The Porsche Boxster is a Porsche roadster with the engine placed toward the middle of the car. The hosts are talking about why some people didn’t like it at first, and why they think it’s still a great buy.
A “base Boxster” means the entry-level version of the Porsche Boxster. The host is arguing that most people don’t need the expensive options to get a great Porsche experience.
“Hairdresser’s car” is a teasing insult people used for the Boxster (and Cayman). It’s basically saying, “this Porsche looks too stylish,” not “this is a real driver’s car.”
“Goldilocks” means “just right.” In this context, the host is saying the 987.2 Boxster generation hits the best balance—good enough to avoid the worst issues, but not so new that it’s unproven.
“Engine architecture” means the basic design of the engine—how it’s built at a fundamental level. The host is saying the 2009–2011 Boxster got a more substantial engine redesign than a simple refresh.
An IMS bearing is a small part inside certain Porsche flat-six engines. Some versions are known to fail, so when the host says it was “done away with,” they mean that risk was reduced or eliminated.
Car
987.2
“987.2” is Porsche’s internal generation code for the Boxster/Cayman platform. Here, the key point is that the base engine and the higher-trim engine use different fuel-injection setups.
Direct injection means the fuel is sprayed right into the engine’s combustion area. The host is saying some versions of this Porsche use it, while the base version doesn’t.
“Flat sixes” are engines with six cylinders arranged in two banks that sit flat like a boxer. The host is saying these engines tend to sound great and feel happiest when you rev them higher.
Port injection sprays fuel into the engine’s intake passages. It’s different from direct injection, where fuel goes straight into the cylinder, and that difference can affect how much gunk builds up inside.
Direct injection shoots fuel right into the cylinder. That can be efficient, but in some engines it can lead to more carbon buildup on the valves over time.
Over time, soot can collect on the intake valves. That buildup can make the engine breathe less freely, which is why people talk about it when comparing injection types.
It’s a saying that means when the overall market gets better, lots of things go up together. Here, they’re saying that while prices rising can help owners, it makes it harder for other people to find and buy the cars they want.
“Secret cars” are the less-famous models that used to be easier to find and cheaper. The point they’re making is that once more people notice them, they become harder to buy and cost more.
This is a Porsche 911 Turbo from the 996 generation, and it’s powered by a turbocharged engine. The host also mentions it’s a six-speed manual, which is the more driver-focused way to shift.
A six-speed manual means you shift gears yourself using a clutch and a gear lever. It’s usually more engaging for drivers than an automatic transmission.
Sports seats are seats designed to keep you more firmly in place while driving. They usually feel more supportive than basic seats, especially in turns.
These are a specific style of Porsche wheel with hollow spokes. If one cracks, it can be dangerous and may not be something you can just patch—so you often end up replacing the wheel.
A suspension refresh is when you replace worn parts that help the car ride and handle correctly. If the car still has original parts, it can feel like a big, expensive project.
Control arms are suspension links that locate the wheel and allow controlled movement. Bushings are the rubber/urethane bearings inside those links; when they wear out, they can cause looseness, vibration, and uneven tire wear—often prompting a suspension refresh.
“Engine out” means the mechanic has to take the engine out of the car to reach the part. That usually makes the repair much more time-consuming and expensive.
Coolant pipes move the liquid that keeps the engine from overheating. On some 996/997 engines, the parts that connect those pipes can loosen over time, and you can lose coolant very quickly.
Epoxy (a glue-like adhesive) is used to hold coolant pipe fittings into the engine case on these Mezger engines. The segment explains that the epoxy can degrade over time, leading to fitting release and rapid coolant loss.
Pinning here means adding a mechanical fastener so the connection can’t come loose. It’s a way to stop the coolant pipe fitting from separating and losing coolant.
“Bore score” means scratches or wear inside the engine’s cylinder walls. If it gets bad, it can hurt compression and engine health. The hosts are debating whether this is a big problem or exaggerated for these cars.
“Thermo cycles” just means the engine constantly goes from hot to cold. Over time, that repeated heating and cooling can weaken materials. In this case, they’re saying it can stress the epoxy that’s involved with the coolant pipes.
They’re talking about whether things like hot vs cold climates or track driving can predict when these problems happen. The host’s take is that those patterns don’t really show up clearly. So it’s more about time/age than specific driving conditions.
Concept
not stuck in that situation
They’re basically saying: don’t wait until something fails. If you want to avoid getting stuck with a big problem, either do the preventative repair or buy one that’s already been fixed. It’s about reducing the odds of an expensive surprise.
Here, “weld” means using welding as part of a preventative fix for the IMS area. The idea is to reduce the chance of the IMS bearing failing. They’re saying there are two main methods people choose between, and the workmanship matters.
Turbo lag is the short pause you can feel before a turbo engine really starts making boost. You press the gas, then there’s a moment of waiting before the power kicks in.
“Spool up” means the turbo is spinning faster until it starts forcing more air into the engine. When it spools up quickly, the car feels more responsive.
Here “boxers” refers to Porsche’s flat-style engine. The host’s point is that if a car has been neglected, it can feel worse than it should, and people may assume that’s how all of them drive.
Suspension is what controls ride and handling. If it’s worn out, the car feels sloppy; refreshing it can make the car feel tight and fun again.
Term
refresh everything
This means replacing old, worn-out parts and fixing systems that have gotten tired. The host is saying a well-sorted car can feel totally different from a neglected one.
Porsche 930 is the older 911 Turbo generation. They’re comparing how the turbo power hits—this one comes on more suddenly than the newer car they’re describing.
“Spooling up” means the turbo is winding itself faster as the engine revs and exhaust flow increases. Once it’s spinning enough, it starts making boost and the car feels stronger.
A boost gauge tells you how much pressure the turbo is adding. As you press the gas, the number climbs, and that’s when the car is making its strongest turbo pull.
This is a metaphor meaning the car can handle lots of different kinds of driving. The guest is saying the Porsche 996 feels versatile, not just one-trick.
Bore scoring means the inside of the engine cylinders gets scratched or worn. If it happens, it can lead to oil consumption and engine wear, so the host is saying this is not something you typically have to fear on these engines.
The AOS (air-oil separator) helps keep oil mist out of the engine’s breathing system. The host is saying the related water-pump/maintenance items are normal and not usually a big surprise problem.
Second gear pop out is when the car unexpectedly kicks out of second gear and goes into neutral. The host says it’s mostly seen on earlier years and is usually tied to the transmission internals, not the engine.
A detent is a little mechanical “catch” that helps keep the shifter/gear engaged where it should be. The host is saying a detent-related fix can help stop the gear from popping out.
Tiptronic is an automatic transmission that lets you choose gears yourself if you want. The host is saying the 996 Turbo often comes that way, and it matches the car’s relaxed, long-distance vibe.
Service records are the paperwork showing what work a car has had—like oil changes and repairs. When you’re buying a used Porsche, they help you judge whether the car was cared for.
Tufted leather is a type of seat or panel upholstery where the leather is stitched in a way that creates a slightly padded, patterned look. They’re saying that this kind of leather can hold up differently over time.
An air-cooled engine uses airflow to keep the engine from overheating, rather than circulating coolant. The host is comparing the classic feel of air-cooled 911s to the 996’s more modern, refined experience.
IMS is a part inside the engine that helps drive the timing system. If the IMS bearing fails, it can damage the engine badly, so it’s one of the big things people worry about on some 996s.
Coilovers are aftermarket suspension parts that let you change how the car rides and handles. The “KW V1” is a specific brand/model of coilovers, and the speaker didn’t like them as much as another option.
Part
holand's road track coilovers
These are aftermarket suspension parts that help the car handle better. The speaker liked them a lot on their other Porsche, so they used the same coilovers on this car.
Shifter cables are the cables that connect your gear lever to the gearbox. If they’re worn, shifting can feel sloppy or hard to get into the right gear.
LIVE
Hey everyone, I'm Derek, this is 11 After 9, and this on the screen with me is my friend
Andy.
And Andy is from an unbelievable YouTube site called While You're In There.
And I fell in love with Andy's content really almost from video one because I think Andy
has something special that very few YouTubers really have.
And that is an eye not only for relatable content, but also for storytelling.
And Andy's content captured me when he purchased a Boxster and kind of dove in and talked about
what it was like to drive and then what it was like to rehab and make it his.
And I followed it along every step of the journey.
And so I'm so excited to introduce to some of you, and he's probably already a face
you know for others, to Andy from While You're In There.
Andy, welcome to my podcast.
Thanks for having me, Derek.
It's a pleasure.
Like I was saying just before we got started, this is my first official podcast appearance.
And so I'm honored.
I'm a big fan of podcasting in general.
I have been for a long time and I'm a big fan of yours certainly and everything you've
done with 11 After 9 and before that as well.
So excited to be here, excited to talk Porsos.
Yeah, dude.
So for those of you listening on the radio, Andy is completely showing me up with the
sweetest background.
He's got his cars lined up in his garage behind him and he's set up to chat Porsche.
So Andy, maybe what we can do is this, if you're okay with it, let's just start from
the beginning a little bit and introduce folks to who you are if they haven't been following
your channel.
And by the way, everyone, while you're in there, just search it on YouTube and I'll
say it again at the end of this podcast because it is absolutely something you want to follow.
So Andy, you've been, you have, what's it been?
And maybe two years you've been on YouTube, year and a half, two years?
Yeah, I think, I mean, officially probably five years now but posting an earnest with
while you're in there and the episodes on Porsos specifically, yeah, I think coming
up on two years now.
That's awesome.
And so can we talk about the cars you had and why you got into YouTubing and specifically,
let's talk about your Boxster and what made you pick that as your kind of big car to
show on YouTube?
Yeah.
Well, this is, by the time the viewers see my first episode on the Boxster, they will
understand I guess that that's actually my second Boxster that I owned at that point.
And part of the reason I bought that Boxster is I owned an almost identical 987.2 base
Boxster about a year and a half before that.
And I only kept it for a little while.
It was a perfect example.
It was low mileage, single owner had never been driven in the rain.
I fully PPF'd it.
I like it was a truly perfect car.
But I got caught up in all the things that so many of us get caught up in just wanting
something different and wanting something newer, wanting something more exciting.
And so I ended up selling that car and then spent about a year and a half regretting that
sale and really felt like if I ever found one that was the right spec and the right
condition and the right price at the right time that I would have to jump on it.
And so this one came up on Facebook Marketplace late at night, one night.
And I remember I was laying in bed with my wife and I turned to her and said, oh, boy,
I think I found my next car and your heart starts racing a little bit, right?
You're like, oh, my God, this is it.
This is it.
Yep. And it had just been posted a few hours prior.
And so I messaged the guy really quickly because I thought, ah, this is a good deal.
And it's a special color.
It's like, this is going to go quick.
And thankfully got ahold of him before it had sold and we made a deal.
And yeah, I mean, ultimately it showed up and was exactly as I expected and I expected
it to be a little ratty.
And so that really started the sort of series on bringing this thing back to life.
Why did you want to share it with everyone on YouTube?
What brought you to kind of put it up there for everyone to kind of follow along?
That's a good question.
I love photography.
I love videography.
I've always been a fan of making content.
And so just starting kind of for fun, wanting to make videos that I found entertaining and
sort of enjoy the process.
But most importantly, and sort of the genesis of the channel was really around helping to
convince other people or realize that you can buy cars that are a little bit ratty and
you can buy cars that maybe are a little bit imperfect.
But if you put blood, sweat and tears into them, you can make them much better.
And not only is that yielding you a better car at the end, but you're also going to
learn a lot and you're going to learn a lot about the cars.
You're going to learn a lot about the experience, learn a lot about working on them.
Yeah.
But most importantly for me and sort of the tagline of the channel is a journey of self-discovery
through vehicle maintenance.
And sort of the most important part to me is just learning a lot about myself through
the process and learning about what I'm capable of and, you know, achieving a whole bunch
of things that I didn't know how to do, you know, two years ago.
Yes.
And surprising yourself, right?
Yeah.
And that's the thing with these cars, especially when you, I feel like maybe like 2000s to
the 2010s, those cars are still so approachable.
And I feel like people can surprise themselves that you can do a lot of stuff.
Yeah.
Yeah, you really can.
I mean, you know, ultimately it's just, it's all just nuts and bolts.
And it's, you know, I think there's another YouTuber that always says, you know, anything
made by a human can be fixed by a human.
And I think about that often.
And yeah, it's true.
I mean, some things are difficult.
Some things require specialized tools.
Some things are challenging to do by yourself.
But the reality is, I think, you know, if you're diligent and you're careful and you're good
at researching and understanding how these things work.
I mean, you know, I'm an engineer by trade.
And so I have sort of, I'm technically minded to begin with.
And that certainly helps.
But I love learning.
I love figuring things out.
And it's, it's amazing what you're able to figure out and what you're able to do if
you just set your mind to it.
And take your time and just plan it out and you're not under the gun.
The while I'm going to amend that awesome quote that you just gave me about anything
made by a human can be fixed by a human.
Audis don't count when it comes to that.
I think that they're designed not by a human and they can not be fixed.
So let's just get that out there right now.
Yeah, BMWs too.
But this is a different show, I guess.
You know what, Andy?
We're showing our bias towards Porsche.
We better slow down.
So I love that about you.
And I love that you picked this, this Boxster.
In this, everyone out there, honest to God, this is, this is more happenstance.
I know that I'm a big Poxster fan and we've had a lot of Boxster content on this channel.
I have a Boxster and there's going to be other stuff on this channel too.
It just so happens that Andy, I came to him when it comes to his Boxster.
And we're going to talk about his 911s in a minute.
Andy, you said that when you had your first 987, you sold it and then you regretted it.
Why do you think you missed a base Boxster so much?
It's a great question.
I much like you.
I've heard you talk about it quite a bit in the past.
I'm a fan of the base in general.
I'm a big advocate for base.
I think for most people, it's the right choice.
And I think there's a lot of, we could do probably a whole podcast on that.
The Boxster, I think, if you look at the history of the Boxster in general, obviously,
when it came out, there was a lot of fanfare, but also a lot of hate from 9-11 owners
and 9-11 enthusiasts.
And it's a long history of being called the hairdresser's car or the lesser Porsche
and all that kind of stuff.
And there's always been this undertone of if you know you know,
and if you know really how special the Boxster and the Cayman are,
you understand that they are just as special as a 9-11 can be so many ways.
And in some ways, actually superior, although much like you, I own 9-11s and love them.
But this one in particular, I think the 987.2, it's one of those sort of Goldilocks
generations. It was, you know, 2009 to 2011, it was a new engine architecture.
It did away with the IMS and the IMS bearing, bore scoring concerns and so on and so forth.
But in particular, the base of the 987.2 is a 2.9 liter engine with the new architecture,
but it's not direct injection.
Yes, exactly.
The S of that year is direct injection, but the 2.9 isn't.
I'm sorry, just this is super geeky, but I'm curious about this because
Nathan Merz brought that up to me once about how that was such a sweet spot.
And he said it was a 2009.
Are all the bases from 09 to 12, are they all not direct injected?
Yep, correct.
All the 2.9s.
Okay, so sorry to interrupt, I was just curious about that.
Well, so I fell in love with this being like this sort of one-off weird engine that was in
this sort of halfway in between point between the, you know, the dot ones and the new direct
injections and once I owned it, I sort of immediately realized how special that engine
really is.
And, you know, it's not outrageously powerful.
It's 260 horsepower or something like that, but it sounds incredible.
It's, I mean, like so many flat sixes, it loves to be revved out and it really howls
in the higher RPMs and it's just a wonderful, wonderful engine that is almost completely
without fault.
It doesn't have any of the sort of lingering issues, things that typically go wrong.
It's a very reliable engine and there are so many of them out there with hundreds of
thousands of miles on them that just keep ticking and they're outstanding engines and
just a ton of fun to drive.
And because it's not, it's port injected instead of direct injected, you don't get
carbon buildup on the valves and they also, in my mind, sound a heck of a lot better than
the DFI engines and I just became really, yeah, I became a really big fan of that engine
and that platform.
They're also pretty rare.
I mean, just 08, 019, the Great Recession, they weren't making them and people weren't
buying the bases and so they're, for you to find one is pretty awesome.
It's also important to remember too, that was the first year of the PDK and so many
of the ones that you will find were sold with PDK and so it can be pretty rare, pretty
difficult to find them with a six-speed manual, which this one had.
Such a solid point.
If you find one, grab it.
For real, I mean, I feel like we're kind of letting out a little bit of a secret here
because you're the third person that has said that to me and really fell in love with that
base Boxster Dot 2 motor in that car in general.
Because like you said, styling aside from the Dot 1s to the Dot 2s, they really did,
I feel, in the Boxsters, in the Caymans, really fixed a lot of those little issues that plagued
that first generation and with very few drawbacks.
Yeah, the interiors is slightly nicer too.
It's all the reasons that people love the sort of Dot 2 refined, the 997.2 for all the same
reasons.
It's just those little refinements and those little fixes that just make it a really compelling
package and I think the market is starting to understand that and see that, which is exciting
to see, but also really frustrating to people like us that miss the days where you could get
into one of these for in the teens or low 20s and now those days seem to be long gone, I think.
There's no more free lunches for sure.
We talk about this a lot on 11 after 9 that the rising tide lifts all boats,
but this is not in a good way.
It's just the prices of things are all going up and dragging everything with it and especially
these secret cars that it used to be, the if you know you knows type of cars are getting swallowed
up and they're appreciating too and it's great if you own them.
It's really hard if you're trying to find them and it's really frustrating.
So let's fast forward a little bit.
You did a ton of work to your second Boxster that you had and documented so wonderfully and
beautifully on your channel.
Again, your storytelling is just a step above where there's very few, I don't watch YouTube a
lot. I know that sounds stupid for a YouTube creator, but I like to be creating and I sometimes
don't watch a lot of YouTube for that reason.
I don't have the time.
When I watch your stuff, it's almost kind of like meditation a little bit, the music you play,
the way you relate to the camera, the way you tell the story and you have a lot of open white
spaces. It's very bright. It's very relaxing.
So you document your journey with all the work you've done and then you get to a point, Andy,
where you sell it and you turn this car into kind of a forever Porsche really and then you
sell it and what was that like? Why did you come to that point?
It was a really tough decision. I had a sort of a false start actually last October where I
started to kind of toy with the idea of selling it. There was something else that I was looking at.
Actually another 98702 came in that had come into view and I was considering purchasing it and
just needed to make space and so last October I put up a couple of feelers on Instagram and a
couple of other places and I got an overwhelming response at the time but I got cold feet and
I mostly got cold feet because I felt like I just hadn't really finished the car yet.
Certainly I wanted to continue to enjoy it and love it and drive it but there were
some remaining things that I really wanted to do to get it to the place that I wanted it to be
when I sold it and there was some paint work and some interior stuff and a few other projects
that I really wanted to complete before I sold it. So I set throughout the winter to focus on
those things and get some of those things done and then decided in the spring this year that
it was time. I had put about 3,000 miles on the car. I really loved it. I really enjoyed it but
I like so many of us are sort of serial experiencers and I love trying different things and I love
different experiences and I'm ready for a new project. So it was a difficult decision. I think
about that car almost every day but I'm really happy that it ended up with the person it ended
up with. He's extremely happy with it. He loves it and he's a real enthusiast and yeah,
I mean the auction was quite an experience. Dude, I mean at the end of the day it's a base
auction brought in from a number standpoint almost twice what these cars normally go for
and I don't know exactly if you can put your finger on what it is outside of the fact that
everyone just got swept up in your story and I will say this that I do think that you're the
type of person I want to buy a car from, number one, and you've documented it and your car had a
personality. It was a character on your videos and I can't believe that didn't help in terms of
people wanting to have a part of that. Yeah, I think it did and that was always kind of my
hypothesis and this was a good proof of concept really is to see if there could be value added
to a vehicle outside of even just the mechanical fixes and the paint work and all the things that
were done to the car itself but by making it by fostering a connection between an audience and
the car and it seemed like that was the case and I think a lot of the success of that auction,
I was really, really diligent about the presentation and making sure that the pictures were
high quality and honest and I was in the comments every single day. I was responding
to people within 20 minutes of questions coming up and obviously all those things help but
I really feel like the success story there is showing that you can create a connection
and an emotional connection between an audience and a car by creating this content and connecting
with the audience. And also kind of in a weird way, dude, like making connections with people,
obviously, I'm sure you have people that comment on your videos that become known to you and they
become friendly names that you see for time to time and I had the wonderful pleasure this past
weekend. I did a local cars and coffee at the Porsche Nashwa store and I had a lot of folks that
were just honoring me by coming up and chatting about how much fun they have
and it's cool in that regard but then also from the point of view of once you sell your car,
you can have that connection with the person you sell. It's not like it goes away,
it's kind of like it stays in your orbit because you know them and they feel free to reach out to
you forever. Yeah and I sort of jokingly said, I put out a video when I posted the auction
just sort of running through the service history and records, all the things I did do it and I
sort of jokingly but not so jokingly said at the end that whoever ends up buying it,
like let's make a pact that if you ever decide to sell it, give me a call first.
And I do hope that that proves to be true with the new owner and who knows,
fall ever and end up with that car again. But you're right, you build relationships,
I've built now friendships and relationships with people even that didn't win that car but
bit on it and we're trying to win that car and yeah certainly a relationship with the new owner
as well and I mean it's one of the things that I've loved so much about this entire experience of
posting this content and you know getting to know the communities around these cars is that the
people are incredible and there's so many like-minded folks just like us that are out there that are
just passionate about these things and just want to drive them and talk about them and work on them
and tinker with them and it's just so nice to connect with all of these people all around the
world. And maybe also to Andy, that's because you were driving and then selling a baseboxer.
So by its very nature it wasn't a flex, right? I mean it was for the love of the car and it might
be, I've been so unbelievably bowled over by how nice the folks in the 11 after 9 community are
in terms of they're just great people that love to drive and I get the same sense that the folks
that watch your stuff are that as well and I think that does follow you but talking about cars
that kind of enter back into your orbit and again you're right anytime you sell a car it's like hey
listen first right or refusal please. Can we move can we move just slightly over to one of the cars
sitting behind you which is a 996 turbo which I'm trying to remember I do believe that that
that was yours once and then you did buy that back and so let's talk about 996's we're moving off
a boxers dude we're moving to 996's we're talking 9-11's, hooray hooray. Give me the specs on it
real quick if you could. Yeah so this you're right this is a car I've now owned twice this is a 2001
9-11 turbo in forest green metallic with savannah beige interior in killer color very few of them
in that in that era in that color six-speed manual of course it has about 73,000 miles on it now I
think and it's pretty lightly specced it's got sports seats and a rear wiper as most of the turbos
did at the time but and that's about it which is just the way I like it it's um it's a beautiful car
and something I'm really excited to get deeper into. Where did you end the first time where did
you end up finding a car like that and how long ago was it a couple years ago? It was yeah about
three years ago I found out I'm bringing a trailer actually. Oh you did? Yeah and it was I was kind of
at this point the only Porsche I owned was an air cooled jeep body and I was starting to get the
itch to experiment a little bit with some of the more modern stuff with some of the water cooled
cars and had had just read and watched so many things about the 996 turbo and really felt like
well this is not only does this seem right at my alley but it also seems like something
that's a relative bargain in in Porsche at least it was at the time. It has tents? Yeah exactly and
so I found this one I'm bringing a trailer and and you know those of you that know me and that
follow me know I have a thing for green cars and and so when I found it in this color I thought
well I'm just gonna do anything I can to get my hands on this car and I think I overpaid for it
at the time but it was uh it was the right thing at the right time and and I'm really psyched to
have gotten it. Did um did it come with any issues like you know sometimes the the famous thing and
I'm not gonna bag on bring a trailer but really any online auction outside of your your auction
some of these cars could be misrepresented and um sometimes there's some hidden worries and
hidden issues that you have to deal with. Yeah. Do you have any of that? There were um there the
biggest and and proved to be sort of most expensive and frustrating thing was one of the
wheels was cracked um and these are you know hollow spoke turbo twists and they're they're
hard to find and can be quite expensive and so it was losing a couple of psi a day and I kept
taking it back to the tire shop and they kept saying like we don't we don't know where the
hole is and eventually they dunked it in the tank of water and found a crack in the wheel and so
and those can those those can't be repaired right because they're hollow spoke?
It depends who you talk to some people claim they can. I'm I wasn't willing to take the risk.
So yeah yeah I ended up just finding one um but that that was a big one and and you know to be
honest there were other things that I kind of knew going into it I I knew that it was going to need
a suspension refresh it had about 65,000 miles on it when I bought it and it was on the original
suspension and all the original control arms and bushings and all that stuff needed to be done
and then of course you know the sort of elephant in the room with the 996 turbos coolant pipes and
all those types of things that was always sort of looming over my head um and was part of what
sort of spooked me a little bit into selling it in the first place was I just yes I didn't quite
realize when I bought it what I had gotten myself into and and I got afraid and I wasn't doing much
or any of the work myself at that point so things like a suspension refresh was an extremely scary
and expensive endeavor um and you know certainly coolant pipes and all those types of engine out
jobs was was scary as well so I got a little bit spooked and that's ultimately what caused me to
sell it in the first place. It's funny man you know I completely relate um with what you're saying
and and I think it's a real thing out there where people have a car and there's almost like um it's
almost like a I think of it like a pocket watch and it's like every time you get in it and you're
driving it if it's one of those cars that's known for something whether it's IMS rear main seal
uh boar score or in your case the coolant pipes or the turbo and I feel like it's like you get in
you turn the car on it and you're just it's like you're counting down to when it comes and it takes
away from the enjoyment sometimes. I don't blame you at all for saying I'm going to move on to
something that's quote unquote more reliable um just for those of you out there with the 996
turtle turbo that don't know what we're talking about could you explain real quick about the
coolant pipes and why they're kind of an issue in a worry? Sure yeah so on these mesgar engines so
certainly all the mesgar engines from the 996 and the 997 generation which would be you know the
turbos the GT2s and GT3s of those generations they all used a sort of glue or epoxy to hold the coolant
pipe fittings into the case of the engine and that epoxy over time has shown to fail and when
that happens the fitting sort of releases from the engine and ultimately you lose all of your coolant
very very quickly so this is you know often not catastrophic in the sense that you'll lose your
engine um that that is if you notice it and you you would probably um and you shut off your engine
quickly enough to save it not overheat and so on and so forth but um it's uh it's a pretty big job to
prevent it can be fully prevented this is you know it's it's a lot like the IMS bearing
issue in in the sense that you can do one thing and it will prevent it for life
but it's a big job and it's an engine out job you have to you know remove the engine from the car
have the coolant pipes either welded in place or do what people call pinning which is essentially
you know screwing in a sort of a tapping screw into the fitting to prevent it from removing
from falling out and then you're good it's it'll never happen again and and it won't be an issue
but up until that point where you have it fixed you definitely it's hard to really enjoy these
cars knowing that you might be on the freeway at some point and lose all of your coolant in an
instant and um that you know that can be a little a little scary and I agree I mean you know I don't
want to get too mired down by these types of things because anything can happen to any car at any time
but things like that that you know are likely to happen at some point yeah definitely can
can wreck the the enjoyment of it yeah it's it's true and you know they say this about the IMS
it's not a if but when and uh you know I I wonder we've in the past kind of delved into uh you know
the bore score thing the IMS thing what those numbers are and maybe that is overblown um I
my sense is and please tell me I'm wrong Andy that when it comes to the coolant pipes it is maybe
a little bit more when not if just because of the thermo cycles on the engine the epoxy is
going to get stressed over time yeah there's been a lot of people that have tried to you know
build sort of correlations between uh climates where these cars are driven or how they're driven
whether they're tracked or not tracked or you know those types of things to try to understand if
there's anything that that can be done to uh to either prevent it or prolong it or you know if if
there's a way to sort of predict that it will happen and honestly the correlation between any of
those things largely isn't there and so I think what we're seeing now is these cars are I mean this
this is a 25 year old car at this point um these as these engines age uh it is happening more
frequently and and I am personally of the camp that that believes that it will happen to all of them
and maybe there are ones that will you'll get 700,000 miles out of it before it happens and
you're very lucky but it will happen at some point and if you really want to be sure that
you're not stuck in that situation you just have to bite the bullet and fix it bite the bullet and
fix it or buy a car that's already had it done yeah coke and Pepsi pin it or weld it these are
the two camps this is like west side story and they're fighting each other neither one's wrong
neither one's right which way did you go I went pinning um and uh there were a couple of reasons
welding forever pinning sucks no I'm just kidding I don't even know the difference between them I
just want to give you a hard time I I don't have a super strong feeling about it um part of the
reason I went pinning is the two shops that I were talking that I was talking to locally here um
both advocate for pinning they only do pinning um okay and uh so you know just out of convenience I
think it made more sense um but you know there's I I think it ultimately it all comes down to
the people doing the job and the quality of the job I think there have been cases where
welds have failed or there's been pinholes and welds it's a really difficult um it's a really
difficult piece to weld properly I think if done by a really skilled um welder I think it can be
trusted but if done by someone who's maybe a little bit less experienced with it could potentially
be more problematic uh but again it's really to me if your shop if your local shop that you
trust to do this job advocates for welding over pinning or pinning over welding take them at
their word and trust them I I think you can't go wrong either way either way you're you're buying
yourself peace of mind yeah you are and you're getting the job done um and I'm afraid that I'm
not super knowledgeable in that topic but like always on this podcast I find myself with my
guests and you especially because you're so well versed in these cars that we descend down into
the whole of nerdery and we are deep right now in the whole of nerdery um and let's climb back out
for a minute and um can we just talk about the 996 turbo in general because what a cool car
number one and it's a car that was the bargain turbo as you had said for a long time and it
it kind of had this like thing around it where it was this approachable speed but the market is
responding to that like all things Porsche like we talked about earlier and and those prices have
come up as well what's it like to drive man like like honestly in in uh spoiler alert
Andy put out a video about what it's like to drive and so but for the for the 11 after
night audience until they go watch your video after this podcast what you you you've had your
boxers you have a 993 like talk to me about this turbo what's it like to drive
for starters uh it's fast it's really quick and it you know it was it was super car fast
at the time and even by today's standards it's really quick i mean zero to 60 in in the low
fours uh or high threes depending on who's measuring um but uh it's it's really really quick
it's sort of a kind of old school turbo feel in the sense that there is turbo lag and and you
know you're sort of you're waiting for it to spool up and then it just hits you like a roller coaster
but not not quite so extreme you know like you might feel on on the older tour on like a 930 or
or things like that right um it's really really drivable it's so it's really easy to enjoy the
speed um and certainly very easy to uh exceed uh speed limits um yes but i think you know to answer
your your question what's it like to drive i think that the answer kind of is it depends and i think
this is this is a thing that i'm finding a lot with certainly with boxers a lot with 996 is is
there are perceptions of how these cars are to drive that are based often on people's experiences
with cars that are maybe less than stellar examples of them yeah that's fair and so i think
you know we've seen this a lot with boxers 986 boxers this happens all the time you know people
don't take care of 986 boxers because they haven't historically been worth much and so most of them
that are out there in pretty rough shape you know suspensions in bad shape they haven't been well
cared for and people drive them and think oh this is this is a piece of junk yep um and i think we
see that in 996's as well because historically they really haven't been worth much um and so
there's a lot of really beat-up ones out there and certainly a lot of beat-up turbos too and
the the 996 turbo when it was new it was really i think like most turbos even to this day it was
really a grand tour it was you know a sort of a cruiser it was softer and heavier than than all
of the other 911s at the time um but even then even uh you know taking that into consideration
it's still a 911 it still drives like a 911 it's still you know still has the rear engine
feel and and all that kind of stuff but i think if you take one of them and you really get it
dialed in you update the suspension you you you know bring it up to today's standards and and you
refresh everything it's it's a really really compelling driving experience and um i think
people are missing out if they've only ever driven a ratty one and haven't driven one that's truly
dialed in yep like a high mileage clapped out one that just hasn't been touching you what a great
point that is andy you're right you know it you have to take a look at the the item or the the
individual car that you're driving and you can't make broad generalizations about a whole range
you know of um of them and and and 986 is a great example i did a video on a 986 and i'll be honest
with you i saw where it the value was in terms of entry-level portion ownership it wasn't compelling
to me and i was just kind of honest in the video and a lot of people reached out and they were
kind of slamming me about like you need to drive a dialed in one they're like the best thing ever
and maybe they're right about that and you know maybe the one i had was a little bit tired and i
shouldn't pass judgment and so what a great point to make about that um you know i have uh the experience
i had mentioned to you in a 911 turbo s which a little bit faster in terms of horsepower etc etc
but generally the same thing one of the things i really enjoyed about that car
and you hit the nail on the head uh having owned a 930 in the past that power delivery with the
turbo was very light switch what i loved about the 996 was that when the turbo came on it was like
this elastic band and you just felt like the the higher you went in the reverence the faster
that elastic band was contracting and you it was like a slingshot and it would what a what a addictive
thing uh to to drive over and over again on back roads yeah it really is and and i think you know
one of the other sort of brilliant pieces about the 996 and 997 turbos too is this mesgar engine
this 3.6 mesgar engine is is unlike some of the other flat sixes it is actually pretty torquey
at the low end um and so you've got power all the time um you just have an incredible amount of
power once the turbo starts spooling up but it it is it it just feels like it's it's like a race
horse that's being held back it is an incredible incredible feeling when you're starting to it's
got the boost gauge in in the you know in the dash cluster and you can see it you know starting to
increase a little bit and you know you've you've just got it ready and waiting and if you put your
foot down it's going to really wow you it's it's a pretty incredible experience
the most enticing german word uh actually i shouldn't say it's a german word it's a it's a
unit of measurement bars and does your gauge have bars as bars yeah bars in terms of what the what
the pressure is and it's uh it's a very cool thing though you you also were very correct in my
estimation that that car has long legs and you can tell that it really wants to be in like high
speed sweepers where you can really exercise the upper rev range and i didn't find it the car i had
it to be like a real back roads car where maybe the base boxer is where tight technical stuff
it was a little bit heavier but boy when you get into it i mean what a great way to cross
state lines in that car yeah no kidding i mean i when i bought it i from a guy out of
Atlanta and then had a four-hour drive back home uh here to middle tennessee and and i mean
it was a perfect a perfect cruiser and pulling off the freeway and doing some back road rips
occasionally i mean it was just it was delightful and and yeah i mean i'm with you to to be honest and
i don't want to spoil it for anybody but i don't think there's any better back roads
car than a boxer like i don't think anything even comes close um but uh and and this certainly
doesn't but it is a lot of fun and a lot of fun and in really wildly different ways than than the
boxer is such a capable car it's maybe much more than a boxer more of a swiss army knife of yeah
what do you want to do today um game let's go yeah you know type of ride um what if people
i know a lot of people reach out to me i'm sure they reach out to you about what are some secrets
about finding 996 is what should i look for i'd love to let the audience know like
the people that are looking what are some of the things they should be aware of if they're
looking for 996 turbos andy well i would say to begin not even talking about 996 turbos but
talking about 996 is in general i'm a lover of the 996 and i've shared this in one of my videos
but you know the 996 was the new 911 when i was growing up and so it was the one that i had a
poster of on my wall and the 993 first and then and then the 996 these were these were really
my sort of iconic uh my my iconic generations of Porsche growing up and um and i think you know
obviously we've gotten to this point now where a lot of people are scared of them and a lot of
people are uh are concerned that you know that they uh aren't going to hold their value or
they're going to have issues they're going to put them in the poor house because of of catastrophic
problems and i would say i'm a i'm a big lover of all of the 996 is not just the turbo i've had a
c4s as well um and so people that are interested in 996 is uh or think you might be or maybe it's
just the only 911 that is within your price range and sure you you want to get into it but that's
the only that's the only one that works for you economically don't be afraid and and by all means
proceed because there's a lot of really great stuff out there and and they are outstanding
cars it is truly i've i've owned almost every generation of of 911 from 3.2 g body up to to
modern you know 992s and i keep coming back to the 996 as being just one of my favorites and so
um the 996 in general i'm a huge fan of when it comes to turbos you know one of the great
things about these engines is aside from the coolant pipes they're really really rock solid
engines and so there's not a lot that you have to worry about from a maintenance perspective
you will see a lot of high mileage ones people have uh people have have really put mileage on
these cars and and you could go you know hundreds and of thousands of miles
with these engines and and not need to rebuild if they're well taken care of there's really no
sort of catastrophic issues to be concerned about bore scoring isn't a thing the ims bearing
isn't a thing um you know aos water pump you know all of those types of things are all very
standard uh there you know there's not anything in particular that stands out as as big concerns and
so uh you know you're if you're looking at a sherbo you're looking at something probably
pretty reliable there are some nuances with certain years and potential transmission issues
there's a thing called second gear pop out which can happen happen I think largely in the in the
sort of earlier ones 2001 2002 where when coasting in second gear your your your car will just pop
out of second gear into neutral and this as far as I understand largely just requires a transmission
rebuild to fix there's a little piece of detent that you can put in that can help prevent it but
that is a flaw in the transmission seems to be pretty rare my car is a 2001 my car does not
have it not to say that it won't ever but you know that does come up occasionally in in discussions
about these cars but otherwise you know you're you're pretty safe with any of them you will find
a lot of them with tiptronic transmissions and I haven't ever driven one tip turbos a lot of tip
turbos and I think that speaks you know sort of to the intention of the 996 turbo too which you
know again was meant to be sort of a cruiser was meant to be a GT car and I think the tiptronic
probably lends itself well to that so far as I understand it's a decent tiptronic but I've
never driven one I can't speak to it but you know I certainly I would recommend a six speed manual
if you can find one and otherwise you know really it comes down to you know general
condition that you'll find on any car and you know take a look at service records take a look at
interior condition it's a 996 interior so they don't wear particularly well yeah true and you'll
find a lot of them that are you know ugly tufted gray and things like that that were in vogue at
the time I guess but but didn't age super well but one of the things that that I'll talk about in
sort of future videos is how to kind of spruce up the interior of these cars and clean it up and
and get it looking fresh again and you know there's a lot you can do I like the 996 interior in
general but I do think you know certainly when it's ratty it doesn't age super well yeah the
leather gets this like hard kind of plasticky patina to it yeah yeah what is it about gray interiors
and I'm sorry out there for those of you that might have them I'm not slamming you it's just
those early 2000s I mean even the 993 is a little bit but the 993s were soft or tufted leather
and I felt like wore a little bit better but like the 996s 997s the gray just kind of turned
like this almost like brown kind of pukey color that it was never really sharp again after the
first year of ownership what is it about that it's strange yeah the carpet sometimes turns
sort of a purpley gray to like it's just it is very odd I like to think that like almost everything
in sort of fashion world that like whatever is not cool today will at some point be cool in the
future true so maybe gray interiors will have their time I'm impatiently waiting but but
but yeah you will find a lot of 996s in general and certainly a lot of 996s with gray interiors
which is too bad but you know if that is less important to you then you can certainly get one
for less expensive as a result yeah I do kind of feel like there that does reflect in the price
a little bit for sure and I'm going to echo your love on the 996s I have never had the pleasure
of owning one for sure there is one in my future there's no doubt about it maybe it came in first
but I do think that in the 996s I've driven what I keep coming back to what I love about them is
of course there's a lot of reasons why when they came out they got slammed and we don't have to
get into that but the fact that it was just not a 993 really did put it at such a disadvantage
for such a long time and every time I get in them and drive them I immediately think like I can feel
the shifting is from a 993 like it feels to me old-school air-cooled shifting but the motor
has more pep and it has not as not more character certainly but it has enough character that it
harkens back to you know what was an air-cooled motor and I'm constantly surprised when I drive
them about how much fun they are they are a little bit more civilized maybe than the air-cooled cars
they can't not be but if you can get yourself a stripped down 996 like give me a blue 996 with
a beige interior coupe all day and and you drive it you're like this is a great car I could drive
this car every day and you can they're reliable enough that you can yeah they're reliable they're
really comfortable the the interior space is great the seats are comfortable you know generally that
the suspension is is compliant and comfortable and you know it's it's still a 25 plus year old
car but it's relatively quiet inside certainly a quieter experience than than an air-cooled car
and and yeah you you absolutely can drive it every single day and and I've encouraged many
people many of my friends who are considering buying a 996 I've always said to them listen just buy
one that you think is the best you can find at the time and just drive it and look if it if it
has bore scoring three years from now or the IMS fails and the engine blows up whatever but just
drive it every single day until then and enjoy the heck out of it and if that happens it happens but
like we could all get hit by a bus tomorrow too like we can't worry about everything all the time so
I'm 100% with you and I you know I own a 993 and it's it's really interesting looking at the 993
I have a 1997 993 and then the 2001 911 turbo and looking at them as being only four years apart
from each other but feel like they're from different centuries like it's like years it's
unbelievable how different they are but then you go and you drive the 996 and and exactly what you
just said it it is still raw mechanical um you know has a lot of that same
sort of air cooled ethos but just feels like a much more refined and modern experience
what do you have on your menu for things you're going to be doing in upcoming videos to your 996
what can we look forward to so I have a video that's coming out soon um about the suspension
so I did a suspension refresh on it just completed it last week actually um I it actually the previous
owner had done um some suspension work on it he had kw v1 coilovers on it that I wasn't a huge fan of
and I had put holand's road track coilovers on my c4 s and and really loved them so I I did that on
this car I'd you know refreshed all the control arms and and all that kind of stuff and and really
I'm just kind of working on getting it to you know sort of base base level a baseline um I need to
replace the shifter cables and and a few other little things and then to be honest it's it's
really just enjoying it and and this is I think perhaps much less of a project than the Boxster
was and so perhaps there will be less content or maybe even less compelling content for this car
and and I should say too I'm not the idea of getting into another project car is not off the table
I'm always looking I'm always always interested in things that could come up um but I think the
big priority for me is is really just getting this car to a point where I'm really happy with
it and then just enjoying it in the ways that I felt like I kind of didn't get to the first go around
and uh and you know we're we're coming up into sort of the prime driving season of the year right
now and and I'm just excited to get out and and really love it get to know it and then you know
decide if it's the right thing for me long term or if it's a car that I want to move along or replace
it with something else or who knows I mean it would be really cool to see the other side of your
content about actually using a 996 turbo you know what it's like to be in the wild and get into
those sticky situations and and what is that like because you're right it's it is a car to be used
every day and it's I think sometimes and I can only speak for myself but sometimes you get I get so
focused on you know fixing a car up and getting it where I think it needs to be and doing all
the things and then I get there and then I'm almost like the board is not the word the word
is like tired where it's like I've I've spent so much mental energy getting to where it is
that now it's time to move on it's almost like you lose interest a little bit yeah and it sounds
like this car that's not going to be the chance and you can actually get out there and actually
put some miles on it that's my hope and and same goes for the 993 too I shared in my most recent
video that I've the 993 has been my least driven car over the last couple of years and you know
largely last year was spent on the Boxster and that took priority and there was also a handful
of things that I wanted to get done on the 993 as well that over time I sort of chipped away at
but I feel like I really haven't driven that car as much as I want to and and as much as it deserves
and so both of these cars I I really just want to drive the heck out of them this year and and
enjoy the experience enjoy the sort of fruits of my labor and and you know ultimately in that
process to figure out what I like figure out what I don't like and figure out what I feel like I'm
missing and yeah hopefully that can inform what I end up with next and that's it it's just like
this it's like a filter constant refinement of each ownership experience it really
informs what you love and what you don't love and then you just kind of refine that I mean it's a
lot like maybe dating you know you find out what you like and you don't like and then you end up
with the perfect person and I do think that my Porsche ownership is reflective of that
and for those of you out there Andy really does do his own work I texted him today being like hey
man we good for later and he sent me an awesome picture of him doing a laser alignment on his
car he was obviously on his back doing this and he's he's the real deal and I'm not gonna lie I'm
a little jealous because I have great equipment but sometimes I don't have the gumption
or the time and and Andy you're absolutely someone that I look to for that and so we're
believe it or not my friend you blink and we're coming up on an hour and so I just really want
to from the bottom my heart say thank you for taking the time to chat with me I want to encourage
everyone out there on 11 after 9 go check out while you're in there search for it on YouTube I'm
going to put the description of the YouTube channel down below the videos and give Andy
some love he's a great person I think he's a great ambassador of the brand and and he's
hell of a nice person and he's someone I'm really happy he's in the orbit of 11 after 9 and I'm
very thankful for you Andy well thank you Derek and and I mean the feeling is mutual I've got a
lot of respect and appreciation for you and everything you're doing out there in the community
and and yeah similarly a great ambassador for the brand in this community and I'm just I'm
thrilled you reached out and and really excited to do this and yeah and thank you to everybody
that watches the content that everybody that's already watched it or people that are new and
please enjoy it reach out comment reach out to me on Instagram and yeah I love connecting with
with viewers and and with other really passionate people so thank you all for for watching and and
excited to have more conversations like this in the future and many more conversations we shall
have buddy because we just we didn't even touch on really anything today so
we can ask the audience to expect more of that but my friend have a wonderful afternoon thank
you again and for everyone else we will see you next Tuesday bye now
About this episode
Andy from While You’re In There joins Eleven After Nine to talk Boxster ownership, restoration, and why “ratty” cars can become great drivers once you put in the work. The conversation zooms out to Boxster culture, the 987.2 “Goldilocks” sweet spot, and 996 Turbo buying decisions—especially coolant-pipe risk, engine-out preventative fixes, and the 996’s old-school turbo feel. They also cover how documentation and community can add real value when selling.
The 996 Turbo is the most supercar you can buy for sports-car money — and the one a lot of people are still too scared to own. So Derek sat down with Andy from the "While You're In There" Youtube Channel to settle it: is the bargain-Turbo reputation real, or are those coolant pipes a clock you'll regret ignoring?
They get into the Mezger engine and why it sidesteps the IMS and bore-scoring drama, what these cars are actually like to drive once they're dialed in, and exactly what to look for before you buy one. Plus a detour into Andy's 987.2 base Boxster — the port-injected 2.9 nobody talks about — and the auction that sold it for nearly double.
PLEASE go check out and Subscribe to Andy's youtube Channel
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► Andy — While You're In There: www.youtube.com/@whileyoureinthere
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CHAPTERS
00:00 Meet Andy (While You're In There)
02:03 Why a base Boxster — twice
06:54 The 987.2 secret: the port-injected 2.9
12:48 Selling it: the auction that went 2x
18:32 Enter the 996 Turbo (2001, Forest Green)
21:06 Buying off the internet: cracked wheels & hidden costs
