TFL Car Chat Mar 17, 2026

Is The Toyota 4Runner Still The Benchmark Or Has It Lost Its Way? | Ep. 329

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63:25

Car

Toyota 4Runner TRD Pro

The Toyota 4Runner TRD Pro is a tough SUV made for driving off-road. The 2026 version has a special blue-green color and extra gear to help it handle rough terrain.

Car

The Jeep Wrangler is a type of SUV made for driving on rough roads and trails. It has special features that help it go off-road easily and can have its doors and roof taken off for an open-air experience.

Car

Ford Bronco

The Ford Bronco is a type of SUV made to drive on rough and uneven roads. It has features that help it go off-road and can have its doors and roof removed for an open-air feel.

Company

ARB

ARB is a company that makes special parts to help cars drive better off-road, like racks on the roof to carry gear.

Part

frame-mounted rock rails

Frame-mounted rock rails are strong bars on the side of a car that protect it from getting scratched or damaged when driving over rocks.

Part

rear skid plate covering the rear diff

A rear skid plate is a strong metal piece under the back of the car that stops rocks or bumps from hurting important parts.

Term

internal bypass shocks

Internal bypass shocks are special shock absorbers that adjust how they absorb bumps to make the ride smoother, especially on rough roads.

Part

Fox QS3 2.5 inch diameter aluminum shock absorbers with remote reservoirs

These Fox shocks are special parts that help the car's suspension absorb bumps better, especially when driving off-road, and they have extra tanks to keep them cool.

Term

tow package

A tow package is extra equipment on a car that helps it pull trailers or other heavy things safely. It includes things like a hitch and special wiring for trailer lights.

Term

upgraded suspension

Upgraded suspension means the parts that help the car absorb bumps and keep it steady are better than normal. This helps the car drive smoother or handle rough roads better.

Part

upper control arms

Upper control arms are parts that help the wheels move up and down smoothly while keeping them in the right position. They are important for safe and comfortable driving.

Part

Toyota Open Country AT3 tires

Toyota Open Country AT3 tires are special tires made to work well both on regular roads and off-road, like dirt or snow. They help the car drive safely in many places.

Term

hybrid

A hybrid car uses both gas and electricity to help it go. This helps save fuel and makes the car cleaner for the environment.

Term

horsepower

Horsepower tells you how strong a car's engine is. More horsepower usually means the car can go faster or pull heavier things.

Term

torque

Torque is the force that helps a car start moving or pull heavy things. More torque means the car can do these jobs better.

Concept

off-roading

Off-roading means driving a car on rough ground instead of smooth roads. Cars need special parts to do this well.

Car

Ford Bronco Raptor

The Ford Bronco Raptor is a special version of the Bronco that is made to drive really well off-road. It has a strong engine and big tires to help it go over rough ground.

Term

twin turbo

Twin turbo means the engine has two devices that push extra air into it, making the car more powerful and faster.

Term

37-inch tires

37-inch tires are very big tires that help a vehicle drive better on rough or rocky ground by making it higher off the ground.

Car

Jeep Wrangler 392

The Jeep Wrangler 392 is a special Jeep that has a very strong V8 engine. It can go off-road very well and is more powerful than regular Wranglers.

Term

locker

A locker is a part that makes sure both wheels on the same axle turn together, helping the car not get stuck when driving on rough ground.

Concept

on-road vs off-road performance trade-off

Cars made to drive on rough ground sometimes don't drive as nicely on normal roads. People have to decide what is more important to them.

Concept

hard top

A hard top is a solid roof on a car, not made of cloth. It keeps the car quieter and safer.

Concept

body-on-frame SUV

A body-on-frame SUV is made by putting the car's body on top of a strong frame, making it tougher and better for rough roads.

Car

Mercedes-Benz G-Class

The Mercedes-Benz G-Class is a fancy SUV that looks boxy and is very good at driving off-road. People like it because it is both tough and comfortable.

Concept

snow wheeling

Snow wheeling means driving a vehicle through snow, which can be tricky because the ground is slippery and hard to drive on.

Concept

torsional rigidity

Torsional rigidity is how stiff a car's frame is when it tries to twist, which helps it handle better and feel more solid.

Concept

frame flex

Frame flex is when the car's main structure bends a little bit when driving, which used to happen more in old cars.

Term

body flex

Body flex means the car's outer parts bend a little, which can make doors hard to open sometimes.

Term

bedliner

Bedliner is a tough coating sprayed inside truck beds to protect them from scratches and rust. It helps keep the truck bed in good shape when carrying heavy or rough items.

Company

Raptor liner

Raptor liner is a brand of spray that protects truck beds from scratches and damage. People use it to keep their trucks looking good and strong.

LIVE

[SPEAKER_00]: Tell me this has got to be the most expensive foreigner I've ever been in because of course this is a TRD Pro it's a 2026 and it's in this crazy wave maker turquoise turquoise is the color that's right so this is the new specialty TRD Pro color for 2026 definitely one of the bolts that I've ever seen yeah and the question that we're gonna try to answer in this [SPEAKER_00]: Would you get this over a Wrangler or a Bronco?

[SPEAKER_00]: Dare I say Tommy a Bronco Raptor?

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you're 5k away from that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we're not quite there, but we're definitely knocking on the door, and certainly you could get a very nice Wrangler Rubicon for $74,000.

[SPEAKER_02]: But what I want to do in today's off-road podcast off-road podcast number three Yeah, if I remember correctly as we're gonna do a walk around at this thing We're gonna get it out off-road and then later in the video case now I'm gonna go back into the studio talk about the news of the week and everything you need to know about the off-road world But dad let's do a quick walk around yeah of this wave maker You know, it's I mean we kind of hinted at the fact that this is a very expensive Car and I don't know what happened to Monroe any this is a center console there.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, thank you [SPEAKER_00]: That's good to know.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, so I've got them in a row and you're right here, Tommy.

[SPEAKER_00]: And this starts out at 67,000, 900, but as tested where it's 74,263.

[SPEAKER_00]: And that's because it's got gosh, $7,000 worth of options.

[SPEAKER_00]: And the wave maker color, guess how much?

[SPEAKER_02]: $6.95?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, you saw this already.

[SPEAKER_00]: But the most expensive option on here is the ARB RoofRack, $1,110.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, I think that's pretty cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's like a three-quarter length platform.

[SPEAKER_02]: So if you wanted to put a tent or all sorts of accessories up there, that certainly is a good option.

[SPEAKER_02]: This one also has the frame-mounted rock rails, what are those costs?

[SPEAKER_00]: Those are $990, Tommy.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it even has little things, like this one's got the wave maker overlay.

[SPEAKER_00]: There in the grill with the Toyota and the what's that run yet one eighty nine and also has the dash cam front integrated That's five hundred dollars will show you that one to go inside But when you get all this stuff up Also has a four hundred twenty five dollar rear skid play covering the rear diff So that is an addition to what normally you get on this vehicle so you're at seventy four thousand But you get a lot of goodies for that.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's start with the shocks [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so this is, of course, a tyranny pro version of the 400.

[SPEAKER_02]: So we get the Fox QS3 2.5 inch diameter aluminum shock absorbers with the remote reses in the back, you know, an expensive shock set up internal bypass, of course.

[SPEAKER_02]: And this is kind of the ultimate off-road 400.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this and the trail hunter kind of battling it out at the top for the most capability you can get.

[SPEAKER_00]: If you guys remember, we bought [SPEAKER_00]: Last year, actually, about this time, the foreigner came out, the TRD offroad, and I have to say, I've got a little bit of jealousy when it comes to this one, because this one is so much nicer.

[SPEAKER_00]: Now, you do have the tow package, but you also have all kinds of goodies on the inside, which we'll go through.

[SPEAKER_00]: But I do really think that if you're going to go for a runner, and if you've got the money, go for this one in Wavebreaker turquoise, because it's got a lot of cool stuff.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think it's Wavebreaker.

[SPEAKER_00]: Wavemaker.

[SPEAKER_02]: Wavemaker.

[SPEAKER_00]: I say breaker.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, there you go.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's Wavemaker.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, so look, it's a long history of these one-off colors from all of yours.

[SPEAKER_02]: So like, blue, blue, blue, they had the green.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think there was an orange one, but Wavemaker certainly kind of my favorite.

[SPEAKER_02]: I really like it a lot.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, I kind of like Wavebreaker better.

[SPEAKER_00]: I just feel a little bit more, a little bit more like, you know, manly, I break waves instead of I make waves.

[SPEAKER_02]: So some of the things we need to talk about, we do of course have the upgraded suspension, we also have those beautiful red upper control arms, which is cool, 18-inch wheels, three peaks, snow rated by the way.

[SPEAKER_02]: These are the Toyota Open Country AT3s, it's about a 33-inch tall tire.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, let me open up the hood to start there because you can get your four-runner in two flavors, same engine, but two flavors.

[SPEAKER_00]: There is a non-hybrid which we had and then there is this hybrid.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think all TRD pros are hybrid.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, that's right.

[SPEAKER_02]: So 326 horsepower, 465 pound feet of torque, but the best part.

[SPEAKER_02]: I gotta tell you, let's get the camera.

[SPEAKER_02]: I got you.

[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, they don't give you struts.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, hold it up for you.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is the cold air intake.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look at this.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is, well, medium cold air intake, I should say.

[SPEAKER_02]: What's cool about it, TRD, you got these red intake pipes, even has the red intake horned down there.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, I was reading that this is a change for 26-mollier, the fronter has more sound ending material throughout.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but isn't there supposed to be like an air intake right here that then is through by this hood scoop?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, not very functional there.

[SPEAKER_00]: because we know that the air comes in over here.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's just a light scoop.

[SPEAKER_02]: It should be over here.

[SPEAKER_02]: I know.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, in the front of this, you do have the rigid industry lights here, the Toyota LED light there.

[SPEAKER_00]: And Joe, my favorite part, yeah, right there.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's good play, that's the STRD Pro and it's got us.

[SPEAKER_02]: Pretty cool, no, I mean, I think it's a good looking attractive vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: Of course, based on the TNJF architecture along with, [SPEAKER_02]: I think every now Toyota Inlex's body on frame vehicle is TNGF to some variation of that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now compared to regular Bronco, you can get a regular on 35s, you get a Bronco on 35s or 37s, so Toyota is definitely a little bit small on tire size.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well you know, Toyota has always been more concerned with fuel economy.

[SPEAKER_00]: You know, that's why we have every two of the now comes almost every two of the comes in a hybrid model and you start putting 35s and 37s on and it's just going to it's going to freak the total engineers out Tommy because fuel economy will go out the window by the way, this one is 23 combined.

[SPEAKER_00]: And people are already doing that so they may be freaked out but they're doing it one way or another.

[SPEAKER_00]: You want to show them the inside?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's really nice on the inside.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, I think that this is certainly an area that Toyota does shy especially over the Bronco into your quality fit and finish.

[SPEAKER_02]: The pro gets a lot of red accents, so here across a dash, red contrast stitching.

[SPEAKER_02]: These unique seats that have these kind of camo finishing them, although [SPEAKER_02]: If I pop up in the back here, it doesn't have the shock absorbers, like you'd find in a Tacoma theory pro.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, and forgive us for having all of our stuff, I do think it's fair to mention that Toyota flew us out here to California, we're at a place we're in a off road park called Dov something.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think it's the Mojave Desert, and we're on a way to Mammoth because Turtle let us this go ski and surf Tommy, so we'll first go take this to ski and then we're going to go back to LA and go surf.

[SPEAKER_00]: How crazy is that?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, pretty cool.

[SPEAKER_00]: You want to show them the other kind of fun goodies on the driver side because there are some goodies, there's some hidden Easter eggs.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so this one's got some accessories on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's got the little camping lantern.

[SPEAKER_02]: So if I twist here in the dash, pull out, has a little hook on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is actually an integrated lantern that's kind of fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then it also has the JBL speaker in the dash.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this is, they're going after the camping crowd with this pop that out, listen to your tunes.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then up here, we're going to find your built-in dash cam, which keeps going off every time we hit a little bump [SPEAKER_02]: So, there's your button for LED light bar, four auxiliary switches, your four wheel drive selected down here, two wheel drive, four wheel drive, high and low, rear lockers, stabilize a bar disconnect, a tow mode, and it does have quite handling and integrated brake controller.

[SPEAKER_00]: And it is missing a front locker, if you're, it is.

[SPEAKER_00]: If you're comparing it to a Bronco or a Wrangler, and that's kind of a head scratcher.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's 74,000.

[SPEAKER_00]: Look, you can get the LX with that's triple lock, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: The Lexus, the Toyota is in the Toyota Land Cruiser isn't triple lock, but the one that we have at the office right now is actually 70,000, and it does have, unlike this one, a heads up display and a cool box, Tommy.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, let's do this to that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna grab our in and out cups.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, you forgot to show them the coolest part.

[SPEAKER_00]: Let's the coolest part.

[SPEAKER_00]: What's your got there?

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, I gotta show you this.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, all the foreigner fans are freaking out because you didn't show them the thing that they all love.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, I think by 1984 to today, most people would probably know this by now.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, Windows still goes down.

[SPEAKER_00]: Four or two years old, that.

[SPEAKER_00]: I know, but this is, this is, I like it.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you don't have to actually open up this rear.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll just do it this way.

[SPEAKER_00]: You don't have to open up this rear if you don't want.

[SPEAKER_00]: I also like that we have got the toe package and a brake controller.

[SPEAKER_00]: Now there is a little bit less room back here because this is where the battery lives and there's a little cubby compartment over here that you can pull out but because I got my skis in here and all of our bags it's hard to put back and you can't get the rear seat on this TOT PRO Canyon.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, no third row option.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well let's see this tag close it up and we got to go take them for a little spin.

[SPEAKER_00]: Can you throw them together?

[SPEAKER_02]: No, you drive.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: Here you take the key then.

[SPEAKER_02]: Just stay full cup.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's right here and just need a little bit of help, please You know it's funny.

[SPEAKER_00]: We still haven't we still coming in and out only coming California even though it And out is now in Colorado.

[SPEAKER_02]: That feels right though when you're in the sun So let's talk about this tech here 14 inch display [SPEAKER_02]: Pretty big old screen, even have the digital review mirror.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's your hate, and I like it.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it always gives me headaches as the digital review mirrors.

[SPEAKER_00]: Dual temperature zones, cooled and heated seats.

[SPEAKER_00]: Nice, heated steering wheel.

[SPEAKER_00]: Nice.

[SPEAKER_00]: All kinds of Toyota safety sense, whatever point, oh, we're at now.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you get three.

[SPEAKER_00]: So you do have like Lane Key from Lane Centering, which is, we just used to driving up here.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's okay.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's still prehistoric compared to like the, [SPEAKER_00]: Tesla FSB supervised full-cell driving supervised that we have where it elected drive you.

[SPEAKER_02]: So go through the gates there and we'll do the little hill climb we did earlier.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, hop on out.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because we're not at a usual or for a test course in Colorado, we got to improv out a little.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I do want to show the fine folks how this thing does.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm going to help them do windows because it's so nice.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's really nice.

[SPEAKER_02]: So we've got this thing in foreloat, we've got multi-terrain select [SPEAKER_02]: You know, you're your off-road adventures.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it doesn't have a front locker, but multi-terrain Selecting crop control will get you most places you need to go.

[SPEAKER_00]: So a good thing and yeah, good thing It's just come on we're off road.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's gonna be a little why I'm a baby.

[SPEAKER_00]: So a good thing and I bet I'll start with the good thing We've been we've been doing kind of off-roading out here just trying it out and what we have found is that these [SPEAKER_00]: dips go from two high to four high to four low very easily.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, the transfer case, sorry, in the past it's always been a little like you had a drive at a little bit.

[SPEAKER_00]: It was always kind of hit and miss, now it seems we're working much better.

[SPEAKER_00]: The misses, if you leave your door cracked open and you try to move the car like to park it.

[SPEAKER_00]: The parking brake stays on and the car doesn't go anywhere.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's really annoying in some ways All right, I'm gonna hop out here.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'm gonna go up to sell.

[SPEAKER_00]: What's that?

[SPEAKER_02]: We got to give us some kind of dramatic name.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's YouTube Oh, the sill yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: We're gonna call it the sandy null of death.

[SPEAKER_02]: I didn't fall out the wave breaker [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's actually a good name.

[SPEAKER_02]: See, thank you.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, do you want to talk or should I talk?

[SPEAKER_02]: You can talk.

[SPEAKER_00]: All right, I'll show you.

[SPEAKER_00]: Hey, what I'll do tell me is, just so you know, I'll go up this and then I'll go over that crack and you can actually see the articulation.

[SPEAKER_02]: Sure, all right.

[SPEAKER_02]: So here in the standing null of death, a breaker, we've got this kind of crack here in the earth, which splits apart here and then it grows.

[SPEAKER_02]: to this gully here, that my dad's gonna try to traverse.

[SPEAKER_02]: And if our tire's not big enough, we're gonna dig that front skim plate into the earth.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it looks totally flat on camera, but it's pretty steep in person.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, here comes that blue runner.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, it does look cool out on the trail.

[SPEAKER_02]: I really like that color a lot.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's just nice having actual colors in 2026.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, that looks really good.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that right front's gonna dip down into this gully.

[SPEAKER_02]: Nice and slow, a little bit driver.

[SPEAKER_02]: Nice.

[SPEAKER_02]: We're gonna quick look at that ground clearance.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of kind of a lot.

[SPEAKER_02]: A harder driver, harder driver.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, stop.

[SPEAKER_02]: We're falling into the whole way, you know.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, gotta go more, more driver.

[SPEAKER_00]: There we go.

[SPEAKER_00]: There you go.

[SPEAKER_00]: I've been off road a few times.

[SPEAKER_02]: Nice.

[SPEAKER_02]: So we even fully air it up because here in California we don't have any of our air down gear It still holds up pretty well and get through where we need to go You know it's really tight over there.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think you'll have to take this other path Sure, I'm gonna have to go I don't want to fall in the sandy hole of death or whatever you call it It's sandy noils.

[SPEAKER_00]: I said you know all of death.

[SPEAKER_00]: Sorry.

[SPEAKER_00]: I'll just go this way You go and we'll go around here So we don't scratch up to this brand new This is brand new.

[SPEAKER_00]: We've got a hundred and fifty six miles on it [SPEAKER_02]: We picked it up at 21 miles, so I know I'm being a bit of dramatic about this ride quality, but it is very firm.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, that's always been the thing about the foreigner, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: It's always been a whole choppy.

[SPEAKER_02]: A little choppy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, a little choppy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, for sure, you want to go through that.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's our little gate there, and that'll take us back down to the main road here.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this isn't just a little open area that is available here in California at the road users.

[SPEAKER_02]: So if you're out here and you want to have some of fun exploring, you can do that.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's [SPEAKER_00]: If you can turn off these parking sensors, you can.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, because I'm sure it's somewhat rare.

[SPEAKER_00]: It gets in the center, you know, but it's always a...

[SPEAKER_00]: Pretty sure I wish they'd just had an off.

[SPEAKER_00]: But it's always an adventure to get to.

[SPEAKER_00]: I mean, hammer.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't really have to stop.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, boy.

[SPEAKER_00]: This is the problem.

[SPEAKER_00]: You can't see over the hood, so you have to use the camera with the problem with the camera, so it doesn't show you any depth.

[SPEAKER_00]: I think we can also just make the front bigger.

[SPEAKER_00]: There we go.

[SPEAKER_00]: Doesn't help.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, that kind of helps a little.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that your fake hood scoop there is so big.

[SPEAKER_02]: It just eats away at the Ford visibility.

[SPEAKER_00]: It certainly does.

[SPEAKER_00]: But yeah, you're right, this ride's a little, and I think we've got our flavor disconnected, actually.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do we?

[SPEAKER_00]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it reconnected.

[SPEAKER_00]: You think it reconnected?

[SPEAKER_00]: No, which way?

[SPEAKER_02]: That would have been good to our sanding null of death that would have helped us out.

[SPEAKER_02]: Back to the road, and then we're going to go left.

[SPEAKER_02]: OK. Yeah, and we'll finish it up in the...

[SPEAKER_02]: the trail head down the street.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think that they've done a lot right with this car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean it's the right size.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's got the right clearances and it's got the right tires.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that'll get you most of the way where you need to go.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that the back seats a little bit compromised for carrying passengers, anything bigger than little kids.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that the price is kind of outrageous.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, but everything's outrageous these days taught me, so they just dropped the price on the Bronco Raptor, so it was 90, it's now down to 80, and you do get a six cylinder there and you do get a twin turbo and you do get obviously a convertible.

[SPEAKER_00]: Well, 37's.

[SPEAKER_00]: And you get 37's with front lacquer, so for five came more.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is that really only 80?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think they went from 90 to drop to 10k and then of course the Jeep 392's coming out the willies and that's going to start at 6999570 so you're at 70 so you could get yourself the willies and won't have a hard top but just have a soft top let me put this in it's so far high [SPEAKER_00]: Let's see if your test is right about how easy this switch is for high and click and there we are Nice, you know jump to it.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's usually the locker.

[SPEAKER_00]: That's the problem though.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, this is also a bit in this you I remember when Andre and I first drove the a new Tundra we had a hell of a time getting it from four load of four High so that would drive like a quarter mile that little beep is the dash cam thinking he got into a minor accident [SPEAKER_02]: I think it does, yes, so it's going to have a lot of really boring clips of off-roading By the time we're back with this, but no, I mean, I think that the certainly the design is here It's a very cool looking vehicle, the capability, it's definitely there You know, when you get this back to Colorado, we'll really put it through the test But we've driven foreigners off-road, we've taken them to some pretty extreme places And they do continue to just come back for more

[SPEAKER_00]: But the bottom line that we have to question, would you get a Bronco or a Wrangler?

[SPEAKER_00]: And the answer is pretty straightforward.

[SPEAKER_00]: It depends.

[SPEAKER_00]: Do you want to get a vehicle for how you use it?

[SPEAKER_00]: Most of the time, or how you use it some of the time, because the issue with both the Wrangler and the Bronco is that they're very compromised, especially the Wrangler when it comes to on-street performance, whereas this is very comfortable, ish, on-street, so this doesn't make that many compromises.

[SPEAKER_00]: for off-roading because you have this hard top right that doesn't whistle squeal or do any strangeness you have a relatively comfortable seating position unlike the Wrangler where your face is up against the glass you have you know real lumbar support and the Bronco kind of cuts the difference between the two of them if this is the most on-road or the with a lot of off-road capability and the Wrangler is incredibly off-road worthy with kind of if the [SPEAKER_00]: on-road capabilities, the Broncos kind of splits the difference.

[SPEAKER_00]: It's kind of in between there.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it's livable on-road and it's very good off-road.

[SPEAKER_00]: So it really depends on, you know, do you buy vehicle for what you are going to use it for or what you think you're going to use it for or do you know exactly what you're going to use it for?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I think that's a good analysis.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look, I think that the, I really hope that brings color into the normal for a lineup because it is so cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's really the big change for 26.

[SPEAKER_02]: Although I was reading, they did add, we can just park it here then.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, they don't want to go down these little things.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's shooting like it's a, you might get some pin striping.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was reading, they did add the availability of the stability bar disconnect to more vehicles for 26, which is cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: So yeah, they've done some nice improvements there.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, I don't think I don't love his engine note.

[SPEAKER_00]: No, it sounds like rocks in the blender.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, it's not great, but there's tons of torque and there's, you know, great power.

[SPEAKER_00]: So, you know, it doesn't sound great, you never feel like you're lacking any.

[SPEAKER_00]: But, on the plus side of the hybrid, you do get 24-hours of power for your camping, and that's huge.

[SPEAKER_00]: And I think, Tommy, this is, of course, the most expensive version of the pro you can get, especially with this paint job.

[SPEAKER_00]: And there will be people who will be clamoring to get one of these [SPEAKER_00]: or an RTRD pro off-road, right?

[SPEAKER_00]: Just here, any pros?

[SPEAKER_00]: I know.

[SPEAKER_02]: Cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, that's all we got to say about that one.

[SPEAKER_00]: Oh, there's a lot of electricity here, I can hear.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah, that's why I got stuck talking.

[SPEAKER_00]: Just like I heard this like the crinkle of the power going through the power lines and I was like, where the hell did I stop?

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So guys, let us know what you think.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is this a better option than the Ford or the Jeep?

[SPEAKER_02]: And now we're going to cut to the studio and we're going to bring you some news.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, we're back in the studio after talking about some Toyota's, and now we're going to definitely not talk about Toyota's because our first segment is news of the week.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now, this came out a little while ago, but I think it's very important we talked about.

[SPEAKER_02]: But apparently Lincoln is working on a body-on frame SUV to compete with the G-Class.

[SPEAKER_02]: which is crazy.

[SPEAKER_01]: So what do you think of that case?

[SPEAKER_01]: It would be interesting to see what they do if they base it off of the Bronco, which would kind of make sense because that's obviously a very capable platform.

[SPEAKER_01]: But the Bronco doesn't really lend itself very well to being refined and Lincoln has to be refined.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'd be surprised if they do an entire bespoke platform for that vehicle.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if not the Bronco, then what do you base it on?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know it's interesting.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this is a current auto week, apparently it's supposed to launch in 2029 or 2030.

[SPEAKER_02]: But this is a really interesting topic because I remember reading something while back that it was reported outie maybe working on a G-Wagon competitor based on the scout platform.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think that Mercedes has had that segment of kind of the ultra luxury, but also very capable for we'll drive to itself for a long time.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it seems like everyone's trying to compete with a G-Wagon now.

[SPEAKER_01]: And even Mercedes themselves, they're bringing out a what's being referred to as a baby, G-Wagon.

[SPEAKER_01]: So there's been camouflage prototypes of the smaller, very boxy rugged Mercedes.

[SPEAKER_01]: SUV that already land rover has a prototype, they've been testing, that seems to be targeting the yet to be released, baby G wagon, that a lot of people are thinking is going to be on the defender brand and might be called the defender sport.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, I mean it's an interesting topic, but I think what's key about this and what Lincoln has to get right Same thing without ease if they actually want to compete with the G they have to make it a genuine for wheel drive right for sure It can't just be another navigator.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's got to be something it can't even be a navigator tremor It's got to be something I think that that's got not only the look [SPEAKER_02]: but the potential to be awesome out in the dirt.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because that's the apology wagon.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, technically no one will ever see the dirt in it, but it's knowledge that like it's got all of the things you need.

[SPEAKER_02]: So when the apocalypse comes, you can look cool wearing your red bottomed heels.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I'm saying?

[SPEAKER_01]: Sort of.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I agree that I think it's a key part of the G wagon that it has those three buttons in the center of the dash.

[SPEAKER_01]: The center locker, the front locker and the rear locker.

[SPEAKER_01]: are all an important part of the DNA of that vehicle, even if they put it on what looked like auto cross tires.

[SPEAKER_01]: Funny enough, even the G5AB with EQ technology, in other words, the electric G-wagon, that Tommy and I tested, we did a slip test on that, took it through our trenches.

[SPEAKER_01]: And that was our joke, is that the tires that G-wagon came on from the factory looked like auto cross tires.

[SPEAKER_01]: They looked like performance, summer tires.

[SPEAKER_01]: which doesn't necessarily not make any sense because it does have a lot of power.

[SPEAKER_01]: But when we tested it on this lip test, even the electric G-Wagon with its mechanical low range for each of the four electric motors did shockingly well.

[SPEAKER_01]: It doesn't have a lot of clearance, it doesn't have the right tires, it doesn't have the most amount of articulation.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it has a pretty fantastic formal drive system, maybe the best formal drive system we've tested in any EV, just not paired up to tires and ground clearance that let you do anything with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it is a fundamental part of the G-Wagon to have that DNA.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I agree that if Lincoln's actually going to successfully target the G-Wagon, it has to be [SPEAKER_01]: It has to be capable in some sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: What do you think Bronco is the leather on the dash for that work?

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe in the late 90s, but not today.

[SPEAKER_01]: I just don't know how you're going to adapt the Bronco platform into a luxury vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, it would be tough because fundamentally when the top comes off, it does create a compromise experience, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Because you end up with a lot of movable panels that are hard to weather seal and hard to noise, noise proof, and it is challenged.

[SPEAKER_01]: And if you make a hard top only Lincoln version of the Bronco, [SPEAKER_01]: then it might be hard to justify why why spend more money on that when it has one less feature that I think brings a lot of people into the Bronco the room will top I think that's an important feature yeah I mean I think that [SPEAKER_02]: There is potential in that Bronco platform that is undiscovered.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just think that it's going to take a substantial amount of reengineering.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that the basic ladder frame with the front and rear lockers and even the power trains, I think if they launched that thing with the three-liter twin turbo, a standard, if you're going to compete on that level, it's got to be a very powerful unit.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then I think if they do make it a hard top and they make it look substantially different and they make it actually nice inside, there is a potential there.

[SPEAKER_02]: How about this?

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's hear your thinking.

[SPEAKER_01]: If they want to sell a lot of them, even though the power figures might not be the headline, if they put the coyote V8, which they want to.

[SPEAKER_01]: But if they put the coyote V8 into a Lincoln version of a Bronco, [SPEAKER_01]: that would make people buy.

[SPEAKER_01]: That'd be cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you could make the interior nicer.

[SPEAKER_01]: You could try and make the sound editing better.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe soften up the suspension a little bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's, you know, not such a cabbage card.

[SPEAKER_01]: What would you call it?

[SPEAKER_01]: What's like a fancy horse?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, I should know this.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is your mom and horse stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it does do horse stuff.

[SPEAKER_02]: Cole, what's the name of a fancy horse?

[SPEAKER_01]: Cold doesn't now.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, [SPEAKER_02]: All right, next piece of news I want to talk about has to do with the Super Duty lineup.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're expanding the tremor name, which is kind of their off-road spec of Super Duty to other products within the Super Duty lineup.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you want to explain that?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so as with any truck configurator and all of the possibilities, it is somewhat complicated, but in its simplest form, [SPEAKER_01]: What Ford is doing is they're going to make it so that you could get the tremor package on basically any trim of superduty truck from XL all the way up to platinum.

[SPEAKER_01]: So you can get a more basic tremor.

[SPEAKER_01]: You can also get a long bed tremor truck with you.

[SPEAKER_01]: Couldn't do in the past.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, you know, earlier Andre and I were talking about this, he brought up a good point.

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe if you have a sizable camper, but you still want to be able to navigate some rough roads and a long bed tremor might make sense.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tremor package for most people are probably familiar, but it gives you 35s, slightly taller suspension, rear locker, limited slip diff in the front, some underbody protection, and slightly better shocks.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the other update that they're doing.

[SPEAKER_01]: So for a long time, they've had the Excel Off-Road, which is a very basic truck that gives you 33s and a rear locker.

[SPEAKER_01]: And you can't option it with a winch and everything from the factory.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the Excel Off-Road is pretty simple, pretty basic.

[SPEAKER_01]: But now, they're also offering on the Excel trim.

[SPEAKER_01]: And XL off road 35.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's basically an unbranded tremor package because one of the caviots with a tremor package, it is.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the caviots with a tremor package is that you can only get it on crewcabs.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you want a more capable single cab truck, something super basic and you would get XL off road with 35s, which is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which is basically a drummer.

[SPEAKER_02]: Is that that?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's in XL off-road with 35s.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's got the 35s front lock or rear locker front limited slip.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, makes sense.

[SPEAKER_02]: Nothing rolls off the tongue like Ford F250 XL off-road 35s.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, I mean, my only issue with this, I think it's great that they're expanding like that capability across lineup.

[SPEAKER_02]: And to your point, like it looks like anything from XL through like, could you get a King Ranch drummer?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I mean, to my knowledge of the configurator has gone live yet, so we haven't actually had the chance.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think by the time this podcast goes live, the configurator will be live, but my understanding you can get in Excel.

[SPEAKER_01]: upward with a tremor package from this point on, it has to be a group cap though.

[SPEAKER_02]: So the only issue I have with that, Cole, if you could go back to that previous picture, we had an STX tremor, which is kind of like a more entry-level truck-ish, nicer than the off-road.

[SPEAKER_02]: There it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that one is then a tremor.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Thank you.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can see it on the back.

[SPEAKER_02]: but they are deluding the brand a little bit because one of the things that made the tremor cool is it was very distinguishable as a tremor.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like when it launched in the F-150 you remember and I think maybe 255 did had the orange tow hooks, had these very special graphics.

[SPEAKER_02]: This STX just looks like any other STX with a little tremor thing on the rear quarter.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it kind of feels like they're making the tremor the new FX4 in some ways.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know, is that fair to say it could be, but it comes with a lot more content because you do get them and let it slip different the front 35 inch tires rear locker, which that alone makes it genuinely pretty capable.

[SPEAKER_02]: So the capability is is still there and you can get it like it sounds like diesel and gassers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, for sure, the only way you can get in XL with a tremor is if you get the STX package that makes it a little nicer.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you used to.

[SPEAKER_01]: So the tremor trucks are always going to be a little bit nicer.

[SPEAKER_01]: They now have a more entry level tremor, but if you want a really basic truck with off-road features, you do one of the XL off-road packages.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, no, it's an interesting discussion.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I think that we're seeing across all of the sizes of trucks, people want to be able to buy more capable machine.

[SPEAKER_02]: The Ford still doesn't have quite the same level of capability that Ram is though offering the power wagon.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, the new diesel power wagon, which is exciting, you can spec with a front locker, the diesel power wagon cannot be specced with a factory winch, which is a little bit of a difference.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, on the Ford trucks, you can't spec a winch, we even had, I think we had at one point.

[SPEAKER_01]: You remember that red platinum plus that we towed the Model T out to Moab with?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, I think that had a winch.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that was a high output.

[SPEAKER_01]: That was easy on everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: So pretty impressive packaging that they were able to do all that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, very, very interesting.

[SPEAKER_02]: OK, so that's kind of the only news, I think, of the week this week, not a really big week.

[SPEAKER_02]: There is one new story.

[SPEAKER_02]: I guess, Jeep fixed the Wrangler.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it was stop rolling over when the insurance is too for Highway Safety's version.

[SPEAKER_02]: Small overlap.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, is that what it was?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think that was the test where they were rolling over and granted that is one of if not the hardest.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: You said they modified the frame a little bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, they made some updates to frame rails.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I guess it doesn't flip over anymore.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that's a good thing.

[SPEAKER_01]: Good news.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's always good news.

[SPEAKER_01]: It used to be back in the day that if you even used the brakes on a four by four, they would flip over.

[SPEAKER_02]: So that's a great segment to our latest purchase.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's actually not a purchase.

[SPEAKER_02]: So a gift.

[SPEAKER_02]: Here's a story.

[SPEAKER_02]: We've been renting a storage unit from Andre's Okel.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, for the last few years, now, actually a bunch of years.

[SPEAKER_02]: And there was a bit of a situation in honor that Uncle has to stay, where he's out right now.

[SPEAKER_02]: So he has no use for this 1995 as Susie Rodio anymore.

[SPEAKER_02]: But we pre-paid a bunch of rent.

[SPEAKER_02]: So he's trying to sell his place.

[SPEAKER_02]: So an exchange for the rent.

[SPEAKER_02]: He's giving us this 1995 Susie Rodio.

[SPEAKER_02]: And now this is the first generation rodeo.

[SPEAKER_01]: It is.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: And admittedly, it's not in the greatest condition.

[SPEAKER_01]: It leaks a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: It makes a lot of noises, especially the top end of its V6 makes a lot of noises, but it's a five-speed manual, four-wheel drive, with a low range.

[SPEAKER_01]: So it's a pretty neat vehicle.

[SPEAKER_01]: The funny thing about these is that apparently back in the day, if you slammed on the brakes in the rain, [SPEAKER_01]: Supposedly they would pretty much immediately go sideways and flip over.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I'm going to air drop you a picture Cool now what I love about this machine is this is The video is pretty popular.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's because that this is kind of in that That that space now where they were really really really really popular back in the day and then people have just forgotten they've existed, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: So this is, I think the series that we're working on is a little bit nostalgic for a lot of people, because a lot of people had these rodeos, they were very, very popular, and then be it just age or rust or mechanical issues.

[SPEAKER_02]: They've all kind of just disappeared off the road.

[SPEAKER_02]: I can't remember the last time I've seen one, especially a first generation rodeo.

[SPEAKER_02]: So when we put out the video, there's a bunch of people that had stories to tell us, we sent us emails about rodeos.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now our first email from our friend Sam Sam is actually an engineer.

[SPEAKER_02]: He's also in the industry.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you listen to last week, CarPodcast Sam talked about his experience.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sorry, call my air drop is saying that you're, you're, you're, oh, here we go.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's coming to you.

[SPEAKER_02]: So Sam back in the day was an engineer with general motors.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he actually was one of the [SPEAKER_02]: Here's an image of him developing the ABS system.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not going super well.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because the car is on its side.

[SPEAKER_02]: So here's what Sam said.

[SPEAKER_02]: You bought a rodeo, please be careful with that thing because it will roll over if you look at it funny.

[SPEAKER_02]: Back in the 90s, these things were sold in multiple badges including rodeo, Amigo, which was a two-door rodeo.

[SPEAKER_02]: Honda Passport and the Voxel and Opel Frontera.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so that's what we have a picture of right there.

[SPEAKER_02]: He said, I sadly got to spend way too much time with these things as an engineer because we had a contract to put together the Kelsey Hayes ABS system.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was working on the Opalvoxel variant.

[SPEAKER_02]: Others used a Denzo ABS in the span of two years.

[SPEAKER_02]: We had more roleovers with these things than anything else we ever worked on, including one that nearly killed a co-worker while testing in Japan.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was a close as they ever came to a roleover while testing at the Chelsea Preven Grounds.

[SPEAKER_02]: I've got multiple photos from an incident in Northern Sweden in January, 93.

[SPEAKER_02]: He's simply lifting out the accelerator without ever touching the brakes and a slippery surface when send these things into a spin.

[SPEAKER_02]: They are among the worst vehicles I've ever heard of, so not a glowing review.

[SPEAKER_01]: In a way...

[SPEAKER_01]: Andre's uncle did us a favor in a way we may have done my favor.

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't know which it is.

[SPEAKER_01]: But what do you think about this thing?

[SPEAKER_01]: You've driven it a little bit.

[SPEAKER_01]: I have it's neat, especially for the price, which is essentially nil.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think that we should tell me like this idea too.

[SPEAKER_01]: I think we should try to drive it on two wheels.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you not just read the email we got about them rolling over really?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, clearly they tip very easily, which means it wouldn't be difficult to get it onto wheels.

[SPEAKER_02]: All right, all right, but I do have to say regardless of the role of the thing which granted might be a big problem.

[SPEAKER_02]: I do love the rodeo because this whole era of 90s Japanese four wheel drives.

[SPEAKER_02]: This was such a good era of vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: They were really well made.

[SPEAKER_02]: They are [SPEAKER_02]: very simple to drive and operate.

[SPEAKER_02]: They feel like the last forever, and they're shockingly capable, just because they're so much smaller than the modern stuff.

[SPEAKER_01]: Exactly, that's the key thing is they're compact in their light.

[SPEAKER_01]: And this class of vehicle in this day and age doesn't really exist anymore, because there are a lot of, [SPEAKER_01]: rugged if you want to call it that crossovers, but none of them have low ranges, almost none of them have low ranges, and most of them are all wheel drive instead of a traditional four wheel drive system, so they don't, they don't really have the same underpinnings.

[SPEAKER_01]: So if you want a more traditional four by four with that, [SPEAKER_01]: kind of hardware.

[SPEAKER_01]: You got to step into something like a full-size Bronco or a Wrangler.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's essentially a bigger, more expensive vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: So we got another email I want to read from a gentleman named Dan, and he starts off by saying a thousand years ago, I started my career as an Asuzu Tech at a dealer.

[SPEAKER_02]: The first jet rodeo was designed and built when GM owned a large percentage of Asuzu, but very few parts were sourced from GM.

[SPEAKER_02]: As soon as we tried really hard, but just didn't have the R&D budget develop two new V6 engines.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it goes on to talk about R3.2 liter, which has a pretty nasty kick in it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It does.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is very loud and not in the right way.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, Dango's on to say, the single cam 3.2 liter V6 was really close to being as good as something like the 3.4.2 liter V6.

[SPEAKER_02]: And people who did frequent synthetic oil changes had almost no problems with them.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, then he goes on to say there were a couple different major issues with them, um, specifically related to ticks.

[SPEAKER_02]: First was a tiny belt tensioner, um, and the second was the ticking noise from the valve train.

[SPEAKER_02]: Uh, the design of the valve train is cylinder head would be awesome if they were reliable.

[SPEAKER_02]: They copied some things Honda were doing, but it also worked like the inside of a piano.

[SPEAKER_02]: There are two hollow steel shafts bolted to the cylinder head.

[SPEAKER_02]: The one closest to the single camshaft has six rocker arm for the intake, but also six finger followers.

[SPEAKER_02]: which kind of, you know, essentially transmit the motions.

[SPEAKER_02]: He goes on to say, those are the big problem.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're very small.

[SPEAKER_02]: And have tiny check balls that stop working, letting oil bleed out.

[SPEAKER_02]: And he kind of explains that they tend to sludge up and then they wear.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then they're very expensive and challenging to fix.

[SPEAKER_02]: So essentially, the engine is bulletproof except for the valve train, which is fundamentally kind of flotted and it's designed.

[SPEAKER_02]: Also the lug nuts.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so apparently, we realize pretty quickly that ours is missing a few of its lug nuts.

[SPEAKER_01]: Apparently that's not altogether uncommon on these.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, he says the design of the lug nuts is terrible.

[SPEAKER_02]: The steel wheels pinch the soft steel of the lug nuts, then they destroy the studs and get stuck.

[SPEAKER_02]: Best to ditch the three piece lug nuts and center cast and use the regular A-corn lug nuts.

[SPEAKER_02]: But then he finishes by saying, so it's a really long email.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm kind of just summarizing.

[SPEAKER_02]: On the bright side, the rest of the vehicle's [SPEAKER_02]: clutch and transmission are pretty strong.

[SPEAKER_02]: Auto locking a hubs are dumb, but generally reliable.

[SPEAKER_02]: Pretty sure the rear axle is a light duty Dana 44.

[SPEAKER_02]: No cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: A bunch of other people said that.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think a lunch box locker is available from several companies.

[SPEAKER_02]: Seems like you can get about two inches of lift from the front from adjusting the torsion bars, longer rear springs and shackles that a few inches to the rear.

[SPEAKER_02]: cheap rear add-on springs can add about 105, 1.5 inches to the rear, but it hurts articulation.

[SPEAKER_02]: So listen, this is kind of like a car that just doesn't exist anymore.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's not a huge community around them, but I don't think we should forget the rodeo because it was fundamentally a pretty interesting car.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and we're going to have some fun with this one.

[SPEAKER_01]: We did go through and check the oil level, and it's not noisy because it's low on oil.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's got some of those issues I think he was describing.

[SPEAKER_01]: So we are essentially going to run it until it doesn't run anymore, I think, is the plan.

[SPEAKER_02]: The good news is he was kind of saying that you can kind of just let him keep ticking.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: If it's got 2308,000 miles of it's made at this far, it sounds like it'll kind of just keep going until it until it does hops.

[SPEAKER_02]: But it's a plan.

[SPEAKER_02]: We're going to try that.

[SPEAKER_02]: But let us know what you want to see with this road.

[SPEAKER_02]: You guys think tires and I think an offered adventure would be pretty fun on this thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe we'll fix the valve cover gasket leak because it's pretty atrocious.

[SPEAKER_02]: But apart from that, [SPEAKER_01]: And then the other vehicle that we were spending some time and adverse driving conditions in recently is another questionable one.

[SPEAKER_01]: Tommy and I went and did some snow wheeling, if you want to call it that, in our Model T, 93 year old Ford Model T, 99 year old.

[SPEAKER_01]: Is it 99?

[SPEAKER_01]: I don't even know.

[SPEAKER_00]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, 99 year old, so basically 100 year old Model T, and the way that we got it to work in the snow, because a long time ago, you and Roman had tried to drive our other Model T in the snow, didn't move.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it went maybe 20 yards.

[SPEAKER_01]: We wrapped rope, almost twine like rope, very old time [SPEAKER_01]: old-timey tire change.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, and this is a really interesting hack that I read about a long time ago and I I kind of thought to be one of those things where you know, a small-timers tell you, but doesn't really work But the old-timers were exactly on the money so he took three eighths gardening rope and then [SPEAKER_02]: Case tight is not, so we wrapped it around the tire.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know probably 25 times something like that 20 times And essentially it digs into the snow in the mud in the grime and then gives you additional traction and the difference was amazing Like like you said in the old model T it barely moved at all This system caused it to climb up pretty much anything.

[SPEAKER_02]: We we pointed it at it was so impressive [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: We did manage to get it stuck in some really slick clay, but to give context to that, we also took a Kawasaki side by side and put it into will drive on that same bit of clay and it too was stuck was stuck into will drive.

[SPEAKER_01]: So yeah, the the model to you with a rope wrapped around the rear tires is impressive.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I mean, especially considering back then, they didn't have all terrains.

[SPEAKER_02]: They didn't have no tires until the mid-30s, and they weren't super prevalent.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think we were seeing some comments people saying there were chains back then.

[SPEAKER_01]: Sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: But this was an interesting comment.

[SPEAKER_02]: If you click on the 157 there, Cole, this guy said that this trick has a tendency to actually work better in some cases than chains, because the fibers in the rope interact better with the snow, [SPEAKER_02]: than some of the change, I thought it was really interesting, I don't know where that comment went, but it was a really an insightful comment in that, you know, in some cases, depending on the conditions, this might actually be a better solution than dropping metal around the rubber.

[SPEAKER_01]: Which I would believe, because Tommy and I have tested over the years a lot of different traction aids for driving in the snow, because it always ends up being a pretty popular video [SPEAKER_01]: And we'll do a test that compares, there's quite a few different styles.

[SPEAKER_01]: There's ones that are almost similar to this in their approach.

[SPEAKER_01]: One of the traction aids we've tested is like these big zip ties.

[SPEAKER_01]: That didn't work that well.

[SPEAKER_01]: It didn't work that well.

[SPEAKER_01]: There are also these blocks that you could strap to the wheels that was awful.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also terrible.

[SPEAKER_01]: Chains do work, but they can be...

[SPEAKER_01]: annoying to put on, especially if they're sized almost right, but not quite right, and configuring them in such a way that they're not going to destroy the face of your wheels, especially on a lot of modern cars that have pretty low profile tires.

[SPEAKER_01]: The best traction aid that we've tried on modern cars has been the snow socks.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, absolutely a really good job.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's pretty easy to wrap those around tires.

[SPEAKER_01]: They are kind of pricey, but they do a great job and they're easy to put on an easy to store.

[SPEAKER_01]: but the before and after with rope wrapped around the tire of his monotlety might be the best result we've seen ever.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, pretty crazy from before and after.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm not saying that a model T with rope around this tire is going to be better with better than a modern car necessarily with a snow sock.

[SPEAKER_01]: But it might be.

[SPEAKER_02]: It worked really well.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that some of the big takeaways we learned are, look, these cars were designed before roads were even a thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: And if you show it to the TFL truck main page, I want to show kind of our articulation video.

[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, it was a, it's a transverse amounts of least spring and solid axles for an and back with, [SPEAKER_02]: no sway protection whatsoever.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not even talking about sway bars, go to shorts cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm talking about it doesn't even have shock absorbers.

[SPEAKER_02]: So what that means is that the front end has has completed other freedom to go in whatever direction and at whatever angle it wants and what that means is you get absolutely bonkers articulation under these modelties because they were designed in an era before road.

[SPEAKER_02]: So they had to work.

[SPEAKER_02]: in dirt and in mud and in clay and that kind of thing and it really does.

[SPEAKER_01]: It really does and it's something that's pretty much completely lost in modern cars.

[SPEAKER_01]: Every time we go on the launch for a new vehicle, they tell us about how there's 5% more torsional rigidity here and there's 10% more stiffness there.

[SPEAKER_01]: which is great in a sports car but a lot of times we're going on launch events for some new crossover and they're telling us about how much stiffer it is and it used to be that you would get some flex in the frame and everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Now granted the model T maybe flex is a little too much in the frame because even the body [SPEAKER_01]: The, the, the grill and the back end of a model T will basically be facing different directions.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: If you fully articulate them if there is such a thing, that's probably a bit too much flex.

[SPEAKER_01]: But I actually kind of miss the days of cars having a little bit of give in their frames.

[SPEAKER_02]: In the, when we got a suck in the snow, we were going up this like slight holes, of course, the holes were maybe four inches deep.

[SPEAKER_02]: And we got it stuck at the top of the hill and went to go get the side by side to pull it out.

[SPEAKER_02]: But the hole was just deep enough to cause a little bit of flex in the body.

[SPEAKER_02]: And even like an inch or two of flex meant that I couldn't open the door.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was like jam shot.

[SPEAKER_02]: So anyway, it was a really interesting little experiment we did.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can check those videos over at Tiva Classics.

[SPEAKER_02]: We'll have those up this weekend.

[SPEAKER_02]: Speaking of which, another classic thing I've been working on, my new Jeep, oh, true, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: So this is the Indegarage segment of our off-road podcast.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and Tommy was having so much fun with his flat fender Jeep that he decided to buy another.

[SPEAKER_02]: So the story is, I bought this little flat fender Jeep case, and I blew it apart, and I've been slowly working on it a little bit, but what I've been realizing is like, [SPEAKER_02]: even though I paint it over it, it looks pretty nice.

[SPEAKER_02]: So there is some pretty bad structure where I set could probably do with some fixing.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I was poking around on Facebook, and I found this Jeep, this is another 47, really CJ2A with a blown engine and a clean title.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I picked this one up for $2,900, and my plan is to take essentially two jeeps and build one nice one out of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I'm gonna use the engine out of the first one, and I'm also gonna use the rebuilt transmission [SPEAKER_02]: stick it in this one and then use kind of a College Podge of Parts that I have to create one good Jeep out of it.

[SPEAKER_01]: And the nice thing is there's a market for all of the other old parts as well So the parts that Tommy's not gonna use You can use tub of already purchased.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so those extra parts can be used to make other people's jeeps complete [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's just great about these things.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're kind of like Legos.

[SPEAKER_02]: They never fully die.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's kind of technically impossible to kill one.

[SPEAKER_02]: Although I'm working on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, this is a really cool Jeep.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it was owned by this guy who bought it in the 1980s.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then the engine blew some time in the early 90s.

[SPEAKER_02]: It spun a bearing.

[SPEAKER_02]: There you can actually see the original engine.

[SPEAKER_02]: And in the backseat of the thing, but what's nice about this one is there's just like a lot of better things than the first one I was working out So I was just putting break lines on at this past weekend and like the tabs where the break lines mount work just completely missing on the first one And this one has all the tabs already which is great news, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Luckily my engine on the old one was rebuilt case pointed out So I noticed when I was rebuilding it it was bored 40 over Which I'm like oh, this thing's a hot rod cases like no, it's probably just worn out and yeah [SPEAKER_01]: That amount of boards, it's not like a big block or say, well, not that a big block is just bore.

[SPEAKER_01]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's not like a bigger displacement engine, yeah, it's just been rebuilt at least once twice.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Cole, if you go back, I pull these horrible wheels off of the stupid fender flares and the ridiculous top, and I've got a picture of kind of what it looks like now, except I just did, there's an interior, interior, it was full, a junk and garbage, it should be them.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, there it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I put the wheels on it and it looks pretty cool.

[SPEAKER_01]: I'm really excited about it totally that this is not going to be great for people listening to this podcast, but yeah, what you've essentially got is is a mostly white Jeep with some pretty cool patina on it, not a lot of rust.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I think it's gonna shape up into something really classic.

[SPEAKER_01]: The idea with the other Jeep that we were working on, mostly Tommy working on was to repaint it.

[SPEAKER_02]: But this one I think I'm gonna leave like this because I really like how the kind of the primer's coming through.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's got these like very 70s pin stripes on it.

[SPEAKER_01]: You gotta do this split windshield though, right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Maybe we'll do this split windshield.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I did bedline the inside of it this past weekend.

[SPEAKER_02]: Which you're right, it was a pretty fun job.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_01]: D-I-Y bedliner kits are actually a lot of fun to use, you used a different brand.

[SPEAKER_01]: I've used unsponsored raptor liner kits in the past and it's been pretty nice.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's why I did the bed of my truck with and I did the entire exterior in bedliner of a van and of a Tacoma with that same kind of kit.

[SPEAKER_01]: Plus I think that's the same kit that we used on [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, so I've used that kit a bunch of times and it was nice, but you got a similar thing different brand.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it was like the JB weld version, but it seems I think like it's probably the same.

[SPEAKER_02]: You've got the bed liner and then you mix the hardener in, you shake it up like crazy.

[SPEAKER_02]: You put it in the little included, comes with a cheapo little spray nozzle.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yep, and then to compressor.

[SPEAKER_02]: Let's spray it on.

[SPEAKER_02]: So Leslie's I learned.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I did mask up like the edge of the tub, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Probably should have messed up more because I probably spent more time cleaning over Spray off and it actually spraying the tub, but I was like, ah, just screw it because the things already got to be on in our anyway.

[SPEAKER_02]: So they got a little bit of over Spray on the tub, same thing with the dash.

[SPEAKER_02]: But apart from that, like, just know that it's gonna kind of go everywhere.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it kind of spits out of the gun.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, I eventually got it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's got a steady stream, but it does have just a lot of muck that goes everywhere.

[SPEAKER_01]: Also to clarify, Tommy bedlined the inside of the tub for a little extra traction.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, the exterior of the tub is still going to have factory paint and everything, so that's mostly just kind of a functional decision.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, and also the underside of the hood.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, yeah, live in large, wow, it's going to let me be like sound instantly.

[SPEAKER_02]: The only other thing that I'm stressed about with this project is I looked a little bit into the wiring harness I bought and I don't think I understand how wiring works at all so it's going to take a little [SPEAKER_02]: That's tough, it's going to take a little bit more research because basically what I figured out is the hardness that I bought, more or less like a universal kit, it's got 12 fuses on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you're probably thinking, well, that can't be that complicated and it's not, it just looks intimidating when you're holding like the big bundle of wires.

[SPEAKER_01]: for sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: But basically the problem with these jeeps which I'm learning is that nothing is fused in the modern sense.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like there are a few fuses on the Jeep to begin with, but not many.

[SPEAKER_02]: And basically it's just a wire like there's a wire that goes from the battery directly to each of the switches and the headlights and the ignition and the red right where it goes is how I'm understanding it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So like the way the headlights work is there's a wire that goes from the battery to the headlights which to the headlights which is great and until suddenly [SPEAKER_02]: And theory there should be a fuse mine doesn't have it, probably was when at some point.

[SPEAKER_02]: But basically how is going to work now is I've got one wire that goes from the battery to my little fuse box.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then from the fuse box, those wires go to the headlight switch.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's a wire that goes from the headlight switch to the headlights.

[SPEAKER_02]: The interesting thing about this wiring harness is it only replaces the wire from the fuse box to the headlight switch So I still have to run my wire from the headlights which to the actual headlights right so it's not doesn't sound like it's gonna be too bad I just got to get like some lengths of some wires, but it'll be okay because there's only three things that is powered by electricity on this gene [SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it should be pretty straightforward and it's going to be exciting.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's going to be fun to see that on the road and on the trail and doing some neat stuff out in Moab.

[SPEAKER_01]: Are you going to keep the roll bar that's already on?

[SPEAKER_02]: I might.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is very solidly mounted.

[SPEAKER_02]: So.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, we'll see.

[SPEAKER_02]: I got to see what the combo of the roll bar and the two-way windshield looks like, because the three-way windshield is a little taller, so right now it's right at the same level, so it may look kind of stupid if I put the two-way windshield on it, so I might end up flopping the roll bar, but for now, I just want to like get the engine in it, the transmission in the transfer case, get it moving, we'll go do some cool videos with that, uh, yeah, and they'll be fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm excited about it.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I heard big news, everybody.

[SPEAKER_02]: Case cut is landed over back.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I have a back, and it is running and driving.

[SPEAKER_01]: I can do both of those things with it.

[SPEAKER_01]: What we figured out, which is good to have figured things out, is that actually the transmission is fine, which I'm kind of surprised by, because I have had problems with the transmission in the past.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was my initial assumption, but it is instead the transfer case going bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I am able, I am able to Jimmy the transfer case in a gear and it'll stay in gear for a little bit, but it's also making a lot of noise and it's going bad.

[SPEAKER_01]: So I'm an order of rebuilt transfer case.

[SPEAKER_01]: I was thinking about it though.

[SPEAKER_01]: The funny thing about my Corvette powered Land Rover is that by the time I get this new transfer case and eventually when I put some lockers in it, [SPEAKER_01]: every single part of the drive line, every physical part of the drive line that moves the vehicle from the piston to the rubber touching the road will will be different from when it was new.

[SPEAKER_01]: Engine transmission, transfer case, drive shafts, [SPEAKER_01]: everything internally in the axles, hub assembly wheels, tires, brakes, all that, also other systems like the steering from, from the steering wheel to the front wheels, the only original part of any of that is from the back of the steering wheel to the firewall, and that's it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So what case is learned is to make a reliable landover.

[SPEAKER_02]: You just start over.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and genuinely that was a plan I mean the the vehicle itself the canvas if you want to call it that that I bought was very cheap intentionally because I didn't want to buy something nice like like a nice 80 series land cruiser or something that's already a nice vehicle and then tear out a good engine for a different engine [SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to start with something when the idea was to build something more or less from the ground up some people might have a problem with me saying that, but to essentially fully go through something and make a different thing out of it, I wanted to start with one that wasn't already good.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, you did.

[SPEAKER_01]: Does that make sense?

[SPEAKER_02]: No, what about you like your ring in opinion to those stuff, actually?

[SPEAKER_01]: Once I do lockers, they won't be [SPEAKER_01]: the axle shafts and the entire different everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: It'll even be a different spline count.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh my gosh.

[SPEAKER_01]: And everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: So once I do the lockers, the axle tubes will be original.

[SPEAKER_01]: We'll vote lug nuts.

[SPEAKER_01]: No, no, nor the threats because when I do lockers and everything, I'm going to do new wheelbarings, how do you do these and everything.

[SPEAKER_01]: So, Axel tube is that Axel tube will be original, most of the body and interior will be original.

[SPEAKER_01]: most of the frame will be original and that's it.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's crazy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, that's absolutely nuts.

[SPEAKER_01]: So that was kind of the goal.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to again, I'll put air quotes around.

[SPEAKER_01]: I wanted to build a vehicle essentially.

[SPEAKER_02]: But the great news is the three-month battle to fix the transmission has been solved.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Transmission works.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right?

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I drove a...

[SPEAKER_02]: It was the shop like astonished when you drove it on the trailer.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, because the thought was their thought and mine as well was the transmission.

[SPEAKER_01]: And they kind of hit a wall where they were like, we don't know anything else we can do to try and get this to run and to move.

[SPEAKER_01]: So they basically said, you know, go ahead and pick it up.

[SPEAKER_01]: And I was talking to our buddy, Jordan, who has dealt with some similar issues in the past and he told me to mess around with the transfer case for a bit and see if I could get it to go into gear and I eventually was able to get it to actually go into gear well enough to pull up onto a trailer.

[SPEAKER_01]: which freaked out the shop and I thought I was picking it up from here for like how did you just get that to move yeah yeah so it's nice to know what the problem is new transfer case and it should be it should be sorted nice sweet well we're gonna have an update on that soon um we've got some plans on how we're gonna get that finished which talk about the next podcast but the last thing I want to talk about [SPEAKER_02]: Um, is something.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes, we'll leave the deep discussion for next week, but I do want to do my, my, my Tommy talk.

[SPEAKER_02]: Tommy talk, what is Tommy talking about?

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm talking about, I think perhaps.

[SPEAKER_02]: The single ugliest new vehicle I've ever seen.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, yeah, I didn't know if we were actually gonna bring this up.

[SPEAKER_02]: I feel bold enough to bring it up.

[SPEAKER_02]: Now listen, we have had a tumultuous relationship with Subaru in the past, it's fair to say.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I genuinely do love a lot of their products.

[SPEAKER_02]: For example, we bought a 23 cross trek.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I thought that was a fantastic vehicle for what it is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Our video for now drives it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's got like 75,000 miles on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's been perfect.

[SPEAKER_02]: I really do like cross trek.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, but I did see what could perhaps be the uglyest vehicle I've ever seen in my entire life.

[SPEAKER_02]: Call it is not this one.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is the new Subaru Outback Wilderness.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, this is a vehicle, this is interesting.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know, sometimes you see vehicles and pictures and you're like, ah, that's not great.

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe it'll be better in person.

[SPEAKER_02]: Usually it is better in person.

[SPEAKER_02]: Until I saw this outback wilderness in person.

[SPEAKER_02]: First in person.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is the worst-looking thing I think I've ever seen.

[SPEAKER_02]: Just look up a picture, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Super Outback wilderness from the back, going down the road.

[SPEAKER_02]: What?

[SPEAKER_02]: What has happened to this vehicle?

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I think fundamentally the outback has always been a very handsome, purposeful, sure.

[SPEAKER_02]: Station wagon, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it wasn't offensive.

[SPEAKER_01]: The new one though, there's the old one.

[SPEAKER_01]: It was kind of offensive.

[SPEAKER_01]: Oh, let's see.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yes, there we go.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, it's covered in a lot of what did they do?

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean they they just they they took a square design They should have stopped there and they just barfed plastic In places there shouldn't be plastic.

[SPEAKER_02]: What is that thing on the tailgate, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: You've got this lift gate and then just three layers of plastic [SPEAKER_02]: There's the base outback layer, these two weird little rubby things, these crazy yellow light, what happened in the look of the outback?

[SPEAKER_01]: I think the most charitable way you could describe it is a little busy.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks like, it looks like Stevie Wonder tried to build, make a cake.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like someone helped to make the actual base of the cake and it was pretty good.

[SPEAKER_01]: And he decorated it.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then he decorated it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Well, if you look at the front end, the front end is not necessarily great either.

[SPEAKER_01]: Let's see the front.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it's not awesome, is it?

[SPEAKER_02]: No.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I just don't think that.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then for the square wheel arch is the top.

[SPEAKER_01]: The square wheel arch is the worst part.

[SPEAKER_01]: That.

[SPEAKER_01]: something about the side of this vehicle and the proportions of it, screams Aztec.

[SPEAKER_01]: It really does.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, and I think it's the way that the plastic has been applied with such vigor, you know, forcefully applied to the plastic cladding.

[SPEAKER_01]: I mean, look at the cladding on the door.

[SPEAKER_01]: It looks like it's maybe six inches thick.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I don't, I really, I think the standard outback is visually fine.

[SPEAKER_02]: The wilderness is one of the most appalling looking new vehicles I think I've ever seen.

[SPEAKER_01]: And who knows, this, so by the way, this is almost kind of a dig at Tommy.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, Tommy's a fan of the Aztec, but this may be, this may be more upset than an Aztec.

[SPEAKER_01]: This may be now Aztec.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because the Aztec, yeah, that's a great way of putting an Aztec of today.

[SPEAKER_02]: But if you squint from a mile away, you can kind of see what they were going for.

[SPEAKER_02]: Facing the same direction that the Aztec is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because the sort of the Aztec is it was designed to be an off-road Camaro, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: And then the bean counters put it on the minivan platform, which is why I got narrow and tall.

[SPEAKER_01]: The difference is that the Aztec has cool stuff like a tent and a floor that is built into the back, yeah, in a cooler that lives inside the vehicle and a conventional four-speed torque converter automatic.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not sure this has those, I just don't know what they were going for.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, if you, like I said, you can kind of see how maybe sort of the Aztec was supposed to be an off-road Camaro, maybe, maybe.

[SPEAKER_02]: This, I don't know what the design briefing was at all.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, what is the purpose of that little, what is that blue square thing by the sea pillar?

[SPEAKER_02]: Why did they just stick a square of blue by the sea pillar?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's the defender thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: Also terrible, but at least on the defender, you can get like a cargo box there and a ladder, which my dad hates.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I know your dad hates it and a lot of people do, which I'm not a fan of it either.

[SPEAKER_02]: But this is just a random blue, someone stuck a sticky note on the design and said, please fix this, and they use the sticky note as a design element.

[SPEAKER_01]: was funny because so many, so many brands and not even just automotive in basically every area of design in this day and age, everyone has leaned so hard toward minimalism.

[SPEAKER_01]: I guess Subaru decided to swing way the opposite way.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, if this was a store, it would be like that we're cha-chiki curious store that no one actually likes to go to because you don't know what's going on inside of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's exactly what the design of this is I'm sorry.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'd love to drive this car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I will never now, of course, but I [SPEAKER_02]: I think that the outback fundamentally is a staple of Colorado, and I really appreciate why it exists, and I really value it as a car, but specifically this new outback wilderness is an appalling abomination to look at.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_01]: It really is terrible.

[SPEAKER_01]: It's the 2026 Aztec.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's fair to say.

[SPEAKER_02]: I can't think of a vehicle with the closer design briefing to an Aztec.

[SPEAKER_02]: You're exactly right.

[SPEAKER_02]: The the cladding on the side, the weird proportion is what makes it especially Aztec.

[SPEAKER_02]: I would have thought you'd be happy they brought back the Aztec.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look, I love grotesque use of plastic.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that there's a place for that in society.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just don't think it's on the side of a car.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, probably not.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well guys, I think that's what we've got for today's pad podcast.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm sure you'll leave a comments in the section below.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'd love to read them.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you think case final thoughts?

[SPEAKER_02]: The 95 rodeo or the 26 outback wilderness, which is a better looking car.

[SPEAKER_02]: The rodeo, which is already the dumpiest looking thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a little dumpy.

[SPEAKER_02]: Guys, we'll see you in the next one.

[SPEAKER_02]: Thanks for listening to this off-road podcast.

[SPEAKER_02]: Every other week here on CarChat, and thanks for watching.

About this episode

A deep dive into the 2026 Toyota 4Runner TRD Pro, exploring its off-road capabilities, premium features, and pricing compared to the Jeep Wrangler and Ford Bronco. The hosts discuss the vehicle's hybrid powertrain, suspension, and unique Wavemaker color, while also testing it on challenging terrain. The conversation shifts to off-road news, including Lincoln's plans for a G-Wagon competitor, Ford's expanded Tremor package, and Jeep's safety improvements. Nostalgic stories about a 1995 Isuzu Rodeo and vintage Jeeps highlight the charm of older 4x4s. The episode closes with a critique of the controversial new Subaru Outback Wilderness design.

37-inch tires ARB bedliner body flex body-on-frame SUV Fox QS3 2.5 inch diameter aluminum shock absorbers with remote reservoirs frame flex frame-mounted rock rails hardtop horsepower

Ford Bronco Jeep Wrangler Mercedes-Benz G-Class Toyota 4Runner

Original notes

( https://www.alltfl.com/ ) Check out our new spot to find ALL our content, from news to videos and our podcasts! In this episode of TFL Car Chat, Roman and Tommy get behind the wheel of the highly anticipated 2026 Toyota 4Runner TRD Pro to see if the sixth-generation icon still holds the crown. After a full walkaround and drive, they dive into the new i-FORCE MAX hybrid powertrain and updated off-road tech to determine if this redesign maintains the rugged simplicity of its predecessors or if the 4Runner has finally lost its way in a sea of modern complexity.

The conversation then moves to the studio as Kase and Tommy break down the latest off-road headlines, including rumors of Lincoln developing a body-on-frame competitor to the Mercedes G-Wagon and Ford’s updated Tremor packaging for the Super Duty lineup. They also share the latest updates on the ever-growing TFL project fleet, from Tommy’s newest flat-fender Jeep purchase to the surprising discovery that the transmission in Kase’s Land Rover actually functions. Finally, the team introduces the newest member of the fleet, a classic Isuzu Rodeo, and discusses what the future holds for this 90s off-road survivor.

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