Episode 88: EV4 outrage, the Micra backlash and Volvo doubles up

Hello, and welcome to your weekly recharge of all the latest electric car news brought to you by the team at ElectriFind.com.

This week, we're going to be talking about how it has been apparent to us that you cannot please all of the people all of the time, as Nicola and I were about to get a really good turning off.

Those will also be answering your electric car questions, dipping into the postbag to find out all your views on last week's episode.

Welcome to the kilowatt half hour. I'm very repentant, Ginny.

I am a apologetic Nicola.

And I'm right. Oh, sorry. I'm Mike. Yes.

And you're Mike. Should we kick off with the elephant in the room?

Normally, we would go to the comments on the questions towards the end of the podcast.

Or should we just make people wait to find out why we're going to get to hold off?

I think we should wait.

Okay. That's the YouTuber hook, isn't it? Stay with us, gang.

I don't know. What do we do?

Find out later.

Anyway, let's talk about some news. What have you been driving?

So professional.

I don't know what YouTubers say.

Mike, you've been driving a lot of stuff, haven't you?

But I love the fact that you've been from one extreme to the other.

Really? Indeed. It's a rare day out of the office on Monday.

I drove, yeah, two really different cars.

You couldn't get them more different, actually.

I drove the first time I had to go in one of the MG IM cars.

MG IM 5 and 6, which were crazy quick and loaded with tech.

Just about the most advanced things, you know, the electric car I've driven in a long time.

I also drove a Microlino, which is that kind of, it's like a smeg toaster on wheels.

It's a lovely cute little sort of reboot of the classic sort of Izetta bumble car.

It's something I've been following for ages.

I had a deposit down at one point, but I decided not to do it when it was all delayed

and then the prices were a little bit higher than everyone thought, but it's a weird thing.

Did you both get it going? I know you've got to go in it, Nicola.

Yeah, we all drove it. It's just a charming little thing, isn't it?

You can't fail but love it, actually, but I'm just not sure how practical it is.

As are a lot of those little micro car quad recycles, really.

They're all charming in their own way.

I think this probably has gotten more charm than any I've seen.

It's quite a punchy price tag, though, I thought as well.

Yeah, wasn't it like 21 grand or something? Ridiculous, yeah.

But I mean, I took it for a little spin and I absolutely loved it

and I do think I reckon I could get myself and both my dogs in there

and it's got a little bit of boot space.

But the moment I saw Mike get into it, I was like, Mike, this is Mike's car.

This is Mike's car. Hands down, this has got Mike written all over it.

This is 100% the car for you, Mike. You have to get one.

I mean, it ticks all the boxes, mate. It's impractical.

I'd lose a fortune on it. I must be ill because I didn't, you know,

despite doing that and getting into it and quite enjoying it,

I didn't leave thinking I absolutely have to own one of these,

which I've done with another car. I know.

I don't think I'm getting old.

Yeah, I still saw you looking longer.

We had a twizy there as well for reasons which will be revealed in a few weeks,

but I still saw you looking longingly at that twizy.

Yeah.

You had a glint in your eye with that.

There was a bit of sellers regret about the twizy.

I don't think I've really regretted selling any of the cars I've had.

But the twizy, yeah, I think that was, I called that a bit too early really.

And it's quick the twizy as well.

Yeah.

I was quite surprised. It really can shift.

Yeah, it's a nippy little number,

which I kind of not really sure it should be able to be as quick as that.

It feels a little bit too fast for something.

It is terrifying at 50 miles an hour in a twizy.

It really does.

Yeah, I did drive it at full power.

We were on a track, I hasten to ask.

Yes.

But still it did feel, I'm not sure I'd want to be driving it at that speed

out on the open roads.

But yeah, it was, that was a fun day.

And we've got, we've got some, some treats coming your way from that day

where we had a full on team day.

You've been driving something a bit more practical.

A bit more practical.

Could be as ugly as a car only a mother could love or one of the variants,

the EV4.

Is it for me, the EV4?

Like, I love, I mean, we all know, I've said this a million times.

I love Korean cars.

I think they're fantastic.

And I think they're just like the best things ever.

But then, you know, we've fallen in love with the EV3.

We love the EV9.

I love the EV6.

And then this car's come along.

And it's like they've designed it on a Friday afternoon.

And they've gone, let's just not bother with this one.

And it's just, it's, it's not a looker.

And let's be honest, the fastback is ugly as sin.

That's it.

No, that's a firm no from me.

I'm looking at Mike's face because I feel like maybe Mike likes it.

No, I mean, it does look like two.

It looks like it was designed by two different people who didn't

speak to each other.

Yes.

Yeah.

I mean, to be fair, and I think you do say this in the video as well.

I actually quite like the hatchback.

I don't think no.

And actually, so I remember these pictures first dropped when I went

out to look at them and Tom and I were talking about them.

And we were both completely in agreement on the fastback.

It's a very unusual looking car.

Very, very different.

Yes.

It's a car with a really good personality.

The hatchback, I don't, I'm listening.

I'm not saying it's, it's EV6 and I'm not saying it's a great

looker and I don't absolutely love it.

But I don't, I think in comparison, it looks a lot better.

But I would like to know what people think.

Go and check out the video of the, of the EV4.

If you haven't already, it's here on YouTube.

We've got it over at the website, electrefine.com.

Let us know in the comments for next week what you guys

would like to make of the EV4, the hatch.

I'm, I'm wondering if maybe the hatch just looks nice because

it's parked next to the fastback.

Possibly.

Yeah.

It's a bit like it's the, it's the best of two horrible

looking things.

But the annoying thing is, is it drives really well?

It will do, won't it?

It drives really well.

And the other thing is the fastback.

It's got the most range key has ever had in a car.

I can't remember off the top of my head.

Is it 400 miles?

It's touching.

Yeah.

It's because of course it's got that slightly unusual,

but very aerodynamic shape.

Yeah.

You're quiet on this, Mike.

You're quiet.

No, I think it's a, it's a, it's challenging piece of design.

I think both, I think, I think from the side, there are

some angles that work better than others.

But the rear, from the rear, sort of three quarters

onwards, both of them are kind of quite weird.

I don't think fit with the rest of the family terribly well.

Yes.

I think that's the thing.

And most of us on the electrifying team, we like a weird

looking car.

We like something quirky, something that stands out amongst

a lot of cars that end up looking the same.

We like that.

But then this car's come along and it's like, it's a

universal, oh God, no.

I know.

That's what it feels like.

I'm not seeing it.

So I saw it for the first time in studio in Korea last

September.

So I was out there driving EV3.

And they took us into that Namyang, which is where

they developed their cars and their design studios were

there and we went into a studio and they showed us,

they showed us the EV2 in an early stage form in a

clay.

They showed us the EV5 and then they showed us the

EV4.

And even then I remember it was the one that was

there in the corner of the studio in the saloon form

that everyone was a bit like, oh, okay.

That's Sam.

Yeah.

They knew what they were doing by putting it in the corner.

So they put it in the corner for a reason.

They did.

Oh, nobody puts the EV4 in the corner.

Anyway, let us know what you think.

Because I do think this will probably be another round

of ours that will end up being a bit divisive

because beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

And I think you've already been told off in your

video in the comments I noticed for having too much of

an opinion on the way it looked.

How dare I?

But it is absolutely true that you were very much told

that your job was to drive and assess the car and not

comment on the way it looked, Nicola, because that's

for the individual to decide.

Have you not seen that?

Is that what someone said?

It's a real comment.

Yeah.

I spotted it this morning.

Yeah.

So does that mean we're not allowed to have

opinions anymore?

We're not.

That's our job.

So I'm going to take a step for, you know, again, as we're

going to find out as this podcast goes on, you and I have

been put on the naughty step.

Fine.

Okay.

As long as you bring me wine on the naughty step, I'll

be fine.

Oh, no.

You don't get wine on the naughty step.

So I spent a bit of time reacquainting myself with

the Taycan Cross Turismo.

Someone's got to do it.

I know it's awful.

It was just, you know, I thought I'd take one of

the team on that.

Thank you.

But it also coincided with the news from Porsche this

week that they are really scaling back its EV

plans.

So I don't know if you guys saw that news.

So they're massively hedging back on it.

Scrapping battery production.

They're extending combustion models.

And it triggered quite a big hit on the share

price.

And it's also going to have to be going to

cost them a lot of money, you know, shy on

two million to start to adjust all their

production plans to go back into, you know,

producing more of the combustion engine

costs.

They had been set on becoming an EV only

brand.

And it just reminded me that it just made me

think, why are they doing that?

I mean, they're doing it.

I know because they don't feel that the

global market is where they need it to be

to only be selling EVs.

But they're doing a bloody good job of

them.

I mean, that Taycan Cross Turismo is a

beautiful, beautiful thing to drive.

The McCann.

Fabulous.

And I do think that that I don't know.

I thought I found it a curious decision

from somebody that actually is doing

really great stuff on

electrification to do that.

But anyway, that's what they decided.

But I was also like pouring through the

options list on it because you got to

love a Porsche options list, haven't you?

They are just great.

The money goes.

Yeah.

Absolutely brilliant.

So the base car was 99,000

pounds for this.

So it was the 4S Cross Turismo.

It had 26,000

pounds worth of extras on.

I love.

The paint.

So there's this fabulous paint

color, which is

like a kind of, you've seen it, it's like a

kind of purple-y type color.

Oh, it's like berry.

Berry.

It's cold.

I can't remember what it's called,

actually.

It's cold.

But that, from memory, was 1,400 quid.

The wheels, beautiful wheels.

21-inch wheels.

I was utterly terrified every time I

got to look up.

3,500 pounds.

It's got this thing.

It's got the Porsche Active Ride

system, and that's a fairly new

suspension setup that Porsche has

done.

It's six and a half grand.

I've got to say,

if I was speccing the car, that is

worth every single penny.

It is the ride on that,

on that Taycan Cross Turismo with

the Active Ride is

utterly unbelievable.

It stays so flat under braking,

accelerating.

When you corner, it kind of bends

slightly into it, like a motorbike.

You go over speed bumps and you're

like, was that a speed bump,

really?

It's got that.

It does feel nice and agile and

sports car-like.

But it's also got, wow,

just that kind of very luxurious,

super, you know,

super refined feel that you get

in a really expensive saloon car.

I thought it was, I think there's

a lot on the options list I

wouldn't be going for.

I wasn't fortunate enough to be in

the position of speccing one of those

over the coming weeks and months.

I mean, hats off to you if you are,

you're winning at life.

I would definitely consider that.

I thought it was amazing, amazing.

Wow.

That's quite a statement.

Quite a statement.

It was my favourite thing about the car.

I wanted to, I drove over quite a

lot of speed bumps just to kind of

reassure myself that I wasn't

being wrong in my assessment.

It's bloody brilliant.

I don't know what, do you reckon about

the Porsche news?

I was a bit surprised, actually.

Yeah, I feel a bit surprised by it.

But also there is a part, I mean,

it's like, it feels maybe a tad

predictable that they decided to do

that.

I'm trying to think of everything

else within their line-up and obviously

they're trying to keep their customers

as happy as possible.

So are they just going to stick to

doing, they're just going to do some

plug-in hybrids rather than fully

electric vehicles?

Well, they're definitely pushing through,

because the McCann was electric only,

isn't it, at the moment?

So they're definitely pushing through

a combustion engine version of that

and they're just going to revise the

line-up going forward.

But I mean, as long as they don't

drop EVs completely, I guess.

But it's obviously a very expensive

decision to start rolling back on.

There we go.

So what else are we going to talk

about on this podcast?

Are we going to tell people why we're

in trouble yet or are we going to go

back?

I'm going to give you the news hard out

of the week.

So there's quite a bit of news in the

last seven days or so.

But the one that caught my eye was

the Volvo EX90 had an upgrade.

No, it's only been out for a year.

Now normally when car manufacturers do

a model year update, you might get

a new colour, different design of

wheel, something like that, you

know, if you're lucky.

But Volvo have gone proper big

time.

It's a huge change.

They're changing the architecture

and it's getting a whole new

brain that runs the

infotainment and all the systems

as well.

Do you know how many calculators it

makes per second?

This new brain system it's got.

Well, they all know

will tell you hundreds of

millions, won't they, in their

press releases, which just kind of

blows my mind and doesn't really

mean much, but got to me.

But go on, how many?

How many?

500 trillion operations

per second.

I mean, I can't decide what

I'm going to have for breakfast.

And this thing is making 500

trillion operations per second.

Now, that is

seriously impressive.

If only, if only

that LiDAR system wasn't

sat at the top of the car like a

London taxi sign.

I know, but apparently that's

the only place it'll work properly.

But I mean, there is

I mean, it's all good news, but

it's particularly good.

If you bought, if you're one of

those early adopters who bought

the car in the first year and

you're thinking, hang on a minute,

this is this is a completely

different car they're rolling out

now.

Apparently this is all

retrofitable and it will be.

I'll tell the cars back to the

workshop.

Transfer the car from a 400 to

800 volt system is

retrofitable.

How do they do that?

Really surprising.

Well, I can imagine that it

ran as an 800 volts.

It was designed as an 800

and they stepped it down to

400 because all the rest of

stuff worked with it.

Yeah.

So now I think it's enabling it

as I don't think you could

normally transfer, you know,

convert any 400 volt into an

800 volt car by plitting a

switch or changing with a

software.

But apparently the

none of the early customers

are going to lose out.

They're going to, I don't know

how long it takes, but all

cars, they're going to be

invited back and get it

updated.

So yeah, I mean, it'd be

quite a different car, I

imagine, because I think it

was slightly hobbled by the

fact that the software

wasn't ready.

That's the one who drove

in the States, wasn't it,

Nick?

Yeah.

And it was everyone was

having technical issues with

how it's pre-production.

It's pre-production, but

also at the same time,

literally the following week

they were being rolled out

to customers.

Yeah.

So we were all like, oh,

it's just, to me, it's still

being this pre-production

at this point.

It just doesn't feel right.

Everyone's screens were

crashing and all that sort

of stuff.

So software updates are

going to be very handy

for this thing.

But I guess in some ways

it does make sense to me

because we were about to

drive the ES90, which we

saw earlier this year,

which is of course the

saloon version of that.

And that already had this

stuff on, didn't it?

And it had that.

It had it from memory

a more powerful

NVIDIA micropost.

Yeah.

It's got all that stuff on it.

All the stuff that the EX

are going to get there.

So they've obviously gone right.

We'll give it all this,

check it all works, do it all

on that, and then we'll

transfer it, which is a

sensible thing to do.

But I think what's

fascinating for me,

just about cars generally

now, and I really noticed

this actually when I was

out in Munich at the

motor show, was suddenly

they all want to shout

about have we got a

Qualcomm chip?

Is it an NVIDIA?

What's its processing power?

What is it?

A Snapdragon.

This new language

about computer processing

is now intrinsic

when we're talking about

cars.

And that's something that

I think until I would even

say over the last sort of

12, 18 months, we just

wasn't really on our radar

really, was it?

No.

You know, what tech

who was making the

chips going into the cars?

Whereas now it's

often like front and

centre of what they're

telling people.

I don't know.

Does it make a difference

to your buying habits,

whether the car's got

a Qualcomm chip

or an NVIDIA chip?

I don't know.

Not sure it does,

but I think it does.

I think it does.

If you're the kind of person

that's buying this,

if you've grown up with

computers and smartphones

being the defining

factor of them is

the chips that run them,

maybe that's the thing

or it means nothing.

It means very little to me

as long as it works.

But yeah,

people

think people have some sort of

brand loyalty in the way

they do with, you know,

Microsoft and Apple

and that kind of thing.

Do they think, well,

I'm an NVIDIA guy?

Yeah, I'd love to know that.

I think I want to follow that.

You know, it's interesting,

isn't it?

Yeah, let us know.

It's podcast at electrify.com

or you can let us know

in the comments below.

But yeah, they both had

like massive presence

at Munich

with their own stands

and, you know,

as did Google as well,

you know,

sort of TED talky

things happening.

And again,

it's just not something

you would have seen.

It's almost that crossover

between, you know,

sort of the big tech events

now becoming much more integrated

into the automotive ones.

I mean,

I've noticed the same

just abnormal tech events.

They now have whole stands

for automotive stuff

where everything's

all just being blended together.

I think it's just

it's a generational thing,

isn't it?

Because I think a lot of people,

I mean, even, you know,

younger than me

sort of in their 20s

actually find their tech

a very important thing.

Their whole life revolves

around tech.

If they can buy a car

that then they know

is still kind of a drivable computer

that they understand

how it works

and they like that technology

and that particular chip,

then I guess then the car itself

doesn't really matter.

It's all what's going on

within its brain, I guess.

Yeah.

And I guess it ties into that whole

what's that big show in Vegas

consumer electronics show

every year

for more, you know,

for quite a long time now

that has become

a bit of a test bed of both,

hasn't it?

But yeah, let us know,

are you a fan

of a certain kind of processing chip?

Would it influence

your buying decision on your car?

Yes.

Good question.

Any more news?

What else?

Any more news?

Towing cars?

Towing cars.

Best tow cars announced.

This is Batch's department,

really, because Batch

loves a tow car, doesn't he?

And he does that.

Isn't he a judge?

Is he not a judge?

He is a judge.

He is a judge on the tow car

awards.

Yes.

Well, I mean,

the kind of headline figure here

is that

six of the top

category winners

in the tow car awards

were EVs.

So there's not like

an electric car category

for, you know,

that can tow

some little trailers

or anything like that.

This is the proper

they test them with.

They're all the other

petrol and diesel cars,

and EVs won

six of the major categories,

which I think is,

you know,

showing that there's

definitely progress from here.

I think there's

it's not perfect,

is it, by any stretch

in terms of towing

and range and everything.

But just to give you

Enyaq,

Aria,

Porsche McCann

and BMW iX

all won their categories.

And the iX was named,

was electric

tow car of the year.

So you do tow

and it's all sort of

moving in your direction,

I would say.

Definitely is,

isn't it?

You do have to pay for it,

though,

because you do still

need the big batteries,

don't you?

You sure do.

To do that.

So yeah,

it does come at a cost,

but it's definitely getting there.

Manos is going to

be happy, isn't he?

Because

the two

adventurers got

the government

electric car grant.

Well,

it hasn't got

the government

electric car grant,

but it gets its own

electric car grant

as well.

I know, I know.

It's the big one.

Go on,

go on,

tell me.

Yeah, so it's

Jeep's own one

because the

Avenger itself

doesn't qualify

for the grant,

but it's 3,750 quid.

So they've gone

for the full amount

that any car

can get.

Do you actually,

one car has actually

got from the

government,

which is the

four-poomer.

It's the only car

that's received that,

so good on them.

Indeed.

And it's

zero percent

about an Avenger fan,

which Manos is,

I would say that now

is the time to

strike a good deal

on one of those.

Manos's

love for the Avenger

is actually exhausting.

It's

unparallel as well.

We were

in Malaga this week

and we were

just out driving

and as soon as he spots

one, he goes,

that's the greatest car

ever made.

Oh my God,

I love that car so much.

Let me take a picture

of that car.

Look at that.

Oh my God,

it's so amazing.

Every time,

every time you've seen one.

He's obsessed.

He is obsessed.

I don't know.

I mean,

it is a great car,

but he really does love it

like to a degree

that I don't understand either.

No.

So,

have we got

a Barnards bargain

for us?

Yes,

I've got two

and as usual,

one to buy,

which came up last week

in the podcast.

The Ioniq

without a number,

the original Ioniq,

the Wind Knife,

as it was known.

Yeah.

Tom's found one of those.

It's a

38.3

kilowatt-hour one,

11,250 quid,

and you've got 9,000 miles on the clock

and that's a perfect battery score.

Very nice.

I've just checked it.

It's still there.

You can find it on

Electrifying.com,

Fortress,

used cars.

We've got rid of the hyphen, Ginny.

Last week,

you said,

why have we got a hyphen

between used and cars?

I've never got a hyphen.

That's what we do.

That's the power.

That's what I do.

You ask for it,

it gets done.

So,

you can still use the one

with the hyphen.

It goes to the place.

Right.

A leasing,

a leasing deal now.

Just before we go on

to the leasing deal,

I just wanted to talk

a bit about used cars

because I don't really,

it's really interesting,

isn't it, is people,

you know,

know what you do

and start saying,

oh, I'm thinking about

going to electrics.

I've had two lots of this

this week.

I was away for

a couple of days

and Jeff,

our lovely Sam Ricardist

who lives in Bath

was like,

I really like to go right to part.

I just can't afford it.

I just was like,

well, what's your budget?

It's like,

10 maybe 11,000

and want something new

of course you can.

So I took him through the listings

and I'm showing him,

you know,

there's a really good

Peugeot E208 on there,

decent range,

you know,

I think it had like

16,000 miles on it,

just under 11

ground at the time.

And it was an absolute

eye-opener for him.

Really?

As to what,

what now you could get

and he still just thought,

no,

it's going to be

way too expensive for me

and literally

he's gone away with

about three different things

that he's going to look at

and he's going to buy

a used EV

and he was,

you just was convinced

that it wasn't even worth

bothering.

So that's,

I think what's interesting

is where,

where the price is unused

or coming down,

we'll get into that magic

point now where

you can actually pick up

a really good one

for under 10 grand

and it's going to be

more and more of those.

So that,

that was it.

And then there was

there was somebody else

there that was saying,

I also want to switch.

They wanted something new,

but increasingly now

those conversations

are coming from people,

but it was the used one

that I found really

interesting.

Now they're still too expensive.

You know,

we still have to worry

about the batteries

and I showed him a couple

of our articles

and shown him some cars

and he was like, right,

I'm on it.

I'm doing it.

So he's going to go

and buy one, which is brilliant.

They're nice.

They're welcome to

the world of EVs.

Jeff and family.

Yeah, Jeff the soundman.

Fantastic.

Yeah,

he said he'll let us know

when he,

so we can do an official

welcome to him.

What was the other

the other lease,

leasing, right?

Okay.

Put your lease hat on now.

I'm going to give you another.

What would you rather have?

Okay.

Cause the,

the government grants

being filtered down.

They're starting to come

into the lease pricing now.

So they,

they have been reduced.

Would you rather have

Renault five,

40 kilowatt hour,

Renault five,

210 pounds per month.

This is exactly the same deal.

Or would you have a Renault

four with the bigger battery

with 255 pounds

per month?

So that's 45 pounds

difference.

I'm holding,

I'm holding that five,

five.

Five.

I mean,

this all comes down to

how you run your life.

I mean, for me,

you know,

I don't have children.

I just got a couple of dogs

only to throw in the back.

So for me,

it's the Renault five all day.

But if you do have

kids and you need

better access to the

rear space,

that Renault four deal

is magnificent.

I think

again,

what's that showing

is just

how competitive it's getting

now out there.

I mean, the fact that it's cheaper

than something like

a BYD Dolphin,

you know,

that's pretty,

that's a good price.

Isn't it?

Oh, sorry.

Someone's on the phone.

Sorry.

Just have just

they've gone now.

Okay.

That was just somebody

phoning to disagree

with me on that.

That was

BYD.

It was big.

Yeah.

Ring from China.

I can't.

I've never said I can like I

can't learn to learn.

I'm able to learn to hate.

I learn to love.

I did say.

No.

Didn't say that.

Yeah.

aircraft.

Um,

OK.

So what else,

what else for

us?

So we've done.

How would you

rather welcome to the

world of Eve E Fine.

Do you want to welcome

somebody, Nick?

Have we got someone to

welcome to the

world of Eveeizin

Yes, yes, so that should have been the big bit with the green hat with the green head.

Yeah, perhaps. I'll go for it.

Drew Brown, a 4103 who got in touch with my YouTube and this is referring back to the

conversation we have where apparently the the Ioniq that we were just talking about has

been widely referred to as a wind knife, which I haven't heard, which I loved.

So Drew Brown said we just chopped in our wind knife like what you did there for an

Instagram Monday. It's Friday now. We'll never have the six plus miles per kilowatt hour,

but so far we're getting 4.8 to 4.9 and the weather's cooling down. Can't wait for summer.

I was getting antsy about getting parts of the Ioniq. Hyundai made us an offer. We couldn't

refuse having invited us in for their sales weekend. My wife is quite disgusted with the

unmistakable color I chose. Sienna orange, but I love it. I really love it.

Love an orange car, yes. I can find it in my car park. I can fit my walker in the

boot or behind the seat. So if you're in Kent, look out for Drew, Drew Brown in the orange Sienna

orange insta. Give him a wave and embarrass his wife. Definitely. It's a great car. Really good

thing. Brilliant. I love a bold color in a car. That's a great choice. I know exactly.

I mean, I've got that Renault 5 in that bright, kermit green and I absolutely love it and my

son is mortified by it still. He literally was like, oh God, that's great. Literally he kind of

puts his hoodie up when he comes out from the school college car park for me to get into the car,

so his friends can't see him. Right, okay. I've caught up with where you are now,

so now I can do the next one. Here we go. This is from Neil Lark. Hi Neil. He says,

I can't help it. I'm an over researcher and have to understand everything before I spend my

hard-earned cash. Fair play. So last year, I thought about getting a FEV, so I started my research.

Having seen pretty much all of your videos and hundreds of others, I came to the conclusion

that a FEV is pointless. Batteries last. There's lots more to go wrong, etc. in a FEV.

But having seen the huge leaps in battery tech this year, I've decided to wait

and lease an EV for two years to see what unfolds. I have just booked a lease

on a Ford Puma EV Premium. All the add-on packs, 8 grand, 8,000 miles a year,

nine months deposit, £164 a month for 23 months. I think that's a great deal. What do you think?

Would that make a Barnard bargain? I think that would make a Barnard bargain. That's amazing.

That's a result of 164. That's a good car, isn't it? Yeah, great car. Good fun.

Wow. That is absolutely a Barnard bargain. Yeah. Welcome. Let us know what you think of it, Neil,

as well. And the best boot space you will ever see. Unbelievable. You can literally hide a body in there.

We put Vicky Parrot in there. Did you ever let Vicky out, by the way? She's not still in there.

I'm going to give you a buying dilemma from Peter Schoenberg, who I guess emailed in.

And if you do want to email your questions in, it is podcastatelectrovine.com.

So I have a buying dilemma. I'm about to go fully electric after years with my beloved BMW

330e plug-in hybrid, which is one of our very, very popular early reviews actually on the site

from when we did do quite a few favorite reviews. It's really populist all that. Anyway,

its logical replacement is an i4, but BMW is obviously selling as many as it wants,

and there are very few deals around. I can't find a monthly price for under £600.

So I've been looking at the competition. Tesla Model 3 will be cheap, because at the moment,

I guess, the Musk situation, you'd guess right. I can get a long range all-wheel-drive Model

3 for just under 350 quid a month for 0% finance. That's a huge difference. But I'm worried that I'm

going to be the butt of everyone's jokes if I go for Tesla. Do they offer a version without a badge?

You can do what everyone else has been doing and just change your badges over. I've seen a Tesla

with a Honda badge. Just get a sticker for the back that just says it was so cheap I couldn't

resist. Nothing is going to disguise the fact, as I'm sure you know, that what you are driving.

I think a sticker, if you feel it appropriate, is absolutely the right thing, the right way to go

and would explain your decision if you're feeling remotely uncomfortable about it,

because that is a pretty good price for a good car. It's a tricky situation with Tesla, isn't

it? Because I mean, if you disagree with Elon, it's annoying that it would then affect your choices,

because also at the same time, you've got everyone that works at Tesla that probably also disagree

with Elon, but they're just doing their job and they could probably do with getting the money in

themselves and selling their cars and they don't end up all losing their jobs. So really,

you're doing it to support everybody else. Not Elon, you're supporting everybody else.

And there are some very nice people like that at Tesla that we know. So there are,

it's just such an interesting thing, isn't it? You know, that kind of the consumer's right to

I guess have your thoughts and feelings made by just refusing to engage or buy a brand,

but you know, a certain brand. But yeah, I wouldn't, I think I do think a sticker

is the way to go with it. Or as Nick said, you could get a Nissan badge.

Stick a Nissan badge on it.

There you go. If you don't get it, listen to last week's podcast.

Oh dear. Okay. Should we move on to why we're on the naughty step?

Should we leave this to Mike? Go on then, Mike. Over to you, Mike.

Well, if you listened last week, you'll realise that we spoke, but we discussed the Nissan

Micro and its similarity, shall we say, to the Renault 5. And I was, I merely threw in the question

as to say, well, if it's basically the same car, which was your beef, why have they got different

scores? Why are we down on the Nissan and up on the Renault? And much to my amazement,

it's never happened before. People came to my defence in the comments. So we have a selection.

I mean, that's not a selection. Yeah, this is like 20%.

Just read them. Just run them for about 10 pages of comments or saying that basically you're right.

Yeah. Just read them, Mike. Just do it. Go on. You start. Go on. Go on.

I'll start with Gary McPherson, who sent us an email. He was so

engaged with this. He said, as a former Nissan engineer, I feel the need to inform

you that the platform on which the Renault 5 and the Micro ride on was very much a Nissan

project. The CMF-B architecture was developed for the Duke in brackets and Clio and then adapted

for electric by Renault when it became the CMF-B EV. It's a bit geeky, but it's renamed Amper Small.

Just because you can't see the Nissan parts doesn't mean there aren't any. Love the podcast,

by the way. Okay. Okay. I'll move on. I'll do another one. At Simon Dihas 8784,

people do not buy cars for cockerels in reference to the fact that there is a very small black

cockerel silhouette on the windscreen of the Renault, which I would suggest that 97% of people

even have the Renault wouldn't notice when even fewer people would notice on the Micro,

but anyway, you two found it. The idea that Nissan decided to put their badge on the 5 after

it got good review is bonkers. The funding contribution from Nissan would all contributed

to developing the 5 in the first place. I think it's stupid to assign any extra Q-DOS to either of them

based on which came first. If one is a 10, the other has to be a 9 or a 10, depending on whether

you like the design as much. Do you want any more? Yeah, go on. You're not looking repentant,

either of you. I have something to say, but I'll say it at the end. You can carry it.

Cox Jewel says, I think you'll bring very unfair on Nissan. The two cars were being worked on

collaborative for years, with Renault probably contributing more. If the Nissan had come out

first, you would be accusing Renault of slapping their badge on it with our 5 heritage on

show on the bodywork. Rob Smith, F.A. I imagine someone who's bought a Micro won't

give a flying what's it about being a Renault 5 with a different badge. Full stop. Mike's right.

I could read more, but you just, you know. Ginny, are you eating your words? Exactly.

Les Whitehouse, dissing the Nissan and loving the Renault sounds a little snobby to me, hoping

I'm wrong. You're not wrong. They're bad snobs, the pair of them. I think this joking aside,

you've all been told off here, but does it open a larger question in terms of,

I mean, I kind of see this podcast as a speak easy, really. I think there's the site and there's

our reviewing and there's this where we kind of chat with each other. We perhaps give our more

honest opinions on this. I don't know why I'm trying to defend you, too, because you're both guilty,

but I'm saying what I'm saying is you can, you can like a bad car and you can also dislike a

good car. Is that fair? Yes, it is fair. But I think I would say that when we do have our review

hat on, generally speaking, I think the aim is always to put an objective review of the car

that's been placed in front of us. But I think perhaps last week you were expressing your

personal opinions towards it. Yes. Thank you for that, Mike. I do want to also give a shout

out to Tom Yeuton 440 who says, sorry, but this is why Nicola is not in charge of a car.

For many, one of many reasons why Nicola is not in charge of a car company.

It'll be a disaster. Why in fridges? It all cars. Can I also just add in Nile Church 269

who said, if you're going to be a micro, be a micro. Don't be a Renault. Otherwise,

you really are being lazy. But then that's all we can read out and you could have gone on with the

support. To bear that was the only one that was on your defence to be fair. So I'm just going to

say, like, we understand that they were made together, sharing platforms. Yes, maybe Nissan

put in a bit more work, et cetera, et cetera, behind the scenes before the Renault was

starting. Shut up. Listen to me. Right. We get it. However, the Renault 5 was launched a good year

before that. And from what Renault have put in their vehicle in terms of behind the steering wheel,

the stalks, how you control the volume, et cetera, that's been in Renault's for years, for years.

And it's just where Nissan didn't add in their extra flavours on the interior. They've done their

flavours on the exterior, but on the interior and what it's like to drive, there was no effort there

to make it even slightly different from the Renault. I understand they were made at the same

time, but they also at the same time have to go in their separate directions. And that's not

what Nissan did. That's all I'm going to say, but also I'm sorry.

Did you have the same beef about the, say at me, Skoda Citica and Volkswagen Up,

which were identical cars, except for a badge? I didn't, but I think the issue is that we were

just grateful back in the day then that there were some electric cars. They didn't really care.

There were hardly any of them around. And I think it's more of a, I guess it's just more of a,

what have Nissan done with the Micra to give it their brand identity? That's what I felt, is that

I think it matters more now. It didn't, with my serious heart on now, I know about the platform

stuff, of course, and that's not what we were saying. The platform is, of course, part of a

much bigger partnership across that whole alliance. But it's the fact that like Nick just pointed

out, you get in the interior and it is literally, everything around you is Renault.

It's got the same, that very distinctive headliner, which is a throwback, of course,

to the Renault 5 turbos of old. So it's more about the fact that in a world which is increasingly

competitive, and Nissan is a car company that is struggling. They really are, that's not,

that they haven't differentiated their brand enough with that car. And Nicola would like

to make another point. Go on, Nicola. I also think it's going to try and

stand up for Nissan here that maybe, where everything was all being built and planned at the

same time, it was just such a shame for Nissan that Renault, that Renault 5 landed with a bang

and won everything. And everyone went, wow, what a car, that's how you bring back a name,

blah, blah, blah. And everyone raved about it. And everyone's gone, wow. So the Renault 5

was just put up on this incredible platform of everyone loving this car. And then,

then Nissan revealed their car. And it was just like, because they have done,

because Renault did so well. I think if Renault, if the Renault 5 landed as an average car,

we wouldn't be kicking off so much because we just kind of go, oh, okay, it's similar.

But because the Renault 5 landed with such a bang, it's made the Nissan look less.

I agree. I do agree. But I do think it is more about that thing that they

were with the issue that I think you and I have with it is the fact that it isn't,

there's nothing in there that they've done, as you said, they've done their own thing outside.

And I think it looks cute, actually. I like it. But you go inside and it is just like being in a

car from, it's so much like a car from another brand. But it's also the suspension and it's

everything is copy-pasted. Is that going to bother buyers though? Is that going to bother

somebody who's got a Nissan dealer on their corner and they're going to drive it and

they're going to think this is great? The suspension and the setup and all of that.

That's not what I've got my beef with. I actually haven't driven the Micra yet.

I've only seen it. I haven't had a chance to drive it.

That's my beef with it. It's not about how it drives. It is not because I'm sure,

you know, I've spoken to you, spoken to Vicky. It drives really well. But it's more about the

fact that it is this curious thing that is a half Renault, half Nissan that I'm not really

sure it's got its own identity. And I come back to that point that when you have got now

150 mainstream electric cars in the UK, and if you've cast your mind back to when we launched

a lecture five, five years ago and when the three that you were talking about might were around,

you know, the me and the up, we reviewed about 27 cars. So there's so many cars now that I think

that's what Nissan hasn't, you know, hasn't had the opportunity to do is to personalize it

enough. Of course, look at the, you know, the Taycan and the Audi e-tron, same car,

pretty much, but you don't ever get in those cars and feel like these are the same cars.

They've got very different personalities. Yes. It's also if you go full top spec for the

micro, it's a thousand pounds more expensive than the Renault five. Yeah, there is that.

You get leather seats, though.

Which somebody pointed out, if you have a dust might allergy, that's the only car you can

choose out of those two. I really think we need to move on. Okay. Well, anyway, we're sorry.

Nicola and I have, how long do we each have to spend on our respective naughty steps

then later this evening before we're allowed a glass of wine half an hour? I don't know. I'm

not the judge and jury for this. I'm merely reporting the facts as they've come to me.

Okay. Okay. We're sorry, not sorry. We're sorry you feel that way. Yes. We're really sorry we made

you feel that way. That's how you do it. You're just going to get more complaints there. Bring it

on. It's good for the algorithm. I don't mind. Anyway, let's go back to Instas. People who've

been spotting Instas. Yay. Let's do some Insta spotting. Hey, Robert McGregor 2575.

I saw an Insta on the M90 headed for the Queensferry crossing today. Yay. Exciting. And then we've got

SDP 101. Insta spotting head down to the coast on the south side of the New Forest in a short 20-minute

drive. Three went past in the other direction on the return journey. At least one was spotted.

Okay. Can I just say that if that was at the start of the summer, there was a launch

happening down there because that's, that's why they helped us. I just thought that.

So please, please, can we just have an update on that? Because if we need to know,

if you could let us know again in the comments below of SDP 101, was that a while ago or was

it recently? Because that's really important information. Yeah. See, that's the thing. But

here's where you'll notice. Like if you ever see a load of the same car, it's because

there's a car launch going on and it's being driven by journals.

Well, there on that point, I think it's time for us to go and find our

respective naughty steps. Nicola Hume. Fine, fine. Sorry. Sorry, not sorry.

And yeah, I guess we just, that's, that's what I feel like we should go now. Sorry.

What else have we got coming up though? We've got things coming up. Oh, I'm going to

Porto on Monday to drive the new DS4. Oh, that's exciting. That's good. I'm going to Korea

on Sunday to drive some new Korean cars. Oh, I'm excited for you to have the

nice fried chicken. Korean fried chicken, so fit. It is the best thing in the world. I will be,

I will be definitely in a karaoke bar having some fried chicken one night next

time. Oh my God. I'm so jealous. I'm there. So listen, thank you for joining us for another

episode of The Killer What? Half Hour as always. We forgot to say the thing that we're

meant to do every episode, which is if you are watching here on YouTube,

please also go over and follow us on your local, on your podcast platform,

because that helps to build podcasts, which is what we want to do. Yay. Thanks, team.

Bye, everyone. See you next time. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye. Bye.

Episode 88: EV4 outrage, the Micra backlash and Volvo doubles up

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