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This is off track.
Oh man, it is.
It's the May hangover. The May hangover's a real thing.
It's a really real thing. Yeah.
Could you imagine if you were also hungover right now?
No. I, IM not.
I sure can are. I sure can imagine that.
Yeah. I thought, Hmm, nevermind.
Um, yeah, but in, in, in our defense, or to counteract your point, you didn't really work as hard as the rest of us this month.
You weren't even here the whole time. So
You didn't even, he didn't even run a marathon in the same trip you were here.
Yeah. That was totally the last trip.
Wait, okay. No, you did do the gp.
I was gonna ask if I was the only one of the three of us that finished a race this month, but you did do the GP at Barber.
So , I guess you did.
Yeah, dude, we worked Barbara, then we worked the gp.
I mean, you talked, talked about it.
Do you have any idea how much work that is? Sometimes
It's so hard.
It's so hard. It's so hard. Let's not talk about,
let's not talk about the 30, no, what was it, 40, 50 something hour?
I forget how many hours we did of broadcasting this month on top of several live show podcasts and charity events and et cetera, et cetera.
I just don't wanna talk. But guys,
we're gonna be on a podcast for the next hour. So
Giddy up special.
Two parter this week, to really just keep talking, right?
We figured, you know, technically this is a Tuesday episode, but it's post 500 and everybody wants to hear about the 500.
We don't wanna wait till Thursday for that.
So we're gonna do the main show, which is gonna be an extended main show, cut up over two episodes Tuesday and Thursday. It's part
One's coming at you hot. It's part ones heavy,
Coming at your hard, just like there's, We're on fire.
Um, wow. Where do we even start? , there was so
Mean, do it chronologically To happen.
Do we go back to, because what's important to remember is our last show was recorded on a Tuesday and on Wednesday is when everything post qualifying drama.
Oh, God. Exploded. I wasn't even thinking about
that. .
Yeah. So like, we have not talked about the Penske firings
and the cars getting kicked to the back and, or maybe, maybe we knew they were going to the back.
I don't remember exactly the Criminal, I think we knew they were going to the back.
Yeah, I think we did. Yes.
Yeah, we didn't talk about Centric and Yep. All you would
Say the other two names, I forget.
Mm-hmm. Kyle Wire and Ron Raki.
Anyway, yes, I did know that. I just woke up.
Um, it feel, that feels like it was a month ago.
Yeah, I mean, honestly, it's like, not even that interesting to talk about anymore .
Like that's how, that's how rapid things move.
But no, um, listen, oh, my, my, my apologies guys.
I'm, I'm quite ill. Um, thanks Tim.
I'm still gonna blame this on you.
Uh, even though you probably didn't do it, I'm still gonna blame it on you. Pretty sure
I didn't, but Yeah, I'll take it.
I like it. So
I think, I Think, you know, we covered a lot in last week's episode about, um, you know, our thoughts and opinions and, and all of these things that happened.
And I don't think it was, it was necessarily a surprise, um, that there was some action taken in terms of personnel.
Um, but the magnitude and the amount I think was a surprise.
Wouldn't you agree with that, James?
1000% on all points.
Like, 'cause I mean, when, when things happen in corporations, forget motorsports, um, and there's a kind of black eye associated with said corporation.
And if it happens once, you know, there's usually a, a bit of a grace situation and then it happens twice, and there's usually things that are adjusted and changed in the hierarchy of that organization.
So like, I, I guess all of that is understandable.
Um, but then when you look at like, the severity of the punishment versus the crime committed, right?
I think that's another thing you have to take into consideration.
It's like, I think, I don't know that those two things necessarily add up.
Yeah, it was weird. It was weird
because one thing I know we did cover was that the, the, the issue in qualifying was not some, like ASEP was some Software hacks, Right?
Secret performance, performance enhancer, get an extra, extra 50 horsepower kind of deal.
It was a very minor detail that everybody agreed.
Like I've heard other drivers on interviews and stuff publicly saying that like, yeah, from a performance standpoint it wasn't a big deal.
It's a black and white rule.
So yes, action needs to be taken, whatever.
Um, so to Alex's point, especially given the previous, you know, season and the issues that that had, there some changes were probably not surprising.
The yeah, surprising part was you look at Cindrich, Zuki and Moyer, those are like the three top guys at the program for Penske's IndyCar deal.
So you're, you're just removing, like, it's like looking at an org chart and just taking the, just ripping the top off the page and kind of starting from scratch.
That's a monumental thing to do.
Now again, this, this is where it gets kind of weird is like, was that done?
Because Roger, just as a team, o let, let's say he didn't have any say in anything else and was just the head of Penske racing.
Is that the decision that he makes because he doesn't like that twice in two years, something of this magnitude happened, or do we think it is, it was an exaggerated response because of everything else?
Well, based on the penalty, you'd, I mean, I guess we'll never know, but based on the penalty, you'd have to bias towards the latter, right?
Like, again, this is a attempt to, you know, show, um, that he is not approving of his team not being held to the highest standard of accountability.
He's showing that he does not want the series and its reputation to be tarnished because of his team.
And so actions are taken are arguably incredibly severe because of that, right?
Had he say, chip owns the series, right?
I don't think three people get fired because of this, right?
I don't even know that one person gets fired.
One person might get moved or demoted or suspended for a period of time, right?
But like, if you think about these guys, I mean, especially Tim and Ron who have committed their entire lives and, and careers to, to team Penske and, and everything and have been there through some incredible times, both positive and negative, like the, it's a, it's a huge, huge decision.
And, and I'm sure it's not one that Roger came by lightly.
I'm, I'm not saying that Roger is wrong for doing this, I'm not saying that this is something that, you know, he wanted to do, but I feel like he probably felt that his hand was forced because of all of the, the conversation that was surrounding this issue.
So, um, I feel just like, I felt bad for the, the, the kind of hate that Joseph and Will were getting.
I feel terrible for TC and Ron and Kyle because again, I don't think these people were in boardrooms being like, we need to, we need to putty the attenuator.
Like that's not, this wasn't some directive that was coming from them.
Are they ultimately management?
Does the buck stop with them?
They like it has to with someone, right? But mm-hmm . Yeah.
I, I feel, I do feel very bad for them.
It's, I I, and again, I feel bad also for the drivers because, you know, uh, TC has been on Joseph's stand for a very long time.
Um, Zuki Hass been on Wills stand for a very long time.
Moyer's been on McLaughlin stand, I think his entire IndyCar career.
Mm-hmm . And these are, these are like team like, you know,
Critical people. Yeah.
This is like at mission critical position here, right?
You got driver engineer and, and team manager slash strategist.
That's, that's the guy on the radio to you.
That's the person, you know, like you've had that voice in your helmet for however many years and then they're just gone three, four days, whatever it was before the biggest race of the year.
It's that, that's a huge adjustment to make.
Um, and it's, uh, yeah, it's crazy.
But again, we don't know.
We don't know what goes on behind closed doors.
We don't know all the facts and, and we don't know the whole story.
It is what it is. It's done.
A lot of people feel bad for a lot of people involved, but, you know, people thought, certain people thought that was the move that needed to be made.
So here's, here's a wild, a wild scenario, and I'm not gonna say who I was, who I was talking to about it.
Um, but I was talking to someone at, at Team Penske and I was like, who Was it?
No. And um, they were like, oh,
do you wanna know what's like, I'm not really that concerned about this weekend in terms of like the restructuring and everything.
It's like, I mean, the ship's already sailed and we're, we're pretty sorted and all this sort of thing and it's strategizing the Indy 500 and calling that race as a group effort anyways.
Right? Right. It's never just one, one person's decision.
For sure. He, he, this person was like,
what I'm terrified about is showing up Monday to the office.
'cause like all the people that are responsible for getting everything to Detroit and turning everything around and doing X, y, and z and logistics and all of this stuff are gone, Right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Like it's, it's now it's not making race cars go fast, right?
It's a concern. It's like, oh, how do we do the simple shit?
Because I've never done that before.
Because like we said, they are, they are strategists slash team managers for those individual cars, right.
And it's the team manager part. That's the bigger stress.
Yes, a hundred percent Once you leave the racetrack. And
I was like, that's a, that's a great point.
Good luck with that.
Managing the team is actually evidently the trickier bit. So Yeah,
I I know we have a lot of other things to cover, but I did have two questions on this.
I mean, one, how quickly do these three guys think get job offers at other places?
I mean, they'll get offers, they got offers eight minutes after the press release came out.
But I imagine that there's some sort of like non-compete clause I apply when you're fired.
I have a question. I have a, I don't know.
Yeah, I was about that ask. I don't, it does like can you,
'cause Indiana's a right to work state now this is Charlotte I guess, but like if you leave, If you quit, then there's the non-compete Maybe, right?
But if, if you get fired, I don't think there can be a non-compete, at least in Indiana.
Okay. So maybe, I mean, again, we don nothing.
This is pure speculation. Yeah, yeah.
I have no idea what if the team was like, I mean if it was me, if I was in, if I was in that kind of position, I'd be like, yeah, yeah, we're super firing you, but like sign this, here's a big check and you're now quitting and you have a non-compete for six months or whatever it is.
But I don't know. I have no idea.
I guess, I guess we'll find out, but um, 'cause you, you never want anybody to lose their job.
No, no, exactly. And the,
but the answer to your question, Tim, is all of their phones were ringing off the hook as soon as the news came out.
Um, and then I guess the other follow up question, we don't really, there's no real answer to this, but I just think it's worth bringing up.
You guys have talked about how it's silly if you're blaming the drivers on that.
Completely agree.
Taking that in and already understanding that it's silly to blame Joseph or, or will for this.
Why do you think it is that so many people are mad at Joseph and not that many people are mad at will?
Well, because it, it all ref it, it all reverts back to the push to pass thing.
Right? Okay. So ultimately will didn't do it.
Ultimately Scott did it but immediately turned it off and Joseph did it multiple times, right?
So there's already this like idea of Joseph intentionally trying to do things.
Um, and so wrongly this also gets attached to that also Because, because Joseph is not putting Bondo on the car Of course. No, no, no.
Also, also because, you know, there was, there's a lot of differing opinions about how 2023 Indy 500 ended.
Right. Okay.
And the confusion about like, why are we seeing something we've never seen before?
And a Penske car ends up winning on a decision that was arguably made by Penske people to finish the race under green.
Right. You've got that. And then
Bondo shows up in the museum on his car in 2024.
So I mean it's, it's all things that are actually irrelevant to Joseph.
And Joseph is an innocent kind of bystander of it, minus the push to pass thing.
Um, but that's why like, it's, it's just things have built up and Yeah.
And Will hasn't been a, a party to really any of those other things.
Yeah. That makes sense. Thanks.
Okay. It's funny 'cause I feel like I just want to,
I just want to, nah, I won't even get back into it.
It doesn't matter. It doesn't matter. Um, alright,
Well then we had, uh, we had everybody, you made up two spots, um, after qualifying before the race starts because of that.
We're gonna skip over Carb day. Tim.
No, we No, I was gonna get into that, that and then carb day and then was gonna point out later that you made up another spot.
But I was just gonna, okay.
It was a thing in my head. I'm tired.
Yeah. Say I feel like your head's
in a great place for us to be. Um, I
Don't want being in it. Well,
I mean there was Monday practice, which was fine. I guess
We talked about that talked 'cause we did a live show in the Tower Terrace after that.
Oh yeah, that's right. Thanks again. Fun.
James Schwarze coming on board. That was cool.
Um, so yeah, so Carb Day. You heard the Carb Day show.
If you're a good human being, um, good For all of us for making an appearance by the way.
Good for all of us for show.
Well, good for you and I for showing up.
And big, big props to Tim and Joey for being Out. No big props to Joey. Yeah,
Props to big props to Joey.
I had to be there. That's true. Joey didn't .
Um, big props. Hi buddy.
Oh s he looks so cute right now. Sorry, can
I just say, I know we have other actual carb day stuff, but if you haven't listened to it yet, the, the interview with All American rejects at the end of that was awesome.
Those guys were so cool and just, I could have hung out with them for hours on those couches. So,
So Tim, so Tim, you're not a big music guy.
No. Um, I spent the rest of that night listening
to All American Rejects.
Again though , I felt like I was back in high school.
Okay. Did you, I mean, would you say like, what,
what is your favorite like nineties punk rock band?
I don't even know if I have one. Um, sugar Colt.
Does that count or were they more early two thousands Sugar Colt?
I'm not sure I know who that Is. I know what that is.
They're a good one. I'm gonna stick with that.
That's probably a smart move.
'cause neither one of us can comment on it. Yeah.
And thus criticize you for it.
So that was probably a good play. Good play.
Interesting. Anyways, um, I'm
Gonna golf clap that. So
What was, what was, what was so, uh, what was so cool about 'em? Like I I'm not gonna
Listen.
They came out and just immediately made fun of Joey and I like, I love that they hit it.
They, they got the vibe right. Maybe I'll listen so quickly.
They were just fun. Cool.
It was every, they were engaged, all the questions were cool.
And don't get me wrong, creed was also awesome.
Um, just all American rejects felt like four guys I just wanna go hang out with. So
Let me ask this question.
'cause I tried really hard to beat this into you beforehand.
While you were interviewing Creed, did you guys make silly Creed puns using their lyrics?
We did a little bit. Mm.
It was, it was kind of hard because we were up against the Oscar Meyer Wienermobile race, which is just like an absurd statement that, like we were interviewing Creed while Oscar Meyer wiener mobiles were racing.
Well, let's, let's get to that.
So to lost a lot of crowd for that.
Right? Okay, let's, let's get to that. Um, the fix
Suzanne, right? They faked that.
Your, your car. I, I don't know.
Um, your carb day practice was kind of irrelevant 'cause you broke apart.
Actually no, sorry. I do need to ask this question. Oh boy.
So watching, watching the broadcast, you have five laps on the board and we see the 20 rolling back through gas alley and the report back from one of our pit reporters was there is a water pump failure.
Is this correct?
I mean, yes. Cool water pump failure.
And so you were leaking fluids.
Very happy that that didn't cause an accident.
'cause water leaking onto your rear tires at speed could be bad.
Don't worry. We tried something like that later.
Cool, cool. You did sort of do that. That's true.
Um, here was my, and then, and then it was cars not expected to make it back out in practice because they had to go to Detroit to get a new part.
Um, they did not have to go to Detroit.
Detroit had to come to us.
Sorry. A a part was having to be Yeah. Sent from Detroit.
So my question was my here's, I could not fathom that there was any part of an IndyCar or the engines or the electronics or the whatever.
I could not fathom that there's any part that bolts onto a IndyCar at the in 500 that there wasn't one spare of on the entire property.
So fair, you're taking this incredibly literally.
Um, there was a water pump. The water pumps are internal.
Um, this was the last that we were not gonna get an opportunity to run the car again.
So they wanted an engine builder to come down from Detroit to tear apart the engine, to reinstall a water pump.
So it, it had nothing to do with the part not being there.
It was because there was gonna be no leak check.
They wanted the right person no install.
They want an engine builder to do it.
And here's what's badass about this guy.
He got the call, um, and he was like, yep, no problem.
Got on his motorcycle. Nice.
With a little, with a little like I i you no borderline Ikea like all in one toolkit.
I mean it wasn't that, but like that same size and look right?
Yeah. Yeah. Rolls down to Indianapolis, drives his bike up
to the garage, hops off bike, boots on the car's, already prepped and ready, does his thing 25 minutes, doesn't take his bike boots off, gets back on.
Heads to Detroit. Thank you very much. No problem.
Like pretty, I mean as far as like mechanics, that's pretty cool.
And like nerds go like, that's badass .
That is pretty, that's a long, that's a lot of riding in one day.
That's about a four hour ride.
Unless he was just ripping it. Um, okay.
So that, that clears that up.
Thank you for clearing that up. 'cause I was a little bit
surprised by that information.
Um, yes.
So then the weenie 500 Oscar Meyer with a objectively brilliant marketing move to have all six of the Oscar Meyer Wiener mobiles racing around the speedway.
Tim, you didn't watch it because you were interviewing Creed.
Alex, I assume you had it on the garage but weren't really paying too much attention.
Um, well no. 'cause I was at a Java house activation.
Um, and also don't care.
Like, I'm sorry, I don't think it is.
I don't, I I I didn't like it. I thought it's dumb.
I thought it's a little bit lame to have.
I mean, that might not be a popular opinion, but like, this is the Indianapolis 500 and we're watching stupid hot dog trucks go around at 25 mile an hour in a stage race.
Like, what are we doing? Like, I'm sorry,
I objectively don't disagree.
I was very like, joke, I was very shocked when like the idea first was pitched.
I'm like, that's really happening.
I remember T Bell and I looked at each other, we're like, there's no way Roger knows this is going on , this is gonna get k this is gonna get canned before it ever happens.
But dude, the buy-in from the audience, like fans loved it. We
Are very Do you, you think you could love it if you are not under 10 or sober?
The the second one makes it tough. I don't know.
I'm not sure. I think yes, I think you could based on really
Like as a 30-year-old sober person, you think you'd enjoy that?
Me personally, No. Any,
Yes.
Interesting. And I'm only saying that be like the post
that we made on it was like the most, I got more responses to a story about the weenie 500 before it happened than any other post I Do you think It's just 'cause it's the word weenie.
I think it, it doesn't matter.
It's it's the absurdity of it, right? I think
It doesn't matter. Yeah.
It's taking people talking Wiener mobiles, drag Taking, there was prop bets on like the length of the anthem, which was the Oscar Byer Wiener song, which was also very funny. Like that was, that was
Funny.
It was, it was done well and like all the pi, all the pilots, all the drivers had like, you know, like corny names that were hot dog related or whatever it was, it was done very well.
I was shocked to see it happen at the Indianapolis, but if we were in Milwaukee Yeah, I get it.
That makes sense. That makes a lot of sense in Milwaukee.
I was floored that it happened at the Speedway.
Um, and obviously we had to call it, and we had to call it using just an absolute boatload of puns and, and terrible wiener jokes.
Uh, but it was, it was, there were people on their feet.
They were like, like hundreds of people in full co hotdog costumes in the stands, having a blast, having a great time.
It was, uh, look, if we can't have the freedom 100, No, don't say that.
don't put those in the same kind of case. I would
Rather have the Freedom 100.
Just so we're clear. No,
I mean, I don't, okay, here's this is, this is a good comparison.
Um, and maybe I'm just scrooge, but like, I also think the Puppy Bowl during the Super Bowl is stupid.
Yes. Do you agree with that? Yep.
Okay. All right. So we're the same.
We're the same. But okay, here's, but here's the thing.
This is the thing. Let's say,
let's say you can't be over 30 and sober and still like it.
We want a younger audience.
Like if this got a bunch of 10, 12-year-old loved to think it was awesome, then awesome.
Cool. Like Hazel loved it. That's a great example.
So, but again, I do think To the point where she left my show , her dad, like us doing the live show, which I, I call it mine.
'cause you weren't, you and Alex weren't there, but she left watching me, her dad on stage talking to a massive band to go watch the Oscar Meyer Wieners race.
And honestly couldn't blame her. Like No,
It was, no, I was, again, I, I'm not gonna lie, I was skeptical, but then when I saw the fan reaction, I'm like, okay, it's, it's something.
And if there's, if there's a day to do it, I mean, carb Day is, that makes a lot of sense.
On Carb Day. I'm kinda, I I I definitely get that part,
but I think it'll be back next year.
I think it's gonna be a new thing.
You know, Nathan's has their 4th of July hotdog getting concert or contest and Oscar Meyers gonna have the, the Weenie 500.
So my biggest fear is that we've got, we've gotta come up with a whole new raft of, of wiener jokes for the broadcast we used.
All I'll say, I will say, I will say, um, I watched Relish the, and it was, it was incredible.
Like how well you three did because like, I, I don't know how you even talk about such a thing, like I was flabbergasted.
But, um, dude, good job.
Constant Professionals, uh, Tim, our producer is texting us, uh, telling us what to do on the show, guys.
So sorry for the abrupt change.
Uh, he wants us hang to talk about, no, hang on. Okay, hang
On.
Let's just get through one more thing on Carb Day. Sure.
Then we could talk about Tim's topic and then we can, I don't know, end part one.
Um, 'cause Carb Day's not over because it went to the Pits Stop competition.
Mm. And the Pits Stop Competition was
absolutely blitzed by Penske.
Um, Shocker.
Which dude, it was shocking how fast they broke their own record by like seven three.
Like Joseph broke his own record like three times. Yeah.
And, and it was like seven tenths faster than the record from previous.
But my favorite part about , the favorite part about the base up competition was you won your first round.
Right? And first of all, I love the piss up competition.
I'm just gonna throw that out there objectively.
It's an awesome event. I love that the crew gets
to be the spotlight.
It's about what they do.
'cause what they do is very difficult and they put a lot of effort into it.
And Rocket, the, the tech guy that puts it all on, I mean, it's $150,000 worth of prizes all in.
It's awesome. I really, really love it.
So Alex wins his first one and he gets outta the car and he is walking back towards the staging area and his helmet.
And, and like Alex walking through the paddock with his helmet just cuts this very like, specific figure, right?
You just, your body language when you're just kind of walking, it's, it's, it's tough to explain.
But, so we've got, and I was like, and you're just like, you, you could be walking through a shopping mall.
Like you just, there's nothing to decipher what kind of mood you're in or whatever.
So I was making this joke.
I was like, oh, that's, Alex is very happy with that run.
You can see it in his body language and you're just walking like as normally as you could possibly be walking.
Right? And then you lost when you lost,
I forget if it was the next one or the one after when you eventually got eliminated, you're doing the exact same walk back.
I'm like, oh see here.
Notice the subtle differences in his stride, .
And I was trying to get them to put, I was trying to get them to put a side by side of the two of the two shots of you walking Back to like circle the very, very noticeable differences in your body language.
Mm-hmm . That were identical. Yeah.
But I couldn't get it in there, but I really wanted to.
It was just funny. Anyway,
Uh, congrats to Team Penske.
They came first and second in. It was
Competition.
It was pretty cool. I've, I've done the piss out competition
now this is, uh, I think my third time I did it once with Andretti, once with McLaren, and now once with ECR.
And this is the first time I've ever not gotten eliminated on the first round.
So there you go. I was pretty, pretty happy. Pretty cool.
Made it through. Made it through. Uh, okay.
So Tim now wants us to pivot.
We're gonna skip ahead, um, excuse me, to, uh, discuss the post-race penalties that were assessed on Monday.
So Monday after the race, uh, three post race tech penalties were announced. The 28
Executions Ex Yeah. ,
the 28 Marcus Erickson, 27 Cal Kirkwood and the number 90 of Cal Ilot.
Uh, both the Andretti cars for the same infraction, a different one on ilo got, uh, bounced from the race.
Essentially. They, they, I guess it's not a
disqualification, they got moved to the three last positions.
So they finished, they were classified as 31st, second, and third.
Um, that's like a, that's a, I mean, as if Marcus's day wasn't already bad enough.
Well, , I mean like, He thought it was bad.
He thought it was bad. And boy did it get worse. Yeah.
Boy did it get worse? 'cause now not only are you looking
at, you know, oh my God, what could I have done differently And just, just missing out on the Indy 500.
Now you also lose like 40 points in a million bucks, which is a pretty big kick in the nuts. And like he was,
He was having a tough season.
So like he went from like getting himself towards the top 10, the championship, to now immediately being 20th.
Like it a big kick in the Yeah.
For Marcus, just from a points perspective, forget the, the glory of it.
Forget the money like that, that's painful in the championship for him. Do
We know what the infraction was?
Yes, Tim. We do.
I don't, I tried to look it up yesterday and I didn't see anything about it.
It just said there were modifications to the car.
Listen, um, IndyCar is as, as much as it is a spec series, um, there is a lot of, okay, when you've had a car for this long, there is a lot of optimization that is done to all of the components, right?
In terms of you've, you've had the thing long enough and you fiddle with things in our six month off season and you find little ways to install stuff better and you make body fit better.
And all of these little things that we, again, we talked about last week with the Bondo on the attenuator, if that's what we're calling it.
Like it wasn't, that by itself was nothing.
It's all these little things you're trying to do to subtly improve the level of the, the build of the car.
And so the components, at least on the Andretti cars, um, it was, it was purely a build quality situation.
Um, on the, on the 90 car, like the thing that happened, I, you could argue that maybe it's a new team and they don't maybe understand all of the, the ways that the regulation works.
Or maybe I talked to Callum in the race and he said that he had some contact on that side of the front wing.
So maybe that was enough to, to put it outta spec.
Again, though, we are seeing a, a ccra not a crazy, a very new trend in the series where these are not intentional, um, malicious cheats if you will.
These are people working in the gray area of the rules.
These are people, you know, maybe not fully understanding the rule book because they've been doing things for this way for the past decade and nothing's been said about it.
And so they just don't even realize that it's not legal.
It's been going on for so long.
So I wonder how much of that is existing. Um,
So that, yeah, that was gonna be my follow up.
Is it, was it, is it like a new rash of this or is it just getting caught now?
Is it just getting punished now?
Is it a little bit of all of the above or we don't know.
'cause we're not in race control.
We don't know. We're not in race control .
Um, it is, it is interesting though, you know, with, with everything that happened after qualifying and the way that the paddock reacted, which led to what felt like an exaggerated response.
I can't help but feel, and I could be totally off base here, but like Alex's point, like a lot of this stuff's been done and there are gray areas that are, you know, look, it's, it's, it's engineer's jobs to like interpret things a certain way to try to find a competitive advantage, right?
Like that's the, that's the game, right?
It's not intentionally trying to break a rule.
It's, well, I read it this way, so I think this makes sense.
Um, but is it, have we now set a new precedent, right?
Is is what happened in qualifying in the subsequent response?
Now the level at which we're gonna be seeing tech operate and the level at which penalties will be issued.
If that's the case, fine, as long as it stays at this level now until there's some announced change.
Because if you know that being 0.01% outside the tolerance of the rules
leads to this level and this severity of penalty, you are gonna back off your adjustments to leave a slightly bigger margin, which is fine if you want every rule to be black and white in or out.
Harsh penalties. Cool. Awesome.
Everyone's just gonna have to recalibrate their, their deal.
It just seemed like the timing of it seems a little strange.
Yeah. I mean, I also wonder how much of this is, um,
is this, I don't wanna put words in in his mouth because he hasn't said this, but is this the type of IndyCar that Doug Bowles wants?
You know, Doug Bowles was, was brought into the head of competition for IndyCar and, and all this sort of thing and it, you know, he's worked in on the team side before and all this sort of thing.
So did he, is he of the, is this a, is this a mindset shift because it's a, a personnel shift?
Is, is he like this? Listen, this is the rule book.
It's not my job to make sure you follow the rule book.
You've had the rule book, your professional race teams, your professional organizations follow the rule book or you'll be penalized.
And, and that could just be the way that he wants to do it.
And, and also, like you said, James, that's totally fine as long as that's the way it's done.
Um, but I, I certainly think teams are probably now like reconsidering a lot of things, especially going into Detroit, like holy shit, like yes, this is legal, but it's barely legal.
Should we pull it off the car?
Like what do we do about this, this, and this?
Because like, these are, again, we talked about the points, like that's a huge deal.
A hundred thousand dollars is not a small fine. Right? Like that's,
Especially when you're also losing the price money Exactly.
That you Would've been earning. This is
A big penalty.
So I think teams are now probably feeling like they're walking on eggshells.
So I mean, it's, it is interesting.
It's a, it's a, it's a strange thing to have this sort of seemingly monumental shift in the middle of the season.
I mean, I can't imagine that nothing in the gray area was caught in the first five races, but thi This is the part that I find weird, right?
Like if that was the deal from the get go, cool.
But to your point, it seems weird that it's only after all this sort of came out in Yeah.
At the speedway that, but again, look, as long as it, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a tough one.
But at the same time, I'll remember, I never will forget Texas 2016, we come second in the race.
My, my floor was, uh, worn.
Oh, I'm aware. Point six
Giving everyone spark showers.
Yep. Point. But it was 0.6 of a millimeter
to too far past the thing.
Right? So is it an advantage?
It's certainly not a disadvantage. Right? Excuse me.
This was at Texas and uh, and we got docs 25 points and $25,000 or whatever a few years prior to that.
Justin Wilson won the race with Dale Coin and he had full on aerodynamic components bolted onto the car that were not allowed to be on the car.
Correct? Correct. That add down force, right. Won the race.
He got a $5,000 fine. That was it.
So when our penalty got announced, I text Jay Fry, who was in his first year at the series and said, Jay, this is respectfully, this is bull because a few years ago Justin won the race with very obvious bolted on parts that he shouldn't have.
The, the race that I got, you know, uh, docked for, we showed up, we had a 10 minute practice session that we weren't allowed to adjust the car after.
'cause it was that August race. So the right
heights were a fraction off.
It was 0.6 of a mill. Mm-hmm. And I get a 25 point penalty.
And his response was, I wasn't running things back in 2012.
And I was like, that's a good argument.
That's kind of the only argument that I would've not like, continued to lose my mind over.
So now it's, now it's a different person in charge.
And so maybe that's just the shift.
It, it, there's a lot of talk about all the tech stuff and the conflict of interest that exists or whatever.
The other thing that we sort of missed last week was the interview with Roger.
And in that interview he said something that I think was music to the ears of a lot of people in the paddock.
And don't get me wrong, there's still a lot of details to work out here, but IndyCar is in the process of creating a system whereby tech and race control would be independently run and not actually controlled by IndyCar.
So there are, there are different ways to go about that.
And I know that they are exploring a few different avenues.
I think there are pros and cons to the different ones that I've kind of heard, uh, being kicked around.
But ultimately, you know, this is something that IndyCar has been actually working on for months and is not being done in reaction to what happened at the Speedway.
I kind of wish they had shared more of that, you know, what was happening behind the scenes and maybe people wouldn't have lost their minds so much, you know, over qualifying weekend.
But if we can get to a point whereby next year race control and tech are independently operated and can't be influenced in that respect, that's a huge step forward for the series.
I think.
I, I couldn't agree more. Um, I think that it's, it,
it shows that despite all of the accusations or opinions or, or anything like the priority of, of Penske Entertainment and Roger is the health of this series, and he does care deeply about it more than just, you know, it's a, it's an avenue for the Indy 500 and he wants it to be a, um, championship that is, uh, held in high regard and is some of the best teams and drivers competing, you know, across North America.
And, and that that is, that is very clear through all of this.
Like, he is not, this is not just a, a byproduct of something that he purchased as a package deal.
So, um, it'll be interesting to see how that, how that evolves.
Obviously none of that's gonna come in 2025, but would be very cool.
And I think exciting for everyone, not only teams, drivers, um, and the such, but also fans, um, to know that there would be an independent body going forward in the future.
Well, we look forward to learning more about that as more becomes known.
Um, and we've kind of covered now everything up to the race, so we're gonna stop it here for Tuesday.
Uh, thanks for listening guys, but make sure you check in on Thursday where we're gonna get into everything.
That was the 200 laps of the Indie 500.
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