The Real Cost of CP4 Failure... & Why Owners Are Switching to the DCR Pump
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Part
DCR pump
The DCR pump is a special part that helps diesel trucks get fuel better and run stronger.
Company
SNS Diesel Motorsport
SNS Diesel Motorsport makes parts that help diesel trucks run better and last longer, especially fuel system parts and electronics.
Term
electronic controls
Computers in diesel trucks help control when and how much fuel goes into the engine so it runs better and cleaner.
Concept
modern diesel fuel systems
Newer diesel engines have special parts that control how fuel gets to the engine, making the truck run better and cleaner.
Part
high pressure fuel pumps
These pumps push diesel fuel very hard into the engine so the truck can run strong and clean.
Concept
drag race vehicles
These are vehicles built to race in a straight line very fast over a short distance.
Concept
motorsport division
They have a part of the company that makes special parts and computer settings for diesel trucks used in races and competitions.
Concept
land speed record racing
This is racing where the goal is to go faster than anyone else over a set distance.
Concept
reliability improvement products
These are parts made to help diesel trucks last longer and have fewer problems.
Term
CP3 conversion
A CP3 conversion means swapping out the old fuel pump in a diesel truck for a newer, stronger one that works better and lasts longer.
Concept
aftermarket high pressure pump conversions
Some companies make better pumps to replace the weak ones that break easily. These stronger pumps help stop big problems and expensive repairs.
Brand
Standardine
Standardine is a company that makes better parts to fix problems with diesel engines, like stronger fuel pumps that don't break as easily.
Car
Ford F450
The Ford F-450 is a big truck that can pull and carry heavy loads, used by people who need a tough work vehicle.
Part
CP4
The CP4 is a part that pumps fuel into the engine at very high pressure. It helps the engine run but can sometimes break if the truck is pushed too hard.
Part
high pressure lines
High pressure lines are special tubes that carry fuel from the pump to the engine at very high pressure so the engine can run properly.
Part
low pressure line assembly
The low pressure line assembly is a set of tubes that bring fuel from the tank to the pump at normal pressure before it gets pushed harder.
Term
horsepower
Horsepower is a way to measure how strong an engine is and how fast it can make a car go.
Term
OEM
OEM means the parts made by the same company that made your car, so they fit and work well.
Term
ECM
The ECM is the car's computer that controls how the engine runs, like when to add fuel or spark.
Concept
emissions testing and certification
This means checking that cars or parts don't pollute too much and are allowed by law to be sold and used.
Concept
inventory cost
Inventory cost is how much it costs a shop to keep parts in stock. Having one part that fits many trucks saves money.
Part
plastic canister filter
This is a fuel filter made with plastic on the outside. Sometimes it can crack and cause problems like leaks.
Part
quick connect fittings
These are plastic parts that connect fuel lines together so they can be taken apart easily. But they can sometimes break.
Part
billet aluminum filter head
This is a strong metal part that holds the fuel filter in place. It's made from a solid piece of aluminum, so it lasts longer.
Car
Lancia Beta
The Lancia Beta is an old Italian car that tried new things but sometimes had problems that made people wish they hadn't bought it first. It's like being the first person to try a new gadget that might not work perfectly yet. People talk about it when they mean someone who tries something new before it's fully ready.
Company
Hotshot Secrets
Hotshot Secrets makes special liquids you add to diesel fuel to help your diesel engine run better and last longer.
Concept
diesel truck
A diesel truck uses a special kind of fuel called diesel, which helps it pull heavy loads and go a long way without needing much gas.
Term
VP44 injection pump
The VP44 is a part that helps send fuel into diesel engines, controlled by electronics, but sometimes it can break.
Concept
12 valve
The 12 valve is an older type of diesel engine that is simple and strong, often found in older trucks.
LIVE
Welcome to the diesel podcast presented by DFC diesel Luke. Welcome to the diesel podcast. I'm looking forward to chatting with you today.
I had you on a couple of years ago when when the SNS released the DCR pump and it took the took the industry by storm.
And I know it's grown in popularity and there's probably a lot of things you guys have gotten feedback from from truck owners and, you know, that kind of stuff.
So I look forward to catching up with you and see what you guys have been up to. Yeah, thanks for having me.
It's good to see you again. Yeah, it's always always a great time to chat with you. I thought it'd be great to maybe start with, you know, to me, SNS is a household name in diesel.
But there's a lot of people who we picked up a diesel truck over the last three to five years and it's out of warranty now.
And now they're starting to jump into the aftermarket, starting to, you know, learn more about it.
I thought it'd be great to start with talking to us about the company, what you guys focus on and just a little bit of background on the company itself.
Sure. Yep. So SNS diesel motorsport is we're based in southern Indiana, Seymour, Indiana.
And we specialize in modern diesel fuel systems. And then also electronic controls that kind of go along with that.
So modern diesel pickups really are what they are because of the fuel systems and the electronics that control everything.
You know, diesel engines have been great for a lot of years, a lot of decades, but they've really evolved in the last 20 years to get, you know, a lot more refined, a lot quieter, a lot more power, clean power, all that kind of stuff.
And it's really the, you know, the fuel system, the electronics that precisely control it that's made that happen.
So that's really our background and our specialty is high pressure fuel pumps, injectors.
And then on the racing competition side, we've got a motorsport division as well that has electronic controls, tuning that kind of thing for, you know, drag race vehicles, sled pull trucks,
bondable salt flats, land speed record racing, things like that.
But most of the company is dedicated to fuel system manufacturing.
And a lot of the company now is also based on focused on reliability improvement products,
really solving problems that are out there in the field.
So, you know, performance is great.
And that's what a lot of us are interested in is racing and really pushing the limits to the upper echelon of all that stuff.
But what we keep getting for years and years is there's just really a lot more guys out there that need and want reliability as well.
So we focused a lot of our growth, a lot of our development and engineering resources on solving problems that are out there in the field.
And that's been a huge success and driven a lot of our growth.
I was going to ask you that, like as far as when the company started and through its initial phase, was it focused more on the racing side?
And then as the demand or feedback from the diesel community grew with, hey, I need some reliability fixes or I'm having these issues with my truck,
then it started to transition or how did it evolve through both kind of sides of the diesel aftermarket?
Yeah, it kind of started out doing more of that performance stuff, you know, oversized pumps and injectors and providing those types of products.
But then also early days was I identifying that there was starting to be some failures in the field.
You know, there was some LML Duramax issues with fuel pump failures and there was some fleets actually in
in Alaska is where a lot of them were that were having lots of failures and lots of problems and looking for solutions.
You know, there was starting to be Ford failures around that time as well.
And LB7 injectors were having early life failures and hazing and that's really where it's like, okay, well,
there's people that need solutions. There's people that are having problems and
unexpected downtime, expensive failures. Let's solve those problems and fix that for those guys. So
that's where some of the earlier products on the reliability side, you know, there was always
stroker pumps and oversized injectors and stuff. But
the reliability stuff early on, some of the first ones was like CP3 conversions for the LML Duramax platform and doing
true drop in. That's kind of been our forte also is
we don't want to have, we want it to be as OE like, OE fit and finish, OE like, no tuning required, if at all possible,
and things like that. So it's just a drop in, but better than OE reliability in a lot of these cases.
So that's where some of that came in and kind of what
really showed a lot of growth for us was, okay, there was a lot of guys that actually had bone stock trucks.
They just wanted to be reliable. So that's where like our card compliant
LML CP3 conversion came from
where that's just a, you know, a great drop in for a guy. He doesn't necessarily want to have to
modify anything else or try to do anything different. He just wants reliability, bolt-in reliability. So that
early days also was, you know, kind of the first generation of the Ford
CP4 bypass kit, disaster prevention kit.
That was popular as well. And then like LB7, the Sax zero nozzle, we designed and developed a better nozzle,
more modern nozzle for the early LB7 Duramax injectors that tended to have problems.
And so all that kind of stuff was
became more highest volume products, you know, where we've got
plenty of other products, but these just became the most in demand. And then,
you know, just kind of kept down that path as well, developing a lot of solutions.
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and free shipping over $50. I know when I talk to somebody who either just like we focus in on
the six, seven power stroke, if they just buy one, maybe, I mean it could be brand new. Sometimes
it is when I talk to people or it's a few years old. They have some knowledge of the issue with
the injection pump and then they immediately transition into how do I avoid it because they've
heard the stories or maybe seen the repair bills or had a friend that had to replace their fuel system
and like when we talked a few years ago about the DCR pump, it was one of those products that
really jumped up and it grabbed my attention and it was so impressive because it was a complete
solution to be able to address it. For people who didn't catch that episode or maybe they don't
haven't followed you guys or they maybe heard of the DCR pump but they're not too familiar with it,
what does it do, what is it for six, seven power strokes and how does it address that factory
failure point? Yeah, so that is a product for the six point seven power stroke which is 2011
to current model year forward, you know, Super Duty's really tough 250, 350 up to six, seven,
fifties if that was the, you know, it comes in a lot of those vehicles. It's also in ambulances
and a lot of other kind of like cabin chassis type applications that might have a different
body on it all together but those became really well known for having high pressure pump failures,
that high pressure pump is well known as the CP4, that pump is just a really fragile design.
Everything, you know, there's a lot of people that have pretty good luck with it last in a long
time getting a lot of miles out of them and that's great if everything's, you know, perfect
but unfortunately it's not a perfect world we live in and there's a lot of other factors at play
and sometimes these things just fail and that started a bad reputation of early life failures
of these pumps and then what really rubs salt in the wound is that when the pump fails it creates
a lot of metal, really fine small hard steel metal debris which then circulates through the
rest of the system and, you know, wipes out the injectors and contaminates everything so
it's not just a pump replacement when they go down it's a full system replacement that's typically
in the 10 to 15 thousand dollar range so it's really a compounding issue for the market where
it's a more common than it should be failure and compounded with a lot of collateral damage
whereas a lot of other things okay yeah maybe you have a lot of there's, you know, there's one
vehicle that has a lot of power steering pump failures or they got a lot of, you know, alternator
failures or something well if they don't wipe out the whole rest of the system then it's not as big
a deal, you know, power steering pumps may be a bad example because sometimes they do but, you
know, if it's an isolated failure all right that sucks but at least you didn't have to replace a
whole bunch of other perfectly good parts so the DCR pump was that came to fruition was a
co-development between us and Standardine, Standardine's aftermarket division pure power
and, you know, we were well known for our high pressure pump conversions reliability conversions
on the Duramax platforms on some of the Cummins platforms and then it kind of came to the the
DCR came about a collaboration between the two companies to really develop a complete, you know,
conversion to get rid of the CP4 all together and get a more robust pump in there that can handle
a little more of the everyday life. Will we get into that more the technical side of that pump
like what to help somebody understand it who is like a sedesal truck enthusiast or somebody who
uses truck for work and they're wanting to understand what makes that pump different than
what came on the truck how would you explain it to like a lay person who's not super technical
with injection technology and understanding it all but just to know what makes that pump different.
Yeah it can uh I should have had a cam here uh in my office but uh we have got some good
videos and stuff out there too kind of showing the differences between the two we're actually
working on some some really cool like animations and uh you know kind of exploded pump graphics
media stuff right now to help explain exactly what you're asking about and we've done cutaways
as well that we take to events and shows and things and just let people kind of see firsthand
because the problem is all these pumps are going to look similar to somebody that doesn't know what
is going on inside right on the outside and I don't expect people to know the differences
but there's very key important differences inside so at a base level the CP4 is a
it is a very compact pump it's it's impressive from a manufacturing perspective the CP4 actually
from uh if I was a manufacturing engineer uh at at Bosch that thing rocks you know it's lightweight
it's cost effective it's um it's it's easy to manufacture compared to a lot of these other pumps
it's very modular because there's just two heads the bolt onto the top the high pressure heads
and they can be clocked any which way so in from their perspective you know
John Deere's coming to them BMW's coming to them Cummins is coming to them Ford's coming to them
all needing a high pressure pump well they designed this thing that's extremely compact and
lightweight that'll fit about anywhere and is is modular where like an eco diesel wants the
high pressure outlets facing a certain direction other ones want to face in a different direction so
from that perspective the thing's great and very cost effective I'm sure from just a reliability
perspective there's pros and cons every every which way right well this thing is is lightweight
and compact and fairly high output for its size but the way that it's designed versus other pumps
say like the DCR is that you know the DCR is heavier it's it's more expensive it's it's all
these things but the key difference is the cb4 has a has an aggressive two-loop cam
with a roller there's two rollers a little little v-twin basically and so you've got metal on metal
contact that cam spinning extremely fast inside of that pump and you've got metal to metal rolling
contact and if you get some of those generations there's nothing that actually keeps that roller
from turning sideways and just cutting into the cam and some of them also probably the majority of
a lot of them that roller is in a real tight shoe basically and that can seize up and then just start
skidding on the cam so the DCR as a comparative instead of having that metal to metal contact
it's got an eccentric cam which is just an offset so it kind of orbits around like this
instead of a paddle almost that's flapping around in there you know and it's got a
roller with a big bushing and so there's no metal to metal high speed sliding contact
it's pressure lubricated through the cam up underneath those bushings like a
crankshaft is basically with connecting rods or main bearings it's actually got lubrication
forced up underneath of all that so it's just a stout pump that's that's pretty hard to hurt and
and is just a lot less fragile to to be out on the market like that and that's why a lot of
guys have been really really happy with that and a lot of people do adopt it early on even
some guys with brand new trucks you know yeah yeah i think that customer asked me he said what's the
what's the record for the lowest miles on a dcr or the lowest mile install um and uh
dust and sterling out of texas and i think he was trying to win the competition and he probably
did because he bought a brand new f450 had it uh had it hauled to his shop i think he said he had
seven miles on it and uh immediately converted it so he didn't want to run a risk there i had
mentioned that before the podcast if i had a brand new six seven power stroke that'd probably be the
first thing i would do to avoid you know that 10 to 15 thousand dollar bill especially you know it's
probably not something that dealerships are just going to warranty um you know you'll probably be
on the hook for it and i would just want to want to avoid that but i think what was so cool about
our conversation years ago and i thought it'd be great to spend a little bit of time with you
is you had mentioned an oem style fit and a focus with the install and not having to do
tuning or some of these these other things how how does it how does it work when you put one on your
truck as far as you know is it just as simple as taking the factory cp4 out putting the dcr pump
in hooking it all up and you're just ready to go yeah yeah it's it's just a drop in uh it's
essentially it's it's really close to the same thing as just replacing the cp4 if you need to
put a new cp4 in it anyways um you know the kit comes with everything you need to do the conversion
which is all the stuff that would normally come off has to come off anyways so um it's got new
high pressure lines with it a new low pressure line assembly with it the pump itself an adapter plate
in the hardware to do it so if you were going to replace the cp4 anyways your high pressure lines
have to come out your low pressure lines have to come out the pump itself has to come out so
it's pretty well the same process there's just uh there's like three studs that the cp4 is held
in by we reuse one of those but we get an adapter plate and uh and some new fasteners that go on
there so the process is not a lot different um yeah you know you need to get the end takes off
to get down to the pump in any situation and then you got it the vacuum pump comes off the front
because the vacuum pump's actually driven off the front of the high pressure pump gear so you need
to do that to get to it but uh the process is is very very similar and everything you need comes
with it there's no you don't reflash anything we've the pump has been designed and developed to
make it where it's transparent to the vehicle basically the vehicle doesn't know anything
different um but a huge benefit of the dcr as well as it does have extra capacity so
in the normal operating range of the truck um it the truck doesn't know any different it
assume as far as that knows it's got a cp4 in it um it's not going to throw codes um it's not gonna
you know require anything else but there is a lot of extra headroom the dcr is a higher output pump
higher capacity pump so for a guy who needs or wants that extra uh output extra horsepower it's
got a lot more on tap so we've had them over 800 horsepower with a with a single dcr it's a little
bit of a misconception in the market it seems as they think that all right if you just want
reliability dcr hands down that's the way to go if you want power you need to go with some sort of
stroke or cp4 or with something else or whatever but um but actually the dcr has a lot of headroom
for the performance guys too it's really cool honestly even pulling we've got them on pulling
trucks drag cars uh airboats we had a we we were at the national farm machinery show
just a couple weeks ago and we had an airboat in the in the booth that's a customer that has
got a six seven power stroke in an airboat that's a really cool setup that uh kill devil diesel
did all the engine stuff with that and then we did all the fuel system motec uh you know custom
harness and a dcr and it was 800 somewhere spare it's it's it's kind of rare and i think in the
aftermarket where you can get something get a product or an upgrade that addresses a major
failure point you can run it on your bone stock truck or if down the road you decide you want to do
something with injectors and you know tuning and turbo you can still use that same
product a lot of times you get in having to buy things a couple different times and and uh
having to do that so it's cool that it fits both the bone stock truck and then the ones that are
going for a bit more power yeah you were honestly it's it's the ultimate win-win you couldn't
really come up with a better combo it you know you don't have to really give up anything um it's not
like well i really want the i really want the high power version but it tends to be not as reliable
you know sometimes there's those kind of trade-offs or the i want to i just pretty much need a stock
replacement but i don't want to have to go buy another pump later if i decide that i want to
do something different with it so it's it's been a great great win-win and and widely accepted
in the market really well and we've got lots of dealers lots of installers lots of in customers
that that uh you know do a lot of them one of the things that really impresses me
is when i think of it being drop in as far as not having to do tuning and just with my limited
knowledge of common rail diesel and and the cp4 was and i could be wrong but the the perception
that i have is one of the reasons that those replace the cp3 was because of demands to be able to
hit higher rail pressure or maybe do it quicker for emissions standards or or or guidelines or
what the oems were trying to do so being able to remove that metal on metal contact that you
talked about in the beginning and have a better design that eliminates that but then also be able to
hit the the rail pressure or the the commands that the oem or the ecm wants without having to tune
it i'm sure a ton went into that from design engineering everything but that's so cool because
a lot of people don't want to do tuning or they don't want to if they have it they don't want to
change it they just they just want that upgrade yeah it's kind of yeah most honestly i think most
people are probably in that camp they either want to leave it alone whatever they got they
want to leave it alone yeah or they don't want to have to do it at all or pay for that extra amount
you know so that's where some of our whether it's an lml cp3 or whether it's our ram cp3 conversion
or whether it's the dcr we're not often the cheapest option um but we intend to be the best
option and highest quality and the best customer service and all that kind of thing and in a lot
of cases if you get ours it's the no tuning required drop in like 50 state card compliant version
and you save the money on not having to tune it as well so there's kind of that trade off
there'd be like man the s and s one's a few hundred bucks more well you're easily going to burn up a
few hundred bucks in tuning if you get a tuning required version you know and a lot of times
wasted time as well with now with the the dcr that's a 50 state product yeah yeah we all of honestly
all of our highest demand highest volume stuff is all in that category um and we go through we've
got a really good engineering team here with a lot of good oe background experience too um
mostly hex Cummins guys um with some you know x boss as well so we know how that stuff works we
know how factory calibrations work we know how emissions you know is created and we know what
matters and all these things so we'll work with seamah garage and work with carb and emissions labs
and stuff like that and do all the testing do all the validation work provide all the data and
everything required to get it to where it's got the the eo you know number that's legal safe to
sell in all 50 states which has become almost a requirement these days with most of the with a
lot of the distributors yeah yeah that's something that it's it's it's really cool for like somebody
in california that has a six seven power stroke they're facing the same issues as somebody in
texas or tennessee or indiana and to be able to access the the products and go through whatever
emissions testing their you know locality might have and have that confidence is so so important
and you know to be able to take advantage of it one of the things i wanted to ask you with
the dcr pump itself is are there different part numbers based on the year range of six seven or
is it one part number for all of them does anything vary between year ranges there's a lot that varies
between year ranges but the dcr is just one part number that fits all so that is another thing that
took a lot of work and a lot of engineering and a lot of you know even tweaks and stuff there's a
lot of you know cost on the front end to make that happen and a lot of challenges because
everything from like a 2011 the early model like 11 to 14 trucks have even just on not even related
to the high pressure side on the low pressure side there's a fuel temp sensor and a pressure
sensor switch well on the earlier model of trucks it was a separate sensor and then there was just a
low pressure switch it wasn't actually you can actually get a reading on it just had a a switch
if it was below a certain amount it would trip um a diagnostic well later generations went to a
combo sensor there was one sensor that was a pressure plus temp later on they still a combo
sensor but they changed the thread so things as simple as that we have to we could have easily
you know and actually saved some money and done different part numbers for different model years
because we have to include you know some amount like the line has to be able to adapt all those
model years and there's there's adapters or plugs depending on what you have but we supply all that
because we want whenever possible we want a shop to be able to source or to stock you know
one thing and that doesn't matter if you got a 2012 truck that shows up that day or a 2025 truck
shows up that day their cost of inventory is much lower if they're able to stock one part number
so whenever we can do that and whenever it makes sense we definitely do we do that on the on the
disaster prevention kit too same thing we cover you know that one product does a lot of different
years but we've had to tweak things like a 2020 and up there was other model year changes the
turbo coolant line was different um intakes are different this and that so we've had we've made
some running changes along the way to just continually improve that product either for new
model years or as we're kind of getting some feedback hey some trucks there's a little less
clearance between the high pressure line and the intake or this or that we're actually
continually engineering and developing in the background to make those to make it as is
the best we can you know so that a lot of times guys might not have a problem but we
don't want to get any callbacks we don't want our dealers to get any callbacks so if we can prevent
you know an interference issue where there was a fitment problem we're just going to continue to
do that that makes a that makes a lot of sense and I think probably most of these most of these
jobs are going through a shop and when I think about the distribution network whether they're
getting the DCR pump direct from you guys or maybe they go through a distributor and these
things are sitting in a warehouse and you think of being at the shop level and like you said somebody
comes in with a 2014 and the next day it's a 2021 having to get different part numbers or you know
is is this the correct kit or you know how many of them should I it would just kind of be a nightmare
to try to stock like different year ranges that you have different parts but having it all in one
kit I think is something that's really really important for a dealer network it's a it's a
amazing blessing for all of us to be able to have to produce and sell and install one product that
covers you know two to three million vehicles across that whole range but it definitely is a
bear on the front end to make it happen and we're doing it right now on we're in the final stages
of releasing a new product too that's also for the forwards it's a second stage a fuel filter
replacement setup because those tend to be problematic too that plastic canister filter
has also a reputation for failing cracking spraying fuel some fires and and then the
little quick connect fittings that go to those little barbs will break it's all plastic stuff so
we've designed developed a really nice you know finish complete kit that goes to a billet aluminum
filter head that mounts in the factory spot it's got a it's got a bigger higher capacity
better filtration filter than is available on the market today and a really nice uh I got one sitting
here I guess instead of these little plastic fittings we're going to have these real high
quality all metal quick connects that are easy to install and fix all those problems but what we're
running into is really subtle model year things and so this product we started on this product
five six years ago probably put the brakes on pretty much everything while we focused on the
DCR and then you know in the last years too we've kind of fired it back up again but
it's all the little final finish work making it try to make it perfect that's what takes forever
Ian my chief engineer loses sleep over it for sure he's he's a stud and he's really particular
and I know that if he's had his hands on it it's going to be perfect but there's all these subtle
little tweaks like the factory line from the supply pump and tank is slightly different for
certain model years and we're trying to get the fitment just right and get the fitting lengths
and placement just right where everything's just as drop like it is primo fit and finish not just
trying to kick products out there we tend to develop and release products slower than most
other companies like there's probably no doubt about that if we if we release one product a year
that's probably almost optimistic to be honest ideally we're doing it quicker than that but we
just want to make sure they're right there's a lot of companies that churn out a lot of products
sometimes they're good sometimes they run into some problems but we tend to try to do it right
the first time and then not have fallout later I think truck owners appreciate that because they
don't want to be the the beta tester for anything or any consumer there's not even just in diesel but
sometimes just in the marketplace out there you kind of feel like you're beta testing the product
and you don't you don't want that so it kind of gives you that that good feeling that you know
it's all been done and I like along with that I wanted to ask you a question like you mentioned
that shop owner in texas that did one with seven miles on his f450 well these have been out there
for a while now what are some just off the top of your head people that have put a you know a ton
of mileage on them or maybe it's a hot shot trucker what kind of feedback have you had either from
an individual customer maybe from you know a shop owner out there that's doing a ton of them that
you know people get 100,000 miles 200,000 miles probably you know maybe even more I think that's
one of the questions that somebody would have is you know how long how long does it last how
long can I expect it to last and perform yeah yeah and that's you know we've had we've had great
success with it even early in field testing we tried to identify different different partners to
field test with hot shot guys that never shut the trucks off basically cold weather guys hot
weather guys you know all those things and some of them put some significant mileage on and we've
got ones out there with a few hundred thousand miles on them you know going strong the hot shot
guys is impressive how much they can really rack up some miles in a short period of time
all over the country is is crazy but um yeah we've we've really yet to find a end of life
you know really like any mechanical part right anything with moving parts they're going to wear
out they're going to fail eventually but we really haven't seen that yet and you know the
the simplicity of the design and the lack of you know some of the key failure points that do happen
in other pumps is why we've got so much confidence in it and you know if anything maybe sometime down
the road way down the road maybe you have some there's valves in these pumps too just like an
engine basically there's inlet and outlet valves or intake and exhaust valves functionally you know
eventually if you get some valve wear or something like that possibly you'd end up with kind of pump
output decreasing over time but we still really haven't seen that either you know what we've seen
there's 65 to 70 thousand of these out there now and I would venture to guess that's a for the
aftermarket that's a massively high number for products in the market so we see all kinds of
wild stuff occasionally you know what I mean like death some reason ambulances tend to be kind of
hard on stuff you'd think that'd be the opposite of that but we've seen a handful that just chock
full of death just plumb full of gasoline stuff like that you know and it's it's gonna wreak havoc
on the system but the DCR is actually usually fair pretty well. Hey diesel fans I wanted to
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from you guys a lot is hey I need a diesel engine I either you know I can't wait this long to get one
or normal place I get stuff from it it just takes too long or I don't they don't have the parts in
it that I need maybe my truck's not stock or I tow heavy with it I don't want to go back with just
the stock engine. DFC diesel is a sponsor of the podcast we worked with them you know hand in hand
on doing episodes answering technical questions they have a complete lineup of Cummins Duramax
and Powerstroke remanufactured engines that are set to a standard of ISO 9001 2015 standards
which is a huge deal in the aftermarket and there's certain levels of quality testing validation
that are required for that so you know when you get one of those engines the type of quality
that's built behind it with an industry leading warranty that's really comprehensive and you know
the other thing with that is you know sometimes the options that are out there it's just it's
a basic OEM engine you want a little bit more you don't want to have the same failure again so
there's a bunch of different series of engines that they have from core street tow haul and also
the speed of air series which we've covered on the podcast before there's a lot of really cool
benefits to it and if you have questions about that reach out to them if you don't know the
type of engine that you're looking for if you go to dfcdiesel.com there's a ton of info there you
can send an email or you can reach out to them also they're working with speed of air pistons
which it's the only piston that pays for itself and there's a lot of really cool technology behind
it so you can add that into your build and be able to get better fuel economy you know increased
power increased torque and better engine life out of it you know some of the most common engine
applications or series of engines that they have with that lead time a lot of them are in stock or
they have really short lead times so you can check your favorite retailer or go to dfcdiesel.com
check them out see what's in stock see what you can get if you have questions maybe you want to do
you know something that's outside of the normal series of engines they have tons of choices for
rods cranks pistons valve train upgrades tons of different things so if you're in the market
definitely make sure and hit on over and check them out with people that that use additives
whether they use it religiously or like there was a huge like cold snap that just happened where it
went down you know into into the southern states can people use whatever their product of choice
is if they're on you know a consistent um you know fuel additive schedule or in those colder
climates or they use an anti-gel is the pump compatible with those sort of additives yeah
we don't really see any issues with that like say again the the pump itself is pretty robust there
there are definitely some small intricate pieces the imv which is the inlet metering valve you know
that's that's an electronic device that's got a little spool once metering fuel into the pump
sometimes we'll see like heavy bio build up you know where it's kind of gummed up things and stuff
like that it but in general we haven't really seen any issues with it there are people honestly
it's kind of surprising there's not more issues than there are because it's kind of the wild
wild west out there there's there's a lot of additive manufacturers and then each of those
manufacturers has multiple blends and then within that right some guys might be at something like
uh a 20 dose and some guys might be at a 500 dose you know the variables are wild
in the market as far as hey i did it per i'm in that boat too to be honest like i don't i don't
typically use any kind of additive but when it got real cold here there for a little while
you know i was throwing some some hot shots uh you know anti-gel stuff in and if i'm in the
ballpark i'm like oh that's close enough you know i don't know i probably got roughly 15
gallons of fuel in here i'll throw you know however many ounces in and call it good but it's
kind of surprising it doesn't create more issues than it does there's the hardcore two stroke oil
guys or i dump atf in it guys and all that kind of stuff too i wouldn't recommend it but uh
we at least so far in the and with the dcrs we we really haven't seen any issues on the additive
we get that question a lot on additives um in general extra lubricity shouldn't hurt anything
you know with with moving parts it shouldn't hurt anything um but the way that cb4s tend to fail
um either if that roller turns 90 degrees and then it's not rolling anymore it's actually just
cutting in a groove that's you're not going to save that basically right and the other failure
mode where it's a it's a roller you know it's a roller in a shoe and if you get a really small
piece of debris wedging and locking up that roller again if you've got awesome lubricity
versus not great lubricity it might last a hair longer but it's gonna fail anyways you've got
seized up metal on metal skidding at that point so um a lot of the cases you know we we still see
some cases where guys say man i use i can use something religiously and i still had a failure
what it just depends which way the pump went down whether it was gonna whether it was gonna save it
or not what would you recommend to somebody like say they got a six seven power stroke
they had a failure so they had to replace their fuel system and while they're in there they say no
i don't want to go with another cp4 i want this dcr pump from sns well what is the best way for me
to protect it is there a guideline or recommendations that you guys have for being able to give that
pump the best chance it has at lasting hundreds of thousands of miles is it changing your fuel
filters regularly is it finding a good fuel station is it um you know just getting it into the
shop or doing regular maintenance um like what would you guys recommend for that yeah uh it's
good question and we get that quite a bit too and in general you know there's the oh just get good
fuel right it's like okay that's easier said than done right yeah you're pumping out of a
10 000 gallon underground tank you don't know what the hell you're getting you're you're you know
you could hit the same station every time and it should be good fuel but it there's easily you
know hiccups and things like that as well so yeah i try to myself i try to avoid super sketchy looking
stations that you know have probably got nasty tanks underground that are rusty and got water in them
and junk like that but it's it's really tough to say well yeah i just get places i get fuel from
places that are good that's so subjective it's a possible to know plus the guys that are traveling
you don't know either um so in general good filtration and um paying attention to a water
and fuel sensor would be the one well for starters don't put death or gas on it that's that that's a
pretty good start and uh unfortunately that's not always the case either but if you get that basic
out of the way um good filtration is really your best bet and um and not bypassing water and fuel
sensors for example there's some aftermarket systems aftermarket you know filter systems that
actually um disable the factory water and fuel sensor i don't understand that but um we've had
truck ourselves actually a local truck there was a field test truck ran into a lot of problems
with that had tons of water and fuel and rust in the fuel and the whole system didn't know it
because the aftermarket system didn't even have a water and fuel sensor in it so at a minimum
that's there for a reason it's there to alert you you've got water and a fuel before you go
circulate a whole bunch to the whole system for a long time so typically factory filtration is
actually pretty good when you talk about actually filtering the fuel like uh you know bosh for example
i might not i i mean i did engine development fuel system development at commons and um
there's stringent requirements within the oes and bosh has extremely stringent requirements to say
we're unless your filtration system is up to a very high standard we're not going to warranty
the systems you know they say it's got to have these type of requirements and all that and so
they're not skimping on the filter media itself the the factory filters are typically pretty decent
it's pretty good on the media they might put it in a crappy plastic housing because they're trying
to catch costs there and have leaks or have cracks or things like that but we do see sometimes
where guys go with aftermarket filtration assuming it's better but you really need to look at the
actual filtration specs and that is or should be published and we're we're going to do that
with a part of our new forward filters uh you know our what we call our LPK leak prevention kit
we're going to be kind of showing hey here's the real data on what the factory filter is versus
what our filter is what some aftermarket a b c d um filters you know how they perform and
you can kind of make your own decision as to what you want to do with it i think it's really tough
for for diesel truck owners with the amount of like education and information that is available
and how easy it is for us now yeah to be able to stay on top of
like the fuel question like you know you said and people always say well get good fuel
well unless i'm actually sampling that fuel like that day or before it's refilled i i don't really
know and you're trying to make the best guess that you can uh you know to do that and it's
it's so tough where maybe 15 years ago or longer like i don't really remember a whole lot of talk
about where do i get my fuel how much water is in it or you know am i getting algae in it or
you know any of that kind of stuff so it's almost overload for a consumer or truck owner
with the amount of information so i find people gravitate towards
like this conversation we're having or your company because this is what you guys specialize
in and what you do and you get data from all over the country and from a bunch of different
partners and you know the expertise you guys have it makes it easy to kind of cut through all the
noise and say what do i need how do i keep it running you know what's what's the best practice
for it and honestly it's it bothers like it has become a thing like you said you know
several years ago it wasn't nearly as much of a topic well there wasn't as many failures
several years ago so it wasn't you know as it wasn't on the radar like it is now
one thing that bothers me is i don't want people to be scared of having a modern diesel truck
you know we all love these things they work so well they tow amazing they got good power like
they're refined they're they're awesome pieces of machinery but well we don't try to do like
you know we're not trying to do like marketing scare tactics or anything like that we just try
to educate people on how things work and reality and how our products work but what i have seen
is some guys just go into gas fleets you know they they're like well i was so sick of some of
my guys putting gas on the fuel tank and then it's a 15 000 dollar repair bill or something like that
or you know we were worried about this that or the other and so that's why some of that's why our
products exist is to just develop a really stout robust reliable option so somebody can just put
that in their truck and not have to worry about it because you're paying a premium for a diesel
truck you shouldn't have to be nervous driving right like you shouldn't have to go around like oh
boy i wonder if i got good fuel this time or not and so that's where the the really stout robust pump
solutions really come in and that's the feedback we get from a lot of guys they're like oh man this
is the greatest thing ever i just just for the peace of mind i don't have to worry about it you
know what i mean and and i could see people being on that boat where they're like you know they really
got to make a decision if it's like a eight ten thousand dollar option upgrade for a diesel
you're gonna want it and want to use it and feel good about it and that's what we're here for is
to make you feel better about your diesel truck and uh and having confidence in it that is such a
key point and i like i've never i never had the words to put it that way but i think that's exactly
what the the market and everyone who's interested in diesel really thinks is
you know is it i don't want to be scared of this truck and you know i take a big kind of overhead
view of diesel trucks like people have a tendency to idolize those 12 valves or those vp44 trucks
to those 73 obs trucks they're great they're amazing they're they're classic trucks but you
think of the power level they came with new versus what you get now people used to spend a ton of
money to get to 500 horsepower a thousand foot pounds of torque and those older ones and now it's
oem it's right there but in the back of our minds we always think well yeah but i've read about these
cp4 failures or i've read about this or i've read about that yeah and i think products like this that
completely solve it it adds it adds in that that confidence that i think is the real reason people
buy a diesel truck that well it's a couple different reasons one i think is they need the torque for
what what they're towing what they're hauling but then you also want that reliability you don't
want to have to think about an engine rebuild at 100 000 miles or 150 or and all the different
things you do kind of in the gas world which is a little bit different and so something like the
dcr pump infuses that confidence in that truck which way before this podcast you know people
sometimes they ask me like well what truck would you get or which one you know what would be the
best one or which one would you get today and i would always gravitate towards the six seven for
a few different reasons the six seven power stroke but literally the first thing i would do would be
to put a dcr pump on it i would like like that dealer in texas i would love to have it hauled
somewhere with seven miles on it and that would be the first thing i do because it infuses that
confidence that i would want in that truck yeah yeah the old the old stuff the old glory days right
like you could feed them about anything and uh they're not gonna they're not gonna hurt themselves
but like say most of them weren't making enough power to hurt themselves either yeah so it's like a
1980s Honda something right yeah they'll run forever but they're making they're not making
enough power to really hurt themselves so but those old fuel systems were they were they were
tough you know we're we're trying to make make the newer systems act more like the older systems
basically have all the best of both worlds have all the modern amenities quiet and powerful and
clean and all that but uh with more like old school reliability it's it's i think it's been
one of the coolest products in the last i don't even know how many years that that i've that i've
seen where you know it encompasses that oem reliability for the guy that's bone stocks never
gonna add power to it just wants reliability or you know maybe i'm gonna do an added turbo kit and
some tuning and a built transmission i can still you know use a use the same product so it's been
really cool to catch up with you on the evolution of it and kind of right along with that is the
other day i saw on social media you guys had a video of a new building that you guys are moving
into and you guys had talked about the growth i thought it'd be cool to to chat with you a little
bit about that it's it looks like there's a ton of space you guys are gonna have is a beautiful
property and people like to they like to understand the growth and like what's behind the brand and
the logo and and kind of the story of it can you tell us a bit about like the new move and
what some future plans are with s and s in this new location yeah yeah we've been growing
one rapidly since day one basically and it's been a wild ride for sure we've got an awesome team
we're adding more guys all the time developing new products we've got you know a lot of we've
we've had great success with with a really strong team that's well respected that can develop
good products and then support them really well and you know we even have more of other companies
coming to us for consulting and stuff like that you know some some large companies will come to
us for engineering consulting work or fuel system consulting and and all that so we we we've been
at a crazy high trajectory for for years even before dcr and before some of this other stuff
that's just been a really rapid trajectory and then some of the newer products have really
amplified that even more we the building we're in currently we bought a little over four years ago
i think and i remember when we moved in here this one was like uh fall four to five times
more space than what we were in and thinking man there's no way we're going to use all this
space what we're going to do with all this room and then that didn't last long at all within like
two years we were you know uh we were pretty getting pretty tight and getting tighter it
seemed like i do a team meeting every week with the guys and uh there for a while it was like we
had a new i had a new a new guy to introduce every month or so you know just kind of continually
or more so than that but um we we just got tied on space we need more room everywhere basically
more room for production areas more room for inventory more room in the fuel lab all over
more room for engine dyno we bought a hub dyno last year so we want to you know grow the motorsport
side of it as well and have really good tools for ourselves to continue to develop and and evolve
and our customers really more than anything our race customers is really why i bought the hub dyno
was was for the race customers to help get their vehicles more ready before they have to hit the
track and even from a safety perspective i want them to be making a few passes before they ever
go to the track if you you know it's a brand new build all brand new plumbing brand new everything
way too many times somebody will have a a leak or oil down or something like that and you just hope
you don't put that thing in the wall so we can basically let guys make some full passes without
actually moving you know you can make equivalent of a 200 mile an hour pass but you're sitting
stationary and the driver actually gets some passes under his belt too i think that's a huge
advantage on the hub dyno side is i i would treat it like it's a full race you get suited up you get
a suit helmet the whole deal on have your pit crew doing their thing you know checking stuff over act
like it's a regular pass and then you're not showing up at the track the first time like oh
shit what's going on you know uh did we pull the pins out of the shoots did we check bottle pressure
did we do this um you know get some under your belt you show up a lot more confident but but anyways
we we ran out of room for all that stuff and uh had bought another building across the road
that was you know kind of a buffer space we started to build a like a a test cell for engine dyno
there put the brakes on it we've kind of temporarily put the hub dyno up over there and
we've been running the hub dyno but still need more room so i've been on the lookout for a while
either i've been evaluating adding on where we're at trying to buy some you know land beside us
and add on expand our existing building it was going to be a ton of money and not a lot of square
footage possibly buying land somewhere and just building new but that was going to be at least
a couple year project and at the rate that we run at a couple years is way too long you know
we're we're running at a pretty fast pace and uh can't wait that long so i happened to come across
the property for sale just actually down the road from us uh i think it was memorial day weekend maybe
it was over a holiday weekend it was like late friday night or whatever you know instead of doing
something fun i'm looking for commercial property and trying to figure out what the heck we're going
to do with my life and found a place it was definitely it was bigger than what we needed but
i was didn't want to do this again got ahold of them it was actually pending already they already
had some paperwork in process and the realtors didn't want to show it to me uh they said well
it's already pretty well done deal you know it's pending and uh i don't take no for an answer too
awful well when i know that we need to be doing something so i talked them in to showing it to
me and uh said hey you know i think this thing could be the right fit for us and and talked
them into showing it to me and then ended up working out a deal and pouncing in on it and uh
and jumping in line so worked out well we bought it uh well middle to late last year kind of got
got possession there was a ton of work to be done there it was a big commercial print press
operation actually the the 2020 census like billions of pages of the whole census for the
whole country came out of there um but massive huge industrial equipment really dirty um and
and a lot of work to be done and there was huge duct work and big incinerators and all kinds of
stuff all over so a lot of roofing work a lot of repair work a lot of concrete work and everything
but we've been going at it diligently for months now we kind of finally just announced it here
it's kind of just been in the background a project in the background for a while we announced it
this week and then i'm going to be kind of releasing some more videos as we go along
showing some of the progress of it uh we had a concrete crew in there for a couple months
grinding concrete and kind of grinding and polishing we've had paint crews in there for months and
a lot of other roofing work and everything so we wanted to be i wanted to be something that
that the guys can be real proud of you know it would have been a lot cheaper a lot easier and
a lot quicker to kind of you know clean it up a little bit it's perfectly functional move in
get up and going but it's kind of a once in a lifetime chance before we get all settled in
there to do it upright and uh kind of using that opportunity it's adding a lot more great
hair i think to me for sure and the beard's gonna be all white in no time but it's it's exciting
i'm looking forward to it kind of we're doing it up so it kind of matches our style and our brand
and um and i just like say i really want it to be something that that everybody can be proud of
when they come to work every day when they're walking from you know their office out into the
fuel lab or something like that i'm just trying to trying to keep that in mind where it's something
that that the the guys can enjoy and and be proud of are you guys looking at moving in this year
yep originally it was early this year but we're well past that i tend to be a little
overly optimistic with that stuff sometimes but honestly the concrete work took a lot longer i
thought the paint works taken longer the roofing works taken longer we still need to we still need
to build a fuel lab in there that'll be basically double the size of our current one finish i gotta
sit down and finish design and a lot of the kind of the rest of the facility too and getting that
stuff built so i'm hoping middle of this year actually will be head in that way but it's it's
awesome to have that facility and that capability it's a lot more room it's 170 000 square feet
and uh having a space where everybody whether you're whether it's it's shipping and receiving
or it's production building dpks or dcrs or whatever it is or the fuel lab we can be so much
more efficient uh once we can kind of like spread out a little bit you know get some fixtures and
jigs and equipment and um and storage and just inventory it should help it's definitely the
expensive route but it's it's an investment to make us bigger better faster all those things
and uh i know the motorsport guys are looking forward to getting the the dinos up and running
again and a lot of the race customers are looking forward pulling truck guys and all that are
been patiently waiting for us to get our engine dyno back up and going and getting the hub dyno
moved over there um but there's a lot of where the hub dyno where the hub dyno is gonna go
looks terrible right now but uh it'll it'll look all right here before tealum
that's it's really cool because i think with the innovation of products like the dcr and
you know i'd love to chat with you in the future about some of the commons products and duramax
products but as that demand increases knowing that you you'll have the ability to fulfill that and
still keep that quality in that system that's in place that you guys have had on a bigger scale
it's it's more product it's more solutions that are hitting the marketplace and then you know that
excites you know i'm sure dealers truck owners um you know being able to get a quality product and
get it you know in a timely manner with with with the quality that they've come to expect from sms
i think is is really cool and exciting i look forward to seeing those videos as you guys release
them and show it and you know when you guys get uh get moved in that's it was really cool i love
seeing that video so i wanted to make sure i asked you when we chatted today um but it was really cool
to kind of look back and talk about the dcr pump and then see where it's at now and i'm sure people
you know might have questions might want to learn more where's the best place to go is it to the
website to call you guys if they have questions about it um or maybe some of the other products
that sns has where's the best uh the best place sure yeah our website's a good starting point we've
got product pages you know for each of the products we've got um everything from installation
instructions to videos to kind of show how it works um so the website's a good starting point
for the individual products um we do quite a few tech videos and things like that too um whether
it's like some of the technical service or the sales and support guys actually will do like
tech tip Tuesday kind of thing you know just short hey here's something that can save you a
lot of trouble or save you a lot of money here's some recommendations so our facebook you know
we're kind of standard uh facebook youtube instagram x all that we're we've got a lot of content there
too um we actually just started a facebook group as well for common rail diesel in general uh called
the fuel lab so there's a the fuel lab by sns diesel motorsport as a facebook group we just
started uh a week or so ago actually with the intent of it kind of being a hub for people to
ask questions people to share information people to to learn and and develop and and things like that
so and that's any any any product basically um and not even specific product specific it's you
know obviously we want people to learn about our brand and our products but it's not even a promotional
thing so much it's just a place for people to ask questions and learn and interact and all that on
everything modern diesel so those are all all good places to go very cool well it was great
to chat with you today luke i appreciate the time i love seeing the products that you you guys release
and like i said i'd love to chat with you again maybe hone in on the common side or the or the
things seem to be changing so much or like the the kind of questions we get um you are really
interesting i i learn a ton through these these conversations i think the education part you
mentioned about learning is is really important you know like as a truck owner it makes our
decisions so much easier when we have some sort of basis some educational you know basis to be able
to say okay how do i want to make my truck more reliable um which product do i need how do i
maintain it so this was a great conversation to be able to learn that let's see in the growth
that you guys have and uh i'll definitely be uh be uh subscribing tuning in following you guys to
see those videos and new things you guys are releasing so i appreciate your time today sure
yeah yeah we appreciate uh appreciate the support it was good talking to you and if
if you've got you or the listeners have got questions or anything like that you know feel
free to reach out to us or suggestions on on videos you'd like to see or educational type
stuff you know i'm passionate about all that and i don't have as much time to do as much as i'd
like but it is a recurring thing usually weekly or more so we're trying to put out some sort of
content and oftentimes it's you know something something educational to help teach guys about
what they're driving every day so definitely up for suggestions if there's other questions
don't forget diesel fans make sure and head on over to kershaw.kaiusa.com use code 20
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$50 so we really appreciate them offering that discount code just for diesel podcast listeners
also want to give a shout out to some of our patreon supporters robert john tsw diesel all
of our other patreon supporters all of you who follow us on social media we appreciate all your
support here in your 10 of the diesel podcast and look forward to bringing you more of the content
that you want to hear in 2026 till next time keep the shiny side up
you
About this episode
The discussion dives into the challenges of the CP4 high-pressure fuel pump failures in 6.7L Power Stroke diesel engines and how SNS Diesel Motorsport's DCR pump offers a robust aftermarket solution. The conversation covers SNS's evolution from performance upgrades to reliability-focused products, highlighting the DCR pump's design improvements that prevent catastrophic system damage caused by CP4 failures. The episode also explains the technical differences between the CP4 and DCR pumps in an accessible way, emphasizing the importance of reliability for diesel owners facing costly repairs.
Original notes
6.7L Powerstroke owners no longer have to be stuck with a CP4 and the
expensive damage it can cause. S&S Diesel joins us today to talk
about their DCR conversion and how it injects reliability into the 6.7L
Powerstroke platform.
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