Kicking Tires #74 - 2024 Ford Mustang, Ferrari SUV, Pagani Utopia, GR Corolla Pricing

Hello, and welcome to Kicking Tires.

My name is Jimmy and I'm Justin.

And today is September 14th, and we got a bunch of news today.

A lot of exciting stuff.

We got some Toyota news, some Honda news, the most exciting,

Chevy news you've ever heard in a very long time.

Also, just this exciting Chrysler news, but we'll get to all of this.

I promise we will.

First off, though, we got to talk about the GR Corolla.

I mean, we talked about GR Corolla already.

We actually talked about GR Corolla like a lot three times, four times already.

But this is the most important one of the most important aspects, pricing.

So pricing was announced for Canadian as well as the US

starts at $37,000 US or $45,500 for Canada.

Pricing is pretty good for an all-wheel drive car.

Like that's right in line with the Golf R, I guess.

But you're getting a bit more unique, I would say.

Yeah, the thing is for Canada, our Golf R prices is just so good.

So, so good that it actually just kind of it hurts the Corolla really

because the Golf R is $47,500, which is cheaper than the mid-grade version

of the GR Corolla, which is the circuit edition.

But like only $2,000 more than the core, which is the base one.

Chances is you're probably going to get a Golf R a lot easier than the Corolla as well.

Yeah, just that's just how it is performance wise.

You get fancier differentials, even with the core model.

Yeah, so it's kind of the big news for Canadians.

You get that because, you know, our winter, let's disregard the American spec.

Let's just talk about Canadian, Canadian pricing.

All right, it's relevant.

45 five, you know, it's a good price.

You get good spec, like you said, like the circuit edition.

The only thing I see that is kind of like, oh, I could I could kind of use that

as a heated steering wheel.

I personally like a heated steering wheel, but that's really it.

Like the carbon roof, the red brick calipers, the hood bulge and the spoiler.

And I'm not too crazy about that.

I mean, visuals, sure.

But like, you know, it's not a it's not anything really that big.

Um, so in my opinion, save yourself the eight grand or whatever it is.

Get yourself the regular model for 45 five and it's a really good package.

Yeah, I mean, the carbon roof is is really the thing that you can't just bolt on.

Heated steering wheel really doesn't matter too, too much, I would say.

It's nice, but I could live without it.

But yeah, the carbon roof, you can't can't really do it aftermarket.

Like you can, but it would cost more than just getting that getting the package.

Yeah. Yeah.

So it is special.

It definitely is special.

Would you would you recommend the Mariso edition, though, for 60,000?

I mean, people will love it because that is the that is the speculative gem, right?

Like if if you're someone who only cares about resale value, exclusivity,

you know, making money off of your car, then that is the one to get, right?

Like the the Mariso is the best, you know.

Well, it's more money, but they take away the back seats.

Mm hmm.

So to me, it doesn't make sense.

Like as far as like the spirit of the G.R.

Corolla, right? It's not it's not really a track weapon, right?

I I almost doubt that the G.R.

Corolla will be much faster than a G.R.

86.

Actually, throttle throttle hosted a

that a track test between the G.R.

Corolla circuit edition and a G.R.

86, the 86 wasn't that like it was slower, yes, but it wasn't that much.

Yeah, I think it was less tire and less three seconds.

Yeah, it's got less tire and less break, which really is very easy to fix.

But the chassis itself is better inherently, just the balance and everything.

And you could put a lot of tire under a G.R.

86 too. So yeah, the power it's great and all, but it's as a track weapon.

It doesn't make sense.

And so I think stick with either the core or the circuit.

I think the core is a way to go for the money.

It's just for the money grand.

It's 15 grand different.

The Mariso is not 15 grand better of a car.

But you get a signed thing, don't you?

It's not even his real name.

It's Akio Toyoda's racing name.

Like it's like I'm using my Xbox gamer tag.

I love tofu.

Whoa, whoa, whoa.

It's actually not.

I love tofu, but OK.

I don't remember what it was.

Yeah, that's my rev scene.

Oh, whatever. Same thing.

Same thing.

But OK, wait, wait, wait.

It's what I'm confused about is the press release talks about the Mariso

having like a retuned engine with a higher 295 pound feet of torque.

But isn't the base also 295?

No, it has three.

Yeah, it has a bit more horsepower.

Oh, it goes up to.

Yeah, it's 273 and it goes to 295 horsepower.

It's the same.

Hmm. It's just tort.

There's probably no difference.

Like mechanically, there is probably no difference.

It says it's retuned.

Yeah, it's just software.

Yeah, they probably just limit the regular one.

So they can sell you a better one.

Yeah, so the Mariso, like I don't see anything about oil coolers,

like enhance anything.

Like if they did, they would tell you that it has, you know, a blueprinted engine.

It has an upgraded oil cooler, but it doesn't.

So it's worthless because anyone could

software tune a core and get the same, if not more power.

But what I want to see is is it more durable?

Is it going to last more laps, which it doesn't sound like it will

because they would tell you if it would.

Yeah. Yeah.

So more of the story by the core, by the core.

Yeah, and have more fun with it.

But either way, you can't and you can't.

So by go far.

Yeah, because even this morning, we were having this discussion

in our one of our track chat, right?

Like people are like, you know, I put two deposits down.

Like your deposits worthless.

Like if you're if you're like the typical guy that puts a deposit down,

like and then they slap you in the face with a low ball trade in value.

And then you're like, yeah, you know, if you got too much pride,

then you're you're not getting this car.

Like at the end of the day, a dealership is not a charity.

Yeah, it's they have only so many cars coming in

and only so many GAR Corollas.

They're going to give it to whoever they can make the most money off.

That's and a story.

There's no.

I don't know why people are so naive about it.

And people are like, you know, I could, you know, I can put the money down on it.

Like, nah, you got to.

If someone is willing to bend over more, they're getting it.

Also, you got to have a better trade in.

You got to have a car that they want easy for my advice.

Money buy a Prius Prime now and expect to lose 10 K on it in the next three months.

But you will at least you're saving money on gas, right?

At least you could drive that commute on it.

And they would love to have a Prius Prime to resell whatever Toyota dealer

Raph or Prime or Raph or hybrid pricing is just kind of nuts.

But I think in Prius Prime, take a 10 K hit on it.

Get yourself a new Jiracarola because the markup on a second hand market

for Jiracarola is going to offset that anyways.

I mean, if you do end up selling it, right, then we'll offset it.

But if you're looking to keep it for a long term,

you're not going to make anything out of it.

But remember what we said about the Jiracarola and the Focus RS being that lesson is.

Yeah, they they tried to sell the Focus RS for a lot, a lot of money

and ended up being a bit of a disappointment and the values are not

kind of what they were hyped up to be because at the end of the day,

if you can outperform this, if the GR86 can run laps around it on a track,

people aren't really going to care about this after, you know,

the public release, basically, because the way a car reviews really doesn't matter

because the court of public opinion is going to set the tone.

If they start blowing up on track, if they're slower, if whatever,

just a lot of issues, then this car is not going to do well.

And that that was the exact opposite with the GR Supra,

which does not review well because they put garbage Michelin PSS tires on it.

And it's aligned terribly out of the box.

And that's a car that initially people were like, man, I don't want to spend

sixty five thousand dollars on it.

And then now you can't get one.

And now people are like, I'm glad to pay eighty thousand for one

if I could get one hands on one, but you can't.

I just realized a manual base GR86 is thirty one K.

Yeah, so for fourteen thousand before you hit the base price of a G.R.

Corolla for fourteen thousand, you can do a lot to it.

The eight six is really fast.

I I can't stress this enough.

A lot of people ask me like, hey, do I buy a base came in

something like that?

And I'm like, dude, just get yourself a GR86.

It's faster in a straight line.

It's faster in the corners.

It's faster on track and it's going to cost you less to run.

Get the GR86.

Like it is such a good car.

I have no complaints about it.

Like it's it's fixed the fatal flaw of the eight six.

And it is legitimately quick.

The lap times speak for themselves.

It does overheat a little bit and a few people have blown them up,

but they are a small percentage, I think.

Here here's a better opinion.

Don't get the GR86.

Get the BRZ.

Because the BRZ has better rates.

I don't like the front end of the BRZ.

Yeah, I prefer the look of the Toyota.

Whatever, just you can get a front bumper and slap it on.

Yeah.

I mean, it's ultimately it's the same thing, but a BRZ.

Like it starts, I think, a thousand dollars more.

It's like thirty one versus thirty two.

But your rates on a BRZ, it's significantly lower.

I think it's five percent.

Yeah, five percent for five years.

Whereas for Toyota is seven point five percent.

I mean, you can work out the pricing, figure out which one's better for you.

But generally speaking, Subaru has better

better rates if you're going to be financing it or leasing it overall.

But yeah, very sensible opinions, not opinions, advice here from kicking the tires.

Just as sensible as our next topic, the brand new Honda Pilot.

So there's no information on this.

If you go to Honda news dot CA, you can see a picture of the back end

and you can see a picture of the front end on the brand new Honda Pilot.

So it's a trail sport.

That they're that they're kind of pushing here

from the tires, it looks better than their current trail sport tires that we get

because the current trail sport tires, they look rugged on the outside.

But tread is just a regular passenger tire.

This looks a little bit more rugged than your

I can't remember whatever tires that they put on on the old firestone destinations, I think

something like that.

These look like normal passenger alterings, like OK, a better time.

I don't know why this really matters.

Like who's going to be taking this off road?

I mean, they're doing they're doing development testing, though.

And like some crazy places, it looks like, you know, in the desert,

they're climbing rocks and whatnot.

No one in a Honda pilot is going to be doing any of this.

But I mean, the front end looks like a CRV.

The back end doesn't look like anything Honda has ever made.

The back end looks more like a Subaru.

Kind of has a Subaru or yeah, a scent kind of shape.

Yeah, to it.

I'm really curious if this is going to be competitive,

because the pilot has not been competitive for a while.

And no, I mean, where are we at?

The Pathfinder is more competitive.

The last update was 2016.

It's been a long time since the auto update.

I wonder if it's still going to carry the J series V6 in it.

Oh, boy.

Your favorite.

They don't think is they don't have a good

like alternative power plant, right?

Because other than the J series V6, if they like this pilot

shares that platform with the MDX,

that's currently a turbo from like the RDX in.

But they didn't do that with the MDX, neither.

Right. And the MDX, which is they always put out the MDX first

and then they put out the pilot and the MDX is exactly the same

as the pilot always has been, right?

So unless, you know, in 2024,

they decide to put in the the K series turbo.

I don't know.

I mean, they put a Type S motor in it from the TLX,

but I highly doubt they're going to put that in the Honda pilot.

They don't need that kind of power.

So maybe they'll put the two because people are going to compare

the MPGs of the pilot versus the Palisade, the Highlander,

Pathfinder, and those are all decent.

The K turbo is a good motor.

They use it basically for all their all their vehicles, right?

It doesn't sound good, but it doesn't need to.

It's a pilot. Yeah, you don't want to hear it.

Yeah, but we'll see. We'll see.

Hopefully we'll get some more information.

I don't think they said anything other than this fall.

Yeah. So we'll get more information in the fall and we'll go from there.

The most exciting, Chevy news.

Wow. Got a biggest yawn from Justin

as soon as he saw the car.

This is the 2023 Tahoe RST Performance Edition.

I don't know if you read the blurb yet.

Did you read the blurb?

Mm hmm. You did. Oh, OK.

Well, it's inspired.

Yeah, the first blurb is as motor sport inspired

and pursuit rated performance enhancement offer a balance

of accelerating performance with true SUV capability and comfort.

It has 13 more horsepower and seven pound-feet more torque.

It's decently quick.

It's a six point two.

It's it's good power ready.

But like the way that they're putting it, it seems like it's something crazy.

Right. It's something like an escalate V.

But on a Tahoe level, but no, it's just a small increase of power.

Yeah, Tahoe SS.

Mm hmm. Yeah.

That'll be cool. I would buy it.

No, I can't I can't afford it zero to 60.

They claim five point eight seconds, which isn't that quick.

But I mean, it's quick enough for an SUV of this size.

The only thing is the Ford expedition

stealth performance was released recently.

And that is like a under five seconds zero to 60.

So if you really want a big SUV that's fast, buy an Alpina XB7.

Hmm.

Or, you know, I mean, this thing is probably what, 80,000 bucks

around there.

No pricing that I saw.

No pricing.

But it does have a nice truck, though.

The, you know, I'll agree with you.

Like the new Tahoe's are really, really nice.

But they did do some suspension tuning on this.

It's the pursuit Tahoe, so like the police interceptor version.

So it slightly lower point four inches.

You get bigger brakes, red calipers.

You also get.

What else do you get?

Damper's anti-roll bars as well that are upgraded.

Hmm.

I mean, it's not a.

Oh.

Is that a pricing there?

Oh, they do have pricing.

It's 8,525 dollars above a regular RST.

But I don't know how much an RST is.

That's quite a bit.

Cause you're getting like an intake and exhaust sway bars breaks.

That's not bad.

It's like it's 8,000 us worth of upgrades of upgrades to me.

Yeah.

But I don't know.

Maybe I don't really care for these.

We're not the target.

We're not the target demographic for it.

Absolutely not.

But you know, it's kind of cool.

They're doing something to kind of reimagine the Tahoe a little bit.

Just as exciting.

Another big yawn from Justin here.

As we go into Salinas news.

I didn't even put it in for this week,

but still aunt has also released a new version of the charger and

challenger button that we're just going to get more yawns from

Justin here.

But the last of the legend.

So what it is is Chrysler released a new version of the 300 C.

They're putting the 6.4 Hemi in it.

I think they took it away from the 300 C for a long time because

they had it in the SRT and whatnot,

but I think they took it away for a bit.

But essentially it's a 6.4 liter Hemi V8,

485 horse, 475 pound feet of torque.

You got four piston Brembo brakes, LSD active suspension,

active exhaust 2000 for the US 200 for Canada.

MSRP 55,000 US.

For a very aged Chrysler 300 C,

but with a big motor.

I mean,

Chrysler is going through the ways of getting brand new.

Electric cars and they did.

Like most Atlantis anyways,

and now it's a bunch of G products that I didn't put in the,

the dock this week,

but I'm going to find it because that is actually more

interesting than this 300 C.

Well, you know, the 300 is dying off,

but I think they really miss an opportunity with the 300 E.

Like just give me a electric big sedan.

And you know, people will eat it up.

It's a, it's got the presence like the whole,

the whole Chrysler 300 thing.

Like it, they, they, they just gave up on it because there was

a time when people were excited about 300s and now it's just

like a rental fleet,

like old man type of vehicle,

but there were cool versions and, you know, stuff to like about

it, but I haven't seen anyone really talk about it.

Anyone under the age of 50 really look, look forward to it.

But I think they're like the shape and the,

the presence of a 300 combined with electrification,

there's a lot of potential there, maybe in the future.

I'm having difficulties finding it.

They had this concept Jeep Wrangler,

not sorry, a wagon near S.

I cannot find the information for it here,

but it's a, maybe under concept vehicles.

Maybe not, but it was a brand new Jeep that they are looking

to debut.

You get this one here that I have on the right.

It's just like four by, not four by ease.

Sorry.

It's a full electric, like a little Jeep.

It's like Wrangler type, but it's not replacing the Wrangler.

It looks kind of like a defender.

It's very cool looking.

It's like kind of rugged, boxy,

proper sized tires.

Yeah.

It kind of looks like a hopped up Patriot a little bit.

Cause it has kind of that proportion,

but it's not the same size as that is bigger than that.

I can't find it for whatever it is.

We'll get to it next week.

I'll be too late next week.

Anyways, some cool stuff coming from Jeep.

The Wrang, Wagon near S.

It's not based on any Jeep.

It's a full electric Jeep that is to compute against like

more like grand Cherokee sized vehicles,

which is kind of weird.

So like, cause a wagon year was supposed to be like the posh brand

of Jeep.

This is like their posh brand of the grand Cherokee,

but the grand Cherokee is already pretty posh.

So it's like, how much more higher can you get?

I guess it's, you know,

to kind of compete with like the Valar whenever that comes out.

Yeah.

And then they also released like a Euro specific model.

Like it's like the compass or the Cherokee,

but it's called the Jeep Avenger.

So they took the Avenger name from Dodge and they,

they made a full EV Euro specific model,

400 kilometer range.

It's going to be Europe, Japan, South Korea.

Oh, that yellow thing, right?

Yeah. The yellow thing.

It looks like a compass kind of size car.

Not sure why it's not coming here because I think a little crossover,

like like off-roading looking crossover with 400 kilometer range

would do great here.

Yeah.

But who knows?

Like we, we talked about this right here.

I remember seeing, we talked about this little guy before because they did.

Oh, here's a pictures.

Brand four by E date.

Yeah. Yeah.

Recon called the recon.

Yeah. That's what it's called.

And then it looks cool.

Wagon your S. This looks like a Valar to me.

And I like that.

Yeah.

But yeah, the recon looks really cool.

I think for people who are looking for like an electrified,

like cheap experience, this is kind of like that step.

You can take the doors off. Yeah.

You can take the doors off of it. That's kind of cool.

But that, yeah, Wagon your S has Valar written all over it to me.

Yeah.

They have a lot of models.

It's very confusing nowadays with Jeep because just size wise, like,

Oh, these are our compact offered. These are mid-sized.

These are full sets.

And there's just, there are so many models,

but Jeep has so much going on compared to the rest of Salantis.

Hmm. Yeah.

But speaking of the rest of Salantis.

Oh, perfect segue for a Ferrari SUV.

Yeah. You probably heard about it.

It's the.

Puro Sangui.

I was going to let you do it.

There's no way I can say whatever the hell that is.

Yeah.

But I'd like to translation from Italian to English.

It's just thoroughbred.

The Ferrari thoroughbred.

It's an SUV.

Doesn't make sense.

But hey, you know, we're in the world of SUVs.

Ferrari swore up and down that they'll never make an SUV.

And this is barely an SUV.

It's a little lifted.

Yeah. It's a little lifted.

It has no practicality at all.

Like as far as an SUV goes, the overhang is too long.

The car is too low. It's got suicide doors.

It's got no trunk, no usable trunk.

Yeah.

There's no off-road modes.

Yeah.

Less trunk space than like a smart car, realistically.

It has a wet mode and that's about it.

Wet snow, I think.

But, you know, who's taking their Ferrari off-road?

That doesn't matter at all.

What you have to know is about this $400,000 Ferrari.

It has a V12 on the front.

715 horsepower, 528 pound-feet of torque.

They estimate a 0 to 100 kilometer per hour at 3.3 seconds

and 193 mile per hour top speed.

I mean, numbers.

It's absolutely there.

But is this a good looking Ferrari?

Or is a GT, so GTC for GT?

GTC for Lusso.

I was like, wait, doesn't sound right.

The GTC for Lusso.

Is that the prettier one that you should get?

I like this one, actually.

Because both can carry four.

I mean, it's much easier to...

Both don't have much trunk space.

Yeah.

It is easier to get into the back of this.

It is graceful, but you will ding your neighbor's door

because your door will just fall.

The problem with clamshell doors,

like I never owned an RX8,

never really driven it for long to know.

But when I had the MX-30,

your most hated electric car that's on sale.

When you park next to someone

and you want to get someone in the back seat.

Oh, it's so terrifying.

You can't because you open the front door

and then you're like, oh, I'll open the back door.

But then it fully opens to the...

Well, to the neighboring car.

And you don't have enough room to squeeze a person in.

It just doesn't work for stall parking.

Like parallel parking, you're okay.

Fine, yeah.

But it's not...

Yeah, it's not very practical for stall parking,

which maybe they don't have a lot of in Italy.

But I think it's a really good looking shape.

I think it looks better than the Lusso.

The Lusso has huge stretched back eyes that I don't like.

I think the previous...

I think the FF looks better.

Yeah.

And this looks kind of more like the Roma,

which is a very pretty car.

Not very Ferrari looking necessarily,

but it is a nice looking car.

Really nice proportions because they've completely compromised

the practicality, right?

It's 40% hood, right?

Like most of the length of the car is hood.

The hood is probably three times longer than the trunk.

You know, your rear headrest goes all the way up to the C pillar

or the D pillar actually.

So there's a long ish trunk,

but like I said, it's probably no bigger than like a Versa,

maybe?

Versa is a huge trunk.

Yeah.

Like any Kia Rio kind of trunk,

I don't think any subcompact.

I think this is in the subcompact range.

I don't think anyone that's buying a Ferrari is like,

oh man, my trunk is smaller than a Kia Rio.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, the thing is you want to take this...

The idea is you want to take it, you know,

grand touring.

Yeah.

I think, you know, you want to drive this from...

You would want a bigger...

Yeah.

I really like this double bubble kind of instrument cluster.

Oh yeah.

Ferrari's been doing it for a while.

They've been doing like a cluster for the passenger.

It's...

But it's like the way that it's designed,

it looks like it's exact same.

It's not,

but this would make it easier for left and right hand drive cars, right?

You would think that it should be.

But the cluster that the passenger has,

has full controls over the vehicle.

So you don't have to have a screen in the center,

which actually makes quite a bit of sense.

That knob in the center is an actual knob.

You press a button, it raises up,

and you can turn it to like control temperature and stuff like that.

It's actually pretty cool.

And there's the same knob in the rear as well.

The seats look good.

Like they look really comfortable.

And they still have that kind of tally and flair to it.

And you have a full glass roof as well.

So like...

It's just not very SUV.

Like it's a clown shoe shape.

And it's very low.

And it's got very low profile tires.

Yeah.

So that's kind of, you know, the Urus,

people were like, that's not really an SUV.

The Urus is a lot more truck-like than this thing.

Well, the Urus is at least based on a Q8.

This is not.

This is based off of a sporty hatchback.

Yeah.

That is now lifted a bit higher.

I mean, I think it's, I think it's cool.

I'm sure we're going to see quite a bit of them here in Vancouver.

Just because, you know, we're the market for it.

I would like to see one in person, but I mean,

I don't know what I'm saying because it's not like I can afford it anyways.

No.

So let's move on to something that's also not affordable.

Yeah, completely unaffordable.

Yeah.

So the next vehicle that we're here to talk about is the Pagani Utopia.

This is the replacement for the Wyra.

I mean, the Wyra has been out for a very long time.

I remember Clarkson in an episode of Top Gear,

he was saying Wyra on Wyra.

Exactly.

Is it a replacement or is it just like something different?

Because it's gone very classic.

I found it is very classic and it's looks from what I can,

like from the blurb, it says is a replacement for it.

Yeah.

Twin turbo V12,

852 horsepower manual or single clutch auto.

Instead of just being carbon fiber,

it's carbotitanium.

Carbotanium.

Dry weight of 28, 22 pounds, 2,822 pounds.

Quite light.

If you want one too late on 99 has been sold for about 2.5 million bucks.

Better deal than the Gordon Murray.

Whenever we look at an expensive thing,

it's always the headlight of a smart 4.4.

Okay.

And then I looked at the interior.

This is, I had a gripe about the interior,

which is, it's not very pretty.

Like the touches that fit and finished, it's a baguette.

Okay. It's amazing.

Yeah.

The look of it is like a Morgan.

It's a very retro, very retro,

really ugly Sarah font on like the auto and like,

I don't know.

I think there's better ways to do this that.

I don't know.

It's really not my cup of tea.

All right. I'm going to say something controversial.

I never really liked a lot of Pagani's like interior design.

They just, they don't.

To me, the, like it's very kind of retro intricate,

but like, sure it looks great, but like.

Function.

I thought the Zonda was, was nice.

Like the Zonda for 25 years ago.

Like that was pretty, pretty nice.

I remember the Zonda had.

Climate control from a four or something like that.

That's the only thing I remember.

Yeah.

But this does not feel like a huge evolution.

From the Zonda, which really was like,

what 98 99 when we first saw the.

The Zonda.

So we're coming up on a quarter century.

Uh, you know, everyone talks about Pagani. Oh, it's,

it's the most amazing detail.

Every screw costs X amount because it's made of whatever.

It's a very exotic car.

Car botanium.

Yeah.

Car botanium, but it, it is not the prettiest car.

Um, it's not the fastest car, but.

You're buying art here.

It is. Yeah.

I think that's what it's right.

You're 100% buying art.

Like, look at that wheel.

You got instead of carbon fiber as a fan blade that goes around

the brakes extractors.

And then you have like a leather watch strap holding down.

Holding the, the hood here, like 100% this is art.

This is something that you go to cars and coffee and you show off your utopia.

Yeah.

Right. That's really what it's about.

Um, and I mean, the guy made a bunch of money selling art.

Why not? Right.

There's tons of people that will love to stare at this.

I would love to stare at it.

I wouldn't want to own one even if I had the money.

I would rather have something that's a little bit more functional.

Let's say like a Porsche, but once again, not the,

not the market for me.

I don't have 2.5 million US dollars.

It almost seems like a good value these days.

Almost.

You know what is a good value though?

Our next car.

The KTM crossbow GTXR.

So the lot of,

a lot of letters, very exciting letters.

Yeah.

It has all the X's, the GT's and R. Yeah.

All the exciting letters.

No, S downgrades it from the R.

RS XRS.

The crossbow GTXR is the,

it's a row going version of the crossbow GT2.

I mean, this is going to be for the European market.

They didn't say anything about bringing it to North America,

but it actually looks amazing.

It's like this.

I was going to say, why does it look the way it looks?

I think it looks really cool because it looks like it's,

the crossbows always looked weird, right?

Yeah.

even like the first crossbow that was like.

Like the open canopy one.

It's always looked weird and always used Audi.

It has a very squished face.

The rest of it, like a pillar back, I think it looks pretty sick.

But the face is just, it's not pretty.

The face to me, this reminds me of like LMP cars.

Yeah.

I mean, it's not proportionally, they could make it look better.

I'm sure they could have, but because of the canopy design,

you got the fighter style cockpit.

They're totally just opens forward.

You got this really good view on the front.

So like you can just, you know,

put that vehicle exactly on the apex,

exactly what this car is about.

Kind of.

That makes sense.

Visibility wise.

It does make sense to squish down the front end like that.

But it just, it looks awkward because the, the,

the window, like the greenhouse is so tall and then the,

the lights are like down here.

So it looks like it has like an underbite.

But functionally, it makes sense.

Yeah.

It has a two and a half liter five cylinder.

Oh, so it's not coming to Canada for sure.

Cause this engine is banned.

Oh, it's a band.

Isn't it?

That's why the RS three is not here.

We can't get an RS three anymore.

Can't get an RS three anymore.

RS.

You can.

Well, you could get it in the States.

Oh, I didn't know that.

Yeah.

The new body style RS three is not available in Canada.

Oh,

because this engine doesn't meet emission standards.

Oh.

Yeah.

Well, that's upsetting.

I had no idea.

I thought we could still just set the,

you know, the weirdest thing though is the people who have the

previous generation RS three are like, I'm holding on to this

because it's going to be worse.

Something cause the engine is so exotic and like, whatever,

it's a mass produced engine that in my opinion does not even

sound that good.

Everyone raves about how crazy.

You did.

You did mention this before.

I really don't think it sounds that amazing.

It's half a Lambo V10.

I, you know what else is a half a Lambo V10?

Mid 2000 Volkswagen Jetta and the Volkswagen Golf and Rabbit.

Those sound, those sound pretty good.

I actually really like those straight pipe.

Yeah.

It's perfect.

The reason why this is more affordable.

I'm not going to say cheap because it isn't.

It's more affordable.

But the Pagani is a 286,000 US.

Kind of what it translates to.

I mean, it's not bad, right?

That's a lot for a motorcycle.

Well, weighs a lot for a motorcycle without fuels,

2,755 pounds.

It's one of these track specials.

But it's one for the road.

It's a track.

It's like a radical for the road.

Yeah.

You got a roof over your head.

That's basically all they did to make it friendly.

But let's talk about our last car here.

The car that probably the biggest story of this week.

It is the biggest story released like two hours ago here.

At the time of recording anyways is the 2024 Ford Mustang.

Seventh generation of the fourth Mustang.

This is a reimagined, revised,

updated version of the Mustang.

It shares the same chassis and the windows and the roof.

Oh, yeah.

Of the previous generation Mustang,

but from the rear three quarters,

as we talked before,

recording today does have some Camaro vibes.

That rear three quarters does,

does look kind of Camaro-y.

I mean,

I think it's the tail lights and the deck lid.

Yeah.

The whole from, yeah,

B pillar back in is very Camaro.

Yeah.

It's the rear haunch.

It's over that rear rear.

Yeah.

The proportions are,

I think the coupe probably looks more Camaro.

The coupe definitely looks more Camaro than the,

than a convertible, but you totally see it.

It definitely has some of that Camaro vibes.

I think it's still a good looking vehicle.

I mean,

it is.

Well,

someone messaged me before the show.

What do you think about the new Mustang?

And I'm like,

it is very much what I would expect the new Mustang.

Yeah.

The front end, I would say I like the new one more,

but the back,

I think I would like the current generation more.

Yeah. And the wheels look small on it, like the,

from the rear angle and even this angle.

I don't know. They cut out,

they cut out on the fender is,

is a little bit smaller, right?

Proportionally,

it's not as pretty as outgoing one,

I would say. And it doesn't sound like they've,

like re-engineered the car very much either.

No.

I mean, I still like it.

I,

I was still definitely considered getting like,

I've been thinking about the Mustang for a while now.

I feel like I need to check that off my list of cars.

So please do so I can drive one.

Yeah.

Like I drove the,

when the S 550,

the outgoing generation now first came out,

I drove the GT, the yellow one they had on press.

And I thought,

I think that was my first real like muscle car experience.

And I thought that one did not drive great.

It was just like the front end gets really light.

But then after my Camaro,

I kind of reconsidered muscle cars.

I just remember that Camaro,

I remember it was winter.

And you've shoved me into the backseat of it.

And we're driving around near Costco and Burnaby.

And there was very limited traction because it was cold.

On summer tires.

But it was a lot of fun.

Yeah. And I think the Mustang now in its fourth generation of

the coyote V8 coyote V8, pretty solid engine actually,

even since day one,

the transmission has always been the issue,

but that's kind of sorted out now,

but the engine's been pretty solid.

Good reliable power, it seems.

It's the same engine that's in your truck, isn't it?

But mine is like second generation.

Oh, okay.

It's been revised quite a bit.

Yeah.

So it might make maybe three 70 horse.

And now they're saying close to 500.

Close to 500.

There's no official power.

No, no power figures yet.

They say it's more than the outgoing one.

I mean, the outgoing one,

I think the highest output we saw was maybe 470.

And so 500 is realistic.

And, you know,

we were talking about this the other day when you stopped by,

it's like, Hey,

a Mustang GT for say 40 grand to start.

That's a lot of car for the money.

It really is like it's,

you can't complain about that interior for 40 grand.

No, it's, it's, it's not a bad interior.

You can't complain about the sound.

You, it's, it's just,

you get so much for your money.

Yeah.

I mean, yeah.

Cause the base eco boost is like 33.

You can get a GT.

What low 40s, maybe.

Building edge.

It is.

Base GT is 46.

With no options on it.

46 with a, with a fees.

So like,

I feel like you need to get the premium though,

because the base one is really cheap,

but that might be irrelevant with the new one.

They haven't really talked about too much with the specs.

So new one,

we know that it's just the four four cylinder turbo,

which is that supposedly an all new engine.

I don't know how true that is cause Ford,

they say this is an all new Mustang as well.

Yeah.

And we know it's not an all new Mustang.

Exactly.

And well, with that, with the,

with the coyote, they're like,

this is the fourth generation,

but with the eco booster,

this is an all new eco boost four cylinder motor,

which eco boost is really not bad either.

No.

300 horse.

Yeah.

But the interior is very different.

I think the exterior is very predictable.

Like we, we kind of saw, okay,

they're going to smooth out some of the lines,

just looks more futuristic because they're going to,

eventually internal combustion engines are going to get phased out.

And eventually the regular Mustang is also going to be like the

Maki and it's going to have an electric power plant of some sort.

But the interior is very different because from as long as I can remember,

the Mustang has had this kind of like double bubble cockpit things

going on and they've switched it to like a driver oriented cockpit.

Yeah.

It's even counted in the middle towards the driver.

Yeah.

The screen is angled towards the driver and then they've got this.

They've kept the volume knob because they said they surveyed people,

people wanted a volume.

So there is still a volume knob.

It's not all screen, like the Maki.

You still get a volume knob in the Maki.

It's just on the screen part of the screen. Yeah.

Yeah.

But it's got like physical clicky buttons, a star button.

And the way it's angled,

it really, really reminds me of the R35, the GTR.

You know, kind of baby version of that.

But yeah, like to me,

you can get it with the Recaro optional seats,

which are just like the GTRs.

And it looks great.

Yeah.

Like it looks straight out of a GTR.

The seat.

Yeah.

It really does.

Yeah.

White two tone interior.

So the backseat is looks like it's all black.

But yeah, it looks very different interior wise than the outgoing car,

at least with the center stack, right?

Like the door card looks very similar.

The cup holder look very similar.

Yeah.

The whole center console is basically carry over.

Yeah.

A little bit of elements from the Camaro,

a little bit of elements from the GTR.

Yeah.

They did move the vents lower like the Camaro,

but unlike the Camaro,

you don't control the temperature with the vents.

Yeah.

At least they're halfway up.

But the Camaro with the vents down low,

really doesn't make sense.

Yeah.

I think, right, the Camaro had the vents.

Yeah.

No, it's all the way down.

It's like right in front of the shifter.

Yeah.

I had a Camaro.

I remember that being one of the weird things about that car.

One of the many weird things about ergonomically.

It had the same vents as a blazer.

That's what you have to remember.

Yeah.

It's definitely a very different dash.

You get these wide screens on here.

The cluster is a 12.4 inch.

The cluster, the infotainment is a 13.2.

So it is a very, very large screen that's in the center.

But the inside is kind of cool and all the,

the best feature I saw within the blurb is none of those.

It's this remote rev that they have talked about.

And what it is,

is essentially you can remote start your car from your key fob,

which a lot of vehicles can do.

But this is the first vehicle I've ever heard of that you can rev

your engine from your fob.

So you have to get an automatic to do that.

I assume you would think so.

Because generally speaking,

any manual transmission, you can't get remote starts on other than

like if you do aftermarket like CompuStar,

but even technically for CompuStar,

you're not supposed to put it on a manual car.

Reservation mode and all that.

There's a whole bunch of things to go with it.

Because you don't want the car to be in gear and to like,

you started into this.

Exactly.

But now you can rev it in gear.

Could you imagine?

But I'm sure it's going to be an automatic one.

But anyways, automatic rev through a key fob.

How awesome is that the ability to rev your car through a key fob?

It kind of makes sense.

It's like, it's already started.

I don't know how loud it goes.

I need to see this in action.

But for the type of people that want to buy a Mustang,

I think it makes sense.

Especially people that buy automatic.

You know, because it's such a,

it's such a statement that you're making when you get one of these.

I feel like.

No, talk about the,

not Romans pack.

Hmm.

A little bit.

So performance pack similar to previous Mustang,

S197, S550.

You're getting a struck bar,

oil cooler,

a little bit.

Not, not that much, but you're getting Brembo brakes.

Really, really depends on how the pricing is with this car,

but pretty cool.

Torson LSD, because I know LSD was always standard,

but I guess it wasn't a torson LSD on the base model.

Getting more aggressive rear tires.

And it's got the weird Mustang thing,

which is the weird, like minimal stagger,

like the rear is half an inch wider than the front.

It's, it's very negligible.

And it's a torson for the GT package on the 2022 as well.

It's already torson to begin.

Yeah. Yeah.

Yeah. So the performance pack.

I don't know. Oh, sorry. No, I'm looking at the GT performance pack.

You get a torson diff.

Okay.

But yeah, 390 mil brakes, pretty, pretty sizable brake,

but it's a heavy car.

So if you are tracking it,

it makes sense to go for the performance pack. Yeah.

Yeah.

But the coolest thing,

coolest thing is the performance EPB electronic parking brake.

So where your handbrake would normally be.

It has this lever that looks like a.

And it is, it's an electronic handbrake.

So I'm going to read from the blurb because I love this quote.

It can quickly turn a novice into drifting pro like Vaughn

getting junior.

Yeah.

Step aside. Vaughn getting junior.

I got a Mustang with the knob on it or a lever on it.

And now it can drift like you.

Ah, the Mustang blurbs.

Why, why do they see the things they do?

I mean, at least it doesn't say can run over.

Someone is definitely going to wrap it around the tree though.

Like, oh, this button is going to push.

I don't know.

It's.

They did the drift e-brake for the, uh, the focus RS.

Right. And that was like really cool.

Kind of makes sense. You know, all blue drive, you can pull it. Right.

Was that for one? No, that was, uh, that was Ken block.

I think right back then.

When they did the focus RS.

I think it was Ken block. It was before he moved to Audi.

But.

Just on a Mustang on a rear wheel drive vehicle like this.

It's locking up that rear. I mean, I don't know if it,

because it is electronic, it might be smarter, right?

It can maybe do something that.

You know, if it senses that you're the.

Like the angle is too much. Maybe it can automatically deactivate.

Maybe it's smart enough to do that. I don't know.

There's no information on that, but just having.

An electronic handbrake for you to drift.

I think mustangs are really getting into enough trouble.

The Mustang is inherently dangerous.

Just the type of people that buy it.

The look of the car and just the track record it's had.

Is, is not great for pedestrian or road safety.

Yeah, like probably not a cheap car to ensure.

If you get my drift.

A drift.

But yeah, the.

It seems irresponsible, but.

Yeah, you're getting it.

I think what all the GT's get it,

or only if you get the handling pack.

I don't recall.

Yeah, but it's pretty cool. I, I definitely.

I'm considering a Mustang, but.

Not at this very moment. I think in the near future.

I would definitely want to try.

The whole Mustang ownership and tracking a Mustang.

Cause they're, they're pretty competitive cars.

Out there. Yeah.

Well, I mean, inherently you put big tires on anything.

The fact that you can fit like a 305 front tire.

That's just makes the car very capable.

Yeah.

But we also have the dark horse edition Mustang.

So it's like a kind of a special.

Higher performance model based off of the GT.

So what they said about the dark horse is they wanted to surprise

you with a special edition right out of the gate.

Cause generally like.

Bullet and other models it's later on,

but that's why they wanted to name this one dark horse.

Like a surprise. Here's a special edition right out of the gate.

It's a more track focused version.

As Justin said, it is powered with the VA targeting five engine

horsepower.

You can get it with the six or the 10 speed auto.

There's special transmission coolers, NACA ducts,

like it's track oriented.

It's going to be kind of cooler.

The best part about it.

Carbon fiber wheels with Pirelli P zero.

PZ fours.

I thought I read something that was true fails.

Oh, PZ four is a standard PZ four.

It's a street tire for fail is if you get the optional,

there is a handling package,

even though this is a performance model already the dark horse,

there is an additional performance package on top of it.

It's kind of like SS one le or Zeta one.

Okay.

On top of it. Yeah.

Okay.

This is like the track special package.

So the track special handling package gets wider wheels,

wider tires, Trophyll RS, which really shouldn't street on.

Cause they have no cold grip.

And if it rains, you're screwed.

Gurney flaps, different springs, larger sway bars.

So handling package pretty cool,

but it is definitely a track specific model.

I know a guy that used Trophyll RS on his Porsche.

On a, on a autocross in the wet.

He did not have.

He said it's, he survived.

He told me it was not fun because there was no grip.

Yeah.

So compared to the regular GT performance package,

you're getting standard.

Right. Which is kind of nice. Cause they make you pay extra for that

on the, on the, even if you get the performance pack,

the Mustang, but yeah, a little bit better aerodynamics,

but it's kind of a new model, like a dark horse.

I don't know how I feel about that name.

I mean,

there's a different logo on the fender.

Yeah, it's a, it's a special dark horse emblem.

I don't know.

I think it's kind of cool. Dark horse.

Yeah.

I mean, I'm really waiting to see the GT models,

like the GT 350 GT 500, the Shelby ones, they're going to do that.

I don't know if they're going to do that.

I mean, this is like really need to.

Well, the thing is, this is the last we're off for them, right?

This is supposedly the last actual gasoline Mustang.

Yeah.

Internal combustion only Mustang.

They're, they have to do something special as a send off.

They have to. It's Ford. They're not going to just leave it.

I don't know if you watch the live stream of,

of this Mustang kind of like being delivered,

but like the crowd was going wild over it.

Just because of the vehicle that it is.

Yeah. The fact that they're still doing it, right? It's not.

People were probably worried like, Oh no, the monkey.

That's, that's not how this car is going to go out.

Yeah.

I'm sure a lot of people like felt exactly that way.

Yeah.

I would say the dark horse looks a lot better.

Like it just, it's so aggressive.

It does have a different front and rear bumper and a bunch of other stuff as well.

Yeah.

It does have GT 350 vibes, like.

Yeah.

Relative to the previous generation.

One GT 350.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

I mean, I, well, you say that's the one to get.

I wouldn't mind an eco boost with a performance pack to be very honest.

No, you'll always like,

it'll always be in the back of your mind.

Like I should have, should have got a V eight. Yeah. No, absolutely.

People will make excuses. Oh, it's 60 pounds lighter on the front.

Yeah.

Like so much better turn in.

Yeah.

They will say stuff like that.

But realistically there.

It's like,

I just,

your lap times will not be.

It's just realistically,

I couldn't get the financing for the,

for the GT at the settle for the eco boost.

At one point I considered getting the V six.

Oh God.

This is like,

this is a decade ago when I started working.

And the V six, because back then this is like 2011 and I had like,

I'm like, okay,

I'm going to save money and get myself Mustang,

any Mustang because that's, I really wanted one.

And yeah, this is like 2011.

And prior to that,

the GT only made like 300 horse 305.

And then they came out with the 3.7 V six with the variable can timing,

whatever.

And that made three in a horse.

I'm like, damn, that, that is so fast.

It's, it's as much power as a, as a Nissan Z.

But, you know, at that time it seemed like a decent performance.

At that time,

the Mustang you should have bought was the SN 95.

But keep in mind the V six Mustang at that time was $26,000 to start.

And already had a lot of features, you know, for 2011 standard.

So at one point, like I get, I get the entry level car,

like at 35 grand, it is so much car for your money.

I'm not going to talk anyone out of it, but, but for me,

I think it will just drive me nuts.

Like I will always want at least the GT.

Yeah.

I mean, if it makes more sense to get the GT, a base GT,

then get an option filled eco boost.

Oh yeah.

Cause you can get a lot of that stuff aftermarket.

Everything is bolt on.

Yeah.

The engine you really can't bolt on.

That's the thing, right?

But if you want to get like the better brakes,

you can't get that aftermarket.

It's not going to be as, you know,

as cheap as maybe getting it from Ford.

If you want better wheels, tires, suspension,

like you can get that all aftermarket.

So you're buying a base V8.

You can do whatever you want to it.

Get a better car.

It's a good platform to build off.

Yes.

There will be people that build up the eco boost and tune it,

put a downpipe intercooler on it.

And hey, it's making the same power as a GT.

I don't doubt it, but it won't sound like a GT.

That 2.3 actually sounds decent though.

I've heard one with the exhaust.

It sounds pretty good.

It's not GT good, but it's pretty good.

But you cannot flex on an IS 500 with the eco boost.

You actually can because the IS 500 is very weak.

As we have discovered.

The eco boost is probably faster.

Yeah.

But at least when that guy goes, oh, come on V8,

it sounds so good.

You know, like, that's not a V8.

That's not a real V8.

Yeah.

And he like, that sounds like a U-Haul, like a Chevy Astro

or whatever Savannah V8.

LS V8.

So those are good too.

Or LT's.

Yeah.

But not in those vans.

Just cut the muffler off.

It'll be fine.

Anyways, I think that's really it for this week.

Thank you so much for joining us, everyone.

And we'll see you next week.

Hopefully we get some exciting stuff.

If not, we'll skip a week like we did last week.

Catch you on the flippity flip.

It's flippity flop, actually.

Kicking Tires #74 - 2024 Ford Mustang, Ferrari SUV, Pagani Utopia, GR Corolla Pricing

About this episode

Honda TLX

Request an Explanation

Want to learn more?

Help improve this episode

More from Kicking Tires