995: The Whole Family Included, The Fight Between Needs And Wants, Learning Porsche Models

Love them or hate them. Everyone has an opinion on cars. But we believe we're all one great car away from a car enthusiast. So we're here to help you find a car you love. And let it take us to everything else in life. I'm Todd. I'm Paul. And this is the everyday driver car debate. Happy Friday everyone. If you've had a week like we've had, this is a much earned Friday. That's all I'm going to say. It's been a crazy one, but we are very excited about so much going on. That's actually why it's been so crazy. There's so much going on.

We're going to shoot this week. For a piece we have coming out pretty soon. I'm very excited about it. It is me doing a one year wrap up, not like it's over, but a one year conclusion of my Amira ownership talking about what's that first year been like. The car is continuing. It's going to code of many other things. But we had one of you reach out to us with a four cylinder Amira, which we hadn't even driven yet. So we put my Amira with the four cylinder. In addition to me talking about that first year, that's coming out soon. We also have a four runner comparison.

Coming out very, very soon to the channel. It's already been filmed. And then we go on a bit of a road trip. Maybe you've heard. Maybe you heard that we can't believe it. It's coming in just a few weeks. I mean, we've been talking about this for practically six months, six months. Yeah, six months for sure. So circuit of the Americas. If you are still thinking about coming, we encourage you to register at hooked on driving.com for that two day great track event. And that does coincide with our 1000th podcast recording, which we intend right now to record.

From the top of the tower at Coda and we're going to figure out how many people can be at the top of the tower. And there's the fire code that we have to respect and the tracks wishes that we have to respect. But we thought wouldn't be cool to record that 1000th with a view. But of course, I'm afraid of heights and I'm not. It's going to think it's a cool idea. But yeah, but you have it up there yet. I mean, just so you know, actually, you can go to our website right now. I read a driver.com on the adventures tab under the Coda portion. You can register for the track day there. You can get the information. How to be a part of a road tour.

You can also get your tickets now for the 1000th podcast if you're going to be there. And I'll be really honest with you. I've been talking with this with our patrons on Discord. I don't know who's coming. Is it 10 of you? Is it 150 of you? I have no idea. I mean, the reality. Look, I'll be really candid with you. The reality is we can probably get about 50 people at most at the top of the tower. So tickets are available. It's first come first serve. Once we hit that max, then it'll be wait list. I guess if we wind up with I don't imagine this 1000th

of people want to come. Then we won't be in the tower. We'll pivot somewhere else. But hopefully we're going to get 50 of you. They're going to join us up at the top of the tower. That'll be really, really cool. That's the 1000th podcast. Of course, it will be available on video on our main channel. So you're going to get to see it and hear it. And of course, it'll come out as an audio as well. So all of that will happen as normal. That also brings me to the fact that starting at the 1000th podcast will be on a bit of a break. There'll be at least a couple of weeks where you won't hear from us because we'll

still be traveling as part of that road tour. And we are coming back to a new studio to do all of them video going forward. So that means the 1000th and first podcast will be some time in the back half a June. And then we'll go weekly from there. So again, that's just the code of stuff that doesn't cover the fact that we have a monster hooked on driving Watkins Glenn event happening on July 4th. We have the first ever Midwest event is happening actually two weeks after code. And now that I think about it at the hedgehog raceway on the southeast of

Kansas City, you can sign up for that. A bunch of stuff going on the rest of the summer. We have our park city drive days in July. We have baretooth in September. That's just the stuff off the top of my head. There's a ton of stuff I'm still filming. Filming other cars coming out. Yeah, I want to touch on that Watkins Glenn event because this is going to be a very big event. It's July 3rd through the six three days on track. Car show and camping available. You can get a camping spot. That is your home away from home for the entire weekend. Evening campfires and a lot.

A lot of great people, great community. So register hooked on driving for that one. And then as Todd said, hedge hollow. If you are in the Midwest and Kansas City area, hedge hollow is the newest racetrack down there. And we would love to see you at another three day event. June 13th through the 15th, 2025. It's an incredible track, digital flagging for what we understand. It's no expensive pit garages in the middle of cornfield. Long straightaway. It's just in the middle of nowhere. But the track we've heard is

spectacular. And we're planning on being there as well. This is like the field of dreams equivalent for racetracks. That's true. All this is is cornfields. I'm going to build a racetrack. If I build it, people will come. Well, that's where we're doing hooked on driving. We're going. We got requested. We're going to come hooked on driving Midwest is ramping up and actually kicking off with that event. That'll be that weekend like two weeks after code. So we will be there. I think with our cars, which is even even cooler. So ponder that as well. This episode is by

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Will is writing in from North Carolina. He and his son Ben have been listening to the podcast in the school pickup line since he's been picking up his son in the afternoons. They've been listening to the podcast and if they don't actually have enough podcast with our two a week to actually get through all of the pickup days, then they go through the back catalog and they're enjoying it.

The problem is that because of us, his son Ben is now obsessed with GR86s and Porsches, and you know what, Ben, great choice. I'm just encouraging you right now, man. I hope you guys are listening and enjoying this right now, but that's really cool. I'm glad that we are infecting you all with the car disease, and I love that you guys are listening together. That's really awesome.

Yes, Will and Ben, hello to you both. Will is writing from North Carolina because he needs an off-road family holler, but he wants a GR86.

Those are not the same. They're really not. But Will needs this family holler that's capable of handling rough forest service roads in the national forest in North Carolina and the surrounding states, but get this. He currently has a model year 2020 Jeep Gladiator Overland in Gator Green that he loves.

The problem is, as big as that truck is, it doesn't have enough internal space for his soon to be eight year old and soon to be three year old. He's got a forward-facing car seat and a rear-facing car seat in the back and one needs to come out if he transports the dogs anywhere.

And so what he does instead is that he steals his wife's 2022 Palisade to haul everybody and all the stuff.

Because he needs the third row versus the bed of the Gladiator. I see where we're going. Right. And the Gladiator is perfect for the forest service roads and his wife's Palisade doesn't cut it, but he likes it on that road. He's been doing this.

He's been sort of hanging out and trying to make it work up until now, but he needs to get rid of the Gladiator. Again, as good as it is, and as big as that thing is, the interior space is still no bigger really than a four-door Jeep, which is not that much.

One of the things he's looked at actually is a Wrangler Sahara 4xE, which I kind of think of the Gladiator's not working that doesn't, but the only reason that might work is because you've got a closed back now.

And they can argue about a third row. I mean, they could argue about a third row. So theoretically, there's more both kids and dogs space in that because you don't have the bed. I get it, but I think the Wrangler's probably out if the Gladiator isn't working.

But again, we're looking at a full closed back SUV, ideally, something with a third row, potentially. That's where we are.

He names a bunch of stuff that he is interested in. Land Cruiser 1958 version, the new 4Runner SR5, that Sahara you mentioned, Honda Pilot Trail Sport and Passport Trail Sport Elite.

He says the Land Cruiser is out of the budget because of the Minister of Finance's recommendations.

We need to bring that shirt back. Minister of Finance, shirt needs to resurrect. That's a good one.

That's a cool one. He says the Passport 4Runner and Wrangler are all pushing on the budget and the Pilot fits in the budget.

So it seems a little bit flexible even though we didn't land on a particular number. I don't see an exact number.

True.

But of course, even if you had an exact number, we'd probably ignore it anyway.

We would probably walk away from it a little bit, yes.

As much as Will says he'd love to get this Jerry VI because he wants something to handle as well, all of these SUVs he said are boring from the handling standpoint.

And his car history does not include fun cars, like an 86 GMC Jimmy, 2002 Hyundai Land Cru Manual and a 2006 Honda Ridgeline, which I always thought was cool.

You're right, not a handling standout but a cool truck standout, I thought.

The car's hand is Minister of Finance have owned include a 1998 Subaru Legacy wagon and a 2001 Honda CRV, both manual and most recently a 2014 Forester.

I think the Forester fits on the Forest Service Road.

It does. It's there in the name, in fact.

It says the launcher legacy were slow, fun to drive fast, especially with the legacy with all-wheel drive.

And the closest that he's come to driving a performance or sports car was a mid-2000s GTI that his brother had for a little while.

So to Will, the Palisade is a ton of fun and sport mode.

Okay. All right, good.

All right, good. As much as he'd love to get something like an SI or in a lot of energy already six and a beat or four runner, he doesn't think three cars is feasible right now.

So what are our suggestions for vehicles that will haul the kids and the dogs, take them camping, still be fun to drive 95% of the time when it's being used as a family hauler?

What is he missing out of this long list? He's also willing to go slightly used but he's thinking trying to maintain what a vehicle he gets then to pass on his car obsessed eight year old and eight years.

So he's thinking ahead, serve the needs now and then that becomes his eight year olds in eight years, which is why he's thinking newer.

I see the logic. And that's what's happened with our Rubikayan. I get it, but don't plan that way.

Solve the problem now. Don't solve the eight year future problem.

Don't plan that the car you're buying now is the car your kid is going to drive.

You don't know what life is going to bring. You don't know what actual Ben's interest is going to be in driving.

You don't know how much he might not want to drive that car or that car has X problem. You can't even define.

Don't tie that to the car. That's the big thing I have. Especially if you said you were two years away, sure, three years away, maybe five and up.

Let that problem solve itself in eight years. Let's see what Ben's interest is. I hope he's still excited. But anyway, green well will says specifically no GM products.

OK. All right. And lastly, Ben would like to know if we have suggestions of things he should be doing to set him up for something similar to what we do.

He likes when we talk about all the behind the scenes stuff that goes into what we do. And of course, he would love to be able to drive all the cars and talk about them like we do.

And Ben, I didn't see this coming in my career. Agreed. Todd didn't see this coming. No, no.

You thought you were going to be in LA screenwriting directing. That was the hope. Yeah. That was the goal, right? For sure. Yeah.

I thought I was going to be designing stuff products furniture cars stuff and designer and maybe move up to a vice president design role. And I'm working for a company and that never happened.

Here we are. But you know what? I wouldn't trade it. And I don't think you would either. No, definitely not. I mean, I love the twist in terms that life takes.

And that's one of the big things I want to encourage you about Ben. And also you will as a just a parent. And that is you don't have to tie into I'm going to be X.

Especially now with the automotive media, the landscape of media changing so much YouTube. I mean, it is the go to for automotive media.

But we see changes in that. We see practically every YouTuber doing some sort of shift into some other kind of things.

So I feel like the media landscape for just cars is going to change two or three times before you even get to driving age, Ben.

Well, but I'm even taking it beyond automotive media in general. And I think about this because I think about a lot with my son who's about to be a sophomore in high school, which is astonishing to think about.

But when I was his age, I kind of knew exactly what I wanted to be. And that was a fighter pilot with the Air Force. Seriously.

It was very cool, very cool. But I didn't want to get a computer science degree or a math degree or any of the degrees that the Air Force wanted. And when I went into college and was a film major also an Air Force ROTC.

There was also an economic budgetary downturn for the military at that point. And I had a friend who was at the Air Force Academy in flight school to the Air Force Academy. And he was being told the Academy guys get seats first, by the way.

He was being told to expect a three year weight out of college. And I'm at Baylor University in the ROTC program that I only think the Air Force knew existed thinking I am not going to end up with a good good opportunity here.

So I how do I put this kindly I pivoted fully into film because the other thing because it kept saying, well, if you really want a better shot, you should become a computer science degree. I was like, I'm not doing that.

So I this was in one fell swoop. I left ROTC. I was in their full first full year. I left ROTC. I leaned fully into film and I grew my hair out. That was this was the plan. So that but but then to your point, Paul, I was going to be a filmmaker. That was the only next thing that I had any interest in whatsoever.

Yeah. And after 14 years in Hollywood in LA, I left that not knowing if I would ever do anything Hollywood related again and it overlapped with us starting the show. But then I worked as an editor of commercials. No part of me while going through school thought, I like edit TV commercials. But it did that for like eight years.

And then we pivoted and a good skill set that I had that I was able to use. And then we moved into this show full time. And then that led us to hooked on driving and also leading trips around the world. If you had pulled me aside in college and said, you're going to lead people on travel trips of driving around the world, I would be like, I'm sorry, but you grabbed the wrong student.

Okay. So right. I'm saying all of this to say something that I'm really trying to take to heart, both will and then for both of you. And that is my son's not sure where his path is going to lead. And as a parent, I need to be okay with that.

Because my path didn't lead the places that I was convinced it would go when I was in high school. So then I like that you have this interest in doing what we do. And I encourage that.

But I want to tell you two things. First off, take the opportunities that come your way. Yes, they will lead places you never imagine. That's why we do that.

Yes, that's why I mean, sorry, that's why we do what we do because we took opportunities that came our way and we kind of pivoted from the thing we thought because there's a new thing and look where it's led us, which is crazy.

That's the first thing I want to say. The second thing I want to say is, and this is a hard lesson. The things you are passionate about can always be a part of your life.

And they might not be your job. You may have a life long love. My wife is a talented actress. She has rarely been paid to act. She has been an actress the entire time I've known her.

She's fantastic. So it's been the side hustle thing that she thoroughly enjoys that feeds her soul, but it's not the day job. So this is the thing I feel like, at least when I was growing up, adults never shared.

They never shared that they might have a passion that is not their job. And if they did a job that wasn't their passion, their life that was something they didn't like.

And what I'm saying is there is a reality. I did it for years. And even though our job now is something we can't believe and we truly love, there are days when it's really hard.

But there are also times in my life when I hated my job, but I had things in my life outside of my job that I thoroughly enjoyed that fed my soul.

So you may have a lifelong passion bend that may be cars. And you may have, I'm just put it out there, you may have a small YouTube channel with a dedicated group of people that watch you and you make enough to buy yourself dinner every month.

You have a whole other job, but because of that side hustle, you get press cars and you drive them regularly. That might be enough. That might be where it ends up.

True. We have, we have counseled many, many people. I didn't expect this to go as long been, but it's striking a lot of things in my brain.

We have counseled many people in the nearly 20 years of doing this who have wanted to start out to do what we do, who have wanted to start YouTube channels. Some have been very successful.

Some are more successful than us, but others, it is, it's like the second side hustle. It's not even the first one.

It's like the one where they put a piece out every six months or so because they like doing it. And they found this car and they did this cool thing and they put this out and they're excited about it.

Both are valid.

Absolutely. And your involvement with the automotive industry and doing stuff with cars might look different than what we do.

I'm almost guaranteeing you it will look different because the media landscape will look different and your interests will change.

I have a friend named Jim Denison then and when I was in my 20s, he and I were chatting.

Jim is in the UK now. He married a British gallon and raised his family in the UK and we were talking one day and this will never leave me.

And it was a conversation about who you are as a person and the things you accomplish after age 45 or 50, somewhere in there.

You've had a good length of a career, you've worked for some companies at that point, you're professional and whatever you do at that point, you're an established person.

And it struck me because I'd never thought long-term. I always thought, right now, what am I doing and that's going to be the thing forever.

And he counseled me and said, all the people that we know, the celebrities that you know, when did you first become aware of them and what do you know them for?

Is it like Jack Nicholson? And you might know him for early in career work.

Maybe that's, you know, you might know him for some of that. But I think many people know him for his work probably after age 45, 50, somewhere in there.

And certainly, I always reference Paul Newman. I was astonished to find out that he didn't have an interest in driving and ever really start driving on track until age 48.

And then he got obsessed and then he got really good.

You're right. And then he decided, you know what, I'm a racing driver that just happens to screw around with filmmaking.

Yeah, Hollywood and all that stuff. But many people know him later in life as the actor Paul Newman, the philanthropist Paul Newman.

That's not how he thought of himself.

Astonishing for me to realize. Sean Connery is another example.

Okay, we've all seen the early bonds. But what a film career after all the bond films ended.

Good point. Yeah. He had an extensive film career that had nothing to do with the bond films. And he's known for a huge list of stuff that he was spectacular in.

Unless you are a professional athlete, and I mean, even go this far in Olympic athlete, most of the accomplishments of your life will be after you are quote unquote young after the age of 30.

Yeah. Yeah. And unless seriously, unless you're an Olympic athlete or in some cases, professional athlete in other areas,

this is when the real accomplishments of your life happen. I mean, hopefully you've read the story about Warren Buffett.

He's in his mid 90s now. And I just read that he recently retired as head of Berkshire Hathaway named Greg Able, his successor.

But Warren didn't start really investing until age 50. And here he is on the list of the world's billionaires. Like in the top 10, you know Warren Buffett.

You've heard that name. The company's he owns like, whoa, Warren Buffett made some good money. Yeah.

He didn't start investing till age 50. What? Yeah, it's crazy. You waited all this time. So people who had a life and a career and are known for the things later in life more.

So then early in life, the whole point then is I want your mind to be open to that and for you to know that that just because I didn't do it when I was 16.

I didn't do it when I was 26 or 36 or 46. And maybe you started a new career at 50 56.

Be open to that because it might not come around immediately in life. You might have a whole other career and suddenly you found it came back around full circle somehow.

That's what it's been for me. That's what it's been for you.

Things just kind of weirdly came back around.

The opportunity didn't reveal itself. And then when it did reveal itself, it might not be in the opportunity you expected it to be.

And you kind of have to go ready for yeah, there's a new yeah personally financially you might not have been ready for it and been able to take that on.

This is like a topic Friday. I don't know what we call it, but we're having a great time.

Appreciate it. That's a good one. It's very cool. It's great.

Here, we're trying to recommend cars for you. We're circling it back here. We're coming back.

Life choices for Ben. We're back to cars, but I swear.

I like your list. I went looking. And okay, fair enough, you don't want to GM products.

And you mentioned the Toyota so I will start there. We recently drove and have a piece on the brand new four runner coming out soon.

And that is a car truck. You need to have on your short list.

And you know what? It's not that boring to drive into wheel drive mode.

See, that's key. It is one of the tarmac. Yeah, it is one of the rare off-roaders that you can't because most off-roaders now pick your brand.

They run all wheel drive all the time. Unless you go pickups.

Now, I realize you've had a gladiator, so this has done it too. But unless you go pickup based stuff, most of the stuff, it runs all wheel drive all the time.

All the new land cruisers are this way. Yeah, the four runner can run in too high.

I mean, there's amazing how that does give you back some flavor, some interest in chucking it around.

I thought about the Toyota Sequoia. Since you mentioned, you were open to use and you have a growing brood, dogs, camping gear, a lot of stuff.

How about a Toyota Sequoia TRD Pro? That's large. It is big. It's great for forest service roads.

True. It's got a lot of power. But again, don't imagine that vehicle as your new 16-year-old in eight years as that's the car that they're going to start driving.

Yes, and also it's not like, wow, it's a back road. I'm glad I brought the Sequoia. You're glad you brought the family and the families in the Sequoia.

But the great fun back road is not going to be great in the Sequoia. I have to take the obvious turn here because Ben, you brought up something here where you left in a little PS here.

But you kind of think the Rubikayans amazing. Ben, I'm going to kind of agree with you. They're really cool.

You could definitely do a Cayenne and give it just a little lift like we did and you would have something back up a second.

A Cayenne exactly as it came from the factory would do everything you want to do. It would do forest service roads and it would be fun to drive on a normal road.

If your forest service roads end up needing a lot more clearance, now you can start doing lifts, but keep in mind, I did a three-inch lift.

You could do a one and a half. You don't have to go even as far as I choose. Yeah, 32-inch tires.

For sure. So what do you actually need? Because I keep coming back to you've been using the Palisade.

It's true. Okay. A Cayenne is more capable than a Palisade and it's more fun to drive.

Now, the standard... There's speed increases on forest service roads.

The standard lift and capability of a Cayenne is better than the Palisade, but I don't think it's better than the Gladiator.

So my question is, where in the spectrum of off-roading are you? Because you've taken the Palisade for most of it.

You prefer the Gladiator for the off-road, but you're looking for more fun to drive.

Base from the factory Cayenne. More fun to drive on road in both of those and capable for my guess is 90% of the off-roading you need to do.

Then do you even need to bother to make it more like my Rubikayan? I think you might not.

It's getting plates, lights, paint your wheels, a cool color. You could do all of the above.

Graphics. Yes. Again, we spent snarkle roughly around $6,000 to do that bump-up.

And you even mentioned you said, wait a minute, did I say you can get them in manual? You can.

The first gen's are available. There is a manual option. The second gen, I think it was only the first two years and it was the base car.

You could get an manual if you want that. Again, that'll increase the fun quotient as well.

I can't ignore the Cayenne. It is the obvious one here and you've even brought it up.

It might be the answer. Now, that is all we'll drive all the time and you wouldn't be buying a new one for your budget.

And then you ask the question of what's maintenance going to be. I think it'll be reliable, but when it needs stuff, they are expensive.

And would you rather have something new with a warranty versus a Porsche that's out of a warranty that you may want to go, should we lift this?

Which does lead me back to Forerunner. I do like the Forerunner quite a bit.

And you know what? I like your Honda choices too because that Trail Sport designation from Honda is trying to be Forerunner. They're trying to steal Forerunner sales.

Absolutely. They're trying to make a genuine off-roader version of those cars.

It's also my understanding, Will, that the Trail Sport version started out as a badge on the first year it came out.

It was a badge and some stitching.

It was a cool trim with nothing else behind that.

But subsequent years, they have done more and more so it might be worth looking at the Passport Trail Sport.

Is it big enough? Do you need to go pilot?

But the Passport Trail Sport trim, they're increasingly comparing it to Forerunners and doing some light rock crawling with it.

So something brand new, they're adding more and more off-road and photo drive kinds of features on that.

I went looking at Fords and I thought brand new, you could look at Expedition Tremors because that is...

Oh, interesting.

It's the big one. It's the biggest of Zoya.

33 is on that thing.

Cool. Lots of power.

But might be out of your budget.

What might be in budget?

Why are we not talking about Broncos?

I was wondering if you were going to bring it up.

I used Bronco at this point. They're out there now.

Yes.

For sure.

I think a Bronco could work with their very good off-road.

They're excellent.

I mean, different than a Wrangler, they're aimed at rock crawling and can certainly do that.

But we discovered they're more like an overlander, high-speed overlanding, plus rock crawling.

Well, yes.

It could be better suited.

Get something used.

And they drive better on the road than the Wranglers and gladiators of the world.

But yet they have that level of capability when you need it to.

I think that's a great idea.

Lastly, I can't believe I'm going to talk about Subaru Outbacks.

Really?

But I will mention it here only if you do like method wheels with some navies.

Oh, sure.

Just lean into the fact that it's off-roader.

I see that.

Outback and make it outbackish even more than it already is.

Okay.

All right.

Yeah.

Because we already say nothing outbacks and outback quite like an outback.

Yeah.

That's true.

Somehow it is the random actual station wagon that we actually buy.

It's not an SUV.

It's a wagon.

I think you would like the forerunner first.

Then unused Bronco, consider the Rubikayan building your own.

Or just yeah, just see if it'll work.

The kayons.

Yeah.

And last, way down here on the not wild, not cartish.

The Subaru Outback probably would do it with, I mean, not probably.

It would do everything he's talking about, of course.

Are you going to be happy with that, only you can decide.

But it's certainly within budget and can take on the forerunner service trails.

Kind of like nothing else too.

That's true.

Happy hunting, Will.

Ben.

Happy exploring.

Yes.

Agree.

You've got all this life in front of you.

The next 10 years of your life, 8 to 18.

Who knows what you're going to discover.

And I think I hope you embrace it.

It'll be cool.

Agree.

If you've got a debate like Will, like Ben.

Write to us every day.

Drive a TV at gmail.com.

Top two days.

Car conclusions.

Car debates for off-roaders.

For four service roads.

For track use.

For street use.

Can you carving?

Name it.

Bring it.

We're excited to read them all.

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James and Vancouver writes to us trying to balance needs and wants.

Aren't we all?

You know I'm going struggle.

He discovered two years ago something called a podcast.

What now?

It's the strangest name based on a product that no longer exists and nobody cares about anymore.

And now it's all video, even though it started as an audio medium and now it's all video.

It's the radio show that you get on demand on a device you can't get anymore that by the way is video.

It was just a portable hard drive.

I'm really confused, yeah.

Since birth James has been a car nut.

Naturally his first search was car show and he discovered the program.

Thank you for listening James.

He's a father of two children 11 and under and working at a power sports dealer.

Okay.

Sent a photo to us of his 2021 Ford Ranger tremor.

That's the four cylinder fuel economy seats foreign comfort commutes with ease and comfort.

Takes any amount of cargo in any terrain, any weather, anytime with a bike in the back in the bed.

He says from a motorcycle drop off to big campsite setup at the air show

to dropping kids off at school every morning the truck does it all.

Hey, Will and Ben how about you buy James's tremor maybe that's not a bad idea, but here's what's funny.

Then all of a sudden James's email takes quite a turn because he asks himself why would anyone need any other kind of vehicle.

Life is complete.

Everything is fine.

And then he started listening to this car debate show and went wait a minute.

Should I have something else and then he calls me out because he remembers very distinctly me making the comment.

That you know the average person needs a truck about twice a year to go to the dump.

And this suddenly just it burrowed into James's head and he started realizing, do I need this truck?

It does.

And look, you guys I can't overexpress that the the love affair paragraph prior about how perfect he thought the 2021 Ford Ranger tremor was for everything he ever needed.

But then he realized, do I even need this which is fascinating.

It opens the whole thing up.

Now James argues that he actually uses a pickup to its fullest potential every week.

He uses all four seats every day loading, hauling, moving almost weekly and using the bed.

That's much more than most James for sure.

It is.

Perhaps there's a way to replace the need with a want and then figure out the need after I like this logic.

This is the reverse of what everybody he calls you out.

He says, this is Paul logic because you always make this comment when people are tuning things.

You always call people out when they're tuning things because they just well I got on on on Reddit and I got on the forum.

And it said I should do this and your question for anybody tuning a car ever is what do you need it to do?

I've got to have a cold air intake and I will I've got to have the name the parts.

Yes, yes.

Figure out what you need it to do, what you actually wanted to do, what is your goal and work toward that.

So we clearly have influenced poor James.

Again, James is in Vancouver, the land of the Subaru and mild weather.

So he needs a vehicle that has four doors is new or nearly new with a focus on driver engagement.

Manual transmission is preferred.

This will be a daily with commute to work in light traffic.

His budget is up to $50,000 with a Paul limiter of $65,000.

So $65,000?

So $65,000.

I don't know why did you bother writing $50?

Perhaps a car plus a beater dump runner pickup.

Those exist.

See, see, this is the actual piece.

I have a friend here in Park City.

His wife hates that this is true.

He has an old 1980s Ford F250.

It's rusty.

It's beat down.

It's manual transmission.

It's got roll up windows.

It is an eyesore of a truck.

Ideal.

It's perfect.

I've driven it a couple times.

Legitimately, one time to the dump.

So were you like, it is brilliant.

This is the day.

No.

The time that I took that truck to the dump, I was like, this is an actual perfect synergy of

everything that why this truck exists.

Yeah.

On James' short list includes a Subaru WRX Civic SI Jetta GLI.

Make sure you take that one off right immediately.

We're not a big fan.

Yeah.

And an integrity type S.

Like that.

This thing is a four cylinder.

The only option for him, car history includes get this.

92 Mazda RX 7.

Those were cool.

A 2006 Jetta GLI.

That's why it's on the list.

The GLI has changed from then to now.

Yeah.

The 08 Rabbit 2.5 2011 Jetta TDI Ford F150 2018 Pasad GT.

And now the Ranger.

He's a lot of Volkswagen front wheel drives in there.

Yeah.

Well, James, thank you for writing.

I do like your short list.

But the thing that I love on there is the Acura Integra Type S.

Agreed.

Superb to drive.

It's very good.

Yes.

Excellent.

While you're at it, just see if you can drive a Civic Type R.

Just for the experience.

Just see.

For sure.

Can I move it back to back and just decide?

Yep.

I don't want to just say go get the Integra Type S even though I think you should just go get

an Integra Type S.

But go drive that Civic Type R.

It's worth it.

But what you're wanting, sedan, manual, four cylinders are most prevalent in that arena.

However, if you're going to spend 65 and you're feeling adventurous.

I'm wondering if you're going where I'm going.

Keep going.

Blackwing.

Yes.

Blackwing.

These are his blackwing.

CT4V blackwing.

Blackwing.

Yep.

That's the answer.

Manual, sedan, power.

Yep.

Classy.

It's, I think you should go explore this.

At least have a drive.

Agreed.

Because that is pretty much the only new one on the market of the recipe that you're looking for.

What you're asking for.

Yes.

Because it gets you away from four cylinders and it gets you away from front wheel drive.

Yes.

And then you could get some beater, get a while to come.

See, beater to come as are like 20 grand.

No, here's the answer.

When you actually need a dump run, you rent a truck.

Ooh.

Yeah.

See, now you're using logic, which I know.

I know.

Terrifying.

I mean, I love that you had that RX-7 experience.

You know, I want to suggest the GR-864, you're a super or something like that.

But still, four doors got it.

New.

New brand new.

Go get a, yes.

Yes.

Blackwing.

I'm stuck on it.

It really is exactly what he's asking for.

So it's hard to walk away from that.

I'm going to give you three others and they aren't as ideal for various reasons.

I have to bring it up.

Chevy SS.

Yeah.

Chevy SS is older.

That's the problem with it.

But the Chevy SS does everything you want it to do and it is under your budget.

A manual transmission.

Magnaride equipped.

Chevy SS is going to be 40, 45.

Maybe 50.

You're willing to go as high as 65.

That leaves you truck budget.

Ooh.

But the Chevy SS with a manual is going to be a fantastic execution of everything you're

looking for.

So I do have to bring that one up.

And then no one will be surprised to hear me say the Alpha Julia quad folio.

Well within your budget.

It's so good.

You would love that.

Truly, you would love that car.

It doesn't have a manual.

Yeah.

And it's not my favorite brakes ever.

But it is such a good car.

So I think, I think driving homework is in order here.

Yes.

The obvious choice is the one you brought up the Integra Type S.

Go drive one.

I agree with you Paul.

Drive the Type R Civic as well.

Just to see compare and contrast.

Just need to know.

Well, here's where it comes down to.

Do you see yourself in a Type R?

That's really what it comes down to.

Because anyone could drive the Type S accurate.

That works everybody.

Yeah.

After you reach a certain level of maturity, maybe in actual age on your license.

And maybe just in your head space.

You have to ask yourself, am I a Type R person?

Do I feel lucky?

Is that what I want to climb out of?

And in my case, I am that juvenile.

Yes.

I would.

Except for the fact that I would do the actual suspension module from the Type S in my Type R and be very happy.

True.

But are you that crazy person that wants to climb out of a Type R in your 50s?

I mean, as I would be and that's fine.

So do drive it and debate it.

Black wing gets it done new.

The Chevy SS gets it done used.

And the Alpha Quadrifolio gets it done, I guess, Italian without a manual.

Certainly does.

Okay.

What about an M2?

Three series.

The Genesis G72.5T.

No manual there.

What about an M2?

It's not four doors.

So it's not ideal.

Well, it's M4 is his answer.

M4.

Okay.

M4.

Sorry.

The M3 is the answer.

Well, M3.

M4, you could get a larger car.

Yeah, but the M4 is not going to get with four doors.

So it's M3 used four door.

Do you want to go back to the E90?

We do love that one.

That's well within your budget.

But it's older now.

You're maintaining it, which is a problem.

But then he's got leftover truck.

He's got leftover budget.

You're right.

Is that what we're calling out?

It's dump truck.

There's a dump truck or the truck for the dump.

But dump truck sounds better.

That suggests we're buying the real lives of full sized Tonka.

Okay.

It's a daily and those are E90s are really thirsty.

They're thirsty and they're going to take maintenance at this point.

That's the problem.

But a newer than that M3.

You could go just before the Beaver Tief era.

That is a fan.

What is that?

The F80?

That's a fantastic M3.

Yes, it is.

You could do that.

Yes, it is.

You'll get manual transmission.

That might be your BMW answer right there.

All right.

James, you've got some deciding to do.

When you write back with your car conclusion, send a photo.

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Great questions as always guys.

You guys bombarded us.

It's funny.

Paul posted just the GT3 dispenser of 9-11s in Germany.

And it is.

We make fun.

And then we get over there and realize, no, no, we're not exaggerated.

That's what's so crazy.

It's obligatory.

I just had to do it.

I had to get it off my chest.

And you guys post all that you responded.

I love it.

I'm going to start right here related to that.

And that is Eddie Murphy calling me out on Facebook and saying,

if I'm not drinking, if Todd is not drinking the 9-11 Kool-Aid,

then what's my go-to speed demon car for the ring?

Now, I want to say a couple of things here, Eddie.

I've said this before.

If I were buying a track car.

A road legal car that is a track car.

You really can't do better than the current GT3 RS.

There is so much car there.

There's a reason people buy them as their track car.

I get it.

I understand it.

I am not a 9-11 disciple.

So you're asking me what would be my choice.

And here's what I think it is.

It would be a late model.

Exceeds with the Camry V6 that's in my Amira.

Because the thing you have to also keep in mind about the ring,

is the ring is not a high-speed track.

It's got some high-speed sections, but you want something with fantastic handling

and ideally a little bit of downforce if you can get it.

But it has to be really agile.

Little agile things.

I'll give you a great example.

We recently drove the GR Yaris on Spa.

That car was not quite right for Spa.

It would be fun like crazy on the ring, though.

Yeah.

So you don't have to have the big heavy-duty stuff on the ring

to have an amazing time to put down an incredible lap.

So I'm going to say that late model exceeds with the V6

and then just give me some time.

On Instagram, Mike Steering column asks if America has a Corvette dispenser.

That's in Bowling Green.

I think Bowling Green.

But it's probably Kerbek Chevrolet and Atlantic City, New Jersey.

But of course, Mick Malkin Chevrolet in New Hampshire also claims

to be the number one Corvette dealer in the world.

There's a bunch of others too that are large.

Yeah.

Texas sells a decent amount as well.

Texas, yeah.

Bowling has a lot.

Definitely East Coast.

Less Stanford Chevy and Dearborn.

Yeah, there's a lot there.

Jeff is calling us out on Facebook.

I don't know if you saw this.

He says, all right.

Since we both have our dream cars, I have the Amira.

You have GT4 Cayman.

Since we both have our dream cars and we truly can't believe it.

What was the last car we each looked up on auto tempest for ourselves?

We shouldn't be looking up anything because we've accomplished it.

The peak has been realized.

What are you talking about?

Other GT4s.

Did you really?

Well, I just wanted to see compare the price I paid and just, you know,

what else is out there?

And did the trend continue?

A lot of GT4s without buckets and were any in my spec that I would have considered.

If I hadn't gotten that one, were there any others that I would have chosen now, you know, months later?

I mean, I wanted some others.

But then I was like, well, I have one.

Why would I think this?

It's really funny.

But it was other GT4s.

And then I go to a site that is dangerous.

Okay.

For me, it's Ryan Friedman motor cars.

Ryan Friedman in New York.

They have the most spectacular examples of incredible 911s and Ferrari's too.

And then meritpartners.com.

They get the best of the best of the best of the best.

You pick scary stuff.

You have a very different party.

I'm browsing.

Of course, I can't.

Jeff, I actually am incredibly guilty of this and unbelievably guilty of this.

I'm on a tempest all the time.

I've been on a tempest going, could I should I wouldn't it be interesting about two cars recently?

And I don't need either one.

And I am doing just fine.

Okay.

The first one is the Porsche Panamera Sport Turismo.

The actual good Ryan back.

Okay.

My wife and I have agreed, that's the car she'd drive.

If we got her out of a cayenne, that's the car she'd drive.

So if he went down to only one cayenne.

Thank you.

That was a deserved shot.

Here's a crazy thing.

The Rubikayan, now that it is the Rubikayan, is the one that will probably stay.

And we like our ehybrid 2017 just fine.

That is excellent.

Cayenne asked, we're very pleased with it.

And we don't have any financial business trading up right now.

But the car she would actually get is the Sport Turismo, the good wagon back version of the Panamera.

So I just keep watching what those prices do.

And they're still out of our reach.

But I just keep watching those prices.

The other one is, I'm just curious.

What are people selling current used BRZs and GRD 6s for?

What do they sell them for?

The used ones.

Like a couple of years old.

Because those are so good.

And so I mean, just if one just happened to be in the right price range just reappear.

You know, if I had a really good excuse for, you know, my son just turned 16.

But he really needs one of those.

We can't afford that either.

But that's what you're counting it under.

Exactly.

So I look for those as well.

Because I, this may, I know you're going to think I'm insane.

I know you are.

But in spite of having the cars that I do, I think I really want another 86 back in my life.

These are such good cars.

They're just on unapologetically good cars.

And I actually had this crazy thought the other day.

How much with the internet and the internet is not reality.

We know that how much with the internet believe I had lost my mind.

If I got rid of my Amira one day and got another 86.

I would think you'd lost your mind.

Possibly.

And I'm thrilled with the Amira.

And I love my Elise.

I'm not saying I'm dissatisfied at all.

In fact, I am resoundingly blessed to have those cars and two kinds.

It's ridiculous.

But 86s are great.

The BRZs are great.

Those are, that's a fantastic car.

Maybe you could just add one.

Keep all the low time.

Just add.

See, I just see it's just add.

I'm hanging on my fingernails right now.

Oh man, I can't add.

On Instagram, Jake's on a plane asks about a recent episode

where we were talking about slate, the new little EV truck.

And then we mentioned it would be an ideal for each manufacturer

to make a full range of vehicles.

Ooh.

This is more of a topic Tuesday, but I'll try to touch on this Jake.

If we were running a manufacturer, how many types of vehicles

would we make?

What kind of vehicles would they be and at what price points?

This is a long large.

This is a topic Tuesday, for sure.

I think we should come back to this, Jake, but definitely a range.

And you've heard me talk about it.

I keep thinking about Porsche and how much I want them

to bring back something small.

Sure.

Yeah.

Something that you, if you wanted to spec it out

and really go crazy on price, you could.

But then there was the lowest cost, lowest priced, like 50 grand.

Or 50 grand, we'll call it.

Because that's still in keeping with Porsche's being Porsche,

but still that's significantly way down there.

And it would just be mid-engine, a stick shift, and a steering wheel.

Bring it back to 550.

Yeah.

Something like that.

They wouldn't have to call it that.

They could jump with something new.

But just that, it doesn't have any tech.

Nothing else.

It meets crash safety standards.

And chairs and steering wheel.

And that would be it.

That would be cool.

That alone would be really interesting.

And so I see that for every manufacturer that kind of thinking

from low to high.

But not every manufacturer needs to make giant pickup trucks either.

I think we are maxed out on the size of pickup trucks at this point.

They're just too big.

I see even 250s with a long wheelbase.

Yeah.

My expedition is dwarfed.

It is amazing.

Dwarfed your expedition when you look at it by itself.

You think that's an amazingly large truck.

You get in it.

You think, why would anyone need more space than this?

And then you go park it by any modern truck.

And it is just like, who brought the little one?

It's crazy.

I don't believe it.

And I know there's plenty of contractors.

A lot of people that do have trucks.

I see even towing trailers.

Yeah.

And it's definitely necessary.

But I don't know that every car manufacturer needs to build something that big.

And so for the ones we're talking about, Jake,

it would be the biggest truck I would make would be like Ridgeline size.

That's still kind of big.

Sure.

The slate size and a Ridgeline size.

And then a handful of SUVs that would just be to satisfy, okay, I guess they're sales there.

Here's a crazy idea for manufacturers.

Why don't you make one SUV in each of the major sizes?

Most manufacturers make like four in each of the major sizes.

Yeah.

And they came out with the cake versions of that one and doubled the portfolio.

Just make one.

Yeah.

We need a little small five-seat egg need as I'm being generous.

We need a little small five-seat egg.

We need a medium-sized, cayenne-sized five-seat egg.

And we need a seven-seater, a legitimate seven-seater.

Thanks, Sequoia, Singtah, Thinktahos.

And we're done.

Yeah.

You don't need that.

You have covered SUVs.

You're finished.

Okay.

How about three of each?

Three sports cars?

Three SUVs?

Ooh, I like this.

Three trucks?

Is three trucks too many?

Three trucks is probably too many.

For a portfolio of nine?

Well, but maybe too old?

But you could do three if you have a slate or a maverick as your bottom truck.

You have the slate or maverick level bottom truck.

You have a middle truck and you have a behemoth.

Yes.

And just apply that three.

Three is a great number.

Rule of thirds applied to each category.

You have a little civic-sized sedan.

Yes, it is.

You have a medium-sized sedan and a big sedan.

It's the three-to-five and the seven.

But the ones from the 90s.

Yes.

It's the BMWs from the 90s.

Pretty much.

The three-to-five and the seven.

There's your sedan.

Why did we need four, six, eight, ten?

Well, you know, because we got to make coupe versions.

No, no.

Okay, so we'll have to come back to this.

The title on Instagram is asking, even though he knows that us driving ourselves around the ring is the best.

What would be our dream right along for the ring, both car and driver?

Oh.

And I've thought about this for a while because I have definitely written Ron Simons of the best example.

I've driven with people that are driving the ring at a level that I am not going to achieve.

And it's very impressive.

Yeah.

But this is going to sound weird.

It's impressive to the point that it's like watching a supercar sit at a car's and coffee.

I respect it.

I'm here seeing it.

But it doesn't relate.

So it isn't, it's not like laugh out loud fun for me.

It's like very impressive to be in that situation.

Which led me here.

And I'm going to initially go car and driver and then I'm going to expand it, but I've got car and driver.

You remember when Sabine Schmidt, rest in peace because she was amazing.

Remember when she drove the sprinter van around the ring?

I want to ride along in that.

Yeah.

That's good.

She and the van would be perfect now since she's no longer with us.

Somebody else that would do that because it doesn't make sense.

It doesn't work.

I think that would be laugh out loud funny.

Somebody that you know, like Sabine, that you know is such a good driver.

You're in good hands.

But the vehicle is so ill-suited that the vehicle is at the absolute edges of his capability.

That's good.

And all we do is hang on to the seatbelt for dear life and laugh.

That's the ride I want.

I like your version better because what I was thinking is our friend David Petard, who we interviewed last year.

That'd be a heck of a ride.

I want to ride in a GT2R.

Yes, GT3R.

That's really good.

David knows it.

Yeah, it would be amazing.

Because he knows the track so well.

The master class.

I want that.

But I also want him to drive me in a Renault Clio or something.

I like the van better, actually.

But just something a GRRS or something.

What are we doing?

Yes.

Totally not suited.

So we've got his expertise now applied to the basic, you know, like Kevin Astra in his race car.

And then Kevin Astra with Fiesta ST or something small, tiny not suited.

And no improvements.

Like stock tires.

Yes.

Absolutely.

You've got to go.

Like all the quarters.

You've got to drive totally differently because it doesn't do what you thought it did.

Yep.

I love it.

Madgear 82 has a cool question.

He said he recently watched Henry Catch Pohl's video on the Honda NSXR.

And Henry does great work.

His stuff is always really impressive.

He's a great driver.

He's a really good presenter.

I like his stuff a lot.

And he was intrigued, Matt was, to hear Henry talking about the fact that it isn't a

spec sheet drive.

It's not that impressive in numbers.

And he's heard us say the same kind of thing.

And that reminded him and Henry was talking about the Japanese quote-unquote gentleman's agreement

at the time where nothing had more than 270 horsepower, which isn't true, actually.

But there was an agreement that we're not going to make anything that has more than that.

That's a number.

It's a number.

It's what we actually did.

But if you look at that though, at that era, we're talking about the 90s super hits.

The RX-7, the 300 ZX twin turbo like I had, the beloved Mark IV Supra and the NSX,

all technically had a little more than 276, but they didn't have like 400.

They came out at a round 300 horsepower, which leads him to his question.

What would our modern day version of that be?

Where we'd like a car to not max what?

And who could make great cars for what?

His pitch is no more than 3,100 pounds and no more power than 420.

I like that a lot, Matt.

I'm aware of the fact that cars are much heavier than they used to be, much to my chagrin.

So I'm going to expand you a little bit.

I think the cap should be, if it's a sports car, 3,200 pounds and no more than 450 horsepower.

If everybody was trying to hit those numbers, I think we'd see some unbelievable cars.

Because think of the stuff that wipes away, by the way.

The C8 doesn't make it.

An nominal car, but it doesn't make it.

Some Porsche's don't make it.

Yeah.

See what I'm saying?

Yeah.

The Supra's gone?

Too heavy.

Ooh.

BMW's are all off the map.

Right?

Right.

So what cars would that create?

Look, I'd love to be the guy to say, 2,500 pounds and 250 horsepower, but that world's

not happening.

I know.

400 pounds, 450 horsepower.

Those are your upper limits.

Go make something cool.

That's really good.

Over on Facebook, Kirk Meyer asks, if there's a car that does or could get away with having

so many variants or customizable features, from a factory equivalent to the 9.11.

Which is all like 24 variants at this point, something like that.

It's in the mid-20s.

Nothing can touch the variants that they've come up with.

It's unbelievable.

But it's not a car, and it doesn't come close, but the only thing I can think of is the F-150.

There's only eight current new trim levels, the XL, the STX, XLT, the trimmer, Lariat, King

Ranch, Platinum, and Raptor.

True.

And then if you consider the fact that the 250s and 350s are kind of variants of the F-150,

we might get there.

If we can include those, then we're actually talking.

Because if we can just do F-series, because you could claim, well, the 9.11, we're cutting

the roof off and having to re-engineer the structure a little bit, well, the F-150, we're expanding

that a little.

Can we get away with all the F-series trucks only up to F-350?

Because of course, then there's the commercial grade, which is 450 on up to 750, I think.

But just those, if you can give me that, then I can get close with an F-150, but cars?

Oh, speaking of Porsche and trying to translate Porsche to other brands, Ted Adam Green has this

question on Facebook.

And while I think it's a good question for you, Paul, I'm going to take it as the non-Porsche

fans and see if I can just cut through the madness, because Ted is saying he understands

the tiers and models of Corvette and Mustang, but he cannot figure out Porsche.

So can we please try to explain the model designations and how on earth it works?

He's congratulating you on your GT4 and he should, because it's a phenomenal car.

Ted, I'm going to give you the bassist version of this, but I'm going to caveat it one major

way.

Not every car in the lineup has all the trims I'm going to list.

Okay.

trims I'm going to list do have a standard hierarchy at Porsche.

You have car, pick your car, Cayenne, Cayman, Tycon, just name.

Nothing else?

No designation?

That's the bass one.

Hmm.

The one above that is the S. So it's that super.

Okay.

The name with the S is the super version.

Now, by the way, I'm not going to cover all 24, whatever trims of the 9.11.

It's not happening.

I'm just coming with the base designations.

So the base is just name.

The S is the super version.

There's a greatest hits version about the super versions like they looked at the super

version and they said, what's the best way to spec that we're going to make a greatest

hits version?

That's why I, how I remember, GTS.

It's the greatest hits.

Okay.

All right.

It's the name with GTS.

It's above S.

It's the greatest hits version.

Tactically it means grand touring.

I know.

But the greatest hit.

I'm just trying to simplify it.

Great test.

Exactly.

It's the greatest.

It's just the greatest.

All right.

There you go.

Above that is the turbo.

Now, I'm going to acknowledge in most of Porsche's lineup, there may be turbos that didn't

have a turbo designation, but just go with me.

Just follow along with the class.

Turbo is faster, more and better than the GTS, also quite a bit more expensive.

But you know what's better than a turbo?

Turbo with an S behind it.

Turbo S.

Turbo super.

Okay.

So, quick review.

Base S.

GTS.

Turbo.

Turbo S.

This is the basic hierarchy.

We can go nuts, but that's the basic hierarchy of their all of their lineup.

Now, I'm going to give you one offshoot and one offshoot only G.T.

Yes.

That means track version.

Yes.

Figure better, more and focused for track.

Often they have some tech taken out and other tech put in, lots of wings, lots of craziness.

In the Cayman world, it's G.T. 4 and the Porsche world is either G.T. 2 or G.T. 3.

Don't bother Ted.

It doesn't matter.

It's fine.

You're okay.

But the G.T. is just, we went tracking now.

Okay.

That's the variant.

But again, quick review.

Base S.

GTS.

Turbo.

Turbo S.

That's roughly the hierarchy at Porsche.

Now, let's talk about that.

No, I'm kidding.

I'm kidding.

Where's R?

There's ST.

There's Targa.

Exactly.

We can go crazy.

We'll drive or we'll drive.

No.

Thank you, guys, for all your questions.

We really appreciate it.

There's some others we will say for next time, but we sure appreciate all your topic

Tuesdays.

Like I said, the car conclusions are great, and of course the car debates are always

looking forward to next time.

Cheers, everyone.

995: The Whole Family Included, The Fight Between Needs And Wants, Learning Porsche Models

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