How To Get Ceramic Coating To Bond To Clear Coat and What is The Best Ceramic To Use On PPF? Episode #936

Welcome to the Pints and Polishing Podcast, the most influential and listened-to podcast in auto detailing.

Welcome to the community.

All right, new year, new you. Welcome, everybody, to 2026. People woke up to 26, a little different maybe than last year,

but we all know one thing remains true for the detailing industry.

As you heard on the opening of this episode, we still remain the most influential podcast for the auto detailing industry,

as Nick's wearing that beautiful hoodie.

We're trying to go into some other parts of the auto industry, making waves and getting more people accustomed,

as you've seen in the hyperclean specialist group, more people coming in going,

hey, newbie, hey, I'm here. This is what we're excited about 2026.

All the new people coming in to hyperclean and listening to the podcast.

Now, Nick, we're going to get into a lot of fun stuff today, topics and questions out of the specialist group.

We have been warned now, the reason why I said that about being the most influential,

we've actually been warned not to go too in-depth over the products that were coming out in 2026.

Too many years listening, huh? Too many people wondering what's coming with HC.

Yeah, no doubt about it. Happy that 2026 is here. We're through the holiday season, so it's back to work.

Back to work now. Did you take off? How'd you do with your crew?

No, I worked pretty much the whole time. We took the Christmas, you know, and that Thursday, Friday off,

and then last week we just took New Year's Day off.

I kind of give my guys the option, whatever they want to do, what they want to accomplish,

and we kind of vote on it, and they voted to work.

Well, my inbox was flooded today with people from our vendors getting back to work.

Oh, yeah. It was a hellish two weeks of trying to get things done.

Yeah, you couldn't get people to respond. You couldn't get people to respond. You couldn't get people to respond.

We knew it was coming, and, you know, you can celebrate the end of your year that way by just relaxing, which doesn't make sense.

You know, we talk about the most influential. There's a question inside of the hypercleaning specialist group

that we're going to spend a little bit of time on. We're going to throw that into neutral, not into park,

because we're going to still be moving, but go into neutral, maybe rev the engine while we're at the light.

Okay, we want to talk about concentrates, and particularly there was a question inside the specialist group about revive.

And can we make, you know, it's very excited, love using revive, and this question has been asked many times over the years.

So once again, as people wonder, hey, is this about me? I mean, we're bringing it up because of the question.

I think it was Drake. Yeah, it was a good question.

It was a great question, but Drake, this question has been asked many times throughout the years,

we're going to go over some stuff, right? Like, let's start, let's, in a sense, go back in the day, right?

Drake, when you and I started, there was only concentrates. You couldn't find any, at least for me,

I couldn't find here locally, you could find glass cleaner that was ready to use.

I mean, look, it was basically five gallons. So it was a five gallon world, what we call five gallon cube world.

I mean, that's the world that it was. There was no, I mean, very rarely some specialty stuff was in gallons.

But like, even when you bought spray wax, I mean, most of that stuff, if you were on the shop or production level,

you were 110%, you know, five gallons, you know, that's, that's kind of what everybody sold.

And we've seen, not only is that not the case now, you can talk to detail supply houses, you can talk to anybody you want.

The vast majority of customers, professional or not, don't want a five gallon at all. I mean, that's the stuff that sits the longest.

Anything in a concentrated version. And there's some companies that you and I know of that have done a great job in their concentrates.

They don't sell nearly the level of what they do in gallons and bottles.

Yeah, correct. So we go back and we think of what has that journey been from concentrates out of the five gallon cube?

How do we get to one gallons and how do we get to 16 ounce, you know, ready to use? And when I say we, I mean the industry.

Right? Like, I want us to all to have a moment here and some of you that weren't around.

There was one company that we could tip our hat to and say they really kind of came into the market and change the way people thought of it.

And I think the way the industry changed was the quote unquote DIY enthusiast market. It's always been there.

Right? We've talked about my memories of the chamois, right?

And my memories of my dad and my mom washing their cars and the other people that we would all you car guys would all joke about, right?

Like, there were people that did wash their car, but has the amount and did that amount increase?

Maybe about, I don't know, 15, 20 years ago with this thing called Facebook and some group that did a lot of great foam videos

and really began to open people's eyes to, oh, well, I don't have to get it in a five gallon anymore.

Oh, I can get it in a smaller size. That was the wake. It was the big wake for everybody.

Yeah, I mean, obviously, there was a famous guy that sold his company for a lot of money that, you know, pioneered getting out of just the professional market and into the consumer.

And you look at it any way you shake it, we are where we are, right?

There's another thing about gallons and ready to use stuff that as a guy that runs a company that, you know, number one, if you're mobile, you know, that's a big deal, you know,

to just be able to throw some gallons on your truck and kind of move around, you know, space saving those types of things.

But the other thing is, you know, if you're around concentrates long enough, you also see the downside of it.

You see a real downside to it, because, and that's where like, you know, and big, you know, you and I talked to somebody at SEMA or talked about somebody that I spoke with at SEMA

is like these metering systems, if you're really doing a lot of work, you can't let people just mix up chemicals.

Like there's a real danger with concentrates. And you and I've seen it, all the guys that are experienced out there from a different time know about it,

whether people want to admit that that was happening, wheels get burnt, you know, windshields get burnt, you know, interiors get burnt.

You know, we see all kinds of stuff still to this day. One of the wildest things that I see since we're talking about revive in particular,

guys, you shouldn't be burning up interiors. Like you just shouldn't be a part of the world anymore. And the fact that it's so prevalent.

And when I say prevalent, it means we only see the people that post after they burnt the right. So you can imagine the number that don't post.

And the matter of fact, then the hundreds of comments under the post tell you that those people are burning up interiors because they always have a solution.

They're like, Yeah, you know, just slap this on it. It works great. And you go, Well, how many interiors is this guy burning up?

So from a business perspective, and also all you DIYers out there that that again, want to talk about concentrates in this yester year.

And this is something I'm saying on clutch culture a lot now because we're seeing it. If you weren't there, you didn't know the downside to it at all.

And so there is a downside for every one out of 100 people that think that a concentrate is a solution.

There's another 99 that have seen the problems that come with that. And we're just, I think at a better place as as people that make products now to go.

Hey man, grab this gallon, put it in your bottle and go to work. And that's just not always how it's been. I mean, there's real fear.

People can remember of mixing up chemicals or having a helper mix up chemicals and things not going correctly.

Yeah, I mean, I can speak very specifically to early on when when I began to go into the market here locally.

You know, I set up a lot of those metering systems. And when the dealerships or when something went wrong, and let's say that the product they were using had to be cut,

or they might receive some damage on their plastics, like for instance, specifically, not our brand, but I was selling a different brand,

and their degreaser if it wasn't cut properly, guys would use it. We all know this to be true. They'll go and spray it on the front,

get the bugs. That's the way they clean bugs at a dealership. Go spray it up on the cow windshield all over on the side.

Just cooked.

Yeah, you can get a call out of nowhere. Hey, something's wrong. How many cars did you spray? Well, what'd you do? Right? Like it was all about.

And here's the key. I think what what most people when they get into concentrates, they want to concentrate because point blank,

I like the product, but I just don't want to spend that much. Yep.

There really is when you boil it down. Yep. That's what happens. And so what we're saying, I think to your point, what actually happens is,

sure, you might have a concentrate that saves you and we joke, but might save you a few pennies per spray bottle. I mean, am I, and it probably will, we get it.

But what do those pennies actually cost you? Well, yeah, I mean, because all you gotta do is burn up one car. One. Yeah, one.

And, you know, look, we've heard stories from our district distribution network that guys use one of our products that works fantastically.

They want to save, like you said, a couple pennies. And all of a sudden they fried a windshield. They fried a front end.

They fried an interior with someone else's product because quote unquote, they saved a couple pennies. This just isn't the business anymore of trying to shave pennies here and there.

I see a lot of talk about what people think high production places do versus what they actually do.

And I can tell you the best high production PPF shops or or or tent shops or detailing shops.

They can tell you all they want publicly that they sit there and you know, we got our system down. Look, man, you and I have gone into these places.

There's things they're buying off this truck and that truck and there's a mishmash of shit. And when they flip over to us, they're like, well, now I just go one place.

This is so great. We're going to be bringing a really famous shop online that does, you know, some incredible work.

And we got down to that conversation. It was like, oh yeah, you weren't saving money. You were just taking you didn't count all the time it took you to track these things down and do all of these things.

And now that you've done the math, you go, holy, you know what? Here we are.

Well, you mentioned a word there that I want people to also realize we talked about the savings financially.

But come on, guys, does it ever pour? Absolutely right. You don't have any that jiggle down the side of your bottle that gets on your hand.

You got to go wash off if you use the wrong chemical and the guys don't use you're like Nick and you don't use your gloves.

I mean, who does so you pour the wrong product and some guy accidentally oopsies over, you know, they got Ross degrees or something straight onto their hand and what most of us go, that's not a problem.

You just go wash it off. We're talking time. Yeah, yeah, what did that just cost you three minutes.

If you're like somebody three minutes. So those pennies.

They're gone. Yeah, no, it's it.

I think this is an excellent question to start the year with is like this pension pennies thing and look we I get sent posts from all different types of Facebook groups which is basically where a lot of this detailing conversation happens.

I mean a lot of this stuff's just unhinged.

That's just what it is. It's just unhinged behavior. It's not really thinking about the big picture. It's not thinking about standing behind your work.

Guys, I was sent Rinsless's you know Rinsless products from other companies 1012 15 years ago almost now.

And people would be like you can do everything on the car with this and then I use it on a couple interiors. I'm like yeah man this stuff doesn't the interior doesn't feel how it should feel.

So I see all of these quote unquote hacks of saving a nickel and I go go really clean a car clean a car you're going to drive around a car that you like that's yours.

Clean it with revive and then clean it with a concentrate and then clean it with a Rinsless solution and you tell me which one really makes your car come out on that elite level.

Because that's the other part of the argument that I don't understand if my guys can dump this gallon into a 32 by the way how many of you are discharging an entire 32 ounce bottle on a car.

Come on.

I have like.

Pardon me.

Not many.

Okay.

And so I'm not saying it doesn't happen.

We've certainly all seen beat up vehicles.

I'm just saying that's not really the norm in the detailing space today unless all you're doing is high production stuff, which again, as we talk to many people and a lot of different other companies.

They're like, yeah, not as much work is happening in the high production world as it once was.

So the story that we have to tell here is get a product that works that makes the interior as new as possible.

Move on with your life and anytime wasted towards I could save three nickels.

I could do this.

I could do that.

Now there was something said about I get a little leery about spraying on a dash or spraying the chemical on this.

That's just not how I work and I totally understand that there's a simple fix.

Spray it on the towel.

It's that simple.

It's fixed.

I don't have that worry with revive.

Now I don't go willy nilly spraying up near glass and stuff like that.

But if you're worried about spray it on the towel and be done is what it is.

My Jeep does just fine.

Yeah, I mean it's it.

I just think people have again all of this wasted energy costs something.

Yeah.

You're not getting a customer.

You're not working on your car, whatever.

All of this wasted energy in the system that really doesn't get to a better result.

I think that'd be one of the things we could take and leave in 2025 and maybe in 2026 just concentrate on what matters.

Well, you and I know somebody that we won't say his name publicly but we would say this about him and his business.

He focuses on the wrong things.

Maybe trying to get a better deal with UPS instead of out trying to get a sale.

Right.

This does happen and this isn't even in the detailing quote unquote industry.

Right.

This is just another business person that we know.

Right.

Focused on things that are important.

I mean we can't argue Nick because people would say hey listen you manufacturers are just saying you want us to do that because we won't you know we're going to spend more money with you.

We won't be able to cut it back as much and I can't.

I mean what are you going to say you can't deny that.

Right.

What are you going to do and that's why I want to push back on this is where the market has gone.

Yep.

It's not us.

It's the market that is forcing it.

Trust us.

We've got interior concentrate right on the shelf.

We've got a degreaser concentrate.

We've got a car wash concentrate.

I wouldn't use a car wash concentrate.

Most people don't like it.

If you're a quote unquote detailer they say it under performs.

Okay.

It isn't for you.

It's for old school solvent is going to make you cough.

It's tough.

The interior cleaner and here's where I want to kind of go for a second.

You've got some things going to come to interior cleaner of solvents and surfactants.

Right.

This is going to be a big part when you go into concentrates versus ready to use.

That is a big deal.

So factants are like the bridge that help everything.

The solvents is the big ones that cut.

They're cheaper.

Yeah.

That's what we've talked about.

Why you see burning doors?

Why you see bug cleaners that burn?

We get it.

It does happen.

You know, so why we do revive?

Why we do our products the way we do them?

There's a need for a surfactant specific surfactants that we use to do a job that

we felt was needed in the industry.

Right.

I mean, if the industry's headed one way as you've parked, you know, you've

said is like, Hey, when I came into hyper clean, this was what I wanted revive.

The industry was in a different way.

Have other people come back and got, Hey, fresh interior cleaner is very much needed.

You bet.

But we do have a pulse on the industry.

And if people want to know about concentrates, let's have no problem talking about me.

Always.

I could talk about a constant and you got to remember to get to a concentrate.

You have to do something that cheapens everything.

I mean, it's just a math problem at that point, because you can't sell a concentrate that

cost as much as ready to use, right?

So how do we get a concentrate more than likely?

We're putting something in there that brings a hint of danger.

If it's not diluted correctly, if it's not used correctly, whatever.

Those are just the trade offs.

I think it was an excellent question, but I would go back and say.

I couldn't have my guys use anything fast enough as revive.

It's like poured in a bottle, get to work.

Right.

And if your process is what's catching you up, which is like, well, this is how I do it.

I would say revive makes your process simpler.

There's no worry.

Spray it again.

Use caution.

Don't go spraying every screen and every button, you know, still use your caution

because it is a chemical that has water in it.

And you don't want to get water down and buttons unnecessarily and all over screens.

That's spray your towel, move on.

I can tell you there's no product that I could, I could almost trade out any product.

I would never trade out revive.

You know what I mean?

Like if push came to shove and it was like, it's like revive just makes it easy.

I don't have to worry about anything.

Guys seeing all these fried doors that I see online just don't risk it.

I'm just telling you, I don't care how cheap the door panel is or how.

Why we don't need to do that.

So I think that's a great place to where we're at.

I mean, I can see what everybody's point is, but I go, dude, I love just being able to let my guys loose and just not have to worry about the things I had to worry about 10 years ago.

I don't want anybody to imagine maybe you are in this place.

Maybe you are not.

But imagine you're in the market to buy a car.

Now that could be new car or used car, but we're going to think used car.

All right.

It's 2026.

We're in the market by used car.

We're going to go over to the Facebook marketplace.

We're going to find and I'll let's just say we're looking for a, I don't know, pick something.

Nick, what are you looking for this year?

I don't know.

A truck.

All right.

We're looking for a truck.

Definitely not a dodge.

So we're going Chevy, huh?

Yeah.

I don't own any Chevy.

New year.

New year, Nick.

Yeah.

It's not a Chevy truck.

All right, Nick, you got three Chevy trucks on Facebook marketplace.

You're trying to decide which one to choose.

They're all specs are the same colors.

You love everything about them.

You want to start looking over the vehicle to see if you can get an idea for how

somebody took care of this car.

Now I want to give everybody a little bit of a hint of something I look for.

And it came up when I pulled up to a stoplight.

You can do it as Nick says, when you walk up to the big box store, whether that's Target,

Walmart, wherever you're going, Best Buy, you can go look.

I love to do it when I'm at a stoplight.

And I saw this really cool Ranger over the other day.

I'm sitting there and I'm looking at it.

I'm like, man, that looks really great.

What do I do?

I'm either go down to those rims.

I gotta see what the rims look like.

If they take care of their rims, then they take care of the rest of the car.

Right?

It's almost like that movie.

Well, if you can dodge a wrench, you can dodge a ball.

Yeah.

Right?

Like if you take care of your rims, you definitely are taking care of other parts of your

car.

Now what did I see on this Ranger over?

I saw dark spots with a bunch of light spots with almost look like fingers that

had wiped off real small fingers.

Maybe like baby fingers.

That told me that they went through a car wash, right?

Because there's these little mitts with little foam fingers that go around and flick

the wheel.

So they didn't get all the way off, but they got most of it off.

Then that gives me a look.

Okay, if they go through a car wash, I can then look at the rest of the vehicle

and tell how well they've taken care of it.

Most car washes dot, dot, dot, dot, dot.

Right.

If they had a clean wheel, I can assume then they automatically take care

because to get down and wipe a wheel.

Yeah, it's work.

It's almost next level in it.

Yeah.

Or, you know, like in most people's case, you know, they pay to have somebody

do it professionally.

And you go, okay, well, they care enough for somebody to show up a couple

of times a month and take care of their car.

They're spending the money.

They're not just, you know, set it and forget it people.

They're not, you know, just saying, I'll get to it when I get to it.

They set it and forget it in the other way, which is looks like they have

somebody come out pretty regularly.

I mean, there's no question that, you know, when you look at cars in a

variety of different places, whether that's an auction site or whatever,

you know, wheels can tell a story.

I mean, wheels tell a lot of the story.

You know, and again, even if a dealership has them recon or refurbished,

I always look to see how good the refurbishment job is.

I'll tell you what quality work that was maybe done across the whole

vehicle at the dealership when they recon the vehicle.

You know, that stuff becomes important.

I was wiping down our Nissan wheels this weekend.

I mean, I've done it before.

I just now remember once you said that I pointed out some some

rash in a sense from when she hit that wall and they took care of it

on the panels.

The wheels, they didn't take care of it.

Didn't.

Is it cosmetic?

Is that why they go, insurance isn't going to cover a cosmetic damage

on wheels?

You have to be on top of it.

I mean, when I told them, I said, hey, make sure you get this

taken care of.

Well, then seems like you better go back to the body shop and go,

hey, why didn't this get taken care of?

That'd be the move.

That would be the move.

But you sent me a video, right?

I mean, it is true if you go up on and you know, the Range Rover

wheels were, they were just a regular Range Rover wheel,

right?

Standard factory wheel.

But you sent me a funny, a funny video was actually commented

inside the specialist group where I think it was Justin was

asking, hey, are those on rock stars?

Right.

Like it is known, thanks, Dustin, that I do have rock stars

on my older Jeep.

It's a 2011.

And that was the time that rock stars were big.

So I got them, right?

If you don't take care of black matte wheels, though.

It's as bad as it gets.

Yeah, we we've had crazy experience with a couple of

Mercedes where even the Mercedes factory finish was

problematic, didn't hold up very well.

I mean, I think we're probably largely out of the old

school traditional matte black wheel.

You know, I think we're more towards like a satin,

more sheen type of finish that kind of ages a little bit

better.

I still see Matt from time to time, but it's definitely not

as big as it once was.

And we also start to see like bronze and gunmetal gray and

all that kind of stuff is more popular now a little bit

more of a, let's call it a forgiving, you know,

powder coat, so to speak.

All right, let's dig into those concepts.

How do I know if I'm a detailer and I'm a newbie

because there's people in our group and people listen

to go, I'm a newbie.

All right, let's newbie those wheels.

How do I tell the difference you listed satin,

you listed gloss, you listed not talking about Matt.

It's just a finish.

I mean, look, I mean, Matt, how do I take care of them

based on each finishes?

Yeah, I mean, I think this kind of goes back to our

last conversation is that, you know,

if we take the aluminum wheel and we say that one

sits over here, okay, the aluminum wheel that needs

polished and stuff like that, that sits over here by

itself.

We're not discussing that.

We're discussing basically every finish besides that,

let's just say.

Then this is the important thing of, you know,

you kind of talked about how we have this

concentrate of a degreaser.

That's where it becomes problematic, you know,

even for the dealer level, the car wash level,

they've even cut back and started to understand

that safety is the priority because look, man,

to have a set of gold wheels refinished is that's

that's you're going to a powder coat.

I mean, those are coming off the rubbers coming off

and that wheel is going to be refinished.

You and I grew up in a time when somebody could

come out to the dealership and this is largely

still most wheels and they could fix some some rash

and they could.

Yeah, they could they could go ahead and,

you know, match the paint and then they could go

ahead and clear coat over that and they'd be done

in an hour.

You're in a little bit of a different world now from

the factory.

There's all kinds of different options from

different manufacturers, different colors,

different ways they're done.

That stuff's not as easily easy to repair and

make look good at times.

This is where just having sound products bails

you out of all the problems are our iron

remover.

If these wheels are in really tough shape and you

need to decon the wheel or you're going to go

and coat them, you need to decon the wheel.

It's pH neutral.

Not many people can actually say that about

their iron remover.

No matter what anybody tells you when you

really get down to the nitty gritty and test,

there's very few people that have a an iron

remover that's truly pH neutral.

The next thing is, is that that's where TRX

becomes important because when you use TRX

on the rubber and it starts coming down

on to the wheel, you've got a harsh

degreaser that can still cause problems even

though you quote unquote didn't spray it

on the wheel.

Now, if you just want a simple clean up,

just use TRX all the way around.

Use it on the wheel, use it on the tire,

it's a good all around cleaner for both

things, but this is where, again,

dialing in the products that you're using

and using them for a specific reason.

Number one, they need to be effective, right?

So we're not going to ever gloss over that,

but safety, when you're talking about,

you're going to be, you know, you could be

an owner like myself, like you,

and I have six different finishes

across the cars I own.

Then I have like two more that are just

kind of normal, you know, four more

that are just kind of normal, but I got

six different finishes.

So if I have any flaw in the way I do

things, I would maybe have to carry

on my shelf just to clean my own cars.

I'd have to carry like a ton of different products.

Just simplify it, carry TRX and Fuego

and you're good on all of them.

All right, so if we see a glossy wheel,

I think we can most even hear a newbie.

Sure.

Is it Kia has a lot of these glossy

black wheels now?

Everybody does. Yeah, I mean everybody.

A lot of them.

I think the one problem that a lot of us

face when we get into that is,

we could go into this moment of,

hey, I want to make sure I get it clean,

but I do want to do it in a cost-effective way.

Sure.

And so a little spray and then take a brush.

Yeah, look, we've talked about this.

Makes sense.

You can understand.

Hey, black gloss can look bad pretty quick.

Explain that, like what happens?

So, you know, one of the things

that I've shown on our social media

a lot is just

TRX in a foam cannon.

And I think a lot of people misunderstand

or I don't do a good enough job

always explaining, you know, first of all,

it gets a lot of product on the surface,

but everybody needs to understand

the foam cannon already dilutes everything.

So I'm pouring TRX

direct into the foam cannon.

I'm not diluting it.

And then the pressured water coming through there

dilutes it for you.

So don't put, like, two ounces in there

and think that you're going to get such a watery product.

But by the way, you don't use very much

to do four wheels.

I mean, very hardly at all.

I mean, I bet there's times I only use, what,

like one or two ounces,

you know, on four wheels

if I use it at the foam cannon.

But the reason I do that

is, number one,

it allows Fuego to dwell more

liquid onto the surface, right,

of the wheel. So I got Fuego on there.

It's hot out or suns in.

It gives me more time.

But the other thing is it provides lubricity

to go in and actually detail the wheel.

I mean, that's the most important part.

Because even with a boar's hair,

I mean, even some of the softest,

the softest brushes,

not enough lubricity,

we've seen the damage.

There's no question for sure.

Yeah, I mean, we could joke about,

all right, next time.

Or next big box story. It doesn't matter.

I mean, you can see

wheels that is great

that they designed them this way.

They look pretty cool.

But crap.

Man, they can make it look bad quick.

Man, yeah, they just went south

in a wrong way.

All right, let's get into

this out of the specialist group.

This comes from Sean.

Sean, I think it's a good question.

I have to defer

again because

I just still get to even apply

one piece of PPF down to

do a car. So got to defer

over to you. But the question

really is about

putting PPF down

and there's this brand that he had.

He was a kid and he said, you can get

this kid or you can get this kid.

There's a one level

and then a second level.

I think it's one with a top coat

with some protection and whatnot.

I don't know. I'm not getting into it once again.

I don't know PPF so don't quote me

on it. I think that was the basis

of it. But explain

to everybody that might be wanting

to think about PPF in 26

and go, hey, what

do I need to do with hyper

clean coatings?

What do I need to think about PPF

and should I even put a hyper

clean coating on PPF?

Yeah, so

I kind of said this to Sean's

post. There's a ton of misconceptions

about top coat

ceramic infused top coats

all these different things that go on

with PPF.

And the confusion lies at the feet of

the marketing around this stuff with

the PPF companies themselves.

Sure. Now

game changer.

Game changer. I'm sitting over here

looking at my table and we have manufacturers

that have sent us PPF

to specifically test our coatings

with their PPF

even some of these people

who own the PPF companies and we

actually know people that manufacture

PPF. Okay, they're not just a middle

man like some of the big companies, they

actually have a manufacturing facility here

in the United States.

When you sit down and talk to them

as well as their head chemist

and everybody, you start

to realize they've convinced themselves

of something that they can't

back up. Okay.

When you're talking about something like pain protection

film, you need to realize no matter how much top coat,

no matter how much ceramic

infused top coat, whatever

it is still an extremely

porous surface.

And when something is porous

we can coat it.

And actually

there's a reason

to coat things like vinyl wrap

and pain protection film

because they're always going to fall short

of the level of protection they need

from the element.

Yeah, absolutely.

Right, so

I always tell people

my belief on pain protection film

we've put

every one of our coatings on pain protection film

all of them work fine, all of them

install fine, everything's great.

I just, yeah.

But when you're applying

one of our coatings on

PPF

there is a thing that you tell people

to make sure that they do.

Yeah, you lay it on even more heavy

because you have a more

porous surface than pain.

Okay, same with vinyl wrap.

Vinyl wrap actually to the maximum

is in this position.

So, but I always also tell people

if you're

coating PPF and there's PPF companies that have

released coatings that have failed so

miserably in the marketplace it's like caused

a huge riff in the installer network

and it's still going on to this day.

So, even PPF companies

don't get this right when they try to

they're not in the coating business

that's what everybody needs to realize

they're not in the coating business even

a little bit and most of them are not very

educated on the coating business.

They'll tell you that and admit that behind

the scenes not something they're going to say publicly

by the way, so

which is understandable.

So,

I tend to believe

that if you have these extremely porous surfaces

the best thing you can do

is bring that car

back in the shop if it's yours

or someone you're doing it as a business

and just use something like

Uno or Stack

yearly.

So, number one it gives you a chance to

inspect the paint protection film and how it's

wearing and the way that the customer is

taking care of it or you yourself

but also

it's just such a porous surface

it's just going to soak up more coating

which is going to give you more longevity

which is going to protect things a little better

it's just a good rule of thumb that I use

but you absolutely can put

Trey or Sparta, we've had people put tons

of Sparta on PPF and they love how it works.

Our

lineup is designed

to be very flexible

on purpose because that's

really the latest technology it's not

some rigid surface it's about flexing

and moving with the surface that it's bonded to

and so use them however

you want if people want my recommendation

you should be coating PPF

every year.

And so that would be using

more of whichever you choose

but probably not the Sparta

right? Not the Trey

there's some customers that say

that's what they want so provide it

it doesn't matter how much you argue with them

Agreed but the average

right if you're going to have a

system or a theory behind

which most of your customers

are probably going to come and go

hey man what do you recommend here?

Stack is a perfect option

and heavy stack right?

Heavy on the stack

We always get these questions

about things like RVs

things like anything like that

when the surface

is extremely porous

when we say lay it on

that means lay it on

like don't

put a couple drops and try to do it

it's like man you're going to have a

long work time on PPF much longer

usually than paint

lay it on thick, lay it on

half the hood, watch it beat up

let it sweat as much as you can

so you know that more active ingredient

more solids are being left behind

go ahead and wipe it off

you'll be good to go. We've done a million of them

I think there'll be some PPF

installers that might push back

and go listen I might

not see this guy again

I've gotten them for PPF

I'm going to get them for Trey or Sparta

and get them in that three to five here

and hit them

again it's not a right or wrong

not a right or wrong

because

their business model

might not be set up

that their customer comes back

we're seeing a flaw in that

and we're starting to see

Thank you this is why I was going to have to

we're starting to see

very very large

PPF operations

understand

that they maybe took a wrong turn

not a wrong decision just took a wrong turn

some of them abandoned

coatings altogether which was a huge mistake

and they're

realizing it now at least the smart ones are

and so

look I've always told people

you know for guys that tell me

that they're in really competitive markets

I'm like

you realize if you put stack on the whole car

in 20 minutes you could just offer this

as part of the service that you charge the same

for because it's going to take you like 20 minutes

and you get more peace of mind

10 bucks cost me too much

it's crazy right so

I would say to everybody

I get it

and that may be what you have to do with some people

okay

I think you could make a nice

extra living in your shop

or mobile if you say I'm coming out here

to do this every year

we'll send you a reminder

come up with your price for it

$299 $399

if you're in a strong market you get a strong brand

$499

it's a lot of money for

very very condensed amount of work

I mean prep everything

you could have this done in an hour hour and a half

there's a lot of money to be made

and you're taking care of the customer on an elite level

I think it's kind of a no-brainer

yeah agreed

okay let's get into this question

and I found it to be very interesting

and a little confusing to

I might not remember it correctly but

the question had basically to do with

Trey or Sparta

and was the customer

had Trey on the car

and Sparta

on their car in a different vehicle

and they felt that Sparta's hydrophobics

were better than Trey

yeah

I mean that's exactly

there's a reason

that you go to the elite level

coding

is if you want all of the experience

durability

hydrophobics

best cleaning ability all those types of things

you go for something like Sparta

I mean that's the best of the best that we have

I would say this

are you going to notice a dramatic difference

in hydrophobics

you'd have to be

pretty knowledgeable about what you're looking at

okay

you'd have to be really at the top level

of a consumer to go

I see a dramatic difference

but there is a small difference because you're talking about

a higher solid count

left on the car

so you're going to have more hydrophobics

and better things

and

the unfortunate part

of a Sparta on something

and then for whatever reason they want to go cheaper

on another vehicle

or more value driven and go down to Trey

or go down to Uno

it probably needs to be part of your talking point to go

your other vehicle has the best

on it

so this is what the best looks like

do you want it to look like this then you need to use the best

you need to get my best package

that's not to say

you don't see awesome stuff with Trey

or Uno or any of those things

if you're a tricky customer you might want to stick on Sparta

it is interesting

the continual will always be

that

they'll evaluate a coating based on

hydrophobics

it just is what it is

hydrophobics are the key indicator

the way most people look

at a coating

you know

we could always some of us could go

could one coating have gotten clogged

right you could

and ask questions

but at the end of the day the average person

looks at a car and goes

hey the hydrophobics the way these beads

look there's smaller beads on this

car or more beads than this car

you and I are sending pictures

oh shoot I didn't send you that picture

I meant to send you a picture

but you sent me a picture and I meant to send you another picture

of a product that we've been

working on and seeing some of the hydrophobics

on the cars

and we go on wow

2026

hey when it comes to beads

man we might have some of the best out there

yeah no it's

it's just the way the market is right

like people look at hydrophobics as this is

the exact reason why

I got a coating and there's going to be a lot of people that

that's the reason they got it

it's like the most satisfying thing to them

so I think it's just all about where you place

it to the customer

but yeah I mean if you go from uno to tray

you're going to see a little bit of a difference

you're just talking about

the strength

the contact that all of this stuff

put together

you're going to see a bit of a difference

so we're thinking tray vs sparta

and we know prep is key

you know do you prep

a car differently with tray than you do sparta

or is it just

you know if somebody chooses to get a polish

then or a compound

once I get to three

and five year everybody's getting a polish

I think you're talking about

you know when you're trying to get

something to last longer

you know prep work becomes

extremely important

when you're trying to get something to last a year

with the technology the way it is now

you can do a simple nice

thorough decon and you can get stuff the last

12 18 maybe even 24 months

there's a peace of mind

of three and five year somebody's

made the investment they want it to look nice

getting some scratches and swirls

out and things like that

it's a different type of customer

that's my opinion

there's plenty of cars that just

want to know that their car

is protected

that's why we have stack and uno and dos

and things like that when you get to three to five

year you're usually talking about a different customer

and those customers want the paint

to be as shiny as possible where does that come

from it comes from the coating along with

how you finished out the panel

with polishing and compounding

and things like that and so I just

find that it's a different customer but

every three to five year for me is going to get

some type of polish

and even if it's a new car

because you know this is something we've gotten into

you know if it's a new car does it

necessarily need a polish

I don't you know do you

choose that with your customers

different than I choose with my customers

different than other people with them

I you know I had a guy that you know he was a newer

car and only had maybe I don't think

a thousand something miles on it

and I quoted him with

for a polish is a while ago right

and and he goes

okay cool that sounds fair I think it was like

anyway I don't want to list the number because everybody

everybody goes into something on numbers

I won't list the number

my number might be different because

my needs are different than your needs

so once

I got the work done

and I returned the vehicle back to him

I let him know that the number

wasn't as high

as the number I quoted

because I told him I said you have a newer vehicle

I did not need to polish it

sure so I didn't

quote him and I didn't charge him

not quote I didn't charge him

for the polish now

we've gotten a question

inside the specialist group which rolls

right into this

if you've got stack and you're going to put

stack on a car

do you have to polish the car

like somebody asked

should I put a one step on

if I do stack is that a must

you know I think this comes to that

process where people are looking

and I can understand

looking for a just blank

an answer

so

one of the big misnomers

is we have to

do all of these things to

put a coating on

and that comes from a different time

there was some necessity because the technology

wasn't as good

sitting here at the beginning of

2026 the only thing that matters

to bond

a coating to a car

is that you have naked paint

which means you have

nothing interfering with the

coating and the painted surface

the clear coated surface

that is all that matters

you can get a five year

and not do polishing or whatever

and coat it as long as

it's naked paint and it's going to be just fine

we would say

there's a lot of reasons

to just run over it and give it a

clean up when you're starting

to talk about something lasting five years

and let me go ahead and exfoliate a little

bit of this light oxidation that happens

as soon as the car's done painted

done being painted

but the truth is always

going to be the truth that scientifically

the only thing you need

is naked paint to get a coating to bond

so if you're putting stack on

and this is one of the reasons it was invented

you don't have to polish the car

that comes down to

does the customer want the ugly swirls

gone

do they want their car

to look better

and have some of that

those spider webs and

random things taken out of the paint

that's what it was down to

because the guy earlier that was questioning hydrophobics

we could if we took a look

and once again we're not coming after

this guy

we're just generally talking

like you could take maybe take a look

at a car that did a

a three or five year did

Tray or Sparta and whether or not it got

polished before

well I wonder if

then we could see just

a little bit more hydrophobics

I wonder if you could

see just a little bit better

clarity is where I would really think

for those of us that have been around

paint long enough we know that we're leveling

when we put some type of

polish or abrasive

onto the paint we're leveling down

leveling

taking off the higher parts

and making it more even

so then when the sun hits it I get a better

reflection of what was underneath

in a sense I could

create a glossier look

100%

that clear coat has been

perfectly smooth

there's no question I mean that

a lot of the gloss

on the elite level is all about how you've

leveled the clear coat and then finished

it out right and then

you put on top of that a really

really glossy coating and all of a sudden

you got the recipe for something that looks

pretty incredible but again

I think stack and

uno maybe even to some

people dose needs to be looked at

a hybrid where you go

there's going to be certain customers that want to pay

for a polish and there's certain customers that

don't the only

concern when you're putting on a coating is

whether or not you have

naked paint and that going to be achieved

with cleanse with white

with all of those different you know

with flago to get all the contaminants

off all that kind of stuff

making sure you have no bonded contaminants

if you have to clay you have to clay

but again

we got to state this as a factual

scientific statement

if the clear coat is

with no interference

coding bonds

that's exactly the story and in some

cases

some people use products that are heavily oil

based then don't do

a thorough wipe step

they would have actually had a better bond had

they not polish the car

because that introduced

another contaminant in between

coating and not to get down a hole here

because it's not the purpose

that's why that wipe step

being done thoroughly slow yourself

down load the car

up with it to you know

especially if you use

there's a lot of you guys using polishes

that I'm telling you is causing

some of the issues you're seeing

we've been stating that for well over 18

months now two years almost

so

you just need naked clear coat so

go ahead and decon and get the car

prepped and slap stack

on it if that fits the customer

all right so we can see definitely out in the

market if we want to go look at

and we'll just go ahead and tip our hat

it's been cool at least I thought it's been pretty cool

to see Mildren go out and put

this hey I'm using stack and I'm

doing a 199 and

he'll say no polish

ceramic coating you know it is

interesting how some people are

starting to make certain points

around what they're going to do

and how they're going to use the you know

work on the car I think he's somebody

that way if anybody wants to ask him

you can get a lot of people to send you

messages and you can get a lot of

great great marketing tool it's

a great marketing

$200 stack

ceramic coating put onto the car

it's all it's all about where you're located

you know I mean some of you guys might be

at 299 399 some are going to be

at 199 149

but you got to remember the whole idea of it is

you know you're working on the car for an hour

hour and a half

that's pretty good money you know

Brian's been doing this a long time

you know he knows how to get around a car

he knows how to train his team to get around a car

and more importantly he understands

I need people to talk to me

and that's

gets people to talk to you

right like oh I've been interested

in ceramic coating let me talk to him

how many of those people you guys end up

calling to Trey or Sparta is limitless

it's limitless so people see these

things and then the people that come in

and take advantage you go hey my guys love doing it

it's not doesn't beat their body

up it's nice quick service

people see the gloss on their car after

having this applied they're ecstatic

they got some protection everybody's

happy so you got to find

and understand why those things are used

and then how do you capitalize on

them

you definitely have to have your system ready

okay so let's break that down

one more time we get a car that comes in

what are we gonna hit it with

how are we gonna do it walk us through

you know is that 10 minutes here

and then 15 minutes here at the

end of it how long does it take

me and what have I done yeah cleanse

flago if you're

in a place that the car needs clayed

you got to fit that into your process

dry the car off

get all the cracks and crevices cleared

out with some type of blow tool

whatever you use to blow out cracks

and crevices go do a

thorough wipe with our

white product and start applying the coating

you should be in and out on a mid-sized

SUV which is what most people

see that's why we use it because

that's the number one seller in the United States is

mid-sized SUVs

you're in and out if you're

efficient in under an hour and a half

that's that's two hours max

yeah I mean it should

if you're at two hours

you need to look at parts of your process

yeah you should yeah

you're basically just having to wash and

de-con the car and put down a

20 minutes should be max

call it 30 if you're

yeah if you're trying to be if you're not if you're not experienced

mm-hmm yeah man you should be

rocking and rolling and it's

a great service and I'm glad to see

that he's putting that out to his

area and he gets

a lot of response and again

guys remember it's a foot in the door

thing you're getting people

to talk to you because you're like

I got this great service

you're happy if they purchased that

service but there's going to be a lot of people

that want to get a three and five year coating as well

yeah

all right so we're going to end with this and I did not

prep Nick so he doesn't know this question

it's coming we'll end the episode with this

as we go into

2026 you know for me

I don't do it as often as I used

to but I used to always do

a goal for the year no I didn't

right a lot of people love to set goals

but Nick and I aren't gold people we don't

do that for me I've

always been a word of the year

where it kind of gives me a path

to guide myself right

so for me here at HQ

I gave us the

word purity I don't know why

that that name stuck it just it just

really did because when I think of

26 I think of wow

getting to 27 and looking back

and going

that was a year because

Nick and I know internally what

we have planned out for 26

and it's bigger is greater is

more than we've ever done

and that's not high

I think once people start to see as we

get through the year and the products

that are put out the media that's put out

all the different things that between

the two of you and I we've been working on

I think we're going to get to 27

and we're going to go wow

that was a lot so if there's a

lot to do and there's a lot

coming out of HQ

I think that's why the name

and the word purity kind of

stuck because it was like I've

got to refine things I got to make sure everything

is great because there's

going to be so much coming out

if it all comes out and it's not

pure wow

well we can get into some problems so

I you know I really is my word

for the year here at HQ and it's kind of a weird

word I I've never thought of that word

before but I really do

look at the the products and

probably why I sent you a message recently

about going back in and trying

to refine a product that we

have coming out and how can we make

this product easier how can it be something

internally that is is more

efficient for our team to

produce right how can I

purify what we do

here at HQ do you

have a word or you have anything with

your team as you've talked to the media

team like what you guys are looking

for into 26 yeah it's not

a word I think it's just

more of

you know the way

the last half of 25

went and and kind of some things we've

seen internally

is

you know I would probably say set the

standard you know that

we want to have talked about

we want to be our own standard

I think a lot of people probably

think

and I could see why from the outside you would think

this is that we

heavily worry about what other people are

doing and we really don't

you know we really

like I said I mean

you know we've been notified of a few

thing of a few people

who now all of a sudden have

some products that look very eerily

similar to our lineup

that really doesn't bother me and I've

had to say this to a couple people that

it's like

those people aren't going to last

right because if you don't set the standard

and you don't

actually know what you should be doing

internally there's no way

you're going to make it out alive

right so we're more concerned

of setting this and I think everybody

could take this is like

you know there's a lot of

really negative stuff on the internet especially

you know in any industry and our industry

is no different but our industry

again I'll say is no different

every industry has this

negativity it's like

if you guys notice man

we stay in our lane

because we have a standard we want to live up to

and if we live up to that standard I think the

chips fall where they're supposed to fall

and that's kind of where our head

is at is like doing our own thing

being in our own lane you know even when we

say things like the industry

we're talking about the industry the way most people

talk about it we're talking about anybody that takes care

of a car you know we're talking about all

of those kinds of things and so

I'm extremely excited for

2026 I want to thank everybody

for listening I want to thank

everybody for all the support and we look

forward to a great year and

we'll catch you guys next week

How To Get Ceramic Coating To Bond To Clear Coat and What is The Best Ceramic To Use On PPF? Episode #936

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