BMW M3’s: From E30 to E46 Which Is Your Favorite?

You are listening to the Analog and Grit podcast.

I'm your host, Victor Troyer.

We got a special episode today.

Who do we have on the show?

Let's start here.

Roy G.

Roy G?

All right.

Who else?

Rome.

Josh from Analog and Grit.

All right.

And Mike Miggs.

Mike Miggs.

So welcome, guys.

Rome, welcome back.

You're on the podcast, back in the day.

Back in the day.

Yeah.

You guys want to just maybe push it towards you, like just bend it down, because it looks

like it's sticking up.

There you go.

Perfect.

Yeah.

All right.

What's talking about the mic?

Get your face closer.

What's your face closer doing?

What kind of adjustment are you doing over there?

What's it look like if you put your mouth on it?

Yeah.

Lime it a little off.

I feel like we should go around the room because everybody said their name, but

yeah.

That's what we do.

This is Roy Prince.

So he's the most prolific printer, screen printer in San Diego.

I've been doing it for like, introduce yourself properly.

Forever.

Yeah.

All right then.

Roy Prince.

I've been printing for like 30 years, print for a lot of the motorsport industry.

I don't know.

I can include some names if you guys want.

Yeah, names of people.

Probably Eibach, Bilstein, HP Tuners, HRE, like quite a few.

You may have heard of some of those brands.

Yeah, some of them.

Little brands, they're tiny.

Yeah.

But I also print for inductive.

Yeah.

Okay.

All right.

So he's been printing and also today we're going to talk about BMWs, E36 M3s, E90

M3s, E46 M3s.

How many M3s have you had, Roy?

I've had a lot.

E36 M3s, probably like 20.

Wow.

E46s, probably, I don't know, four of them.

E92.

I can't count the salvage title one that never was fixed, but two of those.

And then finally got the E30 M3 in the build process, thanks to Mike and his skills too

and everybody's support as well.

And I feel like one of his most famous M3s was the lightweight that you built,

the 36 M3 lightweight.

Yeah.

I loved that car, but at one point I'm just like, I got to sell it and move on and started

building the E10.

It's like the one that's got the liquid molly livery.

But yeah, I took that funds from that and then bought another car.

Anyway, long story short, I took some of that money and eventually got the E30 M3

and stripped it down and getting it going.

And on that note, one of the builders for your current build, your E30 M3,

we got Mike Miggs here, which is arguably one of the best builders for BMWs,

custom BMWs and swaps in San Diego.

I don't quite say this.

You guys went around the table and you're like, what's up on Mike?

I do stuff, I guess.

I do stuff.

Yeah.

So like introduce yourself, tell the people what they need to know.

All right.

I'm Mike Miggs.

I think it's hard to talk about yourself.

Well, for me, it's hard for me to talk about myself.

Exactly.

I don't like talking myself.

Humble.

He's dope.

I've been in the industry for 20 plus years, suspension companies.

I founded a company called Status Group where we were the world leader

for a minute doing E46 and three parts, carbon, suspension, exhaust, stuff like that.

My current companies are Grail Brand, Inductive, which is a wireless charging company.

And then on the side, I build cars.

I don't want to say I'm a builder, but I do, I'm passionate about building for sure.

What are some of the most epic builds, in your opinion, that maybe if you're talking

about it, like with humility, you're like, oh, those cars are cool.

But what cars have made the internet go wild?

Like you told me about the S65, it's like E46 build you're doing.

So currently I'm doing an S65 DCT swap.

As far as I know, there isn't one in the U.S. right now.

There's some in Germany.

There's a couple places in Germany that build really cool versions of that.

But as far as I know, the only S65 swaps in the U.S. are 6B cars.

My current, the car that I'm doing that is the Status Group car.

So a lot of people know what that car is.

It's a Silver Gray E46 M3.

And I've had it for 15 plus years and spent in Performance BMW magazine,

a couple different magazines, some of the other cool builds.

And I don't know if you guys even saw that car,

but I built an off-road looking BMW.

So I used a lot of CSL parts and we built custom bash bars and stuff

that were removable, wrapped the whole thing, lifted it four inches.

And as much as I wanted to be an all-wheel drive car,

my friend didn't want it to be built like that.

But that car was featured in Performance BMW and stuff.

That's incredible.

That was cool.

It's so hard to remember all the builds.

You know, I built a bunch of wagons,

I've been a part of a bunch of wagon M3 conversions, sedan conversions.

I had a personal F80 M3 that was individual Silver Gray,

which was a cool car.

People were upset.

They're like, why don't you spend all this money to get a cool color

and you got the same color as your other car?

But I'm one of those weird car guys where I don't go through cars.

Like you guys have had so many cars compared to me

and I've had like the same car for 15 years and I just kind of changed it up.

That's a testament.

I just, I get attached to them.

So it just, my problem would be if I had money,

I'd have like too many of them, you know,

and I'd need a place like this just to keep my own cars.

I do love that though, because the way you build cars

and the way you do projects, you're doing stuff that you don't see.

Like the rinse and repeat game, it really grinds my gears.

And if we're doing stuff that hasn't been done before

or just kind of one-off stuff,

like tell these guys about the truck that you pulled up in today.

Like how unique that is.

So my daily is a, it's 2015 F-150 XL.

So just a regular truck started out,

but it's all full Raptor, OEM Raptor body,

lowered four inches in the front, six inches in the back.

It's got 20-inch off-road tires and wheels.

And then it's a 3.7-liter GT500 supercharged V6 in it.

But it's a little flexible.

It's like five to 600 horsepower.

It's faster than a new Raptor.

So it looks exactly like a slammed Raptor.

From first glance, you're like,

oh my God, this guy lowered his Raptor.

You're like, hey, relax, buddy. It's not a Raptor.

It makes people mad and breaks the brains and it's the best.

It's so fun just watching people as they're like,

what is that thing?

You know, as they're taking a picture, a video of it.

Mike makes out here breaking brains.

I got my first thumbs down the other day.

I don't know where I was.

I was in Poway and I was taking a corner.

I was going to pick up my son from football

and there's like some young kid in a Bronco

and he's just ready and he had his phone

and ready to like recording me as I drove around.

Just giving me the big thumbs down,

waving thumbs down and I was like, what?

It's because you're not lifted.

It had hurt. I've never seen a thumbs down.

I've never had a thumbs down.

Coming from a fellow Ford brother, right?

If you would think the Bronco guy would be all about it.

I'm like, what?

It's like while recording, too.

I was just doing it for a tit-talk.

Did you hear your thumb in the shot?

Yeah, my thumb's in the shot.

Did you see it? Look at my thumb.

I'm giving them a thumbs down.

Well, Rome, why don't you go ahead and introduce yourself, too?

Yeah.

I've been on this podcast before.

I'll do the reintroduction.

I am active duty Marine Corps.

I actually retire this year.

My ceremony will be November 12th.

It could be held here at Analog and Grid.

It's been a long time coming.

I appreciate it, guys.

I've also had a whole bunch of BMWs.

I grew up with BMWs.

My father is a huge five-series guy.

He had E28, E39s, all the way up to the current model five-series.

So I'm die-hard BMW, but it's kind of funny

because I kind of shipped it to the Mercedes platform.

Ooh.

Tell them why. Tell them why.

Is this another thumbs down?

Don't just kidding.

I'm recording it, too.

Getting a little right here.

Yeah.

So I've had two E90M3s at one point.

E36M3 built by LTMW that I sold.

And yeah, then I had a BMW 2002 Turbo

that was rebuilt by Monafide that I just sold.

And I stepped away from the BMW community.

I wanted to try something different.

I had other vehicles that I was on my bucket list.

Some personal things came up with some of the builds I had.

And so instead of, I'm one of those people,

if something happens and I'm not okay with that,

I'll just completely step away from it.

There's no need. I just like a fresh start.

So there was a Cosworth 190E that popped up

for a really good price.

Had a really good stuff done to it.

And so I took that money from the 2002 Turbo

that I was pretty much synonymous for

and bought the Cosworth.

I love that car.

First of all, I haven't had a car that had AC in almost seven years.

So just that, you're like, this car's amazing.

I was sold. I was sold.

Watching this guy, I got to chime in.

So watching this guy drive his Turbo 2002,

wait, he's got a big ass black poodle.

So he's on the freeway.

I look over.

The car has no AC.

He's got this big ass black poodle

like panting in his face.

I'm like, hey, what's up, Roman?

How you doing?

He's just like miserable.

Sweatin' bullets over there.

So to see this guy now in his Cosworth,

he got a big smile.

But they see.

Like, Nipple's hardship because it's so cold.

I got to look over his dog.

All six of his Nipples are hard.

They're just like ice cubes in their car.

It's hilarious.

I'm like, you deserve it, bro.

I thought it was car talk, not Nipple talk.

Yeah, it was a long time coming.

So I've been so excited.

I've been blasting the AC.

I've been over 2,000 miles on this car

and I'm out of two and a half, three weeks.

I've been up to San Francisco, the Redwoods,

the Sequoias, Big Bear.

You name it.

I drove that car since I bought it everywhere I could.

And so right now we're in the process

of representing the DTM love, right?

Like it's a forgotten era.

And that's why I really love the bill

that Roy and Mike have produced.

I tell Roy all the time, you know,

how much I love how he was able to curate this bill

with a lot of great people.

And I just got done telling him that.

Also, I also have a brand called Garage Icons.

So the 190E and the 2002 that we were going to build

was all supposed to be the Garage Icons build.

And it's funny because Mike is such a great engine swap guy.

I was going to do, and I'll take the rabbit out the hat now,

I was going to do a V12 swap on a BMW 2 or 1600.

There's going to be a rear engine car, center seat car.

Yeah, it's supposed to be the N73 motor out of the 760 Li.

So I bought a whole car just for this swap.

And it sat in my friend's driveway

for whenever I bought this like six months ago.

And he never started it.

And eventually I went over to swap the battery out

and it started.

He's like, can I buy it?

I'm like, sure it's all yours.

So I bought this car for do this crazy swap.

Obviously I was a little over my head

because I knew it was going to be like $90,000

to complete this car.

But I was so hopeful and I still want to do it.

But now that we got this guy over here,

I might have to hustle and bustle him into doing something crazy

and continue to break the internet and get thumbs down.

So yeah, that's a little bit about me.

Nice.

Yeah, as long as I have AC.

I feel like at this point, I'm almost 40 now.

At this point, if a car is too stiff,

if it doesn't have AC or radio or heat, I'm out.

I don't want to deal with the car.

That's the first question.

Josh has been sending me a car at the car, at the car.

Cool cars.

And first thing I always text Josh, does it have AC,

heat and radio?

He's like, no, look, I'm out.

Like in conversation.

That's not the first thing.

The first thing he texts me is, how much is it?

Because I want to offer half price.

Because it's too much.

I haven't told you yet.

It's too much.

So that's my background.

So Josh, tell me about who you are.

Yeah.

I know you're talking about how we short-changed ourselves.

You completely short-changed yourself here

and what you represent to the automotive community here

in Southern California.

I'm going to do an introduction like you guys.

What's up?

I'm Josh.

I do some stuff.

Who's up next?

Yeah.

So for those of you who don't know, we run analog and grit here in San Diego

at the southern tip of South Park.

It's actually a neighborhood called Grant Hill right on the border

of Logan Heights and Grant Hill.

And we're just outside of downtown.

And we have a 17,000 square foot facility

where it's not just a car storage facility.

It's what we like to call like a camaraderie

and rich brotherhood, sisterhood.

And we've got four lifts where we can work on your car.

You can work on your car yourself

or we can teach you how to work on your car.

We've got an in-house detailer.

He goes by the name of Sudmuffin.

His name's Nick.

So he can do paint corrections, ceramic coats.

And then we've also partnered with Elite Finish

because we don't do PPF, but they do.

So if you join our club and go over to Elite,

then they'll PPF your car.

We do events here.

We do every Wednesday.

We do grill and chill.

So as funny as it may sound,

it's kind of like a Fast and the Furious for family.

And then we just grill up meat

and we eat tacos and crack beers

and everybody just pulls up

and whatever build they're working on.

We do that every Wednesday.

Every last Sunday of the month,

we do what's called Sunday Grit Cars and Coffee.

And we'll serve all the coffee,

all the pastries from Glenny's Bakery

and we actually brew all the coffee

and espresso in-house.

So every last Sunday of the month,

we'll do that from 8 a.m. to noon.

It's just kind of like a place

where you can just come and do car stuff,

no judgment.

It doesn't really matter what you drive.

It's just something that we're trying to build together

to kind of bring the community together.

So that's what we do and that's what we're a part of.

If any of that sounds fun,

yeah, come down and see us.

And now we're about to talk about BMWs.

Let's start there.

What makes you a BMW guy?

Let's see, yeah.

So what BMWs have I owned in my life?

I've owned a bunch of M3s.

I'm obviously an analog vintage guy,

so the E9X platform.

I always say it's kind of a funny story,

but that was my midlife crisis car.

It was the E90.

So when I, you know, I felt like I was getting too old

and then I needed something spicy.

I was like, you know what?

I'm gonna do it.

I'm pulling the trigger.

I'm getting a freaking V8 M3.

I'm getting a new one.

Yeah, and then I think I had that car for about a year

and I'm like, oh, this car is too new.

I'm gonna get something older, like less common.

But yeah, that's kind of what got me into it.

And I love manual cars.

I was a big E30 guy, still am.

I've probably had 90 30s.

But Roy here, who's part of the podcast,

he just recently sold me what was that last week.

Super clean, a storel blue,

dove gray interior E36 M3.

So when you buy a car from Roy,

I consider Roy Mr. E36 M3.

He says, oh, you want to buy this car?

First of all, he gave me like a supreme deal.

Second off, he's like, oh yeah, I think I got a roll cage here.

You need a roll cage for that?

Oh, hey, I got a carbon fiber door panels.

Do you like carbon fiber?

I'm like, yeah, I do.

He was like, oh yeah, it's got this coil overs.

He's got some sick wheels, you know, like, oh,

and the AC is cold.

It's got heat and AC in the radio.

Ron Perksup, he's like, AC?

He's like, tell me you'll pay him half price.

If you're going to pay him, I'll pay him half.

Tell him.

So I've never owned a E30 M3,

which is arguably my favorite M3.

But my second favorite is the E36 M3.

So I'm pretty stoked to have it.

Shout out to Scott.

He brought me a, what is that, a light weight wing?

Yeah, LTW wing.

Yeah, LTW.

He brought that over, just, you know, donated to the cause.

So pretty excited about that, getting all cleaned up

and making it look nice.

So, yeah, very excited about that.

Cold AC.

I wish I had all those same parts that I had for E36 for E30.

E3 that's kicking around.

So safe to say we have some subject matter experts

regarding BMW on this podcast today, right?

Super exciting platform.

I think we're all, it's kind of cool because we all have

our ones we really, we really like, you know, like E46.

I die hard E46, you know,

but that's the only thing I know

because I've never had anything else.

So let's do this.

Let's go around the table.

Tell us which M3, you know, you have your closest affinity

towards and then we'll talk values.

I want you guys to guess the values per classic.com today

with the values of let's just stick

between E30, E46 and E36.

So we'll start with you.

Go ahead and tell us which M3 is yours.

My favorite.

So if you go by looks, I love the E30 M3.

Can I afford one?

No.

But the way they look, that's my favorite for sure.

Just that era, you know, I'm an 80s baby.

So a 90s car is my favorite.

But to me, value for what you get

and how the car drives,

all the things included in the car is an E46 M3.

Including AC.

They have AC.

They have heat.

They got radio.

Some have a radio.

Just the rawness of the car.

You know, it's so analog, if you will.

I will.

Yes.

The size, the feeling of it.

You know, I've had a newer M3,

an F80 M3 for seven years.

And that car was great in what it did.

It was comfortable.

It was big.

It was fast.

But it just didn't have that charm of the E46.

Just the rawness, just the shape of the cockpit,

everything inside of it.

You know, just the way it felt was just natural to me.

And all the other cars after that or before that

just felt different or weird to me.

But to me, E46 M3.

Have you ever wondered,

because when you were describing that, Mike,

have you ever wondered if maybe

our affinity for a car later in life

kind of is tied to original memories

that we experience in the car?

Probably some of your favorite memories were in an E46 M3.

Like with buds, like cars, like building experiences.

I have a lot of those in an E30.

And when I look at my E30,

I think, oh man, this is a kid's car.

It's like a college kid's car or something.

I got to get rid of it.

And then I drive it.

And I experience memories flood back in.

And I'm like, oh, this is great.

Why I originally loved the car,

like the shifting and the weight transfer.

Do you think there's anything tied to that?

I think so.

But I think that could go the other way too.

I remember this car being so cool and so good.

And then you get in one and you're like, oh, no, never mind.

This car sucks.

Yeah.

Like, why did I like this thing?

But probably because you had so much fun in it

when you were younger.

I mean, I had a CRX.

My first car was a Honda CRX.

Shout out CRX.

CRX, CRX.

And I fit four people in there.

CRX.

Let's change.

Oh, no way.

What?

All five of us?

All right.

CRX?

We're changing the podcast from BMW

to Honda CRX.

Switching it up.

It's going to Honda now.

But it was like, that was my first car.

And I had a bunch of memories.

I mean, fitting four people in that thing,

mobbing around, just being a hooligan.

And do I want a stock 89HF CRX right now?

No.

Yeah.

I feel the same way.

I mean, give me a nice SI, baby.

How do we both at the same time simultaneously

love the CRX and also never want to own one again?

That's weird.

Yeah.

Well, it's nostalgia, right?

I mean, you pretty much hit on it, right?

The nostalgia effect is what made you want that E46, right?

Because it reminds you of your childhood

or reminds you of when you were maybe in high school

when those were super sought after

and you couldn't afford one.

But real quick, what's your favorite color, E46?

Favorite color, E46.

It's the color half silver gray.

I love that color.

Really?

I'm a huge gray fan.

So I had a Volkswagen for a long time

and I built that car for five plus years,

multiple magazines, all kinds of cool stuff.

Did everything.

I even had an Audi TT gas door

on the inside of the hatch on it.

So as far as I know, no one ever did that.

I always tried to do,

not because I was trying to do something cool,

it was just like, oh, that'd be a cool idea.

Let's do it.

I've never cared if someone's going to like what I do.

And I think for anybody building cars,

to me, that's the mindset to have,

never try to please people

because if you try to build a car to please people

and they don't like it,

you're going to be upset.

And it's like, well, why did you build it then?

Build for you.

It's so funny you mentioned that

because Josh and I just had this conversation

and I would say almost a week ago

about sometimes you have to

even have a great idea,

take it and run with it.

And we get caught up.

I'm guilty of it at a certain point.

We get caught up when we turn around

and look behind us and be like,

oh man, what is everybody else doing?

Does everybody approve of this crazy idea?

And then you slow down

and someone else passes you

and takes your idea.

I like how you mentioned that

because that's very synonymous

in the car community.

Yes, we like what we like to build

or our cars,

but we do,

we are all guilty of doing it

for just a little bit of attention

or someone going, man, that's really dope.

We like to hear the yada boys

and the bat.

Whether we like to say it admitted or not,

I like to just say

I like to keep things straight up.

We do like someone going, man, that's a great job.

And the little details that you mentioned

with the Volkswagen community

and Audi community, me growing up in Europe,

the little details that Volkswagen people talk about,

that's what the whole community is based on.

OEM plus, that is the key.

The little things.

Oh, this bumper is different.

It's wider by an inch

and now it's shorter.

I'm like, okay.

You're like, all right, cool, man.

I already spent a bunch of money doing that.

But I love how you mentioned that.

Like just take your great ideas

and just run with them.

Especially with BMW,

like they have so much of a huge platform

and everyone can make something out of nothing.

Like you could have an E30 M3 or E36 or E46,

but you could do something so simple

that that would change the look of that car

that everybody was like,

I was thinking about that.

Or I never thought about that.

I never thought about that.

Like, oh, I think that's the Volkswagen.

My Volkswagen background is what kind of brought me

how I approach all my builds.

That car was, it was almost like

trying to outdo the next person,

but you're not trying to do it outlandishly

or making it weird.

You're doing it.

You're trying to think outside the box

but make it look like it's supposed to be there.

We did Mark IV dash swaps

and a Mark III way back then

or TT dash swaps.

And it was, we were seeing this stuff from Europe.

Europeans were always doing super cool stuff,

especially the Belgian people were always doing crazy stuff.

And you'd be like, well, I don't want to get that crazy,

but you take inspiration from it.

And I think that's how I approached

all my stuff and especially my E46,

shaving stuff off that are,

it's very special to that car,

but it's like, well, it doesn't look clean with it though.

So I want it off.

I don't want to get rid of it.

You know what would just popped in my mind?

Volkswagen people are more creative

because that platform has been around longer.

And so in order to stand out,

you had to do something different.

Everything's been done before.

And so if everything's been done before

and you still want to customize your car,

then you better dig deep into your hat

and pull out some kind of new trick.

And so if you got inspiration from the Volkswagen community,

that was it, originality.

Be original.

Yeah, you were always trying to do,

like I said, trying to outdo someone,

but it would be like your best friend

and be like, oh.

And so growing up in the Northeast,

I grew up in New Hampshire

and our car season was tiny.

You know, we had three months of maybe good-ish weather.

Other than that, I mean, you're not driving your car.

So I was lucky enough, I had a friend,

he had a garage,

and he would let me put my car in his garage all winter.

And you're just,

you got winter to do whatever you want.

So it's like, you know,

every night, every weekend,

you're over there messing with something,

changing something,

or it's at the body shop for months

and didn't matter.

You know, where here I feel like

it's a different luxury with the weather,

but you don't,

you miss your car if it's gone for a while,

because you're like, dude,

I could be driving this thing, you know?

So I don't think people do the crazy stuff

that we used to,

because I mean, you're not going to drive

your car in the winter.

So it's like, cool.

So almost every spring,

it was like really cool going to like New Jersey

and you'd see the spring openers and stuff,

and everybody would roll out some crazy stuff.

It's like, they had all winter to build some stuff.

You've been working on that all winter,

you crazy son of a bitch,

you didn't tell me what you were doing.

Oh yeah, and then no one would know what you were doing.

All of a sudden you're just like, bam, what's up?

You showed up with a color change.

You showed up just beaming with pride.

You're like, why is that guy so shiny?

You're like, he looks very proud.

Yeah, he's very happy.

But back to, so my first Volkswagen was,

it was a red car, then I painted it gray,

then I painted it red,

and then its final color was gray.

And so I've always gravitated towards gray cars.

So I love gray.

I see.

That was a really long answer to your question.

But yeah, gray.

He was summing up gray.

He loves gray, folks.

My truck is gray.

I thought you were going to say like Phoenix Yellow.

No, I hate that color.

He went with gray.

To your point, why do something to please others?

Do what you love, right?

I feel like you would get,

so I don't mind bright colors.

Like I always wanted an Agarra Blue

Audi S4 with a blue interior.

Like that sounds awesome,

but I would be over it in a week.

You know, I mean, or whatever,

I'd just be like, ah, it's cool,

but it's so bright, you know,

where it's like, you can't get sick of gray.

That's a very mature answer.

You know, gray is just always look good.

Gray, silver wheels, gray,

like there's classic things, you know.

I respect that.

I was kind of gravitated towards that.

What about you, Roy?

What's your favorite M3?

I like the cleanest canvas,

white, alpine white.

Alpine white, yeah.

Like your E30.

And the E10.

So did the E10 and alpine white,

my E36, the one that I sold,

that one.

That's white.

White.

Alpine white.

Just like a clean slate.

But what would be your favorite M3?

Is it an E30?

This is going to be my first,

well, now it's the E30 with the S54,

so it's like the best condo.

Oh wow, yeah.

Yeah, so we've got, you know,

Mike Mig's favorite.

Actually that motor came out of his car

and the transmission.

So yeah, basically having the best of both

and then still sliding in the E36 range too.

Okay.

He's got the body, the best looking body

is the E30 M3, like we all agree,

we can all agree on that.

Right.

And then he's got like arguably

one of the best motors, you know.

So an S54 engine in an E30.

Wow.

Yeah.

That's special.

It sounds incredible.

I'm feeling special right now.

You should.

Yeah.

Any, are you going to do a livery on it?

Like you have on your 2002?

Yeah.

Usually I'm always about representing everybody else's

brands that I work with.

Liquamoli was the E10,

but at this time I'm going to do my company,

which is super little screen printing.

So it'll be a Warsteiner inspired DTM livery.

Nice.

Yeah.

DTM.

Yeah.

Nice.

All right.

What about you, Ron?

What's your favorite M3?

E30 M3.

I just told the story a little bit earlier.

I had an opportunity to buy an E30 M3 EVO-1

back in Cherryport, North Carolina.

An older gentleman was selling it on Craigslist.

And as we've all been joking about,

I'm like, I will haggle everything.

And he posted for 24 grand.

And at the time in 2014,

I mean that was a lot for any old thing.

Like that was back when 96 cores were like 9 grand.

You can like buy a Targa, you know,

Porsche for like five grand.

You can like, you know, people are tossing.

You can buy a no car.

I bought my Datsun for a six grand.

And it was all like mint and all original.

And so this guy, it was like,

yo, I'm going to go look at the car.

I was all excited.

I brought the girl I was dating with me at the time.

And he told me the price because I was trying to have him.

He was like, I'm not budget.

And I'll take this bullcrap.

Like, you sure?

I was like, how dare you be upset?

I offered him like 18.

I got offered him 18 for the car.

He was so offended.

And I was offended because he didn't set my offer.

We got into a fist fight.

We rolled around on the ground.

You know, I'm trying to throw out everything like,

oh man, I'm a veteran.

I've been to Iraq.

Come on, bro.

Like help me out.

And he wasn't budget.

And I regret not paying for a price of that car.

That would have been one of the best opportunities.

I mean, I also, it's taken away me to another,

another way.

I ended up buying a Mark 4 Super like a week later.

The six B, the whole one, the one everyone wanted.

That was Batman.

What was it?

What was the real street?

Real street was really big.

And there was like a thousand horsepower.

So I was super excited about that because I got a halo car

back when they were affordable.

But the E 30 and three has always been like,

there's always like, like Josh Mitch before,

like as a child, me growing up in Europe,

DTM was always on, always on TV, like sky network,

AFN, which is the armed force networks.

Sky network was like a British channel and BBC and all that stuff.

It was very prominent in Europe.

And every time you turn on the TV,

it was this back on like the bubble TVs for the young people

that don't know when you like, you rub your hand over it

and it's like static everywhere.

I had the 13th TV and turn it on and we DTM or MotoGP on.

And I would watch this stuff.

But like, and I would think the body kits were so outrageous,

but ugly.

But it was like the ugly girl with a hot body, you know,

and like, I'll just be like, man, that thing is like,

I was like, man, that thing is like ugly, but beautiful.

There's something about it.

The height of the cars in the DTM era,

like how you're like, how did the rear even work on the car?

But it was just all rim.

It's all you saw.

And so the E 30 and three just stood out to me

from the very beginning.

So like, not only do I gawk at my cause,

we're talking about BMWs.

I literally come in here and gawk at Roy's E 30.

That S 54 is a perfect combination.

It sounds so good with that induction.

Yeah, straight piped, but man.

There was no exhaust on it right now.

But we didn't get to that point yet.

It sounds so good.

And it's a perfect combo with the cage.

It's all white on white.

You can't get more DTM than that.

So I'm ready for Roy's livery to get on

because I'm doing a livery on my car also

and I want to do like the battle of the DTM cars.

I've already kind of started it by doing a voting form

on social media.

I was like, hey, vote for your favorite car.

Which one would you pick for a track battle?

You know, the E 30 and three or the 190 E cars were

and Roy's car beat my car out by one vote.

That wasn't me.

You know, I'm over here.

You like the 30 and 30.

I think I voted for the E 30 and 30.

I can't be selfish.

Whoever did that, damn.

I was like, dude, it was you.

It was just after like the DTM love

and like what they did with that,

like they made an E 30 and then they were like,

all right, let's add this weird trunk

and add these extra parts on there

to make it look way different.

Just add these box flares.

And you're like, what?

That's so 80s.

Oh, it's so 80s.

The whole history of that car, I mean,

the only reason they made the street version

was to have a race car.

Exactly.

It was a homologation.

Yeah.

You're right.

And the only reason why they made the E 30 and three

is because the 190 E Cosworth.

Yeah.

They're trying to compete with each other.

So yeah.

They made it really boxy

and then they went crazy arrow, you know,

and like one fun fact, which I will say,

this is why I love the Cosworth

against the E 30 and three.

So all your famous Formula One

drivers back in the day.

So Nikki Lauda, James Hunt,

Aaron Tinsina all raised the 190 Cosworth

on a race called the Race of Champions.

And they all race a factory spec Cosworth.

They're just only difference was just two colors.

Yeah.

Like a pearl black

and then that like champagne gold color.

And they all race that car.

And it was literally like drivers,

like how well like the drivers were.

So everyone had the same car,

same playing field.

It's just how good are you as a driver?

And can you guys guess which driver won that?

I'm going to say Nikki Lauda.

Okay.

Senna.

Yep.

Harrison Senna won that race.

And he was just gotten to.

He just got into Formula One.

And he was a no one knew who he was.

They were like, Hey,

we need another person because all the other,

there was like 14 drivers in there

from Formula One.

And like a couple couldn't make it.

Nikki Lauda showed up last minute

because he had other obligations.

He didn't come in third.

And he took it very serious too.

So Aaron and Senna took it really serious.

Other drivers were like driving off the track.

They didn't care.

They're like, who cares?

But Aaron and Senna came in

and took it to heart.

If you're a racer, you're a racer.

Yeah.

But he was an unknown racer at the time.

Yeah.

And it's so like that really sparked

like the true interest of the DTM thing.

And I feel like a lot of DTM racing

is like a forgotten thing now.

So certain companies are bringing it back.

But I love that era of E30 M3.

The races were wild.

They were wild.

And it's not even, they were going fast.

You know, it was very technical racing.

But it was like, they were bashing into each other.

They didn't care.

And it was super, super fun to watch.

And that was also when they didn't have that many rules.

Like Audi showed up in like a VA car.

Like Porsche, I mean that Porsche Ford came in

with a turbo car.

BMW had a Volvo showed up.

Opel showed up.

Lancia was in it.

Yeah, Lancia, Alfa.

And then, you know, BMW and Mercedes were like,

nah, we just care about handling and power.

And Mercedes was like, oh, we're going to beef up this Cosworth.

And BMW was like, well, we can do it better with the S14.

And all pure handing alone to BMW was kicking ass.

Yeah.

And Mercedes getting their butt whooped.

And then, you know, every other company like Audi dropped out.

And they went to a rally.

And it was like the battle between Mercedes and BMW.

Yeah.

I'm just like, we're going to go in a rally.

And then we'll do really well, which they killed it.

Mercedes tried it.

It tried rally.

And they got walked.

Yeah.

It's hard.

All the time was king at the time.

So, yeah.

So keep the long story short.

That's what it was.

So what was the color?

What was the color?

That was even worse than Mike's.

What I meant to say was gray.

At least it came back to the color.

He's like, behold, picture all the F1 drivers racing together.

I wanted by the closer eyes.

His locks, his hair.

He had a key chain.

It was blue.

That's the color.

You have me on DTM because you segue to that.

So obviously that's like a racing, what is it?

Like a German racing or European car, like racing group, right?

And so who mainly dominated back then?

Was it the E30?

Which car?

So at one point it was all E30.

And then E30, BMW pulled out, Audi pulled out.

And there was Mercedes racing themselves in Opel.

And then eventually it became all Mercedes racing against themselves.

And then certain teams came back in.

I see.

Because Formula One was really big.

A group B rally was really big.

Right.

So the main two companies that were battling were BMW and Mercedes at that time.

Well, you mentioned something earlier that I really like.

Because you said, you know, I'm now a Mercedes guy because I have a 190 car's worth.

But, you know, I had the 2002.

But there's no, there's no like beef between BMW and Mercedes Benz, right?

Like you appreciate them for what they are, right?

Because usually like with Ford and Chevy, like you have your Ford guys,

you have your Chevy guys and obviously Dodge people, whatever.

Sorry, Dodge people.

Dodge people.

They're reserved to like Santy, you know.

No, no, I'm kidding.

I'm kidding.

I have no clue.

I just lost a hundred subscribers.

I saw the number draw.

Honey, hear what he said about this, Dodge people.

Like unfollow.

But honestly though, like BMW and Mercedes, right?

Like there's no, you have no beef between them.

Obviously you've owned them all, right?

But my next question is, do you have, if you had to choose one, which one, you know,

you don't have to say BMW because this is a BMW episode, but just curious.

That's a good question, man.

I go back and forth on that.

Honestly, because of like the lineage where I come from, my dad always having BMWs.

It's always going to be BMWs at heart.

I was never a Mercedes guy.

I end up owning two now, whoever I thought.

But BMWs always have my heart.

I think at one point I was completely over it and Josh has been like bugging me

to get back into the 2002 game.

And I was like, I'm over it.

I'm done, but I'm coming back.

That's how he is.

He loves to live.

He likes to like live through others, you know.

Josh lives rent free in my head and back in my head.

He has a fucking apartment here and he's not paying rent.

It is ridiculous.

Like I'll be like, I'm over BMW at the end of conversation.

And then like at two o'clock in the morning and then Josh was like,

look at this, 2002 bro, 16 grand will pick it up.

And I'm like, I'll go look at it.

Hopefully he'll take it.

And on that note, let's take a minute to ask Victor about what he's driving

as of last week.

Okay.

What you got?

He's going to get on me because he thinks I love convertibles,

which now that I think about it, I've owned a good amount of convertibles

that you have.

I've owned a good amount of convertibles.

So my only BMW, by the way, I've owned was a M Roadster,

a Z3 M Roadster.

Cool.

That's what got Josh thinking like, why the roads are not the clown shoes?

Well, they're worth half the price.

Every season of clown shoes prices now.

That's one convertible he mentioned.

Why the girl version and not the man version?

Hey, the cars that have feminine, like design cues usually have the most

value, right?

Like the curvy, you know, not so sharp edges.

So for me, I'm always looking for a car that's worth the most.

But they answer your question.

Yeah.

What are 996, 911, Cabriolet?

Two convertibles.

How many?

Six speed manual.

So that's all I care about.

Analog.

But yeah, I mean, I think like what you were mentioning between BMW and

Mercedes, like at the end of the day, Porsche or whatever it is,

the driving experience is going to be different depending on which brand

you choose or which brand you, you know, love to get C timing.

But you don't have to have your favorite, right?

They're all great for their own reasons.

Like, you know, BMW ultimate driving machine analog, you know, stiff

steering, like they're known for being very rigid type of vehicles,

right?

Like Mercedes is more luxury comfort, right?

The air conditioning might be blown colder.

Soft, more plush.

But look, at the end of the day, everyone has it's something for

everyone, right?

And you don't have to choose.

So I'm glad you actually didn't choose a specific one because

obviously there is no, there is no right answer.

There shouldn't be.

There shouldn't be lines drawn between, oh, I'm a BMW guy.

I feel like that's more of a modern thing.

You know, I feel like we're all older.

So we just appreciate cars, right?

Like you see a cause worth and you're like, oh, it's a Mercedes

though.

You're like, dude, that's a sick car, you know?

But I feel like it's like a newer where it's like, oh,

you'll see a lot of modern BMWs would like buy AMG or ha ha

AMG.

And it's like, why?

Why are we, you know, we don't need to have, there's no point

in having a rivalry.

I think if you're German engineering, you're, you're a home.

Yeah.

No, no, no, no.

Like there's, there's a marrying cars.

I like, you know, like, I mean, I drive a Ford every day,

but like, you know, I, I think we need to be more appreciative

of just being a car person, you know, like just, just,

you know, like that's a cool car.

Like there's never, I don't see someone's car.

I'm like, oh, that's, oh, what is that?

Oh, that's a Hellcat.

Oh, that's good.

You know, like,

Where do we expect all builds, bro?

No, just like, there's certain things about certain

cars.

Like, would I own one?

Probably not, but I'm not going to hate on it just because

I'm not, you know, I don't have one or wasn't into it,

you know, but

That takes me back to, oh, Roy remembers, remember

back in the nineties when you would see the Calvin

like peeing on the other brand.

Yeah.

Like you're driving a Mercedes, Calvin's peeing on

a BMW assemble.

Yeah.

That was, that was like, it was a wild time.

Yeah.

We got to bring it back.

Yeah.

Love a cartoon of Josh.

Yeah.

Like just peeing, like you had a Honda and your,

your Calvin was peeing on like a Toyota.

Like, I don't like Toyota's, man.

Yeah.

Like my Calvin sticker.

Honda's a lie.

You know what I feel?

Ask Calvin.

Yeah.

If you look at analog and grit, right?

Look at the members here.

Everyone has a wide variety of cars, right?

There's, there's Alfa Romeo's, there's Porsche's,

Audi's, Volkswagen, literally every single brand,

JDM American.

So like, when you think about it,

like we're a good representation of what the

car enthusiast community should look like.

Oh yeah.

Right.

So can't hate on that.

Before we wrap up, we got about 20 minutes.

I want to talk about values, right?

So let's go down the list here.

I want to get your guesses, right?

We'll start with E30 since it's the,

the first M3.

What do you guys think is the value,

average value, right?

And we're only talking coops with the manual.

So when you're thinking of the other M3s,

just think of coop manual, right?

Cause that's the ultimate one, Josh.

I understand.

You know, Cabriolets aren't worth as much.

What do you think the E30 M3 average price is?

So not the highest price, the average price.

50 grand.

Yeah.

He's like, I'll give him, no.

So the E30 M3, that's a,

that's a wild example to start with.

Because as we were discussing Mike and I earlier,

that thing is all over the map.

If we're talking about current 2025 values,

I would say minimum.

Um, and, and not even discussing salvage title

or, or broken motor cars.

If you're talking about a running,

driving, clean title E30 M3,

you're looking at at least 75 grand.

You know, minimum.

I'm not, I'm not gonna say anything.

I want you guys to guess first.

Go ahead.

And that, and that's like you,

that's like a friend of a friend of a friend.

You're lucky.

Yeah.

You got a good price.

Yeah.

You got like, that's like,

if you don't buy it today,

then you, you missed a boat.

Yeah.

It's going to bring a trailer for 100 grand.

Yeah.

100 grand.

So like, I would say 100 grand,

you know, for,

100 grand.

I'd say 60s.

Mid 60s is probably average.

Okay.

Just to, cause we were talking,

there's the, you know,

basket case.

Oh, I found this E30 with not a running motor,

but it has parts of a motor for 25,000,

but it needs paint.

Yeah.

Not, not to argue,

but I would say if,

if you can't call it E30 M3,

like running, driving, clean title,

60 grand and average price.

Correct.

Because if we,

if you showed me a $60,000 clean title,

running, driving M3 today,

we would all collectively buy it today.

Oh, right.

That, that wouldn't be average.

That would be low.

Yeah.

I'm just saying based on a search,

it's probably going to,

it's not going to put all that into account.

So just to answer his question.

Yeah.

I got you.

All right.

So you said mid 60,

mid 60, mid 60.

Roy, what do you got?

I'm going to go with 75.

75?

Yeah.

And the winner,

well you should have stuck to your guns

because you said 75.

Average price is 74,150.

Wow.

50 grand.

Take it away.

Oh, I'm bad.

I'm 35.

Roamed it and got it.

I'll give him 20 grand.

It was, it was already too much for Roan.

Yeah.

He could have gone on some long tangent.

He would have gone on some long tangent.

My bad.

Well, the evos are all over 100.

Right?

Yeah.

You know that.

So, yeah.

74,150 for an 87 and 91 M3 coupe.

So that's obviously the highest

of the three.

Right?

So, yeah.

You should have stuck to your guns.

You had it at 75.

100,000 probably for like the most,

because when you look at what they do is

they comprise all the data from cars and

bids, bring a trailer,

Haggerty Marketplace.

The prices within the last year or two

have gone down.

Yeah.

Oh, they were a lot more.

And it is down if you look at the metric

there.

Last year was wild.

Yeah.

So maybe last year,

two years ago, 100 grand.

Yeah.

And I think they're still going down.

So maybe in another year or two,

they'll be back down to 65 or something.

Why did I even invest in this building?

That's a car you're having for life.

Yeah.

That's your car.

Yeah, you'd never do wrong.

Yeah.

That's why Ethan, my son's like,

no, you got to make it slick top.

Because it had a center if I'm like,

nope, just got to be slick top for me.

All right.

Let's move on to E36.

So what do you guys think a manual

coupe M3 E36 goes for?

With AC.

Ice cold AC.

Rome here.

I think 35 grand.

I think you're high.

Wow.

Yeah.

I'll come in.

So this is clean top.

These are all clean title, right?

Yeah.

Average price.

Dude, 20.

20?

Yeah.

Okay.

You said 35.

I'm going to cut the middle.

I said 25.

25,000.

24,800.

What do you got?

Where's the mileage going on this?

It doesn't matter.

So like I said, it's average price.

It's going to take all the listings of sold data.

Right.

And it's going to comprise that into an average price.

So average mileage on that car is probably 100,000 miles.

Yeah.

I'm going to go with 18.

18,000.

Yeah.

Just because of how the markets kind of dropped on cars.

Okay.

So I'll go with 18.

What are you at makes?

I said 24,800.

And you're doing $1.

He goes by prices right rules.

Yeah.

So if you go over your DQ.

$1.

Yeah.

You said 35.

You said 20.

I said 20.

And you said 18.

He wins.

Mike.

What is it?

$28,000.

Oh, nice.

Yeah.

$28,000.

Dang.

Why did I sign over the title already?

Raining BMW champs.

Yeah.

And these are going up.

So the indicator here is that they're going up, which they are.

Because if you look at what I was telling you about earlier,

that got appraised, I was shocked.

Low mileage examples are hard to find.

Oh yeah.

Shout out to Roy for selling me that E36 M3 so cheap.

You're welcome.

Yeah.

So you feel good now?

And just throwing a bunch of parts too?

Yeah.

He's like about those carbon door panels.

Yeah.

You want to get them out of the LR4 before I leave?

Yeah.

So 27,865, it's green with the arrow going up.

So that's indicating that it's increasing in value.

But real quick, let's talk about it.

Why do you think they're going up in value?

I think it's because the E30 M3 seems almost unattainable

for the majority of people.

I think that's where.

And the platform, honestly, the E36, I've got so much love

for the E36.

Yeah.

They're great cars.

They're handling.

You can work on them.

There's so many parts available for those cars.

Yeah.

I agree with Roy.

That's the next best M3 to the E30 M3.

And so the same thing, I think we're all too young to remember,

but when the E36 M3 came out,

the E30 M3 was like pennies on the dollar.

Nobody wanted it.

They're like, why do I want that old crappy E30

when I can get the E36?

And so now that same phenomenon is happening

to the E36 M3.

I think it's a combination of the E30 M3,

like Roy mentioned, is pretty much unattainable

for most people.

And the E46 is everyone's halo car.

I remember growing up in the car,

earlier on in the car scene,

and the E36 was like the clapped out car

that someone pulled up in the car of me.

And I feel like that's the equivalent to the 996 Porsche.

Like I'm not saying it's the ugly child.

What I'm saying is everyone wanted the E30 M3,

or mainly the E46.

I've never seen the E46 M3.

And I was like, oh my God, that's the car.

And it was in a video game underground,

and so I remember those two cars being like the Mecca.

And then like all the kids were buying up,

you know, the E36 M3's, you know,

cutting the springs and straight piping it.

So I think now it's because I said the attainable car,

kind of like the 996 Porsche is,

whereas like in price range,

people are like, oh, this is affordable.

I can't, I got a nice clean E46 M3's

kind of out of my price range.

Very clean E30 M3's out my price range.

So this is the next big thing.

E36, and they were cheap.

Like, well, and they had automatic versions,

you know, so you can get an automatic sedan for nothing.

You know, for forever, there were two grand, three grand.

So it's like, oh, I can buy an M3,

because a lot of people buy the car

based on it being an M3.

They don't know anything about it other than,

oh, I'm going to buy an M3.

New beer can.

We interrupt this regularly.

Hell, that's the real version.

Not the mock-up.

So for the people who can't see,

Mike Hess Brewery just sent us

the proof of the new Rensoft

for Cartoberfest,

which we're hosting here at InShop

at Analog and Grid headquarters.

And it's got Roy Prince,

E10, his BMW 2002,

on the can per your request.

Yeah, right there on the can.

So you got your own beer now, brother.

Just have his signature on it.

I love what you mentioned,

because I literally said the same exact thing

in the last two episodes of this podcast,

where the 996 got skipped over,

the E36 got skipped over,

because when E30, and then no one was like,

the E36 is like, you know.

I think also the watered-down engine,

that we didn't get the European,

that we didn't get the Euro motor.

Correct, yeah.

Yeah, that hurts too, because it's like,

the S52 was what, 240 horsepower,

and it had the emissions restrictions,

and it just wasn't as powerful.

Also the body, you could take any E36,

get M3 kit, and it could look the same.

So there was a lot of forgery out there.

But it's still an M3, right?

To your point, the 996 is still a 911.

So why am I going to pay double?

We have the Rome discount here.

It's the car that's half the price.

Right, what did we say, 28?

I'm going to have to trademark that now.

The Rome discount.

We're going to have to trademark that.

But like, hey, do you accept the Rome discount here?

Well, what's that? That's half.

Half the price of its predecessor, right?

The E30, which I get.

E30 has the halo effect.

It's a modification special.

Yeah, third of the price.

Well, either way, go ahead.

I wanted you to actually,

I know you were mentioning something.

I think the car has aged well.

The E36 has gone to the point where now it's people like us

that are looking for the nice one.

Because we all know some of these cars can be investments.

And I think the E36 is one that we'll slowly appreciate.

So I think people are looking for low mileage, nice clean examples.

But they're just great cars.

There could be people like, I've never had any 36,

but if I could, I would buy one just because I'm like,

you know, everybody says they're so awesome.

I've driven them on my built-in, but I've never had one.

And they're classic.

I mean, it's a car you really,

with my company's status group, everyone's like,

make E36 parts.

I was like, why?

It looks great.

Like I would put a wing on the lightweight wing

and lower it and it looks great.

You should have still done the UUC version

with the little gurney flap.

We were going to remake something

and make our own risers and stuff.

I don't know if we will, but it's just a great looking car.

I think it's just, it's getting to that point

where it looks really good.

You know, it's like we love the E30 so much.

Now people a little bit younger than us are like,

oh, the E36 is amazing.

I think it's great.

I think the younger generation

gravitating toward analog cars is incredible.

Like the young 20-somethings,

they don't want to drive Teslas.

They don't want to look at screens.

They want to shift.

They want to see gauges.

You know, they want analog stuff, which I love.

So back to the riser thing,

like what would make your risers different

on the LTW wing?

So I was, I was, what was that?

No, so what I was scanning,

I did some 3D scanning of a UUC wing.

And the UUC wing didn't have risers.

So it's just a short wing with a gurney flap.

So I was going to make my own risers for it

and then make our own version of it.

Nice.

And would that gurney flap be adjustable?

Yeah.

It had three different adjustment points.

Oh, incredible.

Because they stopped making it.

So I believe they stopped making it.

We need that.

We need to make that.

So I had a bunch of people like,

they were all excited like,

you're making it?

There's six of them.

I never did it.

Yeah.

We got a reason now.

It's a good point you made with the,

you know, us getting the U.S. version,

which was strangled, right?

The S52, I feel like that was the reason

it got skipped over.

So like the 996 got skipped over

because of headlights, right?

Or the fact that it's now the first,

you know, water cooled, right?

So if you think about it,

they're not valid reasons.

Like, yeah, I guess the engine, right?

We want performance, but it's not like

that car is not reliable, right?

The time difference in those cars,

zero to 60 was barely anything, you know?

But the sound, you know, there was a lot of it,

but I think that was kind of a,

not a made up reason, but you're just like,

oh, we didn't get the good motor.

It's like, how do you know the difference anyways?

You don't, you know?

It's like, there's still a great car.

I remember, I have a core memory of,

I was probably 18, 19,

out of high school, and, you know,

I don't know what I was doing.

It was like midday partying, some,

for some reason, and a buddy who had just,

it was like a buddy's cousin had a super clean silver,

I think it was a silver E36 on Brayton wheels,

you know, exhaust, a whole bunch of stuff,

crazy radio in it.

And he's like, I need you to drive this somewhere.

And I just remember just, I was probably a little drunk,

but I'm just slammed through gear,

driving like an asshole.

And it was amazing.

And the car was like a year old at that point, you know,

they were brand new.

And I'm like, just do you want me to drive this brand new BMW?

And I'm like, all right, whatever, you know,

and just egging me on to drive it.

But that was my first experience in the E36.

And it was awesome.

It was awesome.

And I always loved that wheel too,

the Brayton inspirations on there.

So what do you guys think values for an E46 M3 are?

So let's start guessing.

Point at me.

Mike makes has already been like annihilating the competition.

Manual coupe.

He's brought up is the platform he's most familiar on.

Let's see if he knows it.

You guys go first.

Price is right rules, manual coupe.

So it's more than an E36.

I'm going to go with 50.

52.

Let's call it 52.

35.

37.

36.

One dollar.

35 and one penny.

Honestly, I want to say it's going to be right around the same as the E36.

The values of E46s were crazy two years ago.

But a lot of like the E30, like there was everything was crazy two years ago.

Everything's dropped down.

You said 27 on the E36.

I said 248 on the E36.

I want to say it's under 30 grand.

It's going to be like 28 grand.

Great.

Overbid again.

I'm terrible at this game.

Let's say 28 to 34.

That was the E36 was 28, right?

Yeah.

So what's your what's your number for E46?

28 to 2?

I want to say 28 to 34.

So let's cut the middle 30.

Let's go 30 grand.

30 grand I think is is average price.

He wins again.

Got it.

33.

35.

Look at what I said.

I said 28 to 32.

I said 52.

Yeah.

30.

He said 50.

He's like you want to buy an E46?

Yeah.

So 33.

35.

So going down as you can see for the M3 group.

Yeah.

Price is a drop.

Yeah.

And it's the opposite for the E36.

Prices are rising.

So just to kind of give you reference the SMGs are getting 25.

So you can get an SMG E46 for less than an average E36 manual.

And convertibles Josh 24,000.

They're worth the least.

You can get an SMG convertible 24,000.

Yeah.

SMG convertibles 15 grand.

Yeah.

But all day long.

All day long.

So a manual convertible.

A manual convertible.

I'll convert it for you.

You're good.

There you go.

There's your next convertible.

10 grand less for a manual convertible.

Look at that.

Then the coup.

Come on Rumble.

What are you going to say?

Do it.

All right.

Deal.

Left the rubble on.

Discount.

He ain't feeling well.

Gave the rum discount.

Yeah.

So I want to show you guys a quick chart.

Like this is what it was in 2021.

So average price was about 15,000 for an E36.

Yep.

So you can kind of see like.

Boom.

Yeah.

Look at that.

That's incredible.

Yeah.

Wait.

You see the spike of E46.

E30 phenomenon happening to E36.

Yeah.

It's the next boxiest car that you can get next to the E30.

Now let's see E46.

Yeah.

That's just four years that it's gone up like that.

And I think it's the younger generation that's just like damn.

Like I now I got enough money.

I can get an M3.

Who cares if it's an S52?

Yeah.

Or it's just like us.

It could be us that were like, oh, these things are still cheap and we know the price is going

up.

You know what all of that fall that market crazy.

You know what else is happening?

And like the pop culture and like musicians, you know, there are our age 30s and 40s.

Yeah.

They're using a lot of old cars.

And you see videos.

In the videos.

Yeah.

Well, and like look Radwood.

You know, it's like people are probably buying these cars for certain things, you know,

like, oh, I can't bring my newer cars.

I'll buy another.

I'll buy you older car, mod it up.

Bring it.

Because you almost feel like you're missing out.

You know, you hear about how cool these shows are.

Yeah.

And that's kind of a newer thing.

So Brian Scotto and Jason Whipple, who Jason Whipple was one of the founders of

Rotiform.

Brian Scotto, we all know from Hoonigan.

They have a secret Volkswagen show that they're going to be doing.

Yeah.

If you're not a complete douche and you want to come here, just send me a DM.

Yeah.

Tell us why you should come.

Yeah.

It should be cool.

So I think that's kind of a, not a new thing, but I think there's, there's people who

are influential are going to be starting doing similar things like that.

Just kind of bringing back, you know, cause like I know and Brian, Brian from forever

going Volkswagen days in the Northeast.

But we had like such a cool scene.

You know, I feel like that's lost.

We don't have that scene anymore.

Like even the BMW scene, it's cool.

But it's like, if you don't have a G80 on HRE wheels, it's like, oh, or BBS is your car

is not cool anymore.

You see them all.

Yeah.

And it's like no one's doing something different.

Cool stuff.

You know?

And it's like, like, so I made, shout out to my own brand, Grail brand, but we made

a grill for the, for the G80s to make it look like the older cars splits across

the center.

It's paintable.

It's interchangeable.

You can have different options and stuff.

At first I was upset because it wasn't like taking off.

People weren't buying it.

I was like, what?

And, and I'm realizing it's, it's not ahead of its time, but it's just so different.

That's why people aren't into it, you know, cause it's like, well, this doesn't,

this isn't that carbon CSL style grill.

Why is it, you know, like why it's, it's like, it's almost, it hurts their

brain because it's different, you know?

But that's why you're here.

You're here to hurt brains.

Yeah.

So I'm like, and so I don't get upset because I made it because I wanted to

you know, it's like, cool.

I think it looks cool.

The cars I put on it looks cool, but, but I think that, that's lost now.

Like this, everybody's building cars to impress people, but they're building

the same cars everybody else.

Same car.

Yeah.

Same, same stuff.

But I think maybe it's not lost.

Maybe it's coming back.

I hope.

But we, we hit the friendships we had were wild, you know?

And I don't know if these people, like the newer BMWs have that

friendship, you know?

It's like, they go to the car shows and then they're like just

sitting there and it's like, walk around, meet some people, talk to

people, you know?

And it's like, or they're like, they'll see someone they know from

the internet and they won't talk to him in person and they'll

message them after.

Like what?

Yeah.

Dude, you kind of walked up and talked to the dude.

I love how you mentioned that.

I went to a car event.

I'm not going to say which one it was, but it went to a car

event and I was, it was myself and another vintage car,

classic car.

That was it.

Everything else was all newer Porsches, G80s, F80s.

And they were actually like doing votes on what car did they,

Dean was like the best looking car.

And I'm not big on like the whole trophy thing.

And I ended up pulling out way before they started this stuff.

And my girl was like, why did you leave?

I was like, no one cares about these old cars and you're

mixed in with all the newer modern stuff.

I'm not saying the modern tech and modern cars aren't

cool.

Oh, they're great.

I love them, you know?

That being my thing.

But like we mentioned before, the G80s great, the F80s great,

the E90.

I had two of them, two E90 and three.

They're all great.

But like once you do one, you do them all.

And like you have to do like the subtle Volkswagen thing is do

little things and make a change.

But if I see a G80 on HREs or BBSs, that's maybe a manual

and it has carbon, no lip and a, you know, trunk lid.

You're like, okay.

Yeah.

I've seen that 800.

Yeah.

It's like Skittles.

Open a bag of Skittles.

Right.

With some little, you know, you know, gooping in between.

I feel like it's kind of the same thing.

That's why I kind of like, like Josh likes to harp on,

like driving just driving classic.

There's so much character behind it.

And they're easier to fix.

You were feeling like the Sauer Skittle then.

I was.

Very sour.

Very sour, very bitter.

But it's funny because you talked about people don't talk

to people at these events.

When I left a couple of people DM me like, dude, we had

voted your car.

Like you left.

I was like, well, y'all were the two of those.

I appreciate it.

I know that's for the love.

Yeah.

Half of you didn't come talk to me.

Yeah.

Come say what's up.

And I was standing here in the heat and dying, you know.

But it's one of those things that I like now when people

are starting to get back into these old cars and really

appreciate them.

It's funny.

My son, who's about to join the military himself,

when I bought him his FRS, he, I was trying to buy

him a 2002.

Because I was the first car he learned to drive

manual and it was my old Malaga red one.

And he was like, I don't want to drive that old

thing.

And then he, I got an FRS manual.

I put wheels and suspension and the whole nine

on it.

So he was stunting in school.

And literally two weeks later, he called me and

was like, I wish I would have got that 2002.

Yeah.

I'm like, why is this?

Because he probably sees a bunch of FRS guys.

Yeah, that was exactly what it was.

That was his friends.

He could stand out with a cool car.

His friends were in his ear like, you don't

want to drive that old thing.

But he was the only kid driving a cool car.

Technically all his friends had like, you know,

fusions and poor fusions and whatever else,

like, you know, Camry's not saying those aren't

bad cars.

That's why the FRS was a flex.

Yeah.

It was a flex for him.

But he felt like he blended in with everyone

else.

He was like, man, the 2002 is fun.

I'm like, yeah, the caveat is you won't have AC.

You know?

And you're in Alabama.

It won't be hard.

Yeah.

And the value goes up.

But he didn't see that.

No, not at his age.

No, no, no.

No.

All right.

Well, Josh, you want to take us home with

you?

You mentioned Cartoba Fest coming up soon.

What's the dates on that?

Yeah.

So we're going to do Cartoba Fest here at

Analog and Grid headquarters.

It is going to be on the 25th of October here

at 3025 Commercial Street.

And we're going to have beer from Mike Hess.

We're going to have cars, bring your German

car.

It really doesn't matter if you got a German

beer to hang out and have fun.

We're going to have food.

We're going to have beer.

We're going to have music.

Or if you bring, if you show up in an

Endurndl, which is the traditional German

dress or Liederhosen, then you drink for free.

So people say, I'm not dressing up.

But then when you say there's free beer,

then people are like, oh, yeah.

Honey, where's my Liederhosen?

I'm on Amazon right now.

I'm looking for one.

I'm going to get it.

Yeah.

Pointy boots.

Here I come.

That's funny.

That's a good one.

So throw your feather in your cap.

Come down.

Yeah.

See what we're all about on October 25th.

That's a Saturday.

And it's going to be great.

Last year we had it at Mike Hess and Alpine,

which is great.

This time we're going to have it in-house.

We got quite a bit more room here.

And it's going to be incredible.

Yeah.

You don't want to miss it.

Awesome.

Also, we have a Dodge Viper that we wanted

to talk about that we have for sale.

Not on that note.

Not German.

Speaking of not anything that has to do

with anything, analog and grip marketplace,

we got a Viper.

It's a sapphire blue Dodge Viper 2001.

It's got 30,000 miles.

The car of your dreams can be had now.

Wow.

Speaking of German, we have this Viper for sale.

Das Viper.

It is a beautiful spec.

Cognac interior on that navy blue exterior.

That's cool.

It has the more modern rims because it's pretty much

was that last year of the GTS.

01.

It's got to be somewhere around there.

I don't know.

Let's defer to our...

So that's live now for sale on analog and grip marketplace.

Awesome.

Well, look, thank you guys for joining the show.

Roy.

Thanks for having us.

Mike.

Ron as always.

This was fun.

Josh, as always, of course,

until next week on the analog and grip podcast.

Cool.

Nice job, boys.

Thanks.

BMW E36

BMW M3

Ford F150

Shelby GT500

Ford Bronco

BMW E28

Mercedes-Benz 190E

Bmw 2

Honda Crx

Audi Tt

BMW Z3

Porsche 911

Challenger Hellcat

Scion Frs

Toyota Camry

Dodge Viper

About this episode

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