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WelcometotheWilsonDealsPodcast.
I'mSamtheoldcardadiaandmyguestthisweekisJake'sHarding.
ButyoumightknowhimasJamesfromChopsGabbage.
He'saCardealerbydayandaYouTuberbynight.
Andwithoverahundredthousandfollowersonsocialmedia,areallysuccessfulone.
Butwhatmostpeopledon'tknowaboutJamesisthathe'salsoaclassiccarenthusiastownerandafact.
Youwon'tbelievewhathe'srecentlysupercharged.
Staytunedtofindoutyou'reinforasurprise.
Hiscarstoryisataleoftwohalves,andthatisexactlywhatwe'vedonewithhispodcast.
Sofortoday'spartone,let'sfindoutwhatexactlygotJamesintoclassicsanddealingmoderncarsaswell.
Plus,howhaveyoumadethemovefromacorporatecareertoshiftingmetal?
Solet'scrapon.
HiJames,thanksverymuchforjoiningme.
Hi,Islam.
Firstofall,whatbroughtyoutothecarsandwhichcamefirst?
Themoderndealingortheclassiccarsofyourown?
TheearliestmemoryI'vegotofseeingacarandgoing,wow,wasbeingonholidayinFranceandbeingtakenroundatownandseeingaCX25GTIcitronwithotherflattedrearventandthequiltedseats.
AndIwaslike,thatisamazing.
AndIrememberlateroninthesameholiday,IthinkitwasaRenault5GT,justlikeovertakingmydadinhisSierragoingaroundthecornerflatout.
Mydadwasalwaysobsessedwitholdcitrons,soIthinkIgotabitofitfromhim.
WhatsortofyearwasthatwhenyouwereinFrance?
Sothatwouldhavebeenprobably30yearsago,maybe.
ThatwasatimewhenFrenchcarswerelikespaceshipscomparedtoours,weren'tthey?
TheywerejustMydadwassointocitrons,mysisterwantedherfirstcar,andhedecidedhewasgoingtododgehimself,notactuallybuyacarforher.
Andhecamewithalightbluecitronvisa,Ithinkitwasa1.1
withtheCokecancanisteronthesidewithallthecontrolsonthat.
Shewashorrifiedandhewassopleasedwithhimself.
Itwasterriblefirstcarforagirl,really.
MinewastwoCVs.
Yeah,helovedtwoCVs.
Iactuallyboughthimoneatonepoint,butheneverspanneditoncars.
Wedidn'tknowanythingaboutmechanicallyworkingonthem,butwewehadaloveofcarstogetherandhewasobsessedwithcitrons,soIthinkthat'swheremyloveofoldercarscamefrom.
AndheboughtAustinA35onesandputitinthegarageandsaidwe'regonnabuildthistogether,butneitherofusknewhowtodoanythingoncarsatall.
NowI'dbelikeanAustinA35wouldbetheeasiestcarintheworldtoworkon,wouldn'tit?
Igavethatcarawaywhenhepassedaway.
IgaveitawaybecauseIdidn'tknowwhattodowithit.
Butsoyeah,somydadstartedoff,andthenIhadastintasacarsalesmanatabout20cardealership,didthatforaboutthreeyears.
Yeah,I'vejustalwaysI'vejustalwaysbeenalittlebitobsessedwithcars.
IrememberlikewhenIwantedtogetmyfirstcar,theParker'sGuide,IwouldgothroughtheParker'sGuideandcheckeveryinsurancegroupandthehorsepowerandtheperformance.
AndIwentthroughandIworkedoutthata216forTessroverwouldbelikethefastestthingIcouldgetforthelowestinsurance,butthenIthinkIspotteda105TCFiatStrada.
IstartedoffmyloveofFiatandAlphaMayo'sfromthere.
Soyeah,IjustI'vealwaysbeenintocars,butIonlyhadaveryshortstintdoingitasajobabout20to23beforeImovedawayfromitagain.
I'veonlyjustrecentlycomebacktoit.
Whatmadeyoucomebacktoit?
SoIwentfromsellingcarsinthattimestraightintomobilephones,whichwasthebigboombackinthedayswhenmobilephoneswasthebigboom.
Iworkedinacompanyforabouteightyearsdoingmobilephonesandworkedmywayupfrombeingashopguyrightthewaythroughtonationalsalesmanagerthere,anduhsawanopportunitywhenFacebookfirstcameouttoadvertiseonFacebookformobilephones.
Imeanthatthatboomperiodinmobilephoneswascrazy.
Therewassomuchmoneyabout,somuchmoneyabout.
AndweweregettinggiventripsontheQE2andprivatepartiesinLondonandstufflikethat.
Itwasjusttherewasloadsofmoney,anditwasarealworkhard,playhardatmosphere.
Soyeah,thenIendedupsettingmyowncompanydoingthatonline,butthenitchanged,likenetworksdidn'twanttohaveindependentdealers,andyouusedtogetallyourcommissionupfront,soaphonewouldcostyou£100,butyou'dget£300commission,soyoumake£200aboxonamobilephone,andyoucouldsell15ofthethingsinadayoutofonestore,couldn'tyou?
Butiftheychangedit,sotheysaid,andthenyoustartedtogetintotheApplephonesandtheycostthree,fourhundredpounds,andthentheystartedtosayingwe'renotgonnapayallthemoneyupfront,we'regonnagiveyouongoingrevenueasthecustomerpaystheirbills.
Soyouhadtocompanieswentunderovernightbecausetheydidn'thavethecashflowtosustainthat.
SoImovedoutofthatintoIhadmyownbusiness,likeIsay,withacoupleofcallcentres,butImovedonoutofthatintoonlinemarketingwithafirmforengineeringanddidthatforaboutsevenoreightyears,butthenIhadachatwithmybosswithIwasn'treallyhappywherethingsaregoing,andwehadachat,anditwasallveryamicable.
Weagreed,Ithink,onabout12kpayout,andmywifesaidtome,Youlovecarssomuch.
Atthispoint,Ihadaboutfivepersonalcars,soIhadtohaveasharedgaragewithafriendwhorananalphamayospecialist.
Werethosefivecarsallclassiccars,orwereyourunningphallium?
Yeah,soIyeah,Iskippedabit,didn'tI?
WhileIwasincorporate,allthetimeIwasincorporate,Iwasflippingcarsatweekends,andIwasjustbuyingcarsthatinterestedme.
SoI'dbuyanMGB.
IdidalotofMGBsbecausethey'resoeasytospanneron.
Andyouknowwhatthey'relike?
Theyalwayshaveaterribleinterior,they'dhaveaterriblesteeringwheelandthey'dhavebubblingdowntheseamsandthatkindofstuff.
SoIno,actually,wellbeforethat,actually,whenIwasinmycorporatejob,IgotboredatweekendsandboughtaminiandputitinthegarageanddecidedIwasgoingtoteachmyselfhowtodospannering,dobodywork,thatkindofthing.
AndandthenIstartedflippingcarsatweekends,andIdidalotofMGBs,butIdidSaab900turbos,anythingthatreallyinterestedme,anythingthatwaslikeamodernclassic,thatI'dbuystuffthatwasjustabittired.
I'dlovejustmachinepolishingandtidythemup,andI'dflipthoseatweekends.
ButIgottoapointinmyjobwhereI'dbesittinginaboardmeetingandI'dzoneoutthinkingaboutwhatIwasgoingtoweldorfixattheweekend,andthensomeonewouldaskmeaquestion.
Ididn'thaveacluewhattheyweretalkingabout.
Andcorporatejustgotsoit'sfullofbullshit.
ItwasjustlikeIspentallmytimeinHRmeetingsanddisciplhelpingwithoutwithdisciplinerecruitmentandallthatkindofstuff.
Ijustgotreallyquitedisdisheartenedwithallthatkindofthing,andImuchpreferredbeinginthegaragespannering.
Itwasmywifewhopushedme,said,soIsaid,Okay,we'vegotabitofbreathingspace,I'llgoandgetanother,I'llsendoffmyCBandgetanothercorporatejob.
Andsaid,No,you'vegotgaragespace.
Whynottrycars?
Youlikecarssomuch,whynottrycars?
AndmyfriendswasnowforaMayoFiatspecialist,soIdecidedFiat500s.
SoIstarteddoingso.
IthinkIatthattimeIthinkIhadaFiatSteelOabath,whichIthoughtwasgoingtostarttobecollectible,a205Rally,aMercedesE320convertibleonanighte4,sotheoldsquareones,youyou'llbebetter.
W124.
W124.
Blueonblue,bluehood,bluebody,blueleather.
Itwasreallynice.
Yeah.
WhatelsewasI?
Ohno,myAlpha75.
ButthelongestcarI'veeverownedismythree-litreAlpha75.
Ihadthatforaboutnineyearsorsomething.
Irebuiltthatonmydrivewayontheaxlestand.
Soshesaid,Whynottrycars?
You'resomadaboutcars.
SoIstarted,butIIdidn'tthinkofgoingdowntheclassicroute.
Ithought,what'sgoingtobetheeasyseller?
AnditwasIwouldstartonandwhatwouldmakesenseoutofanAlphaRameraspecialist.
SowedidstarteddoingFiat500s.
AndIusedtobuycrashdamagedonesfromCo-ParkanddothemupuntilIrealisedthatitwasasmuchtimeandeffortasjustbuyingagoodoneinthefirstplace.
Andthenthat'swhenIstartedfilmingYouTube.
SoI'dgonefromhavingacorporatejobtostartingtofixcarsup.
SoI'vegonefromwearingasuiteverydaytocomingininapairofcombatsandat-shirtandrollingaroundunderneathcarstryingtogetnutsandboltsoutandchangegearboxes.
Soitwasacompletedeparture,itwasn'tanaturalprogressionfromanythingyouwerealreadydoing.
Itwasaconsciousdecisiontogodownacompletelydifferentroute.
Yeah.
AndIcanaskhowoldyouwerewhenyoumadethatdecision.
OhGod,whatwouldIbethen?
38,maybe?
38,Ithink.
Grabokay.
AllmylifeI'drunsalesteams,I'dbeeninsales.
IthinkwhenIleftthelastjob,IthinkIwasoverseeingabout150,Ithink,atonepoint.
AndwhenIwasinretail,itwaslike30storesandhundredsofpeople,butwhichalwayssurprisedmebecauseIneverthoughtIactuallylikedpeoplethatmuch.
Iwasalwaysinasalesjob,butIneveractuallythoughtIlikedpeoplethatmuch.
AndIwassupposedtomanagepeople,andIhavenoempathyforpeopleatall.
AndIwassupposedtomanageallthesepeopleaswell.
MywifealwayssaysI'vegotnoempathyforanyone.
See,itwasalwaysamazing.
IwasalwaysendedupIthinkIwasabitmoreofapitbull.
IthinkthetheCEOsalwayswantedsomethingbetweenthemandthesalesteambecausetheyhadnoideaaboutsales.
Theyalwayswantedtoimplementstupidideasandtheyneededsomeonetogoandsellthestupidideaanddealwiththeflack.
SoIalwaysconsideredmyselfabitmoreofaIwasprobablythepitbullreallyfortheCEOs.
Yeah,soitwasagoodtime.
Imetalotofgoodpeopleduringthattime.
Imetagoodlotofgoodsalespeople.
Butyeah,soitwasacompletedeparture.
ItwaslikeIsay,suitedthebootyboardmeetings,doingreports,everythinglikethat,tocominginandliterallytakingapartofFiatFire.
BecausewhenIstartedout,Ididn'twanttospendanymoney,soIdidalltheworkmyself.
SoIwouldliterallylikesaystripthecarsdown.
There'safewfriendsthatweremechanicfriendshelpedmeoutwithsomeoftheprocesses.
Didyougostraightintoregisteredtrader,tradeplates,limitedcompany,traderspolicy,ordidyoujuststartgivingitagooffyourdrivewayandseehowitgoes?
Well,soIhadthegaragewithmyfriendalreadyandIpaidhalfofit.
SoIwasIhadthatstraightoutofthesoasinaproperworkinggarageliftseverything.
Andthedealwehadwasthathegotapercentageofthesaleofeachcar,soIdidn'thavetoIalreadypaidrent,butashegotapercentageofeachcarhelpingmeoutwithsomeofthetoolsandsoforth.
ButIstartedtradingunderhisnamebeforeIthensplitoffasasoletrader,andthenI'veonlyrecentlygonelimited.
Soyeah,soIdidstartunderhisnameinitially.
Anyregrets?
Areyoudoyoumissthecorporateworld?
Notatall.
Becauseit'saveryit'saverydifferentlifestyle,especiallybeingaonemanspeakingfromexperience,beingaonemanbandcardealerisit'sajobapartfromanythingyou'veeverdonebefore,isn'tit?
Yeah.
Idon'tmissitforacoupleofreasons.
One,thecheesyone.
IgenuinelydolovewhatIdo.
SoafteryearsandyearsofMondaymorningswaslike,ohgod,I'mbackinagain.
Whatdramasaretheregonnabe?
WhatamIgonnahavetodealwith?
Idon'tfeellikethatatall.
NowI'dquitehappilydosevendaysaweekinhereifthefamilyletme.
Sothere'sthatcheesyelement,IdogenuinelylovewhatI'mdoing,butalsoiswithincorporate,thisisgonnasoundreallybad,butseeingCEOscomefromcertainbackgroundsfromcertainuniversitieswhodidn'treallyknowanythingbutgotpositionsjustbecauseofthat,andthewaytheylookeddowntheirnoseatoneofthethingsjustbeforeIleftwasaboardmeetingwhereIwon'tsaywhothepersonisbecauseactuallyanon-executivedirectorfromaverybig,well-knownfirm,
sittingthereandsayinghowherdaughter,hisdaughterwascominguptoworkexperienceandshewantedtobeaphysiotherapist,sohehadarrangedforhertogoandwork,goandstayinMilanandworkwiththeMilanfootballteamforphysiotherapy,andinthesamemeeting,laughingatthereceptionistbecauseshehadnowherenearamillionsetupinherpensionforaretirement,shedidn'trealisehowmuchmoneyshe'dneedtoretire,andthentheywouldtalkaboutweneedtodocutbacks,andthey'dbelookingatthepeopleon20grandand
25grand,andtheperformanceofpeoplewhenthey'vebroughtnothingtothetableandthey'regettingpaidthesamekindofmoneyforthreemeetingsayear.
Ialwaysthoughtbeforethatitwaslikehowhardyouworkwaswhatyou'dyou'dearnbasedonhowhardyouwork,andthenIrealisedthesystemisabitgainedtoacertainextentwithoutgettingtoopolitical.
Andasamanageraswell,theotherthingaswell,whenyou'reinsales,alotofpeopleknowthis,isthebetteryouperform,likeIwasgoodatmyjob,soIwenttoacompanythatwasmassivelyunderperforming.
Igotittoupandupandthenintogrowth.
Butwhathappenswithyourtargetjustgoesupanytargetgoesup,soyouneveractuallygetahead.
Ifyoudowell,youshootyourselfinthefoot.
Soyoucanneveractuallyearnwelloutoftheperformingwell.
Whereasinthisgameformyself,ifIpushreallyhard,allthatmoneygoesinmypocket,Igetaninstrumentawardforit.
It'snoonesayingnextmonthyou'vegottosellanotherthreecarsoranotherfivecarsbeforeyoucanearnthesamemoney.
No,beingabletomakeyourowndecisionsaswell,thatit'suptoyouwhetheryoubuythecaratwhatyoubuyit.
It'suptoyou,notsomuchinthenewcargame,butcertainlyintheclassiccargame,it'sespeciallywiththeconsumerlaws,whichwe'regonnacomeonto,it'sasmuchaboutmedecidingwhetherornotIwanttosellthemthecaraswhetherornottheywanttobuyit.
BecauseifIthinksomebody'sgonnabebackwardsandforwardsonelastic,ifIthinksomebodythinksthey'rebuyinganewcar,it'snotacarforthem,andIwon'tsellittothembecauseattheendoftheday,ifthey'regonnaridetheclutchforfiveandahalfmonthsandthenbringitbacktometoreplace,uhit'snotforme.
Thebiggestthingformecomingintothisindustry,thebiggestshockerformecomingintosellingcarsfulltime,andobviouslyalotofpeoplelisteningtowillhavebeenintheindustryforalongtime,sothere'llbenoshitSherlock,wasjusttheattitudeofthepublictowardscardealers.
That'sbeenthebiggestshockforme.
IcomeintoagamewhereI'mbeingtoldyou'reresponsibleforthisproductanywhereuptosixmonths,within30daystheycanjustgiveyouthecarback.
You'renotevenallowedtodiscountforthemileagethey'reputonit.
Andtheydon'tneedareason.
Thatdoesn'thavetobeareasonaboutit.
Theycouldactuallytakeituptofiveyearsiftheywantto.
Iftheygotonfinancefiveyears,yetyou'rebeingtoldthatallyoudoiswashthemandstickthemoutofthedoor,andthenyoudon'tdoanythingbecauseanythinggoeswrongwiththem.
It'slikethere'snologicandyou'realldodging.
I'mgoing,hangfar,thatcardealership'sbeenthereforthreegenerations.
Whyarepeoplestillgoingtothatplaceifalltheydoiswashcarsoutandthenabsolvethemselvesofanyissuesthatcomeuplateron?
Howhavetheybeenthereforthatlong?
IwentontheTieKickerspodcast,exercisemyrighttoreply,becausetheywereMax,MaxandMattwerehavingaconversationaboutisitokay?
YouseeacarbeingboughtatauctiononaSaturday,andbythefollowingFridayit'sonadealer'swebsitewithamarkup.
AndIsaid,ifyou'vedoneyourduediligenceandyou'vedoneyourhomeworkandyou'veboughtwellatauction,you'vehadagooddayattheoffice,that'swhatwedo.
That'sourjob.
Youdon'tbegrudgethemaninthecornershopforgoingandbuyingwellfromCostcoandsellingitonwiththemwithenoughofamarkuptomakealiving,doyou?
Sowhywouldyoubegrudgeacardealermakingaliving?
AndIjustbasicallysaidthatwhatmostpeopledon'trealiseistheoperatingoverheadsofaofanoperationlikethelikesofusismuchhigherthanmostpeoplerealise.
We'vegotthegrossfatscheme.
Soifwebuyoneforfiveandsellitforten,weowetheBatmanagrand.
Ifweenduphavingtospendfouronit,westillowetheBatmanthegrand.
Sohowinsaneisthatonethinginitself?
Thepublicdon'tknowthatonething.
Therewasacommenttheotherdaygoing,Doyouknowwhat?
Iusedtohaveoneopinionaboutcartradersandhowmuchmoneytheymadeoutofcar.
Buthavingwatchedyourchannel,I'vegotacompletelydifferentviewpoint.
Andforme,that'sawinstraightoutofthegatebecauseYeah,you'reright.
Thatcaryou'resellingis30yearsoldorwhateveryou'reselling.
Imightbesellingwhat's10yearsold.
It'schangedhandfiveorsixtimes,butwestillhavetopayVATonit.
AndtheVATschemedoesn'tgiveamonkeysastohowmuch.
SoifIbuyaclassicreallywellatfivegrand,butspend30grandrestoringitandget,sowhereamI,35andsellitfor40?
I'vegotfivegrandleft,yeah?
I'vegottopaytheVATonthatwhole30Ididjustdoingthecarup.
Andnotallofthatwouldhaveallexpense.
TheremighthavebeenBillywho'sreallygoodattuningaCamaraup,who'schargedmeagrand.
He'snotthatregistered.
He'snotthatregistered.
Hewilldon'ttakecashoffme.
Butthepublicarecompletelyunawareofthat.
Someonesaidittomeyesterdaywhentheyweretalkingaboutpartexchangeinacarandtheyweretalkingaboutleavingme1500quidinitandsaid1500quidyou'llmakeagoodprofit.
Outofthatone,yougo,yourealizeI'mgonnalose300quidofthatstraightoutofthegate.
Doyouknowwhatatradecostmetochargingme£100toadvertisethecar?
Sowe'renow£400now.
DoyouknowIdon'tputasinglecarforanMOTnow,evenifit'sbanging,thatdoesn'tcostme£500quidbecauselabourratesare£70,£80anhourandpartshavegonethroughtheroof.
Sodoyouknowhowmuchthat£1,500willactuallyendupinmypocket?
Oh,andtheVatmanandthetaxman,he'llwant30%.
Butyourcorporationtax,andthenwhenyoudotakedividendsoutofthebusiness,you'vegotyourpersonaltaxtopay.
Sowhattheythinkistwograndprofitprobablyendsupbeingabout400quidinyourbuttpocket.
Isaidexactlyassomeonetheotherday,triedtoshipme500poundsonthecar,andIsaid,Doyouknowtheaveragedealer,ifthey'vedone10%netafteralloftheircosts,they'redoingallright.
Obviously,I'mtalkingaboutthecarsIsell,Idon'tknowabouttheplasticcarindustry.
Soyou'reactuallyaskingmeforalltheprofitI'mgonnamakeoutofthiscarwitha£500discount.
Thisisn't1970,thisisn't1980.
Beforeyoueventurnedupatmypremises,youcheckwhetherthepriceofmycarwasfairbecauseyou'vegotamilliontoolstodoandyou'vecomeandyou'vedrivenit.
Soyouevenknewbeforeyougotitthecarwasfairitwasfairlypriced.
Sounlessyou'veI'vecomehereandthecar'sterrible,youshouldbepayingexactlythatprice.
Andwell,theotherthingIalwayssayissomeoneaswellwithdiscounting,we'realreadyonarant,I'veonlybeenfiveminutesin.
Wheretorun,James,carryon.
Well,whenyousay,forexample,IsellaFiat500,a2014Fiat500theotherday,guy'shaditfortwomonths,hecomesbackin,hesays,thedoorlockwon'twork.
Now,underthelaw,thatclearlywasn'tafaultofpointofsale,wasit?
Becausethedoorlockiseitherworkingorit'snotworking.
Itwasno,soitclearlywasn'tafaultofpointofsale.
It'sworkedfortwomonths,butyou'redrivinga12-year-oldcar.
So,dowethinkit'sreasonableatthatpointIshouldhavetoreplacethatdoorlock?
Now,obviously,I'mgoingtobecauseIjustwantaneasylifeandIwantrecommendations.
Butthethingis,peoplethinkbecausetheyboughtitfromadealer,thatthattherepairshouldbedoneregardless.
Butmypointisthatwhenitcomestodiscountingatthebeginning,theyaskforadiscount,whenhecomesinforthatrepair,Iknockyou200quidoffthepriceofthecar.
Tellyouwhat,it'sahundredquidbacktodothatdoorlock,togetthatdoorlockfitted.
Nooneeveroffersyouthemoneyback.
SoIalsosaythat,say,areyougonnabringthecarbacktomeifitgoeswrong?
Yes.
WellthenIneedallmymargintomakesureI'magooddealerforyouandIjustfixitwithoutquestions.
Becauseifyouchipmeonmymarginandyouknockmethatmoneyoff,I'mgonnabethedealerthatdoesn'tanswerthephonewhenyouwantthatfixing.
I'mthesame.
Ifsomebodyreallybidsmeinthebollocks,ifI'vegotsomethingupfor20andtheywanttogive16forit,it'snochance.
Butit'satellyouwhat,I'lltake18,butIdon'tseeyouagainbecausethattwograndthatIleaveinthatcartocoverthewarrantyIputonit,tovalidit,toputafulltankofVpowerinit,tobeattheendofthephoneifyouhaveanytroubleforthenextfewmonthsoryouknow,that'syourtwograndgone.
Soyoucanhaveitforthe18,butyou'reonyourown.
That'showIcanjustifyknockingthatbigachunkoffacar.
Ifsomebodywantsa10%discount,thenyoucanyoupayretailandyougettheretailservice,oryoupaytradeandyougettradeservice.
AndIknowthey'renottechnicallytradebuyers,butIhadthisconversationwithsomeonetheotherdaytryingtochipmeontheyardforareallycheapcar.
Idon'tknowwhyIdecidedtosellitforacoupleofgrand.
ItwasapartX,Ithoughtitwasquiteatidycar.
Hewastryingtochipmeontheprice.
Isaid,That'snoproblematall.
Isaid,I'lldoyouadeal,there'snowarranty,butyouhavetotrailerthecaroffofthepremises,yeah.
It'sgonnabesparesandrepair,andyouhavetotrailitoffthepremises.
So,whatisit?
It'sgotanMOTonit.
Isaid,Yeah,butyouwanttohaveabigdiscountandgetonatradebasis,butIknowthatifanythinggoeswrongwiththat,you'llregretthedealandcomeaftermewithsomething.
Sothelegally,theonlywayyoucanbuythatcaroffmewithnocomebackistoyousojustdothatdealandI'lldriveitoff.
AndIwent,no.
Isaidithastoleavehereonthetrailer.
Ithastoleaveonthetrailer.
Soyoucangetit.
Theyjustdon'tlisten,dothey?
No,theydon'tlisten.
Ithinktheproblemisit'sjustacaseofraisingawareness.
We'renotallDellBoysandArphaDailies,weworkreallyhardtoearnalivinginthegame,andwearepeoplelikemeandyoutakeagreatdealofprideandresponsibilityininsendingthecarsoutinasbestconditionwepossiblycanbecauseA,Idon'twanttheaggroofstuffcomingback,andB,Irelyonrepeatbusiness,soIIhavetotakethatview.
ButIthinkthatthiswholesortofethosofalmostwantingtonickthestuffoffusforcost,andit'salmostlikethebiggrudgeisearningaliving,andIfindthatsometimesit'sdeliveredinawaythatIfinditquiteoffensive.
It'swouldifyougotacalloffHRonFridaytosay,yeah,we'renotgonnapayyouthismonthbyphonedown,you'dbefuming.
Andwhatyou'retellingmeisyoudon'twantmetoearnanymoneythismonth,sowhywouldIsellyouthecar?
Goingbacktomyearlierpoint,thisisexactlywhatIfoundsomadaboutcomingintothisindustry.
WassoIwasreadinguponwhatIhadtodowithconsumerlaw.
IhadthisimmediatethingasbeingacolourdealerthatIwasdodgy.
Yeah,youcanbringmeacar,youcanexchangethatcarwithanynumberoffaults,andI'msupposedtobeabletocomeback.
Yeah,no.
ThiswasaconversationwehadwithSimonHopeinlastweek'sepisodewherehewassayingthatit'sallverywellbuyerbeware,butwhoprotectsthesellers,tradeorprivate?
There'snothingthere.
Andallthesethethatweweretalkingaboutwe'vegottoputthesame,we'vegottoputthesamewarrantyonyourtwo-year-oldcar,my60-year-oldcar,oraTVfromJohnLewis.
Consumerlawisconsumerlaw,itdoesn'tdifferentiate,itdoesn'tringfenceanything.
Thatpersoncouldhavedonethisforthepastsixtimesintwoyears,yeah,andthere'snocomeback.
Youcanbuyacaron14-daydistanceselling,forexample,14days,youcangotothesouthofFranceandback,bringitbackonday13,askforyourmoneyback.
Norisk.
Yeah,butthat'sbecausesomebodyingovernmentdecidedtoapplyalawthatisinplaceforbuyingapairofsocksoffofAmazonandapplyittoausedcar.
Goingbacktomypointaboutthepartexchangesaswell.
Sothenyougetthecommentnobodyeverpartexchangesacarthat'sdecent.
Youshouldknowasadealerthey'regoingtobefaulty.
Soyougo,that'sfairenough.
That'sagamewe'replaying.
Soyourpartexchangeofferisreallylow.
Oh,youdealersaresododgy,youoffersuchshitpartexchangeoffering.
Exceptmakeyourmindoff.
Makeyourmindup.
Soyou'retellingmeit'sokayforyoutoparexchangefaultycars,it'sfairgameonadealer.
Butadealershouldn'tgetyourpartexchangeinwithbigmarginonit.
Butwhenyoubuyacaroffme,Ishouldberesponsibleforitforanynumberofperiodoftime.
SoI'mlikeI'mlookingatitgoing,Angfar,howisthisstackedupinfavourofadealerwhenwe'retheonesbeingtoldthatwe'remakingallthemoneyandarethedodgyist?
I'mquiteluckythattheandIdon'tsellmanycars.
Anymore,butievenwhenIwas,Itendedtosellquitenichestuff.
Soifsomebodygotbacktothesouthcoastintheir71CamarOSSandheadlightswentbecausethefusehadblown,theydon'twanttosendthecarbackbecausetheywon'tfindanotherone.
SoI'llalwayshelpthemout.
It'slikeandaccordingtothelaw,theyhavetobringthatbacktomesoIcanchangethefusefornothing.
I'dratherjustsendthem20quidgojustnipitintoagarageandI'llcoverthecostofit.
AndIdon'tactuallyhavetodothatbylaw,butIalwaysdobecauseyouthinkforthesakeof20,30quidI'dratherhaveahappycustomer.
Butwhattheydon'trealiseisthatthelawdoessaythatwehavetherighttorepair,whichmeanspeoplebringingstuffbacktous.
Andifyou'resellinglocally,that'sprobablyadifferentcattleoffishforyou.
Butsomeofmycarsgoalloverthecountry,theygoallovertheworld,soit'sjustnotfeasible.
Ifactrefusetododistantsales.
Ididit,Ididittwice.
Ididittwice.
Isentaforwardfocusuptoachap.
Ipaidsoontheinvoice,hepaidfordelivery,whichwas£400.
SoIarrivedwithhim,helookedatitonthetransporter,he'dhadtwowalkaroundvideos,andhewent,there'sastonechiponthebootlidofthat.
I'mworriedthatwillrust.
Andturnmydeliverydriveraround.
Becausetheinvoicehadthe£500deliveryonit,Ihadtorefundinvoiceincluding£500delivery.
SoI'm£500down.
Cararrivesandadriverremindsmethatthebootlidonaforward-focusestateisplastic,thelowerpartofit'splastic.
SoI'mlike,soI'vegottoswallow£500.
Ican'tpassthatontothenextcustomerbecausethecar'sworthwhatit'sworth.
Andyou'veturnedhimaroundforsomethingthatisjustthemostnonsensicalreasonona10-year-oldforward-focusestateyou'veeverheard.
AndIdon'tdoesitaffectyoubecauseitaffectsmecanitcanaffectthevalueconsiderably,addingmoreowners.
Soifyoudodefinitely,yeah,yeah.
Ifyoudefinitelyonceyou'vebecauseIdoitallelectronicallynow,it'sallpartoftheservice.
UhdoyouwantmetoputtheLopickinyournameandI'lljustdoitforthem?
Ittakestwominutes.
Butyes,you'readdinganotherowner,andbecausethere'sagreatdealofvalueinalow-ownercarinmyendofthegame,Iit'snotjusttheinconvenienceorthecostofthetransport,thecostofreadvertisingit.
It'sthatthere'sagreatercostintermsofdevaluingthecaraswell.
Fornoreasonfornofaultofthecar'sandfornofaultofitsown.
Ihadoneguyboughtacarbacktheotherday,andhesaiditwashesaiditwasidlingfunnyandthesteeringwheelwobbledatacertainspeed.
AndsoIsaidI'dlookatitandI'dfixit,buthejustsaidhewantedtobringthecarback,andIthoughthe'djustrefundandmoveon.
Andheturnedupwiththecar,andIsatoutsidetheunitwiththeengineidling.
Isaid,Sothis,trafficlights,yeah,andnothing'shappeningatall.
Unlessyoupresstheaircon,nothingdoesanythingtotheidle.
SoItakeyoudowntheroadanddo70milenow,whereIshouldn'thavedone70milenow,nowobblingthesteeringwheelatall.
Yeah.
SoIbringhimbackandhe'slikestillwantingtorefundit.
SoIjustthink,right,refundandmoveon.
Ilookathowmanymileshe'sdone.
He'swithin30days,soI'mnottechnicallyallowedtodeductmileageanyway.
Ijustsaythat'sIjustwanthimoutofmyface.
I'mlike,justgone.
AndthenIrealisedthatIheaskedmetoput50quidinthecar.
WhenIturnedthekeyonthecar,it'sgotnofuelinit.
Hedidn'tevenknowcommondecencyforafullrefundtoputthe50quidbackinthecar.
Now,attheendoftheday,Ialwayssaycarlayer.
James,that'sthefreecar.
Itwasfreecar.
Anddoyouknowwhathispassingcommentwasasheleft?
Isaid,Whatdoyoudoaboutacar?
Hesaid,heboughthiscaronhisown.
Hesaid,Oh,mywifeneverwantedausedcaranyway,we'regonnagoandgetanewone.
SoIwaslike,Butdoyouknowwhat?
Forallyouknow,hedoesthateverymonth.
Sorry?
Ohhedoesthattwelvetimesforallhedoesthattwelvetimesayear.
Yeah.
Sothethingis,it'slikeIsaypeopleaccuseyouofwhinging,butI'mnotsayingIdon'tmakemoneyatthecargame.
Yes,Imakemoneyatthecargame,butIjustthinkit'sgonesofarstackedupagainstthedealer,it'sgettingridiculoustothepointwherepeoplecometomeeveryday,becauseIdosellcheapcars,andtheysayyoucan'tfindacarforthreeorfourgrandanymore.
Andit'sthere'sareasonforthat.
There'sareasonforthatbecauseitdoesn'tstackupforanythingsellingwiththeriskversusI'vegotaFordFocusona2011inthenextdoor.
ThetwotheHIDheadlightshavegotafaultonadashboard.
Theheadlightsare£400eachona2011FordFocus.
Ifyou'regonnaberesponsibleforthatkindofthing,howmuchdoyouneedinthecar?
AndtheproblemisthattheinIwasgonnasayaswellinthisgameaswell,iswhatIdon'tthink'shappenedisthatsowehavenowthemoreconsumerrights,wehavethe14-dayreturnright,butalsothepartsonthelikeyoucouldtakeabasiccar,I'msellingmoremoderncars,butyoucanhaveexactlythatscenariowhereyou'vegota3995carwithtwogrand'sworthofheadlightsonitorradarcruisecontrol.
Themarginshaven'tmovedwiththeresponsibilityandwiththecostoftheparts,themarginsarethesameastheyalwayswere.
Realistically,yougoandbuyfromBCAcarauctionsandpeoplearestillwantingtoworkto1500quidonacarwhere,likeIsay,you'regiving300poundpoundstotheBatman,butiftheydriveitdowntheroadandtheradarcruisecontrolstartsplayingup,you'vegottodropitintoVolkswagenandyou'regonnabe1500quidintothatalone.
Andtheycanbringthatbackinpointuptosixmonths.
Yourendofthemarketscarestheshitoutofme.
AnythingwithanECUscarestheshitoutofme.
Ijustlikethingssimple.
Airfuelandaspark.
It'spartsreadilyavailableandeasyenoughtodiagnose.
Buttheproblemiswithcarsatthemodernendisthatalightcancomeonatanytime,literallyatanytime.
Andit'sthroughnofaultofyours,andit'sthroughnofaultofthecars,butifyou'vegoteight,nine,ten,eleven-year-oldcars,itthereiswearandteartobetakenintoconsideration.
Ithinkthatthehugegeneralsweepingstatementhere,thepublicasawhole,havetheyleanontheconsumerlawtoabsorbthemselvesofanyresponsibilitywhentheybuyacarandtheyjustthinktheycanjustpingitbackwardsandforwardstothedealerforeverything.
Andifyoubuyanewcarandit'sunderwarranty,oryoubuyacarthatandyou'veboughtawarranty,orthedealer'spaidforawarrantytobeonit,they'ddealwithawarrantycompany,andIcompletelyunderstandthat.
ButIthinkthathasspilledoverintotheclassiccargame,morethemodernclassiccargame,alittlebitnow,whereifpeoplewanttobuyaPeugeot205GTIasaweekendcar,theyviewthepurchasethesameaswhenthey'renippinguptheroadandgettingtheirbrandnewleasecarforthreeyearsaswell.
Liketheslightestlittlethingthatgoeswrong,youjustpingitback.
AndIthinkweneedtoringfencecarsafteracertainagethatareusedandclassiccarsagainasseparateentities.
AndIlovesellingprojectcars,buyingprojectcarsandsellingprojectcars.
Soaboutfindingtheminagarage,towingthemout,gettingthemrunning,driving,andstopping,andsellingthemonasarecommissioningprojectbecauseIknowI'msellingittosomebodywhoisasensibleclassiccarblokeorbird,whoifthey'rebuyingaproject,theyknowwhatthey'regettingthemselvesinfor,they'vegotnoexpectationsornounrealisticexpectations,andtheycertainlyaren'texpectingawarrantytogoonit.
WhereasifIspendfivegrandputtingthatcarright,I'monlygoingtogetanotherfivegrandforit,andI'vegotalltheresponsibilityoftheconsumerlawthatgoesalongwithsellingafinishedcar.
It'sjustnotworthit.
Yeah.
Thisisyoumentionedaboutlights.
Thisisthetroublewithsellingthenewerstuff,islightspingupforfun.
ABSlights,oxygensensors.
Yougetsomeonechangesgearbadlyroundacornerandyou'llpingupanenginemanagementlightbecauseit'llbeanoxygensensor'sgotcokedup.
Andpeoplewillimmediatelystopandsay,Ican'tdrivethiscar,itneedstogoin.
YougetinanMGB,ifyouturnthekeyandtheenginerunsandyoudrivedowntheroad,andyougettowhereyouget,you'rehappy.
IfthatMGBhadallofthosesensorsonit,itwouldtellyouyoucan'tdrivethecar,itwouldtellyoutherewasthingswrongwithleft,right,andcentre.
Thisisthetrouble.
Lightspingupeverywhere,andtheywantitimmediatelyresolved.
Andeverylightthatpingsonisayouplugacomputerinanditgivesyouaroughideaofwhat'sgoingwrong.
ButI'mconvincedthatmostmechanics,andIwanttoupsetsomepeoplehere,justplaypartstarts.
It'sjustaguess.
Youthinkthey'realegendbecausetheydidthefirstoneanditworked,butthentwoorthreetimesafter,theyplacefourthingsbeforeitisresolved,iswhattheproblemis.
Andabsolutelywhatyou'resaying.
I'vespokentopeoplefromothercountries,andthere'ssensibleruleslikeoncethecar'stenyearsoldoroverahundredthousandmiles,youbuyasis,oryouwanttobuyathird-partywarranty.
Youcanchooseasagrownadult,youcanwalkintoacardealer,doyouknowwhat?
I'lljustbuyitasisandI'lltaketherisk,orI'llpayanadditionalamountofmoneyforawarrantycoverbecauseIrecognisethecarisoldandit'sused.
WhereasthiscountryButitwillbreakdown.
Yeah,itwillbreakdown.
Thetroublewiththeconsumerrightslawisnotthatit'sanincorrectlaw,Idon'thaveanissuewithit,butithasnocleardefinitionsbetweentheageandthemileageofthevehicle.
Itsaysitinthere,butwhowantstogotocourtandarguethetossoverwhetherthatwasfairforthatageandthatmileage?
Whydoesn'titphysicallydistinguishatcertainpointsofavehicle'slifewhatisconsideredfairwearandtear?
Ithink,likeyousay,itshouldbering-fenced.
Sothehistoricvehiclesover40yearsoldarering-fencedseparatelyforMOTlegislationandtaxation,forexample.
Whyaretheynotring-fencedseparatelyforconsumerlaw?
We'realreadyrecognisingthatthey'reinacompletelydifferentcategory.
Sowhyaretheynotringfenced?
Andthenyou'vegotcarsmaybebetween15and40.
PerhapswehavethoseascategoryBwhereyouhavetoapplyalittlebitmorecommonsense.
AndIdohaveanaccountwithhandlerclaims,anythingupto15yearsoldorupto20withextraordinarilylowmileage,Icanpayanythingfrom50to300quid.
AndIIwilloffertopayforthebasicone,andthenifthecustomerwantstotopitup,IIdon'tmakeanymoneyonit,Igivethemahandlerclaimsnumberandtheycando.
ButIIveryrarelydealanythingthatnew.
Minestuffisallconsiderablyolderthanthat.
Andit'sveryI'dliketosay,IhavetomakeadecisionnowbecausesomesomeonecomestolookatacarwhetherornotI'mcomfortablesellingittothem.
Evenoncetheydecide.
Don'tyousaylights?
Imean,warninglightsinourgame,it'slikeacomedything,likeshadows.
Youturnleftandyou'vegotafulltankoffuel,andyouturnrightandyouryourfuellightcomeson,sortofthing.
Andyeah,ifyoudogetasensor,youjustgetascrewdriverout,popthebonnet,bridgeit,seeifit'sthesensorortheactualpart.
It'snormallyfairlyit'snormallynothingtoworryabout.
Becausewetendtocheckourlevels.
Wedon'twaitfortheoillighttobe.
Iftheoillightcomesoninoneofmycars,it'stoolate.
It'stoolatetodoanythingaboutit.
Wecheckourlevels,that'sthething.
Wewecheckourcoolant,wecheckouroillevelsbeforewesetoff.
SoIthinktheproblemiswithnewercars,yourelyonlightstotellyouwhenthere'saproblem,whereasintheoldstuff,generallybythetimeawarninglightscomeon,it'sforit'sgotnooilinitifyougetanoilwarninglightonmostoftheoldstuff.
Butyeah,Ido.
I'mabigadvocateforringfencingbasedontheageofacarintermsofconsumerlaw.
AndIthinkit'sIthinkthefactthattheyarealreadyringfencedseparatelyforsafetychecksandtaxation,Idon'tseeanyreasonwhyconsumer.
Ithinkit'slazythatnobody'sactuallyrevisedtheconsumerlawforthesamething.
It'sbecausenoone'sgoingtogotoBACforcardealers.
II'vegotatheorywiththis,Sam.
I'mtellingyouhowwecanchangethisindustryovernight,andit'snotgoingintoBACforthecardealersbecauseI'minalreadyforthecardealers.
Whatwedoiswesaythatwhensomeonesellsacarofftheirdriveway,there's30dayscomeback,orevenjust14dayscomeback.
Youseehowquicklypeopledon'twanttosellacarofftheirdrivewaywhentheygo,Pangfire,someonegetstodrivemycarfor14,let'sjustsay14days.
For14days,Idon'tknowhowthey'reusingthebrakes,Idon'tknowhowthey'reusingtheclutch,Idon'tknowhowthey'reusingthevehicleatall.
Theycanmakeupallkindsofstuff.
I'vegottoletthemhavea14days,andthenifthere'saproblem,I'vegottotakeitback.
I'mnotdoingthat.
Andsuddenlythemarketwillbeflooded,dealerswillbefloodedwithpartexchangesbecausenoonewantstosellanydriver.
Andeveryonewillwakeupandgo,shit,what?
Socardealersdothatforsixmonths.
Oh,JesusChrist.
Howaboutthis?
Whenyousellyourcar,youcan'tspendthatmoneyforsixmonthsorforthfor30daysinitiallyandthenuptotwomonths,isn'tit,forthemoneyback?
Youcan'ttouchpennyofthat.
That'sgoingtositinaring-fencedaccountincaseIwanttobringthatcarbackandI'mgoingtoneedallthatmoneyback.
It'sbadthough,isn'tit?
Youcanhavesomeonebuya2014forwardfocusofsomeone'sdrivewayandtheycanneglecttotellyouthatit'saccidentdamaged,thattheheadgasketisbadonit,blahblahblah.
Aslongastheydon'tphysicallysaythisisnotaccidentdamageandthisisasanokayheadgasketortheengineworksperfectly,aslongastheyphysicallydon'tmakethatincorrectstatement,youcandriveofftheirdrivewayandyouhavezerocomeback.
Whereasyouwalkintoacarthat'smaybe2014onacardealershipforcourt,there'sprobablyonly500poundsmorethantheoneoffthedriveway.
Andanywhere,ifyoutakepayonacreditcard,anywhereuptofiveyearsyoucouldcomeback.
AndweheardaboutaguytheotherdayonaFordFocusthatkindofagewithakneecapboostengine,wentatlikefouryears,dealerhadtorefundafterfouryearsbecauseitwasapre-existingfault,accordingtotheindependentengineer.
Sothatishowmadthiscountryis.
Ononeside,youcanbuythecarfor£500offthedriveway,andyou'vegotabsolutelynorightsforacarthatcanbehithaveanynumberoffaults.
Ontheotherside,you'vegotsomeonethat'sresponsibleforanyrightsixmonths,youjustassumethefaultexistsatpointofsale.
Andafterthat,ifyouthinkyoucanprovethatitexistedatpointofsale,youmightstillgetyourmoneybackaswell.
It'saninsaneImeanIthinkyoufallintothereallydifficultbitofthetrade,tobehonestwithyou,becauseIthinkthatIdotoacertainextentwithmyself.
Icanit'snotifit'swhen,thiscarwillbreakdownatsomepoint.
It's60yearsold.
That'stheonethingIcanwarrantyisthatatsomepointyou'regoingtoneedtoreplacethepart.
ServicekeepontopasI'mabigbelieverinpreventionratherthancure.
Serviceitwhetheritneedsitoritdoesn't.
Changetheoilregularly,evenifitdon'twaittillit'snearlyoutorit'sgoneblack.
Usegoodfuel,useagoodfueladditive.
I'mreallyfunnyaboutstufflikethat.
ButIthinkwedohavealittlebitmorecommonsenseinmyendoftheindustrythatyouaresellingtoenthusiaststoenjoyspannering,understandit'sallpartofthefun.
Imean,Igetalotpeoplepickingcomingtopickthemup.
Idon'tknowwhethertodriveitawayorsendatruck.
Doyouthinkit'llgetmehome?
Andit'shonestlyI'dsetoffinit,butIcan'tpromise.
Makesureyou'vegotI'vesaidthiswithSimonlastweek.
Themainthingofeverybody,makesureyou'vegotbreakdowncoverbecauseatsomepointyou'llneedit.
Andthat'sthemostIcanguarantee.
MymateMadMikedoesfromWales,doesclassiccars,andhetoldmeaclassiconetheotherdaywhereaguyranghimupandsaid,Iwanttodriveithome.
Doesitdrivewell?
IthinkitwassomethinglikeitwasaMorrisHitelorsomething.
Andhesaidtheywereshitwhentheywerenewatdriving.
Becausethey'veneverdrivenwellthelast40years.
Ithoughtthat'sabsolutelybrilliant.
Thatisthewaytopre-filteryourcustomers,istellthemyourproductisshit,andiftheystillcomeandbuyit,gameon.
Peoplesayifit'slikeit'shadweldinthis,it'snottheoriginalpaint.
It'sit'ssaferforthewelding,andthepaint'smuchbetterthanitrolledoutofthefactory.
Itakeitasawin.
Butsee,thethingis,whatpeoplesaytomeaswell,whatonearthareyoudoingsellingcarsatfourgrand?
Ilikesellingthembecausetheysellsuperquick.
Moveupthemarkettothenewerstuffwiththelowermileage,andyou'llbesafe.
ButItalktomyfriendsthatdothat,andtheyendupwithiftheydon'tsellfinanceonit,they'reonlymakingathousandpoundsatthecar.
Iftheymakesellfinance,theymightmaketwothousandofit.
ButasIsaidearlier,onefixonthatcar,onefixforaTaycanisheadlightsfourgrandorsomethinglikethat,isn'tit?
Yeah.
Butevensimplecars,likeIsay,they'veallgotLEDheadlightsnow,they'veallgotradarcruisecontrol.
Youcan'tdomostofitatyourunit,you'vegottotakeitofftothemaindealer.
ThestoriesIhearofthesimplestproblemscostingfourorfivegrand,theyterrifymedoingthosenewercars.
Becauseevenahigh-endI10petrolendsuphavingithasanEGRonit.
DoyouknowwhatImean?
Andtheyputadualmasssplyonwheelonittomakeitsmoother.
Allthesekindofthings.
Oh,yeah.
Andthepricegoesfortheroofforrepairinganything.
Evenatmyend,though,ImoveditwhenItookoverfrommydadfromquitelumpystufftosub-30,sub-20.
Ilike10grandcars.
Imakeasmuchmoney,asmuchnetmarginonacarIsellfor10or12aswhenIsellfor20or30.
SoI'dratherhavetwoofthemthanoneofthem.
Itjustmakesmoresenseformebecauseit'sareallyit'salow-risk,buoyantendofthemarket.
Andtheexpensivestuff,it'syougenerallydon'tmakemuchmoremoneyintermsoftheactualnotthepercentage,buttheactualpoundsinthebank.
Sowhywouldyouhaveallthehassleandalltheriskandallthemoneyintheonecar?
I'mabigbelieverinchasingthemarket,beingwherethemarketis.
Andlikeyousay,itit'sreallydifficulttofindgoodfourgrandcars.
Soifyoucanfillaforecourtwiththem,you'realwaysgoingtobebusy,aren'tyou?
Thetrickisbuycarsthataremadelikeoldcars.
Solikeahigh-endII-10hasacableclutch,cablethrottle,ithasachainthatactuallyOh,okay.
It'slikeanMGB,ithasaproperchainonit,likeanMGB.
Youcanliterallyfixonewitha10milspanneronahammer.
SoifyounowgowiththeKiaPicanto,younowgowiththeMazda2.
Mykindofcar,see,IknowwhereI'muptowithstufflikethat.
Well,that'sexactly.
Youbuythestuffthatdoesn'thaveanyofthoseextrabitsonBob'son.
Youcanfixityourself,noneofthepartscostmuch.
Soyoumightnotbemakingahugeamountoutofthem,butyounevergetanybigscaryrepairbills.
There'salwaysamarkettobuythem.
TheissueisatthemomentIcansella2012,13,14one,butifwegoforwardfiveyears,allthatsimplicitydisappears.
SoIwon'tbeabletosellthosecarsatthosepricepointsunlessI'mliterallysellingthatcaranddeletingfromtheAutoTraderAdverteveryfeatureithas,andjustsayI'msellinga2018high-endII-10,andthat'sallI'mselling.
Idon'tlistcruisecontrol,Idon'tlistdaytimerunautoheadlights,autowipers,alltheotherfeatures.
That'stheonlywayasadealeryou'regonnabebecausethecostofrepairingoneofthosethingswouldwipeoutallofyourprofit.
Soyou'regonnahavetoYeah,Idon'tthinkIcouldsleepatnight.
IfIhad30takehandsorcayansorwhateverthatI'dsoldoverthelastsixmonths,I'ddon'tthinkI'dsleepatnightworryingaboutfourorfivemorecomingbacktomorrowatthesametime.
It'sjusttheoperatingcashflowyoumustneedatthatlevelisterrifyingforme.
Yeah.
Ohabsolutely.
Thejustincasefund,thejustincasefundmustbeawful.
Well,youthinkaboutitonmycars,ImightmakeaImakeagoodImakeagoodgrossmarginofprobably25%offafourfourgrandcar.
Youstartbuyingstuffat30or40grandandtryandreplicatethat.
Iknowitdoesn'tworkexactlyonthemathlikethat.
MyriskelementisalotlikeI'vegotagoodfriendJamieCable.
YoumeetJamieCablebefore?
Yeah,absolutenutter.
Absolutenutter.
He'stheonethatscaresalivingdothat'sout.
He'sgotabig150cardealership.
HebuysRangeRoverswiththetwo-litreingeniuminit.
Buthejustplaysthisgamewherehebuys,he'sgothisguyssogoodatdoingthetimingchainsonthemnow.
It'stheonlycaryoucanbuyatauctionwithaboutfourorfivegrandacrossit.
Sameauctions,peopleconsumershavethisideayougotoauction,yougetcarscheap.
Ifyou'rebuyingnormalrun-of-the-millcars,themarginreallyisn'tthatbig.
Butyoubuystufflikethat,everyone'sscaredofit,fourorfiveKmargin.
He'llbuyaloadofthem,andhesays,Yeah,oneinthreeisbad,butI'mmakeI'mgettinglikefourKacrossacar.
Sothat'sit.
Soheplaysitacrossthespot.
Helivesthatrisk,hejustplaysthewholegameonthatrisk,andhedoesdolumpystuffliketakehandsandsoforth.
Butlikemyrate,RobQubitatQubitCars.
Irememberhimdoingathevideoonceonacar,andtheguywaskickingoff.
Imean,itwasa40-50grandBMW,butIthinkitwasbecausethelightsdidn'tcomearoundthesideofthedoorasyouopenthedoor.
Hadlittlelightsrunningaroundtheoutsideofthedoorcard,anditcosthimafortunetogetanauto-electricianintotrackdownwhatthatissuewas.
Yes,itscaresthelivingJesusoutofmeaswell,tobehonest.
Let'smovetowhatyou'redoing.
So,myretirementisthatisgodowntoasmallerunitandjuststarttradingthestuffIreallyquiteenjoydoing.
Butdoitexactlyasyousayisnottryandprepanyofthemandsellthemasperfectcars,justfillayardforthethingsIthinkareinteresting,putapriceonthem,andthensaygetthemrunninganddriving,andthenyoutakeitfromthere.
Afteryourexperienceinmyworldwiththatsilvershadow,hasitnotputyouon?
Hasitnotputyouonthescreen?
Oh,Gary,Ilovedyourvideoonthat.
Ohmygod,boilersuit,yeah.
Hecamedownforanentireday.
I'veneverknownNicklikeit.
I'veneverhadanybodylookatacarforanentiredaybefore.
Andthenhestillhadanindependentinspectionafterwards.
Aftersayinghewasgoingtobuyittrade,hewantedtogoforanindependentinspection,andthensaid,ButitalsoneedsanewMOTbecauseIwanttodriveithome.
ButIdidmakemoreoutofthatdealthanI'dprobablymakeoutofsellingthreeorfourofmycheapies.
Iknowwhenyousaidtomeaboutyouneedabitmorepatiencemaybeonstufflikethat,butyouitisworthitbecauseofthemargininstufflikethat.
Andthat'sjustpartofmyjob.
Ijustacceptthat'sthatthere'salittlebitmorehandholdingperhapstobedone,andalittlebitmorepatienceandafewmoredeepbreaths.
Butthenthepayday,youhavetoputalittlebitmore,Ithinkyouhavetoputmoreintoeachcar,butthenyougetyoudolesscarsbutmoreprofitpercar,Ithink.
Butsee,thisisthethingwithlisteningtoyourpodcast,isthatweweresayingthistheotherday,isn'tit?
IwaswhenIwasdrivingback,IwasIforgetwhatweweretalkingabout.
IwassayingIfeelabitembarrassedaboutthekindofthingI'mdrivingaroundinandI'msellingwhenIlistentothestories,andI'mthinkingifI'monlyacardealer,ImightaswelldoitinstuffI'mactuallyinterestedin.
I'msosafeatthemomentdoingstuffthatIknowisaguaranteedsellerandvery.
Don'tforgetthough,thatthatstuffthatmydadhadwhenIwasyoung,thatwasjustdealerstock.
Itjusthappenstobethattheyareamazingorthey'vebecomeamazingclassics.
ButthosecarswereI'vegotadsofmydad'sandit'sMurechoiceoftwo,1799five.
Thenatthebottomthere'sDB4,2995.
Becausenofuckerwantedthematthetime.
Soit'sjustthestuffthatthatmydadwasturningoverthenwasjuststock.
Andthere'llbestuffthatwe'returningovernowthat'sjuststockthatbeen50yearswewishwe'dkept.
ButIthinkso,a2010high-endI10.
Yeah,maybemaybe.
Idon'tthinkso.
Idon'tseeitmyself.
ButItheonethingIdidwanttoaskyouisthankyouverymuchforlisteningtothepodcast.
Buthavingbecauseyoudidn'tgrowupinit,youthiskindofinsightintothe60s,70s,80smotortradeisprobablyabitnewertoyouthantosomeoftheotherlisteners.
DiditcomeasasurprisetoyouabouthowthetradewasandhowthetradeTraderswerebackthen,ordidyoujustassumeitwasmuchthesameasitisnow?
Obviously,Iwasn'tthere,butinlikewesaidearlier,Ithinkinthattimeperiodpeoplewereexpectedtobemoreresponsiblefortheirowndecisions.
Andthetradewasandyoutellstoriesaboutatradeandandpeoplebeingabitdodgyinabitwooinabitway.
Itsoundsliketherewasabitmorefreedombackthen,butitalsosoundslikeitwasabitmoreglamorous,anditwasabitmoreItellyouwhat,itsoundslikemoreofacommunityaswell.
Ithinkthat'sasfromlisteningtothepodcast,Ithinkthat'saslightlysadthingnow.
IthinkifIdidn'tdoYouTube,Iwouldprobablynotreallyknowanycardealersatall,becauseIdon'tattendanauction,Ibuyonline.
Nooneotherdealersdon'ttendtospeaktoyouinthisarea.
Alotofthemaregettingboughtoutbybiggercompanies,sotheydon'ttendtodothetradesalesanymore,itallgoestotheauction.
Thereseemedtobelikewhenyoulistenback,thereseemslikearealsenseofcommunity.
Likeyoualltendtoknoweachother,youtalkaboutdealershipsandandYeah,therewasalotofcamaraderie.
Ithinkthatbutbearinmindthiswasthedaysbeforelikemobilephonesandevenfaxmachinesandthatkindofthing.
Soyouwouldallyou'dgotoanotherdealer'sandcaravan,everyonehadcaravansforofficerstostartwith,andthere'dbelikecigarsmokeanddirtyteacupsandstufflikethat,butyou'dtalkaboutwhat'sgoingoninthetrade,whatyou'vebeenoffered,whatyou'vegotcomingup,whatyou'vegotpunterfor,anditwasthatwasnobodyhademailortextoranythinglikethat.
Anditisquiteisolatingasbeingaone-manband.
Igetthattoo.
ButIthinkthatininthosedays,becauseitwasn'tjustaseasytojustplayonyourphoneorsendsomeoneamessageororafaxasitwasnotthatlongago,Ithinkpeoplemadetheeffort,theygotinthecarandtheydroveroundtootherdealers.
Andtherewasalwaysevenevenininevenintothe90s,theearly2000s,mydad'sofficewasalwaysfullofotherdealers,fullofmostlyretiredbythatpoint,otherdealerssmokingthecigars.
It'slikethelandthathealthandsafetyforgot.
Butyeah,andIthinkifyouhadsomeoneonyourpitchandtheywerelookingforsomethingthatyoudidn'thave,butsomeoneuptheroaddid,you'dsendthemdownandyou'dphoneaheadandyou'dhaveadrinkoutofit.
I'mdon'tbewrong,thereweresomedealersthatdidn'tlikeeachother,butIthinkthatIgrewupinaworldwheremydadandhisfriends,allcalleduncle.
Istillcallthemuncletobefair.
Yeah.
Butthatyeah,ittheywasthey'dhaveeachother'spantsdownondealsandthatkindofthing.
Thegeneralfeelingwasyoulookedafteryourown.
Thetradelookedafteritsownonthewhole.
AndIfeelthat'sgonenow.
Idon'tfeelthatthere'sandmoreintheclassiccargame,Ithinkitstillexiststoacertaindegree.
ButIdon'tthinkthatyouhavethatkindofthingwhereyou'llhavehalfadozendealerslikeyouinaradiusthatwillhelpeachotherout.
LikeIcanrememberwhenIwaslittle,you'dhavesomebodygoandyou'dbelikethat.
Ifyou'vegotasuchandsuchforsuchandsuchcustomerscominginhalfanhour,partsmanhasn'tbeen,you'dbelike,Yeah,comeandgrabit.
Youknowwhat?
Idon'tseethathappenswithnewercarsnowthewayitusedto.
AndIpersonallyIthinkit'sashame.
IIthinkifthere'safewthingsyou'dgo,look,nobodywantstobuyacarwithsawdustinthegearboxthatgivesuptheghostfivemilesuptheroadandthere'snothingyoucandoaboutit.
Iunderstandconsumerlawisthereforareason.
Idothinkitshouldprotectthesellersaswelltoacertaindegree.
Idon'tthinkthere'sinIdon'tthinkthere'sanythere'snoprotectionforsellers,isthere?
Ithinkthat'sthethingIhaveanissuewith.
Butyeah,IdoImeanitknowingwhatyouknownowabouttheoldtrade,itwouldyouswapanythingout?
Wouldyougoisthereanythingyou'dpullfromthewayweusedtodoitandusetodayifyoucould?
Idon'tknow.
MaybeI'mlookingatroasttintedglassesbecauseIlikethecarsfrombackthen,soitjustseemedlikemoreinterestingstock.
ButIalsoagainI'mprobablybeingunfairtothepeoplethatwereworkinghardintheindustryatthetime,butobviouslyacar,you'vegotspark,you'vegotfuel.
Ifyougetthosethingsright,it'llrun,andthey'rejustsomuchmorecomplicationinthestuffwesellnow.
Sothetypesofcarsyouusedtosell,thecamaraderie,andthesimplicityoftheproductaswell,Ithink.
Plus,Iimaginetherewasmorecashdealsdone,andIimaginewe'reallbeingforcedtorunitthroughYeah,runitthroughit.
Beingforcedtorunitthroughapieceofsoftwaretomakesuretaxmancankeepaneyeonwhatyou'redoing.
Allthosethingsappealed.
Mydadusedtohaveasignoverthecaravandoorthatsaid,InGodWeTrustallotherscashonly.
Itwaseventhingslikeifsomebodywantstopaybycheck,theycouldn'tpickthecaruptillitcleared.
Anditonabankersbankers'draftwereathing.
We'dtakeabanker'sdraft,Irememberthat.
Butyeah,itwasititwassimplertimes,andIthinkthatandpeople'sbuyingpatternsweredifferentaswell,weren'tthey?
Somepeoplewouldbuyacarandit'dbethefamilycarfor15years.
Thatdoesn'thappenveryoftenanymore,doesit?
No.
Yeah,Iguessifyoutakeitfromtheotherside,theyhadtohavethecashtobuythecarinthefirstplace,soperhapstherewaslesspeoplethatcouldaffordtobuythem,oriseverybodygonnabelike?
No,noteverybodyhadacarandcertainnotmanyfamilieshadtwocarseither.
Yeah.
Youknow,becauseIguesswe'vegotabiggermarket,easierrouteforthemtobuythem.
SoIguessthatitthere'shalfadozenofthemontheother,isn'tit?
Iguess.
There'llbealotofoldertradersouttheregoing,flipaneck,ifIgotwhatyougotnow,I'dbeflippingandknockingitoutofthepark.
Don'tyouthinkmanyoftheoldboysareswapwithyounow?
Ireallydon't.
No.
ThereusedtobeIthinkyourwordwasyourbond,ahandshakewasadeal,andIdon'tseethatasbeingagivenanymore.
AndIthinkthat'sarealshame.
IthinkIhavearealissuewithwiththetermrefundabledeposit,whichisjustanonsensetome.
Adepositisadeposit.
No,didyoumeanopenbackonthewordnow?
Ihadsomebodyaskmeyesterday.
Whatdidhesaytome?
Hesaid,Oh,Iquitelikethatone.
IfIleaveadepositandthenmywifedoesn'tlikeit,doIgetthedepositback?
AndIsaid,no,becauseifyouleavethedepositandsomebodyelseaskedme,canIbuythecar?
I'mgonnasayno,there'sadepositonthecar,soI'mgonnaloseasale.
Ifyougivemeadeposit,it'sacontracttobuythevehicle.
Ionlyaskedfor£100,Ionlyeveraskedfor£100deposittoholdthevehicle.
Buttheamountofpeopleaskmeifit'srefundableandtheamountofpeoplethatwanttoputitonacreditcard,theywanttodoitonacreditcard.
No,I'llbenowaytheydothat.
Idon'ttakedepositspersonallybecauseitmeansthatyoucanchangeyourmindandIcan'tsellthecartoanyoneelse.
Andevenifyougivemea£500deposit,thatdoesn'tcompensatemefornotbeingyoucouldmessmearoundforamonth.
Uhit'snotIdon'ttakeandbasicallywhatIwilldoisIwillsay,you'vegottillMonday,Iwon'ttakeanymoreviewingsonit.
Andifanybodyphonestoviewit,I'llsayI'veagreedasale,butI'llletyouknowifitfallsthrough.
ButIdon'ttakeadepositbecausethattiesmeintonotbeingabletodoanythingelsewiththecarinthemeantime.
AndifsomebodycomestolookatacaronaSaturdayandtheywanttopickituponMonday,Idon'tneedadeposittonotsellittoanybodyelsefor48hours.
ButifIdotakeadeposit,Ican'tsellittoanyoneelseforthreeweeksorhoweverlongitisyoutake.
SoII'mveryreasonableinIwillholdforaperiodanagreedperiodwithoutadeposit,butIwillnottakeadeposit.
Ithinkit'sacompletenonsense.
AndIthink,likeIsay,thatthetermsrefundableornon-refundabledepositevenexistiscompletelynonsensible.
Isnonsensicaltome.
IgetalotofpeopleringingmeupandwanttoputadepositonacarbecausetheywanttoseeitonSaturday,onaMonday,andtheywanttoputadepositdown.
AnduhIflatlyrefusethough.
It'sliketheonlypeoplethatcanputadepositonmycararethepeoplethathavephysicallybeendowntomysite,test-driventhecar,andseenit.
Thenyoucanputadepositdownbecauseitisnon-refundableifyoupulloutbecauseyouknowexactlywhatyou'regettinginto.
ButAutoTraderstartedout,didn'tthat?
That'swhat'skickedoffwithAutoTrader.
Youcanputyourcarsontoifanybodydoesn'tknowthis,youcanputyourcarsontoAutoTraderanditautomaticallyfallsintotheirpackage.
Iforgetwhatit'scallednow,DealBuilder,wheresomeonecanput£95,£99downonthecaranditstopsdisplayingasbeingavailableonAutoTrader.
Butthat£99doesn'tevencomeofftheircard,itjustpingsittocheckit'sthere,andit's100%refundableatanytime.
Sosomeonecango,Ilikethatone,Ilikethatone,Ilikethatone,Ilikethatone,Ilikethatone.
Theycanputfivedepositsdown,they'reallnotyeah,exactly.
They'reallnotnownotavailableonthesite.
Andadealer'sgotsomebodyinfrontofthem,andthedealisthatifit'sonautotraderasareservedwiththat,andthey'vegotsomeoneinfrontofthem,theyshouldn'tsellittothatpersoninfrontofthem.
Butthenthatpersoncocks,likeyousay,flippingtwodayslaterbecausemydad'saccidentallykickedthekeyboardwhenIwaslookingatitandIdidn'tdoanythingatall.
It'sjustutterlyridiculous.
Peopleandagain,itjustI'mgonnasoundlikeagrumpyoldman,butitjustcomesdowntopeopletakingtheirresponsibilityfortheirowndecisionsagain,isn'tit?
Ifyou'vegonetoadealershipandyou'vesaidyouwantacarandyou'veputdepositdownandyoubail,that'syourlookout.
Ifyou'renotsureaboutit,don'tputadepositdown.
Well,adeposit'sadeposit.
LikeIsay,itadepositistosecureadeal.
Andifyoudecidetopulloutofthedeal,you'velostyourdeposit.
Andthat'sit'sawholetrustandabondthing.
AndIthinkthat'soneofthethings.
Inthe70sand80s,Idon'tthinkdidthetermrefundabledepositevenexistanywhere.
Idon'tthinkitdid.
Uheverybodyunderstoodwhatadepositwas.
Andifyoudidn'twanttoleaveadepositandyouwantedtocomebackinaweek,yourantheriskthatthecarwasgone.
Anditwasagiven.
Itmightstillbethere,butitmightnot.
Thatwasthatwasthatreally.
Ithinkitstoodmewellintheindustry.
IthinkII'dliketothinkpeoplethinkaboutit.
IfI'veagreedsomething,evenifIworkitafterwards,I'mlosingoutonit.
Iwillstandbyiteverysingletimebecauseyouareonlyasgoodasyoucan.
I'lldothat.
Ifit'smymistake,yeah.
Yeah,yeah.
IfI'vecockeditup,I'vecockeditup.
I'llstandonforanythingI'veagreed.
Iagreeexactlythesamethingyoudo.
Especiallybuyingstock,becauseyoumadethatonemistake,butthatguywillcomebacktoyoutimeandtimeagainbecausetherearesomanyothermessesaroundnow.
Andunfortunately,thosemessesareactuallygettingintothetradeaswell.
Yougetalotofpresentpeoplepresentthemselvesastraders,they'renotatall,arethey?
Andtheymuckyouaround.
IgetitallthetimefromtheYouTubechannel.
I'minbusiness,Ijustwanttobuyatradeoffyou.
II'masmalltimetraderaswell.
Andthentheyallthequestionscomeoutthat,youknow,aboutalmostwantingtoguaranteethecarwhereyouknowthatthey'renotatraderjustfromthosequestionsalone.
I'mlikeasimpleone.
Yougivemethereg,yougivemetheprice,yougivemeabriefdescriptiononit.
Sorry,giveme,andI'llgiveyouapriceonit,andI'llstandbythatprice.
Andifitturnsupthecarisn'twhatyousaiditis,Ijustwon'tdealwithyoueveragain.
That'sassimpleasit.
I'llalwaysstandbyit.
Ithinkthat'sumhelpedmeoutalot.
Andwe'llbebackwithparttwoinacoupleofweekstogetintowhatit'slikebeingabottomdealerversusaclassicdealerandwhyhemightbereadytomakethemoveintoourworkinthefuture.
SotoseewhatJamesgetsupto,pleasedofollowhimonallthesocialmediachannelsatChartsGarage,andyoucanfindmeattheoldcarlady.
I'mofftotheNECthisweekendfortheClassicandRestorationShow,whereI'llbetakingalookbehindthescenesattheAnconicAuction,aswellastalkingyouthroughafewofthecarsI'mtemptedtohaveabitofmyself.
I'llbecatchingupwithafewoldcarmates,checkingoutthecars,andI'mevenhavingagoataliveFacebookvideoonSaturdayafternoon.
SopleasedojoinusnextFridayfortheClassicCarShowspecial.
HavealookatournewFacebookgroup,theoldcarladyclassiccarcommunity.
Iwouldlovetoseeyourcars,hearyourclassiccarstoriesandmemories.
Sountilnexttime,happymotoring.
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