Honda Civic Hybrid, Ram Kills EV, 1969 Camaro

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All right, this is the Consumer Guide Car Stuff podcast.

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All right, with me in studio, Jill Seminello.

Jill, how are you today?

I'm doing all right.

How are you?

I'm good.

You are a Consumer Guide contributor.

You are a prolific freelancer, and you're a North American Car of the Year juror.

Yes.

How are you doing?

I'm doing all right.

So today's episode is spicy.

Okay.

Spicy.

Do you know why it's spicy?

Because we're going to talk about some running.

No.

Because I did just run three miles.

No.

Yeah.

No, I drove three miles.

Okay.

And boy, my arm's tired.

Okay.

I don't know where to go with that joke.

Yeah, no.

No, I have a story that has nothing to do with anything automotive, but I have to

share it.

Okay.

But I have to lead with something.

Are you ready?

That it's spicy.

It's spicy.

You're literally putting your arm in my face.

I am.

Yeah.

Okay.

Just do I smell good?

You smell like soap.

That's where this is going.

Okay.

Wow.

You nailed it.

I have a friend at the health club.

Her name is Marnie.

Okay.

Marnie and I were talking, and Marnie is an employee of the health club plus

she works in fragrances, and we were talking about how the youngsters that

come to the health club, 20-somethings, now douse themselves in different fragrances.

Yes.

And there's some new super expensive thing.

It's like the polo of the 20s.

I don't know.

Okay.

But here's the deal.

We started talking about fragrances and because I can only end up talking about

something without talking about a Western for like, you know, after about 10 minutes.

Right.

I mentioned that Nick Barkley, one of the boys on the big valley, was into Bayram.

Okay.

Two days later, I went into Marnie, she brought me a bar of Bayram soap.

And that is from BadgerCreek.com, Badger Creek.

People should check it out.

But I'm wearing Badger Creek Bayram soap.

I watched with that today.

So I should smell.

I should smell good.

And my wife described it as spicy.

I don't know that I would say it's spicy, but it's definitely soapy.

Yeah.

It's mild, I think, compared to other Bayram.

Are you familiar with Bayram?

I am not.

It's definitely like the predecessor, the great-granddad of like modern men's

cologne.

Okay.

And I think it was born in San Francisco from the Bay area, you know, Asian imports

and stuff.

But whatever.

Okay.

I like the way I smell.

I don't not like the way you smell.

How's that?

You don't smell bad.

I got free soap from BadgerCreek.com.

That's.

Got it.

Also, I don't think Marnie is affiliated with Badger Creek.

So it's not even a pimp there.

Okay.

All right.

Are we done with that topic?

I think we're done.

I think we could go back to talking about the three miles I just ran.

No.

That would be a way better conversation.

No.

No, we're good.

Okay.

Not spicy.

The 2025 Lexus 500H F-Sport Performance All-Wheel Drive.

Okay.

It's really good.

Okay.

But like so many Lexus crossovers that have F-Sport in their name, not actually

that sporty.

No.

It's more of like a design package.

Yeah.

There is sporty stuff in there.

21-inch wheels and you get a specially tuned adaptive suspension.

But dang, is that a refined vehicle?

Like a benchmark for crossover refinement.

It is quiet.

It is refined.

It rides well.

The power delivery is good.

Even though, and we've talked about this, I'm still mad that the old V6 is gone.

This new hybrid powertrain is pretty slick.

Okay.

Have you driven this thing yet?

I think I have.

It's been like a year or so, but yeah.

Yeah.

I don't know what's happening to its sales.

We talked a little bit about how Highlander, Grand Highlander sales are stealing Highlander

sales.

I don't know if that's happening at Lexus where the TX, which is more or less a long

wheelbase three-year-old version of the RX.

Yeah.

Well, it's like the Grand Highlander.

Yeah.

Kind of.

Yeah.

All right.

So that's a nice car.

Big news at Ram.

Yeah.

You want it?

I feel like, yeah, we need the death march here.

Just to clarify, Ram isn't dead.

No.

But a Ram product that we never got to see is.

Yes.

The Ram Rev or the electric vehicle from Ram is dead and they are going, or I guess, were

they originally calling it the Rev at any rate?

The Ram charger lives.

And I think they are now calling that the Ram Rev.

Yeah.

So it's all very confusing and a little bit sad.

Yes.

I know it is, but you and I have had this conversation on the show before where I never, ever, ever

thought that a full-size truck was a good place for an electric powertrain because it

was just never going to be able to appeal to the truck guys because it couldn't do

truck things.

I think the reason manufacturers thought it was, and you're not wrong.

I'm never wrong.

But.

Dear God, the reason I think manufacturers thought it was a good idea was volume.

The Ram 1500, the Ford F-150 and the Chevy Silverado sell in massive quantities.

Yeah.

Huge numbers.

Yeah.

All three of them combined for almost 2 million units a year.

So I think they figured the volume was there.

Yeah, it was not.

And it was, and I've done a couple of articles about this when I was working with Tim

Esterdahl from Pickup Truck Plus SUV Talk.

He's also written articles about why truck guys were never going to adopt an electric

full-size truck.

And I fully believe that mid-size electric trucks were where they should have started.

And I mean, maybe even compact electric trucks because when you get into the compact and

the mid-size, you're looking at more of a lifestyle-y city truck that isn't dependent

upon towing and doing heavy-duty truck things.

That's true.

But I think an awful lot of 1500, half-ton pickups, the big trucks also end up being

lifestyle vehicles.

Well, they do.

If you see one on the road here on Palo Tain Road, yeah, probably a lifestyle vehicle.

They do.

But here's the thing.

A guy who is a truck guy is going to buy a full-size truck for that one day in

20 years that maybe, maybe they are going to tow heavy shit.

That is actually the point we've made about Subaru and the eight days a year in Chicago

where you're really glad you have a Subaru because of the snow.

Or the-

Although you're always glad you have a Subaru.

Or what is it?

The 350 days that they're going to put a kayak on top.

Because Subaru gives them 10 bucks off their monthly payment every-

Yes.

Every- yes.

Yeah, I-

They're putting a cardboard or inflatable kayak on their roof.

There was a period of time.

Every time I saw a Subaru with a kayak or something on the roof rails, I had to take a picture

and send it to Tom.

Yeah.

Crazy Subaru.

But yeah, the F-150 isn't selling especially well, but it's not a stinker.

It's- what are they moving?

Like 30,000 units a year, something like that, 35,000?

So they're moving some of those.

And then Chevy, or General Motors I should say, has backed off building the Silverado

EV and the Sierra EV to the extent that they're not opening that new factory yet that was

going to build those at Orion Township, I think.

Right.

So they're going to keep building those at their factory zero where they build everything.

And then Ram's just not going to bring one out.

Yeah.

And so we- I guess we should talk a little bit about what the Ram Charger or the new

Ram Rev is.

And that is a range-instended electric vehicle.

So essentially it has an electric powertrain with a gasoline.

I think they're using the Hurricane- No, it's the old Pentastar V6.

Okay.

So the old Pentastar V6.

I'm like, I knew it was a six cylinder.

So they're using the Pentastar V6 as a generator essentially.

It does not provide any motivation to the wheels.

It simply charges the battery.

So electric powertrain, but takes gasoline.

Yeah.

It's a plug-in hybrid.

I forgot what the range was, 190 miles.

It was a lot of range for a plug-in hybrid, not a lot for an EV.

And then I've always had these questions about how this was going to work in terms of towing

for long periods of time.

I thought it was getting up to like 500 miles of total range.

Yeah.

There's a bunch of range there.

But I've always wondered about power output when the battery was depleted and you were

just trusting the V6 to provide rated power.

And I still don't have all the answers there, but it passed some towing tests that

I don't understand.

Yeah.

Well, so I mean with towing, the important number is going to be your torque.

And so one of the things that electric powertrains do really well is they have a lot of instantaneous

high, you know, good torque numbers.

So I, you know, and I don't think they've released any official specs.

I don't think we have a lot of information here.

We just know that it's going to be a range-extended vehicle.

So that's the thing they've committed to and it will be the only, the F-150 is available

with a hybrid, no plug-in hybrid, and available with an electric powertrain and

the Chevy and the GMC are available, electric and gasoline.

But the RAM will be the first plug-in hybrid, basically.

But it's not, the difference between extended range electric vehicle and plug-in hybrid

is subtle, but there is a difference.

Although I've, CEOs don't care when they talk about it.

No, no.

I mean, it's definitely semantics.

I think the difference is when you have a plug-in hybrid, the gasoline engine can

provide power directly to the wheels.

But when you have a range-extended vehicle, the gasoline engine never provides

motivation to the wheels.

It only charges the battery.

So the big question here is when now will we see what they're now calling the

RUV, which used to be the RAM charger, and, and what will that cost?

Yeah.

Because the opportunity for that to be too expensive is real.

Yeah.

Because you have to have a big battery to make that work.

So that's like an added cost, plus, plus all the equipment involved in charging.

Speaking of charging.

Charging, yes.

I have a personal email today from the good folks at Electrify America, and I said

good folks because I'm surprised they're being nice to me at this point, having maybe

said some bad things about them over the years, but, but they're putting in a new

station right by here.

Okay.

And it's going to be a 350.

Okay.

So a Superfast, or they call it Ultrafast.

Okay.

350 kilowatt stations going in, run here, which is nice because my never-working

EV Go station across the street from my house apparently has been abandoned.

Yeah.

So thank you folks at EV Go.

Yeah.

Well, and speaking of charging, I actually just posted on all of my social

media outlets today, a video where I was charging the, just kind of showing how the

charging situation was going with the many countrymen EV at Electrify America Station.

So in the city, it was at, in the back of a Bank of America parking lot, nothing

ticks me off more than when they do stupid crap like that and they put a charging station

in like a desert so you can't pee or get food.

Oh, see, this is interesting.

The Bank of America thing must be a tie up with Electrify America because in Lake

Zurich, not so far from here, there's a 150 kilowatt station in a Bank of America

parking lot.

But this one is convenient to things, including I think of Trader Joe's.

So, I mean, you can, you can get up and pee if you need to.

You could walk a half a mile from this Bank of America parking lot and go pee maybe

in a coffee shop somewhere down the road.

But I'm just like, this is, I, I get very irked when you have a charging station

that doesn't have a facility.

At least it's relatively quick.

All the EA stations are 150s or 350s, so much faster.

Yeah.

And a lot of the 50s out there.

The thing about the mini EV is I want to say it only takes up to 130 kilowatt

hours.

Okay.

I had like a 350 kilowatt hour charging station.

It was never going to charge like in 15 minutes.

It took me about a half an hour to go from 40% to 85%.

I learned something today, by the way, in my exchange with the good folks at

Electrify America, and that most of these stations are eight charger, eight unit

installations.

Okay.

And there's off four islands of two.

And this is how this works.

If someone is parked there, don't use the same island.

Yep.

Each island is set up for 350.

If you pull up, both of you are just going to get 150.

Yep.

So not only are you doing something dumb, you are totally screwed.

Yeah.

And I actually mentioned that in my video today because like the charging

station was full, and so I had to share a charging block with another

electric vehicle, which cuts your power in half.

All right.

Moving on.

You're done with electric charging.

I am.

Okay.

Yeah.

A little bit.

Yeah.

A little bit.

Yeah.

But I've had good luck with them lately.

Yeah.

So fingers crossed for those guys.

I, fingers, fingers crossed.

And yeah, they actually put a nice comment on my Instagram post.

So yeah, they reached out to me simply because I was excited about the

installation of Palatine, which I mentioned at X.

Okay.

So they reached out to me.

So I don't even know.

Their social media team is working over time.

Yeah.

I don't know if they know that I'm angry, Tom.

But I have had two.

But you're spicy, Tom.

I'm spicy, Tom.

Because you smell spicy today.

I've had two very good charging experiences there.

Okay.

Quickfest.

Although I have to get an account there because I'm paying 63 cents a kilowatt hour,

which is highway robbery.

So I need to set up an account.

I mean, I have an account and it's still 56 cents.

That's too much.

Okay.

It's still, it's still a lot.

That's a lot.

Yeah.

We've talked a little bit about Magna International and its Steyr plant in

Austria.

We know this plant for a bunch of reasons.

But it currently builds the BMW Z4 and the Toyota Supra.

And it was building the Fisker Carmo, or Fisker Ocean.

Which means they're not building the Fisker Ocean anymore.

No, they are not.

But this is a huge and very flexible manufacturing facility.

They are now, this is tariff-related, but not American tariff-related,

they are going to begin building electric vehicles for GAC, China's GAC and X-Pung.

X-P-E-N-G.

People pronounce it X-Pung.

I don't know what the correct pronunciation is.

But they're going to begin building vehicles there in Austria so they can import them

without tariff into the EU.

Okay.

Well, interesting thing, Big Magna has got more work to do.

And someone's trying to dodge some tariffs there.

And Chinese are big into exports.

So there you go.

Okay.

Oh, you know what else?

They build the G-Class.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

The big Mercedes paramilitary.

The Galandawagen.

Yeah, that.

Or...

The Galandawagen.

Yeah.

How do you spell that?

I don't know.

I don't know how you spell it.

Can you spell Sierra?

Yeah.

It starts with a C.

It does indeed.

Millions.

There were millions of those.

Yes.

If you went to an airport and drove past a rental lot, it was just a C of Sierras.

B.

Sierras.

Okay.

All right.

And by the way, that's a reference to last week's episode.

Yes, it is.

If you don't understand, you should go listen.

Yeah.

Where you passed the spelling bee.

I did.

Yeah.

Barely.

All right.

You just drove.

Very important car.

Still kind of driving.

I turned it in tomorrow.

Oh, okay.

And it is a car.

It is a car.

You just drove the 2025 Civic Hybrid?

Yeah.

I have not driven this yet.

And I've heard nothing but good.

You know, yes-ish.

In some ways, I think it's a bit of a mixed bag.

Oh.

I am H.O.

So I just drove it to Indianapolis and back.

So that's my.

200 miles.

200 miles there and then 200 miles back road trip.

And I had my husband and my sister in the car.

And about an hour and a half in, I looked at them and I said, okay, how are y'all

feeling?

What's the comfort like?

What are you feeling like?

And my husband was snoring.

So I'm like, okay, I imagine he's probably feeling pretty.

Reasonable comfortable.

Reasonable comfortable because he's snoring.

But my sister, she's like, you know, the seats are a little firm.

And I can echo that from the driver's seat.

The seats are definitely a little bit firm.

Now they're not as bad as some recent Honda seats that I've sat in.

Like the Honda HRV, I thought those were miserable seats and very uncomfortable for

a three hour drive.

The HRV.

The tiny crossover.

Yeah, yeah.

And so I mean, the seats not super comfortable.

I wonder if they would break down over time.

So that's thing number one.

Thing number two.

When you say break down.

Like get a little bit, not the car breaking down, the seat foam

breaking down.

I'm just picturing you in the highway and the seat bag just falls all the way

back.

That would be bad.

That would be uncomfortable.

Well, and I mean, I've got good core strength, but that would be tough.

But thing number two is going to be the highway fuel economy.

You should be getting, I want to say it was 47 miles per gallon on the highway.

The EPA numbers for the hybrid are thundering.

48 or 49 MPG, depending on the trim level.

So I suppose that's wheels.

On the highway are combined.

That's combined.

Okay.

Yeah.

So on the highway, I think it's 47 and I got nowhere near that.

Okay.

And how fast were you going?

I mean, I was going in Indianapolis on 465.

The speed limit is 55.

So I was going 55-60, but that's 20 minutes of my drive.

On 65 heading north between Chicago and Indianapolis.

That's the longest stretch of the drive.

That's a 70 mile per hour speed limit.

And so I was probably going 75, going with the flow of traffic.

And I was getting like maybe 38 miles per gallon.

That's still really good mileage.

I mean, it's good, but it's not close to EPA estimates.

No, it's not the EPA numbers, but I'm not a strict adherent to comparing real world

mileage to the EPA miles because the EPA miles.

And I'm typically not, but I will say the last two vehicles I've driven.

So Volkswagen Tiguan included, which we talked about, I think last week,

I've gotten at EPA estimates or above doing the same drive.

So I'm willing.

I am not as willing to cut slack because I've now had like two vehicles

prior to this that hit the numbers or went above going 70 to 75 miles an hour.

Yeah.

I think real world numbers need to be compared to real world numbers.

I don't know about the EPA numbers, but yeah, that is disappointing.

Yeah.

But almost 40, just, you know, just stepping back almost 40 MPG

in a roomy, quick, powerful car seems good to me.

Yeah.

I will say the steering is really stiff.

Like you would think Honda is civic is kind of an economy vehicle

and would be a little bit sloppy.

But I feel like they, especially because I was in the top tier sport touring.

And you know, Honda has started calling all of their hybrids like sport.

And yeah, they have completely unique model names for the hybrids.

Right.

And so this was the top sport touring trim.

And I just felt like it was, it was certainly fun to drive.

It had good driving dynamics.

The steering wheel, like it didn't feel numb or loose.

And so I thought that it felt actually a little bit sporty.

But you know, I mean, as sporty as it can be when you're just stuck in a lane on a highway.

Interesting thing.

We've talked a lot about this, about how America seems to be hybrid crazy.

But increasingly manufacturers are forcing people into hybrids.

Yeah.

The civic lineup now only includes three non-hybrids.

Yeah.

And four hybrid models, hatchback and sedan.

And then you still have the SI and the R.

Yeah.

And the only manual left is in the manual, in the SI or the R.

Yeah.

But yeah, it's Alex sedan, sports sedan and sport hatchback.

Those are your non-hybrids.

150 horsepower regular two liter engine.

And then you have sport hybrid, sport hybrid hatchback.

Or sport hybrid sedan, sport hybrid and hatchback.

Sport touring hybrid sedan and sport touring hybrid hatchback.

Yeah.

And I was in the sport touring hybrid hatchback.

It's also much more expensive.

Yeah.

I mean.

Because those are being treated as premium trim levels.

$33,000, you know, is the base price of the sport touring hatchback.

Which, it's a lot of car for the money and you're getting a hybrid and you're getting

great fuel economy.

It is.

And this had leather seats.

It had the Google built-in.

Yeah.

It had wireless, a couple of carplay and Android Auto.

Bose premium audio sound system, which I'm a podcast listener, so I don't listen

to the music.

But funny thing about the Bose thing is that the folks at Honda never wanted

to go with a branded audio system in any Honda, but they found out that the public wanted it.

Yeah.

So with top trim levels at Honda, you now get Bose systems.

Yeah.

And they sound pretty good.

Yeah.

And here's the interesting thing that is missing now.

XM radio.

Oh.

Honda has started removing XM radio and I believe Acura has started doing it as

well from.

Interesting.

Their vehicles because like it's a subscription based thing.

Yep.

They don't have to pay for it one way or the other.

So what they want you to do is to subscribe to Sirius XM radio by yourself on your phone

via an app.

And then when you connect to carplay, then you can connect to XM radio through your

phone.

Yeah.

That's kind of a bummer and a bit of a drag, but it is handy if you get in and out of

more than one car.

You're only paying for one subscription.

Yeah.

Although the subscription then is attached to the person, not the vehicle.

Yep.

So if you have a family of five people, that's a little complicated.

You need five subscriptions.

Yeah.

And I don't know how that works if there's like a family subscription.

So everybody would download that onto their phone, but I do know a single

subscription to XM radio.

If you put it on your phone is less than what the subscription would have

been if you had it in the car and you get more stations.

All right.

We're the only the other hybrid compact cars.

The Elantra and the K4.

I think you are correct.

Yeah.

The cars in the class to think about are the Corolla.

The Mazda 3 is spectacular.

It's not going to get anywhere near this mileage.

Not a hybrid.

Big honk and four so.

Well, Corolla has a hybrid.

It does.

Yeah.

I forgot that.

Yes.

But the Mazda 3 doesn't have a hybrid.

Yeah.

I mean the compact sedan is starting to go away.

And if you wanted something a little bit bigger, I mean, obviously you could go

to Toyota Camry.

You could go to.

I find the current crop of compact sedans big enough.

Like they're roomier.

Yeah.

G's.

Yeah.

It feels like an Altoid.

It's big.

And my sister sitting in the back seat.

I mean, she's 5'3".

Let's be clear.

She's not a tall person.

But sitting in the back seat, she said she had plenty of leg room

and felt, you know, in terms of head space and just passing.

She was working on her computer.

So she felt pretty comfortable back there.

So the Honda Civic, one of the last truly hot selling small sedans.

Your final take is?

I really like it.

But as I said, it's a bit of a mixed bag.

If you are looking for really cushy seats or spot on EPA fuel

economy, you might not hit it.

But overall, I think it's an attractive car and it has some

really good sporty dynamics.

There you go.

Yeah.

All right.

Honda Civic.

We're going to take a break.

When we come back, we talk to Don Secora, editor-in-chief of

Collectible Automobile Magazine.

It's been a while.

Stick around.

Questions or comments?

Drop us a line at CarStuff at ConsumerGuide.com.

That's CarStuff at ConsumerGuide.com.

Welcome back to the CarStuff Podcast.

And we're back.

This is the ConsumerGuide CarStuff podcast.

I am Tom.

She is Jill.

Jill, how's it going?

This is like the third time you've asked me that.

I think second.

I don't know.

You asked me twice, like right close to each other in the

first segment.

So I'm just going to say, hey, I feel great because you know

what?

I ran three miles before this.

This is our spicy episode.

It is our spicy episode.

So you haven't changed it.

Like you're still fine.

I am still fine.

All right.

I'm still fine.

Help me out here.

You would like to talk about social media.

Not really, but just a little bit.

I am CarGuyTom on TwitterX and BlueSky.

Okay.

Fine, fine collection of CarSpotter stuff this

Saturday.

Yes.

Which I got up on Saturday.

Okay.

I don't know anymore.

I shared a CarSpotter this weekend.

Wait, what was it?

It was a Chevy SSR.

It was a very pretty blue.

Oh, I didn't see that.

With the top down.

Parked in a lot.

I was visiting my mom and saw it in Indianapolis area.

It was gorgeous.

I once called that the ultimate parade float tow vehicle.

Not a lot of use for that thing.

No, but you know what?

It was a very interesting vehicle.

I remember I had just started writing about cars when

that came out.

And I was fascinated by it.

And I talked to one of the engineers who was so geeking

out about how the top goes down and folds vertically

between the cabin and the bed.

Yeah.

It was, I mean, it's just kind of cool.

It's mechanically cool.

You can make something, do something cool that is also

meaningless.

Both things can be true.

You know who has thoughts on the SSR?

Don Secora.

Okay.

All right.

On the phone with us is Don Secora.

He is the editor-in-chief of Collectible Automobile

Magazine.

Don, how are you?

Good.

How are you?

I have a test for you, Don.

Okay.

Can you name all seven vehicles that were on the GMT?

I think it was called the 380 or 360 architecture

with the SSR?

The Chevy Trailblazer.

Uh-huh.

GMT Harnboy.

Uh-huh.

Provada.

You're going to get it.

Buick.

Oh, the Buick.

My sister had one.

I'll give it to you because you know the Buick.

Rainier.

Yeah.

The Saab.

Yeah, I forgot about the Saab.

Yes.

And there was an Azuzu.

Uh-huh.

Was that a sender?

Yeah, I think it was a sender.

One, two, three, four, five, six.

That's it because we have SSR.

That's seven.

Was it the Sabaru or was it the 97?

97X.

Okay.

Yeah, which was terrible, but I have a long story

about that event.

Oh, no.

I don't know.

You did.

Because our friend Tom Beaman, who was at that event

working for Saab, shared that story.

Don, how are you and how are things at Collectible

Automobile Magazine?

I'm doing pretty good.

We're very busy.

Right now we're working on the February issue.

Wow.

So, December issues at the printer should be out in a couple of

maybe two, three weeks.

And you know, just keeping very busy.

So, for people who don't know, tell us a little bit about

Collectible Automobile.

I checked.

The magazine goes back to 1984.

So, you guys are celebrating your 41st year?

Yeah, 41 years.

We're almost to volume 42.

So, December issue was our 250th issue.

Congratulations.

Thank you.

That's nice.

You know what I mean?

Yeah.

It's like the name implies we focus on collectible cars

and also on usually light duty, some light duty trucks.

There's usually four to five feature articles and then

some photo features.

And we do some columns.

Like we do cheap wheels and future collectible where we

pick what cars that we think cars or trucks that

we think are interesting and talk about them a little.

And then we do, we cover like the collectible literature,

like dealer brochures and stuff and model cars.

And we have a value guide and then we have a retired designer,

Dick Nesbitt, and he talks a little bit about the design

of the cars and that issue.

That's really cool.

Dick is awesome, by the way.

He is relatively prolific on Facebook for people who don't

know Dick.

He did a lot of...

Well, he was with Ford for most of his career, correct?

Yeah, mostly Ford.

And then he was with...

I think he was with International for a little while.

And then he was with one of the big like semi-truck

companies.

Like...

He recently shared...

Marmin?

Oh, okay.

He recently shared pictures on Facebook of this very

interesting minivan that wasn't a minivan that Ford was working

on way before...

Way before Chrysler hit the minivan idea.

And it kind of looked like a full-size van with a very rakeish

profile.

I can't remember what it was called.

Good Luck and Vehicle.

The Carousel.

That's it.

What a great looking vehicle.

But that was Dick's work and it definitely prefaced what we

would come to think of as a family hauler.

Does he keep his profile public?

Yes.

So, what is Dick's full name?

Nesbitt.

So, if people wanted to follow him, they could.

Yep, they should.

Okay, Dick Nesbitt.

Yeah.

So, Dan, we have in front of us right here, Open.

Open!

Open is the October 2025 episode.

Tell us about episode issue.

Tell us about what's going on this month.

So, this month, this is currently on newsstand.

We have feature articles.

We have the clear top Ford's and Mercury's of 1954 to 56.

That is crazy.

Yeah, tell us about the clear tops.

So, they decided to put basically a very early version of the

sunroof in certain two-door hard tops.

But it was a fixed plexiglass panel that was, I believe it was

heat form or vacuum form to the shape of the roof.

Yeah.

We're looking at the article now.

And then they had, I think some of them had zip-in sunshades

and other ones had nap-in sunshades.

Interesting.

So, they did it from 54 to 56 at Ford and Mercury did it

in 54 and 55.

They're pretty interesting cars, but they at least have a

reputation as getting kind of warm inside.

I don't know how true that is.

Yeah, kind of.

Because it's a green tinted plexiglass top.

Yeah, they're cool looking.

Basically, yeah, they are.

But it basically covers the entire front seat of the car.

Cool.

What else is in this issue?

I'm sorry.

I didn't mean to cut you off.

That's okay.

The 1971 to 74 Dodge Coronet.

Uh-huh.

That's when Dodge split.

The two doors were all chargers and the four doors

in the wagons were Coronets.

It was like their mid-sized car.

And then we did a 1947 to 55 GMC light duty trucks.

And then the feature that was my favorite for the issue

at least is the 1969 Chevy Camaro.

Which was written by our dear friend Sam Fiorani.

Yeah, Sam wrote that.

Sam is famous for writing stuff about kind of lame cars.

Oh, this one's...

Hi, Sam.

I know you're listening.

He is.

He just texted me.

I haven't had a chance to look at it.

But it's good to see Sam get to write about an exciting car.

Yeah, I think he's a little disappointed.

You know, he'd rather write about a U-Go or something.

Oh, man.

Yeah.

Well, tell us about the 69 Camaro and why that was a big deal.

So it's just a pretty interesting car because it's very unusual.

It's a facelift of the 67 to 68 Camaro,

but it basically ends up being a one-year only design.

So, which is pretty unusual in cars, especially by that time.

It wasn't so unusual, 50.

And it was much like the Mustang.

It was kind of anything you wanted it to be.

It had a very extensive option list.

It had a lot of different engines from mild-manered straight-sixes

all the way up to the COPO cars with 427 SS 396s, V28, all that kind of stuff.

But of course, the main market for them was the much milder cars.

And so we talked about the design because it steps pretty far away from the 67 to 68 car.

It's like everything from the belt lying down, except for maybe the hood and the deck lid, was new.

I didn't know that.

Okay.

The exterior.

The interior was changed somewhat.

And they still offered, you know, it had two different front ends, a standard or rally sport.

It just came as a two-door hardtop or a convertible.

And it had a lot of unusual options, like it had a fold-down rear seat.

Oh, that's handy.

It wasn't no pass-through to the trunk, but the seat folded down.

Oh, not as handy as I thought.

No.

So it was just, you know, kind of unusual, kind of like a 911, I guess.

It had some unusual options.

You could get headlight washers that shot windshield washer fluid onto the headlight.

That's pretty cool.

And then the kind of a legendary option that almost nobody bought was you could get this contraption that sprayed

from aerosol cans, mounted in a trunk, traction-enhancing fluid that was supposed to help in the winter.

It would spray this stuff that you could buy at the parts department through the inner wheel well and onto the tread of the tire.

I have, I actually have an article about that stuff, about that system on consumerguide.com.

And it's crazy.

And there's no, like three years after they gave up on that, no one was able to find a can of that stuff.

Wasn't it just sort of tacky tar stuff?

I don't, I'm not 100% sure.

They called it liquid tire chain.

And from the, we actually had like a very good document with like how many Camaros were fit with each option.

And there was only 188 Camaros had that option.

And we do have a picture of it in the article.

Yeah, we were literally just pointing at it.

Yeah, it's a great picture.

There's probably one can of that stuff left.

It's on eBay right now for $38,000.

Yeah.

Yeah, that's probably one of those things where rare does it necessarily mean valuable.

Yeah.

So 69, some of these Camaros have concealed headlights.

What trim levels were those?

That's the rally sport.

Okay.

That's good looking.

Yeah.

The rally sport had the, it had a totally different grill with, and then with hidden headlights.

And the interesting part, the doors that concealed the headlights had each door had three little clear windows in it, which was fairly unusual touch.

Yeah.

And then the regular grill was very heavily bead kind of sunken into the front of the body with just two exposed round headlights.

Now you had mentioned that the bulk of the sales were in fairly low performance trim levels.

Was this sort of the birth of what we referred to for a while as the secretary's car?

I think a lot of pony cars were kind of bad.

I think that was fairly common, though.

You know, the hot ones got all the tension.

Yeah.

Plus, you know, two Mustangs and Hemikudas and all that kind of stuff too, but that stuff was very low volume for the most part.

And they sold much more, where it was just, you know, kind of a nice 40 little coupe.

I mean, they didn't, they didn't want a Nova or didn't want to sell in a Maverick or whatever.

I mean, this could get you basically a base Nova experience and better looking sheet metal, so why not?

Yeah.

And it was related to the, these cars were related to the Nova that came out in 68.

Yep.

My pop owned a 70 Nova 307.

That car had three options on it.

307 automatic AM radio and the, and the thigh burner black vinyl interior.

Yeah, it sounds like a car my dad would have bought.

So explain this if you can.

Maybe you have a handle on why this is.

So for 69, kind of a unique year for the car.

It was updated for 69 and then it was updated for 70.

Dramatically different looking and I love the 70 so much.

But then General Motors did nothing.

They basically redesigned the car for 69 and they did nothing between 1970 and 1981.

Yeah, well, they did.

They got some pretty, they got several facelifts.

But yeah, the car was, the car stayed pretty steady and the market really changed in the 70 and personal luxury coupe.

That was the hot, that was the SUV of the 70.

Right.

They sold, you know, hundreds of thousands of Monte Carlo's and especially all the real cutlaces and Chrysler Cordova's and all that stuff.

And the pony cars, the pony cars kind of faded into the background.

The Challenger and the Cuda and the Javelin go away after 74.

The Mercury Cougar evolves into a personal luxury car for 74 and gets bigger.

And Camaro and Firebird and the Mustang of course gets downsized to the Pinto based Mustang too.

But the Camaro and Firebird held on.

And then, I don't know the details, but they were talked where they was very close to where they were going to get discontinued somewhere in that 1974 or five, six range.

Which would have been crazy.

But the cars survived.

Yeah.

Because they sold so many Mustang twos.

I mean, enthusiasts say to them, we look back at them and kind of cringe a little bit, but they were insanely popular.

And then they did what they were supposed to do.

And they were small, reasonably practical, reasonably affordable.

And by the standards of the day, good looking.

And then reasonably fun.

And but the Camaro and the Firebird, then they kind of caught a second wind in the late 70s, especially with the Firebird with, you know, the smoking, the bandit transams and all that stuff.

And they had some very good years at the end of the 70s.

My first fantasy girlfriend was a 1979 transam.

So I completely understand.

Fantasy girlfriend was a car.

Yeah.

That says a lot about you.

Yeah.

No, it's a problem.

I'm still in therapy.

But the 79 transam, holy cow.

Okay.

Black with gold.

Was it the WS6 package?

Got your rear disc brakes?

Holy cow.

Yeah.

What a cool car.

The wider wheels.

Ah.

Yeah, those were, for the day, those were great cars.

If people want to read this article or just subscribe to Collectible Automobile, how do people do that, Don?

So they can check out our website at collectibleautomobile.com.

You can subscribe there.

Or in the U.S., you can call 1-800-777-5582.

Sounds good.

This is a fantastic magazine.

Also, the holidays are coming up.

This is a perfect gift, right?

And people can do that, right?

They can subscribe as a gift.

Yeah.

You can do a gift subscription.

Yeah.

You want to do that.

Your dad would love it.

Your grandpa.

Maybe your grandma.

Was grandma into cars?

Mm-hmm.

Mine wasn't.

Mm-hmm.

But my grandpa had a Mustang.

Just want to say.

Yeah.

Oh.

All right.

Don, thank you so much for your time today.

Okay.

Yeah.

You're welcome.

All right.

That was Don Secora, editor-in-chief of Collectible Automobile Magazine, the finest old car magazine.

You can buy on Newsstands today.

We're going to take a break.

And when we come back...

Quistank.

Questions or comments?

Drop us a line at carstuffatconsumerguide.com.

That's carstuffatconsumerguide.com.

Welcome back to the Carstuff Podcast.

And we're back.

This is the Consumer Guide Carstuff Podcast.

I'm Tom.

She is Jill.

Jill is fine.

I am.

You know what?

I'm better than fine because you know what I did before the podcast?

I don't know.

You ran three miles.

I ran three miles.

Yeah.

Which isn't really spicy.

I think it's kind of spicy.

I think I had a really good clip today.

I've been coming back from an injury.

Yeah.

And today's run felt good.

I will feign interest later.

I know.

You're...

Speaking of feigning interest.

You're active in social media.

I am active in social media.

Yeah.

You can find me on TikTok, Instagram, YouTube.

All the things.

X Twitter.

I am on Facebook.

Typically at Jill Siminello.

And I use the hashtag car-de-jour.

So if you're looking for me someplace and you don't see me

and you don't know how to spell Siminello,

because it's a lot of eyes and a lot of L's,

just look for the hashtag car-de-jour.

You should do car-de-jour.

Doesn't that mean with garlic?

I have no idea.

Car-de-jour is the car that I'm driving today.

Because there's shrimp de jambe.

No garlic here.

It's not that spicy.

I had sort of an epiphany thinking about this week's quiz.

I've been thinking it hasn't been as educational as it could be.

Okay.

So I thought we should do something that maybe looks back

a little bit in history.

It's educational and still fun, I think.

Okay.

So I'm going to be a little bit more serious about stuff this week

Okay.

You and Sirius are not two words that go together.

Just like you and Spicy actually doesn't go very well together.

I'm just going to put that out there.

Like me and Spicy probably goes a little bit better than Tom.

You might be giving yourself a little too much credit there, young lady.

I don't know.

I'm thinking of creating a column called Spicy Jill.

Yeah?

Yeah.

I'm just saying.

Spicy Jill.

Spicy!

All right.

Today's topic is, you know, educational.

Okay.

I'm going to give you someone's name and you have to tell me if they were a member of the

Partridge family cast.

Okay.

Or a past CEO of Ford.

Okay.

It's educational.

Okay.

It is educational and I will not get this because I don't know anyone in the Partridge

family.

I've...

Well, the Partridge family ran between 1970 and 1974.

Okay.

And it was terrible.

Okay.

Before my time, glad I missed it.

And I remember watching TV as a kid and like, crap, is this all that's on?

I hate this show, but I would still watch it because...

Okay.

Yeah.

I know nothing about Partridge.

I didn't want to do anything healthy, like go outside and be in sunshine.

Okay.

All right.

Five questions plus the bonus question.

You need to get three for a win.

Okay.

The first question, the first person I'm going to throw out there is David Madden.

David Madden.

Is David Madden a member of the Partridge family cast or was he a past CEO or president

of the Ford Motor Company?

It does not ring a bell either way.

The only thing I'm thinking of, isn't there a video game that's like Madden, like a sports

something?

Well, yes, but that's got nothing to do...

I know it has nothing to do with this, but I'm like, I got, I got nothing.

I don't know if they still do that.

Madden NFL used to be super popular.

Yeah.

I don't know.

I think it was called Madden NFL.

Okay.

That's a good update.

Not, not a gamer here.

We are a little tight on time.

Oh, we've got 10 minutes.

We are not tight on time.

We've got plenty of time.

Okay.

I'm just saying, we got time.

I'm going to even grab my donut, which is a cinnamon powdered donut.

You're assuming that one's yours?

I am.

It is mine.

I've claimed it.

I've touched, I've sneezed on it.

Atchoo.

My buddy Dave and his brother used to go play basketball in the summer and they would

bring a bottle of knee-high.

It might have been Fanta, orange soda with them.

Okay.

And they'd get there.

And my buddy Dave's brother would go, this one's mine.

I spit in it.

Yep.

And yes, that was his.

That's his.

Yeah.

So I sneezed on it.

That is a solid claim.

That is mine.

Yeah.

I'm going to, I'm going to say a Ford president.

No.

Donald Madden played, David Madden played Ruben Kincaid, the band's manager.

Got it.

All right.

Yeah, nothing.

Donald Peterson.

I'm going to say Ford.

I'm going to say Ford president.

He was.

Yeah.

He was CEO between 1985 and 1990 and would oversee the development of the launch of the Explorer.

Okay.

So kind of a big deal there.

You have one point.

You're on the board.

I have a point.

You didn't use your favorite phrase when you could have though.

Oh yeah.

You've got no points.

Yeah.

But now I have a point.

You can't use it.

A lot of the sting goes out of that then.

Brian Forster.

Hmm.

I'm going to say Partridge family.

Yes.

He played Chris Partridge, which I believe was the youngest Partridge.

So wait a minute.

The Partridge family wasn't actually a real family.

It was actually a fictional TV show.

Yes.

I don't know why I thought it was real.

Probably because they toured as a band.

Okay.

I don't know.

Yeah.

The ugly bus that looked like a Mondrian.

Yeah, that's how much I don't know about the Partridge family.

All right.

Well, you've got two points so you're in good way now.

Okay.

Ellen Malali.

Oh, that one I actually know.

Uh-huh.

Because I have a badge signed by him.

Oh, there you go.

Yeah.

He's Ford President.

Yeah, between 2006 and 2014.

Is he the dude that came from Boeing?

I think he is.

I don't remember that.

He may have come from Boeing.

But I've met him.

He was, I mean, he was a friendly guy.

Yeah.

You've won already.

Yeah.

He was the founder, the instigator of the Ford One Strategy, which was a plan to integrate

all the global platforms of Ford so they wouldn't be building different cars in every country

that were entirely different.

Got it.

So, and I think he got some of that done.

Finally, Alex Trotman.

This is not a name I know.

But I've already won so it doesn't matter.

I can guess.

I'll say Partridge family.

Nope.

He was a Ford, 1993, 1999.

He was actually the, he actually launched the predecessor to the Ford One Strategy, which

was the Ford 2000 Initiative.

Okay.

He called it the Ford 2000 Initiative and he quit in 99.

What was the slacker?

But he was also working to achieve some sort of global...

He was afraid of Y2K, which is why he stopped before the year 2000.

That's right.

So you got three total.

You've won.

Time for the bonus question.

Do you want to know what it's about?

Always.

Topic is booted from Greece.

Okay.

I'm talking about Wendy's here.

We talk a lot about fast food restaurants.

We do.

Wendy's has had the hardest time breaking into Europe.

Okay.

As it turns out.

They had a few stores in Greece and they were there for three years and everyone

hated them.

So Wendy's left Greece.

Oh, like redheads there.

Is that the problem?

But what I have here...

Well, guess how many Wendy's there are in the whole world?

Oh, we know I'm horrible at this.

14,000.

Not bad.

7,300.

Okay.

I wouldn't have thought that number was...

I actually would have guessed higher, too.

In the U.S.?

2,000.

6,000.

Okay.

And in the U.K.?

100.

14.

Okay.

So we're just talking about Wendy's phenomenal global success here.

Yes.

I need you to tell me which of the following is not on the U.K. menu at

breakfast menu at Wendy's.

Are you ready?

Mm-hmm.

The breakfast baconator with Heinz ketchup.

The breakfast baconator with HP brown sauce.

The egg double stack.

The egg triple stack.

One of those not on the menu.

The breakfast menu at Wendy's in the U.K.

So I'm going to say brown sauce seems very British.

Yes.

So I'm going to say that one is true.

Okay.

Why would they have a double stack and a triple stack?

That's a good question.

Think about brown sauce real quick.

We have a bottle at home.

Mm-hmm.

And to try it.

Mm-hmm.

And at first it's like, wow, brown sauce is great.

So there's like any ketchup again.

Very, very much an acquired taste.

Well, the Brits do a lot of mayonnaise and they dip their

French fries in mayonnaise instead of ketchup.

That's a Euro thing.

But I always thought that was very weird.

I felt bad when I was in Belgium in high school and we were

someplace and we had French fries and they served us mayonnaise

and everyone was being grossed out by it and I kind of like it.

Yeah.

It was good.

Lest anybody think that I'm making fun of the Brits,

I did live in England for a year.

Well, I don't think anyone thought you were making fun of the Brits.

I don't know.

Just, you know, like, because we apparently made fun of the

Swedes.

The Swedes.

But don't...

As anyone knows, I only make fun of the French.

Okay.

All right.

But no, I still have friends in England.

Okay.

So read through...

Except for the second one with the brown sauce,

which I'm pretty sure is going to be real.

Give me the first one, the third one and the fourth one.

The breakfast baconator with Heinz ketchup.

Okay.

Egg double stack, egg triple stack.

Why Heinz?

Good question.

I think it's going to be the first one.

That's the fake?

Yeah.

It is not.

Strangely, on the menu, the first two things on the

breakfast menu are the breakfast baconator with

Heinz ketchup and the breakfast baconator with

HP brown sauce.

What's weird about that to me is that they're calling

out a condiment that would not be on them in the

U.S.

You would apply them yourself.

Yes.

So very interesting that they serve them that way.

And use the brand names.

Right.

It's Heinz ketchup.

But brown sauce, they're pretty much

universally is HP sauce, isn't it?

Yeah.

I think HP and brown sauce are kind of

used interchangeably.

Yeah.

Like we never say cola here.

No.

The egg triple stack is the fake.

All right, you won.

I'm going to sign this for you.

You got three correct.

A passable showing.

A passable showing there.

I got off the phone not too long before we got here.

Did I talk about this at all?

The Audi E5.

Okay.

So I had the test car and I got the test car

in a bit of turmoil about what is actually happening

with the Audi lineup.

Okay.

And we talked a little bit about this.

But there are A5s now that are redesigned

for 2025 and A5s that are not.

And then no A4.

And no A4.

The A4 was just, I just found this out.

The A4 was discontinued late last year.

It was a 2025 model at the end.

But they're gone.

Okay.

So what's happening here that's so interesting.

The A5 and the S5, which is the same vehicle

but with more engine stuffed under the hood.

I drove the S5.

A plastic car.

Really nice.

But just to be clear about this, the A4 goes away.

And this is partly due to tariffs.

Okay.

They need something slightly higher margin in that spot now.

So they're moving up to the race year A5,

which was this fastback version basically

of that same architecture.

But much better looking car.

Hatchback, which is interesting.

Yeah.

So for 2025 and moving forward,

the A5 and S5 are called hatchback.

Okay.

We lose the Sportback designation.

Which was the old four-door designation.

And then if it was just A5 or S5, it was the coupe.

Okay.

Two-door.

Very confusing.

That is confusing.

Yes.

But the good news here is though you're going to be paying more

for a compact four-door Audi moving forward.

That's the good news?

No, the good news is that it's an extremely nice car.

Okay.

I was like, the good news is that you're paying more?

No, that's the bad news.

Okay.

But the three-liter twin-turbo-charged engine.

So slick.

So sweet.

H-speed automatic transmission works really well.

And the interior, interestingly, not as flamboyant as all,

we talked a little bit about this because you had mentioned

you thought Audi interiors were kind of dull.

And that was not the case for a long time.

They were over the top with wood and aluminum.

And they were winning design awards and stuff.

But ultimately, I think Genesis now wins.

Yeah.

The interior conversation.

Yeah.

Well, though I haven't been in very many Mercedes lately,

I'm getting into one soon.

Okay.

So, and that's, those are still.

Mercedes to me is like a big computer screen.

That's where they're going.

Yeah.

They showed, wasn't it?

And lots of ambient lighting.

Yeah.

And part of that is that they have to do something, right?

We've talked about how, as regular cars get nicer and more luxurious,

luxury makers are struggling to find things to separate their cars

from the less interesting vehicles,

the less luxury-oriented vehicles.

So, strange situation.

Yeah.

All right.

Guess what we did?

We had a really great conversation today.

Yeah.

Thank you to Don Secora of Collectible Automobile.

We tried to get him in studio.

We lured him with donuts.

And he said no.

But he said no.

Thank you, Jill.

Thank you to producer Randy and the good folks here at TalkZone.

Let's talk more about cars again.

Next week.

Thank you.

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