A used car aggregator is a business that helps people sell or buy used cars quickly by handling many cars at once, making the process easier than going to a regular dealer.
A service contract is like an extra promise that your car will get fixed or maintained for a certain time, so you don't have to pay for some repairs yourself.
Used cars are cars that someone else owned before and are now being sold again. They usually cost less than brand new cars but might have some wear or issues.
ADAS windshields are special car windows that have cameras and sensors built into them to help the car drive safer. Because of these parts, they cost more to replace.
Concept
EVs coming off lease
When people rent electric cars for a few years and then give them back, those cars become available for others to buy or lease. This can make electric cars easier to get used.
The used car market is where people buy and sell cars that have been owned before. Prices and availability depend on how many cars are for sale and how much people want them.
Used EVs are electric cars that someone else owned before. They are becoming more popular because they cost less and more people want to buy electric cars.
Market day supply tells you how many days it would take to sell all the cars like this one if no new cars came in. A low number means the car sells very fast.
A regular hybrid car uses gas and electricity together, but you can't plug it in to charge. It charges its battery while you drive.
LIVE
You don't have to worry about the consumer not trusting you anymore.
You have to worry about chat GPT not trusting you.
And that's a very scary thing.
It's everyone's dream to grow, to be a bigger dealer, to be a better dealer,
or even get your first dealership.
Car buying is about the people.
Everybody wants to know what's a car business like and they like to see the
under the hood.
Welcome to the Walkaround Podcast.
I am one of your hosts, Mark Spoto, joined by my co-host, Heather Wilkinson.
Hello, Heather.
Hello, Mark.
And I can't wait to get into the conversation with Brian around digital
transformation, the used car market, the opportunities that are out there for
dealers.
I mean, Brian shared so much insight.
Has he always done?
He always does.
He's the EVP of dealer growth and success at Cars Commerce.
But you know, Brian's been in the industry.
He's been in retail for 30 years.
And he has such a unique perspective on what's happening from a digital
perspective, but also how can dealers just be better in their process?
And then also around how FNI technology can really drive the attachment
rate and products and a little insight on interest in the technology intent.
We talked to him about guide.
Yes, we did.
All right.
Let's, let's get to it.
Let's take a walk around with Brian Kramer.
Well, we are thrilled to have the one and only Brian Kramer with us on the
Walkaround Podcast.
I think for the third time, Brian, yes, yes, this is such a pleasure.
We always love having you, your insights, your perspective on the industry.
Let's jump right in.
Let's go.
I love mixing it up with you guys.
It would not be an industry update without having your expertise.
So we really appreciate you being here, Brian.
I appreciate you.
So obviously you are involved in all things digital.
What should dealers be thinking about when we talk digital retailing in 2026?
This has been an ongoing topic for the industry for years.
Where are we at?
Where are you, where do you see it going?
Have we gotten further than we've ever been?
Tell us what you're thinking.
Yeah.
And it's almost like a sequel to what we've been talking about the last few years,
right?
And why are dealers not being more transparent overall?
You know, some of them are, but why don't they provide more information?
And we finally crossed that threshold, I think now, especially with AI, AI search.
So like what we're doing right now with cars.com is we've got an AI tool called Carson.
It allows clients to know no different than chat GPT or something like that to do
long-tailed searches on our website, but it's referencing, just like with chat
GPT, Gemini, Perplexity, it's going to reference trusted signal citations.
So reviews, and it's going to do almost like a truth serum.
So as we see on our dealer-inspired websites, we've got like 7,000 websites,
and we look to see what happens on a website, what causes consumers to convert.
What causes them to convert is the, if you're going to show up in a chat GPT or
at Google AI overview, for instance, there's only one answer.
And how that answer is determined is determined by digital trust.
So it's going to say, I'll give you an example.
If you say you have 60 minute oil changes and your reviews, which there's
dealers, many dealers in this situation, the reviews say it takes two hours, two
and a half hours to get an oil change.
You're not going to show up because the large language model doesn't feel like
you can trust you.
Less is more in 2026, and it's never going back.
But the other thing is, is that you've got to really live up to these standards.
And you've got to, you've got to guard that because you don't have to worry
about the consumer not trusting you anymore.
You have to worry about chat GPT not trusting you.
And that's a very scary thing.
And the ones that are the most trusted and the most transparent and the most,
you know, frictionless and easy, similar to this, you know, your new product guide,
I just saw when you're doing things like that.
The LLM knows it and it knows that people aren't bouncing and it knows that
they're more engaged and the more engaged you can keep people, the more they're
going to transact and the more it's going to recommend you and pull them at the
top of the feed or the top of the search.
Yes.
Or even as the answer, if you get on chat GPT and you ask it a question, right?
It'll then tell you, would you like me to show you how to do this?
Give you the answer.
You want to be that answer.
Do you feel like, you know, the dealers that we talk to seem like they're
still sort of mixed in reviews of AI and how it's really helping their business?
Do you think they're not seeing enough of the opportunity or are they right to be
cautious?
And I think where I'm going more specifically is like customer contacts,
communication, you know, that I think consumers are still a little bit unsatisfied
dealing with that side of AI and would rather talk to a person.
So do you think dealers should be focusing more on this type of AI technology
that's helping them from an operational standpoint rather than focus on the customer
contact?
He always has the good question.
So goes deep.
Yes.
And I think that dealers should be very cautious because there's a lot of shiny
objects here and there's a lot of AI and everything stamped with AI and you know,
made with AI, but it's not all real.
And there's different levels of it, right?
And there's some that are generative and some that are self healing and some of them
that are just what they call RPA.
It's repeatable, programmable actions where they retrofitted something and they're
not building something new.
You know, like as you're building this native, you know, guide, you're building
it with that infrastructure, I'm sure, but somebody that built something three
years ago, it's not the same.
If you just go and put AI on it, it has to be, you know, built from within.
To break this down in the most simplistic level for our listeners, Brian, I'm a dealer.
I've got my website.
I've got chat GPT.
I have my use car inventory.
Give me three things I should be thinking about.
You should be thinking about from a use car inventory standpoint, how you index
with your photos, with your merchandising.
There's a very specific way, like with AccuTrade, we've built this into our new
inventory management tool where it's written in schema, which is what's easier
for a bot or an agent to read.
And right now, for the first time in history, more than half of the internet
traffic overall is bots and agents, and it's not going back.
So you've got more traffic online from that than you do from humans.
So you have to appeal to that customer and you have to appeal to a bot or robot.
I get that bot or agent to recognize my inventory, recognize my dealership and
recognize your photos.
So some people are going too far on AI photos and it doesn't have a shadow and
it looks like it's floating.
Google doesn't like that, right?
So it has to look real.
It values authenticity.
It doesn't want cookie cutter comments and, you know, just that sort of thing.
And to reference what Mark's talking about with the calls, the texts, there's a
lot of cookie cutter out there and there's a lot of average.
And if you've got a below average store, it can get you to average.
But if you have a good or an exceptional store, that's a different conversation.
And if you want to go to a real high level of excellence, a lot of these tools
don't allow you to tune the answers and personalize the personas to your
business, your dealership.
And that's a huge piece that I know that's a big piece of your product that I
just saw is the customization of it.
And so if I'm, if I'm a dealer, I want that on everything that I do.
I want it on my website.
I want it on my chat tool and I don't want the conflicting messages, which is
where you're going, where I've got one chat tool that does this.
I've got one AI tool that follows up, that doesn't communicate with this over
here, causes confusion for the customer, causes confusion for search engines.
And then nobody likes that whatsoever, especially the consumer, but also
the dealership associates.
It's just too confusing.
I think that I know that every dealership needs to be focusing on less is more
right now.
And if you got three or four, you know, what's my trade worth on your website?
Payment calculator, get pre approved.
If you have get pre approved, you have a subprime message that conflicts
with another page, anything that's not consistent, you're going to, you're
not going to be the answer that gets recommended by these engines.
Brian, you mentioned it a couple of times guide.
Thank you.
Shameless plug time.
What do you think?
What are your impressions?
I didn't even know this thing was coming out until I walked over here.
So kudos to you guys for keeping that under wraps.
Cause I like to think that I know what's going on.
And we were very surprised by that because keeping something under wraps,
it's typically not something you see in the automotive industry.
You're so plugged in.
You are.
You are plugged into so much until this morning, right?
But I was, I was, I was very impressed.
I'm actually still very impressed with what I just saw.
Wasn't expecting that.
Yeah.
And I'll just say this candidly, you, you, you guys are very good at execution.
You're consistent.
I don't think anybody executes better than you guys do.
I'm talking about this as a business, right?
This simplicity, pay plan, process, people, right?
And how it all ties together until now, until now.
And what I, and what I just saw was absolutely amazing.
I mean, it's dynamic.
It's intuitive.
You can tell it's powered by AI.
I don't know exactly how it's all built from, you know, behind.
But as I'm looking at it, I'm thinking about a recent experience I had selling
my vehicle to a large used car aggregator.
And as I'm looking at it, you know, that, that process was a little too easy.
And I think dealers need to be terrified of somebody else doing that.
And, and they're not matching that experience.
But that's, I felt that when I just went through that guide presentation,
that it felt very similar to that, that used car aggregators process of selling
my vehicle, it was just so easy.
It was so intuitive.
And my perception is it makes it almost too easy to buy products, you know,
but you could text somebody that you could email.
I'm thinking about it from a virtual standpoint.
If I, if I was in retail, I'd want that thing like yesterday.
That's good to hear.
Absolutely.
Well, we were going to come back to you in several months and see what other
impressions you're hearing about, about the product.
But let's, let's go on to something that we know is also near and dear to your
heart, used car inventory and appraisals.
What are some big opportunities for dealers to get smart with appraisals
and inventory management?
So there's a similar to AI.
There's a lot of things you can get lost in with used cars and you can get
in used car acquisition.
And everybody always says it's the biggest pain point along with consumer
affordability, the sourcing used cars from consumers.
And here's the ones that are doing it the best are putting their best foot
forward, they're being very transparent.
It's very simple, not a lot of steps on the, on the website in order to get from
A to B, but most importantly, the ones that I see that are winning.
And I use you guys as an example.
I'm not saying this because I'm here, but I use, I use JMA as an example where
when I, you know, I came into stores and from, took them from $600 a copy to
over $2,000 a copy.
And that doesn't just happen.
It's a series of small events that happen.
And I know that when I first started in the mid late nineties in F and I,
long time ago, I was, you know, $400 a copy was a good job.
And then, and then by 2010, $1,000 a copy was a good job.
And it's very easy to forget how that happened, right?
But I'll tell you what I didn't do or nobody in the industry did back then.
We didn't actively go out and interview the client at their, you know,
where they're located.
We didn't then go back and summary close them later on and tie our menu
presentation back to the needs analysis or the interview.
We also didn't core comp people.
We also tolerated below average performance because we didn't have really,
you know, disciplined metrics.
We didn't have a cadence account of accountability.
And I couldn't tell you what's my percentage of service contracts.
What's my prepaid maintenance?
What's my excess wear and tear?
What's my tire and wheel?
And I'm just going through my stony goal, you know, in my mind.
Yeah.
But so I, so as I talked to a lot of these dealers and they're like, well,
you know, we're, we're running $2,000 a copy and use cars.
And that's good operation.
Let's average, right?
But it's been $2,000 a copy since 1995, 2005, 15 to 25.
Whereas F and I is going up use cars or stays the same.
Now, the dealers that I work with that are using, you know, they're getting real
surgical with AccuTray to be able to source more use cars.
They, they spend more time pricing their wish list like, uh, like these other
use car aggregators do than pricing their age inventory because they source
the right cars, but more importantly, it's what I just experienced when I
sold my vehicle, they connect the online to the in store process seamlessly,
brilliantly at the basics.
And if you think about service contracts, you think about prepaid maintenance,
you think about tire and wheel in the use car world, it's the exact same thing.
Did you measure the tread depth?
Did you scan it with an OBD scanner?
Have you done the car facts?
Have you done the title history?
That's exactly right.
And no, in your opinion, it's more about process and less about the
technology that they're using.
Yes.
And I'm a technology guy.
And you can have all the tools and technology in the world.
If you don't have the right process, whether it's in use cars, F and I,
sales or service, it doesn't matter because it becomes a mute point.
It becomes something the dealer is just paying for over and over, but they
don't have a process that's followed consistently on every appraisal.
You just nailed it.
And we've got dealers, I can think of one dealer group that does an amazing
job and I said, you know, you tolerate these things and you use car department.
They don't anymore.
I said that you would never tolerate in your F and I department.
You would have somebody coming in core comping these people.
You're at 30% on this one metric.
You'd never tolerate that in F and I.
And you might have tolerated it 20 years ago in F and I, but you don't today.
Why do you do that in use cars?
And that same group I'm thinking about, they sell 40,000 plus use cars a year.
They doubled their, their average use car, PVR per vehicle, retailed two years ago.
And then they doubled it again.
Now their sales are up two, three percent, but when you're doubling your gross and
you're, and it's all it is is stopping the leakage.
Yeah.
So what was the, what was the key success factor to doubling in that particular
group's case?
They're, they were measuring tread depth, maybe 20, 30% of the time, like a normal
dealer is and tires right now are, are insanely expensive with the terrorists.
And some of them are up 30%.
They weren't, uh, taking the time to look at windshields.
And right now, you know, those ADAS windshields can be $3,200 with the safety
features in them.
And, you know, arbitrarily before they were like, Oh, it might be $600.
I'm just going to put a flat $1,500 recon on there.
And it wasn't being surgical when they weren't taking the time.
They weren't slowing down and they weren't treating it like their F and I
department and the dealers that we have that are treating their use car department
like an F and I department and they're executing and they're taking the online
appraisal and then masterfully, uh, with the client present, just like an
interview, right?
They're not back behind a, and then many still just do it behind closed doors.
Like they used to do F and I, right?
Oh yeah.
And then we'll run $800 a copy, but I'm not going to go out and get actively
involved with the customer.
The ones that are getting actively involved, they're going to connect wherever
the online appraisal was and they're going to say, here's what, here's what
the online appraisal was.
Here's, we just walked around this.
This is the difference.
And in many cases, $800, $900 a car and that difference times thousands
of car deals adds up and they typically use car managers, just eat it or the
new car department, just don't worry about that.
I don't want you to blow my deal.
And the customer knows they know that they're, and they're waiting for you to
do it, but you just have to be brilliant at the basics and I guess stick the landing.
You know, Brian, thinking about the basics, you know, dealers are always
looking for, um, the best place to find their used car inventory.
And really the, the best place for a dealer to find his used car inventory is
that trade that pulls in or in their service line, which you agree, right?
And we need that consistency of the process.
So how can service and sales teams really collaborate better together to more
effectively convert those high equity customers that are in the service lane?
And this is something we've talked about for decades and we still talk about it.
How do they get them more inclined to buy a vehicle at that dealership when
they're in that service department?
What could they be doing to work better together?
These questions today, Heather, that's a good one.
That's, um, a daily one for me.
So I just had this conversation last night that we deal with thousands
of dealers, obviously, um, we've got like 20,000 dealers on our products.
And as I, as I go around the country, there's not a single dealer that I'm aware
of and I visit them all, I seek them out to try to find the top at this.
And there's not a single one that uses technology without execution that,
that drives more than half a percent of acquisitions as a percentage of repair
orders that I'm aware of.
Now those stores that are three, four or five percent, but they're physically
going out, they're, they're greeting the clients.
They're not harassing them.
They're just asking them if they'd like to know what their vehicle is worth.
They're not pre-qualifying them.
They're not trying to determine what's their interest rate.
Can I lower their payment?
What do I, and trying to over engineer the deal is what they, because that's
where a lot of people make a big mistake.
They try to architect the whole deal and they get them and they waste a
bunch of the manager's time when they don't even know if the customer is engaged.
I would mind for commitment.
I would mind for interest or engagement instead of equity.
And a lot of these clients have negative equity, but intent is really what we
should be mining for rather than equity.
And it requires them walking up to somebody, shaking their hand.
All the, all the stores that are three percent or above are actively involved.
And when you're saying, how do you get the service department and the sales
department working together?
A lot of people overthink that.
And the big mistake I made is I was, you know, all excited.
I'm high five and we're acquiring a bunch of cars off the service drive.
And I didn't realize that the service advisor was just steaming.
And I'm asked, and typically they just internalize it.
And they're like, you know, everything's fine.
It's fine, fine.
And, and the technician that works for them that did the inspection that on those
three or four, uh, lines on the repair order are sitting back on their toolbox.
And then the internal advisor and the internal technician are rocking it out.
And they're, and they're setting records and we're celebrating them and all the
recognition, all you have to do is just make sure you keep the repair order open
and put it back to the advisor that the CP advisor and quit saying, well,
that's the process.
That's got to go to internals.
Just give it back to them.
And you don't have to pay spiffs.
You don't have to pay all these bonuses that blow your cop out of the water.
And everybody's happy.
And then you won't have to worry about sales and service friction.
They'll, the service advisors will come seeking out your salespeople and they'll
start selling cars for you.
So interesting.
I heard process.
I heard people.
I heard communication.
Pay plans.
Pay plans.
I didn't hear the next AI chat bot tool to improve that though.
No, Brian, on the last question for you, we know you're busy.
You got to get going.
But obviously with this wave of EVs coming off lease, you know, what do you
see, where do you feel that impact is going to make on the used car market?
And in particular, like from a pricing and being able to retail that perspective.
I'm super excited about that.
More excited than I've been about EVs ever on the used EVs specifically
because of the affordability, you're going to have more used EVs this year
that are sub $30,000, which are the cars that move the fastest.
And I think that you're also going to have a lot of people that buy their first
EV because they're going to be introduced because of these affordability things.
And there's a lot of people that I talk to them all the time in my, you know,
where I live and like, I would never have my doctor's model.
I would never have an EV and I go, are you sure?
I go, these, these deals are pretty strong.
No, I'm, I'm never going to do that for all these various reasons.
And then next thing you know, he's got an EV in his parking spot.
Like what happened?
He goes, man, I just, I try to look at everything else.
And the payments were double for the same dollar amount car.
And plus it does this and look at these doors and their goal, you know, all the things.
And at the end of the day, affordability is the biggest pain point.
And people will really quickly get over some of that stuff in order to do that.
But my favorite car, I don't care about, you know, all my favorite cars,
the one with the lowest market day supply that sells the fastest.
That's my favorite kind of car.
It was like, well, you like Ferrari, like the, no, I like the fastest turning car
that, you know, with the most amount of gross and the least amount of time,
those are the sexiest cars in the world to me.
So if you're a dealer this year, if you're a dealer today,
you would focus on acquiring EVs coming off lease.
I wouldn't just focus on acquiring EVs.
I would have a whole strategy on getting them from consumers.
I would be updating my website.
I would make sure that I'm optimized for on everywhere to be able to get those.
I would be the most aggressive best end user on those, but I would also be
updating my website and I would be educating consumers because that's the
other thing, how they find you.
You think that you've got to call people prospect them, but instead of going
around chasing butterflies with a net, I would rather build a butterfly garden.
And the flowers that attract the butterflies on EVs is comparisons.
You know, what's the difference between a PH EV and a BEV?
And what's a, you know, a plug in hybrid versus a regular hybrid?
What's the difference?
And when you start educating people, they're on your site now.
Well, what a, what a better parting image to think about than Brian and a
butterfly garden. Exactly.
That's amazing. Fly away butterfly. Yes.
It's tranquil. It's peaceful.
And it brings harmony to the industry.
Brian, thank you so much.
I also want to emphasize, get your quote, get brilliant at the basics.
I love that.
Well, then that's a good person to steal from.
Great advice.
Brian, thank you so much for your time.
Really appreciate.
Thank you, Brian.
Always fun.
We really appreciate you joining us today on the walk around and we hope
you enjoyed the episode.
Please be sure to like, share, subscribe and follow us.
We look forward to seeing you next time on the walk around.
About this episode
Brian Kramer shares deep insights on digital transformation in car retailing, emphasizing the critical role of digital trust and transparency in 2026. He explains how AI tools like Cars.com's Carson influence consumer conversion by prioritizing authentic, consistent dealer information that aligns with customer reviews. The discussion highlights the importance of appealing to AI bots through proper inventory indexing and authentic visuals, while cautioning dealers about overusing AI without integration. Brian also praises innovative tools like Guide for simplifying the buying process and stresses the need for dealers to streamline digital experiences to compete with used car aggregators.
Brian Kramer from Cars.com makes his third podcast appearance with us to share industry insights on the future of AI and digital retailing, how process drives profitability, and the wave of demand for used EVs in 2026.
For more information about our guest, visit their LinkedIn.
Episode Breakdown
0:00 - Brian returns for a third time!
2:00 - Digital retailing & AI in 2026
5:53 - Optimizing your dealership’s digital presence
8:30 - Brian’s first impressions on JM&A Group’s Gyde platform
10:33 - Getting smart with appraisals and inventory management
16:32 - How service and sales can collaborate on service lane acquisition
19:37 - The coming wave of used EVs
Liked this episode? Find our full episode library here.
