The show kicks off with hosts sharing personal car project updates, including carburetor and fuel line challenges on a classic T-bird. The main segment features Dave Kinney and Greg Ingold from the Hagerty Price Guide discussing the 20th anniversary of the guide and recent record-breaking auction sales at Kissimmee and Barrett-Jackson. Highlights include multi-million dollar Ferrari sales, unique custom colors, and market trends in collectible cars. The conversation blends enthusiast stories with expert insights on valuation and auction dynamics, offering a lively mix of technical talk and industry news.
Brett and Mark welcome Brett’s sister Robin Bolin, Dave Kinney and Greg Ingold from the Hagerty Price Guide to discuss the record-setting results of the Mecum Kissimmee and Barrett-Jackson Scottsdale auctions, interesting cars from the sales, cars that are down in value, and their favorite cars sold under $75k. This and more on this week’s Driven Radio Show!
"...I only had to harass you for like a month and a half about your T-bird asking you, hey, have you done anything with it? Have you dug into the carpet?"
The Ford Thunderbird is a type of car made by Ford. People like it because it's a nice, stylish car that you can fix up or make look cool.
The Ford Thunderbird, often called the T-bird, is a classic American car model produced by Ford. It has a rich history as a personal luxury car and is popular among car enthusiasts for restoration and customization.
"You know, I have whined about that freaking carburetor for how long. I've had that holly sitting in my garage for two months. So I'm like, dude, just put on your big boy pants and go get her done quick. So I got out there, I pulled the, I pulled the old carb and it was interesting."
A carburetor is a part of an engine that mixes gas and air so the engine can run. It helps the car get the right amount of fuel to work properly.
A carburetor is a device that mixes air and fuel for internal combustion engines, commonly used before fuel injection systems became widespread. It controls the engine's air-fuel ratio to ensure proper combustion.
"I've had that holly sitting in my garage for two months. So I'm like, dude, just put on your big boy pants and go get her done quick."
Holley is a company that makes parts for car engines, especially carburetors that help the engine get fuel and air to run well.
Holley is a well-known American company specializing in performance carburetors and fuel system components. Their carburetors are popular among enthusiasts for classic and performance cars.
""No, no manifold. No, this dude manifold. No, no, no, no, no, no.""
The manifold is a part that helps get air into the engine so it can run. It spreads the air evenly to all parts of the engine.
A manifold is a part of an engine that distributes air or air-fuel mixture to the cylinders. In this context, it likely refers to the intake manifold, which channels air into the engine's combustion chambers.
"And so I did finally get the, there are a couple of, no, no, the fuel line's not sorted out quite yet. What's going to happen with the fuel line? The fuel line came around. It's the original metal line. It had a, a fuel fitting that was kind of a screw in. I think it's a, I think it's three eighths. Yeah. And, um, the new one has a one eighth nipple, you know, sticking out of it."
The fuel line is a tube that moves gas from the car's tank to the engine so the car can run. It's important that it doesn't leak or get blocked.
The fuel line is a pipe or hose that carries fuel from the gas tank to the engine. It is critical for delivering fuel safely and efficiently to the engine's combustion system.
"Not tons. Still waiting on the Schadenfreude express and dad's truck. I'm told end of the week."
The Chevrolet Express is a big van used for carrying people or things. It’s strong and useful for work or big families.
The Chevrolet Express is a full-size van commonly used for commercial purposes or as a passenger van. It is known for its durability and versatility, often appearing in discussions about practical work vehicles or family transport.
A vacuum hose is a small tube in a car that uses engine suction to help parts of the car work properly, like the brakes or fuel system.
A vacuum hose is a flexible tube that carries vacuum pressure from the engine to various components, helping control functions like fuel delivery, emissions, and brake boosters.
""By the way, it is the 20th anniversary in 2026 of the Haggerty Price Guide. Is it really? Yeah, we started it in, it was called Cars That Matter. Started it in August of 2006.""
The Haggerty Price Guide is a book that tells you how much old and special cars are worth, helping people know the price if they want to buy or sell them.
The Haggerty Price Guide is a well-known publication that tracks the values of collectible and classic cars, providing pricing trends and market insights for enthusiasts and buyers.
"There was the 250 GTO that sold for 38 and a half million."
The Ferrari 250 GTO is a very old and rare car that collectors really want. It sells for a lot of money because there aren't many of them and it's very special.
The Ferrari 250 GTO is a highly coveted classic sports car produced in the early 1960s, known for its rarity, racing pedigree, and extremely high auction values.
The Ferrari Enzo is a very fast and special car made by Ferrari. It was made in small numbers and is very valuable.
The Ferrari Enzo is a limited-production supercar named after the company's founder, known for its advanced technology and high performance during the early 2000s.
"Yeah, 17. Nine when you round up GT 40 mark two that sold for 12, 12 for when you round up 95 F 50 that sold for 12.2 at 03 Enzo at 11 one and 17"
The Ford GT40 is a very famous race car that won big races in the 1960s. It looks cool and is very special, so many people want to own one.
The Ford GT40 is a legendary race car from the 1960s that famously won the 24 Hours of Le Mans four times in a row. Its racing heritage and iconic design make it one of the most coveted classic sports cars in the world.
"Nine when you round up GT 40 mark two that sold for 12, 12 for when you round up 95 F 50 that sold for 12.2 at 03 Enzo at 11 one and 17 La Ferrari that sold for 11 flat."
The Ferrari F50 is a very special and fast car made to celebrate Ferrari’s 50 years. It’s rare and many people want to buy it because it’s so unique and powerful.
The Ferrari F50 is a rare supercar from the mid-1990s, designed to celebrate Ferrari’s 50th anniversary with Formula 1 technology and a V12 engine. It is highly collectible and commands high prices at auctions due to its exclusivity and performance.
"...e most of those cars. Makes me regret collecting Corvettes. Most of the big dollar cars were from an estate..."
The Chevrolet Corvette is a famous fast car from America that many people like to collect. It looks cool and goes really fast, so it’s often talked about when people sell special cars from collections.
The Chevrolet Corvette is an iconic American sports car known for its performance and distinctive design. It has a strong collector following, often featured in estate sales where high-value cars are sold. Its significance in automotive history and enthusiast culture makes it a common topic in car collecting discussions.
"that makes a big difference in selling these collector cars. So I mean, you could obviously right now you could make a damn good argument that you can go out and buy a collector car today because"
A collector car is a special car that people keep because it's rare or important, not just for everyday driving. These cars can be worth more money as time goes on.
A collector car is a vehicle that is valued and sought after primarily for its rarity, historical significance, or unique features, often kept in good condition and sometimes appreciating in value over time.
"...place. Well, look at the last two generations of Ford GTs. You want to talk about a guaranteed collector c..."
The Ford GT is a very fast and special car made recently that looks like an old famous race car. Many people want to collect it because it’s rare and cool.
The Ford GT is a modern supercar inspired by the original GT40 race car, featuring advanced aerodynamics and a powerful engine. It is highly collectible, especially the limited production generations, and is often discussed in collector car markets.
"You want to talk about a guaranteed collector car right out of the gate, limited production, high performance, really sexy,"
Limited production means only a few of these cars are made, so they are special and hard to find. This makes them more valuable to people who collect cars.
Limited production refers to manufacturing a small number of a particular car model, which often increases its rarity and desirability among collectors. Cars made in limited numbers tend to hold or increase their value over time.
""...between a standard 0506 and a heritage edition. I don't know if we've talked about this before, but you know which cars did not sell as new cars at all were the heritage edition...""
A heritage edition is a special version of a car that looks different and celebrates the car brand's past. It might have unique colors or decorations that make it stand out.
A heritage edition is a special trim or version of a car that often includes unique styling or features meant to evoke the brand's history or legacy. These editions are typically produced in limited numbers and can have distinct paint, badges, or interior details.
""they didn't understand the golf livery and the heritage behind that. A lot of people did, but the entire collector car world understands it implicitly just by looking at it.""
Livery means the special colors and designs painted on a car, especially race cars, to show who owns it or its history.
Livery refers to the specific paint scheme, colors, and graphics applied to a car, often to represent a racing team, sponsor, or heritage. It can be iconic and instantly recognizable among enthusiasts.
"So I don't think they really carried carrying too much about the horsepower because I believe the car was herbal and ants at the time."
Horsepower tells you how strong a car's engine is. The more horsepower, the faster and more powerful the car can be.
Horsepower is a unit of measurement that indicates the power output of an engine. It helps quantify how much work an engine can perform, which relates to the vehicle's acceleration and top speed.
"...ut the VW Convy is that VW just introduced their ID buzz and then pulled it from the marketplace, which w..."
The Volkswagen ID. Buzz is a new electric version of the old VW bus that many people liked. It was sold for a short time and then taken off the market, which made people talk about it a lot.
The Volkswagen ID. Buzz is an all-electric modern reinterpretation of the classic VW Microbus, combining nostalgic design with contemporary electric vehicle technology. Its brief market availability and subsequent withdrawal have made it a notable topic among EV enthusiasts.
"...tplace, which was an homage, a tribute to the VW bus in electric and everyone's doing fantastically wi..."
The Volkswagen Bus is a famous old van that lots of people remember from the 1960s and 70s. New electric versions that look like it are also popular today.
The Volkswagen Bus is a classic van known for its distinctive shape and cultural significance, especially during the 1960s and 70s. Its electric tribute models and ongoing popularity keep it relevant in discussions about retro-inspired vehicles.
"and when you can arbitrage buying one for $15,000 and
having it restored in South America for $50,000 and then
bringing it to the United States and selling it for 90 to 150."
Arbitrage means buying a car where it's cheaper and selling it somewhere else where people pay more, so you can make money.
Arbitrage in the automotive context refers to buying cars in one market at a lower price and selling them in another market at a higher price to make a profit.
"...n a logical one. You know, but but a 99 two door Tahoe arguably kind of a cool truck, 22,000 miles on i..."
The Chevrolet Tahoe is a big SUV that can carry lots of people and stuff. The older 1999 version with only two doors and low miles is special and liked by some car fans.
The Chevrolet Tahoe is a full-size SUV known for its spacious interior and strong towing capabilities. The 1999 two-door model is considered a cool and somewhat rare variant, especially with low mileage, making it appealing to collectors or enthusiasts.
""Think about what it would take to go buy a two or three year old full size four wheel drive SUV with 22,000 miles on it. I'd be willing to bet you'd violate the 47 grand.""
Four wheel drive means the car can send power to all four wheels at the same time, which helps it drive better on dirt, snow, or mud.
Four wheel drive (4WD) is a drivetrain system that powers all four wheels simultaneously to improve traction on rough or slippery surfaces.
"...hese are not just you know, stapled together old Mustangs or something like that. There actually could be ..."
The Ford Mustang is a famous fast car from America that lots of people love. Newer versions are built really well and aren’t just old cars put back together, so they’re fun to drive and collect.
The Ford Mustang is a legendary American muscle car with a rich history dating back to the 1960s. Modern Mustangs are well-engineered and not just rehashed old designs, which makes them popular among enthusiasts for both performance and collectibility.
"One of the one of the editors chose a Lincoln Continental sedan, which I thought was kind of cool."
The Lincoln Continental is a big, comfortable car made by Lincoln. It's known for being fancy and roomy, often used as a luxury car for people who want a smooth ride.
The Lincoln Continental is a luxury sedan produced by Lincoln, known for its spacious interior and classic American luxury styling. It has been produced in various generations since the 1930s, with notable modern versions offering advanced features and comfort.
"... I was surprised to see, there was a 74 D Tomaso Pantera GTS. I'm amazed to see one of those go for sub 7..."
The Pantera is a cool sports car made in the 1970s that mixes Italian style with a strong American engine. It’s special and some people collect it.
The De Tomaso Pantera is a mid-1970s Italian-American sports car combining Italian design with American V8 power. Its rarity and unique styling make it a collectible classic, sometimes surprising buyers with lower-than-expected prices.
""...Greg and I are well over six feet tall and getting into a Pantera is yeah, that doesn't work for either.""
The De Tomaso Pantera is a cool sports car made a long time ago. It has a powerful engine in the middle of the car and looks very stylish. People who like sports cars really like it.
The De Tomaso Pantera is an Italian-American sports car produced from the early 1970s to the early 1990s, known for its mid-engine layout and Ford V8 power. It's considered a classic Italian sports car with a distinctive design and is appreciated by enthusiasts for its performance and style.
"...I find myself watching Barrett Jackson when I am, you know, quite literally six miles away in my time share there..."
Barrett Jackson is a company that holds big sales where people can buy and sell special and old cars. Many car fans watch these sales to see cool cars and sometimes buy them.
Barrett Jackson is a well-known auction company specializing in collector cars, classic cars, and automotive memorabilia. Their auctions are popular events for car enthusiasts to buy and sell rare and valuable vehicles.
"What is the Hagerty market rating and what does it show? ... Hagerty market rating is, uh, that's our zero to 100 scale of the current temperature of the market."
The Hagerty market rating is a number from 0 to 100 that shows how busy or quiet the classic car market is. Zero means nobody is buying or selling, 50 means things are steady, and 100 means lots of buying and selling happening.
The Hagerty market rating is a scale from 0 to 100 that indicates the current health and activity level of the classic car market. A rating of 0 means there is no market activity, 50 means the market is flat or stable, and 100 means the market is extremely active or unpredictable.
"... your big cars on your to like the the F 40, the 959 your 0506 for GT Mercedes SLRs cars of the 90s a..."
The Porsche 959 is a very fast and fancy car made in the 1980s with lots of new technology. It was one of the best cars back then and many people want to collect it now.
The Porsche 959 is a groundbreaking supercar from the 1980s known for its advanced technology, all-wheel drive, and impressive performance. It was one of the fastest and most sophisticated cars of its time, making it a highly sought-after collector’s item.
"at post January, but you know, this has some of your big cars on your to like the the F 40, the 959 your 0506 for GT Mercedes SLRs cars of the 90s and mid to mid 2000s early 2010s are on"
The Ferrari F40 is a very fast and special car made by Ferrari a long time ago. It’s famous because it was the last car the company’s founder helped make, so many people want to own one.
The Ferrari F40 is a legendary supercar from the late 1980s, celebrated for its raw performance and status as Ferrari’s last model personally approved by Enzo Ferrari. It remains a highly sought-after collectible due to its iconic design and limited production.
"think. I mean, a golf GTI would probably make it onto an affordable list w..."
The Volkswagen Golf is a small car that many people like because it’s easy to drive and useful. The sportier version, called the GTI, is especially popular.
The Volkswagen Golf is a compact car known for its practicality, quality, and sporty variants like the GTI. It is widely regarded as an affordable and fun-to-drive hatchback, making it a staple in many automotive discussions.
"done spectacularly according to the price guide and that's that 99 Mercedes S 600. I try to knock that down right away."
The Honda S600 is a little old sports car that’s fun to drive and was made a long time ago. It’s become more valuable because people like old Japanese cars.
The Honda S600 is a small, sporty convertible from the 1960s known for its high-revving engine and nimble handling. It has gained value over time and is appreciated by collectors of classic Japanese sports cars.
"Okay. Will the low production Ford F 150 Harley Davidson edition pickups ever make it into the price guide?"
The Ford F-150 is a very popular truck that many people use for work and fun. Some special versions, like the Harley Davidson one, are rare and valuable to collectors.
The Ford F-150 is one of the best-selling pickup trucks in the United States, known for its durability and versatility. Special editions like the low-production Harley Davidson models are highly collectible and often discussed in price guides due to their rarity.
"You know, for Mercedes, I believe this is their 140th anniversary, if I'm not mistaken this year. So 1886 till now, I just did the math because I saw the commercial."
Mercedes-Benz is a famous car company from Germany that makes fancy and high-quality cars. They've been around since 1886, which means they've been making cars for a very long time.
Mercedes-Benz is a German automotive brand known for luxury vehicles and a long history dating back to 1886. The brand is celebrated for its engineering, innovation, and premium cars.
"Last time, last time I looked, I actually, um, there was a, uh, a couple of different vintage Bentley's that I was looking at, but I don't remember the models."
Bentley is a company that makes very fancy and expensive cars. Older Bentleys are special because they are classic and many people like to collect them.
Bentley is a British luxury automobile manufacturer known for producing high-end, handcrafted cars with a focus on performance and opulence. Vintage Bentleys are often prized by collectors for their classic design and engineering.
"...unrestored cars from, uh, they have a 51 Vincent Comet that's, uh, in patina to unrestored condition, u..."
The Mercury Comet is an old American car that was made to be affordable and nice looking. Cars that haven’t been fixed up much are special to some collectors.
The Mercury Comet was a compact car produced in the 1960s and early 70s, known for its affordability and classic American styling. Unrestored examples with original patina are valued by collectors for their authenticity.
"to unrestored condition, uh, 59 to 50 GT, pen and farina coupe, um, a 356 Porsche with a roundels on it. That's a really, really well aged on the car."
The Porsche 356 is an old, small sports car that many people think looks nice and drives well. Cars that haven’t been changed or fixed up much are very special to collectors.
The Porsche 356 is a classic sports car produced from the late 1940s to the mid-1960s, known for its elegant design and driving dynamics. Well-preserved unrestored examples, like the 1959 coupe mentioned, are highly prized by collectors for their originality and historical value.
"...lue chips. So, you know, you start talking about 62 Ferrari 250 GTOs. Nobody's surprised when that car bring..."
The Ferrari 612 Scaglietti is a fancy and fast car made for comfortable long drives. It’s a popular Ferrari that many people think is a good investment.
The Ferrari 612 Scaglietti is a grand tourer produced in the 2000s, known for its elegant design and powerful V12 engine. It is considered a blue-chip Ferrari, meaning it holds its value well and is respected among collectors.
Select text to request an explanation
Quiet, and I'm Skulls on Broadcast, and hey all you gearheads and car fiends, welcome
to Driven Radio Show, your weekly automotive happy hour.
I am Brett Hatfield here with my co-host and engineer extraordinaire, Mr. Mark Groves.
That's me.
And for the first time ever in studio, my fabulous, lovely, beautiful sister, Goblin.
Hi.
And we are coming to you from Driven Radio Studios where, oh my God, I only had to harass
you for like a month and a half about your T-bird asking you, hey, have you done anything
with it?
Have you dug into the carpet?
You know, as much as I appreciate your motivation, the real thing was just shame.
You know, I have whined about that freaking carburetor for how long.
I've had that holly sitting in my garage for two months.
So I'm like, dude, just put on your big boy pants and go get her done quick.
So I got out there, I pulled the, I pulled the old carb and it was interesting.
I, you know, all the things I'd read, I tried to prep for it and all this, that, and I went
to this and that bulletin board, yada, yada, there were three things that needed to come
on hook from it to take the son of a bitch off the engine.
Okay.
So does the new one fit the original manifold?
Oh, yeah.
Oh, so you didn't even have to swap it?
Oh, no.
Okay.
No, no manifold.
No, this dude manifold.
No, no, no, no, no, no.
But, uh,
Oh, come on.
Got the carb, you know, cleaned up the plate, got, and then put down my little stuff and
then put the carb on, got it tightened down and, you know, did it the crossways correctly.
And so I did finally get the, there are a couple of, no, no, the fuel line's not sorted
out quite yet.
What's going to happen with the fuel line?
The fuel line came around.
It's the original metal line.
It had a, a fuel fitting that was kind of a screw in.
I think it's a, I think it's three eighths.
Yeah.
And, um, the new one has a one eighth nipple, you know, sticking out of it.
It's male.
So there's no way to connect that three eighths screw onto a one eighth nipple.
So what I'm going to do, Hey, wait a second.
I got a bunch of plumbing crap upstairs.
I, well, I looked for, uh, uh, because I don't, when something's so original, I don't
really like to mess with it too much, but the, uh, um, I couldn't find a brass fitting
that would go.
I'm calling shenanigans immediately, Mr. Craggers.
Well, let me finish the, uh, the brass fitting that would have gone on the three eighths.
I went looking everywhere I could for one that would reduce it to a one eighth male.
Yeah.
Uh, when I, uh, what do they call a nut bit?
Um, there's a name for that end of it, but, uh, couldn't find it, couldn't find it.
It was quarters to three eighths to this and that.
And I've got three eighths and I believe quarter inch gas line at home right now.
That's to reduce from three eighths to one eighth.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Because while you've got a three eighth, uh, screw part and you need a one eighth nipple
to go to a one eighth hose, uh, fuel line to go to one eighth.
It seems really small.
It is.
And, uh, and so I've been trying to, uh, get that hooked up and I've got stuff ordered
already, uh, summer racing.
Once again, it's taken care of me.
So I got plenty of stuff arriving and I'll get that sorted out and then once I can get
the son of gun running, then I can start really kind of figuring out, I can maybe move it
out of my garage so I can work on the headlights and, uh, and be able to maybe actually take
it for a couple of mile test drive.
I have yet to drive that over probably 2,000 feet.
Oh, God, that'd be crushing me.
It's, it's not been great.
Okay.
But, um, we've got, hey, we got good weather this week.
Yeah.
I got good weather.
I had the time this past weekend and so I finally dug in and if you're going to hear
me whining, it's going to be about real stuff now.
Not about, oh, I'm scared to do that.
Well, okay.
You're already elbows deep in it.
So congrats.
Yeah.
Let's see.
What do I have to report this week?
Not tons.
Still waiting on the Schadenfreude express and dad's truck.
I'm told end of the week.
This is the third week.
I've heard that.
Oh, you know, you got to make it right.
I'm really hoping both of them are completed.
However, I will say on Schadenfreude express, I had some of the parts that the guys were
looking for and could not find, which made me feel really great.
And that took the estimate down quite a bit and they also do a very nice discount
if you pay with the green papery stuff.
Oh, side note.
I just realized I was saying that it was a one eight fuel line.
No, the fuel line is already ordered.
That's a second piece.
That's coming in as much shorter than the first piece that I got that wouldn't fit.
This was a vacuum hose.
Okay.
That's the second thing.
I bet that was really confusing.
I'm like, how the hell is one eighth inch of fuel going to be able to go?
That's what I was thinking.
I was like, that sounds very small.
It all just suddenly hit me.
I'm like, oh, shit, rewind.
I would just edit it.
But no, this is how stupid I am.
And it gets 47 miles a gallon.
Absolutely.
Because no guess.
Our special guests this week, the repeat offenders, the dynamic duo are Dave Kenny
and Greg Engold of the Haggerty Price Guide.
Dave Kenny is a lifelong automobile enthusiast, collector, owner of automotive
valuation firm, US appraisal.
And also so thin you could hold him up to light and watch his heart beat.
He is the publisher of the Haggerty Price Guide and he serves on the
McPherson College Auto Restoration Program advisory board.
Greg Engold is an avid car enthusiast member of the Haggerty Valuation
team for the last 12 years since 2014.
Contributor to the Haggerty Media as well as the Haggerty Insider and editor
of the Haggerty Price Guide.
Dave and Greg, welcome back to Driven Radio.
Thank you.
It was fun hearing the entire story of Mark's manifold destiny.
Wow.
Giddy up, slow boy.
You know, he spent the entire time we were talking about that trend.
He did.
Yeah, no, he really did.
He really did.
By the way, it is the 20th anniversary in 2026 of the Haggerty Price Guide.
Is it really?
Yeah, we started it in, it was called Cars That Matter.
Started it in August of 2006.
So that was the first publication date.
Greg wasn't born yet actually at that point.
But yeah, so we're celebrating 20 years of the Haggerty Price Guide.
I know there's big parties planned.
I haven't been invited to him, but I know there's parties planned.
And, you know, Greg's probably going in my place and not telling me
because he just doesn't want to upset me, but that's okay.
We keep waiting for our Haggerty Price Guide t-shirts to show up.
Haven't seen him in the mailbox yet.
I've never seen one either.
I think I'd be happy if you would send me some more of those
Haggerty Baggedy tote bags that we use for everything around the house.
Very, very good.
There's a very famous time I was talking to McKeel Haggerty,
whose name is eponymous with the company, and some guys showed him
a picture of a car cover that he had hand sewn out of Haggerty bags.
And I believe the reaction from McKeel is best described as priceless
because he was probably adding up what it costs for each one of those bags
to be a car cover.
But hey, it's great advertising.
So what now?
McKeel's probably thinking, okay, where'd you steal the box of Haggerty
bags to be able to make that?
That would just show up enough.
But back in the day, you could just show up in enough events
and you would wind up with that many Haggerty bags, I think.
So, well, I've got quite a few myself.
I'm guilty as charged.
We only have a handful and we found out that if you overload them,
the handles will come off, but they go right back on with a handy-dandy stapler.
There you go.
So there have been some awfully big results
January from the massive sales at Meekam Kissimmee and Barrett Jackson
Scottsdale, as well as some other good Scottsdale sales.
Guys, you want to talk about some of these totals?
Because, geez, Kissimmee was incredible.
Kissimmee sold $420 million worth of cars this year.
And was that putting that in context?
That is just under double what they did last year.
And the one that we're going to wind up talking about a lot is that second Saturday.
Yeah.
Which was the, I think they did more on that second Saturday than they did all of last year.
Not to mention they did more than Barrett Jackson did for their entire,
what was Barrett Jackson this year?
Was it 10 days, 13 days?
Something like that?
Yeah, it's hard to kind of get your head around either of these auctions
because they're so massive.
But I believe the first day of auctioning was Friday and then it ends on Sunday.
So yeah, it would be eight days, eight days, nine days, something like that.
So, make them Kissimmee, was it $259 million that they did on that second Saturday?
They sold six eight-figure cars in one day.
Yeah.
That's insane for any auction company.
Absolutely.
No, I mean, and there to be congratulated because, you know, you can criticize everything
you want about any auction and people do and people love to criticize auctions.
And I get it, but the results are, you know, the results are what speak
and they did a fantastic job for the most of those cars.
Most of the big dollar cars were from an estate and they just did phenomenal numbers.
I think, you know, when we drill down, which we're going to have to do,
a lot of the cars were one of a kind colors and they tended to be red and yellow.
So, you know, my immediate headline, which nobody picked up from me,
but I loved it so much was fast food colored cars sell for McTriple.
And they did, and they did.
I mean, they were just astonishing prices.
And now, you know, people are routinely talking about a $15 million enzo.
And, you know, that was not something we talked about in 2025 so long ago.
Oh, yeah.
So, you know, I mean, it's just amazing.
And as a matter of fact, Broad Air has got one coming up.
It's a black one that, you know, only I think a dozen of the 400 cars were black.
If I'm not mistaken, so that'll probably make some noise.
And I think that'll continue for a while.
I will say, however, this was a sale like most sales is probably not repeatable.
It was a moment in time.
You know, congratulations all around.
They did great.
But it was a very strange collection from a guy who wanted his own colors and
basically bought enough cars from Ferrari that they finally said, we give up.
Just order them in the colors you want, I assume, because a lot of the times
the manufacturers don't want colors like that going out there all the time.
So, you know, more power to them and more power to make them.
They did a great job.
It was astonishing.
I mean, it's just absolutely God's make was his entire collection.
Giallo or yellow fly yellow Ferraris.
Were they all not entire?
But yeah, I mean, that was the by far and away the majority of the cars.
So and do you have any idea how is there is the yellow Enzo one of one?
I think because the interior color was, is that right, Greg?
Yeah, I believe that's the case.
So are you I think it was ordered in one color and he replaced the
seats with blue as soon as the car was ordered.
If I'm not mistaken, so is yellow with blue.
Yeah.
So yeah, I mean, there are other yellow Enzo's out there, but not in
the color combination of yellow with blue is kind of a cop wearing a high
Viz jacket.
No, no, no, no, no, no, no, right.
Yeah.
How many you said six cars went for eight figures?
Yep.
Do you have the list by chance?
I do.
There was the 250 GTO that sold for 38 and a half million.
Okay.
We all expected that though.
Yeah.
The the three Enzo that sold for 17.
Yeah, 17.
Nine when you round up GT 40 mark two that sold for 12, 12 for when
you round up 95 F 50 that sold for 12.2 at 03 Enzo at 11 one and 17
La Ferrari that sold for 11 flat.
Good grief.
Wow.
Makes me regret collecting Corvettes.
I should have been collecting Ferraris.
Who knew?
So Meekum Kasumi sold more on that second Saturday than Barrett
Jackson did for their entire Scottsdale sale and Barrett Jackson
didn't have a bad Scottsdale.
That's exactly right.
Very good.
They had a very good Scottsdale.
It was incredibly well attended.
And another way something like a hundred and ninety one million
or a hundred and ninety five hundred and eighty nine is so I've got
okay.
Yeah, one ninety.
So but I think that that what we need to do is put a little perspective
on this ten years ago.
Those numbers were maybe a little bit more than ten years ago, but
maybe 15 years ago.
Those numbers were the total for all collector auctions in maybe the
year 2008 or 2009 or something like that.
So and of course the word collector has expanded very much.
So you know, I've given up on trying to say what what a collector car
is. I think it's any car that anybody kind of defines as a collector
car, but the manufacturers are now building collector cars.
Porsche is probably the best Ferrari is very good at it by making
small numbers of a car.
Even if the difference is only that, you know, they have, you know,
plaid inserts in the seats or something like that.
And they call it the Scottish edition or something, whatever.
I'm making that up, but it's not far away from that.
No, but a lot of the cars now have a little bit of difference
tweaked in the in under the hood and and that makes a big difference
in selling these collector cars.
So I mean, you could obviously right now you could make a damn good
argument that you can go out and buy a collector car today because
you know, it's going to be limited edition and it's going to be
something that was either outrageous or in terms of colors
or performance or something like that.
So the whole world of collector cars keeps on changing, but that's
a big dramatic difference as well.
So, you know, there's nobody in out there right now who's active
in the market who wouldn't tell you that, you know, 2015 or something
like that would be a very conservative cutoff for what year
you can buy a collector car from or the last year you could buy
a collector car from the rules have gone and I like that.
I mean, I think it's good because the marketplace changes all the time.
And so, you know, there are people with a 2015 car that cherish it
and treat it like we would a 25 year old car and that's just
a change in the marketplace.
Well, look at the last two generations of Ford GTs.
You want to talk about a guaranteed collector car right out
of the gate, limited production, high performance, really sexy,
at least the 0506's and you just they I think about the 0506
heritage paint job on those and what an absolute gossamer difference
there is between your standard paint job and that page.
It's just paint, but it makes more than $100,000 difference
between a standard 0506 and a heritage edition.
I don't know if we've talked about this before, but you know
which cars did not sell as new cars at all were the heritage
edition. It took until it went into no kidding.
You can talk to anybody who was a Ford dealer back in the day
and you know, 0506, they couldn't move the heritage editions
and the reason why was because the guy who wanted a car for the
weekend who wanted to put his golf clubs in and take it around
and all that sort of stuff.
Why would I want a blue one with an orange stripe because
they didn't understand the golf livery and the heritage behind
that. A lot of people did, but the entire collector car world
understands it implicitly just by looking at it.
That's an homage to the golf livery of the GTs of the past.
Yes, it is.
The GT40.
So, you know, that's I mean, that's the difference between
the new car market and the collector car market.
Is there are there any conclusions that can be drawn from
the Kissimmee and Scottsdale sales that we should carry forward
for the rest of the year?
There are a lot of people with a lot of money and it's not us.
Yeah, rich people continue to do rich people things.
Right. Yeah. News at 11, right?
Yeah.
I think that I think the the interesting takeaway is, is that
you know, the markets become so much more segmented and I
wrote an article on this for Haggerty not too long ago.
It's not the collector car market anymore.
It's the collector car markets.
Yes.
And the people who are involved in the later model cars are
not the people who have any interest in all in 60s or 70s
cars on a whole as a whole.
There are plenty of people who have a brand new X and a, you
know, and older X as well in their garage.
But there's a new generation of collectors and, and, you know,
that is to be celebrated because, you know, the the thought
that we had, you know, 15 years ago, everybody's moping around
and saying, oh, you know, kids these days aren't interested
in cars.
I mean, if I had a dollar for every time I'd be able to afford
an Enzo if I had a dollar for every time I heard it.
But, you know, that's not it.
The kids aren't interested maybe in the cars that you were
interested in when you're their age, but they're still interested
in cars, which is a great thing for the future of the automobile.
So Greg, you wrote an article last month about five cars that
are taking losses this year.
Can you tell us what they were and what's happening with them
and how big are these losses?
You know, they some of them they are pretty substantial losses
not just in percentage amount, but in dollar amounts.
You know, the big one that snagged the headlines were the
type two VW transporters from the fifties and sixties.
Really?
Those lost 19% in the previous quarter.
And, you know, this is really you have to segment it down to
the 23 and 21 window buses that went absolutely ballistic
about 10 years ago that, you know, remember 10 years ago
when you looked at these things and said like a hundred
thousand dollars, who the hell would pay a hundred thousand
dollars for a VW bus?
Yeah.
Well, I think that that is finally starting to settle down a
little bit.
These are still six figure buses and really, really good
condition.
But I think that's that's that's sort of money that's that
people are willing to put down on these things that's starting
to shrink a little bit.
And frankly, I think coming back down to reality, I mean,
these are really, really cool things or cultural icons.
But, you know, probably not lovely to drive.
Yeah.
40 horsepower is 40 horsepower.
Yeah.
I drove one across a parking lot once and found it to be
very wanting.
My sister and her friend drove one to Woodstock, New York.
That is absolutely true.
And we're talking for the Woodstock Festival.
So I don't think they really carried carrying too much
about about the horsepower because I believe the car was
herbal and ants at the time.
So yeah, I was going to say it's it's tough to think about
performance when you're altered.
Now, the funny thing about the VW Convy is that VW just
introduced their ID buzz and then pulled it from the
marketplace, which was an homage, a tribute to the VW
bus in electric and everyone's doing fantastically with
their electric cars in the United States.
Sarcasm to 11 there.
But $68,000 for one of those could only seem reasonable to
somebody who just paid 150 for VW bus from the 60s.
So I didn't point out very well, very well pointed out that
part of the reason that there are more of the decline in
value or they're more hitting the market because there are
an awful lot of these cars that were used in South America
and when you can arbitrage buying one for $15,000 and
having it restored in South America for $50,000 and then
bringing it to the United States and selling it for 90 to 150.
That was great.
But now there are many, many more in the marketplace than
there ever were and also the faking of 21 window buses as
well.
So.
Well, it's the Pablo Escobar business model.
If we can make it cheap here, send it to America and sell it
for a lot.
Why don't we do that?
That didn't work out for a guy here last week.
I hate when that happens.
Another another Hagerty article listed some of the sub
$75,000 favorites from the January auctions.
Gentlemen care to discuss those?
Yeah, this this one's a really fun article we do after the
big auction.
So we they ask all the editors to go through the editors and
writers to go through the run less and pick some of the cars
that we would have bought with an arbitrary budgets and you
know, there were some really cool cars out there to be had
for under 75 grand.
I think mine was probably the most overpriced for what it
was. There was a two door Tahoe and 99 Tahoe of 22,000 miles
that I absolutely fell in love without that Barrett Jackson
that sold for 47 three the last two door Tahoe that I had.
I bought it for three grand.
So you know, I think that one's more of an emotional purchase
than a logical one.
You know, but but a 99 two door Tahoe arguably kind of a
cool truck, 22,000 miles on it.
Think about what it would take to go buy a two or three year
old full size four wheel drive SUV with 22,000 miles on it.
I'd be willing to bet you'd violate the 47 grand.
Yeah, yeah, you're right.
You know, and well, I don't know.
There's there's a lot of there's a lot of things that are out
there right now.
You can buy below that $75,000, you know, mythical limit
that they were given and there's a lot of really cool cars
that are out there at that limit when you're when you're
talking about $75,000, you're buying real cars.
These are not just toys or these are not just you know,
stapled together old Mustangs or something like that.
There actually could be and some of them actually are really
decent cars.
One of the one of the editors chose a Lincoln Continental
sedan, which I thought was kind of cool.
It was a lot of money for a sedan with with kind of donkey
wheels on it, which not my not my style, but I could understand
why that was cool.
And Andrew Newton chose a Daimler limousine, which I
thought was the craziest thing in the world, but it turns
out it was bought new by Howard Hughes.
Oh, no kidding.
And it had an air filtration system in it and the toilet.
But is it?
Yeah, but it didn't have toenail clippers.
Oh, gosh.
Yeah.
So you could work on the go, so to speak.
Oh, God, Dave.
But anyhow, you know, so there's always weird stuff out there
and and I think Andrew's note was that it sold for I think
45, 47,000 something like that.
And the last time it sold, which was in early 2000s from
what I remember sold for 75,000.
So it's depreciating pretty fast.
The hard use connection is cool.
Yeah, it is.
But you know, famous fleeting.
We talked about this before and ask a bunch of 20 year olds
who Howard Hughes was and who, you know, they would they'll
reference Howard Hughes, but they don't know who who Howard
Hughes you like that, am I?
Yeah, but but they don't know who Howard Hughes is.
So, you know, it's it's just one of the ways of the world
that when when you have a celebrity car, you better be
aware that, you know, the next generation might not know
who the celebrity was.
One of the cars on there was a 63 Corvette, obviously not
the split window coupe because prices on those are going
bonkers right now.
And the other one that I was surprised to see, there was a
74 D Tomaso Pantera GTS.
I'm amazed to see one of those go for sub 75.
Yeah, I think they were, you know, from from memory.
I think they they kind of touched maybe 130.
Does that sound right, Greg?
At some point and now they're back down a little bit.
Yeah, they were definitely in the six figure range and
they've settled down for sure.
I think that's a great way to get into Italian sports car
for under the six figure mark.
Those things are so cool and you can actually work on them.
Speaking of but speaking of getting into both Greg and I
are well over six feet tall and getting into a Pantera is
yeah, that doesn't work for either.
Yeah, not something you could do all the time.
That's for sure.
I mean, you know, if you if you drove into the chiropractor,
you at least have a reason to visit them.
So it's a pain, Tara.
Yeah, exactly.
Yeah, they're great.
They're great to look at.
That's for sure.
So aside from the cars that made the 75 K list or the
sub 75 K list where there are other things there that went
for surprising money, either good or bad.
Yeah.
How about that 94 Cadillac?
Oh, Jesus.
Barrichax.
Oh, my God.
It's for a hundred thousand dollars.
What?
And it wasn't a special car.
I have no idea.
I believe these were two two bitters who were fueled with
what what I call auction juice.
What everybody else calls alcohol.
Yeah, and you know, that's my only explanation.
But you know, a great way to spend three times as much,
maybe four times as much as you needed to on a malaise or a
Cadillac, basically.
So but you know, they they have the world record and they were
probably on TV.
So, you know, some people would be worth it to spend a hundred
grand.
I don't know.
There's a reason those bitters passes come with free trips to
the bar.
Yeah, that's no secret in the world of auctions and not just
automobile auctions either.
So yeah, you know, I'm going to say that I didn't attend me come
Kissimmee.
I did attend Bear Jackson.
I think Greg and I would agree that, you know, one of the
things was a good time was had by all.
I mean, it was really a happy crowd.
You know, the funny thing about Bear Jackson is you could
probably remove the auction from it and you probably still
have 90 percent of the people show up because for them it's
a car show and it's an opportunity to buy all kinds of
overpriced things or sometimes, you know, a nicely priced
things at their at their vendor stands.
I had a guy try and buy the watch off my wrist, which made
me smile that he was actually a dealer.
A watch dealer.
It wasn't a guy with a gun, but but and I had interactions
with some of the vendors and they were they all seem to be
very happy, which is great.
And the people there were, you know, it's a lifestyle crowd
and they were, you know, shopping for furniture and gun
safes and, you know, kind of questionable artwork and all
that sort of stuff.
But, you know, God bless America.
I mean, that's fine.
And if you want to have something like that, it's a great
place to go and see what's out there.
But the funny thing is that I would say fully and this is
just my estimation.
I could be wrong.
80 percent of the people who go in there only peak at the
auction for less than five minutes and they don't stay.
That's the reason that you and I and everybody listening
are almost everybody listening would be to spend some time
at the auction, but there's a lot of cars to see out in
the under the tents and it's fun and, you know, you can come
with your buddies or bring the family or whatever.
So, you know, it's like a state fair type of thing.
It is and I, I'm sorry, Greg, just one of the things about
Barry Jackson and rightfully so, they've made it a lot more
difficult over the years to get close to the cars.
Once they're in the line, headed up to the, headed up to
the stage, you can't walk up on stage anymore.
You used to be able to do that.
I've been going long enough to remember when you could, you
know, walk by the car all the way through the bitters pit.
Man, they check you if you're not supposed to be there.
They don't let you be there.
It's gotten to be tougher to watch the auction over the
years, but they had to do that.
The stage used to be a mob and they've made it now.
So only the people who are supposed to be there are there.
You know, but, you know, I will say the same thing for going
to an NFL game.
Um, I've gone to lots of NFL games in my life.
I mean, let's just say a couple of dozen.
Um, I have learned that being home with a widescreen TV on,
you know, having your own beverage, having your own snacks
and you know, saving the price of a brand new widescreen TV
every time you don't go is a good idea.
And I find myself watching Barrett Jackson when I am, you
know, quite literally six miles away in my time share there.
Um, especially for the end of the day, because you're worn
out, you walked all you can walk, you know, or, you know,
whatever.
And instead of, uh, instead of enjoying a, uh, you know,
$26 slice of pizza, uh, you have two pizzas there that
you couldn't finish that were $26.
So I mean, but same with an NFL thing.
I'm not dissing on just Barrett Jackson.
It's a, it's a show and they, and they get the money for that
stuff, but, uh, I've learned that, uh, you know, to end the
day, I'll turn on Barrett Jackson and watch it on TV.
Greg, you were going to say when I stepped on you a minute ago.
No, I was going to say, I mean, if you haven't, to anyone
listening who hasn't been to Barrett Jackson in a year or
yeah, to Barrett Jackson over the past few years, like it's
worth going back.
They've, I mean, all these changes you've mentioned.
One thing that I have noticed is the atmosphere at Barrett
Jackson is a lot more family oriented.
You do see a lot of families walking around you and there's
everyone from teenagers all the way up to, um, you know, folks
in their 80s and 90s walking around looking at cars where I
remember 10 years ago, it wasn't quite like that.
It's, uh, it really does showcase that, um, it is a car
show for people of all ages and I saw a lot of young enthusiasts
walking around there and that, that just warms the heart.
Yeah, that didn't used to be the case.
I've been going to Barrett Jackson long enough to remember
when Patron Tequila came out.
And do you remember, do you remember where you're going?
Uh, they hired playboy playmates to make the margaritas and
they weren't using blenders.
They were wearing low-cut blouses and handshaking maze.
You couldn't believe how long the line was for guys lined up
to get margaritas.
Guys, you know, it's so many things.
I could so many things.
I could say now letter rip.
We'll edit them out.
It's alright.
It's alright.
I have my, uh, I have my standards.
They're very low, but I do have guys.
What is the Hagerty market rating and what does it show?
I love we know.
Um, you know, Hagerty market rating is, uh, that's our zero
to 100 scale of the current temperature of the market.
So, you know, for those of you who haven't seen the Hagerty
market rating before, um, you know, quick, uh, quick view of
it is zero is there's no market left.
Um, 50 is everything is flat.
100 is who the heck knows what cars are going for because
I just bought it and I sold it for double like 10 minutes later.
So, um, that this is our way of saying this is the current
state of the market.
And the current heat, heat index of the market.
And right now we're at a, uh, an all time low.
If I'm not mistaken, aren't we, uh, Greg?
We are currently at a 58.2, which is it, it is, uh, it is
the 15 year low flat market.
Absolutely flat market.
Now that'll change because of the action in January.
I was going to say, doesn't that seem oddly contradictory given
what just happened?
Yes and no.
I mean, I would say that, that, um, it's very hard to sell a
condition three or condition four car right now.
You have to sell it entirely on price.
Um, you know, the, the, I was talking to a vendor today who's
a large, large vendor who's a friend of mine and he's been
killed by tariffs, not just the stuff that he imports, but
the other stuff that his company has to import.
So when you buy that, that carb kit, you know, the gasket
comes from Canada, the, uh, the springs come from Massachusetts,
the, whatever comes from here and all that sort of stuff.
So there are a lot of people who don't see the economics now
and you're seeing it more.
So in restoring a car, restoring a car is now a passion project
more than it is an economical, uh, sensible thing.
Unless you can do the work yourself, if you can remove the
labor from it, you'll be fine.
Most likely I bought a set of tires, uh, year and a half ago
for $88 a tire.
They're just cart.
They're just, you know, okay, tires that I basically used to
roll around cars on instead of having old flat ones on it.
And that same tire is now 143 and because I checked yesterday
and I mean the exact same tire and there's no reason for that.
That doesn't, you know, that's not just tariffs.
That's people, you know, adding, you know, adding price to
these things.
And I think that's part of it.
And I guess the other part of it is, is that we don't want to
get out and get under like we did.
Uh, we don't want to fix things.
We want point and shoot.
And so everybody's looking for the number one and number two cars.
And unless the marketplace has a bunch of those number one and
two cars, you're going to find that they're very, very tough
to sell anything other than that right now.
So it's a change in the marketplace and maybe we just need
to readjust and say, well, let's forget about the number four
cars.
By the way, one is the best car in the world.
Just, you know, absolutely perfect.
Two is a fantastic car that you probably think is the best car
in the world.
A three is a really, really decent car, but it's got something
wrong with it.
Maybe it was painted in the wrong color.
Maybe it's got some scratches on it.
Maybe he's got some tears in the interior.
Then a number four car has both of those things and maybe some
rust in the bumper or something like that.
So I mean, just in case you don't know, but the number one is
almost a mythical car.
Most cars are threes and we aspire to get number twos.
But that's part of the problem in the marketplace right now.
People want nice and they'll pay up for it, but they don't
want anything that just needs this anymore.
They want it completely done.
Not my cars, man.
They're all number twos.
And I try and I end up buying a number twos.
Now, two years ago, I would have made a number two joke,
but you know, that's not me.
No, no, I'm going to give you a chance to take a shot at me
hearing a few more questions.
There's one that I've just teed up for you, Dave.
It's just waiting on you.
That's great.
Hargady also has several indices that track different cars.
Tell us about the rad index.
I understand it's at a new high.
What's driving that?
Yeah, so I mean, our indexes try to take a look at these segments
of the market and, you know, we'll pick out some of the
icons of that segment and, you know, sort of gauge how they're
doing.
So the red index covers some of your big cars from the 80s
and 90s, like Ferrari Testerosa's and 993911's that sort of stuff.
But yeah, that is at an all time high.
And I think that's because we are in the midst of a generational
market shift that there are gen X and millennials that are getting
more involved in the market.
And these are the cars that they're gravitating to right now.
That's not to say that they're not interested in 65 Mustangs,
but, you know, if you went to high school in the 90s and that 300
ZX twin turbo was the cool kids car in the high school parking
lot.
That's the first car you're going to get as soon as you have
the coin to buy one.
There's also a super car index.
I'm kind of curious what cars are on it and what's it show
right now?
Yeah, so that is also white hot.
And that has nothing to do with the Bachman cars yet.
I mean, we are still in the midst of looking at the market
at post January, but you know, this has some of your big cars
on your to like the the F 40, the 959 your 0506 for GT Mercedes
SLRs cars of the 90s and mid to mid 2000s early 2010s are on
this list.
And that's where there's a ton of activity.
And yeah, this this index is right up there.
Will the new Corvette ZR1 and ZR1 X eventually qualify for the
supercar index?
I feel like performance wise, they definitely qualify as super
cars, but there's they've been on the market for such little
time right now.
It's hard to say whether or not will include them in a few
years, but they're definitely cars to watch or they are selling
for if you can get your hands on one, you're going to be able
to sell it for more than you bought it for from the dealer.
So not that saying that it wouldn't go on the index, but
right now it just needs a little time on market.
Yes, little too new to know.
You also have a Ferrari index and affordable classics index
blue chip index.
Do any of the indices align with the market as a whole right
now?
You know, I would say right now some of them are some of them
are not, you know, for right right now the 50s index, which
is a lot of your jet age cars that index has taken quite a
drop while the affordable index has leveled out a little bit.
So that is more along the lines of the market ratings.
So again, the market rating is a temperature of the market as
a whole and the indexes are our way of saying, Hey, here's a
more segmented and nuanced view of the market and how these
these are doing and some of them are definitely up.
Some of them are down and some of them are flasks of pancake.
You know, it's probably time for I've been talking about this
to some other people, but then Greg and I talked about it about
a year ago.
It's probably time to do just like the Dow Jones does and get
rid of some of the cars that are in the index and update it,
especially with affordable cars.
We've got a lot of cars.
It's very heavy on 60s and 70s cars actually.
And those cars are not, you know, not not what everybody
think.
I mean, a golf GTI would probably make it onto an affordable
list where you know, in 2026 and it was a used car back when
we put this together.
So I think that's probably time that we that we get a new
generation of cars on the affordable index, you know,
completely what people do with indexes.
There's nothing nothing wrong with that.
You don't see that.
You know, Sears, Roebuck is no longer on the Dow 500.
So there's a lot of companies that, you know, have have done
well and then their time is their time is gone, even though
some of them are still, you know, still still exist.
But and that would, you know, that would revitalize it.
I think if we did that over a short period of time, maybe a
year or two to do that.
Um, I think that the British car index, the German car index,
all those have pretty much held their own.
The German cars seem to be doing better than some of the other
indexes.
Um, but it's a, you know, it's, it's just a market snapshot
and, um, uh, you know, and over time, these things will
change.
I would, you know, I would probably in the German car, I
might put an SLR in there now.
I mean, you know, that's that's sort of thing to, you know, to
update it would probably be worthwhile.
So, you know, that's just my two cents on this.
I was involved when we first did it.
That was Rob Sasse's project, actually, who's with us for a
long time now, the editor of the Porsche Panorama, uh, shout
out to Rob and, you know, he came up with that whole idea
for a market basket index and it is stayed for probably
with us for 15 of our 20, 20 years now.
So it's been very, very popular and it's a great way to
kind of put your finger on the market.
All markets don't go up forever.
Everybody, uh, should be aware of that when you buy a, when
you buy a collector car, you should be buying it because
you love it, not because you want to make money on it.
Best way to make money in a car is buy a cheap and sell it
the next day for more money, uh, because you're never going
to have to spend money on, you know, all those things, all
the maintenance and, you know, getting new tires and all
that sort of stuff, which is no longer cheap anymore, especially
for these super cars and these below super cars.
You know, I just mentioned that I bought tires for $88.
You can't buy anything on those cars for $88 and tires
are probably started, you know, for the cheap ones started
$400, uh, well, 800 and axle.
So, you know, 1600 for the car is probably really, really
cheap for some of those cars.
One of my German cars over the last 12 to 18 months has
done spectacularly according to the price guide and that's
that 99 Mercedes S 600.
I try to knock that down right away.
I checked out one the other day and it's up to almost 39
grand in number two condition.
It's a lot of car for the money even at 39,000 when you
think about it because it's a, you know, it's a great
grand tour, but, uh, the one of the problems is parts are
very expensive.
That's bad, but the good news is that so many of them have
been parted out and gone by the wayside because so many
people abandoned them when they take them to the dealer
and the dealer says, yeah, to get your car running again is
10 grand and not even the dealer.
Sometimes, sometimes it's the aftermarket guy who says,
yeah, to get your car running again is 10 grand.
Oh, I've been in that conversation.
Yeah, I'm sure, I'm sure.
And, you know, so if you, if you can pull the rear end out
of another one that's still good, you're going to save
yourself $4,500 by buying a used rear end, something like
that, but that's the way of the world with cars now.
You know, when I was a kid, which of course was when the
earth was cooling, you know, you, you, you back your car
into something and it'd be 300 bucks each to fix the car.
Now 300 bucks, you know, that's what you pay for detailing
after the car is done at the body shop.
So, you know, it's, it's, you know, obviously I'm the old
man yelling at the sun here, but things change and
change is good.
So there you are.
All right, Dave.
Here's the one I've teed up for you, dude.
Oh, I'm sorry.
My, my, my, my zoom call seems to be going, going off here.
No, no, no, this is your time to shine, Dave.
Okay.
Will the low production Ford F 150 Harley Davidson edition
pickups ever make it into the price guide?
I believe they will at some point.
Sure.
Why not?
Yeah, the newest one of those was 23 years old now and low
mile examples are starting to bring pretty good money.
You know, it's funny because I drive a F 150 limited and
the limited isn't made anymore.
So that makes my truck a collector edition now.
There you go.
So maybe we'll, maybe we'll, we'll start concentrating a
little bit more on those, you know, that's funny because a
lot of times people wonder why their car didn't make it into
the, into the price guide.
And, you know, it's, it's, it's hilarious because you know,
50 years ago when the collector car market actually, you
know, was kind of gaining steam in the 1970s.
There were, there was a history of automobiles that was
about 75 years old.
Now it's 2026 and the history of automobiles is, you know,
getting close to 130 years old.
You know, for Mercedes, I believe this is their 140th
anniversary, if I'm not mistaken this year.
So 1886 till now, I just did the math because I saw the
commercial.
But the, but so, you know, there's so many models and
sub models out there.
This is a Herculean task even to add one, one vehicle because
when we add it, we go back and add historical pricing when we
put it in there as well.
So, you know, and, and instead of concentrating on older
cars right now, we're madly adding newer cars because who
know the GT3 plus the GT3R plus the GT3RS and then, you know,
all the other, you know, permutations of Porsches, you
know, are what people want to see and what, you know, the
people, you know, want to talk about.
So they said it's, it's, it's like the never ending task.
So you have to love Porsche, the company that makes you pay
more to get less.
Yeah, that's, you know, that's precisely right.
We'll take the, we'll take the power windows out.
We'll remove the air conditioning.
We'll put in, you know, taxi cab door panels instead of, you
know, plush, you know, door panels.
We'll put in, you know, straight vinyl and we'll gladly
charge you $18,000 more.
Absolutely, absolutely.
That's a pretty good business model when you think about it.
Yeah, you know, not that this should be the rationale to add
the Harley trucks.
I just like giving you crap about it.
But you, I know I'm aware of that.
You got to admit from a company that pretty consistently
makes a half million F one fifties a year, uh, having in
addition that they only made 10,000 of, it does make it
a little rare, but that doesn't mean it's collectible.
That just means the guys like me who like Harleys think it's
cool to have a truck that says Harley on it.
Uh, Amelia Island is coming up soon.
You gentlemen going to be there?
And if so, what events are you looking forward to attending?
Well, everybody's attending the event on Thursday night
which is my golf tournament.
So, uh, I mean, that's, that's obviously the, the, the, you
know, the, the event of there's something about a concord
that goes on there too.
Greg, do you remember that?
What concord?
I'm, I'm, I'm here for the, uh, US appraisal open.
Yeah.
No, there's a lot of events now.
There's a good thing.
There's a good auction.
Uh, there's also, of course, a broad arrow auction.
I'm looking forward to both of those and they're both very
good sales and they, I liked, I liked the lineup coming up.
I, uh, I'm very, very happy about that.
Um, and then the concord, which has moved to Saturday.
Um, so no, it is now on Saturday.
Um, and so the, uh, the cars and community event is on Sunday.
So, um, um, you know, and that's happened in a lot of different, uh,
different places now that they've moved the concord to a Saturday.
Um, so I'm looking forward to that.
Um, I'm judging, um, and, uh, I'm judging with a friend of mine.
So, uh, I can't believe they let him in to judge again.
I guess he must have gotten a day pass from his, uh, from his jailer,
but, um, I'm looking forward to that and, um, I'm, I think it's going
to be a very strong show and Amelia Island is a great place to visit
for a car show.
Um, it's a, it's one of my, it's one of my favorite events.
And, and that's that, um, I'm not adding any more events to my calendar,
but basically I'm just, I'm just happy to go to events like this
that I like.
I must have missed my invitation for the golf tournament.
Are you going to be there?
Uh, no, honestly, we, we decided to forego Amelia this year
in order to get a long beach.
But I want to be invited.
Come on.
I just wanted to, I just wanted another reason to give you a crack.
You're invited and you can bring a guest.
How's that?
Yeah, I got mine a month ago.
Uh, so I appreciate you mailing that.
And the money that you said, I had the A list and that already went
out in case we didn't get, you know, the 50 people that we need.
I didn't even make the alternates.
Actually, uh, actually I was, uh, um, I've got to go through the list
because we've got, uh, we like to have, you know, as many as about
50 people there.
It's at, uh, uh, a mini links place.
Obviously I don't play real golf.
I play, uh, you know, miniature golf.
This has a great history.
This is the third year.
He brings us on clubs.
And yeah, right.
And I'm happy to say this year for the first time it's a charity event.
We're, uh, partnering with the, uh, the Nassau County Humane Society,
Nassau County, not the Nassau County in New York, the Nassau County
that, uh, is, uh, encompasses Amelia Island and it's $20 entrance fee.
And, um, so, uh, you know, bring your, bring your, bring your clubs,
bring your foursome and play around.
It's a seven to nine on the Thursday night of things, but you got to
get in touch with me.
So you got to figure out how to get in touch with me to get your, uh,
invitation.
So if I got an invitation, I would have come.
So there you have an invitation now.
So why don't you come?
Oh, great.
Now I got, now I got to get on VRBO and rent that house.
I thought you, I didn't know you were going to be there.
I'm sorry.
Um, no, I couldn't catch an assignment.
So it was tough for me to justify, uh, all the expense of going.
Um, yeah, I get that.
I think I have an assignment for Monterey this year.
So we will be back in Monterey.
Uh, now at Amelia Island, are there cars you're keeping an eye
on, either at broad arrow or good.
What has your interest?
Oh boy.
Last time, last time I looked, I actually, um, there was a, uh, a
couple of different vintage Bentley's that I was looking at, but
I don't remember the models.
I have to tell you, I have not been doing my homework for the last
week on this because I've got another project going on right now.
Um, I don't have a really good overview right now.
I just remember looking at the, looking at the cars and thinking
it was a really good selection.
Um, it's, it's always, you know, I, the reason I like auctions is
because of what pops out when you're there.
Greg, I know you'd say the exact same thing.
You look at the cars, you look at them online, or if there's a
printed auction catalog back in the day, when that was a thing, you'd
look at it and you just say, yeah, that's kind of interesting.
And then you get there and you see this car and it's just dropped
dead gorgeous because of the restoration, because of the colors
or that it's a, you know, it's just so interesting because it's a,
you know, it's a barn find or something like that.
And then you kind of follow it through on the day and that's
what I like to do to kind of, you know, not have anything that
just is, is going to be, I'm not in the market to buy right now.
So I'm just in the market to watch.
And I'm looking forward to having a couple of cars that I follow
when I get there.
Yeah, the, the, the cars that I'm looking at, um, obviously
modern Ferrari's because we need to, um, we need to definitely
see exactly where the market's heading post Scottsdale.
I mean, we've got that black Enzo at broad arrow that is, um,
estimated at 12 to 16 million.
Um, they've got an SP to Monza.
Yeah, that was, yeah, that was another car that I just couldn't.
Yeah, that's going to be interesting too.
Yeah.
So, so they have some modern Ferraris that I'm very interested in.
And then just interesting wise, gooding has a set of unrestored cars
from, uh, they have a 51 Vincent Comet that's, uh, in patina
to unrestored condition, uh, 59 to 50 GT, pen and farina coupe,
um, a 356 Porsche with a roundels on it.
That's a really, really well aged on the car.
So, um, original cars are very interesting.
So I'm very curious to see how these do.
We've covered all the auction stuff.
We've talked about indexes.
We've talked about what surprised you, what raised your eyebrows.
Have there been any changes in your personal collections in the last few months?
Dave, you say you're no longer shopping.
That usually means your garage is full.
Yeah, pretty much I had to buy a car for my bride.
So, uh, we did buy a new car in our, in our household, but not, uh,
I would say nothing exciting.
Um, and, um, so I'm concentrating.
I have a car that's, uh, I have actually right now, I have three cars
in restoration.
So I am under the forced austerity plan of not buying any more cars
until, uh, two, two of them are done.
And I will reference the fact that, uh, um, you know, I said earlier
that the price of restorations has gone up.
I'm very fortunate in that I saved a metric boat ton to put it in
the, uh, in the popular family edition of what I would say,
a metric boat ton of parts for these cars.
So I bought them at, uh, you know, maybe, uh, let's call them 1990
and 2000 prices.
So I'm very, very happy that, you know, with the exception of some
of the expendables, things like tires and batteries and all that
sort of stuff, I have them already in stock.
And I'm very glad I do when I look at, oh, a rear bumper that I bought,
uh, five years ago that was freshly chromed and kept very nice.
And I paid an ounce, you know, outrageous $600 for it to replace
it right now, it'd be $1,500 because I shopped one the other day
and that's not unusual anymore.
So, uh, no, it isn't, uh, like I mentioned earlier in the show,
uh, the shot and Freud express at 99 s 600 is, uh, at the body shop
right now and it's being painted and you cannot source front
or rear bumper covers for it.
So much so that the body shop took them off the car and repaired them
and it's, they're getting ready to paint them.
You know, in the past, those bodies will do that for you.
I didn't know that you got the presidential, right?
You didn't get the, hey, you leave Earl shy alone.
That's quality work.
Greg, anything new in your garage?
Cars, bikes, snowmobiles, toboggans, anything?
Uh, you know, nothing new.
I am very space limited with my one car garage, which is probably
all for the better send them to Kansas every month.
I have room, send them to Kansas.
You know, you just reminded me of something that I'm going to,
uh, this has nothing to do with cars, but on the creepiness
scale, we, we, we had, uh, we had snow coming in over the weekend.
I live in Northern Virginia and, uh, uh, I asked ALAXA whose
name I'm not going to say because she would probably respond
at this point.
What's the weather forecast and ALAXA responded to me.
It looks like three to four inches of snow, Dave.
Plenty of time.
I mean, uh, what a great time to use that new electric snowblower
you bought last year.
How creepy is that?
And that is why I don't have one of those in my house.
It's bad enough our phones will listen to everything we say.
Yeah.
Next is Dave.
I'm afraid I can't do that.
Dave.
Daisy, Daisy.
No, thank you kids.
We've been speaking to Dave Kenny and Greg Engold of the
Haggerty Price Guide.
Gentlemen, please tell us where we can find you online and on
social media.
Greg, you go first this time.
Well, yeah, I'm, I'm doing a bit of a social media hiatus,
but if you want to find me, I'm on Facebook or on Instagram,
Greg Engold, pretty easy to find, but more likely than not,
you're going to find me on Haggerty Insider pumping out
articles here and there.
So look for me there.
Pretty much the same for me.
I'm also on Blue Sky.
It's Dave Kenny on Facebook.
There's about 15 Dave Kenny's on Facebook, but I'm the one with
the goofy picture of myself.
And, and you know, it's funny.
I think Greg and I came to that conclusion.
I have been on a social media hiatus for the last few months.
I posted, I think five things since the turn of the new year
and I'm kind of tired of, you know, of hearing everybody's
opinion of, you know, what I've done right or what I've done.
Everything.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So, you know, I think that, I think that it's a great, you
know, a great equalizer.
I'm also on LinkedIn.
I believe you are too as well, Greg.
So you can get me on LinkedIn, but I'm not looking for a job.
So I don't go to LinkedIn too often.
I'm trying to get out of all the jobs I have now.
That's what I'm trying to do.
Greg and Dave, thanks as always for being with us.
We really appreciate you taking the time.
It's always fun.
Thank you guys.
Really appreciate it.
Always fun having Dave and Greg on.
Yeah, they've always got great information.
I was kind of surprised by how the market has flattened up to
a point, you know, because after seeing all those sales,
you're thinking, my God, it's still on fire.
Well, like we talked about before the show, rich people are
still doing rich people stuff and will continue to do so.
Yeah.
And the other thing is blue chips are always blue chips.
So, you know, you start talking about 62 Ferrari 250 GTOs.
Nobody's surprised when that car brings mid eight figures.
That's what they do.
You know, you start talking about super rare Ferraris and
then it's one of one because of the colors that it has.
Those are going to bring big money.
I am still really shocked at $259 million in one day.
That's a quarter of a billion dollars in one day.
So that's a sledgehammer.
And also keep in mind, you know, would they move 4500 cars?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Out there.
Just an insane amount.
And we've had this conversation with John Cramon, rest his
soul and with the other guys from Mecom and we've discussed
this at length.
Think about how much paperwork is involved any time you buy a
car.
Multiply that by more than 4000.
Yeah.
And they process that crap in two weeks at any rate.
Pretty extraordinary stuff and I say it every week and I
tell everybody, thank you so much for spending time with
Driven Radio and we do love this.
This is still my favorite thing to do all week.
And with a few exceptions that I can't mention here because
this is PG.
We do love what we do.
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That's B R E T T at drivenradioshow.com.
I am Brett Hatfield from Mark L Groves and Goblin Bowlin.
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We'll see you next time here on Driven Radio.
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