259: Unpacking Things

This is the What Car EV podcast for Thursday, February 26th, 2026, episode 259, Unpacking

Things.

So, we got a little unintentional late breaking news we weren't expecting, but actually segues

into our segment pretty nicely, actually.

It does, especially considering we're recording this episode ahead of time.

And we had a concept of a, what would you say, we had a concept of a plan, but the breaking

news has kind of wrapped a little bow on it, sort of, an unknown bow, a bow of, yeah, of

something, I don't know, a strange unknown bow.

Strange little bow.

Yeah.

I'm Phil Royal.

I'm not David Spade.

What?

Get to that in a minute.

I have been, I have derailed myself.

I don't know.

Go to youtube.com.

David Spade doppelganger.

Slash.

The What Car.

And you will see I am indeed not David Spade.

I'm glad I cut my hair between last week and this week.

So it's not quite as long and flowing of my locks because I could, I could see, I don't

hear it, but I could see it.

And I'll explain that in a minute.

You go.

Ed Sanchez, I don't know if I'm a, who I am a doppelganger of, but I've been mistaken

for Arab, Persian, Israeli, um, rarely for what I am.

Yeah.

I was going to say, with Sanchez, there's an obvious one.

Yeah.

Uh, anyway, uh, been doing this for a while going on, uh, I don't know, coming up on three

years of, uh, podcasts, I think, for math, right?

Four.

Are we in our fourth?

That shows you how good I am at math.

Anyway.

We talk about TVs.

We don't do math on this project.

Exactly.

So anyway, let's, uh, let's jump right into it.

All right.

We got it.

Well, we'll jump into the first thing.

We got a reader's letter and normally we'll get letters, uh, every single reader's letter.

That shows how long I've been doing this business, isn't it?

Cause I'm a magazine guy here.

Well was magazine guy here.

Hopefully it's not from a prison because I remember there used to be a prison letters

with a best.

They were the best.

They would, we could do an all, a whole episode on letters that I've received from prisons.

I remember when I first started way, I mean, gosh, I don't want to say how long go it was.

And I was like shocked.

I was like, when you get the first letter from the, from a prison, you know, I was an

intern at the time and it was like, oh my gosh.

And the editor was like, it's like, we get those all the time.

Well, the best ones was that you would get all these letters from listeners and then

or listeners from readers back in the magazine day, you would get these letters from prisons

and some of them were like really weird.

Like they cut out the pages of the magazine and they would write.

Yeah, I got some really weird ones.

I got ones where I would like wash my hands afterwards because I was like, I, I don't,

I don't know.

I don't, I just anyway.

So I, at one point I received a series of letters from, I think it was the same guy.

I don't, I don't really remember.

That's even creepier.

And then I received a letter from the warden of the prison that stated that the magazine

was unsuitable to be in the prison and that they were canceling the, like, I guess I didn't

cancel the subscription, but they stopped giving it to the prisoners.

Because you have bikini clad women or?

We didn't have that in the magazine.

I think it was this guy must have been acting out or whatever it was.

And so they took it away, but they need to like follow a procedure.

Anyway, we received a listener or a watcher letter in his last week that I was just so

entertained with.

Apparently I sound like David Spade.

Who knew?

Maybe I do.

I don't know.

I'm so used to hearing myself and you hear yourself in your brain that I don't sound all

So the reader letter pertains to David Spade somehow?

Just said, apparently I'm, I'm the spitting sound image of David Spade.

And then I was like, oh crap, last week, like, well, for the last several months I've just

been growing my hair out long.

So by coincidence, I happen to cut my hair and here we are no longer David Spade.

The news item that happened between last week and this week, I guess,

that has nothing to do with David Spade that has more to do with the episode

is apparently all of the tariffs that Trump's been signing in are illegal.

Most.

Yes.

And not yes.

Okay, unpack it a little bit for me.

Okay.

This is the Supreme Court has ruled.

Yes.

And this is a developing story.

So there's still a lot of unknowns to this.

I'm sure we'll dive into it in a future episode because already, predictably,

he's raging and, you know, calling for revenge and well,

Trump has said that this is an I'll say quote unquote, but it's not an exact quote,

but it's 95% of the quotes to disgrace that.

No, he said that these tariffs are the most important thing that he has done in this administration.

And the Supreme Court, well, conservative majority Supreme Court has just voted six,

three, that all of these tariffs that he's done under the how do you say IEPA,

the IEPA tariffs are illegal.

So the most important thing that he has done is not just by it was illegal.

It should never have happened.

Yeah, pretty much.

It's a little different than all the tariffs go away.

Yeah.

So IEPA, which is basically the acronym is basically emergency powers.

So you can claim like national security or like emergency powers act.

Anyway, it was put in place in 1971, I want to say, and has never been used for tariffs.

Yeah.

So basically that's what the Supreme Court ruled is like this is this was incorrectly

interpreted as to allowing tariffs.

So those are thrown out.

However, there are many, there are many flavors of tariffs.

So and that is just one of them.

So there's section 232 and there's section 301.

So the 100% tariff on Chinese EVs that was implemented under Biden was under section 301.

So that's still in place.

So that will not be immediately affected and steel and aluminum and auto parts to

were under section 232, which I think are currently subject to 25%.

So for the time being, those will remain in place.

So the immediate impact on the auto industry is not immediately apparent

because I mean, autos are complicated and have a lot of parts from a lot of countries

and a lot of different areas.

So it's not exactly clear how on in the short term, how this is going to affect the auto industry.

Sounds like for the most part, it's going to be kind of status quo.

Um, well, sort of.

Okay.

Go in the way back machine now by like four episodes.

Okay.

I think it was like 254, 255, something like that.

And we did a, we talked about this article that we linked to that maybe I could link to it again.

Although there's no point.

I'm going to make you go back and listen to that 254, 255.

And there will be a link in those show notes.

BYD sues government over tariffs.

They think that there's that the tariffs that affect BYD fall under IEPA.

And they are suing not just for those tariffs saying that they're illegal.

This was before the Supreme Court struck this down, but they're also suing for all money back.

They want refunds.

And I think it was with interest.

Yes.

So that's what BYD is asking for.

Already people are saying companies are going to just inundate the government with basically

refund requests because of this ruling.

This stops about $30 billion a month in tariff income.

And if companies like BYD that think that they have been affected by this can sue and

get the money back and get interest.

That's 30 billion times back to April.

Yeah.

This has potentially devastating consequences too for like budget and fiscal impact.

This is I mean we're talking billion interest on billions if they say you know that you get

interest back as well.

But even so this money has been I imagine spent.

I imagine this is I mean when you're like how many trillions in debt already.

I mean what's what's a few more billion.

Just crank up the machine and print some more money.

This is there's a lot of stuff that doesn't affect the auto industry.

Ironically the stuff that goes back to Biden that doesn't in this being struck down.

But there's a lot that does that auto manufacturers think does and are suing over.

So like I can't this is going to play out in a very interesting way.

Yeah we may I'm not promising this but we may do a future episode entirely on

the tariff impact and ramifications on the auto industry because there will be some but

as of right now it's not immediately apparent because it's so multifaceted.

So it's going to require some research and some analysis.

But anyway I just imagine how much unwinding there is to do.

I imagine that there is a question as to what tariffs are on what at this point.

Because Trump would say oh Canada's got this tariff and it's on this and this and this.

And then the next week would be like OK we're not doing that.

And then the week after be like all right well we're doing it but we're doing this.

I mean it's since April this is very crazy.

And it was very hard because if a foreign leader said something he perceived as negative.

He said well we're going to increase tariffs we're going to you know just

basically depending on what side of the Betty woke up on it.

So there was an article I was reading that was that exact thing about Brazil.

And that it was just.

Oh Lula said something bad.

Yeah.

Or he wanted amnesty for Bolsonaro and they said no.

And so he's like oh I'm going to.

Yeah.

And I maybe I'm wrong about this but there's car parts that are made in Brazil.

Like I want to say they're like maybe not number one whatever but they produce like

a large producer of like alternators or starters or something like that for the auto industry.

And I mean that's what yeah auto industry.

I'd say I'd say Brazil.

I mean off the top of my head I'd say they're probably like a top five global auto supplier.

So anyway.

So it and that starters and alternators don't necessarily affect this podcast.

But if they make that they might make other things as well that I'm completely unaware of.

Yeah.

So you will unpack this in the future.

I'm sure there's a lot of things that will come out of this.

Anyway.

So many things that you could barely fit it into the back of a station wagon

that Paul Starr will be bringing to America.

So they say and this I got to eat my words a little bit because I remember last week I said

the new SPA three architecture enables like a lower lower floor which you know hypothetically

could enable different body styles including wagons and I said oh well that's great but

they'll never bring them to the US.

Now that conversation was specifically referencing Volvo and technically Paul Starr is a different

brand but it's still I'd consider it the basically the Lexus of Volvos.

I that's kind of a maybe somewhat flawed analogy but I I effectively consider Paul

Starr division of Volvo even though they say oh no we're not you know kind of the whole

Hyundai Kia thing but yeah they're not legally they're not the same yeah I'm guessing if it's

like Hyundai Kia legally they're not the same but for anybody who talks about them they're

exactly the same.

Yeah so anyway so so what's interesting is is they say it's going to be based on the Paul

Starr four which if you remember is the one that became notorious because it got rid of the back

window so they placed it with the electronic rear view mirror and a lot of that's generally a lot

of controversy in its own right you know it's kind of a love it or hate it kind of thing.

Anyway I mean I just say the wagon version will have a rear window for what it's worth.

Which is great the funny thing with me is I love those digital rear view mirrors I think they're

fantastic superior to a regular they're take a little bit to getting used to especially when

you got kids you used to looking in the mirror to see the kids so it takes a little bit of getting

used to doing that yeah but I think they are far superior for actual visibility from the back

but the idea of not having a window a window that I don't look through the idea of not having that

scares me for whatever reason and I love the digital rear view mirrors so I would be a great

candidate for having one of a car with no rear window because I know I love all of this stuff

but it still scares me.

I'm going to date myself a little bit but we're kind of from the same era so you

probably remember this and you and you and I both moved a bunch of times when you rented a U-Haul

and no no rear view mirror no camera no nothing it's just either you had someone to spot you or

you just kind of you know made the sign of the cross and just went for it.

Every time I toe with my camper is what it is because I don't have a camera on the back of

that thing either but yeah I've noticed the newer U-Hauls do have a rear camera which is very helpful

because otherwise you have like almost zero you know rear visibility so anyway so Polestar

wagon coming to the US you know not impossible the M5 came back as a wagon in the US even though

it weighs like 6,000 pounds or whatever but anyway I guess it feels some kind of niche but

I guess I'd be more excited if I thought this would be about 30,000 but it's probably going to be

60, 70, 80 but it anyway I'll take them in where I can get it. What it takes you won't buy one but

because it's going to be out of your price range but you'll take the win. What this does though is

and this is where it all kind of works together is with the tariffs in question

with Polestar saying hey the thing that you've always taken for granted that we won't bring

wagons into America you know where they're few and far between that that's you know we're definitely

absolutely was the quote absolutely coming to the US that now all of a sudden there's all these

other EVs I think they're all Chinese aren't they that you listed that you're like I'd like to see

these come into America and that's where this just ultimately this was what the conversation was

going to be but then this was the original podcast yeah and then all of a sudden we had the tariffs

and then the Polestar thing or like boom episode yes okay so this was uh I call them the top five

forbidden fruit EVs I'd like to see in the US so and and also that kind of the subtext of this

conversation is in the context of a hundred percent tariffs which don't look like they're

going away based on this latest Supreme Court decision is to do kind of a value proposition

on each of them assuming a hundred percent tariffs so I've gone through and I'd say

if it costs this much is it still worth it or not so anyway top of my list

costs no object and I've talked about this before

I think this is my top model that I would like to see just because I think it's

just kind of so outrageous and just kind of crazy I just I don't know it appeals to me from that

level it's just it's so unapologetically like unhinged it's just like awesome so it's the Zeekr

001 FR which is like their version of the plaid I guess but basically kind of a wagon form factor

so this is quad motor 1200 horsepower KW coilovers which brings me you know back to my

younger days in the tuner scene yeah I remember KW well yeah I think they're still yeah I mean

so even in China this is an expensive car in China it's about a hundred fifteen thousand dollars

yeah so this is not now as as will be the case for a lot of these other vehicles I bring out

there are cheaper versions the FR is like the most expensive crazy flagship versions

there the kind of base model starts at around 38,000 in China and I guess these are on sale in

Europe for about 61,000 euros so for that price it's like okay that's a decent deal but assuming

100 percent tariff so double 150 so 230 grand so almost a quarter million dollars as much as I like

this car I'm sorry that's it's gonna have to be a pass for me I just as cool as it is it does not

justify that price if you wanted the wagon you get the Porsche take hand sport tourism sport

tourism yeah and I don't know how much that costs but it's not 250,000 no it's it's in the six figures

by quite a ways but yeah not not almost a quarter million dollars yeah so I mean I'm assuming you

you agree on this one it's like cool but not quarter million dollars cool yeah no I don't even know

if it's a hundred thousand dollar cool yeah I mean if this I would say if this was ensure the FR

specifically if it was sub hundred thousand if it was like 80 grand I'd say this I got you know

this is awesome this is a screaming bargain crazy performance gotta have it factor but yeah even at

115 it's like so still a cool car just does not justify the price I am looking now see that's not

Porsche I know that's Panamera I want take hand sport tourism sport tourism off the top of my head

I want to say like about 130 starting uh one the gts sport tourism is 156 oh wow okay turbo cross

tourism which is different but that one is 176 all right so so if the thing was in that ballpark

if it was even like the same price I would just get the Porsche yeah and I think I mean kind of a

big picture view of this I think that's going to be the challenge for Chinese brands is competing

against more established more prestigious brands so Porsche has a name BMW Mercedes

they have names they can bank on that Zeke it's cool it's kind of unusual and edgy and they could

sell it like oh well you know it's related to Volvo but who's who's gonna I mean now granted Volvo

has had six-figure cars before but they've been pretty rare and so I just yeah I as cool as this is

they're gonna they're gonna have to either kind of eat a lot of the price and bring it in about 80

grand or yeah or just we're just not bringing the FR and concentrate on the lower trim models that

have a more justifiable price if they made the lower trim models look like the FR but didn't

necessarily have the performance of it then and I think some of the lower level models are like

six or 800 horsepower so they're not 100 power yeah I mean they're not 1200 but

you don't need I mean even with 600 horse I think that the 001 is cool but yeah anyway

okay moving on next one um I'm having to google some of these I think we've talked about this we

have but yeah the why you seven GT so so it's interesting like the why you in the SU I call

why you an SU most of other people come you or sue so this kind of reminds me of the

toward the show versus SHO if you're really not debate yeah like and I heard a lot of people

call the tourist show I always call the SHO yeah it was the SHO they're all seven you seven whatever

you want to call it so this is the crossover variant the first model was the SU seven which

ironically was sedan you think SU yeah I remember that I remember I think we talked about that yeah

so why you sevens crossover the reason I picked it over the SU seven is rationally speaking

crossovers are a bigger market sedans are not very popular in the US possibly I would get the sedan

over the crossover personally but I'm time in the larger context of the US market I think a

sure bet is a crossover so that's why I kind of picked this so this one um I think it kind of

looks like a Ferrari pro song way which ironically a son like on the road about a week ago well you

live in fancyville yeah well so cool looking I think it looks pretty pretty sweet the GT model

which is like just now coming out 990 horsepower so probably in the league of the person in terms

of power um in china this is 60 to 70 thousand dollars so in terms of bang for the buck I think

this strikes me as a much better deal than the 001 so doing the math uh assuming this is 140

grand in the US again brand recognition value proposition again this could arguably kind of

compete with like a ticon sport tourism or cross tourism I think for if you're talking about that

kind of money people are going to go for the Porsche I mean unless you're like a really like

Silicon Valley type that want to have latest and greatest kind of obscure off-brand but

which you can say like why would anybody do that but you know how many uh vin pass I see around in

my area yeah surprisingly a lot so there are definitely people that just want something

because it's different or maybe there's a good financing deal on it or something I don't know

I don't know so assuming no tariffs for 70 000 I think this is a sweet deal 140 grand pass so um

yeah although again like the 001 there are different trim levels there's standard and a pro

in china they range from 35 to 78 000 um or excuse me no that's my tariff math never mind

um so yeah the the lower the lower trim levels in china are 35 to 39 000 so applying the tariff

math to that that would be 70 to 78 uh more competitive but still I think kind of high

for a new brand and it depends what the the standards look like is the same thing with the

zeeger it depends on what the standard one looks like because when I was testing a lot of hellcats

mm-hmm I was I would drive the challenger or the uh the charger I would be driving the charger around

and thinking this is a great car you know it's the build quality is decent you know it drives well

like just forget the 700 horsepower it it's a solid car but then I would go to I would go on

some work trip I would rent one a base model one and be like this is crap this is absolute crap

the the hellcat version was nicer but the base model power obviously yeah but even when you take

the power out of it it was a nice interior it could have been better but you know I just assumed

that it was the same interior as the base stuff that you'd rent at Hertz no the base models really

suck which we get into as as in the automotive journalism industry where you test cars they

generally give you like higher end vehicles so you rarely get to see the base base model

and so you get this like false perception of what a base model could be so here man 70 000

for a base model if you got the base model and you did 100 tariff on on the yu7 it would have

to be a heck of a base model for 70 grand yeah and again I I mean obviously these cars aren't

allowed in the US and I mean they have had some over on like a very limited basis for like influencers

to drive mm-hmm we're not among that group so um so I can't really speak to the niceness of the

the base interior so anyway uh cool I think you could make more of a case for this than you

could for 001 but anyway yeah I definitely I definitely agree like if this came in at um

you're not selling any of the gts at 100 tariff no but you might sell some of the others yeah

at the lower at the the lower model of the yu7 yeah the next one I think

possibly might have the best appeal to kind of an upscale

audience uh this is the neo et5 t which is the touring or wagon version of the et5 which is kind

of a fastback sedan now this one I definitely had to google yeah this is a little more obscure

but neo what's interesting is I talked to a guy at CES last month who was Chinese he was based

in the US but originally from China and he tracks the Chinese auto industry pretty closely and I

asked him who do you feel what brand do you feel is kind of state-of-the-art in China in terms of

technology and he he said neo um for what that's worth so they're kind of perceived as kind of

being on the cutting edge of kind of automotive technology over there um so the appeal for this

is the et5 t is very sleek and understated like the fr is like boy racer civic suddenly

you know won mega millions and just wanted to go crazy this is this is to me has more of

an outie outie vibe to it a little bit kind of an outie tesla vibe you know very clean

kind of unadorned look to it but kind of elegant I think um so this one has four seconds zero to

60 not bad not like record breaking but plenty quick I think it's the big thing that got my

attention it's as fast as you need to go yeah the thing that got my attention was 150 kilowatt

hour battery I don't know if that was a typo or not that is a massive battery for a non-truck

basically that is huge does this thing weigh like 8 000 pounds I would guess with that size

battery we're talking at least six that's um that's a standard one's like 100 which is you know

for higher end EVs is fairly common but 150 um starts at 42 000 in china um assuming 100 tariff

84 grand I mean it's nice it's not it's not 84 grand nice in my mind 42 yes 42 it's like wow

this thing's really nice and you know good bang for the buck 84 I don't know I I I don't see it

being a huge hit so the t specifically the touring the wagon specifically if you could get that kind

of power for 80 I could see that well no I mean if you look at it purely from like a spec standpoint

it's a good deal relative to like a lucid error or gravity or you know model y or whatever you're

like okay you know you can make a case for it even like the you know Audi e-tron um you know gt or

they got a wagon version of that now too I can't remember what it's really I'm pretty sure I'm a

neighbor I still my neighbor's got a e-tron gt I should tell him trade it in and yeah I think

they got a wagon version now but anyway um but again it's its name so I guess depending on how

quickly they can establish kind of a brand reputation I think that's a defensible price

but again if people are purely shopping like on level status like Audi Porsche you know BMW

even Tesla for that matter is like Neo unless you really again you you're aware of Neo's reputation

in China and you're like ooh that's you know that's a cool desirable you know kind of cutting edge car

again I think that's I think 80 if you said 84,000 gets you a well equipped one of these

and then you marketed it right I could totally see it I think you bring that in with a wagon

you go for the same market that Lucid was going for you can you put it against that you go after

image you don't lean into the Chinese owned thing you lean into something else

uh but I I totally for for limited market which you know the wagon's gonna be

I could see it I totally see that the other two I'm like yeah you know

the double the price you're not you're just not really selling them that much yeah but this one I

I could totally see yeah I think in terms of you know factoring in the price and the specs and

everything I think this is the one I'd be most interested in owning personally even you know

84 grand would be a stretch I mean you know but I could say okay it's defensible as much as I like

the FR I mean it's just the price is just crazy yeah anyway the next one I think you know I know

BYD's gotten a lot of attention just you know globally in the automotive market so this is a

I think a redesign I'm trying to remember what model replaced but and they have different naming

strategies depending on the market like between China and Europe and whatnot so the BYD song

ultra so this is kind of the mid-sized crossover kind of model Y sized kind of so in China this

is 26 to 32 grand 362 horsepower I think that's rear wheel drive I think they're planning on all

wheel drive variant but standard 70 I think it's like 77 kilowatt hour battery optional 82.7

so decent size battery so assuming 100 tariff would this would be 52 to 64 which is pretty close

to like a well-equipped model Y with the tariff tax so and you know if you're comparing it again to

like some the Audi models like a Maki maybe I'd say this is like okay this is a decent deal

but again BYD brand-wise is considered more kind of mainstream it's not considered luxury the

BYD's luxury brand is Yang Wang you know the 3000 horsepower you know crazy sports car and

they've got like these you know massive SUVs and big sedans and stuff so I think this would be

an interesting one terms of positioning I think BYD strategy and in China and I think outside of

China where they have a presence is value is bang for the buck I'm trying to think of what their

little kind of subcompact hatchback I want to say the seal I think that's like all their names are

anyway that's so that's like 12 grand and so that's you know bang for the buck assuming

that price that that thing's like a crazy deal I think in in Europe that's basically double that

so it's like like low low to mid 20s still still competitive but not like as screaming a deal as

it is in China so yeah 26 to 32 this would be just like I mean I think they'd have a line down the

block waiting to buy this thing but 52 to 64 maybe I think this falls into the same trap and

largely why I'm going to bring this as a comparison I guess is because I'm looking at it and that's

what it reminds me of maybe I'm looking at an older version is the how we were just talking about the

rogue the redo of the rogue and then the p have yeah the p have and the outlander that is based on

kind of what this reminds me of just looking at it and then you think of the conversation

that we had there which is like why would you get those if you could just get a tesla

that does more for p have yeah well but in that case but in this case we were saying there why

would you get the rogue if you could just go and get you know the model why for cheaper basically

the same you know same or cheaper yeah and I kind of view that in this realm visually it doesn't look

amazing to me it's not bad to me of a Nissan it's fine yeah it's fine and that's where you'd

look at like I think it'd be a hard uh rogue to sew over something like a tesla whereas like the

neo et5 t is very different it's well it's more it's more of a niche proposition which this one

is clearly trying to aim for a mass market yeah when you're trying to sell refrigerators

price sensitive yeah it's like you kind of just go for the same for what's the best deal bang for

the buck you know because you're buying a you're buying an appliance essentially at this level

yeah so I think it would be very difficult to to sell one of those I think the price is in that

the right realm but I think it would just be very difficult to do it when you're like here's this

vehicle that's a good all-around quality I guess like what's your sell what's I think I think at

40 grand this would be very competitive in the US market 40 to 45 so I think all my neighbors

bought a vin fast would buy one of these as well yeah I think that's how big your market is

I think this is why you know China is obviously playing the long game with the US market

which is why I'm sure they're watching the tariff situation very very closely and how that's

unfolding and you know what the ramifications are going to be on that they're also trying to

and again this is still kind of unknown exactly where this is they're trying to set up production

in Mexico they reportedly kind of put that on hold to kind of see what's happening with the

terrorists maybe that's going to go back on they were even talking about you know possibly starting

building a plant in the US I'm still going to stand by my statement I think one of the G. Lee

brands like non-volvo Polestar because those are also G. Lee brands but Zeke or one of their other

brands will be first in the US just because they kind of have the existing infrastructure they can

leverage whereas a lot of these other companies BYD included will kind of have to start from scratch

anyway so BYD is interesting I think they will be in the US at some point I think

they'll probably be second and after G. Lee or Zeke or but anyway but again mass market brand

kind of price sensitive so yeah I kind of agree with your take on that all right this last one

we have talked about this before but this is if I were just to say this name I don't think anyone

would know what the heck we were talking about I have to look it up every time you bring this car

up and you brought it up like this is at least the third time we've talked about this this is the

JMEV SC01 just rolls off the tongue yeah rolls off so this is the one I've referred to in the

past is the electric Miata basically and you call it a fat pig but anyway I still think it's

not bad for what it is but it's like three thousand pounds isn't it in that way throughout

three thousand pounds which you know looking at the specs I think is not bad it's basically it's

kind of I kind of see it as like an off and I don't mean to insult it but kind of an off-brand

revival of the original Tesla Roadster mm-hmm which was just Lotus Elise first-gen Tesla Roadster

yeah maybe that's a little harsh it's a throwback to the way Chinese manufacturers used to design

cars definitely they just straight up ripped off another design and you look at it and you're like

oh this is the Tesla Roadster or the Lotus whichever one you want to see it's it is very much like

the Elise or the first-gen Roadster yeah it's like a bad thing I think I thought those were kind of

cool cars on their own right the Chinese manufacturers had this tendency in the early 2000s and probably

before I don't know to design cars and the joke I don't know who it was that said it originally

whatever but it that it was they the vehicles look like somebody tried to describe like a BMW

over the phone to somebody else and that's what would pop out of Chinese manufacturing

and since then now we've got things like the the ripoff was so blatant even the badges would

interchange yeah like I think I can't even remember who made it but somebody made basically like

a Honda CR-V clone and it looked I mean unless you went up close you'd say oh that's a CR-V

and even the little indentation in the tailgate for the badge was like interchangeable

that's that's how yeah they've come Chinese manufacturers have come a long way since then

except for jmev yeah but but I'm honestly I'm not upset about it because I like kind of the purity

and simplicity of it it doesn't have like a huge wraparound touchscreen I think it has like a small

one in the center console 3 000 pounds which you know again for sports cars a little on the heavy

side but for what it is 429 horsepower dual motor I'm trying to remember what I read on the zero

to 60 I think it's like 3.3 or 3.5 so again not plaid territory but plenty quick for something

that size in China this is 32 000 which is I think a screaming deal if this was on sale in the US

for that I I mean I'd be like all over that but I assuming 100 percent tariff 64 grand

I still think it's cool for that price but it's not like a must-have I mean this is kind of more

your background so I'm kind of curious on your take on this I have called it as you said like a

fat pig essentially every single time we talk about this thing at 3 000 pounds people will be like

what are you talking about well if you're trying to go after like a sports car and lotus where you

add lightness and things like that yeah it needs to be sub 3 000 pounds there's just it's a barrier

if this way 2950 I'd probably be singing a different tune it's just this mental blockage once you get

to 3 000 pounds which is fine and so that's what I've called it and you may think that I don't like

it this thing is also a tube frame car with push rod front suspension this is a performance car if

assuming the geometry is all correct it's got the essentials there to be a fantastic track car and if

you can then go and buy this track car for 60 000 dollars and drive it on the street I think there's

a lot of people out there that would buy something like that I think there is definitely a market for

something like that assuming that the infrastructure is there to actually go and do a track day there's

only handfuls of tracks where you could charge the car at the track a lot of them you're having to

run off to a supercharger or other fast charger or something that you could get the level to if

you get the rv spot but that's not doing anything no but like you said that situation's changing

do you say button willow or somewhere just called superchargers yeah button willow

near me southern california they petitioned tesla I think I don't know the ins and outs of it but I

believe button willow essentially gave tesla the space and said come and install these superchargers

and so tesla comes in and they installed a bank of them it's not huge I should have counted last

time I was there maybe six six or eight spots I don't know and you come in and the cool thing is

you get free admission into the track to go and charge a tesla so if there's some day track day

going on you want to see it and they would normally charge you a $10 gate fee or something

you just go in and say have them here to charge it the supercharger and they'll let you in which

now would be any ev not just any test so you know it's so they might be changing that policy

well now it's five bucks yeah yeah but then there are some tracks that you simply can't run an ev yet

because the track thinks that they're dangerous and they're not equipped to and the fire danger is

real and they are not equipped to deal with the fire danger they need the blankets or the

dunk tanks or whatever it is it just the yeah it is a different yeah and so some tracks are just so

scared of it that they just say absolutely no no you can't have an ev yeah so um this I could see

though at 60 grand like I'm for what you get as far as what the chassis is

um it's now I'm looking at another page of this push rod front and rear

and also too I mean if the weight is that big a deal I I feel if they really wanted to they could

incrementally trim 100 200 pounds from this they could get it below 3000 if they really wanted to

if you if you yeah if it's 3000 ish on the nose and they wanted to drop it down you could chop the

roof off of it you could take the front the the front part of the hoop and the down tubes down

take the windshield off drop the roof off you just have the hoop behind you and that'd drop

I don't know 50 80 pounds at least I don't know I mean windshields aren't like that still be

well let me ask you this is you know our resident race expert would that still be compliant

in terms of the rules with I mean it depends on the class it's a track it's a track day car it

doesn't fit into any class so you could do anything you want as long as you've got a roll hoop and it

would pass whatever kind of inspection that they're all that they're um so that's so that wouldn't be

like the windshield or the a-pillar yeah you can get rid of all of that generally a lot of people

refer to what what is the broomstick test that scca would do that I don't think ever actually

existed but the idea is you run a line down from the top of the rear main hoop down to the front

of the car where if it inverts and you're lying upside down would your helmet hit the floor

and that was the broomstick test and as long as you pass generally that but you look at like factory

five the cobra replicas they don't pass that those things kill people left and right so

allegedly allegedly uh kill people left and right then you can still go and run them at

track days and things so this is like an aerial atom or something along those lines that let me

ask you this if they were really determined to come into the u.s. market do you think if they

came in with like a spec series they could get some people interested in this I think so I think

spec series work for as long as you're gonna offer support I think a lot of that's a marketing thing

how much do you like the mx5 cup I think the gr I don't know as much about it the the gr cup

thing that they've got as well a lot of it is if you enter you're gonna get money back

and you can if you do well you can actually make money on those yeah it's a lot of it is the

contingency and it all comes out of marketing budget for the most part uh so they would have

to come in with a huge effort it's hard to launch like a spec series like that there's things like

with gosh I don't I don't know it well enough well so there are local tracks that do things like

not a nationwide traveling series but like you might go to perump in Nevada and run

a aerial atom or similar series there in a spec car essentially so the interesting tidbit about

jmev is one of their investors is xiaomi I believe so in terms of getting money I mean they're back

by xiaomi yeah I mean they could come in pretty big if they wanted to I I'd say of of these in

terms of bang for the buck what I would be most interested in I would say probably the neo et5

t in this yeah in terms of the value equation the rest of them are like either kind of me

or just too expensive yeah but these the neo in this I'm like yeah I think the zikr

001 fr even without tariff prices too expensive it's just a non-starter for that one the the

yu7 gt once you put tariffs on it it's just not there if they could bring it in without

tariff prices they could maybe add you could do a 50 tariff on that one and probably still sell

them yeah I think I think 50 60 grand that that gets some buyers yeah the neo et5 I bring it in

with the tariffs whatever I think there's a market it's marketing at that point as to whether

or not that sells by the song non-starter to me it's cheap but it's the competition in that price

range is just it's too hard and the the jmev or however you want to call it I actually think

that's one of the you bring it in small batches you know I think there's there's money I think

for mass market they'd have to do a name change to me this sounds too much like a

like a robotic vacuum or something I don't know the reason that I think to that exact point like

the aerial atom has an awesome name yeah everybody knows about the aerial atom but if it were called

the jmev sco1 no yeah I mean sco1 doesn't bother me that much I mean it's like you know there's a

lot of alphanumeric names out there but the jmev that have to do like I don't know like

crouching dragon or I don't know well if you're gonna rip off the the roadster design

the original roadster just call it the roadster sco1 and call it a day make roadster be the brand

yeah yeah there you go I don't know if anyone's done that but there you go you heard it here first

folks yeah so you know what we've just done an episode yeah we filled about 50 minutes

with something that I thought this would be a 30 minute episode there you go so that is our filler

episode uh no I'm off traveling and yes and probably more on tariffs in the weeks ahead

I'm guessing yeah a lot will develop between when we are recording this and when the next

up-to-date episode airs yes so hopefully we'll have more tariff information and I did recently

get an update we are I did get a confirmation on upcoming a special guest sweet sweet stay tuned

yeah and then we'll reach out to jmev and send them our suggestions yeah maybe they'll fly you

to China to uh or if they send one out here yeah they can send one here I live close enough to

China I'm on a coast they can just drop it off if they drop one off at button willow cool yeah no

there we go okay jmev you heard it here I'm in hookah all right show notes are available wherever

you find show notes in podcasts and on youtube speaking of youtube youtube.com slash at the

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David Spade but you go there like and subscribe ring the bell icon whatever it is you do on youtube

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259: Unpacking Things

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