The Ferrari Luce Revealed! THIS CAR POD! EP113

The Ferrari Luce Revealed! THIS CAR POD! EP113 THIS CAR POD! with Doug DeMuro & Friends! · May 29, 2026

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117:33

Car

Ferrari Luce

The Ferrari Luce is a new Ferrari that’s fully electric. Unlike most Ferraris, it’s a four-door, five-seat car—so it’s meant to be more practical for everyday use.

Term

four motors

Instead of one electric motor, the car uses four—so it can control power to the wheels more precisely. That can help with grip and how the car feels when you drive it.

Term

1,050 horsepower

That “horsepower” number is how much power the car can make. For an electric car, it’s the combined output from its electric motors.

Term

US cycle

“US cycle” is the official test method used to estimate how far an EV can go on a charge in the U.S. Different countries use different test methods, so the range numbers can change.

Term

WLTP European cycle

WLTP is a standardized EV range test used in Europe. Because it’s a different test than the U.S. one, the same car can show a different range number.

Concept

collaboration between Ferrari's design studio and Joni Ive and his design firm Love From

Ferrari worked with Jony Ive and his design company to help shape the car’s look and design. It’s basically a high-profile design team effort, not just internal styling.

Person

Luca de Montesemolo

Luca de Montesemolo is an important Ferrari leader. Here, he’s being quoted about how Ferrari has a special reputation and how damaging that image could hurt the brand.

Concept

destruction of a myth

This phrase is about protecting a brand’s image and reputation. The idea is that if you change things too much, people might feel the “magic story” behind the brand is gone.

Term

prancing horse

The “prancing horse” is Ferrari’s famous logo. It’s a big part of what makes a Ferrari feel like a Ferrari, so changing it would upset fans.

Company

Ferrari's stock price

The speaker is talking about Ferrari’s stock price dropping after the announcement. They’re using that as proof that people beyond car forums are reacting negatively.

Company

Ferrari IPOed

An IPO is when a company first sells shares to regular investors. The speaker is saying Ferrari went public after Luca’s time, and that changed how the company grew.

Car

Ford Mustang

The Mustang Mach-E is Ford’s electric car. It’s meant to feel sporty like a Mustang, but it’s an EV crossover.

Concept

The host is describing a marketing strategy: using a famous car name to sell a very different product. The idea is that brand recognition can pull in buyers even if the underlying car concept (here, an EV) doesn’t match what enthusiasts expect.

Concept

offer an EV

They mean that in some countries, you basically have to sell electric cars to keep growing. If you don’t, customers and rules push you out of the market.

Car

Batista

The Batista is a very fast electric hypercar. In this segment, it’s mentioned as an example of an expensive performance EV that didn’t do well with buyers.

Term

four-door car

A four-door car is just a car with doors for both front and rear passengers. They’re saying this kind of practical layout is more popular in China than sports cars.

Term

0-60-25

They’re talking about acceleration test numbers—how fast the car gets up to speed. The point is that the Ferrari’s performance targets don’t sound impressive compared to what competitors can do.

Car

Lucid Air Sapphire

Lucid Air Sapphire is a fast, high-end version of Lucid’s electric sedan. They’re using it as the yardstick for how quickly it accelerates and how much it costs, to judge whether the Ferrari makes sense.

Term

0-60-1.8 seconds

“0-60” is how fast a car can go from standing still to 60 mph. Saying “1.8 seconds” is basically bragging that it launches extremely quickly.

Person

Johnny Ive

They’re referencing Jony Ive, a famous designer associated with Apple. The point is that his design influence is showing up in the Ferrari’s styling choices, like the round tail lights and interior details.

Concept

sentimental

Here, “sentimental” doesn’t mean feelings in general—it means sticking to tradition and nostalgia. The point is that Ferrari thinks it’s done well by not clinging to the old expectations and instead pushing new products.

Concept

EV strategies

“EV strategies” just means how a car company plans to switch to electric cars. The point here is that some brands tried it, but if buyers didn’t show up, they backed off and adjusted their plans.

Term

five-seater

A “five-seater” means the car can seat five people. The hosts are pointing out that this is a big deal for Ferrari because it changes the usual, more driver-only focus of many Ferrari models.

Person

Flavio Manzoni

Flavio Manzoni is a top Ferrari designer. In this part of the episode, they mention him because he’s the person responsible for the car’s design direction. The discussion is about whether that design would impress people like Enzo Ferrari or Steve Jobs.

Person

Enzo Ferrari

Enzo Ferrari was the founder of Ferrari. In this clip, they’re using him like a “would he approve?” test for the new car’s design. It’s about whether the car matches Ferrari’s original style and values.

Person

Steve Jobs

Steve Jobs is famous for how he pushed Apple products to be extremely well designed and easy to understand. Here, they’re using him as another “would he like it?” yardstick for the Ferrari’s design. It’s more about design taste than car mechanics.

Term

EV world

“EV world” just means the electric-car industry. The point here is that most EV makers don’t design everything themselves, so Ferrari doing the motor design is unusual.

Term

swap out for future battery cell type

They’re talking about batteries that are designed so they can be updated later. That way, if battery technology improves, the car can potentially use newer battery cell types.

Term

sound is captured from the vibration and the axles

Instead of playing a made-up sound through speakers, the car uses real vibrations from the drivetrain/axles as the basis for what you hear. Then it amplifies that so it sounds more “connected” to how the car is moving.

Term

false sound that's generated

Many electric cars use speakers to create an artificial engine-like sound. The host is saying this one is different because it’s based more on real movement than a purely fake sound.

Brand

BMW

BMW is mentioned as another electric-car brand that uses an artificial sound through the car’s audio system. The point is that it’s different from the vibration-based sound being discussed here.

Person

Hans Zimmer

Hans Zimmer is a well-known movie music composer. In this context, he’s being mentioned because BMW has used his style/branding for an EV sound experience.

Car

Jaguar Ipace

The speaker compares the Ferrari Luce’s styling to the Jaguar I-PACE, implying the Luce’s exterior design cues resemble the Jaguar’s next-gen look. This is a visual comparison rather than a technical claim.

Term

allocations

An “allocation” is basically a promised production slot—who gets to buy the car when there aren’t enough cars for everyone. Some people focus on getting those slots for the most wanted models.

Concept

new buyers

“New buyers” means Ferrari wants people who don’t already buy Ferraris to start considering the brand. The idea is that an EV might appeal to a different kind of customer.

Concept

allocation game

The “allocation game” is the behavior where buyers compete for limited manufacturer production slots rather than buying based on personal preference. In this segment, the hosts contrast that with Ferrari’s goal of attracting genuinely new customers for the Ferrari Luce.

Term

SP4

SP4 sounds like a code Ferrari uses to categorize which cars or allocation slots someone gets. In the conversation, it’s part of the “allocation game” people try to win.

Term

SP6

SP6 is another code in the same allocation system. The idea is that some buyers try to get the specific code that leads to the car they want.

Term

SP5

SP5 is another label/code used in the allocation system. The hosts are saying people try to get the “right” code so they end up with the car they want.

Concept

derivative

“Derivative” here means the design looks like it’s copying or closely resembling other things. One host thinks the Ferrari Luce looks too similar to other EVs.

Car

Lamborghini Huracan

The Lamborghini Huracan is a high-performance supercar made by Lamborghini. People buy it for speed and driving excitement. The podcast mentions it in relation to resale value—how much it’s worth later.

Term

resale

They’re talking about what a car is worth later when you sell it. The point is that Ferrari cars tend to hold their value better than competitors.

Car

MC20

They mention the Lamborghini MC20 as another supercar people could buy. The point is that Ferrari’s brand pull makes it difficult for other brands to attract the same level of attention and buyers.

Term

corrosion

Corrosion is when metal gets damaged by chemicals, often showing up as crusty buildup. On a battery, it can mean the connection isn’t working well, so you should check it.

Term

serpentine belt

A serpentine belt is one long belt that powers multiple parts of your engine. If it starts squealing or looks worn, it’s a sign it may need replacing soon.

Car

Ferrari SF90s

The Ferrari SF90 is a Ferrari supercar that uses both a gas engine and electric motors. The discussion is about how some SF90s aren’t holding value the way people expect, with prices dropping below the listed sticker price.

Concept

full departure

“Full departure” means this new car is a much bigger change than previous ones. The host is saying it may be the first time Ferrari really strays from the formula longtime enthusiasts expect.

Concept

connective tissue

“Connective tissue” here means the common traits that tie the cars together. The host is saying earlier Ferraris still had enough of the same “Ferrari feel” to satisfy enthusiasts.

Term

V12

A V12 is an engine with 12 cylinders arranged in two rows. The host is using it to point out that some Ferraris still use the classic, high-cylinder approach.

Term

V8

A V8 is an engine with eight cylinders arranged in two rows. In this segment, it’s mentioned mainly to compare engine types across different Ferraris.

Term

Apple iPhone guy

The host is comparing Ferrari’s direction to Apple’s approach—more focused on a modern, mainstream audience. The point is that Ferrari may be changing its style to attract people who aren’t traditional car enthusiasts.

Car

Porsche Cayenne

The Porsche Cayenne is Porsche’s SUV. The speaker is saying that when it first came out, some people thought it didn’t drive like a “real Porsche,” and that opinion influenced how others viewed it.

Car

BMW X5

The BMW X5 is a luxury SUV that’s meant to be comfortable and easy to drive. Some versions can feel heavier and less “car-like,” especially compared with sportier vehicles. That’s why people sometimes describe it as driving more like a truck.

Term

high powered EVs

This means electric cars that are really strong and fast. The speaker is saying we’ve already seen what that kind of power feels like in other EVs, so it’s hard to imagine a new one surprising people in a good way.

Term

EV

EV means the car runs on electricity from a battery. Instead of a gas engine, it uses electric motors to move the car.

Car

Honda Prelude

The Honda Prelude is a sporty two-door car made by Honda. It’s aimed at people who want something fun to drive rather than just a basic commuter. In the podcast, it’s mentioned as being surprisingly good for its price.

Car

Fiat Multipla

The Fiat Multipla is a small family-type vehicle made by Fiat. It’s known for having a very unusual, distinctive look. The podcast mentions it as an example of a car people consider a “modern classic.”

Concept

Resto mod

A restomod is an older car that’s been fixed up and upgraded with newer parts. It tries to keep the classic style, but make it drive better than the original.

Brand

Hagerty

Hagerty is an insurance company that focuses on collector and enthusiast cars. They’re often used when normal insurance doesn’t match how special or valuable the car is.

Person

Ryan Lopez

Ryan Lopez is the person mentioned as having a drift car. The hosts bring him up to explain why a collector-focused insurance company like Hagerty is relevant.

Term

tow hitch

A tow hitch is the metal connector on a vehicle that lets you attach a trailer or towing equipment. If there’s no tow hitch, you can’t tow in the normal, intended way.

Term

child safety tie

Child safety ties are the anchor points meant for installing a child car seat. Using them to tow a heavy vehicle is not what they’re designed for.

Term

hybrid

A hybrid uses a gas engine plus an electric motor. In this clip, they’re saying the towing vehicle is a normal hybrid minivan, not a special heavy-duty truck.

Car

Volvo C70

The Volvo C70 is a Volvo luxury car that can be made as a convertible. In the podcast, they mention a specific C70 with a blue roof setup. It’s brought up because the details of the roof color matter for identifying the car.

Car

Toyota Sienna

The Toyota Sienna is a family minivan. It’s the kind of vehicle people use to carry kids and gear, and here it’s being mentioned alongside the Cybertruck situation.

Term

all wheel drive

All-wheel drive means the car can send power to all four wheels. That usually helps it grip the road better than a car that only powers two wheels.

Term

platinum

“Platinum” is a higher trim level, kind of like a more option-packed version of the same model. Different trims can come with different wheels and features.

Term

wheels are articulating

Wheel articulation means the suspension letting the wheels move to follow bumps and dips in the ground. It helps keep the tires touching the surface, but if the truck is stuck deep enough, it still may need help getting out.

Concept

off road

Off-road means driving on rough, unpaved, or uneven ground instead of normal roads. It’s harder because the tires can lose grip and the vehicle can get stuck more easily.

Term

all terrain tires

All-terrain tires are tires made to work on both regular roads and rougher surfaces like dirt or gravel. They improve grip, but they can still fail to save you if the vehicle gets buried in soft ground.

Car

Cybertruck

The Tesla Cybertruck is an electric pickup truck with a very distinctive, angular design. Here they’re talking about it getting stuck off-road and needing help to get out, which shows that even a “tough-looking” truck can struggle if conditions aren’t right.

Car

Ford F-150 Lightning

The Ford F-150 Lightning is an electric pickup truck. It’s based on the F-150, but it uses electricity instead of gasoline. The podcast mentions it in the context of Ford’s decisions about the vehicle.

Car

Chevrolet C7

The Chevrolet Corvette is a sports car made by Chevrolet. It’s designed for fast driving and is known for being a strong performance value. In the podcast, it’s mentioned in the context of having multiple Corvettes lined up.

Term

coupé

A coupé is a car body style usually with two doors and a fixed roof. People use the term to describe the shape and layout of the car.

Brand

Asuna Sunrunner

The Asuna Sunrunner is a small, niche vehicle that was sold in the U.S. years ago. Here, they’re saying they’d accept that specific model.

Brand

GeoTracker

GeoTracker is another small, rugged vehicle name from the Geo brand. They’re pointing out that it’s not the same thing as the Asuna Sunrunner.

Company

General Motors

General Motors is the big car company behind this story. They made the Asuna brand to sell small cars in Canada and tried to make them feel more European, even though many were based on Japanese cars.

Concept

European flair

“European flair” is basically a marketing vibe. The host is saying GM wanted the cars to feel “European” to buyers, even though the underlying cars weren’t truly European.

Term

rebadged

“Rebadged” means the car is basically the same, but it’s sold with a different brand name and badges. The host is saying Asuna cars were Japanese cars with different branding for Canada.

Brand

Suzuki

Suzuki is a Japanese car company. The host is saying the Asuna cars were originally Suzuki designs before being sold under the Asuna badge.

Car

Pontiac Sunfire

The Pontiac Sunfire is a smaller, everyday car made by Pontiac. It’s not a high-end sports car; it’s more of a regular commuter type. The podcast mentions it as part of a joke or trivia question.

Car

Pontiac Gt

The Pontiac GTO is a muscle car, meaning it’s built for strong acceleration and performance. In the podcast, it’s mentioned because someone is clarifying the correct car name. It’s a well-known model among classic car enthusiasts.

Place

Le Mans

Le Mans is a super famous long-distance race in France. Cars have to last for hours, so it’s not only about speed—it’s also about staying reliable.

Car

Pontiac Le Mans

This is a Pontiac convertible that the podcast describes as a small and unusual car. The speaker is talking about it as something that’s not common or not what most people expect. The conversation focuses on the car’s odd identity and rarity.

Place

Lars Andersen

Lars Andersen is a popular car creator/event host. The conversation is basically saying Felipe will be there at his event.

Car

Ferrari 400

The Ferrari 400 is an older Ferrari model that’s extremely rare today. The conversation is basically about whether one might show up for sale or be mentioned, because it’s not something you see often.

Car

Ferrari 550

The Ferrari 550 is a well-known older Ferrari with a V12 engine. In the chat, they’re saying they’ve actually sold one through auctions, so it’s a real car people can buy and sell.

Term

federalized

“Federalized” means a car that wasn’t originally built for the U.S. was made legal to drive in the U.S. That usually requires meeting U.S. rules for things like emissions and safety.

Place

Lars Anderson Museum

This is a car museum tied to Lars Anderson. The hosts are joking that people should go there to see the guest’s project or story in person.

Person

Ian Callum

Ian Callum is a famous car designer from the UK. In this discussion, he’s mentioned as part of the creative side behind these modernized classic-car builds.

Concept

Singerized

“Singerized” is a slang term derived from Singer Vehicle Design, used to describe restomod-style builds that follow Singer’s approach: modern engineering and materials applied to an older Porsche. In the segment, it’s used to criticize how many imitators copy the formula without matching Singer’s execution.

Concept

restoration

They’re talking about the difference between restoring a classic car to stay close to original versus modifying it with modern upgrades. The point is that copying the idea isn’t the same as doing it well.

Car

Porsche 911

The Porsche 911 is a classic sports car that a lot of restomod companies use as a starting point. Here, they’re saying people buy an older air-cooled 911 and then pay huge money for upgrades.

Term

air-cooled 911

“Air-cooled” means the engine is cooled mainly by air passing over it, not by coolant in a radiator. Older air-cooled 911s are a common base for expensive classic-car upgrades.

Part

wiring harness

The wiring harness is basically the car’s electrical “wire bundle.” If it’s changed, it usually means the original wiring had a problem—like a connection or routing issue—that could lead to failures or dangerous overheating.

Term

chain drive system

A chain drive system is a way to transfer power using a chain. They’re bringing it up as an idea that might make repairs easier—so you wouldn’t have to pull the engine as often.

Term

catching on fire

They’re talking about a serious problem where the car can ignite. They connect it to electrical issues, which is why changes like updating the wiring harness matter.

Car

Ferrari 355

The Ferrari 355 is a classic Ferrari from the 1990s with a mid-mounted engine. Here, the host is basically saying the original 355 already looks and sounds great, and that changes made to it didn’t really make it better.

Car

Ferrari 280 TTO

The Ferrari 280 TTO is a historic Ferrari race car from the early era of modern racing. The host is using it as a style reference—suggesting the rear lighting and details feel like they belong on a classic Ferrari racer.

Term

20 miles an hour

They’re talking about the speedometer gauge design. Even though the car might be updated, it still keeps an old-school look—like showing “20 mph” in the same way it used to.

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Hello and welcome to this car pod.

I'm Sean.

And this is a very important episode of our podcast.

We recorded this episode a week ago because I am out of town.

So we recorded the whole thing. We were going to post it and then disaster struck.

Actual disaster. This is bad.

Real disaster. The Ferrari Luce is announced and we're sitting here. We have to comment on this.

We've got the biggest car pod. We have to comment our opinion and tell people how we feel about this thing.

So Ferrari Luce, Filippo, why don't you start us off with just the basic facts and then we'll get into what we think.

So Ferrari on Monday, yesterday was refilling this, revealed the Luce after months of like teasing the interior and teasing other things.

It is a five-seater four-door electric vehicle.

We'll get to some pictures in a minute.

It has something like a 1,050 horsepower from four motors, one on each wheel.

The rear ones produce 800 something of that.

We expected to have just shy of 300 miles of range in the US cycle.

A little bit over that in the WLTP European cycle.

It was developed and designed in collaboration between Ferrari's design studio and Joni Ive and his design firm Love From.

Joni Ive, of course, famous for his Apple work.

All right. I have a lot of thoughts about this.

The biggest of which is this is an absolute abomination and the single worst decision that...

I don't want to say that any automaker has made in my lifetime, but we're getting there.

We're getting really, really, really close.

Let's start with Ferrari and just what this is for Ferrari.

Ferrari says they want to bring on...

They want to kind of go in a different direction.

And I've been thinking about this and I wonder if the different direction they want to go in is that they want to, for the first time in their history, have nobody interested in one of their products.

I wonder if that's where they're headed with this one.

I don't find it to be particularly ugly.

A lot of people are saying it's ugly.

I think it'd be fine.

I think if it was released as a Polestar or a Honda, we'd be like, oh yeah, this is a car or whatever.

I think releasing it as a four-door electric Ferrari that looks so generic and so non-Ferrari and so not desirable.

It looks practical and aerodynamic, but this isn't how we think of Ferrari.

It's just a total... it's absolutely insane.

And I want to be clear here about a couple things.

I think it's insane.

I'm sure you guys do.

Everyone does.

All comments I have seen all over social media everywhere have been unbelievably negative.

I have not yet seen a single positive comment anywhere from anyone on any subject,

but this isn't just the usual internet car enthusiasts, losers who are going off.

Luca de Montesemolo, who was Ferrari's CEO before, was quoted on the record today as saying,

if I said what I think it would damage Ferrari, we risk the destruction of a myth.

I hope they remove the prancing horse from that car.

This isn't just a guy.

This is the most important guy in Ferrari's modern history who blew up the brand and created Ferrari, basically what it is today.

Ferrari's stock price dropped.

Ferrari's still resting on the steam in the momentum that Luca set in motion.

Well, to a degree.

I think Ferrari IPOed in a post-Luca era and have greatly expanded things since then in a way that some purists don't love,

but that has been very successful financially for Ferrari.

And so Luca kind of started them on this trajectory,

and I think they've done an amazing job of continuing on this trajectory since then.

But this changes things.

Ferrari's stock price today was down almost 5% on the announcement,

which I think is proof that it's not just a bunch of internet people who don't like it.

This is real.

These are real people responding in real time watching this and saying this is a complete disaster.

Unbelievably negative.

I have a lot of annoying rich guy friends who aren't actually into cars, but sort of pretend to be,

and all of them are laughing.

These are the kind of people who would normally buy something like this,

who like bought Cayenne turbos and other EV AQSs,

and they're sitting here like, who would touch this car?

You know who likes this car?

It's Mustang Mach-E buyers.

It's the same exact concept.

Let's take an iconic name and just put it on absolute crap and let's see what happens.

Okay, Mustang Mach-E is a relatively compelling when it came out EV product.

Here's what I think Ferrari is struggling with.

They realize that they have to, in some markets, Europe being one of them, frankly,

if they want to have any amount of sales growth, they need to offer an EV.

That's kind of non-negotiable for some of the world markets where they compete.

It's not true in the US, but it's true in some markets that they need to offer something.

For both of Ferrari, for every other manufacturer, I think it makes sense, yes.

For Ferrari?

I think they'd not, to have growth, to be able to sell in certain markets,

I do think they will need to have an electric vehicle in their lab.

Yeah, I think that that's reasonable.

I think that that's an acceptably fair point, especially Asia.

I think that they saw the failure of some other cars, the P&F, the Batista being one of them,

a bunch of others, where these are high-powered sports cars that have not done well in the market.

And they thought, we need to go in a different direction.

It feels like they chose the wrong different direction, but I get what led that.

I think that you can see where their head was.

You can see what they're thinking.

A practical four-door car is much more popular in China, where sports cars have not been particularly popular, even Porsches.

And so there's some sense to that.

And hey, we need to go in a different direction, so we're going to hire this totally different design team, basically,

to take us in this different direction.

And this is going to be a new Ferrari.

And so you kind of understand where they're going in that sense, but it is obviously one of the stupidest, most indescribably idiotic decisions.

I mean, any one of these things taken individually would be insane.

The car has basically the numbers of like a nice Polestar, right?

Like 0-60-25.

I know. It's not competitive.

The Lucid Air Sapphire is 1.8. 1.89.

The Lucid Air Sapphire is 0-60-1.8 seconds.

Ferrari's the fastest whatever.

If Ferrari's going to come out with this car and charge what? 3x?

What Lucid Air charges for that Sapphire?

And then it's going to look like this and not even be faster?

Right.

That's the thing, really.

I think Ferrari, despite what everybody wishes, which is I think everybody wishes that Ferrari was a more sentimental brand that looked back and tried to just keep going.

That's not how they present themselves.

Yes, but in the design of this car, that's not what they want to be.

Sure, but in the design of this car, there's a lot of looking back.

The round tail lights, a lot of the interior features, a lot of what Johnny Ive took from Ferrari is looking back.

Sure.

I think Filippo's point, though, is a great one.

Ferrari has actually not only have they don't view themselves as being sentimental, they've actually been successful by being not sentimental.

Every time they've come out with a new product that has not been sentimental, an SUV, a four-seater convertible in 2008, which was a big deal,

they have actually, all they've done is get more sales and sell more cars.

And so they're sitting here watching this.

I bet you there are people in Ferrari HQ sitting there watching this and saying, this will blow over.

It's another California launch.

This is just another California.

These people don't know yet.

And I think what who doesn't know is Ferrari.

We have watched brand after brand attempt these things and not succeed particularly well and walk back EV strategies, not just in the States, but globally, because demand hasn't been there.

At this price point in this segment, the Batista and the RIMACNivera are good examples, but Lamborghini bail out of the whole thing because they listen to their customers.

And I think it's interesting.

Ferrari has always been intentionally arrogant about listening to their customers.

They've always kind of, we're not going to listen to our customers.

We know what's best.

And I think that works right up until it doesn't.

And this will not work.

This is not just an abomination as a, it's just, it's embarrassing.

It's completely embarrassing to do this to the Ferrari brand.

A couple of things that are interesting, legitimately.

Five-seater, first five-seater Ferrari.

And why they felt they need to do that.

I don't really know, but regardless, they,

Because age, I think because, because, because cars with four doors.

Four doors.

Yeah.

But four seats, I think is fine for the Asian market too.

I don't know how they got specs to be that unimpressive, hard to know.

I want to know what it weighs is if it's super light, then that becomes much more interesting.

It's not.

There's just, I want to know that number.

I have a few other things that I've been thinking about.

As do I, but keep you, go ahead.

Johnny Ive is famous in the design world.

Maybe the one of the most famous living designers.

And I don't want to say that he's got an ego.

I don't know him.

I haven't seen a lot of interviews with him, but obviously he has this respect.

So he goes into this and probably people are willing to, you know,

First off, what is his legacy look like after this?

Obviously there's a, there's a tarnishment here and there will be when this car is the flop that it will become.

But you also have to wonder, like, are people just, did people just say yes because Johnny Ive said it to be true and he did the iPhone or he knows what he's doing.

And we want to go in a different direction.

And so here's, here's this man who he must know better than us, you know, like, and just people rubber stamped it because they just assumed that a different direction meant something like this.

I'm curious about that.

So I do want to say about that the shape itself per Ferrari's own press releases was designed by Ferrari before bringing in Johnny Ive.

All he did from their, their description was basically like put the finishing touches on it, do some of the like stylistic elements around the shape.

Well, he's going to go to, I mean, regardless of that, he will go down as being associated with this forever.

I mean, this will be part of his legacy.

I was also interested in my, some of my colleagues who went to the event.

Pay close attention over the next week to these videos.

There are going to be people who tell you things in order to keep a relationship as opposed to the truth.

And we are going to tell you the truth here.

This thing sucks.

I do wonder what it looks like with other cars.

It's hard to get a sense of like its full height and shape.

It looks like it looks like that.

It is much lower than a porousangue.

I don't remember the exact number, but I longer.

It's also lower.

I do wonder what it looks like relative to other cars.

It's interesting.

There's a creator named Cleo Abram that doesn't do car content, but got to interview Johnny Ive and Flavio Manzoni, who's the head of design for Ferrari.

And she asked really the right questions that you want.

You want to ask like what would Enzo Ferrari think of this?

What would Steve Jobs think of this?

And they had a really hard time answering those questions.

I think I would too.

Okay.

I do want to speak about a couple of interesting things by all accounts from people that were there in person.

So take everything that I'm about to say with the grain of salt that Doug added.

The interior is stunningly beautiful and like well executed, great materials, truly beautiful, purportedly.

We predicted on this podcast a couple of months ago that they showed the interior first because the car was going to be so disappointing that they wanted to get some positive.

I agree.

The interior looks cool.

We predicted that.

We even put on a short.

We did.

The one thing that I do think is actually interesting.

Apparently the motors are designed by Ferrari, which is kind of interesting.

That's somewhat rare in the EV world.

The batteries are made to be able to swap out for future battery cell type, which is kind of interesting.

The sound thing is actually truly interesting.

So you can change the sound that you're getting from it, but the sound is captured from the vibration and the axles.

It's not like a false sound that's generated for this like everybody else does.

Like BMW does that's Hans Zimmer.

Can you change the sound to make the car not suck?

Is that possible?

I can't say that, but it is kind of interesting to use the sound waves from like the vibration and the axles that are then amplified.

That's somewhat interesting.

I will say, it's just not going to be enough, but we've got to get a start.

For sure.

Is this going to be the first time Mansari improves a Ferrari?

I don't think it's that.

I don't like how it looks, by the way.

I do think that it looks like the next gen I-PACE.

Like when I look at it, I think I see a next gen I-PACE.

And that's another sadness for me.

Like this is a derivative car.

Ferrari's entire history has been like with a few exceptions in the 60s and 70s has been like being the leaders in design.

We're going to go out there and we're going to just make the most beautiful cars that are the most desirable and everyone else is going to follow us,

especially in the last 20 years.

And that's been true.

And to show up with this derivative design that looks like it could be a Mercedes, a Polestar, a Jaguar, like anything, that's just like totally crazy.

You know what hit me?

The other day, it hit me as I was thinking about this.

Everybody always accuses me of being a Porsche guy.

You know, if Ferrari's going to do this.

Like my kids are growing up in an era where Porsche is the enthusiast brand.

Ferrari has handed this to Porsche.

When I was a kid, Ferrari was the enthusiast brand.

And me and Sean fell in love with Ferrari.

And I know every Ferrari and I am most obsessed with Ferrari of any brand.

And why is my child going to like grow up in that same way?

Porsche is making cars with manual transmissions and like real naturally aspirated engines.

And Ferrari's making this.

Like this is what, for $600,000.

Like what?

Competitive specs really.

I find it kind of interesting.

I want to see one person to really draw judgment.

The Doug review of this car is going to be amazing.

Yeah, I mean, obviously they won't let me a car.

So I'm going to have to borrow it from somebody.

I'd be surprised.

Obviously the people that I borrow Ferrari's from are going to be forced to buy one.

And I think that that's a reality of this car.

Ferrari's going to point to some sales and say, hey, we're selling them.

But that's only because there are people who are hoping for allocations of other cars who are going to get stuck with them.

One thing I do find very interesting is, Ferrari has made it incredibly clear that they want this car to be a car that creates new buyers for them.

And so there, I assume what they are hoping for is people who are not just trying to play the allocation game and get allocated in SP4, in SP5, in SP6 or whatever those cars come.

They're trying to find actual new customers buying this car.

And I can't imagine there's a market for this car outside of people who are forced to buy it.

I'm not as pessimistic on it as you and literally every other person.

$600,000 you're not as pessimistic.

There's a lot of rich people who like tech.

I think it looks kind of interesting.

You're all going to get laughed at.

Those rich people only like this stuff in as much as it is cool.

They only buy these cars in as much as it makes them feel cool to be driving it and be looked at as cool by other people.

No one will think that about this.

If someone I know who's in my rich guys sphere buys this car, the rest of us will all be laughing at him behind his back.

And probably to me, I would laugh at him to his face.

This is an absolute abomination.

I get your point about it being looking like a lot of other EVs and being a little derivative of that.

I don't fully agree.

I think there's a lot of pretty unique elements from a sandwich market.

I think that there's a chance that in real life, in some markets, this does come out and looks futuristic and can bring new people to the brand.

I'm not as pessimistic about it as I think you or most other people, especially in the US are.

I don't think this is a car for us.

This is not a car for the US market.

I mean, it will come here by all accounts, but I don't think it was developed with us in mind.

I think that's reflected here.

It's not a car for any market at $650,000.

Probably true.

By the way, can I throw out there?

The headlight appears to be in the lower section of the bodywork.

It does.

It doesn't matter.

The details do not matter.

The overarching big picture is Ferrari has been an object of desirability that seems untouchable and amazingly cool to the point of frustration, honestly, for the last 25 years.

Other automakers bang their heads against the wall saying this Huracan is just as good.

Why can't we keep resale?

Why can't we have a long waiting list like Ferrari does?

Why can't we get people into an MC20, right?

Even though it's the same, it looks even better.

The performance numbers are the same.

Aston Martin has been killing themselves for 25 years trying to make cars as desirable as Ferrari.

Their numbers are similar.

No one wants the cars because Ferrari has this mystique which in my mind has taken a massive hit.

If this car does come to market, which it seems like they're serious.

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Why did they do this?

Why do you think they chose to do this at this moment?

Ferrari and the Italian government are very cozy.

They didn't need to do this for any regulatory reason.

Yeah, I mean, Ferrari is probably worried about falling behind on a global level in terms of its brand.

But it does absolutely astonish me when we are looking at other automakers.

The fact that Lamborghini was going to do this and then bailed because of consumer interest.

And we've seen Pininfarina and we've seen Rimmak other companies, including Ferrari's own SF90s,

which are trading at half of sticker.

That's another thing that hasn't been discussed here, but this is a different era of Ferrari in a lot of ways.

And we're already starting to kind of go down that path where Ferrari is no longer the brand that it once was,

making one less car than the market demands because you're seeing resale values tank.

You're seeing 12 cylindries on the market right now selling for under MSRP, cars that are at 75 miles on it.

And this ain't the Ferrari of your.

And I think that they're worried that their brand won't be as accepted globally.

A four-door car, an electric car is going to get them into some of these markets.

But it certainly is not going to curry them any favor in any place where Ferrari is an established and desirable brand.

And I don't think this car will serve to make them more desirable in those emerging markets that don't know the Ferrari brand that well either.

So I think it's a flop on basically every level.

I do think I don't disagree to be clear, and I'm taking a somewhat contrary view here.

Since Ferrari went public, they had a huge run up 2022 to 2025, more or less, in their stock price.

It has been coming down for the last year plus.

And the last year it's down 32%.

Yes, it's down again today by today's Tuesday by about 5%.

But in the last five days, it's about flat, which I'm going to interpret as the market has kind of realized

that Ferrari is in a precarious position where maybe they're not worth as much as we once thought.

I do hope that the Luce is a little bit of a wake-up call for Ferrari,

and this reaction is a little bit of a wake-up call that they actually do need to go after enthusiasts if they want to retain any of their brand credibility.

I don't think that will do.

I don't think that Ferrari will truly get a wake-up call until the sales numbers come in.

And because I think it's going to be fair. They're down.

They will. I truly think that Ferrari is sitting there,

that Ferrari who has always been arrogant about their customers' demands.

From the day that Enzo Ferrari told Ferruccio Lamborghini to go build tractors,

Ferrari has always been arrogant about this.

I think that they're sitting there thinking the market is reacting like this,

but they don't know and it's a bunch of internet people and none of these people are real anyway.

And when this car comes out, people are going to see how great it is and they're going to buy it.

I think Ferrari truly is sitting there right now believing that.

I don't think that they're sitting there thinking like shaking or nervous about the reaction.

I think they're reminded of California and of Piero Sangue and they're saying we've weathered this stuff before,

and we are Ferrari and we will weather it again.

And I think that this particular car, I think when we look back, this car will not have been the beginning of the end.

I think that came earlier, but this car certainly was probably the biggest block in terms of pushing them kind of down the road of becoming

a brand that is not as revered as it was when we were all growing.

This is the first full departure, right?

Every other car has had some connective tissue to what made Ferrari Ferrari.

Even if they're looking forward, weren't looking in their past, right?

The Piero Sangue has a V12. The California has a great V8.

There's something about this departure.

In the design, the style of all those cars was unmistakably Ferrari.

And honestly, people have been complaining about the departure of Pinoferrina since it happened.

I don't entirely agree.

I think that Ferrari has always been sort of a futuristic leader type brand,

and they've taken the company in a completely futuristic direction that has been kind of cool and interesting.

And until now, and now forever, we will have, we will associate, you know,

they went to the Apple iPhone guy and got an Apple iPhone car.

And this is not the Ferrari that we ever wanted.

And it's, and they're sitting, I truly believe they're sitting there right now in Italy saying,

these people, that's the whole point. We didn't want the enthusiasts.

We want a new group. And I think that they're not going to, as a result,

they're going to lose a lot of enthusiasts and they're not going to get the new people.

I think that's a fair, but don't worry.

They have thousands of deeply considered details that unite to create a singular driving experience.

So we're going to have to write one of these on tarot.

There's nobody in the world who's going to let me one of these.

We're going to have to write one of these on tarot.

Unfortunately, that won't be possible because no one on the planet will ever buy this trash.

What if it is the greatest driving experience of all time?

We get in this car and it's like, you know, it's interesting.

I am curious about that, how it drives.

Like it's funny because that has not been something that Ferrari has talked about.

They've talked about the details all designed in the first power.

As a 296.

I remember when the Cayenne came out, one of Porsche's fallbacks was, okay, say what you will,

but this makes the X5 drive like a truck.

That was a direct quote from the people at Porsche.

And when people drove the original Cayenne, they had that opinion and it really did start to sway public opinion on it.

I don't think that's going to happen here because we've seen the pin in Frena Batista and the Rimec,

and other high powered EVs and we've already had that experience.

There's no way that they can make this car drive in a way that makes up for all the other BS.

It's not possible.

I am into this big bet like fundamentally.

I think it's cool, but I don't think that it's a good business decision in any way, shape or form.

Yeah, I think I am into it also.

They did a poor job of it.

If they did a good job of it, that would be super.

Totally.

I think Ferrari, an EV Ferrari, if we're being honest about the future of cars, this is a direction they probably do have to go.

There's a lot of different things you could say about timing and all that,

but I think this is probably a future reality.

Doing it at this time with this car that looks like this with these numbers at this price point is just laughable.

The Honda Prelude is off the hook.

We have a new worst automotive decision of the last 10 years in our world here.

With that, should we return to the regular podcast?

Let's go back to it.

Goodbye, everybody.

Goodbye.

Hello.

I'm leaving.

You're leaving.

Good bye, Sean.

Yeah, Kenan's joining, or Nick is joining.

I'm moving that.

You too.

Goodbye.

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Hagerty never stop driving.

Hello and welcome to this car pod.

I'm Felipe.

This is a very special episode of this car pod because I am out of town.

And so we've prerecorded this.

You're watching this.

We recorded this weeks ago.

Nothing that we say on this podcast.

We still believe that.

Yeah.

No, but because we recorded weeks go, unfortunately, we have to skip our most sumptuous segment.

The news.

Sumptuous.

That's the adjective for that one.

Okay.

And so we're going to move directly because the news has happened, but we can't report on it because we don't know the news this week.

Right.

So we're going to instead move on to the talk cars segment right away.

And there's a lot of talk cars.

I have saved a lot of talk cars for this exact podcast to talk through a lot of different car things since we don't have started to discuss.

Start us off strong.

Okay.

I will start us off strong.

You know what?

Let's just start with the most important thing of the day, which is kind of news to an extent.

Sean and I received an email the other day a couple of weeks ago on our podcast.

I made a big thing about how I was still looking for two Colorado license plates to complete my set of one from every county in Colorado, one of these denim license plates.

They were blue.

They were only made from 1992 to 1999.

And I've been looking for 25 years.

I've been trying to complete this.

This is not an exaggeration.

I've been trying to for 25 years and I'm down to two counties.

And we got and I said I jokingly said, I really, I didn't think anybody out there said I'd give a thousand bucks to anybody who can get me one of the remaining two counties.

And I gave him Sean's email.

Sure.

That's s e a n i.

So we got an email from a guy.

You want to pull it up?

We got an email from a guy named Curtis in Salt Lake City.

And he said, Dear Doug, Dear Sean, I have a plate.

Doug's looking for you.

My wife was a dental hygiene student at Colorado Northwestern Community College 1998 to 2000 and rangerly Colorado.

It's one of the small towns there.

We registered our 1995 Subaru Legacy sedan Rio Blanco County while we were in school.

We moved back.

I kept the plate and he's asked if I wanted to have it 25 years.

I've been looking for this.

Some people when they nice that is so generous.

And this is I gave him a thousand bucks.

Are you sure you're sure?

I'm glad you're a man of your word.

But look, Filippo, aren't now the last county left is mineral.

We're not going to find that by the same way, unfortunately.

No, we won't.

But Curtis came through for us.

Unbelievable.

Are you thrilled?

I'm thrilled.

I'm also I didn't realize you've been looking for 25.

25 years.

Some people turn 13 and have hobbies.

I don't know what those hobbies are, but they have hobbies.

Doug turned 13 and starts looking.

I'll tell you what happens.

I'm going to make it very clear.

When I was a kid.

Yeah.

I was turned up when I was 11 years old.

Colorado stopped producing license plates that showed what county the car was from when I was 11 years old.

I consider it to be the worst moment of my life.

Okay.

It's January 1, 2000.

Right.

The dawn of the millennium and they ruined everything.

So because there were no more counties on the license plates, I made it my life's goal to get all of the counties and they had green plates and they had blue plates.

Green ones were standard.

They were easier to find.

These cost $50 extra.

So what Curtis didn't tell us here is that he actually spent 50 bucks extra to have this plate.

Back in that era.

And so, yeah, that was what I, as a child, that's all I wanted.

I wanted to capture the license plates of my youth.

See, Kenan wants the cars that from when he was a kid that are the most, I only want the license plates.

That's where we did.

I'm not even like I grew up in Colorado.

I haven't been to Colorado in like seven years.

I'm not interested in Colorado at all.

But you happen to every county.

I've been to every county in Colorado, including beautiful Rio Blanco County, which is the northwest part of the state where they find dinosaur fossils.

That's very cool.

And they have denim license or had.

And have a white river.

Yeah, there you go.

Rio Blanco can't believe it.

Truly changed my life, Curtis.

Thank you so much.

If you're out there and you find the mineral, $1,000 for you.

Okay.

You gonna look?

No, I don't.

I've got flight.

You'll never find it.

So don't worry.

To be honest with you, I have never once in my whole life cared about license plates until you came into my life.

And now that's all I see when I look at cars.

Ohio, by the way, still does, puts counties on the license plates.

And in fact is one of my hero states because they were going away from the whole county thing.

They have switched from the county name being written on the license plate to little numbers that you had to memorize.

And they since went back to writing the county name.

They've actually gone forward in, I think all license plates in all places should have.

But it looks terrible.

The way they do it is like they print, it's just like, it looks like someone used a label.

It looks really cheap.

High plates in general look bad now because they're all flat now.

Also to be clear with the small county numbers, like it did say on there, but like really had to know.

But hey, you know, I saw, I knew Summit County.

I can't remember where it was.

That's the problem.

It's been a long time.

I don't live there anymore.

Have a listen.

Plates.

Yeah.

Yesterday, this week, it passed again.

I was up in like in the by Big Bear ish.

Yeah.

And I saw I was on the 15 a lot.

There's a lot of new cars up there and on highways.

I spent the entire time looking for a new format California.

Yeah.

Still have not seen one.

No, they only issued 250 of them in some Northern California County is like a test.

Surely they run out of nine wise.

I think a lot of nine wise.

They're going to go to 9Z and do the whole thing.

Sorry.

I'm not going to see the new format.

They're going to do 90.

Although I have.

Yeah.

Although I have the first new format.

Don't forget.

I haven't seen it.

Have you seen it?

Have I seen the first new format?

I thought I had didn't come in.

No, I possess it.

It's I've had it for years.

I put it's literally I have a picture of it.

Me holding it.

Sean has posted on this podcast.

I can't believe we start off with the most boring subject.

Your decision.

I want to move on to the best talk cars the whole time.

This is generally a general talk car.

Yeah.

The Toyota Sienna pulling out the Cybertruck.

Have you seen this video?

I have not.

As if having a Cybertruck at this point wasn't even more

embarrassed.

It wasn't incredibly embarrassing.

I want to take you through the levels of embarrassment.

Seventy.

Park behind it.

Pause here.

So we start with this.

The stock Cybertruck.

Obviously embarrassing since this vehicle was touted as it can do

anything and go anywhere and do anything.

In addition, the Cybertruck in general has kind of gotten

embarrassed.

We all agree.

Like you see him around you're like, oh, well, that was last

year's fashion accessory.

Okay.

So we start there.

We're at the beginning of embarrassment.

Then the camera moves.

All right.

And we see it's being pulled by something.

Right.

And the something that it's being pulled by is go back to the

start before.

Is a Sienna.

Now pause here.

Pause here.

Go back a little bit actually.

The next embarrassing layer is that it's being pulled by a

Sienna.

And this Sienna is so weak that it doesn't even have a tow hitch.

They've got this strap hooked up somewhere to like a child

safety tie.

The Cybertruck is such a pathetic vehicle that it's getting

pulled out not only by a minivan, but a minivan without even

the capability of tow it.

It's a hybrid.

Okay.

And then you see it's some, I don't want to be sexist on this

podcast, but you assumed it was going to be some burly dude who's

like, I rescue people like that's off road recovery.

You see, but no, it's a woman.

It's like she's just, and then also to me, the most embarrassing

thing is they've all decided to go to the kind of beach where

people go with 70.

You think that's a season with a blue top.

I was going to say it's a salon.

Oh, it is.

It's a C 70 that aftermarket blue top.

You think I would be wrong about what kind of Volvo is the

point is the point is if the Cybertruck wasn't already an

embarrassment, boy, this video really drives it home.

They end up in that.

There's so many layers to the video.

It's really hard to pull them all apart.

I'm glad that you've given the play by player.

What?

Well, also he ran over the like, I don't know where like,

I don't even capable.

How do you think they're tearing into those things?

Right.

That is so a Toyota and 45 bystanders.

A Toyota Sienna.

And it's still kind of not out all the way at the end there.

That is Cybertruck ownership in 2027.

I look at him now and I'm like, and now that I've seen this

video, I'm like, oh, like it doesn't, it can't tow.

It's a four cylinder hybrid.

Yeah.

They're pulling out a Cybertruck.

Remember Elon Musk said it would be, it would save us from

the apocalypse.

Hey, is that an all wheel drive Sienna?

Go, go.

Yeah, I know.

I know that you specifically have a way to know.

Yeah, that's a, well, it's not a platinum.

I don't know.

I think it is an all wheel drive.

We dug and I discovered a lot of extensive research that the

platinum Sienna has two different wheel design.

Yeah, the bigger wheel is for the two wheel drive.

I cannot tell which is which.

I can tell instantly this is the small wheel, but it isn't a

platinum regardless.

It's probably a four wheel drive, but like, it doesn't matter.

I mean, this is the most embarrassing thing I've ever seen

in my entire life.

Yeah, that's tough.

I wonder how quick, do you think the guy sold this car?

It has to be.

I think this is the beach at Carmel.

Yeah, I think this is the beach in Carmel right at the end of

Panoram, and drive of it.

Yeah.

This is even more embarrassing.

Imagine driving one of these around picturesque, serene,

quiet Carmel.

I hope someone yelled and go back to the bay.

So true.

Well, you see both the wheels are articulating there.

What did you think when you saw this video for the first time?

I just, just now.

Really?

I don't know.

Let's figure out how they got in that situation at all.

Well, they got in this situation because they thought this

could off road, which it does have like all terrain tires.

Does it not?

Honestly, they're so dug out here.

If they just took the air down, they would have gotten that.

Exactly.

But they don't know that because they have a Cybertruck and they

have no capacity for understanding how to operate it in any

situating manner.

That's so true.

Cybertruck getting pulled out by a Sienna.

What are your thoughts when you see a Cybertruck these days in

the room?

You know, I just kind of ignore it.

I don't give people the satisfaction.

If you have one at this point, it just says a lot.

I do kind of get annoyed when Piazz passenger of mine go,

look, it's a dumpster on wheels.

It's like, yeah, we've already heard that.

All the tropes are played out.

It's just like nothing.

The tropes are even boring.

The car is obviously boring.

The tropes are even boring.

Well, and it feels like bad to say that because it's like,

okay, you're really kicking them.

We know.

We get it.

It's an unspoken thing at this stage.

Right.

The fact that that article I read that said that 20% of

new Cybertrucks were sold to one of Elon's own companies is just

kind of that.

And this picture just kind of sum up everything.

Also 40% year-over-year drop.

40% drop.

25% is 24.

I mean, Ford has the ability to just cancel the lightning and

absorb those costs.

Tesla put actual company behind this ridiculous vehicle.

They're canceling their SUV.

They're canceling their sedan.

But at least they got the dumpster on wheels.

Am I right?

Okay.

We have to move on to our next talk car story.

Flipo, why don't you give it to us?

Yeah.

All right.

We have an event coming up that I will personally be at.

And I would like for you all to come too.

Okay.

Where is it?

All right.

This event is going to be at the Lars Anderson Museum right

at the Boston.

Oh, Boston.

Great.

Well, folks there, good old days.

We're going to be on the East Coast.

We're going to have something like 400 cars there, which is going

to be our largest ever event.

The Lars Anderson Meetup.

If you go to the events page, we'll have a link in the bio too.

You can get a ticket, the free ticket, but we need to kind of

track that you're going to be there to know how many cool cars

we'll have.

I told Jeff to go.

So you don't have to register?

Yeah.

You do have to register.

Jeff, go.

There'll be a link at the end of the day.

Oh, got it.

But it's free.

But it's free to go.

What kind of cars are registering?

Who's there?

Who's coming?

I'll be there.

It's a month away.

There must be some people registering already.

Who's coming?

There's all kinds of people.

We're recording this two-part in advance, man.

I can't tell you the best cars.

Anybody with an Acura ADX coming?

I hope that they come with their other car.

Whatever it is.

Whatever it may be.

I hope they bring a different one.

Lars is interesting because there are like, you can park like

up top of those parking lot down below.

You can get a lot of cars there.

I will be selecting the cars that are in the premiere.

Oh, my God.

Never mind.

Don't go to this.

Oh, man.

It's going to be.

If you got a base automatic C7 show, he's going to park 14 of them in a row.

We got every color, guys.

First of all, they call it stingray.

No, it's going to be all porcious.

It's going to be indistinguishable from any other automotive event.

It's going to be all 997.

I know.

Brookline and Massachusetts in general has some cars that I'm into.

If you have a manual C70 version, which exists, let me know.

Yeah.

Also like that.

Yeah.

So Jeff, don't bring the 575.

Leave the M5 at home.

You're talking about a coupé.

Yeah, of course.

There will be a lot of really, really cool cars.

Let me see your question.

Make sure you register.

This is June 27.

If you're not going to it, who even are you?

Right.

You should go.

Lars Anderson is such a great person.

Are you going to be there?

I wish I could.

What are you doing June 27?

I got things.

I don't need to go see the cars.

We'll have a lot of cars.

I'm a dead serious ask you a question.

Dead serious.

Yeah.

What car would you dream would show up?

You're sitting there doing the pointing.

Yeah.

You know, because that's like his dream already.

To be able to control.

He moved cars and could point things.

Exactly.

The only way to get better is if that, you know, just let me do it.

That is the only way.

Say it to someone.

Yeah.

I love a TZ three.

A TZ three.

The Viper version.

Yeah.

That's not, you're not into those.

Admit that.

How are you know what that is?

How am I not into this?

Admit that what you want to show up.

It's a challenge.

Design Viper.

You want an Asuna Sunrunner.

Yeah.

If you have an Asuna Sunrunner with, there's actually an Asuna Sunrunner, not a GeoTracker.

I will accept it.

Can you pull up an Asuna Sunrunner for us?

I want to help with the ASU.

ASU.

ASU and the U has two dots over it.

Okay.

We call it an umlaut.

Umlaut.

It is a GeoTracker.

ASU.

Excuse me.

It is a GeoTracker.

This is an Asuna Sunrunner.

GT.

I can't believe that you would, that you would say is that you would denigrate the Asuna

Sunrunner.

Sean sitting over here like, where is this going?

I'm wondering the same.

How are we only 15 minutes in?

We're on the Asuna Sunrunner.

How did it take us this long to get here?

Kenan, are you wondering what the hell this is?

I know what the tracker is.

That's what this is.

Right.

I'm dead serious.

Okay.

I'm going to tell this is a short story of the Asuna Sunrunner.

Boys in a short story.

Have you ever heard of the Asuna brand?

Not until today.

There were a few Asunas.

Really?

Yeah.

Okay.

Here's what happened.

Canada generally prefers smaller cars in the US.

In general, Canada is a little bit more towards the European side of like littler cars.

And so General Motors sensed that and they decided that they would create a brand for

only small cars, but they would call it Asuna and give it sort of a European flair, even

though it was actually American cars rebadged from Japanese because this started life as

a Suzuki.

And they tried to trick the Canadians and the Canadians are savvy people.

Alex Trebek, you can't fool.

Did Alex Trebek have a Asuna Sunfire?

No, he didn't.

Asuna Sunfire?

He didn't have an Asuna Sunfire because he knew point blank that this was an embarrassing

attempt to trick him.

I'm believing this was some European brand.

You got to get up pretty early in the morning to fool me there, bud.

Yep.

I have an important question for you.

What was the Asuna Sunfire?

Pontiac Sunfire?

No.

Pontiac GT.

The Zuzu Impulse.

Pull up the Asuna Sunfire.

I don't believe it.

That was the GeoStorm.

The Sunfire.

No, the Impulse was the...

I mean, I wasn't a question.

Look at that.

Yeah, click on that.

Rebedge the Zuzu Impulse.

There's one.

These are all just Azuzu.

Oh, yeah, Asuna.

There it is.

No, there was one that wasn't.

What the umlaut, baby?

What do you think the Asuna SE or the GT, depending on the trade?

I think that was the Pontiac...

I don't remember.

Le Mans?

Yes.

That little Korean-made Pontiac Le Mans?

Yeah.

This was a horrible situation.

And I'm so sorry that all of you have had to deal with it.

Right.

This is fascinating.

I'm sorry.

This is...

Deal with it.

Fascinating.

Anyway.

So, Felipe, you're going to be at Lars Andersen.

At Lars Andersen.

Thanks for getting us back on track.

Yeah.

We don't have the news.

We got to...

Deep.

We're getting deep today.

Come...

Check it out.

Come say hi to myself and a bunch of our team members, as you like to say.

And bring your cool car to the Lars Andersen.

So, here's what I suggest.

First off, he said, come say hi to myself.

So, when you walk up to the Lars Andersen, walk up to Felipe and say, hi, myself.

Yeah.

And then walk up to the other cars and bids people and say, hi, team member.

What's your name?

Are you part of the team?

I would love that.

How many cars do you expect?

That's not a nice thing.

We have space.

We're going to cap it at 400.

400 cars?

It's going to be a big event.

It's going to be our largest ever event that we singularly are hosting.

So, if you're number 401, tough luck.

Too bad.

Do you think a Ferrari 400 is going to come?

There was one.

I was there.

Really?

There's 550, which we sold on cars and bids, actually, later on.

Really?

So, they're real stuff.

So, I think it was...

If you're 401, I'm so sorry.

I will have to kick out the Asuna Sunrunner for you.

I hope the Asuna Sunrunner shows up.

You better take it.

I hope the entire Asuna Sunrunner club.

Which other...

But I'm sure if there were one that would show...

You know, there's two guys...

Calgary.

The car was federalized.

But do you think that Asuna will provide a substantively similar...

I think that it's been 25 years.

I think we've already got that figured out.

That's all past.

Good point.

You think any of us survived Canada and New England?

It's quite a combination.

No.

There are none of these that have survived anywhere.

Okay, Lars Anderson, Filippo, thank you so much for promoting something.

Love to hear that.

I did really well.

He's going to promote this on every podcast for the next month, people.

Get ready.

Get ready, indeed.

Honestly, I'm not on many podcasts in the next month.

Because you're going to Italy.

I'm going to Italy.

But he's going to still promote the hell out of it.

Folks, come to the Lars Anderson Museum just to put him out of his misery.

Just to be like, Filippo, I did it.

To be clear, don't kill him.

Don't kill him.

Yeah.

Okay.

I hear he paints houses.

Tell us about the 355 Revoluto.

Oh, yes.

So recently, we've talked about this car before.

Now, the 355 Revoluto has been...

Oh man, it doesn't even...

Revolutionary War.

Oh, wow.

Oh, I can see 55 Revolution War.

Yeah, the Evoluto.

The 355 Evoluto.

Now, I have two things to say.

One, tell us what it is.

So this is a 355 Resto Mod that is created by this, I believe it's an English company.

Ian Callum re-did the...

Ever since Singer happened, there have been all these companies that have popped up...

Turn the word Singer into a verb.

Right.

They've singerized blah, blah, blah, sing, blah, blah.

They've tried to make Resto Mod new but old versions of...

Now it's like dozens of different cars.

In fact, I have an entire list on my phone dedicated to Porsche because there's so many

companies that do it and pop up every day where they take some air-cooled 911, do some

vague modifications to it and charge $750,000 for it, and people pay it.

I will say, the more of these that pop up, the more I realize how hard it is to do what

Singer does.

Yes.

To do it well.

Because my criticism of this now, I have a couple things to say.

One, the only one I had ever seen, and I saw it in person at Car Week, was the blue one.

Blue one.

Which is the one they did as the press image.

But then I went to Modo Miami this year and I saw the red one.

And I wonder if they're not the same car?

Just painted.

Oh, probably.

Okay, but regardless of that, what's the problem with it?

They're singerizing at 355.

It sounds like a perfect situation.

They're having a lot of problems.

You make it reliable.

You know, like, yes, it did have a lot of problems.

You're right.

And they solved a couple of them.

That's great.

So they solved, like, they changed the wiring harness.

I think the engine does come out more easily.

But I asked the engineers, it's like, did you guys, you know, the car?

The engine doesn't have to come out anymore.

That's the thing.

So that's the thing.

I asked the engineers, I said, so did you guys consider a chain drive system or something

like that, so you, you know, don't have to take the engine out?

Because all the things catching on fire, that is one of the big issues it's known for.

And they're like, oh, we looked into it now.

It's just too expensive.

But we went to the design and I'm like, well, look, in my view, and I haven't driven one

in fairness, but in my view, there are two things that 355 has to do.

It has to look good and has to sound good.

And they screwed with the way it looks.

And I think they did a poor job.

I actually like how it looks, but I think I regular 355 looks so good.

I don't think they've improved it for sure.

No, they took the logo off of the hook, which is weird.

They don't want to get sued by Ferrari.

But they kept the Ferrari logo.

Well, I'm sure Ferrari is still going to if they haven't already.

I don't think it looks bad.

I think it looks terrible.

Especially from the rear, I think it looks pretty cool.

I think that adding the little streaks back there, like a, like an F40 is pretty neat.

The F40, I mean, oh, yeah.

The 280 TTO.

And like the rear lights, I think is cool.

I don't think they've improved on the look of a 355, but I do think the key to rest,

to singer rising a 355 is to change the stuff that was bad.

Was bad.

Yeah.

And this, and the style was not.

The style was one of the things that did better than anything else.

You want to sing arise a 35?

Well, you leave it looking exactly like it is.

You just make it reliable.

Yeah.

Well, because if it could be reliable, which is probably true.

Yeah.

Maybe they thought, you know, this, it can't be reliable.

I think it's exactly what they thought.

They thought we can actually make this good.

No one can improve this.

So you have to provide them with a 355 and then they charge you, I think it's like half

a million dollars to do this, which is a tough sell.

Yeah.

Go to that interior photo.

Oh, yeah.

The interior, so I like, so.

It looks okay.

So they put a spot in here for you to put your phone, which is kind of cool.

But then there's no like, I can't zoom in because thanks Google.

But there's no, there's no wire.

So it doesn't like charge or anything.

It's just sitting there.

So if your battery starts to go down and you're using your mouse, which famously consumes

a lot of power, that's tough.

So at least there's some Italian flair to it still.

But the other thing is the gauges, you know, they famously like are showing 20 miles an

hour and like still does that.

Didn't change that.

So it's like, they still left some of the stuff like I just, they just wrapped it all

in nice looking.

There's a lot of the point, you know, it's ironic because Singer is known for this, but

I had an old defender and there's a, I think that this all got started in the Land Rover

community.

I will agree with you.

Like there are all these companies that are trying to put lipstick on an old defender

and it never works.

And they're these rich guys who can't handle a real old defender who think that if they

spend 300 grand, it'll make it good.

And they quickly discover that no, it's just a defender with leather seats.

It ain't still ain't good.

And that's the situation.

Unless you put an LS1 in it and then it's still mediocre, but at least reliable.

I think those cars still have problems though.

I think those guys still have issues.

You got a master market LS1 and that's dealing with all this electronics and it just, it's

the same situation.

So why is this coming up now?

So because it really made the rounds with a lot of journalists the other week and it

has been everywhere.

They clearly put a lot of effort behind this, like in marketing the car and things.

And the top gear review, which I kept for the video, it was amazing because they had

a normal one next to it and looking at them aside, it's like, damn, that looks bad.

Can everybody say positive things?

Mostly, yes.

It seemed that way.

I think Ferro was the, I still haven't watched Ferro's review on it.

I need to, but he also had to because he could drive them back to back.

The first guy on top gear when they did this, it's like, he admitted he'd never driven one

and then was driving this and it's like, okay, well then you're in, but it's not funny.

One thing that's interesting about journalists driving cars like this is that like, of course

they like it.

It gives them an opportunity to be in something analog.

A lot of these people have never spent time in analog cars.

And so it's like, oh my God, this is analog.

It's so cool.

Well, that's all cars were at one point.

Well, that was the whole point.

I had, because I had a long conversation with this engineer and our friends stood around

and I just grilled this guy because I owned one of these cars and it's one of my favorite

cars.

And at the end he said, you know, we build this car to be an analog driving experience

that you can go out and really enjoy and rev the engine and show through on gears.

And I said, so like the original, he went, exactly.

Yeah.

I think I would just get an original and service it really well and keep the other.

It's a 700G.

Yeah, exactly.

I don't disagree.

But I also just don't think Ferraris are akin to the Singer Eyes thing.

I think the Ferrari market is a lot more about preservation.

Like that's what people value.

I think in the end a lot of people look at this as just a modified 355.

Maybe I think that doing it well with a 550 would be cool because that's a soft car.

And I think that if you could make that car kind of cool, I wouldn't mess with much on

the exterior.

I actually like the idea of LED tails in the circles.

I think that does modernize it a little bit too big.

The whole point of the car is not that you don't need a modern experience.

If you improve the driving experience to make it feel more like a modern car, that's what

I would do with the five.

I just wouldn't screw with the way it looks.

You know what I would do?

550 with some new suspension.

That's doable.

That's all.

That's it.

That's doable.

That's pretty doable.

Yeah, I think we could make that happen.

Okay, I want to move on to our next conversation, which is my 4GT color swap.

All right, you texted about this.

Where is this coming from?

What do you think about this idea?

Here's my thought.

Yeah, 4GT.

Pull up the whistle away.

Pull up that one.

About four days ago, I saw 4GT on the street.

Yours?

No, someone, some guy.

Oh, it was red.

Okay.

And it hit me that I still prefer the lighter colors.

Specifically, you prefer the white.

And personally, I have always, the Creo GT, I now firmly believe that silver is the best

color for that car and I have zero regrets.

The Kuntash, I think white, which a lot of people agree with.

But this car, I've never fallen in love.

The 993 Arena Red.

This car, I've never fallen in love with my dark blue.

I can't believe it.

Your blue with white stripes.

I just don't like a dark color.

It hides the lines and the lines are cool.

And the dark blue with white stripes cars are now selling for like a 100000

dollar premium over white.

Really?

Why?

Yeah, because it's like the old colors, like the Shelby colors, the American car racing

colors, the Viper GTS, the Shelby Daytonas, the Shelby color.

And to be honest, it's the Jeremy Clarkson color.

It was one of the press colors.

There's a lot of that.

There's a lot of that kind of hype.

But I'm honestly and truly starting to wonder if I should sell my car for what I think is

about a half million, a 45,000 miles and buy a low mile white car for the same price.

Honestly, I know it's not as prized by enthusiasts and collectors and all that.

I just like it better.

And at some point, isn't that the only thing that really matters?

Just gonna repaint it.

Yeah, let me repaint.

The transaction cost will.

Transaction cost won't be zero for sure.

No.

If you want to go, I mean, I don't restart the clock at 10,000 miles.

So I get to go.

I mean, the car's been bullet, bulletproof, reliable.

I don't have to do anything to it, but it'd be nice to restart the clock.

I guess go through those same 10 to 35,000 miles again or 45,000 miles.

This like, you know, you live in your house for a long time and then you look at your

neighbor's house.

And it's like, yeah, I always preferred their color.

And then you swap house with your name.

It just seems like an insane move to get rid of it to get the same car just in a different

color.

I love the car.

I still love the car.

I still drive it the most.

I've never, I have had that car now for coming up on eight years and I have never loved the

color ever.

I have some shocked to ask you a question.

I don't see you drive the Ford GT that often.

I know you claim to a lot.

Well, actually, you know what?

He sends a picture of him driving into tennis and I often drive it to places I wouldn't.

So the reason that you don't see it in the office that much is because I can get away

with bringing the career GT and the Q-Touch to the office.

It's a really, really tight night.

Often, but yeah.

Well, if I'm going to pick up the kids or something, I'm done in three.

I'm done in three.

But the Ford GT, I'll drive, like I drive the Ford GT, yeah, to tennis at least two days

a week.

Got it.

The grocery store.

Like I'll do the Ford GT.

Solid five miles a week, got it.

I think you got to have, it makes so much sense.

You have to still have one.

I understand what you're saying.

Like it is such a usable super car.

I love the car.

I do drive it the most from a mileage number, like number of miles.

I take it to Palm Springs when I'm filming a video out there.

We drove it to, well, that's 400, 500 miles around trip.

What do you ever do it?

Twice a year.

Yes.

Twice a year maybe.

That's real.

You know how many Ford GT owners are doing that?

No, but I guess I'm wondering whether you would just consider maybe it's time for a

different experience.

There is no other car.

There was no other car at $500,000 that I prefer.

None.

Not one.

It also like, we've had this discussion many times, but think about like what experience

would replace that in the garage that would make sense.

It's like there's nothing that is as I can.

There is no other car.

I think it's patently insane to sell a car to get one of the different colors.

But there are some nice benefits to it.

Resetting the mileage clocks a big deal.

If I could sell it for $500,000 and buy another car for $500,000 and start again at 10,000

miles, that's a pretty cool trade.

But also, yeah, but also it's actively will, so your theory is that the values will continue

to rise and as you put miles on it won't matter.

Is that the edit?

Because I just think it would take a hit.

I'm not trying to be a jerk, but at this value level, yeah, I think they will continue

to rise, but I'm not as obsessive about this car rising.

Do you know what I'm saying?

I don't think it'll ever be a $5 million car.

And so going from five to $550 versus the other car going from five to $580, it's not.

Right.

I just think if you bought one with 10,000 miles on it, I guess with 10,000 miles, you

don't have to care as much.

If it were like a four mile car, then you'd probably want to do it.

And actually, I can't make that trade.

The white cars with really low miles sell for more.

But I think a white car with 12,000, 10,000, 12,000 miles, I would still want no Macintosh.

Honestly, I prefer the base wheels too.

I know you do.

Let's have David Lee thing.

And there was one with the BBS and one with the base wheels next to one.

I'm like, I can't believe you ever like the base.

The concept car had the base wheels.

That's why the base wheels look more like old school muscle car wheels.

This car has the base wheel.

They just look more like old school muscle car wheels.

They're more correct for the car.

The Ford GT, which is kind of a brute car, shouldn't have BBS.

It's just wrong.

You know, mentally, it's just wrong.

Yeah, but that looks right.

It does.

There's a reason they were popular.

Yeah.

And on the used market, base wheels sell for two grand.

Oh, it's set.

And BBS is sell for $25,000.

The market speaks loudly on that one.

OK, but fair enough.

I don't know. I do.

I have come to appreciate your for you.

I think you feel you've always.

I love the word.

You know, you think it'd be crazy to do this?

Yes, I think it's insane.

Why?

Well, what about couldn't you wrap the car and change the color?

Yeah, but but I actually think that financially it may actually be cheaper to do what I'm talking about.

And I would start the mileage clock over.

Well, what's a what's a new full color wrap?

And I'd have to wrap the stripes.

Can I ask you a question?

Do you think that it would feel like I think for a lot of people,

the experiences that you've had in the car, what makes it?

Oh, yeah, I don't have any of that.

OK, I thought.

I'll correct.

He's not emotional, but that's one thing.

Most corn enthusiasts are.

Here, yeah, it's so.

To be clear, I don't think those wheels are better.

You think that color combination is better.

You also think they you're not sentimental about.

I don't think that the thinking that the color combo is better is actually

that contrary. And I think that most people would agree that showing the lines is cooler.

I think that the blue, white is is is more valuable for two reasons.

Number one, because of the historic American racing color thing and number two,

because it's rarer.

But I don't necessarily think that I think a lot of people would agree with me.

Showing off the lines is is cool.

Red is the most popular color.

There were a lot of people who wanted to show off the lines in red.

And it's therefore the cheapest.

I do like the white with blue stripes.

I you would not be able to say that you've had it for eight years.

And now I might have GT for eight.

I've had two keys eight years.

I think it's insane because there's transaction.

It's like moving down the block to like a slightly different house because you want

a square foot larger yard.

That's what I'm going to mind here.

Let's pretend there weren't any transaction costs.

Let's just pretend there were none.

Not that I'm advocating doing anything illicit.

Well, there's there's still some transaction costs.

There's time.

There's maintenance used to put in to get it up to your standards.

There's some amount of time and energy.

Yeah. And money.

Even if it's not substantial all the real value in taking a 45

thousand mile or dollar, though, and bring it back to 10,000 miles.

I assume that the 10,000 mile car has been maintained the way you want to.

But it has. These cars have all been maintained well.

Well, I mean, if you in general, my approach is if it makes you happy,

you should do that.

I mean, other than the car, the mileage thing, I think is kind of a moot point.

I don't see what benefit you personally gain.

I like driving one with lower miles.

Oh, just that it restart.

There's stuff that has worn and is wearing.

The seats are wearing, etc.

Age-related. I get it all back to the beginning.

Maybe maybe having noodles sit in it without any car cover on it has something

to do with that.

That was it.

The seats.

But I don't want that there's generally stuff in the car that is worn,

that is wearing that that you start at the clock on 10,000 mile car again.

You come back with the billet A arms again, which I had to lose

because my my grommets were off and things like that.

Like it sure.

But the rubber components time out over that period of time.

I don't have I want to have Camillo's signature on it.

I can hunt him down again.

I'm sure. Well, if you park it anywhere near him.

I love Camillo.

I don't think it's I mean, I think it's insane, but if it makes you happy,

you should you have a white blue

and you want to trade for a blue white with three or four extra miles sent.

Well, I think people wouldn't make this.

I think if I did the whole thing, I could come out net zero.

I think it would take me three months.

Yeah, it would be a lot of work.

I'd have to list mine sell at my point.

I would probably want to buy a white one first to make sure that I actually had

the white one before I sold the blue one because I can't be for GT list.

Can't be for just you.

You understand. I obviously.

Yeah. Oh, we're both for GT list over here.

I think I should do this.

OK, S E A N at cars and bids dot com.

If you've got a white blue and you want to trade it for a blue white,

let's have a conversation.

My car is perfect.

It's a it's a two owner car.

It's perfect.

Always been in Southern California.

Took one road trip to you.

I do think it would be sad to lose the color in your garage.

All your cars are white or silver.

That's true. Except for the 93.

I got I got a 993 and another one of my

taught car segments today.

Oh my god, is it happening?

Yeah, I'm just going to say it.

You're going to roll with it.

We're finding some of the cars that I had announced I was looking for.

We're finding some of the cars.

Some of them might also be silver.

We don't know.

I've been looking for an E 55 station wagon at 2000 or 2001.

E 55 station wagon.

Rami. My god.

There are. No, we got.

Oh, we did. Wow.

But it's a 99.

It's a shame you don't remember that.

It's a shame.

Rami, my automotive god, inbound motorsports.

Rami, we have found one.

Wow. We have purchased it.

Whoa, it's in Holland.

Whoa, you purchased it?

It happened.

You know it as the Netherlands.

I do. But I know it as a tunnel.

To. Oh, geez.

God, that's horrible.

Thank you. We got one of these.

This isn't it.

Mine's mine's not a 99.

I can't take these rocker panels.

This is such a question.

We'll do it.

And we're going to install a third row

because it doesn't have one,

but we bought a third row.

Wow. That's coming in the mail.

And then make a rush on it.

Can do it.

So can you.

We found another one of the cars I was looking for.

I don't think we should announce.

We should have not.

That one. I keep that one.

Found another one of the cars I was looking for.

Now, unfortunately, I'm not going to be able to tell all of you

about these things until August,

because I'm personally not going to actually see the cars until then.

So we're going to see them before you do.

I say absolutely you will.

And you can give me your thoughts.

Oh, I will.

Canada, like any of my cars,

it's not true.

The 55 is cool.

I don't get it, but I don't know why you need it.

I need a third row.

Right. Yeah. You don't have any.

I need a third row.

Are you not worried?

Are you really not worried that

absolutely without the 4GT,

like all too many of your cars will be white

if the 4GT becomes white?

Are you not worried that that's too much?

Cars that I have purchased in this are not.

No, no, obviously I'm aware,

but it's still not not that much color.

I yeah, it's disappointing.

It's disappointing.

I don't like red.

If only two of your eight cars

have a color that's not white or silver, that's not enough.

I think there is something to that.

So the 4GT is helping you get to three.

I agree. It's it's nice.

It's going to be up to me to get a car.

You can't complain, though,

about the Qantas being white.

That's not like one of those like,

oh, we didn't get in a correct color.

Qantas is white white.

That's like a Qun.

You know what I mean?

Like that's it. That's correct.

That's like how it's done.

And I am glad in retrospect, the Sequoia is white

because I was next to a tiered

a black tiered Pro Sequoia

and the camo shows way more.

It does.

By the way, it's ice cap.

That's the color.

Anyway, the point is we're finding some cars.

OK, I'm excited for you.

And we're going to do a 4GT color.

So you're going to have three new vehicles,

maybe maybe more.

And I'm not in the 4GT.

It's my guess.

Yeah, I actually have.

I think that's all.

But I do. I do sit in my garage and I look at it

and I think why if I don't like the color of this car?

Do I not just it's worth way more?

Why don't I just do the easy thing?

That's a reasonable point.

You could make it the color that you want.

It's silly.

To not like the color.

I agree with you.

You know what I don't agree with that.

I think that it is important to buy as someone

who didn't buy the car and the car that he wanted to.

You have the 355 and your M5.

And my M5. That's two now.

Yeah, because I wanted I wanted a Rosa Corsa

when I bought this car.

It looked like Rosa Corsa in the picture.

So I didn't even think to ask.

It's such a common color.

But that's your point is that I should do it.

I well, I think you should have done it originally.

It just got in the right color.

I made that step.

I mistake the problem.

The problem I had was I couldn't really afford a 4GT

when I bought it or I could barely.

So I had to buy a high mileage car

and they're just no.

It aren't any.

And these day and at the time,

there wasn't really a price delta for the colors,

the heritage room with more.

But there otherwise there wasn't really a price change

for the colors.

And over time, the blue has really risen

and the yellow was falling to the point

where I can get away with this now

and be like driving a new 4GT again, a new old 4GT.

I just feel so I'm billow about this for you.

Okay, fine.

Fine.

Then let's discuss the other big talk cars segment.

Canon, tell us about M5 costs.

Yes.

So recently I put out a video on my car

where I damaged it.

Yeah, where you crashed into a parking brake.

I didn't crash into it.

Sounds better.

Well, that's not what happened.

I know you're a revisionist for history,

but that's not what occurred here.

And everybody's actually very nice.

The car is repaired.

I did that throughout the video.

And actually I was very humbled.

I was very grateful that so many people reached out.

Thank you for all your sympathies.

And a lot of people said,

I was stunned the number of people texted me.

It's like, I've done that.

I've been in the same.

However, immediately of course that might,

as you may recall at the beginning of the year,

I set out the goal of yet again,

not spending more than $2,000 on my M5.

Well, this little incident.

But that doesn't, this doesn't count.

Is it okay not to count that?

So I wanna make sure with you guys and the rules.

Well, we have a different opinion about this.

Okay.

If it was me, I would have replaced

the minimum number of things.

If it was my E55 wagon, I would have replaced just enough.

He would have probably used ZipTies.

Yeah.

He would have taken the front end from an E320.

Wouldn't be cheaper.

So the question I think is,

how far beyond what you had to do, did you do?

That's when it starts to count against it.

I like that.

Yeah.

Well, the bumper was split in half.

We can agree that I needed to replace that.

You need a bumper.

You can do it.

So that's $1,000 for that, for just the bumper.

Fender liners is a different conversation.

That's, yeah, but that was the, the,

I would argue from looking at the photos

that the fender liners probably didn't get damaged.

Well, they all, the problem was,

they were the metal on the two barbs on this thing.

I pulled it where it caught it.

It ripped three components at one time

in addition to the bumper.

So it ripped, it split the tabs off of the brake duct.

It ripped the belly pan, which was attached to that.

And that also attaches to the fender line.

It ripped that off.

What could super glue have done for you?

Or zip ties, or zip ties?

Not much, because it ripped off all the mounting points.

Well, let me rephrase.

What could zip ties have done for me or Filippo?

Ask not what you can do for zip ties.

Like if I was doing it, keep in mind,

I once zip tied a painted front bumper

to a body of an Audi A4 that I had.

One time I made a throttle cable.

Oh, for years.

For years.

We used a key hook for a throttle cable.

We one time my throttle cable snapped

and we used a key chain.

Yeah.

We drove around for a while.

Well, no, that makes sense.

That was what you needed to,

you're on an island.

I personally expected that way.

I think Doug considered it.

No, he had fixed it properly.

In the end.

Well, in the end, I only fixed it properly

because I had months where I wasn't with the car

and it was at a mechanic and I was like,

hey, why don't you just fix this?

I wouldn't have driven on that key chain forever.

Oh, but then, do you remember what also happened?

We went to check on the key chain,

holding the throttle cable together.

It stretched.

Hold the hood release and cable.

That was Land Rover the car ship.

That's a quality view.

So we could check on it.

So then I had to tell the guy,

why don't you fix both these things?

So what's the answer?

How much of this was discretionary, what's that?

I think it's a zero.

He's gonna say zero with that one.

Yeah.

To him, it had to be done.

I had probably 1700 out of it was discretionary.

Of the total.

Okay, so you're at 1700

and then there's more maintenance necessary upcoming.

Yes, so I've driven the car a lot recently

which has been awesome.

I mean, it's been, I mean,

genuinely it hasn't given me a single issue.

I did start to notice there are like a couple

little things that are starting to creep up.

One is like,

Do we think we need to address the little things?

Do let me, me rephrase it in a different way.

Do we think we need to address the little things?

Well, one is a click coming from the front suspension,

which I think, so I think that should be addressed.

The other, what was the other thing?

Oh my God.

Seriously.

They were, so the exhaust,

there's a crack that had formed around one of the welds.

Near the kind of the catalytic converters.

And that has since spread around the world.

So you can hear it when I'm like,

when I start the car, it's a lot louder than it once was.

I have any, it's, but it's.

Phil Chong has a exhaust shop welder guy

who will take care of that.

Yeah, that would be great.

I take, I don't respect, no disrespect.

Well, I take my 39 to one place for service.

And that's 39 source.

I would argue this is part of the problem.

No.

With the costs.

Oh, we've gotten so out of the real stuff.

No, no, no, so that needs to be welded

because I can smell it.

Like when I like come up to a stop.

And I'm like, oh yeah.

It's like, oh, that's my car.

Geez, he's polluting our state.

Polluting our state.

Exactly.

And I don't want to.

Okay, so those are like,

those are the two things.

Those are the two things.

I don't think it's that bad.

Really, other than that,

it's like I can't find anything else wrong with that.

That's great.

So you're at like, what, three grand?

Yeah.

You only have 50% above your budget for the year.

Five months in.

Yeah.

You're gonna do well.

I don't think it's that bad,

but I do think those things should be.

No, it's not that bad.

It's not great.

You're gonna end up another $10,000 a year here.

No, no, we're not gonna have another time.

I would rather just get a Viper

and not have a $10,000 M5 year.

I don't think we're gonna have a $10,000 M5 year.

Here's what you do.

You get this Subaru Sambar as a daily.

Yeah, it has wood paneling.

Like our friend Kevin,

daily into the sense that I would drive it once on a day

and that would be my daily.

I think it's very cute,

but this might be a bit much for me.

Okay, well, somebody made the point recently

that it's like,

and Kenan, I think you should get a Macan turbo

or this was that as a daily.

It's like, I just,

I still don't want to do that

because I think that while I'm single and like,

and young-ish-

You should have a four door sedan, I agree.

Right, exactly.

That's exactly the point though.

My second car that I should buy should be,

because I am a little weird of using the M5.

Like, but I think that having the second car

should be a sports car.

I should own more sports cars.

And I still want a Viper and I've found one,

but I'm pausing just a little bit,

but I have found one that I think is like-

Pausing, press play.

Nice, well done.

What do you mean?

Well, we all want you to get a Viper.

The whole audience wants you to get a Viper.

That Kuntas rug wants you to get a Viper.

We're ready.

It's talking right now.

I do, I am going to get one.

I just, you'll see.

I am going to get one though.

I am hot on the trail of one.

I see it here about an Aster Marnin Vanquish.

I have to say,

it's gonna be after the Viper already.

Well, the 02.

I will-

You told me they're horrible to own.

Yeah, well, I like cars that are bad, though.

Yeah, but that car is probably,

dude, I'll tell you something.

I drove this one, this one.

It was so amazing.

Yeah, they are unbelievable to drive.

That engine, that sonorous V12 sound that it makes is so good.

Did you enjoy driving at Ryan Lopez?

Which one?

Who did that?

I mean, it's a car.

He wasn't alive when this thing was made.

No, he took those photos though.

He did.

You liked it.

What about the trans?

It's quirky.

You would, you get us, would you swap it?

Well, that's the thing.

It's like, I'm, I want an S to be clear.

I think that, because I like the S a lot more.

Yeah, it just screwed up the wheels.

There's a big jump in power though.

It was a big power jump.

It screwed up the wheels.

Well, I think if you're gonna do it,

own the one you want and I want an S.

And I don't think the wheels are screwed up.

Own the white one.

Put a base wheel on?

Yeah, put a base wheel on.

It just did like DB9 was.

Go back to the original,

to me the original Vanquish wheels meant business.

I don't think they're that different.

You know, I've read this thing.

I don't know where I read it.

My friend Perry sent to me.

That Pierce Bros.

and got one of these after dying another day.

He was given one.

Yes.

And then he lost it in a garage fire.

Correct.

But he was, the fire department was able to dig out

the kick plates and it said it was made, you know,

for Pierce Brosnan.

What the hell?

So you retain that and then at the end of the video,

he goes, that's life.

Yeah, this would be cool.

But I think this is the next.

For 35, 40 is cool.

I just think Aston's are such an incredible value.

And this is the Aston.

Yeah, this is the one because it's like,

this competed with the 575 and I love both of these cars.

And honestly, I prefer driving this.

For a third of the price.

Even Filippo would like this car.

I don't, I've never loved how the vanquisher.

I can't even like this.

He doesn't, sorry.

I wish you liked something Filippo,

other than your 9-11, which I'm glad you like.

I gotta tell you guys a story about,

I got two stories for you actually.

One is about Freddie.

Oh, Freddie Tavar.

Freddie Tavar-ish.

We had a Hoovey on the pod last week.

God love Hoovey.

Love Hoovey.

We haven't recorded that pod yet.

I hope it all works.

I may not have been on it.

It's gonna be Hoovey and Nick.

It's gonna be something.

I'm gonna be the sane one.

It's gonna be something to watch.

Oh, that's awesome.

Or it was something to watch.

I don't know.

I'm just gonna have to moderate it.

Geez.

But so anyway, so Hoovey's on the pod.

Hoovey's been out here.

Hoovey's hangs out with us.

And I get a text yesterday from Freddie Tavar-ish,

who I'm not gonna say he's a chaotic person.

I'll let you make that determination.

Yeah.

He sends me a text and he says,

he says, hey,

he says, I'm on a plane to San Diego.

You around?

And I'm like, Freddie,

there was a time when I was 19

where my life worked that way.

You could just send me a text and be like,

yo, I'm coming, was hang.

But like I got kids.

I do a lot of kids stuff in the school.

We got a lot of videos scheduling to keep here.

We got a lot of crew.

There's no like, hey, man, let's chill.

And I was like, that's not really how it works here.

I'm so sorry.

I would love to hang.

I just don't have time.

I may be a little bit more noticed

because I assume he didn't just get on the plane.

Right.

I assume he had booked the flights

some amount of time.

That's an assumption I would not make.

If anybody shows up to the airport and buys a ticket

from the gate agent.

Freddie.

So I said, Freddie, I'm so sorry I were missing you.

I would love to have you on a pod.

I said, next time give me more notice.

And Freddie goes, how much more notice would you need?

Like he's incredulous that I can't make this happen for him.

And I said, Freddie, more notice than I'm on the plane.

He replies, but measured in days.

What number would that be?

What does your reply?

I said, like give me at least a week.

I don't know.

Like that's what people do.

Like if I'm going to see somebody,

I don't just call them and say, I'm on the plane.

I hope you can accommodate them.

I'm going, I'm coming to see you in New York.

Are you there?

You text beforehand.

Have you ever, in any moment since you became an adult,

had a situation where you were flying on an airplane

to visit someone and you hadn't yet informed them?

You think I would have done that?

The whole purpose was come to just here to visit you?

No, that's of course.

That's true.

It was not as whole as I'm sure he has some things to do.

I'm sure he has cruises to go on.

But that's Freddie Tavar.

That's my Tavar.

And people who are wondering why we have Hoovey on the pod

and not Freddie, Hoovey schedules us.

It's still very difficult.

Okay. He won't text Sean back.

He won't reply to our emails.

I gotta text him.

It's a disaster.

But we kind of narrow what we get it down.

And on the day of the pod, we just sort of roll the dice

and hope he walks in at the right time.

But Freddie, it's not even that.

We can't even get that.

That's my Freddie's word.

Don't you think that he might be in last week's podcast?

Just Freddie?

He might.

Freddie might walk into the Hoovey pod.

I have no idea.

It's like a beginning of a bad joke.

Freddie, Hoovey, and Nick.

Freddie, Hoovey, and Nick walk into a podcast.

Our Markter Report is brought to you by Rob Lopez.

Which is to say we're gonna talk about something

completely different.

So I wanna talk F90 and five.

Pull up.

That is tremendously interesting.

Yeah, so we recently sold an F90M5 for $29,250.

Now, I will say it did have a lot of miles on it

and had an accident and it's passed in modifications.

But in my view, this is the floor now.

Because this is not an old car.

I mean, it's eight years old.

That's the example with high mileage

and an accident that's gonna hit the floor.

Yeah, hit the floor, exactly.

But dude, I remember reviewing this

when it was a new car at Crevier BMW in Orange County.

It was a brand new with a 140 sticker.

It was the coolest thing anybody could imagine.

It was a new M5 is here.

It was all wheel drive.

It was this amazing.

You could disconnect the all wheel drive.

Remember that you can get rear wheel drive.

600 horsepower.

I can't believe like no car, I think,

has made my career feel long to me.

More than this.

Quite like this.

It's like, oh my God.

Like I've been around long enough to have like reviewed

and now seen the depreciation on this.

Dude, I know.

I mean, when I see, I mean, C-Cross from 2015.

That was a long time ago.

It's, you know, we're getting old, man.

But I think unbelievable these guys are worth that.

Unbelievable.

Crazy.

Especially when you consider it's,

what was it, it was 600, someone crazy.

600 horsepower.

Yeah, 600 horsepower.

Just an unbelievable, unbelievably fast share.

650 pound feet.

Full of cars that sold for more in the same day.

Yeah.

A 2015 automatic Chevy SS.

Oh.

An auto Chevy.

An auto Chevy SS was sold for four grand more.

A 2015, so four years older for 12, 13% more.

And a tip also.

And a tip.

I mean, that tells you how the market,

how afraid of these cars the market is.

And maybe, maybe roughly so.

I don't really know, I don't know much about a science.

It's a beast.

This car.

I know, it's a monster.

A beast.

And like, people are gonna write,

it's like in the market because they're unreliable.

Probably they are unreliable.

I don't know.

It's $29,000 though.

To me, when I see one of these on the road,

I'm still like, wow, new M5.

It's not even a new M5 anymore.

There's a newer M5.

I think that's an amazing five.

I think it's an incredible value.

I really do.

You buying one?

No, I can do it daily.

You just had a tip.

I did, and I guess what I did, I sold it.

You've had more tips this year than I have.

You own three.

I don't know who you is.

I don't own any tips.

What tips I got?

Well, you're about to have a fourth.

What?

Don't reveal anything.

Mercedes Benz, a great traditional Mercedes Benz.

Unless you're gonna manual swap it like crazy, Nick, but.

I'm not.

No, I didn't think you would.

But yeah, unbelievable value here.

I just think it's so cool.

But we...

You think about one?

Absolutely not, but it is quite a deal.

It's like a five guy.

I can't say...

A lot of the cars in the genre

are quite substantial deals.

We sold them.

They mean high power sedans.

Sedans and coupes, luxury sedans and coupes

that are just...

Pull up that M850.

Yeah, the M850 we sold.

Sean's out here looking for a M2, by the way.

A-I.

If you have a Long Beach Blue M2 with some miles,

maybe it's been hit, maybe it's got some bad wheels on it,

no cats.

Sean at CarsandBids.com.

S-E-A-N at CarsandBids.com.

That's what he's looking for.

He doesn't know it yet, but what he wants to pay,

that's what he's looking for.

You agree, right?

Yeah.

Of course he's stunk and I don't know what he ends up with.

Well, for the same money as an M2,

you could have this, which surely has a hundred,

something thousand dollar MSRP.

Totally, and it's not in the athletic.

It's not the athlete that the M2 is,

but Sean's an appearance guy,

and he would like to ride around in this.

Everybody thinks he's rich.

Or it looks like a Mustang.

And it has everything.

Side profile.

Looks like a Mustang.

That was the best thing about it.

Yeah.

Has everything.

You can also, if you want to be in the same price point,

we sold an S63.

What's the horsepower on this M850?

It's serious, I believe.

523, 552 pounds.

I'm not trying to make it seem like I'm hyping these cars,

and I want to kill everybody's financial situation,

but how unreliable can it be at six years old?

Seriously.

It BMW just like hold my beer.

I know, I know, you're right.

But like really, it's six years old.

20 miles.

56,000 miles, you got an answer.

How bad can that car be?

Truthfully.

Are we talking major engine trouble

at six years and 56,000 miles?

I have a hard time.

If it hasn't been tuned, like I wouldn't think so.

And I'd like to think of, I'd like to think a manufacturer

that's been around for over 100 years can make an engine.

And with all their experience,

a special one for 56,000.

This isn't like a high performance.

You probably was driven pretty relaxed, you know?

Right, because it's the end.

It's the end.

Yeah.

This is an M850.

It's not like an M, it's not like an ultra high performance

car, that M2 that Sean wants has been beat on.

You know?

Yep.

Yeah.

This car probably has been sort of chilled in.

Yeah, I would like to think so.

Occasional hard accelerations.

Can I have positive one more for Sean?

Yeah.

Look at C43.

That's not, Sean has no interest in that.

Yeah, but if you for $23,000.

Of course it has that.

I'm not telling you to do this for you and Sean.

It's a four seconds, you're just gonna say,

I'm gonna tell you to do this for you and Sean.

300,000 for our car.

You're a deal shopper.

You will change the entire thing you wanna buy

if it just means you can get a good deal.

Sean, Sean is an alert right now.

He needs a car and he's sent some wild options.

Sean is selling, I'll tell you what's happened.

Sean is selling his bad color G-Wagon.

Yeah.

And so because he's taken all the photos

and taken the, cleaned it up and done all that,

he can't drive it anymore.

He's, because if he crashes it at this point,

it's a problem.

So his bad color G-Wagon is sitting in our office

and Sean has now realized he's left with a 360

and an old alpha.

He's like, oh my God, I need a car.

Is that why he shows me like Lexus LS430?

Yes.

Or the SC430.

Yes, he's borrowed from his parents.

He's borrowed a Lexus SC430 on dinner plates.

The man owns a Ferrari, a vintage L-format

and a G-Wagon and he had to borrow a Lexus from his parents.

That's what's happened.

That's how it's generally worked.

That is motivation.

That's why he's low ball on people on Facebook,

Marketplace left and right with reckless abandon.

No, no.

He told us he insisted on a four seat car.

He sent us a screenshot.

He low balled the guy on it with a C7.

He's no longer, he's like medium balling now

because he's getting desperate.

He's getting desperate.

That's how you know.

The longer he drives that SC430, the desperate he'll get.

I wanna talk about the F12.

Pull that F12, let's talk about that.

Unbelievable result, I think.

Truly agreed.

So yeah, so 2014, so first year production,

F12 Brunietta.

Ryan Lopez is eating.

I'm glad we're here for Ryan Lopez's entertainment.

I look over, he's just crunching.

So soon you're just gonna hear,

as he opens, the oven's a cold one.

What's the problem?

I don't understand.

I went upstairs, the guy wasn't there.

The next day.

But yeah, back to Ferrari's.

So yeah, so this 14 F12,

so F12 Brunietta, fantastic car.

They've been coming up in value recently

because I think the new cars are so damn expensive.

Do you worry that we miss the boat here?

I worry more about 599 but yes.

But this car is better.

It is, but the dual clutch is,

like I would still prefer manual conversion.

I would prefer manual conversion.

For sure.

But the thing with this car,

so it's sold for $311,000, with 16,000 miles on end,

a vinyl wrap, which I was surprised,

because normally that brings quite a bit less usually,

unless you have pictures before and all that stuff.

But I think this number is strong.

The most recent comps that I was looking at earlier

are in the 230 to 250 range.

I just, I really think that it is because,

the new Dodecice Cilindri, sorry.

Beautiful car.

But it is expensive.

It's so expensive.

Really expensive.

The 812 also was very expensive and they still,

they still are.

I think a lot of people who,

even like people who've been for our customers for years,

can't justify spending, what, $600, $700,000 on a car

after you've optioned it.

Especially because this car offers basically

the same performance level.

If we're being honest,

I know the Dodecice Cilindri is faster,

but not useably.

Yeah, but it's still 730 horsepower.

Yeah, yeah.

I mean, it's a lot of power.

And with the door clutch, and the interior looks,

And these are relatively reliable.

The interior looks fairly modern.

I mean, I don't know.

I think it's a tremendous.

And you want to be 12.

For 300 something in Ferrari world,

you get what, 296 if you want newer?

Like that's, you could probably get a 296.

The last 296 we had was failed to be reserved,

but it was marked correct.

They were on 350.

Yeah.

315.

311 is, I don't know if the 296 is quite there,

but in that rain.

I would rather have a V12.

Of course there's a V12.

Yeah.

This is a secret.

Most people wouldn't to be clear.

I mean, the V12s usually get depreciated like crazy

as most people go after the mid-engines.

But now, at this point, we're all.

This thing is so cool.

Yeah.

I mean, it's still a lot of money.

Have we messed up here and not bought F12s

when they were merely 200?

I thought we would be able to sit and just watch

the values continue to fall.

Not the case, it seems.

Apparently not.

Maybe one car is not an outlier or is not a market,

but I do watch other Ferraris in the world,

including the Skood.

And I, Sean Stain said,

The Hatcha, I know.

Finally gave it to him.

I know you did.

Including the Skood.

And I watch these values and I'm like, wow.

You see that MC12 sold for $10 million?

Yep.

Maybe we've just missed it altogether.

The Ferrari, I mean, obviously an MC12 and an F12 isn't,

but like there seems to be a renewed interest in cars

as an investment class, as a blue chip collectible.

Every hyper supercar seems like it's really hot right now,

especially not the newest.

A generation old, one of us still a little bit more analog

than it is now.

Which like most current these just admittedly,

I do start to kind of roll my eyes and be like,

God, everything's just getting so expensive.

And like I feel priced out of many cars

I hoped to own one day.

Challenge Trudale is my favorite example.

You really wanted to own one of those.

And now at $700,000, $800,000,

that's not realistically not gonna happen.

Yep.

Or even if I wouldn't spend that kind of experience.

Yeah, no one would spend that on a challenge for a while.

Get Sean's from, have most of the same experience.

Anacuntas.

Or yeah, Anacuntas, yeah.

Yeah, Anacuntas, that's true.

Can we talk about the 430 Skood,

can we pull it up?

Because it's still gonna be live when this podcast goes on.

430 Skood, we got 430 Skood up right now.

How are you interested in this?

Sean vehicles.

It's a 430 man.

He's just having to give me the SC for it.

He's driving a 430.

Here, now what are we doing?

Sean's got a 430 Spider.

It's that or BMW.

It's just got an acre of burl walnut in the dash.

The rare.

It's a slightly different, yeah.

It doesn't have sticky plastics, it's got old wood.

You know the SC 430 and the F430

have the same size back seat.

That's.

Pull up an SC 430.

You will never see a smaller, pull up that car.

It is tiny.

Look at this.

This is what the seats folded forward.

Oh that's suspicious.

Give me a break.

Keep going.

Look at that.

That does seem suspicious.

For your size of an ant.

That is a cavern.

I cannot get my children back there.

My children are as small as possible for front facing.

Literally impossible car to drive.

Right, even if you want to, but you don't.

Look at all that wood.

Sean is experiencing this right now as we speak.

You remember driving those, the steering wheels fall like.

It was just like, like steering through peanut butter.

Radically over, yeah.

And the car is so puffy and cloud like.

And there's so much wood.

Go to the interior.

The amount of this light wood, it's just an unbelievable.

It looks nice.

I think it looks perfect for the clientele.

And never forget, as much as the tuner kids,

the Ryan Lopez's over here are like,

oh the SC 300 with the 2JZ.

The SC 430s are worth more.

Boom.

Yup.

V8 baby.

Anywho, the 430s skewed is expensive.

Very.

What's gonna be interesting is we don't know how expensive.

Cause there's not been a public regular result.

There hasn't been a public result in almost a year.

The fitting right now, two weeks ago,

is about where the last public result was.

That's right.

That tells you it's on the bounce way.

Well, we'll see.

I don't know.

I'm very curious myself.

I drove this car.

It was an unbelievable experience.

This car is absolutely incredible to drive.

It is incredible to use.

It is so much more aggressive than a regular 430.

I steering precision, exhaust note, speed.

It is so immediate, so raw.

In a way that honestly, I think none of the other

sporty mid-engine cars are.

Not the CS, not the speciality.

None of them.

This is the most mechanical and the most raw

of all of those cars.

And we'll see where it ends up.

I felt the strally still pretty raw.

The CS?

Yeah.

I'm not a CS guy.

I know you hate that car.

I don't hate it.

I just think it's crazy what people spend.

This car is better than the CS in literally every single way.

But they produced more, more, much more.

Not even that many.

1700 of these versus 1288 CS.

CS isn't even that much rarer.

It's just a frog.

You know what I'm saying?

I like the frog.

This car is cool.

It is cool.

I'm glad.

I've been telling people for years to buy them.

I also told people for years to buy 458

speciality coupes, because I knew they were going to go up

in value, and I was right there too.

But I think that it is just like.

This car, F12.

I'm so curious to see where it ends up.

Yeah.

All the good Ferraris are definitely not quite as low

as they once were.

Again, even my beloved F355, this spider at 25,000 miles.

It makes me one.

Because there was a time when we were kids

where a RADD 308, 348, 355, they were all pretty much

available for 30 to 60 grand.

Like RADD ones.

Even kind of average.

38 GTSIs, the two valves.

I still thought that.

But it does make me one.

I always thought that that would just happen to the other

Ferraris venture, the 36 and 430s.

But what has happened instead is there seems to be this tide

that has risen, that has literally lifted all of the

Ferraris as the really crazy ones have gone up.

So too have all the other ones.

And it's like maybe the days of a RADD 60K Ferraris

just never going to happen again.

So I have been thinking about this a lot since January

when all those cars sold the Bachman collection.

Because the big Ferraris, the super cars all went up and

vice-versa, then people bought the limited edition V12s.

Those went up, people buying the stripped out limited

edition V8s.

So what's next?

I mean, yes, all of those are original.

I think the manual ones will catch fire yet again.

Yeah.

I mean, I think that what's next is anything next that's rare.

The factory manuals, the.

But then after that, you end up with the normal production

stuff. And then yes, that goes through.

I just I wonder, do you think that people are going?

I'm not just saying this one because I have one live right now.

But do you think people are going to start to look at the

lightweight Lamborghinis or like different?

You know what?

I have my garage is full of cars that don't say Ferrari on them.

And I don't I don't I've never I not bought my cars to

invest. I'm cool with it.

But I have watched in a little bit of annoyance as the Ferrari

brand name continues to be the defining characteristic of what

seems to attract buyers to a lot of these cars.

Where Lamborghini, the Countach is cooler than any Ferrari that

has ever been made, except maybe the F 40.

The 50 cooler.

I don't know.

But regardless, like the Countach is incredibly cool.

I'll take about in pop culture, maybe.

If the Countach was a Ferrari, it'd be a $10 million car.

It's a Lambo. It's five homing.

And I think that that is just sort of a reality that is the

truth. And it is.

I wished it would change.

And the Porsches have changed a little bit.

But the Ferraris just seem to be the thing that commands the

money. And I will also say one other thing as Ferrari becomes a

brand that makes more and cars.

Regular production 5 9 9 is a rare car.

Regular production 5 50 with 3,000 units.

And that's a good one.

Units is an afternoon of pure songways.

Rareer than a 300 SL.

But like you know what I mean.

Yeah, I do know what you mean.

Like a production modern Ferrari is a

rare car by standards of today's Ferrari.

And so there hasn't really been a market equivalent of this to

see how these cars are going to fare in the used market.

I wouldn't be surprised if one day all those cars are really

expensive. Just like back in the day at 250 p.

F was a normal car.

That was a regular production Ferrari.

And now it's an expense or at some point it was an expensive

car. It's still not a Ferrari.

You get my point.

I get I do.

I think the regular production cars of our youth will become

incredibly valuable as Ferrari becomes more commercialized,

higher production, more sanitized electric vehicles designed by

the Apple guy.

Like a 599 suddenly becomes a pretty attractive

proposition if you want to get into the old stuff.

I have to have a life.

Do you think it's just get a Ferrari after get a

599 dude.

I do want to get a tip 599 and spend a lot of money

every time it breaks.

Yep.

We can't see it.

Look at those cars.

I do wonder about them.

It's like they are super the Jarrah like that.

That's the one that in my mind has to at least I don't.

I come to a big disagree.

I'm not saying fly through the moon.

I think that I've been sitting here waiting for Lambos to pop

for so long and they never have a mirror at 3000000 is

like the all time ceiling for any Lamborghini ever.

And that's only 3000000

And it's the father of the supercar.

Like it was the first supercar ever.

It was Gandini's first real design.

It was the first mid-engine production.

And it's like the Countach invented the wedge shape.

The first car with scissor doors and both of those cars

languish at murals at 2000000

Countach is at 600 in their Bible.

They're all day long.

That's true.

But the appreciation on the Countach is fair about his the

same time you bought your Ford.

So it's a it's a 600 car.

Whereas a you know an Enzo is a 10 million car.

And those were 600 and three.

Well for yeah for an afternoon.

They're one point two immediately.

All right.

I want to move on to the questions.

The questions of course are sponsored by.

Can I suggest a sponsor.

Yeah. Cars and beds.

There's an app.

Cars and there is.

There's a one coming.

There's also an Android app.

There is an Android app right now.

I don't use it.

We're doing an Android app.

That's amazing.

We're doing an Android app.

Take that.

Bring the trailer.

They have an Android app.

Oh they already have one.

Forget it.

All right.

I want to move on to questions.

And we got a lot of questions because this was supposed to

be a more questioning pod.

But you know what we ended up talking about other stuff.

I still have great questions.

First question from Ness.

I'm sorry.

I still have great questions.

First question from Daki P.

Ken you got to answer for it.

What happened to your hair on the podcast two weeks ago?

I tried.

I have a lot of hair.

I have my hair is very thick and it grows very fast and I wanted

to try something different.

So I did.

And I got a lot of attention way more than I was expecting it to.

It's just hair for God's sake.

Just hair.

I walked in that day and I said Ken.

Well nobody tries anything different.

I took one look at him and I said Ken you can't have your

hair.

Which again getting getting style criticism from a man.

So style is truly crushing.

It wasn't about me.

I just knew that the comments would be endless and literally

every comment people couldn't even get into Filippo's brilliant

takes because they were so consumed by the hair.

Well they're welcome.

In a way it was actually a good thing.

You're welcome for all the comments and the extra engagement

on that one Sean.

Next question.

This is a real question and I think a good one and I want you

both to atone.

One to be clear.

Look me in the face when I ask you this question.

OK.

From Siberian motor wagon.

I've been making this point in our group for the last week or so

in our group chat and I've been very very vocal about it and now

someone happens to ask the same question.

How come the only non-German cars in your friend group are a

Ford sports car and a Toyota truck.

Hey now.

What happened to the other cars is why is Ken and now is Ken

and looking for the most American car they're in but Filippo's

got this Mercedes.

You know what I have a 1973 Ford truck.

You know what's funny about this Ford truck.

Every time I met his house the tires on this truck are 25 years

old and every time I met his house every time I met his house

I'm like Filippo you got to get these tires changed.

He goes it's not my truck.

It's my truck.

It's not my truck.

It's not my I'm not doing that.

Let her decide on the tires and now Filippo gets called out for

having only German cars.

He goes I got a truck.

I got a truck.

Third point.

Hard to argue that one.

It's impossible to argue that.

I am the only person.

Let me tell you the answer to this question because only I have

a full appreciation for the automobile.

Only exactly.

And what do I got?

I got a Toyota.

I got another non European car.

You know what I got to say.

I got the Ford GT.

I was going to say if we were in your financial position we'd do

different but to be honest with you.

You won it.

Because you guys this is the car I've owned the longest is an

American car.

I don't own any more and I haven't years but it's a car I've owned

the longest.

You guys have these narrow worldviews.

He's got a GTI an E station wagon.

That's the German.

Three German.

You have German everywhere.

SL65 German.

M5 German.

You have the Ferrari European.

The rest of the world is out there.

But I will say my appreciation has expanded tremendously.

I've done two films both on American cars recently.

A third was the Lamborghini but ignore that European car.

But I did the Ford Daytona Coupe which we sold.

Absolutely loved that car.

Absolutely adored it.

And then I did the Ford Mustang Mach 1.

That car was cool as hell.

I appreciate it for American cars and so I really want to own one.

I will own one.

A lot of people out here saying first off have some respect for

your own country.

Italy.

It can be Italy.

You don't have an Italian car either.

I'll let you have Italy.

He did have that 500 A bar.

I did.

Yeah.

Three months ago.

You know what upsets me.

Yeah.

I guess still you're at the end.

You know what upsets me.

I guess still you're at the end.

You know what upsets me.

I'll tell you specifically.

What upsets me about you specifically.

America took you in.

Yeah.

You were a poor child washed up on the shore on a beach in North

Carolina.

We don't often tell this story.

I'm going to tell it today.

He washed up on the beach.

He was only he was in a grocery bag from.

Yeah.

You'll get there.

You'll find a guitar.

I'll see you later.

I want to see which one you come up first.

You go first.

It's a grocery bag from from Euro spend.

Oh wow.

Okay.

A discount grocer.

Nice.

And he washed up going mama and you know who his mama was.

America.

That's true.

And what and you pay us.

What do you do.

I owned a Ford Focus built in America for years.

Six years.

I think that this is a legitimate question and beyond by the way

this group.

Nick has only a Mercedes station wagon a Mercedes SLR his

wife has a Cayenne that's three Germans plus he has his land rover

which is British European Nick has always been.

I mean well yeah but his first car was a Ford Euro Euro Euro

our buddy Sam is a boxer of variety and he's your always held

the other.

Jeeps built in America.

No but the point is we all had things.

Okay.

And then when we got some money and we got some taste we all bought

your opinion.

Not got to believe has an American car.

You don't have.

It's true.

You and it's like as a German car.

There's a Germans everywhere.

You guys are Euro trash.

We are.

You don't have a little bit of desire to say hey.

I do.

I'm going to own the most bear tested American car there is.

The difference between going to own and will own is the difference

between I'm keeping my GTI and I'm going to sell my GTI.

I set a course and I stick to it.

I make.

I'm waiting.

We're all sitting here.

Siberian motor wagon is sitting here waiting for you to fly a flag.

Well I will and when it happens I will wear an American flag when I

have my.

You'll see.

Interesting.

There are a lot of cars in this office.

A lot of cars.

There are two American cars in this office.

Actually from my standpoint I can't sing a single American car.

And two is really kind of a stretch.

Italian Italian Japanese Japanese Italian.

There's a Chevy Sprint turbo around the corner.

I see it.

I in all honesty I am in all honesty.

Oh there's a Corvette.

Generally speaking the only member of our group who's really interested

in all of the countries in the car.

I don't think that's true.

At this moment I happen to own three German cars.

I don't understand how that's happened.

I need to correct that.

My car list is generally my car list is pretty comprehensive.

I've owned every country.

Volvo Audi Volkswagen Toyota Ford BMW Lotus Cadillac.

You ever have a Cadillac?

I had two.

I'm general.

I've owned.

Thank you very much.

I've got fewer cars but I think you will agree that I didn't have that little tax incentive

from Georgia State of Georgia that you did where you could just cycle cars.

Yeah you could lie on the forums like everybody else.

You're advising that people lie.

Oh we can't lie.

We don't do that.

You can't lie on the forums.

I don't do that to be clear.

I think that you should accept that I also have an equal love of all kinds of cars even

if I don't own them.

No I think once you've got a little money to buy cool cars they were all Europe.

All your cars before were BS cars that you didn't care about.

Suddenly you start to be able to…

SE Sport.

That car's long gone.

Four years.

I will.

If you look at the list of cars.

I have a list on my phone of every car I've ever driven my entire life.

I will drive anything.

Yeah.

But when it comes to committing to owns it's like there are tastes that I like.

No no.

It just happens.

There are no waggles.

No I just happen to fall into three Euro cars.

I like what I like.

What's wrong with that?

I am the only person who has a whole love of cars.

If I ask you something Corvette will you stop on this trend?

Yeah.

Okay.

I will bow down to you.

I don't know what like what…

Dead serious.

I am proud to drive the 4GT every time I drive it in part because it's America.

That car is designed in America, by an American, built in America and then…

Hey, so is your Corvette GT sort of…

Hell yeah.

We're going to have Jason Hill, the designer of the Corvette GT on this podcast.

He doesn't know it yet.

I haven't told him.

But I now connect to do him on Instagram.

I would like to own more sports cars and I'm taking that advice.

That's why I'm not buying a Macon and I will own more.

I'm sorry.

Were you speaking German or just speaking?

I couldn't hear you.

You know.

Very funny.

Very funny man.

Okay.

Making fun of Germany.

Can't believe it.

Okay.

Next question.

This is a good question.

From Plaza Blee.

Hey fellows, what podcasts are you listening to?

Flippo, tell us about your listening experience.

Yeah.

I don't listen to that many podcasts, but I listen to some like news related podcasts

and tech related podcasts.

Okay, look what?

I'd rather not get into it.

Flippo, tell us.

I will say I do love MKBHD's Waveform podcast as one of my tech ones.

Shout out to Tamar Kez Brownlee.

Flippo, tell us.

I'm trying to like solicit some favorites here from.

Tell us about the podcast that you listen to.

It's MPR to see.

There's a fair amount of MPR, yeah.

They have some good podcasts.

Flippo, I want.

But it's not exclusively MPR.

When do you listen to it?

I'm curious.

When I walk the dog or when I'm on a really long walk.

I always wondered what you're listening to when you walk.

I don't listen to music that often.

You know.

Doug is in the top 1% of Spotify listeners worldwide.

I'm not.

I don't.

You're not going to admit here to listening to hardcore left wing podcasts.

You're not going to admit that.

I thought I was going to describe them.

I listened to more podcasts and more genres than you might expect.

That was good.

Oh my God.

All right.

Let's do three more questions.

Three more questions from JMF3.

By the way, I don't listen to any podcast.

Can I do you?

Yeah, I do.

What do you listen to?

MSSP, Matt and Shane Secret podcast.

Shout out to the dogs.

What just happened?

Everybody who listens to that, everybody knows.

I love Matt and Shane.

I think I love Matt and Shane.

What do you think this is?

Lebo, what do you think this is?

Shane Gillis, Matt and Shane Gillis, the comedian and Matt.

They both do great podcasts and all the time.

I also listen to Smoking Tire.

Love Matt Fair.

I always have listened to Smoking Tire.

Still my favorite podcast.

No offense.

No offense to you too.

I'm a little offended.

And I listen to a lot of stuff.

Boot inky radio.

Listen to them of course for watch stuff and play a bunch of others too.

I listen to none.

I listen to music.

Yeah, I do know that.

Speaking of, there's a question here.

What is the best song to listen to while driving during the day?

What is the best song to listen to while driving at night?

I'm going to tell you the only song I listen to is called Standing Still by a band called Bouda Head.

It's the only song I listen to.

I haven't heard that one from you yet.

Over and over again.

That's the only song I listen to.

Night and day.

Is that a summer song?

No, it's from like 20 years ago.

You can have it if you want.

But like what is it slow?

I'm giving you the song of the summer.

You got it.

Call me maybe maybe.

We need to call me maybe.

No, but you always have a song of the summer that you like.

I know.

We need to call me.

It needs to be poppy and fun.

I'm giving you this song.

Standing Still by Bouda Head.

You go listen to it.

Felipe, you go listen to it.

Instead of listening for once, instead of listening to Rachel Maddow.

It's right there on Spotify.

That's the song.

Okay.

Yeah.

Two more questions.

Two more actual questions.

Kyle K.P., are there any car manufacturers that you think will follow in the footsteps

of spirit airlines within the next five years or less?

That they will go bankrupt.

Or just disappear and people have to fly around repossessing their problems.

Yeah, somehow infinity.

I got it was so.

First of all, it comes alive.

Infinity just rolled out the QX-65.

I know.

There's a bunch of automakers that are constantly in trouble.

Aston Martin is a load of McCleary and honestly is constantly in trouble.

The thing is, an automaker with a really strong brand name is never going to go away.

So Saab went away because it did never go away.

Aston Martin is always, there's always going to be some value in it.

I also, the real answer is that there's going to be a lot of, by the way, there are a lot that have been smaller scale.

Lord Sound Motors was around for a brunt moment.

There's other ones like that.

Tell me about a real, if you were to place your bets.

On a real automaker.

That I think the next few years will truly go to business.

Yeah.

And fully collapse.

A lot will form.

I don't know about collapse, but just like the brand is gone.

What do you got?

Can't think on it too.

In the US market.

In the US market, I think probably half of the manufacturers in China will go bankrupt.

Yeah, US market.

Hit me in the US.

Who's leaving?

Why can't you immediately answer that?

I got two right off the bat.

Well, if Lotus actually does the thing they're going to do, they get rid of the V6 and that's not around anymore.

That seems pretty light.

I think either Alpha or Mazurati.

Alpha, definitely.

Mazurati was the other one.

They have strong brand names, but no way Mazurati.

I don't think that that's the Lantan has the will power.

The answer is Mitsubishi and Infiniti are both going away.

They are both going away.

Yeah, Mitsubishi is probably right.

I'm breaking the news right here.

Mitsubishi Motors is done in the US.

When you go on Mitsubishi.cars.com, the only car they're offering is the Outlander.

Yes, it is.

The Eclipse Crosse.

That's been true for a while and at least there is a new Outlander and a refresh one coming out of memory service.

Based on the Rogue, right?

Correct.

Well, this is all going to go great.

But then you remember, of course, that the Rogue hybrid is based on the Outlander.

The Outlander, yeah.

No, I think that...

Mitsubishi is a good guess.

Mitsubishi and Infiniti.

They're circling the drain.

It depends on how Nissan plans to do it.

I think they will want a luxury brand and so they may keep it alive even though they should.

I just don't know.

You know, it's interesting.

When all the Japanese brands launched luxury brands in the late 80s and early 90s, they did it because they saw the enormous amount of money that the Germans were making.

And it hasn't gone well for any of them.

Lexus has been great.

Infiniti has been pretty much a disaster after year three.

Acura never really took off like I think they were hoping it would.

It always sort of lived in this budget space, which was never going to be as profitable.

And you know, Mazda tried to do it too.

They had this brand they were going to launch called the MOTI.

That was the 929 was going to be that.

And they never even got it off the ground.

I'm going to add one to that.

Not to the list of luxury makers, but that might truly be gone in five years.

Lucid.

Lucid has taken back all the predictions on production this year.

They've fully removed their guidance and said, we don't know how many cars we're going to make.

Have you watched what happened with LiveGolf?

Yeah.

Do you know about this?

Yes.

The Saudis came in and tried to bribe.

Is that a term we can use?

I think it's the most correct.

I can't go to Jeddah anymore, but they tried to bribe all the golfers from the PGA Tour to come over to their new golfers.

And it worked because they had zillions of dollars.

They were going to start their own golf tour.

But you saw what happened recently.

They've shut down.

They've shut it down.

They've stopped paying the golfers.

It's all over.

And so you sit here thinking, oh, the Middle Easterners have all this money.

They can bankroll stuff forever.

Well, we'll see how long forever lasts.

And Lucid may indeed find out.

Fundamentally, the Saudi government is having some money troubles by not being able to export their oil currently.

It may have an impact on where they decide to place bets.

And I could imagine Lucid running out of money.

We've got oil problems.

Oh, by the way, VinFast is still around.

I did.

Yeah, what's VinFast?

They were on this huge kick.

They were trying to get me every VinFast ever made.

They sent me a blanket one year, which I still use.

And by the way, as a result, I am a shill for their company.

They make the best cars in the world.

Make pretty decent blankets.

The blanket's amazing.

There's a VinFast store at the mall here in San Diego.

I don't know if you're familiar with this.

They have had a VF9 in the showroom for the last two years.

Not for sale.

Well, they get to sell another one.

But so what's the deal with that?

Are they still doing it?

Apparently the VF7 is coming soon.

Okay, last question.

Last question.

Okay.

From Crossy with a K.

Hey, Doug, the podcast of Ruma, best parts of my Fridays.

How lovely.

Sean, you hear that?

It's very kind.

But I think it would be even better with more regular

outside guests included.

Good news last week.

These people don't like, Sean, you hear that they don't like

Cannon and Filippo.

I can't blame them.

What are some of, or maybe me.

Right.

I do.

What are some of your most desired guests to have on the pod?

Well, it's Howard Hoover.

Obviously.

Here's the problem with guests.

Two things.

Number one, Farrah has guests on his pod and he tells us the pods with guests

always do worse than the pods with the crew.

Yeah.

Because people don't, they see the guest name and they don't want to hear from

that guest, so they just don't watch that pod.

Whereas if it's just the guys, they'll tune in.

Number two, in order to have the sort of jovial, enjoyable experience that we all have,

it has to be someone that we are comfortable with.

Yeah.

Right.

In this case, if Doug wants to tear into us and make fun of us, it wants to be someone

who knows not someone he's not familiar with.

Yeah.

Like Huvvy.

Right.

But Huvvy, you can ask him.

Right.

You're going to ask him some tough questions, I'm sure.

Yeah.

We'll see him square.

Didn't we get into his marital status last time?

Yeah.

I'm sure the taxes will come up.

Oh, for sure.

For sure.

At least he filed an extension that's your smart.

So, the answer is, like if we had Whistlin' on, I feel like I'd be able, like Camisa was

here and I felt like nervous a little, like Camisa's an automotive icon.

Yeah.

And I was like, not really sure how to, you know, it's not the same energy.

Right.

So, who do I want on?

Number one, most desired guest, Ryan Lopez.

Oh, wow.

He could answer for the air conditioning incident.

He could answer for the picking the guy up upstairs incident.

Yeah.

He's got a lot of other ones.

Filippo came in today, he said, Ryan Lopez booked a meeting and he was on an airplane

for the meeting.

Yup.

And Ryan said, well, what's the problem?

Filippo said, well, did you take the meeting?

Ryan said, I couldn't take the meeting.

I was on an airplane.

Filippo said, well, why did you book the meeting?

I was there.

It's like, he and Freddie were probably on the same flight.

They just, they wandered and they got on the flight.

Boom.

I didn't know it was going to be on a flight.

Didn't know it was going to last.

Didn't have any idea it was going to be on a plane.

How do you calculate how long it's going to take?

I don't know.

I did say yes to the meeting, though.

Ryan Lopez is my number one guest that I want on the pie.

Yeah.

And I think we're going to have that.

It is quite doable.

What are you doing?

You're sitting there.

He's right there.

He's listening to all of this.

Bring his chips right into the studio.

Yup.

And we do a pretty good AC, so he'll be pretty good.

We got good AC in the office.

He'll sleep well.

Sleep.

Who else?

Who do you want, Kenner?

Hmm.

I'd love Matt to come in.

I'd love Matt Farah.

Farah?

Yeah.

He's been on the very first live we ever did.

Yep.

Which started this whole thing, was with Matt Farah.

The problem is it's hard to also.

Actually, you know, Zach Clapman.

Zach Clapman.

So funny.

Both of them would be great.

Zach Clapman is the funniest guy in the car biz.

Yeah.

He does stand up.

He's a comedy writer.

He is so funny and I love him too.

You want Zach Clapman?

I would love to have that.

Sean, make it happen.

I think we could also have a fun experience.

They wouldn't feel like overbearing or like,

oh, what do I say to this person?

Do we have to ask them if they want coffee?

Like, you can just have them and have them

like they're one of your friends.

Yeah, absolutely.

What about you?

I want Nick Rochon's wife.

I need somebody to explain.

Oh, my God.

A special pod with Nick's wife.

I love her.

You know what, actually Nick and her.

I actually do second this.

I think that would be amazing.

That would be amazing.

Nick's wife.

Play her clips of what Nick has said that we cut

and then have her react.

The answer for this.

Yes, so Nick's wife will also say her name.

Prepare.

Don't you think it would be amazing to get some real insider

like, okay, so what's the record?

You know, is this go on even at home?

Do you know about all this stuff?

She is the most patient woman on the planet.

Because Nick is so crazy, I can't imagine.

Gotta be.

Yeah, truly insane.

That's a great one.

I hadn't considered that.

A lot to answer for.

We'll send her a note.

Maybe she hates us.

Maybe she thinks we're bad at it.

Nick probably goes home and is like,

I had Philippo make me buy another car.

She taxed it all.

I can't believe it.

I think she wanted one too.

Don't give Nick ideas.

I fairly comment she watches and or listens to the public.

I'll be with Nick's watch.

I can hear this.

Okay, we're good.

That's the end.

There's a pins gower on the site.

By the time you're watching this, long gone.

Sorry, someone just bought it.

But hard, all the velocity cars, if you go to browse

slash velocity or go to the banner.

I'm going to go to the banner because it's cool as hell.

It is very cool.

There's a lot of incredible cars that aren't going to be ending

tomorrow when you're listening to this.

Tomorrow.

So make sure you use it.

So many cars.

I'm not sure it comes around to that.

Yeah, maybe it does.

You might have to go to carsmines.com again.

And by the way, that's a note for you.

Go to carsandbids.com.

Click on it.

But truly, there's some absolutely incredible cars.

If you've ever wanted a Lola T212, and you have

and you have sitting here waiting, you've been waiting

for all these years.

By the way, that skyline.

Wild.

I know.

I was coming in, I want to buy this and then I looked at the

midnight purple.

Yeah, it's getting real money.

If you ever wanted a Lola T12 and I want to buy this,

this is your chance.

Now Nick's going to buy it and be like,

but don't sit on the pond.

Now this is my chance.

This is my chance.

This is my hand to buy it.

Okay, that's our last thing.

Anything else? Any parting thoughts?

Safe travels.

Safe travels to you.

I'll see you at velocity.

Yeah.

It's our best pod ever.

Goodbye, everyone.

Goodbye.

My hair's back to normal.

Bye.

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117:33

Batista

0-60-25

0-60-1.8 seconds

sentimental

SP4

SP6

SP5

Apple iPhone guy

Asuna Sunrunner

GeoTracker

European flair

Lars Andersen

Ferrari 280 TTO

About this episode

Original notes