Near Premium SUV Shootout, Ford Kills the F-150 Lightning, More NISMO Models on the Way

Hello and welcome to the Auto Guide Show. This week we talk about our latest big shootout comparison

Kyle drives a pair of other vehicles and we have a lot of news, mostly from Nissan and Honda,

but first a word from our sponsor. eBay has re-invented car buying, from

click to curb, everything is covered. With their new secure purchase, eBay isn't just

where you find your car, it's where you buy it start to finish, title, financing,

registration, delivery, it's all built in. And eligible vehicle purchases are backed

by up to $100,000 in protection. This is what modern car buying looks like. Get your

next ride on eBay. eBay, things, people, love. Secure purchase is powered by Carmel dealer

services, LLC, and eBay subsidiary. Okay, so kicking things off was our most recent shootout,

which ended up being just a slightly bigger comparison, because we wanted to have eight vehicles

for what we call the near premium SUV midsize two row, whatever you want to classify. We're

looking for the vehicles that were from mainstream brands, but are almost up against the premiums,

like Accuro Volvo, Buick, better the two row midsize. And we almost had a Buick. Buick,

you know, it's a weird one, right? Buick straddles the line and where it's sort of premium,

but sort of not. Well, Buick was going to be our, basically, our benchmark of premium

was, you know, are you better or worse than they were, but that and another vehicle had

an incident before we got our hands on them. Third one couldn't arrive and a fourth one

isn't out yet. So that put us down to just four, but it was still good. We had the crown

signal from Toyota, the Hyundai Santa Fe, which we'll get to in a second, the Mazda CX70

and the Volkswagen Atlas crossport. So yes, the Santa Fe is a seven row, but size wise,

it's right on top of the signal. And that third row, although it was actually quite spacious,

when folded, I think it's trying to achieve the same thing. So that's why we included

it and we drove them all back to back to back to back to back for a week took them home,

did daily stuff in them and then came up with our conclusion that the best mid size premium,

your premium SUV is a wagon. Yeah, I mean, this was maybe our closest in terms of all of our

bigger comparisons in terms of points, I think it was the closest finish. And are we,

are we good with, I guess we've spoiled the winter now? People should go and read the whole comparison,

also go and watch the whole video on YouTube. But yes, the, the senior ended up winning, but if

that's because we average pricing in both the US and Canada for our final scoring, if you only look

at the Canadian pricing, it's actually the Mazda that would have won even though it was far and

away the most expensive and we all really like it because it feels like it's worth that money.

Yeah, it's different depending on region. I also added to somewhere in there that if you're

towing regularly, the Hyundai and the Toyota for that matter maybe aren't the best picks because

the other two can tow 5,000 pounds. Yeah, and the Mazda is a rear drive bias system, which is usually

better. Oh, the Volkswagen can tow quite well. But yeah, the Mazda was the biggest, it had the

nicest interior, we think it has the nicest exterior, it had the most power that had just the most

of everything. And like you said, price and in the US, we're talking several thousand dollars

between it and both the Hyundai and the Toyota, which is a big gap and it isn't quite worth that gap.

And then I mean, the Volkswagen we got wasn't fully loaded, it was mid trim, so it was even,

it was like over $10,000 cheaper. So when you're talking 55 versus 45 versus like 48,

it's a big difference. But then in Canada, as you mentioned, the gap goes from like 6,000 down to 3

and the prices are higher because of Canadian, so suddenly that percentage of difference isn't that big

and I would pay the a little bit extra to get it, I think, goes with the SIGNIA. Now the SIGNIA

and it couldn't be any more different. You have like basically a car in the SIGNIA because it

is a wagon, it's even classified as such, even though Toyota calls it a crossover and it drives

like that. Like you call it the camera across and this is exactly what it is, it's basically a

camera wagon and any other sense of the term. Whereas the CX70 has, you know, got things like the

almost like the BMW X5 and it's crosshair, so like it's been built to be just like the 5,

the X540i I believe. Yeah, so it's, and it drives like that, it drives heavy, it drives big,

and it drives refined, but it drives like an SUV. Yeah, I'd also, I'd modify what you said,

like it drives heavy compared to like the crown, but for people who are sitting here being like,

oh, I don't know, I should clarify, I feel like it drives deliberately, not necessarily heavy,

like it's very like sure of itself. I really like the CX70 and it's funny because we've

joked since this vehicle launched, like, oh, it's the point because it really is just a CX90

without the third row, but when you compare it against its two row competitors, that's when it

makes sense, right? It's like, it's very comfortable, it's super stylish, it's weirdly good on gas,

considering it is 340 horsepower. It's, I suddenly still understand it, although that being said,

if you're going to go to the dealership and look at the CX70, just look at an ID, get the third

row, and just fold it down when you don't need it. Yeah, I think that segment exists and it makes

sense, and I think the problem that everyone's had is they called it a different vehicle. I mean,

yeah, and they teased and promoted it was going to be different, and it was just the same. Like,

if they just called it a CX90 sport or whatever term they wanted for being the two row,

no one would have thought any different, and I don't think it would get that sort of flag,

I mean, like, the atlas could have three, but now this is the two version, and so many other

ones we wanted were in the same situation with the Grand Cherokee, but this, yeah, this is just a big

comfortable car for four people, or SUV, with a lot of storage in the back that has a smooth,

great sounding inline six tons of power, not terrible fuel economy for how heavy and big the engine

is because of the mild hybrid system, better than the Volkswagen, so yeah. Oh, way better. Yeah,

as I could say, all four of them were good vehicles, which we kind of knew going in,

that's why these are the survivors of the segment. Anything that wasn't good vehicles longed

put to pass. Well, on that note, we should also clarify that the winner will face off against

the Nissan Marano when we can get a Marano, but I would like to take a moment to just talk about

the Santa Fe, because for me, the Santa Fe was the surprise in this because it didn't win,

because both you and I talked so much about how nice the current Santa Fe is, it's spacious,

like you mentioned before, with the third row, it has a lot of features, it's priced well,

it's just the funny thing is, as we've always driven or opted driven the lower trims

solo, and it was here where the top trim actually didn't really match up, right, as you're spending

so much more for this, and you get a ton of tech, don't get me wrong, and a lot of features, but

you're missing that premium feel that the Mazda and the Toyota just did better, and I think that's

what hurt the Santa Fe. I maintain that the Santa Fe is maybe the best family vehicle out of these,

but it's just, oh yeah, you know, get a lower trim. Yeah, a lower trim, maybe you get the,

well, it depends on your country, if you could save some money by getting the turbo instead of

the hybrid, what not, I mean, you're gonna pay for it in gas, but it's funny, because you're right,

the Santa Fe, we always regard it so good in isolation, because it is, and then in this class,

it kind of doesn't match up, whereas we said earlier, the 670 were always kind of like,

what's the point, but then in a second, you're like, oh, this is the point, so that's why we do these,

is because you can drive as many cars as you want, and as often as you want, but if you don't drive

them back-to-back, you don't really see the difference, and like, the crant insignia, yeah,

at barely one, but at barely one, because it does have a shortcomings too, I mean, the biggest one

is if you're regularly carrying adults, they might not want to have to bend down that extra little

bit to get in the rear seats, once in there, there's decent space, but when you're in the Santa Fe,

or the X70 or the Atlas cross, there's just so much more space, feeling of space, maybe there's

a more space, but just the feeling, especially in the boltswagon, feels like you're sitting a mile from

the person beside you, which is nice. Yeah. Yeah, it was a surprising comparison, and Mike,

you kicked it off because you pointed out, like, this segment has seen sort of resurgence in the

last few years, researches, cheese, because it used to be something like the Ford Edge, right,

and now there's a lot more competitors that they kind of slid in at two different

trains of thought, and, like, these are the more premium feeling on road biased ones,

but then there's the more rugged choices, like, the Outback, which you drove recently,

certain versions of the Grand Cherokee, like, those sorts of vehicles still exist, but it's

funny how, yeah, this category has just split two ways. Yeah, like this, this used to be a big segment,

with the original Marano, and like I said, the Edge might be outback when it was still a more

vague and yielding. It was just sort of, oh, I don't need a big SUV with three rows, but I need

something bigger than a Forester, and then there was so-called compacts of grown so big, it kind of

killed the segment, so to have a reason to exist, right, it's gone rugged without back passport

four runners, things like that, or it's gone premium with Marano CX-70 Signia, so we do plan to do

the off-roaders down the road, and like you said, the Marano is going to face the Grand Signia down

the road as well, but until then, go check out the video and read the article, and let us know what

you think. Yeah, yeah, so moving on to a completely different vehicle. All right Kyle, we've talked

about the Ford Maverick to death on this podcast, because we both like it. Not to death, and you have

more than once said, how much you like the hybrid all-wheel drive is your perfect one, and I'm always

team turbo, so convinced me why this is better, but before that, my biggest question is you've driven

them all. The numbers on paper makes the power seem like there's a decent gap, but being with

electric assist, do you feel it, or not so much, or yeah, it's there. I think you feel it on the

highway. Around town, honestly, there's probably not much difference between the two, because you get

such a more responsive initial feel with the hybrid, right? I don't, I say this in the review,

and I don't think Ford gets enough credit for doing excellent hybrids, right? Like the Escape

Hybrid in 2005 was the first SUV hybrid in our market, and so Ford's been doing this basically

with the same powertrain for 20 years now, and has really refined it in a way that I think,

yeah, the numbers, it's 191 horsepower, doesn't feel like that, it feels much more than 200,

and so day to day, great, on the highway, if you're on a short on-ramp or you need to get around

someone, maybe then I'd want the turbo, but otherwise this is great every day, I really appreciate

that it drives like a crossover, unless you look at the rear view, you don't really feel like

you're driving anything different than a broken sport. So the big advantage of hybrid obviously

is fuel economy. Does it sort of live up to that? Like I'm sure it doesn't get its exact numbers,

but is it noticeably saving fuel, or are you driving it a little hard, or that it doesn't make

much difference? So this is not the first time I've driven a hybrid, it is the first time I drove

the all-wheel drive this year, but I beat my numbers, or the official numbers. That's the other

thing, it's not like a Toyota setup. It still has a physical connection to the rear axle,

but it can of course disconnect and just drive as a front drive vehicle, which is what it does 95%

of the time anyway. But yeah, compared to a Toyota, I find that Ford's hybrid system is more

eager to run on electric power alone, and so even in a truck, like a 3,800 pound truck, like

them average. I found that a lot of the time I'm just coasting along on electric power, as long as

you're not digging deep into the throttle if you're going around town, it stays in it pretty easily.

And so you're getting maybe not civic hybrid fuel economy now, but you're getting regular civic

economy out of a truck, which is pretty incredible, right? Yeah, as much as I like the turbo,

because I like things a little sportier, this is the consumer one, and the all-wheel drive being

added to the hybrid is a huge deal, but I don't think it's enough talking about it, because that

was sort of the thing was you could get a hybrid or if you don't, we'll drive, and they both

kind of compromise where yes, a lot of people don't need all-wheel drive, even though they want it,

but being a truck, it's kind of expected that in a moment's notice, you can go down a dirt road,

this now can tow the larger amounts because of the all-wheel drive system, which is another big

thing, and although the payload number isn't dramatically different, you just feel more confident

that the wheels under the payload are being powered too. So yeah, I don't know what else we can

say about this vehicle, but it's got so much choice, and it's so well put together, and yes,

it's a car with a bed, so to speak, but that's what makes it so cool. Yeah, I will say so it's not

perfect. I should probably clarify, you know, we always talked about how affordable this thing was,

it's not super affordable now, this one just skims under $40,000 US, or a little under 50 Canadian,

so that's a lot to pay for, excuse me, a truck, and the other thing is the features that I think

most people would want, namely adaptive cruise control, 360 camera, and the towing assist,

those are locked to the top lariat trim because I was in the XLT. I think, I understand that

like Ford's not the only automaker that does this, that locks the best features in the top trim,

but I will say since this car had or truck had the 4K tow package, I do think it's a bit of a miss

that Ford doesn't put its pro trailer assists on with the 4K tow package. I feel like that should

be a giveaway, where if I'm speccing 4K tow it's because I plan on towing, give me those features.

Yeah, it's unusual because Ford usually lets you option whatever you want to a degree,

and gets pricey and expensive, but at least you can pick it usually you want. So yeah,

locking things out at the higher trims is it's a different strategy than these to have,

but maybe it's what a lot of other in the industry do, so maybe that's where it needs to go.

Yeah, but otherwise, fantastic. The best all-rounder, even if I agree with you that the

logo is a ton of fun. So moving on to something completely different that you drove,

another vehicle that you are, you're high or not as high as the optic, but you do like this,

it's actually both the size, I only a little bigger than those two rows we're just talking about,

it is the Cadillac Mystic 3-row EV. Yes, it's big. I don't know if you've seen it sat beside

the Escalade IQ, but or sat beside a gas S-blade for that matter, but yeah, the Mystic is nearly the

size. It's in fact bigger than the first few generations of Escalade. It is a fantastic 3-row EV.

I don't know how much more I can really say, I mean, I can say a lot, but that's really the best

way to sum it up is Cadillac has been doing great work with EVs. I've set up before that I think

they have one of the strongest EV lineups right now out of any brand because they have all these

different sizes. The Mystic keeps things simple at launch, it is one battery size, it's 102 kilowatt hours,

it's one powertrain setup, it's a dual motor with 615 horsepower, so it's plenty quick,

it's big inside of the 3-row is maybe not adult friendly, adult acceptable. The interiors are

fantastic, the work that they've been doing with the new layouts with really intricate stitching

and and perforations. It's a blue faux leather that looks great. There's a lot of tech. Supercruise

is fantastic. You and I will both sing the praises of that whenever we get the opportunity.

It's a really good all-round vehicle where I think if you're able to make EVs work, say you have

a charger at home, I would argue that this is a better buy than a BMW X5 and I love the X5,

but this feels more special. So this is a question because we've driven now, I think every kind of

like EV except for the celistic, but that's a model. Back in the day we had badge engineering,

so the platforms for say Cadillac all felt different, so the vehicles felt different, although

they had siblings that were so identical. Here we're basically using the same platform quote platform,

I know it was expanded very much, but between the, I guess you'd say compact optic, this three-row,

the lyric that kind of falls in between and then you have the monster IQ. Do they all feel

driving-wise like their own personality? Obviously, interiors will be similar because

all manufacturers want to have a family theme, but does it feel like you're in a different vehicle?

Or does it feel like you just did different, feel like you're in a C-70 of the C-X90 basically?

No, that's a fair question. I will say that the S-blade IQ does feel substantially different,

all the vehicles that are on the, what is it? The quasi-unibody, quasi, the truck platform for the EVs,

that one is different. This feels heftier than a lyric. My personal tastes lie toward smaller

vehicles, so an optic or a lyric. This feels, well, I used the term before, very deliberate. It's

over 6,000 pounds, so it is a chunker, but it, I think, Cadillac very rightly has kind of dialed

down the sportiness here, whereas the lyric has a bit more of an edge and is a little more eager. This

is more, you know, slow things down, take it easy. It has an air suspension so it can drop low, but

that's mostly for ingress and egress. Otherwise, it's just a little more comfort-focused, but there is,

I would say there is a difference in personality, but it's a lot smaller. The optic and the lyric feel

a little more different, whereas this actually feels like a slightly bigger lyric.

So you've driven this on the IQ, S-blade IQ. What's the size difference inside between the two?

Is there like noticeable? It's tough to say, you get a lot more headroom, I would say, in the S-blade,

that's the thing is there was this impression of width and height more in it, but in terms of comfort,

they're pretty similar. The weird thing that I will say is the S-blade IQ that I drove,

that one had the second row, what is it? Premium pack or whatever, so it's, you know, two

individual seats with a big console between them, and it made the third row basically inaccessible.

So based on measurements, the third row of the S-blade is more spacious because of course it is,

but otherwise, I would say the first two rows, you're not getting much of a difference.

I think the biggest difference is just, you know, the amount of tech.

Yeah, the reason I bring it up is the S-blade IQ obviously is much more like the S-blade

in terms of presence and style, whereas this weight, power, and the three rows is closer

spec-wise to the S-blade. It's obviously a smaller vehicle, but like this kind of feels like what

should have been the three row, but I get also trying to catch you in such a popular name, so

yeah, I can't go wrong with that. No, yeah, I get it. I would, I say it in the review that I would argue

that in fact, this is the better choice. If you need a three row, if you need a three row EV

from Cadillac, I would skip the S-blade IQ personally. The price is a big hurdle,

and the gas one is, well, as you've experienced this year, pretty darn good.

But yeah, overall, really impressive. This is, we're probably not going to do a three row mega

comparison for EVs anytime soon, but I would say if we were, this has to be in there.

And making this feel small on pretty much every other three row EV, I had the Volkswagen ID buzz

again. And if you're a regular listener, you may think, Deja Vu, didn't you have that last holidays?

Yes, but this time it was for something completely different. I didn't get it for a car review.

I only have it for a couple days. The point was, we were doing a food and toy drive at my

son's school, and we wanted something to catch people's attention and, you know, fill it up.

And I said, hey, why don't we fill up a buzz? Because it definitely grabs attention, and it's got

a lot of space. So we did. And yeah, it worked well in the sense a lot of the people donating

paid comments. Yeah, like almost completely positive. Everyone was like, oh, that's so cool.

This thing's huge. It looks like the old bus. And it's like, yeah, that's kind of a point. But

but beyond that, I just put out a fun article about five ways it actually worked really well for

what we were doing. So the first one is the obvious, it's massive. When I folded the second

and third row seats, and we put so much food and toys in it, it looked like we barely had anything

in. But we went, well, when I went to the local fire station to drop all the donations off

later, I did like 12, 15 trips, like arms full of stuff to to dub over. And there was way more

in there than it looked like. So we could have taken much more, but it's a tiny school. So we got

what we could, which is really good. There was, they were very generous. I don't think there's a

single person who attended this event that didn't bring at least one, if not like seven things.

Yeah, it was well done. So being the holidays, I thought we should decorate the buzz a bit. So I got

some LED lights that I strung all around the roof and the windshield and the trunk. So there's the

convenient 12 volts outlet right in the hatch. And you can run a cord up through the hatch and

close it. So that's nice. And then there's that sort of hidden 110 conventional plug end of the

passenger seat, but it doesn't allow you to get much more power because it's not feeding off the

big battery. It's feeding off of what a normal car is. So I got to put more lights up there. But

I had more than enough. And I mean, it looks kind of cool with its own lights and lit up.

It does have a very, very striking nighttime light signature on its own.

Yeah, yeah. So I made sure that was on. And speaking of having it on, that was the nice thing as

being an EV. I ran it for three hours. I didn't have to worry about like it was parked

up by the entrance to the schools. I was very about fuming out the school or you know,

it's not getting people in the Alcove. It just sat there and ran. I probably lost like five percent of

the battery. Like it's crazy how little batteries used if something stationary, like how much

energy is needed to move cars compared to just power or radio. And if I turn the heater off,

I think I would have had no percentage lost. I just got it. So like helping into warm up

every once in a while. Yeah, because LEDs don't use a ton of power anyway. Yeah, no. This was

the fully loaded first edition. It's technically last year's model, I guess, but the new ones

haven't arrived yet. So that's a harming card and sound system. So that was nice too, because I had

both sliding doors and the rear hatch open for donations. So I turned into like a mobile music studio

and pounding Christmas tunes. And it's got a great sound. So I don't realize how good it is

outside of the vehicle. Because that's the problem. So I'm sound good in. And I'm going to get out

and you're like, oh, it's restrained. But this thing opens up so much. So let's all the sound come

out. And you know, we had Bing Crosby and Ryan Carrey and Elton John and all the classics pounding.

Oh, yes, yes. No, they love, you know, all their cameras. It's honestly like that's one thing

that I've said with EVs is, you know, it's kind of a shame that something like a driving theater

is so rare these days, because they're so well suited to that particular purpose of like, oh,

I have to leave it running for hours. Cool. Easy. Yeah, like I joked with Volkswagen way back and

it's never come. So I don't know if ever will probably not now with the mandates all changing. But

I said, like, this there should be a camper version of this because this would be the ultimate

camper. It turned the seats into a bed, maybe pop the roof up like the old one used to, but

I think that I thought at this thing at this event that would be cool is how the door slide out.

It's like imagine they were like double hinged and you could open them like suicide style like

backwards. So the panels were facing out from the back of the vehicle and they could really like

pound in music and light show and stuff from the ambience. Yeah, because the ambience is another

thing a lot of vehicles have ambient lights. A lot of vehicles have multiple color choice. Some

even have two tone, but this one allows you to pick I think six different two-tone patterns inside.

So and the colors, so I picked red and green and I had it going between the different patterns and

yeah, just you know a little more Christmassy even if the buzz was yellow. So gave off the right vibes.

So yeah, so it may be expensive. It may have not great range. The brakes kind of,

brakes I'm gonna use to. I forgot how yeah, like they're, if you're way too small for this vehicle,

I guess the way it looks. I'm used to it now. I haven't driven it for a couple days, but the first

couple stops. There was like moments where I'm like almost slamming on the brakes before the

final stops. I don't get whatever's in front of me. Yeah, but everything else is just so cool about it.

It's just the perfect like you got a lot of money and you don't have far to drive around town

with a lot of people. And you want something that everyone's gonna stare at because you are a giant

rolling show off basically. When I had the one last year, I had been white and gray and I got attention.

People who knew what it is, but if you didn't know cars or pay attention to your peripheral,

you just see something gray blob go by. This thing being bright yellow, everyone puts their head up and

I get so many double takes. What is that thing? So yeah, I mean, you've nailed it, right? It's like,

yeah, it's not perfect. Neither was the original boss. Let's all remember. But it's so full of

character and it spreads joy, right? The Christmas time isn't even better time for us to do that,

of course, but I mean, it's worth a year. You drive one of these things and people are going to be

smiling all over the place. It's so nice to have a car that has that attitude right now.

You can use that. Yep, so that's it for our driving and reviews. We're going to take a break on

the AutoGuy show, brought to you by eBay Motors. And then Kyle and I'll be back because this is our

second last one before the holidays. And we're getting ready for that. So we actually had a lot of

news. It's like the automakers know the holidays are coming. So they're dumping out all the news. So

yeah, so we'll get to that in a couple minutes right after our word from our sponsor.

eBay has reinvented vehicle buying from click to curb everything's covered. It's all thanks to their

new secure purchase. Ever try to buy a car and end up in a parking lot with a stranger on some

blind trust or spend half the day at a dealership talking to pushy salespeople and signing paperwork

or maybe worst of all wait hours at the DMV just to transfer the title. That era is over.

For years, eBay has been the go-to for gear heads collectors and DIYers because whatever you're

into from classics to SUVs and trucks to imports, eBay's got it. And now with secure purchase,

eBay isn't just where you find your next ride. It's where you can buy it start to finish. Sellers

and titles are verified. Paperwork is handled by experts and payments are traceable and digital.

So you know exactly who you're dealing with and exactly what you're getting. Plus you can finance

ensure and register your vehicle all in one place. No more hours at the dealership. No more trips to

the DMV. Get your vehicle, plates and paperwork shipped to your door ready to drive. And it's all

part of one seamless process designed to feel as easy as buying anything else online.

And eligible vehicles purchased on eBay are backed by up to $100,000 and purchase protection.

Thinking about selling your ride, secure purchase makes that simple too because you know your buyer

and their funds are verified. If you still owe on your car, the financing payoff is fully

integrated so you're not chasing paperwork or waiting on checks to clear. And with secure purchase,

you get paid fast and you're not going to be stuck, chasing no shows or answering the fifth

still available messages. This is what modern car buying looks like. Skip the DMV, skip the sketchy

meetups, buy it on eBay, eBay, things people love. Secure purchase is powered by Carmel,

dealer services, LLC and eBay subsidiary. All right, so I guess arguably it's funny.

Arguably the biggest news of the week is the Honda Accord, well lower trims at least,

got a big refresh. I mean, back in the day, this would be massive news, but it's crazy how far

the Accord's fallen in the sense of the public's consciousness. Like in the camera, we're like

decars if you wanted a family car. And the camera is still kind of there, but like you think

honey thinks you're a V, you don't think Accord anymore. I think the problem facing the Accord in

particular too is that the Civic, as we've said so many times on this podcast, is so good.

Whereas a camera, a camera is very good. And you know, that's now hybrid all the time,

but there's a noticeable gap between it and the Corolla. Heck, the Prius slots in between them,

right? Whereas this is like, now you have the hybrid powertrain and the Corolla and the Civic,

it's basically the same output as the one in the Accord. So unless you absolutely need more space,

there's very little reason to move up to an Accord now. And so as Mike said,

updates to the lower trims, you get a standard nine inch touch screen now. Whereas before,

it was at seven, I think the higher trims are still the 12.3. The two lowest trims in the US are

the turbo 1.5, which I guess you can't get in a Civic except the SI now. So there is that

differentiating the Accord. But otherwise, once you get into the hybrids and the higher trims,

basically the same, you get a slightly more power and more torque. And yeah, the second

of the two gas trims, the SE, gets 19 inch out of the ice, which it shares with some of the other

hybrid trims. That's about it. Like there's no styling changes. There's no changes to the top trim.

It's just the lower trims. And hopefully, the base model still actually starts under 30K,

which is kind of a great deal for so much car. I will admit, but I would probably stretch to get

a hybrid if I was in the market. Yeah, you nailed it about the camera and the Corolla. The Corolla

is one of the smaller feeling compacts. Even though it really isn't, but the rear just does

were a specific one of the larger feeling ones. And I'm happy the Accusal has those gas entry

engines, because that's sort of an area like these cars, historically back in the day,

all had like some sort of four cylinder entry. And then they went up to a V6, so then they went

to a turbo or something. And that's sort of what the hybrid's come. It makes that power with

even better gas mileage. But camera and some of the other ones that are left, they're just kind of

the high end motors and engines now, because the sales are so much smaller, they're trying to get

the good margins. Yeah, so it's kind of nice having the sub 200 horsepower one five entry. But on

the flip side, we already said this in the Civic too close together. And at that point, it's really

close. It's basically for those who miss having a one five turbo Civic. It's like, well,

there's an accord for around the same price now if you want that set. Yeah, I will say also writing

this up, I realized as I was typing. This is the only mid-size sedan left that doesn't offer all

wheel drive, because the the camera does now, the Sonata does since its facelift, the K5 always has,

and the Ultima still does. So I don't know if that's a good or bad thing for the accord.

It's the hottest thing because the Civic too, it doesn't offer it in so many of its compact

competitors are starting to offer it in some form, not all like the center and Alontera don't,

but a lot of the others do. But I think it's because of that hybrid system, but it has that

trick transmission that isn't a transmission type deal that would be I think it would be really hard

to adapt that toll wheel drive. But the same transmission though. Yeah.

So then I guess they could just send it down because it's not like Toyota who has that

disconnected system. Yeah, it's odd. But I mean, I guess the people who are still in the market for

an accord probably don't care, right? Because if they want all wheel drive, they're going to go to an

SUV. Yeah. So speaking of mid-sized sedans, wasn't that we were almost certain was dead or

at least would be very soon? Lives on for another year. There's a 2026 Ultima that's coming in and

even has some updates. Got a new appearance package which basically gives you a two-tone paint job.

You get the black roof and black wheels and some black badging and stuff. So yeah.

It's not a big change, but the big change I think is the fact it's still going. And they're still

at least doing some changes to it. Like even if it's just detail, they're not completely ignoring it.

So with the new century, it hasn't yet killed off the Ultima. There's still some life there. And maybe

as we were just saying, the big reason is it can get all wheel drives. So if you want a wrong

wheel drive car or not an SUV, this is the Nissan you get as opposed to the century. Yeah. And the

Ultima used to have the turbo engine that set it apart, but that's been gone for a few years now.

I will say trying to build this on the configurator when this news dropped. I didn't know that

Nissan quietly added a green, which I guess was actually new for 25 as an exterior paid option.

It's a really nice green. It's tactical green, which is an odd choice for a sedan. But yeah,

that's nice. I'm with you. I'm genuinely kind of shocked this thing still exists. It feels old. It

felt old when we drove it two summers ago. So now it's real old. It's too bad they couldn't get

the old wheel drive and the turbo combined because that would have been something either time I get

why there's a legacy that did that and there's a Hyundai and a Kia. But I think that's something that

would set it apart still now to kind of, because everything else has gone hybrid at that PowerPoint.

So you'd have a turbo and you'd have the option of power and all four wheels if you want. So it could be

like the Nissan WRX basically. Well, the Hyundai and a Kia were front drives. That was always

the strange thing is if you got an N-line or a K5 GT, it's front drive only. So it's like,

oh, 290 horsepower, torque steer city. I've had the one before that did, but I guess not

when it had the older. Yeah, I guess all wheel drive was only the two-five. Yeah. Yeah, so it's

funny. If you get more power, they're like, yeah, less driven wheels. Don't worry about it.

Well, you need to get more robust everything. So then there's more investment and just

just a lot of power for you. Yeah. But yeah, good for the ultimate.

Big old energy for another year. So stepping back to Honda, they have announced officially that

their F1 engine will be debuted on January 20th, 2026. And this is interesting because

they are powering as to Martin this year, which is a new partnership. They they've been

in Formula One off it on since 1964, which is pretty crazy. And in 2021, they technically left,

they were powering the Red Bulls, but Red Bull kept using their engines. And Honda still had

unofficial, oh, it's unofficial. They still helped with technical support, but they weren't

basically bankrolling it anymore. And I remember Red Bull like renamed it like the Red Bull

Power Planter, some weird name. So, but the new car be completely different with new engines

that are completely different and everything. They made a deal with Asimarn who were using Mercedes

engines to get their own engine suppliers. So these new engines are V6s, hybrid V6s like they are

now, but the power they can make is limited. And the electric motors make almost as much power.

It's a much more 50 50 setup. And it's going to be pushed to pass and all this and that. So Honda

some tease the sound. It actually sounds good. Sounds better than the old one. And that's a little

bar. Yeah. And just a little bar. And they're going to show it off on the 20th. No word when Asim's

going to show off their next gen car. I would have thought most manufacturers are going to wait till

closer to testing to not give away anything, but like Ford's going to have already apparently shown

their car by then because they're saying the 16th of Jan, they're going to show theirs off. And

some other manufacturers are hinting at it. But I think Honda just wants to show off the engine.

They're not going to get into technical details, probably just to show like, okay, here's our

engine. So it sounds like a man go from there, but it just makes me more and more excited for the

season coming up. We got Ford and Honda back making engines. We got Audi Cadillac joining the grid.

Like it's just it's going to be so many corporate. Yeah. And then Toyota is getting deeper

stakes into their teams. So maybe one day they'll take over us. And you could have so many manufacturers

they're like the old days. And that was sort of the point with the new car was they've gotten rid

of the hybrid heat exchange recapture, which is super expensive. So that helps keep costs down.

And there's no more DRS. It's active air. So it automatically flaps down in corners and opens

up in straights. And like so this pushed a patch. The cars are a little narrower, a little shorter,

a lot lighter. So yeah, it should be better action. And I just hope out of the gate, not one

team nails the formula. And yeah, I hope Honda, Audi and Ford all do well and Cadillac.

I mean, Cadillac's not using their own engines for the first year, but it'd be great if these other

teams get eight and also there's like six, seven teams all competing near the top. But we'll see.

Yeah. I just I'm mostly just going to be shocked with the next next Aston Martin

vanquish has a Civic type R engine. I thought the Honda Ridge line was going to get to be 12.

But maybe you're right. Yes. Ridge like type R. I'm here for it. So speaking of performance

editions of vehicles, Nissan not only kept the ultimate life, but they're well, you covered this

like else, you know, the number better, but they they're white doubling, tripling, quadrupling,

pedestals they want to make. Yes. So apparently Nissan as part of its pre Nissan plan wants to double

the global number of Nismo models. So currently there are five. If you count the Armada and the

Patrol as one, which we all probably do, then yeah, there are five of them and they want 10 by

2028. In terms of global models, that kind of, you know, muddies the waters a little bit as to

which models might get the treatment. But of course, I took the opportunity to do a really

lousy Photoshop job on the new center and you know, hope that maybe there will be a central Nismo

coming back because we've said it so many times that it's a solid platform. It's just in need of

something a little sportier. And it was one of the cruel ironies of the previous generation that

it was the better driving center than the one that it proceeded. And yet I never got a sporty trim.

So yeah, hopefully the central gets it. I mean, maybe the upcoming Xero will maybe this new skyline

that will be the basis for the Infinity Q50, the rear-drive manual sedan. Maybe that'll get one.

It's very exciting times for enthusiasts, right? I mean, we love it when Nissan makes sporty vehicles.

And this one has a good history of doing that. Even if it is a little cash-strapped at the moment,

there's a lot of stuff that it can pick at from its global parts bin and create something that could

be fun. Well, that's like 20 years ago. They were all over this, or yeah, 25 to 30 years ago. And

they were doing it. It was there just taking the engine from one side up and shoving it down. And

they could still do that. And I was looking the other day. I think there's like 12 or 13 models

depending on how you want to differentiate it in North America. So yeah, I don't think we're getting

all 10 here. I don't know. We're getting Pathfinder Nismo. Oh, that'd be kind of crazy or

a Versa Nismo. Nissan kicks Nismo. So yeah, this center is the most obvious one because

it is in need of a bigger engine at some point in its lineup. You could take the ropes, turbo

three, and put it in there. If you don't want to get back complex, even just the two, five,

like it used to have straight out of the ultimate would be a big improvement. And then I would say

next, the ultimate, you could bring the two liter back and call it Nismo if you wanted.

Like there's some easy plays there. Yeah, I know, there's some easy plays there. Yeah,

two out of the two, five would fit in the kicks because the kicks Nismo would be cool. And it's

like a fun youthful vehicle. So actually work well. Look over there. Like how did the jukai Nismo's?

Yeah. Well, now that the kicks is on a different platform, yeah, a kicks Nismo could work. I mean,

stick the road engine in that 211 horsepower in a kicks would be a lot of fun because basically

share an engine with the center. So whatever you would think you could do to one

you theoretically could do the other. But yeah. And the road's all built drives. You could also make

it all build drive, which would really make it a rock at a 201 horsepower all-wheel drive jukai kicks.

So I mean, you mentioned the road and we know that the next generation road is going to be shown

next year. And we know that a road Nismo already exists in other markets. So I wouldn't put it past

Nissan to make a road Nismo for the next generation, right? I mean, go after the Toyota. What is it?

The Rathor GR Sport? And anyone who thinks, you know, we're being ridiculous or going too far.

This is the company that currently sells a Armada Nismo. So nothing's on the table at this point.

The Lief Nismo. They had a Lief Nismo back in the day. So it wasn't it was a race car, but still.

And there's an Aurea Nismo now. So I mean, the Aurea won't happen in the US at least. But you know,

there are options. This is true. All right. So moving on to our last story on the AutoGuy Show by

the eBay Motors. This is a surprise and not a surprise. So we mentioned Summersh Ford was going to bring

out a midsize electric truck. And it was killing the escape, which that was a shocker. And I can't

they didn't confirm that. But the writing was on the wall the way they talked about it was we knew

the lightning would die when this electric truck came because it was a more right-sized midsize EV.

So it was more Rivian size, which I think is where that market for electric trucks should be. So

it made sense. What I think surprising is they've killed the lightning already. And this midsize

truck isn't ready yet. I thought they would eat it out. But the bigger surprises, they're going to

bring out another lightning. And that's going to be a range extender, which I don't think anyone's

all coming. So Ram has the same sort of idea. And I think I've said it before. For a full-size truck,

that makes sense. I know you have to carry around a bit of extra weight, but you're already carrying

around so much weight, but it's another 500 pounds. And this takes care of the big complaint you

always hear about people with EV trucks as well, you can't go as far tow. Well now you have your

electric or your gas engine to help power when you do the tow. And now they're all the rest of the time

you're driving around on your big battery. So it kind of gives you the best of both. So I think

strategically it works for Ford. I just wonder if the ename is something different than lightning

because to disassociate it for the people who maybe wouldn't give a range extender a chance,

but does that really matter because maybe they wouldn't even care about that if they don't care

I don't know. I think lightning has, I mean, yeah, they're killing it, but I think lightning has

reestablished itself as the electric truck name, right? Like I know people remember the performance

version from the 90s and early 2000s, but I think lightning now is the electrified F150. And so if you

stick a range extender in there, people will still be interested. And in fact, like you said, it's

probably knocked down a major barrier for them. I'm a little sad because I really like the F150

I think it is probably the best F150 for day to day use unless you were towing regularly.

And so this does make a lot of sense. Look, I don't think

range extenders aren't necessarily the better choice for other categories of vehicles,

but for a truck, yeah, if you're towing long distances or crossed states,

you don't want to have to stop and figure out a charger that you can actually pull into with

your trailer, filling up with gas is something that we all know how to do. I do see the benefit here.

And now it means Dodge will have, or sorry, Ram will have a competitor. The next question of

course is when is GM going to kill one of its 18,000 electric trucks? Yeah. And you have that

giant space under the hood to put the engines. So that's not a problem. And you don't need it to

connect to the wheels. So you don't have to worry about redoing that. You just need it to charge

the battery. So they could take the current lightning. The lightning was the first electric truck.

And I think the problem is everyone kind of saw it and they did want to exactly copy and

they deviated and kind of left it hung out to drag because you have the smaller,

more nimble longer driving, Rivian style. And then you had GM that was like, here's the world's

largest battery in a massive truck, but we don't have to worry about range and the towing

concerns much better and whatnot. So the fork is kind of off the middle. So I think

they've maybe looked around or they already had the idea like Ram. And I think the naming is

going to be important like lightning. Yes, you keep. But you don't call it like, I know we call it

the EREV, which is not the name. It's just extended range. But if you call like the the lightning

extended or the lightning max or the lightning range, like something that right in the name says

it doesn't have to worry, then when people talk about it, that name's always there. So are you saying

that Ram shouldn't be calling its range extender the exact name that it was going to call its EV?

Which it is doing. Yeah, the revs. Yeah, no, I, this is interesting. And you know what,

once they have that mid-size one on stream and they have this new range extender lightning,

Ford will have a very compelling electrified truck lineup. Yep, no, I fully agree.

Well, we'll have to wait and see what these next two products are like down the road and hopefully,

you know, I'm not hopefully, but you have no idea what's going to happen between now and then.

Manufacturers need to be changing their mind daily because the regulations are changing daily. So

we'll see what happens down the road. But for now, that's our show. We will be back next week with

a best of show. It's great to end the year. But until then, this has been the AutoGuy show and we'll

see you later. So long, everybody. EVA has reinvented car buying. From click to curb,

everything is covered. Ever try to buy your car online and end up in a parking lot with a stranger

on blind trust? That era is over. Now with secure purchase, EVA isn't just where you find your car,

it's where you buy it. Start to finish. Title, financing, registration, delivery, it's all built in.

This is the modern way to buy your next ride on EVA. EVA, things people love.

Secure purchase is powered by Carmel dealer services, LLC and EVA subsidiary.

Near Premium SUV Shootout, Ford Kills the F-150 Lightning, More NISMO Models on the Way

About this episode

Buick

Toyota

Hyundai

Mazda

rear drive bias system

Kia CX70

Kia CX90

Nissan Murano

Kia Santa Fe

Subaru Outback

Subaru Forester

Ford Maverick

hybrid all-wheel drive

all-wheel drive system

towing assist

360 camera

adaptive cruise control

XLT trim

BMW X5

12-volt outlet

driving theater

EVs

Volkswagen

camper version

ambient lights

two-tone patterns

Nissan Nismo models

charger

Ram

EVA

Request an Explanation

Want to learn more?

Help improve this episode

More from The AutoGuide Show