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"Like Rocket Fuel for Growth!" – The Scale-Up Playbook Behind a Rapidly Expanding Dealer Group | Matt Stuckey, President of Stuckey Automotive
"Like Rocket Fuel for Growth!" – The Scale-Up Playbook Behind a Rapidly Expanding Dealer Group | Matt Stuckey, President of Stuckey Automotive
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About this episode
Matt Stuckey, president of Stuckey Automotive, shares insights on the rapid expansion of his dealer group, emphasizing the importance of centralizing operations like BDC and reconditioning to boost efficiency. He discusses the challenges of constructing new showrooms, the strategic decisions behind facility layouts, and how technology is reshaping dealership operations. Stuckey also reflects on the evolution of dealership management from his father's era to today's tech-driven environment, revealing how they maintain a robust technician pipeline despite industry claims of shortages.
Today I'm joined by Matt Stuckey, President of Stuckey Automotive.
Matt explains how real estate mandates, throughput targets, and workforce pipelines intersect, and why productivity—not volume—is the real competitive edge in today’s market.
This episode is brought to you by:
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Topics:
05:08 Why waste prime retail real estate on dirty, used car reconditioning?
05:18 The "Shrink the Footprint" strategy for building high-leverage, low-overhead dealerships.
09:07 The "150-unit rule" that dictates exactly when you must centralize operations.
22:08 Why the secret to a happy family business is never working in the same building.
23:48 How to force your sales team to average 25 units—double the national average.
25:12 Why 45 minutes is the "magic number" that defines a modern car delivery.
25:27 The "Stopwatch Audit" trick to find out exactly where your deals are dying.
26:45 Ending the "Print-Scan-Shred" insanity to reclaim hundreds of lost staff hours.
33:45 The "Clock is Ticking" mindset for stealing B2B market share from competitors.
41:53 Why the "tech shortage" is a myth fueled by lazy dealership training.
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Filter:
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Technical
Too Afraid to Ask
Brand
Subaru
"And then Subaru, which is one of our, sort of the first store that my dad and I expanded outside of our original Ford store."
Subaru is a car company from Japan that makes vehicles known for their ability to handle tough conditions. Many people like them for outdoor adventures.
Subaru is a Japanese automaker recognized for its all-wheel-drive vehicles and boxer engines. The brand is popular for its rugged and reliable cars, often associated with outdoor activities.
Term
front wheel drive
"...that's a, that's a. Front wheel drive escape that I thought I got this great deal on, or, you know, thought"
Front wheel drive means that the front wheels of the car are the ones that get power from the engine. This can help the car handle better in bad weather and usually makes the inside of the car more spacious.
Front wheel drive (FWD) is a vehicle configuration where the engine's power is directed to the front wheels. This setup typically offers better traction in slippery conditions and is often more space-efficient than rear-wheel drive.
Car
Cadillac SRX
"Just like that. I talk about the flood SRX that I purchased off. Yeah."
The Cadillac SRX is a fancy SUV that offers a smooth ride and a nice interior. It was made for people who want a bit of luxury in their everyday driving. The mention of a 'flood SRX' means that the car might have been damaged by water, which can cause problems later on.
The Cadillac SRX is a mid-size luxury crossover SUV that was produced by Cadillac from 2004 to 2016. It is known for its comfortable ride, upscale interior, and a variety of powerful engine options, making it a popular choice among luxury SUV buyers. The mention of a 'flood SRX' suggests a discussion about a vehicle that may have been involved in water damage, which can significantly affect its reliability and value.
Brand
Mitsubishi
"We have Subaru Mitsubishi and Nissan. So, you know, all the domestics at least at least some of all the domestics and three of the Japanese brands."
Mitsubishi is another car brand from Japan. They make different types of cars, including smaller cars and SUVs, and are known for being innovative.
Mitsubishi is a Japanese automaker that produces a range of vehicles, including sedans, SUVs, and electric cars. They are known for their innovative technology and have a strong presence in the compact SUV market.
Brand
Nissan
"...and three of the Japanese brands. And, you know, they all have their goods and bads."
Nissan is a well-known car brand from Japan that makes many types of vehicles, including cars and trucks. They are also known for their electric car, the Leaf.
Nissan is a major Japanese automotive manufacturer known for producing a wide range of vehicles, from compact cars to trucks and electric vehicles like the Nissan Leaf. They are recognized for their innovation and performance.
Car
Ford Expedition
"...she just awarded the Ford Expedition, the car mom of the year. Oh, wow. And she's a very influential among moms."
The Ford Expedition is a large SUV that can carry many passengers and has a lot of room for luggage. It's great for families who need more space.
The Ford Expedition is a full-size SUV known for its spacious interior and strong towing capabilities, making it a popular choice for families and those needing extra cargo space.
Car
GMC Yukon Denali
"...go with it. But I, you know, we may go more full size, like not that expedition is about like a like a Yukon Denali or something along story short. I was like, wow, look at that..."
The Yukon Denali is a fancy version of the GMC Yukon, which is a big SUV. It has a lot of space and nice features, making it a good choice for families or people who need to carry a lot of stuff.
The GMC Yukon Denali is a luxury SUV known for its spacious interior, high-end features, and powerful engine options. It's often chosen for its comfort and capability, making it a popular choice among families and those needing a versatile vehicle.
Term
mobile service
"You know, what do you think about the fact that Ford is, you know, bonusing dealers on mobile service?"
Mobile service means that car repairs and maintenance can be done at your home or another location instead of having to go to a garage. It's convenient for people who can't easily get to a shop.
Mobile service refers to automotive repair and maintenance services that are performed at a location convenient for the customer, rather than requiring them to visit a dealership or repair shop. This can include oil changes, tire rotations, and other routine maintenance.
Why waste prime retail real estate on dirty, used car reconditioning?
The "Shrink the Footprint" strategy for building high-leverage, low-overhead dealerships.
The "150-unit rule" that dictates exactly when you must centralize operations.
Why the secret to a happy family business is never working in the same building.
How to force your sales team to average 25 units—double the national average.
Why 45 minutes is the "magic number" that defines a modern car delivery.
The "Stopwatch Audit" trick to find out exactly where your deals are dying.
Ending the "Print-Scan-Shred" insanity to reclaim hundreds of lost staff hours.
The "Clock is Ticking" mindset for stealing B2B market share from competitors.
Why the "tech shortage" is a myth fueled by lazy dealership training.
Select text to request an explanation
When we're looking to set up these showrooms,
it's really just, okay, how many sail stations do we need?
For how many cars we're gonna sail?
I mean, if an eye office is,
how many seats in the waiting room, how many bays?
Today I'm joined by Matt Stuckey,
president of Stuckey Automotive.
Dealers are being forced to rethink
how and where work actually gets done.
Matt breaks down why centralizing BDC, Recon,
and back office operations
can dramatically increase throughput,
shrink showroom footprints,
and fuel massive expansion in his dealer group.
We dive into real estate risk,
paperless operations,
and the secret behind his full technician pipeline
while others claim there's a shortage.
A big thank you to our sponsors
for making this episode possible.
I pack it.
Lotlinks and CDG Recruiting.
And now let's get into the show.
Matt Stuckey on the CDG podcast, Matt, welcome.
Thank you.
Happy to be here.
Happy to have you on.
Dude, you have, like,
three or four dealerships being built right now.
Yes.
What's going on in your world?
I think that's my main job these days
is construction overseer.
We have a great partner that's done
the general contracting work for us here
in the last couple of projects.
But, you know, that's very hands-on.
And I enjoy it.
But it does get to be a lot.
Pennsylvania, I'm sure,
is not any different than a lot of states.
But it's definitely, at least to me,
seems like the hardest place to build anything.
So, I, you know, within circles are peer groups.
We had some dealers discuss in construction.
Yeah.
And just best ways to go about it.
Anyways, I'm curious to hear from your perspective.
You're doing four at a time.
Tell me a little bit about your process.
I haven't talked a lot about this on the platform.
Almost every dealer does it.
And it's typically a pain.
It's not part of our core job.
So what has that process been like for you?
Well, thankfully, it's only two at a time this year.
I just got done with a project, though.
That wrapped in September of last year.
And we're getting ready to kick off two more.
We'll be doing a new Ford store in Belfont, Pennsylvania
for the Ford dealership there.
And then Subaru, which is one of our,
sort of the first store that my dad and I expanded outside
of our original Ford store.
We'll be building that a new location right down the street
for where it is currently.
So, yeah, I mean, building is, I don't know.
There's just so much that goes into it.
You know, most of us car guys are not always great
with the real nitty-gritty details, right?
So there's a lot of that.
And the details do matter.
So you kind of got to get down into the weeds
and flip through all the pages and, you know,
you need good partners.
So how, how into weeds are you getting here?
Are you getting down to like line items
or what's your, what's your level of detail?
You know, we've done design build on the last two
projects we've done.
And so the theory of that is, you know,
you partner with the general contractor
and, you know, you don't have like, you know,
you don't bid the actual bid, you know,
the packet of the, for the construction.
So, you know, in theory, you cut out a lot of time that way
and you kind of end up changing a lot of stuff.
As in my experience, I have bid projects over the years.
And so this, you know, as long as you can get all the,
all the stars to align and everything you need
and have a good partner on that,
it can work pretty well.
But yeah, as far as down into the weeds,
I mean, I don't get down to like what colors
we paint the walls and light fixtures and stuff like that.
Thankfully.
Oh, really?
One of the, well, one of the best parts about working with,
you know, our OEMs is they pick all that stuff.
So, you know, Subaru has a color palette already figured out.
So you don't have to pick that stuff.
But, you know, you do have to figure out what walls
you're putting where, how many offices you're making where
the walls are, you know, those kind of things.
And working with a sheet of paper versus seeing in reality
is always a different thing.
So, you know, we always go take a couple field trips,
go visit a couple stores that are going to be similar to ours.
And we have a pretty good flow from our other facilities.
We run seven showrooms now.
So we kind of know where we want the sales managers
versus the sales team or the waiting room,
you know, those kind of things.
Well, my question was, it was the next question was going to be,
how do you feel about facility standard requirements
in today's day and age?
You are a dealer specifically who's leaning very heavy
into technology.
You're one of the fastest growing dealers in Central PA region.
And with all that said, right, where is the future headed?
How much utilization are we going to get out of our showrooms?
And so that got me thinking, you're investing in four facilities
right now.
What do you think about just OEM facility standards?
If, you know, I guess obviously it's OEM by OEM.
So you can kind of tell us which stores are being built
right now at this moment.
But I know you're also building a CDJR.
So what's your, what's your take on that kind of reconciling
technology in a more technological sale for the future
and, you know, maybe less showroom time for the, for the client
versus investing in your facilities for the future.
And of course that's a, you know, the big investment up front.
It is for sure.
Yeah. So two things.
I mean, the way I see the, you know, the retail locations
and one of the things that's probably a little bit unique
about our group is we really focus the stores just on retail.
So what I mean by that is at, so there's seven,
seven dealerships at each of those,
they pretty much just take customers, you know,
that are looking to buy a car and looking to get the car serviced.
So we don't recondition or use cars in our shop for support
and foremost.
That's probably the biggest thing that changes how much space
we need and how many bays we need and those kind of things.
We have a consolidated facility that does that.
We don't have BDC in the stores.
We have BDC on one office that handles all of that,
all of our accounting, all of our administrative payroll.
Centralized.
We do all that centralized.
Yeah.
So, you know, so when we're looking to set up these showrooms,
it's really just, okay, how many sales stations do we need?
How many cars we're going to sell?
I mean, if an eye office is how many seats in the waiting room,
how many bays, that's our biggest thing.
We've really focused those around that.
Like this Ford store we're building is going to have 32 bays,
a lot of space for fleet and commercial work.
So, you know, that's, so I try to work it back from that.
And then just as far as the scope of construction,
that's where I take that to try to make a,
okay, what's it going to cost me per square foot
for how much I got to build and how much site work I got to do.
And is there a return on it?
And that's generally the equation that I wrestle with for a while
before we start one of these projects.
Why did you, I would say, why did you adopt centralized?
And then I want to talk about how you adopted it.
Yeah.
But this is a common, I would just say there's kind of two schools
of thoughts here, right?
There's certain dealers that just keep everything super decentralized
by store, maybe like accounting is the only thing
that they keep centralized.
And then there's others like yourself who I'm going to assume
are leaning into a more operating leverage and, you know,
things of that sort and just probably easier efficiency.
So tell us a little bit about that thought process.
Your third gen, I can't imagine you know,
centralized, you know, that generation ago, but...
Yeah, that's what I say all the time.
You know, my dad's job at Dines and my, you know,
my dad ran the store until about 15 years ago.
And, you know, his job and mine were totally different.
He ran a single point Ford store.
He opened the place and closed it every night.
Isn't that crazy, by the way?
How did being a dealer today is like,
you have to be like a tech wizard?
Yeah.
Obviously emotional intelligence hasn't changed.
You still have to be very emotionally intelligent,
but it has changed a lot.
It's over 400 people now.
And, you know, I have keys to all the buildings,
but I don't typically use them that often, you know,
because our team's there before and after.
You know, we have extended hours all throughout the day
and stuff like that.
So anyways, to get back to your question of how did we get
started in decentralized?
So as I got involved in business with my dad,
we bought Subaru in 06 and that was really kind of
rocket fuel for us, believe it or not,
even though that was the last real rough patch in the car
industry, right?
07, 08 were not good years.
But we were really positioned to grow coming out of that
strongly having a second brand.
And we just kept running out of space.
So in the shop, in the showroom, in the parking lot,
so, you know, it led us to different phases of parking lot
expansions, ultimately building a much bigger dealership
about 10, 11 years ago now was kind of the first
project I got involved with from a building standpoint.
And as we were under construction,
we did not have space in the shop.
We had to move the shop around a few times.
So we looked for a place to move something.
What can we move off site?
Well, the easiest thing to do would be to move
used car recon detail.
So we found a place to rent for that,
to just clean up used cars, get the pictures of them
for the internet, those kind of things.
And it led us to another bigger facility,
which was an old industrial site that I ultimately
ended up purchasing, which is like 15 acres
and 150,000 square feet of building,
including a nice office on the front of it.
So here I got this office now.
I ended up buying another dealership in that area.
Also, they had office staff that were in two different places
that just didn't work well.
So I'm like, hey, this should just all be together.
It just makes sense.
We're fortunate to be geographically relatively compact.
We've expanded it from Altoona into state college now,
but that's still about 45 minutes in any direction.
So, you know, it just really works well for us.
Part of a great Supergroup 20 group,
and one of the things that we wrestle with every time
in that group that we go is,
what is the right structure for your dealership?
These are like 12 rooftop kind of dealers.
And, you know, everybody has a different take on it.
At what volume did you introduce the reconditioning center
or like more centralization?
That is a key point.
So like 150 per month is kind of the tip,
was the tipping point for us to where it made sense
from like a financial standpoint to do the reconditioning
together just to have, because you know,
you need a couple of technicians.
150 used retail?
What are we talking about?
Yeah, sales rate.
Yeah, selling 150 a month.
Oh, total, okay.
Yeah, we're selling 4 to 500 now, something like that.
We've been trying to get it to 1,000.
We need to get it to 1,000.
It's going to get to...
I'm actually surprised.
150 feels pretty low for that pencil out,
but sure it did for you.
That was my next question.
So you mentioned state college, right?
Yeah.
College town, more like transient, I would say.
And in general, you're in central PA, Altoona.
Again, another university.
So what is it like for you?
I've had rural dealers on the pod.
I've had urban dealers.
I've had, you know, whatever dealers like every type.
But what's it like for you being in this like more transient market?
How does that impact your operations?
Whether it be marketing, retention, service, right?
It's almost like I know down here, there's like in Florida,
there's like snowbird specials or all these things.
So what is it like for you in that type of college town?
Well, bottom line is there's not as many cars sold.
You know, Altoona, if you can watch,
have roughly the same amount of permanent residents,
give or take a little bit.
And Altoona sells about 20% more cars, you know,
cars at least.
So, you know, and there's a million reasons why.
I think the transient thing is the way I always understood it.
But it's, you know, the university is,
it is a company town.
So the county's roughly 160,000 people counting a bunch of college students.
So there's like 120,000 permanent residents,
20 some odd thousand work for the university, you know.
But anyways, so yeah, so we've really, you know,
we were able to expand into state college during COVID.
That was kind of our first step outside of our original market, if you would.
I was able to get the mid-species dealership up there.
And then a year later, I got the Ford store.
And I got a Nissan point about a year and a half ago,
all kind of right around state college.
So it's close enough.
It's been a great place for us to stretch out into a little bit
and kind of take our, you know, consolidated model
and just, you know, feed a few more locations with used cars,
you know, the support that we offer through our BDC center,
our administrative team and all that kind of stuff.
And so it's still kind of up and running.
We got, you know, I don't feel like we're on plane there yet, quite frankly.
But we're getting there. It's going well.
And how, how are you channeling the focus of the team for, you know,
like what is the goal you mentioned?
You don't sell many cars or relative to maybe like a more urban market.
And so what are you, you know, you know, do you know how we learned in,
like when we were elementary school, right?
They would tell you like, oh, if one of your senses does not work
or you can't smell, suddenly you can hear better and stuff like that.
Like in that, that is kind of, you know, I think about that a lot in life.
And so with that, like if you're saying sales is not going to be a massive
driver for you in your markets, right?
What are you doing in other areas of the, of the dealership to, you know,
really strengthen your operations?
Well, I mean, I guess I was speaking more to a new car sale specifically, you know,
and there is a limited number of new cars and especially as the prices come up,
you know, we are not as affluent in areas, some of the urban areas.
So, you know, you're going to have only so many new cars get sold in each of those
towns every year.
I guess that's the kind of limiting factor.
But they're, you know, they're good markets.
They're not like rural, I wouldn't say.
So a couple of things that's led us to first and foremost, we fight hard to get
that new car share.
We want to be the leader in the markets we're in.
And we know that drives a lot of things.
But our first pivot on that really was just used cars.
And I kind of saw the light on that, you know, as I got involved in the business
here after college with my dad is just like, hey, you know, this used our markets
3X, 4X depending on the year, the new car market.
So why aren't we playing in that?
There was a big used car kind of wholesale to the public, if you will,
independent in Altoona that we ran real hard after and continue to.
And they were.
What does that mean, by the way?
When they say wholesale to the public, is he like not reconditioning the cars?
Is that all that means?
Well, at least it felt that way as a dealer.
Price wise more so than anything.
No, they saw it.
Okay.
So just undercutting prices.
Yeah.
You know, a quality retail car, just at a margin that we couldn't quite catch
or didn't think we'd catch for a while, but ultimately did.
You know, Matt, it's funny because like, you know, people like people used to ask,
oh, can you grab me this car from the auction?
Okay.
Oh, and by the way, can you help me get financing?
Yeah.
Okay.
Oh, and by the way, it's going to need a couple of things and can we do it in the
shop?
Okay.
I mean, great.
Congrats.
You just bought a car from a dealership.
You buy from the auction, take it to the shop, you know, get you financing.
Congrats.
That's literally the point of a dealership.
You know, the market, you lived in this market.
You see the 2010s car market was a whole different market than we're living in right now.
Whole different market.
Whole different market.
And it was all about, you know, buying the, really watching those dips and buying the
cars that people wanted when they dipped and they dipped every year at some point and
just had to, you know, get close to near the bottom of the dip and not the top.
And, you know, I got stung by that cycle the wrong way a couple of times and just realized,
hey, you know, we got to do this a lot differently.
And, you know, some of those same principles still apply.
The difference is just the supply is just, I don't know, when's it going to come back?
I know.
I know.
It's a whole different world, right?
Yeah.
It just, it feels like there's so much more money in the economy in general.
Yeah.
And, you know, the deals, you know, deals of the past on vehicles at least, it's like,
that doesn't exist anymore.
The market has just gotten so efficient.
Cars at a $400 payment.
That was like our bread and butter.
Wow.
Yeah.
And boy, you don't get much for that anymore, unfortunately.
Tell me more about used cars then, right?
Yeah.
So it's a big part of your just dealership strategy.
I did notice that, by the way, when I was taking a look at your stores.
Yeah.
Like, what is your percentage of total gross that would you say that you're attributing
to used and I want to kind of get into what you're doing there?
Yeah.
So, I mean, we grow, you know, total dollars.
We definitely gross a little bit more off use than new, but that does vary and fluctuates.
We've had some, you know, pretty solid new car months and years here the last couple
of years.
So previous to 2020, we were three times as much used volume as new.
We're about two right now.
We're fighting a claw to get back above two and we'd like to get it to three.
And has that been driven by fewer use sales or more new sales?
Our use sales have been per store.
So like the existing stores are definitely down a little bit.
You know, we've added a few, we've added four stores in in the last six years.
So, you know, that's kind of muddy the water a little bit as we look at how we really want
to compare year-over-year, but a little bit more used cars company-wide, a good bit more
new cars company-wide.
And that's, you know, kind of converged the, you know, the ratio of new used, but the average
average new car dealer still sells less used cars than new cars.
So, you know, so that's been, I think back to what I was talking about earlier, that's
that's been part of our pivot to how we build our business just focused on the market.
We're in, you know, right?
There's, there's good opportunity in new cars, but it's only so big.
We can do even a bigger job on used and, you know, that's, that's the driver.
So obviously you got to be price competitive at that.
Having the consolidated recon being able to really, you know, control those costs, make
that as efficient as possible, make the process as efficient as possible.
I mean, I purchase two to 300 used cars a month, something like that with one guy.
Wow.
When you say with one guy, how are we doing this?
What's your, what's your strategy?
He's amazing.
He's just awesome.
He goes to the auction typically two weeks a month, you know, for one to three days,
depending on where he's going.
But the right, you know, we can buy wholesale through a simulcast.
So we do a lot of that proxy, proxy bids and stuff like that for options.
Yeah.
All that.
Yeah.
And you know, you can always buy cars because right, you can always pay more than the next
guy wholesale.
Is the trick is, can you, is that something that you can retail and have any kind of a,
of a, you know, good equation come out from that.
Yeah.
So what is his, what is his source of leverage to buy 300 cars a month?
Right.
We said some proxy bids, some simulcast.
Yeah.
Are we, are we doing anything else?
Does that include like buying from the off the street?
What's your, what's your strategy?
A little bit off the street that mostly goes through the stores.
And, but no, his, and he oversees that.
So he also oversees all the appraisals as well.
You know, he doesn't get called on every appraisal, but he's kind of always on call,
you know, and involved in these talking to the, to the desk managers all the time about,
you know, where the market's at and how we can get more, you know, we try to get as many
vehicles off the street trade ins as we can.
We're always willing to pay top dollar for just about anything.
Cause we know where to take it, right?
Retail or wholesale.
So it's just being efficient.
And we actually, we weren't going to the auctions at all before 2020.
It was probably 90 some percent simulcast, you know, the condition reports had gotten
good enough that we could really feel like we could trust them.
The supply was there and, you know, different market.
How do you feel about condition reports today?
They're getting better, but, you know, there was just no vested interest in the auctions
to do it well for a while there when they had no supply rates.
So we, we, you know, over the last few years, it definitely spent more time in the lane
than we used to.
Um, but, you know, man, IPA still isn't running cars in the lane.
So how do you, how do you square that?
I don't know.
It's definitely a crazy world.
I know.
Do you have any, uh, preference towards your specific auction when it comes to condition
report?
Like, do you feel like there's any just variability between auctions and the reports they put
out?
Or do you feel like it's kind of the same across the board?
Honestly, I learned a long time ago also that I was not a good used car buyer at the auction.
I still remember.
By the way, kind of know what you're not great at and what you are great at.
That's a, that's a.
Yeah.
Front wheel drive escape that I thought I got this great deal on, or, you know, thought
it was four wheel drive and turned out to be front wheel drive.
That's why I got such a great deal.
We've all been there.
We've all been there.
Just like that.
I talk about the flood SRX that I purchased off.
Yeah.
So that was, that was a fun one.
You mentioned your buyer.
Mm hmm.
So not, I'm genuinely asking this, not sarcastically, but what happens when he goes on vacation
for a week?
Uh, and even if he doesn't vacation, but yeah, he does.
Yeah.
No, he gets, yeah.
He takes, he's got kids.
He takes, he takes trips.
Yeah.
I have just like, I have all, I have dealership PTSD from single points of failure.
Yeah.
Sure.
Because, you know, when you're, when you're starting from like very small, just like everything's
a single point of failure and you're just like, you know, I gotta get that.
And he can, you know, he knows what, when he wants to not, I mean, when he wants to
be aware and, you know, just work it out.
And there is, there's some redundancies and we need to, you know, the guy kind of heads
up our whole sales operations very soon as well and a few other folks.
So we're probably due to put another person into the mix with that, but, you know, one
of our ethos is just to be as efficient on all the stuff as we can and, and it, it works.
So.
Yeah.
And maybe they're listening right now and they'll reach out to you.
Yeah.
Maybe they're out there, you know.
That'd be great.
Yeah.
It wouldn't be the first time.
I promise you that.
Let's talk, you know, lots of dealers really enjoy the personal side of this conversation
as well and in the podcast.
So let's just talk about that.
Like, do you have family in the business?
Is it just you today or what's, what's that like for you?
So I'm the only one of my generation in the business.
I have two younger brothers who both chose to do other things and not come home.
So they, they live on parts of the country.
I'm the only one who came home.
I worked for a bank for a couple of years after I got out of college and kind of decided,
like, you know, I was running a retail office for them.
And like, this is not too different than what my dad does.
And I can own the thing in a period of time if I want to.
So, so yeah, I've just celebrated my 23 year anniversary here with our company here.
First is my start date as an adult.
And so my dad is a second generation.
I'm third generation and but my grandpa passed away really young.
So he was just 60 when he passed away and, you know, built the business, worked hard
didn't take care of some things in his, in his personal life health wise that he probably
could have that, you know, unfortunately, you know, let him not to have as long a run.
So so my dad stepped out at a pretty young age.
2009, I got to take the reins of the company.
I was just 30 and, you know, I've been been able to do it since then.
My kids are still pretty little.
So they're getting to be teenagers here.
We got a got a little while yet to boys.
Do you do you see a future for them in the business?
Yeah, I'd like them to be able to do it if they want to.
That was one of the other big important points to this.
We transitioned ownership from dad to me was, you know, myself or my brothers had to want to.
And also, we weren't going to work together.
So, you know, if both my brothers had decided they wanted to be car dealers,
we would have been separate car dealers, not not the same car dealers.
What drove that decision?
I think my grandfather's generation of, you know, just not getting along as well
family wise, you know, there was some of that in the original generation.
And and family is more important than work, right?
So, you know, trying to try to have those boundaries.
And we certainly have seen it go mild to wild with our peers.
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You seem like a very analytical person in the 26 minutes we've been chatting here.
That's sort of how I see you, you know, analytical, very thoughtful, kind of, you know,
know what you want or you have a good vision.
You don't seem very like cavalier.
How are you building your new stores?
Of course, there's OEM requirements, but beyond that, right?
Talk to me about tools and in order to future proof them and to, you know,
really build for the future where we're going.
How are you thinking about that?
Probably the most important part is just to keep the RPMs going.
My sales guys average 25 sales a month.
We've been doing that for 10 years now, you know, the industry is still at 12.
Yeah, that's higher. It's double the industry.
That changes everything quite frankly, you know, obviously changes are the way we do
our compensation plan. It changes how many staff people we need to sell,
how many cars we want to sell, you know, my desk managers, how many finding it,
all that kind of stuff.
So tie that back into how we're going to build the footprint of these stores.
It really just comes back to what we think the throughput of that location is going to be.
You know, when we were sitting here and like six years ago,
when everything was starting to shut down in Cova in Pennsylvania was, you know,
one of the most restrictive states.
I went crazy during that time, quite frankly, well, not literally, but nearly.
They're not the only one.
One of the questions was, OK, is the model going to change?
Like, are we going to, you know, people not want to come out?
Are they not going to buy cars first and foremost?
And thankfully, the answer to that was, yeah, well, yes, they are still going to buy more.
How are they going to buy them? They can buy them all online.
You know, that was one of the big pushes.
We thought we'd be able to transact everything online.
And, you know, quite frankly, we do a lot.
We talked about the BDC, you know, 40 percent of our deals are handled through there.
And so, you know, a lot of the folks show up to the dealership pretty much
all they need to do is sign the stuff, make sure everything's right on the car.
You know, let us give them a tutorial on how it all works and get on their way.
So I think continuing to evolve that thinking of just how, you know, how much time does it take?
And that's that's another thing we really push on every single day.
We deliver cars in less than an hour.
So from the time when the customer tells us they want to buy the car,
they're out of there in less than an hour and 45 minutes is our target.
You know, to do the paperwork.
Do you track that?
Like, do you do you actually track this or is this just like a cultural value?
It's kind of like we have gone as far as putting stopwatches at the desks.
When we feel like we have issues with that, because obviously with, you know,
seven stores and, you know, sales team of 150 people or something like that,
sometimes we're not living up to that standard.
But we almost always hit it, I should say.
Yeah. You know, but the only way you hit that is how consistent process.
You know, you got to have all the steps done right and the team working together
and really looking at, you know, where it's going well and where they can make it better.
And, and, you know, it doesn't take that long to sign paperwork.
It's just a matter of getting it all put together and ready
and and efficient and that kind of stuff.
So that's where circle back to where you started from.
You know, that's that is where it's getting better.
We're about to make a big leap here with the DMS change that we hope is going to really get us.
We still use way too much paper, you know, we're still very paper to sell cars
and service cars and and there's there's ways to not, you know, yeah, anxious to get to that.
Can you tell us about your DMS change and what's driving that decision?
We've been an automate dealer.
We were we were really keyed in with them for a long time.
And, you know, they was there was a sale with them here a few years back.
And quite frankly, that's just not quite been the same.
So so tech, you answer the prime one we're looking at.
We are looking at a few others.
But, you know, we're just really anxious to get a system where we can
like our process and sales and services do all the stuff we do.
You know, you know, printing a bunch of paper to deliver a car to complete a service
arrow. And at the end, then we scan it and shred it and throw it in the trash.
Recycle it. Yeah.
You know, how is that a good way to do it?
You know, it drives me nuts.
I see the paper coming on skids, right?
Doesn't make any sense. Yeah.
So you're you're looking to just completely evolve that makes sense.
And OK, a huge amount of time.
I mean, you know, obviously the cost of the paper is probably not that huge,
honestly, in the grand scheme of things.
But but the time it's just inefficient, it's inefficient.
Yeah. No one wants to do that.
OK. And what about integrating, you know, voice AI?
I want to say text AI in your stores.
Yeah. Have you done this already?
Are you planning on doing it?
What's your thought there?
Yeah, a little bit.
What we've we really are working on.
We actually were just, you know, one of the main things we were working on
last week in NADA with with my team, you know, was how we use the AI to augment
our, especially our BDC team, because what we found and you know,
you saw this when you're on the retail side, Jesse, like, you know,
every cardio just has some nuances to it.
And to be able to to really connect with the consumer, there needs to be a person,
you know, kind of just think of like if it's a symphony, you know,
conducting the symphony and making all the stuff work.
So how you how you work that back to, you know, using the best technology
and and chatbot AI kind of things.
And we just installed a new phone system last fall.
This just made a world of difference.
And it has a bunch of auto attendants and different things.
Which one is that?
Which phone system do you use?
Yeah, go to that one.
But, you know, it's it's like a lot of you can you can turn it up and down
basically wherever you want.
So we're, you know, we're using that different parts of the process
and in experimenting as time goes on, just ultimately it allows our team
to to be more efficient and to be more productive.
Yeah, I'll tell you, man, this phone system world,
I never liked that part of the business.
It was always so like opaque and like weird.
So we are headcounts about four twenty right now.
So we probably have three hundred and fifty handsets that need to be physically
there because when the phone rings and the customer is calling, we got to answer.
I know.
So that was the best part of switching the phone system was actually by the handsets.
You know, everything else now is wowed.
So yeah, yeah, I'm being phone support or being tech support for the phone system.
That was also not a fun period.
Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.
We've got a great IT team that's really helped us get a bigger in that out.
Yes.
Got to have a good IT team.
How do you network?
And there's some good ones out there.
I've, you know, I would say in the latter years, I came across some really good ones
actually in the PA area that were just focused on dealerships did a great job.
Tell me about I want to go back to brands and then touch on service.
You mentioned your Ford store.
I think you're building 30 plus bays.
So first about how do you feel about your brand mix nowadays?
And I am, in a way, asking you to pick a favorite child.
But let's follow the money.
Where are you putting?
We're investing the most dollars.
Yeah. Yeah.
Well, so Ford and Subaru is really our bread and butter.
You know, we've been a four dealer, 67 years here coming up.
Follow the money, baby store now as of five years ago, almost five years ago.
So we but we have GMC.
We have President Ashley Bram and then we have Subaru Mitsubishi and Nissan.
So, you know, all the domestics at least at least some of all the
domestics and three of the Japanese brands.
And, you know, they all have their goods and bads.
Our Subaru store has just been unbelievable.
We're, you know, top four or five in the state for Subaru,
including running with all the big filly guys in Pittsburgh.
But I really see, you know, there's been enough of a
kind of winnowing out of the brands in the US market.
You know, as we aren't adding any brands, we haven't had a new brand come in.
Tesla would have been the last major one, right?
And so they all have, I think, an opportunity to do well in certain markets.
Right. If you're in a big metro market, pretty much the brands are going
to get their market share somehow some way, maybe not with one dealer.
You're going to have three or four or five or whatever.
And they're going to they're going to get there.
But in the smaller towns like we are, you know, you really have the
opportunity to over overachieve.
So like our superstores, three times national market share, our Ford stores,
two and a half, you know, all the rest of our stores are at least one,
one and a half, getting the two, something like that.
And, you know, that's that's I think just that's a fun business to run.
Yeah. You know, we we we kind of like that model.
But we'll see, you know, we'll see if we have the opportunity to expand beyond
Altoona and stay college at some point, you know, it's just going to be
a totally different world because I don't see how we can manage the way we manage
now in a bigger, you know, distance geographically.
Yeah. On the Ford note, our friend, a friend of the podcast, Kelly from the car
mom, she has a big social media account.
She just awarded the Ford expedition, the car mom of the year.
Oh, wow.
And she's a very influential among moms.
And I mean, I shit you not like my wife is showing me that she's like,
I think I want an expedition.
Now, we just just to be clear, she just we just replaced her car like four
months ago, maybe, but it's it's already too small.
We're like, ah, we made a mistake.
A beautiful car. Love it.
Like absolutely killer, killer everything.
So I suddenly find myself considering expedition.
I don't think we're going to go with it.
But I, you know, we may go more full size, like not that expedition is about
like a like a Yukon Denali or something along story short.
I was like, wow, look at that.
Like look at what a way to get moms to want to buy it.
I mean, it's beautiful.
It's great.
And so anyways, that's my that's my tangent for you.
But tell me more about Ford service.
I one of my favorite conversations on the podcast was with Ed Roberts and
Bozard and his mobile service, you know, just absolutely massive
operation down in Florida.
Yeah.
What is your thought on just Ford service?
Are you trying out mobile?
Are you not doing that in your because?
Yeah, we do both in both of our stores.
Each have each have a van.
It's a little different in the in the more, you know, smaller towns than in
the major metro areas.
I'm sure it is.
I have big capacity.
So you call me today, you get in today.
So, you know, that's what we do is try to, you know, fill up our shop as much
as we can, but the mobile is a great way for us to bring customers back into
the fold that it may be if, you know, choosing the service or vehicle
somewhere else for some reason, when we come to them, I mean, how great is that?
It works well for a lot of our fleets.
And, you know, we're still just kind of experimenting, figuring out what the
niche is there, but we know there's opportunity in lots of different ways
with with the mobile side.
We do a whole lot of pick up and delivery shuttle driving.
You know, we're always running for cars all day long.
You know, each store has several just go and do that.
But there's the Ford business is just I just I love the Ford business.
It's great.
It's like it's like what makes America great.
You know, it's awesome.
In what sense?
It because we, you know, so we're roughly a third, maybe 40 percent B2B, you
know, where we service businesses, fleets, the biggest thing that happens when
that vehicle goes down for any kind of service.
If it's just basic or some broke is the clock's ticking and needs to get back
on the road so it can get back to doing what it's doing.
Of course.
You know, all the businesses that we serve.
So so we just kind of run hard after that side of the business and that leads
to all kinds of really cool things.
It allows us to employ a great team of technicians.
You know, we've got the brain surgeons of the car world working for us.
I have like, I think I'm up to about eight Ford senior master techs now
between the two stores and, you know, most stores just have one.
And what's your, how did you achieve that?
I mean, those guys have worked for us for a while in almost all cases, and
they just keep doing so they just grew longer and more.
Yeah, they just grew internally, able to increase their capability and
efficiency and all that stuff.
And, you know, they're, they're just great contributors to the
keeping people's vehicles rolling for him.
You know, what do you think about the fact that Ford is, you know,
bonusing dealers on mobile service?
Does that incentive play into your decision making?
Or is it just not enough right to really change the processes for you?
What do you think about that?
Yeah, I mean, well, it does.
Obviously, it probably doesn't quite pencil as well without it.
But, you know, this is a director from the top.
I mean, Jim Farley has been the, been the pusher for, for mobile for several years
now, and I think he's definitely, you know, he's definitely in the right vein.
I mean, we got to, we're, what's the percentage?
It's, it's under half that dealerships is a total retain of, you know, customers
coming back to them for service.
And there's a lot of reasons why.
I mean, we certainly always fight the, the stigma that it's the most expensive
place to get your vehicle service.
We're not, we're absolutely not.
We're, we're generally, you know, mid to lower tiers.
Or we, we, what we target for on all of our basic stuff, we do have, we do
expensive repairs because right when your engine breaks, we're the guys who can fix it.
But, you know, the, so to, to come to the customer is always good.
And that's been, you know, that's been part of one of the things we've done for a
long time and we do that as we're selling cars too.
We'll bring the car to them and let them, you know, take a test drive, check it out.
If you can't get out to us for whatever reason, and in almost all cases, the
customers come into the luck as they want to see all the other cars too.
But guess what?
Just offering that is, is a great way to, you know, to just solidify the relationship.
Yeah.
So seven rooftops and growing.
There is a trend in our industry right now where you're seeing more private
equity back dealers or, you know, investor back dealers, right?
Less mom and pop or just, just different forms of financing, which is also a
byproduct of the fact that dealerships have gotten so expensive.
Right.
You know, fewer open points, blah, blah, blah.
What is your plan?
Are you looking to acquire more?
Are you using your own capital?
Are you bringing external financing beyond just normal bank debt?
Like, what's your plan?
I'm really fortunate to be able to not have to go outside of, you know, myself
in some good banks.
And, but I realized, you know, like this 20 groups, I know, man, almost everybody
else has some version of, if not private equity, certainly some partnership.
Really?
Wow.
Okay.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I didn't expect that.
Yeah.
Everything's gotten so expensive, maybe not actual private equity funds behind them,
but, you know, they're just a group of family offices or stuff.
Yeah, those kind of things.
And, you know, and it's, and even in, even in the smaller towns, everything
is getting more expensive, you know, I'm working real hard to keep these
building projects within a number that I think I can swallow, but it gets more
expensive every year and I can still get real estate relatively cheap.
Yeah.
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And in your area, what are the acquisitions?
Is it like low eight figures or what is it?
Yeah, it just depends on the ones.
You know, for instance, a couple of the stores that we've bought were
either, you know, negative or we're certainly not doing much.
And, you know, we paid for them.
So trying to figure multiple out on some of that doesn't make sense.
You know, all stores profitable today.
We got a couple that are struggling.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Yeah, it's been brand.
We last last year, definitely the tables turned, you know.
So we got a plan over.
We're close.
We're not we're not off by much, but we definitely need to we definitely need
to get our stragglers up to up to speed.
Yeah.
And even for the ones that are struggling, would you say you are sort of in
line with the market and what other dealers are feeling?
In other words, do you think it's being driven by the brand over supply
and stuff like that?
Or is it more like store specific?
How do you feel about that?
Yeah, I don't, I don't, you know, I don't get to see that with our local
competitors, obviously, but just from what I see across the country through 20
group and whatever else and where we're at, you know, our issues, we just, you
know, we had a nice run up with kind of the post COVID market and all that
kind of stuff.
And we, we acquired a couple of stores during that time that just haven't
quite got on plane yet.
They're on track to be there.
Just not there yet.
And then, you know, obviously, you know, used cars have been a little bit more
challenging.
We didn't have as good of a year as we'd hoped.
Certainly the second half of last year, that's really, we're waiting for that.
Nice.
It better be starting here in the next few weeks, right?
We're coming into spring to actually concede weeks away.
Hopefully not a five Memorial Day.
I know.
Amazing.
Um, I mean, dude, Matt, this has been super fun.
Yeah, I agree.
Um, what else can I say?
I mean, what are you most excited about?
What's nice?
You know, one thing we didn't talk about too much, which I don't think you
quite get into as much, but it's, it's near and dear to me and our operation.
And we've really put a lot of effort into is, uh, we talk about technicians and
where we get these master technicians, but we work really intentionally and,
and, uh, closely with a lot of the career and tech centers in the markets that
we're in, uh, really the Votex.
And, uh, uh, boy, that's just a great thing.
If all dealers need to just get to know those folks and embrace that, uh, the
two, the, the tech centers in both of our markets in Altoona and state college,
the main ones, uh, actually have waiting lists right now.
Can you believe that?
Wow.
Look at that.
How, how had the tables have turned?
Yeah.
Yeah.
And, uh, and, and, and these are great jobs.
You know, we, we typically, uh, bring the kids on in their senior year of
high school for the high school kids and, you know, they work force part time
and then work through the summer and they got a job waiting for them when they
graduate, if they want some of them go to college, some of them go on to, you
know, further automotive tech or other kinds of schools, trade schools.
And, uh, uh, it's just a great pipeline.
So we have, uh, and we're doing more with colleges now too.
So we hire college students and, you know, I have IT, I have marketing, I
have all these kind of tangential things now that I can put, uh, interns and,
and recent graduates into amazing, um, you know, I think really having that
focus on a pipeline of, of, of young folks coming into the industries is key.
It's really important and certainly something that is.
And I remember being in high school and the trade school, all the students
that attended trade school with like, I think leave a little earlier, you
could just, you knew when people went to the trade schools and it wasn't cool.
That was like, uh, oh, they're going to the trade school and they're not
going to college and all that.
And today, I mean, you're seeing white collar workers being replaced now.
And I mean, who knows what the future holds for entry level lawyers and
finance and finance and I mean, it's just such a different world.
Yeah.
Um, but it feels like, yeah, it's totally changed.
And, you know, another, I mentioned Ed earlier on the pot at Roberts, but
another thing he said that I loved, which is he said, you see, there's no tech shortage.
I said, there's a shortage of training.
Right.
There's a training shortage and education shortage.
And I was like, you are absolutely correct.
That's sound, that just makes sense, right?
People need to be trained.
Yeah.
Um, so that's, that's really great to hear.
Yeah.
And my wife and I are both college trustees, so we're not against college.
Um, but, uh, uh, which college?
Uh, I'm at Mount Aloysius and my wife is at Messiah.
Um, very cool.
And, uh, and then Messiah is, uh, they're, they're, are they, is that a really
good wrestling college?
They are a wrestling soccer.
Yeah.
It's outside of Harrisburg.
I know went to college there.
Uh, I remember that because I used to wrestle in high school and I remember
like everyone talking about like Messiah, Messiah, Messiah.
And it just stuck in my head.
And I was there was, uh, you know, he wrestled 125 little guy.
And boy, he used to drag my butt all over the dorm room.
It was ridiculous.
But, uh, well, I was, um, I think I was one to five to start.
Yeah.
Both of those colleges are very focused on, uh, you know, I would call it maybe
practical education, education that had, you know, hey, you're going to be a nurse.
You're going to be, uh, an accountant.
You're going to be a, uh, an engineer.
You're going to be a doctor, you know, whatever that might be.
You know, I think that's the, the key.
And that's why trade schools make so much sense, right?
Cause you're going to go and fix forwards.
I mean, okay, I know what that is.
You know, you're saying I shouldn't pay $130,000 for a liberal arts degree.
Is that what you're saying?
It just depends.
I think there's a real case for some of that.
I think it just needs to have an, an, an outcome, you know, um, and, uh, it's
always great, you know, uh, try to, uh, for our folks and to work with our company.
I try to give them different things outside of their daily job that they can
just, you know, be interested in and, and, and open, open doors to new ideas
and new possibilities.
Yeah.
Yeah.
To be clear, I'm not a hater.
I mean, I went to college as well.
I graduated and I did very well.
Um, but I do think that the world has changed meaningfully.
And I think, like you said, it doesn't surprise me to hear now you're
telling me trade schools are backed up because, you know, the job market is
different.
And I, I think about this a lot with young kids, as I'm sure you do too.
But like, what do we teach our kids?
I keep coming back to what I learned as a kid from, you know, my parents,
which is just be a builder, solve problems, use your brain, you know, and,
and you'll be able to adapt and no, no matter how the world changes, right?
But that's what I love about this industry and this business that when
you get thrown on that car lot and, you know, whether it's a customer just bought
a car and has an issue or maybe they want to buy a car, maybe they need to
service the car, like whatever it is, you have to be a problem solver or someone,
you know, calls out and they're your single point of failure.
Like we discussed, it teaches you how to solve problems.
And it's, uh, I think it's, it is so, so just integral in the way I was, you
know, I kind of learned how to navigate the world.
And anyways, I want that for my kids too.
So I think everybody should sell a car at some point.
That's it's a great life experience.
And, uh, it is, uh, when you sit across the desk and ask somebody to spend a
lot of money and then, you know, figure out why they're saying yes or no and
get to get to, you know, an agreement and it's, uh, it's just, it's, it really,
you know, it, it strengthens you as the seller as well.
Amazing.
It's awesome.
So.
All right.
Well, this has been incredibly fun, Matt.
Matt Stuckey from Stuckey Automotive is really cool to see your growth and
please keep it up.
This is just an amazing journey, which I'm sure we'll touch, uh, based on in the
future and we'll have you back on and we'll talk about your progress.
So you're doing some great work.
Likewise.
I've enjoyed listening to your show here and, uh, was trying to get out and
catch you there at NADA last week.
It just got to be a really busy.
Oh, I wish you came.
Yeah.
The party is phenomenal.
And I had to take your, your nights next time.
It's okay.
I get it.
Do trust me.
We will also like walking around and nonstop.
So it's, it was busy.
Thanks for coming on, Matt.
Thanks so much.
It was amazing.
All right.
Be well.
Take care.
All right.
Hope you enjoyed that episode.
Please give the podcast a rating, consider subscribing to the show and check
the show notes for links to what we talked about.
Thanks for tuning in.
I'll see you guys next time.
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