The Polestar 4 is an electric car from Polestar with a sleek, coupe-like shape. Here, the hosts are talking about a lease promotion and how incentives can lower the monthly cost.
Term
lease from $399 a month for 39 months
This is a lease offer structure: the monthly payment is quoted ($399/month) and the lease term is specified (39 months). Lease deals like this often depend on assumptions about the car’s residual value and incentives, so the same car can look very different under different lease terms.
This is a customer loyalty discount for people who already own a Polestar. The hosts say it can add an extra $1,000 toward your lease payments.
Term
putting like this $19,000 on the hood for leases
“Money on the hood” means the seller is adding a big discount to the deal. In this case, it’s specifically for lease offers, so it can make the monthly payment cheaper.
Winding down US operations means the company is scaling back or leaving the US market. When that happens, they may offer bigger discounts or lease deals to sell what’s left.
Car
Polestar 4
The Polestar 4 is an all-electric Polestar SUV/crossover. Here they’re talking about lease pricing and which versions are available, including a dual-motor setup and a package of driver-assist features.
A dual-motor EV has two electric motors instead of one. That usually helps the car feel quicker and grip better, and here it’s the version that’s hardest to find at the advertised price.
The Pilot Pack is an add-on package that includes safety/driver-assist features. In this case, it includes lane-keeping help, and cars with the package cost more on the lease listings.
Lane Keep Assist is a safety feature that helps the car stay in its lane. It uses sensors to detect lane markings and can gently steer to keep you from drifting.
Bigger wheels are when the car is equipped with larger rims and often different tires. They can make the car look sportier and can affect how it rides, and here they’re mentioned as an option that costs extra.
A Polestar store is the brand’s retail/service touchpoint where customers buy and arrange support. The host is emphasizing that the store you purchase from may be the one coordinating service going forward.
A service plan is a promise about who will fix and maintain the car and what’s covered. The host is saying you should get that promise in writing before you commit to the purchase.
A Volvo dealer is a regular car dealership that can do repairs and maintenance. Here, they’re saying you may be able to get Polestar service handled through a Volvo dealer if the deal includes a service plan.
Geely is a big Chinese auto company that owns parts of Volvo and Polestar. The host is basically saying that because of that connection, service and support might be easier to sort out.
A lease deal is when you pay to drive a car for a few years instead of buying it outright. The monthly price can look great, but you still have rules like mileage limits and what you owe at the end.
Term
fine, fine tooth
They’re warning you to read the fine print in the deal. Lease offers can look cheap, but the small details can add costs or add conditions you have to meet.
Term
asterisks
“Asterisks” are the footnotes on ads that explain the deal’s conditions. If you skip them, you might miss extra requirements or fees that change what you actually pay.
Term
MSP
MSP is a baseline price number the manufacturer uses. It helps you compare deals more fairly—especially when a lease payment looks low but the overall price or fees might be higher.
Concept
Polestar pulling out of the US market
This means Polestar might stop selling in the US. The host thinks that could lead to better deals, but you should also worry about whether service and support will still be available.
The Polestar 3 is an all-electric SUV. In this episode, they’re talking about newer versions of it—especially changes to the electrical system and software—so it can charge and drive better than older setups.
“400 volt” is the electrical system voltage inside the EV. It affects how the car handles power and charging—higher voltage systems usually let the car charge faster.
“800 volts” means the EV uses a higher-voltage electrical system. That can help the car pull more power during charging, which is why high-voltage EVs often charge faster.
“Rear biased” means the car sends more drive power to the back wheels than the front. That can make the car feel more stable and fun when you accelerate or turn.
“Computers replaced” means the car’s main electronic control hardware was swapped. That can help the EV run better—like improving how it controls power and charging.
Leasing means you rent the car for a few years and return it at the end. The host’s point is that leases are often clearer about what you’ll owe up front and over the term.
Rivian makes electric vehicles, including trucks and SUVs. Here it’s mentioned as another EV brand you can buy more directly, without the same dealership hassle.
Dealerships are the traditional retail channel where buyers negotiate pricing, trade terms, and add-ons. The host describes them as a high-anxiety environment (“snake pit”) and contrasts that with direct-from-company EV buying.
A 24-month lease means you’re renting the truck for two years. The host prefers it because it can reduce how much tax you end up paying over the life of the deal.
“Zero down” sounds like you pay nothing upfront for the lease. But the host says you’ll still likely pay some money up front for taxes, fees, and extras.
Dealer fees are extra charges the dealership adds when you sign. The host is saying these can make a “zero down” lease not actually be $0 at the dealership.
Taxes can change the real cost of a lease. The host is saying that with a shorter lease, you may end up paying less tax overall.
Concept
re-register the car
Re-registering means renewing your car’s legal paperwork with the state. The speaker is frustrated because even if the tax term is shorter, you may still have to pay again when the state’s registration renewal comes due.
MSRP (Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Price) is the sticker price automakers publish as the baseline for what the vehicle costs before taxes and fees. The speaker uses it to frame how expensive California registration fees can be for a higher-priced vehicle.
Pro-rated means you get charged or refunded based on the fraction of time you used. If you only had it for part of the period, you should only pay for that part.
Term
expired tax
Expired tax means the vehicle’s tax period is over and the payment is no longer current. The speaker is saying California has some unusual rules where, for certain lease returns, the manufacturer/bank may handle it instead of the driver.
The GMC Sierra is a big pickup truck from GMC (part of General Motors). Here it’s mentioned because the speaker is talking about how rules like warranty timing work when a truck is used as a loaner.
A vehicle warranty is the manufacturer’s coverage for repairs for a limited time. The speaker’s point is that the warranty should start when the car is put into service for the actual owner, not when it was sitting around as a loaner.
The in-service date is the date the manufacturer treats as the start of your warranty. It’s usually when the car is officially yours and put into use, not when it was first handled by the dealership.
The GMC Sierra EV is an electric version of the GMC Sierra pickup truck. It’s basically the electric “Sierra” you’d compare to the electric Silverado, and the hosts talk about how big the battery is and how far it can go on a charge.
A battery pack is the large group of battery cells inside an electric vehicle that stores electrical energy for driving. Its size (often measured in kilowatt-hours) strongly affects how far the truck can go per charge, which is why the hosts immediately connect it to range.
“Miles range” means how many miles the electric truck can drive on a full charge. Your actual number can change depending on how you drive and conditions like temperature and speed.
“Efficiency standpoint” means how well the truck uses its battery to go a certain distance. If it’s more efficient, it can usually travel farther before needing to recharge.
A gooseneck trailer is a type of trailer hitch where the connection point sits higher, usually in the truck bed. The trailer sits more securely for heavy loads, but electric trucks often have batteries under the bed, which can make this hitch setup harder.
Term
GV RW
GVWR is the maximum weight the trailer (or vehicle) is rated to handle safely. It matters because it tells you whether a truck can tow the load without exceeding its limits.
This is a Ford F-350, a heavy-duty truck that’s commonly used for towing and hauling. The hosts are saying it’s been doing the job for a long time, so they’re looking for an electric truck that can replace it.
The Ford F-100 is an older style pickup truck. Pickup trucks are built for hauling and towing, and the F-100 is known for being a classic work truck. In the podcast context, it’s being discussed as part of a hauling story—who’s doing the work and what gets moved.
A gooseneck hitch is the special connection that lets a gooseneck trailer attach to the truck. The problem for electric trucks is that the battery is often under the bed, so there may not be safe space to mount the hitch the usual way.
Frame rails are the strong metal parts under a truck that hold everything together and support heavy towing gear. If an electric truck doesn’t have the same frame layout, it can be harder to mount a heavy hitch the usual way.
Unibody construction means the car’s body is doing most of the structural work, not a separate heavy frame. For towing, that can change where you can safely mount things like a gooseneck hitch—especially when the battery is under the bed.
The Silverado EV is Chevrolet’s electric pickup. In this segment, they’re talking about whether it can tow like a diesel farm truck, and how the towing rating depends on the exact work-truck version.
“5WT” is a particular work-truck version of the Silverado EV. The host is saying the towing rating depends on the trim, so you have to pick the right one to get the maximum trailer weight.
Gross trailer rating is the maximum total weight your trailer is allowed to be when you tow it. The host is saying some versions of the truck can tow less than others, so you have to match the rating to your trailer’s needs.
Kilowatt-hours (kWh) tell you how big the battery is—basically how much energy it can store. More kWh usually means more potential range and the ability to handle longer work sessions.
EPA range is the official estimate of how many miles an EV can drive on one full charge, based on standardized testing. Real-world range can be different, but it’s a useful baseline for planning.
Term
outlets to plug this to power tools
They’re talking about built-in power outlets in the truck. That means you can plug in tools directly, which is handy when you’re working in the field and don’t have easy access to power.
A front trunk (often called a frunk) is extra storage at the front of an EV. Since there’s no engine there like in a gas truck, you can use that space for tools or supplies.
GVWR means “maximum total weight” your truck is rated to handle. It includes the truck and what you’re carrying, and it’s used to judge whether your towing setup is legal.
A CDL is a special driver’s license for certain commercial driving and heavy towing. If your truck-and-trailer setup is over the state’s limits, you may need one to drive legally.
A fifth-wheel is a trailer hitch style where the trailer connects to a special plate in the truck bed. It’s common for RVs, and its weight rating affects whether you need extra licensing.
Brinkley is the brand of the RV trailer they’re towing. The important part is that the RV has its own weight rating, which affects whether the whole setup is legal.
Connecticut is where the speaker says their setup would be over the legal limit and would require a CDL. It’s an example of how towing rules can depend on where you’re driving.
Florida is mentioned because the towing/license rules can differ by state. The speaker suggests that even if it’s not “commercial” in one sense, the way it’s used could still require a CDL.
They’re referring to Ford’s F-250 and F-350 heavy-duty trucks. The point is that towing legally at high ratings usually requires a truck in this heavier class.
Texas is mentioned as a state that can be strict about towing rules. The host says they may focus on the official weight ratings on the truck and trailer, not just the real-world weight.
A fifth wheel is a towing hitch used for heavier trailers. The hitch setup mounts in the truck bed and the trailer locks onto it, so you need to respect your truck’s towing and weight ratings.
The Hyundai IONIQ 5 is an all-electric Hyundai crossover. Here, the host is saying the cheapest/new versions aren’t the best deal because they have a smaller battery and don’t hold their value as well as better-equipped used ones.
The Ford Model A is an older car from Ford’s early days. It’s not like modern electric or gas cars you’d drive today—parts and maintenance can be very different. If someone brings it up, it’s usually because of its classic status and the importance of finding a good condition example.
The Tesla Model 3 is an electric car. The host likes the Long Range version because it’s a great all-around EV, and they mention that older ones often already have Autopilot features, with an option to pay for more advanced driving-assist later.
Term
highway speeds degrade cold weather range
EV range can drop in cold weather because the battery and cabin need extra energy, and efficiency worsens. The host also points out that driving at highway speeds increases energy use, further reducing the usable range in winter conditions.
Residual value is basically how much the car is expected to be worth later. If a car has low residual value, it usually means it will be worth less when you go to sell or trade it in.
Autopilot is Tesla’s set of driver-assist features that can help the car steer and control speed in some situations. It’s not full self-driving, but it can reduce workload on long drives.
The Equinox EV is Chevrolet’s electric SUV. The host thinks it’s a good choice, but says it charges slower than some competitors—though that’s less of a problem if you charge at home with a Level 2 charger.
Level 2 charging is the common home EV charger that uses a 240-volt outlet. It’s usually much faster than plugging into a regular wall outlet, so you can charge enough for daily driving.
Standard range means the EV has a smaller battery. You’ll usually get fewer miles per charge than the long-range version, but it can still work well for everyday commuting.
Term
Pro or an XLT
Pro and XLT are different versions (trim levels) of the Ford F-150 Lightning. Different trims include different equipment, so the host is warning that the cheaper ones may not have every convenience/safety feature.
The Hyundai Kona is a small SUV/crossover. Some versions are electric, meaning they run on a battery instead of gas. It’s mentioned alongside other EVs because people compare options based on range and price.
FSD means “Full Self-Driving,” a Tesla software option. They’re saying you might not need the most advanced version if simpler lane help is what you care about.
Lane centering is a feature that helps the car stay in the middle of your lane. The hosts think it can reduce mistakes when you’re tired or driving the same route every day.
E-GMP is the shared “electric car design” platform Hyundai and Kia use across multiple EV models. They’re saying cars built on it tend to offer similar driver-assist features like lane centering.
That’s a warranty promise for the car’s main electric battery, measured in years and miles. The point here is that even a used IONIQ 5 may still be covered for a long time.
A drivetrain warranty covers the big power-related parts that help move the car. They’re bringing it up to show that buying used can still leave you with strong coverage.
The basic warranty is the standard coverage that protects you from certain repairs for a set time and mileage. They’re using it to argue that a used EV can still be covered similarly to a new gas car.
The Ford F-150 Lightning is an electric pickup truck. The hosts are discussing how far it can go on a charge and how that changes what you should pay for one.
The Ferrari F50 is a very rare, very fast sports car made by Ferrari. It’s usually expensive to buy and maintain because it’s a special, limited-production vehicle. People often talk about it in terms of price and how hard it is to find one in good condition.
This is a battery problem where some small parts inside the battery don’t stay balanced with the others. When the cells get out of sync, the whole battery pack can lose performance sooner than you’d expect.
Ground-mounted solar panels are installed on the ground instead of on a roof. Where they’re placed can help them capture more sunlight, which is important when you’re charging an EV off-grid.
LIVE
Today, we'll recommend an EV for Jason, who's looking for a pickup truck with big towing
capacity, a highway cruiser for David, who has a 90 mile commute, and helps Sarah and
Marcus decide if a Rivian R1T is the right vehicle for their specific situation.
Welcome to Battery Bargains, where we shortcut your search for the perfect EV.
This is episode number 59.
I'm Dominic Ioni.
Joining me today is Dave Connor from the Elvispec Dave channel, along with Andrew
Lambrecht from Evercars, a used EV buying platform with actual physical locations.
So if you'd like your own EV recommendation, send us an email at hello at battersincludedpodcast.com,
telling us your needs and budget, and we'll feature your case on an upcoming episode.
All right, so I guess let's kick things off with our deal of the week.
So, so far our deals, deals of the week have been used EVs less than three years old, with under
30,000 miles and a price tag under $30,000. So this week, we're going a little off script
and looking at a new vehicle, but we're not going to recommend that you buy it.
Instead, we're going to recommend that you lease this one.
And that's because our deal of the week, and let me see if I have this up here,
is a Polestar 4. And that is the new one.
It should be up there now. Right. Yeah, Polestar 4 coupe lease.
All right. And you can see here in the corner, if you're watching us on YouTube,
it says lease from $399 a month for 39 months. This is a $1,000 down deal.
And also, right, so if you are a current Polestar owner, they have another $1,000 they can lay into
your monthly payments or whatever. So this is our deal because the company will be winding down
its US operations at the end of the year. It's putting like this $19,000 on the hood for leases,
plus another $1,000 if there's already a Polestar vehicle in your household.
There actually, if you buy them, they're putting I think $25,000 on it, but that's a whole different
kettle of fish. Like when you talk to Dave about buying cars, one of the things he always brings
up, and this is such a great piece of advice, but always have your exit strategy in mind.
And so exiting from owning a Polestar a few years from now, when there's no Polestar
dealers around or anything, might be a tricky situation, but if you're leasing it,
there's no problems, right? You can just send it back to them, or maybe they'll make you
with some kind of crazy deal to keep it, but you can make those decisions like down the road.
Yeah, so that means, so for $399 a month, that gives you a real drive Polestar 4,
but there is a slightly problem out there. That's a dual motor. That's $399.
Well, this is a dual motor on the screen, and that's the exact problem here, because as you can
see, this one says these from $6.76 a month. So the word went out about this deal like a week ago,
or just about a week ago, and I feel like any single motor, a dual drive Polestar 4 in the
country are gone, because they were like $31,000 basically, right? Or $399 a month. But I believe
there's a shipment coming. I mean, you could call your Polestar 4 and see what kind of information
they can give you, but I was under the impression there was a couple thousand more Polestar 4s
on their way here from, they make them in South Korea actually, they sort of make them in South
Korea, so they could get around the majority of the big tariffs on imported cars, right?
But that didn't really work out so well for them. But anyway, the truth of the matter is that really,
it's a $499 a month, at least if you can find the right vehicle. So you can change this price
from low to high, and you should be able to find a dual motor for $499 a month. And that's
comes with the pilot pack, so that's your lane keep assist and all that kind of stuff is in there.
But not a whole lot of extra options, but you can, as you can see, if we scroll down here,
you can get the cars with more options, pilot pack. These could have bigger wheels or
a few different options, maybe different paint colors that cost money. That's why the prices
are a little higher. But yeah, you can get to, I saw some with performance versions and pilot pack
and a few different things. So the prices can get up pretty high a month, but if you're looking
for that bargain, the bargain is $499 for the dual motor or $399 for the single motor.
But then again, also, I don't know if I would do this if I didn't live somewhere close to a
Polestar store or a Volvo store that currently houses a Polestar dealer, basically,
because that's for all intents and purposes, that's probably who's going to be doing the
service on your Polestar going forward. So before you pull the trigger on something like this,
make sure the store you're buying it from them. You got to get from them a commitment that
they have a service plan for you. You can take it to the Volvo dealer and they will
take on that service load. There's been mixed messages coming from Volvo, I think, but
they both kind of have ownership by Geely in the big Chinese conglomerate.
So they should be able to work something out, I would hope. I don't know. What do you think about
this, Dave? Yeah, I mean, I wouldn't worry too much about the service. They'll figure it out.
The thing that I would have just cautioned you on is I think what we're trying to do is put you in
the camp of here's a cheap lease deal. But until you sit down with the dealership and go through
the fine, you know, fine tooth, all of the details, you know, these asterisks scare me,
you know, at least from 499 month with the little one up there. So what does that actually mean?
So, you know, they're putting a lot of money on the hood, which is great, even without the $7,500
down because these are not cheap cars. I mean, what's the MSP on a Polestar 4 dual motor?
Like, they're $670,000? Yeah, it's a lot of money. So, you know, so, but keep in mind,
you're going to have to put, you know, put down tax or, I don't know, apologies for my
instant message going off. That was your ringer? Yeah. But, you know, just if you're interested
in a Polestar, there is a little bit of noise, but be opportunistic about it. If Polestar is
pulling out of the US market, smell the blood in the water and go have the conversation with
the dealership. It's a great car. I mean, I happen to think it's, you know, this is the one without
the rear window, right? You got the camera in the back. It's kind of funky, but it's a cool car.
But yeah, I mean, just be careful and until you actually sit down with them and go over and see
what the numbers are, do your due diligence, figure out what it is, and then you'll be able to, you
know, this just gives you that ballpark. Here's where it is, $399, $499 a month. But those asterisks
are really, they're going to be something to be concerned about. They also have the Polestar 3,
which is the nicer one. But those are at $579 a month and the down payment, I believe it's,
no, there's a big down payment involved here. It's $5,000, $4,000, $5,000. No,
it's in here somewhere. But yeah, it's a lot more, $5,000 down.
The only other thing I'd add is whatever the deal is that they say, okay, don't just think
that's the deal, right? Say, if you really want to make a deal here, you know, talk to them about
maybe they'll even go, these guys are going to be in the business of selling these cars.
And while some of those rear wheel drive Polestar 4s, you know, the real cheapo ones,
maybe are gone, whether or not they're getting another shipment or not, I don't know, but
I think you mentioned that earlier, Dom. But yeah, just realize that you are in the driver's
seat when it comes to, first of all, leasing a new EV, in my opinion, I think you're in the
driver's seat, especially with the Polestar. So the other thing about these Polestar 3s,
and maybe this is a, we're going to really apply that pressure here, Dave, because these Polestar
3s, these are actually 2025 Polestar 3s. So that means these are 400 volt Polestar 3s. The Polestar
is changing all the Polestar 3 to 800 volts, giving them newer motors, making the rear biased power
trains, they're getting a better suspension, some, it's just, it's just kind of a big refresh.
This one has had, the 2025 has had their computers replaced so they can process things better,
but they're still kind of primarily like a front drive sort of car. And the just thought is
desirable as a new 2026, but they don't have, the 2026 didn't quite make it to the U.S.
So I don't, I don't know, I think this is, I think they're asking for too much, even with all that
money on the hood, considering they're leaving the country, I would, I would try to hammer a better
deal out of them for that, basically. Yeah. So, so Dave. One last thing I just want to add, and I'd
Polestar and Dealey, they're making cars for the entire world, right? And so for the decision
for them to pull out of the U.S., that is not, that's not something I would be afraid of
from the company itself. You know, you get a lot of these EV startups and you're taking a chance and
you buy something from them. This is a major league established company that's still very
much building cars for the world. So as long as you can get comfortable with whether Volvo
is going to, you know, service it going forward, definitely buy it right. Make sure you steal the
car if you're buying it. And if you are leasing it, at least you know, definitely try to get the,
you know, negotiate the best price on the lease on behalf of the leasing company, which in this
case, I would imagine it's Polestar itself. But everything is negotiable. Know that. And the good
news about leasing is, you know exactly how much money you're on the hook for when you sign
on the day you drive it away. When you buy, you don't really know. So those are the things to
think about. This would be a good time to mention that, Dave, so you have some,
all this great buying advice. You have, you're starting a new YouTube channel,
a new kind of thing where you're helping people buy cars. Maybe tell us a little bit about that
so people can know what this other is. Yeah. So real fast and thank you, Dom. I
suspect deals is a new basically division of out of spec where we are, we are going to be negotiating
car purchases on the behalf, on behalf of buyers, whether they're used or new.
And the idea is that when you think about buying a car, typically it's the second largest transaction
you'll do in your life, right behind real estate. And while it's super easy to buy a new Tesla,
a new Rivian, a new Lucid, or at least one, because it's direct from the company itself.
There's no negotiation when you either are buying a pre-owned one of those cars or
the dealer model itself that's out there. It's a really kind of a snake pit, a dangerous place
to walk into dealerships and a lot of people have a lot of anxiety about it. And you know,
look, if you've got a really good friend that can help you, you know, Andrew, call him up.
He'll help you get a good deal. You know me, call me up. I'll help you as a friend. I've
done that for years. Kyle and I both have done this for years. And also the other thing is that
there's so much information out there today on the internet. So if you want to be an informed
consumer and learn about what should I be paying for this car regionally perhaps or based on the
supply and demand of that particular model, that information is out there. However, if you're
either busy or you just don't want to deal with it, call me, okay, out of spec deals. We're in the
process of organizing the infrastructure around this. I just retired from my 41 year of car air
on Wall Street, JP Morgan, C-Bank, Lehman, the whole bit. And the organization around helping
people negotiate car deals is what I'm setting up right now. And yes, we're going to make content
around the deals as well. Because sometimes when you're dealing with car dealerships,
you know, they're fine. They're great. Sometimes they can get a little shady and entertaining,
if not, right? So look, what Tommy McCoola is doing with Delivered is amazing. He's built
an incredible business. And while he's super successful, he's only, I mean, not only, he's
doing 400 or 500 car deals a month, okay? How many thousands and thousands of car deals are out
there today? So I am super excited about launching out of spec deals in conjunction with Kyle, my
son from out of spec. And we're going to see where this goes. The most important thing is that
I'm super excited about having fun, helping people either save money or know that they've
gotten a fair deal. And we'll see what happens. We're going to give it a shot.
So when does the first out of spec deals video go up? Well, we'll see. I mean, first of all,
I'm probably going to put a lot of the content initially on Dave on out of spec Dave. And then
we'll see how it goes. If people like the content, maybe we'll
rebrand one of the existing channels that have been around for a while, or maybe we'll
start a new one from the ground up. I think the most important thing is to
see if I'm going to do proof of concept, see if this, if people like the idea,
if people like the content, if people are getting value in having me help them
buy a car. We'll see. I feel good about it. But you know what, Dom, sometimes in life,
what you expect to happen doesn't really pan out. So we'll see. But I feel good about this one.
All right. All right. So you also came in this morning and you had your own deal of the week.
Besides, I had myself, someone had recommended this particular deal of the week. So I thought
we'd share that as well because it's a pretty sweet, sweet one. Yeah. Put that one up.
This is pretty cool deal. When it comes up. Actually, Colton from out of spec detailing
channel sent this over to me last night. And I thought we, we should share this,
this something he saw on, I guess, X or wherever. Maybe it was, yeah.
Andrew, why don't you take us through this? Cause you thought this was pretty sweet.
Yeah. This is a great deal. I think I, I'm still like, I like to get really cheap leases. So
out of my budget, but this is still regardless of really good deal for this truck. First off,
sale price, 54 grand for cash purchase, which I don't think is terrible. This is probably the
Sierra EV elevation, which is the entry level trim. So unfortunately, it's probably not that one in
the picture because that looks to be a Denali with the 24 inch wheels. But anywho, it's still a
Sierra EV, still has over a hundred kilowatt, 120 kilowatt hour battery. But the lease price is
665 a month with zero down 24 month lease, which I like. I don't like 36 month leases. I really
prefer those 24 month leases. Zero down, which sounds nice. You're probably, it's not going to be
zero down at the dealer. It's going to probably be in the ballpark of $2,000 to $3,000 down,
effectively down with taxes, fees, dealer fees, add-ons, whatever. But so I don't, I don't think
this is a bad deal at all. I think this is pretty reasonable. If you want to have a pretty cool
truck for two years, this is probably going to end up being 850-ish total, including down payment
for 24 months, or sorry, every month for 24 months. So yeah, I think this is a pretty decent deal,
for sure. You make a good point about 24 months as well, just generically. But one of the direct
benefits of a shorter lease horizon is the fact that you're going to pay less in taxes.
Because basically what happens is if you lease a car for 36 months, and it's $100 a month in
taxes, you're going to have to write a check for $3600. I highly recommend you write that check at
the time you lease the car. Don't roll that into the lease payments, because then you're paying
interest on top of the tax, which is like a real bad no-no from Finance 101. But in the case of if
it's $100 a month tax, and it's only 24 months, you're only writing a check for $2400. And then
you have also the fun opportunity to get a new car every two years instead of every three. So I
like that as well. Yeah, and I think another point on that too with registration. So this really
irritates me, but Polestar likes to do these weird terms like 27 months or 39 months for the Polestar
4. And the issue with that is, depending on how strict your state, I mean, you're going to have to
do it anywhere you live. But like in California, coming up on that three-year period, I'm going
to have to re-register the car. The car's MSRP is over $60,000. I'm probably going to pay somewhere
in the ballpark of like $1500-ish to just re-register that vehicle in the state of California to have
in-date tags. And then I'm only getting to use three months of that.
But, Andrew, in that case, wouldn't you get a pro-rated amount back as a refund?
No, I'm in California. Are you kidding me? Really?
Yeah, in California, I really like some money. But I mean, the thing is, you can go without
registration for that brief period, that three months. It is illegal. But if you do get pulled
over and you explain it, there's a chance the trooper would be like, okay, like maybe. But then
it goes on the manufacturer. So there's actually really, so you can return a lease car with expired
registration in California. I'm not sure about other states, but you can return a car in California
without, with expired registration. Yeah, expired, sorry, expired tax, not registration, expired
tax. And it's actually okay. Like it goes on the manufacturer then. So that's a manufacturer in
bank's responsibility, but they, the bank and manufacturer can't like charge you. So there's
like some weird rules there. But the point is, I don't like this. On this particular vehicle on
that GMC Sierra, that was a loaner, right? So it already had some miles on it, but it was sold as
new. So the vehicle warranty will kick in on the in-service date that you actually take ownership
of the vehicle. It's not already punched or anything like that. So, but knowing that it is
one of one, when and if you call that dealership, because we just saw that yesterday,
chances are it's gone. You know, it was probably legit, but just fasten your seatbelt because
now you've got a dealership that's going to probably try and get you into something that's
maybe not a sweet deal. But be aware, be aware that these types of deals are out there and keep
searching for them. Thank you, Colton, for sending that one to us. We appreciate it.
That's great. And the Sierra, the GMC Sierra EV, it's like the GMC version of the Silverado EV,
and it's got just a little bit nicer seats and material, I think inside, right? It's just a,
I think it's probably a, you know, if you have, if you have your brother's, I think you'd rather
have that in person. I think it looks better than the Silverado too. The battery pack is what?
How big is the battery pack in that things, isn't it? Like,
120 on the big model. It's like 273 miles range. There aren't a lot of base
Sierra's out there. If you go, you know, at least last time I looked at them, the guy looked at me
like, oh yeah, we haven't seen any of those. Those are tough to come by, but they had a
bunch of Denali's on the lot. I don't know what the market's like right now. I'd have to take
a peek at and see. But yeah, no, listen, great, great vehicles. As a matter of fact, that vehicle
in the Silverado trim was the one that won our race from Jacksonville to San Diego from an
efficiency standpoint. And yeah, it was pretty cool. And they had like the base spec. The guys
were dressed up. They had like the yellow light on the top. And it was like they had the yellow
vests, you know, when they were charging. It was really funny, but good vehicles. I really like
Silverado's and the GMC Sierra's.
Well, you're going to enjoy the rest of our letters because it's a pretty truck heavy
show we have for you today. So let's find these folks. Our next favorite car. Our first email
comes to us from Jason and he writes, hello, I run a farm and during the harvest season,
we help produce to the processing plant, which is about 10 miles from the farm.
We make four to five round trips per day over a 10 to 12 day period. We finish at four in the
afternoon started six in the morning. So there's plenty of time for an overnight charge. We use
a goose neck flatbed trailer with a GV RW of 16,000 pounds. Currently we're hauling this with a
diesel Ford F one F 350 flatbed. It works great with 350,000 miles on it. It's time to start
thinking about a replacement. Is there anything in the EV space right now that would function as
our harvest hauler, but still have functionality as a daily farm truck in other times of the year?
Our budget is 50,000. So this is probably a tall order, but I'll bet something you will
enjoy seeking about. Absolutely love the podcast and I am looking forward to hearing your thoughts.
Best Jason. Okay, so I want to kick this one off a little bit because unfortunately a goose neck
hitch is not really feasible with an electric truck. Usually those are mounted to the frame
rails of the truck and come up through the floor of the bed. See on electric truck,
that's where the battery is right under the bed. And this is a unibody kind of construction. So
I'm not exactly sure what the frame rails are, how it all works out. It's basically
not going to happen unless you do some really expensive custom fab and I don't think that's
really what you're looking for here. So I would just suggest going to a bumper trailer and it will
have a lower GV RW because like Chevrolet has said that they have a model coming with a 20,000
pound towing capacity that will eventually join the lineup. But right now, 12,500 is a limit.
So I would suggest for Jason here, a Silverado EV in the 5WT work truck spec. So Chevrolet has said,
right, so 5WT, this is the only, I think it's one of the only work truck specs that gives you that
full 12,500 pound gross trailer rating. I think the LT's also have that, but then
for various reasons, you know, they've had to lower a bit, so like 10,500 on different
trims. You have to check that out for sure when you go to buy. But anyway, those trucks are
pretty sweet. Over 200, like 220 kilowatt hours of battery in the bigger ones.
This will have all the range and the grunt you need to handle your harvest season with no problems.
And then it gives you a truck with maybe 424 miles of EPA range, a huge front trunk,
and then outlets as well to plug this to power tools. If you're working some way away from
the farm buildings or whatever, it's just a great utility in a truck. So what do you guys think?
A couple of things on this. You're right, the Silverado EV has the highest GVWR of any EV
truck out there. Hummers 12,000, but the Silverado EV in the work truck spec is 12,500. But the
specific ask of this gentleman is to have a 16,500 or 16,000 pound GVWR. You just can't do it.
And the other thing that I would caution you about is that the GVWR of the trailer itself
is one thing, but you also have to add to that the GVWR of the vehicle that you are using the tow.
And when you add those two together, whatever that is, you have to check your state's regulation
to see if that exceeds, you may need to have a CDL, which is a commercial driver's license,
in order to pull a rig like that. So I don't believe you would run into it, but look, I have an F350
diesel with a Gooseneck pulling a Brinkley 5th wheel, RV, and technically my setup in the state
of Connecticut. I'm over the limit, so I would need to have a CDL in the state of Connecticut.
However, in the state of Florida, as long as you're using it for non-commercial purposes,
but you are using it for commercial purposes, so I think you're kind of screwed there as well.
There's a lot of hair on this question, but to answer your question right now,
there's no EV that's going to pull 16,000 GVWR. It doesn't exist.
Yeah, I mean, you basically need an F250, 350.
Yeah, and you've already got that. So yeah, that's why I bought an F350 diesel,
because I went through this exact situation, and it's really tricky. You've got to be really
careful, and the state of Texas is specifically really, they really will look at, and it doesn't
matter how much weight you're carrying. They'll look at the GVWR of your vehicle on the sticker,
and they'll look at the GVWR of the trailer. If those two add up to more, even if you're way under,
you're going to get impounded in Texas. There are videos of guys then that do that,
so be careful. Good news is you're not going to find a solution.
Yeah, yeah, I was just moved to a slightly lighter trailer. I don't know, maybe have to make an extra
trip or two, or maybe just wait until the 20,000 pound towing capacity Chevy comes out.
Yeah, I haven't heard anything really news about that. I just saw that today, actually,
in a car and driver, that statement from Chevrolet. I've been thinking about heavy-duty trucks,
like we have F250, 350s and things. We don't really have that in the electric world yet,
and it's time, really. Do we look at any particular trucks? Oh, I pulled up a few
trucks here. I'm not sure. You should be able to get within his budget. I think he had a hard
$50,000 budget, and this is kind of what we're looking at right now. These are brand new trucks,
actually. These work trucks, 45, 9 foot. Of course, this might not be the exact price you'll pay,
but it'll be in this neighborhood though, maybe a little bit over 50 looks like, actually.
But you could actually go, these are brand new, so you could go use and find something that works
under 50, with a little miles. I'm pretty sure that's something you could find out there.
All right. Shall we move along? I think so. You can add anything to that, Andrew?
Yeah, just same thing. Generally, get a goose back EV.
Right, right. I never thought about that, but you're right, because on my F350, I got holes in
where the brackets go and all of that. The one thing I would be curious about is,
goose neck is one thing, but a fifth wheel is, generally speaking, that's probably the same
issue, but that's a bracket that goes up. It's a different contraption to connect up than a goose
neck. A goose neck is just a ball in the bed of your truck, and a fifth wheel has got a bracket,
and then what you do is you slide in to that, and it clamps on. A goose neck is basically the truck
has the ball. In a fifth wheel, your hitch has the ball. It's like the opposite,
but either way, you're still screwed on the GVWR.
The other thing with goose necks real quick is they also put a lot more weight on your bed
than a regular trailer, and so you have to look at that capacity as well,
how much weight you're putting on your suspension on the bed. Our next email
comes to us from David. He says, hey team, I have a brutal daily commute, 90 miles round trip,
almost entirely highway internet driving at 75 to 80 miles an hour. Because of my workplace setup,
I have access to free level two charging at the office. Awesome. I'll be doing half my charging
on their dime. I have a strict budget of $35,000 between two completely different paths,
buying a brand new lower range model like a based Hyundai IONIQ 5, a Chevy VB to get the full factory
warranty, buying a used higher end model, Ford F-150 Lightning, or a Tesla Model 3 long range
that has already taken the initial depreciation hit. Given how much highway speeds degrade
cold weather range and the fact that I'll be racking up nearly 25,000 miles a year,
which strategy makes sense for long term reliability and cost per mile? I appreciate
all the insight you guys give on the show every week. Listen to the podcast on the drive. Cheers,
David. Andrew, go for it. Okay, my take, do not buy a new base Hyundai IONIQ 5 at all,
because that one's a small battery, makes like 167 horsepower, base interior, all cloth seats,
doesn't even have a rear center armrest, not a nice car, does not have good residual values,
nobody wants the SE standard range at all on the used market. So for your exit strategy, Dave,
this would be a no go, but I would recommend going with like a nice used 2025
SEL or limited off lease IONIQ 5. So when it just came off the lease, you can get one for less than
a new base IONIQ 5. No, there's still good deals on new IONIQ 5s, but I still think use is the
way to go with an IONIQ 5. So IONIQ 5, I think great car, maybe can even get an XR key trim too,
if you live in a colder environment, you want some ground clearance, etc. So that's an option
used model three long range rear or all wheel drive, fantastic car. You can't go wrong with that.
Tech is great. All those older ones will have autopilot, you could always upgrade to FSD if you
want that as well. I think the model three is a great choice. Equinox EV, I think that's definitely
a solid option as well. Can't really go wrong with that. The charging speeds are a little bit
slower, but doesn't really matter if you're just level two charging. And then also a used F150
lightning, I think those are great. They can't really get them for under 35 anymore. And it will
be a standard range, which is still going to be fine for the commute, but it's hard to find
lightnings for under 35. And then the other thing too is if you do get a lightning for under 35,
it's going to be the Pro or an XLT and both of those is standard, do not come with adaptive
cruise control. So if you're driving 90 miles, you kind of want to have those safety features. So
I think the short answer is there's a lot of great options. F150 lightning probably is not going to
be one of them. Yeah, I mean, you know, I echo that. The one thing though, I just want to maybe
give you a little bit of context, 90 miles round trip. While that sounds like a grind,
that's nothing for unless you're buying a mini EV, right? Whether it's a bolt, a leaf, an equinox,
a Kona, a Nero, a BZ, any of Model Ys, Model 3s, any of these cars, you'll be able to do
two full days of driving on your commute and not charge, right? Like you'll be able to charge
one day, not charge that night, drive it and then charge the next day or whatever. So that's not,
you know, even to me, 90 miles isn't even a challenge for today's EVs. Even in cold weather,
I think you're going to be fine with the range. Most of these vehicles have well over 200 miles
of range and you'll be fine. I definitely like your suggestion, Andrew, about getting an older
Model 3 or Y, for that matter, that has autopilot and maybe you don't need FSD, but lane centering
is, I think it can save your life and if you're tired, you're getting up in the morning, whatever
it is, I think that having that kind of tech is really smart and you won't get blue crews on
those base 150s like Andrew mentioned. So, you know, just basic lane centering is pretty much
on all these cars, like on the Hyundai's, on the EGMP platforms, whether it's a, you know, in EV6
or an IONIQ 5, you know, whether you get HDA1, which is basic lane centering or HDA2, which will
also add lane changing, you could find an HDA1 equipped IONIQ 5 or EV6 and be really happy,
but I think especially with that kind of a mundane commute where you're just highway, you want, you
want, you know, autopilot of some sort, lane centering of some sort. 100%
And I think for me with the Hyundai's, just the warranty is so good, it's like I would just go
with the used one because you get a 10-year, 100,000-mile battery, drive train warranty,
and then the basic warranty is five years, 60,000 miles. So, you could literally get a two-year-old
IONIQ 5 with low miles and it's basically going to have the same warranty as a new Equinox, just
minus the balance of the high-voltage battery and component warranty.
Yeah. Good options. Well, yeah. Well, Andrew, you destroyed my thesis. I was thinking, oh,
I was going to go, well, first I thought, okay, Model 3, because that's, I mean, I know that car
is like a great hobby cruiser, you can drive all day long and that thing. But then I said, oh,
what F-150 Lightning? I'm on a truck binge right now for under 35. Can you even find that? So,
I looked and like you said, there was no big battery versions of that out there at all.
So, yeah, I gave up once I realized I was way over, way overpriced.
Well, I did see some nice ones on your site, Evercars. You got some nice F-50 Lightning's
out, shout out to Evercars. I was hoping to actually use them, but I couldn't quite find one
that worked for this particular case. I just want to say that if you're looking to buy this,
call me first. I'll negotiate with Andrew. I'll take care of you. Don't you worry.
Yeah, we'll get it down to 25. All right. So, this is what's out there,
basically representative of what's out there in a Ford, 235 miles range rather than 320 for
the bigger battery versions, which is enough to do the thing, right? Yeah. And it's a great
highway cruiser. These things are great. Then you have a nice pickup truck for when you're not
running back and forth at work. 35, this one though, it does have already, to get it down to
this price, you got to get some miles. So, maybe it's fine. I don't know. I haven't really heard a
lot about these things going bad really. 39,000? That's a toddler. That's not even in nursery school
yet. Come on. That's nothing. Right. But he's going to be putting on 25,000 miles a year.
So, in my mind, I'd like them to start lower than that. You're right. It's always better to start
lower, but from a reliability standpoint, 39,000 miles is just not a lot. What did it come with
four year 50 or those three 36, Andrew? They come with the basic is three or 36 on the lightning.
Now, this is actually interesting. We've actually noticed this too with lightnings,
just with some battery testing is sometimes the batteries actually go bad prematurely in the
lightnings and it's like not, it's uncommon, but it's less uncommon than I thought it was. And
it's basically you get these cell voltage deviation issues and you basically just get a big, because
you're limited by the lowest performing battery cell. And I've seen several battery replacements
on lightnings before. I'm not trying to scare anyone away, but there is just something about,
like we've seen batteries go bad on them at like 10,000 miles. Take it in. Obviously,
it's all under warranty. So that's good. But I have seen it before on like pretty early lightnings,
and I've seen several of them happen. So just something to keep in mind. But even if that
does happen under warranty, then great, you got a brand new battery pack. So I'd say that's fine.
It'll work in the car as well. A silver lining. Yeah. Yeah. I'll take a brand new battery pack.
That would be great. Yeah. So there you go, David. Hopefully you can find some
something in there that works for you. See, our final email comes to us from
Sarah and Marcus. They write, Hello, my partner and I live entirely off grid on a homestead
in Northern Arizona. We produce all our own power through a 12 kilowatt ground mounted solar array
paired with a 30 kilowatt hour home battery bank. We are looking to replace our old gas
Subaru with a Ruvian R1T. It would be our primary vehicle for runs into town about 45 minutes away
and hauling building supplies, feed and water tanks. My question is about the logistics of
charging an EV solely from the off grid solar setup. So we average about 6.5 hours of peak sun per day.
Is it realistic to expect our system to handle an EV with a large battery pack,
or are we going to end up draining our home storage and sitting in the dark?
We usually drive into town twice a week. Love the podcast. Keep up the fantastic work.
Best, Sarah and Marcus. So I didn't pick a specific. There's no charging in town where they
either level two or DC fast charger in town, right? Here at the RV lot last night, I plugged in the
model Y to just like a regular 110 at 18% state of charge. It's an 81 kilowatt hour battery pack
and that was at nine o'clock last night. So 14 hours and I went from 18% to 36%.
It's now at 36%. So it'll charge roughly that car roughly three miles every hour. If you're going
into the town twice a week and how many miles was it into town? 45 miles one way.
I think you probably won't have an issue just sipping. You could even lower on the Rivian.
You could lower the consumption of the the amps. Maybe you could go down to even like
instead of 12 amps, you maybe could go to six or even three amps and just let it trickle charge.
And then when you take that thing on the road on a road trip, you're going to have a DC
fast charging network everywhere. So I like that worst case scenario add another battery, right?
So you could buy another device to store up some energy. So you have that in your back pocket.
But I think you could do it. I'd love to hear. have you do it and I'd love to have
you follow up and I'd like to see how that works out for you. Andrew, am I too aggressive or what
do you think? No, I totally agree. I was just running the numbers real quick, but a 12 kilowatt
solar output or sorry, 12 kilowatt solar array at six and a half hours a day. That should be 78
kilowatt hours a day. Now is like multiply that by 0.9 to account for efficiency losses.
Oh, let's just say like I'm 70 ish kilowatt hours. Sure. That would charge that home battery
two times every day. So I don't think you're going through that much energy as a home. There's
probably other stuff as well because it sounds like more consumption is really thirsty though.
So yeah, we don't want to do sweating the death in the house at two o'clock in the afternoon.
But at night, the funny thing is your consumption of the AC goes down at night,
but your replenishment of the battery, it goes to zero at night, obviously. So you'd have to
manage that a little bit. Yeah. So no, I'm not too familiar with solar arrays, but on paper,
you're making a lot of energy and I don't think you go wrong with the Rivian and then plus you
can also, well, not the Rivian, but if it was like a lightning or something, then you could use it as
an additional backup battery. So yeah, I say can't go wrong with the Rivian and it's a great car.
And I think that 45 miles to the town twice a week, that's 90 miles to the town every week
is not going to be that much of a burden on your solar setup.
You know, Andrew, you bring up a great point that for this use case, finding, choosing,
so does an R, she's looking at an R1T, is that what it was? An R1S? Does that vehicle do vehicle
to load? I should know this, but I don't know. I don't think so. My dad just
bought a used one and he was trying to see if it does and I don't think it does. Okay. So if you
think about it, I know your heart may be set on a Rivian, but if you identify a vehicle that
does have vehicle to, let's just say output, then you've got a really great way as a backup
to power your house as well for, you know, the big bash party when Andrew, Dominic and I come out
for celebrating this purchase, you want to make sure you have enough energy to power the sound
system and all the fun toys and the carnival rides. So, you know, I think maybe expand your
horizons a little bit beyond just the Rivian, just saying, I think you could do it with the Rivian,
but think about the vehicle to load or vehicle to home capability, because that would give you
a huge battery pack. If the battery you have right now is a 30 kilowatt hour battery pack,
what's the size of the Rivian? Rivian, it's what 120, goes up to 140.
140? Max pack is 140. So you'd have four, think about that, you'd be increasing,
if it had vehicle to home or vehicle to load, you would be increasing, you'd have four of those
battery packs, so you'd have a total of five. That's pretty sweet. And just to give an idea of
what used Rivian prices are like right now, so this is used Rivians R1Ts below 30,000 miles,
no accidents, good titles. Yeah, well this is today's, you know, I just looked up,
so 55 is kind of where they start, 56, kind of just where they start, and it goes up from there,
right? And then you have all the different configurations to figure out what do you want,
and you want the original quad motor launched, you want the refreshed dual motor,
you know, different size batteries, there's a whole lot of decisions to make when you want
to go buy a Rivian R1T, there's so many trims and different variations on it.
By the way, the R2 is supposed to have vehicle to load, vehicle to home as well,
so bi-directional charging, so if your heart's set on a Rivian, maybe you check out an R2,
I know it's not a pickup, but something to consider. Right, yeah, that's a fair shot.
Yeah, I think they will make it a smaller pickup truck eventually, maybe that's what the R4 or R5
is going to be, they're talking about these other trucks coming down the road, so, you know,
fingers crossed they're going to do something like that, because I don't know, I think a compact
truck, we don't really have much right now in that area, but I guess we'll have the slate
coming soon, then we'll have the new, the Ford coming soon. F-150 Lightning's got bi-directional.
True, true, yeah, also fine for what they're doing, and I don't think too much,
any less efficient than the Rivian really going down the road, it's like they're about,
I'm not sure, it depends on how fast you're going with the Rivians, or any pickup truck, but
yeah, so I guess we'll leave it there, call it an episode. I think we've got some good choices.
All right, yeah, that's for the gooseneck. Well, right, except, sorry about that. Yeah.
But thank you all very much for hanging out with us, appreciate it. Let us know in the comments
why we're wrong and about everything, and what you would suggest instead. If you're ready for
your own battery bargain, drop us an email at hello at batteriesincludedpodcast.com with your
About this episode
Polestar 4 lease deals take center stage, with the hosts warning that “$399–$499/month” pricing comes with fine-print caveats and limited inventory—especially for dual-motor models. The discussion emphasizes an exit strategy: leasing reduces long-term risk as Polestar winds down US operations. They also stress checking service support (likely via Volvo/Geely networks) before signing. Later, buying-advice context is shared via Dave’s new “Out of Spec Deals” concept, aiming to negotiate EV purchases for consumers.
Welcome to Battery Bargains, where we shortcut your search for the perfect EV. Episode 59 • Deal of the week X 2 • Jason needs a pickup with big towing capacity • David's looking for a highway cruiser for a big commute • Sarah & Marcus wonder if Rivian R1T is right for an off-grid solar situation
