New vs Old - Why Do Enthusiasts Gravitate Towards Analog Cars?
Annotations will appear as you listen
0:00
67:04
Car
Kia K4
The Kia K4 is a small car made by Kia. It's designed to be easy to drive in the city and has a unique look.
Car
Fiat 500
Car
Fiat / 2100 Familiare
The Fiat 500 Electric is a small, electric car that looks like the classic Fiat 500. It's made for city driving and is environmentally friendly.
Car
Ford Mustang
The Ford Mustang is a popular sports car in America, famous for its powerful engines and sporty design. It's often associated with speed and performance.
Car
Chrysler Pacifica
The Chrysler Pacifica is a family-friendly minivan that has lots of room for passengers and cargo. It's designed for comfort and convenience, making it great for families.
Car
Honda Civic
The Honda Civic Hybrid is a car that uses both gas and electricity to run, which helps save fuel. It's part of the Civic family, known for being reliable and efficient.
Term
CVT
A CVT is a special kind of automatic transmission that helps the car change gears smoothly without the usual steps you feel in other types. It can help save fuel and make driving feel smoother.
Car
Honda Prelude
Term
1.5 turbo
A 1.5 turbo is a type of engine that is 1.5 liters in size and uses a turbocharger to make it more powerful. This helps the car go faster without using a lot more fuel.
Car
Toyota Supra
The Toyota Supra is a popular sports car known for its speed and design. It's often talked about among car enthusiasts for its performance features and history.
Car
Nissan Z
The Nissan Z is a new sports car that many people find attractive and exciting. However, it hasn't been selling as well as expected.
Car
Honda Civic Type R
The Honda Civic Type R is a fast version of the regular Honda Civic. It's designed for people who want a sporty car that can perform well on the road and track.
Term
turbocharged six
A turbocharged six is a type of engine with six cylinders that has a turbocharger. The turbocharger helps the engine produce more power without making it much bigger.
Car
Nissan 300 ZX
Term
twin turbo
A twin turbo means the car has two turbochargers that help the engine produce more power. This makes the car faster and can improve how it drives.
Term
MSRP
MSRP is the price that the car maker suggests you should pay for a new car. It's a starting point for how much a dealer might charge you.
Term
horsepower
Horsepower tells you how powerful an engine is. The higher the horsepower, the faster and more powerful the car can be.
Term
Nismo
Nismo is a special performance version of Nissan cars that are designed to be faster and look sportier than regular models.
Car
Nissan 370Z
The Nissan 370Z is a sporty car known for its speed and handling. The Nismo version is a special performance model that has some upgrades to make it even faster.
Car
Kia Telluride
The Kia Telluride is a large SUV that can fit a lot of people and cargo. It's known for being comfortable and having many features that make driving easier.
Car
Hyundai Palisade
The Hyundai Palisade is another popular SUV that is known for being spacious and comfortable, making it a great choice for families.
Concept
pride of ownership
Pride of ownership is how happy and proud people feel about their cars, especially when they take care of them.
Car
Mazda Cx30
The Mazda CX-30 is a small car that has a higher ride height, similar to an SUV, but is still compact like a hatchback. It’s designed for people who want a mix of both styles.
Car
Subaru Crosstrek
Car
Toyota Crown
Car
Subaru Outback
The Subaru Outback is a type of vehicle that combines features of a car and an SUV, making it good for both everyday driving and outdoor adventures.
Car
Volvo V70
The Volvo V70 is a family-friendly wagon that offers a lot of space for passengers and luggage, making it a great choice for road trips.
Car
Subaru Legacy
The Subaru Legacy is a car that is known for being safe and reliable. It can handle different types of weather well because it often comes with all-wheel drive.
Car
Hyundai Genesis
Car
Ford Bronco
The Ford Bronco is a type of SUV that is built for off-road driving. It's known for being tough and is popular with people who like outdoor adventures.
Concept
analog car
An analog car is one that feels more connected to the driver and has fewer electronic features. It's about enjoying the driving experience without too much technology getting in the way.
Term
unreliable
When a car is called 'unreliable', it means it often has problems that make it hard to drive or use. This can be frustrating for people who own that car.
Car
Toyota Chr
Car
Porsche 911
Car
Dodge Viper
Car
Tesla Cybertruck
Car
Porsche Cayenne
Car
Toyota Camry
Car
GMC Yukon XL
Car
Mazda Miata
Car
Buick Enclave
Car
Volkswagen Jetta
LIVE
You are listening to the Analogue and Grid podcast. I'm your host, Victor Troyer.
Former kind of co-host Justin Pitner.
And Mainstay Dillon is what they call me.
It's the first time he's ever said it.
Well, that's what you guys call me.
He's owned it.
I guess so.
I call you whenever I show up these days.
I think I got some slobber on my pants.
Wouldn't be surprised.
You have a little napkin there.
Good job, girl.
So, yeah, well, I wiped the slobber off my pants from the dog that we have here.
Another dog.
Last time we had a Patriot.
We've had him on before a couple times.
We had Patriots.
You could hear him in the background.
All right.
Hopefully we don't hear rain tonight.
Well, I hope we're the best, man.
So today's episode, we're going to be talking about new cars versus old cars.
Ooh.
So we recently, Justin and Dillon and myself went to the San Diego Auto Show at the
convention center, which was in town this week.
Dillon wasn't with us, but he did go.
Oh, he did go.
Okay, cool.
I was like, dude, it sucked because I went and then the next day Victor is like, yo,
I got tickets.
And I just like paid for tickets and parking the day before.
And parking.
Yeah.
Yeah.
He was really close to paying parking.
I was like, whoa, whoa, hold on.
Street parking.
I didn't pay for, yeah, I didn't pay $50 for the underground parking.
Forget it.
We fucking bonkers.
We went on Sunday.
For that auto show too.
Yeah, right?
So it's a little underwhelming.
Yeah, no doubt.
What are your thoughts?
The first thing that I noticed is like when I got there and I walked in and we had walked
around for a while, we covered it all in such a short time without, without like rushing
like I sat in cars.
I like poked around, you know, press buttons did the whole thing and like was not in any
rush to leave and we still covered like everything and like under an hour with when the coolest
car at the show is the Kia K4 hatch, you know, it's a rough show.
Yeah.
Like when that's the coolest shit, like out of all the car, like I like the Fiat 500
Electric, but that's because it's like, at least it's unique, but other than that, like
the coolest car there is the K4 hatch, which is just.
I agree with you.
It was kind of the coolest car.
There was a cool EcoBoost Mustang.
You got a trucks.
Yeah, nothing, you know, nothing unfamiliar.
A 10 year old Chrysler Pacifica that's going off as a 2026.
Yeah.
The prelude had the little rope around it.
Yeah.
This and do not touch.
I'm like, it's a fucking Civic Hybrid.
What are you doing?
Like, hey, we already can't sell these minus one, not people like you get in them.
I'm like, I saw when I traded Joe's last week.
What again, like.
If I'm not mistaken to they only come in automatic.
Yeah.
It's a hybrid.
It's only automatic.
Only CVT.
That is the most I.
I don't.
I have no words.
Well, it's like Honda.
Like the like everybody's excited like prelude names coming back and then like it's going
to be a coop and they're like, it's going to be a hybrid.
But like maybe they'll make it manual.
So make it cool.
You know, Honda's done manual hybrids before and they did it well.
I've driven them.
They're they're good.
Fucking just drop the ball hardcore.
Yeah.
And then charge a fuck done for it.
It's like close to 50.
Right.
Yeah.
It's like 40.
I think four.
I think base is 43.
I think which is I was talking about this with somebody the other day.
And if the prelude was like if it had everything that made the original like prelude SI like
so cool, I think that it could maybe justify the price, but it doesn't.
If it had all kinds of cool like like tech like driver tech, like how the early ones
had four wheel steering.
If they just integrated something cool like that or even like a lap timer and the infotainment,
just cool stuff like that, then maybe it could justify it.
But automatic only CVT is just like so sad.
I feel like all they even really had to do was just put a manual on it.
Like they really only had to parts been the fucking SI motor, the 1.5 turbo.
It'll fit in there because that's the size of motor that's in it for the hybrid system.
Do I sound super loud?
No, it sounds like a pitchy.
Like every time I use an ass, it's like whistling.
They really didn't have to do much.
I don't like it just would have been a coupe civic basically again is all they had to do.
And I think it would have sold decently just to be a coupe and something unique, but they just didn't.
They did nothing.
Yeah, it's kind of a bummer.
It has underpinnings of the type R, right?
Some suspension components I heard.
Like it's not obviously a type R even though it's priced like like it ought to be.
Yeah, it's right next to it.
Like the more you think about it, the more it's just like, what were you doing?
Yeah.
Well, look, they discontinued 42 grand.
They discontinued the civic coupe, right?
So this is like the coupe now that you can buy and it obviously is bespoke.
It's really nice.
I think the styling is great, right?
It is striking.
When I first saw it at the LA Auto show two years ago, I was impressed.
But back then, I think it was going to be a fully V and everyone was just like womp, womp to that.
So the fact that it's now automatic hybrid, like it's what we expected.
I'm glad it's not fully V, but I imagine when sales start to like not be as good as they suspected,
they're going to probably introduce a manual kind of like how to super it.
Yeah, that's exactly my thoughts too.
And the Supra is the perfect car to use as an example of that.
Yeah.
But I don't even think the manual Supra has done that particularly well, right?
Well, it's taken over sales.
It's like, I think 80-20 now.
No one's buying automatic Supras anymore.
But then no one's buying Supras anymore in general.
Yeah, it was like they definitely sold that well in general.
Yeah.
Now the car that Justin is amazed that is not selling, and I agree with him, the Nissan Z.
Dude, yeah.
I think it's so good looking and I haven't driven one like in great like a lot or much
at all.
I've only kind of driven one around in like a lot.
But I think they're striking to look at.
I personally think they did a pretty good job of new to old.
It's relatively analog.
So I, and I never, dude, I never see them.
I never see them.
I never see them either.
I've seen like maybe, maybe four.
And that includes one that's on Nissan's lot because I drive by it on the way to work.
Last I checked, they had only sold under 2500 nationwide.
Dude, that's brutal.
Yeah.
And they lose value fast, too.
But that was months ago, but still, I think it maybe is doing a little bit better now.
But yeah, they are not.
People aren't buying them, I guess.
Dude, and I got one at work and it was cheap.
Like they don't seem to hold value well either.
Like I think it was like 36998 or 35998.
And I'm like, that's, that's cheap.
Like that's a decent amount of car for that money.
No, the value.
That's less than a type R Honda Civic and you're getting a front engine, rear drive,
400 horsepower turbocharged six.
Yeah.
The value is there on that car.
No doubt.
When you think about like how much you can pay for like a 300 ZX today.
A prelude.
Right.
Like, like my 300 ZX, right, with over 100,000 miles is worth close to 30.
A twin turbo.
Mm hmm.
You can get, you can now get a really close to news,
like slightly used Newsy for that price.
And that one only had 6,000 miles.
God forbid you find one that has like 20 to 30,000 miles.
That's probably low 30s.
Which one are you referring to?
The one I got at work was had 6,000 miles or 4,000 miles,
which is wildly low.
And it was, I think, because MSRP on those is like close to 50, right?
Yeah.
It depends.
There's the Z, was it the performance?
They have the Nismo.
And then there's the Nismo, which is the top of the line.
It was a performance.
Yeah.
Which is like the mid-level.
Okay.
But you can't, you now can, but you couldn't get the Z Nismo in a manual initially.
But now they.
Oh, you can now.
You can now.
Oh, that's news to me.
See, that makes the Nismo, the Nismo Z exciting because I liked everything that they did to
the new Nismo Z.
I was just disappointed that it was automatic.
And I get it.
It's supposed to be a performance car.
The automatic is better, faster in every way for racing and track performance.
But I just feel like you could still have all those features, have the cool seats that
are in it, the racing seats, the body kit, the arrow and just make it a manual and tune
it a little bit for a little more horsepower.
Yeah.
Because people will buy it because it looks great.
Like the Nismo looks great in my opinion.
Does the Nismo have more power than the regular Z?
Yeah.
Not by much.
I must say, well, because remember the Nismo 370 barely had any more power than the regular
370.
A basic tune on a, a basic tune on a new Z will make it, you know, equal.
But all the other stuff, suspension, adjustable dampening, this and that.
Yeah.
Is what separates it.
What other highlights like cars that you saw there that were like, like the tech and
the tell your ride.
I love the tell your ride.
Tell your ride is pretty cool.
I've always loved the key to tell your ride, but the new generation, like I even saw one
on the freeway the other day and I was like, wow, that looks like, you know, a $300,000
like Rolls Royce or Bentley SUV.
Right.
Yeah.
The tell your ride and the new Palisade kind of take design like the same design language
like the front end with those little blocky LED, I don't know if it's LED lights, but
it's like a blocky like layers of headlights and headlamps and all that.
I will say, I do think Hyundai and Kia, Hyundai more so than Kia, but I think both of them
are doing styling pretty well right now.
I'm liking most things are coming out with a decent amount when I'm not, when most other
brands and cars that are coming out, I'm really not vibing with.
Yeah.
Like most cars, like they come out with a new design and it's like worse than it was last
time.
I'm like, oh, yeah.
No, I kind of like that Kia and Hyundai have gone back to like using that like blocky kind
of like eight almost eighties styling.
And I think all of their cars are in their lineup are pretty good looking for the most
part.
The EVs, I love like all the, the Genesis stuff, all the higher end Kia stuff, like
the tell your ride, really stylish new cars.
That one made a big impression on me at the auto show.
Yeah, I agree.
Because like you said, the Kia, the tell your ride, tell your ride.
Yeah, that was pretty cool.
The Kia K4 that we saw there was the new hatchback, I guess, version of it.
We were just like kind of comparing like where does this fit and like, you know, the customers
cross shop and things like that.
Yeah.
But you're starting to see more like little hatch wagons.
Like when you look at a CX30 Mazda, obviously the Crosstrek and Subaru's like been doing
wagons.
But like, I think people are starting to want higher ground clearance, but in like a car
size.
Yeah.
Like not an SUV or crossover.
Like the Toyota Crown, for example.
And that's why I mean the Crosstrek was on one of the top selling cars.
So that makes sense.
Yeah.
It's not necessarily an SUV because it doesn't really look like an SUV, but it's also not
a car.
It's totally not an SUV.
I would consider it like a hatchback or a wagon.
Right.
So I'm starting to see like, I noticed that at the car show that there are more options
in that segment.
Yeah.
You know, like I told you a few weeks ago about the Outback, like for the longest time,
the Outback was really like the only like wagon you can buy unless you like found somehow
found the E 350 wagon or you found like a Volvo V70 or whatever they made.
But for the most part, that's like the most popular wagon.
Now you're starting to see little smaller versions.
The Toyota Crown comes to mind.
The Crown Signia.
When you look at a Crown Signia, it's a different shape than the Crown.
Yeah.
But it, you know, because it's more of like an SUV, but same thing, like it has a little
bit more ground clearance, but it kind of doesn't look like an SUV.
The Signia does more than the Crown Crown is just like an SUV that's been, I guess,
lifted.
I mean, a car that's been lifted.
So yeah, the Crown is an odd one.
It's, it's, it reminds me of, have you ever seen like the old Subaru Outback sedans?
Outback sedans.
They make an Outback sedan.
I know they had the legacy.
And it is considered a sport utility sedan, and that is precisely what the Toyota Crown
is.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
Look it up, Pitner.
Subaru Outback sedan.
Yeah.
Because the legacy.
I remember.
That was from like the early 2000s.
Early 2000s.
Yeah.
But it was like that kind of same like ideal, like a lifted.
The two tone too.
Let's go.
Yeah.
I forgot seeing those.
It's basically the legacy before the legacy existed.
No.
Yeah.
The legacy didn't exist yet.
No, I believe it did.
Interesting.
Wow.
So the front end is, is Outback and then the rear is legacy.
Interesting.
Okay.
I like it.
Well, let me pose this question to you guys because clearly we were unimpressed with the
auto show.
Yeah.
There were a few cars that we liked, right?
Obviously Kia and Hyundai, Genesis, you know, I've said many times are the most exciting
automaker right now on the market.
Another thing that I think is worth mentioning is a car that I thought was cool to just see
them put on display just because this is not the type of vehicle you would typically
display at an auto show, but Ford put out like a base, base, base model Bronco.
Did you see that?
With the steelies?
Yeah.
Yeah.
With the steelies and like plastic cladding and the smallest engine option.
Yeah.
I was actually showing Justin it because I wrote an article for hot cars saying that
the, the base model Bronco with the steelies, you just add some, you know, all terrain tires
to that.
Yeah.
Two door.
So you want the shorter wheelbase, you know, they go, I mean, it has the four cylinder.
They go for like brand new, like a little under 35 grand, I think.
And to me, that's, that's the one you want for that price point.
Not bad.
You know, cause you can pay up to like 55 for a Bronco.
They go up there.
I think even more.
But it was cool that they had this base Bronco there that people were sitting in and walking
around and looking at because like I said, that's not the flagship.
Right.
Well, they had the heritage edition there, which is their flagship with the white grill
and the doors were all open.
And that was kind of like the one that a lot of people were attracted to.
But the question I want to pose to you guys is we were unimpressed, right?
But I feel like as enthusiasts, we're unimpressed because we gravitate towards the analog car.
We don't care about the tech as much as, as we do the character that the car has, right?
Like we want a car that's obviously older, maybe has more, just less is more actually,
right?
For us as enthusiasts.
So what do you guys think?
Do you feel like new cars?
Is it just the generation or is it because I'm I'm an older generation.
I gravitate towards older cars because I remember them as a kid.
You guys, a lot of the cars you drive, you don't remember as a kid, right?
But I wanted to ask you like, why do you think we gravitate towards those older analog cars
rather than the newer stuff?
I think so many reasons.
There's a ton of reasons.
I've been kind of thinking about this on and off ever since the car show because initially
I wanted to just kind of say, well, it's because cars aren't very analog anymore.
But it's that's more than either it's, it's definitely deeper than that.
A lot of it cars don't just feel necessarily well built anymore.
There's not a single car to look at the auto show and just go like, oh, I would be willing
to trust or want that car.
Pricing's got to a point where nothing's affordable, like I guarantee that little Kia
wagon was probably up in the thirties, like I'm like, or high twenties and there's just
not really anything that affordable anymore.
Everything's just kind of so mashful of tech and that's kind of all you're really getting
and all the tech really isn't that good.
One thing I mentioned to Vic is a lot of cars tech is not that good.
Like tablets 10 years ago is about where car tech is now.
As far as like responsiveness, overall usability, some of them aren't even like user friendly.
So it's like, you have all this tech and it's not that user friendly.
You're forced to have the tech.
You don't have an option to not get a techie version.
You don't have the option to get like a base car really anymore in general, even like the
base versions are relatively expensive and still chocked full of tech at this point.
Yeah, the average sale price, the average price of a new car is I think close to 49 grand.
It's almost 50 grand.
And that's crazy because I used to be like, I used to be like a dream slash future car.
Like when you've made it now, that's like your average price of the regular consumer car.
Yeah.
And I think the big thing is like a lot of these new cars that are full of screens, they don't
they just don't feel durable.
Like you don't see like elements of like stuff that's overbuilt, you know what I mean?
On the interiors or in the engine bay.
Anywhere, everything you see just feels like it's going to last even less long.
I remember seeing something because a lot of new cars are proving to be unreliable.
Like like brand new cars off the dealer lot from all, all manufacturers, like not saying
even Toyota cars, but like everybody at least, yeah, even Toyota, but everybody at least
has one car that is like not building a strong reputation in its first few years.
And so it just makes me think that like older cars are better.
Like remember seeing like just better in every way, mechanically, the design, there's just
less to go wrong.
I think they've gotten too complicated and too efficient.
There was an article that somebody sent me.
I didn't get a chance to read it, but it was about the argument that engines have like
reach the peak of efficiency and everything going forward is just going to be a less durable
long lasting engine, which in turn, if you think about it is bad for efficiency because
you have to produce more engines and they don't last as long.
Yeah, not only that, but so cars also because of all the tech and the way everything's going
and everybody's doing the same thing with a slightly different flair.
Like on top of all else that was mentioned, every car is the same.
Every car is a big tablet screen, sometimes two in the center.
If you have an AC control, that's all tablet controlled.
Every car feels kind of the same.
You get in every vehicle.
It's just slightly different styling that's over styled and has screens for the gauge
cluster screens for your center cluster screen for HVAC.
If you get in a luxury car, that's like that seems to be the big determining factor at
this point of his luxury or not.
If it has two screens or one screen in the center console.
Yeah, that's another thing.
It's just screen like everything feels the same.
Every car you get in, like none of them really have touches of uniqueness.
None of them have touches of personality.
It's just the same car remanufactured for this brand.
And while if you pay more, you get a couple more features like, oh, will you get a
Bose sound system or you get a panel roof, which comes in relatively lower model cars.
Like you don't, everything feels the same and everything has the same turbo charged
motors. You can't even go to Toyota anymore.
That's all turbo charged at this point, except for, you know, a select few.
Yeah, there's a lot of copycatting.
Like ironically, it seems like some of the electric cars, like the most unique cars.
Right. Yeah, absolutely.
Like, you know, I drove a Rivian the other day and even that drove surprisingly well
and like had some unique features.
Let me see.
Go ahead.
Do we lose you?
Typical difficulties.
It sounds like maybe sounds like you're not on.
Yeah, well, I hear, I hear something now.
He's just got really loud.
Can you hear?
I can't hear.
Oh, wow.
He's on his own.
Because he's on one.
Oh, okay.
Now you can hear me, right?
Yeah.
Okay, cool.
All right.
You know what it is?
He's on.
He's usually not on one.
That's why aren't you normally on one?
Yeah.
All right.
Well, we're back.
We're back.
Welcome back.
Yeah.
But yeah, I agree.
That's a good point is that it seems like the electric cars are more like they're taking
more risks with design on the electric cars.
And sometimes the result is really beautiful looking.
Yeah.
And unique.
Mm hmm.
Like the I mean, think about it.
They don't have to incorporate a grill so they can they can have a car that has entirely
different brand recognition with a whole new front fascia.
That's stylish and efficient.
Obviously, aerodynamics are huge on an electric car.
So they're making them swoopy and slippery and kind of cool looking.
A lot of them, even like an Ionic six.
Yeah.
Well, five.
The five.
Dope.
That's a little like Tron looking car.
The little squared.
Oh, yeah.
The six.
I like the six.
The rounded one.
A lot of people don't like it.
I like it.
It's like a teardrop.
Yeah, I can't do the styling on the six.
But regardless if you like it or not, exactly.
And it says they took risks with the styling.
And I'm seeing that, like you said, more on electric cars.
And I never really thought about that until you mentioned it.
Yeah, it's an interesting point because like now that automakers are pivoting back to ice
engines, right?
Because for a minute, they were like ready to just, you know, get rid of all the internal
combustion engines and just Ford's like, we're done.
No more cars, only electric going forward.
All the brands are saying, yeah, I know.
But like still, like even Toyota, Toyota always said, no, hybrid is the future.
We're not going to fully invest.
But then we have like three or four electric cars of the auto show.
Yeah, they did add that.
You see the CHR they added now.
Yeah, that's all electric now.
They redesigned the BZ.
You bring up a good point.
Like a lot of these companies are just looking at each other and just replicating what everyone
else is doing or copycatting what everyone else is doing with interior dashboards and
the tech, right?
I always thought tech would eventually become like just outsourced to Google or Microsoft
like companies that do it well, rather than automakers making infotainment screens still,
you know, because I really can't.
Right.
Well, my thing though is like, what else are you going to do?
Well, let me go back to the question.
Why do you feel that you gravitate towards the lesser, non-techy, you know, vintage cars
that you guys feel?
I don't need any of the tech.
The only tech I think is decent is Apple CarPlay and that's easy to add in pretty much
any car at this point.
And you don't need a giant screen for Apple CarPlay.
That's the other thing.
I can't say that cars have massive fucking screens.
You don't need a TV.
You can get a single-den carplay if you want.
Dude, and that's cool.
I know I almost got one for my car and I'm like, that does everything you need carplay
to do.
You just need to be able to see like the direction you're supposed to go.
You need to make sure you're not going to run over a child with your backup camera.
The reason these screens are so big is people literally just fucking stare at them.
Have you ever seen somebody back there?
I'm going to go on Test Drive and literally they go to backup and they just stare at the
screen the whole time.
No mirrors, nothing.
I'm like, dude, you're going to kill somebody.
I saw Doug Demiro put a little single-den Apple CarPlay in his 996, 993, 911.
Yeah.
Not a bad call.
They do make them.
The screen is like, what, two by two?
Yeah.
Steve has one in his Viper.
Oh, okay.
Yeah.
Nice single-den.
They're pretty much just as good as modern OEM screens.
And they look like a period correct, right?
Ish, because it fits in that area.
So yeah, I mean, that makes sense.
I think you bring up a good point, right?
We've already talked about this on the podcast.
You mentioned words like character.
It's type, cars that are older and vintage.
When you park them, you look back at them, right?
Today, I feel like we get excited for new cars when they're new, right?
And they're obviously like new in the sense that, well, no one has that car.
Like I can flex, like a Cybertruck.
When the Cybertruck came out, everyone wanted it because it was out of this world.
It was something so crazy that people were going to chase you down the block to go and
get pictures of it, right?
That's like in the first, what, maybe four or five months, six months, right?
Now once that's faded and now no one cares to see a Cybertruck anymore, now you're stuck
with a $40,000 appreciation.
Yeah.
Not more.
So people paid way more than MSRP for those and they're just cut.
So here's my take and this could be a hot take.
I think we gravitate towards analog, vintage, classic cars more so than maybe ever.
I feel like the community is growing, right?
Because you guys are young.
Obviously, you're still in your 20s.
You're into cars because you love them since you were young.
But I think the car scene, the modern day car scene, the reason why we're not excited
about new cars that are coming out and being like, because I don't think people back in
the 80s weren't excited when a new car came out and they were driving 60s and 70s cars,
car enthusiasts.
Yeah, they were excited because it still felt like a car.
I want you to continue your point and then I'll go later.
So I think a lot of it has to do with the direction of the auto industry.
It's going in this direction of crossovers, SUVs, cars that are kind of mundane.
They just kind of all look neutral.
There's no more nice colors anymore.
So people are okay with that.
People think of an automobile today as just a means to get from point A to point B.
This has always existed.
There's always been people that didn't care about the car.
They just wanted to use it as a means of transportation, right?
That's its purpose.
But my point is, is the cars that are new are SUVs, right?
The cars that people care about or excited about are SUVs.
No one's excited anymore for like a two-door coupe.
Like back in the day, there were coupes all over the place, right?
But today a prelude comes out.
It's like cool because like, oh, wow, they're making coupes still, but no one's going to
buy them.
Let's face it.
Yeah.
No, I think what you're saying and something that I've observed is like just regular people
used to love their love and appreciate their cars back in the day.
And now they don't like, even if they weren't necessarily an enthusiast who is washing and
working on their cars every week and they had pride of ownership.
And I think a lot of that is faded like with more leases and this and that.
Right.
Yeah.
And cars were built.
Like, I remember sending you that video on like the W124 S-Class, they built that car
like the same Land Cruiser of the same generation to go 300, 350,000 miles.
Like the parts were built to that standard and they tested Land Cruisers, not just in
normal sunny Southern California terrain, like they put that thing in deserts, making
sure like these parts were tested, tried and true.
So that way that car, they could almost guarantee 300,000 plus miles on that engine.
Right.
People now probably don't even care if the car will go 300,000 miles.
They don't care.
So they're not going to make cars like that.
Part of what's making a car enthusiast is the thing less interested.
Like every car you look at feels like an appliance.
Even if it looks cool, it's like, okay, it's just an appliance, how long is it really
going to last?
This is not a car we're going to see 30, 40, 50 years from now still on the road, like
a lot of the cars that we've gotten to experience.
I think that's part of like, and also I think cars are just kind of peaking, like they
can't really get better in the way that car companies used to constantly fight to make
them better.
The constant fight was how quiet can we make the interior?
How smooth can we make the suspension?
How well can we make the suspension react to all the terrains that you're going to hit
on a day to day?
How good can we make everything feel when you shut, click, touch, push on this car?
Cars haven't done that now for at least 10, 15 years.
It's just been a tech game because tech became introduced with like touchscreens and GPS.
And then that got a lot of people excited because now it's easier to have that in your
car.
So now you can have GPS factory.
That was a big thing.
And then, but once you have GPS, you already have a screen, well, no, I don't take that
step farther.
Now we're going to, you know, use it for multiple things.
We're going to connect it to your smartphone that everybody has in every pocket at this
point.
And they're an appliance in quite literally every single way.
And it's only, but it's like every single car does the same thing, but you can't really
make them better.
They're all just the same.
It's just like pick your flavor of styling and some of them are faster and some of them
aren't.
But none of it feels good.
Yeah.
And cars really can't get faster now, like in terms of production, like production cars,
like the only limit at this point is like tire technology.
I mean, like a Tesla Plaid can do a 1.9 seconds, zero to 60, like, like what's the only limiting
and they have to do, they have to use traction control so that the torque of the motor doesn't
just rip all the tires off.
Right.
So like cars can't really get faster, which maybe is another reason tying this into a
topic we've talked about in the past that like enthusiasts are gravitating towards cars
that like don't, they don't need to have a lot of power.
Yeah.
Speed is becoming something that enthusiasts and even just modern day car buyers are not
necessarily looking for because anybody can experience it.
Exactly.
It's like diluting the desire of it.
Right.
If it's plentiful, then it's like not going to be that special to have a car that can
go fast.
Right.
So what's special now, right?
That's kind of the point where we're getting to is like, when you look at these new cars,
there's nothing that sticks out other than tech to your point, right?
That's special.
Like tech is all the same.
Like you're not really like, I'm sorry, you're not really using tech in your car that often.
And if you are, you suck at driving.
Okay.
So let's just take automated cruise control, for example.
Right.
Let's say you're sitting in a modern C class, right?
It has beautiful ambient lighting.
You can change the color, the ambient lighting on the front of the seat and it could have
different color in the rear of the seat.
You put on automated cruise control.
You're going down the freeway.
You're chilling.
Right.
Great.
Right.
Such a nice experience in a car.
But like, are you going to like desire that feature in your analog vintage classic car?
No.
No.
Like you don't, like it's, it's cool to have in a new car because it sets a vibe.
And again, that's a feature that's going to be really cool for one and a half months.
And that's going to be the same thing in your car.
Every time like, oh, wait, you know, I got to change the color.
I'm getting kind of tired of this one.
It doesn't feel fresh anymore.
Right.
And then you're going to run through the colors.
Right.
And also you're never going to choose yellow because who's going to choose yellow and like,
what is your go-to ambient lighting?
Okay.
I really like purple and pink.
I think it matches like almost any interior.
And then in cars, I hate red.
Yeah.
I'm blue or coral.
In cars that have like a tan or beige interior though, low key and nice orange ambient light
makes it feel a little older because, because orange is like the color that is on so many
cars.
I can picture like a becker cassette.
Yeah.
But there's, I don't know, man, cars are just really becoming, they're not going to really
get better.
I think that's part of it too.
They're not going to get better.
Like they're not going to get more impressive.
They're already there.
Like how do you get better?
Rolls Royce literally had to make their cars slightly louder when the newest ghost came
out because they made it so quiet that it was upsetting the nervous system because the
human body wasn't wrecking, like it was moving, but there was no signs besides visual and feel
to tell you the car was moving.
So they literally had to pull back on the sound ending a little bit so it doesn't affect
you in a way that makes you nauseous.
And it's like, so if we're already there, like what, okay, you can't get quieter now.
Yeah.
You can't really get smoother.
In fact, I feel like cars are bumpy than they used to be.
Every car I drive is on 20s and stiff.
So what more tech, what more tech can come out that's going to be like, make people
race to the dealerships, which the more we talk about this, it kind of makes me happy
because the only thing I can see brands doing is be like, oh yeah, people want to show that
feels good again.
Yeah.
I have an answer to that question, but it's not the answer that enthusiasts want to hear.
Safety tech.
Yeah.
Safety tech doesn't bring people to dealers unless they're going to the Volvo dealership.
Right.
You know, well, here's another thing I wanted to say.
So besides that SUVs are kind of the new future of car building, right?
Every automaker has nine to 15 SUVs and like three sedans, right?
So we see the direction that they're going and no one, no enthusiasts, no one's excited
about SUVs.
Those are just, it's the practicality.
I mean, yeah, we like them because they're, you know, they're obviously practical and
you know, they make little slopey ones now that are fast and whatever.
But my point is, is the other take that I wanted to say earlier was when you're a young car
buyer, you're usually thinking of what is the best bang for your buck, right?
So like, for example, you guys go out and cross shop cars, you're looking at fun cars
that are obviously checks a lot of boxes.
And when you look at a new car today, if a brand new car or even like a slightly used
one is 30 to 40 grand, it's a lot of money to invest in a depreciating asset, right?
Also with housing costs at an all time high, like that's, I think part of the reason cars
are doing what they're doing is because there's not the only people buying brand new cars
like regularly and keeping the market going are people that are doing well enough somehow.
Yeah.
And like where are the type of people that car enthusiasts, I'll sell, I'll try and speak
for everyone here that prefer something that has character that's older, that's vintage
that when you park, you look back at when you sit inside of it, you can smell that something
leather or whatever scent that just, you know, keeps bringing you back to one of the experience
again, you know, when you're behind the wheel, but it's also the fact that you're buying
a car that's not that expensive, right?
Like, like think about like most classic cars, you can be so satisfied.
There's so many cars we can think of under 10 grand and be so satisfied has enough safety
features.
It's not going to, you know, you wrap it around a pole, you're still going to, you know, survive.
It's not going to be crazy unless you get something maybe pre airbag.
But like, it's just, it's something that it's worth every penny, right?
It's hard to justify buying a car today and saying, oh, this car is worth every penny.
You go out and buy a Maserati Gricale for 82 grand.
In two years, it's worth 40.
Two years.
Two months.
The more you drive the thing up, the lot is worth nothing.
And that's that's a cool crossover SUV, you know, you see like the Modena or the Trofeo,
like those are, those are pretty cool.
But yeah, but I'm also the, none of them are pretty, like nobody makes like a real pretty
SUV.
Like cars also used to be pretty and cars aren't pretty anymore.
They're just hard to do a funky.
Unless you get like one of those like coupes, you know, like a GLE coupe, right?
They make those now.
Like for every single pretty much, you know, I would say even the entry level SUVs, there's
like the GLC coupe now, the Cayenne has a coupe, right?
Right.
So like those are a little bit sexier looking, I guess, right?
But regardless, it's, you're right.
Like it's not a sports car.
It's not going to look like it's not going to have the lines of a sports car.
Yeah.
That's what I'm thinking about.
There's like a surprising lack of cars that have sex appeal.
Yeah.
And we haven't really talked about kind of universally gorgeous.
Yeah.
Or just that, like, I wonder a lot of that comes from the fact that like all the stereotypes
that were garnered around so many cars that were cool.
Like if you drive a Porsche, you know, you always use euphemisms towards who owns different
cars.
Dylan's really good at that.
And I wonder if part of that is like why cars have gone the direction they are, because
now you don't want to go buy one of those cars because you might be looked at as like
a douchebag or somebody that's like not cool.
Like, oh, you bought a car that like attracts looks.
Yeah.
Small dick, dude.
I wonder how much that affected the market as well, because like everything's SUVs, but
it's like, OK, then where are the cars that are actually like you just want to look at
and buy just by looking at it?
Like there are certain cars that you just look at them and you know, there are problematic
car, but you're like, I still want to fucking buy that.
I know why.
Have you?
When was the last time a new car came out and it was designed by Pininfarina or designed
by Jujaro's like the answer is not one you want to hear.
Yeah.
Vin Fast.
Pininfarina.
I didn't know that.
Vin Fast is designed by Pininfarina.
That's pretty fucking sad.
At the car show.
Fuck yeah, Vin Fast.
Justin saw Vin Fast and he's like, dude, why is this Vin Fast look good right now?
Oh, wait.
Yeah, they had the bigger one there.
The VF9 looks good.
It looks great.
Why does this Vin Fast look so good?
VF5, I think it is.
VF9 is the big one.
No, it's a small one.
VF6, VF5.
I don't even know.
It fucking doesn't look good.
Yeah.
And it was universally praised for being shitty to try.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Hey, you liked it though.
Pininfarina design, baby.
Yeah, but I didn't like it like Pininfarina.
I didn't like it like damn, look at that fucking car.
I wasn't like, I want to buy it.
Yeah.
I want to go back on a point that you made because I like what you said.
You said that you feel like an old car is worth every penny.
Right.
And like that's so true because if you're an enthusiast who knows the market and especially
even more if you know how to work on cars, then there are so many used cars that are
a tremendous value like even older depreciated luxury cars.
There are ones that can be fairly reliable if they've been maintained and like they'll
have the features that like a new car that costs the same has their better built and
they're way cooler.
Yeah.
I mean, less is more when it comes to a classic car, right?
We don't need all that tech, like you said, we don't really need to have all the safety
tech that these new cars have.
It's nice to have.
It's not a it's not something like you'd be bummed.
Oh, wow, this car has, you know, lane departure warning, but like the end of the day, like
we're good drivers.
We don't need it.
And also, I can't fucking stand when cars beep at me.
Yeah, I cannot stand when my car I'm driving my car makes a noise.
I'm like, no, you're not going to tell me how to drive.
I don't know.
It makes me so mad.
Like what was like, oh, the fucking Rivian I drove.
It beeps and bongs and boops like the entire time you're driving.
I'm like, dude, this thing's going to and has no motor noise to cover up anything.
So I'm like, I'm going to lose my mind.
About lane keep assist.
I cannot stand it.
I can feel it in this year.
Who's fucking control here?
Yeah, exactly.
I'll show you.
You guys can't see this because they're going to be listening, but this is who control.
Yeah.
Well, this, this will help me transition to my next point.
So I don't know if I talked about this on the podcast, but back there and I think it
was Thanksgiving break, I drove in my first Waymo, right, which by the way, Waymo is
in San Diego downtown Dylan's face.
I will never.
There is a guy mapping that they drive in it right now.
They're mapping and it's not the Jaguar.
It's in that weird little, it looks like a, it looks like a ID buzz almost.
Was it a Chinese car?
I don't know.
I hope not.
It probably is Dylan.
They're mapping San Diego roads so that way we can be like where I lays out right now
where it's full, like there's Waymo's Waymo's coming down the block every two minutes.
Nothing like killing more jobs, brother.
But let me tell you this, this is the direction people are going to get.
Like they just need to get from point A to point B.
Obviously it costs money to spend on a trip, but if they can get the cost down because
there's no driver to pay, right?
And now it's like five bucks to go 50 miles.
People are just going to do that.
Fuck it.
I can already see.
Especially in cities.
Yeah.
Yeah.
That's, I mean, you make a good case.
Yeah.
The whole point of not having someone in the car is so that way you don't have to pay.
There's no overhead.
Obviously the upkeep on that car with all the sensors and everything that probably need
to be, you know, making sure they're cleaned and they're not dusty and, you know, things
like that.
Bro, I can already see being a game to like, like if like driverless cars, especially for
like ridesharing stuff become more popular, it'd be such a fun game.
It's a fucked up game.
But just like to fuck with all the cars that are driving themselves because you know,
they're going to do this.
People are already doing that.
You know, they're going to do the safest maneuver.
Like I know it's common to cut Teslas off because the car will stop.
Like there's not a way to turn that feature off.
Yeah.
And so could you drive in the skies?
We were like, well, hey, dude, if they're all driverless and you're driving your car
still, you'll never have to worry about waiting in traffic because you just cut off a bunch
of cars to get where you're going to go because they're not going to road rage at you.
They're not going to not let you in.
They'll just be like, oh, sorry.
And you'll just pull through.
Yeah.
That's going to be fun.
And it won't even stop short.
It'll somehow just manage to slow down gradually.
Yeah.
Even though you just jumped out in front of it from the sidewall.
Yeah.
Because you can see like the middle of the second you start turning towards it.
It's like, oh, he's probably going to drive in front of me.
And that's going to be fun.
It happened to me.
A guy just came right.
He j-walked right in front of it and it just gradually came to a stop and gradually continue.
Dude, what would you have done if it's like just took the car out?
I would have been like, you deserve to do.
You're just on the back seat and the guy just rolls over the car.
You're just like, oh, fuck.
The way it was just like, the way it was just like, you're still on your way to your location or your destination.
It just doesn't care.
It's not a human.
It's like, now we're not going to stop.
Hazard or head.
You are still on the fastest route.
Whoa.
What was that?
Well, I'm telling you though, it drove better because like what?
Because there's no emotion behind it.
It doesn't care when it gets there.
Two hours later, you know, I had some other, you know, guy didn't even speak English,
drive me from where we went to back to the hotel and it was a way worse experience.
Dude, sometimes Uber drivers are no fucking chill.
Yeah, yeah.
The fucking car smelled like smoke.
The guy's hitting every bump at like, like 30 miles an hour more than he should be.
You know, we're in a residential area where it's speed bumps and he's just like, like sending it.
Bro, did I ever tell you about the fucking Lyft experience I had in Vegas?
No.
I went to Vegas for my birthday and most Lyft riders are fine.
Like we got picked up in escalates most of the time because we had a pretty big group
and the guys were always just cruising like comfortable.
I'm like, okay, cool.
Like I'm not that scared of driving.
You know, I don't like riding rideshare.
I the first time I ever did was in Vegas and I was 20.
What, 28?
I turned 28.
I don't.
I never take rideshare.
I hate being passenger, especially with somebody I don't know.
So I just I've never done it and it's fucking expensive.
But in Vegas, you know, we're drinking and doing that shit.
And I just didn't want to be driving like that.
So I would hope we got lifts and all of them are cool.
So I'm like, getting comfortable.
I'm like, awesome.
Well, thank God this lift.
I was hammered.
He was driving an infinity QX 80.
So the giant SUV, bro, that fool drove like an indie car driver, but he hit curbs and shit.
And he was fucking talking about how fucking sick his car is.
And he's flooring it in like flowing through traffic, like driving crazy, making last minute
turns sharp as fuck.
Like the whole car is silent and he's just still talking.
And at one point he's like, oh, yeah, I just got the transmission replaced.
And again, I'm hammered in the back.
Like I'm already scared.
But like, thankfully, I think being like super drunk was like, chilled me out a little bit
because I would have probably told him to slow down.
I would have been pissed if I was not.
And I like, look up at the gauge cluster because I'm like, there's no way this
was over a hundred thousand miles.
So he drives like this.
There's no way his transmission lasted.
And I looked up 48,000 miles of the thing and I'm like, that means this guy drives
like this 24 seven.
Like, and it was, but dude, it was crazy.
Like he drove insane.
So he was like, mean, pinned to win everywhere.
You're pro Waymo.
Mildly, I had to be safer for everybody involved.
Tell us your gripes, Dylan, with Waymo.
I think so.
We got a one month free trial of the full self driving on my mom's model three.
And when I would borrow it, there was a time where a couple of times where I
tested it and there's a lot like that.
I know Waymo is more advanced, but like that did not feel remotely safe using the
Tesla full self driving, not remotely safe.
It was getting close to cars.
And the worst and arguably the most dangerous part was it was not assertive
enough, right?
It needed to be more assertive.
Yeah, it was too cautious.
Yes.
So let me tell you an example of me observing a Waymo from me driving.
So this was in LA cars double parked with the hazards on and the Waymo is in
that lane.
So I'm in the left lane, right?
But I'm behind.
So I'm watching it and I'm like telling my fiance.
I'm like, let's see what it does.
Does it just stop and just stay behind this double parked car?
That shouldn't have been there anyway, right?
Bro, it slows down, puts on its left blinker and just goes around him and then
goes back into the right lane in front of that car that was double parked and
then stays in the right lane of and approaches the traffic light.
I was fully expecting you to say it just sat there for 30 minutes.
I think I think though.
Here's the caveat.
If it didn't have hazards on the car double parked, I don't think it would have
known, right?
How would it have known that that car is double parked and there's no cars in
front of it, right?
Like I'm sure it has enough of ability to see.
It could be by mapped out roads, like knowing that car is not where it's
supposed to be.
I think it would have stopped and then it would have said, okay, it's
unusual that this car stopped for this long with a green light because it
could probably see the way the Waymo recognize the fact that it had hazards
on because that would just be light.
It needs to recognize people's turn signals.
Of course.
So yeah, that's crazy.
Bro, it's insane how good it is.
I'm going to go on the record here and say very soon people will be taken
Waymo's without any fear.
They'll all be doing it.
Did Uber has to be shipped?
Very soon.
I'm talking like Uber will just buy all the cars.
Bro, less than a year.
It'll be in every city, every major city.
Dude, that gets rid of rideshare.
That gets rid of food delivery.
Dude, that's with the exception of New York City because New York City, like
they're really cracking down on even lifts and Ubers because of the yellow
taxis.
So they might like be opposed to it.
Sure.
But look, at the end of the day, like I said earlier, people just want to be
able to get from point A to point B without paying too much money, right?
And safely.
If there's no lawsuits on, there's going to be way more car accidents
due to human area than there is on AI, right?
It's scary.
It's a scary thought, but at the same time, that's the future in my eyes,
at least.
I agree for rideshare.
It's definitely the future on quite literally every front.
It's more so just like, man, like how many fucking jobs are we going to take?
Well, like how many things are we just going to take away from humans though?
Like it's pretty wild.
Yeah.
There's like people make that argument for a lot of different things like AI,
but like I feel like those it also creates other jobs like simultaneously.
Like there's going to have to be people who are like monitor.
There's going to have to be people monitoring there.
Those Waymo's people servicing them.
And I don't think it's it's going to be as detrimental as some people expect.
Yeah.
Yeah.
But how much of again, that's now more corporations being in charge of more jobs.
Like, I mean, technically they are now because Lyft and Uber are basically just
a massive corporation that basically just pays you what they want to pay you.
But I don't know.
Well, good thing we're not a, you know, economics podcast.
We're just a car podcast.
We don't have to worry about that, but also driverless cars.
That's scary because if that becomes more prevalent also, that just one more push
for driverless cars would be the norm even for regular people.
Well, look, we always will worry that electric cars are going to like be the
end of classic cars and no one's going to drive cool vintage shit anymore
on the roads.
It's not going to be it's going to like the more electric, the more tech gets
advanced, the more people will gravitate towards classic cars.
And another thing we've also talked about before on that same note is it's
never been an easier time to own those vintage cars because of 3D printing
and and CAD and everything else.
Like if you can't buy parts, you can make them.
Right.
And you can source them through the internet by just figuring out, oh, wow.
Little did I know my GeoStorm, you know, intake manifold is also the same shape
as the one on, you know, the Oldsmobile Aurora.
Okay, cool.
I can find an Oldsmobile Aurora like whatever.
Like there's, there's parts been sharing that you can do, right?
And you can discover that using the internet, right?
Yeah, you were back in a day.
Maybe someone say, oh, this part's unobtainium and not dink outside the box
and say, oh, let me check.
Maybe it is a similar fit on a like maker model, you know, like I remember
my Montero, the EVAP canister was straight out of a 3000 GT.
Yeah.
And I found that the 3000 GT in a junkyard, not another Montero since
that was way more 3000 GTs, I think the Monteros, at least I never see Monteros,
by the way.
Well, I think I don't think that second gen Monteros, not third gen Monteros.
Yeah, they definitely was still out there.
I don't think there was necessarily more, but the 3000 GTs were just kept
like by more enthusiasts.
Right.
So I want to talk about some classic cars.
So or not too classic in some cases, but Justin bought a car recently
and you bought a car recently.
So let's start with your car.
So you recently put out a nice little reel on the Toyota Cressida.
Oh, yeah.
So that's one that I'm selling with work.
So yeah, we did pick up a Toyota Cressida.
Talk about it.
I don't know much about them because I know they came to the U.S.
and then they stopped after the 80s.
So it's it was basically Toyota testing luxury Japanese luxury in the U.S.
Gotcha.
So that was like the test for like Lexus, basically.
I mean, when the Cressida came out, Lexus was still years away, but Toyota
wanted to see if they could sell a kind of more traditional American
style luxury car in the U.S.
Because the Cressida in very many ways is feels like what Americans
of the 80s would have wanted in a luxury car.
It has the plush seats with buttons and crushed velour.
You know, it has the type of creature comforts that Americans want,
like the cruise control and heated mirrors and that sort of thing.
And it's a the best part.
What I think makes the Cressida cool is it's an inline six rear wheel drive.
Oh, wow.
Yeah, really inline six rear wheel drive.
The same engine from the Mark III, the early Mark III Supra, the 5M GE.
Yeah.
I didn't know that that that makes that car reliable and fun to drive.
Well, inline six is, you know, yeah, but it's one of Toyota's less reliable
engines.
They're known for popping head gaskets, even the GE's.
Okay.
So that that's part of the reason why you don't see Cressida's as often.
Yeah, I mean, I thought like he said, fancy Camry, you know,
front wheel drive based, maybe a V6.
So it's an original.
Rear wheel drive.
Yep.
Cool.
ES more when the new when the first yes, but in terms of like size and market
position when the when the ES came out, that was more or less kind of like the
replacement for the Cressida because the LS was like a full sized luxury car.
ES was, I guess, a more direct replacement.
Okay.
Yeah, that's a cool car.
When I saw that you put together that reel and that you bought it, I was thinking
like this is a perfect example of a car that came to the US.
It came in wet, right?
Like the name plate lived on and now it's like forbidden fruit to import one
that came because they did continue it.
The name plate, right?
In Japan.
No, I don't think so.
I don't think so.
Oh, wait.
I'm thinking crown, my bad.
I'm thinking crown.
So because the crown is still Toyota name plate, but it's like the luxury full
size, right?
Right, right.
Um, but Cressida, we actually got.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Okay.
Yeah.
That's what I confused a little bit, but, um, I just think that car, like when you
look at it, you see like, like a boxy typical 80s K car, you know, but with some
luxury features, right?
So yeah.
And then can I talk about the car that I bought?
That was one we bought for work.
Yeah, you're right.
Go ahead.
But I got a 1977 Akano line, uh, four by four.
Akano line.
Yeah.
Akano line, 250 big block Ford V eight, 7.5 liter.
Jesus.
Um, yeah, and it's an original, well, not original technically, but it's a four
wheel drive conversion.
And it's like a body on frame, four by four.
That's pretty much that you can use for van life.
Yeah.
Right.
Yeah.
You can like deck it out through the whole kitchen sink.
I'm going to deck it out partially.
I'm going to put floors and walls and a roof in it and a foldable bed, but I
want to use it as a motorcycle hauler.
So let's put motorcycles in the back and strap them down for the desert.
What about you, Pitner?
You bought yourself another GM product.
Oh, that's right.
I bought the GMC Yukon XL Denali.
Forgot.
It's been a while, right?
We, we actually talked about it on the part.
I was like, is he talking about the Miata?
I can't remember.
I talked about the Miata.
I remember the last podcast though, like the whole episode was Miata.
Yeah.
So what do you think?
Yeah.
I know you always wanted a Denali.
Yeah.
It's great.
Drive's great.
Um, the GMT 800 in general, I'm definitely loving more and more as time goes on.
I was definitely more 900 and, you know, K2X over time.
Uh, cause I do like multiple gears still, like just going upgrades and doing
the stuff I usually do, but, uh, it's pretty incredible.
Bless you.
It's pretty incredible.
A, how well those vehicles held up.
It's pretty low miles.
That's about 98,000, but when you drive it, it really, and this kind of goes
towards the fact that cars really haven't got much better.
They just got bigger.
Yeah.
It drives incredibly well.
Like the transmission shifts kind of exactly I expected to every time just
kind of smooth and seamless.
Um, the motor has plenty of power, uh, and it's quiet inside.
It rides butter smooth.
It rides smoother than I think my Escalade did.
Well, like genuinely, I think that 800 drove better than my Escalade did.
The Escalade, it felt smooth, but always felt kind of stiff.
The older, the 800 felt nicer than the 900 I had.
Um, as far as like overall smoothness, I never probably take corners a little
faster, but yeah, I was going to say it's probably, it feels that way with 800
just cause it's a little more like floaty and less like focused on.
Yeah, but I like that.
Like it's a fucking giant.
Yeah, exactly.
Why should a giant as if you should never have to take corners fast.
Right.
Like I don't care that everybody else is driving 100 miles an hour.
I think like people don't want that like, um, body on frame, you know, body
roll type of feeling when they're driving a car.
So I feel like automakers are trying their best to eliminate that because
people are used to driving unibody cars and SUVs today.
So when they do make a body on frame SUV, they want, they want to make it with
the least amount of body rolls possible, right?
In case you do end up taking a corner at high speeds.
Which is probably good for most people.
Yeah.
I mean, most people, like I was saying earlier, the crossovers, they, they
want to just be in a comfortable car.
You know what I mean?
So GMT 800, I think is a good example.
And we've, I feel like we're playing out this, this platform, but we've all
owned one, right?
So we can speak to it, but it's a, it's a perfect example of a car
that's worth every penny today.
You buy a people mover.
Like if you're looking to buy a car, cause you need a vehicle for
eight passengers, right?
There's a few, there's a bunch of minivans you could think of, like an older
Sienna, whatever, like you can find for around 10 grand, right?
Maybe like 20, 10s or early 20, 10s, you know, LE, XLE, whatever, right?
And you can find, we're going to tell your project car.
Right.
So it doesn't check every box, but an Yukon, a Suburban, Denali XL,
Escalade, GMT 800.
I mean, we're talking right around 10 to 15 grand and, and you're
going to have a people mover for a nice example.
Yeah.
For a nice example with decent miles, you're going to have a people mover
that's, that's going to get you to from point A to point B and tow and have
a third row and have, if you get an XL, you're going to have plenty of
storage.
How many cars would a third row today have room in the behind the third row?
Right.
Just the long wheelbase SUVs still, there still isn't like, they literally
the only two I can think of off the top of my head.
Well, technically three would be like a Chevy Traverse, a Buick Enclave,
Nissan Pathfinder and Infinity Q.
And even those don't have nearly as much space behind the third row.
They're more space behind the third row than a short wheelbase.
Yeah.
Like a Tahoe or a Yukon, but definitely less than the XL.
Yeah.
So, so why would you then go and buy a 2023?
Let's say GMC Yukon for $55,000, $60,000, when you can pay a fraction of
that and get the same thing and you know, cause it's tried and true that
that six liter Vortec is going to go almost 300,000 miles easily.
Right.
So why even bother?
That's, that's my point when I say that's, that's just one example of
why we gravitate towards the old perfect, the GMT 800 is the perfect
example because like the nicest one you can possibly find on local
classifies is like eight grand and even cheaper, even ones on the cheaper
side, you still can feel confident that they're going to be turnkey and
going to last a long time.
Yeah.
And the reason why people don't buy them is cause it's just, it's,
it's not a new car.
Yeah.
It's going to feel old.
It's not going to have new body roll.
They tell, they make themselves think why they don't need it.
Right.
It doesn't have this.
It doesn't have that latest technology that we all, but like you said,
how often are we using that latest technology?
You get in your phone and play music and everyone's want to put on maps.
Like, I don't know.
Cars don't need to have a 40 in screen.
You can put in a carplay.
Obviously that's so important to you, but that's just a perfect example.
So like, you know, when, when we drove in it, as soon after you bought it,
I was just thinking like, damn, like, like why remember I was telling
you, like, why would anyone want to buy anything else?
Like this is a perfect car.
It doesn't even look that old.
It looks still pretty like modern when you, when you look at the grill and
you look at the smooth lines.
Yeah.
Maybe there's some amber lighting in the taillights.
Big deal.
Like it's still a pretty contemporary car.
Okay.
What is everybody here amber so much?
I think Amber's coming back.
I know so many people that just like amber delete headlights, taillights,
just anything they can.
It's coming back because everyone deleted it.
So now I want it again.
I don't want to hate it so much.
I'm like, it does a purpose.
It, it's just signal.
Like, I don't like, I don't want an LED.
I don't know.
I just don't understand.
I don't know, man.
I remember on my 300ZX, someone at Rancho Santa Fe came up to me and said,
you didn't want the JDM taillights?
No.
And I was like, we never got JDM taillights in, in, in the US.
So why would I want those?
Well, they're not amber.
They're white in the back.
Ooh.
Can I talk about my car?
So you got your car?
No, I didn't.
Soon though, I will.
I know.
I was like, wait, it's the new year.
So the new year means I will be buying more cars.
All right.
But let me.
Wink, wink.
Let me tell you about my Alfa Romeo Spyder, which I rarely talk about on
this podcast because I never drive it because the Milano took up so much of
your time, which is great.
So anyway, got the Alfa Romeo Spyder running today.
It wasn't starting.
No, uh, no, uh, fuel pump fuel.
Well, you didn't hear the fuel pump come on when you turned it on.
So I was like, okay, maybe it's a relay.
Finally find the relay cause chat GPT said it was somewhere else, but apparently
they thought it was a Motronic, even though I stated the year in my car.
It thought it was Motronic Bosch injection, which came later.
It's actually LGET.
We finally find it, test it.
It's good.
Right.
Then he like what he like pretty much put the fuel pump on without
the car using the fuel pump.
Like he, um, like jumped the relay wire, the relay wire.
There you go.
Does that.
So you hear the fuel pump come on, like, okay, great.
Goes to turn it on.
Doesn't still like for like 10 seconds, doesn't it cranks, but doesn't go on.
So I'm like, what the hell could it be?
And then, um, he checks, he's like, there's no fuel pressure still.
You know, so he then goes and jumps it and, uh, checks for fuel pressure.
He's like, okay, there is fuel pressure now that I, whatever, hot wire to jump
the, um, the relay.
And then I was like, wait, let me go get my jump box, get the jump box on top
cause I already jumped it previously, obviously, and it's still in the start.
And with the fuel pump, I guess get a little, you know, kick in the, in the,
in the rear end with the jump, it started.
Well, I was like, so what was it?
I was like, what do you think it was?
Like what was, what did the fuel pump sees and you needed to like do that
to get it to run?
Like the relay was still good.
Obviously like what could it have been?
He checked the cold start injector.
That was still good.
And, uh, he just looks at me with a straight face and he's like, it's a town.
Yeah.
He goes, it's Italian and he's like an old 77 year old, you know, white guy,
like kind of looks like Jay Leno.
And, and I'm like, okay, he's like, just drive it, man.
Just, just drive it like, you know, hopefully it starts tomorrow and just drive
it.
So that's where we ended up, ended up and I drove it today.
I did a nice little spirited drive.
It, I rolled right at 10,000 RPMs.
Didn't, didn't hunt cause it's hunts when it's cold.
I was like, I don't, I don't attend a thousand RPMs.
So it says 10 on the, on the gauge.
So yeah.
I'm just picturing one, two, three and four.
Just jump to the stratosphere, bro.
Hey, it's a good car, man.
It's a good car.
A little twin cam to that, that, that, uh, what is it?
Two liter.
That's a great car or 2000 CC.
Didn't that spirited drive you went on remind you of why you had that car?
Exactly.
Like honestly, all's good in the world.
Yeah.
After I got out of that car.
It's bliss.
It's like, it's, it's bliss.
It is.
You get into your car and you have that feeling.
And that's why I wanted to talk about this today on the podcast cause I
wanted to think like, why do we still gravitate towards the old cars?
Like I can drive a new car any day of the week.
And, and, and, you know, for daily use, it is easier, but like my cars are
old, like my cars are 80s.
They're not even 2000s, but we're talking like sweet spot, like mid nineties
to, you know, mid to late 2000s.
You can't go wrong with a car like that.
Cause like I said, they're worth every penny.
So yeah, any final thoughts before we wrap up and perfections?
I guess I'll say one car if, since you're saying, cause I thought about this
after we talked about the auto show, but one car I really liked and was excited
to see was the, um, the Jetta GLI.
Oh yeah.
I would a manual.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I saw that there.
Why were you excited about it?
I've always loved the GLI, always loved the Jetta GLI.
And, um, I have a friend who used to be a 1.8 turbo guy, Volkswagen, who
would build them and make crazy power out of them.
And now he swears that like the new 2.0s and those GLIs are like the
tuner engine.
Oh, really?
That they can take crazy power and hold it.
No way.
Yeah.
I didn't know that.
Mm hmm.
I didn't know that.
I always thought a GLI was just like an unreliable sports sedan want to be.
No, the older GLIs had the 1.8 turbo that has forged crank and forged rods in it.
Was it the same engine that was in the GTI?
Uh, yes.
Yeah.
Always.
Yeah.
The Jetta was just like the GTI sedan.
Yeah.
Yeah.
I was surprised to see that there.
That's actually a good find.
We did.
We walked past it.
We like, we picked that in there like, Oh, wow.
It has a manual.
Cool.
And we just kept walking.
Yeah.
I just think they're kind of ugly interior and exterior.
I just really don't think Volkswagen is doing good things.
It's just cool seeing the manual though.
Yeah.
Like I've never, I can't really crap on them because I haven't really driven them.
So they probably drive phenomenal.
They probably still drive German.
Yeah.
And they're not too expensive.
Just make sure you get the warranty.
I was wondered what Volkswagen's new ones like, like remember, they had that little
window right after the diesel gate where they had like a seven year warranty or
six years, 72,000 mile one.
And then after 2019, they went back to their, they, okay, they went back to like,
I think instead of three 36 that like four or five, it's five now.
Five year 68.
Yeah.
So it's still really good.
It's still pretty good.
But like, man, they really fucked up with diesel gate.
Yeah.
Well, I guess they needed to win our hearts for two years.
Yeah.
Hey, we're not hearts again.
We don't got diesels like at 50 miles per gallon and feel great anymore.
But we'll give you that warranty.
Hey, look, now that I got my spider back up and running in again and he's,
you know, putting a rebuilding his econoline, I think it's time.
The Buick is back on the road.
Well, that's coming.
All right.
This guy's buying, he's buying cars left and right, but yet the Buick is neglected
on the side of the road with no sunshade on it.
The Buick just leaves me drive home every day in a different car.
Just crying.
You're the freaking GM good.
I know my four car, bro.
I just got mad when I replaced the fuel pump and it wasn't that.
I'm like, you know, fuck this thing.
Well, I'll have my mechanic come over to you and he'll he'll start,
you know, process of elimination.
True.
All right.
Well, 75 bucks an hour.
She'll be back.
Hey, that's a cheap labor.
That's a good labor.
That's crazy.
And he comes to you.
All right, guys, until next week on the analog and grip podcast.
See you later till next time.
About this episode
A lively discussion unfolds as the hosts explore the allure of analog cars versus modern vehicles, sparked by their recent visit to the San Diego Auto Show. They express disappointment over the lack of excitement in new car offerings, emphasizing the character and simplicity of older models. The conversation touches on various topics, including the appeal of classic cars, the rise of SUVs, and the impact of technology on driving experiences. They also share personal anecdotes about their own vehicles, highlighting the joy of driving and the unique charm of vintage rides.
1.5 turbo
analog car
CVT
horsepower
MSRP
Nismo
pride of ownership
turbocharged six
twin turbo
unreliable
Alfa Romeo Milano
Buick Enclave
Cadillac Escalade
Chrysler Pacifica
Dodge Viper
Fiat 500
Ford Bronco
Ford Mustang
GMC Yukon
Honda Civic
Honda Prelude
Hyundai Genesis
Hyundai Palisade
Kia K4
Kia Telluride
Mazda CX-30
Mazda MX-5 / Miata
Mercedes-Benz GLC
Mercedes-Benz GLE
Mercedes-Benz S-Class
Nissan 300 ZX
Nissan 370Z
Nissan Pathfinder
Nissan Z
Porsche 911
Porsche Cayenne
Subaru Crosstrek
Subaru Legacy
Subaru Outback
Tesla Cybertruck
Toyota Camry
Toyota C-HR
Toyota Crown
Toyota Land Cruiser
Toyota Supra
Volkswagen Golf
Volkswagen ID. Buzz
Volkswagen Jetta
Volvo V70
Original notes
Mainstay Dylan and GM Guru Justin join the podcast to give their Gen Z take on why car enthusiasts prefer vintage cars. We visited the underwhelming San Diego Auto Show and share why we weren’t impressed. When it comes to classic cars, less is more. Justin bought a GMT 800 GMC Yukon Denali and we explain why it’s worth every penny. Dylan found a Toyota Cressida which will be going up for sale soon. I get my Alfa Romeo Spider back on the road.
Analog and Grit Podcast
Victor Troia
0:00
67:04