Unreliable Or Expensive, The Definition Of A BMW Enthusiast, Getting Better At Driving Manuals | Episode 1,006

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Happy Tuesday, everybody. Welcome back to the podcast. We're glad to have you with us. We are in the mid-thousandz, and we are doing a video podcast, something.

One of you actually asked if we're going to do a new opening song, and the short answer is no, because now that we're on video, we have to do a whole now video open.

No, we'll sing it. We'll perform it. No one wants that. No one has asked for this. No one wants that.

So we're not going to do a new opening song. We're just going to dive into all of these card debates now.

We have a topic Tuesday. We've got news up front. We have all the things that we do. The two card debates, the two car conclusions.

There are a ton of questions for this one. Yeah, thank you guys for all your questions. Really appreciate it.

We're diving right into news about updated Apple CarPlay. It is called CarPlay Ultra that has been introduced first on Aston Martin's.

And CarPlay is pretty much ubiquitous. If you check the iOS page from Apple, the list of cars, not only do they publish the manufacturers, they publish all the different cars that it is available on, which is a huge swath.

We love CarPlay. We love Apple Android. We love what it does for your interface. It is simple, clean, easy, and now Apple has decided to make Ultra, which takes over even more of your car screens.

And if it is designed forward, like Aston's, Aston was never known for having a lot of interface and a lot of their own software.

But for the companies that do like BMW, notably, they're pushing back and refusing to install Ultra on all of their vehicles. They're just saying, we'll continue with CarPlay.

And that'll be that.

The concept at its base is, OK, think about sitting in your modern car, anything made in the last 10 years. And you probably have certainly the last five. You probably have at least one big screen above the center console. And then you have a screen in front of you, that is the instrument cluster.

And the concept here is, as Paul's showing on the photo here, the concept is that if there's a screen in the car, your Apple device is now controlling that screen.

It may have branding related to the car, but Apple's taking it all, which means they're also getting data from all of those screens.

The concept is, if you've used Apple CarPlay Android Auto, you have that moment where, if you want to get two features of some of the features of the car, you have to go out of your interface.

Your car play into, typically, is an icon for your car. You have to go into that icon, like on my...

You got it back out to the other software.

Exactly.

To get into the changes. And you don't need it very often, but that's the thing. So the thinking here is ultra now is embedded itself in all of those systems.

So without leaving, if you will, the Apple infrastructure, you can drill down.

Portia's is a bit of a hybrid between Apple CarPlay and some of the functions still embedded in screens.

But I'm sure Apple saw all the instrument panel designs, notably Mercedes, BMW, Hyundai, with that single, very slender screen.

So it's actually two screens side by side, but it has changed the architecture of dashboards and instrument panels.

And so I'm sure they've seen that and said, we could take over the whole thing instead of just the center stack.

It depends on the car certainly, but we could have the entire interface, but they're stepping on car manufacturers' toes at that point.

And car manufacturers that designed their own software and put a lot of heavy lifting into their own software, they're not liking this too much.

But I think since Apple abandoned their own car project, this is how they still get into the car market and get more integrated.

It's left over code. What do we do with this code stack?

You know we could do. We could just push it to every other car over on the planet.

I mean, and GM, they're introducing car play in their vehicles outside of North America.

So good news, you get it.

Not in the U.S.

Well, they're super Google embedded now though.

All the GM vehicles have got a ton of Google information and the fight on all of these.

And I think you have to remember with every single one of these discussions, beyond usability, the fight beyond usability, and GM was at least somewhat public about it.

It gets about data because as you use these devices, your location data, your usage data, your speed data, all that kind of stuff is being harvested.

So if Apple takes over all of these things, Apple's getting the valuable data.

GM didn't want Apple to do that, which is why they originally removed car play.

They've got a Google partnership. Of course, Google's ruling us all anyway, so Google's got all the data anyway.

So that's all happening. But in every single case, what we're talking about is, what data is being harvested by the car and or the manufacturer?

And that's what they care about the most.

All of it.

All of it. All of it.

It's all of your data.

We get to sucks it out of your phone.

It's all attached to the cloud anyway.

So it sucks everything out.

You're right.

And we get these car debates or these arguments or I guess screaming at the sky right now in the emails where people say,

I don't want my car to track me.

And I keep thinking, do you have a smartphone?

Too late.

Because if you have a smartphone, you're being tracked.

Yes.

It's all of that data is out there.

But it's who gets the data and what can they do with the data?

And of course, everybody eventually sells the data.

So this is what we're really all talking about.

The thing I think is interesting is I read one article about somebody who actually had one of these Aston Martin's a journalist for a week and drove it around Los Angeles.

With ultra.

Yeah. And gave the pros and cons of the system.

And one of the big pros that they talked about was how because they use Siri a lot in their normal life, you know, hey Siri do this.

By the way, when I said that, did your phone do something just now?

Anyway, so hey Siri do whatever thing in the car.

So I watch the show actually the day where on the show somebody commanded Alexa to do something.

And when they did it on the show, mine tried to respond.

Fantastic.

So I had to stop the show to not have other audio.

We're going to troll each other's phones.

Exactly. And to tell my Alexa to stop.

And then go on with my show.

I mean, here's the thing.

They did it 100% on purpose.

I know they did.

Of course.

It was not something that is casual.

Anyway, but the point was this journalist was talking about how much they liked driving the car and talking to Siri to tell Siri to do things like turn up the air conditioner.

Now, my question is and this is a genuine question.

You listening, you watching, how much do you use those car change this voice features in the car?

Because I'll be honest with you.

They drive me nuts.

They drive me absolutely nuts.

I don't want to tell the car to do anything.

If, here's the exception, if I can reach it with a small movement.

Well, in Volkswagen's, you can't.

So they're forcing you to speak to the car, which I'm sure they enjoyed.

Yeah.

Because they're having to stop so terrible.

There you go.

So they, you know, all of your pass codes are cracked.

If it's dead encryption or, you know, the HUD is scanning your eyeballs as well.

Or something is scanning.

Well, the little bar scanning your, of course it is.

Telling you to pay attention to the road.

Yes.

That's scanning your eyeballs too.

Totally.

But back to the point I'm making here, you know, I have limited usability or limited features set up smart home wise through an Alexa in my house.

Don't have a ton of them.

But the main place I use it is because we have a lot of various lamps around the house.

And none of their switches are accessible easily.

It's not like you walk over to the wall and you hit one switch and five lights turn on.

Right.

You got to go over to that light and that light and that light.

So we've programmed them all over the coffee table.

Exactly right.

So that's the thing.

So that's the great thing for a smart assistant to do.

I can ask the smart assistant to do the thing and multiple things that would take me time and reach and get up from where I am to do.

That's perfect.

I'm sitting in a car.

I can reach over and adjust the volume or I can reach over and adjust the fan speed faster than I can say the sentence.

Yes.

And so my question is legitimately, how many of you are actually using the voice features to control stuff in the car?

Because I think this is a this is a non-issue anyway.

And people have said to us many times we've talked about bad buttons and that kind of stuff use the voice controls that are sitting here going.

Black there is.

True.

I'm sitting here going.

I don't want to take longer and have to speak the thing properly when I can reach over or should be able to reach over and do it.

But this is the kind of stuff that apples counting on is that you're going to use Siri even more.

But I'm literally pulling the group because it's not something I use.

It's not something I use.

Well, so clearly this comes down to car manufacturers telling Apple this far and no farther.

And if Apple does want to go farther and continue on in the automotive market, they either have to invent a car by themselves and bring it to market somehow.

Or they need to take all these executives out to a really nice dinner or a sporting event and continue to push on the.

So hey, we're trying to get cozy with you guys and convince you that you should go with our system because you know that's going to continue.

Of course.

Just because a car manufacturer has decided doesn't mean that's the end of the story.

True.

I'm sure all these companies are constantly asking car manufacturers what's coming next because none of it's sorted.

It actually kind of ties into today's debate about software and that has to do with reliability.

But we'd like to all think it's as reliable as our phones, but it might not always be.

So, you know, TBD, I think this far, no further.

Does that mean Apple will just not support car plan anymore?

Hey, if you guys don't want ultra, it's either ultra or we just sit on a 10 year old code stack for car plan.

It's still in your cars.

Well, but see then, but then that would actually give up the data and the usability back to the car makers.

And Apple's not going to do that.

Apple wants to be getting that data.

They want to keep you captured.

I mean, the only real benefit I can see to this Apple ultra idea, and I say this because you and I drive so many things.

If you drive lots and lots and lots of cars, there's no getting in a new car and searching for how it works.

True.

Because it works like your phone works all the time, which is the thing candidly, I actually like about Apple car play right now in the cars

because the music and the podcasts and the whatever.

That all works exactly the same as it does in every single car.

So that's nice.

But if you take it all over, then you cease to have personality related to the car or the car's design.

This is the progression you've talked about before.

All cars are skateboard platforms that are EVs with batteries in the center and they all have Apple car play.

And then they're all just same.

And now if you have to plug a cord into your phone, what does this ancient technology have to plug a actual cord?

How come it's not Bluetooth? I mean, there's still our cars in the market.

You still got to plug the cord into the end of your phone for the car to actually recognize and you're trying to make fire in the cabin.

That was like way back in the 2020s in 2020 somewhere.

Cold and dude.

Yeah, before times.

It's very funny.

Moving on to a new piece of news, I actually did miss this in coming across the news that we've found.

And that is an announcement from a new ultra luxury automotive manufacturer called Dakora.

I'm glad you brought up photos of this.

I have I have many questions.

I have many, many questions about this at decora.com.

You can reserve yours.

It's slated to be about a half million dollar EV that is designed to harken back to 1930s.

Streamline modern styling on an unannounced EV platform that probably a source from GM.

I mean, here we go.

If we can buy crate motors from for interest Chevy Chrysler that are a thousand horsepower that 1000 horsepower crate motor from GM that you can buy with a 30,000 mile warranty.

Well, there's the what the hell of a dodge or whatever.

Yeah.

Can we also buy batteries and EV platforms?

Can we buy the skate board?

Can I buy your skate board?

And now create our own car companies.

This one is decora.

Decora.

I don't know.

Decora.

All I know is it looks like this.

It is the 1930s streamline modern styling that the founders of the company have decided this will appeal.

Now it's not going to appeal to everyone.

But something I did note is you can see right here on the hood, it is teak, I believe.

But they'll need to make teak polish for this particular car because it needs to be kept nice.

I am not quite convinced about the styling but Decora has partnered with Penn and Farina group to come up with the new design.

Now that also means that anything you want when you go to a design firm, they're designing for their client.

They're not designing for themselves or us necessarily.

They're designing for the client and what the client thinks their customer base is.

So this is the direction that they're going.

Question remains when this car and if this car will hit the market but also the customers.

Will that appeal to...

Yeah.

I understand it's sort of a throwback to the 20s, the 30s, the elegant everybody dressed up for every occasion for dressed up to go flying.

You just wore a suit and tie just to fly because that was the reason you wore a suit and tie.

It's also the era where people inexplicably stood at the dock and it fully dressed in hats and everything and waived at a cruise ship until it vanished.

We have moved on.

That's true.

We have moved on folks.

They did see it off.

I elegantly dressed.

Yes.

We're going to waive until it vanishes.

Which is a long time.

The world has moved on here folks.

The thing is this looks so out of time.

It looks like this belongs in some kind of steampunk movie where they took a 1920s or 30s aesthetic and they jumped it 100 years forward to make some weird sci-fi movie and these are the kind of cars driving around.

This doesn't look any more real than the current Jaguar concept.

It has that same out of reality kind of look about it.

And the biggest question I have this to be honest, this is a start-up.

And if you dig in, not sure if they've arrived the up part yet.

It's starting.

The thing about it is they are trying to create a whole mystique around this car that if you want to be a buyer, you're going to come into their studio.

They have like a place like their, I don't know, Decora Acres, whatever we're calling it.

They have a place where you come in and you meet with the designer and I'm sure all of the couches are wonderful.

Seriously, you see them say it.

They're going to give you an espresso or whatever it is you want.

And they're going to go through swashes and you're going to figure out exactly what you want your car to be.

That's the concept.

They're trying to make a thing that is fully bespoke which was an idea of the 20s and 30s which was very cool.

Coach building was very, very cool up into like the 50s. It was awesome.

You can get this in four seat luxury.

You can get it in like six seat benches.

You pick all your materials.

They're going to have adventures and experiences for their buyers.

Yes.

You're trying to create a cultural thing.

Yes.

The question I have is the half million dollar figure.

This is as vaporware.

I feel like as the current, supposedly still coming Tesla Roadster.

That is just vaporware in my opinion.

Although Tesla claims it's still coming.

It's still coming.

Yeah, for sure.

Where they are looking for people to put down money.

Whoever the startup people behind this, I'm sure they will end up well off.

And some of their customers might get one or two that will never get driven.

But this doesn't feel real to me at all.

And also who out there is really wanting to spend a half million dollars on an utterly untried car.

The platform apparently will make the car way about 6,500 pounds.

It's a large car.

It's going to be 800 horsepower.

Of course it is because it's electric.

So a lot.

Yes.

But it's also apparently slated to have a 400 mile range.

Now that styling, at first when I saw this, I thought, are they onto something?

Are they so tuned in to the next cultural zeitgeist of where buyers are going and what ultra high-end buyers want that we had to look back a hundred years to capture the styling and bring it forward in a modern way.

And then I'm not convinced.

I entertained that thought just to be open-minded.

You know what?

Is this to move forward?

Do we have to look back a hundred years?

To move forward into the future with EVs and new designs that are fresh and appeal to a new customer base that want this, do we have to look all the way back?

And I'm not convinced that we do.

Well, but okay, let me give you two alternatives to this idea.

Let's assume that this is awesome.

Let's assume everything about this is across the board.

It's so fantastically coach-built that you're going to want one.

Okay.

Would you take this over a cellistique or what is it the specter, the Rolls-Royce all electric specter?

Yeah.

And my instinct is no.

As much as I think the cellistique will probably be dead on arrival,

I think you would go for that car or the Rolls-Royce specter before you would roll the dice on this unless you are just a car collector who wants to have something nobody else does.

I mean, the specter already exists.

Yes, exactly.

They're actually used.

They're out there out there.

And here's the thing, Rolls-Royce knows this market.

Yes.

What Rolls-Royce does.

I'm also fascinated by the continual use of teak decking on any car that is supposed to be very expensive, very high end that is always trying to tie into yacht ownership.

It's yacht thinking, yes.

And this car kind of matches the deck of your boat that you have it somewhere, maybe docked at your private island somewhere on the planet.

So that's the appeal.

And I'm not sure that always needs to happen.

For luxury moving forward, I don't think that always needs to be the case.

The back deck on all Rolls-Royce is it's always the teak decking.

It's just the yacht thinking.

But this, I see pulling up at a futuristic movie featuring horse racing where somebody would pull up in this in Kentucky.

And they're at there.

And the horses are now robots that hover and they go, are they coming out of Jetsons?

You said acres.

And that always conjures up old racehorses and where they go to die.

Something sunny acres is where you're old racehorses.

Welcome to Decora acres.

Can I get you a, can I get you a sherry?

And you know, here's your robot assistant who's going to help you pick your, I don't know, all your materials.

Oh, you do want it to look like your yacht.

Did you bring pictures of your yacht?

Oh, you know what?

We'll look up your yacht.

We'll look up your yacht registration.

It's probably available.

We'll look it all up.

It's going to be great.

I also wonder how much, I don't know, obviously we don't have this kind of money.

We aren't these people, but what's the vent a diagram?

What's the crossover of people who have a wildly expensive yacht that want their car to match?

I should have made that vent diagram.

Because there's a thing I actually don't think most super high-end yacht owners want their car to match.

I think the yacht is an experience and the car is an experience and the house or house is in this case is an experience.

And so is the plane.

I don't think most of them want it all to match.

So you're talking about a niche on top of a niche on top of a niche because you've got to be,

I have a monster yacht.

I'd like a crazy half-million dollar vaporware car that is a startup to match my yacht.

I mean, we don't often talk about concepts, but the amount, the amount of projection.

Yeah, there's the right word.

The amount of projection this took, the boldness of this cell is way out there.

Look, I wish the founders of this company a lot of luck.

I think we constantly need fresh ideas for the automotive industry.

It's because I'm always wondering what's next.

Sure, what's next for car companies after this.

And that's something we may still cover in the future and that is,

what is next for the automotive industry?

Is it just consistently more the same?

Do we keep talking about robot taxis?

Does the tech finally get better and it's just more and more and more?

Or are there fresh ideas that need to be introduced?

I love the ideas and I love it if there is a market for this.

Others have been tried.

I've seen people buy the IP and the rights to old car company names

to try to resurrect them and bring them back.

And that's not always been successful.

The automotive market is hard.

It's even harder than it was a hundred years ago to just come up with a chassis

which then was pretty much a skateboard chassis.

All those packets and rolls and do's and burgs.

It was always the Murphy body or that some kind of body on top of a platform.

Same kind of thinking.

Maybe that is the future, but now it just comes down to styling.

So if it's all the same EV platform, skateboard everything including Apple CarPlay Ultra.

You just plop a new body on it.

Can I get an ultra in my Decora which matches my yacht which doesn't have CarPlay Ultra?

But maybe it could. Apple Yacht Play.

Apple Yacht Play Ultra.

Play me some yacht rock.

Siri, let's go to the Bahamas.

Okay.

I just don't even believe this is a thing.

But okay, this is what we're talking about.

We're way out.

Look, we're a long way from everyday driver stuff.

But I am fascinated by these moonshot ideas.

And especially when it's when it's connected to the word start up because I kind of think no.

But we'll see.

We'll see where it goes.

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The topic Tuesday today is very interesting. I was trying to think about what is it really about and it's about...

Do we look at the words reliable and maintenance as different and what makes a car reliable and also is maintenance a bad word.

And I feel like and we're going to unpack this but I feel like in many ways we have conflated the two ideas.

We think reliability is somehow connected to I never have to maintain this car ever.

I think there are a lot of us who just I want to buy a car, never do anything to it and then get angry if anything goes wrong.

But most machines in your life, your own body, all these kind of other things, maintenance is required.

If you like things to continue to run well, maintenance is required on most things in our lives.

And cars are very complex mechanical things.

And your toaster doesn't really need maintenance but you need to brush the crumbs out of yourself.

So you're retically, don't put over the sick, something that please unplug it first.

The point is the point is what where is the crossover because AJ is writing in about unreliable things versus expensive things.

And he knows because he has a 2008 E60 M5.

Yes, the one with the infamous V10 known for blowing up, he bought it with 63,000 miles and ladies and gentlemen, hang on to something.

He currently has it with 221,000 miles on it and he wants to talk reliability versus maintenance.

This is not AJ's car. This is just a photo of that M5, that E60 M5, that I admit I was all about when this came out.

They're very cool.

I had a ride in one.

I felt those inflatable seat bolsters for the first time that pushed on you.

Yeah, I argued cornered and I heard the V10 and it was magic.

We did a test drive forever ago. It was awesome.

We were both terrified of the potential maintenance but it was an awesome car.

AJ's got this 2008 M5, 221,000 miles.

It's got its original engine.

He admits that maintenance hasn't been cheap but he's done countless track days, road trips, spirited drives.

It's never left him stranded.

He was thinking about this one day at what point is a car considered reliable?

Is it 100,000? Is it 200,000 miles?

It's an interesting thought experiment that he writes just recently to us when you compare this M5 to an accord of the same year from 2008.

Okay.

So here's that accord. Remember those accords?

Oh yeah.

It says the MSRP for the M5 was about three times more than the accord.

So it isn't fair to compare the maintenance to be around three times more for major service.

You would expect it to be fair.

Here's the thing, I love that he identified that because when you and I bought our old used sedans,

your Mazarati and my fate, one of the things we brought up.

Old used sedans.

Yes, they were.

One of the things we brought up is while we're big fans of used cars and Autotempest will help you without Autotempest.com slash every day is the place to find anything you can imagine.

And used cars buys them all about it.

As much as we like and have bought some new cars, used cars are where the deals are but you can't buy a massively depreciated luxury car

and think you're taking a $30,000 car to be serviced.

You may be taking $100 or $200,000 car to be serviced and the repair bills will be in accordance with the original MSRP.

I like that you identified that way back when with my 928.

Just because it's an old car, they'll say, well, it's still a Porsche 928.

The best car they ever.

Yes.

All their engineering stuff.

And AJ is saying this.

He's saying, look, if my repair bills on a three times more expensive than Honda Accord car are three times more expensive than the repair bills on Honda Accord, doesn't that make sense?

And I would argue, yes, you can't think that a car you bought cheap that was expensive will be cheap to maintain.

You are maintaining an expensive car.

AJ is saying this V6 Honda Accord requires a timing belt about every 100,000 miles.

Okay.

So it's about a thousand bucks with labor.

The M5 requires rod bearings every 100,000 miles which is about $3,000 with labor.

He's done research.

Re time.

He's done the math.

I love it.

He says both of these major services, if they're neglected, can blow up the engine.

So they are both non-negotiable services.

Both cars have problematic automatic transmissions, that six automatic transmission for the Honda, the SMG for the BMW.

And they could leave you stranded if and when they fail.

Consumables like brakes, tires, etc. for the M5 around two to three times more expensive, but they last just as long as the Honda's.

He has done math here.

I love that he's dug, dug around into the comparative car from the same era and actually done the math.

It's a fascinating discussion.

You did get us thinking, AJ.

Thank you for writing.

He says the MG or MG M5 is consistently considered the most unreliable car ever made, not ever made, but ever.

It's up there, yeah.

In the enthusiast head space, the Honda Accord is renowned for its reliability, but when we break down the maintenance and adjust the prices accordingly,

are they really that different in terms of reliability?

He says no one calls Porsche's unreliable when you have to spend five to $7,000 to drop the engine to weld some cool lines on the Messger engine cars.

The research has been done here.

He has dug around.

I love it.

All this Porsche nerds just say, well, they're high maintenance, right?

Yes, do.

So AJ asks, do we often confuse unreliable with expensive?

That is fascinating.

Well, AJ at first, I thought very few people buy a car anymore these days thinking, I'm going to keep this to 200,000 miles.

I'm going to drive this to 200,000 miles.

Yes.

Does anybody buy an EV these days thinking, I'm going to keep this for 221,000 miles.

I'm going to drive like you do with a Subaru.

I'm going to pass this down through the generations.

That is not the marketing advertisement behind Rivians, Teslas, Hyundai's.

That's a great point.

Those marketing people say, well, you want this now.

You want it now.

Release it.

Get a lease.

Yeah, get the latest you greatest comment.

You're right, that's totally the difference.

And you've nailed it.

Subaru leans into that.

Honda Accord, the Camry, the Subaru's, buy it now, give it to your kids when they go to college.

Yeah, I know your kid was just born, but they can come home from the hospital in it and they can go to college in it

because you'll still have it.

No EV is being sold that way.

No.

That's a very good point.

No one thinks I'm going to keep this EV.

Does anybody think going into a 10-year-old Tesla Model S right now?

I'm going to buy that and it's got 118,000 miles on it.

I got it for $14,000 or $15,000.

I'm going to have this for a long time where I want somebody's castoffs.

I'm probably the eighth owner of that car.

Did the software properly get upgraded?

Interesting, all right.

I mean, that brings me to the question of what makes something reliable.

I mean, the reason all those mid-90s and 2000 era Honda's and Toyota's

remember all those engines, the CRX's, the Camry's?

They just seem to run.

And that was because they had relatively unstressed, generally low compression ratio engines.

Not always.

Yeah.

And having a low compression ratio or having a high compression ratio does not necessarily

determine the reliability, but it can affect it over time.

For example, a highly stressed turbo motor, like on the Mitsubishi Evo 10,

that's a high stress engine, like 75,000 miles.

Well, and you have to assume somebody's driven it really hard versus your average

base Honda Accord is an unstressed engine that probably wasn't driven that hard.

You assume that can go a long way.

Right.

We're talking about a V10 here that takes a lot of maintenance.

He's done the maintenance, and it's just kept running.

I mean, granted, diesel engines, they are all about compression ratios,

from 14 to 1 to 25 to 1.

So, of course, they last a long time.

So what it also comes down to is the quality of the materials,

the quality of the metallurgy, the components, the quality of the car.

Ultimately, and that's why all these cars ran and continued to run.

I mean, you could successfully go buy a 300,000 mile Honda CRX right now

and drive it another 300,000 miles.

Probably just fine.

It's got 90 horsepower, unstressed engine, just keep the oil changed

and Bob's your uncle, and you're good.

Well, but you know, this brings us back around too.

I want to talk about some super high-mile cars.

I'll go to the first place, and that is Matt Faire.

We all know Matt Faire is 100 million mile Lexus, right?

He bought that Lexus LS with 900,000 miles and thought

this will be a laugh, will take it to 100.

And he thought what all of us thought.

And that is a Lexus LS that's already at 900,000 miles

is going to be a breeze to get to a million miles.

And he spent in the Northern amount of money,

he's talked about it for a Northern amount of money,

just keeping that running because something was always breaking.

Now, you can look at that two ways.

It's got 900 plus 1000 miles on it.

Of course, stuff is breaking.

But on the other hand, the spectrum isn't a Lexus LS,

just supposed to run.

It's a Toyota.

It's everything you're supposed to magically work.

He put money into that to keep it running because the gag was to get it to a million.

And so if it needed something, he spent the money on it.

We have talked about this various places before.

And I want to go down two rabbit holes real quick.

The first one I say is, this is the reason behind why you and I rarely do a car debate

based on maintenance or perceived reliability of a car.

Because I don't know what day your car was building.

That's why I'm free to buy Mazda Rotties.

Yeah, exactly.

And I don't know how you were going to maintain it or the person you're buying it from maintained it.

I've got no idea.

Yeah.

You can have the world's most reliable car you think and you bought it from the wrong owner

and it was built on the wrong day and that one will never be right.

So it's one of the reasons we don't worry about that.

But the other part of the equation here is,

we have joked before and I truly believe it.

If you want to spend the time and the money,

you, the collective you listening, could buy one car right now

and drive it for the rest of your life.

You could keep driving in theory.

In any car you pick.

In theory.

Indefinitely.

Because unless you run into a situation where they have physically stopped making parts for the car,

if it breaks, you get a new part, you either put it on yourself

or you get somebody to put it on for you and it keeps going.

These are very complex machines.

But they are machines built on an assembly line.

And as long as all the parts talk to each other,

they could theoretically go indefinitely if you can keep getting parts.

We don't drive them that way.

We don't think of them that way.

But you could.

You could buy a car at the age of 16

and drive it till you're 106.

And theoretically, if they kept making parts, it would keep running.

Now, where is the sliding scale of is this reliable?

But I think where we're headed is into a conversation about

how much we have all become consumptive.

And I'm not trying to preach here, but my point here is

I meant to bring up a picture and I totally forgot.

Think about all the iPhones that have existed in the last decade.

I have a box.

Full of them.

It's like not the junk draw.

It's the junk box.

Do any of you listening still have your first smartphone?

Meaning, no, I don't mean in the drawer.

I mean, you're using your first smartphone.

Oh, not using it.

I still have it.

It's totally dead.

How many of you are using your first smartphone?

A smartphone is a computer in your pocket.

Okay, as long as the software updates,

you should be able to keep plugging it in,

keep using it as a computer in your pocket.

It's more advanced than any phone prior to the 100 years prior to that.

Why aren't we still using that?

Because we want the new shiny with the extra features and the whatever.

This has permeated into everything we buy,

cars being the worst example.

Because when your phone starts to bubble,

look, my current iPhone,

this has happened in the last few weeks to me,

which is why it's in my mind.

My current iPhone just doesn't seem to hold a charge much anymore.

And what's my headspace?

I oughta get a new one.

I oughta just get rid of that.

I oughta put that one in the drawer and just get a new iPhone.

I'm sure AT&T is hitting you up for some sort of trade-in.

They can't believe I haven't gotten one in a few years.

They're a stoner.

Somebody at AT&T is scratching their head.

Why hasn't taught about a new phone?

The point I'm making here is the minute there's a bobble with most of our tech.

We don't think,

I should get that fixed.

We think, what a terrible piece of tech.

And we just replace it.

I'm saying the collective we.

I know there are exceptions to every rule.

I know maybe you spend your money one place differently than I do in vice versa.

I totally get that.

But in general,

the minute it starts to not work optimal,

we get a new one.

So now you have a car as complex as they are.

And we bring that thinking into our cars.

I should never have to do anything to this.

I'm annoyed I even have to get gas.

Maintenance.

What's that?

What is maintenance?

What do you mean oil changes?

What do you mean tires need air?

What my brakes wear out?

And if it has a bobble, you freak.

Yeah.

And I say this because I've had this experience with people's response to my Amira.

I have met many, many people who because I have publicly acknowledged the problems that I've had,

look at me dumbfounded that I still like the car and I'm willing to keep it.

And I'm like, I've had because of the three problems.

I've had three problems in the first year.

Yes, it left me stranded.

It didn't start mysteriously 600 miles in in the middle of nowhere.

That was very frustrating and I was, look, I will admit, as much as I liked the car,

I was like, is this the beginning of a pattern?

But it wasn't.

It was a random bobble that hasn't happened since.

I had the weird issue with the gas cap, the plunger broke.

I had to get a new gas cap.

Okay.

And I've needed software updates for little weird things on the dash that pop up.

Okay.

Is this annoying?

Yes.

What I prefer didn't happen?

Of course.

Should it happen to a car is expensive of that?

Definitely not.

But hate it and get rid of it?

How difficult are we?

That we can't expect as complex as cars are for stuff to go wrong now.

And then when it does, I know I'm preaching.

When it does, just get that thing fixed.

The thing that broke?

Fix it!

And keep driving said car that you love.

And if you kept liking it, I had this thought because I looked it up.

There is this fascinating story of the most high-mile car ever.

Oh yeah!

Volvo P1800.

That guy Ira had over 3 million miles on it when he died.

3 million miles.

Remember that car?

A mass, mass-produced car.

This is not like a Mercedes they built for 30 years.

A Volvo P1800.

How hard was it to get parts for this car?

How hard was it to get tires?

Plus it's closer than everything.

That's 70s.

Fine.

But my point is he bought it brand new in like the 60s and he drove it until he died.

And it had 3 and a quarter million miles on it.

Which means short of body panels he probably replaced everything.

And my question is I thought looking for parts on normal things was going to be hard.

How hard was this?

He's a dominer with spinning like a silly thing.

Exactly.

He said he didn't have the sixth column.

He drove like 90,000 miles a year.

The five columns like 3 and a quarter million miles.

People have done this with big pickups.

Matt Farad did a million miles with his Lexus.

The point is it's just about the dedication for I don't want to get rid of this.

I wanted to keep running and can you find the parts 3 and a quarter million miles on that Volvo?

But he did it.

And it happened.

And I'm so glad you brought up software because I have a short history lesson for all of us way, way back in 2019.

You remember when Volkswagen decided to pivot completely to EVs.

And they made the announcement.

And the following year, 2020, you remember this.

They came up with a new division called Cariad.

Cariad.

I don't know how to pronounce it.

Cariad.

It's terrible name.

Terrible acronym.

Yes.

So they staffed this division with 5500 employees, really smart people, programmers.

Yes.

And they decided, along with building EVs, changing the factories over, they were going to bring everything in-house.

And they were going to design all of their own software.

Yep.

And they were going to do it all.

Well, things change and they realize not as easy as Tesla makes it look.

True.

Yeah.

Tesla does it well.

And that day when you and I reviewed the Volkswagen ID4, still pretty new.

Yes it was.

And you noticed the check engine light came on on the dash on an electric car.

And by the way, if you don't know, the check engine light is about your emission system.

So an electric car that does not emit anything, the check engine light came on.

Just forgot about that.

Remember, the gas engine light came on with a little fan, with the same icon we've all seen a million times,

the check engine light came on.

You know what was wrong with the car?

Nothing.

The check engine light came on.

You pointed it out and we scratched our heads.

We did.

Decided to keep driving.

Nothing happened.

Yes.

Hated the infotainment.

Yes.

The world eviscerated Volkswagen's design because we decided that it looked great in a boardroom.

In a meeting and you click here and you have an iPad and you demonstrate, here's how it's going to work.

And well have you noticed, you're constantly looking at the screen.

And at that point, you've driven into a tree because autonomous driving still is not where...

Not a thing.

We all think it should be.

Self-driving cars don't really exist unless it's a wayboat.

Yes.

What I love about our friends Kyle and Jordan over at Out of Spec, they constantly test software.

And Jordan made a comment to me that he thought Rivian's software was better than Teslas.

Low and behold, just a couple of years ago, you remember Volkswagen partnered into a 5 billion Euro arrangement with Rivian.

Why?

Because they realize car...

Carried.

Car ID.

Car I add.

That needed to be walked away from it.

It's bad.

Yes.

It still exists but they laid off 1600 employees kind of admitted defeat.

Yes.

It still works for most of the systems in the car.

And as of April 2025, they have claimed 9 out of the 10 best-selling EVs in Germany used the software developed by Carried.

Carried.

That.

Nevertheless, they have a tie up with Rivian.

Why?

It's not that Volkswagen can't figure out how to build cars.

It's not that they don't have good batteries or don't know about electric motors.

It's because of the software and Jordan identified it.

Rivians got great software, great interface and it works.

That helps.

Yeah.

We treat cars, EVs from here on out, anything that relies on all this software like our phones because our phones just work.

But what happens when they don't and you can't get it maintained in the new firmware update that hasn't gotten pushed to your car yet didn't happen.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And some other mechanical thing, you can't make it update, you can't fix the car.

What happens?

Those EVs are disposable at that point.

And I think that's kind of become a...

I don't know if people have really been able to articulate that but I think people are kind of catching on to that.

Because it's that phenomenon that has caused Porsche Ticons to plummet in value.

Why aren't they doing the Porsche thing where every Porsche just sells used for more than it was new?

For more than it was new, it just does.

I can't explain it, but no, it doesn't because of that software issue.

So can we continue to buy all these cars?

Do we think of these cars as 221,000 mile keepers?

We don't.

And there's another thing going on here.

And I can't guarantee what I'm about to say is correct across the board but I'm just wondering for any of you watching.

Do any of you watching have a family member with a refrigerator from the 50s or 60s?

I have a family member with one.

You do?

Yes.

Like an old-style refrigerator.

They're all like cagurators now.

Like put the tap right in the middle of it.

Kind of.

But my point is...

My point is...

Why is that still working?

The post-war stuff.

The stuff that was made out of cast iron?

The stuff that was made post-war.

Yes.

Was made with this demeanor of this needs to be robust and it needs to last because I don't know when I'm going to get another one.

But the problem with that thinking, if you are selling a consumer device, the problem with that thinking is the customer doesn't come back.

If you sell them a refrigerator that's going to last them for 50 years, you don't get them back again.

We sold them the thing.

They're good.

And they're gone.

They're just...

They have a refrigerator.

We need no customers.

To make it shiny and new and have new options that they don't have on their current refrigerator in this thing.

But then the secondary part is...

Look at how everybody.

This was a shift in the late 90s, early 2000s.

Every company has gone to, please subscribe.

Please pay a monthly fee for X.

Whatever X is for their company.

Please pay a monthly fee so that we can know on our balance sheets for Wall Street, we have X amount of money coming in every month because you are subscribed to get the new updated thing.

While I do believe that you could buy a new car and you could keep it for 200,000 miles.

I believe you could pick any car you wanted and you could keep it for 200,000 miles.

I truly believe it.

EV, any car you're looking at, I think any car you think of if you bought it today could go 200,000 miles if you maintained it properly.

None of those car companies want you to.

You just said your phone battery was dying.

I know.

I don't got to get rid of my phone.

So we need a new battery.

That's got to exist.

You would think.

But it's never quite as good as it.

But my point is that car company, even though your car could go 200,000 miles if you maintained it, they want you back in five at most.

They want you back in five years at most.

At most.

Okay.

Nobody releases a car for five years.

There is a benefit to these things dying.

There is a benefit to you subscribing.

Yeah.

All of the stuff.

I'm saying for companies that sell products, the benefit is we need your back.

We need it to be just reliable enough that you'll be back for the next one.

But not so reliable that it's the last one you bought.

Let's be honest.

What's the edge?

Engineering team?

Listen up.

Seriously.

And I do think.

Make it good.

Not too good.

I do think I'm good.

50,000 miles is like the edge.

They really want.

By that point, it's just like, you know, you ought to come in.

You ought to come in and get us.

And I also think this is the trick of warranties.

Because by 60,000 miles, most cars are fine.

They're fine.

Yeah.

But so many of us, the minute it falls off warranty, we're like, I ought to get either an extended warranty.

Which might be expensive and I'm not sure about or just I should just get another car.

60,000 miles.

It's fine.

I don't care what it is.

It's fine.

Except for a box on the golf with the timing belt and the Christmas tree.

Maintain it.

I'm still saying.

Doesn't matter what it is.

Maintain it.

But they want you back.

There's benefit to it not really running 200,000.

That's not what they want.

You can do it.

It's not what they want.

Make it really good.

Not too good.

Good.

Just good enough.

AJ, I think the answer to your question is the consumption that Todd identified earlier.

And that is we all want the newest, shiny, latest new tech and new tech moves faster than

cars can be built than they can be developed and built.

Yeah.

That's why Apple is here to offer CarPlay Ultra.

Yes, it is.

Side note.

But.

Hey Siri, make me a new car.

Hey Siri, order me a new car.

Hey Siri, this phone sucks.

I need to know what.

Oh look, my battery's gone.

Yeah.

On the other hand, all those 2013 Tesla Model S's, they're fine.

They're still fast.

They're still working.

They might have lost 10 or maybe 15% of charge capacity, but for the price you're paying.

So.

And they've got 118, 120, 150,000 miles on them.

So.

Get it.

Buy it.

Keep driving it.

Drive it until the real car turns into dust.

But will it last?

Will that chassis last?

The software updates I think are still happening on all those old cars.

I wish them so.

Yeah.

So that means you're still getting those updates.

But I'm encouraged on one point that the updates will always be coming.

So it doesn't matter what the screen is, the electronics hopefully can handle it.

It's not like your laptop where the iOS is too good for your laptop's guts.

So I have to actually throw this away.

That happens.

That happens too.

You're right.

The software has surpassed the computer's capability.

The memory.

For sure.

Yeah.

So I'm encouraged that theoretically software updates mean that new cars, new EVs can continue

to be built and we can successfully buy them.

It's just nobody does anymore because the tech moves so fast and we want the shiniest

newest thing that has to get integrated.

We have to have it.

I was reading a thing recently about how the general, like the JD power stuff where they

talk about initial quality and that kind of stuff.

And that's just about how many issues did you have in the first 90 days or year of your

car ownership?

And people satisfaction has gone down since 2009.

And most of that is connected.

Just in general, most of that is connected to people being annoyed with the interface

in their car.

So it's not that the cars became less reliable as far as the mechanical reality, but the

interface that I'm working with, maybe CarPlay Ultra is the end.

Maybe that's what we've done.

It's just talked our way there.

But I really do think, it should just be Apple CarPlay Ultra, or I guess Android Auto

Ultra, we're done.

No, but the thing is, it really comes down to pain tolerance and do you want your car

to keep running?

Do you want to get a new car?

And I've said forever and I don't think this is a perfect answer, but once your yearly

maintenance bill divided by 12 months is the same as you buying a good new car you would

like, newer car you would like, it's time to jump.

Because you could keep just spending money on car X indefinitely and make it run three

million miles.

But if you're spending, I'm just averaging it out, three to four hundred dollars a month

equivalent to keep your old car running, why don't you spend three to four hundred dollars

a month equivalent on a car loan and get a newer car.

That's always been my breakover point.

Not saying that works.

So that's the pain threshold.

So we've determined.

I think so.

Horsepower to weight ratio, which is seven pounds, a horse power cannot move more than seven

pounds to be considered.

No, it was it was up to it was up to 12.

It was 12.

Yeah.

12 and under per pound of car, that horse power is moving.

Yes.

12 horse power under defines great sports car and you have your horse power.

I have my swath of horse power, 250 to 600 horsepower, which is a lot of things, by the way.

Yeah.

500 horsepower in a car is a lot.

It's a lot.

The base C8 with 500 horsepower is a quite powerful car.

That's a lot.

It is.

Yeah, you don't really need anything more than you'll be fine.

All these VVs with a foul.

That is not the direction.

More power.

No.

I think we've ended it more power, like a thousand, a thousand, six hundred eight hundred.

I don't care anymore.

It's going to be arrow.

It's going to be fluids to make it run.

I guess.

Tires to keep it on the earth.

There's brakes.

That's the next thing.

Horse power.

We're done.

We're good.

I just read actually.

There was a UK magazine that just did testing on the Avaya.

We talked about it last week.

And it blew away all of their prior records for 100 to 200 mile an hour speeds.

It was seconds faster than any other car.

And I kept thinking, who's using that?

You know what they did was they took it to a runway and tested that, which is very cool.

And I just kept thinking, broke all your records 100 on 150 miles an hour and up.

And I was like, and so there for what?

And now that's useful for, I mean, it's very cool.

But okay, I'll drive it for coffee.

That's what most buyers do.

Yes.

Oh.

Good for coffee.

Yep.

Because if you're going to try to drive doors, I'm driving for coffee.

If you're going to properly put a car on track, it's going to be something a lot less expensive.

Anything.

And if you go on track, you're not getting close to 200 miles and there's no track long enough.

There's no track that has maybe Coda that has a long enough straight that you could even

get close to the top speed of these super powerful cars and then bring it back down with

braking.

Maybe something like Coda, which has got a three-quarter of a mile straight.

But generally, it's just, what, runway runs?

Who's doing that with their Avaya?

Who even has an Avaya?

Separate question.

Okay.

That's from what has access to our runway.

But we're moving on.

Okay.

So the final answer here.

You're going to wrap it up.

I'm excited.

I'm excited for you to wrap it up.

It's $400 per month.

I think.

Right?

The equivalent of $400 a month.

Yeah.

$400 per year.

Yeah.

Right?

Is that the, you can't, if you get the $400, $400 a year.

$400.

Sorry.

$400, $400 a year.

Yeah.

I want to start school.

Leave me alone.

It's okay.

Yeah.

$4800 and that's it.

If you're spending that every year, I think it's time to really consider.

And so you have two major services a year.

Sure.

And does that include tires and brakes?

I think so.

Yeah.

I think so because of consumables.

So your car either runs.

But if you keep the car more and you don't spend that amount of money and then you have a major

bill, you're still within the threshold.

Of course.

That's what's going to keep it longer.

I'm talking about every year.

If your car is costing you five grand a year, you keep it on the road.

Five grand a year.

Really?

You couldn't get something else for that kind of money that might run better.

That's my personal, personal way of looking at it.

I realize.

Or who goes personal at regard.

I think so.

$400 everyone.

Get a cool car for that.

Yeah.

You can.

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That topic Tuesday got lengthy.

I like it.

That's really good.

Let's do some car debate.

That's what this show is called.

Let's do the car debate.

Albert S. writes to us that he's not a BMW enthusiast and he doesn't want to own any more than

the four he currently owns.

Any more than the four.

He has four in his garage right now.

But he's not a BMW enthusiast.

He's not.

He just happens to own four BMWs right now.

Do you like how I tied this into the topic Tuesday?

I do.

And more BMWs.

Albert, thank you for writing.

He discovered us earlier in COVID and coming off nearly a decade of 2.0 turbo four cylinders

and front wheel drive based platforms.

This podcast was exactly the amount of bad influence that he needed.

We are often your bad influence.

That's very pretty.

I aspire to be your bad influence.

We are, for sure.

A manual E60 BMW 550i broke the streak.

I like that.

That's good.

Even though he's had plenty of fun cars and he touched a spreadsheet, there was never a true

sports car on the list and he's never driven his own car on track.

Hooked on driving.

Come to a hooked on driving track day.

Something finally clicked.

Again, credit to the podcast for pushing him over the finish line or off the cliff depends

on either way depending on yeah.

Mid 2021, he sprung for a 2000 year 2000 Z3 M coupe.

Oh, those are cool.

He didn't start the day thinking he'd buy a car.

This is what happens when you're on a break a trailer.

That's what happens.

Yeah, he said the clown.

She wasn't even in just consideration list.

He was looking at the 86 platformer of BRZ, the Miata, the 370 Z.

But he bought it and he couldn't be happier.

He has one now and he just loves the analog feel of it.

It's exactly what he wanted.

I love that.

You were just, I love how people accidentally buy things on bring a trailer.

You're just like, no, I've always liked no, but he bit after me crap, honey, I got

a car.

Yeah, that's happened more than once.

Many of you written to us with that.

It is a thing that happens.

That's really cool.

Al wants to have new experiences, but he feels like he's just going to fall back on his

past.

He wouldn't say that he's done the best job diversifying, but cars from his past that

stand out include a 128 eye also BMW, I'm sorry, I have to say that doesn't stand out.

It's another BMW.

Yeah, it's true.

Anyway, prelude must be three, Audi S4, all the TDIs, the Golf R and the E Golf, he barely

ever thinks about the Tesla Accord or Volkswagen CCs.

He owned those and they just, they don't matter.

He sent a whole spreadsheet.

There's been a lot of car ownership here.

Yeah.

Over the past half decade, Al's felt a strong obligation to daily drive something efficient.

He wants to support companies that move the needle forward, hence the Rivian R1T Model

3 Performance and E Golf in his history, and he's found EVs to be fantastically utilitarian

but low on fun.

And he likes owning an EV, but he's not requiring owning an EV, and he realizes that his wife,

who now has a CX90 plug-in, so he feels like, okay, so the EV thing's kind of been handled.

We have driven that.

He said, so now he feels like his desire to have an EV as one of their kind of dailies

is handled with the CX90.

So he doesn't have to do that, but his two kids aren't front-seat-sized yet, so he hasn't

really been able to share the clown shoe with them, but he's looking for something that

can be fun.

His current fleet, besides the BMW's E3, includes the Project E30, which runs, that's

very good.

He's got a new drivetrain and refresh suspension happening on that.

The E46 M3 that he got so the kids could come on fun drives, but until the E30 runs

right, and is fully sorted, and they like the AC.

And then when he had a ribbon, when he got rid of that, he was offered a manual BMW X3.

That is rare, actually, a manual X3 for almost nothing, and he couldn't say no.

So we've got X3, E30, E46, and the Z3.

These are his cars, four BMW's, and that does not count the fact that his wife has a

Mazda CX90, but he has four BMW's, personally.

Well, that sounds like a collection.

It does.

It sounds like he's a BMW guy.

Are you the guy that actually wears the BMW shirts when you walk around your old BMW

car?

No, because he's not a BMW enthusiast.

Apparently not, but I beg the differ, yeah.

He says, after driving on the salted roads of upstate New York in winter, by the end of

February, he is foaming at the mouth for some form of driving fun on his 30-minute commute.

He really needs the next day to be engaging, especially during the winter, and provide variety.

So not a BMW.

Well.

Ideally.

Yeah, okay.

Got it.

He'll likely replace the X3 soon since it's old enough to have a driver's license, has

145,000 miles, but Al, you can keep putting money into it all the way to 220.

Yeah.

It can run to 221.

That's the benchmark.

Yeah, it is.

From now on, 221 is the benchmark.

$400 a month is your threshold.

He said he doesn't consider himself a BMW guy, but did he realize is how ridiculous it is

that he owns four?

Al is always lean towards the sporty end of driving.

He's got a strong preference for a man, even though he realizes that limits him, luxury

isn't a priority, but he does admit the whole time he had his 2019 WRX, he wished it had

a nicer interior.

Hmm.

Anytime you drive a WRX, you wish it has a nicer interior, but that's not why you buy a

dress.

That's actually fair.

Every winter.

By the end of February, Al will be foaming at the mouth.

Yes, that's true.

But every winter, somebody with an STI is going to post a picture or a video that they

shot badly on their phone or they're pulling a UPS truck out of a ditch.

That's the reason you buy your STI.

That's true.

And it'll make the news.

And you hoon yourself around and you buy a winter-tired STI and you pull delivery trucks

out of ditches for fun.

It's like your own weird version of automotive Santa.

Yeah.

Al admits to missing something modern since selling his ribion.

He says using FM transmitters to connect his phone to his car is getting old.

They still have those?

I know they do.

Just easy.

This will be the daily family car, so it also needs to be somewhat practical and reasonably

new.

He is not afraid of rear-wheel drive in the winter though.

It's not preferred.

He's got a cool list of ideas, currently, including a Cadillac CT4 or CT5V series Blackwing.

Love those.

The G80 generation M3.

That's another BMW.

But he suggests it because it's manual.

I know.

But it's another BMW.

Ionic 5N RS3 or RS5 Integra Type SE53 AMG or the V60 Polestar.

The Cayenne and Panamera e-hybrids also come to mind.

Todd, you can speak to Cayenne e-hybrids.

I can.

Yes, for sure.

Better than anyone.

He says he doesn't like non-car person attention.

He'd rather not stand out in his nice middle-class neighborhood, littered with pilots in F-150s

and Highlanders, except for a person who owns a 911 GT3.

He occasionally sees on a trailer being pulled by a Cayenne, so that does stand out.

That's crazy, except.

But the point is you don't want to be that guy.

That's what you're kind of saying.

I want to be that guy.

I know you do.

So some of the Cayenne things may be out.

I'm already that guy in my neighborhood.

My neighbor has like, what's Paul got in the front?

Absolutely.

You absolutely are.

People are coming and going and have no, no, their ability to look at your driveway.

Yeah.

So if I had GT3 on a trailer being pulled by a Cayenne, that would really get the neighbor's

talking to you.

You got more than they already.

RS cars coming already.

So anytime you walk outside, you get besieged by at least two neighbors.

I've seen it happen.

Today, whatever car is in the driveway, Paul's out talking to somebody about it.

It happens.

Al says, maybe a heavily depreciated TyCon would be okay.

He's not completely opposed to something Volkswagen and Audi, but he worked for Volkswagen

of America.

So for a while, he's kind of been there done that.

The RS3 is likely the exception, but he's been thinking about Golf R's, and he's okay

not selling anything but the X3.

That means keep 3 BMWs replaced with a car.

So the X3 is 145,000 mile X3 is not going to get you a whole lot of money.

If we sold more, we could find you more money, but he says there's no set budget.

So fine.

Well, that's your first mistake.

Yeah, exactly.

There's no set budget, which is really dangerous, especially for Paul.

And also then the question just becomes what BMWs do you sell to get into whatever else

we're discussing?

Al, I think this is amazing.

I think this is really funny, because look, I have to be the guy that acknowledges the

fact that, yes, you can decide you don't want more of the same thing in your driveway.

And then I wound up with two notices and two kines.

So as a result, I thought you were suggesting a Lotus for House.

No, no, I'm not.

I'm just saying, I understand how you don't think of yourself as a single mark person and

suddenly end up with multiple of them, because they work and you like them.

I get how it happens.

I don't recommend it, but I get how it happens.

I have to say, look, you can't go wrong with your number one choice here, and that is

either of the black wings.

Yeah.

There's not a single thing wrong with these.

Both of them are great.

How much money do you want to spend is really the question of the budget, the bigger one

than the T5 is the more expensive and more powerful one, but we drove a CT4 recently.

That review is coming as part of our Coda series.

And it is phenomenal.

I know that's not a spoiler to anybody, because people know they're good.

You cannot go wrong here.

So I highly, highly recommend you there.

I have to say that one of the other ones you brought up is excellent.

And that is the Integra Type S.

I think that this to me is the palette cleanser for you, the Integra Type S.

You're coming out of a lot of BMW product.

You haven't had front wheel drive in a little bit.

This is a new model, new thinking front wheel drive.

This would be a great car in the winter, but it doesn't have an I'm sorry interior.

It's got a nice interior, but it is front wheel drive, manual transmission, great manual,

great chassis.

Looks good.

Isn't very common, but it's one of those cars also that's just stealth enough.

Your neighbors are not going to be like, wow, flashy car.

I mean, I love it in this cool blue and I would want to go as flashy as possible with

it, but you can get it subtle.

You can get it in white.

We had a white one forever ago.

It had crazy red seats in it, but it was so subtle to look at it.

And then he drove it and I'm like, that drives just great.

It does great.

Yeah.

Really, really great.

If you want to go all-wheel drive and you want to lose the manual, here is the only

that's the only reason I bring up this one and that is the other one in this line up.

Is the TLX type S all-wheel drive?

Yes.

You have two small kids.

The only problem we've ever had with this car which we've loved every single time we've

driven it, the only problem we have is the back seats aren't big.

Doesn't matter.

Yep.

In your case, you could drive this car year round.

It is overlooked.

It drives very well.

It has very good power.

Super handling all-wheel drive from Acura is a thing.

It is a good thing.

If you're willing to let go of the manual, which I know is hard in this conversation, this

is my choice for you.

It was the Acura TLX because this is a bigger car than the Integra.

If manual is paramount, then you go Integra, but I have one wild card for Owl.

Okay.

I've got a wild card too.

And I'm very excited for your list because I think you're probably going to do this

better than me.

But my wild card is just because you want a different experience and you want fun and you want all-wheel

drive and you want manual transmission.

All-wheel drive and manual transmission is hard.

There's not very many-

Manual transmission is hard.

Yes, but there's not many that converge.

All-wheel drive and manual transmission.

You don't want it to be flashy.

I've solved all of that with my wild card and it's this, the GR Corolla.

Now you're going to be in the GR Corolla and you're going to think this interior isn't

very nice.

But you didn't spend very much.

You didn't spend very much.

And the thing is, this car is going to make you laugh all winter long.

You're looking for that car that you can drive through the worst of winter with a smile

on your face.

That's the GR Corolla.

Because the other thing you have to steal yourself against, and you kind of already have

talked about this, you have to steal yourself against the fact that this car is going to get

beat on.

That's what winters do to cars, winters are hard on cars.

This is a $30 to $40,000 bang around Corolla all-wheel drive rally beast.

This purpose is to be beat on like winter only can do, okay?

The fact that the interior is not that nice and it isn't.

The interior is a Corolla, it's not that nice.

But it has all the modern tech you're hoping for, so that's solved.

And then it has this kind of, it's a winter car, who cares, and yet you're having fun.

This is my wild card, but I feel pretty strongly about it.

The GR Corolla is the pallet cleanse that does everything you want, bang around winter,

four seats, four doors, all-wheel drive, manual, and still fun on the commute.

I give you the GR Corolla.

That's really good.

I didn't really see that coming.

That's really good.

That's why it's the wild card, because I don't know that it works, but I'm pretty proud

of it anyway.

I mean, see, it'll be used for all winter long, and then he'll hop in one of his 4 BMWs

or three or how many still have.

Three at that point.

Yeah, exactly.

But this is still fun in the summer.

Of course.

It's just going to be fun in general.

That's the thing.

It's a car that you might drive, period.

He does.

He'll have three BMWs.

I mean, they're really nice BMWs.

They are.

They're cool, but yeah.

He's not a BMW guy either.

I've heard that story.

I'm going to show you a different set of photos, because we aligned like crazy.

Oh, did we?

I am going to suggest the G70, because when I saw the G80, I thought you meant Genesis G80,

but no, you were referring to the chassis code of the M3.

Let's not do that because that's another BMW.

Yeah, it's another BMW case.

The G70 is superb to drive.

Yeah, Genesis G70 is great.

The 2.5, the base engine was 2.0, it is now the 2.5, lots of horsepower, 300-plus horsepower,

excellent car to drive, not a manual, but luxury, understated, and it's one of those

cars in the neighborhood, your neighbors are going to take notice of what's this.

It's luxury, but it's smart luxury.

Ooh, it's luxury, but you're savvy.

It's not ostentatious at all.

It's not the typical German flashy brand names, Mercedes BMW, that kind of thing.

Genesis, wow, interesting choice, and your neighbors are going to want rides, and you're

going to sell Genesis to other people in your neighborhood.

But we do move on.

Todd already covered it.

I am all about the CT4 or the CT5 black wing.

Yeah, they're good.

That's CT4 that is coming out in one of our Coda Road Trip films, and fantastic to drive.

I do think you'd really dig it, and it's such a different flavor, not BMW flavor.

For sure.

Moving on, I also chose the TLX Type S, I'm just showing you a different photo of it.

But it's still good.

It's still very good, yes.

The only reason I didn't approve the Integra was because of Frontwheel Drive, but it

is fantastic to drive.

He keeps bringing up manual as a thing, and that's the problem.

That's the reason that it worked.

It's hard to get all wheel drive to the manual transmission, and still fun is a difficult

list.

Yeah.

But this has super handling all wheel drive.

It drives very well.

It's super fun all wheel drive.

It really does work.

It's excellent to drive, and yeah, you can get the Tigray Pearl as cool blue, and yeah,

I think you'd really enjoy that.

And last on my list, before we get to the wild card, I wondered if you'd go here.

I did wonder about it, because I thought of it too, and I thought, I don't know, but I'm

glad you brought it up.

Like, talk about rowdy in a suit.

It's rowdy, but it's, oh, it's a Lexus, so it's understated, and then you can like, cold

start next to your, no, maybe not do that.

Creep out of the neighborhood before you really get on the throttle, but then it's like

ripping silk.

The Lexus IS-500 is, it's a rare car that still exists.

It would be cool if it had a manual, because then you could really have a Cadillac CT4 black

wing plus M3 plus Lexus comparison.

I'd like to shoot that film, actually, but this doesn't have a manual.

The engine deserves a manual.

The best part about the IS-500 is the V8, the V8 is great.

It's superb.

Everybody in your neighborhood, they will just say, oh, you just got a Lexus sedan, cool,

good on you, and then wait for the start up.

What is that now?

I'm sorry.

Which car did you buy?

I went to a completely different place with my wild card.

Okay, good.

Good.

And it is not available for sale quite yet, as of this recording, but I like it because

it is so different.

And I like it because Hyundai has leaned so heavily into the performance EV, and because

you've owned EVs, and this does appeal to you, I thought this could be really cool

to add to your collection.

Well, he brought up the Onyx 5-In, so the fact that you're bringing up the 6-In, it makes

sense.

Yeah.

That's the newest, that's the hot newness, that's the play.

I expect this to drive and be as entertaining as that 5-In.

Probably, yeah.

But the through line, you remember Hyundai hired all those BMW designers and engineers?

Yeah.

There you go.

So you got to have a BMW with a different badge.

Well done.

That's right.

Well done.

I didn't think about that, but you have just solved the BMW problem.

But it is.

It's good.

The styling says performance, but it says normal sedan.

It just says an elegant, normal sedan, it's not going to stand out.

The I-5-In is sort of like, what's that little hot rocket rocket thing, that's a little

different.

And this, I don't think your neighbors will notice too much, except in the performance

blue, which is the best color.

You can actually order a carbon fiber wing for this thing.

I mean, as you should.

Yeah.

No nuts, but that will feed your addiction to put new carbon bits on a car.

You can still do it with the I-6-N.

That is what I think you should consider.

Because again, you were really into it.

You had the Rivian, you had the Eagle.

You were interested.

I do think this could appeal, and it's the I-6-N.

Different style.

True.

This is my wild card for you.

Happy shopping.

Yeah.

You got to let us know what you get.

When you come time for the car conclusion, and you tell us that you've sold all the BMWs

or something.

Or at least one of them.

But see now, we're giving you opportunity to buy the swag from any of the car companies

that we've suggested.

Because you're not a BMW person, so there you go.

You have to buy a shirt from a different car company when you buy your next car that

is different, and not a BMW, because you probably have just an all-bmw closet.

Thanks for riding everyday driver TV at gmail.com right to us topic Tuesday's car conclusions

and car debates.

Jason W. is looking for garage advice.

He owns a 2021 Julia Quattifolio.

Very cool.

Daily road trips and a mechanically restored a 1971 Alpha GTV 1750 such a cool car.

Fun, but costly to take further, not road trip friendly, but a sweet car.

When you see one of those, they are very cool.

Yeah, they're very, very cool.

Jason is craving something new.

Maybe a Lotus Amira or a prior gen Aston convertible.

Is the vantage too close to the Julia?

Should he replace the Julia instead?

Jason wants a two-car setup.

The budget is $120,000 or $170,000 if he sells both.

That's a healthy budget.

I'm going to spend it.

I'm sure you are, yes.

What car beats the Julia in looks, feel and fun for a single guy who loves road trips and

canyon drives?

Also, he doesn't think he's ready for a Porsche yet.

He wants fun and exciting and different.

He'll settle for a Porsche when he's a little older.

So, Porsche's on for old people?

I think that's a fascinating assessment of Porsche, though.

It is.

Because he's saying that they're a little too staid for what he wants right now.

I mean, they're for all the people.

Well, that's the thing.

They are the default purchase for all the people.

And don't be wrong.

I've talked about it with, look at our problem with Porsche episode.

A lot of their branding, a lot of their cars aren't as interesting as you think they

are.

Their GT cars are awesome, but a lot of their cars aren't as crazy fun as exciting as

you might think.

I don't think this is fascinating where you talk about your two, you own two alphas.

Two.

Two alphas.

Two excellent alphas, by the way.

The Julia Quadrifoli was one of my all-time favorites, and I love that you drive it all

the time.

But the thing about the GTV that's fascinating is your assessment, your add-on here.

Fun, but costly to take further, not road trip friendly.

Now, if I take the first part of that fun, but costly to take further, I think what

you're saying is there's nothing more I can do to this.

I'm done, and the fact that you are willing to sell both cars says to me that that car

isn't a car you're willing to just start up and take.

You've gotten it as perfect as it's going to get, and you know that every time you drive

it, there's going to be a little something we're back to reliability again.

You've taken it as far as you can.

You say fun, but costly to take further.

That is not about road trips.

That's just period.

So I think it goes.

The Julia is really hard to replace because, I mean, look, we talked the black wings, we

talked this kind of stuff.

That's the only stuff that really is a contender to the Julia, but I actually don't think other

than the fact that the Cadillac's drive really, really well and the fact that you can get

a manual transmission.

I don't think they are more beautiful or drive better than the Julia Quadrifoli does.

And I like them a lot.

But prettier and drives better than the Julia Quadrifoli, I don't know that I'm there.

I like the Aston Martin idea.

I think I am.

I hope I'm there.

I think I can do it.

All right.

I like his Lotus Amira.

I think that's a great choice.

Of course, I own one.

So I have to say that.

I also wonder about the Mercedes GT, the prior gen, pick your flavor of that.

But I have your two car garage.

It's good.

You do.

The first one is you talked about Aston, get yourself one.

Get yourself an Aston Martin Van Dyck, the prior gen, the V8, manual, if you can pull

it off.

Look, I would say V12, but they're a lot more expensive and I've heard they don't drive

nearly as well as the eights do.

Like when you start to push them, you're a canyon carver guy.

You want something unique, interesting, new experience, which you are a car guy who likes

to road trip and do canyons.

I've got your two car garage.

Your 170 grand, you get yourself a prior gen Aston Martin Van Dyck V8 and a Lotus Evora

GT.

Oh, that's good.

The Evora GT is your track car, canyon car, and you could road trip it.

But it is a little hardcore for road tripping.

But it is manual transmission, mid engine, quirky and British, and doesn't look or drive

like anything else on the road.

But then if you want to be relaxed a little bit, you didn't get it obvious choice.

You got an Aston Martin Van Dyck V8, which everybody on the planet just thinks is sexy,

sounds good and is classy.

I love that both of your choices are British.

I love that.

Yes, I didn't expect that.

Tell me what.

You know what?

This is what you want to be.

The fact that you want to be unique is key to this discussion.

You've owned two Italian cars, two Alpha Ramayos.

Let's get two British cars that are very different to drive.

Yes.

Either one of these, you could road trip or track.

But let's be honest.

You want to road trip or go to a nice meal in the Aston Martin, and you want to actually

run the canyons and do a track day in the average GT.

Two cars.

So both your Alpha's get both of these.

I think you can do it both for your budget and be happy.

Wow.

Those are really excellent.

I really like these two.

I think that did it.

I do like your choices.

I'm going to give you the hard sell, Jason.

Because I think that there's, in all seriousness, a real case to be made for the Maserati GT.

I am listening.

The new Maserati Grand Turismo surprised both Todd and I in the way it drives.

By the way, have we mentioned that all the versions of this, the Modena, the Trofeo are

all-wheel drive.

And they have the new Netuno V6 twin turbo engine that I think is going to be fine.

I don't know that, but they're putting it in the Grecole SUV.

People are buying this engine.

And up to this point, I have heard no angry, sure, no rumors, no angry customers, like this

just doesn't work.

This is a pile of crap.

This is a fresh, clean start V6 engine with modern electronics, modern ECUs.

They didn't go get that engine from somewhere else, from Ferrari or somewhere else, and put

it in the car.

It is truly a Maserati engineered design developed, manufactured engine in their car.

And I think it's going to be just fine.

It's a pretty cool engine.

I think it'll just run.

And the way the car drives, it's like an overgrown GR86.

It's crazy that you say that, but I don't think you're wrong.

It drives so much better than it has any right to.

I'm throwing a yellow one up well.

I'm throwing Skittles Colors at you, Jason, so I'm throwing a yellow one up.

But there's also a deep red, sort of like a cranberry red.

I couldn't believe how well this thing drove.

And here's the crazy thing.

You might be getting there, but here's the thing.

These are really expensive until you go buy one, and they aren't moving them,

so the discounts are deep.

They're very deep.

Here's why I'm encouraged, because despite the woes that Stellantis is having,

they have steadfastly said they are not selling the Maserati brand.

It is also Italian, which I think appeals to you.

It is unique.

It is different.

You're not going to see yourself coming and going.

It is an excellent road trip car.

You can go canyon cruising with it.

Comfortable, fast, lots of power, head turning.

Let's take the badges off.

I think it's one of the sexier GT cars ever designed.

It does look really good, yeah.

Just the sketches alone make me want to own this car.

And then now combined with those deep discounts, the Modnas are kind of starting to get cheap.

The trofeos are not far behind.

The trofeos are the ones with extra power.

Either one I think you could do very well owning this, and pile the miles on.

I think the electronics, I think it's all going to be just fine.

I think it's going to be in the same category that we all wondered.

Who Alfa's coming back with the Julia, this new Juliet to US?

No, it's Alfa.

Ha ha.

Make all your Alfa jokes, and it's going to be not so great.

And then what was the car and driver and they discovered it was the battery not getting

enough, giving the electric pad a couple of owners to tell us that, yeah, for sure, yeah.

But we've also seen very high mileage, Alfa's, yes, Julia's.

Yes, for sure.

Wonderful.

There's of all kinds, 50, 80, 100,000 miles, they're doing fine.

So I think this new Maserati is in that category of, I think it's going to be great.

I think it'll be just fine.

It's just going to run.

It's going to be a lot of fun to drive.

Good idea.

I like it.

And I'm saving you money so you can, for your second car, go get yourself a Mazda MX-5

RF.

Ha ha ha.

That is your drop top.

That is your manual.

That is your very lightweight counterpart.

It is.

Your license tag can say Mazda Rade 1 and Mazda Rade 2.

Oh, no, please, no.

Funny, but no, no.

Please don't do that.

Mazda MX-5 and Miata RF, which is, stop, stop, sexy.

It's timeless.

It is timeless.

You're absolutely right.

RF is such a cool car and that's your drop top.

That's your take to the track.

I want a different flavor and that different flavor comes in the form of being very lightweight.

But there are two very different cars, even though they sort of, one's an overgrown

Miata.

One's a Miata, but they both drive really well and I think between these two, you'd have

trouble choosing on any given day which one do you want to get in and drive?

I love it.

I think it would be difficult.

You're talking about a Mazda Rade on a Mazda.

That is fantastic.

Yes.

Well done, my friend.

I love it.

That's great.

All right, so you have a choice.

Italian, British, got the Japanese car thrown in there too.

Definitely let us know.

EverydayDriverTV at gmail.com.

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For the first car conclusion, David's writing in just to kind of let us all know that we've

talked about it with the tariffs, with the EV pullback, with the discounts not happening

anymore for EV, the tax credits not happening.

There's some deals going on.

He actually has a weekend fun car that is a current gen GR86 that he loves.

He was shopping for a commuter.

He just got himself a lease deal on a 2025 brand new Volkswagen ID for pro all wheel drive

for $80 a month.

It was 2,000 down, 7,500 miles a year, 12 month lease.

He hasn't for a year at $80 a month.

He commutes about five miles to work.

So having only 7,500 miles when this was just going to be his commute car, it was like

and that is fantastic.

They are desperate to move them at his local Volkswagen dealer because they know the EV

tax credits are ending.

He was even given 500 kilowatt hours free charging from elect fire America, which is going

to be the equivalent of 8 to 10 charges.

So maybe 1,500 of his 7,500 miles are going to be free miles.

Unbelievable.

So if you're shopping for an electric commuter right now, now is your time friends.

He was just writing and letting us know that, David, I think that's amazing.

Well done, David.

Moving on to car conclusion number two, Thomas R gives us the longest time for a car conclusion

way back from episode number 249.

That's a long time ago, yeah.

He wrote to us back in 2017 about getting rid of his 2016 forerunner and replacing it

with something more comfortable and exciting.

He's a long time listener.

Thank you, Thomas.

Really appreciate it.

Thank you.

It took him a long time for the opportunity to have a fun car in his life.

He's got one son now.

Congratulations.

He really wants to show him his interest and maybe spark car interest of his own.

OK.

Although he's young, he currently only cares about monster trucks.

That's a stage.

Which is a good one.

He says he writes this maybe for some of those others that dream but don't or can't currently

act.

He says it is never too late.

A few months ago, Thomas bought a project in 1983, 944.

Oh my gosh.

He has a thing for old Porsche's 914's and 912's and he's owned it.

It looks like he's owned those cars and he actually fits in the 944.

He's got low miles for the year, 78,000 miles and has barely been driven in the last 20

years.

The car was supposed to be a driving project however he finds himself with the entire

drive train on his garage floor at the moment.

He says getting the clutch in the transactional car is not easy.

Tell me about it.

And it leads to many other side jobs on a 40 plus year old car.

Now Thomas, I read this and the more I read it, the more I shook my head, I have to say.

Because we started with you were looking for something to replace your four runner that

was more comfortable and exciting to drive.

You then wanted to buy something to get your son excited about being in a fun car.

And the result is a car that can't be driven that is now parts on your garage.

Now I love that you're excited about it and I am thrilled about that reality but I really

hope you get this car running soon because so far we have, even though you have a conclusion

for a car you bought, you haven't actually closed the gap to find something either more

comfortable or more exciting to drive or that gets your son excited about driving.

You have introduced him to project cars, by the way, and I'm not sure if that's good

or bad influence but at the moment this is a will run great win works.

Yeah, but Thomas writes he's still as excited as the day he bought it.

That's awesome.

Eager to get it on the road.

Which is amazing.

He's on the East Coast.

I think he'd be ready for a tale of the dragon trip.

Life might get in the way, but he wanted to inspire others to make a bad decision.

I do love that.

That's what this shows all about, honestly, yeah.

And you know how we were talking about keeping cars running forever.

Thomas, that's what you're doing.

That's true.

By buying this old car and having the entire transactional drive on your garage floor, I understand

I have been there.

It was somebody else's garage floor, a buddy that helped me out with my 928 rebuild.

I get it.

You feel like you're keeping something alive.

That's true.

And you know what?

As your son gets older and you guys get into this, you're going to have to keep

it maintained.

I mean, you have to do all the heavy lifting right now, but when he starts to drive, this

is going to be your legacy.

This is going to be you handing it to him at some point.

Maybe it's his first car.

Who's he there?

Nobody thinks that way anymore.

Nobody buys a project car of a 40-year-old car and thinks, you know what, maybe my kid

is going to want this car and enjoy it.

It doesn't always happen.

Don't put this pressure on Port Thomas.

I do have to say, though, I think it's awesome, though.

If you go from parts in your garage that your son sees to a running car that your son

sees and rides in, even if he's not a car person going forward, that's going to make an impression.

By the way, Thomas at FCP Euro, they've got a lot of parts for you.

They do it.

They've got a lot of parts.

That's where to get all the parts for your car to get it running.

We encourage you to get that thing running as soon as possible, but I know it takes time

to get the right parts.

FCP Euro will have those for you, but then once you do, that will make it last forever.

I mean, that's where we start on the podcast as long as you keep maintaining it, theoretically,

the car will keep running.

We'll just see how likely that really is.

Episode 249 was where we discussed the Tesla semi, which is actually out in limited quantities,

and the Tesla Roadster, which is very much not out.

Where is that thing?

And do we care?

Well, and is it relevant?

All of these things, when the Avaya is blowing down records, is the Roadster going to be that

much faster?

I can't imagine how much will the Roadster cost?

Well, yeah.

And what happened to the Tesla?

Even if it's less.

Even if it's the people that gave him a quarter million dollars 15 years ago at unbelievable

10 and 10 at least, anyway.

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Moving on to audience questions, you guys had a lot of really good questions I want to

first start off here with Trevor in Pasadena says, name some new cars that would be much

more desirable if there weren't so many of them.

They weren't just so darn common.

Exclusivity didn't matter to him earlier in life, but now it really does.

Sometimes he prefers to buy a car that he knows is worse than the competitor, just because

it's rarer and it makes him want it more.

What cars do you think would be more desirable if they weren't so common?

I have three that may surprise you, but I really pondered this, and I think I have three

cars that if you saw less of them, we would all be more wowed by them.

Okay.

And I realize what I'm about to say is a little bit about our part of the country and what

we see here, but I thought of three excellent cars that because they're so common, we just

look right by them.

The 911, not the GT3 versions, just 911 Porsche, like a base model, just a 911 of any era,

just 911.

Anything if not a GT model, while they are excellent cars, how often do we as general

car people go, ah, it's a 911, I think it depends on the area, the country living,

to some degree, not that often.

For the reverse area of the country, a base Corvette, a current C8 Corvette.

If they weren't that common, and I'll give you the perfect example for why.

When we went to Europe this past year, our friends at RSR have a C8 in the fleet.

That's right.

That's a good example.

There's a C of GT3 911 sitting at this track day, and the car that all of the Europeans

are taking a picture of is the base Corvette because they never see it.

If Corvettes were rare, we'd all be going, ah, they're going to Corvette.

I saw two on my way to your house today, two Corvettes, and while they're cool looking,

I saw two.

My point is, if you rarely ever saw them, you'd be like, ah, that was the C8, that was

the mid engine, did you see it?

There was the mid engine Corvette right now.

I mean, it happened when it was new, yes.

The last one is the current Gen Prius, okay, they're taxi cabs, a thousand of them

on your commute this morning, but it's a very good looking car that drives surprisingly

well and actually does its build sheet perfectly.

It's car appliance that has technology and is a good commuter, seats aren't great,

that gets fantastic gas mileage, and as a result, they're ubiquitous, and so we look

right past them, but the truth is, it's still all of those things.

It's just there's too many, and that guy's got one as a taxi cab.

That's really good.

Trent writes to us on email, he's been away from driving a manual and just got another

as his daily.

He's discovering he doesn't think he was ever actually good at driving a manual.

We're all learning, man.

We're all learning.

Well, you're constantly.

He says he doesn't have any problems with all the functions, but he's not smooth at

all home.

He doesn't think this has to do with lack of recent practice, and his memory is that

he was always this clunky.

He's just missing something fundamental and probably has a lot of bad habits.

So where would we point someone like Trent, who wants to get better at this, and he's

not talking about heel toeing or double clutching, he just wants to shift more smoothly.

He's watched a few YouTube videos, and they've pointed out a couple of his misconceptions,

but where can he go, just simply to work on this?

Now Trent, it sounds like you've got the manual already.

You're not asking to learn manual on someone's car, so I feel like anybody that is willing

to sit with you and teach you, but you mentioned misconceptions, and that tells

me right away there's the approach, the way you think of it, and maybe just the fundamentals

of understanding the mechanics of how things work.

Maybe that's the place to start, so you're always thinking about this mechanical thing

moving as you are doing it.

You could any car club.

I think there's probably more people than you would realize that would happily and readily

ride shotgun with you in your own car and give you their tips from ask it around at

cars and coffee.

The next car show you're at, hey, you've got a cool manual, hey, would you mind teaching

me sometime a little bit more, so I get a little bit smoother?

I bet you that people would be more than willing because people love to share their knowledge

on stuff like that.

They know you're not paying them, they wouldn't take a dollar, but to impart their wisdom

to share their knowledge, I think they'd be more than happy whether it's forums, cars

and coffee, your own friends, Abbetia that people would be willing to share that with you.

You know what?

Actually, the more differentiated that instruction is, I think the broader your knowledge base

would be.

That's very good.

Very good.

Not just watching YouTube videos.

Very good.

Because somebody isn't personalizing it for you.

True.

That's excellent.

Trent, I'm going to add to that and say this.

I'm actually in the process of my son is learning to drive.

I'm watching him drive manual.

I'm trying to help him get better, okay?

He's driven the Elise and he's driven the Amira as well, which is a staggeringly spoiled

child.

But anyway, the point is he's driven both of those manually drives in both very differently.

They're very different cars and you're saying here, you don't want to learn heel, toe,

or double clutching, but you know the reality Trent is, yeah, you do, you're wanting to learn

all this stuff.

True.

The thing you want to be is better and smoother, and the greatest thing about this is the

car's your daily.

So it gives you constant opportunity to refine stuff.

And I'm going to tell you one thing that I'm actually talking to my son about a lot that

I hope will help you when I realize was not taught to me.

And I've had to remember this as I've taught my son on a manual.

The clutch and the gas pedal are not on off switches.

That's good.

And they're also not single use devices.

That's good.

Okay.

I want you to play with how much throttle you're giving, how much clutch you're releasing,

and how long you're doing those two things.

And you may have some times when you do it wrong and you're just like, yeah, I really

dragged the clutch and now I smell it.

You may have that again.

I'd be like, I thought I was past that.

But what you're trying to do is find nuance to the way you release the clutch.

It's not just one quick fast movement.

It was all the clutches in and now it's out.

It's not how it works.

There's nuance.

I notice when I drive, because I started to really think this through on all of my cars

that I have, when I drive, there are stages to how I'm releasing the clutch.

There's a, I'm finding the catch point.

I'm rolling through the catch point and then I'm rolling out of the pedal at the top.

So I've got stages.

There's at no point is my foot doing one singular motion from fully clutch in to fully

clutch out.

And neither is the gas pedal.

There's a constant kind of balance and dance going on in the car's attitude and the amount

of rev that you have in the engine and all of this may make every shift a little different.

So what I want you to do is feather both, stay in both longer.

And when you are shifting up to the next gear, I'm talking going up now.

Should you give it a little bit of throttle?

Does that help the shift go quicker, even though you're still going up?

When you're coming down, do you want to flip the throttle even though you're not breaking

just to feel the fact that oh, I did match that there.

You're just trying to get as little shudder as possible out of the drive line.

And the more you don't treat those two pedals as on off, the more you'll get there.

I think that's excellent.

There's also that point where you need to sort of pause.

Yes.

And you feel that clutch engage.

It's not always just a smooth release.

It's you're kind of pausing about halfway through that travel and you feel everything

kind of mesh and engage and then you roll onto the, onto the gas pedal because that's a big

problem I actually had with Bowie because he was he wasn't doing a pause in the middle.

And so we were having this kind of, he was trying to almost catch the car every single

takeoff.

And I was like, there is a pause point that you can feel when the car is starting to engage,

just give it a beat and then now roll out.

So just play with the two.

Let's see on Facebook, Adrian Lane's got a question on leather dash care.

He picked up a 2024 Julia 2.0 with a leather dash.

Congratulations.

He says in his knowledge of Porsche, he learned that they can fail.

Sure enough, there's a few reports of Alpha's failing.

It doesn't have a garage, so he tinted the windshield and he's using a sunshade.

That's excellent.

Very good.

How often should he use and what grills product should he use to keep it fresh?

They've got leather cleaner and leather care.

It sounds like your car is probably new enough.

Leather cleaner is really designed for seats that have been used for years and it's trying

to get a lot of the dirt that's been worked into the leather, trying to get that out.

And then leather care is a consistent usage.

Now remember that it's on the dashboard.

So it also depends on the quality of the supplier and the glue that actually mounts that piece

of leather to the instrument panel itself.

If the glue fails, there isn't enough product that you can put on to do that.

So eventually you can get it restretched or you can have an upholster or probably repair

that.

But definitely regular leather care use, because again, it doesn't sound like you need

to do any deep cleaning.

So usage of the leather care because that will enable that leather to stretch as it heats

and cools.

It'll allow it to kind of in the sun.

It'll kind of keep it from getting too brittle.

It'll keep it supple.

So that's my recommendation.

Zach was asking us, how do you avoid the sick of driving feeling on long road trips through

parts of the drive that aren't fun?

Well, Zach, if you've noticed, we take a few road trips.

So this is relevant.

Actually, I'll tell you the thing that transformed it for me and that was audiobooks.

It's good.

I discovered them in college and I've been a big believer in them ever since.

I mean, granted podcasts, obviously help as well.

But something that occupies your brain, and I'm such a story guy anyway, I love actually

having an audiobook.

When you're doing that thing where it's just like, I'm going to do the next 300 miles

and a mostly straight line at cruise control, that's no fun.

But you want to get through it because your brain is simultaneously occupied by doing

a story.

Keep driving, keep paying attention, but that is the way that I get through it all the

time is audiobooks.

I find that music doesn't work as well.

Podcasts can be great.

Yeah, but music can get, yeah, depends on what you're listening to, I guess.

The thing I find about an audiobook, the reason that it helps me is because audiobooks

I get the long ones.

It takes so long to get somewhere when an audiobook is 8, 12, 20 hours long that that seems

to reduce the sense of, I've only gone another 10 miles because it's, my brain has decided

to be engaged in something for a long distance because the audiobook is a long thing and so

the fact that I may be driving for the next five hours is less of an issue.

That's what helps me.

I found that switching audiobooks midstream also weirdly helps because your brain is already

in the trajectory of where that book, that storyline is going.

Sure.

At the next gas station, your next fill up and you look at that, I like it, break it.

Start in on the other one that you've been listening to and make your brain rethink,

you're on, it changes everything.

That's good.

It's like the tunnel vision that you get on the highway, you got to break out of it

and you're in the zone and then you know you're going to get back in your car and have

something totally different and fresh.

That's good.

So you're breaking it up between rest stops, listening to two books or something.

That's crazy.

I actually did, I didn't break them up, but I actually had one really long road trip once

where I did three different audiobooks in one road trip, back to back to back.

And about a week later, I really couldn't remember which story was which.

I was like, I have no idea what's just going on.

Anyway, style is writing in from Norway, thank you for writing in again.

He said the other night, he and his girlfriend, shouting out to his girlfriend, Linda,

were watching something on TV and then he turned the TV over and put on from our YouTube

channel, our recent Alpine A110 C806 episode on the big screen in the house and she looked

at him and said, those guys again, and he was like, you know, it's a road trip episode.

I think it'll be cool.

Just let's just try it.

She's like, all right, we'll try it.

And when it was over, she said, why don't we take a drive tomorrow, which I think is

a victory and really, really cool.

And so I'm expecting you went out for a nice drive for lunch.

You took your 1998 SLK, you just got that's meant for an eight hour drive.

Unbelievable.

Hi, it's all due both for taking a drive that much.

I love that we were any part of inspiration in that and thank you for watching.

But I think it's amazing that you did the Norwegian Swedish border through mountains

for small towns and loved it and I love that you did it in that car.

But man, why don't we take a drive tomorrow?

I did not expect to be an eight hour adventure.

Bravo to you guys.

That's amazing.

Richard Demiano on Instagram, he's been with us on many trips, adventures, asks if the

true purpose of the GT car is for the driver to go as fast as they want and the passenger

to be blissfully unaware because they are costeted in luxurious quietness and comfort.

Yes, the GT car is designed to distract your passengers so much from the speedometer

that they'd never notice how fast you're going and suddenly, I don't know why we shaved

30 minutes off our arrival time.

The only problem is people like Ferrari go and put the actual dash, yeah, the extra screen

on the passenger side and now they could pull up the dash that they couldn't see otherwise.

It's over and turn it off.

Yes, turn it off.

Yeah, you need to have like driver silence mode.

I was doing this.

It was probably put on for that exact reason.

Exactly why I was put on.

Yeah.

For friends, spouses to know.

Yeah, how fast are you going?

How fast are we going?

Are we still on the route?

Yep.

Guys, thank you for all your questions.

Really appreciate it.

Right to us.

EverydayDriverTV.gmail.com for all your topic Tuesday's car conclusions, the car debates

and then on social media, Facebook and Instagram, we'll continue to post photos from our

trip as those pieces come out and press cars that we drive.

Really appreciate all your interaction.

Please let us know how you're consuming the podcast and we really appreciate any feedback

that you have on it.

Looking forward to next time.

As always, cheers everyone.

Unreliable Or Expensive, The Definition Of A BMW Enthusiast, Getting Better At Driving Manuals | Episode 1,006

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