They’re the sponsor here, and the name suggests they make or support gearbox/transmission parts. It’s worth checking them out because sponsors like this usually have something performance-related to offer.
Road America is a well-known road course in the U.S., and it’s used here as the setting for discovering Pancho Weaver. For listeners, it helps to know that this is the kind of venue where serious racing cars and fabrication work show up.
Dan Gurney is named alongside other legendary drivers, reinforcing that Weaver’s father was connected to top-tier racing figures. This helps listeners place the story in a historical motorsports network rather than a casual local scene.
Carol Shelby was a legendary figure in American racing and performance cars. Mentioning him suggests Weaver’s dad was connected to influential people who shaped how race cars are built.
They’re referring to the Trans Am racing class. It’s a set of rules for what kinds of cars can race and what safety equipment they must have, but it still leaves room for teams to build and improve their cars.
They’re talking about whether racing rules allow teams to experiment. The point is: some series are very strict, but this one is described as more open to new ideas.
Even when racing allows creativity, there are rules meant to keep people safe. Those rules usually cover how the car is built and what safety gear it must have.
They mean a racing series where everyone builds the same kind of car. Here, they’re saying Trans Am isn’t like that—it lets teams try different approaches.
They’re saying racing gets better as technology improves. Better brakes, engines, tires, and aerodynamics all help the car go faster and handle better.
A three-wheeler is a vehicle that has three wheels instead of four. Because it has fewer wheels, it can handle and feel different than a normal car. The podcast is likely setting up a deeper explanation of how it works or why it’s notable.
Concept
Road race, GT1 type class car
“GT1 type” is shorthand for a high-performance grand touring-style race category. In practice, it usually implies a focus on aerodynamic efficiency, cooling capacity, and chassis setup to handle sustained cornering speeds—more like endurance/GT racing than short sprint touring-car racing.
A chassis program is the development effort focused on the race car’s structure and dynamics—things like frame design, suspension geometry, stiffness, and how the car transfers loads. In racing, the chassis is often the foundation that determines how well the engine and aero can actually perform on track.
“Generation three” indicates an iterative design evolution—major updates to the race car’s architecture and/or systems compared with earlier versions. Calling it a “Weaver” generation suggests the guest’s own development lineage and a structured approach to improving performance and integration over time.
He’s talking about building a race car for less money than other teams. In racing, spending less can mean smarter design choices so you still get good performance.
Term
sound of the engine
He’s emphasizing that the car should sound impressive. In racing, exhaust and engine tuning can change the noise you hear.
A header is part of the exhaust that collects gases from the engine and routes them into the rest of the exhaust. A “180 degree” setup means the pipes are shaped to turn gases in a specific way, which can change both performance and the sound you hear.
Race parts aren’t just designed on paper—they have to physically fit in the car. “Tight constraints” means there’s very little room or flexibility, so building the part takes more work.
A paint scheme is the specific color layout and graphics pattern used on a race car. In motorsports, it’s part of branding and fan recognition, and it can become “iconic” when repeated across seasons.
A test day is when a race team goes out to try the car and learn what works. They drive it hard to find problems and improve the car before real races.
Instead of building the frame from square tubes, they used round tubes. Round tubes usually handle twisting forces better, which helps the car stay more stable under load.
A miter joint is a connection where two pieces are cut at angles (like a corner) so they meet at a specific angle before welding. In square-tube frames, frequent angle changes can require more miter joints, which can add weld complexity and potential weak points.
A butt weld is when two metal pieces are joined directly end-to-end. More joints can mean more welding work and more places where strength depends on the weld quality.
Torsional stiffness is how resistant a chassis is to twisting forces. Higher torsional stiffness generally improves handling consistency because suspension and alignment geometry stay more stable when the car loads up over bumps and during cornering.
A coil-over is basically a spring and a shock absorber working together. The spring supports the car, and the shock controls how fast the car moves up and down so it stays planted in turns.
“Sprung” just means the car’s suspension is doing the work of supporting the car. Instead of the tires taking everything, the springs and shocks share the load, especially when you corner.
Recoil is the car’s bounce-back after it squats or compresses in a turn. If it bounces back too slowly or too much, you have to wait before you can put power down confidently.
“Wrap up” is how much the frame flexes when you load it in a corner. If the chassis flexes less, the car usually feels more controlled and you can get on the gas sooner.
When you turn hard, the car’s frame can twist like a wrench. If it twists too much, the wheels don’t stay in the best position, and the car feels less stable.
G load is just how hard the car is being pushed in a direction—like how strong the forces feel when you corner. More cornering G means the suspension and tires are working harder.
Concept
first set / second set (suspension settling)
The “first set” is the car’s initial bounce/settling when you load it in the turn. The “second set” is what happens after it finishes that movement—when the car is ready to hook up and accelerate.
This is about the shape of the metal tubes in the car’s frame or cage. Different shapes can make the structure stiffer in different ways, which can help the car stay more stable in corners.
They’re talking about the Chevrolet Corvette. It’s a sports car that many people buy because it’s built for performance and there are lots of parts and upgrades available.
They’re also talking about the Chevrolet Camaro. It’s a performance car with a big enthusiast following, so it’s common to hear it mentioned alongside other racing-oriented cars.
Mechanical grip is how well the tires can “grab” the road because of the car’s suspension and how it loads the tires. It’s the kind of grip you feel when the car sticks through turns even without downforce.
The steering rack is the mechanism that turns your steering wheel into the wheels turning left or right. Where it sits in the car matters because it can affect how the car behaves over bumps.
Uprights are parts near the wheel that help connect the suspension to the wheel. Their position affects how the wheel moves and how the steering feels.
Bump steer is when hitting bumps makes the steering wheel turn by itself. Good suspension design keeps that from happening so the car stays predictable.
“Knife edge” is a driving/handling concept describing a car balanced right at the limit of grip. When a car is on the knife edge, small inputs or disturbances can cause it to lose the line, so the driver and chassis must manage stability precisely.
A sequential transmission means you shift up or down in order, like a step-by-step gearbox. Race cars like it because it can make shifting quicker and more consistent when you’re driving hard.
“FD” is Formula Drift, a major drifting competition. Saying the “FD field” uses a certain gearbox is basically saying it’s common among drivers who really beat on their cars.
CAD is a computer program for designing parts. Instead of guessing, you can test fitment virtually to make sure things clear and don’t hit when the car moves.
Your car’s center of gravity is basically where the weight “balances.” If you lower it, the car tends to feel more stable and less likely to tip around in corners.
They’re talking about how wide the tires are. Wider tires usually grip the road better, but the car still has to be set up correctly so it doesn’t spin or slide.
A race car can have so much power and grip that it feels hard to control. The goal is to drive smoothly so the tires keep traction and the car doesn’t get loose or slow you down.
They’re saying this series is like a training ground. Drivers learn how to handle the car better, and teams learn how to set the car up so it performs more consistently.
They’re talking about the engine rules for NASCAR. This class allows older NASCAR-style engines, which affects how the car makes power and how teams tune it.
In NASCAR, the “Cup” level is the top, most competitive series. The speaker is saying the engine tech they’re using traces back to that top-level Dodge racing program.
R6 is a newer allowed version of the race engine. When rules let you use a newer version, it can change how the car performs and how teams set up the rest of the program.
Term
R5
“R5” refers to a specific iteration of a NASCAR engine design used under the rules at the time. The speaker contrasts it with “R6,” implying a newer/allowed configuration within their Dodge NASCAR program.
Sebring refers to the Sebring International Raceway in Florida, a famous endurance/road-racing venue. The speaker uses it as a reference point for a driver’s performance, indicating the driver has succeeded in high-profile road-course competition.
“Points” are the season-long scoring totals that determine standings in NASCAR. The speaker is using the driver’s points position (third or possibly fourth) to gauge how competitive the program is.
“Atlanta race” refers to a NASCAR event at Atlanta Motor Speedway, used here as a benchmark for the driver’s points position. Points standings after specific races are a common way teams measure progress.
A driver development program is like a training pipeline for racing talent. Instead of just putting someone in a car, you coach them and give them chances to improve step by step.
A road course is a type of race track with lots of corners, not just left turns on an oval. It usually demands different driving skills, so coaches focus on that style.
“Saving tires” means managing tire wear so the car remains fast later in the race. The speaker credits Boris’s methodical approach—preserving tire grip early to have performance at the end—leading to frequent podiums.
Trans-Am is a road-racing series where cars compete under a specific rule set and class structure. The speaker discusses rebuilding the class and growing participation toward a target “car field” size, highlighting how entry counts affect the health of the series.
Topic
Emsa GT type racing
This is about a different kind of racing where “GT” cars compete. The speaker is saying some drivers are coming from that background into Trans-Am.
They’re saying they make their own racing parts instead of buying ready-made ones. That can save money and also let them tailor the car to how they race.
The Baja 1000 is one of the most famous off-road desert races in North America, known for long-distance endurance and rough terrain. Mentioning it (along with other Baja events) frames the speaker’s background as endurance-focused off-road racing rather than circuit-only competition.
They’re talking about a workshop space on the property. For car people, a shop is where you can work on vehicles, store tools, and do projects.
Concept
Barnum Minions
It sounds like a local group or shop nickname. The point is that in racing communities, there are often dedicated crews that help people build and maintain cars.
The guest lists a wide range of racing categories (open-wheel, dirt, and drag) to illustrate how broad the Parnelli operation was. For listeners, it highlights how skills and engineering approaches can transfer across very different types of racing.
Car
trophy trucks
Trophy trucks are race trucks built for desert off-road events. They’re made to survive big bumps and jumps while staying fast.
In off-road desert racing, a co-pilot (or navigator) helps manage pace, route information, and strategy—especially in events where navigation and timing matter as much as driving skill. The role can be critical for avoiding wrong turns and maintaining consistent performance over long distances.
Concept
single-seater
A single-seater is a race car made for just one driver. Building one yourself is a common way racers learn how cars are built and how to make them work.
The Mickey Thompson Stadium series refers to off-road racing events held in stadium-style venues, bringing desert-style vehicles to a more spectator-friendly format. These series helped popularize off-road racing by making it easier to watch and follow.
Topic
1977 Off-Road World Championship Grand Prix
This is a specific off-road race from 1977. The host is basically saying you can look up the footage to see what racing was like back then.
Term
fabrication process
They’re talking about fabrication—how parts get built and put together. The key idea is there isn’t only one “right” way, as long as it works well and looks decent.
No lift shift means you don’t back off the gas when you shift. The car keeps making power through the gear change, so it accelerates harder.
Company
Enthmodo
Enthmodo is mentioned as the group that does the transmission work behind the “6XD” experience. They’re basically associated with the racing tech that lets you shift without lifting off the gas.
A reverse lockout is a safety/control feature that stops you from accidentally putting the car into reverse. It helps protect the transmission from being shifted into the wrong gear at the wrong time.
This is a racing-style 4-speed transmission NASCAR used for a while. It’s chosen because it’s cheaper and fits the race car’s layout, not because it’s meant for everyday driving.
A dog-ring transmission is a race gearbox that shifts gears with metal “clutches” that lock into place quickly. It doesn’t use the smooth synchronizers you’d find in most street cars.
“Gen 7” refers to NASCAR’s next-generation vehicle/competition rules package that changed how cars are built and what components are used. When he says the dog-ring four-speed was used before Gen 7, he’s pointing to a rules-driven shift in transmission technology.
Instead of mounting the transmission the usual way, he rotated it so it fits better in the car. That can help with space and handling, but you have to redesign the oiling and shifting so it still works reliably.
If you rotate a transmission, the oil doesn’t naturally sit where it used to. The oil system has to be redesigned so the gears and bearings still get enough lubrication.
This is a measurement reference point on the engine. He’s using it to explain how close the bottom of the car is to the ground so the car can be low without scraping.
With only four gears, the engine may not stay in the best RPM range as often. Adding a fifth gear can help the car accelerate and maintain speed more effectively.
Sequential transmissions let the driver shift through gears in order (typically one gear at a time) rather than using an H-pattern. In racing, sequentials are valued for fast, consistent shifts under load.
LIVE
This episode is brought to you by 6XD Gearbox. More on them later.
Hello, ladies and gentlemen, welcome back to the Minoxide podcast. I'm your host,
Harris AK Minoxide, man of many automotive aspirations. And I'm back here in North Carolina
with Pancho Weaver. I want to give the audience kind of a little bit of a backdrop of where I
discovered, I guess, you in the first place. I was at Road America about a year, year and a half ago.
And I was like, man, that is a crazy looking challenger over there. And then I was like,
that challenger sounds pretty crazy. And then I looked you up and then, lo and behold, I actually
got the introduction to you from our friends at 6XD. Right. And now here we are. So real quick,
just kind of give us an understanding of how do we get here today? Where did your career begin?
How did you get into racing cars? And that goes, that's a big story. And you got all day, I guess,
but it started back in Southern California, back in Orange County area.
And my dad was an old midget racer from the 40s and 50s and 60s. And I just kind of grew up around
it, you know, and he... Let's pause you for a second. I'm really sorry. Let's take this first.
Okay. It was sinking.
I know. I forgot to freaking tighten the thing. It's like rookie mistake.
All right. It's all right. Anyhow, he was in the age group of like Parnelli Jones and Dan Gurney
and, you know, Carol Shelby and some of those guys. And they were all from that same area. So
they were Southern California racers and they bonded pretty well together. And so I got to grow
up around these guys and didn't really realize where I was at that point in my life. And until
I got older and who I was hanging out with when I was, you know, seven, eight, nine, 10 years old
and just being a pain, basically a pain in the ass hanging around, getting in the way and whatnot.
But it turned into a great career just by hanging around it through osmosis. I got to learn a lot
of things from lots of different, really neat mentors and fabricators and, you know, racers
and anything that had to do with racing. I was all about it. Was it all appealing to you? Like
seven, eight years old, right? Was the fabricating? Was the putting stuff together? What did
anything appeal to you in particular? Just all of it? Well, I mean, I really enjoyed the
watching the cars, of course, you know, going to the track with my dad and that we had local
tracks and some that were a little further away, but, you know, usually pretty close. And they
raced, you know, even before I was born, they were racing three, four nights a week, you know,
but I mean, when I was around, it was probably once, once a week or something like that was
probably more, more like it. But, you know, and when you're that age, you're building like model
cars, you know, you're going to Revell and you got a plastic model and you're putting it together
and you customize it and you paint it the way you want and you're dreaming, right? It starts your
dreaming process. And, and I, and I always kind of gravitated to TransM as a young kid, because
it started in 1966, you know, and I, at that time, I was about 10 years old or so. And so
I just love that. Plus, Parnelli was one of the drivers and he was my dad's friend. So I used to
kind of watch that, you know, and, and so all those heroes of yesterday and, and as it goes forward,
I just kind of stuck with it. Here we are, you know, many years later, this is, you know, 1966,
and here we are 2026. So a lot of times gone by and cars have progressed and, and, and they have
materialized with technology and whatnot. And I love this class because it's, it innovates,
innovation is welcome in this class. I mean, you have to make certain safety standards and rules
like the TransM class. The TransM class. Yeah. When you say innovation is allowed and expected,
what does that look like? Because like some of these other series, you get so strict to where
it's like, it's difficult. Yeah. What does innovation look like here? Well, it's the only class
other than off road that I know of that isn't a cookie cutter kind of class. It's, it lets your,
it lets your dreams, you know, materialize. It lets your thought process gel, you know. And,
and technology helps drive all that because things change as, as brakes get better, engines
get better, tire grip gets better, aerodynamics and whatnot. But so it's a growing class in,
in challenge as well as just performance for people behind the scenes, cars, drivers and mechanics.
Let's start with this guy. I, first of all, this three wheeler. We need to talk about that at some
point. Three wheel drive is the craziest thing I've heard in my life. There's another dream right there.
We have to come back to that. Yeah. I want to talk about the, the challenger behind you. So
you talked a little bit with my brother off camera here, but uh, that's your brother. Yeah.
Goodness gracious.
Gotcha.
Engine wise, right? Yes. There was a video that I posted when I was at Road America. I think it
did something over a million views. I didn't look one and a half million views because people are
like, what's the sound? Like, nobody could figure out what the engine was. What is the
engine here? Well, I'll take you back just a little bit further than this. And I, you know,
there was a long, a long path of starting Trans-Am and back in like early 80s, about 1980 or so.
I've currently built 50 Trans-Am cars, uh, road race, you know, GT1 type, that class car.
Like the over your career? Yeah. Over my career in Trans-Am. In, in cup, we built 83 cup cars
because I went to work for Dale Earnhardt and I started the chassis program
and it just, it flourished into some other things. Well, that whole, that whole process
ended in 2008 when the company more or less imploded and, uh, everybody was displaced. And
so here I'm sitting on the couch going, Oh, well, what do you want to do? You know,
what are you going to do when you grow up? And, uh, and this is about 2008, you know,
the end of 2008. And so, uh, I decided I'd like to get back into Trans-Am. I'd like to come up
with something different, something new, innovations. Welcome. What aren't they doing?
What would you like to do and made a big list? And, uh, so that's what this car actually is.
And, uh, this is the fourth car of this new design, which I call the generation three weaver.
And I wanted to be in their face. I wanted to be in their face with performance.
I wanted to be in their face to build a vehicle that cost about $100,000 less than the competitors.
And I wanted to be in their face with the sound of the engine and the color of the car.
I mean, the whole thing was to be, to be noticed, right? And so that sound that you projected,
or that it projects, uh, that you really, you noticed and realized that, uh, a different sound,
it's a 180 degree header system. It's pretty difficult to build because of tight constraints
and whatnot. But I'm glad I did it because it, once we heard it, it was just like, wow,
that is a completely different sound. And, uh, you know, when this car is coming,
you don't even have to be watching it. You just know that car just went by out here to turn
13, 14, whatever, like, exactly. I would know exactly which car was coming. I'll get the camera
ready every single time. You know, I finally got that one clip. Uh, so we just finished up
year five starting year six with this car and this paint scheme and this pro this team in this
program. And, uh, so it's kind of becoming an iconic, uh, people relate to it now. And I'd
kind of like to keep it going that way. Is this painter? This is a wrap. This is a wrap. Okay. I
was about to say, yeah. Uh, which by the way, though, you know, on the color scheme, like it's
just bright in your face, like you said. Bright Menard yellow. And there's a story behind that,
too. Um, my dad was painting the, um, Parnelly Jones turbine cars and they were fluorescent,
kind of a red, uh, orange, you know, fluorescent red, orange STP stuff. And, uh, so he's down to
paint shop buying materials to paint these cars and he notices this yellow, this fluorescent
yellow and he goes, Oh, that look great on my midget. And so he painted his midget. I have it
upstairs. It's a 1946 Curtis midget. Uh, it's getting ready to go into risk restoration process
as well. Like everything else seems like, but, um, that's that color was bright. And so this car is
named after my father. His nickname was speedy. And so that's the name of this car. And then the
color scheme and I actually called Paul Menard and I said, Hey, I want to use your family color on
my, you know, my, my, my trans amp ride. And by the way, why don't you come drive my trans amp
car? And he goes, Oh, that'd be awesome. So, and he, he did, he showed up, he was one of the,
he was the first driver to drive this car when it was new along with Boris said, we did a test day
out in Virginia and the two of them, you know, thrashed this thing pretty, pretty roughly, uh,
for the first day and we learned, we learned, you know, we developed it basically at that particular
time. So what kind of, what are some things that defined this car? Right? Like what are some,
I guess, rules, regulations, or kind of take me through the build, I suppose.
This car is quite a, like I said, I wanted to build something quite a bit different.
So nobody was building all round tube construction, which the whole chassis being
round instead of square. There's some examples, we can do this in the video a little bit later,
but the square chassis is, is very, was very popular. It's easy to build on a flat surface.
But every time you have an angle change, there's a miter joint and a weld, a butt weld basically.
With the round, you can actually in this car is done in CAD. We did everything on a computer with
my, my engineer out in California, Chris Willis, my engineer of choice. He knows that and I say it
every time I, I get asked it, but he's very accomplished engineer and he's done a couple
trans-M cars for me. He's done GTP, off-road, lots of different things. But anyhow, I said,
I want to build a car that's a little bit different and I want to build an all-round tube car. So
through CAD, you can CNC bend the frame where there's multiple angle changes. Like a floor on,
the floor tubes on this car, the outer floor tubes, I think they have five or six different bends
in there where that would normally be a cut, a miter, and a butt weld on a square tube. So
it's a lot stronger because you don't have these welds. You don't have these intersections.
And it's a lot stronger torsionally because round is very resistant to torsion, where square is
just basically being held back by the four points of the, of the square tube. So that's why sway
bars are round. They're not square. Oh, yeah. It's just that torsionally, it's so much more sound
because it's backing itself up as it, you know, as it's being twisted. So, and at the same time,
you're losing the corner of the square. You don't have that material. So ultimately, it's lighter.
Our chassis, the first chassis was 100 pounds lighter than our previous square tube design.
And it was over double the torsional stiffness in a torsion, in a torsion test. So we went from
16,000 pounds per degree, we would twist it one degree through the shock towers.
And it would took 16,000 pounds to get to one degree. And the new car took 36,000 pounds to get
to that same. I'm not exactly sure. So when you say 16,000 and 36,000 pounds. Yeah. It's how much
force. So basically, these cars are sprung through shock, a coil over shocks. So all the load of the
corner is going through those shock points, the upper shock points. So the car is wanting to resist
through suspension and through springs. But yet the chassis is wanting to coil and wrap up. Like
any anything coils and wraps up, right? So the reduction of coil or wrap up has the reverse
effect of that is to recoil. So like when you push a car down with the spring, it wants to shoot
back up because of the spring. Well, there's a shock there to control that, to control this reaction.
Well, on a chassis twisting, you don't have shocks to control the reaction of the twist. So
less twist, less recoil. Okay. So when I, when these cars, when this car goes into a corner,
it's rolling up into the corner, it's absorbing the inertia and the G load and the cars wanting to
roll and it has resistance through that. And so if it, if it doesn't wrap up so much, it,
it doesn't recoil so much. So this car will take a set, a lot of cars take a first set and you have
to wait for that first set to react to the recoil. And then the second set, you can really get with
the throttle and come off the corner hard. This car takes a set immediately the first time. There's
more speed coming out of the corner, which is a lot more speed at the end of the straightaway.
So it just reacts to lap time basically. Okay. It was really, it was a total science project. It
was really, it's very basic though. I mean, you know, round tube versus square tube, that's,
that's, that's not that difficult, you know, to comprehend. But in physics, it's, it's way
different, way different. So is this some knowledge that you picked up over the years,
or is this something that you were taught like during that project or combination?
No, this is just common sense, you know, just thinking out of the box a little bit. What's
everybody else, why am I going to do, I don't want to do what everybody else is doing. And
that, there's another reason why it's a dodge. Nobody was doing a dodge. The only guy that's
doing dodges, we built five dodges now. And we just can't, we can't seem to get any help from
that department, but you would think we would be able to, but I don't know, people, I just aren't
buying challenges anymore. They're just buying Corvettes and Camaros. So yeah, they just announced
the Camaros coming back too. Yeah. How about for a third time? I mean, all manufacturers are selling
sports vehicles and trucks. Let's get with it. You know, they're not, they're not selling luxury
cars that much anymore, you know, and even with oil prices and stuff, people love their cars,
you know? So give a big shout out there for the dodge challengers, you guys, come on.
Yeah, hopefully we see something in that department, but that's a whole, again,
that's a whole other deal. These cars don't run, you know, on jelly beans. They run on
thousands of dollar bills, thousands of them. So, okay, so that's criteria number one. Go
the tubes instead of squares. Yep. So what's next? The next was geometry. I wanted more
mechanical grip through mechanics, through engineering. And my engineer said, you know,
that'd be great. And I can do that through suspension, but you're not going to be able to
steer the car. And I go, well, what do you mean? You know, why can't I steer the car?
And I said, well, the suspension has to, it dictates where the steering rack is basically
going to be living in elevation in the car. And the motor happens to be in the way, you know.
Currently, in these earlier years, we had the steering rack underneath the front drives of
the oil pump, the water pump, this power steering pump, you know, the crank, the crank drives that
come off the front of the motor, the steering rack would nest underneath all of that. And then it
would go to, you know, to the uprights and that kind of thing. So, and you don't want a lot,
you don't want any bump steer, if any, you know, it's got to be minimal. So that's that chatter
that you see in a driver's cockpit when you're, he's being filmed and you see that wheel just
chattering and he's fighting that wheel and fighting that wheel. It's a lot of bump steering.
And it's also, you know, saving the car, they're holding the car on a knife edge, you know,
from losing the car off the racetrack to keeping it on the racetrack. So it's also, you know,
there's a lot of wheel input to keep that balance. But there's also a lot of wheel input, just
that's not being driven by your effort, but it's being driven by the car, bumping it back
out of your hand, you know, basically. So long story short, the steering rack was going to be
in the way of the engine or the engine in the way, I said, well, you worry about this, you know,
the, the bump steer or not the bumpster, but the overall grip, let's see if we can get that.
And then I'll work on the steering part, maybe we'll come up some other ideas.
When you get to a certain level in a build, whether it be drag racing or drifting,
road course, or just the badass streetcar, you'll have to upgrade your transmission.
And when we're talking sequential transmissions, there's no one on the planet would have stronger
gearbox than 6XD. And the proof is in the pudding here, folks, half the FD field is rocking a 6XD
and even 3000 horsepower vipers have not been able to tame the best that 6XD has to offer.
So if you're ready to take it up a notch, go to 6XDgearbox.com and when contacting them to
place an order, use code Minoxide 5 or reach out via socials to figure out how one of the
baddest transmissions on the planet could fit in your build. Let's get back to the show.
So he did, he goes, he called me back, I got it, I got the, I got the mechanical grip. So
I worked on a steering and when we got together, we collaborated and we came up with this
rocker design and I'll show it to you later on on the video. It's kind of a, it's kind of simple,
but complex at the same time. And it's got very close tolerances to hitting other things.
But through CAD, we could see where those closenesses were and we could project it,
we could cycle it and we could make sure that it wasn't hitting and you know, everything was fine,
everything lives good. And we've had great luck with it. It's just like no bum steer,
we got the mechanical grip, we got the round tube construction, we got the sound through this,
through the engine, you know, through this headers. And then overall, we just work really hard on
trying to keep the center of gravity down low. Every part and piece you make, you're thinking
about weight to try to keep your overall weight down. Then you can add weight, you know, with,
you know, ballast and you can put it where you want it. These cars tend to get a little,
it's a lightweight class to begin with pretty much for a completed V8 car, a driver and everything,
you're looking in the, just a little over 2,700 pounds, everything included, you know,
versus what's NASCAR, 3,400 pounds or something like that.
That ain't my word.
But anyhow, yeah, it's not your world, mine either, mine ain't long actually.
But still, you know, you're talking 700, 800 pounds lighter.
Yeah, with more motor, more aero, more rubber, we've got 14 inches of rear rubber,
13 inches of front rubber, we're two inches off the ground, roughly 900 horsepower,
600 foot pounds of torque, a little bit over 600 foot pounds. It's just, it's like a monster. So
the trick is to tame the monster, you know, keep the monster on the track, keep your lap times down,
keep it clean. And usually when you're smooth, you're fast, even though it doesn't feel fast to
the driver usually. But so that's what it's all about. And we've been working trying to get
some of these younger drivers to come up to the ranks that want to go to NASCAR. And so this is
a good test bed. This is a proven grounds. This is a driver coaching area and a car coaching area
where you can feel that power. This car makes more power, more grip than any NASCAR program right
now. It's faster than a cup car. It's faster than an Xfinity, faster than a truck. I mean,
you're three categories there. This car at Daytona does 206 at the start and finish line,
going into turn one on the road course. It's just fast.
So do you have a Road America time just so I can have my own reference?
Road America time. I think we're about 185, 187, something like that.
Okay. I think it's about where we're at at this end of the straightaways.
Oh, no, I mean, lap time. Oh, lap time. Yeah, sorry. Oh, gosh. That's a long track. Nathan.
203. Holy. Yeah. 203. Yeah. Okay. And then you said this is a NASCAR engine then?
Yeah. This class lets you use previous NASCAR engines, not the current one that they're running,
the current Red Air Shin, or their current design, I should, my words can't come out of my mouth,
but it's before noon, so it's okay. Yeah, with the current, they won't let us run the very
current current stuff, but they usually let us run like the last design, basically. So these
engines are from Penske when they ran the Dodge program in their cup cars with Rusty and Jeremy
Mayfield. So there was a room full of these engines that we've been buying over the years,
and they have R5, and then we were allowed to use the R6, so now we're into the R6 Dodge design.
And that was, I believe that that's the last Dodge NASCAR engines that were built at the time,
because they've been out of it for a while at NASCAR. Yeah, 2014, I think, was it? 2012,
something like that? Yeah, I think it was, yes, right in that vicinity. So they're great power
plants and reasonably priced. If there's anything reasonable priced in racing, but it works for
me, and nobody was in the Dodge category, so I decided, let's be a little different. I wanted
to make this a statement, and I think we've made a statement in a lot of different ways.
And in the performance, we've had some awesome drivers. Boris said was pretty much my main
driver for many years, and still is, a great friend. And Paul Menard, Adam Andretti,
all these guys, great talents, Casagrala, Brent Cruz, Thomas Iniziotta, and now we've got Kaley
Bryson, who's just a young lady, 25 years old, and she's just done an awesome job at Sebring.
We did a test. We did actually the race after that, a few weeks after that. And then we did
Atlanta race, and she's done quite well. I think she's third in points right now.
Oh, wow, okay.
Possibly fourth in points. So we'll see where that leads, but she wants to go to NASCAR. So this is,
we're trying to maybe work towards a driver development program. Boris is an awesome coach,
and has coached most all the NASCAR guys on road course, the road course talent.
And so he's behind, he's behind us with trying to help the newcomers come along as well as,
you know, and he wants to race as well. So obviously, and we love to race him because he's
just, he's really easy on equipment. And he's, he's very methodical about how he runs his race.
He saves his tires, he has something for the end. And that's how we've done really well and been
podium pretty much most every time out when we run with Boris or, you know, the upper class talent.
What does the rest of this class look like? Are people coming? Like,
how different do cars get?
They, I'd say they're pretty stable right now. But getting through the different,
like it's the, the, the Aero program took off here about three years ago, four years ago.
And it was a little this and a little that and try some of this and try some of that.
And the tech inspector Aaron Caldwell, he was, you know, he's real open to what we call innovation,
you know, and so he was trying to keep it where it wasn't getting too out of control.
But at the same time, we're getting something a little new for newcomers
that are looking to come from Emsa GT type racing, come into Trans-Am,
try to make their home with Trans-Am, try to build that class again and get up to the 35 car field
count, you know, entries. What is that now? We struggled to get 12.
And some tracks, you know, we get, you know, maybe 15 or 18, but it's still reduced, you know,
some tracks we get eight, you know, and it's just depends where it's at, you know,
about half, half of the, I'd more listen that I'd say probably a quarter of the guys are just
they're, they've got great businesses. It doesn't matter what it costs. They don't really have a
budget and they just, they have full-time teams. It's a very expensive sport to probably maintain
at that level. We try to approach it a different way because we don't have the finances that
those big teams have. So we, we try to race smart. We try to, we build our stuff. We don't buy it.
We sell it to other teams as well. So that's kind of how we make our money a little bit. But at the
same time, I, I'm a racer. I'm, I'm competitive. I used to drive and I'm still, I'm not done racing
yet as far as a car owner and, or as a builder, you know, basically. So we'll see where it goes, but
driving wise, what did your driving career look like?
I started in off-road. Stadium racing and off-road was my big deal. The Baja 1000,
the Baja 500, you know, the Mint 400, all the, all the big, big races out in the desert,
Southern California was the perfect place for that. So I was right in the middle of it.
How long were you in California for?
45 years from birth to 45 and then, and then moved here and, and been here for, I don't know,
25 years, 27 years, something like that now or not. It's been, it's a great move. We live here
on, on a huge lake. It's gotten about 500 coast miles, Lake Norman. It's just above Charlotte,
about 30, not quite 30 minutes maybe. That's a shabby of a drive up here.
So living on the lake is awesome because you just, the boat's in the backyard. You off,
off you go and relax at the end of the day if you want, you know, or you're having a bad afternoon,
or you want to go to lunch on the lake, you know, you, or you have a client, you know,
throw them in the boat, we take them to lunch and it's kind of cool. It's stiffer and, but it's,
it's, it's almost like, you know, being retired, but being able to, to live your dream at the same
time, you know, kind of thing. So it's, it's, it's been a blast. It's been a blast.
No, it's a good setup too. Just come on downstairs, coffee and hand sort of deal.
Yeah. Just get to rampaging or working or whatever you're doing that day.
Yep. 20, was it 25 years ago? We started looking for prop. We moved here, spent the first year
with my wife and I and the two little girls, Maddie and Kayla. And so we looked around for the
first year for property thinking we might build and then we thought, well, maybe we'll just buy a
house and add on to it. And, you know, we're, look, we've kind of really, we're wanting lake
property, you know, and of course it's, it's more expensive, obviously. But 25 years ago,
it was more achievable and we wound up finding this lot. This is about a two acre lot and,
and we've got boat, you know, the boats in the backyard and it's, it's a three story house. So
the first story is shop. Yeah. You know, I should have probably built two stories of shop and one
story house, but I had my, my construction was a little bit messed up at the time. So
let's us tell them. This is what we wound up with. Like every house out here has a shop. Yeah.
Like it's just, that's just the norm. Well, that's how we kind of judge houses is, you know,
how big is a shop? Yeah. You know, it's like, well, that's a nice house, you know, or a nice shop.
But yeah, we, it seems like everybody around here, I mean, you have a lot of crew chiefs,
a lot of drivers and a lot of mechanics. And so what do they aspire to do is they have hot rods,
you know, they have boats or the whatever. And so they need shops and it's pretty popular back
here. Barnum, Barnum Minions are very popular. Oh yeah. Yeah. Very popular. So you started off and
off-road then. Yep. Off-road. Well, I, out of high school, because my dad knew Parnelli and
Parnelli knew me and whatnot. And he, they needed a welder and I happened to be a really good heliard,
a TIG welder at the time. And so I went to work in his off-road department and built his off-road
cars or was what part of the team that built the off-road cars at 19 years old. So it was pretty,
pretty big deal for me. And at that time, Parnelli was, had probably a hundred employees.
They were Formula 1, Formula 5,000, Indy car, midgets, dirt champ cars, drag racing, funny car,
and top fuel. What else were they into? They were into everything. It was just like, wow,
I was just like a kid in a candy shop, you know? So all these guys were great helping me out and
teaching me and being mentors. This is how you do this. This is how you do that. And it was my
college education basically for what I'm doing today. And so also, I was very skinny at the time.
I've gotten a little heavier now, especially right at the middle. But I was about a hundred pounds
at the time. And so they had a class in a trophy trucks. Walker Evans was a driver for Parnelli
and the trophy truck, and they needed a co-pilot. So I'm way absolutely just about nothing. And
they put me in there. So we won the Baja 500 and the Baja 1000. It was real a lot of fun.
So and I was getting involved in off-road at the time with my own single-seater that I built.
Built my first car right out of high school at this period of time, about 18, 19 years old and
started racing that. And then with the experience with Parnelli. And then moving on to
with the Mickey Thompson Stadium series, he was doing like the Angel Stadium, Jack Murphy Stadium,
the LA Coliseum Riverside. They had a huge event out at Riverside International and a huge off-road
event there. So go to 1977 Off-Road World Championship Grand Prix and on YouTube and
you'll learn all about that error. But it was cool stuff, a lot of fun and learned a lot.
Okay, that's very different than working on cars like this then. Did you take anything away from
that though? Which you're able to attribute to these? Well, the fabrication process for sure.
Yeah. And getting a little more tricky with that and the outcome. A lot of people can,
you give 10 different guys the same job to do and you're going to come up with
probably seven different ways that it's being made. So there's no really right or wrong way
of doing things. It's just the technique that you used. And overall, the end of the day,
it has to be functional. It has to be aesthetically pleasing. It doesn't want to look like
nobody's, somebody built it that doesn't know what they're doing or whatever. So there's a lot
of things to fabrication. You can make it work. It doesn't have to be pretty or you can make it
work. It could be awesome and outperform and be pretty. So there's a lot of different things
with fabrication. And it's a challenge in itself and a competition amongst fabricators per se.
Like drivers want to be the fastest driver than the other driver or that car that
engineer outperforms another engineer. So it's driven in so many different engine power plants.
It's just driven so many different places. Transmission, 6XD. That's a great speed advantage
right there for crying out loud. Yeah, with no lift shift, you hold your foot down full throttle
and just pull a stick. No clutch, nothing. Just grab it and go. And it's amazing.
It was cool to witness that for the first time. So one of my friends,
it got sold since then and changed up. But my first time experiencing a 6XD was in a 2000
horsepower Viper. Oh yeah. And because Enthmodo does those and they run the 6XDs.
And it was just, it's such a crazy, crazy experience in those with no lift shift and
everything. Right. Right. Right. Yeah. So how did you get to know those guys, by the way?
They actually came to see me here in this little dungeon that we work out. Which is
a really cool dungeon actually. But they came to see me about a reverse lockout. And I was doing
an electronic reverse lockout at the time for a different transmission. And they wanted to know
a little bit about it. So we kind of hit it off Clay and Rick. And I was open with them and what
we were doing. And they were right here about a half hour away from my shop. So it kind of stayed
in touch a little bit over the years. And I was kind of stuck into the, I moved into the four-speed
NASCAR transmission because of its lack of huge expense. It's a dog ring transmission. It's what
NASCAR used before they went to this new Gen 7. And it's just a dog ring four-speed. In my car,
it was hanging out the bottom when I put it in a conventional transmission location,
standing straight up. So I went, man, that's what am I going to do about that? And then the light
went on and said, God said, turn it on its side, dummy. I said, what? It's turn it on its side,
rotate it 90 degrees. And I go, huh, I guess I could do that if I redo the oiling system
and the shifter. And so that's what I did. We rotated it 90 degrees. So normally you have the
stack on top of each other, the main shaft and the lay shaft. And what we did is we just laid it
over. So now we've reduced the weight center of gravity. We've got clearance for the bottom of
the car because we're five inches of clearance between the crank centerline and the bottom of
the car. Oh, wow. This is very, very short oil pens. And you really can't get any shorter than
that and still have an engine on that close to the pavement. So that transmission worked great
for us for a very long time, but it was four gears. And I was getting beat. Boris and I,
and a couple of others, Menard, we were getting beat without having that fifth gear.
And so the handwriting was on the wall. And 6XD, I started investigating,
we had several different sequentials to choose from. And from different price ranges and different
weights and different affordability, well, affordability price ranges and then dependability.
So the 6XD was real dependable from what I could find out. It was a little bit heavy,
but the weight's in the middle of the car. It's down low. And it's mounted the same way I was
doing the four speed. We took it from a straight up and down style to a layover style. I asked,
Rick, can you lay it over for me? And so I can fit in the car better. And they had already done it
in another car. He says, absolutely, we can do that. And they had all the bugs worked out of it
already. Because when you're a guinea pig, that's what you are. You're a guinea pig. You're
throwing money at something and an idea and you hope that it works. And sometimes it does.
Sometimes it doesn't. Usually it's a little refining that goes on through the process. And then
you achieve your goal anyhow at the end. So that's good stuff.
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Let's get back to the show. So to go back then, so how did that progression from
so then was Transam next after all the off roading or when did that come into play?
Well, off road was I did off road for, you know, professionally for I just want to be a race car
driver at that point. And I worked as a as a fabricator and builder to, you know, to support
myself basically in my dreams. But it was taken as tall physically on my on my neck and my back
actually crack my neck and crack my back. And it was just my frame is a large I'm not a large solid
guy. I'm kind of a kind of a weak suck actually, but why are you laughing? It's the fun way of
saying that. I'm saying you're thinking like I have I'm hurting as well. So yeah, so you got a
lot of pain and a lot of things going on. And the doctors are saying, you know, you do this
right again, you know, you might not have, you know, work the use of your whole body. So it's
like, huh. But Transam at the time I had moved in 1980. It was after Parnelli's off road deal.
I was still racing in stadium racing. And a guy I got a call from a guy down in a little bit
further south, and he had a Transam car, he needed some help. And it fit perfectly for my lack of
income at the time. So I said, well, what the heck, I'll try it. I don't know a lot about it,
but let's go see. And I kind of fell in love with it. And then I wound up buying my first house down
that way is about a 30 minute commute. So I don't like the commuting. So move that way. Got married
down there, you know, I had kids down there, that kind of thing. And but it transitioned to, you
know, Transam, Transam series racing, this guy that I was working for, Les Lindley, he decided he
wanted to, you know, kind of get more into it and do more races and do the full season. And so
one thing led to another. And I figured, Hey, maybe I could just, you know, build one of these cars.
And then I can go road racing instead of off road racing. And I'll be okay if I don't hit the wall,
you know, it's pretty smooth and, you know, not too rough on your body until you get into a bad
wreck. But off road, just normal, normal run run time, through the bumps and the whoops, you know,
it's just so abusive. It's amazing, abusive. Especially if you land hard. Yeah, gosh.
You're just like a rag doll in the thing, you know, so but what an experience.
Amazing. How fast you can go over nasty terrain. Yeah, I haven't had that experience yet.
It's crazy. Yeah, hopefully I'm still involved with trophy trucks. My buddies back in California.
Okay. They kind of run one of the trucks that's the top of the top of the program and they're
they're million dollar vehicles now. Yeah, it's crazy. Yep. And it's his name is Adam Householder.
He's about 40 some years old, 42 years old now. But his dad and I grew up together and we work
together in the Transam and off road and this and that. And he wound up making it in business with
overhead sprinkler systems and can support the off road program that they're running now. So
it's a lot. I get to I get to live both both worlds still. How do you help with that world?
Pardon? How are you involved with that world still? They're just so close to friendship,
you know, it's basically mostly friendship. I go and attend some of the races and we hang out
together and you know, cheer them on and but no, they run their own program. They're totally
they're totally self-sufficient. They're they're all professional and they full time.
I think they probably got six guys full time six or seven full time employees now. So it's
it's a big it's a big it's a big problem. It's a big problem. It's a big problem when you're
paying for it. That's probably what it's a big problem. But it's they do really, really well
and hats off to those guys. So have you attended like King of the Hammers and stuff? Oh yeah,
King of the Hammers. Yep, they ran that this year. They won. I don't know if you've heard of the Mint
400 in Las Vegas. It's it's a pretty popular race and he's won that now two times in a row
leading it this year and they had a drive shaft failure, I think. So they didn't win it this year
for the third time, but that would have been the first three Pete, I think they've ever had and
always something that stops that like first ever. Yep. Yep. True. So then did you end up building
your own Trans Am car at that point then? I did in California. We built what we call the the Gen
one weaver, which is a lot. It's really close to this other car that I'll show you in the video.
But then we came up with Chris Willis, my engineer. We we changed up some things and did a Gen two
in the mid 90s. Okay. And it had it was still a square tube construction, but it had it was a
lot stiffer just in the way we constructed the the tube package basically. And we worked on some
mechanical grip. There was some things were a little different, but it was kind of a
the next step of the Gen one was the next two. So the Gen two. So and then this one Gen three
became completely different like we just discussed. He said Gen two was in the 90s in the 90s.
Okay. So then what did that break look like between the two? What were you doing? I guess
that's when you had your NASCAR stint or let's see NASCAR, but I'm working with the team with
Earnhearts. Earnhearts didn't happen until I got back here in North Carolina. So so the Gen
the Gen two was still in California for probably five years before we left California. And so we
were building those and selling those to teams and supporting our our clientele and whatnot.
Okay. You know, we were selling the Gen twos to other we were selling Gen ones Gen twos to many
other teams at one time. Okay. When when TransM had like a 35 car field, we had about a third of
the field in waivers. So it was I mean, it was like go to every race, make a list of who needs
what after the race, go home, build all those parts that got wrecked and smashed and broken,
whatever. And then get to them and then get them shipped out so the teams had them.
Okay. So I understand now. Okay. It was my business grew in that period of time quite well.
I think at one point we had 10 employees, you know, not very big, not a lot of square footage,
not not in this shop, but in California. And then made the move to here and brought my TransM
company to this neighborhood and still continue building them. But at the same time was got
introduced to Earnhardt's group through a mutual friend. He was actually the contractor that built
DEI. DEI is like the garage Mahal. I don't know if you've ever seen it, but it's it was like the
top of the top. It was the shops of all shops. It was if it could be gold plated, it was it was
all gold plated, you know, it was like Taj Mahal. And what a great place to work. There's just an
amazing place. And it started out as I just was kind of, you know, working with them as subcontractor
and bringing like new ideas or just bringing ideas, different ideas from what they're used to doing.
So they were they were kind of welcoming to me a little standoffish in the beginning because
they didn't really know what this crazy Californians all about, you know, but I met Dale Earnhardt at
this particular time. I was probably in town here, probably a month or two, and got introduced to him.
So we were over in his shop that was putting on the bodywork, the body, the body department,
and they were running three, three teams at the time, Napa, Penzoil and Junior. So Budweiser,
Napa, and Michael Waldrop, and then they were running Steve Park in the number one Penzoil car.
So there was a lot going on at the time. And Earnhardt comes over to me and we're standing
there looking he's what do you think I go wow, this is quite a process, you know, this is this
is pretty interesting. And he says, So what's your claim to fame? And I go, Well, I don't really have
I'm pretty, pretty, you know, pretty easy going and and just methodical about the obvious things.
And he goes, Well, what do you mean about that? I go, Well, I got this question. He goes, What's
your question? And I said, Do you guys work off a center line in your cars? Like when you're
putting bodywork on, do you work like from center line out and put your bodies on or
the way you set your cars up? Up? Do you work off a center line to match your four, you know,
your four tires on the pavement? Well, how do you how do you actually make sure you're doing
things correctly? And he goes, That's a great question is let's go to engineering. So we
off we go over to engineering, go through some doors and around another another little
department building. And we walk in there and they had those half walls, kind of like those
little cubbies, right? And so Dale walks in and he goes, Hey, I got a question. And all these
little heads pop up like prairie dogs. And it was like, I just started laughing. I could not believe
it. And yes, it was what's what do you need, you know? And he says, Do we work off center line?
Well, of course we work off centerline boss, absolutely work off centerline. And he says,
Okay, well, this young man's got a question. And he and he said, What's your question? I go,
Well, okay, that was my first question. Do you work off? Now, can you show me where center
line's at? Well, let's go come on, we'll show you how we do it. So we go back to the body shop
with the engineers with with a engineer. And he says, Where's our, you know, I said, We're
centerline on the chassis. Can you show me where your marks are at on your chassis? So how do you
how do you do the process? So what we don't do it like that, I go, How you do it? Well, the tables
are blanchered ground, and they're, they're cut out on a big mill, big, thick inch and three
quarter flat steel plates, 12 feet long, about six feet wide. And they put the chassis up there,
and it has a groove centerline in the plate that's done with the machine. So it's absolutely
parallel, right? And so the car sits up there and they put the frames, the frame corners where
they want them in elevation. And now it comes down to the centerline question. I go, How do you
get it centered on your centerline that's in the table? But, but it's elevated off the table
about five inches, you know, it, it's mimicking ground clearance for the chassis. And he says,
Well, we measure this right side frame rail, this right side frame rail is a four inch by three inch
tube and it's an eighth wall and is the right side of the car. And that is the tube they call
zero. They call and they measure from the outside of that tube to the edge of the table.
That's per, that's parallel to the other edge and to centerline. So they're like, if it's 12
inches on 12 inches, they know that they got that tube equal to the table centerline, right? Is that
making any sense? Yeah, I'm tracking so far. Okay. So I go, Well, that's all great, but that tube's
not straight. He goes, What do you mean that and earn hurts? You know, senior, he says, What do you
mean that tube's not straight? It's four inches by three inches. It's thick wall. And I go, It's
not straight. He goes, How do you know you're just looking at it? How do you know that it's not
straight? I go, because I, because you welded on it, there's a, there's a truck cross member in the
middle of truck arm suspension point. This measure, it's welded right to left. And he goes, Yeah,
so I go, Well, you weld on it, it's going to arch the tube, you know, and he goes, Ah, there's no
way. That's that tube is solid. And so I said, Well, you got a six foot scale, I'll show you.
And we just stand here talking at this. So I mean, I haven't measured this car. I have no
idea. I mean, I'll probably look like an idiot now, you know, but so here comes a straight edge
and Dale's, he's right, he's looking right over my shoulder. And it goes clunk, clunk, clunk, clunk,
you know, on a high point where that weld was made, you know, and the tube was just arched.
There was no weld obstructing it. And it was welded on the other side of the tube, but it
through welding it just arched. And I knew this from just fabricating, right? Whenever you do
things like this, this is what happens. And his eyes got huge, you know, like, what the heck,
you know, what is this? And I said, So there's no way this is consistently center lined every time
you're trying to get centerline, you know, so I says you could have your, your, your chassis,
you think it's centered, and it's going forward, but it might have some yaw in it. And then you
put a body on that doesn't have any yaw in it. So now when you get down to the racetrack, you got
two things fighting the tires and wheels are going this way, bodies going that way, and they can't
get their mile per hour at Daytona, you know, they built five cars over the winter, three of them
were really fast, two of them were terrible, and they can't figure it out. And they were all built
the same boy, same process, same people. And this was the reason why they had inconsistency in
putting bodies on on skeleton chassis. So that was number one. And then number two was, you know,
the when they were doing setup, they were doing the same way they were, they were projecting a line.
And, and they were, they were squaring up their four tires off of this right side frame rail,
which really wasn't center, it wasn't equal to centerline. So that started a whole other process.
And he says, What do I do now? What do we do? And I said, Well, how many cars do you have
inventory? Like they said, Well, we got, you know, 6970 cars in inventory. I said, Well,
if you bring me each car to my shop, we'll put on a lift. Well, and I need a fair warm and an
engineer and we'll category each car how bad it is, or how good it is. And we'll put centerlines
in the chassis. And so anyhow, we did that. That's where it kind of all started.
Sort of that with Earnhardt. What did that categorization look like then? So you take it to
your shop? Yeah. So what were you, they were all bad. Okay. The best one was about a 16th
out from where they thought was zero. And the worst one was five eights out from where they
thought was zero. So it made a huge difference from there in the way that the bodies consistently
got put on the chassis. And then we came up with a string bar program that
put strings on the right side and the left side. And it's exactly centered. The string bars are
centered when you, when you place them on the chassis. And then you get a string on the outside
of your tires on the right, a string on the outside of your tires on your left. And you measure to
your wheels to the string to square everything up, just make sure the rear end is not off to one
side or not, making sure your rear end's not leading on one side or not. Or you can make it do
those things too. You can control through measurement what you're taking to the racetrack,
basically. And then, so is that how that relationship started then? Yeah, that's how that
kind of started. I mean, it had no intention of working for Dale Earnhardt. I never had a dream
about doing that, you know. But just came to town and got to meet him and through the contractor.
That was the only way that it really worked was for, I mean, I wasn't trying to sell myself,
going to the front door and they're going, no, we don't need you. We don't need any of that.
You're from California. So, but the way this worked was I knew somebody at a high level,
his contractor, who was his buddy at the same time. And so we had some one-on-one time that
made all the difference in the world. And he was really a cool, a cool individual. I really enjoyed
him. A little intimidating, as they say, you know, but underneath all that persona, he was
like a little kitty cat kind of guy. And once you got to know him, it was easy to talk to him and
we had some good stories there about that. But only got to know him for a little over a year
and then he passed away. So, and we talked about building our own chassis or having DEI's own
chassis. They were buying them from a manufacturer down in South Carolina, Ronnie Hopkins. And most
everybody was. Roger Penske was just starting a chassis program. And so was Hendrick, Rick
Hendrick's program. They were just starting to build their own product. But everybody else was
buying. And I said, Dale, you know, why would I want to do that? I go, why do you put your own
bodies on? Why do you build your own engines? Well, so we can try things and do things different.
There you go. Same thing. It's no different in the chassis world, you know, you could try
suspension things. You can try, you know, tube placement things because NASCAR wasn't as stern
and locked in as they are today. I mean, this is 25 years ago was a lot, a lot different rule
packages, you know, it was all steel sheet metal, you know, they put templates, everybody knows
the story, you know, all these templates that they had and whatnot, but today completely
different composite comes out of a mold, you bolt it on with this bolt and this whole
and just pretty much takes the thought process out of it. And I don't really enjoy it at all
anymore. Yeah, one of my friends used to work, I can't remember what role or whatever, but he was
at Hendrick. And he was saying that it all comes down to what's underneath the car nowadays. Is
that pretty much what the case is? The aerodynamic panels underneath the car. And the way they can
be shimmed a little bit of a nudge, but just a little forward, just push it a little for you,
perfect, right there. The way they can be shimmed to, you know, help you or hurt you.
The diffuser down there became really important, way more important than anybody kind of initially
thought. So and that's been something that's evolved into completely different
deal. I was involved in that process too. We built the first five prototypes for NASCAR.
Actually for Techniques, Ronnie Johncock has a company called Techniques and it was up in Michigan,
or it is, and he has these fabrication processes with lots of machinery, different computerized,
controlled robotic benders and tube cutters and, you know, fish mouthing and things like that.
And he came to me while I was at DEI and said, look, I'd like to introduce myself.
This is the kind of business that I have. It's up in Michigan and we laser cut chassis components
that you design yourself with your engineers and their proprietary to your design. And I send you
a kit and you put the kit together and weld it up in your fixtures. And I thought, man, that sounds
really repeatable and time, time saving, you know, it's hard to fit a tube. There again,
you can take 10 guys and ask them to do the same job. You're going to get it done different ways,
right? And or how long it takes to fit a tube, you know, in a junction or even a simple junction
versus a complicated junction. But with the lasers and the CAD files, it's pretty much spot on.
Once you get the process in, it's just repeat, repeat, repeat, repeat. So we wound up starting
the chassis shop in 0405. They started that new chassis, which was the COT,
what they called the car tomorrow. And so that's kind of where it all started. And we built,
I believe it was 83 cup cars, a couple of bush cars before the end of it and in the end of 08
when the company just ceased basically.
Because that's not the one that's undecided a car on the photo up there, is it?
No, that's this car right here.
Gotcha. I was just wondering if the sponsor or something was...
Oh yeah, technique. Yeah, that's him.
Oh, okay. Yeah, gotcha.
Yeah, because he kind of, whoops, we were good, we were good buddies and he'd also was a race car
driver prior to business, you know, to major business. And so he had a soft heart for racing
and he helped us out for probably three or four years, three years I think, something like that.
And it was, I'd try and talk him into driving the car because I think he'd be, he used to drive
midgets and Indy cars and I think he'd be perfect for this kind of a car here and have a lot of
fun doing it, you know? And maybe someday we'll see. This just came to mind here a little off
topic, but what are these tuned on? Is it like a standalone EC or what exactly is the tuning
situation with the Trans Am cars? Tuning the engine? Yeah. Well, I mean... Yeah, I should have been
specific. You know, tune a fish, you know, tune a piano, I don't know. It's left up to the
professionals. They don't let people like me touch that kind of stuff. No, I'm just kidding.
The engine builders play a big part of this process and that, with the Penske group,
they had their own engine shop when they had the Dodge sponsorship. They were doing their own
engines. They were building their own engines, developing and dynoing and tuning and a different
facility, not too far from here, but a different facility. So at the end of the, the end of the,
let's call it the 2012 season and they Dodge pulled out and they went to Ford's. Now they
lease all their Ford engines through Roush Yates. It's just a lease program and so they didn't need
an engine shop anymore. So the engine shop got displaced and the guys working in it got displaced
with the head engine guy over there was Scott Collier. Scott Collier still actually works at
Penske today. He's the only one I think that they kept on staff, but the other guys that were doing
the head work and the block work and the assembly, a lot of assembly and Scott was more involved in
running the program and probably tuning and these, I don't know his exact, what his daily
schedules was, but anyhow, these other guys were really proficient and good at what they did. So
they got together and they opened up their own engine shop to continue building engines for
hot rods, boats and race cars and things like that. So I purchased my, I figured what better
to have the guys that were working on this stuff have the same guys work on the same engines
and produce producing power for this Dodge and they do a wonderful job.
Chris Sumner kind of leads that program now. Kelly Thacker, he does like block work and hot dog
that's a head work. Danny Glad does a dyno work and they just together they know how to work together
and they know how to make power and how to make, you know, dependability, reliability and
it's very, it's very cost effective for my position, you know, it's not $38,000 for engines,
you know, it's more affordable and we can, we can make it work, you know, as a group and
they kind of race through us actually, you know, they're kind of grassroots racers, but you know,
as well. And so they, they enjoy being part of it, I think, and we enjoy having them be part of it
it's the fact that 80% of you guys are not subscribed and following the show. So go ahead,
hit subscribe or follow. And of course, if you're on YouTube, hit that bell so you are notified
when we drop a new episode. Let's get back to the show. What does a race weekend look like for
you? You travel across the country? Yep. What is it from the moment you leave the shop? What's
that weekend look like? It starts out with a lot of driving and but I kind of enjoy, you know,
the driving and seeing the country. It's, I mean, it's another part of the dream that you never
expected to see so many things across our great country. And we race a little bit in Canada as
well. But it's a lot of neat places to see and but usually because you're racing, you don't take
the time to go to the Grand Canyon because you're zooming by it, you know, to get to the West Coast
or back and forth. And there's a lot of things I wish I would have changed a little bit and added
more time to my schedule to see, you know, even more things. But the weekend, it's a traveling
for usually a day, you know, if it's the West Coast, it's going to be a few days, you know.
But like from here to Texas to Circuit of Americas, the Formula One track,
that's about a 20-hour drive. You know, you break it up a couple of days, you know, or day and a
half, something like that. But you get to the track and usually in the first few hours, you're
just setting up, going through registration, credentials and whatnot, get your rig parked,
get the car unloaded, get things, you know, kind of pit set up, whatnot. And usually there's not
any other activity that first day that we get there, get to the hotel, get some good rest, get
up the next day, usually starts early. And usually have two runs each day, like let's say you'll set
up on Thursday. Let's say you travel on Wednesday, you set up on Thursday, you have two runs on Friday,
two runs on Saturday, one of them being qualifying, and the race on Sunday. Okay.
So it kind of gives you a breakdown of the days and then another day to get back. So it's a full
wait pretty much. You're away from family and whatnot. So the runs, these are sessions, I'm
guessing like 20, 30 minute sessions? Yeah, yeah, they're about 30 minute sessions. And it gives you
a chance to get out there and feel the car and get, you know, work through your little issues
that you're probably going to have or not. And so this car actually is a very happy car to run.
It's been well sorted out. We've got a good relationship with each other. It lets me know
what's going on. And we let it know what's going on pretty much. So it's been a good program.
So data wise then. So you get to the track. Let's say you're going to Rotolana. I think that's
one on one. So what does that look like? Are you just fresh off the trailer, go do some runs,
come back, look at data or what does setup changes look like? The first run is just getting the
driver acclimated to the whole day and the car and the track and whatnot. Depends if you've
got a driver that seasoned or a newcomer, you know, there's a lot of different things there.
Somebody like Boris, he's got great feedback. He's driven the car. He's driven pretty much,
I think three of these new gen threes for me. And we just have so much fun racing together.
So but he's so seasoned, he can tell me exactly put a couple clicks in that shock over there,
or let's drop the ride height, you know, on the rear, you know, half a turn,
just little things like that. And he can balance it really quite quickly. And it doesn't take much
data. It's all pretty much old school. We can overlay and see what he's talking about. And
then it kind of makes sense. And what the, what the correction was and what the performance level
is now because of the correction. So data is important. And it's, and we do use it.
We probably should use it more. What are you guys overlaying with?
Well, we can overlay with because the car records, you know, from from video,
driver's hands and then out the windshield. And then it also records throttle position,
how much throttle is being used, how much steering is being inputted,
how much brake pressure is being applied, how much rear pressure, how much front pressure,
you know, there's a lot of little things like that, that you can see where the driver might
be complaining about this or that. And then you can overlay it. And you can see, yep, here it is.
It's in this corner, it's worse in this corner than, than those corners, you know, so you might work
on a corner and, and make it a little quicker. And it might take a little bit away from this
other corner, but it's not as important because you're carrying so much more corner speed or
something like that, you know, I mean, so you just kind of balance that balance all that out.
And usually get quicker.
No, it is cool to admire this in the background though, like, you know, again,
seeing it in person the first time was like, this thing is insane.
They're a lot of, they're more detailed than you think they are. And you got to think about every,
every little thing is, is amount is a weight is a placement. And you're trying to balance
the overall construction of the car weight for the driver, like Boris is a pretty, you know,
pretty, he's a heavy guy. No, he's like 200, 220, something like that. Right.
Yeah, but we, we, we jab him all the time, you know, because he loves the jalapeno pickles.
I could tell you a story about him at a supermarket in Indianapolis. It was hilarious.
But really just a lot of fun. And, and so that, that's the other side of the racing thing that
you just can't put a price tag on is the fun level that, you know, the people you're around and the,
and the, and the talent pool that you're around, because it takes a lot of talent to run a car like
this upfront, especially the finances where, with reduced finances, you know, you've got to be really
on your game to be upfront and come up with a little better package. What's the season cost
with this car? You're probably looking at about six to 700,000 on a, on a, on a week budget.
That's not a real substantial budget. You know, we do have spare engine, but
we don't have a spare gearbox. The gearbox is pretty dependable and awfully dependable and
hasn't, hasn't been a, hasn't been necessary. So we spend the money where it's, where it's
necessary to, to run up front and not, and to be able to finish, you know, you got to finish,
right? To be upfront. So you can't have weeks up parts. You got to have, you got to spend the
money where it's, where it's necessary, you know, or you're not going to, you're not going to have
the outcome. Okay. So how many tracks are on the calendar in a typical Trans Am season?
There's like 12, 11 or 12, if it varies back and forth. Some tracks will be like this next race
in Sonoma is a double header. So there's a race on Saturday and there's another race on Sunday.
And it's, it's, they did that because of the travel expense to the West coast
for the majority of the group. And, and trying to just, you know, reduces hotels.
You might have one more room of hotels instead of all these other travel expenses and whatnot. So
they're trying to consolidate a little bit. Okay. That makes sense. So then, okay,
six, 700,000 on a conservative budget. So you're looking at maybe 50, 60,000 a race on average.
Is that kind of how you think about it? You, you come up with a number per race.
That's in your local, your local mileage, what we would call, but like a West coast race, obviously,
a lot more fuel, a lot more travel time. Texas is the same things, a lot more fuel,
a lot more travel time. So, but for the most part, that's kind of how you have to break it down.
And then, you know, on that, you're kind of amortizing some expenses, like your engine expense,
because you don't use an engine for one race. You use it for multiple races, you know. So
we tag a number to it that helps rebuild the engine, helps put new valve springs on it,
but it's usually at its minimum, it's never at a maximum number where there's never anything left
over for someplace else, you know. It just seems like it's running tight. But that's,
that's how we have, if we're going to race, that's how we have to race until we, you know,
we get a major backer that can help us. And we've had some good, you know,
subsponsors that have really helped us over the years. We had one guy, John Cloud,
really neat guy, and enjoy racing with him, an older gentleman that was done well in business,
and he enjoys Boris, he enjoys myself, and he would help us occasionally, you know. And some
of there's companies like that and friendships that have really made it possible.
How often are you refreshing the engine? Is it every race after a race?
No, no, we, we'll go probably 600 miles, which is, it's roughly around a 200 mile weekend,
you know, roughly two to 50. Depending on how much practice time you get in, how much do you
run every lap of every, every practice, usually not, you know, so, so we go about six, six, about
800 miles, and then we'll refresh the valve springs, and look it over, check, check clearances and
whatnot, and then back on the dyno, and then it's good for roughly another, you know, 800 miles. So
it's 1600 to 1800 miles before a fresh rebuild, which is fairly affordable. But we've had some
catastrophic failures too, where we tried to get one more race out of that engine, and it just
wasn't going to do it. And we shot rods out the pan, you know, so that was a not a very good
economical move on my part. Is that you doing the refreshes or is there?
No, the engine builders. Engine builders. Okay. So yeah, it's, it's all a big team at the end.
It's all a big team, right? We take them out and they service the engine. Same with the gearbox,
Rick, Rick and, and actually Todd services the gearboxes for us and mag checks everything and
make sure that everything's looking good or, you know, they, they're experts at what they do,
right? So I don't need to get in the, I mean, I was learning the gearbox, you know, like I was
going to, and I've done most of my gearboxes in the past. And, and not that I won't, you know,
get to doing this one on my own, I probably will at some point in time. But right now, they,
let's not mess up something that's working right now, kind of a thing. If it ain't broke, don't fix
it. Right. And they're close by and they, they don't mind doing it. And, and we do, we do things,
whatever we can do to, you know, to expose the 6xD product and how, how happy we are with it.
Because how many years you've been running it now? This is just one year. Just one year. Yeah.
And what was a limited year of only four races, five races. So it's not a ton of time on it.
But I must say we haven't had one failure, knock on wood, haven't had one failure.
And the guys are, they become good buddies, you know, too. So, and, and, and because of this,
and how this all worked out, I'm involved in a land speed project, which is, we want to go 500
miles an hour with the wheel driven piston powered vehicle car. A lot of rockets have done it.
Some people have gotten close. Right now, I think the record is like 486
with the speed demon guys. 486. 486. I think it's very close to 500.
So nobody's broken the 500 barrier with the wheel. Nobody's broken the 500 barrier yet.
Okay. In a wheel driven piston powered car. Wow. They've done it with turbines. Yeah. They've done
it with jets. So it's a little bit different, you know, thrust versus, you know, traction,
you know. So this, this vehicle is, is 36 feet long. It's about three feet wide.
And most of it's two foot tall, except for the canopy for the head is three foot tall.
So it's more or less just a needle. It's a needle going through space at ground level.
Yeah. So, and it has two engines, two Viper V10s. Oh, really?
That are, those, those are, they're 2,500 horsepower a piece. So we're going to be roughly
five, you know, four, you know, roughly 5,000 horsepower for this vehicle.
Wow. Okay. It's got five miles to pull this off. Yeah.
You know, and then, and he has some shut down room after that. So we've, we just recently,
and this, this vehicle is owned by ex-top fuel driver, Doug Herbert. He was like, I think the
second guy to go 300 miles an hour in a top fuel car. So he's, he's used to speed and he's used
to records and he's, you know, and he wants to go 500 and he's like a little kid in a candy shop.
Are we ready yet? Are we going to go this year? You know, we've got to hurry, you know, and we
are, we, and it's, but this project's been going on for many years. And it's just a money soak,
you know, of course, it's hard to get backing on a dream to go this fast on a salt bed in
Bonneville, you know, Utah. So, but that's what dreams are made of, right? So you, you put it
out there and then you try, you strive and you, and you achieve. So, so we're going to achieve,
we're going to run out, it's going to get finished. And it's well, it's, it's becoming,
it's gotten a lot more traction here lately. And so we decided to go with the Rick Lambert
6XDs, two of them, one behind each engine, and we're going to shift them with air charges
with a button on the steering wheel. Okay. Yeah. So that's one thing that always kind of boggles
my mind is when things have two transmissions. Yeah. How we, you got to sync everything together.
Yeah. Yeah. Well, if you, if you, you have compressed air on, on board and Rick's got a setup
with Clay, his other partner on the transmission that is, it's, it's in a selenoid, it's an
aerosilenoid basically that works off of a charge. And it knows when, and because you just,
it's like a motorcycle all down or all up, you know, it's like you pull back or you push forward.
So it's a pretty simple actuation of the, of selecting the gear. It's just pushing that rod
forward or pulling it back, you know. So, and we're going to be nothing but upshifts with that
vehicle. We're not going to be downshifting it, hopefully. Right. You don't need to downshift
when you're trying to do that. So, yeah, upshifts and a air charge, it'll be a button on the steering
wheel. Actually, a button could be anywhere. We actually thought we'd do a high beam, low beam,
old time school button on your, down by your clutch pedal, you know, where you just pushed
like the horn button or the high beam, low beam button, whatever. And it shifts the gear, you
just push on the steering wheel and it will activate air charge to both transmissions at the
same time. And it'll select the gear on both transmissions at the same time.
So you're saying that they would be basically like engine transmission, engine transmission,
like they're going to be mounted front to back sort of? They are mounted, the engines face each
other because wanted to cancel the torque of the engine. Okay. So like if you, you know, you see
like an engine when somebody's wrapping it, you know, and you can see the whole body twist.
That's the rotation of the engine, the counteraction of the rotation.
Gosh, they'd be canceling each other out. So they would cancel that out. So hopefully,
we won't have to have steering input. You'll see like other vehicles have steering input to keep
them straight, you know, just to keep like he's just to keep it on that black line on the salt.
So that should, that's a good, that's a different engineering approach, I think, what we've done
there. So it's two, two engines, two transmissions, two differentials, it's four-wheel drive.
And because we need traction. Right. So why not use the other two separate systems running each
end of the car? And we're going to marry them through MoTeX electronic system. So that will,
they will marry the engines, you know, their fuel consumption, their, their RPMs, their, you know,
all their different vitals. There's going to be a ton of sensors on this particular vehicle.
Yeah. A huge wiring expense. This is the craziest undertaking I've heard about life.
And this will be, we can juke it with computers, you know, to, to lead one in or to trail another
or vice versa. So there's going to be a lot of electronic setup on that particular vehicle and
testing. How's this vehicle progressing? Is this something we're going to see? We're going to go see
it today. Well, I mean, but like at Bonneville, I mean, like, is it going to, like when's it's
made in voyage going to be? You're starting to sound like Doug Herbert, you know, when's
this thing going to be done? I want to see it run. I'm the customer side of things. Yeah. Come on,
you know? Yeah. Like just relax, it'll be done when it's done and then we'll go.
No, I'm more so curious. Like, I guess, where is it currently in its, in its progress? In its
won't make this year. Right. Yeah. Next year is possible. Sure. Next August,
2027, August. Well, it's kind of like me asking, it's like, oh, yeah, when are we going to be
able to time travel? You know, it's like, it's like, we'll get the, like it's a whole new undertaking.
I mean, we'd like to be able to, but, you know, we have limited crew, right? Limited, you know,
huge expense, you know, I mean, with money, you can drive anything, right? Pretty much. Yeah.
So, you know, that takes it, you know, that kind of thing.
You're probably going to need to ship your car soon or know somebody that will. And as someone
who used to work in freight logistics, I understand the difficulties of finding reliable transport,
especially when trying to make it to rallies, race tracks, or to warehouse to hide your Corvette,
because you're going through a messy divorce and when she says everything, she means everything.
Anywho, next year is the proud owner of SureThing Logistics, having traveled much
of the country with every type of vehicle you can imagine. He's got the experience
and reliability that you want to ensure a safe journey for your pride and joy. If you want to
find out what it takes to ship your vehicle, go to SureThingLogistics.net, fill out the intake
form, and be sure to let him know I sent you. Let's get back to the show. I want to talk about
this though. This project is just, I can't escape Subaru's anywhere because I'm talking Subaru's
every day for my day job. Oh, really? Yeah. So what's that about? Are you familiar with a company
called Company 23 by any chance? Nope. So they make specialty tools and parts for
Subaru's. That's the big, yeah. So like anything, for example, we just relaunched a new product
where you could rebuild AVCS cam gears. That was something that you historically just had to go
and buy. Really? Now we provide something where you just rebuild it yourself, save yourself a
few hundred bucks, sort of deal. And then the other one is a company called CarPoi, same ownership
group for the most part. We're short shifters, bushings, all that stuff. So every day I'm answering
Subaru's support emails, learning that whole market that I always started recently. So that's
why I was like, huh. Now you can kind of put something together with what you're actually
moving. A little bit. Again, I'm just a youngin, right? I'm only 26 years old, so I have so much
to learn. Like everything's starting to click for me. Yeah. I mentioned to you before we started.
This is episode 197, I'm pretty sure. Episode 67 though, I was talking to a guy I had on the
show and he's an expert in porting heads. That's all he does is, heads, heads, heads. Yeah. And
I'm sitting here and I'm looking at this guy and I'm like, I don't know what the hell this guy's
talking about. I was like, I realized that I had so much more to learn. And then for the next 20
or 30 episodes, I went down because there was, you know, at the time I had this bucket list
guest and I was like, I don't want to have this guest on the show until I can at least
know what questions to ask, right? Exactly. Yeah. And now, you know, almost 200 episodes later,
it's all starting to like make a little bit more sense, right? So that's why I love the technical
stuff. Yeah. Instead of working at here, it's more natural now. Yeah. Yeah. Exactly. So it's like,
it takes a little less brain power, thankfully, you know, because the cavity is getting deeper
back here. But anyways, so yeah, this is, from what you told me, going to be a three wheel drive.
This is a three wheel drive vehicle. Again, it's a, they call me dream weaver sometimes,
you know, because what are you doing with these dreams? But dreams are the beginning of something
usually, you know, for anybody, right? They have dreams, follow your dreams, as always say,
follow your dreams, you know, achieve your dreams, achieve your goals. And it was, it's,
it's been kind of a kind of an interesting looking vehicle. I thought the three wheelers when they,
when they first came out back, I don't know, when was that back in the
early 2000s or something. I don't like the slingshots and yeah, the slingshots and the the
t-rex and some of these other ones, you know, there's just a few of them, if you Google them,
but there's nothing that's really performance based. And what more, what's more performance in
race car guys, background and the way they build race cars to build a vehicle for the street.
Because this eventually will be street legal, is my goal, is to mass produce these chassis. There'll
be, again, pre-bent C&C, laser coped, put in a jig, welded, robotic welded, and, and then,
you know, powder coated and then assembled and off on the street they go. So this will be a vehicle
that you can, you can do yourself in a two car garage and you can purchase this, hence the three
wheels or what we call the three phase. So you can order all phases complete, you can buy it,
welded, painted, your color and just purchase it and take it home, put it in your garage.
Or you can build it yourself as a kit and your son or your daughter or your girlfriend or whatever,
you know, of some buddies and you can, you don't have a lot of room in a two car garage. So phase
one comes, it's a minimal amount of boxes, maybe the chassis to begin with and whatnot, a few parts
and you get through phase one and you're still interested, you can go to phase two. So you're
not laying out all your money initially, maybe just part of your money for phase one, you maybe
you lose interest, you don't even want to go to phase two, maybe you sell it to somebody,
they order phase two. You're not out all your money, but maybe you want to stay with it, you
know, so you can go phase one, two or three as your progression goes, you can build it yourself,
you can customize it yourself, you can color it yourself, you know, the way that you want it.
And it could be a two wheel drive Subaru with just a rear wheel hanging and not doing anything,
it can be three wheel drive like we talked about, it could be a two wheel drive Volkswagen
air cooled, no radiator, it still bolts up pretty much the same thing, a lot simpler,
a little lighter, less costly. If you want, you know, let's say you got your kids turned in 16
and once you want to know a little bit about cars or, you know, learn about, here you got a safety
package with roll cages and roll bars and built by racing race car guys, you know,
that knows a little bit about safety and performance. So, so yeah, I just thought it'd
be kind of an interesting, an interesting vehicle for it could be open, like a motorcycle,
it have a full cage, it could have a windshield, it could have, I thought maybe we might do different
body styles like in like five year increments or three year increments or something where you'd
have this style and then you might be able to Zeus on it or clip on bolt on this other body
style to fit into the same chassis. So, then you can get different looks and everybody likes to
personalize their stuff. Right. But this could be, it could be two wheel drive front, for instance,
it could be a Volkswagen two wheel drive front, it could be an electric rear wheel drive.
Okay. So, you could, and you could, the floors could be batteries, right under the seat. So,
you could get, fire up your Volkswagen, get on the freeway, put it in neutral, run your air
conditioner and your alternators and everything else, turn on the electric rear wheel drive and go,
you know, 30 miles or 40 miles or wherever to your destination. And then it recharges when
you're getting there while you're working off, you come home again, it's virtually spend very
little in fuel, very economical. Or you can go all out, throw your money away and just go fast
and have fun and do brodies and all kinds of crazy things on the street, you know. But I kind
of, the whole thing that drove this, one of the whole things that drove this was, this particular
car is going to have roughly 430 horsepower turbocharged Subaru. I can't wait to dump the clutch
and get three patches of rubber on the pavement, with the rear rubber being 16 inches.
I was going to say, you want to break any traction with that thing?
Oh, no, it'll break it. We'll break something. We're going to break something.
Yeah, that's a big tire on the back. Right. But you got to be a fun vehicle. And then,
you know, it's got brimbo brakes, Italian expensive brakes. It's got Tilton hydraulic
master cylinders and clutch assemblies. It's got 300M axles. It's got JRI shocks and
hypercoast springs. So a lot of the product that we use in racing, you know, we're using in this
fun vehicle as well. So what inspired this project that you just one day, did you rent a
slingshot somewhere? No, no, I just, I saw one and I thought, wow, that looks kind of cool.
But they got little tires and they got one wheel drive. And I think they had a Briggs,
Briggs, a lawnmower engine or something in there. I don't know what it was. I think it was an Ecotech.
Yeah, I'm just being, just being an idiot. Either way. So the way I think is, you know,
it's got to be, you know, mach macho, you know, it's got to be the most it can possibly be. So
we're going to start with the most it can possibly be and then work it back, you know,
to, to like a real person that a real person can get involved in something like this,
not a crazy person. So but it ought to be fun. I actually, I'm looking for a, you know, you
remember Ken Block? Yeah. And he did all these crazy things with vehicles and stuff. So this,
the first attempt, this is going to be kind of like that where it's just going to,
rubber's going to be flying. It's going to be doing brodies and circles. I've got
like a four different braking program in this car that you can,
you can manipulate the car to do different things. And so that'll make it kind of interesting too.
And but the real, the real drive with this is to do the hard work now and enjoy the build,
get the performance level up and then turn it into, you know, a money-making mass production
street vehicle process. It can be, it can be licenses as a, as a three-wheeler or a,
what do they call them, a trike. Yeah. Yeah. So it's almost like a motorcycle license. It's
not really a car license. Oh yeah, I suppose. Yeah. And so they call it a trike. So anyhow,
I think it works off motorcycle licensing. I got to dig into all that stuff, but it ought to be
fun. And then, you know, you could, you could clip on a surfboard on the back, golf clubs,
you know, bag, a 10 speed, your last girlfriend, you know, excuse me, she doesn't want to go.
Yeah. I think it'd be, I think it'd be fun and, and exciting. And then I'd like to actually turn
it into a three-wheeler racing platform where you have to have a riding mechanic like the old days.
And so you have to have two occupants at, say, Road America. And you're both flying around the
track with, you know, 15 or 20 of these other three-wheelers out there and just racing and
having a great three-wheeler race. It'd be the first three-wheeler race that I could ever think.
I mean, I don't, I've never heard of it. So maybe we should try it.
No. When you mentioned some of the Ken Block stuff, I actually had one of gentlemen who built
his truck on the show at some point. Are you familiar with Mark McDonald's playing chance?
Not. He used to be over at Detroit speed or however long ago. But are you thinking like
getting something like a hydraulic disconnect in the rear wheel or something like that?
Or there's possibility for that. It's got a turning brake in it to where it'll lock up
either one of the front wheels, which is going to be a little tricky because you're going to
have to have a pretty good grip on the wheel to counteract that pull. But I think this car
will snap or this vehicle would snap in a turn initially, immediately. It's got a rear brake
only where you can set the back of the car and get it going. So your regular clutch or your
regular brake pedal, which operates off all corners or individual front or individual rear
separate. And then a third one is going to be kind of like a parking brake almost. Like if you can
imagine like an old Volkswagen ratcheting park brake with a button on it. But it'd be something
similar to that where it would, when you pull it up, it will deploy linkage out the bottom of the
car in the exact center of the balancing point of the car front to rear as far as front to rear
weight. And it'll, it's going to deploy a rubber pad that it will touch the pavement and pick up
the weight of the vehicle about a half inch. You'll just lift the weight of the vehicle
and it'll have a wheel bearing in this pad basically. So the car will spin once you get the car and
dump the clutch and hit the turning brake, it will spin on its own axis is what I'm in a rubber
blaze of smoke. So you're not going to be able to even see the car. I don't think
and it's just going to spin on its own axis. It just do
like what's more dumb than that, you know,
like I'm just thinking like I'm just going to mess you and then you come out of this in a big
parking lot, right? In a big area and you come out of this tight little spin like a like an ice
skater, you know, when they put their arms up and it's spinning on its own axis to it comes out
and it just swoops and does a big ol Brody and just hazes rubber forever and out the park and let
it goes, you know, or something like that. I don't know, we'll see. So this is just kind of like a
like a crazy dream project. A crazy dream project. Yes, that's what it is. Yes. No, I uh, what do you
have running for a transmission in there? Well, that's one of the, that's going to be the weakest
link. It's just, that's the Subaru stock, basically Gearbox. So right now I'm actually
contacting in the middle of contacting rally Subaru rally racers and trying to see what
they've done with their Gearboxes for, you know, because the rally is so intense and, you know,
just wants to destroy the Gearbox. So I'm thinking I might get a year or two, a year or two older
Gearbox because that that always increases with time and they come up with stronger parts and
come up with this and better, better this, better that. So I might be able to acquire, you know,
a rally box and have a little more luck with that and get to learn it, you know, that's another
process with this, with this particular vehicle. Maybe I can get the X66D to build
me a nice little Gearbox for that thing. Hey, what do you think? Todd, Todd, you get me here.
Hello, Todd. Are you there, Rick?
No, that's going to be, oh, that's what I was going to ask you earlier. So this is going to be like
a stock ECU sort of deal, an aftermarket, like for the tuning side of things. It could be,
there's an aftermarket, it's called the Link. Yeah, I was going to say Link is kind of a go-to for
these guys. Yeah, and that's what this engine will run on, yeah. Yeah, Link and Motec, I think
that those are kind of like the main go-tos from what I hear, but again, slowly learning that
whole world. Every single niche has its own kind of thing. Sure, sure, sure. So other than that,
and as we slowly start to wrap down here with the podcast side of things, any other exciting
projects going on, what does the next five, 10 years look like for you? Oh, wow. Well, I've got
several of my own projects, as you can see, this whole room that's filled up. We've got a NASCAR
DEI Cup car. We've got a vintage Trans-M car from 1986 that won the championship V6. We're
storing that. Which V6 was in that one, by the way, you mentioned that earlier. That's the 4.5
V6. It's basically like a small block Chevy with two cylinders lobbed off of it. Okay.
They came out in the street cars around that time. Oh, is that the one that was in the Grand
Nationals? Yeah, that would have been, I think, that same engine. Okay. I got more research to
after I listen back to this episode. They were good running V6s. They were a little weak in
dependability, but that car was reduced weight by about 200 pounds just because it lost two
cylinders, right? So it was a good power to weight recipe for that car. So there's that. And then
we've got the current Trans-M car that we're getting ready to go to Indianapolis with. Then
over there in the corner, we've got an off-road doom buggy. Yeah, I was looking at that earlier.
Four fat guys and ice chest. And make sure you've got a good solid ice chest and then
four of your best-looking fat guys, and then go for a ride. But it's all airbag
because my back, I wanted a nice, cushed deal. So it's got lots of wheel travel,
and it's got a, it's had the same engine as turbocharged Subaru, 430 horse. Oh, okay. It's
got an aftermarket gearbox, a Mendiola gearbox to take some of the abuse. It's got the drive shaft
shop out in Salisbury, did all the axles for both of these vehicles, the three-wheeler and the
doom buggy. And they're used to taking major abuse and major power and applying it to the
drivetrain. So we use those guys over there to help bring it to the racetrack. What's
the most abuse in a build like that, the buggy style builds? What's the most abuse? Yeah, like,
is there like a, what's the most beefed up part on there? Oh, the most beefed up part. Well,
suspension's pretty beefed up on there. Yeah, because it's just slamming. It's off-road is violent.
So it's the first thing that sees the durability weakness and it'll show its ugly head and
snaps up and break it, you know, more or less. So over the years, you learn what you can and can't
get away with and hopefully we've out guessed what can and can't happen. But that's kind of a
light-duty off-road vehicle too. It's more designed for sand, right? Big paddle tires,
climbing huge hills. Harsh off-road is rocks, you know, terrain, harder than concrete, you know,
and so it's a whole nother kind of abuse to an off-road vehicle. That car will do stuff like
that, but in a more tame atmosphere, you know, looking after your vehicle more than just thrashing
it across the desert. So then the one of the things I was thinking about there is,
is that like a dry sump set up or no? That is not. That's a wet sump. So yeah.
And have you ever ever been up to like Silver Lake, like the sand dunes in Michigan?
Oh, I've heard about those. Yeah. No, I never have. I never have, but Michigan's not too far from
here. Maybe it's a good test, huh? Well, yeah. How was 16 hours, I think? Maybe? Maybe no less.
It's got to be cool. Yeah, I don't know something like that. But that's better than
two, three days to California, you know. But it's worth it out there too. I think it's way,
way more to choose from out in California, I believe, from what I've heard, like for dunes.
Yeah, I don't know. I haven't visited Silver Lake yet, but I've had people on the show who like
go out there. Right. Right. Just because they say it's awesome. They love it. Yeah. Yeah. It might
be a good test. Not my curiosity. That's what I, but I do need to test before I go all the way
to the West Coast. Yeah, Silver Lake, let's find out. Now I'm curious.
From here, it is a grand total of, well, hold that load for a second.
12 hours. No way. Oh, 12 hours. That's not. Yeah. That, okay. That blew my mind.
It's not terrible. Yeah, good little test bed. It'll be there by the end of the day.
Oh, yeah. No, so I'm in Minneapolis and Dallas is 14 hour or 13 and a half hours.
And it's just go straight down to the events that I go down to Texas. Same thing with Austin.
I haven't been to Dakota yet. That's actually a great question as well. What's your favorite
track to attend? Do you have one? There's a few. They all have their own little nuances and what
not and what you like and don't like about them. But I like Atlanta and I've driven Atlanta a bit
myself. And it's very challenging because of the elevation changes and the kinds of corners.
I don't know if you're familiar with the track at all. I've never driven it myself,
but on that last corner, you're coming off the bridge hill and diving down to the last corner
or turn one actually at that point, I think it is. And no, that's the last corner, excuse me.
But yeah, that'll get your attention. Road America, the kink in the back coming after
out of the carousel. And you go out a short little straight away and then you have this
high speed kink. And it's like to get that right and to get that fast, it really takes
everything you have. You're talking to Jesus on now for sure. And so there's lots of
Sonomas, another cool track. You come up at a turn two at the top of the hill and you go to turn
three A and three B and then you shoot off turn four. You don't even see the landing. You don't
really see the whole corner, but you have to guess where to launch the car and it actually
gets a little bit airborne sometimes on the right front. And you land right on the edge of the
racetrack because it's a left hand turn at the same time, a slight left hand turn. So
there's, it's hard to say, they're all challenging. I'd like to know a VIR, that's actually our closest
track to here, to this place. And I've only driven that a bit, but I'd like to master that a little
better. That's an awesome track too from Rod. Again, I haven't driven it personally, but I have a lot
of sim time. Well, and then you get in something like this and it's terrifying. Oh, I would never.
And you're trying to learn and be terrified at the same time as it's really an interesting
combination. But it's so amazing. And the G-Load, well, this car here sees, it's,
you can't believe you're going through the corner that fast and not shearing off the racetrack.
It's amazing. That's one thing that I've gotten for is a respect for race cars. And they're like,
you know, a 600, 700 horsepower street car, that's one thing. A 600, 700 horsepower race car.
Yeah. I don't think, maybe I might have had a rude awakening a few years ago. I'm just like,
you know what? I don't think I got it at me. And then add another 200 horsepower.
Yeah, exactly. Just because you don't need it.
Well, as we start to wrap up here, I will have a final question here in a second,
but what are you most proud of in your career? Oh gosh, my salvation in the Lord Jesus Christ,
I think is the most thing. And being a parent to great girls and having, and being able to play
and have an income and a livelihood in the thing that I truly love. I mean, I wake up each day
with a new smile on my face and what do I get to play with today? And that's been a great
outlook for anybody's life, I think. I've just been blessed with it. And I'll tell you, it's been
a great ride and I can't wait for what's next around the corner. Well, perfect on that note.
Last and final question. At the end of every episode, I like to ask my guests to pick three
cars. You have an unlimited budget and it goes like this. You could build whatever you want,
buy whatever you want, however you want to go about it. It goes like this. You get to pick a
daily driver, a track car, and a show car. What are you picking? Oh, daily driver 1935
crew cab Chevrolet pickup truck that's been cut down the middle and widened the whole foot.
So that you've got a lot of elbow room inside and slight chop to the top, a handmade bed,
and a handmade chassis with probably air suspension on it with amazing brakes, lots of
power. And that's your daily driver. I'd like to build that.
That's the best, quickest answer I've got for such a custom car. I don't even prep you with
this question. You were ready for that one. And just kind of over the top with creature
comforts and leather interior, just really nice solid, a four door with suicide rear doors,
you know, regular doors in the front. So a lot of leg room for the back, like an extended
crew cab, something you can go to lunch foot and not get the seat in front of your dirty
with your shoes, basically, you know, so. Track car, I'm building it. I'm racing it.
This is, I can't think of anything cooler. And there's certain reasons why I say that,
because it's something that you come up with, it's something that you build, you don't have to buy it.
You can build it, and you can compete with it, and you can try to beat the other guys that
have all the money in the world, and they buy the best of everything, but they don't build it.
They don't come up with their ideas. They buy their ideas from somebody else's ideas.
And I enjoy that part of it a lot. And building and being able to race across this country
at all the iconic racetracks with, and nowadays, some of the awesome iconic, you know,
pilots that we've had in the past, like Boris was retired, and I asked him, you want to come back
to racing, you want to let's go do some trans-am. Well, he said, he says, what do you got? And I
said, I build a new trans-am car. His next question was, is it fast? I said, I think so, but you've
got to drive it. So, and once he drove it, he goes, oh, this is it, you know, this is a great
recipe. Let's continue. So we have, and then Paul Menard was out, retired from NASCAR,
and brought him back in. Now he's running, we're competing against him and another team. He jumped
ship and he's, he signed up with another team, which is cool that I understand, but I miss having
him part of it, part of our program for sure. Adam Andretti, same kind of thing. He was racing
for another team. And now he's off racing with another trans-am team. And we're actually competing
against him weekend and week out too. So it's a good camaraderie of good friends over the years.
And, you know, I've been in, I've been in trans-am for what, 46 years or something like that.
And then racing in general, my whole life. I mean, since I was probably about three or four
years old, washing mud off my dad's midget, you know, so good stuff. And the other vehicle was
show car, show car. I kind of enjoy the Riddler award for hot rods. And it's like the top award for
the coolest hot rods out there. And it, it employs again, amazing innovation and technology
into usually older body style cars. And I think that's kind of cool. I would probably,
I'm not sure what that car would be exactly, but something that you'd, and, you know,
something that you'd come up with and something you'd probably make in that regard, a show car
like that. Anything in particular kind of in the back of your head, you're thinking,
what did you go Chevy, Ford, Dodge? I'm not really stuck on any one thing, you know? I mean,
maybe even my Crew Cab 1930 Chevrolet pickup truck would, would fit in that category as well as
your daily driver. But then it's too nice to be a daily driver, you know? You know, what I really
enjoyed when I was a kid, I had a Volkswagen station wagon. And it had probably 300,000 miles on it.
And it went everywhere. And it was ugly. And of course, it had a great motor in it, you know.
And, but I enjoyed that car a lot. It was a lot of fun. And I don't even know that I wouldn't
probably try to go find something like that again. And make that a little show car? Who knows?
You know, who knows? I mean, it doesn't make any sense, but it's just different.
Why not, man? It's just different. Well, perfect. I don't know. Where can everybody find you?
They can find me at 704-609-7423. Do you have a website?
I don't. I intentionally don't have a website. And I don't really intentionally, you know,
give out where I, my place of residence or businesses. But you can get ahold of me and
we can chit chat and talk about things. But I'm looking for actually a partner
to run the Trans Am car correctly. Somebody has got a viable company that really loves racing,
is just an enthusiast and wants to be part of a front running team. I would enjoy that.
I have never had a partner and kind of done this all on my own over the years. But,
and not necessarily do I need a real partner, but somebody that wants to invest and be part of the,
you know, part of the program. And so anyhow, that would, that's probably what I'd do.
When you say partner, what does a partner kind of look like? Like I'm just curious?
Like just a real enthusiast, somebody that's financially has done well in business and doesn't
really, maybe needs a tax write off, maybe just really enjoys Trans Am racing from when he was
a young man, you know. Gotcha. And wants to be at the top of the food chain and beat everybody else,
you know. That's a call to action if I've heard one. That's, you know, let's beat their ass. That's
what it's about, you know. And I really, I get the most out of that. I really do. That's fun
being on top. Of course it is. Who doesn't like to be on top, right? That's a good way to, let's
end on that note. Let's kick some ass. Okay. Well, thank you very much, Pancho. You're welcome.
I'm very grateful to be over here and meet you. So, yeah. Thank you for everybody for listening
and we'll see you all next time. All right.
About this episode
Pancho Weaver shares how a childhood around Southern California midget racing turned into a decades-long career building and racing Trans Am cars. He explains why his “generation three” Trans Am effort is different: all-round tube chassis built via CAD/CNC, a focus on torsional stiffness, improved mechanical grip, and a distinctive 180-degree header sound. Weaver also covers his NASCAR/DEI chassis and engine-program experience, race-weekend workflow, and the team’s use of Penske-era Dodge engines. The conversation expands into his wild 3-wheel “Dream Weaver” street/trike project and a Bonneville wheel-driven land-speed bid.
Pancho Weaver joins us to break down his incredible journey from off-road racing and working with legends in the industry to building one of the most unique Trans Am cars on track today. We dive into the engineering behind his iconic Challenger, his time working alongside Dale Earnhardt, and what it really takes to compete as a privateer in modern racing. Plus, we get into wild builds, future projects, and the mindset behind pushing innovation in motorsports.
