Ep. 305: The Absolute BEST And WORST Truck Engines!

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Welcome to TFL Talking Trucks podcast.

In case this episode, I need to get something off my chest.

Really? I didn't expect that.

Well, it has to do with truck engines, which is what we do, pick up trucks, right?

I didn't think there was going to be this much drama around truck engines.

Yeah, but it's sifted into my personal life.

Really? Yes.

Explain.

Because there was news earlier, like a week ago, not, sorry, let me rephrase.

There was a rumor because GM hasn't announced really their next generation of V8 engines

completely. We don't know the specs yet.

But GM Authority, which is pretty authoritative website.

Yeah, it's a good place to find some pretty credible information about GMs.

They talked about the sizes of their upcoming engines, V8 engines.

We actually have it on our TFL truck website.

But when I was doing that story, I entered this existential crisis for some reason.

Because you want to take your 4.8 LS swap and do a 6.6?

Not quiet. I just thought to myself, if GM is investing almost a billion dollars

into generation six small block V8 engines, they should be like amazing.

Right. Yeah, I agree.

But I'm not sure they will be amazing.

Well, they're making them bigger.

So that's good.

The 5.3 is becoming a 5.7.

And the 6.2, a 6.6.

Those are good things.

Yeah, I'm happy about that.

That is the unofficial number, right?

So this is according to GM Authority.com.

So we have to be very clear, right?

So GM has not announced this yet.

The only thing GM said is actually, this was several months back, actually,

that they said they're working on Gen 6 still.

They're retooling their factory, specifically Northern New York State.

I think it was near Buffalo or Buffalo.

And that will be like four to six percent more efficient

than the previous generation V8 engines.

And presumably more powerful.

They didn't quite talk about power quite yet.

But we have to assume it's going to be more powerful.

It's a bigger engine.

You would kind of figure as much.

So it's good to see that they're at least investing in V8.

So like we've said in the past,

we've known this for a while that they were going to do this.

The V8s are not going away from the GM lineup.

No, no.

But the reason why kind of I entered this kind of thought crisis

is because I was thinking to myself,

I need like a, well, personally, if I think about like new pickup trucks,

I want like a quantum leap.

I don't want to spend, you know,

if a company spends almost a billion dollars on something,

I want it to be like twice as powerful or twice as efficient.

You know, let's not talk about four percent improvements here.

Well, but that's just on efficiency.

We don't know yet what they're going to do with these V8s.

Arguably, GM is the king of V8s.

The small block Chevy is historically one of the most important engines

in the United States.

And I think the best selling engine in history of engines.

Yeah.

So potentially because they did a story like a year ago

where they were marking like a hundred million small blocks sold.

Which is a lot.

A hundred million.

Yeah.

So that kind of brings us to the topic of today's podcast.

We're talking about the best engine for a truck.

And we're going to talk about a lot of different sizes of trucks.

Yes.

I do want to just say right from the get go, historically,

you could definitely make an argument that in all of history,

the small block Chevy is the most important engine for a truck.

Exactly.

Right.

So that's why I think this episode of our podcast

is really about the best engine.

Not maybe specific.

We'll talk about all the engines.

Yeah.

And also.

Maybe not every single engine ever.

How much time do we have?

We got an hour.

Also, Don, one of our viewers.

By the way, we're live on patreon.com slash tfl car.

So thank you very much for your support.

Thank you for joining our live shows for this podcast.

This is how you can get our podcast before anybody else gets our podcast.

And Don actually comments here and he says,

I hope you will talk about the gas particulate filter.

This is the story that kind of was up front.

Also front and center this week.

Yeah.

That's the other piece of news that we want to talk about.

So the first piece of news was that GM is doing their Gen 6 V8s.

And it's going to be a 5.7 and a 6.6.

We don't know tons more information than that at the moment.

But that particular filter.

We have official information about this.

Yeah.

That's the other bit of news.

And there's been a slight change since the story first broke.

Yeah.

Exactly.

And actually a YouTube channel CTE Tech talked about this a couple of weeks ago.

So I want to give a shout out to CTE Tech because and this was precipitated.

We're talking about Ford EcoBoost 3.5 engines.

So their biggest twin turbo engine.

And we're talking about them adding a gasoline particulate filter or GPF to those EcoBoost engines.

So this is not affecting 2.7 EcoBoost.

This is not affecting a 3.0.

This is not affecting the 5.0 V8 specifically for 3.5.

And their website Ford.com.

And we actually have their website here that we could show you if you're watching this podcast

is that the power numbers changed on their website specifically for the 3.5 EcoBoost

and also their hybrid engines, the 3.5 Hybrid.

Yeah.

On the 3.5 for 2026 on their website it says 382 horsepower and you actually did

the work to reach out to Ford's PR team and ask a little bit more about this.

And they said that this is a typo and that the horsepower is not going to change.

Yeah.

Because it was previously 400 horsepower.

So it was really easy to remember and I'm kind of a numbers dude too like you.

So V8 5 liter Coyote 400 horse.

3.5 EcoBoost 400 horse.

They cost about the same money.

Yeah.

There are different types of engines.

So if you're looking for sound like our tremor, you go V8.

And different power curves.

Yes.

If you're looking for low end torque you'd go eat twin turbo but same power numbers.

So when we saw this on their website it started ringing a lot of bells in my head.

Alarm bells.

Yeah.

As it did I think for a lot of people which is why viewers like Don are asking the question.

Yes.

So now I have a quote from PR for PR so public relations and it says,

the GPF the gasoline particulate filter does not influence power train numbers

as they are the same between the 2026 model year and the 2025 model year.

There are typos on our website and we're getting those fixed.

So this is the statement from them.

So this is a little weird but nonetheless it also kind of got into my brain.

I'm like well is now a V6 twin turbo bad engine?

Not bad engine but like not the most ideal engine.

Do you see what I'm saying?

Yeah.

What is the most ideal engine for a truck?

Yeah.

So that's kind of what got us on to the topic for today's podcast.

And the way that we want to do this is we want to start with the most popular trucks.

We're going to start with half tons.

And then we're going to work our way down to mid size and down to compact trucks.

And finally at the end of the podcast we'll finish strong talking about HDs.

And then we'll make the final call.

Yeah what's the best engine of them all?

Yes of them all.

Yeah so you want to go ahead and start with half tons?

Yeah let's do it.

So there's a lot of engines in these trucks because they sell a lot of these trucks.

Yes.

Primarily V8s twin turbo V6s.

Which is becoming more prevalent actually.

Some hybrid systems.

Yes.

Some fully electric powertrains.

And also a turbo diesel.

Turbo diesel.

Yes.

And now there's also well in the near future there's going to be a range extended electric

powertrain so there's really a lot of options.

Yeah I think we can cross the entire gamut of engine types just within the half ton segment.

So let's start with the V8.

Yeah the V8.

Pretty simple right?

Historically has been the go-to engine for half ton trucks, trucks of that size.

And GM has kind of ruled that space for a really long time historically.

That being said five liter coyote V8 is arguably the king at the moment.

Especially if you want to build a high horsepower street truck.

People are throwing superchargers, throwing turbos at coyotes and making insane power figures.

Exactly.

There's a lot of potential with that engine.

Yeah and we actually own one of these.

We alluded to it of course and you've been watching us you know.

2025 F-150 trimmer with a 50 V8.

We have it.

We have many videos.

In fact we published another drag race video this week.

And like you said it's a great engine for truck.

It's great engine for enthusiasts because it's a high revving engine.

Like specifically like for example Roman is drag racing it in this video.

The red line is just above 6000.

So it's a rev happy engine.

Oh and it loves to rev.

And it finds its power up there.

And again the aftermarket potential for a coyote is pretty limitless.

So V8s are still fantastic.

The Ram V8s.

Brought the hammy back.

Yeah yeah.

The hammy is back.

Which is nice.

They are comparatively dated.

Yes and not as rev happy as the fourth engine.

But still I mean I mean it's been around for what 20 something years.

And it's still a V8.

Yes.

But I do want to give credit to Ram when it comes to turbo straight six options.

Because in general for myself and this is a personal preference.

But between a V6 and a straight six I generally lean towards straight sixes.

And the three liter hurricane that you can get in the Ram now is a really impressive engine.

It's a gem.

And we're experiencing more and more of this engine.

It came out what just over a year ago into the pickup truck world with Ram.

And the more we test it I think the more we like it with one caveat.

It's as quiet as a mouse.

Yeah and in something like an RHO where they made it a little bit louder.

It doesn't sound that exciting maybe.

Yeah.

So it's maybe missing that a little bit.

But between an RHO and an EcoBoost powered Raptor I actually like the hurricane in the RHO more.

Yeah well it makes more power.

I mean if you look on paper even the high output straight six twin turbo in the Ram RHO is a 540

horsepower.

And also so that's more than 450 in the high output forward.

And way more than the GM V8.

So we talked about GM V8 engines you know selling hundreds of millions of engines but

once they do a version of it they stick to it.

The current six two and five threes have been around also quite a long time.

But what the hurricane doesn't have is a hybrid option like a power boost.

Exactly.

And the power boost offers you a few extra goodies that are really useful in particular

the power takeoff that you can use to power as much as a welder which we've actually done.

We've done a demo of that and we used your power to weld.

And that's a really cool feature and capability to have plus the fact that with a power boost

with that hybrid system you have a massive torque figure.

Exactly and it's a very quick vehicle as well.

But here's the thing and I think a lot of commenters and by the way we also have a comment

on Patreon from Michael.

So Michael said I was watching one of your older videos where you were driving F250 and GMC

2500.

We'll talk about heavy duties in just a few minutes through snow and it did not appear that you

aired down the tires.

Is there a benefit to airing down when traveling through deep snow.

Yes but let's get back to that.

Yeah yeah we can we can come back to that.

Yeah but I think people who are listening and watching right now they're saying okay

you introduce turbos to an engine you introduce electric motor and you know into the transmission

like the hybrid you're adding complexity.

Yeah you are.

So there's not any brand new truck you can buy that comes without complexity so that

doesn't necessarily bother me.

Yeah and do you see where my crisis is coming in now?

It's like.

Are you having more than one crisis?

Crisis sees.

What is the plural of crisis?

Crisis.

No it's like it's like I would I want an awesome engine and awesome means also durable

reliable right.

So that's what pickup trucks really are about.

They're about you know backing you up and helping you doing your work maybe recreation

you know when you're going on vacations or when you're doing your job it has to be reliable

and durable.

Yeah and when it comes to reliable and durable it's hard to beat the 57i Force V8 that you have

in your older tundra.

Yes.

Now we are primarily for this podcast focusing on engines you could go out and buy brand

new right now.

Yeah right now yeah.

Because if we brought in all of truck history into this.

We would be here for maybe all day eight hours.

It would be a much longer podcast.

But it is still worth noting because that's still a reasonably recent engine.

Yes.

You can get a lightly used truck with the 57i Force V8.

That's a hard engine to beat for longevity.

Exactly and mine currently has about 92,000 miles and it acts as if it was brand new.

I mean no hiccups nothing and also we have to talk about transmissions a tiny bit right

because over the years over the last what five years we've gone from for example a six

speed automatic in that tundra.

We've gone to mostly ten speeds and some you know eight speeds and such.

So we are also manufacturers also changing their transmission lineup as well.

Yeah which is great especially when you're pulling a trailer and if you live up in the

mountains where we do more gears in the transmission more ratios choose from is better.

But in general hybrid systems in trucks very impressive.

Yeah and partially I think a huge benefit that you mentioned working with your truck

welding off of it helping a friend helping to charge your friend's electric car or truck right.

All those benefits are there with a hybrid like the Ford F-150.

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Yeah and then as far as a range extender it remains to be seen.

We don't know we don't know but speaking of complexity the range extended chassis that

Ram showed recently there's a lot of complexity there.

There's a large fuel tank there's a large battery there's two electric motors.

You've got basically two power trains.

Two complete power trains with an exhaust system too.

Two complete power trains for example we saw the new Grand Wagoneer range extended as well

and that's coming on sale very very soon and here's the chassis.

There's a lot of go there's not an empty spot on this frame.

There's a lot going on I think if you're shopping for a brand new truck it's not

that likely statistically speaking it's not likely that you're going to hold on to this

truck for 20 years and 450,000 miles yeah so I think for the most part for the people that

are actually shopping for one of these it's it's fine it's kind of a non-issue because you'll

probably hold on to the truck for 100 150,000 miles in five to 10 years but I get where you're

coming from it will be an interesting powertrain to test though oh yeah and also it will have the

power takeoff options yeah you'll be able to use it to weld off of I want to see actually somebody

who owns a Grand Wagoneer for welding off the Wagoneer yeah yeah I want to see that I don't

know if that's going to happen a ton but we could do it yeah we could demo it why not anyways so

while we're talking about half tons um case I think let's kind of discuss first of all a little

bit more about the gasoline particulate filter and also let's pick our favorite powertrain yeah

because we still haven't talked about what I would argue are the peak engines in half ton trucks

two in particular continue okay the trx which went away but we know is coming back coming back

yeah and the raptor are oh I thought you're gonna go three liters straight six duramax

we haven't talked about that either which I do want to talk about because that's one of my favorite

engines in a half ton truck because it's straight six yeah and it's a diesel yes tons of torque

great fuel economy yeah let's go ahead and talk about it three liter duramax our producer coal

is hating us right now is it because we're jumping topics he's not hating us any more than usual

and our listeners are hating us let's talk about the duramax because you and I've tested on the

denver 100 mpg loop yeah uh we run it we've been running it for years and we towed the trailer and

it was super impressive yeah it's it's a fantastic engine it gives you a lot of the perks that you

would get from stepping up to an hd with fuel economy with torque with towing behavior capability

everything yeah so three liter duramax fantastic engine there's a reason that that's around

in the eco diesel and and gm really won that game yeah they stepped away from their half ton

diesel so did ram yeah and you know the Nissan Titan no longer exists right it's been discontinued

so gm really won the small diesel game yeah absolutely and it's a fantastic engine we love

that three liter duramax it's also impressively quiet not very clattery it's very smooth it's

comfortable but the range that you get from it the torque that you get it's awesome yeah it's a

great engine and it's an engine that gives you a great driving range with a smaller fuel tank

you don't need 36 gallons or 40 gallons of fuel you only have what about 24 but that's that's

plenty to go 500 miles or maybe more on a tank on that one tank yeah which is awesome i think

Nathan and i drove almost 600 miles one time in a ucon with a three liter duramax yeah great

but once again i'm gonna say the peak engine that we've tested so far in half ton for me

is a raptor r explain because i was gonna i'm gonna argue with you are you i like the hellcat

really so you like the trx motor more than the so partially raptor r so the raptor r engine

is incredible because it's basically a race car engine in the truck yeah and that's how it feels

yes and the weight revs you know they have a digital gauge now in the for example there after r

the tech the tack is digital and i don't know if the digital image can keep up with the revs

the rev changing revolutions of that engine it's incredible oh it's such an impressive engine

but there's something missing like when we put we used to own an f150 raptor r and this was after

we owned the trx and the trx is still sticking in my mind as a slightly more favorable truck

it just there's something maybe this raptor engine is too refined in the hellcat you hear the blower

a little bit more you know it kind of winds and breathes but the raptor r was a bit quicker

it was yeah and to me so when when we had our trx and shortly after had our raptor r the raptor r

was more expensive but it felt like they took the trx formula and just made it a bit better

they refined it yeah but and i agree with you but it seems like when you are going for the top of

the line truck it needs to be more raw you have to refine it less right does that make sense

you know what i'm saying but it's like it has to be brutal it has to punch you in the face

it's not like the raptor r didn't sound good though yeah you're right i mean it sounded good

and it was quicker but that blower is too quiet forward make your blower louder i don't know how

i think they both could benefit from making it a little bit louder and then recently we were at

sima yes and we saw a 900 horsepower version of the raptor r yes which would be exciting

yeah i don't even imagine driving that yes and i can i can i can imagine the smile on my face

yeah yes so if they come out with this kit and they're planning they said they are they said

they are next year it is a plan it's what a three-liter whipple yeah on a 5 to v8 yeah 5.2

liter so it should be possible in the near future to bring your raptor r up to 900 horsepower through

forward through your dealership which is insane okay but let's let's come down from the clouds

i mean when you're spending a hundred and twelve thousand dollars or i don't even know what this

kit will cost yeah but let's say a hundred twenty thousand ish might have to be 130 yeah most of

most of me are mortals probably will never buy a truck like this yeah so even though those engines

are amazing and the thing about those engines the hellcat the the predator engines and the Ford

they offer effortless power like anytime you step on the throttle just a little bit

you could pass somebody easily you could have some fun just it's amazing effortless power

and that's a lot of fun but it's not approachable for a lot of people no i you could make an

argument that none of the trucks on this list are that approachable because everything is

getting pricey but do you see my crisis now yeah well that that is a crisis we're all

okay dealing with but to your point if i'm going to be more practical yes more for just a minute

not strictly practical so i think the practical thing is to buy you could argue is buy an older

truck yes but if i want to be more practical i would go for the three liter duramax on this list

okay so so that's where you're going you're going straight if you're telling me i can't

have a 900 horsepower raptor r i'm that's what i said you can't then i'm gonna pick okay the duramax

yeah okay that's interesting that's interesting uh i will pick for the half ton we're strictly

talking about half ton segment right now yeah then we'll move on you know i was gonna say

like if you asked me a week ago before my crisis i would have said three five hybrid

in the forward and we've driven the tundra hybrid as well in fact really soon this month and also

into early december we're doing truck of the year testing for 2026 uh half ton trucks and we do have

a tundra hybrid we do have an f-150 hybrid um and but the tundra hybrid is mostly focused on power

yeah not as focused on efficiency or power takeoff features i think the power boost is better

yes so a week ago i would have said power boost but today i'm gonna say coyote interesting

could you did you see that coming no i did not because you're neither going for the

most power and torque nor the best fuel economy nor the the power takeoff

is it is it purely for the love of the game

wow no it's like because reliability reliability kind of creeped in right into my brain

you know what i'm saying sure and i'm not saying the five liter is the most reliable engine of all

time because you could argue the toyota v8 is probably the most reliable v8 if you're judging by

you know stories we heard about million miles on those engines right um but i'm saying it's a little

bit more you know there's not as much going on there i know they have fuel um saving technology

in that v8 now so there there is some solders shot off in that engine and a lot of people talk about

those technologies as taking away some reliability from the engine but still i think it's it's the

most ref happy we own one of these right now and it's just a good all-around engine it is a good

engine all you got to say to me is you're a big v8 guy and i'll tip my hat to you so it's not a big

argument no no it's not going to be a big argument but but i am a little surprised now let's should

we go midsize move to midsize this is going to be simpler because there are i think so not quite as

many different options yes on the table it's primarily v6's straight straight v6 straight v6

i'm sorry i'm saying i'm saying straight as a no turbo charging yeah there are the four the 2.7

and the three liter in the ranger raptor turbo v6's and then quite a few turbo fours also a

hybrid system in the toyota yes no but also but also for solar turbo hybrid yeah um no plug in

hybrid because jeep walked away from doing the gladiator 4 by e yeah so at the moment that's

an option that yeah and we don't know where that where that decision really rooted itself we just

don't know we don't we don't we don't not preview to that information but yeah we just don't know

yeah so here where we are we don't have a plug-in hybrid option but if you want a hybrid you can

go for the toyota i force max once again a little bit more power uh specific you know yeah goal of

that engine is a little bit more for power and not efficiency so much and also no real i mean i

know the trd pro and trd trail hunter the comas have that 2.4 kilowatt system now um but we're

talking about like you can't weld off of that no it's it's not a substantial so it's not a

substantial yeah in that realm in those options for me by far my favorite engine option is that

ranger raptor three liter turbo twin turbo v6 that makes so much power especially with the

ford performance tune that we put on it's also effortless it's effortless to drive 455 horsepower

536 pound feet of torque with the ford performance tune that we in the midsize track ranger raptor

yes it was so powerful yes and then as well even a step down from that if you want a truck that's a

little bit more practical the 2.7 turbo you can get in the ranger yeah there's also a great engine

i agree 100% um i i don't think i'm going to argue with you either so we i used to own the gm the new

turbo uh turbo max to uh engine in the gm and good engine it's a little bit strained

you know it feels it doesn't feel as effortless it's torquey 430 pound feet of torque yeah very

very torquey very very nice but it's just it doesn't have that reef well now i like refinement

so you see my crisis well yeah but you're talking about a different type of truck yes

we're talking about small trucks usually more fun this is where fun is more important yeah

sometimes less than work right the colorado in the canyon that engine is a little course

yeah it's not as happy to rev it's just not as pleasing a lot of the time to drive

even though i towed my boat with my chevy colorado turbo max um you know we went camping with it we

did a lot of different things with it um toyota engine is also you know it's a step up from the v6

and the six speed that they used to have for sure um a big step up as far as overall torque

delivery power drivability drivability big step up there especially towing you've got

so much more low end torque even if you don't go for the hybrid yes exactly just the standard turbo

four has way more torque the eight speed that makes a big difference so for us towing up here in

the mountains the turbo fours actually do really well if you want to go a little more old school

you could do the frontier that 3.8 liter naturally aspirated v6 which which is good and if you want

to go more old school you'll get the gladiator v6 with a penistar and also if you're a little bit

more old school the v6 honda ridgeline sure which which is a great engine i mean honda is known for

making some amazing v6 engines through the throughout their history yeah of the naturally

aspirated v6 is the frontier would be my personal favorite why is that because it's a little bit

heavier i mean uh more displacement a little bit more torquey yeah and it feels like the the frontier

what they turned that into was what a lot of people wanted the Tacoma to become because there's

obviously people out there that complain about the Tacoma now having a four cylinder turbo which

i understand yes it is it drives much better than the old Tacoma objectively so i don't actually

mind what the Tacoma turned into but if you want something a little more old school i think the

going for all-out performance ranger raptor the hands down and i think but also the caveat being

the 2.7 twin turbo ranger because it's not as expensive you can get into that truck i mean

ranger raptor it still starts at like 57 right with destination charges right so if you can't

that's a little bit high to reach for a lot of people yeah so if you wanted to step down the

2.7 you can jump into that truck for like 40 grand maybe maybe 40 four ish i i still think in the

world of uh of a gmc canyon 84x 8 ev addition that's closing in on 70 grand yes or a trd pro or a

trail hunter Tacoma that's in the mid 60 000 range could touch 70 also yeah i think that the ranger

raptor is a is a good deal for a top of the line truck yeah off-road mid-sized truck so that that

powertrain ultimately if you get in to a ranger raptor especially one with the ford performance

tuned for 800 bucks none of the other mid-sized truck powertrains are going to hold a light to it

not even close and i mean time will tell obviously i mean we can redo this podcast 10 years from now

and maybe and maybe we could talk about you know the reliability of all these powertrains but we

can't quite you know have a great grasp on that right now because these engines are only what about

two three four years old right yeah so we we don't have a huge grasp on this engine so in the

mid-size you're also voting yeah the ford v6 yeah yeah so i think even though they have twin turbos

these are fairly efficient if you don't push them if you don't push them they're pretty efficient

yeah they're fun uh and they're also fun and they're very fast and they tow great yeah absolutely

there you go now as far as compact trucks go tiny this is going to be easier there's only two

yeah there's a Santa Cruz Santa Cruz in a maverick yes the maverick hybrid all-wheel drive that we had

was great not only by all aspects all aspects not only for being efficient and practical

but when we hooked it up to a trailer at the peak of what it was rated a pull which was four

thousand pounds it still did great so this powertrain even towing and downhill yes it did a great

job of keeping that the speed of the trailer truck and trailer combination in check so this

powertrain excelled on all fronts it wasn't exciting to drive it didn't sound great well

because it's a little droney because of the continuously variable yeah a planetary gear set

right yeah so not a belt style not a belt driven CVT which is important for durability yes there's

a big difference there so this powertrain the the hybrid system plus the all-wheel drive on the maverick

even if you don't get the all-wheel drive but we like it with and the two-liter in the maverick

is a little bit tiny bit underwhelming a lot of the cases you have to pay more for it also

this is what i learned this week is when they went from 2024 maverick two-liter ecoboost to 2025

models with the refresh they also added that gasoline particulate filter to that engine

interesting and that was partially the rating change also there was a little horsepower decrease

and it kind of makes sense even though Ford is saying that gasoline particulate filters won't

affect the big v6 ecoboosts you're adding a little bit of back pressure right because you're adding

another filter another filter to the exhaust system hence adding back pressure hence you could affect

your power yeah potentially it would be interesting to see a dyno comparison between a 2025 and 2026

well we could probably yeah i think well we could make that happen we could do it in the future yes

absolutely but but just to wrap up a little bit maverick and the santa cruise santa cruise we

we also had a long-term santa cruise yeah and especially the turbo version of the santa cruise

is very quick so yeah yeah but but the turbo version is DCT dual clutch yeah which is drawbacks

it has drawbacks i mean dual clutch transmissions are amazing for sports cars in my opinion you

know when you're a spirit you know driving in a very sporty manner quick shifting you know in the

canyon on the canyon road or something like that and they can be good for fuel economy as well which

is why some more economic cars use them but if you're on a on a not even a trail but a rutted

dirt road see the the dual clutches they can get very hot pretty hot yes and also there could be

jerky to get off start start starting up they could be a little jerky so not ideal smooth powertrain

no there's some drawbacks there uh and then back to the maverick you mentioned the two leader

i think that the lobo is a fun truck not necessarily because of the engine so much as the rear

diff the all-wheel drive system the styling of it so well there you are kind of going out across

again if you're watching this podcast you can see a video of me hustling around a a maverick

lobo i like the maverick lobo a lot but i wouldn't say that the highlight of it is that two leader

so in the compact category i'm going to give all the credit to the maverick hybrid i think we

agree a hundred percent i think they nailed it with a maverick height also an efficiency

because mary drove it for a week and she got like 46 mpg in it so i mean maverick hybrid is makes

us such a useful vehicle is awesome king of tiny engines absolutely now oh we gotta flex a little

bit of muscle because we're transitioning into heavy duties yeah should we start with gas yeah

let's start with gas let's get it out of the way yeah is not our favorite heavy duty powertrains

probably no especially because we live in the mountains if we're getting in into an hd truck

it's to tow bigger trailers and i i think if you live in a flatter area it makes maybe more sense

to get a gas engine here with our steep grades just the exhaust brake alone so let's start with

Ford so if you look up f250 we we were one of the first people with a Godzilla 73 v8 yeah in an

also have a six eight engine so they have kind of two versions of a very similar engine for gasoline

the six eight is a little bit more price conscious so makes a little bit less horsepower but still

quite a good engine and then of course the seven three gas for them is kind of their top dog gasoline

engine yeah and then gm has the six six in duramax form and a six six in gas gasoline form

and it's going to be curious what they're going to put the six six upcoming gen six v8 into the

half ton trucks i'm wondering if they're going to be reusing their block probably from a heavy

duty engine or at least the design of the block right yeah i wonder it could be some shared parts

and then kind of making more power from it um and then ram has had the hemi i don't know how long

too long but but maybe almost too long but that's six four hemi the larger displacement hemi

is actually a pretty good engine it is it's been around for a long time for but it's not

not a power king anymore no it's not it's it's pretty anemic uh so between all the gas v8s you

also have a 10 speed right now gm switched to 10 speeds across their heavy duty lineup

ram well they're using zf and according to zf eight speeds is all you need apparently which

yeah which i respect that decision i think we respect that you know zf is one of eight is a lot

so zf is one of the more reliable transmission manufacturers of all time yeah so so of course

i respect that yeah and the 10 speed in the gm trucks especially is is having some issues at the

moment yeah which is i mean we have a 10 speed duramax heavy duty chevy we haven't experienced

any issues personally yeah with our transmission but we've heard many reports and heard some

recalls surrounding some of their 10 speeds um but if we talked about recalls we would i think we

have to mention every engine yeah every engine has had the recent recall yeah yeah like the the

Toyota v6 is a lot more vehicles just got added to the list of recalls and that's a really significant

recall because they're replacing engines yeah and then of course the the gm 6.2s yeah so so there's

a lot there is a lot going on with recalls which is why like reliability has creeped in in show my

mind that's fair really really heavily recently like the recent story that zach wrote about the

Toyota v6 twin turbo non-hybrid this is only focused on the non-hybrid v6 twin turbos they're

going to recall another 127 engine thousand engines yeah which is a lot okay that's tough so i think

you and i agreed that the 734d for the power delivery and just overall usefulness i think it's

king as far as the gas engines yes but we have to talk about the the premier elephant in the room

yeah the big diesels yes the big diesels so i think all of them are are kings in their own right

100% yeah they all make tons of power tons of torque get pretty good efficiency especially for

big trucks so they all deserve some credit for me the favorite is going to be i think i'm gonna

guess this one oh yeah you know you know what it is ultimately i think i think i'll produce a

cold nose i think our audience knows yeah for me it's going to be between because i am going to

try to be fair here okay it's going to be between the power stroke high output and the comments

i think i'm in the same area with you really um i'm not saying that the gm duramax v8 is a bad

engine no the duramax is awesome but well the recent transmission issues are small caveat there

doesn't help a slight caveat but when you and i drive that high output power stroke and also the

latest comments you and i went out to the davis dam area and we pulled some heavy trailers

with the new comments and the new eight speed also yeah um that's a very impressive combination

and of course ford is done really well with their power strokes yeah the power stroke has

more power more torque 500 horsepower 1200 and not just on paper you can actually feel it when

driving it yeah it's it's almost bordering on too powerful because we we've done some drag race

videos pulling trailers for these trucks yes and the ford just lights the tires exactly oh and

sometimes it pulls power too yeah i mean it depends on exactly how you launch it but a lot of these

trucks um they're so powerful now it's really difficult to actually launch them is because

sometimes you spin tires sometimes the computer system pulls a tiny bit of power even though if

you can turn off traction control system yeah it's still pulling a little bit of power because it's

like i don't want to overwhelm the transmission and the axles and all this stuff with so much power

on paper you can't argue with the numbers from the power stroke high output because it's the most

yes 500 1200 two nice round numbers that are unbelievably impressive so it's got that going

for it but ultimately i'm going to pick the Cummins primarily because of the character of the engine

the way that it sounds the operation and the effectiveness of the exhaust break

and it is a lazier engine it doesn't want to rev as much as the Duramax and as the power stroke

so in a drag race but i think that's okay i do i mean when you're working your trucks are when

you're working your truck every day you're not worried about you know zero to 60 times probably

yeah uh and i just yeah love the sound of a straight six diesel hey look i'm wearing the same

shirt oh nice i love this shirt i got a different one on so i did it okay yeah you did good um we're

looking at their video from davis dam which was by the way not in the middle of the summer

because if this was the middle of the summer davis dam it would be 120 degrees fahrenheit

and i would not be wearing that my flannel shirt yeah yeah that's fair in that case but

the Cummins is an awesome engine i really again i like the character of it a lot

it makes so much of that torque down low love the way it sounds love the exhaust break on it

especially it's my favorite of the three exhaust breaks and we use the exhaust break a lot in the

mountains so i like the Cummins okay i

so i i hear you but but if if the Cummins the new 2025 2026 Cummins eight speed

combo was equally as efficient in our testing with the power stroke high output i knew you

were gonna bring this up i think we've talked about this before yeah we have um i would

choose Cummins but the power stroke in our particular testing that we've done is a little

bit more efficient and fuel is money and money is you know business so so for that reason it's

hard for me to completely go all in on the Cummins so i think ford you know if Cummins comes out

with a solution for this i don't know we've we've heard rumors about slightly bigger displacement

Cummins coming very soon which would be cool 72 right 7.2 guys if if this is true come on

just just just bring it just bring it and then the Cummins will be a complete find a way to put

a 72 Cummins my second gen oh oh yes and if it if it makes it a little bit more cleaner burning

and a little bit more efficient i mean this would be key but i think high output power stroke i mean

has to be on this list yeah for sure if if i were running a fleet company and all that mattered

were the numbers of fuel economy in the margins and those power figures and everything i might

lean toward the power stroke but ultimately as expensive as hd trucks are now if i'm gonna be

spending not that i am but if i were to be spending the better part of a hundred thousand

dollars on a truck i not only want it to be good on paper which all three of them are

but i want to enjoy it if i'm buying a truck for myself i want to like the way it sounds and

like the way it feels if i'm going to spend that much money on it which is why i would go for the

Cummins because i i just like the sound and the character of the engine the most and the exhaust

brake all the all those elements on those things yeah so all those and all those elements that's

why i would go for it but i wouldn't necessarily try and push somebody else in the same direction

if they don't care at all about those things then if it's all about the numbers maybe or if it's all

about this and that i'm just speaking for myself straight six diesel feels right okay so we're

getting closer to the end of our of our list of our list um so so we've we've called out the

three liter duramax the five liter v8 coyote uh we called out ford v6's we're a little bit

fort heavy on this list you more than i yes because i picked the three liter duramax in the

there's one more thing that i think we should mention yes the very end of the podcast that

we'll do very briefly yes because everybody will hate it for electric trucks i'm going to give it

to the gm sierra silverado eevee because they actually have a lot of range they're very powerful

they can move a trailer no doubt about that and we've towed 230 240 miles on a charge decent

size trailer box trailer yeah with a silverado eevee so that battery is so big that you actually get

a reasonable amount of range with it still not the best setup for pulling cross country because

you would have to stop and charge at some point and there's no convenient way to do that with a

trailer but if you own a trailer and you are looking at a silverado eevee and you needed to

tow a hundred miles to a lake with your boat or something it'd be fine for that yes so if we

um just wrapping up with electric pickup trucks um have to bring up revian and tesla of course

have to think about f-150 lightning is almost on its way out because there was a fire at one of

the suppliers that supplies aluminum and some parts to the f-150 lightning production and

fort paus production and there's a lot of rumors flying around what about the future of the f-150

lightning gm is going strong very you know they're doing more options of their hummery v trucks

they're doing their gmc electrics their chevy electrics they're doing a lot with electricity

um and if i thought about all those i would go gm as well yeah even though revian is also a pretty

nice vehicle sure we've experienced all of them the gm trucks have the biggest battery the most

amount of range and that's the biggest issue towing with an eevee so yeah and that's the thing that

pickup trucks do you gotta give it to the gm they're also the heaviest so they feel the most

stable yes and i think if i was going to go for style like you said enjoying the truck

that you're buying i'm leaning a little gmc uh i don't quite i'm not a big fan of chevy

silverado eevee styling and kind of some of the elements that they have there so i would have to

go seara eevee uh so i'm gonna write down seara eevee here and also reliability electric

reliability is quite good uh we don't have a grasp on all of that right now very few moving

parts it's yes it's not hard to wrap your head around why those are power trains that can go

a long time eevees have been around long enough for us to see that the longevity is is there even

though people are generally very concerned about battery degradation over time the large statistics

taken from all the eevees that have been put on the road for however many years and however many

miles degradation is actually not that bad so yeah the durability longevity on the eevees is

better than most people think it is exactly and for example we recently sold with on tesla model s

from 2014 we just recently sold it that car has most of its range it had when it was new

my wife still drives a 2014 bmw i3 electric car that car also has most of its range from its new

so we've seen it firsthand but you you can find statistics out there that that support it yeah

if you're looking about raw reliability i mean replacement costs are huge for a lot of these

vehicles because a headlamp on a four truck is like a thousand two thousand bucks anymore yeah right

so replacement and maintenance on all these vehicles is quite intense and quite heavy but

the likelihood of you being financially responsible for replacing the battery pack in an eevee is

actually pretty low very very low and unless you have an air cool first gen leaf in which case

it's very hot we feel for you yeah so between all these engines andre yes every powertrain

that we've talked about and the ones for each category of truck that we've highlighted

as being number one in that category on this list which engine are you going to pick outright wow

um the engine that i'm gonna pick doesn't exist you're designing an engine yes really i want

tell me about it here's what i want from journal motors okay we thought that's we started this

podcast by saying gen six is coming yeah okay we know it's coming they've invested they've

retooled the factory they've invested almost a billion dollars what i want to see within the next

few months because it's coming within the next few months is a small v8 let's say 5 7 okay let's

say that's true a 5 7 350 Chevy with a little electric motor on the back of it to make it a

quote unquote hybrid similar to what fort has done with their ecoboosts but i would like to see it

with a non turbocharged engine and see how that combination works and that will improve their

efficiency not by four percent or six percent it could improve their efficiency by a significant

margin and allow them to weld off their trucks and do a lot of cool things i think it's an interesting

idea okay i am still interested to know though of all these engines we discussed that you can

actually buy thank you which ones are your favorite did you pick the power stroke as your hd diesel

yeah i was leaning to it but you didn't want to say because you picked a lot of forts yeah yeah well i

it's it's not you could call me a fourth guy go ahead you could call me that you own a toyota so

yes but but but i really like a lot of their powertrains yeah i mean i mean you could that's

basically it so if i look at all this stuff right now

i'm kind of going back to the v8 so i might say coyote because that what i called that out initially

i called i told you i started this episode you heard me right you're a big v8 guy i get it so

i'm going and i'm not the power the overall power output number is not as important to me

as in just like i said it needs to be a solid working vehicle that is efficient i think efficiency

and reliability is now pushing higher on my priority list so and our coyote is actually not

that bad on efficiency either no recently tested it compared to the eco boost even

day to day driving around it's almost the same yeah yeah doesn't so i'm gonna lean towards the

coyote right now five oh i i love that okay for you are you gonna go maverick no come on

so when we my only thing with the coyote is when we've used that f150 to pull trailers cross

country it's working hard it's screaming the whole time so and it sounds good so it's it's

not the worst thing in the world but there's nothing like yes hitching up a trailer to drive cross

country with any one of the big diesels and my favorite of those is the Cummins so of all the

engines you could get in a brand new pickup truck Cummins all the way all the way you also own an

older Cummins so i do i love it it makes it makes sense ah so and and you're right i mean when

people ask me what is your favorite truck period it's a very hard question to answer because

what i answer with is what job do you are you looking to do yeah right so if you ask me

to tow 20 000 pound trailer i can't do it with a five liter v8 right it's impossible that truck

is not rated for that much it will be if even if you pulled it across your field and at your ranch

it still wouldn't be a great experience yeah but you don't necessarily want to daily drive a

but an hd exactly so it always comes down to your task the job you're trying to accomplish

and right now just just based on my needs you know i have a six thousand pound boat

with a trailer so just for that you know for my personal needs i don't need a heavy duty

truck per se so that's why i'm kind of leaning a little bit towards more of a half ton segment

right now and i'm leaning towards a nice simple v8 i would i would say yeah usually if i'm actually

using my truck because i'm using the bed and having the eight foot bed of an hd is is nice

yes you could get an eight foot bed and something else sure but i also end up having a tow all of

my crummy project cars around here and there so you're pulling quite a bit and and the diesel

for that is yeah great it's it's key so that's that's the combination that's usually when i'm

using my truck is pulling one of my cars or loading up the bed i think right now i've got a

bunch of tree trimmings in the bed of the truck filled to the brim exactly that's what the truck

is about you know it's versatility yeah so those kind of things push me toward an hd you can do

all those jobs with other types of trucks but when you get in an hd truck the amount of capability

that you've got and i think and i think in the future if the charging infrastructure

was better and will be better i think if we did this podcast like two or three or four years

from now i think i could be leaning really electric interesting a little bit more electric

because once again simplicity yeah ease of use but right now if you ask me to go from here to

lake powell with a trailer even using the best crav imaginable it's going to be a pain it still

would not be as easy as doing it with a v8 or diesel or any combination of those so that's

kind of where it is right now yeah at least for me we also have to address one other item

because there was a comment about this and we have um oh the tires uh snow tires no oh oh the

snow tires yeah we said we'd mention that well well yeah so whenever we go off road on something

very very difficult or if we go on snow airing down sometimes helps because you get a bigger

patch of tire right um so that's down but i was also talking about the shock we all received

personally um from passing of our dear friend uh our mechanic uh toby um that has worked with us

over the years um we want to do something special separately so so we didn't with that's why we won't

you know focusing on what's going on with uh with with that situation so thank you don for really

you know the outpouring of support has been really really great because his toby's wife page

really needs it yeah um because their mechanic shop german auto in boulder was there basically

it was basically it was this but it was also the skill of toby that really drew people you know

into that business and also the care that page provided uh for all the customers there um and

the fact that toby is no longer here after uh just a freak accident basically yeah um he was hunting

in the woods and atv related so um in the atv related accident uh it's just awful yeah and

there's like you said pages you can donate to that we should be able to link in here and it

really makes a big difference yeah so so we want to do something separate for that like this is not

about this because we also want to make sure that we're respectful to page and her family and his

family so so that's a kind of a different subject uh right now uh let's see what does chris say

question for you guys why why do the evs focus on speed torque instead of range

i think speed and torque is easier to do it's very easy yeah so here's what i want to answer

this question that i have with as we wrap up is i was listening to a lot of information from the

new company tello truck yeah you know the little compact electric pickup that's coming up hopefully

next year it's a startup company so it's always difficult to launch a new company but what some

of those engineers were saying is that you could think of the electric motor is almost like the

transmission because it's transferring the electricity stored in the battery and it's just

turning it into the motion basically of the vehicle so it's very easy for that electric

motor to make a lot of power yeah range is more difficult because the because the battery

energy density of a battery is the single most difficult hurdle for bringing evs into the future

yes making them better so it's really easy to make them powerful and quick it's not as easy to

give them 500 miles of range so if you're talking about that tiny vehicle like a tello pickup truck

and they say it's capable of 500 horsepower it's true but when you're driving it from here to

cosco you might be using 20 horsepower right it's very efficient it's a very easy way of transfer

power it's just that the battery technology is where it's at right yeah so again questions like

these things that we can answer if you're a member on patreon you can watch the podcast live

give us some questions and we can address them in real time yes and chris says maybe gen 6 v8

from gm will be my dream engine next year maybe let's do this again next year when we have those

engines i like this topic there you go thanks for joining us once again um um check out all

tfl.com and we'll see you next time

Ep. 305: The Absolute BEST And WORST Truck Engines!

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three liter duramax

first gen leaf

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