Here, “defection” doesn’t mean someone is lost forever. It means a shopper you were contacting bought from another dealership instead. The idea is to treat it like useful information, not just a mistake.
Urban Science is a company that provides dealership-focused data. In this episode, they’re presented as helping dealers spot when a customer bought from another brand or store.
They’re saying older reports (like data that’s a month or more behind) aren’t very helpful. If you learn about the customer’s purchase too late, you can’t respond effectively.
“Lost customers” are people who came looking at your dealership but ended up buying from someone else. The goal is to figure out why they left so you can bring them back with better service and follow-up.
“Lead sources” are the different channels or origins where shoppers come from (e.g., specific campaigns, websites, or referral paths). The segment explains that dealers may dismiss certain sources too quickly, but the data can reveal whether those shoppers are actually buying and whether follow-up processes are needed.
“Traffic view” is presented as a solution feature that helps dealers break down lead sources and see what’s actually happening in their market. The speaker emphasizes starting with a broad look (first month) and then drilling down to identify which sources are real opportunities versus noise.
Concept
days to
The speaker begins introducing “days to” as a metric shown in their solution (likely related to time-to-purchase or time-to-appointment). In dealer marketing analytics, time-based metrics help identify how quickly leads convert and where delays or drop-offs occur.
Follow-up is how you contact someone after they first show interest. This part is saying that most teams don’t follow up as long as they think, and that you can measure when it starts to hurt results.
They’re saying that customers still want a real person involved. Even if you use tech to help, the relationship and personal communication matter.
Concept
AI as a partner (not replacement)
They’re saying AI can help with tasks, but it shouldn’t replace people. Customers still want real human help, especially when they’re upset or need understanding.
Sometimes people worry that if they keep contacting you, it will feel annoying. The point here is that you can follow up in a way that’s helpful, not pushy.
They’re offering a small free service (like the first couple oil changes) to make it easier for the customer to try the shop. It’s a way to get them in the door and start building trust.
Dealers often have two big money areas: selling cars and running the service/parts side. This segment is saying the service/parts side can help bring customers back instead of letting them disappear.
A “reactivation driver” is an activity or department that brings lapsed customers back into the dealership relationship. In this segment, fixed operations (service/parts) are framed as the lever that reactivates customers and keeps them from going fully to a competitor.
“Building back sales” refers to regaining lost revenue by re-engaging customers who previously stopped purchasing. The speaker ties it to reconnecting after service visits and using feedback to improve the next interaction.
“Surveying” means collecting structured feedback from customers during the reactivation process. The episode suggests surveys help identify specific reasons for churn (missed calls, unanswered questions) so the dealership can correct behavior and improve retention.
“Data activated human response” describes using customer data to trigger timely, personalized outreach—rather than relying on generic marketing. The speaker highlights the balance: data informs the action, but the response should still feel human and tailored.
Term
LinkedIn
LinkedIn is a website/app where professionals connect and share updates. The guest is just giving a way to find them online.
LIVE
All right, gang, welcome back to this episode of the Dealer Playbook podcast. I have my
good pal here, Christine Lentz, the product operations manager at Urban Science. Thanks
for joining me. I'm so excited we get to do this in person.
I know this is the funnest thing ever.
What in the world? Okay, can you believe it? It's like when you only get to talk to people
online, we're all Mozart. We're all from here up. So it's like, oh, good, you walk.
I'm a real person. And you're a real person. Okay, I want to get right into this with you,
because there's so many things that I want to pick your brain on. The first one is when dealers
hear the word defection. They often think failure. Why is this the wrong way to look at it?
So first of all, I think they need to know what defection is. Tell me. So let's break that down,
first of all. So all dealers, they're working a bunch of leads. And this is a collection of leads
that is in their CRM, they're probably still following up with, that's actually purchased
elsewhere at a competitor. So that's an affection as it is. Right. And why they need to know about
this is, right? I think the first thing is knowing about what an affection is. The second part is
really, what are you going to do about it? And what you're going to do about it is you need to,
first of all, know from Urban Science. Urban Science has something special. So I know everyone
says that, but we really do. And so I always say, everybody give us a minute, let us tell you,
we have our data hub. And what it has is we have sales data that we get every night from all the
major OEMs. So that's exclusive to us. You know, we're not looking at data that's 30, 60 or 90
days old. This is so lead in your CRM that purchased at a competitor yesterday. So that's
really the huge thing about what Urban Science can provide you. That's nowhere else, right? These
are exclusive contracts we have at the OEMs. And so when you have that, you're able to see
Sally Sue. It's the name I always make up. Sally Sue's in your CRM. Do you have a voice for Sally
Sue? I'm sorry, I have to ask. I don't, but maybe I could make one for you. By the end of this show,
we're going to have a voice for Sally Sue. Sally needs a voice. She needs a voice. And I thank you
for advocating for her because she is always here with us. And so you're getting the sales day at
exclusive to Urban Science. You brought up, okay, well, what do we do with it? Yes. What do we do
with it? What do we do with it? Right? We need to find out. So when we know these people have
purchased elsewhere, and it happens for a couple different reasons. So the first reason, right,
it could be price inventory. And then what we do with it is we can actually start breaking down
those processes and understand where that leak is. So we break it down by sources. So there's
sources that you might think, Hey, these are, you know, not great. We don't even do anything with
these. We throw those leads aside. We'll show you, Hey, are these people actually buying and do I need
to have a follow up process for this? That is better to actually, you know, demonstrate what is
going on with there. It's actually a good lead source, which I've, I will tell you, I've had
dealers when they start with us on traffic view, that's when they can break it down and actually
see everything in there. They'll say, cut out these lead sources, don't even show me them.
I don't even want to know about them. Like, I just want to see what the real meat and potatoes is.
And I always tell them, like, give me a minute, let me show you, let's just look at it all the
first month, right? And then we'll dive into it. And then we'll see there's a huge percentage of
these leads that actually are purchasing living in their backyard, purchasing at a dealership
farther away from them, which is crazy, right? Which is interesting, because, you know, often
we'll hear about the pump in pump out report, where is the defection happening? But it's such a
limited piece of information because it's just numbers on a map. And we're like, Oh, shoot,
well, you know, people on the fringe of my primary market area actually bought from one of my
competitors. And sometimes it's like, yeah, because they were actually closer, even though they
were teched between your primary market area. So my question for you is, with the information
that you're able to see what the data you're getting nightly from all of the OEMs,
what changes when dealers can actually see where and why defection happens versus just kind of an
ambiguous number? One of my favorite things that we show in our solution traffic view is days to
sale. This is always one that like makes sales managers, you know, fall out of their chair.
But we know that the follow up process with salespeople isn't usually as long as we want it
to be, right? And so what we can break down is we look at a lead from the day it comes in,
all the way to day 90, right? And then we can see when you've made your sales on that chart,
when you lost sales to same brand, and when you lost sales to competitors. And so when you
match that with your sales process, you can say, okay, you know, we typically, you know,
drop off on day five, everybody wants to say we reach out forever, right? But let's be real,
you don't reach out forever. And maybe your salespeople start dropping off a little bit,
you know, day three, day four, whatever. And then we can see a spike. It's like eight to 14 is
usually the sweet spot of when defection is just huge. And so it really can help you to understand
maybe, you know, everyone's talking about AI, we're at NADA right now. Yes, please tell me.
So AI is like, I think I've heard it nine million times today, just, yeah, maybe just,
but it has been crazy. And so when we're implementing these tools, AI is great when you
know when to use it. And so that days to sale chart, like I was telling you, you need to know
what days that that, you know, automated AI thing needs to jump in in order to
actually fill those gaps, right? You know, salespeople are getting tired. They don't need
to reach out nine million times, but give the tools an actual timeline that's going to make
sense and going to make a change. Okay, this is, this is super interesting to me. I've been taking
a few notes. So, oh my gosh, AI nine million times a day. What to do with it? Where do,
where do we actually inject this? Because my, here's my worry, Christine. People are like,
yeah, you know what, if I'm being honest, I do only follow up for three days and I'm losing so
many opportunities, but I can only imagine your data is showing us how much people actually would
appreciate if you tried following up with them longer than three to five days. What are you seeing?
Yes, that is totally true. The personal touch of it and the relationship building
aspect is always going to be important. There's never a time I believe that we're not going to
need that. AI is amazing and it's supposed to be our partner. I don't think it's supposed to be our
replacement, right? Did you hear that? Did you, did you hear that? It's not meant to be our replacement.
Do you think a time's coming? This is our off brand question. I mean, do you think there is a time
coming when it will replace or what's your view on the human experience as a part of this whole
thing? So I've worked in multiple different parts of our company. I've been here now at Urban Science
for six years and I've had five different roles there in that time. They have been too good to me
and I started off on our support team. When you call into us, you actually talk to somebody
that's real every time. When you chat in, you chat into a person and I can't tell you how many times
people start spamming us and we're like, no, I'm here. I'm real. And it's 9 30 at night and I'm
trying to do a piano lesson. So you know, but how much relief they have when they're like,
somebody hears my concern and someone's going to do something about it and sometimes you just
need to vent to somebody about it and be an ear. Is that the empathy thing you think? It is. Yep.
And then you can give it to AI to solve. You don't have to do everything. I can't believe I just said
the empathy thing. Yes, you don't have to do everything, right? So AI is good for some things,
but when push comes to shove, what I'm hearing you say is there is something inherently comforting
about knowing someone else. Some other autonomous figure is actually
Yes. Kiran Meow. Yeah, 100%. 100%. And everybody wants to have somebody empathize with them,
wants to have a conversation. And like I said, sometimes you just need to vent it out and say,
Michael, I am so upset about today. Let me tell you about it for 20 minutes. And then
go and solve it for me, please. And come back with a response that's going to help that money.
What's the biggest fear you see with dealers who now have access to defection data? They
understand the why and the what. What's the biggest fear they're expressing to you?
So fear, I think the fear comes at the beginning even before they can see the defection data.
Once we get people in to actually look at the data, it guides them to results so quickly that
there's not much fear, but I think it's the ego in some of that. It's hard to say and I always say,
I compare it to a test. It's like after you fail the test, you don't want to look at it because
you're like, I know what I already heard that I failed, right? I don't want to see all the answers
I did wrong, but you need to. You need to know that. And that's what's going to help you to win
tomorrow. When you realize, hey, it was a question B and I didn't study long enough on this subject.
It's the same thing with those leads, right? We didn't follow up long enough or I didn't have
enough of that information. I didn't make a connection with this customer. We need to
diagnose that in order to do something different tomorrow. You're making me think of something
that I've heard once, which I love the perspective, which is that there's a real fear of being too
aggressive. But then there's this mindset, which I really appreciate, which is it would be a disservice
to you, the customer, to not get to experience working with our store. It would be a disservice.
That's the biggest, the biggest issue. What's your, what's your take on that?
So I have a great take on that, but what I would say actually is I think of defection as at the end
of the sale. If you put yourself in the customer's shoes, right? And you've already purchased
elsewhere and I keep telling you, hey, come check out this new vehicle. You're like,
leave me alone. Get off my back. Get away from it. Stop bothering me. And so if I continue to do that,
defection is going to open that door for you to say, hey, this person has purchased somewhere else.
Let me stop wasting energy on them. Let me stop bothering them. And what some of our customers
who have done, who have really made some success here is they've switched to service. And so then
they can say, Hey, I'll give you the first, you know, two oil changes for free. If you come to us,
we know that we're closer to you because this is the kind of information we can give you with
our defection data. We know that you live maybe closer to me. And I know that you just bought
the same brand. We can service you. Come in for your first two services for free. And then we
can start building that relationship, right? Yeah. Then you're like, Hey, I trust you. I'm a
person. You came in. This is something. Yes. Oh my gosh, this is something that I've been
thinking about so much lately. And you're striking a cord, Christine Lentz, which is the driver of
all of the conversations tend to be around variable operations. Fixed operations can be a real
reactivation driver. Yes. It can be an acquisition driver. It can be, oh my gosh, it can be the
thing that drives people right back into variable. And so you're bringing this up. And I'm like,
Oh my gosh, this is an unlock. People need to be paying attention to. Fixed is not the
awkward step, Simway. Yeah. These two departments need to really work hand in hand. And if I'm
hearing you correctly, tell me if this tracks, you can use fixed ops as the reactivator.
It is. Yeah. And that's how you continue that relationship. I think defection doesn't mean
goodbye forever. It doesn't mean that this is a total loss and it has to be doom and gloom and
sadness. But it is if you don't do anything about it. Right. If you take that action, you do something
with it, you learn for the next time and you connect with them, that customer again, we've
seen tons of our customers do this. And they actually are building back sales, building back
relationships and even surveying through that time. Right. So they say, Hey, you know, you came in
for that oil change. Maybe this is the third one. You know, Hey, how did we lose you? And then
they're actually getting real answers from their customers on like, you know, your salesperson
didn't even answer what I was asking them. Right. Or, Hey, they, you know, didn't answer my call
and I needed something. Right. So I went to this other store and said, and they answered right away
and I got what I needed. So all of those things can come in and the more information we have,
the better we can do. Data activated human response. Yes. Oh my gosh. I can't take out the human part.
Can't take out the human part. This has been so delightful. How can those listening and watching
connect with you? So you can connect with me on LinkedIn. My name is Christine Lenz. And then you
can also connect with Urban Science. We have our own LinkedIn page and you can also go to
UrbanScience.com. Christine Lenz, thanks so much for joining me on the Dealer Playbook podcast.
Thank you so much for having me. It's great to see you. Hey, thanks for listening to the
Dealer Playbook podcast. If you enjoyed tuning in, please subscribe, share and hit that like button.
You can also join us and the DPV community on social media. Check back next week for a new
About this episode
Urban Science’s Kristine Lentz reframes “defection” as a diagnostic opportunity, not a failure—customers who bought elsewhere can be tracked in near real time using OEM sales data delivered nightly. She explains how Urban Science’s Traffic View breaks defection down by lead source and, crucially, by days-to-sale to pinpoint when follow-up drops off (often around days 8–14). Lentz argues AI should fill timing gaps, while humans provide empathy and relationship-building. She also highlights using fixed operations to win back lost customers through service offers and feedback loops.
Is your dealership losing customers you thought were gone for good? Every automotive professional knows the sting of a "lost" sale, but what if those defections weren't permanent goodbyes, but instead, opportunities for powerful comebacks through fixed operations?
In this episode, Kristine Lentz, Product Operations Manager at Urban Science, reveals how using precise data can transform your view of customer defection from a failure to a strategic advantage.
What you will get from this episode:
Understand why traditional "defection" metrics might be leading you astray.
Discover how leveraging sales data can pinpoint exactly why and when customers leave.
Learn how to use fixed ops as a potent reactivation tool for "lost" customers.
Redefine your follow-up strategies to recapture customers and build lasting relationships.
Strategically deploy AI in your sales process to close crucial gaps.
Kristine Lentz is the Product Operations Manager at Urban Science, bringing years of expertise in leveraging data to drive actionable insights and improve dealer performance.
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