TFL Talkin' Trucks Dec 12, 2025

Ep. 309: Are Sport Trucks Making A Comeback? Truck King Weighs In!

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Car

Ford F-150 Raptor

The Ford F-150 Raptor is a special version of the F-150 truck that is built for driving on rough terrain and is more powerful than regular F-150s.

Car

The Ford Raptor Ranger is a tough version of the Ford Ranger truck that's made for driving on rough roads and trails. People like to talk about it because it's built for adventure and has a strong engine.

Term

off-road

Off-road means driving on rough surfaces like dirt or rocks instead of smooth roads. Vehicles designed for off-road can handle these tough conditions better.

Car

Chevrolet K10

The Chevrolet K10 is a tough pickup truck that was made in the 1980s. It's known for being good at driving off-road, even if it's not the best for regular roads.

Company

BFG

BFG is short for BFGoodrich, a company that makes tires. They are known for making good tires for trucks that drive off-road.

Term

$115,000 Canadian

$115,000 Canadian means that the truck costs a lot of money, showing that it's a luxury vehicle with many features.

Car

Toyota Rav4

The Toyota RAV4 is a small SUV that's great for families because it has a lot of space inside and is good on gas. People like to talk about it because it's reliable and can handle different types of driving.

Car

Jeep Wrangler

The Jeep Wrangler Sport S is a type of Jeep that's designed for off-road driving. It's a two-door model that comes with basic features, making it a good option for people who like to explore rough terrains.

Car

Gm Sierra

Car

Gmc Sierra

Car

GMC Sierra EV

The GMC Sierra EV 84 is a new electric pickup truck from GMC. It's designed to be powerful and efficient, using electricity instead of gasoline, which is better for the environment.

Car

Rivian R1S

The Rivian R1S is a new electric SUV that can go off-road and is made for outdoor adventures. It has a lot of modern technology and space inside for passengers and gear.

Car

Rivian

Rivian is a company that makes electric trucks and SUVs. The R1T is their pickup truck model, which is built for both city driving and off-road adventures.

Term

independent suspension

Independent suspension means that each wheel on a car can move up and down separately. This helps the car handle better and makes the ride smoother.

Term

skid plates

Skid plates are strong plates that protect the bottom of a car from getting damaged when driving over rocks or rough ground. They help keep important parts safe.

Term

ground clearance

Ground clearance is how high the bottom of a car is from the ground. More height means the car can go over bumps and rocks without getting stuck.

Term

horsepower

Horsepower tells you how powerful an engine is. The higher the horsepower, the faster and more powerful the car can be.

Term

EV

An EV, or Electric Vehicle, runs on electricity instead of gasoline. This means it can be better for the environment and can save money on fuel.

Term

four-wheel drive

Four-wheel drive means that power from the engine goes to all four wheels of the car. This helps the car grip the road better, especially in bad weather like snow or mud.

Term

transfer case

A transfer case is a part of a four-wheel drive system that helps send power to the front and back wheels. It helps the car handle different types of terrain and conditions.

Term

PTU

PTU means Power Take-Off Unit, which is a part that helps send power from the engine to the wheels in cars that can drive all four wheels. It helps the car grip the road better.

Brand

Land Rover

Land Rover is a car brand that makes SUVs, which are vehicles designed for both on-road and off-road driving. They are known for their ability to handle tough conditions like snow.

Term

drive modes

Drive modes are settings in a car that change how it drives. They can make the car feel sportier or more comfortable, depending on what you choose. Knowing how to use them can help you drive better in different situations.

Car

Nissan Frontier

The Nissan Frontier is a type of truck that can handle tough jobs and off-road driving. The 2026 version has new settings to help it drive better in different situations.

Concept

mid-sized trucks

Mid-sized trucks are pickup trucks that are not too big or too small, making them easier to drive and park while still being able to carry things.

Part

locking differential

A locking differential helps both wheels on a car's axle turn together, which is useful for driving on rough or slippery surfaces.

Term

rear differential

The rear differential is a part of a car that helps the back wheels turn at different speeds, which is important when going around corners or driving on rough ground.

Term

Baja mode

Baja mode helps cars perform better when driving off-road, especially in sandy or bumpy areas. It makes the car more responsive and easier to control in tough conditions.

Term

over the air updates

Over the air updates are like software updates for your phone, but for cars. They let you download new features or fixes directly to your vehicle without going to a repair shop.

Car

Honda Stream

The Honda Stream is a small family car that has a lot of room inside for passengers and cargo. People like to talk about it because it's practical and good for everyday use.

Car

Tesla Cybertruck

Car

Chevrolet Silverado EV

The Silverado EV is an electric truck made by Chevrolet. It's designed to be more environmentally friendly than regular trucks that run on gasoline.

Car

Lucid Air

The Lucid Air is a fancy electric car that can go really far on a charge and has lots of luxury features. People mention it because it's a strong competitor to other electric cars like Tesla.

Car

Tesla Model S

The Tesla Model S is a fancy electric car that can go really far on a single charge and is super fast. People mention it because it's a popular choice for those who want a high-tech car that can also tow things.

Term

Airstream

Airstream is a brand of shiny silver trailers that people use for camping. They're known for being sturdy and have a unique look.

Car

Tesla Model 3

The Tesla Model 3 is a smaller and cheaper electric car compared to the Model S, but it still has great features and can go a long way on a charge. It's popular because it's a good option for people who want to drive electric without spending too much.

Car

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Stephen, my friend, long time no see, I'm super excited for this episode of TFL Talking

Trucks.

Yeah, nice to see you, buddy.

Thanks for having me on and hello to all the TFL viewers and listeners, and I'm sure

some of you out there are familiar with me from my time with TFL, and yeah, glad

to be back.

Hell yeah.

If you're just listening to us to this podcast, we have Stephen Elmer from Truck King as a

guest on this particular episode, and the real topic is behind the scenes of truck testing.

You do a heck of a lot of testing in Canada, and you do off-road testing and also towing

with pickup trucks and SUVs.

We do something very similar, but kind of in a different environment, right?

We're here in the Rocky Mountains of Colorado, which is a lot of it is pretty dry out here,

as you know.

Also, I just wanted to catch up with you, because I haven't talked to you in detail

in quite some time, dude.

Yeah, man, yeah, and we've been busy.

We've been running things off-road and towing and doing all that proper truck testing

over here on the channel.

I got three little ones keeping me busy, too, who are all under the age of seven.

So yeah, I'm doing the dad thing right now.

You also had an amazing family trip, right?

Just very recently with your dad and your son.

We did, yeah.

In October, we loaded up an F-150 Raptor, and we drove from our house just outside

of Toronto, Ontario, down to Lake Havasu City, Arizona for the Ford Raptor rally.

Essentially, this is an event for Raptor owners.

There was like 400 Raptor owners there.

They come from all over the country, too.

There was one other Canadian there, actually.

They were from Elliott Lake, Ontario, which is even further north than where we are.

So that was cool.

And then people from all over the states, Michigan, Washington, New York, you name

a state.

There was somebody there from it.

So that was really cool.

And yeah, man, we had an epic road trip.

Like you said, it was my mom, my dad, and my son Otis, four of us all in one

truck seeing the heartland of America.

And I've traveled a ton for this job.

I'm lucky, but there was still a bunch of places I went to.

I'd never been before, like Oklahoma and the Panhandle of Texas.

So yeah, it was cool, man.

And we got to see the Raptor do what I think the Raptor does best, which is on

a long road trip, it's so nice and comfortable.

And then you get out in the desert and it absolutely rips.

So we really got to experience that.

Yeah, because people talk about capability of pickup trucks, specifically like

an F-1 GT Raptor, right?

Big tires, big shocks and big suspension.

But it's also a great cruiser, right?

I mean, it just cruises.

It's crazy.

And I feel like so often these days in every video I make, I'm talking about how

there's less compromise than ever, right?

Like we're just so lucky now that you can get a vehicle that's so good off-road

and on-road.

There was the time when, yeah, you'd live with it on-road because it was so

good off-road.

And that still exists in some places.

When I get in big green, yeah, that exists.

You know, it's not a great truck to drive on-road, my old 85 K10.

But it's worth it for the off-road, where now you get in a modern truck,

you don't give up anything on-road, man.

Even with 35s on it, even with 37s on it, like the BFGs are quiet.

They don't sing out.

Yeah, it's less compromise than ever.

And I think the Raptor is a great example of that.

Yeah, and of course you're paying for all that stuff, too.

But absolutely, I agree.

I mean, the prices of some of these trucks is very high.

But you're also getting a lot for that money, right?

For sure, yeah, that's another, I mean, it's a common theme, right?

I feel like at every video I end by saying this truck's incredible.

That Raptor we drove was, I think, $115,000 Canadian.

So, you know, for well over 100 grand, it better be incredible, right?

That's a crazy amount of money for that truck.

But yeah, just talking about the products we have now, less compromise, man.

It was really, it was cool.

Well, sweet.

Well, I wanted to ask you a couple of things.

And also maybe we can catch up a little bit later about Big Green because.

Yeah, sure.

Big Green, it's, you know, dear to my heart as well.

You know, it's a pickup truck that TFL owned for a little while and you own it now.

But I wanted to ask you a little bit about one of my favorite things that

Truck King does and you even did a little bit of that when we were working together

is the hydroline, right?

Because can you just explain what that is a little bit?

And also some of the recent stuff you may have done there.

Sure, absolutely.

So yeah, the first part of that is just what is the hydroline.

And it's a funny thing, which is really regional.

I don't even think I realized how regional it was until I started saying it

on the internet and everyone was like, your hydroline.

The heck is that? Is that because there's water?

No, it's because we live in the province of Ontario.

And here in Ontario, we commonly just call electricity hydro.

That's just what we call it because a lot of our electricity is hydroelectricity.

And the main electricity supply in Ontario is hydro one.

So here hydro and electricity are just synonymous.

So all we're saying is it's a power line trail.

You see it in the video.

It's cut there because there's a power line.

But for us, it's a hydro line.

So let me start by explaining that.

Yeah. And yeah, that's the one trail on our property

that has always been there because it's a hydro easement

so the guys can get in and work on the line.

And as a result of that, over the last probably 60, 70 years,

there's been so many hydro vehicles stuck up that trail.

So it's just become a mess, especially the one section we run.

There's always water there.

It's spring fed, so it doesn't matter what the weather is.

There's basically always water and always mud

because it comes right out the bottom of that hill.

So it's related to water.

It is. There is water there.

Yes, there is water.

So I can understand how you would make that assumption.

And thank God there's water there.

Again, that's one of the great things that we're very lucky to have

because as you know, most places, they don't always have mud, right?

Or you've got to wait till it rains.

We don't have to wait till it rains.

We always have the mud there.

And then, yeah, the ruts over the years have just gotten so deep

and so many vehicles have been up there.

So it's just really squishy and nasty

and there's tons of frigging mosquitoes up there in the summertime.

So we hike up there and get absolutely eaten alive.

But I always say we're giving blood literally

to make these videos.

Bloods, bloods, blood and tears, right?

Totally, man.

And that's I mean, you want to talk about truck testing.

That is what it takes sometimes, right?

It's not the same as testing, you know, a RAV4 with your family.

Truck testing really does take some real work

and being out there in some sloppy, nasty conditions is all part of it.

And that's really what the hydroline is, man.

It's just sloppy, nasty mud.

We have a bit of a mixture of clay, too.

So it's that kind of really sticky mud.

It cakes the tires up really, really fast.

So, yeah, it's always been a great test.

And, you know, we have sort of a mud pit with full of water

and then immediately goes into a hill that's got a bunch of loose rocks on it.

So that's always it's always a good test.

And actually, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts on this, too,

because what I love about it is I've run that that trail,

I don't know, 100,000 times, right?

Like I've run it so many times.

I'm so hyper aware of every kind of rock, every bump.

So when I take vehicles through, I'm like, oh, man,

I didn't hit that rock that I normally hit or, oh, my gosh,

this thing is dragging like crazy where I don't normally drag.

So I love having sort of a standardized trail, too,

because I'm so familiar with it that I feel like I get a great sense

for a vehicle just because I know, oh, yeah, compared to the last thing,

this was dragging or this wasn't dragging.

I'm sure you must feel that way on the Ike gauntlet, right?

You must have some mental check marks where we go, oh,

this truck did something that the last one didn't or or something like that.

Right. Absolutely. Yeah.

And speaking of doing things hundreds of times,

we definitely ran Ike gauntlet.

What I think, well, we've published about 185 videos.

Nice.

But I think some of them have multiple trucks.

So and it's maybe even more than that now.

So I mean, a great number to figure out hundreds of different vehicles.

And speaking about slightly off road testing as well,

we keep going back to some of our favorite trails.

And also we've got lucky about two or two and a half years ago,

we got some property as well, Tumble with Ranch,

which is about what 20 acres.

So we we actually have created a couple of obstacles of our own

kind of manmade stuff, and we do have that creek in the back as well.

But I totally get what you're saying because and especially in water,

I was going to bring it up because as soon as you introduce either snow or water,

it masks a lot of obstacles right right right below it. Right. Sure.

So and if you were there for the first time,

like if you if I actually was able to join you

on one of those runs on the hydroline, I would probably be going

be going very, very slowly because I'm scared about

is there going to be a rock here, you know, or something like this.

So so definitely I see what you're saying because

it's good to come back to the same test over and over and over again

because it's standardized.

And I know uproading is not super standardized, right, because it changes.

Right. I mean, it is a little different every time. Sure.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the rock moves every time you touch it.

So it's really a unique experience almost every time.

But there's those obstacles like on our ironclad's trail that we go up to

that you've been there before. Right.

You know, there's like the steps, there's the razor rock.

You know, those obstacles are slightly different,

but they're the main features are still there every single time.

Right. And that's it.

And then you get that context.

So you get in one vehicle and right away you kind of judge it, you know,

next to the other ones you've been on those those obstacles with.

And it's also I think it's a good thing talking about truck testing

to always bring up, which is the fine line we have to walk between

I can't go out there and just break everything I get.

So I have to have some mechanical sympathy, but I also need to test

it properly and, and, you know, not, not under tested and then claim

it was a tough off road test.

So that's always on my mind too.

And that's also another thing where you run the same trail over and over

because the familiarity means I pretty much know I'm not going to break something.

Stuff happens. I've broken stuff up the hydroline for sure.

But I for the most part know it's going to be just hard enough,

but not too hard. And you've got to find that balance too. Right.

Yeah. And I think you bring up an interesting point

because both of us, we make a living on YouTube primarily

and that image, right, the featured image, the thumbnail is is really important.

And the more difficult it looks, potentially the cooler it can be.

Right. And then the more viewers you can get.

But like you said, what if you get too deep?

Yeah. Yeah. Exactly.

So so you do have to walk a fine line there

because you want to bury it to the axles

or you want to go through some water where it kind of is halfway up your

grill or whatever. But how far is too far?

Right. Because a lot of these vehicles we don't own, right?

Right. Yeah, exactly.

And it's the classic thing with water too, which is that everyone thinks

about where does the engine breathe them?

Well, there's a lot of things that need to breathe properly.

And so you don't want to go too deep and sink the differentials

and who knows what else. So it is always, yeah, there's that fine line

we have to walk to, which once again, that's why I like having my own trails.

And I'm sure you guys talk to me a little bit more about the ranch

and what you guys have built there, because that was sort of familiar to me

going, you come to a piece of property, you have to identify

where the cool off road trails and obstacles can be.

But then you guys had to do a lot of work to make those happen, right?

Yeah. And so, yeah, the piece of land that Roman was able to purchase

it kind of butts up against this front range in the mountains, right?

So it's right at the front range.

And so it does have some natural elevation changes.

And there is also kind of a, I don't know, not an official creek, I would say,

but kind of a seepage coming off another another creek and a ditch,

a city, a city area there, where there is a little bit of water.

So and of course, whenever there is water, first of all, it cuts a path, right?

So it's cutting its own path.

And also it makes things more challenging as you kind of go through it.

So we've created a couple of areas.

We have something that Roman affectionately called Andres Pit,

which is kind of this downhill area.

And there is also some kind of almost

you've been to Cinder's Park in Arizona, near Flagstaff, right?

It's kind of like this volcanic looking thing.

It's like a really small, kind of dark looking rocks, almost like ash,

like old ash.

So we have a tiny bit of that, tiny area of that terrain.

We call it Lava Lane.

So so we and then we actually worked with our friend David,

who is a great handyman, you know, just an incredible architect.

And he has many talents, but he helped us move some rock.

We moved old telephone poles where that would that we buried

actually in the ground halfway.

So half of the telephone pole would be sticking out.

Nice. We've created.

We wanted to create because we've been to these events with Jeep

and Land Rover, right, where they build their own courses.

Totally. And they're very skillful, you know, they're very skilled at that.

So you wanted to kind of approximate.

It's very difficult, obviously, really costly sometimes to build something like this.

But sure, we also built a couple of what we call trenches,

which is kind of like these elephant steps, which are offset holes

where, you know, you can articulate through and you kind of go go through that area.

And then we have the Onyx Offroad, which is one of our partners

back course with our and I don't think you've have you run there?

Have you not? No, I've never been to the ranch at all.

I don't think. Oh, geez, you know, we have to fix that

sometime sometime in the future.

And yeah, one of these days, I'd love to come down and check it out.

And also our back course.

So it snowed.

We haven't had a lot of moisture this year so far.

This is December 2025.

But it snowed a couple of days ago, several days ago.

And then we kind of have to close that back area

because it freezes over.

And now you have like a 30 degree slope with ice on it.

Yeah. And that's not passable.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

And there that's and that's those the kind of things you have to identify

and be like, that's just too hard.

It doesn't matter what kind of vehicle I take up there.

It's not going to happen and I'm going to break something.

Yeah. But tell me about your property

because you not just the hydroline, right?

But you've also created your own little trail, I guess, through it.

Yeah. So we've cut a whole bunch of different trails.

We have hydroline, then we have the left hook

and then our newest trail is called uppercut.

We're going with the boxing theme.

And yeah, uppercut, it's sort of through the nastiest part

of kind of the swamp that's on our property.

And right now it's still a little too tight.

We want to get in there and make it wider.

However, I recently had a Wrangler Sport S,

so a base Wrangler just open diffs, a two door manual.

So it was it was so fun and that thing fit in there really well.

So I took a rebel in there once.

I took big green in there, but I need to get in there

and cut some more trees because it just we didn't make it wide enough.

You know, when you're cutting a trail and doing all the work,

you're going, it's wide enough. That tree's fine.

And then when you get in there with a big wide truck, you're going,

oh, my gosh, it's not wide enough.

So yeah, we got to get back there.

But I got to tell you, running that two door Wrangler, man,

it felt like a little side by side coming through there.

Like the wheelbase is actually a lot shorter than most the side by sides.

We test these days and I'm in a lot of side by sides too.

So that was sort of kind of on my mind the whole time going,

this thing feels like a little cute side by side.

And yet it's a road going vehicle where the roof comes off.

So it was it was fun and an open diffs.

And I expected it to struggle in some spots and it didn't matter.

It just scampered right through.

And sometimes I also think light weight, right?

Because it's so light, it just kind of floats over everything.

It was it was it was a lot of fun.

I really enjoyed it.

That was the red Jeep you're talking about, right?

It was a red Wrangler Sport S.

Yeah, and it did have the basically the only upgrade

is they added all-terrain tires, nexon all-terrains.

And outside of that, it was basically bone stock.

I love that.

So you brought up a couple of points,

lightweight, small size.

It's really hard to beat because, you know, some of the new vehicles,

especially electric pickup trucks and big SUVs,

you know, some of the GM vehicles are pretty amazing,

but they weigh 9000 pounds. Totally.

And you could definitely tell a difference between, you know,

a 3500 pound little Jeep with solid axles

versus a 9000 pound, you know, tech laden and machine.

100 percent.

Yeah, when we drove the GMC Sierra EV 84

for the first time, it was pretty muddy that day.

And it was kind of like a twisty, windy course

through some farm fields.

You were probably on that event, too, was in Michigan.

And I just remember like it was so muddy

and it just pushed through every corner.

Like it didn't matter what you did.

If you had any speed and momentum and you steered,

the truck's like, no, I'm not turning because I weigh 9000 pounds

and I want to continue to go straight.

So, yeah, it's it is a stark difference

when you get used to testing that big, heavy stuff.

And then you get in that little tiny, lightweight Wrangler.

And then actually another vehicle we did have

on the hydroline this year was the Rivian R1S.

So that was early in the year.

It was springtime. It was just after the ice.

I thought maybe it was going to be an ice video,

but the ice was already all gone.

But the water was deep, probably the deepest

it's been in like recent memory.

And the thing I'll never forget about the Rivian is,

as you know, most EVs in the Rivian, too,

it's super sealed up underneath.

You know, it's it basically looks like a boat hull.

And that's exactly what it sounded like.

Going through the hydroline with just slapping against the waves.

It sounded like my little aluminum boat does

when I'm out with a little outboard on it.

And the sound was just wild to me

how much it sounded like this big boat hull,

you know, slapping against the water.

And it did the Rivian feels kind of heavy,

not quite as egregious as those GM's.

But it was also really impressive, man, for a vehicle.

That's that again, quiet and comfortable and so cool.

Like has all those fun little quirks

and then the interior is so nice and then you take it off road.

And yeah, I was I was really impressed with it.

I don't know what you guys think.

Yeah, so just last week, we had the R1S quad.

This was the quad motor, the second gen.

So so this was the most recent Rivian.

And it has adjustable air suspension, right?

So height. So I kind of jacked it up.

I kind of, you know, got the suspension a little bit extended.

And I kind of laid down here in our studio,

just laid down kind of on the floor.

And I was looking up, up at the up at the belly of the Rivian.

And like you said, it's amazing

what electric vehicles can do, right?

Because the battery is all kind of one piece.

It's almost like this one piece kind of a pan.

And then the suspension is also kind of hidden, right?

So the suspension is independent.

And then the motors are protected with another kind of a

I mean, I guess you could call it skid plates, right?

Because you have to protect all of that stuff.

Right.

And on the back of the new quad, there is a small, tiny pumpkin.

It's not a pumpkin.

It's just it's just a little skid plate

that goes around the electric motors in the back.

OK, sure. Yeah.

But it looks it's like a little lower area,

but it's only about an inch or two, right?

So it's not something that hangs down, you know, a great ways.

And I was thinking to myself, right, you jack this thing up.

They say Rivian says what almost 14 inches of ground clearance, right?

But there is also no obstacles.

Yeah, nothing hanging down.

No, there is no shocks hanging down.

There is no, you know, axle bolts hanging down.

You know, there's that's kind of very smart, really good.

But then the next question comes

because everybody assumed, especially, for example,

on that Sierra program, I was talking to some other journalists

and they were saying, well, when you have multiple motors,

that means perfect control, right?

And like, wait a minute, but it depends on the software, right?

Sure. I mean, if you can get those electric motors

because the trouble is moving slowly, right?

They're really great at putting down a thousand horsepower,

you know, at the at the drag strip.

That's really amazing.

But in order to start moving slowly,

it's not as easy as that may sound.

Yeah, no, that's that is fair.

And it can feel like that, too, again.

And just because the powers are so ridiculous,

you have a tendency to put your foot a little deep into it

and it wants to take off on you.

And sometimes in the mud, that's no good.

Exactly. And also, I don't know which generation Rivian you were in.

But the latest one I was in, they have they have a separate screen.

It's called the Rad tuner, RAD tuner.

Yeah. And it's actually like 10 or I think it's 10 different parameters

that you could there's like slider buttons

and you could adjust them separately,

like distribution of front to rear torque.

That's cool.

Also, how much region you can have or not have.

And that's so cool.

And actually did it did something.

You know, usually when you have some modes,

I want to ask you about this, for example,

for this kind of good at this, right,

adding like seven or eight different drive modes,

but are they actually doing something?

Right. And this RAD tuner on this Rivian,

because I didn't want region coming down an icy slope

because those electric motors are trying to like generate energy

and I didn't kind of want that.

So and I was able to decrease that decrease that level

and actually was actually a better experience.

So what do you think about these new modes that everybody has?

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Well, I do think EVs offer, you know, a distinct advantage.

And yeah, being able to control that power output

and probably more easily able to control, you know, I assume those things

and I know those things are possible with the gas engine

because you can still get into the ECU.

But there's no doubt that there's more involved there than it is with an EV.

And I think, again, EVs, you know, they need all the help they can get to sell.

And that's a cool selling feature.

That's like, hey, you can customize this thing

way more than you've ever been used to in the past, right?

You can really get in and tell me where to send the power,

how to split the power, how much power to put down.

Because that's another thing, too.

I always go, it's great that all our EVs now

make 600, 700, 800 horsepower.

But why not give me a 200 horsepower EV that gets way more range?

And I know that's a function of how you drive as well.

But like, doesn't that make sense?

So if I if I want to limit myself, I take the horsepower slider

and just bring it all the way down.

And then the range starts to go back up.

And how cool is that, right?

So I think EVs specifically offer that kind of advantage.

And then with drive modes in general,

I do think they matter.

I do think they make a difference.

Is it a massive difference?

Not really.

And I think more than anything,

the thing I fear is that these days we're getting to a point

where automakers want everything to be automatic, right?

They don't want you to understand how four-wheel drive works,

how a transfer case works, how a PTU works, any of these things.

They just want you to know, oh, it's snowing.

I'll put it in snow mode.

Oh, I'm driving in the sand.

I'll put it in sand mode.

And I get the appeal of that.

But I think you have to understand what that mode is doing

to then optimize your driving for that mode.

So I've never seen it as just as simple as hit the button

and now the car is perfect.

It's like, no, I want to know.

And the one brand I'll call out is doing this the best,

I think is Land Rover.

Land Rover, when you put it into snow mode,

a little paragraph comes up and specifically says,

okay, we're going to do this.

We're going to have the shift points here.

We're going to not spin the tires

or we will spin the tires.

And I think that's so important

is to give the customers the modes,

but then explain in detail what you're thinking was.

Cause if I, if I'm thinking like the engineer,

then I can drive to optimize the mode.

And so I guess that's my kind of takeaway from drive modes.

If you have no clue what it's doing,

it's going to help you a little bit, but not a ton.

Because yeah, you're not changing the way you're driving

to suit the mode too.

So yeah, there's definitely, I just,

I always feel like more education is better

and drive modes are taking us away from more education.

They're trying to just dumb it down

where I think you need to understand

what's actually going on under the hood.

And I guess the other one I'll call out,

which I think is funny is the frontier, right?

For 2026, the Nissan frontier added drive modes.

And I was like, oh great.

First of all, you're a decade late.

Second of all, now it just feels like it's expected,

right?

A customer test drive all the mid-sized trucks,

he's going to get in the Nissan and go,

hey, why don't you have drive modes?

Does that really matter?

Does it make it a better truck?

A little bit, but it feels these days

like everyone just has to have it now, you know?

Yeah, totally.

Funny enough, I guess we're kind of testing

the same vehicles almost at the same time, right?

Because that's what's available, right?

Those are the new vehicles that are actually coming out.

And I just saw the frontier drive mode button.

It's, I don't know, there's like four or five of them,

right, in this little section.

Right.

And what I would say about it is,

I want to bring up Ford because I think Ford

was one of the earlier ones with the Raptor trucks

that really put kind of drive modes on the map, I think.

But not just drive modes, but multiple drive modes, right?

Because they have the rock and the slippery

and the sand and the Baja, right?

And the other thing that some of these vehicles do

is, and Casey and I, and often Roman and I

talk about this as well, is the truck or the SUV

is trying to think for me and also

it thinks it's better than me.

Sure, totally.

Totally.

Which is, I kind of echo what you said.

You know, maybe it's offering that to more people now, right?

Because a lot of people maybe didn't have the education.

Maybe they didn't grow up on a ranch

or a piece of property where you could go out

and experience all these different modes

on-road and then off-road as well.

So maybe it's offering a wider audience and access to this.

But at the same time, like for example,

I would put the truck in for low, right?

And this happens on a Ford a lot of the times.

And it usually has a locking differential

if it's equipped with for low.

And it will, or even better, I put it in rock crawl mode.

It automatically tells me I want to be in for low.

Okay, that's okay.

And then it automatically locks my differential

or multiple differentials.

I'm like, okay, but I need to make a tight turn.

Right.

So I don't need my locker on right now.

Yeah.

You know what I'm saying?

Yeah.

So the truck is trying to think for me,

which is good, I guess.

But it's also, you know,

let the driver think for themselves.

Right.

I have an example exactly of that one too.

At the Raptor rally, there was a little rock crawl

and exactly they're like everyone,

hey, put your Raptors in rock crawl mode.

But then specifically told us,

but unlock the rear differential.

You don't want to be locked for this.

And that was it.

I'm like, so it's like the rock mode locks it.

And then you have to realize that it's locked

and know what that means, what a locker does.

And that you actually prefer to be unlocked

because it was the same thing.

There was a bit of a turn

and it was just not that technical.

So it was easier to do it unlocked.

So once again, like, yes, I'm off for drive modes,

but with the proper education to kind of go with them.

And sadly, they kind of inherently don't lead

to more education, they lead to less.

Yeah.

So it's interesting.

I guess, I mean, that's kind of good for you and I

because we can make videos about it, right?

We can talk about it

and we can make podcasts about it too.

So.

Yeah, that is fair.

And if I can bring up one more gripe

while we're on drive modes,

it's, I'm sick of Baja mode.

Can we come up with another name?

Like, I love Baja, Baja racing is incredible.

But I don't know, man.

I just feel like every brand has leaned in

a little too hard on Baja mode.

They should call it like flying eagle mode or, you know.

Freedom?

Yeah, freedom mode.

I'm okay with freedom mode.

But yeah, I don't know.

I just, I feel like Baja mode is a little played out.

Here's, Stephen, here's how you know you've made it

when there's a manufacturer has a hydroline mode.

Yes.

That's when you know.

That's what we're working on.

You did it.

You did it right.

No, you know what?

So going back to Rivian just for a second.

So they do have this tuner.

They call this the tuner of the, you know,

the motor control and capability.

Right.

And then you could save that as its own mode.

Oh yeah.

Makes sense.

So that's the ultimate.

That's how you can define your own hydroline mode.

And you can actually say, you know,

I selected this power distribution.

This was, you know, the suspension mode.

This was the stability mode.

And you could actually save that.

And some other people can say,

hey, you know, Stephen told me to do this.

And bam, I'm on the hydroline.

Sure, sure.

That'd be super cool.

And I don't know if it's possibility yet,

but it seems like an obvious next step

that then you could share your modes

directly with your friends in the same vehicle, right?

Send it over the air

and download that mode and you're away to the races.

And that's the exciting thing, I think, you know,

about EVs and over the air updates.

Like Rivian already was,

I believe the brand that added a snow mode after the fact.

And I think even the camping mode, maybe they added.

And that's cool.

Like they can come in after you buy your vehicle

and say, hey, we've come up with this new drive mode,

just download it, right?

That's, that is an exciting, I think, future

for automotive, a little scary.

And there's some downsides too,

but also pretty cool.

Yeah.

Like the camping mode sell auto levels, right?

The whole vehicle on, if you want to park and camp out,

it kind of auto levels itself.

Right, I think it's quiet too, right?

It disables the sound and maybe even tilts the headlamps down.

Like it's got a bunch of little things it does

to make sure you're not disturbing your neighbors.

Yeah, totally.

It's really interesting.

I wanted to ask you a little bit about towing, right?

I know you have kind of several trailers

or maybe a couple of different weights

that you guys are using.

Oh, and I saw recently you did, well, maybe this year,

you did also kind of a camper.

You pulled a camper with a couple of trucks as well.

Right, yes.

So we do a couple of different things when towing,

just like you guys, you know,

we do our best to tow as much as we can.

Actually, again, if you just want to talk about

truck testing for a second behind the scenes

here in Ontario, we've been getting crazy winter, man.

The last two weeks,

like this morning it was minus 18 when I woke up.

So it's frigid cold and I probably have snow banks

outside my house that are already five feet tall.

So winter came in full force early this year.

And our trailer up North, it's just, it snowed in.

So sadly, our one flat tech trailer,

we're not getting to it again,

maybe until January or sorry, until springtime.

And that's just one of the tough things

with filming towing videos is winter makes it way harder.

And then dealing with towing in the winter, we do it.

I know I absolutely can handle it,

but it's a pain in the butt.

You know yourself dealing with chains when it's cold

and they're all slushy and gross.

And so yes, winter adds an added challenge

to the towing side of things.

But that's one of the reasons we try

to keep our options open.

So we have flat deck trailers and we have big concrete weights.

So we adjust the concrete weights as necessary

to whatever the trucks are.

We usually do 7,000 on half tons,

5,000 on mid-sizers,

and then sometimes 10,000 on heavy duties.

Although with heavy duties,

my dad has a fifth wheel.

So we hooked this fifth wheel up a lot.

He has a grand design.

It's 15,000 pounds, I think, 17 GVWR, something like that.

So it's, you know, fair size fifth wheel.

So that's been a great test for a couple trucks.

And then we also have some relationships

with a couple local RV dealers.

So I think the video you're referencing

is we went to and visited our friends

at K&M RV in London, Ontario,

and they hooked us up with an air stream,

identical air stream, actually.

And we did a Silverado EV and a Cybertruck

with identical air streams on the exact same loop.

So we could, you know, test efficiency and all that stuff.

And that's when it does pay to have, you know,

good relationships too,

because it's hard to source

to identical air stream trailers, right?

So we were very thankful for Andy and his team

and he hooked us up.

The Cybertruck was privately owned.

Again, as you guys know, Tesla doesn't do media,

but that was an owner who,

so we actually did a video going back to 2022, I believe,

where Andy, the owner of that dealership,

he tows an air stream with his Model S

and then he built a custom hitch for a Model 3

and he tows an air stream.

So we did a video on his Model 3.

This Tesla owner watched our video call Andy

and said, hey, I'm getting a Cybertruck

and I'd love to buy an air stream from you.

So we kind of facilitated the whole thing.

So then Andy reached out to him and said,

hey, remember that video you watched?

Those guys were curious

if they could get your truck for a test.

So it all worked out.

We were very thankful for that owner

who helped us out that day.

And what a cool test, man.

First of all, that was my first time in a Cybertruck.

So that was obviously just exciting

to be able to actually sit in and see what it's like.

I know you have lots of experience,

so I'll be curious to hear your thoughts.

But the craziest thing about that truck

is the steering, right?

Is the way it steers is so different.

It turns so tight for the size of it.

The fact that the steering is just,

everything's basically right here.

Like it just turns so quickly.

And it takes a minute to get used to.

Like it's a little too twitchy, I found it first.

But once you kind of calibrate your hands,

I really liked it.

Like the way it steers is super cool.

And then the four wheel steering as well

just means it turns that much tighter.

Although I will say that the Silverado EV

turned slightly tighter because we did that test.

We hooked them up and turned them.

And the Silverado EV was like,

I think a foot and a half,

something like that, tighter than the Tesla was.

But yeah, it was cool, man.

It was really neat to drive that truck.

I still don't like the way it looks.

Sitting inside it is weird.

The raked windshield is just super weird up over your head.

It's also really expensive in Canada.

Granted, both of those trucks are.

But the Cybertruck in our test was 150 grand,

which is a lot of money.

But yeah, it was a cool test.

It was great to have that opportunity

to be able to do that.

Yeah, totally.

That's a bummer that you just snowed in

with your trailer already.

Yeah, and the off-road trails too, you know?

Like we, I like going off-roading in the snow,

but again, it's finding that balance of enough snow

that it's tough, but not too much snow

because I don't care what the vehicle is,

it will get stuck if there's enough snow, you know?

We've proven that on our channel a bunch of times

because as you know, the commenters can be harsh

sometimes and say, you know,

my Honda Civic would have made it through that.

So we took a power wagon and got it

miserably stuck in the snow.

We took a Yukon 84, a ZR2.

We've gotten many vehicles stuck in the snow

and that's always the point is I don't care what it is.

If there's enough snow and ice,

nothing is getting through unless it's a snowmobile.

Maybe a Sherp.

Yeah, yeah.

We did have actually a Sherp at our ranch,

what is it, maybe in February or so.

And it was amazing that's, you know,

when you decrease those giant tire pressures,

you know, the tires are what five or six feet tall

and they're really wide.

When you decrease their pressure to like what,

five PSI or 10 PSI, it just, oh, they told me, you know,

he's like, it can run you over without damaging your body.

I'm like, I'm not testing that.

I bet Roman wanted to.

Yeah, probably, yeah, probably Roman wanted to,

but he's like, you could also put,

like if you're on a hard ground,

when the Sherp is aired down,

you could put like a can of Coke or something.

And it's supposed to like go over it

without squishing the can.

It's crazy, man.

Can I say, here's my controversial take on the Sherp

is that it's almost too good.

Like it's still really fun,

but it's not quite as fun as like getting through an obstacle

and an old beat up Jeep is, because it's so good.

And of course, for people in the mining exploration world

or extreme adventure, it's second to none, right?

It's so good.

And there's a whole bunch of other vehicles now

in that kind of category,

but that's my one take is like,

sometimes you're in it going, yeah, where's the challenge?

It's too dang good.

Yeah, and exactly.

And on top of that, when the vehicle is too dang good,

it looks boring on video.

It does, that's fair, totally.

Cause it makes everything look so easy.

And when you're in the vehicle, you're going, no,

this is ridiculous.

Nothing else could do this,

but it makes it look easy cause it's so good.

Yeah, everybody's saying, why are you showing us this?

So anyway, so that's a tough one.

Yeah, that is.

But yes, if you ever get a chance to go in one, do it,

cause it's so fun.

You just looking at everything going,

you can't go over that.

And then it just goes over it like it's nothing.

What a, yeah, crazy, crazy vehicle.

And then, yeah, and the guys who brought it out,

it was like basically a local dealership for the Sherp.

They're like, if you go slowly, you can do anything.

I'm like, okay, I mean, that's fair,

but they really meant it, right?

Because it's also amphibious, right?

It also floats.

Anyway, it was ridiculous.

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But a comment on the Cybertruck, I guess, really quick.

Sure, yes.

I was really impressed,

because we owned one for several months.

Right.

I was really impressed with the technology

that they were able to kind of package inside of it.

Like you were saying, you know, really quick steering

and just the power delivery

and kind of the suspension comfort.

I thought they really dialed it in

in a quite an impressive way.

I didn't like the Yoke style steering wheel

because maybe I'm just older

and I'm just used to a circle, you know?

Sure.

Because I was talking to a dude,

I play volleyball recreationally

and there's this guy with a Cybertruck

at our volleyball league.

And he was telling me, you know,

how he loves the Yoke, right?

Because you don't have to move it very far.

It's about right degrees or so

and you can actually steer really, really well.

But I'm like, well,

but what about doing hand over hand?

It's weird, right?

You can't really move your hands around.

Totally.

So anyway, so it was a big disagreement.

We were kind of talking about this,

but the way that the Cybertruck is shaped,

you know, I know they were maybe trying

to go for a splash,

being very kind of out there, being controversial.

Of course.

But I think if the Cybertruck actually looked like an F-150,

I think it could have been really,

or maybe even more successful, I would say.

Yeah, or honestly a Model X, right?

Like what if they just made a Model X pickup truck?

If you picture that in your head,

I can see that too.

Cause I think that's one of Tesla's,

one of their strongest points is their design.

If you think about it,

they haven't really significantly changed their design

since it launched,

but those cars still look really good in my opinion.

So I do agree with you there.

And that's it, man.

I don't care who you are.

Some people will never be able to get over that design.

Like I could have loved everything about that truck,

but I won't buy it or drive it because of the way it looks.

So it's just polarizing.

And maybe they'll realize that,

maybe they never intended it to be for a wide audience.

And if that's the case, then that's fine.

Exactly.

And also, I mean, yes,

one of it is a kind of a personal taste,

but also the bed is hard to reach in, right?

So there's some functional,

definitely some functional areas

which are kind of difficult with it.

Did you ever do a payload test with your Cybertruck?

I'm just curious,

cause that's the other thing it's very impressive at

is it's payload numbers.

And I was just wondering how it would feel.

I actually did a payload test with it

right before we bought one.

I was out with an owner

who was one of the first people to get one

in California.

And he actually had a forklift with a pallet worth of stuff.

And it was quite impressive.

What is it, like 2,000 pounds?

I mean, it's a lot.

I mean, or maybe over 2,000 pounds.

I think it's 2,500, yeah.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And especially the original ones.

And it also levels itself out.

I mean, it's quite impressive about what they can do.

Yeah, that is cool.

That is cool.

And you know this too,

that's almost like the dirty secret of electric trucks

is that they're all categorized as class 2B,

so heavy duty trucks basically.

And that's one of the reasons it has such a high payload.

So that's why in my head,

I'm like, did they just do it to hit the marks

or did they really properly engineer it?

So I'm happy to hear it's good.

Yeah, yeah.

And also my complaint, I guess,

would be against some of the GM

and some of the, maybe a Ford electric vehicle pickup truck,

the Lightning and some of the GMs

is that they're heavier vehicles, right?

But oftentimes that doesn't come with a lot of payload, right?

The original Silverado EV,

because they kinda, I think there's a classification

where they had to stay under 10,000.

Under 10,000, yeah.

GVW, that meant it had like 1,300 pounds of payload.

I'm like, no, get it over that.

Get it above it and actually give it some real payload

where you can put four big guys in there

and carry a bunch of weight or trailer behind you as well.

So.

Yeah, I totally agree.

My other complaint would be with Toyota, I think.

Some of the recent Tacomas and like forerunners,

they don't have enough payload, right?

They're really adventurous vehicles,

really cool vehicles,

but I was just looking at your forerunner towing review.

I think it has like 900 pounds of payload

or something like that.

For sure, and that towing review is on a limited,

but what's even worse is the trail hunter,

man, forerunner trail hunter is less than 1,000 pounds.

And it's like, you're pitching me

as this crazy adventure vehicle

and yet I can't even put 1,000 pounds in here, you know?

And then if you want me to put a rooftop tent on

and a cooler in the back

and maybe you and the dog, and that's it, right?

And now there's a whole other conversation

about whether you should overload it or not.

And we all know that most people do overload it,

but it's also like, yeah, that is overloaded,

according to their spec.

And it sucks that so many people have to feel

like they're overloading their vehicles, you know?

You know what I've been told by several,

I guess fans who watch some of our stuff is,

they're like, I just bought a pickup truck.

It has as much payload as I say it does, you know?

Fair enough, man.

And that's it, like you know yourself,

you show the door jam sticker and all your videos

to show the payload.

So many people go, what?

What sticker is that?

I've never seen that sticker before in my life.

And that's actually a real pain point.

And I feel bad for customers on this

because manufacturers are a little bit tricky.

They love to advertise that high top payload number,

but the top payload number

is for a base truck with two-wheel drive,

not a loaded up luxury truck, right?

So when you actually get it in the real world,

those payloads really suffer

and they can be pretty low and it is depressing.

The Ram 1500 too, man, when the Hemi came back,

I don't know if you noticed,

but every truck I looked at with that new Hemi,

the new Hemi, and the payloads were terrible.

We found one under 900 pounds.

Oh yeah, some of the luxury ones, right?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It was fully, it was luxury.

It had the split tailgate, Hemi,

they added the screen, right?

Passenger side touch screen and powered steps

and every single option.

And yeah, it had less than 900 pounds.

So that sucks, that hurts.

Yeah, yeah, I guess maybe we should go there a little bit

because it's like at that level,

your pickup truck is really just a sedan, right?

Because, and maybe that's what they want.

Maybe that customer,

and I wanna hear what you think about this.

It's like, when you're buying that limited Ram 1500, right?

And it's got 22s on it, it's rolling on 22s

and it's got massaging seats and this and that.

And I don't know if that customer,

if it matters to them that they cannot actually

haul anything in that truck.

Probably not.

And then honestly, I already said this,

but like most people will never know what their payload

is and it's probably fine.

Because if someone said to me,

I just bought a new Ram limited

and I'm gonna take my family on a camping trip.

I'm like, yeah, go ahead.

You're gonna feel fine with that truck.

You know what I mean?

I'm not talking about towing,

I'm just talking about loading it up.

Or same thing, if you said,

hey, I have 1,000 pounds of payload,

I'd be like, yes, 1,000 pounds of payload

can go in the bed of any half ton.

That's just what my mind says.

And we both know that that truck's gonna feel fine

with that weight.

And what really makes me mad is those payload numbers

are such a, they're arrived at,

they're a mixture between engineering, marketing

and government regulations and lawyers.

So like all of these people come in

to get in on that number.

And I just wish we could have a more honest conversation

about those payload numbers.

Because I also, I don't,

I never wanna be seen as the guy going,

yeah, overload your vehicles.

It doesn't matter.

It does matter.

You can clearly overload your vehicle

to a very unsafe point.

And I don't wanna be advocating for that either.

And every time we talk to engineers,

they don't wanna ever put numbers on it.

I would love one of them to say yes, you know,

15% over payload is where that real maximum is.

But yeah, that's why the whole conversation

is kind of frustrating from that point of view.

I'll share one other tidbit,

which is that I actually reached out

to the Ontario Provincial Police.

And I had a good conversation

with a representative from the OPP.

And, you know, I'm paraphrasing,

but what he basically told me

is that he's almost never gonna pull someone over

because he's worried they're overweight.

He's gonna pull you over

because your bumper's dragging on the ground

or the fenders falling off your trailer

or your lights aren't working

or there's almost always another symptom

of like that's surrounded with being overloaded

that they're gonna pull you over for.

He's like, I'm not looking at that.

Cause he's like, yeah, every travel trailer,

every truck with a big travel trailer,

it's probably over its payload a little bit.

But if it's cruising down the road at highway speed

with a nice level flat attitude,

they're not ever gonna pull you over

and weigh that trailer and try to figure that out.

So he was saying the same thing.

He's like, clearly overloaded vehicles

are a problem on the road,

but you have to use your own judgment, man.

If it feels safe and it looks safe,

no one's gonna bug you about it.

So yeah, that's where these conversations are nuanced.

There's a lot of gray area

even from the kind of police perspective.

They're not gonna pull you over

and give you a ticket for being 10 pounds over payload.

That's just not gonna happen.

I've never heard of that happening.

A thousand pounds over payload?

Yeah, maybe 5,000 pounds over payload.

You shouldn't be driving that vehicle.

So again, it is nuanced

and I wish I could even offer more info,

but we're always talking about payload on our channel, man.

We talk about this so much.

Yeah, and yeah, just to continue on that

just a little bit more, I would view it this way.

So when you were talking about kind of overloading

a little bit, one older vehicle came to mind.

This was, I believe, like a 2018-ish F-150,

which we did a night gauntlet with

and I compared it to a Titan XD.

And the Titan XD was a kind of a beefier vehicle, right?

Bigger frame.

It was a little bit halfway up a class, right?

Which is what Nissan was doing.

And we put the same trailer on both of them

and it was really maxing out the Ford,

but the Nissan didn't,

it wasn't maxing out the Nissan at that level.

And the Ford was squatting, right?

We were trying to use a weight distribution hitch,

all the things, but it felt a little loosey-goosey, right?

So it's squatted.

I think it was basically almost on bump stops at this point.

And the suspension felt different and it was noticeable.

It was like, and also you have to watch tire pressures

as well, right?

So if you're a little bit underinflated

because you're running around getting groceries,

tire pressure doesn't matter quite as much,

but when you're at maximum weights,

you know, the tire squishes also

and it becomes a little bit more loose

and it moves side to side.

And all of a sudden, now you're in a situation

where the truck doesn't feel as comfortable or as stable

as it once was.

And then recently we did a four-truck comparison,

like where we pushed them really heavy too.

You may have seen that video already.

And what surprised me, all those recent trucks,

these are 2026 models and 2025 models,

near the bump stop, they felt really comfortable and stable.

So I don't know if manufacturers are kind of tweaking

little things and making them even more and more stable

and really comfortable, but here's my take on it.

If you're going, I don't know, a shorter distance

with a slightly overloaded vehicle

and it looks level and everything is great,

and then, God forbid, you get into an accident

and then they're gonna start checking things, right?

At that point, they'll say, oh, you're a thousand pounds over.

Okay, you got into an accident.

Oh, okay, you know, so are you willing?

So that's one thing in the back of my mind, right?

Sure.

Which just happens almost never, right?

Really rare, but it could potentially happen.

Also braking could be affected, right?

Your stopping power.

Sure.

Definitely being affected by that.

But like you said, I mean, eventually it is your,

you're taking your own risk, right?

Absolutely, absolutely, and it's a scary thing to say

because, yeah, everyone has to manage the risk

for yourself, but really you're managing it

for others as well, because at the end of the day,

the smartest tool in the truck is the driver.

It's the one behind the wheel.

It's like you just said, realizing, oh, you know what?

I'm a little heavy today.

I need to leave a lot more distance in front of me.

So, and that's the other part of this too, right?

Which is that the numbers have to make sense.

It has to feel safe, but then you have to drive

according to the load as well.

And so to your point, it's like if someone crashes overloaded,

it's probably because they weren't compensating

for that load properly.

And granted, I think we all appreciate,

yeah, there's always emergency situations.

And if there really is an emergency,

you never want to be caught overloaded

or in something that feels extra sketchy.

So I get that too.

But there is some sort of personal responsibility

sort of factored into this as well,

is how you handle driving that load, you know?

Exactly.

And then the final thing is,

I think durability comes into mind.

But that's not something on most people's minds, right?

Like let's say you overloaded your F-150

for the next five years going to work and back.

That F-150 is going to be used up.

That's a fair point.

And I think that is what I've heard manufacturers say

to me before when I've pushed them on this

is they go, you know what?

The number is really saying,

if you're over this number all the time,

something's gonna wear out way earlier than you think it is,

whether it's shocks or springs or whatever.

So that's a fair point as well.

And in that vein, then I circle all the way back

to the forerunner trail hunter with terrible payload

and go, yeah, it's not enough.

It's not enough to know that if I'm regularly camping

with my forerunner, I'm doing more damage to it

than I should be.

And I have to worry about premature failures, you know?

Yeah.

It goes all the way to the wheel bearings

and the axle bearings.

And it goes to every component, right?

It really goes to your brakes wearing out, et cetera, et cetera.

So yeah.

So when people ask me, I'm hauling, I'm a contractor,

I'm hauling lumber and all this stuff every day.

Should I get an F-150 or a Chevy 2500?

I'm like, go for a 2500.

I mean, it's gonna last you longer.

So yes, it comes maybe with a higher maintenance cost

a little bit because it may have a bigger engine

or it may have a diesel.

But in the long run, it'll just last you longer

and you'll be safer.

Totally.

You'll be safer for the longer haul.

Totally.

And we know this, heavy-duty trucks,

a lot more of that percentage of those trucks

do hard work all the time.

Some more half-ton trucks,

they're not really built for really hard work these days

or some of them.

Obviously you can get the base trucks

and those trims are still out there

but so many of the trucks we test anyways

are, yeah, man, they're family haulers

with beds on the back, you know?

I hear you.

What about I was bummed

because we were both at SEMA this year.

Yes.

But I did not run into you.

So I was kind of bummed about this

but what are you seeing as far as I wanted to ask you

a little bit about maybe trends

or what was your SEMA experience like?

Sure.

Well, the first thing I'll say is,

just talking about auto shows, man, SEMA is alive and well.

That show is crazy.

So I did SEMA, I think I covered it five years in a row,

maybe like 2014 through 2019.

And then I think starting the pandemic year

I hadn't been back.

So it'd been a few years since I'd been there.

So it changed a bunch.

There's that whole new haul.

So my first initial takeaway was like, you know,

I didn't go to the Detroit auto show last year

which was a crazy one for us.

We've always done Detroit,

but there's no point as a media member anymore.

I know LA is still doing all right

but it feels like it's going the same way.

New York feels less important.

The other North American auto shows

have totally gone the other direction

where SEMA is absolutely crazy, man.

What a busy show.

And I realize it's not the same type of show.

It's a trade show.

It's not just for, hey, come look at our new models

and it's not even a public show.

Yeah, it's just for consumers in the trade.

So I recognize it's not the same thing,

but man, I was just happy to see how vibrant

in the live it was down there.

And then yet.

It also kind of helps to, well, it helps and it doesn't help.

It helps to spread it out across multiple buildings

because I remember like you were talking like 2014

where you're walking shoulder to shoulder,

you know, with 5,000 other people

and you're like, why am I here?

You know?

Yeah, yeah, it is from a media perspective

can be a tricky show to cover for that reason.

It's so busy, right?

We're pretty lucky where we go to other shows

on a media day and we get a bit of space to work.

Whereas that show, yeah, you're really

in the thick of things with all the people out there, man.

Yeah.

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But yeah, it was fun.

I love seeing all the trucks.

I'm trying to think what really stood out.

I mean, probably what stood out to me the most,

what stuck in my brain is that little Maverick 300T

for the simple fact that they're actually gonna build it

or build some version of it.

It's seem as great to see the pie-in-the-sky crazy stuff,

but I love it when a brand says,

hey, here's a turbocharged version of the Maverick

with 300 horsepower,

and we're gonna do something like this.

You're gonna be able to get one, which was awesome.

So it's fun to see stuff like that.

And then for me,

because it was such a crossover of my worlds

and your worlds as well,

was the Toyota side-by-side.

Like, come on, that was crazy, man.

I didn't have that on my bingo card

that Toyota would build a side-by-side.

But this is a whole other conversation

we can get into if you want,

which is side-by-sides are so expensive now

that there's a legitimate crossover

between should I buy this new, whatever, Polaris Expedition

or should I buy a Toyota Tacoma?

Like those prices actually crossover, which is bonkers.

So I think Toyota is sitting there going,

wait a second, we can do that.

I know how to, I make engines,

I make chassis and suspensions

and I don't have to put airbags into it.

Please, sign me up for that

and I can sell it for how much?

So to me, I think Toyota is just jumping on an opportunity

and I honestly think it would be a slam dunk

if they brought this thing out

because consumers, they know the Toyota brand.

Inside-by-sides reliability

is always the number one thing people are looking for.

Same with trucks too, but inside-by-sides

that's all anyone ever talks about.

So Toyota's got the name, they've got the reputation,

they've got the dealerships.

I hope they do it, man.

I wanna see that thing.

Yeah, and also they named it, interestingly, Scion,

which used to be a compact,

kind of affordable, sporty car brand

and now it's kind of representing,

well, they didn't really say, hey, we're doing this.

So they showed the Scion side-by-side

and I think they wanted a reaction from us

and I think they got a lot of positive reactions

because it seemed to be a popular thing.

You have a sport machine channel, right?

Yeah, so we have a channel called TK Power Sports.

So we do all power sports, side-by-sides, ATVs, PWCs,

all that stuff.

Yeah, so did it do well on that channel for you as well?

Was it pretty good?

It did okay.

I mean, I published after you guys,

so once TFLs published, I mean, what's the point, right?

But yeah, it did okay.

And it definitely got just a lot

of people going, same reaction I had,

which was, oh my gosh, this is crazy.

This is not something I saw coming.

I did not think a brand like Toyota even, maybe Ford,

a brand like that might do it, but Toyota of all brands.

So I think the viewers on our side

were just as surprised to see it too.

Yeah, I wonder what GM and Ford

and Jeep are thinking, right?

They saw that, they're like,

hmm, because it seems like you mentioned the Maverick.

I just wanted to kind of come back to that really quick.

Sure.

Ford did the Maverick and almost nobody answered, right?

I mean, Hyundai answered with the Santa Cruz,

but it wasn't quite as popular,

but still nobody else have answered that question.

And Ford is really successful with that.

And the other thing I wanted to say

about their kind of performance packages,

a lot of them.

So we've been contemplating this at TFL

of whether we should supercharge our F-150 Tremor or not.

Nice.

And the supercharger is a Whipple,

but it has a fourth performance backing, right?

So basically you could do it at the dealership level.

Right, you gotta level.

And similar thing with this Maverick, right?

And they have Mustangs and other Broncos

and other products where you could actually sup them up,

but do it with some dealership backing.

But I recently was talking to my friend Charlie from Houston

and he actually bought an F-150 supercharged F-150,

not a Raptor R, but just kind of a basic truck.

And the gray area was the warranty, right?

So originally he was told it was like 36 months,

three year, 36,000 miles,

but then they're like walking it back,

walking it back to like 12 months of warranty.

So right now there's a gray area

that I need to follow up on because I really want to ask

for then also Whipple,

because Whipple is providing the parts, right?

And then the dealership technicians

and then kind of Ford is backing it a little bit, right?

Yeah, that's the biggest selling feature I think

is the warranty, because obviously you can get stuff

on the aftermarket at any time, right?

But coming from the dealership, so you trust the work

and then getting the warranty, so without that

it's a tougher sell.

Yeah, so, and then they also announced

that the F-150 Raptor are 900 horsepower package, right?

At the same show at SEMA and everything is,

well, first of all, I'm really impressed, right?

That Ford is actually willing to go,

but now there's a little bit of doubt in my mind

because Charlie's having a really hard time

with what they're telling him in Houston.

So I'm really hoping Ford really stands up and says,

you know what, we've checked a lot of these components,

they're satisfying whatever it needs to satisfy

in order for us to back it for at least three years, right?

Yeah, for sure.

Which would be amazing, like you said,

because you could do a suspension lowering kit

or a lifting kit or any number of things aftermarket

at any time, but in order to be properly engineered, right?

And also backed.

Right, that's the selling point.

Yeah, that's a really huge point.

And I'm really quite impressed because, I mean,

GM has crate engine programs

and, you know, Stalant as Mopar does as well,

but it seems like Ford is taking it to the next level, right?

Right.

Okay, it's not just a crate engine,

but you could also get, you know,

some modification done at the dealership,

which is really, really cool, I think.

For sure.

And the one, so we tested an FP700 on the channel

in 2022, I wanna say, maybe 23,

which is the 700 horsepower F-150.

It was a little, I can't remember if it was a Redcat,

but it was a short wheelbase truck.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And it was funny,

because the suspension was done, the engine was crazy,

but they don't do anything to the steering.

And that was like the one weird thing in that truck

is like everything feels sporty and aggressive,

except the steering feels like a regular F-150.

So I don't know if that's changed or if they do anything.

That was the only weird thing to me.

I remember driving going like,

that was the one part of this package

that I feel like you guys missed on

was not making the steering a little quicker,

telling me it's a performance version.

But outside of that, I mean, 700 horsepower

straight to the rear wheels is incredible.

Yeah, and that's kind of like what they were talking about

with the Lobo packages, right?

On some of their Mavericks and F-150s is that

it's supposed to be a holistic package, right?

It's more.

Like the Maverick, the Maverick Lobo,

they talked about quicker steering ratios.

They talked about different brakes.

They talked about, they thought about all those things,

not just, oh, let's lower it or whatever,

and just have it the same, but...

Totally, and the Lobo's fun.

I liked the Lobo, man.

I was really impressed with it.

And I think most people had the same reaction that I did,

which was actually like,

oh, you did everything but the power plant?

It would have been nice to get that power too, right?

Like the handling's good, the steering's fun,

but a little more power would have been cool.

Because yeah, it's like knowing that that's a brand

that used to have say like a Focus RS on the road.

It's like it's not anywhere near the level of a Focus RS,

but maybe it could be with a nice power bump

and a little more tuning.

So I'm happy to see them doing that.

And it's also fun to have a fun street truck on the road, man.

Not everything has to be off-road capable.

Let's get some trucks that are fun

to go around corners in, you know?

Yeah, and I think maybe we can kind of close

our conversation by talking about,

I was just seeing, you also did a story

about the Ram, the dude concept,

which was a 1500 dude,

which is also kind of a slightly lowered Ram 1500

with a Hemi engine.

I mean, it's got a V8, it's got a lower stance.

It's got some body kit on it.

And I'm wondering, they didn't say

they're gonna sell the dude, by the way,

at least straight up like this.

I'm wondering if there's another trend coming

where like the Lobos and then the dudes

and also maybe the SS.

Hey, where is the Chevy SS pickup truck?

Right, yeah, that would be cool, right?

It does feel like we're getting back there

or give us a Tacoma X-Runner, right?

You know, those were cool trucks, man.

And obviously we both love the off-road trucks

so I do not want to see them go anywhere,

but we have so much choice now with off-road trucks

that it feels like maybe they're sitting around going,

we've kind of pushed this to as far as we can push it.

What else can we do, right?

So let's swing back into the street trucks

that we used to have.

And of course, Ram had the king of them all, the SRT-10,

which is ridiculous, Viper-powered Ram

that, yeah, made no sense, right?

And I've never driven one,

so maybe you can add insight if you have,

but that truck apparently wasn't good handling.

It didn't go around corners very well,

but it didn't matter

because it was a Viper V10 in a Ram.

So I wanna see the brands have fun like that again.

And if there's any brand

that's gonna do stuff like that,

it is Stellantis, right?

First of all, they're the kings of the special edition.

If you look at any of those brands, Jeep Dodge, right?

They love their cool special editions

and they just like having fun.

So yeah, we'll have to see.

And maybe we can even tease that,

we know the TRX is coming back

and we think maybe we're gonna find out more

about that hopefully in the next couple of weeks.

Exactly.

And there's a lot of rumors swirling around

related to the TRX,

which is maybe in another version of a Ram,

maybe street capable,

maybe street oriented,

maybe a lowered version with a big engine as well.

That would be cool.

So there's a lot of rumors swirling around,

but we can't confirm right now.

So that could be very interesting as well.

And to roll them out together,

that would make a splash, man,

because we all know the TRX is,

and I say coming back,

as I know the RHO has kind of been the placeholder,

but coming back with a V8,

but how cool would it be to have that truck

sitting next to a lowered Ram right there, right?

With the same engine and ready to go fast.

That would be cool.

And Ram's going back to NASCAR.

So they've kind of got that cool NASCAR design truck

out there now.

They could have borrowed some stuff from that.

Yeah, and they have,

going back to NASCAR,

gives them a little opportunity to advertise more, right?

So maybe there is something there.

And you know what,

we love the Hellcat obviously.

We just recently had that Durango Hellcat here as well,

which is, you would think it's a 15 year old chassis

with a, what is it, a seven year old engine

or eight year old engine,

but it's still so good.

It's still so good.

You know, when they designed that Durango,

you know, when I was in middle,

no, I'm just kidding.

When they designed that Durango a long time ago,

I mean, something,

it was so right,

except it's expensive, right?

I mean, I did the video with it and I said,

all of us should have one.

Yeah, that's fair, man.

That's the best way to take your kids to soccer practice

for sure.

But it's $80,000.

So maybe all of us can't have one,

but all of us should have one.

So anyways, yeah, so it could be a lot of fun.

And like you said, maybe they did push.

I was thinking about this, you know, the Raptor R, right?

It's a 720 horsepower,

drunk on 37s with a, you know,

pretty sophisticated suspension.

Where do they go from here?

Right.

Right?

Yeah, no, it's fair.

And how much, you know, how much are people gonna spend?

Especially when you really get to the higher echelon,

yeah, aren't you just gonna go buy

like a custom tube frame buggy

or, you know, straight to the trophy truck,

go get a spec trophy truck or something like that?

Like, yeah, I don't know, man.

I'm sure they're coming up with something, you know?

They got to, but, and even, yeah,

talking about a limiting factor,

the 37s, as I'm sure you know,

they actually limit wheel travel.

So the best truck for going fast in the desert

is the Raptor with 35s.

So there's already one thing where they've hit that wall

of going, oh, actually, we're decreasing some performance

by stepping up to this larger tire.

And that's just one example.

But yeah, I don't know how much further

they can push it, man.

Yeah, totally.

And maybe the next frontier frontier is the lowering, right?

Maybe you're going back to a little bit more sporty

for the street while still maintaining the off-road trucks,

like you said, right?

You can't get rid of, don't take our off-roaders away.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, I'm the same way.

I'm like, I love the sport trucks,

but if we all sacrifice those,

as long as we keep the off-roaders,

because we are spoiled for choice these days

as off-roaders.

If you have a budget for a new vehicle,

there's so many good choices, right?

Budget off-road trims, mid-off-road trims,

crazy off-road trims.

So what's going on next year?

Do you have any stuff brewing that you can tell me about

or just a lot more snow digging and off-roading?

Yeah, there's definitely gonna be some videos

out in the snow and the ice for sure.

Yeah, nothing really planned too far

into the future right now.

I will tell you the product

that I am most excited to get on next year

is the Yamaha Cross Wave.

I don't know if you saw that thing.

It's Yamaha's newest Wave Runner.

It's got like an open bow design.

So it's actually like you can walk all the way around it.

It just, it looks so cool.

It looks so different from any other Wave Runner

or Seadoo or Jetski that's out there.

And I'm so curious about it.

It looks like the ultimate adventure PWC,

like there's storage bins everywhere.

And yeah, it just, it looks so crazy, man.

It looks like nothing else out there.

So I am very excited to get on the Yamaha Cross Wave.

And then I'm also excited for the Rev, man, the Ram Rev.

We don't have details on when we're gonna be in one,

but I'm assuming we will be driving one in 2026.

And that's exciting.

I think that's a product that should have been here

years ago, a plug-in hybrid pickup truck

should already be on the market.

So the fact that we're finally getting one

and getting one that's so interesting

because it's not just a plug-in hybrid, right?

It's the range-extended EV.

So it'll be a cool one.

I'm excited to hear details on that

and when we'll be actually getting our butts in seats.

Yeah, I second that one as well.

And also, yeah, you're kind of the king

of the water sport, I would say.

Because you know me, I love my ski boat,

but right now it's in storage and we can't,

well, not that you can go swimming right now.

Outside, but...

Yeah, no, we have a short season, man.

We gotta take advantage of our, you know,

four months if we're lucky.

No, but you have some history with that, right?

You have a history with water sports

and you're quite good at that.

So...

Sure, well, you know what?

I will give Roman props because in 2015,

I bought a brand new Seedoo and then I started at TFL

in 2017 and one of my very first videos

was like Roman and I brainstorming

and I was like, hey, I own a Seedoo.

He's like, hey, review it.

So I was like, okay, I've never reviewed a Seedoo before,

but I own it, I spent my own money on this thing.

So I did that video and that video caught on fire,

it went huge and I've kind of never looked back.

I've been reviewing Seedoo's and PWCs ever since.

I've done a few boats, you know, I've kind of crossed over.

Those videos have not done great.

It seems no one cares what I think about boats,

which is fine, I'll stick to PWCs.

But yeah, I love doing that stuff, man.

I just like doing different stuff, right?

It's fun to do a truck video

and then head around the water the next day

and do a Wave Runner video.

And I upgraded my fleet.

This summer I bought a 1997 Wave Runner Wave Venture 700.

So I bought myself an old Wave Runner too.

So that's been fun.

It's always fun to have toys.

That's sweet.

And big green is still kicking around, right?

Big green is still around.

Big green, still good, man.

It's in storage now.

I take it off the road for the winter

so it's not out in the salt.

But yeah, for the most part, it's doing all right.

I think honestly the biggest job I've done

since I've taken it is I switched out

the high pressure fuel pump.

I think we've talked about this.

So the FI-TEC high pressure pump, it was never good.

It always had issues.

You guys went through, I think one or two of them.

And so then is it any wonder

that FI-TEC fully redesigned it?

So I actually reached out to FI-TEC and said,

hey, I'm trying to do this.

Here's my truck.

Can I get one?

And they said, yep, we have a whole new design.

Here it is.

So it's brand new.

I installed it two years ago now

and it's been flawless.

It made the truck not much more reliable

and it's been perfect.

So yeah, kudos to FI-TEC.

I'm so happy because I know you and I have struggled

so much with some of that fuel,

starvation, it basically wouldn't start.

It was just bogged down.

It stranded me a couple of times

but the worst one was I went off road with the truck

and I did this like really steep decline

like it's staring straight at the ground kind of thing.

So I came down, pop up, the truck's running,

and then dead.

And I'm like, geez.

And that was it, man.

It was just, I starved that little fuel bowl

and that high pressure pump because of the angle

and once it loses pressure,

it took forever to get it back.

But it did start, but yeah, it was a pain in the butt.

So that's going.

And then yeah, I just, I love driving that truck, man.

And I worked it.

Actually this summer, I built a new little pathway

in my backyard out to my pool.

So I put just over 2,000 pounds

of limestone screening in the bed of Big Green.

And it was better than I thought.

Like I really expected it, talking about overloaded trucks.

I really expected it to be sketchy and terrifying

and it was fine.

And so it's, I put it in Skyjacker suspension.

So that's kudos to Skyjacker.

But yeah, power felt good.

Handling, you know, it hunkered down real nice

but it did good.

So I love having it, you know?

I just having a pickup truck around.

You can't beat it.

There's so many jobs that you can accomplish

when you have a truck.

So I do miss it when it's off the road.

Second the fall comes and I got to take it off the road.

I start going, what am I gonna do around here?

I need my truck.

I got jobs to do.

Yeah.

I also get sad when I have to put my boat away, right?

Yeah, exactly.

It's like October or September, October.

And I'm like, well, there goes another one, right?

So, you know, totally.

Yeah, same vibes.

Yeah, so it's sleeping in my dad's bar

next to his 71 Chevy.

The two old Chevy's, they sleep in there together.

I wonder if they're exchanging stories.

Who knows?

Comparing owners.

All right, man.

Well, I really appreciate you coming on

on this podcast episode.

I really, I think we have a lot of fun talking.

So we should, we should, well, hopefully I'll see you.

Maybe, maybe even soon.

So who knows?

Yeah, man.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yeah, thanks for having me on Andre.

This was a blast, man.

I mean, we have, there's just so much to talk about

with pickup trucks.

And this was a pretty meandering podcast,

but that's what's fun.

Just cause, yeah, there's so much to talk about.

And what we do is so similar, obviously.

So we're always, always talking about

and complaining about the same things.

So it was, it was good chatting trucks, man.

And Merry Christmas.

Happy holidays to everybody out there and to you.

Yeah, same, same, same thing.

Happy holidays, Merry Christmas.

I really appreciate your time.

And like I said, we should collaborate

maybe a little bit more.

So it should be, it should be fun.

Sure, man.

I'd like that.

All right.

I appreciate it.

Thanks a lot.

Take care, everybody.

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77:52

Ep. 309: Are Sport Trucks Making A Comeback? Truck King Weighs In!

Chevrolet K10

$115,000 Canadian

About this episode

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