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02:11
Welcome to the Total Car Score Podcast.
02:13
Bringing you the world of cars from inside the car.
02:17
And now your hosts, Carl Brower, Lauren Fix and Javier Mota.
02:23
Well, today I'm here in Munich, Germany for the global debut of the BMW iX3,
02:31
which is the first model of the new class, the 100% electric platform from the German luxury brand.
02:38
I've got a chance to sit on the round table with Oliver Helmer,
02:41
who is the head of design, and he's going to explain how all the new technology,
02:47
requirements and the actual electric platform influence the design of these new cars.
02:55
So let's take a listen here.
02:57
Well, Oliver, this is really a new era for BMW.
03:02
So tell us about how that being all electric and all that influences the design of the cars.
03:08
So first of all, for BMW, electrification started quite early.
03:15
For the group, even earlier with Mini.
03:17
But as you know, I think we introduced, in 2009, we introduced two concept cars to the world,
03:26
the i3 and the i8 concept.
03:28
So this was the first time where we have been discussing electrification.
03:32
So there's a lot of, let's say in that time, we built up a lot of knowledge,
03:36
not just in terms of technology, but as well in terms of design.
03:40
And step by step, we decided to go into the direction that we say,
03:47
the drivetrain is not the difference.
03:50
We need to take care of each of our characters within our BMW portfolio,
03:58
which as a result, we say there's no differentiation in terms of styling
04:04
between combustion engine, hydrogen engine, or electrified engine.
04:10
So this is all, let's say, the same form language.
04:12
What we wanted to achieve is a big leap forward in terms of form language, but for all BMWs.
04:19
But you might find differences that are coming, whether from, let's say,
04:24
the architecture of the car or from, let's say, technical requirements.
04:30
And that's what we take as an opportunity.
04:33
And as you see, the upper part of the front is entirely closed.
04:37
There's just the intelligence in there, but no antics or something like that.
04:42
So this is what we took as an opportunity.
04:47
To what extent, you were mentioning, just before we started about the radar no longer
04:51
being behind the kidney grille, to what extent does design have to follow
04:57
to get the function in?
04:59
How much freedom do you really have?
05:01
So I would say there is always, let's say, it's a journey.
05:08
Normally, regardless of radar or other technologies that are being implemented
05:14
the first time, it's more that all of us need to understand the technology.
05:20
We are really careful in terms of, let's say, the safety behind it.
05:25
And for instance, the radar normally is in the center.
05:31
So what we have learned a lot, and that's something we achieved from a design perspective,
05:35
together with the engineers, we were able to take that radar out of the center,
05:41
which wasn't possible in the very beginning of those different,
05:46
there's different types of radars.
05:47
And then honestly, especially in terms of radar, there is physics behind.
05:54
So we are aware of that fact, right?
05:56
So we know the size more or less.
05:58
We know the indications, the angles on all of that.
06:01
It's something that we know.
06:02
But what we are doing in parallel always is together with our innovation partners
06:09
and free development partners and suppliers to improve, to give more freedom,
06:17
to, let's say, getting more sharknose, for instance,
06:21
getting more from a plant-shaped point of view,
06:24
more kind of what is pylon, more angle into the front.
06:28
That's something that is happening step by step.
06:32
You're still going to be producing combustion cars.
06:36
How much design here has to consider the fact that there might be a related
06:40
combustion car version?
06:42
So as I mentioned before, we don't make any differences between combustion engine
06:48
and electrified engines in terms of design.
06:52
But talking about, let's say, form language of Neue Klasse,
06:56
our focus is on, let's say, emphasizing each of our characters in the future.
07:02
You might have seen a little bit of an indication in the i3 already today.
07:07
It's a form language that matches perfectly to a sporty sedan.
07:13
And it's Neue Klasse.
07:16
But there is no difference between combustion and electrified engines in the future.
07:22
So the grill has been a point of controversy in the past few years.
07:25
Too big, too aggressive, too much.
07:28
How can you explain this new interpretation of it, including the lights,
07:32
which has already been in previous models.
07:34
But people talk about that a lot.
07:36
Right. So first of all, what we as designers really appreciate,
07:42
that the kidneys are the most important part in the front of BMW.
07:48
So what I mean with that is that there is a lot of emotion,
07:53
a lot of awareness from fans, from the audience.
07:58
And to be honest, kidneys, since 100 years,
08:03
always, they always change their form.
08:06
And it's always a discussion.
08:12
And to be honest, it's a part of the fact that we are remaining relevant,
08:16
right, in terms of discussion now.
08:21
I could look back into, let's say, the reasons why the size were increased.
08:26
Some of these reasons were like functional reasons.
08:30
And here, in terms of technology, as I was mentioning the radar,
08:35
technological enablers helped us to focus again on, let's say,
08:41
a new old BMW phase.
08:44
When we started to think about the story,
08:46
this was kind of the initial slogans for us.
08:51
Let's say the term was always clear, Neue Klasse.
08:54
And then it was clear to look back into where we have been starting.
08:58
And this was kind of our, let's say, emotional blueprint for the future of BMWs,
09:05
where it was clear that it's not just the kidney alone,
09:10
it's the entire front end that kind of represents BMW in the future.
09:14
And that gave us the opportunity to say,
09:16
okay, let's make it smaller, narrower, but let's keep it high.
09:20
So this is something that is exclusively for our SAVs,
09:25
having more vertical oriented kidneys,
09:28
whereas the sedan is going to solve it differently.
09:30
You're going to keep it more uniform now, because I was saying the last five years,
09:35
you've had a bit of kidney confusion, because you've had a few cars,
09:39
the iX, the i4 with really massive kidneys,
09:42
but the i5 was back to kind of more modest size.
09:46
And if you go before that, there was more uniformity in the kidneys.
09:52
Are you going to go back to having a kind of definable, standard-ish size?
09:56
I would say that it always depends on the proportion of a front end, right?
10:02
A car that is like way lower, a sedan, for instance.
10:06
We understand that maybe, let's say, a horizontal orientation might make more sense in terms of,
10:12
you know, arrangements, whereas as I mentioned for an SAV, we could play with that.
10:18
But there's no uniformity that we're going to keep, because as it's so important,
10:24
we're looking, for instance, they talk about the iX3 has a specific purpose.
10:29
It's a different purpose than the iX3, so i3 and iX3.
10:36
And based on that purpose in front of the customer, we are, first of all,
10:43
playing with rough proportions.
10:46
So what is the appearance? What would be the first appearance when we approach the car?
10:51
And it might be different in an iX5, because it's a different audience, it has a different size,
10:56
so, but something that we take care of is that the kidney is not the center of the front,
11:06
so it's a part of everything.
11:09
And I believe during the press conference, they mentioned that they have like
11:14
14 new updated models coming out.
11:18
So I assume there's a lot of design involved in all of those new models,
11:21
but that being said, in terms of overall design language,
11:25
are we sort of looking at the future of BMW design when we see this car right here?
11:30
So what I can say is, let's say the reduction of elements, the reduction of,
11:37
let's say, unnecessary shut lines, that's something that you're going to find in
11:43
each of our new models in the future.
11:46
What we remain is, let's say, this kind of interplay between like emotional soft surfaces,
11:54
as you can see it on the shoulders around the wheel arches,
11:57
but then combined with like really precise lines.
12:00
So that's something you're going to find in the future models as well.
12:05
You will find areas in the front end, for instance, as you see that
12:11
we don't talk necessarily about a headlight, and then there is another element,
12:16
and there is an intake, so everything is kind of flowing into each other.
12:21
So we say in the beginning, we said, okay, let's try to find functional areas
12:28
that are at the same time representing BMW in the future.
12:33
So in terms of surface treatment, form language,
12:39
it's representing, and that's something you've seen in the showcast,
12:43
previous showcast as well.
12:45
It's kind of representing that what we're going to do in the future.
12:48
And then the other question is in regards to the IX3 here,
12:53
what were some important design elements when you guys were putting it together
12:56
that you thought that you really wanted to get home?
12:59
Is it, I mean, obviously we have a throwback to the 1962 BMW
13:03
with the kidney grille, the vertical thin kidney grille, which is quite pretty.
13:08
But what were some, from your perspective,
13:10
some important design elements for this new model?
13:13
So maybe to the front, first of all, I think it's not just the Neue Klasse.
13:17
You can look into then the history of the 3 Series, for instance,
13:20
you see how close we are coming,
13:23
that we are coming closer to that, how we started.
13:27
The most important thing for BMWs is always the proportion.
13:35
And we are paying a lot of attention to the fact that we don't want to have,
13:39
let's say, the front overhang too long, that the wheels are at the right position
13:44
in terms, in reference to the rest of the body.
13:47
We are looking into, let's say, the Y-series section.
13:50
How does it appear?
13:52
Does it have a certain dynamics?
13:54
Does it have a certain presence?
13:56
So that's how we always start.
13:57
That's always important for each of our BMWs.
14:02
And this takes a lot of energy because it kind of influences the entire package of the car.
14:10
So there's a lot of shareouts with the engineers to get that point done pretty well.
14:21
Surface treatment, believe it or not,
14:23
it's something that is sometimes magical.
14:29
We are still working with clay modelers.
14:34
And a couple of years ago, we had an experiment,
14:39
having a section made out of the computer and then asking a modeler to do,
14:44
to do, let's say, the same section more or less.
14:48
And we have two sides.
14:49
And one of this side and the side of the modeler appeared,
14:54
let's say, perfect in terms of highlights and light and shadow.
15:00
And the other side was somehow dull in that.
15:04
And at that moment, we understood that the manual skill set, the craftsmanship,
15:11
is even more important in the early design phase,
15:16
not just in building the car, but in that segment.
15:20
So believe it or not, that's something that is so important for us at BMW.
15:24
So it's not a specific element, but it's the way how we're going to treat surfaces.
15:32
Can you talk a little bit about the team behind the creative process,
15:36
because a lot of brands are using much younger designers,
15:39
because you're appealing to a newer generation and all that.
15:41
And that's really interesting to see from different parts of the world even.
15:45
You can see things, different ideas and all that.
15:48
So here's some team members from design representing today as well, the IX3.
15:56
Our teams are, so for me, what's important for me actually is to have
16:05
a diverse and creative team, regardless of the age.
16:08
I think that's really important because it doesn't matter necessarily that
16:13
or it's not said that if a young designer is more creative than an old one, that's not true.
16:22
But on the other hand side, it's good to have a fresh perspective from young designers,
16:26
because they know different tools in terms of design,
16:29
which leads into different solutions sometimes.
16:33
They do have, let's say, another perspective on technology.
16:40
They do have their own community.
16:42
They see things differently.
16:44
But for me, it's important to have both perspectives.
16:48
Let's say, even more perspective, not just to, not just young and old.
16:53
And having then the discussion within the team in order to get the best result out of it.
16:58
I think it's important that, because if you are just talking to someone that is
17:03
exactly, has your opinion, there's no benefit.
17:09
You both can say each other, yeah, we are right, but we don't know if we are right.
17:13
So I think that's the key in the future, to really have this kind of diverse conversation.
17:23
It's even in design, it's more important than ever before,
17:27
since we're talking about a hard competition, right?
17:32
So on that note, I was an auto-China in April and I was very pleased to see that the only
17:40
non-Chinese manufacturer that was really focusing on the technology inside the car was you guys.
17:45
You had a massive display showing iDrive panoramic.
17:48
Everybody else was going back at the heritage and you were looking at
17:51
how much has the focus on this car as a technology product influenced the way you've
18:02
Actually, something magic happened there in parallel.
18:08
What I mean is that, let's say with that claim Neue Klasse and with Mike Reichelt as,
18:13
let's say, head of Neue Klasse, he was really keen to open up, let's say, a discussion in
18:19
both ways. So drivetrain proportions is all that that came from engineers, all that what you're
18:27
reading in terms of facts and figures. On the other hand, looking into the panoramic vision,
18:34
it came out of, let's say, a pretty old idea from BMW. I think 2014 we have been showing our
18:46
BMW Vision X100 where we, first of all, it was the first time we were saying like,
18:52
hands on the wheel, eyes on the road. And in that car, we had a really clean dashboard and we
18:59
just had the windscreen and that's it. So times passed by, we were kind of developing our
19:06
head up technology further and further. And then in this case, and it's so hard to say who started
19:15
that discussion again, right? But it happened somehow within the design department, but not
19:19
only design. And then they asked, well, we wanted to, we said, we wanted to have a clean dashboard,
19:26
but there's way more information, there's way more in terms of interaction in the future
19:32
how do we gonna solve it? And then the team has been looking into the past and said, past.
19:38
Oh, well, what is if we are mirroring something into the windscreen? So that's how it started.
19:43
And we had like really rough mockups there, simple displays, handy display,
19:49
mirroring and see, okay, what's the advantages, what needs to be solved, right? This double
19:54
picture, it's something that had to be solved. That's the normal effect.
19:58
So this impulse, for instance, came from a design perspective. And then our colleagues
20:08
in the engineering department, they kind of realized, let's say, the potential behind it.
20:14
And then we started a project together for that development. Bless you.
20:20
Yeah. And you guys had one of the first to have a head up display, right?
20:25
Or even the first, actually. We have been the first car manufacturer with a proper head up display.
20:31
I don't know when it was, but it was 2003, 2004, I don't know, quite early. It's something,
20:36
a nice here is that it's really, it's kind of supporting us as a BMW that is standing for
20:44
shield driving pleasure, focusing on that, that's a core vision, having these layers even further
20:50
away. There's another positive aspect that the instrument cluster is so close that
20:57
the older you are getting, you know, that the more difficult it is to adapt your eyes. So
21:01
everything that is coming further away will really help to being less distracted by driving.
21:08
So it's, I have to say, I am starting already. It's, it's, it's normal. It's coming.
21:16
To what extent in the design of designing the, the IX3? Obviously, the last few years,
21:22
we've seen the rise of AI and what it can do with such a wide portfolio to 10 to 40 models
21:27
before 2027. Have you used AI to help design the IX3? And if so, in what areas?
21:34
So my question can tell them way more about how we used or how they used AI and let's say
21:39
developing the, let's say the, the technological parts. In design, we're working with AI. We're
21:48
training our own AI because there's a lot of questions around intellectual property
21:55
and you have to train it, right? Because it has to understand, we started a couple of years ago
22:00
already with AI from a design perspective. And it's kind of flowing into our design
22:07
process and step by step. You see, you know, there's so huge steps in terms of performance
22:13
each week. And this car, we started to development a couple of years ago. AI wasn't there yet.
22:21
So chat GPT-4 wasn't there. But chat GPT, for example, already knows what makes a BMW?
22:28
It knows the presence of BMW. And you can try it out. I have. I asked it to design a
22:36
3-series for 2030 and it has a kidney grill in and it has super slim lights. The question is,
22:41
if it would have come out with that front end before our showcase, now it's different,
22:48
maybe because there's, you know, sort of thing. Yes. AI is important. And I think it can help us
22:54
a lot in terms of coming closer to a point. But at the end, it's the job of the designer
23:00
who changed, by the way, right? So imagine that when I started designing, I had some pencils and
23:07
AD markers and, you know, and all that stuff and maybe baby powder or whatever. The designers now
23:14
are working differently. They are having blender models. They are understanding. So they're using
23:20
tools. And that process speeds up. Exactly. So it's not about removing the human from the
23:26
process. It's about making the process more efficient. Right. Because there's still,
23:31
let's say that the manual translation is still there. So they're still working manually.
23:37
To be honest, there might be a loss. Every tool that you're losing
23:43
is having a little risk that you're kind of losing that direct connection. But they're
23:47
really good already. We tried out 3D modeling tools with AR, which is kind of impressive as well.
23:58
So you're drawing in 3D, which is really nice. And AI then using as a tool, I think can help us
24:06
a lot in terms of visualizing. Right. Or, for instance, wheel design is, let's say,
24:14
a microcosmos. Wheels, it's not just about styling and driving performance. It's about
24:21
fresh. So the wheels in the IA3, for instance, are an important part in terms of fresh, how it kind
24:28
of, how you say, how it breaks. For this, you can use AI because you can say, okay, there's
24:34
specific kind of requirements or, how you say,
24:42
yeah, regulations. And you can feed the AI and say, okay, based on that,
24:49
let's give me some examples. And then the designer is curating that based on what the
24:57
AI is doing. Right. So with 40 cars coming by 2027, that helps you to get a little more
25:03
sleeping time, a little rest because you're like busy, 40 cars.
25:08
That's what I was hoping for since 25 years. But it's, you know, you know how it is, right?
25:14
Yeah. It's getting more, there's other ideas then coming up. And I think to answer that,
25:22
the chop has changed as well. Right. Regarding the IA3, we're talking about,
25:27
let's say this kind of symbiotic holistic approach. It's not adding components to each other. It's like
25:34
bringing them together. And this leads into, you have to, you have to pay way more attention
25:40
together into a topic. And this takes more time. Thank you very much for your time.
25:46
You're welcome. Congratulations. Thank you. Thank you very much. Thank you.
25:51
That's a wrap for this episode of the Total Car Score podcast.
25:54
Want more expert takes on the hottest cars, industry trends and insider insights?
25:59
Join Javier Mota, Lauren Fix and Carl Brower every week for the ultimate auto talk.
26:06
Hit subscribe, like and share with your friends to stay informed and stay ahead. See you next time.
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