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01:10
Welcome to Unlap Gang is all here.
01:14
It's good to see you guys.
01:15
I'm sure you're both, like, exhausted.
01:18
Does anyone want to be like, no, I'm fine.
01:20
I think we're both pretty exhausted, I'm honest.
01:25
To give the listeners some context, it is the Wednesday after Abu Dhabi.
01:30
I got back on Monday.
01:31
I think Nate was a little bit later coming back.
01:33
We were trying to make sure that we weren't both in the air at the same time.
01:37
And yeah, it's a weird feeling at the end of a season like that, because the final evening
01:41
in Abu Dhabi, there's so much going on, so much to get through, so much to get excited
01:46
about, having a new champion as well.
01:49
And then you kind of get back and it all just feels a little bit flat.
01:51
But hey, good to be on the show and still loads we can talk about, even from this
01:59
Remember, if you are watching on YouTube, like this video, subscribe to the ESPN F1
02:04
You'll find content there 365 days a year from those two.
02:08
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02:11
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02:15
Is there always, I always feel like there's always like an odd let down, too, once the
02:20
season is over, like once something has come to an end, there's just always like
02:24
this big run up to the end, to the finish.
02:27
And it's like the day after Christmas, where you're just like, oh, that's it.
02:33
And I realize that no more is only for like three months, but still, like there's always
02:37
like a slight let down.
02:38
Yeah, I saw a very depressing sign on, or picture on Instagram that said, you know,
02:44
90 days still Melbourne.
02:46
And I wanted nothing to do with that for at least a few more weeks.
02:49
You know, it's, you get to the end of the season and it is, it's a weird
02:54
one because you, there's so long these seasons now.
02:56
You know, by the time we get to the conclusion, you know, it has really
03:01
I was just going back and making some notes of this season, you know, before
03:04
And there's some stuff that happened six months ago and it feels like a different
03:08
So yeah, weird, weird finish.
03:10
I hate finishing in Abu Dhabi as well.
03:11
I think that it's not, it's a race that doesn't do the season justice
03:16
Um, but yeah, I'm, I'm, I, me and Lawrence are probably in the same
03:19
boat where for the next few weeks where we're pretty happy that there's
03:22
no, uh, you know, no racing.
03:24
It's just good to get away, calm it down a bit.
03:27
And then by the time, you know, middle of January is around, we'll be
03:30
talking about testing.
03:31
So, um, people don't have to wait too long.
03:32
I think, I think there's like a selfish part of me that is bummed.
03:36
And like we all know why, like the ESPN contract has come to an end.
03:40
So like F1 is going to Apple next season.
03:42
So there is a certain amount of, um, finality to it for at least us in
03:49
Um, so I think that's where maybe part of my sense.
03:53
Depression come from, I know you guys talked about this like at
03:57
great length on Sunday, but I don't want to like do this podcast without
04:03
at least touching on the fact that the season has done Lando Norris as a
04:06
champion, you've had a few days to like digest it now.
04:10
Or have, how has sort of like the aftermath, the digestion period, how
04:16
has that sort of reshaped, refocused, given you any different
04:19
perspective as to how the whole season went down?
04:22
I think it's, it's nice that we've got a new world champion.
04:25
I think in any season when you, when you can point to multiple
04:27
drivers on the grid who have a championship behind them, that's always
04:31
That's not to say that it wouldn't have been great if Max had won it
04:33
because I think, you know, we'd have this incredible story to get
04:36
stuck into of how Red Bull turned it around.
04:38
And, you know, they still did all that work.
04:39
It's just they didn't quite pay off by two points at the end of it.
04:42
But, um, yeah, I think having Lando there is, is, is interesting.
04:45
I think he's going to bring like a kind of fresh perspective on all that.
04:48
Nate wrote a brilliant piece for anyone who hasn't been checking the website
04:52
this week about why Lando is a very different champion to previous ones.
04:56
You know, he's very open about stuff.
04:58
I think that was very evident from his champion's press conference
05:02
where you would ask him one question and he would give you
05:05
about four different answers on completely different things,
05:09
asking himself questions about where he went wrong and when he had
05:14
self-doubt and stuff like this and just being incredibly open about that.
05:17
And I suspect Lando will actually continue that and perhaps double down
05:21
now that he has the championship behind him.
05:23
We saw a lot of nervous energy on, you know, in the weekend before
05:27
or the two weekends before stealing that championship.
05:30
So I think going into a new year will be interesting what he's like.
05:32
So in a way, I think it's it's a very positive thing for the sport
05:36
that we got a different champion and also good to see that he wore
05:39
a kind of gold helmet at that Abu Dhabi test on Tuesday,
05:43
just kind of signifying that he was the champion.
05:45
And then next year, he's already said that he's going to run the number one
05:48
in his car as well, which I think is always cool seeing that number one
05:50
move between cars and teams.
05:54
Yeah, I always felt sorry for Lewis Hamilton's mechanics.
05:55
You know, he only gave them a couple of runouts with that number one
05:58
on the car. Yeah, I think I'd echo everything Lawrence said.
06:01
I think what's nice as well from a what's great about getting a new
06:04
champion is, you know, I mentioned this on the pod we did the other night.
06:08
It's going to surely going to lead to a more fired up Mac Verstappen.
06:11
You know, you've been champion for four years.
06:13
You want to come back and reclaim that championship.
06:15
But there was also a sense I got that Charles Leclerc and George Russell,
06:18
especially, saw for the first time somebody from their generation,
06:23
you know, winning. I know they're not too dissimilar in age for Max,
06:25
but, you know, came into Formula One, you know, 2018 and 2019,
06:30
those two guys and Lando came in 2019 with Russell.
06:33
I think it was the first time those guys had seen that tangibly of like
06:36
one of our guys is now winning the championship.
06:39
That does something to the rest of the grid as well.
06:41
You know, it gives people an incentive to to go and win it themselves.
06:46
And yeah, I think I think it almost makes it steam attainable in some ways,
06:50
because I think for a long time, Max was just sort of running away with it.
06:54
And Red Bull was on this, this pedestal, this mountain top.
06:57
And before that, let's be honest, it was Mercedes.
07:00
And there seems to be a changing of the guard in some respects.
07:04
And it does make it seem more attainable for the other guys,
07:08
because Lewis Hamilton is regarded as one of the greatest to ever do it.
07:12
And Max Verstappen is regarded as one of the greatest to ever do it.
07:16
So when there is a new guy there who is just the new guy,
07:20
it sort of normalizes it a little bit.
07:22
Not that any of us could go out and win the World Championship,
07:25
but there is a sort of like a normalization to it when it is somebody new.
07:29
Yeah, I think so. Yeah.
07:30
No, that's really a good way of putting it, normalization side to it.
07:33
And I think as well, it's made a lot of those guys realize, you know,
07:38
you don't necessarily get many opportunities to win it.
07:44
You know, Charles Leclerc was very interesting on Sunday in Abu Dhabi.
07:48
He hinted that the first kind of five, six races next year absolutely key for him.
07:52
You know, you can read into that how you want.
07:55
Obviously, he's looking at his own title winning ambitions there.
08:00
And yeah, and next season suddenly becomes very important with a new rule change.
08:05
So yeah, I think it's brought that not that it's never front of mind for those guys,
08:08
but I get the impression that for a lot of them, it's now
08:12
I think, Nicole, the way you said it's perfect, it feels attainable.
08:15
It's a tangible goal.
08:16
You know, when when when Schumacher stop winners championships in Alonzo did,
08:20
it was like, oh, wow, someone else can win titles
08:21
when Hamilton was beaten by Verstappen.
08:24
It was like, you know, someone else other than Mercedes can win titles.
08:27
So it does it does have that galvanizing effect for sure.
08:32
I want to take a look back at some of the things
08:34
that we saw this season and sort of just like pick our favorite moments
08:37
and things like that in terms of the best races for a win.
08:44
And they're also pretty recent.
08:46
But I mean, you go back to Austin and Austin was sort of the moment
08:50
when you looked at Max Verstappen and thought.
08:53
This is real because he had had that super dominant weekend.
08:57
It was it was pole.
08:59
It was the sprint race.
09:00
It was the actual race itself.
09:02
And he started to admit, yeah, I am in the title fight.
09:07
And that's sort of I think the moment where it truly became a three man race.
09:13
And then also then you look at Mexico.
09:17
If we got to the end where we did where Landau was the champion,
09:21
you can't overlook Mexico.
09:24
And just how dominant he was on a completely different level,
09:28
like a different planet, like he won by 30 seconds or something obscene.
09:32
That was sort of the weekend where, yes, he Landau was good in Austin.
09:37
He didn't get the win, but he was good in Austin.
09:39
And there were some sort of like, you know, team dynamics at play
09:42
where I think going into that weekend, we thought this could be favoring Oscar.
09:47
And when Landau came out of Austin and wasn't the one that was sort of
09:52
behind, you know, the eight ball and then went from there to Mexico
09:56
and did what he did in Mexico.
09:57
I think you have to look at those two races as best race win
10:01
to put him in the position that he was in at the end of the season
10:04
to actually win the championship.
10:05
Yeah, I think it was a fair.
10:07
I think, yeah, I think by the same, I mean, yeah, Landau in Mexico
10:11
was his best race, probably of the season, from what I can remember.
10:14
It was classic Landau, you know, when everything was in those conditions,
10:18
you know, he was great.
10:19
You know, I think Landau does need the car to be in a certain place.
10:21
But when it was like that, then, you know, he was spectacular.
10:24
I was actually going to go left field here.
10:26
I thought I'd be smart and I was going to put Max Verstappen
10:29
but him at the Nürburgring, not that we will watch the race,
10:32
but in winning the sports car race, it in between, it should be noted
10:37
winning in Monza and winning in Baku, which were two wins
10:40
that basically revived his season.
10:42
The fact that he then even had the the mind and the, you know,
10:46
the motivation to then go and race at the Nordschleife
10:50
and just, you know, everything associated with that in terms of aura.
10:54
I think it's to be honest, that's that three week spell.
10:57
I think it's probably the best three weeks
10:58
any Formula One drivers had for years.
11:00
But I just thought I'd be smart and cheeky and put that one in
11:03
because so rare you see a driver do that
11:06
and race outside of Formula One to do it like Max did.
11:08
I think it kind of added to this mystique of his season, didn't it?
11:11
Of like, not only is he
11:14
making McLaren pull their hair out,
11:16
he's also just gone and had this insane weekend
11:18
out possibly the most daunting circuit in the world.
11:21
So either I'll be cheeky and and put an asterisk next to mine.
11:26
Yeah, I didn't wonder why Nate had slipped in best race win
11:30
into our run plan before we started.
11:32
And it's because he had a great answer.
11:33
I just thought it was missing and then I suddenly was like, I can be super.
11:38
Now, I mean, that's a that's a really good answer.
11:40
But I was actually going to pick a Max one as well,
11:42
as in the best race win by any single driver this year
11:46
and look back right to the start of the year
11:48
and probably pick Suzuka.
11:49
There's Suzuka and Imola, two races that he won.
11:52
But I'd say Suzuka wasn't a fantastic race by any stretch of
11:55
it was probably one of the most boring races of the year.
11:58
But the fact that Max went and stuck it on pole position there
12:02
with a car that was really not behaving as it should do or to his liking
12:07
and against two McLarens that were incredibly well sorted,
12:10
had had a huge amount of successful development over the winter
12:14
and had basically turned up, you know, some way ahead of the rest of the field
12:18
for Max to go and just put the flag in the sand there.
12:21
Just make sure he got one victory early in the season.
12:25
You know, it as is the case, as he points out at the end of the year,
12:29
actually, you know, like all your results across the year are as important as as another.
12:33
But but that was one way with all the odds were really stacked against him.
12:36
And he just did what Max was up and does and put in an amazing qualifying lap
12:40
that then allowed him to control the race from the front.
12:42
I was going to consider Suzuka as well.
12:44
But then I thought that was actually more the pole.
12:47
And it wasn't necessarily the race because the pole led to the race
12:50
because there wasn't a lot of passing.
12:51
There wasn't a lot of opportunity there.
12:53
But that pole, that was the moment.
12:55
Who was it? Was it Alonzo in the pen who just literally stopped talking
13:00
because he had seen what Max did to put the car on pole and was like,
13:07
But I thought that that was more like a qualifying thing and less of a race thing.
13:11
So I took it off my list.
13:13
That's fair. I mean, it was it was entirely because of the pole position
13:17
that he managed to do that. But I think, you know, when you look at these victories,
13:21
it is just so much that comes together to put the car on the right.
13:24
Well, in that case, the car wasn't in the right place,
13:26
but to put the car on pole position.
13:28
Yeah, I mean, it's yeah, that's fair.
13:30
Yeah, this is turning into a match of staff.
13:34
It's a love fest, but I mean, so Lawrence mentioned Imola
13:38
and until he mentioned it, I hadn't that just slipped my mind.
13:41
But that if we haven't got it on our own plan,
13:43
but that's that start was unbelievable at Imola
13:47
when it went around the outside of Russell and Piastri.
13:49
And you know, it's good when a Max Verstappen move.
13:52
I was actually looking back through this when we wrote our review of the season.
13:55
George Russell said that's the best overtake I've seen in a long time.
13:58
You know, when you're George Russell saying that about Max Verstappen,
14:00
you know, it's pretty special.
14:01
So Max Verstappen, from what I can tell from what we're doing here,
14:07
pretty much the candidate for the best, the best racing driver of the season.
14:09
If he didn't win the championship.
14:12
Yeah, probably. I agree.
14:13
Do you have a favorite podium performance?
14:15
Because there actually are a few.
14:17
One that I think for me is the stat.
14:20
Probably the best podium for a long time.
14:22
That's Hülkenberg at Silverstone.
14:23
I thought that was so great to see.
14:26
You know, it was such a such a long, long time.
14:29
And to be honest with you, that stat of him not having the podiums
14:33
and never, you know, most starts, you'd kind of forgotten
14:36
that he could even score a podium.
14:38
It was kind of like, well, he's never he's never going to do it.
14:40
And then suddenly he's running in third
14:41
and we were we were sat next to each other in the media center.
14:43
Lawrence and I in Silverstone.
14:45
And there's a moment where I looked at him
14:46
and I was like, he's he and Lawrence has already worked this out
14:49
because Lawrence is better at reading a race than me.
14:51
I was like, I was going to do this, isn't he?
14:53
And I was like, yeah, yeah, I think so.
14:55
And it was I was like, I can't believe it.
14:56
And it was actually, you know, sometimes you
15:01
there's sometimes you're like, I want this result
15:02
because this driver deserves it or whatever.
15:04
As those laps were taken down, I was like, please do not mess this up
15:08
or don't have this something happen that takes us away.
15:11
And obviously all the focus on Hülkenberg, but also.
15:14
And this is something that, you know,
15:16
I think Salba generally got overlooked quite a lot in Formula One.
15:19
That was such a nice way for them to mark their final season in Formula One.
15:23
You know, obviously it's now Audi,
15:25
but for Salba to get that podium, you know, they they always have been kind of
15:28
the they were kind of the ugly duckling a little bit of grid.
15:31
I always felt they were they were a small team,
15:33
but they never really performed in a way that got people excited.
15:36
They had a couple of title partnerships over the years that didn't really,
15:40
you know, didn't really lead to anything stepping forward.
15:43
So for Hülkenberg to do it and for it to be with Salba,
15:46
really, really nice story and a genuinely,
15:49
a genuinely kind of, you know, feel good moment.
15:53
And yeah, I was just watching it back again.
15:54
And, you know, it's the only the only sad bit of it for him.
15:57
And I do take umbrage, but this now I look back on it is
16:00
McLaren completely ignoring him on the podium,
16:02
which does not look good when you look back at it.
16:05
I think they don't think they meant to, but you look at it now
16:08
and you're like as a as a visual, it's such a shame
16:10
because he's kind of there spraying champagne on his own.
16:13
But selfishly, sorry, I'm taking ages to answer this one.
16:17
I went down to the Salba garage and hospitality after that
16:20
and kind of got a bit of champagne sprayed like all over me
16:24
while I was down there.
16:25
So that also has a personal kind of resonance as well.
16:28
But I think it's hard to talk about.
16:31
Yeah, it is hard to be that one, isn't it?
16:32
I'd say honourable mentions for Isaac Hadjar in in Zambor.
16:37
I think that was a great moment.
16:39
And then Carlos Sainz's two podiums for Williams,
16:42
which, you know, if we'd rewind to the start of the season
16:44
to say that Carlos Sainz was going to be getting podiums in Baku.
16:48
But then perhaps a more impressive one in Qatar,
16:49
because it's not a circuit that in theory
16:52
they should have been particularly competitive up.
16:54
So those are good ones.
16:56
And then, yeah, just we've got a theme going here with Max.
16:59
But I was thinking like which podium was really important
17:02
for the title race and Max's podium in Brazil.
17:05
I thought was a was a particularly special one,
17:08
but also one that kind of just kept it alive
17:10
going into the final three races, which was important as well.
17:14
And I had that great on board of Ocon.
17:17
Was it Ocon, Nicole?
17:18
I think you you flagged it where they started
17:20
it was Ocon. It's the onboard.
17:22
Max just disappearing through the field.
17:25
Yeah, unbelievable.
17:28
Yeah, he was like, wait for me.
17:32
No, no, it's like I totally agree.
17:34
I don't think you can overlook the Hulkenberg
17:35
moment in terms of not just for the team,
17:39
but also just for him and just having that moment.
17:43
And I think one of the things that I really like the most
17:45
about when you have those moments
17:47
and we saw it with Lando winning the championship,
17:49
how the other teams and drivers respond, you know,
17:52
Sauber didn't have enough champagne.
17:55
So teams were, you know, handing over the champagne
17:58
and the drivers responses.
17:59
And that's like the heart of the story.
18:03
That's the feel good, the emotional connection
18:05
and those are the moments to me
18:07
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20:24
Did you guys have a favorite rookie?
20:25
Like for me, for me, it's Antonelli.
20:29
For, I think, a lot of reasons.
20:31
One, you've got this kid who comes in
20:34
considered in a lot of ways like a generational talent,
20:36
but he's also just that.
20:39
To be able to handle the pressure,
20:41
the ups and the downs, the expectations
20:44
to be the guy who replaced Lewis Hamilton.
20:48
Just the amount that was resting
20:50
on his 18-year-old shoulders throughout the season.
20:54
In a lot of ways, live up to those expectations
20:57
and to take a car that, you know,
20:59
his teammate won a couple of races, fine,
21:02
but there were moments, you picked him to win a race.
21:05
I mean, it was not out of the realm of possibility,
21:08
but then there were also moments
21:09
like with him saying sorry to Max, you know,
21:12
and how he had to deal with the online bullying
21:14
and then, you know, Max lost the championship
21:15
by two points and essentially there were the two points.
21:17
If you want to look at it that, you know,
21:20
Kimi gave up in Qatar,
21:23
you cannot take those two points
21:24
and boil it down to one single moment,
21:26
but just the human side of him going up to Max
21:28
and being like, I'm sorry.
21:31
He's an impressive young man, seemingly on the track
21:36
So for that, he is my favorite rookie,
21:39
not to just count what Isaac Hadjar did.
21:43
I think, you know, from race one,
21:45
where he crashed before they even took, you know,
21:48
the green flag and had to overcome all of that
21:50
and then put together the season he had,
21:52
that's not overlooking him.
21:53
There's just, I think you just developed this soft spot
21:56
for Antonelli and I'm going to go with it.
21:59
Yeah, I'd say Kimi as well.
22:02
I think, yeah, for all the reasons you outlined,
22:04
just very likable kid
22:06
and probably had the highest pressure, highest stakes.
22:10
It would also be bias if I said Berman
22:12
because he's from Chelmsford,
22:14
which is just down the road from where I grew up.
22:18
And I quite often go on BBC Essex to talk about him.
22:20
So I've got it, you know,
22:22
there's a link there with Berman,
22:23
but I think this rookie season is going to go down
22:26
in history, isn't it?
22:27
Just unbelievable talent.
22:28
Portoletto was great as well.
22:30
But if we're saying favorites, hard to pass Kimi,
22:32
you know, you just want to root for that guy
22:34
and you just want to see him doing well.
22:37
Yeah, I'd agree Kimi is an incredibly likable guy.
22:39
I really was quite a big fan of his going into the season.
22:42
I managed to sit down with him last year
22:44
and already kind of like realized that this guy was,
22:46
you know, superstar in the making,
22:48
not just because of Wake doing a car,
22:49
but also how he acted and how he talked away from it.
22:52
So I'm also a big Kimi fan,
22:55
but I think Hajar probably is the one
22:58
who exceeded expectations the most.
23:01
I mean, I don't think any of us had on our 2025 bingo card
23:05
that he would be promoted to Red Bull the following season.
23:08
And that is in part because of how badly it's gone
23:12
for the drivers who have been in that second seat
23:13
alongside Max Stappen,
23:15
but it shouldn't take away from the results
23:17
that he's put together.
23:18
So I think Hajar is perhaps the most impressive
23:21
when you just stand back and look at it.
23:23
But I think the real unsung hero here is Bortoletto,
23:26
Gabrielle Bortoletto,
23:28
going into a sour team that has a lot of change going on.
23:33
You know, Karl really wasn't very good at the start of the year,
23:35
but then did go a lot better towards the end of the year.
23:39
And his performance over a single lap
23:41
versus Nico Halkenberg,
23:42
who has always been a great qualifier,
23:46
was really quite impressive.
23:48
I think they more or less ended up equal over the season
23:51
on qualifying stats,
23:53
but I'd say for a driver to come in as a rookie
23:58
with a pretty difficult car
24:00
and to beat someone seasoned as Halkenberg in
24:03
or get close to someone seasoned as Halkenberg
24:05
in the same car, that is hugely impressive.
24:08
And I don't think Hajar really had
24:11
the same teammate comparison.
24:13
And that's not against him.
24:14
You know, he can only beat the guy
24:16
that he's up against.
24:17
And I think if you look at Antoinette's record,
24:19
you know, understandably, it's quite a long way off George.
24:22
But that's why I think Bortoletto,
24:23
there's a really good case for saying
24:24
that he was the best rookie this year.
24:29
Yeah, it's a hard one to rank actually.
24:33
It's a hard one to rank
24:34
because there were so many rookies too.
24:36
But they all had...
24:37
And they all had...
24:38
And they all have a great case as well,
24:39
which is actually so rare.
24:41
Usually you have, oh, this guy stood out
24:43
and this guy kind of looked pretty terrible,
24:45
but yeah, they all had a moment.
24:46
And I think all four of those guys
24:49
are going to be in Formula One for a long, long time,
24:50
which I think is awesome.
24:54
You know, 10 years from now,
24:54
you could come back to this and be like,
24:56
remember the 2025 class of rookies?
24:58
These guys, you know, there are...
25:01
Like you were talking earlier with Lando and George
25:04
and in Charlotte coming into the sport
25:05
at relatively the same time,
25:08
when and if those guys become champions,
25:09
you go back to the season in which they entered.
25:11
Like that could happen again with the 2025 season.
25:14
Do you have a favorite, Lawrence?
25:16
Like season-long storyline?
25:21
It's gonna sound like a broken record here,
25:22
but I was thinking about this
25:23
and the best storyline to follow
25:26
was Max Verstappen's turnaround
25:29
and getting back into the title fight
25:32
because if you'd asked us,
25:34
basically after the Dutch Grand Prix,
25:36
we would have said, you know,
25:38
Oscar Piatru is by far the favorite.
25:39
Lando's got a chance if he can get the results together
25:42
if something goes wrong for Oscar.
25:44
But I don't think many of us would have picked out Max
25:46
and the fact that he made it a three-way title battle
25:49
into the final race was absolutely brilliant.
25:52
So I couldn't really look past that
25:54
because that is the thing that has got me most excited
25:57
as this season has progressed
25:58
is the fact that we do have,
25:59
or we did have three drivers fighting for the title.
26:04
I think, so yes, I agreed.
26:08
I think for me that the favorite season-long storyline
26:11
is the fact that there was a championship battle,
26:14
you know, coming off a few seasons
26:15
in which the championship was almost a foregone conclusion.
26:18
There was a slight battle last year
26:20
where Lando sort of put himself in a position
26:22
to question it ever so slightly.
26:25
But, you know, Max still clinched the title
26:27
in Las Vegas a season ago.
26:28
That's still well before the season ends.
26:31
So the fact that there was a championship battle
26:34
this year between two drivers,
26:36
let alone three at the end,
26:38
and there were question marks as to who it was gonna be.
26:41
There were points in the season
26:43
where different drivers led the championship.
26:46
To me, just having that
26:48
and having that be a part of the conversation
26:50
weekend and week out and not really knowing.
26:52
I mean, we hadn't gone into the final race of the season
26:55
where there were more than two title contenders
26:59
So to have that be an element of surprise
27:04
and what's gonna happen in a season
27:07
in which maybe some of the racing,
27:08
like you guys talked about earlier,
27:10
like maybe some of the racing on track wasn't the best,
27:13
to have questions about who would be the champion
27:15
made it a hell of a lot more fun and dramatic.
27:19
I was gonna say Max or the championship.
27:21
So there was one I'm gonna throw in there.
27:24
I think, I do think that in the grand scheme of things,
27:27
nothing for a while is gonna beat the Max season.
27:30
I'm gonna keep it in the Red Bull family
27:31
and I'm gonna give some props to Liam Lawson
27:34
for kind of reviving his own fall-in-one career,
27:37
kind of saving it from the brink
27:39
because I think Lawrence and I were both there in Suzuka.
27:42
He looked kind of broken when he got demoted so quickly.
27:44
I mean, that was pretty much just humiliating as it gets.
27:48
Two races at the top team.
27:50
I thought he dealt with it very, very well
27:52
and actually kind of seeing him rebuild that season,
27:56
rebuild himself, get himself to a position
27:59
where not only was he performing well
28:01
but racing balls and Red Bull have decided
28:03
to keep him around for another season.
28:05
Yeah, I thought that was nice.
28:06
I thought it was, you know, it was,
28:08
I didn't wanna see a great promising talent like that
28:12
just kind of thrown on the trash heap, so to speak.
28:16
So not obviously one that captured a lot of attention
28:19
in the headlines but just as a nod to it,
28:22
thought it was very nice to see that.
28:23
And yeah, full credit to him for being able to do that.
28:27
I mean, it's an interesting one
28:28
because had he not been chucked out of Red Bull
28:32
after two races, I don't think,
28:33
and he'd stayed there the whole season,
28:35
I don't think he'd be in F1 next year.
28:37
I think we'd be talking probably about Yuki
28:39
in the Red Bull going into 26.
28:41
You know, I would have thought Yuki would have
28:42
to measure a visor across the whole year.
28:44
Maybe not, maybe Hajar would have shone through
28:47
and still taken that seat.
28:48
But I think that was such a big moment
28:51
and we were quite critical of Red Bull
28:54
for ditching a driver after two races
28:57
not giving him the chance to get back in it.
28:59
But if you look at it retrospectively,
29:01
then it does seem as though
29:04
that was the thing that actually saved Lawson's career.
29:07
Obviously, conversely, it's probably buried to nodders.
29:10
I mean, now he's a reserved driver,
29:12
so he's still there to put pressure on whoever's
29:14
struggling next year within the Red Bull fold.
29:16
But yeah, I think it's a really like key moment there
29:22
for Lawson if he goes on to have a, you know,
29:24
more successful career beyond this
29:27
that he actually got dropped by Red Bull was a key thing.
29:29
But then, you know, we've seen that a number of times,
29:31
haven't we, Pierre Gasly, Alex Albon,
29:33
drivers that seem to be broken coming out
29:35
of the Red Bull racing team
29:38
and have gone on to have impressive careers elsewhere.
29:42
I mean, we've said it about Sergio Perez too.
29:44
Like there were parts of us last season
29:46
where we were like, what the hell is wrong with this guy?
29:48
And this season, we're looking at it a little differently.
29:51
Like suddenly he doesn't look so bad anymore.
29:53
In fact, suddenly he looks great.
29:54
And maybe not that, you know,
29:56
that irrelevant as a fact.
29:59
I'm sure Lee of Lawson has probably thought about this.
30:01
Can you imagine in Japan, pointing at Lee of Lawson
30:04
and say, that guy is going to outlast Helmut Marco
30:08
and Christian Horner within the Red Bull company.
30:11
You know, the two guys that both promoted him
30:13
and then sat him down and said, you're out.
30:15
They're both now gone.
30:17
And that maybe speaks to some of the chaos
30:19
around the decisions around, you know,
30:21
his career and your right, Nicole,
30:22
around the Czecho decision around, you know,
30:25
Limblad, I think Limblad's coming up too early,
30:27
you know, the rookie coming up now.
30:29
And there's, you know,
30:29
we'll talk about Marco in a little bit.
30:30
There seems to be a link there.
30:32
So yeah, you know, within that mess of Red Bull,
30:35
it's good that he's survived.
30:37
And I'm sure that, you know,
30:39
he'll reflect on that irony at some point,
30:42
you know, over the off season.
30:43
Cause yeah, I don't think anyone would have put it
30:44
to that in a million years.
30:46
Favorite race of the season,
30:48
not for what happened on the track,
30:50
not for like a storyline, just selfish reasons.
30:53
Favorite race of the season.
30:56
Oh, it could be a race you got to stay home.
30:58
I would, no, I would say Austin,
30:59
you know, all of us being together and Austin was great.
31:02
Austin is just, for me, is the best race
31:05
that we go to a former one.
31:07
You know, I love that one.
31:10
Obviously you mentioned it in the cold as well,
31:12
you know, it was kind of the last one we're doing
31:14
as big as ESPN does it.
31:15
So yeah, that was, that was pretty, pretty special.
31:17
And I think we got to do that podcast
31:19
where I sat on top of a bull as well,
31:21
which was pretty memorable.
31:23
I'm not going to top that ever in my career.
31:25
So from a selfish reason,
31:28
I can't look past that.
31:30
Not that just to clarify the people listening,
31:31
it wasn't a real one, sadly,
31:32
but everyone who's seen my WhatsApp profile picture,
31:35
which is that, like how did you get-
31:36
It had been a real bull.
31:38
It had been, oh yeah, yeah,
31:39
it looked like a very healthy bull at one point.
31:42
But yeah, and I'm just sat on top of it.
31:45
And so many people on my WhatsApp are like,
31:47
how did you manage to get on top?
31:50
oh my guys, I don't know who you think I am.
31:53
My cowboy skills are not that good.
31:54
But yeah, that was that,
31:55
just that whole weekend was pretty special, I think.
31:59
Yeah, that's a very good shout.
32:02
I'm not sure I'll forget Las Vegas for a while.
32:04
I don't know whether it's because it's my favorite,
32:06
but it was certainly memorable,
32:07
just the chaos that ensued
32:10
when we got the note proof from the FIA
32:13
that both McLaren's were under investigation.
32:16
I don't know what that says about me,
32:21
I think you enjoy the drama.
32:22
Yeah, the drama pretty much.
32:24
But Vegas is always quite a fun one, actually.
32:26
Again, we were all together there, so that was good.
32:30
But I can't argue with Nate.
32:31
Austin was really fun this year, wasn't it?
32:34
Yeah, Austin was fun, Vegas was fun,
32:36
I think for me personally of those three,
32:38
because those are the only three I get to go to.
32:42
I think I liked Miami the best.
32:47
Didn't you and I, actually you and I, Lawrence,
32:49
we got thrown on, the race ended early,
32:52
there was some questions about rain or whatever,
32:53
and then you and I, the last minute,
32:55
you guys have to go on ABC to help fill time
32:57
for three minutes because local news
33:01
and the world was tonight or something,
33:05
we're not, they're not ready, so you guys have to go.
33:08
So it was a fair amount of chaos at the end.
33:11
So selfishly, I think I might go Miami
33:13
as being my favorite race of the season.
33:16
This last one, though, this one feels mean,
33:19
I'm not gonna lie, worst driver of the year.
33:24
This was an eight saunders edition, so later on,
33:26
I just, I felt like we had a lot of bests, didn't we?
33:30
Bestest, best that.
33:32
I was just jotting things down
33:33
that I thought were in the rundown.
33:36
I mean, to me, just given the hype around him
33:39
and given the fact that he also replaced the driver
33:43
that I think kind of got a bad rap,
33:45
you know, it was hard done by,
33:47
Cola Pinto was probably the standout guy
33:49
that just didn't perform across the season.
33:52
But to cut him some slack,
33:55
Alpine wasn't exactly a car he could thrive in,
33:58
but you've got to beat your teammate,
33:59
at least, he'll be close
34:00
and Cola Pinto's just never looked that close.
34:02
So I think he was actually quite lucky
34:03
to stay on for another season.
34:05
That would be my question.
34:06
The way you started that is that you feel sorry
34:08
for the guy who replaced,
34:09
I thought you were gonna say Lewis, but...
34:11
Oh no, well, Lewis, Lewis could be,
34:15
I mean, Lewis did win a sprint race,
34:16
but maybe he's the obvious one.
34:21
I think he's the most disappointing driver of the 2025.
34:24
My worst driver, I just went back and looked at,
34:27
you know, versus teammate qualifying performance
34:29
and other stats like that and 15 Q1 eliminations
34:33
and that was Lance Stroll.
34:34
But I have to say, going into the season,
34:37
I may have predicted some of those.
34:39
I mean, certainly Alonzo would beat him across the season
34:42
and there were a few highlights for Stroll,
34:45
you know, you got a few seven place finishes.
34:47
I think there was one in Silverstone,
34:49
Sandvore, Springs to Mind.
34:50
So, you know, there were highlights as well.
34:52
But then, that's with Lewis, you know,
34:54
Lewis had those high points,
34:55
but the end of the year especially was just so disappointing.
34:59
So in terms of just disappointment
35:00
because my expectations are understandably very high
35:03
for a seven-time world champion, I'd say Lewis.
35:06
But sorry, I don't wanna steal your thunder there, Nicole.
35:07
I feel like I've already just stolen your...
35:09
Like, I think there is a difference
35:12
between worst driver and most disappointing driver.
35:18
So you can make the argument for Colopinto,
35:21
you can make the argument for Stroll.
35:24
I just kind of can't, I love Lewis.
35:26
Don't get me wrong, I love Lewis.
35:27
I love what he has done for the sport.
35:29
I love what he has done for the sport away from the sport.
35:33
I think he's one of the greatest of all time.
35:39
But because of that and the expectation,
35:42
seeing him in red and the expectations
35:44
that we had for him going into the season
35:45
and the expectations I think we all had for Ferrari,
35:48
the way that they finished last season
35:50
going into this season,
35:51
having both of those drivers there
35:54
and then to just have Lewis not do anything.
35:59
He was outperformed Lila Claire,
36:01
the majority of the season.
36:03
Yes, you could talk about the sprint race win
36:05
in China all you want, but it's a sprint race win.
36:08
Yes, points are awarded
36:09
and it probably comes down to a little bit
36:12
at the end of the season for the champion.
36:14
But if you were looking at Ferrari,
36:17
you wanted so much more for Lewis.
36:20
You expected so much more for Lewis.
36:22
You expected so much more for Ferrari
36:25
and it just never happened.
36:26
And then you look at the way it ended
36:28
and how Lewis was going about
36:33
and how he was speaking every time he was knocked out
36:37
and in Q1, there was just like,
36:41
it was like a gut punch every time.
36:44
And it's just, it's hard to shake.
36:45
So while I don't think he's the worst driver by any means,
36:49
I think I just can't, I personally can't shake
36:51
the disappointment that came with what we were hoping for.
36:55
You know, even if he didn't win a race,
36:57
he wasn't on the podium.
36:59
Yeah, and he seemed, he was so far from our
37:02
kind of memories of what Lewis Hamilton is as well.
37:05
You know, so I think that actually,
37:07
if you were, if you're judging it based on,
37:10
I think Lawrence made a good point there
37:12
with Lance Joel, like the expectation is kind of there
37:15
that he's not going to beat Alonzo that often.
37:17
The expectation for Lewis was sky high
37:19
and he, if it was worst in terms of your expectations,
37:24
pre and post, I think it's probably Lewis.
37:27
But yeah, he at least had a few moments where he looked,
37:30
he looked at least, you know, semi-decent,
37:31
but do you think Ferrari have had this conversation?
37:34
Like the higher ups of like, is this guy this bad?
37:37
Like, do we need to think about what we do after 26?
37:40
Because Oli Berman looks pretty...
37:42
I don't know, you wrote the book on Ferrari, you tell us.
37:44
Well, I'm saying, you know, Oli Berman looks pretty...
37:47
Oli Berman looks pretty good right now, you know.
37:49
As you sit there, obviously, he's only had one season,
37:52
but that's the alarming thing if you're Ferrari
37:55
is suddenly you spent, you know, all this money on Lewis
37:58
and he just doesn't look that good.
37:59
But he has always said 26 is the year to judge him on.
38:02
I still think that is going to be the case,
38:04
but you know, if anything,
38:07
he's reset the expectations now to be pretty low.
38:10
And that might help him next year.
38:11
Who knows in terms of, you know, how he looks, but...
38:14
But yeah, I think Lewis is a fair answer.
38:17
If Ferrari are thinking that,
38:19
then they've got their priorities entirely wrong.
38:22
But this is Ferrari, right?
38:24
So you could imagine they are thinking...
38:25
It's the seven-time world champion
38:27
who we couldn't, you know, build a car
38:29
that was competitive enough for him
38:30
and the car which he actually won a race in,
38:32
where it turns out it was illegal
38:34
when it got to the Grand Prix.
38:35
I mean, I think, you know, Ferrari
38:36
needs to have quite a good hard look at themselves
38:39
before they're pointing the finger directly at Lewis.
38:41
But I think, you know...
38:42
But Lewis was very clear about that, didn't he?
38:44
Pretty much, she pointed the finger at Lewis.
38:46
Yeah, yeah, he did, yeah.
38:47
Right, let's talk less and drive away.
38:50
Yeah, yeah, which was surprising,
38:54
especially as most of the stuff Lewis was saying
38:55
was criticizing himself.
38:57
You know, I think he was actually very, very open
39:00
throughout the year about how poor a job
39:02
he felt he was doing.
39:04
But you know, I think there's deeper problems there.
39:08
Then the quality of a seven-time world champion
39:11
in the car is my opinion.
39:12
But anyway, we'll see if they solve them, make sure.
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42:02
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["Ski and Snowboard"]
42:14
Can one of you guys sing,
42:15
we are the champion?
42:17
And then just be like,
42:17
Nicole is the champion.
42:20
Make a little bit of sense to do that.
42:25
So down the stretch, I always had to go first.
42:27
I had to, I had to,
42:28
and then you guys just copied each other's picks.
42:30
So you played it safe.
42:34
Laz and I had like the same picks.
42:36
If you go back and listen,
42:37
we had very similar picks from week one.
42:40
That's why I started writing them down
42:42
and like showing you.
42:43
Yeah, that's proof.
42:44
This is what I got.
42:44
No, no, I think you had the lead all season
42:47
as well pretty much, so you've-
42:48
Well, when you are the worst,
42:50
you should have to go first.
42:51
That is sort of like, you know,
42:53
the price you pay for bringing up the rear.
42:56
Okay, I think we did it differently in previous years,
42:58
but that's fine, you know, rules change.
42:59
But also, Nate, you can't blame us for the quality of it.
43:02
If you were going first,
43:04
like you had freedom-
43:06
No, I'm saying, I made picks that you guys were like,
43:11
well, I'm going to go safer than this.
43:13
Maybe I was being too,
43:14
I think I was being too risky at the end,
43:16
but I'm just kind of-
43:17
I had my picks written down
43:19
before you even started for the record.
43:21
My picks were written down.
43:23
Anyway, final standings,
43:25
Nate with all of 12 points,
43:27
Laz with 16, me with 18.
43:29
Oh, for the record, you-
43:31
Laurence and I, we didn't score points the final two.
43:35
We didn't score points the final two seasons.
43:37
You scored one, Nate, one.
43:38
I was on a single finger
43:39
still at the end of the season, I think, so pretty bad.
43:41
What's crazy about that is that over 24 races,
43:45
Nicole did the best out of the three of us
43:48
and still only got 18 of the top three positions right.
43:52
So not just 18 actually getting the top three,
43:54
like just single drivers in the right place,
43:56
which shows that, you know,
43:58
for all the kind of boring races
44:00
there were this season,
44:01
it was pretty unpredictable, you know,
44:03
in terms of who was going to win races.
44:04
It went into each race
44:05
and it wasn't clear who was going to come out in front,
44:08
which has not always been the case in F1 recently.
44:10
So I think, you know, it says a little bit about us,
44:13
but it also says a little bit about how this season-
44:15
You're going to say you've been too kind about our talent.
44:19
I think it means that I was, I did great.
44:20
I think it means that I did a really good job to beat you to.
44:24
And I would like to thank the Academy.
44:27
I would like to thank my sponsors, the Canteen Ladies,
44:30
my mom and dad for always believing in me.
44:32
And here's to 2026.
44:34
Speaking of 2026, I want to look ahead
44:36
because obviously there have already been things
44:39
that have come out,
44:40
but I think the biggest sort of development
44:43
is helmet Marcos exit from Red Bull.
44:46
When you look at where that team is headed in 2026,
44:49
how does his departure impact
44:51
what we're going to see from them?
44:52
Well, it's uncharted territory for them really, isn't it?
44:54
If you look at now,
44:56
the pillars of that team coming into this decade
44:59
Bar Max Verstappen, you know,
45:01
obviously Dietrich Matzschutz,
45:02
the owner of the team passed away in 2022.
45:05
We saw Nui's gone to Aston, Horner obviously left.
45:07
And the funny thing with Marcos is,
45:09
I think he felt right, this is great now.
45:13
This is my team, I'm in control, him leaving.
45:16
I'm not sure how much impact it's going to have
45:18
on the running of the race team itself
45:20
in terms of operationally with the car.
45:23
The big thing for him is going to be the fact
45:25
that for so long he's been credited
45:27
with overseeing that driver program.
45:28
And I think that a lot of the chaotic decisions
45:31
that have been made were kind of a 50-50 thing.
45:34
Him and Horner always disagreed.
45:36
The drivers were kind of a power play
45:38
for the two of them.
45:40
But I think the question we're all going to have
45:42
is what it means for Max Verstappen.
45:44
He's always said Marco is an important part
45:46
of him being there.
45:47
Marco brought him to the team.
45:49
You know, it is being framed as a retirement.
45:51
I'd heard that there was a talk of retirement
45:53
even last year from Marco,
45:55
but this seems a little bit different.
45:57
It seems like he's been kind of almost,
46:00
it potted to the end of the plank
46:02
and then made to jump off on his own terms
46:04
but still was put on the edge of the plank by the team.
46:09
So yeah, in terms of 26, I think it's fascinating
46:11
because this Red Bull team now looks so different
46:13
to the one that was able to re-establish itself
46:16
as the best team on the grid.
46:18
Max is still there.
46:19
We've got Lauren Mekkes.
46:20
He's obviously doing a very good job there.
46:22
But yeah, it's hard to imagine
46:25
walking into that hospitality center.
46:27
I mean, it was hard enough getting used
46:28
to not seeing Christian there from July onwards.
46:32
Marco the entire time, I've been there from the one,
46:34
you walk in there and he is just sat in,
46:38
same as Horner, they were just
46:40
always in that hospitality center,
46:41
always talking to people, always involved,
46:44
always kind of asking you what's going on around the place
46:48
and suddenly those guys aren't there.
46:49
It's a good reminder that in Formula One,
46:51
the power can go away very quickly.
46:53
But for me, the big thing that,
46:55
and I can already see Max getting annoyed
46:58
with the questions early in the season
47:00
when they come to him, but it's,
47:02
what does this mean for you?
47:03
Does this, a few years ago,
47:04
I think it was Saudi Arabia 2024,
47:06
I was in the press conference there
47:08
where he said, I leave this team if Marco goes away.
47:12
And that was a year and a half ago.
47:16
So I think things have obviously changed internally since then,
47:18
but yeah, very uncertain times there.
47:22
And now suddenly if Red Bull are in a bad position next year
47:24
with the new engine, the new car,
47:26
you do wonder if Marco's not there,
47:28
is it easier for the staff
47:30
to imagine a world beyond Red Bull?
47:33
So I think that's where for me,
47:34
the fascinating part of the story is.
47:38
Yeah, I think it's gonna be a very different Red Bull
47:41
going forward as a much more corporate Austrian
47:44
controlled Red Bull, which is,
47:47
which is what the people in charge want.
47:51
It's still the direction of travel
47:53
we've seen throughout this season,
47:55
but I'm not sure it's really necessarily
47:59
a good thing for the sport because, I mean,
48:00
there were a lot of things that Marco said,
48:02
which were absolutely not good for the sport
48:04
and things where he really put his foot in his mouth
48:08
and got things fundamentally wrong,
48:10
as recently as the Katara Grand Prix
48:13
where he claimed that Antonelli had given up
48:15
fourth place to Lando Norris.
48:18
But I think a lot of the essence of what Red Bull was
48:22
and the edginess of Red Bull came from
48:25
Horner and Marco and whether actually
48:29
getting rid of that could be a positive thing
48:31
and it could actually unleash performance going forward.
48:34
That is a possibility,
48:35
but I think it's a tricky situation right now
48:38
because, like I said,
48:39
they're going in with a new engine next year.
48:43
That's a huge, huge job to pull off,
48:46
something that was put in place by Horner, really.
48:50
Horner had really worked hard to build that up,
48:52
so it's going to be an interesting situation now.
48:54
If that doesn't go well,
48:56
there's going to be a lot of blaming of the guys
48:59
that are already not there,
49:00
but then will that keep Max of the team very much doubted?
49:03
So, like Nate said,
49:05
it really does open up a lot of questions going forward
49:08
and whether Red Bull will continue to be
49:09
the power that they have been in the sport
49:15
I mean, we were asking those questions
49:16
even with Marco still there this season,
49:19
but I also think like change is inevitable.
49:23
If not for nothing,
49:24
we're talking about an 82-year-old man.
49:27
Marco's 82, like not to be mean,
49:30
but like he's not going to stick around forever.
49:32
Change is inevitable for a lot of reasons
49:34
and those questions about Red Bull were there already.
49:38
I do think like you went back to 2024
49:40
when Max said I'm in this team because of Marco
49:44
and if Marco leaves and I'm out too.
49:46
I do think that they were under
49:47
slightly different circumstances.
49:50
The context in which the comments were made
49:52
are different than what I think
49:54
the retirement is happening now.
49:58
I have questions about Red Bull,
49:59
but I have questions about Red Bull
50:01
I think whether Marco is there or not.
50:05
Yeah, I mean, it is true.
50:07
I think Marco said in a recent podcast that he had,
50:10
I don't know whether contracts are right works.
50:11
I'm not sure he had an exact kind of normal
50:14
kind of employment contract in place.
50:16
If he had an agreement to be there until the end of 2026.
50:19
So I mean, it was certainly on his mind
50:21
and I think he had been speaking for some time about
50:23
at what point, does he step back
50:25
and I should probably point out
50:27
82 years old is quite old to be traveling around the world
50:29
as part of a Formula One team.
50:32
But I think it's perhaps not so much
50:35
that he's gone and that Horn has gone.
50:36
It's just the speed at which
50:39
all those changes have happened at Red Bull,
50:41
including I think probably the biggest one of all
50:44
in terms of performance on track as well
50:46
was Adrian Newey leaving last year as well.
50:50
Prior to that, Rob Marshall had left,
50:52
Jonathan Wheatley left to go and be
50:55
the Salbert team principal, Will Courtney
50:56
has gone, he's on gardening leave at the moment.
50:58
He was the head of strategy and he's going to McLaren.
51:01
So it's just the speed of change there's been
51:04
at Red Bull creates a lot of questions.
51:08
But I think if it does go wrong next year,
51:12
I think they'll probably look and say,
51:14
well, it was partly the plans have been put in place
51:17
by the old guard, the putters here.
51:19
But to Nate's point, which is this point
51:21
I was trying to make originally is that
51:23
that's not going to matter to Max Verstappen.
51:25
I don't think Max has got any interest
51:26
in hanging around at any team.
51:28
If it's not competitive and not able
51:30
to deliver him race victories,
51:33
even less so when he's lost a close ally
51:35
like Helmut Marco, the other team.
51:37
I was just going to shout out some reporting
51:39
from one of the Dutch journalists
51:41
that was fantastic this week.
51:42
So Jackie Martins who works at the Limburger,
51:45
which is one of the newspapers in the Netherlands.
51:49
He mentioned that this year the, you know,
51:52
the ally ship between Verstappen's and Marco
51:54
had become a bit strained.
51:56
One of the things that I just wanted to let our listeners
51:58
know, because I think it's an incredible bit of detail
52:01
that Jackie Martins reported on was,
52:03
we mentioned earlier that Limberg,
52:05
sorry, that Limblad had come up quite early.
52:07
It seems that Marco's kind of final dealings
52:10
in the driver program is what really pushed him towards the end.
52:12
So Limblad being signed early seems like a Marco call.
52:17
The Alex Dunn situation.
52:19
Now Alex Dunn is a name that might not be too familiar
52:21
with people listening, but Helmut Marco,
52:24
by according to a couple of the reports in the Netherlands,
52:27
basically signed Alex Dunn from McLaren on a development deal.
52:30
Red Belostria looked at it and said,
52:31
what on earth are you doing?
52:32
We don't think he's the guy going forward.
52:35
Helmut Marco said, well, I'm the godfather
52:37
of the driver program.
52:38
I say he is and I say, well, we say he's not.
52:40
They had to pay a lot of money to get Alex Dunn out of that.
52:43
And Alex Dunn now seems to be on the verge of signing
52:45
a deal with Alpine.
52:47
That gives a glimpse a little bit into the fact
52:49
that Marco had become a bit,
52:51
shooting from the hip a little bit too much.
52:53
And exactly what Lawrence was saying,
52:55
that corporate Red Bull, think Red Bull Leipzig,
52:58
think the Red Bull teams that that company has,
53:01
I can see them becoming,
53:03
they've already become very corporate.
53:04
I mean, you look at the fun,
53:08
I think the Austrians have tried to get back
53:10
to some of the fun things of old,
53:12
but that team has stopped running in the way
53:14
that maybe has made it a captivating team.
53:17
So Marco not being there,
53:19
it's kind of the last cowboys that has kind of left
53:22
the ranch of Red Bull, I think.
53:24
So hopefully they've got a few more characters
53:26
I think the cowboy idea is a really good way
53:32
to sort of like characterize him a little bit.
53:37
There is a shoot from the hip.
53:38
There is a speak first, think later,
53:42
old school mentality that maybe doesn't fly anymore.
53:47
And it does, among all the other things,
53:51
it does sort of signal the shift in mentality a bit.
53:56
This is like the most American thing ever,
53:58
but the Super Bowl is kind of a big deal over here.
54:03
Totally American football.
54:04
Gets a few eyeballs, no big deal,
54:07
but Cadillac is going to unveil their livery
54:11
during the Super Bowl.
54:14
I'm a little biased, it's fine, but I love it.
54:17
I love it because of the eyeballs,
54:21
because of the excitement that already exists
54:24
I love it because then it gets other people
54:28
that may not be totally tuned in or dialed in
54:30
with what this is or what's happening.
54:32
It's just like introducing maybe a new audience
54:38
So I really like what Cadillac is doing
54:40
in their timing and the place.
54:44
And yes, it's very American.
54:45
Yeah, this is huge as well,
54:47
because remember one of the arguments
54:48
against allowing Cadillac in as an 11th team
54:52
when the idea was first floated from F1 was that,
54:56
well, are they really going to bring the value to the sport
54:59
that we need from an 11th team?
55:01
Is it worth diluting the revenues
55:05
that gets shared among the teams to an 11th team?
55:07
Are they really going to add something to that?
55:10
And I think this is a perfect example of where Cadillac can.
55:13
I mean, I think we have to be realistic about Cadillac's,
55:17
you know, what they can achieve on the track next year.
55:18
I think Cadillac are realistic about that,
55:20
but then there's what they can achieve off the track.
55:22
And this is a great starting point.
55:24
So, yeah, I'm super excited to see,
55:26
first of all, what the commercial looks like,
55:27
because I know Super Bowl commercials are a big deal.
55:30
You know, even in the UK,
55:31
where we don't get to watch them live,
55:33
we still see them all through YouTube and everything else.
55:35
So it's always a big deal there.
55:37
And yeah, just to see how they present it.
55:39
And yeah, are you right?
55:41
How much it helps just kickstart this F1 season
55:44
and grab an audience that probably many of which
55:48
have never really, maybe aware of F1,
55:50
but never really watched anything.
55:51
Oh, actually, cool Cadillac are involved.
55:53
I might see how they get on.
55:55
Yeah, I think it's so cool.
55:57
I think at that point about, you know, the value,
56:01
I think Cadillac are enjoying the fact
56:02
that they've already been, you know, they've secured this.
56:04
They've got the big Disney Plus documentary
56:08
They've really, they've gone all in on this F1 team.
56:12
And you know, I think that they're going all in
56:14
in a way that means if they are a bit slow
56:16
performance wise in terms of getting up to speed,
56:19
it will be fine because the size
56:22
and the aura of what they're doing is going to be,
56:25
is kind of going to outweigh us on the track.
56:27
But yeah, I agree with you, Nicole.
56:29
I mean, I think this is the other great thing
56:31
that I think Cadillac are already doing
56:32
is they're saying, we're American.
56:34
What's more American than going in in the Super Bowl?
56:38
You know, I don't know what their car's going to look like,
56:40
but the one thing that was always frustrating
56:42
with the Haas team was they never lent into that thing.
56:45
They never let, they were never like,
56:47
let's put the stars and stripes in the car.
56:48
Let's make it American.
56:51
It was always just this corporate, you know,
56:53
machine tool colors a lot of the time,
56:55
you know, from Gene Haas' company.
56:57
Cadillac, there's few things outside of America.
57:00
There's few things that resonate
57:02
as American more than Cadillac.
57:04
You know, Cadillac is just something that you hear.
57:06
You think of Cadillac, you think of General Motors,
57:08
you think of Detroit.
57:09
It is, you know, it's America.
57:11
So I think they're doing a great job to do that.
57:14
Nicole, you can answer me this
57:15
because one of the frustrating things I have
57:16
with watching the Super Bowl is we watch it
57:19
and it starts after midnight.
57:21
And usually the coverage in the UK is great,
57:23
but what we miss, Lawrence is right,
57:25
you usually have to watch them on YouTube afterwards.
57:28
You have to find them out
57:29
and because we have our own adverts,
57:30
which are just, you know,
57:32
usually not geared towards the Super Bowl.
57:34
They're just bespoke adverts, right?
57:36
Like I really want to watch Super Bowl one day
57:38
with the advert experience as part of it.
57:41
Is that as big of a part of a Super Bowl as like,
57:44
I know the game is huge,
57:45
but is it like the halftime show
57:47
of us like watching and reviewing and laughing along?
57:50
See, that's big in itself.
57:52
Because people are going to...
57:53
Right, the whole thing.
57:55
The whole thing is big.
57:56
I think, you know, because there's always like,
57:58
you have a Super Bowl party,
57:59
you're always hanging out with like friends
58:00
and eating and drinking and like,
58:03
not just like, you know, whatever.
58:04
You're just, there's like a, it's a day.
58:09
The Super Bowl is an entire day.
58:11
It's not just the game.
58:13
The weird thing about the ads are
58:15
they now come out early.
58:16
So you can see them before.
58:19
And then obviously what you didn't see,
58:20
you can see on YouTube and various platforms afterwards.
58:24
But most of the time now you've changed your brain
58:27
to not pay attention to the commercials.
58:29
So I always find this early on in the Super Bowl,
58:33
I'm watching it and then the commercials will come
58:35
and I'll like instinctively turn away
58:37
to do whatever it is that I'm going to do next
58:39
And I need to remind myself, no, no, no, no, no,
58:46
My kids, my girls are 12 and nine.
58:50
They're not the biggest of sports fans,
58:53
which is weird in this house,
58:54
but they will watch the Super Bowl,
58:58
whether it's because they're trying to see Taylor Swift
59:00
or because they're interested in the commercials
59:02
or they're interested in the halftime show.
59:04
So I can get them involved because of that.
59:09
I'm voting, by the way,
59:10
I'm hoping it's a pink Cadillac.
59:12
Yeah, I mean, they've given hints of that, haven't they?
59:15
I'm really, really hoping for a pink Cadillac
59:18
and there are so many cultural ties to that.
59:21
It's the funniest thing that they could do.
59:24
And I'll be honest, if it's like a Stars and Stripes
59:28
put the bald eagle on a Americana car,
59:31
I'm going to be so disappointed.
59:33
Like, if it's not a pink Cadillac, that's a fail.
59:36
Yeah, I feel like you've got an opportunity
59:39
with that car to really stand out.
59:42
Like, the Audi recently did their brand reveal,
59:46
didn't they, where, you know, and it was very Audi colors
59:49
but, and it's hard to see it until the sponsors go on it,
59:53
but they kind of had the colors on the back
59:56
and it was like a predominantly gray.
59:58
And sometimes you're like,
59:59
you want to grab these manufacturers
00:01
and the guys making the cars,
00:02
you want to say, look guys, make this look great.
00:04
Like, just make this look insanely cool.
00:09
People in 20, 30 years time,
00:11
people still talk about the Camelotus cars, don't they?
00:13
Because of how great they looked.
00:15
You know, you could show someone that car
00:16
and be like, how good does that look?
00:18
You know, it happened to be very good
00:19
and Senna's car, et cetera.
00:21
But people talk about stuff like that.
00:22
So a pink Cadillac would be great.
00:23
But also make it, like make it so that
00:27
when you see it on the track,
00:29
you know exactly who it is.
00:32
You know, whether it's running at the front
00:33
or in the back, make it so that it is recognizable
00:39
Don't leave it up for question.
00:41
Don't leave it up for doubt.
00:41
Is that the gray car or is that the blue car?
00:46
Like just make it obvious as to who you are and own it.
00:50
Like obviously there's been a pink car
00:52
in Formula One before,
00:53
but to have it be a pink Cadillac, like.
00:59
There's also, it would give me permission
01:02
to just sing a Bruce Springsteen song all season as well.
01:07
I mean, I know a lot of people sing about pink Cadillacs,
01:09
but he's actually got one called Pink Cadillacs.
01:14
Are you excited for the new 2026 cars
01:17
and the new regs and whatever?
01:18
Like obviously it's the end of the ground effects era.
01:20
It's the end of DRS.
01:23
There are a lot of questions as to what we're gonna see.
01:28
I'm excited for what it's like.
01:29
I'm excited because I think it's about time
01:32
You just mentioned a few things.
01:34
And the fact we talked about this season
01:35
and a lack of excitement and overtaking says it all really.
01:39
I don't think given a blank sheet of paper,
01:42
these are the regulations I would have come up with
01:45
to ensure that going forward.
01:47
I think they're gonna take a lot of getting your head around,
01:53
a lot of understanding why certain things
01:55
are happening in the race
01:56
and potentially a lot of things going wrong
01:59
early on in the season as well.
02:02
That could add a bit of unpredictability,
02:03
which is never a bad thing.
02:04
But yeah, I think it's gonna be a whole new,
02:09
almost language coming out of the F1 paddock
02:11
and testing as to what the problems are with the car.
02:14
A bit like when we had the start of this era
02:17
and we started talking about porpoising,
02:18
which was the cars bouncing up and down,
02:20
which was actually an issue
02:21
right up until the end of this year.
02:23
There's gonna be all these new issues
02:25
and positives potentially as well to get your head around.
02:30
I like that from my perspective
02:32
as like a hardcore F1 fan.
02:34
I like the fact that, you know,
02:36
we've got a whole new set of regulations to get our head around.
02:38
I just hope they don't diminish the racing too much
02:41
or become too complicated
02:43
or just a bit too difficult to get your head around.
02:48
Yeah, early indications from some drivers
02:50
has been very complicated to drive in the sim.
02:53
There's a lot of things drivers have to do.
02:55
I mean, obviously DRS is going away, isn't it?
02:57
For an energy-based system.
03:00
So I've got some skepticism about it,
03:03
but I think, you know, you always see with Formula One
03:06
that they kind of iron out some of the confusing bits,
03:09
but I think the biggest thing
03:11
that could really hurt Formula One
03:12
is Lawrence's right to mention 2014.
03:15
It was my first year covering Formula One
03:17
and the difficulty we had explaining to a layman fan
03:20
about the hybrid power units
03:22
and the technicalities behind it all.
03:27
You know, I don't think it's gonna be as complicated
03:28
as that, but there are a lot of things
03:30
going on with these cars that are gonna be
03:32
pretty difficult to explain, you know, just to a casual fan
03:35
who ultimately just wants to see who's got the quickest car
03:37
and who's gonna win with that.
03:39
So, but then we did allude to it earlier.
03:42
I don't think, hopefully, it surely can't be as bad
03:46
as this year in terms of overall racing.
03:48
So if there's an improvement even there,
03:50
I think we're in a good spot.
03:52
It made me laugh though when you were like,
03:53
oh, drivers, they're complaining about it
03:55
in the sims, whatever, like seriously,
03:58
if you ever find a driver who is completely happy,
04:02
you found a unicorn.
04:03
So just don't hold your breath on that.
04:06
Yeah, so I can dance too, good point.
04:09
Like even when they have a great car,
04:10
they're like, there's, you know, I live with one,
04:13
so it's not like I can't throw him under the bus as well.
04:18
Is there a team or a driver
04:20
that most intrigues you for 2026?
04:22
I sort of have a small list
04:23
and they're all for different reasons,
04:24
but like, is there a team or a driver
04:26
that you've got up there?
04:28
Yeah, he's pointing back at the book,
04:30
Ferrari's on the top of my list too.
04:31
I think for me, I mean, just given what happened this year,
04:36
given the John Alkin comments,
04:38
given that Charles the clerk looks like,
04:41
you know, at least he's got it in his head like,
04:43
okay, maybe my future's not at Ferrari
04:46
given that Lewis has gone there
04:48
and has underperformed, I think,
04:49
it's all about Ferrari next year, you know,
04:52
not just because of the implication of 2026,
04:54
but the implication for Ferrari
04:56
of just being off the pace for another regulation cycle
05:00
or at least not being the team to beat.
05:02
I mean, after a while, if that happens again,
05:05
you start to wonder, how does that team get beyond that?
05:08
You know, how do they, what do they do?
05:10
You know, so for me, it's them.
05:12
I mentioned earlier about the sixth racing with the clerk.
05:15
I think that, I think I mentioned it on a,
05:17
I think I said it on a pod before,
05:18
but there's nothing that would sum up Ferrari's failures
05:22
more than the clerk leaving that team,
05:25
you know, given what he means to that team,
05:27
but also what that team means to him
05:29
and just the fact that I think deep down,
05:31
he just wants to stay there forever
05:32
and drive Ferraris for the rest of time.
05:35
If you drive him away by just not getting a regulation
05:38
change, right, then that's pretty telling.
05:40
But I've got, I've got some optimism.
05:42
You know, Ferrari did stop developing this year's car
05:46
quite early, I think that's worth pointing out
05:48
and Ferrari do tend to develop cars very well
05:52
around regulation changes.
05:53
What happens is when they get to the regulation change
05:56
and suddenly everyone is criticizing the performance,
05:59
they then lose their way.
06:00
So hopefully they have a good baseline next year
06:02
on both the engine and the aerodynamic side,
06:05
but I think it's a huge year for a lot of people
06:07
who work at that team, you know,
06:09
from the ground up to the very top,
06:11
you know, to John Elkin as well,
06:13
because you know, John Elkin has presided
06:14
over this Ferrari team now for a little while.
06:17
So yeah, I think it's got to be that.
06:20
I would say Aston Martin's the other team
06:22
which I'm really intrigued by just because
06:24
obviously Adrian knew he was going there,
06:26
now becoming the team principal as well,
06:28
not a role that any of us thought he was going to move into
06:31
when he first left Red Bull and went to Aston Martin,
06:35
but they just have all the facilities as well.
06:36
They have everything there.
06:37
I mean, I've been to that factory a few times now.
06:39
They often invite us over during the British Grand Prix weekend
06:42
because it's literally across the road
06:44
from the entrance to Silverstein.
06:46
And everything there is in place,
06:49
but it's quite clear that perhaps, you know,
06:52
not everything is perfectly happy behind the scenes,
06:55
given the changes in management
06:58
and the cowl being moved into a position
07:01
which I think will suit him,
07:02
overlooking Honda and the fuel supplier
07:05
and the lubricants and all the rest of it
07:07
and making sure that all marries with the chassis
07:10
is absolutely cowl's expertise,
07:13
but it seemed quite late in the day that they made that change.
07:17
It also seemed like Adrian knew he wasn't
07:19
the most natural fit as team principal,
07:20
so what's really going on there?
07:22
Are they going to hit the ground running?
07:24
Or do they already know that they're not going to hit
07:26
the expectations they need
07:27
and therefore changes are already being made?
07:29
And then of course, you know, Honda coming in,
07:32
a big change for them,
07:33
but Honda are a magnificent engine manufacturer
07:38
that up until this year
07:40
had won the previous four with Red Bull.
07:41
So it's almost like there's no more excuses for Aston Martin.
07:45
Everything is in place
07:46
and they finished seventh this year as well.
07:49
So that's not great, of course,
07:51
but it does mean that they get extra aero development
07:53
compared to the teams that they want to be their rivals
07:57
against McLaren who won the constructors championship
07:59
and then Mercedes, Red Bull and Ferrari,
08:02
you know, they're going to have a significant more
08:03
amount of development
08:04
because that's the way the regulations are set
08:06
to allow teams to catch up if they've been doing poorly.
08:08
So it's almost like they will have run out of excuses
08:11
by the end of next year
08:12
if they're not at least tracking towards
08:16
podiums and race wins.
08:19
It maybe is too much to expect an immediate turnaround,
08:22
but if they're not tracking towards that,
08:23
if it's not all the signs that are lining up
08:25
that they're going there, then that's a big deal.
08:26
So, and also just to see what,
08:29
what age when you can come up with
08:30
under a new regulation set.
08:32
He arrived a little bit later than you would have wanted
08:35
because the work on these cars started
08:38
basically the start of this year is
08:39
when they were allowed to start
08:40
putting stuff in the wind tunnel and through CFD
08:43
and knew he was what, three or four months later than that,
08:46
but still he's had a lot of time
08:48
to get his head around the regulations
08:51
and then come in and kind of say, right,
08:52
this needs to be here, this needs to be like that.
08:54
Here's the overall concept
08:56
and then the team will work on a lot of the details.
08:58
So for me, that's a fascinating one.
09:02
But I think it also speaks a lot to form the one right now
09:05
because Nicole, I'm sure you've got teams as well
09:07
that you could name, but there's a whole bunch
09:09
who are really leveling up,
09:11
Salba becoming Audi, Cadillac coming on the grid,
09:15
Williams with their turnaround
09:17
that they've done over the last year.
09:19
There's so many that you could pick and say,
09:21
this should really be their year.
09:22
And of course, that's never the case.
09:24
There's always one team or several teams
09:27
that are further back down the grid.
09:29
I think you can go top to bottom
09:32
and make a case for every team
09:34
as to why they could be the most intriguing.
09:36
And then honestly, you have to look at McLaren.
09:39
They did not have moments this year
09:42
where they maybe handled things the best way internally
09:46
And they did have to focus a lot on this season
09:49
to get their drivers the championship.
09:51
They've won the Constructors Championship two years in a row.
09:54
The pressure is on them now.
09:56
It is going to be an intriguing conversation
09:58
to see how they follow up on everything.
10:01
And I do think in terms of driver relationships,
10:03
what did Piaz Tri sort of learn from this season?
10:07
How is he going to be different next year
10:10
based on how everything played out this year?
10:14
Ferrari top of list for all the reasons that Nate said,
10:18
Williams to me is a team that is ahead of schedule.
10:22
They've sort of said the same thing.
10:24
I think the two surprise podiums this year
10:26
from Carlos are just that they're surprising
10:30
but it's also sort of like a tip of the hat
10:32
to the work that's being done behind the scenes
10:35
and also the potential that exists.
10:38
For me, and this sort of leads into the next question
10:41
I'm going to have too, it's Mercedes.
10:44
You know, Mercedes was second
10:46
in the Constructors Championship this season.
10:48
They were the other team to get wins this season
10:51
with George and George got a couple of them.
10:54
There were times when we were looking at Kimmy
10:56
as being an actual contender
10:59
to do something more than just get on the podium.
11:01
Yeah, the sprint race pole in Miami,
11:05
they're already being looked at
11:07
as sort of like the team to beat next season
11:10
and with expectations come sort of the conversation
11:14
of can you live up to them?
11:16
And it's been a few really lean years from Mercedes
11:19
and they lost Lewis Hamilton.
11:21
So what can they do?
11:23
And can they live up to the expectations
11:25
that are already being set?
11:26
But again, like you could go through top to bottom
11:30
and have a conversation about every team
11:32
as to why they're intriguing.
11:34
Haas, losing their title sponsor
11:36
and then having the agreement with Toyota Gazoo.
11:38
You know, what does that look like?
11:40
You know, how does that impact their development
11:42
in things they do down the line?
11:46
Yeah, it's like literally every team from top to bottom.
11:50
But I'm going to end this with something
11:53
that I know we love to do.
11:54
Our way to early predictions are wildest predictions.
11:58
When you look at 2026,
12:01
who is your way too early prediction
12:04
to be the driver's champion next season?
12:06
And you know what, Nate?
12:07
I'm not going to make you go first.
12:09
I was about to go, but I appreciate it, Nicole.
12:14
Well, I'll happily go first
12:16
and I'll show you that you can still play it safe
12:18
despite going first.
12:19
So I'm going to buy in through all of the hype
12:22
around Mercedes and also say that I think,
12:25
because I don't think we've really touched on it
12:27
in this podcast as a season review,
12:28
how good George Russell's season was.
12:30
You know, I think if he'd been in that McLaren,
12:33
I think he probably would have been
12:35
in both of those drivers there.
12:36
Slightly controversial opinion, maybe,
12:37
but I think he was that good this year.
12:41
So I'm just going to lay it out there straight away,
12:43
George Russell, as the way to early prediction
12:48
for 2026, because who knows,
12:49
maybe we get to testing and the Mercedes
12:51
just blows up every time it goes out on track.
12:55
I'm not even going to let you go second, Nate.
12:57
And I just showed it because this is just proof.
13:00
I wrote this, it's backwards, but you can see it.
13:02
I wrote George like hours ago, same thing,
13:07
for all the same reasons, like, yeah.
13:11
That's all I got, George.
13:13
Yeah, I think it is difficult to surpass him, isn't it?
13:15
Just given what we are expecting from that team,
13:18
I was kind of, this is probably where I win my predictions.
13:22
I do think it's going to be George,
13:24
just to clarify, but my left field one was going to be,
13:27
was going to be Fernando Alonso.
13:30
Just, I want to totally buy into the fact that Newey built.
13:34
Yeah, that Newey builds him an absolute rocket ship
13:36
and we just have a year of Fernando Alonso
13:39
just winning races and winning the title.
13:42
I think, you know, we talked about how great
13:43
the Max thing was this year.
13:45
That would be an absolute FIFA dream.
13:47
And I'd be, I'd like that more than Ferrari
13:49
winning a championship, just given how long
13:52
he's been in the sport for.
13:53
But also, you know, it would kind of be a great thing
13:57
for that story of that race team as well.
13:59
So, non-serious answers, Fernando Alonso.
14:03
The very safe, predictable one.
14:05
But for good reason is George Russell.
14:07
But yeah, I think it's telling, isn't it,
14:10
that we've all gone for a Mercedes-powered champion
14:13
because it does seem like that is going to be
14:14
the package that wins.
14:16
But I want to throw this to you guys.
14:19
I know no one thinks that the Rebel project
14:22
is going to be the one to beat.
14:25
But to me, this year proved that even if Red Bull
14:27
is still kind of, you know, they're competitive enough,
14:30
you just cannot write off Verstappen,
14:33
regardless of what that car looks like.
14:35
Obviously, if the car is genuinely awful,
14:37
then, you know, there's a limit that anyone can do.
14:39
I mean, look at Fernando Alonso as an example of that.
14:42
But if the car's even semi-competitive,
14:45
we know how good Verstappen is across the season.
14:48
You know, consistency next year might well be
14:50
the key thing in terms of if there's lots of random results.
14:53
So I think, you know, Max is still,
14:57
every season we go into, he's got to be
15:01
in the back of the mind of like, this guy could win it.
15:03
You know, this guy could.
15:04
If Max is in a car, if Max is in a team,
15:08
you cannot overlook him.
15:10
Period, end of discussion.
15:11
Yes, it's like when they say in the NFL,
15:13
you know, all roads go through Indianapolis
15:15
when you're the number one seed or whatever.
15:17
All roads go through Verstappen still in Formula One.
15:20
You know, they just have to, you know, the way,
15:23
and actually I think, you know,
15:25
teams have to prepare for that now.
15:26
Like you've got to be mentally ready to beat the,
15:29
you know, you've got to hear that Jules music
15:30
and see Chucky coming at you as Zach Brown said.
15:34
So not my pick, but I think it's worth saying
15:37
that Verstappen should be in that conversation at least.
15:40
Mm-hmm, don't disagree.
15:44
This is a little sad,
15:45
but I think that's where we're going to end it.
15:50
It's been so much fun.
15:52
This is not the end, obviously, but.
15:57
Yeah, we just don't know, do we?
15:58
We're not sure it's nice.
16:02
Thank you for listening to Unlapped
16:04
every single week of the year.
16:06
Thanks for following along on the journey.
16:08
Thanks for following those guys on Instagram
16:10
and reading their stories.
16:11
They do brilliant work
16:12
and they will continue to do brilliant work
16:15
because like we will still cover Formula One.
16:17
It just might look a little different
16:19
in terms of what we do weekend and week out.
16:21
But guys, safe travels.
16:23
Thank you for your friendship.
16:24
Thank you for the insight.
16:25
Thank you for your brilliance and the laughs
16:28
and all of those things.
16:30
You are loved and you will be very, very missed.
16:32
So remember, like and subscribe.
16:36
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16:38
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16:41
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16:44
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16:46
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16:48
This has been Unlapped.
16:49
Nate, Laurence, Nicole.