They mention IC Cars as the company that collects lots of used-car sales information. That’s how they build the list of which cars are selling the quickest.
This is just the price you pay for gasoline at the gas station. When gas gets more expensive, people often look harder at fuel economy, which can affect what used cars sell quickly.
Crude oil is the “starting material” that gets turned into gasoline. If crude oil costs more, gas usually costs more as well.
Term
85 octane
Octane is a rating on gasoline that helps prevent engine knocking. Higher octane usually costs more, and the “right” octane depends on what your engine is designed to use.
A Range Rover is a big, luxury SUV. Big SUVs usually use more gas, so when gas prices are high, filling up can get expensive fast.
Term
87
“87” is the octane rating on the gas pump. Your car may be designed to run best on a specific octane level, and using the wrong one can cause problems like knocking.
“Sky-high” is a shorthand for unusually elevated used-car pricing compared with normal market levels. When used prices jump, it often reflects supply constraints, higher demand, and higher costs elsewhere in the auto market.
The Hyundai Elantra N is a sporty version of the Elantra. The hosts say it sells quickly as a used car and that you can still get it with a manual gearbox.
A manual transmission means you choose the gears yourself using a clutch pedal and a stick. Some drivers prefer it because it feels more engaging than an automatic.
The Volkswagen Golf GTI is a popular “hot hatch” that’s meant to be fun to drive but still practical. They’re saying the Elantra N is trying to be the next version of that same idea.
Depreciation is how quickly a car loses value after you buy it. The point here is that buying used can help you avoid the biggest value drop that happens right after a new car is purchased.
JDM means “Japanese Domestic Market.” It’s a label people use for Japanese cars that are especially associated with Japan’s own market and driving culture.
The Nissan GT-R is a famous supercar from Japan known for being extremely fast. They’re talking about wanting older, earlier versions to show up at better used prices.
A turbo is what helps the engine make more power by forcing extra air in. A “super large” one can make more power at higher speeds, but it can also make the car less responsive and harder on the engine if it’s not set up correctly.
“Programming” means the car’s computer settings for things like fuel and boost. If you change those settings to chase power without doing it carefully, it can wear out the engine faster.
Term
shorten the life
“Shorten the life” is the hosts’ way of saying that certain modifications—like ECU changes—can increase mechanical stress and heat. That can accelerate wear on components such as the turbo system, engine internals, and drivetrain if the tune and hardware aren’t matched.
“Re chip it” means updating the car’s computer tune to make it run differently. It can add power, but if the tune is too aggressive, it can cause extra wear and shorten the car’s life.
Here “originality” means the car hasn’t been changed much from how it left the factory. Many buyers prefer that because it’s more predictable and usually holds value better.
“Molested” is slang for “messed with.” They’re saying some people want a car that hasn’t been heavily modified in a way that could make it less reliable or less valuable.
The Tesla Model Y is an all-electric SUV. It’s popular, and the hosts are talking about what it’s like to drive one and how its tech helps while you’re on the road.
“FSD supervised” means the car is helping you drive, but you’re still in charge. You have to watch what’s happening and be ready to take over if the car needs help.
They’re talking about how, with driver-assist features, it can feel awkward to know how to hold the steering wheel. Even when the car is helping, you still have to stay ready to steer.
Audi’s Q5 Sportback is basically a compact SUV with a sleeker, more “coupe-like” roof. It’s meant to look sportier than a normal Q5, but still works like an SUV day to day.
The Tesla Cybertruck is an electric pickup truck with a very unusual, boxy design. The hosts are saying it’s one of the most controversial trucks in recent years—people have strong opinions about it.
“Poster child” just means “the example people point to.” In this case, they’re saying the Cybertruck is the main example of the problems they associate with Tesla.
On a pickup truck, the “bed” is the part in the back where you put cargo. They’re talking about a bed-related feature that didn’t work well most of the time.
Instead of a direct mechanical connection from the steering wheel to the wheels, the car uses electronics to control steering. That lets the car adjust how “quick” or “slow” the steering feels depending on the situation.
Steering ratio is basically how much the wheels turn when you move the steering wheel. A variable ratio can make the car easier to turn in tight spots.
Normally only the front wheels turn. With four-wheel steering, the rear wheels can also turn, which helps the car turn tighter at low speeds and feel more stable at speed.
Concept
quartermaster
They’re using “quartermaster” like a playful way to talk about the truck’s storage area—basically the place where you keep and manage gear. The point is that the truck’s layout made carrying stuff more useful.
Steer-by-wire means your steering wheel doesn’t directly move the steering parts with a physical linkage. Instead, sensors and computers translate your steering input into commands that move the wheels.
They mention Infiniti, a luxury car brand. The point is that Infiniti experimented with steering tech, but with a physical backup connection instead of relying only on electronics.
The steering rack is the part that turns your steering input into wheel movement. It’s the key mechanical piece that links the steering wheel to the wheels in a traditional steering system.
A secondary backup is a backup plan for steering. If the main electronic steering path has a problem, the car can switch to another way to keep steering.
They’re talking about a physical metal link (a rod) that can act as a backup for steering. Instead of relying only on electronics, the car can still steer using a mechanical connection.
A locker helps both wheels on the same axle work together when you’re stuck or on slippery ground. Real lockers physically lock things up, while virtual lockers use the car’s computer and brakes to mimic that effect.
Rivian is a company that makes electric vehicles. In this discussion, they’re mentioned because their off-road traction system uses a computer/brake-based approach instead of true mechanical lockers.
Air suspension is a suspension system that can raise the truck up or lower it down using air. Lifting it up helps when you’re driving over rocks, ruts, or uneven ground.
Ground clearance is how much space there is between the bottom of the truck and the ground. More clearance usually means you can go over obstacles without hitting the underside.
A pickup truck is the kind of vehicle with an open bed in the back for hauling. If someone says it doesn’t work well as a pickup, they mean it doesn’t do the hauling/towing job as well as a typical pickup.
“Towed 10,000” means the vehicle pulled a trailer that weighed around 10,000 pounds. Being able to tow that much on paper doesn’t always mean it’s great at towing for long distances or in tough situations.
They’re talking about a price cut to $60,000 for the truck. It’s mainly about cost and buying decisions, not how the vehicle works.
Term
American flag
They’re joking about the truck being wrapped with an American flag design. It’s a style choice—like putting a big graphic film on the outside of the vehicle.
It means you paid too much when you bought, and then you sold for less than you paid. With cars, that usually happens when the car loses value faster than the market prices rise.
Concept
used cars are just ridiculously expensive
This refers to a “tight” used-car market where prices are elevated compared to normal. When used cars are expensive, it can be harder to avoid losses when you sell quickly, because the price you paid may not be recoverable in the resale market.
“Flip it” means buy it and then sell it again soon after, usually to make money. They’re saying some cars are so popular that people can sell them quickly.
“F80” is BMW’s internal code for a specific generation of the M3. They’re basically saying some cars like this are so in-demand that you could sell them fast for a lot of money.
They’re talking about ordering a car the way you want it—picking options first, then having it built afterward. The point is that it sounds like a fun, special process.
These are special high-performance wheels made from very light, hard materials. They help the car feel sharper, but if you damage them, they can be very costly to fix.
Term
parent's package
This sounds like a bundle of extra features/options for that car. The exact package name isn’t clear from the transcript, but it likely means “the car came with some option bundle.”
Premium Connectivity is a subscription that unlocks extra online features in the car, like better navigation and streaming. Without it, some internet-based features may be limited or unavailable.
Supercharging is Tesla’s fast way to recharge the battery at special stations. “Unlimited” means you can use those fast chargers without a usage limit (as long as the offer/program is valid).
Tesla sells software that helps with driving tasks. “For life” here means the buyer gets access to that software on the car long-term, rather than paying only for a short period.
A “signature edition” is a limited-run variant that typically includes unique styling and/or special packages (like software access or charging benefits). Limited production can create scarcity, which may influence resale value.
“Only building 250” highlights production scarcity—fewer cars made than a typical model run. Scarcity can increase collector interest and sometimes supports higher resale pricing, though it’s not guaranteed.
“Bricking” means the car’s computer/software could fail in a way that makes it stop working properly. The speaker is worried that software might become unusable after many years.
In an electric car, the battery is what powers everything. Over time it can wear out, and if replacement batteries are costly or hard to get, the car can become less practical.
The Lexus ES 300h is a hybrid Lexus sedan. The idea here is that it uses a lot of the same engineering as the Toyota Camry, so it’s generally easier to live with and maintain than more exotic cars.
They mention a “Ranger Sport” as an example of a used truck that turned into a money pit after buying it. The point is that some vehicles can require big repair bills soon after purchase.
The Lucid Air is an all-electric sedan made by Lucid. The hosts are saying it hasn’t been a big hit when new, and that early cars had some software and reliability headaches, which can hurt resale.
Depreciation just means the car loses value over time. If it depreciates a lot, it usually becomes cheaper to buy used, but it can also signal buyers were disappointed with the car’s early experience.
Reliability issues mean the car has problems that show up more than you’d like—things that may need repairs or cause trouble while driving. The hosts connect this to early Lucid cars having some trouble.
Software issues are glitches or bugs in the car’s computer systems. With EVs, some software problems can be fixed later with updates, but early cars can still frustrate owners.
Lucid Gravity is an electric Lucid vehicle the hosts describe as a minivan-style car. They’re saying it can go a long distance on a charge and can handle light off-road driving too.
Range is how far an EV can drive on one full charge. If it’s advertised as “400 miles,” that means it’s designed for long trips, but your actual miles can change depending on how you drive and the weather.
Light off-road means the car can handle rougher surfaces like dirt roads or gravel. It’s not the same as extreme off-roading, but it should be more capable than a typical low car.
Residual value is basically the car’s “future resale price.” They’re estimating that if it drops a lot this year, it could be worth much less next year too.
Car
Lexus GX550
The Lexus GX550 is a Lexus SUV. The big point here is that it’s hard to find new, so people end up shopping used ones.
“Limited supply” just means there aren’t many of these vehicles available. If lots of people want them but only a few exist, the used market stays hot.
Porsche is mentioned as another example of a brand where not everyone can easily buy the car they want. The idea is that limiting supply can keep demand strong.
The Lexus GX is a luxury SUV that’s built to handle rough roads too. In this part, they’re saying it’s worth paying extra compared with the Toyota Land Cruiser.
The Toyota Tundra is a big pickup truck. They’re saying the GX can’t be built in enough numbers because the same engine is also needed for Tundra work.
Resells so fast means the used car gets sold quickly once it shows up for sale. That usually happens when lots of people want it and there aren’t many available.
They’re talking about the new Honda Prelude and saying it uses a similar hybrid system to the Civic Hybrid. The idea is that the hybrid parts are related, even if the car is different.
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Hey, Nathan, nice to see you back, my man.
It's good to be back.
Yeah, we got the OG team back for one week, because you're in Colorado visiting your daughter,
right?
She's about to graduate CU Boulder with a million different classes under her belt.
She did really well.
I'm very proud of her.
Sweetheart, if you're listening, I love you, but she's not listening, I can get to that.
Wow.
Nice of you to say that.
Yeah.
So today's podcast, we've got some really fun topics I want to discuss.
First and foremost, we're going to talk about the top 10 fastest-selling used cars, and
it's a surprise, because I wouldn't have guessed any of these cars on this list, because most
of these cars are actually much-hated or have been much-hated, and yet somehow they're
selling.
So we'll start with that.
Okay.
Then, my man, I want to talk about some, let's call it lies that people are spreading on
the internet.
I always said your hair was real.
Yeah, okay.
Well, no, you never said it was real.
No, no, you're real.
Pull, pull.
This is my hair.
That was the lie.
Okay, I got to switch.
I got to switch to my head.
So luckily, I still have my hair.
Thank God.
Yes, he does.
You know, I'm losing everything else, but I have the hair.
And then at the end of this, I want to talk about your experiences in California.
Absolutely.
Yeah?
Yeah, looking forward to it.
I want to kind of talk about car culture there and what you've learned being in Cali.
It's crazy.
Yeah.
We really missed you here, but I'd love to hear, you know, what it's like in California.
So shall we get right into it, talk about the top 10 best-selling used cars?
Now, this list comes to us from our friends at IC Cars, which is, you know, a company
that takes and aggregates data from all the sales data, and that's how they come to this.
And we've been using their information for years.
Yeah.
And I think this is especially interesting because it's recent, and so it reflects what's
happening with gas prices.
As of this recording, gas prices have jumped up again because now oil, crude oil prices
are at an all-time high.
I went to the gas station and almost passed out, but you're not, you're loving these prices
compared to California.
I come out here and it's just like, oh, I forgot how cheap it is here, especially because
we run 85 octane, which means it's even lower.
We don't have any five octane in Southern California.
So I paid last yesterday when we bought, well, we bought a Range Rover.
Of course you bought a Range Rover.
I was there for that.
Yeah, you helped.
If you want to see that video, head on over to altifl.com.
Right.
But we paid, because the guy sold to us with no gas, of course.
Of course.
Of course.
Yeah.
But we paid, I want to say it was for the mid-grade, 87, it was like...
$85 to fill it up.
Yeah.
And it was like $4.59 or something a gallon, which is pretty high, or $4.69 a gallon.
That's so good.
Yeah.
What would you pay in California?
Probably close to six bucks for the mid-grade, but once again, the mid-grade is the low-grade
in California.
So maybe $5.50 to six bucks a gallon, depending on where you go.
Costco has the cheapest gas right now.
Yeah.
Costco, Sam's Club.
Yeah, yeah.
So there's this...
Oh, by the way, get this.
I was at the Sam's Club warehouse yesterday, and I saw one of those stickers with Trump's
finger pointing to the gas.
I did this.
Remember when they had the point?
They had it with Biden and everything else.
And not somebody's putting up the Trump.
I hate politicians altogether, so I don't care who's pointing.
It's just, ugh.
All right.
So it's just the typical thing.
So there's this confluence now of two things happening, right?
Prices and inflation are through the roof, and so used car prices are sky-high.
They are.
We have a former TFL employee, Brendan, who goes to the auction on a regular basis.
And I was just talking...
Actually, Tommy was just talking to him, and he went to the Mannheim auction, and he said
that the auction prices for used cars are now at the retail level.
Usually, obviously, they're like 5% to 10% below retail.
Yeah.
So that dealers can mark them up.
These are for newer used cars.
Yeah.
And so the prices for used cars are high, obviously, because people can't afford new cars.
So the used car market follows a new car market.
Right.
Yeah.
Older used cars, it's a different thing.
And we'll talk about that a little bit when we talk about California, because it's kind
of interesting what's happening there.
Yeah.
All right.
Well, so let's start with the number 10 most rapidly selling used car, and that is the
Hyundai Elantra N.
I would have never guessed.
Elantra N, really?
The average days on the market is 38.3.
That is a great car by the way.
It's a cool car.
I absolutely love it.
And you can get it with manual transmission.
Is it still selling the Elantra N?
As far as I'm...
Yeah.
Yeah.
So it kind of takes the mantle of the Golf GTI.
Yeah.
It goes directly against the Honda Civic Si.
Yeah.
And it's more power.
It's great on the track, a little polarizing to look at.
Some people do not like the looks.
I've warmed up to it a little bit, but driving it is fantastic.
Yeah.
I think that's almost a better used car than a new car in some ways, because you don't
have to take the, you know, you don't take the hit on the depreciation.
Yeah.
But then some idiot kid like slammed it and then took it around the corner and
balled the tires out and everything else.
You know, Supro totally slammed it and got the stance.
You know what I've been dying for?
I've been to Japan a lot now.
So I've gotten into JDM cars and there the Godzilla is king, the GTR.
And so I've been hoping and longing for like those early 2012, 2010 GTRs that come down.
But they're not.
They're not coming down.
They're still, you know, at around 60 to 80,000.
And you can't find one that's been untouched.
You just can't.
Every single one of those has been stansed or, you know, super large turbo K Turbos inside
and whatever.
Yeah.
Or they've messed with the programming, of course, which will shorten the life of the
car.
So finding an original early GTR is almost impossible.
And if you do the carry a high premium.
So keep that in mind all you guys who decide that, you know, whatever it is, 600 horsepower
isn't enough.
And so you want to, you want to re chip it.
It's great for you, but it's bad for your value in the long run.
Yeah.
Originality is what people want.
In many cases, they really do want a car that is, you know, on the term of molested.
Some people don't like to hear.
I avoided that on purpose.
But I just did it.
So it's a trigger ordinate.
It is.
The youngsters would say, yes, but I just acknowledged that.
Cole, you triggered by that.
Were you triggered?
He's about to throw something.
Anyway, let's continue.
He says no.
All right.
Number nine, a Tesla Model Y, which makes sense because it's the best selling electric
car in the world.
Yeah.
It's one of the top selling cars.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So 34.6 days to sell one of these bad boys.
And I just recently had like an epiphany driving one the other day at TFL of all places
because I have never been in one that did the level to, yeah, we just did that video.
Yeah.
If you want to see Nathan's first experience with FSD supervised head on over.
Like I said, to all TFL.
How many times did you tell me not to grab the steering wheel?
It was funny.
Yeah.
Cause every time I looked over, you were holding onto the steering wheel and I'm like, dude,
let go.
Well, the problem with that is it's, it's, it's weird because you don't know where to
put your hands.
Where do you put your hands?
It's, you're so used to having on a steering wheel, then you're like, I don't know where
to put them.
So I put them on my lap and that feels really weird.
Now I'm a coffee drinker.
So I'd probably like have just the cup sitting in my hand or whatever.
Of course, if something horrible happened, that would be bad, but it was weird.
Um, and you, it's worth watching the video because, uh, genuinely I was shocked and surprised,
mostly in a positive way, but if you watch, you'll understand my point because I've never
done that in a, um, Tesla.
And honestly speaking, I'm beginning to understand why certain car companies are doing what they're
doing now, but that's, I'm going to leave it at that.
You think that FSD or versions of it is the future?
You think this is where the industry is going?
Yeah.
No doubt.
And it's not for the people who like to drive.
It's a people who have to drive.
Yeah.
So people who treat cars like an appliance.
Exactly.
Exactly.
And, um, that part, I don't mind.
I don't mind at all if it's for somebody who's, you know, it's a chore and they're not very
good drivers or whatever by popping in, hitting a button and taking off.
Those cars can drive pretty good by a comparison to where somebody's not paying attention when
they're switching lanes or on their phone or whatever and or driving like crap.
So I think that that in itself is a good thing.
The other side of it, of course, is that, um, I don't want it to be a mandatory thing that
you have to use in cars.
So hopefully it's going to be balanced.
I'm a big freedom to choose.
Yes.
Freedom of choice when it comes to cars.
All you politicians out there don't force people to go electric or go full self-driving.
I know that the temptation is there to legislate this stuff, but I think at some point people
will figure out what's best for them and let them figure it out.
But the, the one thing I will tell you, Nathan, and I sincerely believe this, I think computers
are better at driving than humans, but not initially, but now they are.
For instance, you can't see behind you.
You have no eyes in the back of your head.
Whereas at Tesla can or any, any, you know, autonomous car, uh, computers don't get tired.
They don't get angry.
They don't get, uh, drunk.
Always.
Yes, but to beauties can fail.
Yeah, but, but humans fail a lot too.
No, no, no, no.
My wife isn't, is absolutely impervious from failure.
Of course.
Except their wives.
Yes.
Our wives are perfect when it comes to driving.
All right.
Number eight on the list is the Audi Q5 Sportback 34.2 days.
Is that even, I haven't seen one of those on the street.
Have you seen many of those?
No, it's like the, it's like the, the utility vehicle without the utility.
Yeah.
But in addition, I just don't see too many of them.
I cannot remember the last time I've seen a Q5 Sportback.
All right.
The next one is a hot take and people, I was just thinking about this this morning in the
shower of all places.
So the next one, number seven on the list is a Tesla Cybertruck at 33.3 days.
Now the Tesla Cybertruck has become the poster child for everything that is wrong with Tesla,
everything that is wrong with technology, everything that is wrong with Musk.
Uh, and it's become, I think, I think it's fair to say it's the most hated truck slash
car, uh, of the last, what, 10 years.
Would you, would you, would you say that's fair?
I would say the last 50 years.
Okay.
I can't think of anything that's more polarizing.
Even the Aztec was kind of a joke.
And it was kind of a laughable joke.
People were violently opposed to this truck.
What was the Ford that looked like it was second to lemon?
Before the second to lemon.
Yeah.
It was named after the kid, Ford's kid.
I can't think of it right now.
Oh, wait.
Well, Edsel was.
Edsel.
Yeah.
The Edsel.
That was also hated.
That was hated, but that was just hated because it was unattractive.
I don't think it was really because of business choices and political things.
So, so my hot take on this is I really liked our cyber truck.
Actually.
Yeah.
You were, you were pretty hip to it.
I'll tell you why I liked it.
Okay.
Um, first and foremost, I love the tan out cover, which turned into something that is
virtually 90% of the time useless, which is the bed.
When it worked.
When it worked.
Fair.
Right.
We had one of the early ones.
So obviously.
All right.
I'll give him a cut.
But it made it like, I remember I had to go pick up my friend Steve at the airport and
it was raining and I just threw all his luggage in the back and him and his wife and it stayed
perfectly dry.
I just liked the tan out cover.
I thought it was nice to incorporate that.
And look, I don't, you know, I love truck beds, but most of the time they're empty.
And if you ever need them to actually carry stuff that you don't want stolen, they're
useless for that.
Even if you put a topper on it because nothing's easier to bust open than a topper.
So, so this was actually, I think I thought a solution that made the utility part of the
truck much more useful for many people.
So I love that.
But beyond that, the technology that it brought or brings that hasn't been around, people
always get in arguments, but it was the first vehicle to have completely steered by wire
where the ratio changed.
And actually the changing ratio once you get used to it was really nice because what happens
is when you're in a tight parking situation with the variable steering and with four-wheel
steer, it made the truck much more maneuverable.
You were just in the quartermaster.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Oh, that's, that's the quartermaster.
It's the exact opposite.
Yeah.
Well, actually, and they just recently improved the steering.
Yeah.
And it is better, but still it's like turning a battleship inside of a small pond.
And I would, I would push against you on one thing.
The Cybertruck with the four-wheel steering and everything else is perhaps the first vehicle
with the.
Steer by wire.
Steer by wire.
There was an infinity that had.
The infinity was the first of the game with that.
Yeah.
But no, so that's not actually true.
The infinity actually had a physical connection between the wheel and the steering rack.
And what would happen with the infinity is that would disconnect, but it was, it was
like a secondary backup.
So really?
Yeah.
Okay.
So there was a, there was actually a rod.
A stealing rod.
Yeah.
Right.
As opposed to just wires.
Yeah.
Whereas there was no redundancy or there is no redundancy in the Cybertruck.
And then the other thing that they did right with the Cybertruck and Cole was just playing
the video where we took it to Moab was it had two real lockers.
Everybody else, including Rivian, they go with virtual lockers.
And I have found that off-road virtual lockers are not good, whereas real lockers are really
good.
And it also had the air suspension, which gave it up to get this.
If I recall, and it's like extract mode, it was 16 inches of ground clearance.
Take that Subaru with your puny 10 inches of ground clearance.
Okay.
I, I wouldn't even throw a Subaru under the bus on this one.
I would throw, I would, you know, Jeep or someone else because I'd actually,
I just picked a brand that has a lot of, a lot of,
Yeah.
They do actually, you know, their ground clearance is decent for across the board.
But okay, I'm not going to, I'm not going to go into the tirades that I have about the
Cybertruck.
No, you should go, go into the place.
I think you should go for it.
A couple of basic things here is that it hurts you.
Yeah.
It's actually sliced me more than once.
It did slice you.
I think the quality of the vehicle itself, the actual,
This is important.
It sliced you.
No, it actually cut into me.
Almost, almost needing stitches.
Like, like one of those baloney slices.
Yeah.
The front end of it is, is, is made to hurt people.
And you just rushed up against it.
Yeah.
And we were doing a broadcast at the time and all of a sudden, I think it was the videographer
side, bro, you're bleeding.
I mean, you were alive in the studio, bleeding like a stuffed pig, you know,
It's like on camera.
This is not a small thing.
No.
No, it's not.
I agree.
And the other thing is that, you know, when, and it, okay, this is Tesla.
Tesla now knows how to build cars pretty quickly and their build quality has improved, but
not on the Cybertruck.
Even the later models, and I was recently in the later model, the build quality sucks.
I'm sorry, but it does.
There's many things that go wrong just with minor components.
In addition to that, they did not deliver on the price.
Not even close.
Yeah.
But they weren't the only ones.
No, no, no.
Or to the same thing.
Once again, it's not, it's not a what about.
It's, it's a direct thing towards them.
Because yes, there are many other people who are guilty.
And the final component of it is that I don't think it worked well as a pickup truck.
Okay.
Bottom line.
And you buy it as a pickup truck.
No, you buy it as a Tesla fan who needs a little bit of a pickup.
That's my perspective.
So saying it's a competitive pickup.
And at the end of the day, it's really not in terms of the things it can do.
I think that's a proper way.
I mean, it towed 10,000.
It just didn't do it very far.
No, no.
And actually towing, they've proven that towing with it, not a great idea.
So there's many things with it that are being improved or have been improved.
And given what they've done, I'd say some of it's really impressive.
I really liked the ride quality of it and the steering.
I hated the fact that how you had to shift it to go back and forth and all that type
of stuff.
That's the model I know.
They all have it that way.
I don't like that.
I agree.
You don't like, me no like.
But once again, this is not a rant about this vehicle.
It's too easy for me to do it.
You can rant.
No, but I'm going back to what we're doing here.
The fact that it is considered popular as a used vehicle is surprising to me considering
how many they have not sold.
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So we have, you know, one day Mr. Musk woke up and decided that SpaceX wasn't buying enough of the cyber trucks apparently
and so he lowered the price to $60,000 and we've got one of those on order.
You're kidding.
No, I'm not kidding.
We're doing it again?
Are you going to wrap it in another American flag again?
No, Colorado flag this time.
I like it wrapped in white.
I think they look really good in white.
It looks like a giant refrigerator.
I kind of am digging that.
You go, bro.
That's, yeah.
But it was, I have to say, Nathan, it was one of my favorite vehicles that we've ever owned.
The thing that really stung was that we lost $28,000 on it in six months.
We bought it for $100,000 and we sold it six months later for $70,000.
Well, this is TFL.
Yeah, we buy high and sell low.
We buy high and sell low.
This is not good.
And that's especially true right now with the fact that used cars are just ridiculously expensive.
And we're going to get into that in a minute.
So what's next on the list?
By the way, did you know I was offered for some mysterious reason the signature edition of the Model S?
I just got this email.
They're only building 250 of them.
I've always wanted to be offered something.
Right.
Something limited.
Like where the Ferrari dealer, like the F80, apparently like the way that the Ferrari offers,
I heard this on a podcast, the way they offer you the money is they'll actually bring you to the dealership
and they'll give you a box.
F80, right?
And the thing, okay, here's what you have to keep in mind.
When you get up to the level of being offered a car, or let's say even a Rolex watch,
if you got the right kind of Rolex, what they're giving you is money.
Because you could take that car and potentially flip it the next day,
which probably they wouldn't like, but you could for an F80, right?
Those are a million or something.
I don't know.
Oh, easily.
Or more.
I would say way more.
But you could probably sell it the next day for three million.
Oh, yeah.
Someone else is going to want it who's not on that list.
Or like there's certain Rolex says you can do that with an AP.
I do it all the time.
You do that.
Okay.
Anyway, so the way I guess the F80 is offered to you is they call you into the dealership
and they present you with a box, this big box, right?
And it's beautifully wrapped in whatever color they think.
And you unwrap it and you get the key to the car.
Interesting.
And then you go and configure it and then they build it for you.
I would like to know how.
I would love that experience.
Okay, I'm sorry, but that would be such a cool experience.
It would be a really cool James Bondi type moment where it's just like, I am doing something.
You unwrap this body, you'll know what's in it.
And then there's this F80 key in there.
That would be super cool.
It would be super, super cool.
But the other side of that is Ferrari don't, they don't talk to us.
We're more likely to get that.
And the other side is I couldn't afford, we couldn't afford.
Oh, we could sell the business and then.
And all the cars and we still couldn't afford it.
Yeah.
Sell some organs.
I guess it'd be like man, I'm strong on YouTube where you buy a crash one and rebuild it.
But we're not good at that either.
Yeah.
We don't hear that.
It's also bad.
All right.
Number 16 on our list is the Lexus.
Anyway, I got the signature edition offered to us.
Oh, yeah, yeah.
Only $250, but it's $160,000 basically for a plaid that is, except for the carbon ceramic
That kind of ruby red color that the first edition was.
Full self-driving for life and full charging for life.
Yeah.
So in essence, you could drive around the corner, around the country basically doing laps for
the rest of your life in this thing, or as long as the battery would last, I would imagine.
But a plaid is like 120.
And the reason they're doing these is because the car is being discontinued.
Yeah, the essence is going away.
Yeah.
So this is, they did a signature edition for the first ones.
And those carry like a $1,000 premium.
It goes in a lot.
But I was thinking to myself, part of the appeal is that this is something that will go up in
value.
Do you think that, they're only building 250.
Do you think that a Tesla Model S plaid, the last signature edition will go up in value
from 160?
It's questionable at best.
And if it does, when will that happen?
And it will brick itself in 20 years.
Yeah, it's so hard to predict with electric cars.
With an internal combustion car, even a hybrid, there are components that you can replace
relatively easily and keep it going and whatever.
So if you want to trade that's value higher 20 years from now, there's a possibility.
I think there's one company that's keeping the roadsters on the road.
Yeah, they're an organ or something.
Yeah, otherwise, what happens is the computer, the chip side is too slow, the batteries are
too old and it becomes a piece of art.
It's a heavy paperweight.
Yeah, eventually.
All right, number six is the Lexus ES 300H, 33.1 days on the market.
That's a hybrid, Nathan.
So you're seeing a theme here, electric cars, sports cars and hybrids.
Yeah, and the 300H, if I recall, had a lot of components that came out of the Camry.
And it's a perfectly good car.
Yeah.
Not the most exciting Lexus built, but it's one of those really smart cars to buy for
those people who want the Lexus branding, want the Toyota reliability.
And at the end of the day, don't mind the fact that you're driving something that's
a little bit slower than some of the other Lexus's that are out there.
But I think Lexus, with its reputation for luxury, reliability, longevity.
You can't go wrong with that car in that respect.
You're not going to get that car home and then they have another $10,000 worth of repairs,
like maybe on that Ranger Sport that we bought.
Yeah.
I am concerned about that.
I love that thing, though.
All right.
Number five, the Lucid Air, another car that doesn't really sell well on the new car market,
but that's because these things depreciate so much.
They've had some reliability issues out of the earlier ones.
Software issues, yeah.
But supposedly they fixed those.
I just went on, what, six months ago, I guess, the Lucid Gravity event.
And that car was amazing.
Yeah, it's a minivan.
It's a minivan that hauls butt and has a 400-mile range.
Oh, look at this.
It does mean my freight juice.
And it can go off-road, like light off-road.
I mean, I was having some fun with it.
But the thing about the Lucid, that company, they kind of did us dirty.
They never really gave us a car early on.
I mean, it took us years to have access, right?
And that's a shame.
You know, the problem with, I think, the issue with Lucid is that Mr. Rollins, who's a CEO,
came out of Tesla, and he seems to have wanted to compete with Elan.
And so instead of building a mid-sized crossover, which he should have.
He should have done that right.
He built a sedan when nobody was buying sedans.
And then when he finally did build the crossover, he made it look like a minivan.
I mean, I can't think, I guess from an engineering point of view, if you're a
pure engineer, these are two form factors that make a lot of sense.
But from a sales point of view, I can't think of two worst kind of cars to try to
sell in this market, a sedan or a minivan, because minivans have this huge
stigma where people just want them if they have to have them.
I disagree with you.
I think it looks like basically a Lucid air wagon.
And I don't think it's ugly.
But I do think that they should have done more to differentiate it between that
and the other, the Lucid air.
Regardless, the Lucid air, I've driven a couple now, they're really fast.
They're beautifully refined.
I've fallen in love with it.
It's a great car.
We had a grand touring, as you saw.
And I fell in love with it.
And I thought, I need to have one of these.
And then I went online to look to see how much they are.
They're 135 new.
You could buy them.
Dude, it was a one year old car with like 4,000 miles, $60,000.
Half of its value slashed in one year.
So if you wait another year, it'll be 30 grand?
Yeah, I'm thinking that's why this is number five on those 31.6 days.
All right, number four, the Lexus GX550.
That's an interesting one.
The GX550 is an interesting one.
Because you can't get them new.
No, no, they're done.
No, no, no, no.
You can't buy them new because there's limited supply.
So the GX...
I thought that they were throttling them back to where you couldn't buy them right now.
Period.
No, you could buy them.
But the reason, so obviously the 550 came out, what, like two years ago.
And ever since then, they've been limited in supply.
And I was thinking that maybe Lexus was doing the thing that like Ferrari or Porsche does,
keeping...
Because these things are, even today, my friend James wants one of these.
And even today, to try to buy one of these, it would take you, if you wanted a specific spec,
up to a year, if you could get one.
Yeah, I just had one that I drove in California and it was the...
It's the overlanding version of it or whatever.
Overtrail.
Overtrail, that's it.
It was beautiful.
It really, a wonderful vehicle.
Great to drive.
So there's two issues with this.
First, it starts at 80...
It was 80 grand.
The one I had was like $81,000.
So 79, it starts at...
And the Land Cruiser ends at 75.
Oh, it's so much better than the Land Cruiser.
So why wouldn't you spend 5K more for a GX as opposed to a Land Cruiser?
Yeah, and it's more power.
It's a much more powerful powertrain.
So I've heard through the grapevine that the reason that they're in short supply
is because it's got the same engine that the Tundra has
and they're prioritizing replacing Tundra engines.
So basically, the reason you can't build enough of them is...
That's why I think they throttled back on them.
Yeah, because they can't.
They don't have the engines because all the Tundra engines,
they're replacing 200,000 of them,
which is the same powertrain that's in this thing.
Yeah, essentially.
So I think that's why it also resells so fast on the used market
because the second one comes available, people just snap it up.
All right, number three already.
Holy cow, this is an interesting one.
The Honda Civic Hybrid Hatchback, 29.6 days average on the market.
Funny thing about that Honda Civic Hybrid,
that is the same powertrain that's in the brand new Honda Prelude that you and I drove.
Exactly the same powertrain.
I think it's in the CR-V.
No, it's different.
That's slightly different.
I think it's the same one.
They changed a few things on it in order for it to work
because remember the CR-V has an all-wheel drive system,
so there's a couple of mechanical differences.
But the engine and the...
The engine I think might be the same.
Anyway, it doesn't matter.
It's a great car.
It's such a good little car because you get crazy power.
The only thing is I'm not a huge fan of the way the transmission is set up,
but it's just a little whiny, but that's typical for hybrids.
I don't think it's a transmission.
I think it actually has a transmission.
No, it's a planetary gear set, I think, or something along those lines.
I actually think...
Oh, no, it's a direct...
It's a direct drive.
It's a direct drive at a certain thing,
and then it's the electric motors at a slower speed.
But it still makes noise.
It doesn't sound sporty, is my point.
Yeah, yeah, fair.
I think the reason people love it is the same reason that a lot of these cars are on the list.
It just gets incredible phenomenal fuel economy.
I mean, we're talking like Prius numbers from back in the day.
This is like high 40s.
Yes, and in addition, you have really good power.
That was the thing that surprised me.
It's 200 horsepower.
That's really good for a little car.
Yeah, I think I rid of the CVT, though.
Thank God.
Yeah, it's not an old-school CVT, which is real crap,
but the bottom line here is that 90% of that car is excellent,
and if you can find one that's an agreeable price, just get it.
And also, the reliability has been pretty decent as far as I remember.
Yeah, yeah.
And so we kind of danced around, but I think you nailed it.
I think the way that that drivetrain works is it's basically an electric motor,
so it doesn't have a transmission, and then when it gets fast enough,
it actually just goes directly, direct drive.
It just directly drives the wheels.
I believe that's how to say it.
So it bypasses the transmission.
Yeah, and that also gives a great fuel economy.
But you're right.
The engine note is it kind of sounds like a CVT.
I think I'm spoiled because I love the Honda Civic Si.
It's one of my favorite cars, period, full stop.
And I love the way it sounds.
I love the way it drives.
And because of that, I judge other Hondas pretty harshly.
All right, number two on our list is the, this is also an interesting one,
Lexus RX 350H, 27.6 days.
That is no surprise to me.
Yeah, because the RX is the best selling Lexus.
It accounts over 50% of Lexus sales.
And the hybrid, of course, now with gas prices would be the one that you'd want.
And they've had the hybrid, a hybrid version of the RX for years.
Yeah.
Yeah.
For a long time.
And it's a damn good vehicle.
You owned one.
Yeah, my wife.
Yeah.
I like it.
It's like Defrenio was my wife.
So it wasn't me.
Well, the point is, is that that vehicle, I mean, it can take abuse.
It's the really rock solid.
Do you have any issues with it while you had it?
No, we had it for like over 10 years.
I think you put on like just under 100,000 miles.
And no issues, right?
No issues.
That's the other thing.
And that makes our jobs really easy with a lot of people when they ask about, you know,
I want something luxurious that gets good mileage.
Lexus RX.
You know what?
Before we get to number one, let me tell you something that I think is interesting.
The Toyota did right.
And that is, I think they introduced people a long time ago to the concept of electrification.
Oh, with their hybrids?
With their hybrids.
It was a big gamble, but it paid off.
Yeah.
And then they went to like the Prime, which no longer calling Prime, but basically get
the plug in.
And now that they've actually, it's sitting here at our office, that they've actually
improved the BZ outside of the Tesla Model Y, the Toyota hybrids are, I mean, the Toyota
electric vehicles are actually selling really well.
They were, they've been so smart about almost everything.
And if you rewind some of the podcasts we did back around COVID time and around the
same time that various companies were pushing super hard on the electric mandate from other
places.
Toyota was staunch with their whole, their production.
We believe in hybrids.
Yes, we're going to do a couple of these compliance vehicles, which is where the BZ4 blah, blah,
blah.
Initially came from, and that wasn't great.
The first one was not.
But that was Toyota just basically, and we'll play your game, but here's the deal.
We know that the hybrids are the way to go.
And they have been right almost the entire time.
You know, when they first introduced the Prius, they were losing money on every single Prius
that they were selling in the United States.
Yeah, as is the way.
But my point was it kind of weaned people onto the notion of electrification.
Yeah.
So people who would normally, there's a certain subset of people who just jumped on Tesla right
away, early adopters.
Of course, yeah, because it was hip.
But yeah, but most people weren't ready for that switch.
But the way Toyota did it was they said, okay, if you're not ready for that, here's, here's
a mid step, right?
Here's, here's the hybrid.
And by the way, if you want to go a little bit more electric, here's a plug-in hybrid.
Now you get like 40 miles of range.
And now with the BZ, those people are ready to go full electric because they understand
that electric cars aren't the devil because they've had some form of electricity powering
their car in the last 20 years.
And I think that's why the BZ is selling so well because these people are ready to move
on finally to full electric.
They like, they like, they like finally went into the deep end of the pool.
Except they're towing with hybrids and they jumped in the pool with plug-ins and now they're
in the deep end.
There's another component too.
Another simple component they missed.
The word Toyota is just printed on the car.
Yeah, that helps.
It really does.
Brand helps.
And in this case, I mean, they still have quite a reputation and people just will buy a Toyota.
All right, Nathan.
In a million years, I would have never guessed that the fastest selling car, fastest selling
car.
Mitsubishi Outlander.
Used car.
Damn.
Never would have guessed this.
Tesla Model X.
Where did that come from?
You know, the Model X.
It's discontinued.
It's discontinued and it's not the best vehicle they produced.
I mean, it has some issues.
We had it early on.
Yeah, my favorite thing about it, and I wish other car companies had this and I love it
so much.
The Falcon Dorus.
No, I didn't like the Falcon Dorus.
Those are problematic.
What I loved, and no other Tesla as far as I know, maybe the S does this or I don't know,
maybe the new ones do it.
The early one we had didn't is when you get in the car, you step on the brake and it closes
your door.
Not soft close, it closes the door completely.
I just love that feature.
Just a huge smile on my face.
Is that the only Tesla that does that?
I think so.
I don't know.
Maybe the S does it as well or the newer ones, but the old one we had didn't do it.
I would go shopping and then I would load up the back with all the groceries and then
I was like, ah, and then I get in the car and I step on the brake and the door would close
and I'd be like, ah, that's so nice.
We tortured the crap out of the X that we had.
We took it off road.
We took it off road.
We towed with it.
And it was really funny because we were doing it at the time when some other people like
in other countries were taking them off road saying, don't take them off road.
And then we were toying with it when other people were like that.
You really shouldn't tow with it.
So why do you think it's the fastest-selling used car?
Because it's a three-row SUV and it's a Tesla.
And even when you drain the battery a bit, it's still pretty decent range.
There's a big battery in that thing.
I would imagine people just, you know, they're able to get some.
Remember, we tried to tow with it to Oregon and we gave up because...
Oh, God.
We didn't make it out of the state, did we?
No, we made it to Wyoming.
Oh, that was a great idea.
So we made it to Wyoming and the problem, we ran into that very early on where you
would tow for two hours, charge for one hour.
And so we had driven it for two hours and it needed a full hour to charge up again.
And I thought to myself, to get to Oregon, we're going to add like...
Six weeks.
Exactly.
So we had a ram at that point and I remember I called Zach and I'm like,
Zach, come get the Tesla.
Bring us the ram.
Just get the hell out of here.
Yeah, that just didn't go well.
But things have improved all across the board with Tesla towing and all that other stuff.
But regardless, the X, I think, for people who are entering into the whole racket, perhaps
they're looking at massive depreciation.
Well, I think those were like the...
They're over 100.
The older plaid was like 90 to 100.
Yeah, they're over 100.
So I wonder how much they cost.
I bet you can pick one up for only 30 to 40, I bet.
Now, think about that.
So even if it only has like half its range at 150 miles or whatever.
It'll have its full range.
I think it'll have a decent range, at least.
No, no, no.
We had...
You weren't here for this, but we bought an early Tesla 2012.
It had over 100,000 miles on it because Jen used to work at Tesla.
She took it to Tesla.
And usually when you take it to Tesla to check out the battery, they will tell you a thumbs up or a thumbs down.
But she had inside information.
Yeah, that's right.
91% of its battery.
After 10 years, 91%.
And that's a Colorado car dealing with cold weather.
91%.
It's impressive.
So basically the rule of thumb is for all you EV folks, you lose about 1% a year.
Yeah, which has...
And that number changed because years ago they used to think it was 10% a year.
Some crazy number like that.
That was before they did the research.
But that was the Nissan Leaf and all that too.
And that was the Leaf, yeah.
Which didn't have climate control batteries.
Yeah, it didn't.
That is surprising.
I guess it just has to do with the fact that people really do want to get a Lexus product,
or sorry, a Tesla product, but...
I think it has to do with the fact that the gas is $7 a gallon.
That does hurt in some places at $7 a gallon.
I was thinking about that.
I thought to myself, you know, when this happened last time and gas jumped up this high, my wife bought a Prius because of it.
But with this recent war and the spike in fuel prices, people have not been actually buying electric cars.
But what I think they have been doing is buying hybrids.
Hybrids, yeah.
But I'm wondering, like, okay, let's say gas, before the war started, was like $3 a gallon in Colorado.
And now it's spiked to like $5 a gallon.
So I'm thinking between like $3 and $5, you're going to be looking at hybrids.
Above $5, you might start thinking about electric.
The higher it goes, it makes sense.
It makes sense.
Because it's cheaper to fill up your car at night at home off the grid than it will ever be, even with a hybrid, to fill it up at a gas station.
Oh, there's no doubt.
And people who live in my area, now that I'm in Southern California, many, many people do drive electric vehicles,
even though, frankly speaking, the grid is not very kind.
The way they run it is terrible out there.
But you still are financially, it's more logical for a commuter, mind you.
In Los Angeles, hard, hard traffic to drive something electric where you can just bring it home and fire it up there.
Or there's a decent infrastructure.
That's not great where you can plug it in and just basically top it off.
And it's far less expensive than the gas out in Los Angeles or anywhere really in California.
So let's switch gears just for a second before we get to your experience in California.
So there are three.
I hate this word because they use it instead of lies.
They say falses, but there are three lies that I keep hearing over and over and over again.
And as a person, a journalist who values facts over fiction, I just like to break these myths, these lies.
And I'll give you the top three.
We'll start with electric cars.
I keep hearing this rationale for somehow taxing electric cars.
And it's happening in a lot of states right now.
And the rationale for it is you never buy gas so you don't pay road tax because that's what most of the tax...
It is used.
And because the cars are heavier, which they are, they damage the road a lot more.
So that's not fair.
So we need to somehow tax them to repair the roads that they're damaging.
Nathan, how much does a semi truck weigh?
They could weigh 20,000, 30,000 pounds.
Up to 80,000 pounds of roads.
And I listened to a podcast with a transportation expert.
My old school Northwestern has a transportation department.
Right.
Which is unusual.
But he was like, roads are designed for semis for 80,000.
So whether...
When you think about it, so a car that weighs, let's say 1,000, 2,000, 3,000 pounds more,
does no more damage than a heavy duty truck.
And so that's a complete BS.
It is out of BS.
Out of BS.
Now look, there's a minor counter to that.
So yes, your regular roads are built to handle a truck.
And most electric vehicles weigh way less than a truck.
The only example that would probably be comparable is like, I don't know, one of Tesla's cyber trucks.
They're big trucks.
They don't weigh that much.
They actually don't weigh that much.
The only example that would be heavy would be the Hummer EV.
That's like, ours was 9,000.
And it's 9,000 pounds.
Yeah.
And even that, there was less of this public.
Cyber trucks like 7, yeah.
Yeah.
But look at what's on the highway right now.
And I agree with you, and I don't buy that.
It's crap.
It's just they're trying to find a way to tax it.
And that's not the way to do it.
If you want to do that, I'll tell you what, they are known.
They, being electric vehicles, are known for chewing up tires at a much faster rate than your average internal combustion vehicle.
Because they're heavy.
Yeah, exactly.
And they also leave a heavy residue in many places because of tires.
You know, they turn into granules.
So I'm trying to pick, you know.
PFAP, actually.
They turn into forever chemicals.
So in order to clean that up, to fund a cleanup, that would be a tax.
Like a cleanup tax or something like that.
I'm trying to help you politicians out there.
Don't help the politicians.
I despise them all.
But the point is that you guys could go out there and go, whoa, whoa, these cars are actually messy.
And there's actual research to back that up.
As opposed to saying, well, a highway is destroyed much more quickly when you have an electric car across it.
BS, trucks go across it all the damn time and they weigh way more.
Come on.
Yeah, the other BS thing I hear all the time is the story that car manufacturers, and it's true,
but this is an example that is not true.
The car manufacturers are very greedy and that they want subscriptions.
And the worst example of that is when they try to charge a subscription for something that the car already has,
i.e. an example of that is the BMW that tried to drive extra revenue by charging for heated seats,
which the car already had.
Now, that's the story that's out there.
And the truth of the matter is, yes, BMW tried to do that, but in China.
And nobody says that, but in China part.
And I don't know what the market's like in China, but BMW never contemplated charging extra for electric seats in America or in Europe.
It was a thing that they thought about in China because I don't know what the hell's going on.
Are there other subscriptions, other automakers are starting to try to push?
Yeah, I'm not saying that the subscription model is, but this example is BS because they never considered doing it here or in Europe or in the rest of the country,
but they did consider it in China.
And so people use that and they keep saying BMW, try to charge for heated seats at your local dealership.
I'm like, no, they didn't.
So yeah, the story is false, but the fact that manufacturers are trying to continue with or trying to come up with creative and I think stupid ways of additional revenue.
Yes, that is true.
Yeah, and it's going to hurt their sales because people would just walk away.
That I'm sure of.
So what's your third one?
The third one is what the hell is my third one?
It just jumped out of my brain right now.
We just talked about it before.
Oh, it's parts.
Yeah.
So they want to keep always hearing this is especially from like salesman dealerships or people are trying to sell cars.
When a car gets discontinued, people are worried that they won't be able to fix it.
And the lie is there's a federal or state law or Mickey Mouse law that says car manufacturers have to keep 10 years of parts for any car that they discontinued.
Absolutely bullshit.
There's none of that.
I actually talked to a bunch of purchasing managers, the car companies.
The way that works is when a car company decides to build a car, they meet with the parts suppliers and they say, hey, this is how many parts we think we'll need to build this car for however long we're going to build it and a supply that we can then resell once these parts break.
But there is no law that says we have to keep 10 years of supply of parts.
And what ends up happening is after a number of years when the car is discontinued, the parts come from either secondary suppliers or from crashed or, you know, junkyards where those parts exist.
They do not exist in some magical warehouse that the manufacturer has to keep because of a federal law or state law of use parts.
Yeah.
Now, when there is a small caveat to that, which is safety components that are mandated by the federal government, those have to be in ready supply constantly.
So whoever, whichever automaker found someone to build that component, that safety component, we're talking airbag control switches and whatnot.
And those things, by the way, go throughout many different vehicles.
We're just talking about specific vehicles that have a specific component that's based for that car.
Yeah.
I agree with you.
As far as I know, there is no law that states that they have to manufacture those components for 10 years.
Yeah.
You keep hearing it.
People keep repeating it and it's just become one of these things, one of these urban legends.
You know, I think it may have started by just old school OEMs where they would just build a lot of extra components for cars that used to fall apart and maybe made 10 years worth.
And then it kind of flipped that on its head.
Maybe that was it.
I don't know.
And if you guys who are listening or who are watching this, if you know differently, let us know in the comments and then, you know, please let us know what that law is.
And, you know, it's easy enough to find the numbers.
There's another historical one that I've actually repeated.
So, you know, there's that, there's that, first of all, this is interesting.
There's that saying that Henry Ford would build you a Model T in any color as long as it was black.
And you'd ask what the reason for that was.
And the, and the, and the clever person, or I thought I was a clever person would say because black is the fastest drying.
Well, it turns out that's not true.
It's because black was the cheapest color.
I thought it was because his soul was dark, dark, dark, dark.
And he just basically wanted to show how dark his soul is.
Apparently it was the cheapest one.
Okay, that makes a little bit more sense.
And initially, the Model T came out in many colors.
It was only later when they, when they actually started selling to both 10 of them that they actually turned all black.
Oh, that makes sense, you know, in terms of, you know.
But you could get a red one.
You know, they look like the Chitty Chitty Bang.
Those early ones from like 1907 or 1908, they look like Chitty Chitty Bang bang cars.
And eventually they look like the one that we have at the barn.
All right.
All right.
So tell me about California.
What's the car culture like there?
You've had a lot of cars.
I've been jealous, Nathan.
I, you know, I follow you and you're driving Aston Martin.
You're driving Lamborghinis.
I am stuff that we never get here.
Yeah.
Um, so a big benefit to that, you know, it's a bum because you guys at TFL audience, if you showed more interest in these cars, I'd get more of them.
Um, but the reality is, unless it's a Camry or a pickup truck, you're like, yeah, whatever.
That's kind of our thing.
We're every person.
I'm not down on you guys.
I'm just letting you know.
But the bottom line is that you want to drive Lamborghinis in Aston Martin's.
Please start driving Lamborghinis in Aston Martin's and Ferraris.
Eventually maybe.
Um, no, it's a good thing being in Southern California.
I am in a much larger pool for vehicles, which means I can get my hands on almost anything.
It doesn't make a ton of sense for me to get these super hardcore off-roaders because there's only so many places I can go to.
Country Valley.
That's it.
Uh, no, there's a couple of places down near San Diego and I can go into the hills and whatnot.
And there's, there's places in San Dimas and whatnot, but they, there's a bit of a drive.
Yeah.
Whereas in here.
Everything's a bit of a drive.
Well, yeah, that boy, you said it.
Um, the, so the car culture there is still very much alive and well.
There are an awful lot of people there who are very unhappy with the way, you know.
Apparently, apparently you went to some cars and coffee or furries.
Tell me about this furry experience you had, Nathan.
That was such a, oh boy.
Okay.
I'll be completely honest with you guys.
I always thought that the whole furry culture was,
Let me explain.
Allow me to please.
First of all, I just want to, this is a preface this.
I thought that it was a joke or it was like an urban myth.
I really did.
And like three people did it and then spread this thing.
No, it's real.
Furries are people who like to dress up in costume, think Disney, you know, like full costume with a headdress,
which is thousands of dollars because they're unique and they actually have them specially made.
And they are in this unique outfits.
I could just keep thinking how stinky they must be after a hot day.
Yeah.
Well, and, and, and many of them do this apparently to, to meet up and get their freak on.
Uh, that, that's, that's, that's not an urban myth anymore.
Cause I saw it.
Why do they combine cars with this?
I think that's, that was, this is what happened.
So I'm kind of scrolling through and I'm trying to find like kind of unique car shows to go to
and just take a couple of shots.
What was it in the car show?
It was automotive.
Can you look, see if you can find it?
Yeah.
It was, it was automotive animal.
No, automotive animal something.
It was like ma, oh wait, motorized animal weekend.
Look at that.
I swear to God, that's, I think that's right.
And you decided that this is something you had to go to.
What was your, what's your.
Roman, you've known me for a long time.
You know, I make bad decisions.
Oh, there it is.
That's it.
That's it.
Holy cow.
God, I'm already getting flashbacks.
Okay.
If you were a furry, Nathan, what, what furry would you be?
Well, what would I be?
What animal?
What's your inner furry?
I'm rather large.
It would be like a polar bear or something like that.
There you go.
Um, whereas an Andre would be, you know, gazelle cause the Russian gazelle and you'd be a bear.
No, Andre would be a bear.
Well, yeah, Russian.
And then you'd be, you'd be like a giraffe or something like that.
I wouldn't be a giraffe.
Freaking giraffe.
Moose.
You'd be a moose.
Cause it used to be when you're doing the triathlon thing.
Are there any pictures of this?
Are there any pictures you can find on this?
I, I actually did a social media thing.
If you wanted to look at that.
Yeah.
Go to Nathan's social media.
Yeah.
It's a Facebook, Nathan Adlum journalist.
Um, so the thing is about the furries.
Okay.
Look, first of all, I'm not there.
I'm not there to cast dispersions on people because it's, it's, it's weird.
And it's something that I am not familiar with, but it was, um, that's not it.
That's a different one.
Just keep on going down.
There's, you'll see it.
Um, anyway, as, as he's looking, people can do whatever they want to do to have fun.
And they seem to be keeping to themselves.
Right.
That's fine.
My problem is I brought my wife and my teenage son to it.
That was a bad idea.
Okay.
That's all right.
That's all right.
Anyway, um, it's also on Instagram.
Uh, anyway, so this, they brought some really unusual things.
They brought some really unusual cars, which was cool.
They're like, there's like an old LaForest out there.
That's pretty crazy.
That is a pretty crazy car.
In fact, that is running.
It was in really rough shape.
Um, they're too busy spending money on their costumes.
Their costumes are expelled.
Thousands of dollars.
And they had booths there.
They had like a mini rave going on.
And it was a little weird walking around, especially because, you know, when I, when I don't dress
up, so to speak, um, I look like, I don't know, a cop or something like that.
Cause I look stern and I'm walking around and you know, they're kind of looking at me
like a, what's this dude doing here and not wearing a furry outfit.
And, um, why did you bring that picture up?
We need to talk to our producer.
Ah, okay.
Of course.
Um, anyway, um, hope that's not going out live.
So anyway, um, they, they, they brought in several different vehicles, uh, probably
about two dozen by the time I left.
Some of them were, you know, hopped up very interesting looking, uh, like a dodge, um,
challenger that had kind of a unique hood on it and some stuff like that.
Um, are you, are you doing okay buddy?
You're young.
You should be social media.
It should be no problem.
Okay.
That's fine.
Don't worry about it.
We'll just tell the story.
Yeah, that's fine.
Hey, are there any questions?
Anybody want to know about furries?
Yeah.
Look, if you're a furry and you do your thing, that's fine.
I'm only saying that I'm, I'm a stranger in a strange land.
Um, one thing I'll give you guys credit.
Another cyber truck.
I know, right?
That's what I say too.
Um, but it was, it was an interesting event and, um, we got out of it.
Your wife was there.
Yeah.
She went there with and my son and they stuck together like glue and stayed in the corner.
All right.
Let's get off the furries.
Thank you.
I honestly didn't know it was real.
Now I know it's real.
So congratulations guys.
You're real.
Let's get off the furries.
Tell me about the best car that you've had in life.
I just drove the Aston Martin DB 12 S and it was, and I can't talk about it.
It's still in her embargo, but, uh, that was, that was on, on the high end list.
Um, it was probably the rail road, the Lamborghini.
Oh my God.
That car was very volatile.
Well, well, well, well, well, well, well, I want to say in a really Italian like
accented, it's a romantic way.
Well, have you had the Timorario?
Not yet.
I was behind the wheel of one, but I haven't driven it, driven it.
Uh, but I had the Lamborghini for a few days.
I drove it around LA and it was, see, I hate those really loud colors.
Yeah.
This one was this beautiful emerald green and it had the silver wheels.
It was astonishing.
It was beautiful.
And I hang out with some guys who have some really high end cars, including Moto man.
And even he couldn't give me crap for it.
He was just like, yeah, it was really, really gorgeous.
And, um, one thing I found out about it, interesting thing.
So I was driving it down to San Diego because, you know, I had to put some miles on it.
And I was having a great time.
I had my wife in the passenger seat and I forgot.
She liked it.
No.
I didn't think she would like it.
Especially because right in front of her.
It's very tight and loud.
No, no, no, it's not that tight.
I was fine in it.
It's the most comfortable Lamborghini V12 I've ever been in.
Okay.
Which is saying something.
Okay.
But in addition, and it drove, you know, it drove pretty good.
But the thing is that she had access to this readout in front of her that showed how fast
I was going.
Oh yeah.
I tried to lie to her and say it was in kilometers.
It didn't work.
She was mad.
Um, anyway, so it's very fast and very awesome, very ostentatious.
It was just awesome.
So that is one of my favorite cars, like awesome cars that I've had.
I have to say, I got to drive that on the track in Italy and I was terrified.
You know, it's got over a thousand horsepower and we're doing a lead follow and we had an
Italian driver who of course is not going to be pussy-fitting it around.
No, no, no.
And you know, you've got this million dollar car.
It's like they're like, and they were all sold out.
They're like 900,000.
Yeah.
You're in the launch edition or whatever.
They're 200.
The one I had was $287,000.
No, not.
Yeah.
Not the Roberto.
Yeah.
No.
Yeah.
Google can't be 270.
Not the Roberto.
$287,000.
It was the Roberto.
It was.
Yeah.
I don't think so, dude.
But our men's going to look it up right now.
Look it up.
It was $817,000.
Yeah.
There you go.
That's better.
Did I turn those numbers around?
I think you turned them around.
$817,000.
It was still not a million dollars.
They started like 800.
Okay.
$817,000.
I stand corrected, but it's still not a million.
Yeah.
So anyway, but it was.
I'm not trying to, like who's right.
Yeah.
But it was still, it was still remarkable.
It's just burned into my brain because I'm on a track on this, you know, you know,
close to a million dollar car.
Let's go there.
There you go.
And I was terrified that I was going to be the one who puts it into a wall.
Ah, yeah.
And because it's got, so the way that it works, it's got that V12.
And then it's got two electric motors.
Yep.
In the front.
Yep.
And then it's actually a plug-in hybrid.
Yes.
So you can actually.
Oh, I did plug it in.
Yeah.
You can actually, and the plug is under the front trunk, which is weird.
It kind of sucks that you have to do that, but it's.
You could leave it plugged in because your front would be open.
But it means that it's a compliance vehicle in Europe.
You can legally drive it on roads that you can't drive a regular V12 on.
But the great thing about those two electric motors in the front is that you can do torque vectoring.
And so it's a real, like there are two cars that I was terrified to drive on track.
And I'm not a great track driver.
I'll be the first to admit that it's not my thing.
I like off-roading better.
But the two cars that terrified me and that turned out to be really good was the four GT 500.
Yeah.
And this car.
So the Italian driver was like, you know, how fast do you want me to go?
And I was like, slow.
And he's like, ah, go slow.
And of course he didn't.
And then every lap we did three out and then two slow.
And they kept getting faster and faster.
And I just was able to keep up with them.
And I was like, I was like, wow, this is great because I am not this good of a driver.
Because with the torque vectoring, basically the car anticipates what you want to do.
And it takes you quickly to the limit.
And I think that's probably not a great thing for like people who are really good drivers,
who want to like, I'm beating my chest and show up.
Because the car does it all for you.
So I had an opportunity to do the similar thing.
I was on Angela's Crest Highway and it was my buddy Cody's birthday.
Dude, that terrifies me.
Angela's Crest terrified me.
So we were doing, we had about seven cars and it was his birthday.
He has a Gallardo.
It was in the shop.
It's a funny irony considering it was his birthday.
So he's out there.
We had Corvettes.
We had Porsches.
We had the Lamborghini.
That's not a recipe for somebody.
No, but what I did was because I was worried about the car getting any rock chips or whatever,
I let them go way out in France so they'd clear the road.
Because you know, there's sometimes rocks that fall into the road to make sure that it was clear by the time I came through.
And I had a great time and the car, the harder I pushed it, the better it got.
And then I started freaking myself out thinking, I'm not that good.
And I'm worried that at some point in time, I'm going to exceed my capability and kill a very, very expensive car.
Or yourself.
Yeah, true.
But there's a point and that is the car is so good.
And at the same time, I thought it was pretty lively.
I like the sound it made.
Not everybody loves the car.
I absolutely adored that vehicle.
It was, and the interior, it was the beautiful upgraded one with the tan.
Very, very nice all around.
I really enjoyed it.
And the steering wheel had a million different controls.
And by the time I was done with it, I learned about a quarter of them.
So I just want to make myself clear because I sound like a wuss because I'm like, I'm terrified of, I'm not terrified of the road.
I can drive the road, but people die on that road, Nathan.
Yeah, they do.
In fact, someone died right before we went on.
A father and a son died.
Yeah, that was right.
That was the Ferrari and the tunnel.
That happened days before we went there.
Exactly.
And that's a high price to pay to go exercise your car.
No, that's a high price to pay to be an idiot.
I'm sorry, but that guy was screaming through the tunnel at over 100 miles per hour in a place that's like for 30.
And then there's people like on the other side of the tunnel knowing that this happens with cameras.
So not only do you pay the ultimate price, but you can take others with you.
But then you take his son went with him and then of course you get your face plastered all around social media.
Yeah, yeah, but that's the same for some idiot on the highway who decides to go 150 miles per hour and pass you or do wheelies in the middle of the street.
All of those guys are idiots.
The bottom line.
But if you are a good driver and you're conscious about who's around you and what you're doing, then I think that you can exercise your car to a certain degree.
So I was just watching a bunch of street racing.
So this week, my wife calls me up at this and she's got a BMW iX, right?
And she says she's driving home late at night after work and she's going down 36 right at the start.
And that federal where federal is, you know, that's not a bad neighborhood, but it's not a great neighborhood.
But people like Drag Race, so it's dark now and she calls me up and she says, what does it mean when the car says you're losing tire pressure quickly pull over?
And I'm like, what's the number?
And she says, well, it's 20.
I'm like, okay, that's okay.
And she says it's 18 and it's like 16.
I'm like, you got to pull over.
Yeah.
So she pulls over in this kind of right off of federal.
It's like, it's an industrial area.
It's an industrial area.
You know, and she pulled over in this like tire shop, actually, and she's like, maybe we could just have it done tomorrow.
And I'm like, I don't think we should leave the car there because it's dark and there's an empty parking lot.
Right.
So I'm like, you know what?
I'll come and get you.
So I call Tommy.
I'm like, hey, take the quartermaster, which we have there because that was the Silverado is being used or heavy truck is being used for a camper.
And it was Andre had it.
That's a fun video.
That's also coming up on all TFL.
Anyway, so I'm like, Tommy, come get it.
We'll load up the car.
We'll drag it home.
Right.
So he's farther away.
So I drive there and I get there and sure enough, the back rear tire is completely empty.
And I look and there's a nail or maybe a screw that's gone right through the middle of the tire.
Okay.
And I'm like, you know, that's something you could usually do with fixer flat.
And there's a gas station like two blocks down.
So I go down by a can of fixer flat, put it on there.
And these are big tires, right?
These are big, fat, like two 35s.
Right.
First of all, the fixer flat doesn't even lift it.
You know, it's like nothing.
It's like, I would have had to have like a 10 pack of that.
Yeah, seriously, like several cans.
Yeah, several cans.
And I hear coming through the little screw hole.
The whole point is that the goo that's inside is supposed to once it touches the air and all that.
Usually with the with the nail or screw, there's enough contact there between the screw and where it'll actually seal it up.
Yeah, no, this thing's not doing anything.
So I'm like, oh, as I'm doing this, this guy comes out of the shop and it was him and his son who were working in their car.
And he's like, Hey, because this is the guy who owns the tire shop.
Right.
His name was his son was, oh, he was Jorge George and his son was Louise, sweetest people in the world.
And he's like, Hey, can I help you?
And I'm like, you can.
And he's like, you know what, I could patch that for you.
And so he brings up the little jack and lifts the car up, takes the wheel off, puts the little patch and puts it back on.
And within like 10 minutes, the car was back on the road.
That's great.
Isn't that so nice?
I mean, you know, you think you're in this bad area and this great guy comes out and you know, they're working on their car.
And it just was this wonderful like experience where you kind of forget, even if you're in what you think is a sketchy area,
just how great people can be.
And I think we've lost that.
We've for some reason in the world that we're living in now, people don't trust each other anymore.
I don't trust anybody even.
But you know what I mean?
Yeah.
You know, but this guy was just like, Hey, can I help you?
And I was like, hell yeah.
And we had a good conversation and he's a huge car guy.
He's like, we started talking about side by sides and his son came out and he didn't speak great English, but his son spoke great English.
It was just a wonderful experience.
So I want to share that with you because because, you know, we're so afraid of people that aren't like us that are from a different culture.
And this was the exact opposite.
No, I mean, you're more likely to get carjacked in Beverly Hills by some angry housewife who's worth millions.
Then, you know, that can happen.
I read about it on on Reddit, I think.
All right.
Last question.
Then we'll end this because I think we've got hours.
Right over an hour, right?
Yeah.
What's this is a tough one.
But what's the car?
Well, I don't want to say the worst car, but what's the car that you've gotten where you're like, can I tell you one that that I liked and hated at the same time?
Okay.
The Volvo EX 30.
Oh, I'm with you on that one.
That is such a such a such a such a cool car that has serious issues.
The drivetrain.
Fantastic.
I mean, and I was driving the single motor, like the real base model, which is price wise comparable to like a fully loaded.
Nissan Leaf or something like that.
But no, no, I mean, it's still, it was supposed to be cheaper, but, you know, we're not going to go into the whole reason why.
But anyway, the point is, is that that single motor was great.
It drove fast.
It handled great.
I love the look of it.
I thought it looked great.
Great looking car.
Great looking car.
I drove that on a frozen lake in Sweden.
Uh huh.
I mean, that's awesome.
Yeah.
But the single motor is the one that I would think about.
And I was thinking like, maybe my wife would like that soundbar at the front.
Yeah.
That ingenious use of space.
Yeah.
For a small car, it's very, very roomy.
Then.
Then.
Yeah.
The UX.
The UX is like a screwdriver in your ear.
Yeah.
I would rather take a nail through the hand.
Yeah.
It's so unintuitive.
It is dreadful.
And that system and everything's in that screen.
Yeah.
That's your speed and everything else.
Everything.
They're trying to mirror Tesla.
They shouldn't.
I love those.
Like those little controls for the vents are so beautifully executed.
So much of this is really well done.
But unfortunately you have to do everything through that system.
Everything.
And it works with the steering wheel controls sometimes and there's other things and it
doesn't always quite work.
And you know what?
My big bugaboo now and I'll end on this and that is when these systems are designed
and large part, a lot of these European manufacturers do this for European laws,
which are much more restrictive.
Yeah, they are.
Like Ineos does this.
And they don't change the system for America.
And that was one of the reasons.
Well, Ineos did finally change a couple of things.
Finally, but like they have to have like in order to turn off ADAS in Europe, you have
to have a three step process.
Yes.
And you have to do it every single time you turn the car on and off.
And that is like two lines of code you could do.
Just say don't do this for America because we don't have that law.
Right.
And yet a lot of the time these systems are still adhering to the European regulations
and they're so frustrating, especially when they don't have to.
I would say that you're absolutely right.
And I think the our taste in cars sort of dictates simplicity first and work your way
over to more obnoxious things later on.
In terms of the Volvo, even on the base model, it was frankly far too complex to be a usable
daily driver for somebody like me.
And it's a shame because I love I think 80% of that.
Did they say this?
They're getting rid of it.
I think they stopped.
And actually I'm going to Barcelona on Saturday.
Barcelona.
To drive another Volvo.
Oh.
No longer.
No, it's not.
It's not.
It's Spain.
It's Spain.
Barcelona.
Barcelona.
I don't get that.
Be careful there, by the way.
A friend of mine was just there and he got mugged.
Like really badly mugged.
Really?
Yeah.
In Barcelona.
Penny crying in Europe.
It's up like through the roof.
It's pretty bad.
When I was there last time in Barcelona, my buddy had his passport and his wallet and
all of his airline tickets stolen.
Yeah, basically this is what happened to my friend as well, including the scooters.
And they have like these gangs and they like distract you.
Yeah.
And then the other people steal that stuff.
Oh, this was gunpoint.
This wasn't even that.
This was just like that.
They got surrounded.
Where was he at?
He was, so there's the outskirts of Barcelona where there's like this art district and just
outside of it's kind of like a little bit of a poor area and he was an idiot and he
went in there and he was on a scooter and he had his backpack and they took, basically
he was down to his shoes and shorts by the time they were done with him.
They keep the scooter?
Yeah, they took everything.
They took everything.
I'm surprised they didn't.
He wears glasses and I think he begged them not to take his glasses.
It's expensive.
Anyway, all that being said, please be careful out there, ladies and gentlemen.
And I hope to be back in the studio to do another one of these in the near future.
Yeah, it's been a great week having you here, Nathan.
We've done a lot of videos.
We did a lot.
They worked me to the bone.
Yeah.
Yeah, we got to do now.
We're going to go review the BZ and compare it to the Tesla Model Y.
That's going to be interesting.
That's next on the agenda.
So stay tuned for that video at all TFL.
And guys, thank you very much for your support.
If you're a Patreon member, you're giving this live.
If you want to get it live, if you want to get videos first, head on over to patreon.com.tflcar.
Yep.
Because we've been doing it a while.
And as always, this is Roman.
And Nathan.
Saying we'll see you next time.
Ciao.
See ya.
Bye.
About this episode
The hosts count down the fastest-selling used cars while weaving in a lot of side commentary on EVs, depreciation, and why certain models move so quickly. They bounce from the Hyundai Elantra N and Tesla Model Y to the Cybertruck, Lexus hybrids, and the Model X, mixing market data with personal ownership stories and sharp opinions. Along the way, they dig into battery health, parts-supply myths, and a few memorable road-trip and repair anecdotes.
( https://www.alltfl.com/ ) Check out our new spot to find ALL our content, from news to videos and our podcasts! In this episode, Roman and Nathan reunite to break down the latest data from iSeeCars, and the results are a total shock. While used car prices remain stubbornly high and the overall market is slowing down, certain models are vanishing from dealer lots in record time.
You’ll never guess what took the #1 spot—a vehicle often criticized for its reliability and quirky features, yet it’s currently the hottest commodity on the secondhand market. We also dive into the "death" of the flagship Teslas as production for the Model S and Model X officially winds down to make room for Optimus robots. Plus, Nathan shares some... unique observations from the West Coast, including why the "Furry Car Culture" is becoming a legitimate (and very clean) sub-section of the automotive world.
( http://www.patreon.com/tflcar ) Visit our Patreon page to support the TFL team!
