Episode 104: Hot or Not

Uh, just like that. Rory, what are you driving, man?

Tahoe.

The old Tahoe.

Man, I gotta tell ya, I just, I gave up, um,

the CX-90, which we had from another fleet company

to take this.

Mm-hmm.

CX-90 is a nice car.

Yeah.

That's the, that's the Volvo?

No, it's, um, Mazda.

Oh, oh, oh, oh.

Yeah, it's, um, it's that huge...

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah.

Cool.

And it's, like, very drifty, really, like,

um, really fun.

Like, in the snow, like, I was huffing it down here,

like, driving on the ice, and it was, like,

just so controllable, and so easy to drive.

It's really fun.

Uh, so we'll see if this thing can love up to it.

This is, like, Super Lux.

It's got, uh, Blue Chew, or what's the, um...

Blue Chew?

Black rifle coffee in the cup holder.

Yeah.

No, it's got, um, a Mack Weldon.

Um, no, it's got, uh, what do you call it?

The Super Cruise.

Oh.

Oh, uh-huh.

Yeah, it's got all the stuff on it.

So you get a Super Cruise all the way to Florida?

No.

Just curl up in the back and take a nap?

At best.

Land keeping, it's a beautiful hour.

Maybe two hours to finally figure out how to turn it off.

Um, which is, like, very sketchy, like, when you're driving in the ice.

Like, Matty, are you getting my audio, by the way?

Are you getting, like, uh...

Uh, I'm recording.

I'll be able to...

I'll be able to mix it up later if we cut,

if you cut out a little bit.

I'll make it work.

Okay, because I just tried to, uh, record this call,

and I guess it doesn't have permission to do that,

so this is the only thing.

It's a pain.

But anyway, uh, driving in the ice when it does the little lane-keep,

like, wheel jerk to try to get you...

Oh, no.

It's, like, really, really unnerving.

It's, like, going 85 miles an hour,

like, on a very loose or, like, very slippery road,

so it's, like, like...

What if I just give you two to five degrees of, uh, wheel right now?

Yeah.

Um, sketchy.

Yeah, that's enough to, um, cause real problems.

I fucking...

I took my car, you know, because we have to do, like, annual inspections here,

and, um, and last year I just had something else at the dealership,

so I just, like, had them do it there, like, while they were doing whatever

I needed them to do.

But this year I just took it, you know, there's just, like, a garage

that's, like, a 10-minute walk from my house,

so I took it there just to drop it off in the morning

and let them do it.

When I got it back, um, you know, and it's just, like,

yeah, they just gotta fucking look it over

and just, like, slap the new sticker on the windshield, whatever.

Um, and, uh, and yesterday I was driving it and, um,

and I don't know if it's just, like, this garage's policy or whatever,

but, like, I'm just driving down, you know, down the road

and I kind of do a little swerve to, like, get around, like, a fucking, you know, pothole or whatever.

And, and I feel the car, like, fucking yank me, you know?

And I'm just like, what fuck you?

Like, I stopped.

I, like, I was like, God damn it, you fuckers, reset my shit.

You went in and turned back on the safety shit that I had fucking turned off

because I don't fucking like it.

And it's like, that pissed me off, man.

What would they have done that would have reset your ECU?

What would they have even done for inspection that would have, like, gotten into the...

I mean, I think, I think they just did it manually.

I think they just, like, I think it's, maybe it's just, like, their garage policy of just, like,

oh, look, this guy, uh, accidentally turned off his safety suite or whatever.

No!

Well, they, they may just, they may just reset it to factory spec

so that, like, all the missions control stuff is in the standard configuration.

Maybe, but, but, but there's so many other, I mean, there's so many other settings

that would get reset if they were to do that.

Oh, they just, they just did that one.

I think so.

Yeah.

That's crazy.

I mean, like, my, my, you know, my end settings were, were, were the same and, you know, whatever.

Oh, weird.

Interesting.

What the fuck?

Yeah.

It just, like, but it was just, it was really unnerving.

You know, it's that thing of just, like, yeah, where the car is, like, doing something

that you, you're not expecting it to do.

And it's just like, no fuck you.

You, you're not driving.

I'm fucking driving.

That's right.

Yeah.

That's right.

I don't understand who it's for.

And I like, I just don't, it's like, in a million years, the last thing I want is the

wheel to be, like, tricking in my hands when I'm driving down the road, like, artificially,

like, it's so bizarre.

And then the, the, uh, obviously the radar cruise control thing, just like, yeah, no,

I don't want cruise control to set a speed for me.

I want to just go however fast everybody else is going.

That's what, like, that's not what cruise control is.

Like, that's not, you know what I mean?

Like a cruise control doesn't mean just like it's stuck behind someone going 45 miles.

Like, it's, uh, anyway, this damn kid's there.

New single technology.

Oh, did you see the, um, Canada thing?

The Canada thing.

Yeah, they just made an agreement with China to relax, uh, car tariffs.

Nice.

Yeah.

Um, oh no.

In exchange for some agricultural tariffs.

So I think they're going to be selling Chinese cars in Canada, uh, very shortly here.

Oh, baby.

Did this just happen, like, this morning?

Like five minutes ago, yeah.

Canada heard Ai Weiwei gave up and they were like, ah, we're good.

We're fine.

Yeah.

I mean, it's becoming increasingly fringe to have like an anti-Chinese, uh, posture.

Yeah.

You know what I mean?

Like, like that, that's going to just end up being an American thing.

Yeah.

Uh, but yeah, they're, uh, a little bit stolen.

I just finished my review of those cars.

They actually review them, but just kind of like my assessment of that.

Like the cars are ready.

They're going to be successful here.

Actually, I mean, I guess my conclusion is like these cars are competitive with like

anything in this segment, but it just still happens at the segment.

And then it was like dead on rifle.

So it's, and, and we talked to Trump, uh, last week, somebody asked him about Chinese cars

in America and like almost verbatim what I said in the pot last week of like everybody's

anti-China and somebody pulled the factory in the district and like Trump was like,

yeah, bring him here.

I don't care.

He's like, uh, if they want to build a factory in the United States and employ Americans,

like they're welcome.

They're welcome to be here.

He's like, bring the Japanese too, which is like, okay.

Japanese have been here for like 40 years.

Just half a century or so.

You know, that's fine.

Um, yeah.

Wow.

Well, that's cool.

I mean, it's cool that, um, we will be the last country, uh, on earth, um, driving like

dinosaur mobiles.

It's what we deserve.

It's fine.

We made our bed.

We got to lie in it.

It's like a weird, you know, I've been listening to a lot of like, uh, Kim Stanley Robinson

books.

Um, uh, at night, it's, it's funny, like the, all the different kind of visions to the

future that are out there about like the like kind of utopian or post-apocalyptic or whatever

you like, whatever flavor they come in, but none of them are like, um, the whole world's

just moves on in America.

It's just like stuck in like 2004.

Like permanently, you know what I mean?

None of them are like, yeah, it's just, uh, the one country that just kind of stayed.

Just like cut off its nose to spite its face.

Yeah.

It's like, uh, it's like a nation throwback edition, you know, like, uh, if you want to

have that old school nation experience, you got to go to America.

I mean, for real.

Yeah.

I mean, it's, it's kind of like, like the way that Europe has, um, like kind of relegated

itself to just like, the reason you go to Europe is to get this kind of like, oh, it's

the flavor of the old world.

It's like going to Disneyland, you know, it's like, oh, look at how magical there's like

castles and, um, um, and like, you know, oh, there's like a tower and a bridge and, and

like, you know, it's like, oh, people used to live like this, you know, um, uh, it's

like quaint and cozy and fun.

And it's like a miracle.

The U.S. will be like that, except it'll be like, um, it'll just be like empty malls,

big box stores.

It's just like, like strips just like lined with, with like every, you know, fast food

chain and, and kind of, you know, mid, mid, mid, middle brow, um, you know, like, like

chain eatery, like chilies or, um, or apple bees or whatever.

You know, it's like, like that's what you go to America for is to experience apple

bees.

Chicken dippers.

Yeah.

Get a, get a blooming onion.

That's right.

You come to America for fake Australia.

The world will come to America for like urban X, like for the same reason that

came to Detroit in the nineties, like, right.

Urbex stuff.

Yeah.

Totally.

It'll just, it'll just all be like, like, you know, um, yeah.

What do they call it?

Like, um, what was the term for it?

Something porn?

Yeah.

Ruin porn.

Yes.

Yeah.

Kind of, they used to build, they used to build a car here, can you believe it?

Maybe, maybe that's, maybe that's the business that we should go into is just, um, doing

like, like just plan for like five years out, um, like starting like, like national

ruin porn tours for foreign tourists.

Like, like for Chinese tourists to come to America, it's like, we show you how just

how dismal it is.

I think that's a great, I mean, I think you can actually make some use of what you're

doing there.

I think that'd be a boom in business.

That was, uh, I mean, the, yeah, the, the.

Chinese like have to be watching this like Minneapolis thing and the, you know, the,

the rest of it and just laugh, just feel like, oh my gosh, look, they are, they're up to

that right now.

It seems, it's like, you know, like if you, if you had a, if you were a rival power or

whatever, it'd be like, oh boy, they are really seven themselves.

Look at these fools.

Look at these animals.

Yeah.

No, that's, that's really, look at these animals.

Look at these lesser developed.

I mean, it really is.

I mean, it's something like, I've had the thought recently of like, when I look at it

at us, like from like the perspective of, of China or, um, you know, like a country on

the, like, I think of it the same, like, like thinking about like our, our auto industry,

you know, and, and like the thing of just like, yeah, we're just going to go back to,

you know, Hemi's and, and whatever.

Um, and it, it, I have to think that like, um, like the way that, that we used to talk

about, um, the Soviet and Eastern block automotive industries, you know, and the way that, that

we just kind of, we laughed at them, you know, at their, at how crude and unsophisticated,

um, and poor quality they were.

I mean, I'm, I'm a big Soviet car defender, but that was the name.

Like, yeah.

No, exactly.

I mean, that was, that was the mindset, you know, right.

No, that was the perception was like, you know, and, and, um, yeah.

And in the same way, I don't think it's, you know, it's, it, I mean, it doesn't map one

to one.

It's not completely accurate.

I mean, there are a number of like really extraordinarily well engineered, uh, you know,

US engineered American cars.

Um, but, um, but on the whole, you know, it's, it's, it's easy to imagine.

It's like, some people are advancing and some people are just like this willfully

regressive, um, yeah, mindset.

Uh,

that was like, I don't remember.

What are we supposed to talk about when we got to say this?

Well, I, yeah, it's all right.

I had, I had an idea that, um, um, uh, I kind of wanted to talk about, about, um, some of

the EV, the story that, um, that Jay, uh, ran on alloy last week about, uh, kind of the

forthcoming EVs of 2026.

Oh yeah.

Um, I thought it might be interesting to talk about those, uh, in terms of, of what we

think, uh, their, their chances, uh, in the, in the marketplace are.

Um, so that, that, that could be, that could be something to talk about.

Um, we should talk about, about, uh, Daytona and stuff coming up for, for, uh, um, yeah.

I mean, it's the season about to start and some, some, uh, handful of, uh, interesting

new things to talk about, um, with regard to that.

Um, and, uh, oh, and I think the thing that I was going to say before just about, about

that Mazda was, I was, I was thinking of, of like, um, well, like, uh, um, uh,

like I was saying before, like, um, you know, like how sometimes you see like a person like

in a car or driving a car and it just kind of, it's like incongruous, you know, it doesn't

fit, you know, like sometimes, sometimes the person matches the car, you know, other times

it does not.

Um, and I, I saw that, um, like kind of, uh, you know, acquaintance, uh, a guy that I've

known around town for a million years.

Um, and, and I mean, back in the day, he was like young guy worked at, at, at, uh, like

our local dive, uh, uh, venue, uh, as a bartender and, um, and he had, he had, he just like,

you know, this is like 20 plus years ago, close to like 25 years ago now.

Um, and he was, he was very young, thin, incredibly good looking.

Um, had like a, a pompadour and looked like, like, I mean his, his nickname was around town

was, was, you know, everybody called him cry baby.

Um, cause he had that, that kind of like, is that Johnny Depp?

Is that, is that?

Yeah.

And I mean, he looked like, like, like, you know, Johnny Depp before, uh, you know, he,

that guy turned into, uh, a nightmare caricature of, of himself and, um, but like, but like

a, like a very like, like almost like, like a fem kind of, kind of Johnny Depp, you know,

and, but just like incredibly handsome and, and, um, and, and the thing is, and like,

I'll see him occasionally around town now.

And it's just like, my God, dude, you still look so incredible.

You know, he like, I mean, and it's just, it's, he's one of those people that just

like, you know, you go like five, 10 years without seeing him.

And it's just like in your mind, he's still like, you know, that, that 21 year old kid,

you know, um, and, and I see him now.

And it's like, Oh no, you're, you know, you're in your 40s, like mid 40s or whatever, but

he's still like, he has aged so gracefully and so beautifully.

And, um, but, but he also, you know, he's, he's always maintained like this exact same

look of just kind of like, like looking like, like an authentic, um, kind of like, like 50

greaser, you know, just like, like that, that, that, that style and not like in a super

like self conscious way where it's like contrived or whatever.

It's just like, that's, that's, that's, that's his vibe.

You know, that's, that's who that guy is.

It's very rock really kind of guy.

Yeah. Yeah.

For sure.

And, um, but, but a while back I was walking and, and I saw, um, I saw one of those, those

Mazdas go by, um, the, you know, the big sleek, very, very pretty, uh, you know, high end

looks, looks like a Range Rover except prettier, um, and sleeker, uh, Mazda.

Um, and he was in the back, the back, one of the back windows was rolled down and he was

in, in, in the car and it was just like, that does not fit.

It's like that guy should not even be in that car.

You know?

Like, I was like, that guy should not be in any car built after like 1964, you know?

And, and, um, it was just, it was just so, so funny to me.

It struck me as just so weird and it was just like, okay, this, this can't, this can't be.

Yeah.

This can't be happening.

You gotta fix this.

If I say, if I see him around, I'll just be like, man, you can't be right around that

and you can't be doing that.

Yeah.

We've got, we've got standards to uphold, man.

Think about your brand, brother.

That's how I feel.

I mean, I feel that way a lot driving press cars.

Like there's a lot of times where I'm like, this is not, you do feel like totally.

Yeah.

It's like, you feel like you're dressed like a clown or like, you know, like, um, totally

self-conscious.

Right.

Well, I mean, that's the, I mean, the thing is like when you're doing it, when it's a

press car, it's almost like, like when it's something that you're just like borrowing

basically for like a week or a few days or whatever.

You know, and, um, and I've had this experience just like borrowing cars from, from, from

friends or whatever.

And, and it's almost like, like wearing a costume, you know, it's like, it's like playing

dress up and going out into public and being like, yeah, I'm a guy who drives this car.

Yeah.

You know.

Be going Rob's asses and E types for the summer.

Yeah.

Green E type and being like, yep, this is, this is my car.

This is what I drive.

Yeah.

67 E type.

This is who I am.

Yeah.

Um, yeah.

I can't imagine.

I mean, I remember like Davey talking about like driving a Plymouth prowler.

And it was like, and how funny that was.

Um, just cause it's like, just like embracing like, you know, yeah, I'm gonna, I'm gonna

pretend to be like a guy who's like 15 years older than me and is feeling really cool driving

this, you know, I'm a boomer.

When I first got this like auto journey job, I was talking to like some of my former coworkers

and I was like, um, Hey, uh, you know, I was like, this job is pretty cool.

I guess they just give you a different car every day or every week or whatever.

And then right about it, then you get a different one.

And I was like, they're like, Oh, what kind of cars?

And I was like, anything like Bentley Ferrari and like, you know, we have poor vets in the

fleet.

We have all this other shit in the fleet and like that's so red or whatever.

And then I went back to Lansing to like go to a concert with those guys and I pulled

up in like a purple automatic Kia Rio and I was like, and sometimes you get a Kia Rio

like sometimes it's a very sensible car.

Hell yeah.

It was a good car, but I'm not exactly what I was selling.

But I mean, that's, that's at that.

I mean, that's an appropriate car for, you know, for like rolling up to a concert at

that age, you know, with your bros.

It's like, yeah, you fit right in, man.

All right.

So what do we have?

What do we have on tap for the, for the weekend?

Um, uh, I mean, we got the roar coming up.

Um, what, what, there was, there was some, there was some story that came out like, Oh,

just this morning.

Um, I mean, this is not, not raw related, but, um, but the big news in, in, um, sports

car world, um, is that Ford who, who, you know, I mean, Ford and McLaren, both, both

kind of, uh, you know, announced like last year that they were coming next year, um,

with, with hypercars to WEC and hopefully presumably to, to IMSA after.

Um, uh, and, uh, with McLaren, McLaren rolled out their, their, uh, car at Le Mans last

year in the, you know, middle of summer.

Um, so we got to see that and they've been like, you know, pretty forthcoming with, with

their kind of development and, and drivers and, and their whole program.

Ford has been really opaque.

Um, I mean, apart from, from just saying that, yeah, we're not going to partner with anybody.

We're just going to run this team ourselves, which kind of took everybody by surprise.

Um, uh, we've really heard like almost nothing, uh, about that car until today, uh, where

Mike Rockefeller and Seb preole and, um, and Logan Sargent, um, which is interesting.

Um, but also, but the big news too is they announced that, um, the powertrain that they're

going to be running, which is the coyote V eight normally aspirated.

Um, so, so yeah.

So we're going to have another, uh, uh, American V eight, um, competing, uh, in hypercar alongside

the Cadillac and, um, yeah, I mean, that's, that's, I mean, you know, it's basically the

same, uh, engine that that is running in the, in the GTD mustangs.

Um, but, uh, but it will be paired with a, uh, um, uh, you know, electric, you know,

a hybrid unit.

Um, but yeah, but they definitely, um, you know, like are saying that it's like, yeah,

no, this is the way that we want to tie this program to, to our kind of racing heritage

and, and, you know, for there to be kind of a through line from, from the GT 40s, you

know, in the sixties to this car and, and just to have it be just like a big thumping,

uh, loud, uh, American V eight, um, which pretty cool, pretty exciting.

That's great.

Yeah.

And for all of our listeners on hot guy watch, hello to Rockenfeller.

Uh, that's a big win for us.

Thank you for that.

That's a, that's a welcome to the team.

You be he's hunky, hunky German.

Yeah.

I, uh, you know, I was supposed to go dance and heard on our show this week and I like

kind of made some plans with Christina's uncle to go down there and, um, you know, I had

a couple of the people maybe to see, but it was like too busy with alloying with the,

um, the travel, obviously to Florida and then to, um, Florida again next week.

But did they show it Detroit?

Did they actually like,

No, they haven't.

I mean, the only thing that they've, they've revealed is just like a very, uh, a very vague

kind of atmospheric, uh, profile shot of the car that really gives, gives nothing away

about it.

So, so no, we haven't seen what it looks like.

So it's, it's, I mean, they've, they've stopped short of anything close to a full reveal.

They're just kind of like starting to leak out some of the, the details of, of the program.

Okay.

That's good.

I would have been pissed if I drove all the way down here to see.

Yeah.

So, yeah.

So I'm not sure, I'm not sure when we'll get a full look at that car, but, um, um, but

yeah, so it's kind of tantalizing.

Um, yeah, that's great.

Um, in other news, I mean, they, you know, the pictures, I mean, yesterday was the first

day that the cars kind of were rolled out for the roar at Daytona.

So we got to see what, what, uh, what they're going to look like for this year.

I got to say the Wayne Taylor Cadillacs, man, they went with this new livery that like kind

of looks like the one that they ran at, at Le Mans last year, the Le Mans car where it

kind of has like the white side, you know, it's like a dark front and back and then like

white sides and it doesn't, it doesn't work for me, man.

I don't think it, I think it's a big, um, uh,

yeah, I mean, just like definitely, I mean, like last year's liveries were so killer

with the, that kind of like mirror blue and then the mirror silver finishes.

And, and these ones are just not happening.

It's like, it's like one of the, if not the best looking, uh, uh, GTP car, hypercar period.

Um, and, and that livery just totally kills it.

Like it hides the lines of the car.

Yeah.

I, I was pretty bummed out of kind of all the, um, all the, um, liveries that I have seen

so far.

We're just kind of like, man, like kind of carry over ish.

Yeah.

The, the, the Ford, like the, the Mustangs too also kind of feel like, um, kind of a,

a step backwards.

It's just like a kind of like a generic kind of, uh, royal blue and white, uh, you know,

as compared to like last year when it was like that kind of cool red, white and blue.

I don't know.

It just, yeah, like a little bit of, of just kind of like, oh, we got to change it up for

the sake of changing it up.

And it just kind of like, it's not, not an improvement.

Um, the, uh, I don't know that the spike, uh, the AO racing LMP2 car is now like gold,

which looks kind of cool.

Um, I think, um, I don't know what, what, what, what other ones over there.

I've wanted to do for years.

I've wanted to do a, um, feature of like grabbing a car or like a, assigning one car per person

and having a bunch of like kind of known graphic designers to, uh, like a livery for them,

like histories and libraries for them.

And like, I just feel like that, you know, like there's a lot, there are a lot of constraints

around what your livery can look like.

Um, but I also feel like it just needs to be shaken up.

I feel like since like the rap era, like since everybody started doing just raps, like there's

a lot of like sameness or like same kind of thinking that just gets recycled and recycled.

And it's like, it's very rare to see one that's like, oh shit.

Like, you know, like in the seventies and prior to that, like, um, it was very common to have like a,

wow, that's really fucking wild or just like really crisp and like really tight and like feels like,

and again, it's like they had fewer sponsors and like fewer constraints, yada, yada,

but it's just like that whole area seems more stagnant than it needs to be for, for racing.

Like, especially as like, um, how much things have changed and how much like, I mean,

like a lot of the cars like aren't running out of sponsorships.

Like in IMSA, you know, it's like one or two.

Like it's not, it's not like you need to get a thousand longers on it.

Um, like you might ask to an S car like, I don't know.

It just, uh, it would be interesting to kind of blow that up a little bit and see.

It's, it's almost, it's almost like that thing where like, um, the way that like desktop recording,

like when you're like making a song, you know, on your computer and instead of like, you know,

using a four track or whatever, where he's just like, okay, you have this number of choices and,

and you got to make it work with, with this thing.

And like versus like doing it on a computer, you have just like infinite like choices and possibilities,

you know, for just like instruments, sounds, effects, whatever, you know.

And, and it's like, you, it's just, you just have too many choices.

And like the first thing that you have to do when you sit down is just like pick like, okay,

what five sounds am I going to use and just like get rid of everything else, you know.

Yeah.

And it's like, um, I feel like, yeah, just kind of like the, the, the kind of maybe there's something where

just like the infinite freedom that, that the rap kind of allows for is kind of paradoxically almost

like paralyzing where you just end up with just kind of everybody looking around and kind of mimicking everybody else,

you know.

Yeah.

And I mean, I think too, it's like, um, there's just a lack of, it's just like, you know, like the cars have to look,

you know what I mean?

Like there's a vernacular of liberal design.

This is what I would say.

That's like.

Yeah.

I'm just, I'm just surprised at like the number of them that where like they actually like work against the

styling of the car, you know, and work to hide the styling of the car, which I mean, that's, that's the thing

that's going on with those, those Cadillacs that bumps me out.

Cause that's such a spectacular looking car.

It's just like, let me, let me see the car, you know, um, the wheel and one looks good.

Um, but.

The wheel and one does look good.

And so does the crew.

Very exciting lineup for Daytona.

Oh, that's right.

They got Bamber and my special little guys in there.

Connor Zillich.

They're not reuniting my Corvette boys.

I don't think Shane's going to be there at all, but Scotty's there, Ben Keating's there, Connor's there.

So it's all good.

It's good.

Yeah.

I miss my favorite guy, but it's okay.

I'll see him in NASCAR.

Yeah.

Maybe I'll see him walking around.

You're hard to miss him.

Yeah.

I'm excited.

Did I, did I, I don't think I went to Daytona last year.

Um, I did not know because I was, I was in Australia and, um, I was, no, I was doing a national magazine.

I don't know if I'd said this in the pot or if I said this, but I, like, I, I had been invited to do that, like the last three years.

And I think it was because I was.

I was like, Hey, I'm not, I'm just on the list.

And then I didn't get an email this year.

And so I emailed them and I was like, Oh, hey, you must have emailed my old.

It's a lot.

Make a dress.

Surely you didn't take me off the list of national magazine award judges.

Uh, and then I was like, all right.

You know, we didn't, we didn't forget.

Yeah.

No, it's like, no, that was intentional.

You're no longer going to drink.

Dang.

Oh, all right.

Dang.

Well, that's okay.

I needed, I needed another, you go check this here and like another kind of place.

Just, uh, you know, solving my issue.

And I had that.

Yeah.

It's important that, uh, you don't get too big for your britches.

So, um,

the year of small humiliations.

Um, well, speaking of, of humiliations, small and big for 2026, should we, should we go

through this, this, uh, this list of, of, um,

Yeah.

Of EVs that are forthcoming.

Let's hit them.

The first one is the, um, the Honda, Sony, Affila.

Yeah.

Which I, I completely, I think I like saw something about this a long time ago and didn't realize

that they were actually bringing this to production.

Um, and when I saw it, I was just like, wait, what, what is that?

Um.

They showed a, they showed a second Affila crossover at CES.

Yeah.

So they're already, they're already thinking ahead.

The thing is like this, this sedan, which, um, again is, is, uh, is called Affila.

Affila, um, uh, it's, it's, it's, it's very, uh, kind of like almost featureless in its,

in its kind of sleekness.

I mean, it's, it's like, like imagine if you took like a lucid and stripped it of every

kind of identifying characteristic and just made it like blank.

Um, um, that's what this looks like to me.

And it's also, and it's, it's a four door sedan.

Um, and it's going to be $90,000.

It's going to start at $90,000.

Um, it looks like it's been airbrushed in real life.

Right?

It's how, it's how plain it is.

It looks like a bar of soap or it's like, uh, just, you know, it's just a shake to it.

Give me the Irish spring.

Right.

It's like if you just like ordered like a, um, uh, you know, if like you're working in

the, in the clay modeling studio and it's like, yeah, send me over, send me over one

of those blank cars so I can just like start designing on it, you know, and it's like,

default blender asset.

This is just, this is the blank.

Like this is the slug that you get.

You know, um, I don't know, man, like, uh, you know, obviously I don't, I, I know almost

nothing about this, this car, but, uh, but other just like just going on the, the name,

the, uh, what it looks like and, um, and the fact that it's $90,000, I'm going to predict

that they sell zero of these.

It'll definitely be a single.

It's, it's, um, I think, you know, the thing with a lot of this stuff is like a lot of

these are like, okay.

They had this idea in a totally different cultural and regulatory environment where it

was like, you know, they were building a car for what they thought it was going to be like

in 2026 and then 2026 turned out to be totally different.

But in the case of the, it feel, uh, there was never a point where people were like,

Oh yeah.

Right.

Uh, Sony and Honda.

Yeah.

Of course.

Like, uh, yeah.

I mean, that, that part of it is like, okay, it's like, it's, it's, it's too like pretty

respected brands that everybody associates.

I think most people have pretty positive associations with, I do.

Yeah.

But, but yeah, this is just like, I don't get it, man.

I don't, I don't understand what this is supposed to be.

Well, there was a huge deal made, if I remember correctly, originally about it being able to

play PlayStation.

It's like, aha, that's what people want.

But, um, oh no.

I think what is interesting to me about the car, and I think like the reason that it may

still exist is I think they are planning to sell them direct.

So like outside of dealers, like not, not through Honda dealers, which if that's,

the case that does still make some sense.

Cause I think like, you know, there was a period in like everyone has been chafing at their

dealers.

I think especially since like probably the nineties, like everyone kind of recognizes that

dealers are unnecessary impediment to sell.

We hate, we hate them.

We hate them.

Hey, car companies hate them.

And I think like everybody hates them.

Yeah.

You know, there's, there's all kinds of like very stupid justifications for why they exist.

Um, and the car companies, I think like, you know, if you look at like the rhetoric from

car executives, like in the early 2000s until today, like they've kind of made peace with

the concept.

It's like, okay, this is the necessary part of selling cars in the United States.

You know, we have to give lip service to like their value as a partner and like what they

do and yada, yada.

And like, it is true that like, you know, the dealer is actually purchasing the cars

from the manufacturer.

So like the actual sales from a technical standpoint, the actual sale is happening.

Like the manufacturer is selling it to the dealer, which is nice, you know, like the

manufacturer is not carrying inventory per se.

Right.

Um, but in post Tesla and post like Tesla winning the ability to kind of sell independently

and then like Rivian winning the ability to sell independently, like car dealers or car

manufacturers are kind of getting back to like, Hey, wait a second, like, why are we cutting

these fucking assholes in who like don't know anything about our product, don't care to

learn.

Yeah.

Like shit, create the, the one maybe negative touch point that people will ever have with

our company.

Yeah.

Um, and so I think people are starting to chafe a little bit.

So I think like, if the affiliate thing at this point is just on, uh, testing the waters

and kind of poking around the edges to cease about selling direct, then it's like, all

right, like they don't need to make money on it.

You know what I mean?

It's like, they don't need to like sell a hundred thousand of them.

It's like, it's kind of an experiment in kind of like a reason or like a workaround to like

see how that goes.

Like that part of it is interesting.

Yeah.

Well, we'll see if that's enough, you know, I realize what it, what it actually looks

like, what it reminds me of more than anything else is like, remember the, um, the, the Marilyn

Manson album cover where it's just like, like the white body that's just like completely,

you know, with like no genitals.

And it's like, that's what, that's what it looks like.

That's exactly right.

Um, Peter, have you seen the dashboard on this thing?

It is miserable.

Oh my gosh.

It makes me absolutely.

Yeah.

I think like, you know, as an actual product, it is, it's interesting.

Like it's an interesting idea to, to do all that.

I don't think it's going to, like, I don't think there's a buyer for it, but it's like,

you know, I've always said like, I'm not, as an automotive journalist, I'm not in the

business of telling far companies how to make money.

I'm telling, I'm in the business of telling them to do things that are amusing to me.

So it's like, you know, I'm not a shareholder.

Like, I don't, I don't care if you lose your rights and stuff.

Like I want to see some weird cars.

Yeah.

And I think like, you know, this kind of fits the bill in that respect where it's like,

I don't know, let's see what happens.

I do think it is a shareholder though.

The thing that's, that's weird though is that like, I mean, Honda also has those, those

other cars supposedly coming that are, that are EVs that, that are the ones that you saw

in, in Japan last year, right?

That are just like really radical, that, that, that really wild as sedan.

Zero.

Right.

And, and it's like, like that stuff, like, like that, and, and there was kind of like the,

the crossover SUV, but, but similar design language where it's like really striking, really

imaginative and like, and radical.

And it's like, like that's something where I look at it and it's like, oh, I can see

people, I can see there being a market for that just because it's so unique and different

and, and, and bold.

Yeah.

But like this just feels like the complete opposite of that where it's just like so anodyne

that it's like, why would anybody want this?

You know, I, I agree on the zeros.

I think they look like, you know, a future car from the seventies.

Like, yeah.

What's the Woody Allen movie where they go to the future and that's it.

But I think it does.

It is fascinating.

You know, I went to the factory last year and, you know, kind of like got inside.

Oh, you come back.

Gonna be a fun for me later.

There he goes.

Am I still there?

Yeah.

You're kind of dropping in and out, but it's all right.

Okay.

Yeah.

Well, I'm in Ohio.

Different internet now.

Oh God, you're in Ohio.

That's even worrying.

Be careful.

Careful.

You might have to redact what you're just, yeah, exactly.

He heard you.

I'm in New Elbe.

But the, I don't think Honda wants to do that car anymore.

I think like that's another one where it's like huge price, very interesting car, but

it's also like, you're going to go to Honda dealerships and like try to talk

somebody out of a CRV and into that thing.

Like, you know, it's a very big swing for Honda.

And I think like in Japan, Honda is that company, you know, Honda is that company

that has like that kind of cultural position where they're like, no, we're going to

sell this hyper futuristic bleeding edge, you know, very avant-garde design car.

But I think they're, I think in the States they are sweating it.

And I think they've pushed it back again, the timeline, which is like, you know, I've

started referring to 2027 as the year they're going to launch all the cars that they're

ever going to launch where it's like, everyone's pushed up back to 2027 to give themselves

a year to figure out like, okay, are we actually doing this?

Which is not a, not about a confidence.

I did hear that, you know, we had someone scheduled to go drive.

This is a piece of information you're not going to get anywhere else and not about

But we had people scheduled to go drive zero in Japan this year, like kind of as a follow-up

to my trip last year.

And I guess like when they were on the plane going to Japan, they canceled the drive.

And we're like, we're not doing it.

And so like, I didn't get an explanation for it.

I'm sure there's a perfectly logical reason why they did it.

But it like somebody, but somebody got a bunch of free miles.

Yeah.

But, you know, I think like the, the kind of, you know, I did a bunch of like executive

panels about the car over the last two years and that they're, you know, it's like it's

kind of they're pretty buttoned down and pretty organized, but there did seem to be like

an kind of unusual amount of like being off message or like being kind of like differential

to each other.

Like, oh, like, you know, people would ask a question and it'd be like, everybody kind

of look around like.

Right.

Yeah.

Who, who's the authority on this?

Who has the authority to answer this question?

Yeah.

So I don't know.

I mean, like I would like to see that come to market.

I don't think it's a big seller in the States.

I mean, it is massively cool and novel and like, you know, I think I said on the pod right

when I went out there last year, but like they were pitching it as like a kind of new

paradigm and like handling like, I guess that the front is very flexible and like.

Right.

No, I remember that.

And, you know, it's like, it's very intuitive and weird.

Yeah.

And I think did they come up with that after the fact, you know, after they were like,

oh, this has no rigidity.

So, so actually this is a different paradigm and handling or is a lot of, you know, you

would love or no, like you'd have to.

It's a feature, not a bug.

Yeah.

But, you know, I want to see it.

I want to drive it.

Yeah.

I would love a world where that car sells very well.

Yeah.

Same.

But it seems, again, it's like, look at what Honda is as a brand in the United States is

like, you know, probably the most sensible, like high quality, but not like flashy, not

like.

Yeah.

It's the Civic and the Accord.

It's right.

It's just the most.

It's like CRV.

Yeah.

Right.

You know, like, yeah.

It's the most normy, normy car that in Toyota.

Yeah.

I mean, like even, even, even more normally than Toyota.

Yes.

Like I think Toyota is a little more out there.

Yeah.

So I think, you know, again, it's like the idea of seeing those at a Honda dealership

and be like, well, like every fucking while.

Yeah.

But we'll see.

Yeah.

Big, big question marks from Honda in 2026 and 27.

Next up, the Jaguar, the 00, the Type 00, lots of zeros, lots of, lots of zero cars.

I mean, this is a car that, that we've, we've talked about that the kind of debuted in,

in kind of a coupe concept form last year or late the year before to like huge controversy.

It's really radical, brutal looking, slab sided.

The production car is going to be like a four door, but, but still presumably like this

kind of low slung, long hood kind of, kind of thing.

And, and this is, this is basically like a full relaunch of the Jaguar brand moving

like way up market, no longer being a kind of, you know, upper middle range thing, but

kind of like moving up into the kind of, you know, Bentley echelon of just like limited

luxury and prestige.

And, you know, and, and, and this is kind of like Jaguar's reentry into the marketplace

after basically taking a couple of years off from like even building cars.

So it's a, it's a huge dice roll.

And I don't know, what do we think?

What do we think of its prospects?

I read some British press on it, like some British press and driven it, which is like

huge grand assault.

Obviously there's like a little bit of a Homer problem there.

You know, like, who are they going to root for?

If not Jaguar, but it's seen, they say it drives awesome.

I think like I've seen the camo version of the four door and I think it looks very good.

I loved the super weird concept.

I think like Jaguar had to do something like it was a company that like I as a car

journalist kept forgetting about, you know what I mean?

It's like, I kept forgetting that it exists.

Yeah.

It's like, that is bad, like that is a bad position to be in.

So it's like, they had to do something.

And I think too, it's like the more, you know, antagonistic and kind of adversarial

they were like the better, like it's like, you know, like it had to be a huge swing

and it had to be like a huge, I think like market position wise too, like that upper

Audi kind of like lower luxury is probably very difficult to play in at the volumes

that Jaguar is capable of producing.

So I think it does make more sense to do like a much, much more premium.

You know what I mean?

It's like Jaguar is never going to.

Yeah.

Well, I mean, as much as the market is.

Well, and they're there.

I mean, it's going to be a much smaller volume vehicle.

You know what this is?

I mean, they they paired back their dealer network a lot.

And yeah, it's going to be a much, yeah, like they can't, they can't go.

And I think like, you know, they tried, they can't go without it.

Like even if, even if there was demand, there's that, like he said, the dealer

network is also not like the many factory capacity.

You know what I mean?

Like there's not that big of a company and like they're not going to.

So it does, I think make more sense to play in that like rare or five super

high margin, super low volume neighborhood.

I mean, I think, I don't know.

I think it like, you know, with all these, it's like the ones that I'm kind of

like more bullish on, it's like, well, they're also going to go try to sell

an EV sedan in America, which is like to me, a non-starter.

Like this is, you know what I mean?

Like it's just, there's not a market for it really.

So as much as I want it to work or I think it's going to be cool or whatever,

it's like, you know, fundamentally pretty limited constituency.

Yeah.

I was just going to say, I mean, I actually, I agree with you and I'm kind of

weirdly bullish on it too, despite not really being persuaded by it at first.

Like, I don't hate it.

I can't say that I love it either, but I do think that it has the potential to do

something that, it occurred to me that it could be kind of like the Cybertruck

in a way that like, where it's like, it's super polarizing.

But the thing, the one thing you got to say about the Cybertruck, you know, again,

love it or hate it, the thing that it does is it makes the fact that it is an EV

almost irrelevant.

Like nobody thinks of that as an EV.

You just think of it as a freaking Cybertruck.

You know what I mean?

And you hate it because of that or you love it because of that, but it's like,

the fact, its EV-ness is just completely beside the point.

Like it's almost like secondary.

It's overridden by other signals it's sending.

Exactly.

And I think that that's significant.

And I think that this car has the potential to be so dramatic that it kind of does the

same thing.

And I think that it is radical enough.

Like another thing that I thought about it was like as dramatic and radical as the Cadillac

Celestic is.

And I could be wrong about this.

It could just be that, you know, I have a fairly limited, you know, cultural kind of

perspective or whatever.

But it doesn't seem to me like that car has made a huge impact on the public consciousness.

Like, has there been, has a Cadillac Celestic appeared in a hip hop video yet?

I don't think that it does anymore.

Is there a video still?

I think so.

I mean, I guess there's no more MTV now.

So maybe they don't.

But like, like to me, that that was always kind of like a signpost of like, you know,

it's like, like, I remember like seeing a Mybox in a, you know, JZ video for the first time

and being like, Oh, wow, that's like, yeah, people know what Mybox are now.

And and I feel like I could see this car, I could see this crazy Jaguar popping up in

a in a video, you know, because it has like, I could see like Kanye rock in one of these

or, you know, somebody like, you know, I mean, Kanye is maybe a bad example, but I don't

know, I could see it like just just being so dramatic that that people are attracted

to it, like in that kind of milieu.

And and and having it like generate that kind of cultural cachet that that that again kind

of makes its its eveness secondary to just how how dramatic a car it is.

Yeah, I think that the actual production car is like far less dramatic than the the

car. Like if the concept was coming to market, I would agree with you.

But I think this will be a little bit toned down, which kind of will reduce that package.

I don't know, man. I mean, the spice shots that I've seen, like it that that cars looks

pretty similar to the show car. I mean, it's just like the greenhouse is longer, but that's

that's really the only significant difference that I've seen.

It's like the proportions are like insane. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It's like a new type of portions. But yeah, I don't know.

Is the hood is the hood going to stay that long?

Yeah, yeah. But yeah, I mean, like I said, it's like, they had to do something. I don't

I would be surprised if it really works in the way that they needed to.

But they had to do something like you can't just you could not ride out whatever except

and

so yeah, like, you know, the thing is, it's like I was really

excited about the kind of little touch up motors when it sounds they had it like the

2015 2016 era, like those were some really good cars to drive.

Like we had that F type for a year that I drove the shit out of.

I drove that car everywhere. And yeah.

And like, you know, we all the stands, like I remember taking like long road trips and

those and loving them, but they were like, you know, kind of played by liability issues

and does the same old Jaguar show where it's like these cars look great.

They drive great, but like they're not relaxed.

Yeah, like they kind of tell us a car, but yeah, it'll be it'll.

I don't know. Like I think Jaguar is kind of doomed.

But the other thing, the other thing too, like the the celestic thing and like even the

so we're we're bullish on the car, but we think the mark is doomed.

I like the car. I just don't think it's going to work.

Like I think it's going to say, you know what I mean?

Like yeah, and the thing about the celestic and the cyber truck to a lesser degree obvious

through the cyber truck like celestic and cyber truck are purely, I mean, cyber truck

was intended to be a volume product and just sucks and everybody hates it.

Right.

It doesn't sell.

Yes.

But like celestic was never intended to be a volume product.

Right.

It was intended to be a brand statement.

And it's like, you know, it's like celestic, you know, they sell.

But I mean, part of part of being a brand statement is that it generates that kind of halo effect

where it's like where everybody is just like, you know, it's the thing that people kind of like whisper

about in awe, you know, or whatever, where it's like, yeah.

And that's ideally that would be the case.

But it doesn't.

What I'm saying is like, you know, they can sell five celestics and still make money selling optics

and, you know, whatever else like crossovers.

Jaguar is not in that position.

Right.

Jaguar is holding a product.

You know, like, so this, this has to, you know, they bring us to market and they sell five

and boom, they're going to be in deep shit.

Yeah.

And I think we'll probably just be done at that point.

Yeah.

Well, yeah, I am cautiously optimistic about about the Jaguar Type 00.

Yeah.

That's about the best I can say for it.

Yeah, I would say I'm really excited about it.

Like I'm excited to drive it.

Good luck to all the makers.

Okay, next up, we got the Rivian R2, the kind of smaller, kind of mid-sized, down-sized

Rivian, which looks a lot like your car, Rory, but maybe shrunken down like 20 percent.

It's, it's going to expected, expected to have a starting price around 45 grand for

single motor and then going up from there.

I mean, I don't know, this could work.

Yeah, I mean, you know, I think like the, the R2, like they need it, you know, Rivian

is in very bad shape trying to sell their current lineup.

I mean, it's just, it's a big, big ask for, I think, for their kind of target customer.

And again, it's like, I hate to keep going back to this, but it's like, it's like, you

know, somebody asked me a couple of weeks ago, like what, what Rivian could do to the R2

to make it like a surefire hit.

And I was like, put a fucking gas motor in it.

Like that, that would be my answer.

Make it a hybrid.

That's, yeah, that's kind of like the only downside to it.

And I, you know, it's like, again, you're, you're just fighting and I pulled battle

selling and maybe at all.

Yeah.

But I think like as a product, this would be really compelling.

I like, I really too, like as I've gotten back into the press car thing and like keep

driving it more and more new cars, like the UI UX on the Rivian is like so much better

than anything else that's in the market.

And I think that is, that is something that's important to people.

I think it looks good.

You know, it'll be a, it'll perform really well on road and off road.

Like it's, it's a really good car.

Like I think like, I don't have any reason to doubt it as a product.

I just have a few reasons to doubt the product category.

But, but I think like, you know, if they, if they would have launched with both of these,

you know, R1 and R2 or whatever.

Yeah.

R1 S and like, I think they'd be in much better shape.

Cause I do think like the cheaper car is going to be a stronger seller.

Yeah.

Oh, it's funny.

I mean, it's like the way that, I mean, it's like both, both Rivian and Lucid have kind

of mimicked the, the Tesla model of kind of lead with the, with the highest end thing.

And then just kind of like try and expand as, as you, you know, kind of go down market.

Yeah.

I mean, I think that's like, I get the logic of it, but it's also like, it does get harder.

You know, like if you're a company that is say losing a billion dollars a quarter.

Yes.

It's like, you know, selling the lower margin product does not seem like a good balance

sheet answer.

You know what I mean?

It's like, if, if, if they could sell more R1 S's and R1 T's at, or, or some at a better

margin, like you'd prefer to do that.

But it's like, you know, that's why Tesla hasn't delivered it, whatever model T or whatever.

Cause it's like, as every company knows, as you go down the price point chain, like your

margins just get worse and worse.

And like in your costs, you know, the change, but they don't, they don't change a ton.

Like it's, you know what I mean?

Like, but it's been very interesting to see Rivian too, like touting very publicly.

Like here's what we're doing because they have a, they have a constituency of investors

that they have to speak to as well as customers.

Like a lot of the messaging from like RJ Scarron and a lot of the message from like Rivian

official channels is like, here's what we're doing to make this car cheaper to make, you

know, we're reducing complexity.

Like we're reducing, and it's like, you know, like Chevy would never have an ad where they're

like social posts where it's like, now with 25 fewer parts.

Yeah.

It's like, hey, we, we reduced the length of the wiring harness.

Yeah.

But I don't know, I think like this, and I think to like counter to kind of most of the

stuff that we've talked about so far in the list, like the Rivian, and maybe it's because

of where I live, but the Rivian does feel like a little bit more of a mainstream potential

product where it's like Rivian has a customer base.

They have an aspirational customer would like to be in a Rivian.

$100,000 on it.

Yeah.

Rivian feels like the, the, the Patagonia of cars.

Yep.

Absolutely.

And I think like, you know, I can look around at my social circle in Traverse City and say

like, you know, there are five or 10 couples or whatever would be in a Rivian.

You know, it would be in the consideration if they were, if they were half as much.

So I think there's, there's more of like a natural constituency for the car than there

would be for like, if you want.

Yes.

Oh, for sure.

I mean, by a thousand, a thousand percent.

Yeah.

Okay.

Next up Jeep Recon, which is like kind of an electric Wrangler ish.

Yeah.

I mean, it's, it's different than a Wrangler in a lot of like very important ways.

I actually saw this in an LA, I think it actually looks pretty rad and especially in

person, like it's very different and it looks very rugged and like, you know, I think like

from a brand fit standpoint, I think like it works really well.

I don't know that there's really like a market for like, I wanted that I wanted to be electric,

you know, like.

Yeah.

I mean, the thing for me is that like you want a Jeep that's 6,000 pounds, has 650 horsepower

and costs $66,000.

That I feel like that's pretty limited, limited for that car.

Yeah.

And I think like, you know, they sold 4XC's, they've had a bunch of problems with them

and they've obviously stopped selling them just recently.

You know, I think there are people who are whatever outdoor adventure people or whatever

who like, like the idea of a car that like doesn't use gas all the time, you know, or

like is a little bit more environmentally responsible, at least theoretically or whatever.

But yeah, this is one I don't know.

I mean, this is one I don't have a really, my gut says, you know, significant difficulty

selling EVs in general in the US.

The kind of like off-road adventure, except you have to charge it thing does not make

sense.

I think I've said that many times with the Rivian thing.

But at the same time, like, I don't know, I think like the look of this car is going

to do a lot of work, the kind of like ability to take the doors off and the roof off, but

also like not have the like super loud kind of agricultural experience of a Wrangler.

I think like is really interesting.

I think that's like going to be kind of overall look.

They think like, yeah, that's something that doesn't register.

People are like, you know, I'll be like, I don't, I like the Wrangler and I like the

Ford Bronco and they're like, oh, they're so loud.

And it's like, yeah, I guess they are, you know, like as a, as a, we've discussed many

times in the public, I just don't, that's, I don't pay attention to that stuff.

Yeah.

Like I'm too much of a Neanderthal to like really, really like be aware of any of that.

But I think the, to the average, like I think there are people that stay out of a Wrangler

that want a Wrangler, they want to be able to take the roof off, they want to be able

to do a little bit of off-roading, they want that kind of like rugged look, but they don't

like the noise.

They don't like the.

Sure.

They don't, they don't want to have to suffer for it.

Yeah.

And I think like, you know, this can deliver some of that, like that, that might be something,

you know what I mean?

Like there might be a five digit sales number per year.

Yeah.

I could see it actually.

Yeah.

And I think like, you know, the price point, I think everyone's kind of giving, like,

are kind of shocked at like a $66,000 cheap, but it's like, go to a Jeep dealership and

shop Wranglers.

Like they're a lot of $60,000 Wranglers out there.

Wranglers start really cheap, but like they don't sell at that price.

Like there are tons of people spending 50, 60, $70,000 Wrangler.

Like that's not sure.

And actually like, like looking at this, like it does, it does kind of have more of a kind

of Land Rover vibe to it that I think could be somewhat appealing.

Yeah.

I mean, I could see, like I said, like a five digit, you know, low five digit sales figure

for that for a year.

And I think like that would be a huge success for Jeep, especially like some forexie has

been a total debacle Wrangler, like, you know, they have all kinds of engine issues.

And like now they've recalled them from the battery and then like the electric wagon

here was like pretty much as big of a flop as you could possibly have with that product.

So I think like, you know, you sell 10,000 of the Recons in a year or 15,000 Recons in

a year.

Like you got to be pretty thrilled with that.

I don't know if that's a business case.

I don't know if that makes sense for them, but like, you know, I would call that a relief

at least if that a win.

Yeah.

I think, yeah.

I think you're right.

I think, yeah, not, not DOA, but not a huge smash, but maybe potential just to kind of fill

a niche for them that, yeah.

Or it could be a total flop, but.

Yeah, possibly.

We'll see.

Okay.

Next BMW iX3, the the Neue class, Neue class electric, electric X3.

Yeah.

And the car that we've talked about, I mean, it's, it's, it's, it's not particularly radical

looking.

It does, it does look better than, than most contemporary BMWs, I think.

I think that the new design language is, is nice.

It's appealing, fresh.

They do talk a lot about the, you know, the car's just whole kind of

I can't remember if this car, which, which car it was that I was reading about where they

were just talking about, like, basically the cars OS, which to me is just like, that,

like, that's what I want to just like send up a distress signal.

It's like, I don't want my car to have an OS.

I know they all do at this point, but just like the fact that it's like, like, oh, but

Yeah, reading Tim's review of it, there was a bunch of stuff that we're like, a lot of

these controls are super counterintuitive.

Is that right?

It's not, and it's not bad once you can use to it.

Yeah.

Which like, Sim would say if that wasn't the case.

But at the same time, it's like, if there was a big flashing light that said this is not

a car for you, I would say it didn't be going off pretty hard reading that.

But I don't know.

I like it.

I also, it's like, to me, it's like, okay, you sit this next to the, I know what's the

X3 or whatever, you know, yeah, it's the regular X3.

And it's like, okay, I'm a suburban mom X3 buyer.

Sell me the I X3.

You know, like, why do I, why do I pay more for that?

And like that, that's a huge question for me.

Like I, I don't know how to answer that.

I also will totally cop to like, you know, I don't, I don't understand what BMW's brand

position is at all right now.

Yeah.

That's the thing.

I mean, BMW, it's just like, is a bit inscrutable to me.

Like I'm definitely not that, that, that buyer and, and I kind of don't have a real solid

sense of who that buyer is.

Well, at the same time, I have to acknowledge that there are clearly a lot of people who

are that buyer because a lot of people buy BMWs.

And I mean, it's, it's like, it's the one German brand right now that, that I feel like

is probably best positioned and healthiest in terms of just like weathering the current,

you know, German economic storm.

I don't mean that as a criticism whatsoever.

Like I personally don't understand it.

I don't think it's, you know, it's like, it has not been explained to me or like invade

to me in any way, like what their, what their intention is or what they're trying to do.

But clearly it's working like they're, they're selling a ton of cars, like they're doing

really well.

So it's not criticism.

It's just like, I don't, I personally don't know what they're trying to do.

And I don't know how this product kind of fits into that.

It does.

Again, it does feel a lot like a car that was engineered for a feature that never happened.

You know what I mean?

Like, yeah, I mean, I don't know.

I think, I think it could still happen.

I think that in, and actually, I mean, this car, they, you know, Jace is expected to start

around 60 grand, which that seems pretty reasonable for, for a car that, I mean, the one thing

that like, you know, when I, when I read things like reviews of, of, or watch videos about

people driving like current BMWs, they all really rave about, you know, not necessarily

like track behavior or whatever, but, but just like general just driving competence and,

and just, yeah, I mean, they're, they're apparently great cars to drive.

And, and maybe that's just what keeps people coming back.

And it's the ultimate driving machine.

It's the ultimate driving machine, the last ultimate in the sense that it is the last driving machine.

Sign off.

Yes.

Because we're, we're all going to die.

Okay.

Last up is the Acura.

Excuse me.

I'm about to sneeze.

This is a car I did not, was not aware of at all the Acura ZDX, which is.

It's the Honda Prologue Chevy Deeper Nights.

Okay.

So it's, so it's, it's the Acura version of that.

It looks, I have to say really good.

It's a, it's a very sporty and, and handsome package in my opinion.

It is expected to start just north of 50 grand.

So, I mean, this is like kind of mid-sized, dual motor built in Ohio.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I mean, just, just going off vibes.

I could, I could see this.

I mean, just judging by the number of prologues I see around, that's, that's a very successful

car where I live.

And, and I don't think it is overall though.

Is that right?

Yeah.

I don't, I don't, I mean, they canceled it.

Oh, they did.

Yeah.

This is the last version of that car that's out there.

Oh, I had no idea.

I did not realize that the prologue was, was gone.

Well, that's good because those cars blind me more frequently than any other car on the

road.

And I want to kill the person who made those headlights.

But, but, but I mean, this, this accurate version of it, I like, to me, it just looks

like a way cooler looking version of that is kind of sportier and sleeker and sexier.

And if it's starting around, you know, 50 or mid 50s or whatever, I can, I can see that

finding, finding its way into some, some households.

Yeah.

I mean, you know, they've kept it around while they kill the prologue.

So excuse me, they have to be feeling that there's some potential for it.

Yeah.

Or at least they have, they have like anything in the lineup.

Right.

It is, it is weird.

Like, you know, Acura has gone from feeling pretty focused, like through the launch of

the Integra to like kind of hitting the panic button.

They killed a bunch of cars this year.

Yeah.

And they're really struggling with a couple of others.

And I think like, seem to be again, a little bit of a panic posture, which is like, unusual

for Acura, unusual for Honda, like Acura is another one, like just a steady Eddie, like,

you know, like we're not trying to go for Lexus or whatever, but like we're going to make money

and yada, yada.

It's like, but I think the EV thing, you know, it was steady Eddie.

That's, that's a cat carol.

That's great.

But my, isn't that a phrase?

Like, have you heard that before?

I have.

But I mean, it like, it feels like something that like, that older people in my family would,

would have said too.

Okay.

Cause there's a bunch of stuff that my dad said that I, I have grown up thinking we're

idioms that are like great common, like trends of phrase.

That is not all that he said.

And so now when I say stuff and it gets a response, I have to chuck like, right.

But, um, yeah, I, I don't know.

Like I think like, uh, two years ago, I think at Pebble Beach, I was talking to a bunch

of Honda executives and I was like, Hey, do you feel kind of like vindicated as like

the EV thing has proven to be very difficult.

It's like from stack and, um, you know, the, the kind of regulatory structure around them

or the incentive structure around them is going to change.

Do you feel vindicated for waiting?

And like one of the Honda executives was like, yeah, and then another one was like, no, I

feel like we're way behind and we need to get our product out.

Like I feel like, you know, we're lagging the rest of the industry on EV stuff.

And, uh, you know, I think like that kind of is playing out in the actual lineup and the

actual, it's like, they don't, you know, they can relate to the EV thing and then like

the thing is not happening.

And now it's like, oh, shit, but we have all these EVs kind of waiting in the wings.

And like, you know, it feels like they're kind of waiting for a sign as to like what

their positioning is or like what their direction is.

Yeah.

But yeah, it does look good.

Like it's just, you know, from a specs perspective, like it's just not super competitive.

So it feels, you know, it's almost like it feels like a mortal compliance thing.

Or it's like, we've got to have an EV in the lineup.

And this is going to be it until the butter comes on.

Yeah.

So you guys want to know where we're now at half?

Maddie?

Oh, yeah.

Yeah, we've got a bunch to work with.

Do we want to call it or do you want to,

I don't think it's right.

No, I think we can go probably good at this point.

Yeah.

Well, that concludes our 2026 forthcoming EV predictions.

Mash your pass.

Hot or not.

No, we should do, we should do what's the predictive market thing.

The Drive Kings for Human Lives site.

Oh, Cal-Sheep polymarket?

Polymarket.

We should do a polymarket thing with this.

Oh, yeah.

Sure.

Let's do it.

Maddie, you figure out how to do it.

I would sooner.

Well, I won't.

We'll tie it to the Patreon.

Everybody can get in.

We're all going to make a lot of money.

I hate living and being alive.

Did you guys, I forgot the guy that absolutely did the wire.

He's like a kind of a weird guy.

But one thing that I will always give him credit for is,

I'm sure you've heard this,

but last year he was on one of the NPR shows.

And like one of the NPR hosts was like,

you've got to be really excited about AI.

Like it's opening up so many possibilities for me.

And he was like, let me be in.

He's like, well, say you're writing a series.

Oh, I remember this.

Yeah.

And he's like, you know,

you're trying to figure out how to get from one scene to the next.

And you can just plug into AI.

You know,

give me 20 different scenarios that lead from the scene to the scene.

And he was like, I'd rather put a gun in my mouth,

which is like whatever.

David Simon true.

But also just a hilarious thing to say on NPR.

Like, you know what I mean?

Like in the context of an interview.

Right.

We say that all day long saying Terry Gross or whoever is really good.

Right.

Yeah, that's really funny.

Yeah.

And like,

especially when someone is just approaching this in total good faith,

like totally like, you know, totally like,

why would you be against this?

And then it's like,

actually,

let me be clear.

That's good.

Very good.

Yeah.

All right.

Well,

safe travels.

Enjoy your family vacay and your time in Florida.

And yeah,

send us some some pics and and and reporting from from the track

when you get down there.

I'll talk to you before then.

But I'll bring you a lizard or something.

Yay.

Big day for me.

Stay tired.

Yep. Stay tired.

Stay tired.

All right.

Peace out.

Yeah.

Episode 104: Hot or Not

About this episode

Coyote V8

AO Racing LMP2

Honda Affila

Maybach

Jaguar Type

Request an Explanation

Want to learn more?

Help improve this episode

More from Tired: The Car Podcast For People Who Understand That Cars Are Bad