Rocky Sand

This is off track, Rocky Sand.

What does Rocky Sand mean? Um,

It's an alternative to, I don't know, like a pebble beach or something.

Oh, yeah, I get it. For reference, uh, Alex

picks a different name for himself every time we record.

Um, nobody else gets to see that other than James and I.

So today it's Rocky City, which Is good because more often than not Yeah.

A times is not suitable. Lot

Times.

Yeah. Yeah. Hey, Tim, I just found these on my desk.

Oh. What are the, I can't see

this. What do they say? Say it's

Producer, thi and Hazel.

Oh, okay. All right.

I've been meaning to give these to you for about a year now.

Okay. So

Better late than Better Never. Than never. Better

Never. Than never. .

Yeah. I'll get it better.

Never than late. I'll get it when I get my

2023 Christmas present.

Do I know what's hilarious? Did that show up? When

Was it? No,

No.

I was asking James. Oh.

Did the item That was never ordered. Show

Up.

Where? Oh, oh, oh.

I was in the airport yesterday flying home and I saw, I can't say the type of store, but I saw the same store and I was like, oh man, I forgot to order, I think for Tim's Christmas cake.

They didn't have it at the store that day, or I would've bought it.

Yeah, it's probably outta stock. Outta stock. Yeah.

It was also, yeah, they might not make it anymore.

I might have to just come up with something new. .

He's like, he's like, the store was the fricking Hudson News and he was gonna buy you like a guy with some starburst Uh, sour Skittles.

Come on now we're gonna go, we're gonna splurge for Tim's 31st Christmas surg or Whatever it was.

You're gonna, can we talk about, can we talk about how expensive beef jerky is at an airport? Oh,

It's so ridiculous, by the way, James. I

Got it.

Why is beef jerky?

Oh, . There it is. Oh, okay. It showed up after all.

Why is beef jerky at an airport like 1699?

It's also like that just, It's 1699 In California, California beef jerky Price.

It's just incredibly expensive. Yeah.

Is it, I mean, there, there's so much talk in the government and politics about inflation and eggs and everything, and it's like, what, what are people gonna like talk about the beef, beef jerky prices.

Everyone's ignoring beef jerky. Wow.

Can we call it, can we call it deflation?

I think we can . No, we can't

Do that.

We're not gonna allow that. Um, is so,

but like, so is beef jerky reasonably priced elsewhere?

No. I mean, not in California or at an airport.

I feel like it's priced better.

I kind of understand the name, like, oh boy Alberto now.

'cause they're like, oh boy, we're gonna, people when they buy our beef jerky, .

Okay, so follow up question.

, why are we buying beef jerky at the airport?

Is that just a fun airplane snack for you?

Uh, no. It's just like some of us want to, you know, try

and consume protein when we have our snacks and mm-hmm .

I feel like that's the worst thing you can have right before you get on a metal tube full of people.

Or like to eat on a metal tube full. I don't know.

I feel like it has a smell. It leaves a lingering smell.

No, some people Get gassy after they have a lot of protein.

Very fingery. And then your fingers get dirty

and smudging onto stuff. What do

You, what are you doing with your fingers, James, on a plane that would affect other people?

First of all, you just said it was gonna <inaudible> you, so I feel like No, I'm saying like, you eat it, then there's always residue on your hands.

I mean, financially. Why are you so gross?

Yeah, that was sick, Tim, what you said. Oh

Yeah. I am the weird one. Here

You are.

Grow up. Tim, where are you? I'm in Montecito.

So you're, okay. So I'm the only one that's

Actually held. Are you in Harry Potter's house?

Yeah, I'm under the stairs. Um,

yeah, .

Joby. Keep it down. Uh, .

Her name's Hazel. That's just rude.

She just left for surf camp. Oh, that's cool.

Does she surf? Do you

Surf?

She's learning at surf camp.

That's incredible. Do You surf?

I do not. I'm entirely too Midwestern for

That.

He can't even, he can't even like, barely stand up on solid ground.

Yeah, it's, it's Atri, Let alone moving water.

I knew the answer to the question.

I just wanted him to say it out loud to add to the Bears Man.

Um, how did, why did what, where did her interest in, uh, surf camp come from then?

My, uh, my aunt and uncle have a place up here and they, their, uh, their granddaughter was in surf camp, so they just said, Hey, would Hazel have any interest in coming up?

And I was like, yeah, I'll come up and pretend to not be poor for a week.

Let's go. And so we, uh, we loaded up the car, got Teddy

and uh, hit the road from Montecito.

It's pretty amazing how actually, financially independent you are that you can just leave during the middle of the week Point.

Well, when you're unemployed you can do pretty much anything you want at any time.

Exactly. I wouldn't call it financially independent so much

as it is, uh, uh, sub employed.

Uh, yeah, I brought my microphone, so I'm good. You know,

That's, it's his only job is right now is this , which is why like, when we're trying to plan out, when we're getting together for these shows, respectfully, Tim, you have the least say in when we do this . Okay.

Yeah. You know why I text to say my availability?

Because you two don't answer and I feel like somebody needs to say something to spur it along.

You know why we haven't done a Tuesday episode yet?

Because I texted Alex about his availability for a Tuesday episode.

Crickets .

To be fair, that means I'm not available.

A Alex, how many unanswered text messages on your phone today?

783 . Oh my God. Oh no.

It's so much worse than I thought it was.

Damn, I thought I was doing bad with 249 . Oh,

What is wrong with you Guys?

Oh man. Oh, it hurts. It hurts my soul and my brain.

And my heart. Dude, it's fine because,

because like, I went to bed with like 782, so I know I have one text today, Dude, do you know why it's not fine?

Do you know why it's bad for me that you do?

That is because people then reach out to me being like, Hey, I can't get ahold of Alex.

Do you have any idea if X, Y, Z?

And it's like, just Alex, answer your phone. .

I'm like your secretary half the time. Who

Is, who is asking you to get ahold of me? Well,

First, Tim, but like, let's go beyond just the people in this, in this room. .

I do it with you guys, both. Uh, . Yeah.

It's just whenever there's like a one of you will say, Hey, I'm available at this time, and then the other just doesn't answer.

I'm like, okay, I'm gonna bump this, but I'm gonna do it subtly by just saying my availability, which is almost inevitably always I'm wide open. .

I do always feel bad when like, you send a message and neither of us reply, and then one of us replies eventually, and then we're like, we're like, oh, I probably should have also replied to that.

And then so like, you get two replies within 30 seconds.

After 36 hours of silence.

I don't feel bad. I know. I just feel lucky.

horrific. So Alex, you're in Pebble Beach.

How is golfing Pebble Beach?

Um, incredible. Everything.

Um, I don't know.

I obviously the location fantastic.

Um, the amenities and, and everything are, are awesome.

Um, the weather, we all know what it is. Perfect.

The visuals great.

And so from that standpoint, um, no notes.

I was less, um, enthralled than than two of my buddies who were with me just because like, I'm new to, to golf.

So like, I don't appreciate necessarily the history of this place, whereas they were like, oh my God, this is the hole where so and so did this and, and right this, this was that moment in this US open championship and this is where Tiger did this and that's that tree, right?

And it was like, so all of that was kind of lost on me a little bit, just 'cause I don't, I don't know enough about the, the history of golf and, and um, kind of the people who walked here before me, but like, it's, it is cool.

Like it's, yeah, it's awesome.

Um, but it's also one of those things in life where like, I don't think you need to do it again.

You know, like it's, it's one of those Speak for yourself, Play a team, played it, you would want to do it again.

Has, has James Done it? A few. No, I six sounds ready.

No, but my point is like, you didn't choose to do that. You were part of charity.

I didn't choose to do whatever. Yeah.

I didn't wanna do it, but like, yes.

I'm not going back unless it's a Cherokee team do.

Right. Do you agree with kind of the overall sentiment?

Like Yes. It's, it's incredible,

but it's not something that I have to do it every single year.

No, absolutely not. Right.

And, and I feel like even when I did it, I clearly was not with people that were as into golf as you were because I wasn't getting the running commentary on like the, the importance of each hole, like the significance of this tree and what have you.

Yeah. I was more into like, the caddies that we had

who were awesome being like, so that's who lives in this house, that's who lives in that house, that house did this.

And I'm like, I found that stuff interesting.

I was more there for like the gossip pages, to be Honest.

Yep, yep. Yeah, no, that's fair.

Um, some incredible homes. Holy, holy.

Wow. My favorite.

Did they tell, did your caddies kind of give you the lowdown on some of the stuff too?

We, we went caddy free. Um,

Oh, you like caddy free. Okay.

Okay. But we, we saw the big Shot,

The Jim, the Jim Nance house, which I think is the, the hallmark house on the course, but a lot of money and commentary.

So can't wait for, uh, for you to buy a house here. .

And I can't wait to come all the time because apparently you commentate our folk, ut people make a ton.

Let me tell you about how that works.

Um, directly proportionate to the number of people watching what it is you're commentating. So, oh,

So you're gonna be buying a house in Avon, Right?

Correct. Right. Yeah. Okay. Yeah, maybe Pittsburgh.

Um, okay.

So there was this story that he told me.

So, uh, there was like, whatever, I, I guess you're along the back nine to use golf terms and .

There's like, there's like a road.

It's like the, there's the course, you know, the little two-lane road, probably 70 mile drive and then a bunch of homes, right?

So like the homes have a beautiful view of the golf course and the ocean and all that stuff.

The thing is, you know, when this place was built, underground power lines weren't super a thing.

And so we're walking along and, and the guy points out, he goes, do you notice something over there?

And you're looking and you're like, yeah, what's going on?

And then you realize that the, the power lines, 'cause the power lines are kind of right at eye level for the houses, because the houses sit a little bit up from the road.

Sure. Right? And you're look, so your view

is somewhat obstructed.

Right? And these are eight figure homes. Okay.

And so, uh, apparently a lot of the people along that road were upset that the power lines were obstructing the view and one of the power lines buried.

And so this one guy went to like the city and was like, Hey, like, can we get these power lines buried?

Like, I, I bought this house and this, this view's obstructed whatever.

And they're like, oh, yeah, yeah, it's on the list, you know, I think we're gonna get to it probably in about three years, something like that.

And the guy was like, huh.

So he called up the power company and he was like, how much would it take to just bury the lines in front of my house?

And they're like, quarter million bucks.

And he goes, when can you start?

And so on Monday they showed up and the power lines go out, out, out, down, under, up, out, out, out.

And it's literally just this one house had an unobstructed view of the course in the ocean.

Awesome.

I mean, to be fair for him, quarter million bucks irrelevant.

So like, that's actually a great use of money.

A hundred percent. Because like, the value of

that house probably went up by 2 million.

A hundred percent. A hundred percent.

Literally the only unobstructed view. Yeah.

That's incredible. It's

Such a boss who could even think about calling him up and be like, .

I love it. Also, I've, I'm, I'm, I'm curious how long ago

that was, because I feel like power companies now, like there's too much red tape.

Like they wouldn't even do that.

Like, it's cool, there was a day and age where like, you could, you could buy things that you needed, like money talked.

Nowadays you do that and they'd be like, no, get outta here.

I don't know. So I mean, this was probably 10 years ago,

which isn't that long ago.

Yeah, no, that's fair. Um, but maybe I

Haven't thrown enough big enough dollar figures around For whatever your issues are. You are not spending

Enough.

I'll give two, I'll give you $250. Get

Outta here, I'll give you two passes to the Portland Grand Prix.

Oh, good times. So

before we get into, um, Laguna, sorry, I'm tired.

I red-eyed home. It was terrible. As this is a travel

Podcast. That's a stupid decision.

We're gonna be talking a lot about that.

Well, here's the thing, because as a travel podcast, I'll tell you why I red-eyed home from Laguna. You

Always make fun of people that red eye home.

No, I, I hate it. I, I still, I still do.

I I am making fun of myself in this moment.

So I left my house for Iowa and I had not been home since.

So part of it was just like a wanting to get home.

But even that normally wouldn't entice me into a red eye.

It was the fact that, so I landed Monday morning.

I leave Tuesday afternoon, which is to say I leave my house in a half an hour from when we were filming this.

I had been home for 20, 30 hours and I leave until after Portland.

So I leave today. Why I go to Hungary, from Hungary.

I have to go straight to LA for something, for Fox.

From LA I go straight to Portland, I come home.

No sympathy. Big F1 guy,

you make a ton of money commentating.

You're now going to like the thing where you make even more money and then you're going to Los Angeles.

You're fine. Like whatever.

I'm just saying the extra 12 hours at home was worth with my wife and my dogs was worth coming home on a red eye.

Well, yeah, but like, I'm not looking anything.

I'm not outta a red eye when you're making like a hundred grand a day. Dude,

This is not Nan's money.

All right? Yeah. Two and a half days isn't even

Per power line bearing. Yeah. This

Isn't Nan's money.

This is, this isn't even nan money. This isn't non money.

This isn't even money. We're not

even making money over here. All right. Isn't

A different money No this, no, No snow, No nothing.

Making lose money. Yeah.

So anyway, that's why Flore eye home.

So I'm, I'm still kind of recovery. They suck, man.

They still suck. I haven't

done one in a while. They're horrible. They're still

Horrible.

They're horrible. Like they serve a very important purpose.

Um, and I understand them, but like there's not one human being I think that can actually physically tolerate a red eye and not being boned the next day.

Like, it's not possible unless you were Able to actually sleep the entire scheduled time that you're on the airplane. But

The the red eye isn't long enough.

So like I That's true. Understand That's true.

It's four hours your red eye, right?

If your red eye's from Egypt, okay, potentially if you can actually, yeah, you for nine hours, but la tody ain't long enough.

It's like right. Wheels up to wheels down's. Like three 50.

That ain't enough, right? Yeah,

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's, and, and it's not.

And I, I'm, I, I, I was, wasn't entirely sure I had forgotten By.

And you get to the then house at, you get to your house at four 50 in the morning, 5:00 AM then whatcha gonna do, you can't go to bed.

So then you're up way too early.

You haven't slept and you're just host.

I can, oh, I got home at go to bed six 30 and I went straight to bed. Didn't last

Say, yeah, I can definitely go back to bed. I,

I don't think I've even slept.

It was really just like cuddling the dogs in bed.

It was nice. Um, I was gonna

Go to sleep after this Well, fair.

Let's talk about, yeah. Yeah.

Um, but so on Laguna, before we get to the race itself, somebody tweeted me something that I thought was really interesting because obviously after races we get on the social webs and read feedbacks on certain things from like the TV side, right?

And people have their gripes and you know, last week I had a little go at people that were mad at us for missing the restart or whatever and Oh, I do have a comment on that.

When you're done, Do you wanna inject it now or Nah, I'll wait.

Okay. Why wait, well,

since when do you wait till someone's finished Trying new things.

Okay. Um, so one of the things that we get a lot is like,

oh, there's so many damn commercials.

Right? Which I get it seems like that sometimes

that there are a lot of commercials, right?

There's a lot of strategy as to when we go to commercials to try to not Ms. Green flag action.

Like it's like obviously the most important thing for everybody involved.

So somebody posted this nifty little chart, okay?

And I'm gonna read out some of the details to you.

It was just wide screen, but Yeah, I know, I know.

I mean, no one's, you don't need to see it.

It's just, just numbers and stuff.

So the total race time and total broadcast time was two hours, four minutes and 21 seconds of that live green flag time was one hour, 19 minutes and 49 seconds, or 64.19%

of the broadcast was live green flag live caution flag was another 1329 or 10.84% side by side green flag,

which again, we go to these side, we have to get commercials in.

But we, we do side by side when we can.

So you're not missing anything.

Another 15 and a half minutes side by side yellow, four and a half minutes full commercial.

The only time where the full commercial is playing and you're not seeing any race cars on your TV under green flag was less than three minutes of the race or 2%.

We had eight minutes of full commercial under caution.

So for your total race time, live TV was 75% of the time.

Side by side was another 16.2.

So your full commercial time was 11 minutes or 8.78% of the entire broadcast is in full commercial.

And if you actually compare that to the same Pete numbers, we've improved, uh, quite a bit.

I they had them somewhere. I don't have them now.

I'm not gonna go look for 'em. But what I'm telling you is

11 minutes in a two hour broadcast, we were in full commercial the rest of the time.

You guys can see what's happening on track. That's pretty good.

So, and, and just like, can You actually see those numbers For reference like a a 30 minute TV show, you have 22 minutes of, of show eight minutes of commercial.

That's 26 and two thirds percent is commercials for a 30 minute show, right?

So, so how much of this do you think comes from the majority of what people consume now is is streamed television in movies?

Tremendous amount, Right? So people just don't,

I think it's a huge factor. People forget,

Don't forget what they used to do.

Like we used to not even watch live things we used to ddr r at all.

And then fast forward through commercials, right? Like it

And so, which I feel like we're all missing out on, like the sibling yelling at you from the bathroom, that the commercials are almost done and you have to like run back to get to see what like you're Running to the kitchen to like fill up your popcorn and run back.

Yeah. Um,

'cause again, the alternate solution here is a subscription service and then there's no commercials.

So like someone has to pay for this broadcast.

It's either advertisers or it's you.

So you can choose to give up 11 minutes of your two hour broadcast and have someone else pay for it and have it just be available on network TV all day, any day, anywhere in the country.

Or we can charge you up 80 bucks a year and we won't have commercials.

Can we go to the guy who buried the power lines and see if he'll pay for it? I would

Imagine he might, I think we might be able to actually swing him on that.

He can clearly afford it. Anyway, I thought

that was pretty cool and I just wanna give a round of applause to the Fox crew for like getting that, getting that stuff in.

All right. I, my follow up is,

I actually wanna defend you a little bit, James, because I did something that I almost never do and I read the YouTube comments from last week and your point was, uh, Last week being Toronto or last week, week Being Laguna, last week after Toronto.

Okay. So you're, you're,

Did you two comments of our show?

Yes. Okay.

You had said that people should take a step back on the vitriol mm-hmm .

And one of the comments and a few people agreed was like, oh, so we're not allowed to criticize it at all unless we produced a broadcast ourselves.

It was like, okay. That what I said

way to take him outta con. Not at all. He

Said not what I said at all. Said he said take

A step back on the vitriol. Yep. I just wanted, I have

Point opinion criticize, but you don't need to be a about it if you've never done it. Yes. And

That hundred percent.

I just wanted to point that out 'cause I wasn't gonna get in a YouTube comment fight should, it's funnier if I respond here because now I'm not gonna read the the comment You Should, you should really work on your, your people skills.

James, just coming from someone who doesn't get abused in YouTube comments like you should really Oh no, you Do too.

I just don't care about those.

Oh, I assume I didn't actually, I, there's, There's So many things.

I mean, honestly I assume too. That makes

Sense. ,

I just know you do. But like when somebody argues against

somebody for something they didn't say, that pisses me off more than anything. It's the strong man

Argument.

And I, I made sure to specifically say we welcome all feedback and criticism.

Just don't act like we ran over your grandmother with a bus.

Is that like saying though, like, no offense, but you're super ugly , No offense, but just 'cause you said no offense doesn't mean you can say whatever you want.

Even convince welcome. I said no,

We welcome all feedback.

Yeah, we welcome all feedback.

We all, but don't you dare give us any feedback.

No, no feedback. Just you don't have to be,

you don't have to be so mean about it.

We get it. It's not like we,

it's like we're doing this on purpose anyway.

Um, thanks for coming to my defense, I guess. Uh,

So anyways, there's a race.

So and one last thing before we talk about the actual race itself.

I just wanna shout out the listeners to this podcast because between Toronto and Laguna, again, an abnormal amount of people made comments about how they listened to the show.

And it still blows me away, Alex, I don't know if you saw or heard or felt any of that in Toronto and in Laguna, but opposite ends of the continent, different countries, different cities, same incredible response and it's just amazing And the same general opinion of Tim, which is great.

Yeah. It's still like,

man one in a hundred is like, oh, is he here?

And when we'd never be like, no, thank God, they're like, oh, that's too bad.

I'm like, stop listening. I don't

Even, oh well the nevermind of those guys.

I won't give them the finger, but everybody else.

Yeah, no, it's like I say is yeah, the 99 are definitely on our side.

Anyway, Laguna Seka. Alex, how was your weekend?

Are we allowed to get into it?

To a certain extent? Yeah, I think

We can talk about it.

Um, it was, uh, listen, I crashed in practice one, um, before we even got to the red tires.

And that, that's always gonna put you behind, um, because you can only run reds, well, you only have a set of reds to run before qualifying, um, in practice one.

So not getting a, a kind of clear picture of the, the pace offset and balance offset and whatever, um, was put us on the back foot immediately.

Um, no Tim, that's an alarm going off on a truck backing up.

So it's done now.

Um, so back foot crash should have been fairly easy to recover from.

Um, but then practice two got canceled because , this really just weird weather event happened on Saturday morning.

And, um, there's something called a, a marine layer that, uh, I, I don't think anyone entirely new information anyone could have ever, ever predicted, um, came and, uh, didn't allow, Can't wait for the Hollywood blockbuster about this unheard of phenomenon.

This, oh, it, it's like clearly there is a shift in in the global weather because like this is, this is completely new.

Um, so the, the helicopter wasn't able to take off, which is, uh, grounds to, to not go green.

Um, Fox is, was very adamant about their live TV slot for qualifying, which is understandable.

Um, so there wasn't much flexibility on that, which meant practice two got canceled.

Um, which again was tough for us because we didn't get the run on reds.

We only did 10 laps in practice one practice two got canceled.

So on the 20 car we had to roll straight into qualifying, um, with not even an install check with a repaired car.

And so it was just, uh, it was difficult because we, we weren't fast enough.

Um, I wasn't fast enough and we started 22nd as a result of that.

So, um, very disappointing because for the most part I think it could have been avoided.

Um, but that is not the way the cookie crumbled.

Um, what, and so then yes, Well what, what happened in the crash?

What was, what caused the little snafu and six?

Um, Just because like guys, 'cause guys were going off left, right and center, like a dozen cars went off or spun or whatever. So clearly the track was in

Not the best shape.

So like, right.

I mean it was just slow, like the track was just, it was over two seconds off, um, from a pace standpoint.

And I think that it, I was just too, too much, too early ultimately, I mean, that, that is what it was.

Um, it was just too much entry speed into six and had a snap and that was kind of all she wrote.

Like it wasn't that big of a, of a hit, obviously it ended the session, but like the car wasn't in terrible shape.

Um, so yeah, it, it was just practice two getting canceled was like the worst possible thing that could have happened after you miss the most important, I'll put that in air quotes, part of practice one and it was just like, ah.

Um, so anyways, so we, uh, it's funny 'cause like I was actually on a lap good enough to transfer and qualifying, but like I gave up all the time in turn six, which I guess is maybe to be expected.

Yeah. Um, yeah, so, uh, we started 22nd, we finished 15th.

Um, it was a pretty, we didn't call a great race from a strategy standpoint. Um, started Would you start

On Yet?

Started, started on blacks, um, okay.

Which is what Dixon started on and it's what Callum started on.

And our whole plan in the beginning was to, to kind of come in early and get off the blacks, but then we didn't do that.

So I don't, I haven't really had a full debrief as to why that was the case.

Mm-hmm . Um, obviously

that ended up being the right strategy for those cars starting back there.

They got a lot of help with yellows ultimately at the end.

'cause I think both Cal Mans Scott were gonna be in pretty big fuel trouble, but ultimately there was enough yellows that it, uh, it all worked out for them.

So the pace of the car was good.

Like our, our average pace through the race was like 11th.

We finished 15th. Like it was, we, we kind of finished

where we could, I mean it was, it was fairly track position, sensitive race as most IndyCar races are.

Not saying it was a bad race or impossible to pass, but like starting back there without having some stroke of luck on the strategy side.

Like it's not, it's just hard to go forward.

So, um, it ultimately was an okay day from a performance standpoint.

We just started too far back, so that was our day.

Um, I'd love to, before we get into win number eight for the 10 car and everything that he has accomplished, we really need to talk about some of the, uh, race control decisions, I think 'cause those were, uh, wild and I was very, so the fir I was very upset for two different reasons on both circumstances. Okay.

So the two that you're referring to are, I assume reus in the gravel at chart three and then Marcus on the straight, uh, outta six.

Yes. Okay, so we'll start for the first one with reus.

What are your issues?

Okay, so for, for those that missed it, race was fired off, uh, unfortunately by Kirkwood beached, we were in the middle of a pit cycle.

And so even though we had a car very clearly stranded and the gravel race control left the track green and the pits open for about a lap and a half to give everyone that hadn't pit the chance to come in pit do a couple corners of an out lap.

And then the yellow was thrown. So Alex, go

Ahead.

So I was upset about that because turn three was one of the hardest corners.

Um, all weekend. It,

it usually is Turn three is a super low grip corner at Laguna.

Um, it's very easy to slide off there.

Um, there was a car backwards facing, um, oncoming traffic pretty much online, um, in the gravel trap.

Granted there was no yes, James, I say he was in the, he wasn't online, he was in the, he was in the gravel. What do you mean on

Online?

No, online. If he went straight,

like he was in done the firing range of a car, if it went straight, um, there was no contact with the wall, but there was contact and everything that has been previously disclosed by race control has been, if there's no contact and it's in a safe spot, we're gonna let the cycle finish.

There was contact and he was not in a safe spot and they let the cycle finish.

So problem number one is consistency.

Problem number two is they displayed a yellow flag over the top of the hill into turn one, I was in the middle of a exchange with guys on cold tires and it took away a passing zone.

Not only did the cars that beat the yellow from a strategy standpoint and came in early, did they not get the benefit of taking that gamble, which rightly or wrongly, like I was on the side, that would've benefited from it.

I understand Colton's point where he was on the side that would've been penalized for it.

But it's welcome to IndyCar racing.

Like you win some, you lose some.

Like we've had this debate over and over again.

The pits close under yellow.

That's the, that's that is IndyCar racing.

There shouldn't be one human being that is affecting the outcome of the race regardless.

That is our rule. So like that is what it's, so anyways,

the fact that the, the yellow being displayed there was, was frustrating.

Um, and so that was why I was upset about the first one was just like, what are we doing?

Like this doesn't, this doesn't make sense or meet the criteria.

Like the example that we always used to use is to not closing, uh, or not throwing the yellow right away was like, and Barbara and Graham had a mechanical and there was no contact and he had pulled offline in a straightaway where people could see him.

He, there was no danger to it.

Um, that was not the situation that occurred in the first yellow James, go ahead.

So I, I for the most part agree with everything that you're saying.

Um, where I think race control would come back is they would say that is, this is my guess, right?

Um, this is not something they have said.

This is me putting the other shoe on, you know, uh, whatever, um, shoe on the other foot, whatever the saying is, I'm tired is there wasn't contact with the wall.

The contact car to car was fairly light.

Uh, which is true and Yeah, it doesn't matter its contact.

No, I know, I know. So as,

and then as far as him being not in a safe location, the, you know, the argument's gonna be if you throw a yellow, you're a professional racing driver, you should be able to not pitch it off under a yellow flag to end up where that car is.

Right? And he was, you know, he wasn't, he was spun online,

stopped on the racetrack, on the racing surface, obviously different different story.

So in the sense of, I'm gonna disagree with you in the sense of him being an unsafe place, I am gonna agree with you on the contact side though because what I've always, when this conversation kind of first started, 'cause there have been other examples, and this is where it's like they'll, they'll argue the consistency side.

There have been other examples where there's been minor contact, but the yellow didn't come out.

And where I'm with you is, I i it's too gray an area, right?

It's too subjective about what's the appropriate level of contact before a yellow's thrown.

So I'm with you that it should be, if there is car to car or carto wall contact, it should be black and white.

There should be no, you know, no area to le you know, to leave open for interpretation.

The yellow should come out. That is part of the gamble

of IndyCar racing as you said.

You know, would it have hosed the guy that should have won the race?

Yes. But that's part of it, right?

If Reinas had just gone all the way off and hit the wall, the yellow would've come out, you know, certainly.

And the outcome would be the same.

So I'm with you that we should move away from a place where there is any opening for judgment and it's black and white car to car or car to wall contact the and and a car stopped. But,

But, but that's what it is.

I'm just saying there's been examples where that hasn't happened because it was judged that it wasn't serious enough contact To justify it.

No, because, no, because, so we were on, we, no, we had this whole thing and I forget, was it last year or two years ago at Laguna?

The same exact thing happened and I was it Ericsson someone had a puncture or someone?

Maybe it wasn't Erickson, someone didn't know they had a puncture.

It was Felix. It was Felix in 2023. Okay.

And we had had all of these debates in the off season in the meetings, right.

About how we're not gonna close, we're not gonna throw the yellow and affect the pit cycle and all this sort of thing.

Right? In this particular year I was on the flip side of it,

I was in cold shoes, right?

I was on the positive side and didn't want the yellow to come and there was people that were all pissed off about it and ultimately the yellow came before the pits.

I think they let Paolo in, but they didn't let anyone else.

But they, it's not that they let Palo and he was just so far ahead that he got it.

Yeah. Yeah. And everyone went to race control afterwards

and was m f-ing them, right?

That got screwed by, by it who was up front and being like the car was, it was identical to Reus in the identical corner, in the identical situation.

The car was far enough away where professional drivers was covered by a local yellow, all this sort of thing.

He didn't hit a wall, he was fine, like all this stuff, the exact same situation.

And their response was we had to throw yellow because there was car to car contact and he had a puncture.

Oh, okay. And there was contact.

So there was a precedence for this that was already set and they didn't do the same thing this year. That's what's

Frustrating.

And yes, then I'm with you. 'cause that's how it should be.

If there's car to car contact, it should not be, and It wasn't, it wasn't even that big of a contact.

It was enough contact just to give a car a puncture.

But their logic was, and their defense was, well there was contact and that's what we <inaudible> decided.

Right? The other thing

that's an issue is the turn two yellow, right?

Like the yellow should be from the exit of two to the exit of three.

So that I didn't know. And that's interesting.

Um, but yes, I, I know that I've seen situations in the past where there was minor contact and they didn't throw up 'cause it wasn't kind of deemed enough.

But if you said that this conversation had happened for a near identical scenario, then yes, that's where the consistency issue comes in again.

Okay. So that one frustrating. I can maybe see

A little bit more again.

Again. Yeah. Yes.

Like it's wrong because of all the reasons we just said, but from a subjectivity standpoint, which you, you need to get rid of, but ultimately it still exists.

Like you can, you can justify in your head like I think we can all agree upon that, right?

Yes. Yes. Now we get to the next one.

I don't even like, I want you to tell this 'cause I'm gonna try really hard to not get fired here.

Well why would you, you don't work for IndyCar?

No, but you never know. Right

In front of me outta turn six.

Um, Ericsson got a little bit wide on the exit curb, did a great job chasing up the hill.

Ultimately had like a lazy spin over the top, no contact.

Um, but you know, I think everyone's familiar with Laguna.

There's a lot of elevation. You know, we go up

and down a mountain and um, even as he was spinning, there was a moment in time where like I had to like completely lift and get on the brakes.

'cause I, I lost him in my sight.

I knew he was like sideways and to the right, but like I didn't know had he moved back to the middle of the track 'cause it's completely blind.

You, you're coming up the hill up the crest to ex corkscrew and you're like looking at the sky like you can't see the racetrack, right?

And so I kind of went around him and it was no big deal and went, went into the yellow map, like into the corkscrew really.

And then I got, I got to the bottom of the corkscrew and it was still green.

I was like, oh, <inaudible>. So I like went back

and kept racing and I was like, in my head I was like, you're just like waiting for the call, you're waiting for the lights, you're waiting for whatever, right? And

By the time you're at turn four you're like, oh, he must have got going again.

For sure. For sure. We have hybrid

starts, all this sort of thing.

I exit six and I'm coming up the hill and I see yellow flags and I'm like, no way.

And I'm like, well the last time he was very far to the right.

So like I assume he's still very far to the right.

And so like I go far left over the curb and sure enough he was still far to the right.

But you don't see him until you are at the crest of the hill, which is six gear, 160 miles an hour ish.

And he's literally just broadside, broadside.

Kind of like the, if someone like that, it's the worst, worst someone would die. Worst

Scenario. It's the worst

Scenario.

Someone would die. Yeah.

If, if there was contact for whatever reason, right?

Um, but my, my next thing that I, I really struggled to understand, there was no yellow, um, for I think a lap and a half after, because I, I saw him twice now.

It was, I was one of the first cars, oh, high balloons, .

I was one of the first cars on scene.

So I really passed it under caution or under, under like green conditions once .

But it was twice. Why is two balloons?

Anyways, I don't know.

So, so, um, the, the last point that I'm gonna get at is, okay, we have hybrid start.

Let's say race control was waiting for him to be able to hybrid start himself.

How the <inaudible> is he starting himself and then turning it because he can't see either anything.

Was he supposed to turn across the race line at zero miles an hour in on the, on the idle while cars were coming in 150 miles an hour?

Like in what scenario was that gonna work out for anyone?

It Wasn't. And it also wasn't during a pit cycle.

And that's, and this is it, man, like, okay, now I'm gonna try to just take a breath.

I get very worked up on anything safety related. Okay?

And to me this was a hundred percent a safety issue.

We could have been in the middle of a green flight pit cycle.

And when you've got a car stopped broadside on the racing surface.

Don't, don't give me offline.

I I don't even wanna hear it because how many guys dropped two wheels outta turn?

Six. It's easy to do even if you are kind of taking it easy.

What if a tire was going down?

What if you had some sort of failure?

What if some car in front of you dropped a little bit of fluid and you went two wheels wide and just carried up the exact same way Marcus did?

These things are possible, even if they're improbable, they're possible.

But blind crest broadside on the racing surface on a straight at a hundred and whatever fifth gear Race control can see the engine is dead in that scenario because of how dangerous it is.

If you want to give him 10 seconds to try to start it on a, on the hybrid even that I don't love, but like, fine, 10 seconds, not two minutes.

And on top of that, it wasn't in a green flight pit cycle.

The the stops were done, stops every done, everybody was just on cruise control at that point.

You were not affecting the outcome of the race in any capacity whatsoever.

All you did was you left a driver stranded on the racetrack, deeply exposed to a dangerous situation for I think a very, very inappropriate amount of time.

And I'm very curious to know how the Portland drivers meeting goes.

'cause every driver that I've spoken to after the fact has been pretty upset about how long that was left green.

And I just don't, I just, that one I cannot like the other one, I can see a, a devil's advocate argument.

I could understand how maybe they got to the, you know, with the whole arenas thing.

I, I get it. I get how you can get there.

This one, I I just don't, I just don't understand.

I don't get it. So anyway, uh,

that all said, we're almost outta time.

So pull one by a country mile, uh, eighth of the season, obviously.

Yeah, I mean, I mean here's the thing.

His specialty this year has been hard tires except on softs and qualifying.

He was three tenths clear the field, which is insane.

And this was a, a red race.

So, um, I don't know. I don't know. I don't know.

I dunno, I dunno what to do, man. I know.

I don't know what anybody does about it.

It's insane what he's doing. It's so

Impressive.

Nothing. You, you, you regroup and try again next year.

Yeah, yeah. Like there's no, you gotta

F it.

It was, it was interesting like on the podium, you know, he comes up, he gives Christian his high five and Colton his high five and stands up in the middle.

And even Christian and Colton, you can see it in their faces.

Like the, the collective grid is so frustrated that he keeps doing it.

Like it's, he's Making us all look really dumb. .

It's like if, if Cup just raced on street courses and SVG just won every race, and you'd just be like, what are we doing here? Like it's, yeah, but

At least, at least there's manu.

At least there's manufacturers in that.

Like you could argue like, So the thing, the thing, you gotta say it though, like that team is also just operating at an insanely high level because you've got their other driver who started 19th, did a completely different strategy and still ends up in top five. Yes.

James. That is, that is Scott Dixon like, okay,

I know, but it's also Kinzie.

You cannot take away what they are doing. I don't know.

Now to Barry Wan's point at point when he's that when polo's that quick, every strategy is an option for you.

So you can look pretty smart all the time, but their pit stops are always good.

Their car is reliable.

Like they haven't had a lot of issues.

Like it's, it's a team effort. But Polo is out there.

It is, there is no doubt about it.

Um, I guess he probably wraps it up in Portland, two races to go.

Yes. Which I don't know when the last

time that happened was.

I'm honestly surprised he didn't wrap it up already.

What, what blew my mind was an a stat that our boy Nathan Brown put out and, and we'll close with this just to, just to show the dominance that he has achieved over this season, but more so even like this past month.

Okay, check this out. This is unbelievable.

So Patto Award, right? He had a phenomenal July, yeah.

In my mind, two races.

The best July, the best July he's ever had in his career.

This is the best season he's ever had in his career.

He finished by far, fifth, first, fifth, first, fourth, two wins, all top fives.

Okay? Incredible,

Incredible.

Very various types of tracks.

Executed an incredibly high level.

Pelosi still outscored, Patto by 10 points. .

And he finished 12th and that's with A 12th in there. 12th

In Toronto.

Dude, the one, the one that got me was going, that's just into going into um, Laguna.

Okay? He had already scored enough points

to have finished second in last year's championship.

The only guy that would've beat him was him with four rounds to go.

I never seen anything like it. I hate that.

He's like making us like our, our biggest selling point for so long was watch us because you never know who's gonna win.

And so 10 different winners under each season, blah, blah blah, blah blah.

Nope, sorry, like F1 and still whoever's on pole wins the race.

But at least different guys are qualifying on pole and winning.

There's like two at least, you know, maybe a third on a good day.

But , we just have won right now. It's insane.

14 races in three people have won races, he is won eight.

And and to be fair, like he, he should have nine.

Like he gave away nine.

Yes. Midio should have been his should have been

9000%.

Anyway, he's doing great.

Um, solid effort. At least

One.

Alex is your time's coming brother time's coming.

Hey bro. What uh, uh,

In terms of the averages, Alexs are kicking ass this year.

That's a great point. , Alexs have

won eight races this season, So yeah, If you watch your kid to be a success winning car driver, name him Alex, you guys are Yeah. You're

Averaging four wins a piece.

Exactly right. We Are dude, we are Pretty good year.

That's a great year. Uh, I also want to give a shout out

to ECR and thank uh, Java House and Ted Geoff for a little gift package that showed up at the production truck that was the espresso martini pre-mix pods from Java House.

Mm-hmm along with a bottle of KAA and a bottle of vodka.

So that way we could make the entire con concussion. Listen, listen,

Listen.

Very classy move Har Heartland food groups and Java House.

We know how to party. We know

how, how to have, have a good time. Like it's, you

Guys know how have a good Time.

We gotta sort it out. Yeah, I was a big fan of the ads.

The Java House ads that ran on the broadcast were pretty funny.

Mm-hmm . And lesson like, I mean

forget their involvement with ECR and with the 20 car and everything.

How cool is it to see a brand new sponsor, a consumer facing sponsor come into the sport and understand how important activation is, right?

Yeah. So many brands come into the sport

and think, oh, let's just slap a sticker on a car and hope there's some ROI in it.

It's like, great. But like you also have to spend money

to activate, to get people interested in your product at the track.

And they're doing that. Um, I mean

as good as anyone I've ever seen. So it's pretty awesome.

We know I'm not a coffee guy, but I'm definitely an espresso martini guy, so I'm now a loyal customer.

Alright buddy, well, uh, enjoy weekend off, uh, and we'll talk after next weekend, I guess Well fun and get some goulash.

I I will probably avoid goulash at all, at all possible opportunities. But

You don't like beef stew?

I don't, I don't. My mom used

to make it and it, I don't know.

I I'm scarred.

I didn't like it as a kid, so I'm out pierogi though.

I'll get some pierogi. Good to go.

This has been off track with Hinch and Rossi Off track is part of the SiriusXM Sports Podcast network.

If you enjoyed this episode and want to hear more, please give a five star rating and leave a review.

Subscribe today, wherever you stream your podcasts.

We are at Ask Offtrack on Twitter and Instagram.

And if you wanna follow us on Twitter, we're at Hinch Town and at Alexander Rossi.

If you wanna follow them though, we have no idea why you would.

He's at the Tim Durham on Twitter.

Find us on YouTube and subscribe to our channel for exclusive video content.

Offtrack is produced by Tim Durham, and by that we mean f.

Rocky Sand

Jeep Cherokee

About this episode

Original notes