Behind The Glass Nov 13, 2025

[S8, E8] Selling The GT3, Tony's New Range Rover & F1 Thoughts

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Car

Range Rover

The Range Rover is a fancy SUV made by Land Rover. It's designed to be good for driving off-road while also being very comfortable and stylish inside.

Car

Land Rover Range Rover

The Range Rover is a fancy SUV that can handle rough terrains while still being very comfortable inside. It's often talked about because it's a symbol of luxury and adventure.

Car

Defender

The Defender is a tough vehicle made for off-roading. It's known for being very strong and can handle rough conditions, making it a favorite for adventure lovers.

Car

Discovery

The Discovery is a family-friendly SUV that can also go off-road. It has a lot of space inside and comes with modern technology, making it great for trips.

Term

MHEV means Mild Hybrid Electric Vehicle. It's a type of car that uses both a regular engine and a small electric motor to save fuel and produce less pollution, but it can't run just on electricity alone.

Term

hybrid

A hybrid car uses both a regular engine and an electric motor. This helps it use less fuel and create less pollution compared to cars that only run on gas.

Term

S58

The S58 is a more powerful version of the B58 engine, made for BMW's sportier cars. It has upgrades that help it produce more power and perform better.

Term

B58

The B58 is a type of engine made by BMW that has six cylinders and uses a turbocharger to boost its power. It's popular for being reliable and performing well in cars.

Car

Audi Q7

The Audi Q7 is a large luxury SUV that can carry more people and has a lot of nice features. It's a good choice for families or those needing extra space.

Car

BMW X5

The BMW X5 is a fancy SUV that offers a good mix of comfort and performance. It's great for people who want a vehicle that can drive well on different types of roads.

Term

all season tires

All season tires are made to work well in different weather, like rain and light snow. They are good for people who don't want to change their tires for winter.

Term

snow tires

Snow tires are special tires made for driving in snow and ice. They help your car grip the road better when it's cold and slippery.

Car

Aston Martin Vanquish

The Aston Martin Vanquish Volante is a fancy sports car that is very expensive and known for being stylish and fast. It's a car that many people dream of owning because of its luxury features.

Car

Ferrari F8

The Ferrari F8 is a fast sports car made by Ferrari. It has a powerful engine and is designed for high performance, making it exciting to drive.

Car

Aston Martin DB12

The Aston Martin DB12 is a fancy sports car known for its speed and style. It's part of a famous series of cars from Aston Martin that are designed for both performance and luxury.

Car

Aston Martin Vantage

The Aston Martin Vantage is a fancy sports car that many people admire for its style and speed. It has changed over the years, with new versions offering better features.

Car

Aston Martin DB11

The Aston Martin DB11 is a newer version of the DB9, offering better performance and more modern features for a luxurious driving experience.

Car

Aston Martin DB9

Car

Aston Martin DBX707

The DBX707 is a luxury SUV made by Aston Martin, a brand known for its high-end sports cars. This model is designed to be powerful and comfortable, making it suitable for both performance and everyday driving.

Term

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Hello, and welcome to Behind the Glass, your weekly automotive podcast

hosted by two rather uninformed enthusiasts.

I'm Sam from the YouTube channel SeemToGlass.

I'm Tony from Gravelord Castells.

And you can watch us each week.

We hope you enjoy the episode.

A few months back, I hinted that I was going to buy a new shape,

Range Rover, for purpose.

For purpose, wait, hold on a second.

Yeah.

For what purpose?

For A purpose.

No, wait, wait, wait.

For A purpose.

Yeah.

I think you missed the A.

For purpose.

That sounds like a Range Rover TV advert.

Range Rover, for purpose.

Yeah, because that's what it is, for purpose.

No, no, for a purpose.

No, no, you don't need the A.

Why not?

Because people know what I mean.

No, no, no, no.

No, I don't know.

I don't think I know what you mean.

No.

To clarify, for a purpose.

Yeah.

Which was driving down to Austria for your Christmas holidays.

That'd be nice.

Did you know the other person's feeling?

What else were you planning to get?

Well, no, I wasn't planning to go anywhere else.

No, so for a purpose.

Okay, so yes, this was your proclamation.

Actually, at the start of this season,

it was the first episode we did when we came back,

and you said, yeah, I'm going to get a Range Rover.

And then it was annoying because you were like,

iffy-whiffing, you're like, well, I might get a Range Rover.

I might get a Defender.

I might get a Discovery.

I don't know.

But you have arrived here this morning in...

Nice one.

A P?

No, no.

A D?

D, 300, SE, MHEV.

But with some nice spec on it.

Interesting.

Okay, so this is what we would call the big Range Rover.

I'm not the Range Rover sport.

The Vogue.

It's been out for a few years now, my God.

It's a quick-hold, time flies.

This is an updated one, though,

because they got rid of all the clatter inside.

There's no buttons inside anymore.

It's all gone.

Were there buttons?

Yeah, there were some buttons on the central bit

where you start it.

For the all terrain and all that and all that, it's all gone.

So what year is this car?

It's a year old, 74 plate.

Oh, wow.

Yeah.

I missed the update that they did

where they removed the buttons.

But it's quite...

That's quite a base engine, Mike,

because you get the D...

300.

You got the 300, 350, and then you got the petrol models.

But I didn't care.

You didn't care?

I literally didn't care.

Fine.

I just wanted a nice car.

And when we get into Range Rovers,

I used to get confused,

but then obviously I became a GLR fanboy.

Obviously, you have SE, HSE, HSE dynamic,

all these kind of levels.

So...

And that is really just how much leather you get,

how much speakers and what wheels,

that kind of stuff, basically, right?

How much spec, yeah.

Is your packs.

Literally, but a standard SE has got...

I don't care for Alcantara headlining or Leather headlining.

I couldn't give a toss.

And I think with that generation Range Rover,

the base level is just so highly equipped.

They come with everything, mate.

Unbelievable.

Everything you can ever want.

Yeah.

And it's got bigger wheels on it,

so it's got the 20-freeze on it that look like they're like 18.

We said that when we went out to look at the car

before we sat down.

And it's mad because it's such a huge vehicle.

Those size wheels still look tiny.

Yeah.

You have to put 25-inch wheels on there before they look normal.

Yeah, it won't be long

before you get cars with 25-inch wheels.

I'm sure.

But yeah, it's got all the right options on.

And it's got beige interior, which I wanted.

I wanted the beige interior because it just looks lovely.

Would you call that beige?

I'd call that ivory.

Yeah, ivory beige.

Yeah, yeah, whatever.

Yeah, ivory beige.

Purple, blue, gray, whatever.

It's all the same.

I wanted a light interior.

You wanted a light interior.

So that's what I got.

I got a light interior.

And it's like definitely two different things.

We'll let it slide.

Yes, light interior makes a big difference.

Light interior.

It does for me because it has got a nice panoramic roof as well.

So that's some lighting and stuff.

And the seats recline in the back.

Not that I'll be in the back,

but the kids are going to have a nice time.

Lovely time.

And as well, like when you set off cameras,

you've got rear entertainment.

But nowadays, you don't need rear entertainment.

You just get the bracket for the iPad

and click it on the back of the seat.

Yeah, yeah.

Okay, amazing.

When was the last time you drove a big Range Rover?

A couple of years ago.

Okay.

I had, when they first come out,

I had a bit of a run with them.

I had a couple of hybrid ones

and I had a couple of diesel ones.

I mean, it's unbelievable, mate,

because I was getting them in that silly time,

45 grand over list for them.

Wow.

I've given 30 grand under list for this car.

So that was at the peak of everything.

Yes, stupid.

Yeah, 45, 50 grand over list I was getting for.

20, 20, 22, 23.

No, no, no.

20, 21.

21.

Into 22, yeah.

What was COVID?

2020.

Oh my God.

Yeah.

Oh my God.

Yeah.

Yeah, go find it.

Come out of COVID.

So, yeah.

So it wouldn't have been 22.

It would have been late.

It would have been late 2020 into 21.

So when they come out, the first of them.

Yeah.

And all the values were insane of everything.

And 30 grand under list for a year old car

with how many miles?

3,000 miles.

Yeah, as you would expect, basically.

Well, yeah, so I was literally telling my friend

this yesterday, and he said, oh, I've lost a lot of money.

I said, it hasn't.

I said, because six or seven years ago,

I was buying the previous shaped car

that was just about 100 grand list.

I was given 70 grand from him.

So it's just normal, yeah, it's just normal.

Back behind the wheel, though,

as great as you ever remember.

Yeah, yeah, I mean, it's a big old wafter, essentially,

which is what it's for,

but it is way better than the older car.

When you compare the sport and the big Range Rover

in the previous model,

there was a big drive difference,

as in the old car was really, really wallowy,

but this new one is less so.

It's still wallowy, because it's a bit old,

but I don't want it to race around, mate.

I want it to munch miles.

Just literally cruise.

Yeah.

Be comfortable, and when you get out of the snow

into the car, it wants to be warm and cocooned.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

The noise doubling, I think, is so amazing in that vehicle.

It's such a silent little space that you get in there,

and the world just goes away from you.

You literally can't hear nothing.

Unless you're really on the accelerator,

you can't hear the engine.

Obviously, most of you all know

that Land Rover use BMW engines now,

so it's the inline six diesel,

which is a masterpiece diesel engine,

and the same with the petrol engine.

It's the B58 or the S58,

whatever the engine is, the petrol version,

and they're bloody brilliant.

They're such good engines,

and for Land Rover, really,

you should just stop that rot of knowing

that the engine and gearboxes

are going to be all right in their cars now,

because they don't go wrong.

So, as we know down the years,

Land Rover have had loads and loads of problems

with their engines, and that's like instantly stopped.

Yeah, no.

This is allowed other things to go wrong instead.

Yeah, yeah, I'm sure.

But no, I mean, it's a great buy,

and I think you're going to have an amazing time.

You tend to do this in the winters, pick up an SUV.

It's not uncommon for you to buy something for six months,

or so just a couple of hours,

and then we get to the spring, it kind of goes,

and that's your plan again.

You plan to move on from that.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, after Christmas,

once I've finished with it, I shall get rid of it.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And theoretically lose a certain amount of money

that in your head is kind of worth it,

or do you hope that you'll stick?

Well, the reason why I was very vague

in what I was going to buy in the first place,

because the perks of my job are I buy cars mostly

with margins in them.

Obviously like, there's a margin in the car.

So I bought it at trade, and I'll sell it at retail.

So this is like a bit of a derogatory thing to say,

like, who cares?

Like, if I lose a bit of money, like I lose,

I want it for a purpose.

A purpose, not just purpose.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, so I'm buying.

But you're really rich.

No, I'm not anymore.

But like, honestly, like, even if I lose this 50 grand, mate,

who cares?

50 grand, I'll keep it forever if it's gonna lose 50 grand,

because it won't keep doing that.

No, I'm not, yeah.

But again, who cares?

You're so rich.

Yeah, but yeah, I should be all right.

I should best do a couple of thousand miles on it,

and come out clean.

Yes, they're a point where you should be okay,

especially, as I say, given the lucky position you're in.

But in general, if you were a punter

who somehow had that kind of cashed splash,

it is one of those cars that now at that value

are a little bit less,

because one of the lowest-valued cars on the market,

if you're gonna get one, which is three or four years old,

where have they started to bottom out at?

I bet they're still 65, 70 grand.

But they... 30 or 40,000 miles on it.

Yeah, and they would probably suffer

another three or 4,000 miles

and not lose chunks and chunks of money.

So, you know, anyway, you need a situation,

but I'm happy for you.

I think it's the right choice.

I think it's a great looking car.

I think you have a lovely time.

I'm rather jealous.

Well, I sort of, for what I want it for,

I couldn't really think,

because I could have had an X5 or a Q7 or anything,

but for what I actually want to use it for,

I couldn't think of anything better than go and do that in.

And I'm sure we spoke about it.

Are you putting all season tires or snow tires on it?

It comes with the all season.

All season is fine.

Because some places in Europe,

you need specifically winter tires or chains or something.

Because you're going up to Zell, aren't you?

Going to Zell, yeah.

Yeah, so I think just be careful,

because there's definitely some places where,

theoretically, it's a requirement,

i.e. if you get into trouble

and you haven't got the right tires on,

or chains in the boot, you might get a bit of a fine,

but you're so rich, who cares?

Speaking of rich, I parked next to you this morning.

Well, I would say an equally ostentatious car,

but it's actually way more ostentatious, isn't it?

The 400,000 pound Aston Martin Vanquish Volante.

Well, you know what comes to mind,

because I parked up next to it,

and I looked at it and I thought,

oh, what if Sam's got any inheritance money?

The inheritance money's probably confused.

Could you imagine?

I went the M.A. size and all we cared about was poor.

She's going to pick one up.

Oh, I look nice on the Ford Corp.

You know there are people like that.

Of course.

There are literally people like that who have no plans,

and then it's like hanging around these,

walking to show them, go, how much is that P1?

Of course.

Yeah.

Yes, of course.

What a life.

And that's what some of these big dealers hope for.

Yes.

That just some bloke comes in and surrenders.

What, do you remember one of our greatest ever connections

and friends from the Lee Collection?

That felt like how that operated, right?

Well, Lawrence at the Lee Collection.

Yeah.

One of the most amazing human beings ever.

It felt like he was like sitting at work one afternoon,

someone would call him and say,

have you driven an F8?

He'd go, no, I'll buy one.

Yeah, I was like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

That was, we were like, so here for it.

So yes, we've met people like that.

Is he still spending money like?

I think so.

I don't know.

Well, because Josh, my actual fucking best friend, left.

He's gone on his own thing now.

So I have less interactions with Lawrence than I did.

But from Instagram and social media, it looks like he's just-

He's still following in.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Good lad.

What a lovely human being.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Vanquish Volante.

Yeah.

Now, I don't know how I feel about this car.

Well, have you driven it?

To the station at back.

I had to drop the delivery driver.

But, okay, so bear with me.

The reason why, a huge fan of DB12,

like massive fan of Fast & Furious,

new volunteer, I was like, I really like it.

I just don't love the direction they've gone in.

I'm not certain.

Like it felt like a little bit flawed to sports car.

You obviously drove it as well.

I sort of-

But we agree that they probably had to go in that direction,

advantage to separate it from the DB12.

Yes, but my least favorite generation of Vantage.

If I had the money today, I'd be buying DB12 over Vantage,

where every year previous,

I'd always buy Vantage over DB9 or DB11.

Right.

Anyway, for me, it's the other way around.

I would buy the new Vantage over the new DB12.

Interesting.

I would, yeah.

And I wouldn't buy any of the previous ones.

How funny, we've never had that discussion.

What would we?

A valid point.

Anyway, fan of DBX707.

Anyway, boring story.

Like I'm sort of asked and fan always have been

like what they've been doing.

Vanquish came out and I was like, oh, kind of cool.

Looks big.

Don't love the twin turbo V12.

I've never been a massive fan of that twin turbo V12

when they replaced the old V12.

And everyone started putting it up against the dodgy

chill injury and all these reviews came out.

And a lot of people were like, oh my God,

the Vanquish really offers something here.

That's what it rivals.

Absolutely.

But would you say that maybe previously Aston

never got that close to actually competing

with the Ferrari in many different ways?

Yeah, they bring a rival car out,

but they're never competed and still,

although Aston Martin are way better than they used to be,

probably better than they've ever been actually

in terms of making cars because they bloody work now.

Aston have the Ferrari.

Well, but review wise, people were saying

this is now a car that actually dynamic

and for many reasons compete.

So I was like, wow, this car must be unbelievable

because people are saying like it genuinely would

consider this like it offers something.

Or the Ferrari's gone backwards.

Well, that's another point.

But then I drove the dodgy chill injury.

Loved it.

So I was like, okay, well, this is confusing.

And then I saw the Vanquish in the first time together

in that dealership.

It's massive.

Yeah, yeah.

Like it is such.

This is because that Range Rover out there.

Yeah, yeah.

It is wide.

It is long.

I don't know if I adore the looks in the flesh.

Like I don't necessarily know if I look at it and I go,

oh, it's so good looking.

I think it looks better in coupe form than convertible for sure.

I'm with you there.

But just so I've sort of had this weird thing

where I'm like, okay, I know I love what Aston are doing.

Everyone is saying that this car is really unbelievable.

And genuinely would be, you know, a hard choice

between the dodgy chill injury, which I love as well.

All these things like tick, tick, tick.

But something in my heart didn't actually make me go,

and I was supposed to drive it back in the summer.

I think I canceled that.

Anyway, long story short, I finally got the keys to the car.

It is the Volante version, which I agree.

Like I'm not a massive soft top fan because it's a soft top.

Yeah, maybe.

I'm also going to the winters.

It doesn't feel like quite right.

But I don't know.

I'm in this weird moment.

I haven't driven it.

I've driven it to the station and back.

It's literally half a mile that way and back.

And I've got it for the week and I'm going to go out and do it.

And it's a weird last minute thing

because I was actually supposed to be driving the Mercedes AMG GTS-E performance this week.

GTS-E.

Oh, which is the turbo S rival.

Yeah.

And I thought that'd be really interesting

off the back of the turbo S launch going to drive that.

I watched your turbo S video.

Oh, thank you.

Was it wasted your time?

Yeah, literally.

That's literally my next sentence.

It's like 19 minutes.

I'm never, ever going to get back.

You should just waffled on, mate.

Thank you for the support.

Please tell me more.

Go watch it on TV for a glass.

Tell me more.

You didn't like about the work that I did.

You know what he watched?

Six other reviews, hadn't you?

Well, that's probably what I was going to watch.

I thought, what's he going on about?

Yeah, so you knew everything that was going to be said.

And we'd spoken about it on the podcast the week before,

but I'll try not to act defensive

even though I feel personally attacked.

Thank you for that.

How many cars you saw this week?

Seven.

Oh, dickhead.

She was on 10.

Anyway, I never lost my train of thought.

Anyway, someone crashed the Merc.

Yes, I got an email on Friday saying that's not happening.

What? Joe Killies, was it?

I don't know.

So, I suddenly...

I suddenly...

Why would I?

He's got a man in him.

Why are you so...

Oh, he's the first guy that got my head.

And I know he's better than four.

Pooch.

Sorry, Joe.

And anyway, so I just suddenly was like, oh, what do I do?

Message Aston.

And they were like, yeah, we've got the vancrest.

I was like, sit and book it in, please.

So, it's all happened a bit last minute.

And I'm intrigued.

I want to find out.

I just don't know where to drive that car, mate.

Like, I honestly sit there on the road.

No, but dude, not only in the UK is it ginormous.

It's rear-wheel drive with how much horsepower?

Right, it's got the 800.

Yeah.

And something.

Yeah.

I bet it's got 1,000 pounds of a torque as well.

Definitely.

That's a bit stupid, then.

That's what I'm worried about.

Right.

825 horsepower and 1,000 newton meters of torque allows for 214 mile an hour top speed.

I mean, like, it's...

And because of its size, like...

How long you got it for?

I've got until Friday.

What are you doing for the rest of the week?

One, I can't, my Thursday and Friday are my filming days.

So, I'm going to go and take it somewhere and do something with it,

but I just don't know what kind of road.

Do you know what I mean?

Because that car, what I should actually do with that car right now

is drive it to the Black Forest.

Do you know what I mean?

Like, it needs to do a long GT drive to cruise a lot of it

and then get to a really nice flowy road with great visibility.

It should go up to Scotland.

I just haven't got time.

Do you know what I mean?

I need big open spaces where I can carry speed through corners

and be a bit dynamic, but not, like, really have to attack the road.

Anywhere of my usual driving roads around here,

which are with a so tight and narrow...

I'm just going to be miserable the whole time, I think.

So, I'm sort of flapping a bit of, like,

how do I really understand this car?

So, then I thought, okay, flip on its head.

Could I just do, like...

And then I'm going to go find a coffee shop that's, you know,

two and a half hours away in the peak district.

You know what I mean?

I've got to do something with it

that gives me a chance to really understand that car.

Because if I just go to my local test drive route,

I don't think I'm going to like it.

Yeah, fair enough.

Do you like it?

Does it excite you?

No, not at all.

Why?

Well, I get a very good impression normally if...

You know, as James May used to say, it's the fizz.

Right?

So, I get a very good impression

on looking at a car straight away.

And I pulled up and I knew what it was.

Sure.

And I literally didn't care.

Yeah.

Whilst if there was a dodgy chill injury,

do they call it the Aperta or do they call it a Spyder, that one?

Yeah.

The roofless one of those, you would have gone...

What, if there's any Ferrari, I've lost my mind.

Yeah.

Yeah, well...

Well, that's not quite true.

If it was an F12, you wouldn't have cared.

Yeah, I wouldn't have cared.

Yeah, I know what you mean.

Well, let's see.

So, that will probably be next week's episode in some part,

talking about that car.

But yeah, we'll find out.

Anyway, mate, I want to talk to you about America.

Because obviously...

We're going.

No, last week I went.

Oh, you went, yeah.

Left you behind, mate.

I went to Tale of the Dragon.

Yeah, in the mini.

In the mini.

Yeah.

Or as my daughter now calls it, Dragon of the Tail.

Which I so loved because I bought her a fluffy dragon.

And my mum was like, where did that come from?

Papa.

But why?

Because he went to Dragon of the Tail.

I was like, you're perfect.

Yeah, exactly.

She's fun.

North Carolina, my new favorite state in America.

You like it?

Mate, unbelievably beautiful at this time of year.

22 degrees, clear blue skies.

The best autumnal colors you could imagine.

Yeah.

Big empty spaces, mountains, lakes, cool towns, like cool cities.

I flew into Charlotte.

This is very American for non-American listeners.

Yeah, Charlotte, North Carolina.

Personal joke.

Tony put a face because I flew into Charlotte.

And I really shouldn't laugh so much.

I flew into the city of Charlotte, North Carolina.

Stop.

And then we drove and stayed over in a place called Asheville.

It's kind of like a cool town.

And then we drove out to Tail of the Dragon.

Yes, and I was in this 2025 Mini Cooper JCW.

Can't we do a tour there then?

Well, this is what I was looking at because this was,

I think what they call the Great Smoky Mountain

slash the Blue Mountain slash, yeah, driving heaven.

Is there enough time there?

Well, yes.

Firstly, America's just huge.

Matt Farrow was there doing one of his road and track driving tours.

Where does he live, Matt, then?

What?

Where does he live?

California.

LA.

What?

And he goes all the way over to there.

And they do them all over the US.

Wow.

And so they did five days, I think, in this area.

And it is totally doable.

And even when I went to visit Porsche HQ, which is in Atlanta, Georgia,

they told me that there's amazing driving roads you can do all in and around there.

And just not my way to Dragon of the Tale.

I found incredible roads.

So that is an area that I want to explore so much more.

Fair.

And the roads are American, as in they would have suited the vanquish valante massively.

Lots of flows.

But interesting enough and definitely enjoyable enough.

But the views, the scenery, the tarmac quality, how empty they are,

just really, really enjoyable.

OK.

But then I got to Tale of the Dragon.

Now, last time I went was 2019.

It was raining.

It was packed.

I was in the Carrera Tee.

And I followed a guy in a three series up there at about 25 miles an hour the whole way.

And was like, what is this about?

Like, just going, it is endless turns as we discovered.

When were you overtaking, mate?

No, no, he was my guide.

Oh.

And you can't overtake.

You literally can't overtake.

It's 318 turns in 11 miles, solid yellow lines the whole way,

and make nonstop blind corners and traffic.

And people are going flat.

You cannot overtake.

Like, it is death to overtake.

There's a lot of turnouts they call them.

Some places for traffic in front of you to pull into.

But if they don't, if you're behind theoretically fast moving cars,

it doesn't happen.

You can so end up in a queue because I genuinely wouldn't overtake.

Just like it's not allowed.

It's so dangerous.

You have a lot of bikers there.

Fine.

But the interesting thing was what I realized or what I'm going to claim is,

I think this is the closest maybe you could find to the Nurburgring in America.

Wow.

And let me explain why.

Because not only do you have the risk on average,

one to two people die on Dragon of the Tale each year.

It's a public road, not a racetrack by the ring.

And there was a real community.

Not only do people go there with purpose-built BMWs made for the Dragon or Mustangs or whatever

to test vehicles.

And there's a lot of bikers and all these things like that.

But at both ends, there are places to hang out where people congregate

and talk about the cars they've bought.

There's shops.

There's restaurants.

Like, it's a real vibe.

Like a real day's question.

Right.

Like we went up to the top of Anzium's Crest, 100%.

But this felt more grassrootsy.

Anzium's Crest, I think, because of the inherently California car culture,

feels a bit premium.

Even if you get up there and there's non-premium cars,

this somehow feels a bit premium.

This just felt a bit more grassroots, a bit more anyone can go.

A little bit more lawless.

But yeah, I really got into the vibe a lot more this year.

Nice.

But second to that, it was beautiful weather, unbelievable foliage,

and the road was really quiet.

Was it?

So, time of the year, you reckon?

Yes.

Everyone explained, like, there's a multitude of factors.

I mean, middle of the week, time of the year, all of this kind of stuff,

luck with the weather, all these things.

But I must have been there from 10, 11 a.m. till 4 p.m.

Going up and down.

And I must have got the majority of the time clear runs.

And this road is really fun.

I take back everything I said.

I do still enjoy the enthusiasm that some Americans have for

Tale of the Dragon.

Like, oh my God, it's the most crazy road in the world.

Like, I'm like, calm down.

It's a twisty road.

And it is like, there are moments that could catch you out.

There's some really crazy camber.

There's some, you know, apexes that kind of double up on you

and some quite sharp falls.

You could get yourself into trouble if you didn't know what you were doing.

But if you are used to driving technical twisty roads,

it's a technical twisty road.

Nice.

And the Mini was kind of perfect for it because I'm sort of flat everywhere.

Do you know what I mean?

Obviously, JCW is the first better to ask about the cars, most.

Yeah.

One of the latest JCW, obviously, they don't do manual anymore.

No.

So they're auto box, coupe, ready and rocking to go.

Coupe, hatchback.

Sorry, hatchback, thank you.

Because there were soft tops on the drive.

And it was just great as in like go-kart.

Like most of the cars I saw having most fun up there were MX-5s, were Supras, were

sort of light and nimble-ish, 350 horsepower max type stuff.

I saw a couple of turbo S's.

I saw a couple of Corvette that looked like they were just having to wait.

Do you know what I mean?

Like they couldn't really extract much from the cars.

The guys who were really pushing on, GR86s, all that kind of stuff.

So the Mini felt well-placed, but I think at the same time I was like,

I would love to come back here in.

And what's that?

Oh, like a GT4.

I thought a GT4 on that road manual for me just to have that automatic,

because it would be another thing to think about.

Because you do have to think.

It was the only thing I thought, okay, that would be my next level.

But actually, hot hatch, I-30N, Civic Type R would have been

Civic Type R on that road.

Unbelievable.

So I really enjoyed myself.

My quest was to discover, is it actually America's greatest driving

work? Because that's what a lot of people say.

I don't think so, dude.

You don't?

I think even in that area, there are some other roads that you could claim are as good and as-

It's just the most famous road.

It's just got a reputation.

Yeah.

Maybe because of the amount of turns, like the relentlessness of it.

It is 11 miles and it is relentless.

And I couldn't tell you, like, oh, mate, mile six is the best.

Like, it's just all the sides.

Like, it's just non-stop.

You're in the tree line.

And when does it go?

It just ends.

It goes between Tennessee and North Carolina.

It crosses the border.

And it was an original transit route from, like, Nashville into North Carolina.

So it's nothing.

It's not a loop.

It's just a road over the mountains, over the ridge line.

Fine.

So there's obviously a motorway that's a quicker way.

But if you want to go over the top, you can, right?

I don't know what the motorway is, I think, because it's a huge mountain range.

There's hundreds of roads in there.

Okay.

So it's just a specific road within that mountain range.

It's not like Europe.

There's like one pass up.

Yeah.

There's like hundreds of roads in there.

Okay.

So there's just one of the roads that just crosses over.

It's a bit like going to Andermatt in Switzerland,

where there's lots of different passes.

Yeah.

I guess.

Yeah.

Yeah, there's lots of routes and roads.

And there's lots of little communities.

There's an amazing hotel, historic Topoko Lodge,

at the bottom of it.

Really cool old filling station, like by some rapid rivers,

got great sort of tavern and stuff like that.

That's a really cool place.

And that's an added bonus that it's got,

which I didn't know last time.

It's just, if we were there, we're like, let's go do it.

But if you got there on a busy day,

I'd be like, I turn around, it's not worth it.

Yeah.

Okay.

We're going to do the other roads.

Yeah.

Just go do the other roads and you'll have just as much fun.

The photographers that are based there year round,

they just snap everything, put it online.

So yeah, I had an absolute blast and a great trip.

That content is coming soon.

And really what I learned from is,

I want to get back and explore Tennessee, North Carolina,

Georgia, a whole load more, that kind of area.

Because I think for driving roads,

for me, that felt really freaking amazing.

And that's like mid-America, right?

I was trying to explain it because my mum was asking where it was.

No, not really.

It's sort of southeast, but not...

No, it's not the deep south and it's not Florida.

So New York side.

Yeah.

Straight down and then in a bit.

Okay. So it's towards Florida and Miami.

Yeah, going sort of down.

Like if that's the...

If that's the...

If New York's there, Miami's there.

It's sort of in here somewhere.

Okay.

So the flight, not even that long.

Six or seven hours.

Eight hours.

Right.

Eight hours.

Okay.

And I got caught up in the shutdown.

Did you know about this?

No.

The American government is shut down.

I don't know if it's still shut down.

It was shut down for like...

When I was flying 36 days, they just closed the government.

So apparently it's like an argument with healthcare

because they couldn't agree.

Trump was like, why are we closing down?

Really?

Yeah.

So they just like shut down

and that means like no one's getting paid.

So all the airport staff were like,

well, we're not getting paid.

So we're not working.

So they like had to cancel loads of flights and stuff.

Oh my God.

Insane, isn't it?

Weird that we never hear about this stuff.

Yeah.

I had no idea.

My mum takes me like, are you going to get back?

And I was like, what do you mean?

She goes, yeah, they're canceling flights.

I was like, oh my God.

Come into the airport.

But yeah, really, really good trip.

Huge thanks to me for organising that.

I put that together.

It was pretty freaking mega.

And I think we need to head back.

Anyway, I know you said that you got a Porsche story.

Quickly, I want to touch on a Porsche story.

My GT3, about to be three years old.

Do you an MOT and refinancing?

Wait a minute.

Yeah.

Mad, right?

Was it December or January?

Well, it got delivered in December

and I think I paid for it just before Christmas

and then it took delivery.

In January.

First week of January, yeah.

Yeah.

When it's registered.

Yes, exactly.

So MOT is a wild thing.

I mean, I hope it's going to pass, lol.

It'll be fine, mate.

I know, I know, but funny that.

That's the first car I've bought new

and has required an MOT type thing.

So you're going to extend the warranty?

I've got to extend the warranty.

You better do that now.

How do I do that?

Just literally just ring Porsche up

and just say, can I extend the warranty, please?

It's in there, isn't it?

How much is that?

They'll relieve you of between two and two and a half grand.

Then you've got the extra two years.

You haven't got to take it in or anything

because it's still got manufacturer warranty.

So if you do it now,

renew it like before it runs out of manufacturer warranty,

you haven't got to do the 111 point check.

Let's keep spending money.

Let me know.

I've got to sell the car then.

Well, I did think about this.

No, mate.

You can't sell that car.

I don't ever want to.

And it has gone on.

It's gone on to mean so much more than what the car is.

And yeah, three years.

Like where is that?

Like what?

Of course.

And don't forget like,

because I'm at the same position as my car now,

almost I got mine just after you.

And like I've paid a huge chunk of it off now.

Like the refinancing is not going to be that bad.

So your monthly payment is going to go down anyway.

Nope.

No?

Nope.

Why?

That's what I wanted to come into.

Oh, no.

Oh, they've recalculated.

The banks have recalculated the residuals

because they're pooing money.

No, they stop pooing money now, but they were.

The Porsche quote was an increase of £400 a month.

Yeah.

But you're not going to, you can't do that, can you?

Magnitude came in to 80, 300 a month more.

More.

Yeah, that's it.

That's the residual, the residuals of all adjusting.

And I guess new car versus used.

Yeah.

Well, that Porsche one will definitely be geared on

trying to sell you a new car.

And to be fair,

magnitude couldn't match for the first time ever in my life,

the original Porsche offer, because you're right,

there would have been an incentive there

of like new car and new car finance.

But on refinancing, their offer was, I literally looked at it,

I was like, what?

Because I thought the same as you.

I was like, finally, like, I'm going to do some of my playments.

Yeah.

And then the figures came in, I was like, that is disgusting.

And then I saw it obviously came, of course,

called Tiamat magnitude straight away and said, help.

And he came back.

He was about 100, 150 quid cheaper than the Porsche quote.

Increasing the balloon slightly.

Yes.

The AER cheaper as well.

Both.

Fine.

Both.

So he did it both sides.

And, but as I say, it took it and it's about 250 quid

increased to me per month was the cheaper stuff.

On another three years.

Yeah.

That's balloon related, mate.

That would be, of course.

You've got another balloon on it, right?

Yeah.

That's how I would do it.

In that moment, I suddenly was like, oh my God, like,

this is insane.

And three and now I've got the project A.

I just put like half a second.

I was like, what could I or would I do?

Because as you say, I've got some equity in that car now.

Well, just hold on to you.

Just hold on and listen to you, mate, for a minute.

Right.

Because this is the time now.

This second trimester.

I'm so glad to call it.

Right.

Let's go.

Yeah.

It's quite good.

The male trimester.

Yeah.

This period now is where you'll start to use that car as a savings account.

So just keep it.

It's fine.

Interesting.

Yeah.

Because it's not going to do what it's been doing over the last three years.

Not going to do that again.

This three years.

OK.

So just keep paying in.

Just keep paying in.

Yeah.

And then the next time when you go to come out or if you get,

it's then six years old.

Well, it's still not bad, mate.

Six years old.

Like it's still such a modern car, that car.

Yeah.

You know, like.

Oh, three years have gone like that.

Yeah.

And I've loved every second with it and done way more with it

than I ever thought I could.

Exactly.

And even though I've got the project A,

I still see such usage cases for the GT3.

I still adore it.

And because it's weirdly and hurriedly linked to my daughter,

as in literally paid for it,

I think two days before my daughter was born

and then collected it a week after she was born.

I remember.

And you know, got the back seats put in

so she could come with me.

All of this kind of stuff.

That's why I want to keep it.

But yeah, I just, it was just that kind of,

well, it is expensive.

It'll be the most expensive car payment that I do out of the CS project.

All three of them.

That's the most expensive.

And I say, I didn't really sit there.

I think I'm not going to sell it,

but I just thought for a half a minute of like,

like interesting.

But no, I'm going to have to go through it.

And yes, yeah, refinance.

So we won't have any upfront costs.

And we'll put any more money in.

No, no, no.

I have to do the extended warranty,

which you say two, two and a half,

get an MOT and I guess serviced at some point.

I want to do a service tool next year.

Fine.

And you've already done one service.

Yeah.

How many miles have it done?

Oh, no, I don't know.

20,000, 19 and a half.

19 and a half thousand miles.

Yeah, there must be one coming up.

Might be one coming up.

I might as well get them to do it.

Mix them up.

Yeah, stick the winter tyres back on it

and then go take it on some winter adventures

and in the new years, I always do.

And then I'll take it on one of the tours next year.

Yes.

Even for that reason, mate,

like for that reason alone,

you keep it for that reason.

Because it's really one of the sole reasons

why I keep my car.

But also like this is the whole point.

I know we've said it before

and I'm sorry people who hate us talking about this.

And if you don't experience it,

you won't get it.

What on earth do you replace that car with?

That's the biggest problem.

I mean, I guess, you know, you could say,

oh, the project date.

But no, firstly, also for me, manual gearbox.

But just in general, the project is still not

as capable as the GT3.

It offers something different.

But all I would do is go buy an older Porsche.

Do you know what I mean?

Like that's all I would do is go buy a classic 911 or whatever.

And be more pissed off.

Be more miserable.

We just have a different usage case.

But as an actual dynamic,

it just had Friar give me a call

to just basically sniffing around

because I've always told them to keep an eye out

for certain cars.

And they had a very nice Portofino and coming to stock

and I was like, I mean, I could do that, for example.

But then you're back on the gravy train, mate.

You're paying for a car that's depreciating on the wall.

And that's the problem.

I want the GT3.

Do you know what I mean?

Of course.

Like it doesn't, I'm not really playing that game anymore.

I haven't ever really played that game of like move the car.

Just have the cars that I want.

I will go through it all and do the refinancing to that.

Do as I just said.

So suck up a bit of a bill because it's been worth it.

And as you say, actually better to put two and a half grand

plus plus a little bit into that car than 10 grand into financing

a new car starting all over again.

And you know, all that.

10 grand's gone.

The monthly payments won't change.

This is all the same.

And you're worse off.

Exactly.

Just keep the car you got.

What was your Porsche story?

Oh, I've got good news.

Oh, yeah.

They're going to fix the car, which is good.

Hello.

How's this happened?

So, well, because what's the issue first?

They're going to go, how's this happened?

Well, it's because now it's gone to a proper Porsche dealership

that's actually looked at the car.

Independent or?

No, no, no.

A proper Porsche dealership.

It's very, very good friend.

Neil, actually you met Neil.

So his Porsche dealership, he's bought all his Porsches off.

I'm going to say his.

It's Porsche East London.

They are looking after me, basically,

and they're doing what they should be doing.

Interesting.

So, yeah, I had a call literally yesterday,

and they said they've heard back from Porsche Technical.

They're going to put some wheel bearings in the car.

I said, thank you very much.

That's it.

Wow.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Have you passed off it back onto your original?

No.

Porsche authorized?

No.

I think that should maybe happen.

Fire.

You know what, as well, not to dig Porsche out too much.

You know, I made a complaint.

Yeah.

Apart from we're assessing that your complaint,

no one ever got back to me.

I think let's you and I speak to my contacts at Porsche

and give them a heads up on that.

Yeah.

Because that's a bit insane that you waited.

What was that?

I mean, essentially two months with nothing.

The car was in for five weeks.

I then put a complaint into Porsche UK.

I then waited a further three weeks

before I even got a response from them.

Yeah.

And they said they contacted the dealer,

and their response was the dealer

will be in contact with you to rebook the car in.

When I've already said,

I don't want to use that dealer again.

But I've already gone and done my own thing,

and it's now at Porsche East London.

And you've gone to Porsche East London,

and they've immediately identified the issue,

come up with a solution, done, done, done.

Done the recalls, just the previous Porsche,

they didn't even do the recalls.

So they've done the recalls.

They've done what they, and what I've experienced

over the last 10 years with Porsche.

Which is insane when you think that it comes down to that

sort of level, like as in like people specific,

dealer specific.

Because, and that's the point I guess,

whenever you have a group of anything,

forget just being a manufacturer group,

and you know, dealer group or whatever.

It is down to the level of managers in that workshop.

Of course.

Process and protocols.

And you can get so easily burnt,

and suddenly turn against an entire brand,

or an ownership experience, because of...

People do make.

Yeah, of course.

Well, you were very, you were fuming, mate.

I was fuming.

Off camera, we've talked about it a bit on here,

but you've generally been kind of raging, to be fair.

But I've got every right to be.

Absolutely.

But it was specific to that other dealership.

And I wonder how many people have actually got burnt,

or, and it was the McLaren story,

was such an interesting one, right?

The amount of people that I knew,

that were working with McLaren London or Ascot,

that would rage and fume about,

can't get a car in for 10 weeks,

no one takes my phone calls,

because they had like three bays at McLaren Ascot.

And when there's initial cars came out,

that everyone had issues with,

they just simply couldn't service them,

and they didn't have their customer service,

didn't have the people on the phones.

And so people were like, McLaren,

oh crap, it's like, well, actually,

you speak somebody in McLaren Man Chest,

or something like that.

No, no, it's, I'll get my car in in two weeks, or whatever.

So it's so...

Dealer dependent.

So do...

But because in that other dealer,

was part of the retail group, right?

Correct.

Without calling them out massively.

I think...

Whatever we need to say.

Well, no, no, I don't want to.

I specifically don't want to,

but given how close we are with Porsche on a press side,

good of a relationship I've got with that team,

I think they're full, man.

No, no, no.

I want to tell them,

so that they can pass that feedback on,

because there will be plenty of other customers

struggling with that specific dealer,

and that could be done against the brand.

Not all dealers across the country.

Sure.

There'll be other Porsche dealers that...

No, not just Porsche's, mate.

Like...

Yeah, of course.

You get it with Land Rover dealers,

you know, like you get it with all dealers.

A main dealer is only ever as good

as the people that are inside it.

Of course.

And if they were all perfect,

I probably wouldn't have a dealership,

because I've said many times before

that independence exists,

because main dealers, half of them,

aren't very good at their jobs.

Would you take your GT3 on a wintery emission?

A what?

Like a wintery weather emission.

Love to.

That's what we should do, mate.

What's that mean?

In January, either to ice race,

or on our own mission,

to celebrate three years of owning GT3s.

Yeah.

How many miles has your car done?

Twelve and a half.

Because when did we do the Austria trip?

Must have been two years ago, if not a bit more.

The original Recky for On The Road.

Two and a bit years ago.

Two and a half years ago.

It was of October retard.

It was September...

September 23.

Three.

Yes.

Yes, because it was...

Yeah, because I've had my car March 23.

I got it about three months after you.

So if we did, we could even do like Scandinavia.

We could go up like actually like Stockholm.

And it sounds like a massive crash.

But it's quite hard with the winter tyres,

but we get winter tyres on both.

Yeah.

And in January, go on a little celebratory.

We've had these cars for three years now.

Yeah.

And just reflect and enjoy.

We could go and get them to break.

But sliding around in the snow a little bit.

And have a picture of the two cars like up against the snow

and slipping around.

Because I've done so many ditches.

I've done so many wet weather, icy drives in that GC3.

And it's a ton of fun driving that car in cold conditions.

And still great.

And it looks amazing.

So you can imagine our two cars like parked up on a snowy-ish pass.

We should do a tour one day mate.

Oh, I'd love to.

Like a winter tour.

That'd be so.

OK, well, there you go.

Then makes it worthwhile for you.

Do the recce.

Let's do a recce.

Let's go do a recce of a winter.

Because you remember I used to do these snow tours

with the team Calais boys.

And they were mega.

And that was that time of year up in Sweden or Norway.

And we started to struggle because there

started to be lack of snow.

Sorry, Greta Kuttenberg.

It's a real, real schlep to get up to Scandinavia.

So what?

I've never done it.

But you burn 2000 miles just getting there.

And it's like two and a half days of just

the most boring and flat motorways.

What I'm saying is could we figure out a way

to truck the cars half the way.

If we could, if we could figure out a way

to truck the cars at least up to like,

you know, somewhere at the bottom of Sweden.

And wait for us there.

And then we go and do three days of that

into Sweden and Norway.

And then come back like that.

That would be worthwhile to view for a 2026 snow tour.

That's worthwhile, isn't it?

Yeah.

And what we could do is we could leave.

We could both go in a car to Sweden,

leave that car there, jump in our GT3s

that have already been there on the lorries.

I've just figured it out.

Because Porsche Norway are amazing.

And Porsche Norway have wanted to do something for ages.

So why don't we get the car sent to Oslo?

Yeah.

We'll get the car sent to Oslo.

We go up there in like a Panamera Turbo S from the UK team,

spend a few days fighting around the GT3s,

cruise back in the Turbo S, job done.

Oh, what a trip.

Yeah, that's exciting.

Shall we go now?

Let's go.

Okay, done.

What's the space, Johnny?

Oh, and actually on that note, this is what?

Oh, and that's like, oh, I just figured it out.

I know where we're going.

Well, I know.

Well, we'll see how that actually all plans out.

Movements and plans for the next few weeks.

I'm off to Cornwall in the Land Rover.

That'll be quite exciting.

Your Land Rover?

Yep.

Yeah, in the Land Rover 90.

So I'm quite excited for that.

Does that work now?

It should be.

My fur, my biggest drive in it.

The reason I'm doing it is how many years ago now?

I reckon.

Cornwall?

Cornwall, yeah, 15 years ago.

No, maybe 15 years ago or 12.

I'll work out exactly how long.

My mum bought a house in Cornwall and she got the keys.

And we were going down.

It's a great story, actually.

We're going down at Christmas time to go and check it out.

We weren't going to stay there.

She's got the keys, but we're going to go and check it out.

And we were supposed to go down in Dad's Range Rover Sport.

And in the morning we got in and we were driving down the road

and it went boom, low tire pressure.

And it was like quite low.

And it could have been cold temperatures,

but it was low enough to be like,

it's concerning.

I think it was dropping.

So we also like,

Dad, we've got to put air in it.

And Dad got very cross at this.

Did he?

What do you mean?

No, no, no, it'll be fine.

I said, do I have to go to the garage?

I said, no, no, I said, just pull into a petrol station.

Dad, it'll be fine.

Dad had no clue about putting air in tires.

Did you?

Well, yes.

But he was the kind of, you know,

that same mentality of like,

what do you mean put oil in it?

Don't they put oil in at the factory?

So I said, like, you know, come up and go.

And Dad was like,

I think I, I think I was being a petrolant teenager.

Like, come on, Dad, put tires in like,

I'm watching F1 or whatever.

And he didn't know how.

So he jabbed the gun, the air gun on so hard

that he broke off the valve.

The whole time.

And he's been blinded.

Lit fuming, raging.

So we had to abandon the car at a local petrol station

because he's like, oh, what do I do now?

And so we went down and my mum's,

I guess it would have been the evoke.

Where's it hurt?

Shout out an evoke.

Or maybe she had an,

I think she would have an S5 at that point.

Out of, yeah.

She would have an Audi S5.

And me and Dad took the Land Rover.

Oh.

And at that point.

Are you shopping this store?

At that point, like, it was really worse for wear.

It had no D missed like the air con, the fan.

None of that was working.

Did it make it?

It made it.

But we obviously drove on the motorway with all the dogs.

We had to keep, I had to keep winding down the window

and leaning out to wipe the windscreen.

Because the D, what would you call that?

The Hito.

Yeah.

It wasn't working, D-Mister.

And it was hilarious.

And we bombed all the way down there.

Spent a couple of days and called one bombed back.

And it was like, it was one of those hilarious

and bonding trips and blah, blah, blah.

So I thought it'd be fun now that I've got the car's mind

to retrace and redo that trip with a bit of added pizzazz.

Do, maybe go off the beaten track.

Cause I've just fitted these BF Goodrich carry threes,

which is supposed to be these amazing off-road tires.

But also my mum was like, well, if you're good,

I do have a few things that I need you to take.

I was like, well, that's great.

Cause now I've got the car.

It's all like set up.

I can load it in, load stuff in the back.

So it's like a multiple missions trip.

Yeah.

And I'm going to do that over the weekend.

Just bash down there.

Bring the honey nuts back, mate.

Yes.

Don't forget them.

Your favorite, right?

Okay, cool.

I'm going to get those specific nuts that we

demolished on the low media.

I don't meant to last the week.

They lasted the day.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

So they said this is going to last us a week.

Ah, delicious.

Anyway, and you doing anything?

What are you doing at the weekend?

This weekend, I've got a quiet weekend.

This last weekend was busy.

Quiet weekend this weekend.

Because no F1 this weekend.

No.

Yeah.

He's going to win it now.

He's done.

I'm so proud of that guy.

I mean, I've never met him, but if he wins,

I'm going to give him a kiss if he wins.

Because I, I, I didn't think he had it in him.

I thought Oscar and then I thought Oscar was going to get him.

And I'm happy to be proved wrong.

But I think he's going to do it now.

Well, I hope he does.

And I'm glad Max isn't going to do it.

I think Max has made it exciting, which is great.

And what you want a champion to do.

Yeah.

But I think what I love, and look, hey, I think mid-seasonal.

Even I was like, maybe Lando had just reached his level,

where Oscar was still, you know, growing.

But Lando has just shown us all, which he did last year.

He can keep going.

He stepped up.

That's experience and that mentality to just hone in and,

and deliver when he needs to.

And look, season's not over.

Still like a hundred points, you know, to be claimed.

111.

Yeah.

So like anything can happen still.

No, less still.

A little bit less.

Yeah.

But, but, but reliability and all like anything can happen still.

But his performances at the moment,

he is doing what needs to be done in a killer way.

Yeah.

That qualifying when he had the one lap to deliver.

And then just demolished everyone.

I was like, there he is.

So I am so hopefully excited because I want him to have it.

I want him to win it so much.

I know he's a bit of a character that not everyone loves,

but I want him to do it so much.

But it's exciting.

It's what we've got.

Having not really cared all season, I'm now excited.

Yeah.

Well, there's only three races to go now.

So, but I think it was a tall order for Max anyway,

because for the start of the season, he didn't have the car.

But arguably the second half of the season, he has had the car.

And all the nonsense, the part, all the nonsense that you heard online

over the weekend, he went from the pit lane to third.

With a brand new engine.

Because he had the car.

Yeah.

You can't, you can't, it doesn't matter.

And probably 20 horsepower more.

Yeah.

But you can't, you can't do things like that.

I know he's an unbelievable driver and he is.

Undoubtedly.

You can't do things like that in a shit box of a car.

Yeah.

You have to have the car.

Yeah.

And all the greats down the years have done things like that.

You know.

Well, what was it 20, well, firstly, he did it in 2024,

something like that, didn't he?

But 2021, which was the year when Hamilton did,

did he do 20th to first in the sprint or something?

Or he did 10th to first in the race.

He done 20th, he done 20th to fifth in the sprint.

That's it.

And then done 10th to first in the race and got past Max at lap 30

or something in the race.

And I feel like there was a Vettel year at Abu Dhabi

where he did pit lane to P3 or P4.

Lewis done pit lane at Hungary to third in 2016.

He's been done like.

It was an amazing driver.

I think nothing away from like.

But you have to have the car.

Yes.

You have to have the car.

And then the skill and the tenacity and the like,

he's maybe the most competent driver on the grid at the moment

or the most skilled driver on the grid at the moment.

I agree.

And unbelievable confidence and talent.

And so anyway, I don't take anything away from it.

Absolutely not.

But yes, I think, but these greatest of all time things

that people keep coming and keep talking about with Matt.

I'm not having that, mate.

For lots of reasons.

I'm not having that.

Well, it's it's fun.

Isn't it how?

Moving business forever forward.

Business.Walmart.com.

You know, drivers go through these stages.

I think a lot of people love at the moment to discredit Lewis, right?

You know, we were a year five of pretty unexciting run of results

and pretty apart from Silverstone to last year,

apart from like the odd race with Mercedes.

Yeah.

He's had like glimpses of his pace and performance.

And yeah, in general, he doesn't look like Lewis Hamilton that we all knew.

He's faulty.

So people are starting to play, oh, yeah, remember.

But when he retires and when we stop and look back,

the results and everything.

Yes, greatest of all time.

With Max, I think it's too impossible to give him that.

You know, it's like when Vettel,

when Vettel was destroying everyone four times at the Mini,

he left Red Bull, I was like, yeah, not really had it.

So he arguably is one of the all-time greats.

I agree.

And clearly the most capable on the grid at the moment.

I agree.

But until he's retired and we can look back on his entire career

and then judge against other people's entire career,

I think it's hard to give that go-to.

And that's not me as a Hamilton fan as a Brit being like, oh, whoa, Max.

No.

I was like, we haven't we haven't seen his career play out yet.

No.

And I think when you look at greatest of all time,

and everyone has their opinion,

whether they think it's Lewis,

whether they've a lot of people think it's Schumacher.

I know you probably think Schumacher.

A lot of people will say Senna, generations back,

you know, people like Martin Brundle and stuff like that.

They will say Senna because they raced against him and stuff.

They would have said Jim Clark.

Of course, everyone has their as their perception.

But what if you look at Senna, Schumacher and Lewis,

what they all have in common,

they were all one.

They're all multi-world champions with multi-world champions of teammates.

And they'll swap teams all in different teams.

Yeah.

Different teams.

I think it's fascinating.

I don't think Schumacher is teammate wise.

But he definitely a world champions of teammates.

No.

Well, he's used this then.

Um, because if you think about the Ferrari years,

it was 100% a sort of a stop and dynamic and very clear of Ferrari number ones and number twos.

So you had obviously Irvine and Barrichello and then at the last year, Masa.

Now you would say Masa at his peak was championship level,

like basically did win it in 2008,

was at that top level as Schumacher was coming off.

Barrichello,

um, hard to really say what level he performed at Irvine again.

He raced against Reichenan, but he wasn't a teammate of Reichenan.

Yeah.

He wasn't a teammate of Reichenan.

And in the Benetton years, you know, Herbert,

Brunndorf, half-bin it,

George, like, mmm, Schumacher is harder.

Senna 100%.

Prost.

Yeah.

Of course.

Yeah.

Schumacher on the teammate front is harder,

but I think I will always view Schumacher different in terms of how he,

you know, what made him the champion.

And I think that's the hard thing with,

I think it's quite unfair the Verstappen teammate thing because

it makes it harder to really judge his ability for sure.

It makes it harder to say, like,

how much more performance he's getting out of that car?

Like, like how do you compare?

But I don't think it's always that fair because what can he do?

Like, like, what can he do?

No, it's not his fault.

It's not his fault.

But if you, if you want to put him on a pedestal of the greatest of all time,

because last year we drove from the back of the grid at Brazil and went to the front,

which we've seen multiple F1 drivers do that in the past.

It's not enough for me.

And I always think you, you, you, all you do in F1 normally is your teammate.

That's your, that's your barometer.

And if you've got a weak teammate, then you never ever know.

It's hard to, hard to really know what's going on there.

Yeah, it's hard to really, really gauge.

And all the teammates have said that car is suits or has been built for Max's driving style.

So put Max into a car that doesn't suit his driving style.

What is his performance like?

And I'm not saying he won't be able to do it, by the way, because we can't.

You can never, you can't.

I'm desperate to see it.

Me too, yeah.

And, and, and I don't doubt that he wouldn't be able to do it.

And, and like you said, I agree with you at the moment.

He is the best driver in the world.

I agree.

I don't think it's even close to be fair.

But also switching it on its head when you look at it from a bigger picture.

At the start of the season, everyone said that Oscar is a better driver than Lando, right?

If Lando wins the championship, right?

Clearly he's not, right?

And everyone lauded Oscar.

So really what that tells you is, is that actually if you put, it's never going to happen.

If you put them all in the same car, there's nothing between any of them,

which is what I always suspected.

There's like two or three tenths between all the drivers.

One million percent.

And it's the car.

I agree that.

And I think what we'll end it on that I find fascinating in the greatest of all time.

So Schumacher, when he came back with Mercedes, you know, post neck injury,

three or so years out, you know, age wise, performance wise, you know, really sort of

passed it in a generation of cars that he clearly couldn't quite adapt to or get on top of like he

did in his era.

Rosberg, we now know actually on his day, one of the greats.

One of the greats.

Yeah, he's world champion.

You know, beat Hamilton at his prime.

Yeah.

So when you now look back at the Mercedes results with Schumacher and here, all the

behind the scenes stories of how he transformed that team into the championship winning team

they became and then look at his final year where he was qualifying close to Rosberg,

race pace close to Rosberg, got the poll at Monaco, nearly got sort of, you know,

podiums and victories in that year.

You go, holy crap, like he was actually by year three still performing.

He still had that level.

And if you look at Lewis, whilst he's had some scrappy races and there's a little bit of

question marks over his overall, since the summer break, he has been on a, he's been

close enough to Leclerc.

The 10th.

Yeah.

In qualifying, someone's out qualified and in race pace to be a comparative teammate.

Leclerc, yes, fundamentally still feels like the quicker driver.

But as he should be, he's half his age.

And it's his car.

Yeah.

And it's his car.

And he's, so, and that's where, you know, that's where we'll be fascinating about

max is the adaptation.

And so that's why I think we all want to see it before making those claims.

But at the end of the day, we are, you know, armchair pundits and it's hard to say, but I

just, yeah, that's my whole thing.

It's like, I'm, I'm desperate to see max either because I don't want to put an Alonso,

a Hamilton, a Leclerc, a Russell into that red bull seat because Sergio Perez was a great driver,

like a great driver.

And I don't think that Sonoda or Lawson or any of people aren't good drivers.

Riccardo.

Well, and Riccardo, if you look about it, you know, was comparable to Verstappen,

but Verstappen wasn't at the point of the career that he was, you know, so different things.

But I want to see max go somewhere else.

I don't want to put somebody else in that second seat.

I want him to go to Mercedes.

I want him to go to Ferrari or whatever.

So anyway, let's wait and see.

All right, everyone, we will be back with you next week for another episode in car, in studio,

in cafe, who knows, until then subscribe, keep watching us, check out Tony at Tony

Gravel, Car Sales and most of Stream Media platforms.

I'm at Cindy Glass.

See you next week.

Bye-bye.

See ya.

0:00

58:22

[S8, E8] Selling The GT3, Tony's New Range Rover & F1 Thoughts

S58

B58

Aston Martin DBX707

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