Why Are Destination Fees So High?
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Term
destination fees
Destination fees are extra costs you pay when buying a new car. They cover getting the car from where it's made to the dealer where you buy it.
Car
Mazda Cx5
The Mazda CX-5 is a small SUV made by Mazda that is good for families and everyday use. It drives well and has a nice inside with comfortable seats. It has become more expensive over the years because more people want to buy it.
Term
Monroney
A Monroney sticker is the official sticker you see on new cars in the US. It shows the car's price, extra features, and fees so you know how much the car really costs.
Car
Dodge Charger
The 1973 Dodge Charger is an old, strong car made in America that many car fans like because it has a big engine and cool looks.
Term
dealer prep fee
Dealers sometimes charge a fee to get a new car ready for you. This fee pays for things like cleaning the car and checking it before you drive it home.
Concept
SUV
An SUV is a bigger type of car that can carry more people and sometimes drive off-road. Because they are bigger, they take up more space when being shipped.
Term
car carrier
A car carrier is a big truck that carries many cars at once from where they are made to the car dealer.
Concept
pickup truck
A pickup truck is a type of vehicle with a cabin for people and a flat open area in the back to carry things. They are usually bigger than cars and can cost more to ship.
Term
MSRP
MSRP is the price the car maker says a new car should cost. It doesn't usually include extra fees like shipping or dealer costs.
Term
negotiation
Negotiation means talking with the seller to try to get a better price or deal when buying a car. Unlike buying things like TVs, car prices can often be changed by asking.
Term
fixed price
Fixed price means the price you see is the price you pay, and you usually can't change it. This is common for things like TVs or refrigerators.
Concept
car buying cycle
People usually buy a new car every five years or so. This is called the car buying cycle, and it affects how often you shop for cars.
Brand
General Motors
General Motors, or GM, is a big car company in the U.S. that makes cars and trucks under brands like Chevrolet and Cadillac. People talk about GM when discussing car prices and fees.
Brand
Ford
Ford is a big car company from the United States that makes many kinds of cars and trucks. People often talk about Ford when discussing car prices and extra fees.
Brand
Alfa Romeo
Alfa Romeo is a car brand from Italy that makes sporty and fancy cars. Because their cars are made in other countries, it can cost more to get them to dealers.
Brand
Stellantis
Stellantis is a big car company made by joining two other companies. It owns many car brands like Alfa Romeo and Jeep. They often charge higher fees to get cars to dealers.
Brand
Toyota
Toyota is a big car company from Japan that makes cars known for being reliable and good on gas.
Brand
Honda
Honda is a company from Japan that makes cars and motorcycles. Their cars are known for being reliable and easy to drive.
Brand
BMW
BMW is a car company from Germany that makes cars known for being fun to drive and comfortable. They make many types of cars including sporty ones and family SUVs.
Brand
Mercedes-Benz
Mercedes-Benz is a famous car company from Germany that makes fancy and comfortable cars and SUVs. People often think of it as a brand that builds high-quality and luxurious vehicles.
Concept
rail shipping
Rail shipping means moving cars on trains to get them from the factory to the place where they will be sold. Sometimes it's faster or easier than using trucks, especially for long trips.
Term
destination charges
Destination charges are extra costs added to a new car's price to pay for moving the car from where it was made to the dealership. The farther the car has to travel, the higher this fee can be.
Concept
tariffs
Tariffs are extra taxes added when cars are brought into a country from somewhere else. These taxes can make cars more expensive to buy.
Company
Consumer Reports
Consumer Reports is a group that tests and reviews products, like cars, to help people know which ones are good before they buy.
Company
eBay
eBay is a website where people can buy and sell things, including cars and car parts, from all over the world.
Brand
Aston Martin
Aston Martin is a fancy car company from Britain that makes fast and stylish sports cars.
Term
pressure washer
A pressure washer is a tool that sprays water very fast and strong to clean things like cars and dirt. It's stronger than just using a normal garden hose and helps get things really clean.
Term
psi
PSI means how strong the water comes out of the pressure washer. Higher PSI means the water sprays harder and cleans better.
Concept
IndyCar
IndyCar is a type of car racing where drivers race very fast cars that look different from NASCAR cars. The cars have wheels that stick out and race on different types of tracks.
Concept
NASCAR
NASCAR is a type of car racing where drivers race special cars on oval tracks. It's very popular in America and lots of people watch it on TV.
Company
Goodyear
Goodyear makes the special tires that NASCAR cars use during races. These tires are built to handle very fast speeds and tough driving.
Term
tire pressure
Tire pressure means how much air is inside a tire. Racing teams change this to make the car handle better or make the tires last longer.
Term
rotor
A rotor is a metal disc that helps slow down the car when the brakes are applied. The brake pads squeeze this disc to stop the car.
LIVE
Hello, and welcome to the Truthball Cars podcast.
I am Tim Healy, the managing editor, and today we're discussing destination and delivery
fees.
We chat with Consumer Reports' Jeff Bartlett about why those fees are so high.
We also chat about pressure washers and NASCAR's caution-filled race agreements with T-Tech
contributor Matthew Guy.
Don't forget that T-Tech listeners can get $10 off of an annual digital Consumer Reports
membership by clicking on cr.org slash t-tech.
All that and more, but first, we're from our sponsor eBay Motors.
This message comes from eBay.
The worst part about loving cars might just be buying them and all the parts.
From Toyotas to Aston Martins, eBay has thousands of cars and the largest online selection of
vehicle parts and accessories.
eBay Things People Love.
This week on the T-Tech podcast, we're talking with Jeff Bartlett from Consumer Reports.
He is the managing editor for the car group at Consumer Reports.
Jeff, how are you doing?
I'm doing great.
You're glad to have a chance to talk cars.
Yeah, so we'll be talking cars, and specifically we'll be talking about one thing that new
car buyers have to deal with every time they buy a car.
Something we don't talk about a lot because it's kind of taken for granted in the industry,
but it's destination fees on new cars.
Most of our listeners know what destination delivery fees are.
For the few who don't, it's something that is attached to a new car transaction, basically
paying for the delivery of the car to the dealership, as well as the prep it had done
to the dealership.
I'll get into that in a little bit as someone who's a former dealership employee myself.
We can get into that a little bit down the line here.
Destination fees, and I assume there's probably a little bit of profit padded in, but we'll
also get into that too.
Destination fees are something that every car buyer has to deal with, and they've gotten
pretty high.
Jeff, that's what we're talking about today, is why they've gotten high, and can you walk
us through what you've seen in your research?
Yes, certainly.
This has been a troubling trend, and one we've observed for many years.
Destination charges, like you said, are affixed right on the window sticker, and they're non-negotiable.
The idea is that they cover the cost of transporting the vehicle from factory to dealership wherever
that factory may be, but they've become pretty significant.
We found this year, I'm looking into them for the 2020-26 model year, that the average
is $1,670, and that's up quite a bit from the last time we really rolled up our sleeves
on it, which was back in 2020 when they were $1,244.
But the average, as is often the case, doesn't tell the full story.
Some of them are now over $2,000 and even $3,000, making them really significant.
I haven't seen $3,000, which only him is doing that.
That's Alfa Romeo, which in a way you understand like, well, those cars got come from a pretty
far distance, and understandably, they cost quite a bit to do it.
They also don't have vehicles built in the US that they can spread the cost to.
But on the other hand, Alfa Romeo's often carry significant discounts to move the metal,
so they have kind of an unusual situation where that's high, discounts elsewhere, money's
moving in many directions, making it probably confusing for customers.
Yeah, so why has there been such a short, or let me rephrase that.
Why has there been such a high increase, such a short amount of time?
You use an example in your article of a gentleman who had just purchased a Mazda CX-5 in 2019,
and it was up 30% over 2016.
So what's the high increase in such a short amount of time?
Well, part of it is, of course, over the past decade, there have been moments like we're in
right now where transportation costs are elevated, not just the price of petroleum,
which can go up and down, but also a shortage of drivers and the increased complexity with
the logistics of transporting vehicles.
So there are some really hard costs in there, but those tend to be reflected in destination
chargers that go up, seldom go down.
And part of the reason is it appears the manufacturers are using this quote-unquote
fixed cost to make other pricing adjustments.
And in the past year, that's really meant helping offset the impact of tariffs.
So I think some of the increase we've seen very recently has been proactive adjustments,
and some of its reactive adjustments to try and kind of hide some of the real
expenses that manufacturers are experiencing without putting them front and center in marketing
by changing the MSRP.
Okay, yeah.
So that makes sense.
And I think part of it too is, like you said, when it comes to transportation costs,
obviously fuel prices play a part.
The fuel for the semi-trucks that bring the cars from the factory to the dealerships,
and obviously we're, as we record this right now, we're in a particular geopolitical situation where
gas prices might be rising and diesel prices might be rising even more.
You know, it's a little bit influx at the moment.
So now one thing I've noticed too, and you mentioned this in the article that's on your
website at consumerreports.org, is most car buyers know that these MSRP, excuse me,
these destination fees are on a Monroney, and I think a lot of people know to look for them,
particularly I think car enthusiasts and our listeners.
But I think a lot of car buyers who aren't familiar with the industry don't know that.
And I also think, as you say, it's kind of destination fees are not baked into the prices
in car ads, they're not baked into the MSRP.
Usually you have your, if you look at a Monroney, you have your MSRP for the base price,
then you have one with options, and depending on the automaker,
sometimes, most automakers I think, if I don't have a Monroney right in front of me,
actually I do, most of the automakers have the destination fee listed separately.
Yeah, so I've got a Nissan Centra Monroney in front of me from a car I tested a while back,
and I've got the base price listed, then there's a list of options,
and then in another section is the destination charge.
So I think a lot of car buyers don't even think about it, and they get taken by surprise,
and I also think, well, I should probably say that I know.
One thing I've noticed is, as we work on car reviews here at DTEC,
I personally make an effort to list destination in just about every car review I do in the first
drive I do. If I don't, it means either I forgot, which is a mistake in my part, or the automaker
hasn't announced it yet, which sometimes does happen with the first drive, but very rarely.
But we try and make sure they're in our reviews, and I believe most of our, most other
automotive journalism outlets do the same, but the one thing is, the destination fees can often
be really hard to find on a consumer website, and sometimes when I'm working on a car review,
I try and build and price a car similar to the one I tested, for whatever reason.
Sometimes I just do it on the consumer site, potentially since prices change over time,
or features can change, and I'm looking at it, and sometimes I just can't find the destination
fee. Canadian websites, or Canadian consumer websites from automakers are especially bad
about this. They're actually worse than the American sites. We cover the Canadian market too,
so even though I'm based in Chicago and I'm American, we do look at the Canadian sites,
and it can be really hard to find. Is there anything that could change that? Is there ever
going to be a law that says automakers need to disclose these more prominently on their websites?
Obviously there are the Moneronis, but is there anything that can change that?
Well, I don't know that there would be a law, but we certainly, at Consumer Reports,
are pressuring automakers to make it more visible, and make it front and center and
advertising. The concern is that consumers are going into a dealership with a rough set of
numbers in their head and corresponding budget to go with it, and come out having spent or
committed to spending a lot more money. I think you're doing the right thing,
and really modeling what consumers should do in terms of, yes, you can absolutely get these figures
off of a window sticker, and you can find them when you build out a vehicle on the consumer site.
If you're just browsing the consumer site, you'll often find that the destination is
hidden in a footnote among 20 other footnotes. Yeah, I've experienced that for sure.
Yeah, that's a real concern. Another thing that you're exposed is when we're reviewing
new models or models that haven't quite yet come to market, sometimes the media doesn't have
the final accurate figures yet, but you can always get a sense by looking at the footnotes
on a consumer site for shoppers who are thinking a little bit ahead. If you're looking at whatever
brand considering an SUV, just look at any other SUV, or just look at the small print,
it'll get you pretty close. The reality is the destination prices used to be, at least in my
mind, kind of something you're aware of, it's not a big deal. The price of the vehicle is really
what you're budgeting on. Destination kind of comes out in the wash with a little negotiation
on the sticker price, but nowadays, especially with loans stretching well past five years,
it becomes pretty expensive over time. You really got to know what you're getting into
and understand that the destination isn't negotiable. Yeah, that's really good to know.
We are speaking with Jeff Bartlett from Consumer Reports. We'll be right back here
on the Truth About Cars podcast. We're going to take a quick break and we'll be right back.
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Jeff, I wanted to ask you, as we come back from break here, I wanted to ask you a couple
different questions about why the fees have gone up. And first of all, I wanted to ask,
and this is actually something I don't know. I probably should know it given how long I've
been in the industry, but I actually don't know the truth. What do you see destination fee of,
say, 1500 bucks on a window sticker? How much of that money breaking down? How much goes to the
automaker to pay for transportation costs and that sort of thing? And how much goes to the dealer
for prep? Yeah, that's an interesting question. The manufacturers in our experience aren't
especially open with breaking down how the money is used and distributed. But our understanding is
that money goes to the manufacturer and it's for delivery and logistics. It's not for dealer prep.
In fact, often shoppers will encounter a dealer prep fee that gets tacked on to a
Yeah, I've seen that. Yeah, you know, say 300 bucks to prepare the car. Certainly something
to negotiate. But really, you know, you think of destination is almost like the postage on the
package. The dealer's just passing it along and it doesn't benefit from it in any which way,
which also means that they're not allowed to negotiate it. You know, they're free to negotiate
the difference between what they pay for the vehicle and what they would like you to pay.
But that's a fixed cost for them as well. Yeah, that makes sense. And then the dealer prep fee,
you know, I don't know if we ever charged that when I worked at a dealership. I don't believe
that we did. I was in service, not sales. I was not always privy to the numbers. But what I can tell
you is, and again, I haven't worked at dealership in like 20 years, but I don't think much has
changed. I know that there was some prep that had to be done when cars came off the truck.
Someone at the dealership have assigned for them to make sure they were not damaged,
not a sort of thing. In fact, I once got yelled at because I signed for them when I wasn't supposed
to. Nearly I fired that day. That was the biggest chewing that I ever got in five years of working
there. Because apparently, only a sales manager was supposed to do it. And the guy was in a meeting
and I just, trucker was pressuring me and I was 19 years old and didn't know any better. But anyway,
that's neither here nor there. No, the trucks, when the cars come off the truck, there's a lot
times there's, I forget what the name for it is, but there's kind of a protective film on some of
the cars that has to be pulled off. The cars need to be washed in detailed. Sometimes it is done,
the dealership I worked at, we tend to not to do it until the car was sold,
just because otherwise we're doing extra work. But you have porters who are doing this. So you're,
so the costs that go into this are the porters, I'll really wage. Obviously, the chemicals used
to clean and wash the car. So you're soap, your tire shine, and then, you know, your window dressing
or a Windax or whatever. And whatever. So that's basically the cost of it. So it can't be,
it can't be that high of a cost. You know, the tools used to clean and detail a car plus the
person's labor plus, you know, of course, the overhead of electricity and stuff. So a $300
dealer prep fee does seem a little high. So I have to wonder, you know, and again, they don't
break the numbers down. But I have to wonder how much is actually just covering the cost and how
much is profit, whether you're talking about dealer prep fee, or whether you're talking about
automaker who's charging $5,500 as a destination fee, you know, is that $5,500 just covering the
cost? Or is there a profit in there? Well, so if there's a dealer prep fee, I would consider that
all profit. If you think of a dealership essentially as a car store, what the dealer prep fee is
charging you is to stock the item. If you went into the grocery store and you pick up, you know,
box of noodles or cereal, it doesn't also say plus a dollar to put it on the shelf for you.
You know, it should be all baked into the charging. Dealerships are, you know, notorious for
trying to find ways to separate customers from their hard earned dollars. And that is another
one that they, it's another little lever that they can pull. Yeah, it's like what you know,
for oil change, there's a $2.50 shop fee for the towels they use. And I always believed that some
of that covers the cost of using a couple rags, but I always also believed I never could prove it
and it was never high enough up in the hierarchy. I always believed that some of that cost was also
profit too. So maybe they really spent a dollar on towels and the dollar 50 goes into profit. But
anyway, I wanted to switch gears a little and ask my next question, which is, you guys at Consumer
Report saw a nice article about this, the truth about destination fees, kind of like a TDAD,
TDADF anyway. The one thing you found is that Ford and General Motors blamed the popularity of
SUVs and trucks because according to them, you can't fit as many trucks and SUVs on a car carrier
because they're bigger vehicles, right? So you can't fit as many so they want to make up that
increases shipping costs and increases destination fees. But then you also point out that other
automakers, to say that five times fast, didn't do the same thing, but every other automaker is
also selling SUVs and in some cases trucks. So what happened there? Why are Ford and GM
blaming trucks? Is it just an excuse? Is it because they sell more pickup trucks?
Some of the other automakers sell SUVs and not trucks. What is going on there?
Yeah, that's an interesting question. I think, like your shop rags example, the automakers do
have a fair point of larger vehicles, not only take up more space, but their weight means more fuel
is consumed. So it is more expensive to ship a full size, three row SUV versus a little
subcompact car. That's understandable. Some automakers have fewer models to spread their
costs over. So if you were to think of, say, a Toyota, the cost of shipping a Sequoia,
that can be offset by moving a few dollars to the Corollas. But RAM, or even Ford these days,
doesn't have quite the same model mix and latitude there. So I think there's a fairness
in terms of something big costs more. But I think there might be something else to it as well.
Just my personal observation, I have to wonder if there's a certain acceptance among high dollar
vehicles, maybe at play, trucks are super expensive and often bought for businesses or
leased for businesses. And maybe the automaker feels comfortable shifting a little bit more of
the cost into this particular fee for those. Yeah. And speaking of shifting costs, so your
article concludes with a few consumer tips and we'll link it when we push this podcast. We'll
link to it. But your article links to a few consumer tips. But before that, the very conclusion,
you quote a gentleman named Jack Gillis from, he works with the Consumer Federation of America,
and he says the automakers should be responsible for getting their product to the retailer,
just like eggs for grocery store, I'm quoting him here, or like trying to store like Best Buy.
And that sounds logical, but I would also think that if dealers or excuse me, if automakers weren't
separating out the dealer, the destination fee, if the automaker was just paying for it and not
trying to voice that on customers, then the MSRP would be higher. I always use the example of bags
and airlines, you know, airlines are charging for us to check our bags. And then Southwest didn't
charge for a long time. But I always wondered, there's no way to prove it, unless you work for
Southwest, but I was wondering Southwest, maybe raise their fairs just a little bit to, to make
up for the fact they weren't charging for bags. I know they charge for bags now, I believe. But
yeah, if automakers weren't charging you $1,500 separately, and they got rid of destination
fees, would that increase the price of an MSRP? Because wouldn't they just be baking that in?
Oh yeah, they would have to. And your airline example is a good one. You know, essentially,
there are fixed costs and a very specific profit target. And the companies aren't going to give
up either of those. The auto industry is kind of a very unique industry in terms of how it presents
numbers to customers and the shell games that it plays, you know, trying to hypnotize the consumer
into spending a little more than they might otherwise. But yeah, if, if destination wasn't a
separate $2,000 charge, it would just be added to the window sticker and that'd be $2,000 more.
But in this moment in time, especially, I think automakers are trying to be not only competitive
with one another, but very sensitive to customers who are being hit with a bit of sticker shock
at a time when, you know, the cost of most things has been going up.
So, you know, if you can make the car look a little less expensive and then tuck this fee away
somewhere else, you know, I'm sure they spend endless amounts of money researching this.
That strategy apparently is the winning one for pulling people into the dealerships.
Well, it makes sense. And yeah, you mentioned cost of living going up and cost of cars going
up and people's wages aren't matching. But it also makes sense that, you know, if you don't
have that, if you take that $2,000 out, it's not baked into the fee, you can advertise a lower
price. And once the person's in the dealer, they might just like, well, okay, you lure me in at
$22,000. I paid for a few things I want some extra features or a higher trim level. So that's on me,
you know, I added another $1,000 in options. And you say, well, you have the destination fee,
it's non-negotiable, we can't get rid of it, can't avoid it. What's the consumer going to do?
And if they go to another automaker, they'll still have to deal with it. So they can't just walk away.
So they kind of just like, well, I'm here, and it's part of the deal. So now my price goes from
$22,000 plus the $1,000 for options. Now you're at $25,000. And it's like, well, what are you going
to do? You know, so I understand that if the automakers were advertising as part of their cost,
the cars would look too, the price would look $2,000 higher. So I get that. And as you mentioned
too, in the article that you guys pushed out at Consumer Reports, Dan Bador, former PR guy,
and now an independent consultant, a gentleman I know fairly well, he mentions that destination
ends up being another way that the business can bring in revenue. And it speaks back to your point
too, that the automotive industry has always been unique. I mean, it's one of the few things
where you can negotiate a price, you know, you go to Best Buy to buy a TV, the TV is what it
costs, what it costs. It's $500 plus tax. I bought a new TV a few months back. I need my other TV
had got head broke, and I just need another, see a new TV and, you know, I paid whatever,
whatever it was plus tax and boom, you know, done. You know, when you get a refrigerator,
dishwasher, any major appliance, the only thing that you really negotiate price on is a house.
I mean, well, some people might buy a boat or if you're wealthy enough, a plane, but that's,
those are luxury items for only a few people. Almost everybody needs a car and a house, right?
So, you know, if you're buying a house, you can negotiate, maybe you can negotiate rent if you're
renting in some cases, but most, most things you buy are fixed prices. Even when you go to service,
it's fixed. It's $30 Royal change plus tax. So, it's a little strange that the automotive industry
works the way it does. And like Mr. Bredor says too, it doesn't take a lot of mathematical skill
to understand that if you have a small increase over however many million cars are sold a year
for the automaker, that's a, and if there's some profit in that cost especially,
or into that fee, that number adds up quickly. Yeah, definitely does.
One interesting takeaway in your example is, yes, most products in life have a fixed cost.
And you know, maybe you're lucky to get an on sale, which is great. The other major thing you
negotiate being a home, but with that, you have a professional there to help you. Yeah. With a car,
you're dealing with a purchase on average every five years is the typical cycle in America.
And no realtor on your side. No expert on your side. And you're dealing with someone on the other
side of the desk who not only does this day in and day out, but they're personally incentivized
to get as much as they can out of you. And they're trained on how to do it. So, you are
in a weak position buying the car. But you also make a fair point too, you know, no matter what car
you buy, you're going to pay destination. And once, you know, your heart's sold on a vehicle,
that just becomes a, you know, a few dollars extra a month as they finance it out. Yeah.
I do want to follow on the comment about how profit can be tucked in. I've had conversations
recently that expose, you know, the industry is facing some real challenges with the cost of
materials changing left and right. A number of manufacturers are investing and bringing more
production to the US, which is down at a very significant expense. So, you know, I think if
we had this conversation three years ago, we would probably be leaning a little bit more on,
you know, geez, they're, you know, really sticking it to the, you know, to the little guy.
But I think at this moment in time, they're just trying to hide their increasing costs at a time
when the profit per dollar charged is going down. That's offset by they're selling more
higher end cars, but that's a different conversation. So they've, they've got to move their money around
a little bit too. And it is being exposed in these destination chargers.
Yeah. Before we go, and before we wrap up, we have a little bit of time left still. So I also
wanted to drill down a little bit on individual manufacturers that you call out for price increases.
We've already talked a little bit about Ford and GM blaming trucks. And you've already mentioned
Alfa Romeo with being built overseas and having a high destination because of that. But I wanted
to get into Stellantis a little bit and Ford, not as much, but looking at chart that you produce,
the consumer reports, it's clear that Ford is the second highest on the average. And then
Stellantis is really the highest. And I've noticed that too, just, just reviewing cars
for a living and going on first drive events. Notice, just anecdotal, I haven't tracked it on
a spreadsheet or anything like that. But, you know, just noticing as we do car reviews and as we,
and as we do pricing news, just seeing that Stellantis has across, across the board, across
his brands really had the highest destination fees. And let's take Alfa Romeo and Fiat out of it
because of where those vehicles are built. Why is Stellantis so high even with vehicles that are
built in the US, Canada and Mexico? Yeah, that's a great question. They've long been high. So I think,
you know, they're somewhat a trend of their own making because as with all automakers, they're
looking to, you know, sneak an extra hundred or 200 in to offset, you know, the cost of importing
steel or parts, they're already starting from a high place. And so it only gets higher from there.
The other dimension is like we said earlier, many of the Stellantis products these days are large.
So, you know, you get, you know, wagon ears, you got ram trucks, things that are very expensive
to move by, you know, however it's done. So I think that's just where they're at. And they
don't have many small vehicles to offset that. Yeah, so I've got two questions left before we
run out of time here. So you mentioned, you were correct, I should have mentioned that. But
Stellantis, we'll just look at the chart, which compares Stellantis for General Motors, Honda
and Toyota. Stellantis has been higher going back to 2011, going back to 2012, really 2013,
is when they sort of separated themselves. So over over a decade, they've been higher on the
average than the rest. Now General Motors, Honda, Toyota have a similar trend line in terms of
increase. And I'm not quite sure what the word is, but they basically follow the same arc,
and they're pretty close to one another. Ford is on that same arc until 2018, actually 2019,
and then jumps in 2019. And it's not as high as Stellantis, but it's it has jumped, this chart goes
to 2020. So I don't know if the pandemic played a part in that. But why is Ford where they're at,
just because they're so truck heavy? Well, I think that's what we see. So you're looking at a chart
that goes back pretty far. In our more recent analysis, we see Ford's right there in the top
10 of the most expensive neck and neck with GM and really Graham as well. And I think that's
like we've been talking about their product line is now mostly big, heavy things that are expensive
to ship to ship. I don't think there's really much more to it than that. Okay. In a way, I think
the more fascinating thing to me is what's at the other end of the spectrum, which are the
brands that are least expensive. And they're not what you would automatically think.
Three of the least expensive are Mercedes, Toyota and BMW. This might be the only context
which are Mercedes and BMW are less than most other brands by any measure. So that fascinates me
as well. Yeah, I have to wonder part of part is because so many BMWs and Mercedes are built in the
south and have a shorter transit than maybe a Ford built in Canada. I don't know. That's a good
question. We're running out of time, but I did have two questions I wanted to ask. I was trying to
roll them into one. One, did the pandemic change anything? I assume that it may have driven up
costs because it drove across for everything. And then two, how much does rail shipping play
apart? We've been talking about trucking and the cost of fuel and all that. But some vehicles
are shipped by rail, at least part of the journey as well. Does that play a part at all?
So I think the pandemic had all kinds of impact in changing the market and production.
In terms of destination charges, I don't think that had nearly the impact that the tariffs did.
Makes sense. It makes sense. Yeah. They're shipping fewer because obviously sales dipped,
but it didn't increase the costs in quite the same way, at least to my recollection.
In terms of rail, I don't think of rail as often because I simply don't see it,
but I see vehicles on trucks all the time. But rail, truck, however the vehicles are delivered,
that is all rolled into destination charges. And like you said, what's going to impact that is
how far the vehicles have to travel. So models that are built in the U.S. obviously don't have
to go as far, but their costs are averaged over the entire country. So the person who lives next
to the factory will pay as much as the person who lives 3,000 miles from it. The notable exception
to that is some manufacturers charge a little extra to get a vehicle to Alaska or Hawaii.
And by my book, that seems pretty reasonable. Yeah, Hawaii is reachable only by a boat or
cargo plane, obviously. And then Alaska requires you to go through another country if you're going
by road. And I'm sure if you can truck by road through some of those more rugged parts of British
Columbia in Alaska, you may have to fly or boat vehicles or rail vehicles to there.
And I don't know up top of my head how much rail is used. I believe rail in some cases is used
just to get vehicles from a port city or from the port to a place where they can get on a truck.
So I didn't want to overstate the case. I'm not quite sure up top of my head how much rail is
used in shipping. And to your point, I think the pandemic not really affecting destination fees
makes sense because truckers are probably working alone, so they're not really worried about getting
sick too much. And I'm sure some may have missed some time, may have caught COVID and been down
for a few days. But I don't recall gas prices being too crazy during COVID, because oil
shipping seemed to not really be affected as much as other stuff was. I could be wrong. I could be
misremembering, but I don't remember it being the way it might be with what's going on in Iran.
So anyway, with that, we'll have to go ahead and end it. There's actually
more we can talk about on this subject, and maybe we'll have you back on, Jeff, because it seems
like one of those kind of subjects that doesn't really matter that much, but it matters a lot,
especially if you're buying a new car. So again, Jeff Bartlett, the managing editor at Consumer
Reports for the car group. And Jeff, thank you so much for your time talking destination fees
this week on the Truth About Cars podcast. Oh, thank you. I enjoyed it.
We enjoyed having you on. And also, before we go, just a quick note to our listeners, Consumer
Reports offers TTAC listeners a slight discount, a $10 off of an annual, excuse me, let me get
that correct, $10 off of an annual digital Consumer Reports membership. So go ahead to
cr.org slash TTAC. That is part of Consumer Reports looking out for our listeners. So
once again, Jeff, thanks for your time and much appreciated. All right, thank you.
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We are your home for car reviews, car news, opinions, and so so much more.
Just about every week here on the TTAC podcast, the Truth About Cars podcast,
we are discussing the stuff we use in our homes, in our cars, and on our cars as it may be, detailing
products, cleaning products, tools, that sort of thing. So we typically have TTAC contributor
Matthew Guy with us, and he's with us today. That's just about always. Matthew, how are you?
Hey, not bad, Tim. How are you doing? I'm well. So we're discussing pressure washers today, which
is a good, I used to have a good time of year to discuss that because we're getting into spring.
Spring means rain. It means mud. It means dirt. It means washing all the winter's salt and grime
off of your vehicles. And if you have a farm, maybe your side by sides and your trackers and
your UTVs and that sort of thing. So walk us through pressure washers and what you found.
Yeah, definitely, man. I was using a couple of different ones over the weekend. And one I had,
excuse me, not previously used before, were one style, I should say, because most of us
are familiar with pressure washers that have a great big things with the gasoline powered engine,
then you roll them out on wheels, and you used them all the time in your dealership days, right?
I believe so. I don't think I used, I don't think I personally used them a lot. We did have,
for our car washings, we used basically a regular hose, but I have used pressure washers
in other instances. I've got people in my family who have a pressure washer on their farm and I've
gone off-roading with them. And we've used pressure washers to get mud and dirt off after a day off
roading. Oh, totally. And it's absolutely clutch for stuff like that. And I'm used to using those
big bulky ones, but the ones that I was trying at this weekend and the person who I was using them
had gotten them off eBay, was adapted almost like a cordless drill, like you can picture a
cordless drill, it's got the big 48, it's got the 48 volt battery in the bottom, the 21 volt
battery in the bottom. And that's what this was like, it was a handheld, and so it kind of looked
like a cordless drill, but with the big lance on the end of it, right, for the pressure washer
lance for the water to come out of. And it didn't have any complicated mechanisms,
didn't have anything that was super, super complicated to use. It just came in a little case,
and it had an adapter, which you would, one end was a quick disconnect that you would put on to
the bottom of this device. And then the other end would of course go on to your freshwater source,
like a garden hose. And it was really, really handy. Of course, it wasn't super loud, unlike some of
the other gasoline-powered pressure washers, which have the sound of the engine going and the
compressor, right, for making the pressure with the water. But these little wands, these are great,
and they're cordless, I mean, except for the water itself, and the hose, right? And it just
allows you a whole bunch more freedom to walk around the car, or UTV, like you said, and get
some of that really sticky mud, or being able to get some of the winter grime off your car,
as we're headed into the spring driving season. Yeah, yeah. So with pressure washers,
it seems ludicrous to say, but is there anything to worry about with safety? It's a lot of,
a lot of water pressure hitting a person, and some of them should walk in front of it.
You're right, you know, don't put your hand in front of one of these things, even if you're
using, so there are usually different quote-unquote angles, different degrees of pressure washer
tips, like right on the tip of the lance. And of course, the more focused that degree, right down
to zero degrees, in some instances, the harder or more direct the water is going to be. And you
could injure yourself quite badly if you hit yourself with a full pressure, you know, zero
degree stream of water. But you know, if you're using something that's like 20 degrees or 45
degrees or something like that, like a big fan of water, it's not too bad. You know, it's just
don't water your houseplants with them, you're going to wipe everything away. Yeah, you're
going to kill your plants. Yeah. Can you pressure wash your house? You sure can. You sure can. The
only, I suppose tip there, I was going to say pro tip, but I'm not exactly a pro, is if you're
pressure washing your house, just try to angle the water downwards over the siding so that you're
forcing water up under the siding because there's going to be little gaps and little
breaks in the last exciting. So yeah, so I mean, if you're angling it down, it's a great thing.
Also for cleaning off decks or patios on the back of your house, these things are super,
super versatile. And I was really impressed with this cordless pressure washer that the person
had battery powered. It was almost a 900 psi, which is, I think, great for such a small portable,
compact tool. And the fact that it came with everything that they needed, they got the thing
off each day, and then you just recharge it just like you would a cordless drill when you're done
for the day. And the only thing I didn't ask was how long that battery lasts. He was telling me it
came with two batteries. And I don't know, I mean, I pressure wash the Challenger, so that takes,
what, 20 minutes probably? And it didn't eat through an entire battery for that amount of time.
So you can at least do one car with one battery for sure. So this type of stuff, he said he paid
about $60 American for it off eBay. And I think that it was a really, really good, excuse me,
a really good purchase and something that, you know, anyone, any of our listeners could certainly
add to their arsenal of car cleaning products pretty easily. Yeah, anything else we should know
when it comes to power washers, pressure washers, excuse me, pressure washers, not really. I mean,
and the cool thing, one thing I will close with is that you can, with this, you were capable of
drawing water from just about any source, even a bucket full of water, and I even had an adapter.
So if you were in a remote area and just had a bucket of water and didn't have a,
didn't have a running source, you could use that too. So I thought that was very, very convenient.
Yeah, for sure. All right. Well, with that, we will go ahead and close out stuff we use here
on this week's Truth About Our Cars podcast. Thank you, Matthew. Thank you, Tim.
Here on this week's Truth About Cars podcast, we're talking NASCAR as we do just about every
week and we're going over what happened in the desert in Phoenix in the second part of the so
called, forget what the desert duo or desert duo, forget the terminology that NASCAR and
DCAR were using, we'll get to that in just a second. But first of all, we have a T-Tech
contributor, Matthew Guy, with us to discuss NASCAR this week, Matthew Haria. Hey, not bad,
man. How you doing? I'm doing well. So yeah, Phoenix this week, NASCAR and DCAR had kind
of a unique thing. They're going to probably do more in the future where they had IndyCar
and NASCAR in the same track, the same weekend as different days. So IndyCar was
at Phoenix on Saturday. And then I don't think it was the exact same time, start time. So it was
a little more than 24 hours later, NASCAR rolled out and rolled around Phoenix. And Fox had a
desert, I don't think they were using the word desert dual because it wasn't really a dual. Maybe
they were, maybe it was desert duo or something like that, but it was basically two races in the
desert. So a little bit of talk about IndyCar, but we won't spend much time on that because our
segment is focused on NASCAR. And we do have a lot to get to, especially given that this race had
the most cautions in a long time for Phoenix. I want to say, I forget the year, I have to go back
and look it up, but it had been quite a while. So we've seen that many cautions at Phoenix.
And we had tire issues and we had cars hitting the walls and we had cars hitting other cars. So
we had some questionable driving maneuvers and we had Tyler Reddick's historic streak being broken
at three. So with Ryan Blaney taking the victory. So Matthew, I took the lead last week a little
bit. So it's your turn, I think. I'll go ahead and throw it over to you to start.
Yeah, for real. And it was a neat kind of double header, right? In terms of, in terms of watching
them on TV, you had NASCAR and IndyCar, both at Phoenix. And whilst, of course, those are two
completely different series, I think it made for a really good weekend of racing at that facility.
And both the promoters and the TV crews leaned into it pretty well. They did, absolutely.
Right. Even though they are completely different series and arguably have a different fan base.
I mean, there's some people like you and I who just enjoy racing, right? It doesn't matter
in Sir or Indy or NASCAR or whatever. But by and large, you know, IndyCar and NASCAR have
different fan bases. So props to Phoenix and the television crews for leaning into it. I like that
a lot. And yeah, and there were a ton of, like you said, ton of cautions. We were talking before
the show here about how, okay, this race ran long. We had some stuff to, right? You had some other
things to do on Sunday. I had to move some personal things around to the next day because
places, businesses were closing. Yeah, anyway, carry on. Exactly, right? Because it did stretch
on a bit longer than normal. And you hit the nail right on the head. There were a lot of tire issues.
And some of them, I want to lean into that specifically, because most of our listeners
know we don't just recap the race because there's plenty of, you know, the results because there's
plenty of podcasts. And not only that, but we're going live a few days after the race ends too.
Exactly, right? Everyone knows what the results are. But we talked about quote unquote tire issues.
This time it wasn't Goodyear's fault. You know, sometimes we do definitely burn
Goodyear for having, you know, bringing the wrong compound or whatever the case may be. But
this time, I thought it was a really good, almost like a troll by Goodyear. They issued a tweet earlier
and before the race on March 6, and they said Phoenix tire, tire details for the weekend.
And engineers already ran the numbers. This is quote from Goodyear racing. And they said,
all right, so your left front is going to be 14 psi. We recommend 30 psi for the right front.
And all of those different very specific numbers. This is something that is out there. It's not
secret that can, that can, that can be out there. And each team, just in case anyone's wondering,
is allowed 10 set of tires for the entire race weekend, one for practice, one for qualifying,
and then eight for the race itself. And after tires started popping, Noah Gregson's
issue notwithstanding, that was where he broke a rotor, rotor flew apart. And then of course,
there was debris in that caused tire problems that outside of that. The recommended tire pressures
weren't guesses said Goodyear racing on Twitter on X. And so it was a little bit of a, you know,
just a little bit of a, you know, turning the key there because we know that these teams,
these NASCAR teams are always running on the ragged edge. I mean, as much as they can push
the envelope they're going to in order to get that final 100th or that final 10th or whatever.
And it did seem that especially as the race wore on there into the lighter part of the race, that
the teams were just trying to take a little bit too much in terms of tire pressure.
And Denny Hamlin said it quite well in his own podcast that it's the teams, right? We're just
pushing it, right? And they certainly know that the more you lower the air pressure, the faster
you're going to be on a long run. This is, we know this about this car. And teams just keep
pushing it, right? So they'll get comfortable in practice in the first run of the race. They see
where things are and they're like, all right, so we're going to take another 10th
out of the tire. We're going to take another two tenths. And that's where things start to
fall apart. And that's what happened over the weekend. I don't think Goodyear was responsible
any more than normal for tire problems this weekend. It was just teams being on the ragged
edge as they're supposed to be to try and get the most speed out of their cars. But the thing that
liked was, you know, Goodyear coming out with a tweet saying, remember, the recommended tire
pressures weren't guesses. So it was almost like a troll on Goodyear's part saying, huh, told you,
like, don't stretch this too far. We're going to have problems. And as we saw with all those
cautions towards the end of the race, there were some. Yeah, I'm glad you brought that up because
I wasn't sitting watching the race on my couch. I wasn't sitting there blaming Goodyear necessarily,
but I was thinking to myself, gee, why are there so many tire issues at this track? And it's been a
problem in the past. And I kept thinking, well, maybe it's the heat. It was 90 degrees ambient
temperature. So God only knows what was on the track, probably 120, 130. And, you know, tires
don't love excess heat, obviously, and they get hot when you're, we all know the tires get hot when
you're racing. And obviously, they, you know, they do lose grip over time. I think a couple of tire
incidents, if I remember correctly, the tires just kind of came off the rim more than anything else.
So, you know, I was kind of thinking, well, maybe it's just Arizona, maybe it's the surface or the
heat or both. You know, I don't know. So I'm glad you brought that up because it makes sense. Teams
are on, they're always looking for whatever edge they can over the, excuse me, over the competitors.
And, you know, if you're going to do, if you're in a scenario where you're trying to like,
push things with tire pressure a little bit, even if Goodyear says, don't mess with it,
you might mess with it within the rules. You might mess, excuse me, you might mess with it in
the rules because you want to be that much faster than the other guy. And these cars are so close,
the drivers are so close in talent that the guys who have a shot at winning each and every race
every week, sometimes it comes down to just a few, few tenths of a second or a few car lengths. So,
I think obviously that was, you know, like you said, a big part of the issue. And as we've seen
in NASCAR over, over the year and a half, two years, we've been doing the podcast and we've seen
a lot of the ovals, especially the higher speed ovals, the intermediate tracks them up, getting
too aggressive at the wrong time, and drivers hitting each other because they're trying to put
their car where someone else's car already is, and maybe they're too aggressive. Feetings has that
weird kind of dog leg tri-oval with, so it makes the restarts look a little bit chaotic. And then,
I think one of the big accidents, am I forgetting, I know IndyCard has happened and the driver didn't
see another guy and put him into the wall. That was Alex Paloga put into the wall. I think that
also happened in NASCAR too. One of the big accidents guy didn't see, and the spotter didn't
see him or maybe didn't communicate it quickly enough. And a guy collected another guy and we're
trying to think now, if I get my racing mixed up, two races at the same track, you know, six
hours watching two races at the same track, you might get your racing mixed up. But I'm pretty
sure at least once, one of the NASCAR incidents, the driver involved said he didn't see him. And
there was other stuff going on. I think it was the big Ligano wreck with the almonddinger that
was really kind of through a wrench into things, kind of monkey it up. So, you know,
um, uh, yeah, it was, uh, it was kind of a wreck filled just not a great race to watch.
So let's put it that way. Yeah. And I do think that sometimes we would say, oh God, you know,
Phoenix, uh, in terms of the race itself, you know, with that weird looking dog leg and everyone
kind of spreads out there, uh, going into that turn, right? It is, you know, for years we were
saying, oh God, you know, we're going back to Phoenix again, um, as a, as a group, as a, as a,
as a, as a fan base, we clamored for the, for the final race to be taken away from Phoenix and
given back to Homestead, you know, when that finally happened. Um, but you know, with the new
amount of horsepower in these cars, I think that helped a lot at Phoenix. Um, this is probably the
first time I think, um, so far this season that we've seen real noticeable effects of the extra
horsepower, um, in these cars that we now have for 2026 at certain tracks. Um, I think this is the
first time we've seen some actionable differences, you know, in terms of comparing this year's race
at track X to last year's race at track X. So was the race longer? Yeah. You know,
there were more cautions and then you had the tire issues or the tire pressure issues. Um, and, and
pressure as well, you know, I know that a lot of us, not just tire pressure, um, any racer knows
that camber is a big deal too, right? So I mean, how much you've got that camber going on your,
on your tires, whether it's on the left or on the right, that's going to affect tire wear. And
you talk about tires popping off the rim, you're exactly right. You know, that type of stuff is
just right on the regular edge. So, you know, we're looking forward. I'm, I don't know why,
but I always look forward to Vegas. Maybe it's just the spectacle of everything, you know, that
goes on in Vegas outside of the track. Um, but I always grin when I see the, uh, series turn
towards Vegas and there's not too far from Phoenix. So this year it's just going to be, uh,
it's just going to be a matter of, uh, turn the northward a little bit, uh, from Phoenix up to
going up to, uh, going up to Las Vegas. And there's, I'm looking forward to that. There's,
I think there's 36 cars entered. Um, so everyone who shows up is going to make the race that,
it's that sort of deal this time around. Um, and there looks like to be some pretty good paint jobs.
I'm just looking at nascar.com here. There's the standard stuff on the five car and whatnot,
but the six looks a little bit different. Um, which I think is always pretty cool. And the
11 car, I always get a kick out of his Yahoo sponsorship because they add as many O's as
possible and onto the quarter panel. Yahoo. That's fun. It's hilarious. It's so fun. You're
exactly right. It just looks, it just puts a grin on my face, man, to see that type of stuff.
Fan of the 11 car or not. I think it looks like a pretty fun looking paint scheme. So
how about you? What do you think Vegas coming up? You're looking forward to it or is this
going to be another one that's like, eh, not so sure. Well, let me get to that in just a second.
I, I, I did go back and just start taking a look at the Lugano, the big Lugano wrecked
in the Valdos and syndicate. I'd forgotten about how syndic jumped into the wall. So that, that was
the reason I went back to look at that was because that was the, uh, of all the different wrecks we
saw on Sunday. That was kind of the, um, most representative of the race. I thought it was
kind of, it's trying to keep all the cars straight, car numbers straight. It's difficult, but
Lugano kind of got into the back of somebody actually, and that car came around and collected
him and then he collected, uh, it was the one car, I think, the Kubota and then Alex Bowman, uh,
backup driver, because Bowman was sick again. Um, he gets collected and I'm trying to think, so it was the,
um, it was the two car or syndicate got at the worst. And I think it was, I think Blaney,
I don't know if it was Blaney, but it was the 12 car in front of him, I think, got away okay.
Anyway, that was a really bad wreck and that was kind of emblematic of,
of what happened in Phoenix and syndicate got at the worst by far. Um, I'm just looking right now to
see, I think it was Bubba Wallace actually who pulled away. It was hard to tell in the replay,
but, um, you know, uh, switching back to Vegas, um, now that, now that I've kind of just, you know,
talked about that wreck, which was the wreck that, yeah, that was Bubba Wallace who pulled
away. I'm looking for an angle now. Uh, that, that wreck was the one that really sort of like,
basically it was like, okay, this is emblematic of a rough day in Phoenix. So now that we got that
out of the way, I want to shift gears to, um, Vegas, like you said, uh, we've talked before about
how I have mixed feelings on the intermediate tracks, the mile and a halfers, um,
how they're kind of routine. And I don't want to say boring, it's, it's too strong of a word, but
they are sort of also bread and butter tracks in a way, you know, the short tracks of super speedway
as the road courses are all unique. And then you've got the mile, the mile, the mile and a half, uh,
ovals. Um, and Vegas is a, it's a high bank track. It should be a pretty fast track. It,
it should be interesting. I mean, like you said, there's always spectacle because it is Vegas and
everything has to be done to the, to the 11th degree there. You know, the old spinal tap line
about things go into 11. You always have showgirls before the race, walking around in the showgirl
outfits. And they always, I don't know who the celebrity is who's going to do the, the command
this week. I haven't looked it up. I'm not even sure it's been announced yet, but, um, I'm sure
it'll be somebody, it'll be a big name or someone ties with ties to Vegas or both. Sorry, I'm sorry.
It's someone outrageous here exactly. Yeah, yeah, probably. So, um, you know, I'm looking forward
to it, but you know, like you and I have said before, these, these intermediate tracks can kind
of be boring. It's the wrong word, but almost too routine. I think maybe, you know, and then,
but one thing I love about NASCAR is when NASCAR does things a little bit differently than other,
that's one thing I liked and hated about Phoenix. We talked about it a few minutes ago that,
that dog lagging, the, the chaotic restart part of me hates it because of all the wrecks it led to,
but part of me likes it because it's like, it's just unique to watch all those cars dive bomb
from the start finish line or towards the finish line. And if you're watching the race,
especially at one camera angle, that kind of comes behind as they go into turn one,
they're all sort of just dive bombing and you're five or six wide in some places,
you know, that makes things cool. I, I, I would, that's one reason why I love any track that's
a little bit different because you don't want racing to be the same track in a different city
every week, you know? So, um, I think Vegas will be fun as it always is. Uh, you know, these, these,
these intermediate tracks tend to tend to favor the A-listers, of course. So, um, I'm not going
to be shocked if Denny Hamlin or Bubba Wallace walks away with the win or Tyler Reddick gets another
one. Uh, you know, I think it's, it's, um, gotta be a fun race. Um, hopefully that's right for
those Phoenix. And I was surprised looking at some of the statistics, uh, getting ready for
today's podcast because for active drivers, Las Vegas race winners, Logano leads with four wins
dating back to only 2019. So I mean, that's six years. He's had four wins in six years.
I didn't compute that in my jaundiced brain. Um, so between him, Larson has won three times as well
since 2021. So those two cars are always a good bet to perform really well, uh, at any given week,
but just from a statistics point of view, that is even better news. Um, sticking with tires for
a second, just looking here at what Goodyear is bringing for Las Vegas. We know any, you know,
if we have new fans who are listening, um, you should, I feel that the track surface at Vegas
right now doesn't encourage a heck of a lot of tire wear. So the type of tire that Goodyear
is going to bring is going to be designed to shed a bit of rubber. Um, so look for a much higher
tire pressures at Phoenix. I'm sorry, at Las Vegas. Then we saw at Phoenix, um, instead of 30 psi
on the right front, probably look for something as high as 45 or 50 psi even on the right front.
So I don't think we'll see the sort of tire and watch this come back and bite me in the button.
If it does, hold me to it. I will. I'll remember this. If we have a lot of tire problems at Las
Vegas. So just those statistics, I think that, uh, I think the 22 or the five is a pretty good bet
for this week. Also, um, best wishes to the 48 driver. Uh, he is out of the car again for this, uh,
um, race coming up. Justin Allgaier is going to sub in for Alex Bowman again, because he's
a different driver in the 48 is no good. Let's do not mess with that stuff. You know, he's right
to set it out. We talked about this last week, you know, I mean, there was so many, there's
difference in all things. Yes. You got to push through sometimes and, um, you know, make sure
you get the job done, et cetera, but don't mess with vertigo. Don't mess with concussions, right?
It's your head, right? You know, with all of these other cars around,
right? And to be clear, concussions and vertigo can be completely separate things,
but, uh, you don't want to be in anything that's pulling high Gs high G forces, like a race car,
because it'll be hard to, um, I've never experienced vertigo, but if you get dizzy,
I've been dizzy with all been dizzy. Um, if you get dizzy, you know, at speed, it might be kind
of hard to see where you're going and that can cause a problem. You know, so, uh, take it slow
if you're Alex Bowman, take it slow and, uh, take some time off, figure out what the issue is.
And, you know, we initially thought it was heat, there's heat related issues in Austin,
but now obviously myself and maybe the vertigo is, is a lingering effect from that. Who knows,
but I'm not a doctor and I don't want to pretend that I am. But, um, you know, if vertigo is an
issue, then take some time and recover before you get back into the race car, because even
on the bank tracks, you're pulling a lot of Gs and, you know, you just really can't, uh,
um, you can't just, you just can't drive a race car very well when you're, when you're having
a hard time seeing where you're going. So big time. And may I say shout out to our new, uh,
point structure. I'm digging this again. This is great. I haven't dug into it that far yet,
because we're still so early in the season. None of this winning your in stuff. You know,
you've got people who are out there still making points, right? I mean, Tyler, he is 60 points
ahead, but a string of bad races can, can scupper someone's season pretty quickly. So it keeps people
digging and I was watching the other day, Brad, Brad, Brad keselowski. I mean, I'm sure he does
like bread. Um, keselowski was talking about how this, you know, type of format is great because
he often experienced in that, you know, big team of, of, uh, of RFK that once he was into
the points, once he was into the playoffs, um, the incentive wasn't there to give him the best
engine, right? In the, in the shop, uh, because they were trying to get another car into the
playoffs. So I like it. I mean, I'm glad we have this point structure for 2026.
Yeah. And we'll talk more about that as the season advances, but for that, uh, excuse me,
with that for now, we're going to head and close out our, our, close out our NASCAR talk here on
this week's truth about cars podcast. So once again, thank you to our listeners and thank you,
Matthew. Thank you for having me. The cars first, you'll find that eBay are just different.
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That's all for the truth about cars podcast. I am Tim Healy, the managing editor, and you can find
us wherever you get your podcasts. You can also find us online at TTC.com. That's T tech.com or
the truth about cars all spelled out.com. We thank Jeff Bartlett for consumer reports and
T tech contributor Matthew guy for their time and Matt Poskey for editing. Most of all,
we thank you for listening. We'll see you next time.
About this episode
The podcast dives into the rising destination fees on new cars with Consumer Reports' Jeff Bartlett, exploring why these fees have surged, their breakdown, and how automakers use them strategically. The discussion highlights the lack of transparency and the impact on buyers' budgets. Additionally, the hosts chat about cordless pressure washers as handy tools for car cleaning and analyze a recent caution-heavy NASCAR race at Phoenix, discussing tire issues, race dynamics, and upcoming events like the Vegas race. The episode blends practical car buying insights with enthusiast topics like racing and car care.
Original notes
Hello and welcome to the Truth About Cars podcast! I am Tim Healey, the managing editor, and today we’re discussing destination and delivery fees.
We chat with Consumer Reports’ Jeff Bartlett about why those fees are so high. We also chat about pressure washers and NASCAR’s caution-filled race at Phoenix with TTAC contributor Matthew Guy.
Don’t forget that TTAC listeners can get $10 off of an annual digital Consumer Reports membership by clicking on CR.org/TTAC.
You can find us wherever you get your podcasts. You can also find us online TTAC.com, or thetruthaboutcars.com.
We thank Jeff Bartlett from Consumer Reports and TTAC contributor Matthew Guy for their time, and Matt Posky for editing. Most of all, we thank you for listening!
We’ll see you next time!
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