asking?

Yeah, you can still find good deals.

But overall, I think you're paying too much.

But cool as fuck.

You know what? I do like the four teams, too, though.

I like the way the four teams look.

They're a little bigger, though.

And it's like the same little different real performance bump.

So I get why you'd want a 13.

Yeah, man.

Peak Nissan was so good.

Not to not to flash back to last episode, but like so good.

Say I'm telling you, mid to late 80s, early 90s to mid 90s.

Nissan was fucking good.

Yeah, like 1992 Nissan is like.

Oh, absolute prime time.

It's gold, the print and gold. Gold, gold, gold.

I don't know if this is a hot take per se.

But.

Like stuff like cars and mods.

And like additions of cars or whatever that are quote unquote bad ass.

Or like, like just that aesthetic, right?

Whether it's like this, like it's the intimidating, scary spider

edition, like whatever car this one's murdered out.

It's the fucking murdered out edition.

Midnight, this one night edition is what this one's gonna scare you and your kids

and move over the big dogs in town and and just like.

The big dog clothing company.

Yeah, exactly.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, sweet.

OK, we buy big dog.

Yeah, that would be fun.

Actually, somebody made all these like these like 90s cringe band

like brands like big, big Johnson Edition, whatever.

Picker, yeah.

GMC Sierra, yeah, big dog edition.

Yeah, like I just.

It's got to be anything that's like.

Badass, like Intimidate,

like not fun or whimsical in the car world drives me fucking insane.

Do you have any specifics that you are more emotionally really

kind of stuck?

Well, a couple of things in the world of like stock shit.

Like I saw I don't know what the fuck it was.

I think it was I think it was like it was like a Silverado.

Maybe it was a GMC Sierra.

And it was like, I don't know.

The trim level was like the the Black Widow Edition

and has like a fucking Black Widow spider emblem on the back.

Tailgate.

And I think you got like blacked out trim and like

I don't know who the fuck knows what it came with, right?

But just like, it's the spooky, scary spider edition.

Look the fuck out.

And it's just like, man, that is it's it's so cringy and lame.

Yeah, yeah.

You know what, I'm I'm I'm feeling like a badass today.

I'm going to get the spooky spider scary edition.

Yeah, hell yeah.

You see, look how manly I am.

I got it, you know, I'm glad it's got the the open up rear window

so I can stick my dick and balls through there because it's so big.

I got to have it in the bed as I drive.

And just which is usually not the case with those guys.

But yeah, yeah, the versus I can't I'm trying to remember what it was.

I want to say it was like the the Pajero Mini.

In Japan, they had like the Snoopy Edition.

Yeah, I had like it had like fucking Snoopy

and like a Snoopy logo on the Fenders.

I mean, that's a whole culture study, Snoopy in Japan, right?

That's right. It's such a interesting.

But I mean, just like stuff that's like more whimsical or that

or like like the Blackout Edition or the or then and then you have

the whole mod scene where you're going to be like, oh, yeah,

I'm going to make my truck bad ass.

And you just put like Chrome 28 on it, on your brodozer and huge

truck nuts and you just keep a chained pit bull in the bed.

So you're by you're definitely pro Harlequin Volkswagen then.

Harlequin Volkswagen, absolutely.

Yeah, Harlequin babies don't Google Harlequin babies.

But the Harlequin Volkswagen, the name of my emo band in middle school.

Exactly. Yeah.

Yeah. The the band, much like the babies, did not live long.

But yeah, I actually grew up, though.

Yeah, exactly cured.

It was at the Cure Cover Band.

But like I wonder if.

Like cars that are like fun and don't take themselves

and that doesn't mean like performance cars can't right.

But like you have like the the new Shelby,

like like whatever, dark horse murdered out

like black wheels and black trim.

And yeah. And and like like if you like it as an aesthetic,

I guess, but like we're supposed to be like, I don't know,

like the commercials back in the day would be like it comes

rolling out of the fog and like there's like a howling wolf

in the background and then like there's I don't know.

It's still my hurry and like like it's campy now.

So it's kind of cool, like looking back.

But just like like stuff that's marketed by an OEM

to be like intimidating or people that mod their their vehicle

to be like, my it's the most bad ass this in town

because I'm the most bad at like it's so if this dude says one

uncool thing about the Intimidator edition of the Monte Carlo.

I'm going to shut this fucking podcast down right now.

I mean, that's like if you think about it,

that's fucking sweet like it really was, even if it was not at the time.

Not at the time.

We have like checkered flags down the side and shit.

Yeah, it was pretty.

You let me introduce you to GM, my friend for the record.

That generation, Monte Carlo might be single handedly.

Here's a hot take.

And I think I've said this before.

It's not a hot take.

It might be my least favorite vehicle of all time.

That's not a hot take.

It's it's generally considered a piece of shit.

I mean, even like those have such a following.

No, in my mind, no, they're all dead.

They're all dead.

They've all rubed marble reds to their to their graves at this point.

Yeah. Yeah.

Or just didn't wear a Hans device, one of the two.

Yeah, I just into and maybe that's why I like I want to go get

a Suzuki cappuccino and I have a cave in and a fucking Suzuki Vitara.

And and like that's why I don't want like I love a Shelby GT 350.

It's got too much of the lookout bed as I am stigma to it,

whether it's deserved or not.

Like there it doesn't.

It's not like as bad as a spooky, scary spider edition motif.

But like it's got a little bit much of that for me.

It is. But like I don't know, it's just I'm so.

Dude, just sack up cowboy.

Don't be scared of them. I can't.

I don't have I don't have the I don't have the the the

I'm not packing enough heat, I suppose, for to live that life.

I ain't about that life.

I'm not. I hear you. I hear you.

Despite despite how it's intimidating, my my shirt might be.

I did. I love I love her.

I've been playing the Robocop Rogue City game.

They made a video game and it's so fucking true to the the source material.

You shoot people in the deck just like the the movie.

It's just like right here.

Yeah, that's it.

It's so it's it's so good.

Call me Murphy.

This was a shout out.

I'm not going to name drop because I don't know if if they want their

actual human name associated with Robocops shooting predators square in the junk.

But I listen or tip me off to the shirt.

They sent me a link for it.

So I went and bought it.

And so I figured I got to I got to where that's funny.

It's good stuff.

You know who you are.

And you know. So hat tip.

You know what you did.

Yeah, exactly. So any other hot takes, my friend?

I do. I do have one.

C seven Corvette cooler than C eight.

Boy, I'm yep.

I'm here for it.

Look, the numbers.

Look, I'm here to I'm here to contest numbers.

The C eight mid-engine Corvette makes all the sense.

Just putting the engine in the right place increased all the

the acceleration numbers, all that fun stuff, handling prowess, blah,

blah, fucking blah.

The last like ZR one C seven couldn't even fucking get traction for its life.

Oh, yeah, it was just not.

It was never gonna, which is no matter.

Yeah, which is fucking awesome.

But I think and I think I think it is a lot better looking.

I think the C eight isn't it was kind of cool to see him at first.

But now it's like, oh, oh, look at that. Wow.

Is that thing mid-engine? Wow.

Is that a Lambo? Yeah, it doesn't do it.

I think the C seven style looks fucking amazing.

When you see a nice, like, especially in like zero six guys,

the C seven's fucking gnarly looking.

It looks like a straight Corvette race car.

And I love it for that, right?

Like the crazy arrow.

They had like multiple arrow options you could buy with that car.

Yeah, like I'm thinking like as you're talking about this, I'm thinking about.

What is maybe my favorite?

Like I was not to guess.

Not to be the plate out, not to be the plate.

Well, sure. But like.

Yeah, I'm only I'm only watching this for the aesthetics.

But no, like I'm just watching a little bit.

Yeah, right. Yeah, it's it's it's a what do you call it?

When there's like you have like the shorter actor like standing ahead,

like you you play like an angles game.

So oh, so that's how you how you end up with like Tom Cruise playing Jack Reacher.

Yeah, it's like a force perspective.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's what I'm getting at.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's there's there's a whole thing there.

No, so my thought and not to do the plate out, rank the

because that's not that's not the sort of we're not a listicle podcast,

although we very well could be.

What do you think?

Like if you were to rank just purely on.

Looks alone.

What are you for?

I already wrote it in my notes.

I said they're still not as cool as the C4.

C4 is the coolest.

I think I'm sorry is the coolest.

And then see I and then C4.

I think it goes C4 C2 C4 C3.

Oh, early C3.

That's tough, though, because like I like C3 is only for a C5 has grown on me.

A C5 is zero six.

I think he put C7 above C5, though.

I'm on this. Oh, no, I'm saying.

Only looks.

Yeah, no, the C7 is cooler than the C5 only looks.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, only looks.

They look good.

They look. I think C2 is the best looking Corvette.

C6 is like my least favorite.

It's near the bottom.

Maybe it's close.

It's close with C8, though.

It's purely on aesthetics that C8 sounds like if you said,

hey, chat GPT, make me a mid-engine super super car

loosely related to the concept of a stingray.

Yeah. And that's what we get.

That's what would be spat out.

Look, like, again, though, if you catch a C7 in the wild,

which I'm actually I wrote this down because I just saw one,

they it looks short because it's so wide.

It's just something about the proportions of the C7.

I remember when they launched them, I got to drive one.

I drove one with like the Z51 package or whatever it is around the

Gunaseca and just out of the box, that car is incredibly good.

I don't need any more than that.

But I loved and it was the first time that I felt like I was in a decent interior

with everything like angle to the driver and the quality of materials.

I think C7 is like really probably the better package overall.

But my heart take is that I think it's a cooler car than the C8.

Plus Manuel. Yeah.

I mean, I'll know Manuel.

I mean, and I'm not just talking looks.

C8 Z06 is pretty rad.

As far as a machine, I've never driven one.

Um, like.

But as a Z06 coolness, seven is fucking nasty fast, too.

No, they are. They are.

And you can roll your own and the crazy arrow, like again, the carbon

fighter, carbon fiber arrow kit, like there were two different levels.

That crazy level was insane. Yeah.

Yeah, I don't have a cooler car, man. I'm going to say it.

Yeah, I'm curious production because it's funny

because I think like in my mind, like, oh, yeah, the C8 has been out a couple of years.

But in reality, it's been out, what, like seven years?

Yeah, it's been out a bit.

Yeah. I was going to say five.

Has it been seven?

Did it come out in 18?

Did it? I don't know.

I don't know. I'm not that guy.

I'm not. I feel like we should know this.

Like this is this should be our part of our deal.

Remember, remember, kids, we're we're we're experts in nothing.

Oh, absolutely. Absolutely nothing.

But no, I don't know.

C4 probably the coolest in my opinion.

I like how they look. I like the late model C4s, but it might be impartial.

C7 just looks right.

It looks right. Yeah.

Twenty twenty. Ah, so twenty twenty.

So it has been five years going on six.

Perfect.

Yeah, but it's basically, you know, a V8 Fiero, I suppose, right?

Because it's been.

Don't you take my Fiero away from me?

Yeah, out of my cold, dead hands.

Maybe maybe not a hot take, but just a complaint.

Oh.

And when you mentioned the C6, it made me really think about this

because they have this

and I hated it on that car.

And as time has marched on, more cars have implemented this

and I hate every single implementation of an electric

whether it's interior or exterior door handle.

Ah, if it's a button,

like some are really bad, like haptic or, you know, like the Tesla,

you got to wait for the fucking handle a little word out to grab it

and hope it doesn't go like, gotcha, bitch.

And like suck it back in and like leave your fingers off.

Any.

Any instance where open and door from the inside or the outside,

right, like kind of Tesla, you got to push the fucking button.

Same on the C6, right?

You had to push the button.

It's not a door handle.

Just give me a door handle with a cable.

That's all I want.

That's all I need.

It's never been an issue.

It's never been something, you know, unless it's like clapped out

and it's just like the handle's broken.

And guess what buttons break to.

They absolutely will.

Yeah, I cannot stand it.

Always is like this.

This feels so superfluous and stupid.

Why is this a thing?

I just I will never understand it.

And it's becoming more, more common and just like I just

save me the four dollars per vehicle

or whatever the savings would be to just have a cable.

Right. I just I will never understand that.

I'm with you on that one, man.

I got I got one quick modern shot to

modern modern car seats suck dick for the most part.

I'm not.

I think Volvo is probably the best in the game right now for modern car seats

that are absolutely supportive, comfortable, all the fun things.

I think in general, if you grab a base level car now, it is

across the board, I think we've all stepped towards sporty versus comfortable.

Yeah. Right.

And I think it's a cost thing.

And I think we've talked about on the show before.

But I don't know what it is, man.

I can't get comfortable in a modern like I'm not talking a very like

the XC 90, we have the inscription.

The seats are infinitely adjustable.

The like extra thigh support like you can't touch.

That's fine. That's perfect.

But if you get in, let's talk about centers again.

You get in a base model center right now.

The seats are hilariously bad and they're not they're not bad.

Like, you know how you can in the mid 90s, you could get kind of a buckety seat

with your corner box, but it would still be like comfortable.

Right. It's like that new center is like rock hard.

There's like a half inch of like dense foam.

Right. And that's what you get.

That is what you get.

And I just I don't know.

I get it's cheaper, but my hot take is modern seats suck.

Suck all the dick, dude.

They just suck.

Yeah, be better. Yeah, I just.

I feel like I have because I've sat in a lot of modern stuff.

And some of it's some of it seems like it's really good,

but I'd want to sit on it for like long, long.

That's when you find out and then really that's when you find out, you know,

because long dead are the days of, you know, the fleet would brome

tough did seat with buttons and and it's just a bit like

the sofa on wheels era is long dead.

Yeah, lazy boy.

The Bonneville with its like calculator pad of buttons

where you can adjust every little air bladder.

Yeah. And as you said, like, you know, some of the high end stuff,

right, your S classes of the world and stuff still have some nice seats.

Like, sure.

What was it the last Lincoln navigator that had like the mega adjustable seat

with like the butt crack in the middle?

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

And and just some crazy stuff like that.

But I haven't spent a whole lot of time in like bottom like entry level

newer stuff.

I mean, probably like a maybe a four or five year old four to escape

is one of the last kind of more entry level.

And the seats were trash on that.

Yeah, we're not. Oh, yeah.

So, yeah, I don't I don't know.

You think that would be one of the last places

things you would want to inshidificate would be certainly the front seat.

Maybe the back seats you can make those garbage because, you know,

fuck them kids. But like, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, it is interesting.

And because, yeah, like the 80s and 90s, you could get your,

you know, Oldsmobile Trofeo or like a more enter not a entry entry level.

No, but affordable.

Oldsmobile Ferenza or whatever, where it's got like it still has the squishy seats.

Yep. And they might have dog,

like absolute doctor quality powertrain, right?

That's both unreliable and weak and anemic.

But your ass was comfortable.

Yep. Or yeah, or you had like the, you know, your

you know, something like a base Celica where it's like, oh, it's sporty

and the seats good and even though you've got wheel covers and hand crank windows.

So. Yeah, I don't know.

I guess I just mourn the loss of inexpensive quality.

Anything. Yeah, true seat and and everything else attached to it.

Yeah, I agree with that.

Yeah. Cool. Well, I feel better.

I feel better for airing out that stuff.

Yeah, yeah, I think

what is the next time we do an automotive hot takes episode?

We we do the whatever that fucking show is with the hot wings hot ones.

And we just like put we actually eat spicy, like

spicier and spicier things as we get our points across to we're just like

weeping piles of goo and and and just chugging Pepto or whatever.

I'm into it.

I'd be squatting over a garbage candy the entire time.

But I'm down. I'm down.

Yeah, I mean, just to go down that track, that Hershey Highway, if you will.

I, you know, I used to really eat a lot of spicy.

I used like big spice.

Oh, not like not like Punisher level spicy, but just like, you know,

like, whatever, however many Scoville Scoville units, right?

Like an appropriate level of spice.

But now, because I'm an old man now, that's like one.

It's like roulette.

It's like one out of every every three times.

Like I will just immediately go like full prolapse and just I won't.

I won't be able to like, it'll be like six hours later.

I'll be like, oh, my tummy's rumbling.

Like it won't. It just won't. Oh, yeah.

And then the next time it'll be fine.

And like, there's no rhyme or reason.

Feel the bloom and onion, if you will.

Yeah, yeah, pretty much.

Yeah, it's just like like Predator's face, but like more pink.

I assume. I don't know.

I haven't it's been a while since I've, anyways.

Should we play a game?

I would say.

Yeah, should we should we play a game?

Yeah. And I think it's my turn to guess, right?

So it is as as Frank digs through his his library of tossed away

at car advertisements from the 80s, 90s or mid 2000s.

Let me describe a little game called the automotive print and quiz game show, guys.

So he's going to read through this advertisement, usually,

you know, from a periodical magazine, if you will, at the time.

He's going to read it at a third grade level.

He's going to try not to give away the make or model,

which is the most challenging part of this as the night goes on.

To be honest, I'm going to have to guess this vehicle.

I have three guesses.

If I fail at a guess, he will give me a hint.

It's poor. It's usually misleading.

It's a red heron. I don't know how it's going to say this.

It's a challenging game.

I'll have 10 minutes on the clock to figure out what vehicle he's talking about.

These ads are never factual, so that's part of the fun in this.

This one might be. I don't know. Let's see.

All right, Frank, roll that beautiful bean footage.

All righty.

So this is a one pager.

So I deserve just a it's pretty.

There's like there's I don't know.

There's like a small image of the car at the top.

There's just like like a very painted background.

It's just like a it looks like it's photoshopped in

sort of, you know, cloud cloud full sky.

We're looking at our favorite low down front drivers,

front three quarter angle shot.

Cars black color and then under it, it says

there is no joy in Studegart.

And then it's got some it's got some words under it.

Clearly a Porsche, but yeah, yeah, there is no joy in Studegart.

It debuted four years ago and promptly blew the later

hosin of its pricier to tonic rivals.

Now the blank is here with more luxury amenities than ever.

Yet it still starts under $30,000.

How do you say back to the drawing board in German?

Honestly, it's probably a single word.

OK, now we've got some specs here. OK. Revolutionary

one hundred and ninety horsepower all aluminum v six.

Speaking of seats, eight way power adjustable driver seat

and available seat and leather appointments.

Spacious cabin provides even more room than the Mercedes E four twenty.

Six speakers, two hundred watt Bose audio system with an in-dash

CD player and cassette driver and passenger driver, passenger

and front seat side impact airbags are standard equipment.

Ranked quote, the best entry level luxury car in initial

quality by JD Power and Associates.

There's two asterisks on that one.

Interested call one eight hundred four nine nine five nine zero zero

and you bet your ass going to call that one or visit our website.

www dot.com blank own one and you'll understand.

There is not a whole lot in the astresses other than blank,

blank, blank base model MSRP is twenty eight thousand nine

$9,900 excluding taxes licensed destination yada yada yada

Sir

Okay, what entry-level luxury car that is very anti-german?

That to a to a woody Guthrie like level right so right off the rip

We are talking a domestic or at least a Japanese because it's not it's not German not German

Decidely, so what was interesting is it talked about?

Obviously square shot at Porsche and then said her luxury features include and didn't get into performance it got into like oh

Luxury appointments, so I'm like a horse power

Yes, V6 or

Um, let me let me mention V6 or just a six-cylinder. It's I think I heard that six 190 horsepower

No displacement if I remember correctly a revolutionary 190 horsepower all aluminum V6, okay

All right the

Interesting entry-level luxury. Yeah, the best according to JD power

Hmm James Donald power just I need a kind of I thought I heard this but it said four year

It started four years ago. Yes, so this is four years into this this

I thought that was an interesting blur because most these ads we read they come out with an advertisement all new

It's a new model, right? So this is something that existed for a while

Four years anyways, right? But before they even thought to do this advertisement taking a shot at uh stuttgart

That's kind of interesting, right? It makes me feel like the sales weren't there and they were trying to bring some attention back to it

um

I have some feelings

I

190 190

V6

All aluminium

right, so

The uh immediately I thought like the es 300 from laxes

But that didn't make 190 at first. I don't think or ever. I don't think it did make 190. I think it was in the 180s

Um, so that rules that out

But I I do think I'm in the ballpark though. I think it's in the the japanese luxury which means it would either be infinity or

It's

I think it feels more like a infinity to tell you the truth versus I I don't I can't even think of an accurate product

With 190 horsepower v6

And I originally I was going to say early 90s, but it's got to be something that's been out for four years

So I have to factor that this is so weird. We don't usually see this

So I'm trying to do math. I'm like thinking of the year the ad which I think is in the early 90s

But then we're talking about it. But we're talking about a side impact airbags

Okay, that's kind of kind of interesting and you did say all aluminium

Yeah, and you can also potentially visit their website

Keep that maybe

Later 90s

Maybe I don't know, but it would have had to come out in the early 90s because four years, right?

Yeah, we're talking about it was not an angel fire

Website you're not a geosities if you are geosities. It did not like say like look us up on uh, ultra vista

Door count

Uh, I don't think it gave one didn't say so they could I could give you one if you needed

Well, well actually no, what did it say? Hold on

I can't remember if you said

Even more spacious cabin provides even more room than a Mercedes e4 20

Okay

Driver passenger front and side impact

It does not specifically say

I think I know what it is. It's not sporty though. That's my well, it didn't I don't know

I think I'm trying to read into the stoot guard thing

um

Let's go. Let's go with what I think it is

And it's because I know the horsepower on this engine. It's a three liter

It's uh, this is going to be a nine

Four years I have to do the math on the model came out. Well, let's just say it's a 98

8

Toyota Supra

BMW Z4

Lexus Lc

Porsche 911

Porsche Cayman

Nissan 240SX

Gmc Sierra

Chevrolet Silverado

Ford Dark Horse

Chevrolet Monte Carlo

Suzuki Cappuccino

Suzuki Vitara

Shelby GT350

Chevrolet Corvette

Pontiac Fiero

Volvo XC90

Lincoln Navigator

Toyota Celica

About this episode

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