Riley on Ford Recalls, Aviloo CEO on Used EV Market, Mathis on Curbing Turnover | Daily Dealer Live

Hey everybody, welcome to another episode of the Daily Dealer Live.

I'm your host, Sam Dark.

Thank you for joining us today in this gathering place for all automotive to learn, to share,

to grow, to have a voice.

Today you'll notice my background's a little different.

Today I'm here broadcasting live from Ziggler Motorsports in Kalamazoo, Michigan.

I'll give you a little more on that in a moment, but it was kind of a specific request from

a viewer Wednesday saying, lose the black screen for an episode.

We did it.

More on that in a minute, but first let's dive into today's automotive headlines.

First up today, Amazon Auto, the e-commerce giant's online car buying platform has announced

new lending partnerships with Chase, Santander and Wells Fargo.

For now, the partnerships extend to used and certified pre-owned vehicles only, but

Amazon Auto's does plan to expand these offerings to new car sales quote in the coming months

according to the official announcement.

Like other digital retailing platforms, customers can submit their credit applications online

and compare loan offers side by side before completing paperwork online and picking up

their vehicle from a participating dealership.

In addition to leveraging Amazon's digital storefront, market reach and sales process,

partner dealers can now offer customers loan providers they already use in store,

rather than being limited to just one or two provided by them.

They also risk relinquishing massive control over the customer relationship.

Zooming out, the more valuable angle Amazon Auto's is most likely after is collecting

data on customer preferences and financing behavior, which could eventually lead to the

launch of its own branded financial products or deeper integrations with Prime.

Super interesting to watch Amazon grow in this initiative, starting with Hyundai, then to used

and then to parts abroad.

Next up in the news today, on Truth Social, President Trump recently announced a 25% tariff

on imported medium and heavy duty trucks.

It's set to take effect November 1st, a move that will likely create more headaches for

automakers trying to figure it out.

What's unclear is how far the tariffs will reach and whether they'll include tariffs from

Mexico and Canada or countries like South Korea and Japan that already have trade deals with the U.S.

Ford, on the other hand, is largely protected here and applauded the president for its

development.

Every Super Duty Ford sells is built in Kentucky and Ohio.

GM, on the other hand, assembles some heavy duty trucks in Canada

and Stellanus builds its Ram 2500 and 3500 trucks in Mexico.

That means both of those OEMs could face higher costs if those regions

aren't exempt for as well positioned with this move.

And while light duty trucks account for most U.S. auto sales, the heavier segments

are still real profit drivers for automakers, ultimately fanning the flames of an already

tense trade environment, a constantly evolving tariff environment.

And last up today, we turn to the CDGE Bicell Tracker for an update.

Ed Candley Automotive Group has acquired Metro Lexus and Lexus of Akron Canton from Ascent

Automotive Group.

That adds two of Ohio's top performing Lexus stores to the Gantley portfolio,

this according to Kerrigan advisors.

Metro Lexus ranks first in state and tenth in its region, while Lexus of Akron Canton ranks

third.

Together, they control nearly 75% of Lexus market share in Greater Cleveland.

Now, Ken Ghandley Automotive Group operates more than 50 dealerships,

representing over 30 brands.

And the Cleveland market is one of the most ludicrous, ludicrous, oh my goodness,

that is not, it's not ludicrous, it's lucrative.

It's one of the most lucrative in the U.S. for Lexus, with less than a handful of stores

serving nearly 4 million people.

And don't forget everyone, you can see this deal announcement and many more throughout

the entire year on the CDGE Bicell Tracker at cdgebicell.com.

That's exactly right.

And that's a wrap on today's auto industry news, which brings us to co-host today.

Yuli, welcome back.

What's up guys?

And look, for everybody joining the livestream, we're live across all CDGE social media platforms.

Post your comments.

This is the place all of Automotive has a voice.

It's the place to engage in the conversation.

So if you're watching the livestream, get involved, post your comments.

We'll bring them into today's show at Enriching's, which Yuli, did you notice my background?

Do you notice I'm in a different place?

I did.

It looks like you're outside.

It looks like I'm outside because at Motorsports, you bring the outside inside to sell all the

cool toys they have here.

So we have temporarily created a stage.

We have five vehicles on the Sherman floor.

We're bringing the best person to do a walk around from the top five presentations we did

thus far.

And they will compete tonight for the crown of 2025 product knowledge champion across all the Ziggler

Auto Group.

And so I've got the five vehicles behind me.

You see a Maserati off to this side.

You see the Ford or the Ram off to this side.

Do you want to see someone do a wheelie behind you?

We should.

That would be cool.

Actually, if Caleb is watching the livestream, he is free to quietly do some sort of an EV or

something right behind me.

But it's kind of exciting.

You're going to see a little bit of chaos as people are walking around.

You'll probably hear some things because we are in an active Motorsports store.

But it's fun to bring you this unique perspective on this day when everybody across Ziggler

gathers.

So hey, that brings me to a point.

Everybody wants a voice on this show.

We welcome it.

We would love to have as many dealers on this show as we can possibly get if you want to be

on the show.

If you have an opinion, if you have a viewpoint on current events and automotive, go to cdgguest.com.

Fill out the intake form to be included in the show.

And then final up today, you can join us at the NADA party that's happening in Vegas on

Thursday, February 5th.

You'll be there.

I'll be there.

A lot of our guests or some of our guests who've appeared on the show will be there to be

considered for a formal invite.

Hit the link in the show notes, request to join and fill out a questionnaire.

Spots are limited, as we've said.

And unfortunately, we can't invite everyone.

So RSVB today to be considered for an invite.

And we hope to see you in Las Vegas.

And by the way, Lauren Klein reminds me.

She says she's watching today's show from the showroom floor.

We've had people in sky lounges.

We've had people in air watching the show live.

I'm now watching from a showroom floor myself.

So I'm excited to be back on the retail showroom, lose the black background for a day.

So all right, well, let's dive into it, Yuli.

Let's turn to Operations Director, our first guest of Lascaux Auto Group, Kelsey Riley.

Welcome to the show.

Kelsey.

Hi, Sam and Yuli.

Thank you for having me on today.

Kelsey, we're pumped to have you on.

You're actually on the opposite side of the state from us here at the Ziggler Auto Group.

We're in Kalamazoo.

You're in, well, tell us where you are.

Where you are.

So we have a Ford store in Fenton, a population of about 12,000.

And then we have a Mitsubishi store in Grand Blank.

Nice.

Oh, okay, very good.

So you're just north of Detroit by a little bit, right?

Yeah, about 45 minutes north of Detroit, about 20 minutes south of Flint.

Yeah, okay.

Well, hey, we always start with one question on the Daily Dealer Live.

And it is, how is Biz?

So tell us how is Biz.

And along with that, tell us a little bit about who you are and what you do at the dealership.

Okay, so as far as who I am, I've been here going on 13 years since I graduated college.

Obviously, nobody like, you know, as a kid is like, oh man, I want to grow up and work in a

dealership.

But I came in shortly around my graduation time and moved back home, had some sick family.

My best friend was working here.

She's like, hey, I got you a job.

Like, okay, awesome.

Had no intentions of like sticking around was going to go to grad school, my degrees in biology.

And then fell in love with the business.

Wanted to learn as much as I could.

You know, really kind of came up in the variable side and I went through NADA Academy and learned,

you know, fixed operations and that type of thing.

And I have a partner here who comes from the variable or the fixed ops side.

So between the two of us, we've got like a good foundation of experience between the two departments.

But really, I mean, we're in growth mode this year.

We're up about 415 units year over year.

Wow, nice.

So we're having 15 more units a month right now.

We got our first president's award ever last year.

So that was awesome.

We've been a business since 1983.

We're family owned.

So that was a big one.

So you're up 400 units.

How many units do you sell a year?

A year?

A year.

We are tracking about...

It's not a test.

Yeah, sorry.

You can make up the answer.

No, I'm kidding.

Don't make up the answer.

And by the way, you'll hear paging in the background.

Somebody was paging for somebody carry.

That was not for you, Kelsey, just so you know.

But that was my background.

I'm kidding.

Um, we're trending to do about 3,250 this year.

Okay.

So we're doing about 275 units a month right now.

Our goal is to get over that 300 cup.

Yeah.

So you're about 15% up.

So when you think about that increase,

that's a substantial increase even compared to other dealers.

What's one thing that you would attach to that increase

in unit sales this year?

So it's causing the increase.

We've really focused on people in process, I would say.

Making sure, you know, as a good degree says,

like having the right people on the bus, right?

And then once you have the right people on the bus,

finding the right seats for those people.

And we had the right people on the bus.

And we moved some people around and that type of thing.

I've really got them in spots where they flourish.

We focused on like the team atmosphere and growth and employee experience.

Because if you don't have a good employee experience,

it's really hard to have that, like, you know,

top to your customer experience.

So those are kind of things that we have really honed in on.

And without the people in process,

it's really hard to get the volume and then the customer retention with it.

All right, so you talked people, process, and retention.

I want to come back to process in just a second,

but I want to take you back to a comment you made earlier.

And I think it's a truth.

You said, I never intended to be an automotive.

Like, you got a biology degree, you know,

you probably had other plans.

And then you came into automotive, it took you a hot minute,

but then you decided at some moment, hey, this is for me.

Same path, right?

Yeah.

What is it about automotive that causes people to say,

hey, I'm not going to do this forever.

I'll do it for now.

And yet people stay.

And what is it going to take for us to kind of lose that stigma?

So I was just going to say, it was the stigma, right?

Like when she was, my best friend had, you know, got me in and she was like,

I was like, man, I really don't know, you know,

dealership doesn't have the best stigma, right?

Well, why stuck around?

I mean, we've got amazing owners.

We've got an amazing team.

I love that we're family owned.

I love the chaos of the day.

So we have, you know, 165 employees company-wide between sales and service and ROs

and all that type of thing between the two stores.

We probably have close to 1600 customers coming through each month.

So it's just, no day is the same.

And I love that challenge, right?

And it also like you get in the room with like certain people

and everybody just motivates you to be, you know, not to sound cliche,

but like 1% better every day.

It's the goal, right?

So Kelsey, you mentioned having the right person on board.

Where are you finding, you know, given the stigma and given the allure of automotive,

I think this is the best kept secret in employment in the United States.

Like not enough people realize how great it is to work in an auto dealership

or as part of an auto group.

Where are you finding your best employees

that are the right people to bring on that bus today in 2025 October?

We have a lot of tenure.

We have a lot of sales reps that have been with us for five, 10.

We have people getting 15, 25 longevity awards and that type of thing.

And I know that you have had people on in the past that have maybe talked about,

like sometimes it's like bad to have that retention that long.

But I think when you have the right people, it's what stabilizes you

in a challenging market.

Like obviously automotive has been like pretty volatile since COVID, right?

So having the right people, recruiting, and then when you have that environment

that people do well in, they tend to refer, you know, other people that they've worked with.

And we do get a decent amount of our staff off of employee referrals.

All right, so now turn us to process.

Turn us to process for just one second, Yuli, and then you can come back in.

So you've got the right people and they're on the bus and they're rowing in the same direction.

They're bought into the vision.

What's one process in 2025 that has helped you to capitalize and get that increase?

So you've got this team launching towards the goal.

What's a process you've implemented where you're like,

hey, this is really driving increased sales for us.

This is going to sound very simple.

We've worked on communication internally.

So we have a morning meeting.

Every morning, it starts at 8.45 with the sales staff.

We have email communication with updated numbers and that type of thing.

Everybody knows what the mission and goal is for the month.

Like if you don't have a mission, it's kind of hard to have a goal

of what everyone's trying to strive for, right?

I would say that that's like the biggest thing in our process.

And we still have challenges with it.

Like communication is, I think, every organization's Achilles heel to some point.

But is there a technology tool that you're using to help forward that communication

that other dealers could implement to help improve their own if they're like,

hey, we're two or three rooftops.

We don't communicate well enough.

And if we did, we'd sell more cars.

Is there a tool you're using to communicate with?

We use Teams.

So we switched to Microsoft Office about two years ago.

And it's easy.

Like you can have the apps on your phone.

There's chats in there, the email, all that type of thing.

The Teams calls makes things, I would say, roll a lot smoother.

We also obviously have our text group chats and that type of thing as well.

In regards to processes and your tenure,

because obviously there's a tremendous amount of upside

for having the same people that are there greeting your customers

and creating that welcoming atmosphere.

But there is that negative potential with people that are a little accustomed to being around.

Being that your group is so successful, what helps you guys implement new processes in 2025?

Because I would imagine your car buying process,

while being pretty linear since the beginning of time,

has evolved dramatically over time.

So how do you get those people to adopt the new processes that you put in place?

So I will tell you that that has been a little bit of a challenge.

We've been on a mission of growth for really about the last year and a half or so.

We've hit our hurdles just as anybody would, but you keep pressing.

And you find out the people that are bought in and want to press forward with you

and they want to be on a winning team.

And then you can kind of see the people that maybe

that's not their mission or their goal.

And same thing, you have to adapt to everybody on your team individually.

It's not a one size fits all thing.

So like where communication, we do it in all different methods.

Some people are really great at reading emails and I know some people aren't.

So I might send them a text message instead, but they still get the same message.

I think as a leader, you have to adapt to your team to a certain extent to be able to have the success.

So as head of operations in your stores, Ford Mitsubishi,

you've got KPIs that you're communicating frequently and helping to keep everybody

focused on mission and goal.

What are some of the most important KPIs to you on the sales side that

you focus the team on as you're communicating?

Obviously we have volume goals with our manufacturers and then our CSIs, extremely

important at both stores or NPS with Ford is kind of what it's called now, but all in the same realm.

Those two are probably the biggest factors.

Obviously you want to hone in on the EVs, which we hit our objective each month with those.

But SSI would say or CSI and volume are two biggest ones.

I think when you focus on too many things, it becomes kind of convoluted as to what the goal is,

but if you can do volume and you can get good customer satisfaction,

then you can pretty much hit the tick on the rest of them.

So with a 15-20% increase in on the year and unit count, what keeps you up at night as head of

operations? What are you thinking about as the next big obstacle you've got to solve for

as we launch through the end of 2025 and beginning 26 Q1?

That's a loaded question. A lot of things keep me up at night.

Such as?

Such as making sure that we do have the right tools and processes to get to the goals that

we're trying to achieve. Our team, making sure everybody's mindset is everything,

making sure that when they walk in the door that morning that they left whatever was outside of

work or whatever the yesterday brought is a fresh mindset. Use cars, acquisitions, making sure we've

got enough cars in the pipeline coming in and that recon's going smoothly and that we can get

things, you know, our time deline's down and we can get things on the lot fast for our turns.

Just kind of a mix of everything really. I have a remarkable, and it like basically is next to

my gut at night and I'll wake up and I'll like write it out. I love you. I've got a remarkable

as well. Hopefully you have the new one that's backlit. They're a great piece of technology.

So last question up. Last question up. So Ford is the most recalled OEM this year,

year to date, right? Where do you see the opportunities in those recalls and then also

what are the challenges for you in a dealership in eastern Michigan?

So when it comes to recalls, I would say we have a phenomenal service team that's here to

help support any of our customers and that type of thing. We have a mobile service team,

they go out, they do recalls. You know, we try to best serve the customer in that realm. The

challenge would be is, I guess, can come along consumer confidence, right? However, we're not

the only manufacturer with recalls. We just happened to be this year, but everybody has them. So,

you know, it's just part of doing business, I would say. Any message you deliver to Ford about

fixing it or figuring out what's going on? I know that they've talked about it in meetings. They

have processes that they're working on to implement better quality control when it comes to those

types of items. And hopefully in the future, we don't have this type of thing in the headlines as

much. Well, Kelsey Riley, Operations Director Alaska Auto Group in eastern Michigan north of

the Detroit area. Thanks for joining the show today and sharing your perspective on your journey

and what it takes to win in today's environment. Thanks for being on the show, Kelsey. Thank you

guys for having me. Thanks, Kelsey. It's an interesting conversation. It's, you know, I'm

always fascinated to talk to people about the recall thing because it's like, hey, where do you see

the opportunity? Where do you see the challenge? How do you focus your team around the opportunity?

Because at the end of the day, recalls don't hurt the store. That's more service revenue,

but she's right. You've got to build confidence in your team so that nobody freaks out before

they fix it because they're going to fix it. They're going to fix it, I think, quickly. And

they aren't the only ones that are challenged with that. So, Uli, let's talk, get Appraisal Pro.

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Appraisal Pro, thanks for joining the show and watch out for the industry spotlight on Saturday.

I think that's when it releases anyway. So, well, let's turn up to our next guest,

founder of Avilu, Wolfgang Berger. Wolfgang, welcome to the show.

Hey, thanks a lot for having me.

Dude, you've got a headset. I need to get a headset one of these days. That is very cool. So, we

appreciate you being on the show. Thanks for coming. You're going to talk to us about something

that in my mind is a fascinating problem in all of automotive. You've got used car managers. You

have the consumer public out there trying to figure out how to buy an EV well. And on the

reverse side, you've got the reality that the most expensive component of an EV. Yuli, we talked

about this. A Ford F-150. What was the battery replacement on that Ford F-150? 74,000.

So, when you're buying a used EV, you can't afford to make a mistake on figuring out the

condition of that battery. So, as kind of a setup to that, Wolfgang, I'd ask,

how's biz in your world, in your company, and then what do you do and tell us a little bit about

your company? Sure, sure. Thanks, Sam. Yeah, business is great for us. The used market for EVs is

picking up around the world. And as you know, we sell our battery tests in Europe, in Asia,

and of course, in the United States. And the first waves of used EVs are coming in, hitting the

used car markets. And we help car dealerships selling them better, selling them at the better

price with the help of our battery testing system. That's very cool. Very cool. So,

is there, you know, you've got a battery test that will give the consumer and will give car dealers

a picture of the battery. How does it work? Like, how does that proactively work, a battery test,

in this case? Yeah, I think best, in the best, I just show you that very quickly on a vehicle

by coincidence. This has never happened before. We got a live demo. Holy cow. This is a daily

dealer live industry first. Yeah, live demo. Very cool. That's a Volkswagen ID4 full electric. And

in the center of our system is the Avila box. That's how it looks like. And what it does,

it connects to the so-called OBD port of the vehicle. And really everything you have to do is

switch on the vehicle, make sure it's on, and then connect the box to the OBD port. We do that here

with the help of an OBD extension cable that comes in the case that we ship. And that's about it.

You do not need to enter any data, any app or anything. The box itself already comes with a

SIM card built in. So it gets the internet connection via the 3G network and starts sending data

back to our cloud system, back to our servers, where we have developed machine learning systems,

an algorithm that can independently conclude to what is called the state of health of the battery,

what is ultimately telling you how good is that battery working. And that result is then handed

out to a customer in the form of a battery certificate. You see the state of health. Again,

that's a number in percentage. It's like 97.9% in that case. And that gives the confidence

to the consumer when he is buying a used electric car. Because you're totally right,

the battery is tremendously expensive. It's easily 50% of the whole vehicle value. So you might want

to check brake suspension and everything, but the money sits in the battery. So what are some of

the things from your industry expertise that make an EV battery go bad? Or what causes problems in

the battery that a used car manager might not realize? There's a lot of issues that can happen

in a battery. It can be from manufacturing, from day of manufacturing. There could be a defect cell

in the battery pack. And the weakest cell defines the whole battery pack. So if you got one weak cell,

your capacity of the battery will go down, your range will go down. And then, of course,

you have the usage of the car. I mean, we all know there are certain aspects that are not

very good for a battery, like a lot of fast charging, a lot of high strong accelerations,

hot temperatures. And as a used car buyer, you obviously you don't know how that battery has

been treated before. And that's what we tell you is the battery test. And what we do is we help the

car dealer, right? We're the ally of the car dealer. We help the car dealer to sell an EV with

confidence. And the numbers are showing that car dealers get all the way up to 500 or 1,000 euros,

a dollar, sorry, more for an EV if they put it on the market with one of our independent

certificates. So what's the difference between this report and the status report that shows up on

the dashboard of the EV, like? Well, you're probably referring to the state of charge,

which is shown on the dashboard, which has, which you can tell I don't own an EV. So yeah, no.

Yeah, you get the state of charge, which tells you the car is fully charged, but even a bad

battery can be fully charged. And you know that from the smartphone, right? When it's brand new,

it's all good. And after two years, it's empty at lunchtime, even though it was fully charged

in the morning. And that's because these batteries, these lithium-ion batteries,

they get worse over time. They degrade, right? They cannot store energy as good anymore.

And the same thing happens in an EV traction battery worth tens of thousands of dollars.

And that's why we need the battery test. The consumer wants to see it and they're ready to

spend more. So what makes your test so proprietary that you're able to provide information about

the battery that the manufacturer that EV doesn't provide on the dashboard? Like, it seems to me,

I get it in the gas engine. There may not be as much diagnostic stuff available to like,

give a report like that back. But in EVs, like, it's in there somewhere. Like, why don't the OEMs,

why don't the manufacturers make that available on the dashboard or in a report as a printout?

Well, it's, it's a very complex matter. Yeah, we have a team of 80 people working on that for

seven years now. I did start the company all the way back in 2016 when I got my first EV and,

you know, I was quickly sold on EV and thought about services that would be needed

in the future. So it's a complex thing. And we spend a lot of time and effort to do that.

But more importantly, even is that our test is independently, right? It's independent. You might

not want to have an OEM telling you that his battery is great, right? You want an independent

assessment from a third party, inspection party. And that's the role we play as an inspection

company here, providing a test system that is independent. It's also harmonized across all

brands. So we calculate the state of health in the same way, no matter if it's a BMW, a Ford,

or any other brand. So it's that independent aspect that's really important.

So as you think about all the different manufacturers, Tesla and everybody else that does EVs,

is there a, is there a type of vehicle that's tougher for you to pull this diagnostic report

from as you spent all these years with all the engineers trying to come up with it?

Well, as you could probably guess, Tesla is making it more difficult than others. Yeah.

But there's, we still found the ways or there is, you know, adapter cable that you need,

but it comes in the box. And as a car dealership, you can test all different Tesla models. And

you don't even need to know which model exactly it is. There is such a variety with different

battery sizes. Our box, once it's connected, it's able to figure out exactly what battery variant

is in the vehicle, and it'll be printed on the report. Wolfgang, do you agree then that if we're

trying to focus on sound used EVs, which is going to be this next wave that's coming through,

the battery health is an even more important indicator of quality of the vehicle over mileage.

Like I think a traditional used car buyer is always sorting by price and miles, but you think

we're going to get to a point, or should we get to a point where we are leading with, hey,

here's my used EV. It has 97% battery health. Absolutely. So we could even say the state

of health is the new mileage, right? Because you can have two exact vehicles with the same

mileage even, and one has a great battery health and the other one doesn't. So the mileage doesn't

help you a lot anymore, right? It still helps you on evaluating wear and tear on brakes and tires,

but not on the battery anymore. And some used car platforms have already started to introduce

filters and the value where you can even sort out vehicles and say, hey, show me only vehicles

that have a battery test or that are above a certain state of health, right? And that's certainly

going to be at that value that defines the whole value of the used EV. Do you think that this will

start to become a tool in service departments? Like, if I'm a customer, I've got my EV, I'm bringing

it into the service department. Maybe I'm a GM dealer. Like, do you have some dealers that will

plug it in, assess the health, and then they'll, they'll suggest repairs to the vehicle to the

battery, even replacement based on that health report? Yes, absolutely. It can be used in the

service business, could also be offered to a customer as a service. And the good thing is

that our battery test is really down to a cell level. So we are able to identify a defect cell

and therefore a defect module so that even it's helpful for dealership to know which

module could be replaced if, you know, if we're talking about battery repairs.

And we can identify that very cell that is causing the trouble.

Lauren Klein asks a great question online. She says, is there any kind of guarantee you

offer with this information, thinking about like a car fax buyback guarantee or something similar?

Yeah, that's a great question. Stay tuned on that. There is more to come. Something along

those lines will be introduced early next year. Yeah. So what's the charge to a dealer for

having this diagnostic tool in the store? How do you do that? Yeah, so what we do is we license

the equipment. It's a 40 US dollar per month and box or per rooftop. One car dealership only needs

one. So it's a relatively inexpensive device. And then we charge $35 per battery test. And

what we see is that car dealers are able to sell their EVs for anywhere between $501,000 more

if they put it online with one of our battery tests. So the 35 euros comes in multiple times

easily. So the per pole includes the certificate plus some sort of a link where if they want to

post it online, it'll kind of like a car fax report. Is that what you're saying? It's quite

similar to that. Yeah, the battery certificate is issued in real time. It's sent over to the

car dealer as an email attachment or some larger customers are using our API to integrate it directly

into a dealer management system. And then they can use that and put it directly on the use car

platform so customers can see, hey, this is a tested vehicle. It has a Navilo battery certificate. So

I can purchase this vehicle with confidence. So EV rebates are over. I'm going to ask is your

last question to pontificate a little bit on what the future of EV looks like here in the United

States. What do you what do you make of demand and use cars for EVs over the next six months?

Do you have any opinion or feedback on that? Yes, I mean, currently we see relatively low prices

for used EVs. That's not because these are cars are bad. But of course, there is always, you know,

new cars coming in a bigger batteries faster charging time. So technology evolves very quickly

on EVs. But I think we have reached a point now where you can you can buy a two, three,

four year old EV without, you know, hesitation, of course, as long as it has a battery test.

And I'm pretty sure we'll see used EV prices rebounds and getting up again, because they're

just very low now. And these are great cars. So if you're in the market for used EV, go for it now.

You get a lot of car for for a little money. So what does a service department do? I've got like

a let's say I've got a Tesla. It's a used car. I've already bought it. I run the test.

The battery performance test says it's not good. What do I do with that car?

Well, you might still have, you know, there might still be a warranty on it. So you have,

you know, you have a proof in your hand that the battery needs, you know, needs repair or needs

replacement. So it helps you a lot to turn back to, you know, your AM and claim claim battery warranty.

And ideally, as a as a on a car dealership side, right, if you if you're taking trade-ins,

if you're buying EVs, you run the test before buying them, right? That avoids you to buy any,

you know, a bad any lemon here with a bad battery. And on the sales side, same, you run the test

and and and your your customer will appreciate the transparency and customer sees dealerships

that offer that certificate just as way more trustworthy and reliable than than dealerships

that don't. Yeah, that's fascinating. You know, really, you're working to solve a major concern.

It's interesting. You think about like plasma TVs 20 years ago, super expensive. They came down as a

technology got less expensive. When do you think the the cost of EV batteries will come down to

answer it with some of that other technology? What do you see the next six 12 months? Well,

we get some relief. Well, because of batteries, they came down a lot in the last five years,

right? It's a long process, not about six or 12 months, right? But I think we will very soon see

price parity between gasoline cars and EVs, right? Where you, you know, you get a very,

a very nice CV for for the same price as a gas car. And then, well, you can make your choice.

Yeah, but there's very, you know, ready for the simple cars, you don't have gearboxes that can

break down or clutches or anything like that. And, you know, of course, driving EVs, I love them,

I love the acceleration and the power they have. But, you know, both cars are great. Some

also mechanical engineers. So I also love combustion engines. Yeah. Well, Wolfgang Berger,

founder of Avalu. We appreciate you being on the show sharing your perspectives on all things EVs,

battery, battery health and how to make sure you don't how to avoid that time bomb of buying the

wrong EV with a bad battery. Wolfgang, appreciate you being on the show. Thank you very much for

having me. One last word. If you're a digital dealer week in Vegas or use car week in November,

or as you mentioned at another show in February next year, we will be there. So

we can see you at any of these trade shows around the US.

Thank you. Thanks for the live demo, too. That was super, super cool.

Thank you for having me. Thanks, Wolfgang. Bye.

It is a problem. Like, how do you buy a used car when you don't know what's lying under the

hood? And you know, it's interesting you think about the best used car managers and all of

automotive, they can feel the problem in that in turn, you know, the ice engine, the gas engine,

the old engine. So they say, although sometimes they may not be right. But EVs, you got no idea,

you get in there, you're like, it seems okay. I do this once a year, not EV related, but I get

a new iPhone every year, and I list my old iPhone for sale. And now they stack them based off, yes,

price and battery health. So there's no used electronic listing that has a battery that is

now not taking into account battery health, because that's what matters. Why don't the

manufacturers put battery health on their dash? I don't think he hit the nail on the head. I think

it's probably to separate themselves a bit. They got what most of them have a 10 year, 100,000,

right? So. Yeah, well, Lauren Klein says battery lifespan is one of the biggest hang ups for

consumers. Looking at a pre owned EV, and I think that's absolutely correct, just because we don't

understand it. So companies like his Wolfgang, they're kind of dispelling the, the, think about

handing 150,000 mile gas car compared to 150,000 mile EV, but the battery is 97%. Like, yeah,

two completely different cars. Yeah. All right, let's, let's keep going. Next, we turn to director

of learning and development at principal auto group, Fabula Mathis. Welcome to show Fabula.

Hi, thanks so much for having me. All the way from Texas. So Fabula, we're going to ask you

our first question. We ask everyone, which is how's business is part of that? Just tell us a

little bit about yourself and your auto group. So I'm with a principal auto and we are a multi

rooftop across different cities that we have store out in Memphis. We have one in Greatvine,

Corpus Christi, and then also here in San Antonio in the Bernie area. So we are definitely expanding

and growing pretty quickly. Very cool. And how's business? Business is great. We're actually

looking at different options for, you know, acquiring, like for example, we just had our

grand opening at our Hyundai of Bernie store, which is fantastic, especially since the Bernie in

the hell country area are growing pretty, pretty quickly there. Yeah. So you're the director of

learning and development from your perspective as you're growing quickly. What are some of the

best practices that you're implementing to help ensure culture stays intact and people are able

to execute and do the do their job correctly? What are some of the tips you'd give groups that

don't have a department dedicated to what you're doing? So the biggest thing is I have a fantastic

recruiting department that does really great job at getting the right people here. We do a culture

index that kind of helps us to bed personalities because when you're a certain type of personality,

you know that you're either going to thrive or you're going to have a little bit of difficulty

in a role that you're in. So that's the first thing that they do is they make sure that the

recruiters are aligned with the culture of the company and what they're looking for. Okay. I'm

going to stop you there before you go to the next one. So you said a personality test. Which

personality test do you do or what test do you do to kind of test for that? What are you looking for

when you do that? So what we're looking for and that is just your personality. So I can kind of

show you on my name tag. I was like to take it off and show it. So this is what it looks like on

everybody's name tag. There we go. Okay. And it kind of gives you different points on someone's

personality. So for example, the red dot means something different than the yellow, the blue,

and the green. So everybody has this on their name tags throughout the entire organization. So when

you have a conversation with somebody, you know how to speak to them. So that really helps in

development and growing the right culture because you want to have the right people in the right

role kind of like what Kelsey was talking about. So from a practical standpoint, I know their

personality. I see their graph and I walk up to you and I see your name badge and presumably I'm

trained enough that I understand what those dots mean and what is their different language that I

use to engage with the person that way. And then like what's the impact from a financial standpoint

to the group utilizing that? So the biggest thing is yes, just like we have a different

conversation with everybody. Back in the day, like when I was selling cars, they taught you

one way and one way only, which was no way. All they would do is hey, go get a customer and you'd

be like, I don't even know where the bathrooms are. Like, come on guys, help me out here. And so

this kind of helps us teach them about communication, which is number one thing that I tell everybody

all relationships in your life are going to fail if you don't learn to effectively communicate with

that. But Fabiola, you don't need to focus on communication today. It's all about AI and technology

and texting and Snapchat. Like, I don't need no stinking communication. What do you say to that?

Of course you do. You know, consumers are still coming into dealerships and a lot of people think

that they can buy online, but people are starting to see, hey, I did buy it from Carvana and I didn't

have the best experience because you have no experience. Something just showed up like an

Amazon box to my front door and there was nothing emotional about it. There was no excitement. There

was no buildup. There was no cycle of purchasing. So I tell everybody, this is all emotional and

relationship based. And if you don't have the right people that know that and can actually see it

from a standpoint from hiring, then you're going to fail. You're going to fail at putting the right

people at the right places. So let's go back to your name badge and then we'll go to our next

topic. But I'm super curious about that. Showing your name badge with the different dots,

will you just walk us through what dots specifically tell us and then we'd love to know

which test and how much the test costs. So I see the red dot. I see the yellow dot. I see

I think blue and then green. I think is what I've got. So what does that mean? How do I interpret

that as an employee of principle? So kind of as a good rule of thumb, the red one is about power

and taking on challenges and being a leader. So for example, mine is far right. So I tend to

take on leadership roles immediately versus somebody who wants to be told what to do and

wants to be directed instead of taking the direction upon themselves. Somebody is yellow. I am far,

far, far right. Yellow, which means I am a social butterfly. So somebody who is far left tends to

work really well in a support role. For example, maybe in the parts department where you're not

constantly communicating with a lot of people, but you're very organized. The next dot is going to be

your blue dot and your blue dot is actually your patience. So that's kind of one of my

bows in my life that I don't have. That means you don't have patience. Got it. I don't have patience,

but for me, it's more of I don't have patience when somebody's investing into you and they're just

not caring. That's my answer, by the way, when people don't try hard enough and realize their

potential. That's the frustrating thing. So what's the name of the test and how much is it?

So this one is I'm not familiar with the actual name. All I know is we have it internally for our

company and we just call it our CI test and it doesn't cost the service person or the new employee

anything. We do this at recruiting. So when you first come into the company, it's all about

knowing who you are so we can get to the next conversation or not. So and then the very last

one is kind of my favorite. It is the green button, which is about structure. So are you somebody who

thrives in a structure like area? So this is somebody who like for me, I've have always taught

whether I was a general manager or the director of learning and development. I've always been very

process oriented. You know, you do it one way, it builds your confidence and there are some people

that are just kind of wall flowers. They're kind of, you know, the butterflies that just like to

pull creative from everywhere, but those people are great in different roles as well. So I think

it all starts with finding the right people. It is truly interesting about in automotive. You

got to find the right people for the right roles, but just because they come in in the wrong role

doesn't mean they don't necessarily end up in the right way, right? If you've got a super intentional

approach to trying to figure out how do we career path you through the organization. Automotive

is great. There's plenty of room for everybody. You can find, I think you can find that right

role. So one challenge and you kind of alluded to this fabula is beginning employment at any

auto group. So our prior guest said, Hey, I got into automotive, never thought I'd stay, by the way,

same here, right? I always thought I'd go on and have my real job at some point. How do you,

how do you a principal auto group think about that day one and that first week or so,

giving an employee a great experience so that they find they feel fulfilled at work.

What does that first day and first week look like for you? So basically that has actually

been the biggest thing that they brought me in for was to focus on that is onboarding,

because if you have a first grade impression, it doesn't matter if you're the receptionist and you

have a big smile or you're selling a car or you're an ASM, the first impression is everything.

So we want to have a great first impression and say, Hey, we're here. We're here to support you.

We're here to give you some structure. And we want to make sure that you thrive in that environment.

So what I put together is a 10 day onboarding program for all client advisors, which are sales

people. And I go day by day, hour by hour, what they should be doing within the first two weeks.

So you work Monday through Friday for the first two weeks. And by the time you finish your second

week, you will have already taken a nap, taken a phone call, know how to make an outbound phone

call, know how to work for internet leads, and then also have your expectations from your leadership

team. So if you're closing at a percentage less than this, you're going to be, you know, put back

on probationary so that you can learn a little bit more about it. Maybe you're not so strong on the

phone. Okay, well, if you're closing less than this percentage, then we're going to put you back on,

you know, shadowing somebody. And I know as a manager that I can follow up with that

by using KBS. How do you track all that fabulous? Is there a system or a process that you track all

that? Because presumably you've got a lot of employees between you've got Toyota, BMW, VW,

Hyundai, Mini Volvo, Infinity, all that. How do you track all that? So what I do is I actually

track every single one of my owners every single Monday. And I have a meeting with them at 1030

every single Monday, because everybody's here for first and second shift. And I just have

honest conversations with them. Hey guys, how's it going? Do you have your onboarding? Do you have

your manager supporting you? Do you have your logins? And I go by that checklist and make sure

that they're holding them accountable. So on that sheet that I've created, you have your day to day

and it asks two questions. The first question that you're asked at the beginning is, what do you feel

confident in doing today? And number two, what do you find as a challenge already? So asking those

questions and sitting down with your manager on a day to day basis for two weeks is giving them

purpose, giving them structure, because if somebody can learn to have structure within the

dealership, they're going to thrive in anything that they do. So it also it kind of keeps the

manager accountable as well. So hey, it's your job to train them, because the salesperson doesn't

fail because of themselves, they fail as a combination of both. So the sales managers really

have to be there to support them. And the employee has to be there to listen as well.

So what do you do fabula with those sales people, finance people, GMs, others that are like, you

know what, fabula, I appreciate this. Thanks for all the structure and all the training help you're

doing. But you know, it's not for me. I'm really good at selling cars and I can do it without any

help. I don't need, I don't need this. I don't need to take the personality test. I don't need to do

all the other things. What's your response? Because you run into that, right? Yeah, all the time. And

I tell them, hey, if you're selling 15 cars, you do you boo boo, you know, just kind of one of those

statements. And I tell them, hey, if you're thriving the way that you're doing it. Yeah. Hey, if I teach

you one thing today, whether it's how to progress, how to change your vernacular, how to do something

differently so that you can get ahead. Because, you know, the definition of insanity is doing

the same thing and expecting different results. Well, if you're tapped out at 14 cars, and you

can't get past that, maybe anything that I will say in the next day or two will help develop you

into getting to that 15 car guy, that 16 car person. So constant development is actually

something that everybody should seek. So if you are not seeking constant improvement and growth,

and especially in this industry that, you know, just like Wolfgang was talking about EVs, we've

got AI coming in, we've got so many changes that if you're not progressively changing with the

business, you're going to fall behind and you're going to be stagnant and then you're going to

fall below the pack in comparison to somebody who's actually actively changing and wanting to grow.

I love that response. I love that answer. And here's what's the truth of automotive today is,

if you got into automotive as a salesperson four or five years ago, three to five years ago,

you completely misunderstand a lot of them do about what it takes to succeed, right? A lot of

those X's and O's, dotting eyes, crossing T's just got missed during the exuberance and the crazy

times that were started in 2020 and kind of went up to a couple years ago. Training sales people

is awesome. Is there like a training system that you're utilizing or when you're thinking about

training on talking to a new customer and going through steps to the sale and whatnot,

who, what process are you using and who's conducting that training fabula?

I'm doing all of that training. So I travel amongst all six of our stores. I actually created the

principal sales principles, which do a step by step, starting with the meet and greet, ending with

your follow-up. And I go step by step at every single store. I make sure everybody signs in and

learns the way to develop a customer because you don't eat a chocolate cake in just one bite. You

got to take little baby bites and learn. And I've never been a type of person that can sit in a

classroom and learn by PowerPoints. I'm totally against that because when you're in the car business,

your brain works way faster than normal. You know, all of us are high energy. We got to go. We want

to learn in 30 seconds. Let's go. Let's sell a car. And so my coaching, I keep everything under 30

minutes. And most of my coaching is one-on-ones. So I spend most time sitting down with my sales

managers. So what I do is at the beginning of the month and mid-month, I sit with every single

manager and I go over their KPIs of their team. And they tell me who they see is struggling

through their KPIs and through their personalities. So that's when we game plan together kind of like

as a team. And then that's when I go sit with those people that need a little bit more development

in something because I'm a one-size-fits-all versus everybody's going to fit to what I want to do.

So what you are doing is so important in automotive today. What would you say to

a dealer principal that's watching this show today in October of 2025 and he or she are like,

look, I'm not sure it's worth the investment for the type of role Fabiola has. Like,

it costs to have that role in. What would you say to them about being reticent or hesitant to add

the position, the value of it? Because I see the value in it, but not every group has it.

Yep, correct. And you know what? If you guys are willing to invest in having snacks and water

bottles for your guests, why won't you invest in having a coach side by side with your team?

Because I guarantee you that if you're not constantly a general manager that is walking

through the service department, walking through technicians, walking on the sales floor,

you're going to miss something. And if you have somebody who's constantly training,

like for example, I don't just train client advisors. I train ASMs, service directors.

I've worked in every facet of the dealership because as a previous general manager,

I've kind of managed it. So I have the coolest job because I can go everywhere and I can teach

everybody and watch everybody develop, but you have to invest into this. Everybody invests on

more third party vendors. Hey, all these third party vendors, more money to get more leads,

but who cares how many leads you get if your people are not managing them correctly? Who cares

when somebody walks in and your four managers are not paying attention? And this keeps sales

managers accountable. It keeps client advisors accountable. And it's a system that kind of

checks itself. So as we wrap up here, last question or so, you've got a bunch of different brands,

Toyota, BMW, VW, Hyundai, Mini, Volvo, Infiniti. Is there a brand that better supports your training

efforts and kind of coordinates and collaborates with you? And is there one that's a challenge?

Let's start with the best one. I think all of them do because I've met every single OEM trainer

for all the organizations and all the brands and they're so kind and I've sat in their training

so that I can be aligned with their training styles. So like at our Volvo store, I sat with

the Volvo trainer so that I know that how Volvo wants to position their training program,

same thing with their BMW OEM trainer. So I like to be a partner and I like to get advanced in it

because I can also be a better trainer and a better partner if I teach them to listen.

And that's the biggest thing that I try to do. So Fabula, we connect on this here at the Ziggler

Auto Group. Aaron Ziggler 20 years ago or plus hired a high school principal, his name's Mike Van

Ryan, to head up our talent and leadership development courses. Araya Daniels and he

worked together and they travel across all 41 rooftops. They're engaged in training, development,

hiring, processes, what it looks like on that first day. And I want to make an invitation to

you and actually everybody can do this. Tonight on Ziggler Auto Group's YouTube channel, we have

a live stream that starts at 615 and we're going to do what you talk about. We're going to actually

have salespeople walk around each one of these five vehicles behind me and do a good old fashion

walk around, right? And some people would say, I'd be curious your response. Hey, in today's world,

you don't need to do a walk around anymore because technology replaces that. Consumers can go out and

find all the information they want on their own. Consumers don't want to be shown. And I think

that's maybe one of the biggest lies in automotive is that you can skip good product knowledge,

you can skip good setup because technology will take that away from you. And that's why

we go back to this old fashion process with our salespeople and we crown a champion, which we'll

do tonight. But what's your take on that? I don't need to do no stink and walk around because

technology will do it for me. What do you say to that, Fabiola? So I tell everybody, you know,

when I teach them, I tell them, hey, a customer walks in with an emotional piggy bank with them

and the more emotional deposits you make when it comes to the numbers and negotiation,

you have a lot more there to cash out on and they're a lot less resistant. So you have to

emotionally deposit and the walk around is one of the biggest components because when you do

your needs analysis, did you listen to my needs? Did you find the right car? And number three,

a walk around, what people forget is a walk around isn't showcasing the car. They're usually

pretty sold on the brand already. What you are doing your walk around is based upon your relationship

with your client and telling them this vehicle fits your needs and this is why. And Fabiola needs.

All right, very good. Fabiola Mathis, Director of Learning and Development at Principal Autogroup.

Thanks for being on the show. Thanks for joining us today and sharing your perspectives on all

things training and development. Thanks for being here. Thanks, Fabiola. Well, that's fun. I love it.

We believe in that training. We believe in that development, but it's not something everybody

invests in. So it's a channel. And everyone should because I mean, I'm fired up right now.

I'm 20 years in the business and I'm still looking to be 1% better every single day. So to have those

resources, like you guys provide in your group and like they're doing, that's the leading edge.

You know, not everyone wants to suck. They want to be good. Give them the resources.

All right, go find the Ziggler Auto Groups YouTube channel, Yuli, and log in tonight and then you

can vote live for who's the best of the five. I love it. You'll see a lot of former walk around

champion. I am too. So I sold Saturn's and I went to a big competition. I still have a little wooden

trophy from them. Now, what does that say about me? Saturn's no longer, right? My talent is no

longer needed in the Saturn world. That's right. And I hit it. They had the old walk around where

you actually beat the living daylights out of the thing. So Sean H says technology doesn't build

the emotional connection needed for the experience. And I agree with that 100%. So Yuli, don't forget

Friday coming up. We've got our F and I roundtable. DNC, thanks. Can't wait for Friday's F and I

roundtable session. We're going to bring on some of the best in the automotive industry in F and I.

We're going to have a debate around what is the current state of F and I? Where are we headed?

What are some of the big pitfalls? And at the end of the day, with all things technology and AI,

do we still need finance managers? Really? So it's going to, it promises to be a fun,

action packed episode for everybody, dealers and everybody else included. So Yuli into our

loyal Daily Dealer Live audience. Thanks for watching today. Daily Dealer Live where we break

down the biggest moves in the car business as they happen. Broadcasting live from Ziggler Motorsports

here in Kalamazoo, Michigan. Don't forget we're back Friday with our F and I roundtable and we're

here live every Monday, Wednesday, Friday, 1pm. So if this is your world, hit like, subscribe,

turn on those notifications so you'll never miss a beat. And we'll see you next episode,

everybody. See you Friday.

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