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Cameras & Consequences
About this episode
Cameras & Consequences dives into the controversial use of traffic cameras and their implications on due process. Host Dave Polach expresses his disdain for automated ticketing systems, arguing they undermine the right to face one's accuser. The episode explores a current lawsuit challenging the legality of speed cameras, highlighting issues of fairness and accountability. Additionally, the discussion touches on the evolving role of technology in law enforcement and insurance, including how apps track driving behavior for potential insurance discounts. The conversation is both thought-provoking and relatable for anyone who has dealt with traffic violations.
Topics:
traffic cameras
due process
government overreach
speeding tickets
insurance tracking
court system
automated systems
technology in law enforcement
Cars:
Chevrolet Tracker
Join us on "Cameras & Consequences" as we talk about the controversy surrounding red light speed cameras and a court case challenging their constitutionality. We also tackle the frustration of facing the justice system where you often feel guilty until proven innocent. Don't miss this eye-opening episode on Let's Talk Cars Radio!
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Chevrolet Tracker
"...chance that one of those apps has a track, a data tracker to it that would have been tracking my driving on..."
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Dave Let's Talkcarsradio dot com. Now here's the host of Let's Talk Cars Radio,
Dave Polage. Happy Saturday, America. You're listen Let's Talk Cars Radio
and Freedom Radio. I'm your host, Big DAVP hangout with Camera Chaos and
AVB. Hey, it is a great day for a radio show. It
should be a good day for a car show wherever you're at, depending where you're at and how the weather is. I was kind of looking at some
of the weather that was kind of coming in in some of the areas for the weekend. So hopefully where you guys are at, the weather is held
out. Hey, I'm gonna jump right into it cause I think it's kind
of funny. This week. You know, it's like certain weeks you got
a bunch of car news, and some weeks you don't have any car news.
But this week's been kind of interesting for me. I've been involved in
a bunch of different conversations that rolled back around that kind of I'm gonna say they tag in a little bit on conversations we've had. But it's funny how
it's kind of bridged the gap. So the very first thing I want to
really kind of jump into is, so you guys know, and we were talking about before we came out of the air, Nathaniel Cameron and I were talking it's I don't like overreach, And what I mean is like government overreach, right, Like, if you guys listen to the show long enough, you guys will know that one. It's one of my biggest pet peeves because
I just feel that there's no way for us on this side of things to ever be right. It's like we're just always kind of being told like,
yeah, you know, I mean, it's I feel like to a certain degree, we've talked it to death, right, But what's different this week is it's funny how it's come kind of full circle. So if you guys.
Remember, I think I can't remember what episode it was, but we did an episode a while back where we talked about cameras and all that kind of stuff out on the road and issuing tickets. And you guys know that
I'm not a huge fan of cameras or any type of detection equipment that's used against you. And the biggest reason why is maybe I'm just getting old.
I don't know. I feel that you should be able to face your accuser,
right, so if you get you know, if you're going to get a ticket, I don't want a machine give me a ticket. It should
be and I hate to say it this way, but it's like one of those you know I think I refer to it in the past, is catch me if you can. Either you caught me or you didn't. You know
what I mean. If you didn't catch me, I don't think I should
get a ticket. I don't think I don't think I came should send me
a ticket. That's how I feel about when they like hide, because I'm
always like, well, if I'm in public, you should be kind of like you know, in this site, I should want to see you.
It's funny that you said because I swear that back in the day there was something and camera might be able to find it for us, but there was something where that if you were going to get the car had to be visible.
They couldn't like hide to give you a ticket like they physically. Maybe
it's just certain states that had that. I don't know, or maybe I
just dreamt it, or I saw waying too many car movies when I was a kid and believed it. I don't. I thought there was something to
that where they couldn't. You know, that's the reason why you always saw
like police cars would like the tip of their nose out and stuff like that, so they weren't, you know, I don't know, place play fair.
Maybe that's what you know. It's like, I feel like you should
be playing fair. But it's funny. So this week in conversation, cameras
the tickets you have started to come into conversation, and I touched on it before that. I really thought that there would be a pushback on this at
some point in time because of the money that's UH generated right through tickets with camera equipment, and on top of that, most of the equipment is not ran by your local city government, right it's a secondary source that's controlling all of it and then provides the information to the city, and then the city prosecutes you accordingly, without any due process and just gives you, you know, a ticket and you got to pay it. And it goes against everything.
Rather, you guys believe this is right or not is irrelevant to a certain degree. Right, Rather, I believe it's right or wrong is irrelevant
because it's it's happening. What isn't irrelevant is the fact that it goes against
the amendments. Right, So if you take a look at it, so,
and there's a there's a case right this second that's being brought up that it's against our sixth Amendment. We have the right to face our accusers,
and if the accuser happens to be a machine, well then that kind of null and voids the whole process of how that works. Yeah. So,
and I definitely saw that article where it's actually it's proved up in our local town, Chesapeake, where it's actually an attorney in Chesapeake that's filing the lawsuit against the speed camera saying that they basically aren't fair because it's not the police officer that's really pulling it it's not, like I said, it's not even city equipment. On top of they're basically just saying, hey, you're guilty
one hundred hours and here's the ticket by the way, right absolutely, and see like I said, and the equipment. The problem with that is is,
like I said, the equipment is usually monitored, service and everything by an outside source, and then they go ahead and produce the information and then the city, you know, pursues it from there. It's I have not
liked you guys from the I think for the first time. So there was
I don't know how many, it's got to be twenty years ago. Like
the first time. They used to have a police car. You just sit
on the side of the road and they had a camera equipment and everything ran off the battery in the trunk right the police car, so they'd park it on the freeway and then that would catch you when you spend. Yeah,
And I was like, h and I remember everydy talking about it, and I thought I just thought it was iky. Then I was like, so
wait a minute, Like they don't have to like physically see me do it anymore. They can just catch me on camera and say here's a tick.
I just I hate that this affair advantage. And I'm not saying go out
and speed or anything like. That's not that's not the conversation I'm having.
Another thing I thought was interesting that the attorney pointed out and everything was what's the one thing we ask an officer when we're speeding? Well, when's the
last time your radar was calibrating? Right? And they's on that's not a
good question because but so it opens wid they talk about in this court case that this attorney's presenting is well, with the calibration records for these speed cameras in our in our local town and in Suffolk. By the way, the
calibration records aren't even with the police records. It's with the third party company
that's in Maryland. So basically the way that these speed cameras work is when
they issue a ticket and you pay it, it goes to a state in Maryland for our hometown. Right now, it's going to a third party state
in Maryland, and then Maryland. Maryland is a third party state, Maryland
just to go in Maryland, right, No, it's going to a third party company, Yeah, a third in the state of going to a third party company in the state of Maryland when you pay that bill, and then they pay the city of Chesapeake or the city of something. Think about it.
So, all right, this is no different than you guys have heard me talk about. I don't like the fact I'm not a big fan of
radar guns and all that kind of stuff because of the whole calibration side of things. And it's it's been proven several times that you can manipulate those systems
if you know how, because if you use it enough, anything that you use enough, you can manipulate. Just like I said, you know this
show that you can manipulate sobriety tests and stuff, and so that's been proven, like if you if you get given that test enough, you know how to get a false positive. Stuff things like that. I mean, you
know I always question me and not the guy next to me. Well okay,
and you can't really prove that because it doesn't save license to me.
If you guys remember so the one that irritated me still irritated by it, don't wait to answer his question real quick, and somebody answered me if if you guys know, but didn't it take a picture of your license point when they scan when they hit you with a laser. Doesn't it take a photo
of your license? I don't think. I think so. I can tell
you that when I got pulled over the last time, and I knew I would like to say, this is tobog and I knew it wasn't speeding, but I went and did some research on it, I think, I told you. And it shoots within a pinpoint accuracy pretty close, right, But
then it has so a it Also the problem for me is, yes, it has really good aggercy as far as what it hits, but somebody has to point that. Okay, that has to be pointed by man. And
then also there was a deficiency within the system that if a larger object is moving at a faster speed in the background, that a lot of times it will grab the speed of that and not the speed of what you pointed at.
Have you ever seen somebody retombrate one of those guns. No, I've
seen a video, no reason, just seeing an officer and apparently apparently they're chime bells that they pull out and then they tap and they set in front of the radar. Is like a tuning fork, Yeah, like a shooting
fork, and that's how they set. What if the frequency was wrong.
In a minute, you're sitting that with just a frequency, like what if somebody was playing a banjo in the background. Right, Yes, I'm just
I don't like the fact that we okay this, I'm gonna take it in a different, little different direction. It's just it's no different than how I
feel about going to court and you guys heard me talk about this and the officer tells his side of the story. I don't even tell my side of
the story. First he does, and then it always ends with do you
have anything to add to that? As if I'm presumed guild stage better.
I just think there's a better way to do it. They are, They
are absolutely one. They are set in the stage for the fact that every
time you go to court. You guys know you've heard me talked this.
It bothers me that every time you go to court that the officer speaks, he tells this side of the story, and literally the judges just wants to be done with it because history before right, Well he was not because you're hearing it from an officer of the law, right, So they just pursume the officer law has no reason to lie. Now we've proven so would you
time and time again that this happens. They just I mean, okay,
go ahead. So would you prefer an AI to decide what your punishment was?
Oh my god, why are you going with the AI? What we
were talking about a little bit of AI? So would you, like,
would you think that you know, it'd be a fair you know, if if you could give it all the information, if you could give like a tide right right, and there's no motion to it, right, if you could give it all the information. But here's the problem. So then people
are gonna say, sometimes some people need some people needed sympathetic and emotions.
And that's what I say. So you can't like it's the best of both
worlds. Can you have it both? It's I here's I just feel like
courses says, become a machine. I feel like the course system has become
a machine when it comes to traffic. Here's the thing. So the problem
with it is in our state, guys, for the people listening outside of Virginia area, traffic is like in your guys estate, like a serious offense.
Okay, Like so like if you did, like you got picked up for drugs and stuff like that, like some of the punishments for traffic in this state are worse than hand hand down judgments in other states for a lot bigger crimes. That's the reason why it's a big that's the reason why it's
a big driving record. Really does you know, carry on whatever you do,
it does. And but my thing about it is, it is like
when you go to court and they come in with that binder and they flip it open there, you know, and it's like all their notes and it's like, when did you have time to write notes? Right? Like,
you didn't write any notes that when we were on the side of the street.
You're over here, like, well he was a lane one and you cut all the way. Here's here's what I believe. Okay, this,
this is this is my belief. All y'all, I'm gonna say, I'm
gonna go I'm gonna side with the say. Almost everybody listens to this show,
he's probably been in traffic court once or twice in their life. Okay,
maybe not, maybe one of the lucky ones. But if a police
officer sits somewhere on a regular basis, everything applies to you. Does that
make sense? It's not you, but everything applies he is said in that
position of time, he goes whether the subject entered coming off from the right hand side, merged over two lanes blah blah blah blah blah in your case written script, because that's how he pulled over everybody in his life right at that area, you know what I mean. So he's just repeating the same
thing. Really good question. I wonder if you could pull up traffic offenses
and see what with both the hard with A descriptions match each other. You
know, like how many descriptions I'm saying if a police officer and like, look, this is not bagging on police officer. I'm just saying this is
just reality for me. And if a police officer sits at the same place
all the time, right, and he hands out thirty tickets from that particular intersection, every story's gonna be the exact same thing, right, because he's looking for that action that pull you over on he knows you, So he just insert insert your model car here into the story. That's all I'm saying.
All right. So, like like when you were saying, where the
officer gets to talk first, right, right, I don't understand Another thing is well, they just literally called the officer up, and they're like, all right, let's call this first officer up, get all of his court cases out right way. And it's like, all right. So you got
multiple people coming up, around and around and around, and I understand they did have an offense. They were doing what the same person is sitting on
the right side, still getting to talk first, still getting to talk first, And it's like, how is that fair? How is that due process?
I mean, how about due process? So I tell what happened.
You know, you do not stage for you, but I do not set for you to go no, sir. And then he goes, don't that's
what the stage does, the stage when I speak first and I tell, and then he had and then he has to come up with his rebuttals to see the stage better. But even in that case, right, it's not
really going to change probably the outcome. Like I said, they assume you're
guilty. You're there. They assume you're guilty because it was an officer who
wrote you the ticket. Now, so if I was I don't know,
king of and you know what I mean, and that was a real thing, and I got to go to court. Just do I weigh higher than
him? That Okay, So do you think we could solve this if we
had a third person, if we had a a middleman that was meant to handle all the court cases. Think about that. Okay, i'mbout to think
about that for a sec. I gotta take quick rush of break. I
will answer that when I come back, because you can see this one bothers me. But I get it. I understand why people are up and roar
about it. So hold tight. I'll be right back. You're listening to
Dave Pilach on Let's Talk Cars Radio. Dave will be right back. Nobody
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zero zero three. That's seven five, seven four six four one thousand and
three. Welcome back to Let's Talk Cars Radio. You're automotive specialist. Now
back to your host Dave Polach. Hey, guys, welcome back. So
before we went to commercial break, we were actually talking about an idea that I think I don't know, maybe we entertain it by we don't. So
if you didn't catch for a segment we talk about like when you go into court and stuff, and then how that came around with this whole new thing about cameras and how they kind of step all over our you know, rights really is what they do. It's just so if you go to court,
and I we were talking about when you're in court that when you stand up there, you you kind of feel like the stage is already set right, like you just know you're guilty. You're just I don't even know why you
even showed up because you don't feel like you can get out of it unless let messed up on paper or something else like that. You're really not getting
out of a ticket nowadays. So and if they mark you as a female,
it doesn't count. I tried, I promise. I forgot about that.
Cameron got a ticket and they marked them as a female. And even
that mess up on the paper right here, Like we'll fix that right here, John said, They're like, and you're here because as far as I'm concerned, if you couldn't figure out, like when you're filling out my paperwork, how to fill that part out right, like I think everything I should just be throwing out the window. We're done. It didn't dates you used
to get you out, like if they messed dates up and stuff like that, that that would definitely get you agree that it should be like one hundred percent completed. It should be you know, full proof, if you're gonna
give me right, if you're gonna give me right. I was saying,
like, look, I will wholeheartedly tell you I have gotten tickets that I deserve and I took them like a man. That's not what we're talking about
here. I'm talking when you know, first of all, I don't think
anybody well they do, but I don't think real people. I don't know
how to say that. Maybe every day basis not go to court to go
fight a ticket they think they didn't. You know, the usually you go
because you feel like you've been unjust right most of the time. Maybe there
are times you pay. There's those people that are gonna go and just wing
it, try to see if they can get out of it. I'm sure,
but for the most part, like I'm not wasting my time. I'll
be the first want to tell you if I don't think if I think I'm guilty, I'm okay. You got me. You know you guys even heard
me tell stories in there at the window. I'm like, you got me,
Like, I mean, it is what it is. You got me,
know what I mean. But when I feel like you haven't I found
people, That's where maybe Cameron had a good idea. An arbitrator comes in.
So what I mean, like everybody goes, wasn't that what a lawyer is? No, that's what I'm talking about. I'm not on your side
because you don't know the law like that. That's the lawyer is. But
an arbitrator is somebody who hears all the facts other than the judge and makes his own and then comes up with his own. He doesn't work for the
city, he doesn't work for the state. Fact he just right. He
just gives the extra and put based on an unbiased opinion. Maybe I don't
do. I think it's a great idea, dude. I'd pay a fee
for it. I would totally want a fee. I just wanted somebody that's
there. But if the if the court was like, well there's a fee
for it, I'd be like, sign me. Do you got you guys
sit on the bench and going okay, so there's a you have a forty dollars arbitrator option would you like to activate that now you know what I mean.
But there's nothing making them, you know, have to. I mean,
listen to the arbitration. Two thirds vote like you you think you're not
guilty, justin as you're a guilty vision. No, I I did hear
I okay. I've been to court a lot of times. A lot of
times. Now keep in mind, I don't mean that, as you guys
know. Up until ray slide, I hadn't had tickets for twenty five years.
So but I have been okay. So when I was in the military,
I had to go. In the military, you had to like go
with people to make sure they didn't get that they're gonna get locked up while they're in the command. So I had to set through a lot of that
stuff. I've gone with friends, you know. I don't know if you
call that emotional support. I don't know. The house in the car with
them, you know what I mean? Uh, with the boys, obviously,
they got pulled over a bunch of different times when they were, you know, younger. I had to go with them. So I've been in
court a lot of times. So I've watched the case to go down.
On top of that, in a non traffic way. I used to have
to go to court a lot for a job I did, so I got to sit through a lot of cases and well, just watch how the hammer fell in a lot of different people's situations, right, And I gotta be honest with you, it didn't farewell hardly ever for the person on that on that side of it, you know what I mean. I just and I
think that maybe that's what made me and still probably does make me a little bit jaded by the process. I just believe that you go in the current
situation, it's equipment got you, cameras got you, whatever it is, laser you name, it is got you. Somebody tells their side of the
story, which is a police officer, and then they look at you and go, would do you have anything to add before I go ahead and make my judgment. You already as soon as you say it that way to me,
you've already even age your judgment, Like like who we can't as when they say that to me, I just really wanted to be like, well, apparently not judge like I said, And I'm like, but here's the thing, Like, and you guys heard me say, like I'm not I'm not on the kick of you know, I think all police officers are bad.
I think judges are bad. That's That's not what I'm talking about.
I'm talking about just leveling the playing field a little bit, and I just feel that it's not. With technology continuing to grow. Okay, we're obviously
going to start using more AI technology to give tickets all the different kind of stuff. At some point something has to get because when you go and judge
just assumes you're guilty, and anybody tells me I'm wrong, I'm not.
I'm said through enough of this stuff that you're just guilty. You were there
just for the ride, like for him to let you relive the nightmare why he pulled you over. And then the judge look at you and go,
you got anything to add to that? And like something, well, I
do, hold on right if you you guys didn't hear when this last time that I got pulled over, and I, like I said, I'm probably still very bitter about it. I'm not gonna lie because I just knew I
didn't do anything wrong. I was probably this close to probably going to jail
for contempt at court because that's the way that that was going. And that's
exactly I knew it, I felt it. It surely enough went that way,
and I was agitated by time. It was by time he was like
to have anything to add to that? Yeah, well, of course I
kN I wouldn't be standing here if I didn't have anything to add to it.
I would have just painted. And what I mean by that was I
think I told you, guys, they gave the option to people if in the very beginning they said, anybody here who would like to have their ticket expunged or whatever and is willing to go to a driving class, go ahead and stand on this line right the second, and as long as you sign and agree to go to a driving course, they let your ticket. They
dropped your ticket. I didn't go in that line. Why because I knew
I'm get guilty, and I had tons of evidence to proved that I wasn't.
That's a good point to me. So and that was the point that
I made in court. I was like Judge, if I truly thought,
truly he thought I was guilty of what I'm being accused of, don't you stood in that line. I would have went and got that line. I
gotta take what a four hour online course a five hour online course because you can take it online now, by guys, if you didn't know, you don't have to go sit in that classroom all day like you used to have to. You could take it online. I would have gladly did that to
keep my perfect record. But I knew I wasn't guilty and had the burden
of proof with me to proof that I wasn't. And you, guys,
go with you if you if your proof was great, you would you know, you wouldn't have got taken. No, my burden of proof, as
I told you, guys, was recognized, could not be recognized in court because it was based on a self driving car and that's not recognized in the state of Virginia yet, so they couldn't even hear my burden of proof.
It was even even though I said it, he corrected me and told me he can't even listen to my burden approof because there's no case law on it yet to allow allow him to make a judgment one way or the other.
So I really feel like I just got my butt handed to me for no reason at all. And then at that point in time, that's when I
really started thinking about there has to be a better way. I was never
this serious about thinking there needs to be a better way until recently. Now
it really bods because like I'm like, just I wonder how many people have fallen into that situation where I don't know to talk about you. I get
stuff in you guys all the time. Oh man, they got me to
do, and a lot of you tell me your stories and some of your stories, and I go, yeah, you deserve your ticket. Unfortunately,
guys, I'm like, yeah, you deserve that ticket. That's not my
problem. And I'm not trying to say I'm special. I didn't. I
just I wasn't speeding and the car wasn't speeding, and the car knows it wasn't speeding. But there was no way and once I got to court,
there was no way to defend myself. And maybe that's where, like I
said, maybe an arbitrator does come in handy. Maybe it is. It's
two thirds the scanners should be legal, so because that kind of gives you a somewhat of a fair advantage, right, I mean, you obviously are sitting there all day, nothing better to do than you know, look for look for me. Yeah, or you want to give it, you want
to give it me. Well, if you're looking at you know, for
a sound, or you're looking for you know, you have all these indicators that you're looking for to kind of like, you know, prove you know a scanner or radartecker okay, radiartech Okay, all right, I was like scann like you listen to the traffic what they're saying. You know, I'm
talking about the rap star. I got you, all right. I'm not
gonna say I believe you should have one or shouldn't have one. I'm just
saying I'm all for level of the playing field. But you guys know I've
talked about having them and hiding them and ways to take my part and install them in the car in a better way so they can't be found. I
mean, I'm not gonna say I'm not like, I'm not against rat archtector.
I just feel, you know, I don't know. It's a cat
and mouse game has been going on since the invention of car, and I don't think the cat and mouse game is ever gonna go away. Cat's winning
right now, right right, the cat's definitely winning. And even if the
cat didn't win, when he gets to court, he's definitely got the upper edge on you because they just assume that you're guilty. And it's like that
over and over and over again. Like I said, I I've gone to
a lot of cases and they it's forbatum. I mean like you just know
as soon as you hear certain things, you know it's gonna go to dun't dun't to dunk And it's like guilty, you know what I mean, Like you just know. Well, now I just like to wrap it back to
our first thing. Now it's like, now you're not even going to court.
All these machines just send you a ticket and expect you to pay your guilty, right so, and they give you the option to go to court.
But then they just bring a TV out and they're like, well watch this you serve well no, no, no, no, how about the ones we're like where you don't stop when you don't stop at the at the turn red bar and they send you a picture yourself. Have you guys watched
how many of those have been wrong? Like how many people paid it because
they just don't want to be deal with it, but it's actually wrong.
They I want to keep watch this whole I watched this whole thing about you tell all like people California, how many people? Wait, how many people
have paid it? And they're not even the ones driving the car? Well
that see, that's the problem. That's a whole other thing that I it
goes back to where you get it. And then it's like, well I
was I wasn't even that was my car, but I wasn't even driving out that. How are you going to give me the ticket for it? I
mean like, so there's there's that, And that's where we talked about.
With self driving cars that come around, it's gonna be one of those if you own it, you're responsible. Be careful who you own your stuff to.
I guess if they're not going to do right by it. But I'm
talking about I watched a whole thing where people had been people over and over again at certainly this one intersection was what they were concentrated on. Had paid
the ticket for making a turn and not coming to complete stop. But the
camera would take the picture as the car was rolling and wouldn't if they went just past that and stopped because you had to see up and around the corner.
You didn't count that right, right, And people have just been paying it and paying it and paying it and paying it and finally some may challenge it, and they they showed the video and he's like and even the judge was like to see, He's like, wait for it. He's like,
I did stop. See you had to get past where the cars pull up
on the thing to get be able to see past them, so you had to roll up further so they don't catch it. And people are paying that
right, generating money. Oh right, you know all that money. Right.
So it's just it's one of those things where, like I said, I'm not one of those I'm you guys have listened to the show enough.
I'm not one of those people that get on the huge bandwagon of oh this system is rigged. That's not what I'm talking about here, guys. When
I'm talking about I just think there needs to be a better way. Uh
And may maybe because it finally really truly affected me, He's reason why I have that opinion. I don't know, you guys, tell me what you
guys think. Not trying to rant. I'm just saying, I gotta take
quick rush of break when we come back. I got some more for you
guys. What's that app doing for you or what is it not doing that's
what you guys are going on. No, it's a whole tight I'll be
right back. You're listening to Dave Palatch on Let's Talk Cars Radio. Dave.
We'll be right back. Hey, Dave, What? Hey, Dave
what? I've got a secret? What are you twelve? No, I'm
just excited to announce ce Liberty Transmission is headed to the future him by a Dolorean. Did you know? But we did get a brand new building.
That's right, people, Liberty Transmission is moving to thirty forty one Holland Road to better serve the community. Check out our website for updates, or give
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That's right, qu three three thirty one thirty one. And remember my name
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Talk Cars Radio. So for the last two years, if you listen to
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one four. JF. Witlow and Sons Incorporated. Welcome back to Let's Talk
Cars Radio. You're automotive specialist. Now back to your host, Dave Pilach.
Hey, guys, welcome back. Hey. So before I went to
commercial break, I was telling you guys about apps. Right, you guys
know we've talked about apps and cars and subscription fees and all that great stuff.
Well, guess what that has nothing to do with any of this.
So I got into conversation this week because it's in the news. All right,
let me your favorite app? What's your favorite app? Favorite app?
Us? Right? The second? What's your favorite at I want to have
one? Guess I mean you gotta have one. I mean I only do
ass I mean Google and probably you two, okay, and more, you know, looking up news, you know, very in the news, your news appana. I don't have a news app. I just kind of,
you know, go through Google and stuff, research and stuff, you know, hot topics. Okay, Cameron, your favorite app? Professional answer?
Facebook? Business? Mean' sure? All right? So what a favorite app?
Though? All right? So if you have every we all have apps
on our phone, right, and we will have apps, not even me, who's not a big phone person. I got tons of ads on my
phone. Most of my stuff is creator related and things like that, and
editing software and stuff that my phone, so I could do it while I'm on the fly, but it's still not right. I had to get the
app. What if I told you that, going back as far as like
twenty thirteen, there was a purpose for apps that you guys would never think about. It would never come to mind a purpose for an app. Twenty
thirteen, there was a purpose for an app, purpose right that you guys would have never thought to keep us attached to the phones. Nope, nope.
So well maybe to a certain degree, right, I mean there are tracking What if I told you hypothetically that I come out with a really cool game and all you guys are playing it, pick one of the ones I don't I don't have, Like let's say it was Farmville or like, you know, just like trying to think all the old ones. I don't know
if that game's even around anymore, But just pick a game that you see tele Okay, like right, right, this is pretty properly and that app.
Let's just say hypothetically, I'm not and that's one of them. Let's
just say hypothetically, that app was designed by somebody. You would never do
a million years even believe that somebody invested the money to let that app exists.
I mean, this is where it gets kind of crazy. I had
a hard time really putting the pieces together on this, but really understand, what if I told you that insurance companies invest into having some of these apps go out and go live. Car insurance companies. Now I can see that,
okay, and you go, well, why would they do that?
The company itself or a third party company, the company themselves like insurance companies and stuff, so they the invest like big brands. Yeah, big brands
have gotten involved. And the reason why is if you guys had never heard
and you've heard us talk about it here on this show Live three sixty is a tracking app right for your car and all kinds of stuff. It works
really, really well. What if I told you that some of these apps
have nothing to do with that have that technology build in the back in all these years, including right to this date, it is collecting data on the way that you drive because your cell phone goes everywhere with you, right, I mean I believe that. I mean I feel like most people kind of
ready know that in something we know MS. We talked about data, right,
we've talked about that, right, Okay, but nobody already ask you for your location. Half the time they do, but nobody would ever in
a million of years thought insurance companies. It's for insurance. They want to
know how fast you're driving, how often you use your cell phone while you're in the vehicle. All those kinds of things is what they're tracking, so
that in the near future they can adjust your insurance rate based on the data they're collecting on you. Interesting, Well, I don't think it on you,
per se, I think to be on it, but it is on you. It's just but not like personally you right, Like they can't they
can't be like well, I mean like unless you give it, like, they're not going to be open and say that that's what they're talking about.
You know, we're tracking you already, so they are. They are actually
open with it. So now every app, when you open it up,
you'll start to see a message that says allow this app to start tracking your data. And when you hit there's some of it's in very small print.
Take it. It's already there, but usually it's through the first spewed up
of the app that you're hitting all those most people don't ever read that.
They never read that stuff. But you can also go check and see what
apps are trying. You can't. You can, But I would have never
in a million years even thought about, let me develop some type of game that everybody wants to play as an insurance company, so I can go ahead and get that there are also being used, right, yeah, and everything like that. No, it is. It's It's literally one of those things
where if you I've done it, I'm not gonna lie I've had We're like click here and agree to this, and I'm like, I just need this app real quick, and you just kind of go through it and before you know it, on the back side of that it has it give you a perfect example, did you not? Did you know? There's an app out
there called Fetch Rewards And I'm not gonna talk bad about y'all, do't assume me, but they actually give you money for allowing access to apps to track your data. I have said you actually, do you remember the idea we
had where you guys are still in high school we talked about it, but creating apps for good driving and it gives you rewards for like discount on gas free food like you know, say wah wah, tackle bell whatever, like the better you drive and the better it's like a system. Right. Remember
we talked about like that's always not the purpose, right, always going to pick that up unless you're selling some type of data. And I feel that's
why, like all apps are now, Well the problem with it is is people a selling data forever. I can go back and tell you way like,
way before we ever got into these crazy things. Okay, well that's
what it was creative for, right, you know they was they were create They were taking information and data and stuff and selling I remember data sheets.
Uh, that's going way back where you had people's information. Tell me a
self spreadsheet with actual spreadsheet. It was actually they were trying pages. But
I just it's interesting because with now and I'll think about it, so all the apps are going in cars and going like how many apps you got on your touch screen on your car? Quite a few? Don't you actually minds
an app? Uh you know type of infotament system. It's more if I
do have apps, it's the car play section and it's only three of them.
But mine isn't per se like more of an app. It's more once
you're on the screen, all the buttons that you need are there unless you're trying to do like a manual or like Mine's not like he is car though as well. I don't really like his eye drive because it's all apps.
Everything, Everything is an app and a folder. That's the big it looks.
So my truck. So my truck's you know, it's got apps on
the backside. So if you go over to it and you hit it,
there is apps. I don't I've never used them, but I know there's
stuff there that can download the app into the system, and I just I'm not that guy. So I've just I mean, I've had the truck a
while now and I've never thought about downloading any of those apps. But if
I had, there's a good chance that one of those apps has a track, a data tracker to it that would have been tracking my driving on how I drive and then reporting it back to insurance companies so they can go ahead and make decisions based on the future on my driving style. Obviously, I'm
not a habitual speeder, so it's not a big huge deal stuff like that, But if I was. Credit Card, does that so I've actually been
notified by a credit card a couple times about activating their trial where you know, they'll watch your data and stuff and then you can refer that back to your insurance company to get a quote lower rate. I just think that's ridiculous.
It's crazy. I mean, like when I saw that they were develop
when I saw that they were developing apps for the purpose of having that installed on the back end to track it just was mine. I don't think you'd
be as mad if you were getting paid for it. And I think that's
where like the line is right, is that you're kind of taking you know, the work of other people's or you know, and you're using it for their purpose. They're making money off you know, of you. You used
to get a discount with the plug ins, with the little what the OBD plugins that you used to plug in the car. They're not going to give
you a discount. Of people like I thought it was funny. I know
when those first came out, people are like, I'm getting ready to do some hood rat stuff. They unplug the data, you can throw it on
the floor of the car. You know, you used to laugh about it.
I don't know if that worked how that worked, But that's that was always the joke, you know what I mean? Like so, I mean,
but that's now why they are kind of buying your data now. I
mean because people were taking them out and throwing them market, they're trying to find a different way. They're not even buying your data, right, I
mean, as long as you agree to it, they don't. They don't
have to buy it. I mean they're getting third parties selling your data,
so they don't only got to sell it no more. Because as long as
you agree to the terms and condition, you did, and you probably clicked on that app, but they didn't realize it before you know it, boom is gone just like that, and they're sharing it. And like I said,
now with them putting everything being app driven in cars, it's a big push for it. We talk about it and the fact that now so if
you guys didn't follow when we were talking about uh, regulating speed in California is actually now pushing four with it. And there's another state too. I
can't where the other state is. It's actually trying to push forward to it
and went through legislation already. Is New York's the other one too, And
where basically as you enter into a geo fence, your car will reduce down to a certain speed. I mean, so if you have a smart smart
car, I'm not gonna lie. That's why I'm glad I bought my brand
new car before the push of like full autonomous stuff. Yeah autonomous, you
know, I still have control of the train off the tracks. New York,
pe real quick? Did you guys not see what came out about New
York this week? Oh, they're gonna see or they're gonna hold. They're
gonna put a hold on the charging. Yeah, they're one hundred million dollars
expansion that they did for all their radars. They're gonna have to take those
babies back down because they are not gonna charge what was it, fifteen dollars they wanted to charge charge for driving the same you drove your car to work.
And it's not completely table yet. It's just been put on hold because
people can't afford for them to re review, because they say that during the times, people can't afford it. Right now, I think eventually they're gonna
end up doing it. Right, it's a money grab, money like the
push to you know, push out the cars and make it more of a you know, civilization and people walk and bike and that's very cool, but when it's a money grab, is what I have eighteen dollars a day up to like what do they talk about to thirty three dollars a day to be have a right to drive your car in certain areas in the city. I
mean, just it's insane. That goes back to the tolls. When you
have a big city like that and you're trying to, you know, keep people in certain boundaries and stuff, it should be like a pass, Like you have a metro card and stuff, but you should have passed to like all those transportations. It should be like if you're a citizen, you should
just know that you're paying for like a monthly fee. Don't don't don't don't
don't say that every transaction. And it's a scam. And it has the
word pass easy pass. It's not so easy. Just so you guys know,
Hey, I gotta take quick rush of break again. It's going by
fast. The whole site will jump back into couple more things as soon as
I come back right back. You're listening to Dave Pilatch on Let's Talk Cars
Radio. Dave we'll be right back. An ounce of prevention is worth a
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Hey, Michelle, thanks for coming in. No problem. What is that?
Oh? Curtis dropped that off earlier this week. He calls it the
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Liberty, Yeah, liberty, ooh yeah, liberty, Liberty TRANSMISSI for the working man. I don't know about this, Dave, you gotta admit
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one three one. Liberty Transmission. Welcome back to Let's Talk Cars Radio.
You're automotive specialist. Now back to your host, Dave Poalach. Hey,
guys, welcome back. Hey, So to continue at the conversation, So,
you know the fees in New York and there's other cities that want to do it too, right, So have you drop that is like as much as a scam. And I say scammed, it's a money grab. It's
a money grab. That's being the best way to put money grab is like
when you guys hear me talk about this tolls the fact that you paid money.
Right. So if you guys, we got on some trips, right,
so you guys know we like a road trip. It's we have a
good time. We hook up CBS and we can talk to each other in
the cars and you know, we enjoy ourselves, right, because I think everybody should rode if somebody keeps radium right Yeah, yeah, yes, for those who don't reach over and decide to turn down the volume, onde it and then they can't hear when you're yelling at them. But that's a whole
nother story for another day. But I okay, So you know we have
here in our state, we have the easy Pass. The easy Pass is
supposed to work through you call and you find out if it works in this state and then this stuff, and it always yeah, it works on everything.
So we go on a trip. This happened twice now that we've gone
on trips, and I happened at home. Yeah, it's happened at home
too, But I'm just thinking of the trips where then I get like this weird bill in and it's forty six dollars for one pass through like a tunnel or a toll or something like that, which normally be like six dollars, and then you have to fight with them to try to get that money back.
And that's how I mean, that's that's one of the things falls into like the whole system. Everything's computerized and it all works, and when it
doesn't work, you you you're They just assume you're guilty and you have to prove yourself that you're not. And you're arguing with somebody and Nathaniel I were
talking about on commercial breaking stuff. One of the best things I love about
having a Bank of America card is if all my stuff's paid through that card and I have it and I don't agree with somebody, I just call and I'm like, look, I'm not paying it, just don't pay that bill.
And then I go, now you get nothing. Here's the thing,
because that was the last conversation I had. So I had a conversation with
New Jersey. I think I think one of them was in New Jersey.
One was New York and I had got these like out of lanterns about I think the trip costs me like three hundred and semi dollars that they sent me as a bill because I guess my little device only works in certain things and doesn't work in other ones, and they decide to build me. Now,
I did my due diligence. I think I told you guys this before,
so I called on heyes, this this where I'm going. Is this going
to cover me for everything? Yeah? You just got to make sure you
pay. It didn't make sure you prepay and have enough money on And then
we had apps turned on in the otherwise right running yea their absolutely, you go on the app and it works off your cell phone and builds off of that. They still sent me this crazy bill. I do think that if
you were going to pay for the convenience, then you should flip the bill for when it doesn't work out for what you intended to do. I mean
as a company, okay, right right, I agree with that because obviously, like you know, back then, like you had to go through the toll boosts right and there was a person computerized way out. You put computers
up and that's work half the time. That's where the technology part comes in
with that. I don't like because it's like the technology site isn't always accurate.
I said, I get like this three hundred and some dollar bill in and then I got to call somebody. I was on hold for like an
hour and a half trying to get solved. When they finally come, they're
like, well, sir, you just don't. I'm like, I don't.
I had a device in my vehicle. Not only did I have my
pass in my vehicle, but we were running your guys' app as well, which signified it that it recognized that we were coming through the area to take the money off that just to double protect ourselves, to make sure rather it could or didn't because we ran into it before so we knew. And then
like I said, I get this building mail and she was like, we own. And I wasn't trying to be a jerk, but I was like,
really, three times the price which you using paid. I'm like,
it's forty six dollars. It normally be six dollars. And you're telling me
I owe you for going through three of them. And then you got me
on this and you got me late fees, administration fees, all these other stuff, and I was just as I told you. I said, look,
I said, I'm not trying to be difficult. I believe I owe
you money, which is like six dollars okay, for each time I went through. You know I can do math pretty quick, six six and six,
So you know it's sure enough, isn't three hundred semi dollars? I
was like, so here's how it's gonna work. I'm either going to give
you what I know I owe you. I don't know why the system didn't
work the way it's supposed to do. It worked going through one way,
it didn't work going through the other way. Whatever it is, right,
I know you have the opportion over right, you're just being difficult with me.
So I don't live in New York and I don't live in New Jersey.
So either you take the money i'm gonna give you, or you get squat because I don't live there. You stall you can touch me, Like,
what are you gonna do? Send me another bill. I'm gonna go
ahead and put that one right in the round file to Well, that was just like two years ago when they were charged me back to back to back to back, and I was just like, a right, I'm not going to give you anything now. I'm like, you know, I know you're
wrong. I'm like my car still goes through the tunnel. You know.
I looked, there wasn't a catch fence that keeps me going through the tunnel.
So I remember, like and sounds bad, but I remember. There
was a thousand dollars bill before. I remember, and I signed into the
account at the end of the year when I knew they had to balance their books, and it was completely wiped when I called. No, When I
called, they said that they it was wiped because of the I didn't have to pay one for him before, and it was quite a bit of money.
Did have to pay my easy pass, that was my easy pass, but this was with what was h HR or whatever it was. They called
themselves the Elizabeth River e R T e R T Elizabeth River, which was basically like there's two different ones collecting money on the behalf of the same toll.
I'm like, how does that even work? It doesn't make get paid
all right, right, But like no, I told him call one like the other one doesn't, right. I'm like, I'm not trying to be
difficult, but I am sure enough just not gonna give money way. I'm
like, look, it's real simple for me. If your machine messed up,
if I went through your toll right, and it dinged me on the way going through, and it couldn't find a way to ding me coming back the other way. It's not my fault. It's not. Now it's four
times the cost to go through it plus the late fee, plus the administration fee because your system didn't work. And then you get silly with me on
the phone and think like that I care. First of all, I'm talking
to you in like Maryland. I think the one on one one one.
I'm talking to you in Maryland, and like, I mean, what are you gonna do? I mean, come and get the money from me?
No, you're not, like you're not getting your money, and and and how bad do you? Like I try, like like like how bad do
you love your job? Because you just got like the guy that could just
sit there and take up a bunch of your I'm gonna make sure your your customer service, a little scale thing that reads you for the days, gonna be way off because you're gonna be stuck on the phone when you're absolutely I just I don't get it. And like I said, and that's the problem
with the technology side of things. And I think it's gonna get worse as
we go on. You guys know how I feel. I don't need to
tell you guys that I think tolls are horrible because the road's already paid for it. I just don't believe it does the back end, right. I
feel like we have all the back ends already dot out. There's not really
a good user side for it, right. It's just something needs to be
rebassy. Camera's over there typing a way. It's just something needs The whole
system needs to be revamped. And like these some of these people, you
guys send me a lot of stuff, and some people are like, well I pay this money money. Or there's one guy send me He's got to
go through like nine tolls to go into work in the morning, nine different tolls. And I'm like, you must really love you, Joe, you
right, I honestly say, I was like, you must really like going to work. I mean, like you really nine they're nine on the way
back. That's eighteen tolls in a today. Much when I was just going
to Newport News and you would come, the tunnel would shut down after you already went through the toll, and then it would say all right, hey take this exit. You get off that exit for to take you on another
toy. You went through up over the bridge, yes, and then the
bridge closed, so you got to turn all the way back around to go on to the other bridge for them to three times. Dude, I was
mad. I was like, man, I paid like forty you will never
experience. And you all that lived in Illinois, and those a bunch of
guys that listened to the show there and appreciate you all listening because you guys dagging. But living in Illinois when I was young before you guys, wait,
before were born, and you had to pay everything change. You had
to pay to get onto the freeway. It wasn't free by the way,
so they called it highway because it's not freeze, so you can't call it a freeway. But you had to pay to get on. He had to
pay to get off on every single off ramp. You had to pay,
like so many miles every time you got to stop and pay again. And
I didn't you know back then, I was young, Like I was, I was younger than you guys are now. Imagine like I could. You
would fumble around your vehicle looking for change, like you're like digging through the ash train. Hope somebody dropped a quarter. Many times I opened up the
door and picked up something like, I don't buen my door and look down and be changed. I was reached down, picked up and then throw it
in so I could go through because like always broke as a joke. You
know, the walk was crazy. It was like, but now that everything's
automated, you have no like they're getting it from me, like and the fact that he's like, they're just seeing you a bill later on. That's
what I find funny, right, just get it from you later. We
know where you're at. Right, But here's the thing. Imagine think about
it. Nine tolls on the way there. This this guy was telling me
in nine eighteen tolls in the day. I don't know how much it charges
him, but let's just say that each one of them is a dollar.
Well, you know that's crazy money. And I have to laugh about this
because there is a certain policy where if you go through a too I think, what more than seven or eight times a month, then you get discounted weight. And I only found that out at a certain period of time.
I had no idea that even exists, because I'm not trying to go through them that much. There is one to hold on. There's there's one that's
close here to my house, but there is a way where I can get off and go past it and then get back on. And I choose that
option everything every time I get off, go around it and get back on.
I mean, I just I have that option. I think we've been
doing that since we were a kid. Man when when Grave Digger was around.
You know what I'm talking about. I'm going around. I'm not paying
that, but no, it's it's it's funny because like I said, it's just it's it's one of those things where automation, apps, everything we talked about today, the cameras, radars, you name it, everything's pushing towards technology. You guys heard me a bunch of times talk about that. I'm
a technology guy. I like technology. But now the point that I think
it's a lot of it's unregulated, and it's really starting to affect a lot of things. Maybe it's really starting to bother me on their side. So
maybe I'll flip. Maybe I'll be the guy who doesn't like technology so much
anymore because I just love it. I was like, man, technology and
cars is going to be great. I didn't realize the technology outside the car
that was going to affect your driving as much as it depends on, like if you really want that emotion behind the decision making or if you don't.
I mean, in both different scenario decisions. I always want to make the
decision. I don't even make a decision right. It's either you know someone
at you know across from you, or it's going to be That's why, that's why Cameron likes to drive all the time because he wants to have the control of it all. He's like, He's like, I don't to have
the control. I don't want anybody making the decisions for me. And that's
what technology does. It makes all the decisions for you, guys. Ask
him today. No, guys, we gotta go ahead and get out of
here. It has been a great show. Hope you guys enjoyed it.
Do not forget. If you don't catch the show live or if you guys
end up catching recording of the show but you want to watch it later, you can go to all of your podcast sites and pick up our show and listen to it anytime that you guys want. Don't forget real quick. I
know I gotta get out of here. We have coming up July twentieth,
we're going to be out with Hepcat. Honey's doing the big, huge auctions.
You guys are going to miss that. Bring your money, bring your
chair, be ready for that. More information to come on that. I'm
go ahead, get out of you guys, got anything before we get out of here, Enjoy your weekend, have a good one hey, and have a happy Father's Day. Guys, it is this weekend. Don't forget.
Hopefully you get some great presents and some car parts. We're gonna get out
here. Talk to you soon.
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