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Expert Advice for Technicians on Business, Tools, and Personal Life Balance with David Carrol, Part 2
Expert Advice for Technicians on Business, Tools, and Personal Life Balance with David Carrol, Part 2
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About this episode
David Carroll returns for part two of his insightful discussion with Jeff Compton, diving deeper into the challenges and rewards of running an automotive shop. They explore the importance of finding balance between work and personal life, the struggles of hiring and mentoring technicians, and the necessity of adapting business practices for success. Carroll shares his journey of overcoming fears, making crucial changes to his shop, and the impact of mentorship on his growth. This episode is packed with practical advice for technicians and shop owners alike.
Topics:
work-life balance
business management
mentorship
hiring challenges
pricing strategies
customer relationships
technician shortage
tool ownership
industry changes
In this episode, Jeff Compton continues his discussion with David Carrol, diving into the pressures faced by automotive technicians to obsess over their work. David emphasizes the unrealistic expectation for technicians to diagnose issues perfectly every time, advocating instead for a healthy work-life balance. Additionally, they discuss the frustrations of transitioning traditional family businesses to newer, more efficient methods, drawing on David's own experiences with the challenges and successes of implementing change.
00:00 Adversity led to strategic business improvements.
06:20 Offered advice based on shared experiences.
12:48 Discussion about vehicle inspection and maintenance issues.
19:36 Over-promised, struggling to guide and mentor.
23:32 Balancing work and family life is challenging.
26:41 Challenges of being a diagnostic technician.
32:02 Despite challenges, achieved great success but then slowed.
37:56 Leaving allowed strong finish, seeking motivated helper.
43:30 Struggling to find qualified workers with tools.
48:02 Start with basic tools, and build your own.
56:30 Need money to solve technician shortage problems.
59:33 Thank you for your valuable time and insights.
Filter:
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Technical
Too Afraid to Ask
Car
Master Tech
"...ding tools for you, but I'm not going to give you master tech pay with no tool set. You know, it's, it's. I see..."
Car
Ford Edge
"...ity, but I mean, like, I was right on the tipping edge. I was like, listen, I'm done. I can't, I can't d..."
Adversity led to strategic business improvements.
Offered advice based on shared experiences.
Discussion about vehicle inspection and maintenance issues.
Over-promised, struggling to guide and mentor.
Balancing work and family life is challenging.
Challenges of being a diagnostic technician.
Despite challenges, achieved great success but then slowed.
Leaving allowed strong finish, seeking motivated helper.
Struggling to find qualified workers with tools.
Start with basic tools, and build your own.
Need money to solve technician shortage problems.
Thank you for your valuable time and insights.
Select text to request an explanation
That's most tech's dream, is to open a shop and run their own gig and be their own boss. He said, if you did it, you're not going to be happy going back to work for somebody else. Like, just make it work, man. Like, you've got it there. Just make it work.
That's David Carroll on this week's episode of the Jaded Mechanic podcast with Jeff Compton, where today is part two of a conversation they started a week ago. And if you haven't had a chance to listen to that episode just yet, make sure you do that first. Part two, though, will pick up right where they left off on this week's episode of the Jada Mechanic podcast. I don't think Lucas could have gone like he talked about. He was at that tipping point where he could. He was going to take a job as a dealer. I thank God every day that that didn't happen because I know him well enough now to know he would not have been happy. I know exactly what his personality is.
You're the same way. I can tell you get to that level of expertise and smarts. And I'm not saying I'm at it now, but it becomes very much where it's hard to watch the little things that are not being done right and not, like, get Uber focused on them, you know what I mean? This place sucks because of this little thing. It's so hard not to, because if it was your business and you had been in business for yourself, you wouldn't do it that way. Right? And we get hyper focused on that. So the. The 114 seven, just. Yeah.
When people joke at me, it's just.
Like a little poke in the eye, man. I was like, wow, you just couldn't come up that extra $300 for a year, huh?
That's every person at a dealership. I think they could have to be, like, some kind of level of slime, you know, before they're allowed to be working there. Like, it's just. Ah, gross anyway, you know? Yeah. The thing you're talking about where it's like, you make, you know, all. I made a hundred thousand last year just as a round number, but I work 72 hours every week. You know what I mean? It's just like. It's just like that when you break it down to what you actually paid yourself, you should have been working for somebody else, right.
Without the stress and everything else.
There's a lot of owners that would literally make double what they make a year if they went worked at a properly operating shop.
Yeah. So you went to ast, had the kind of revelation, I guess you could call it, for not going to use the word epiphany, that you. How did you come back and change? What did you do?
So while I was out there, I had signed up for the a sog dinner, and I had signed it before I went. I had this whole thing. I'm gonna go, you know, do this. I'm gonna go to the ace hog dinner. And my. Luckily, my. She's my wife now, but she was my girlfriend back then. She went with me, and she is a social butterfly.
I am not. It is very difficult for me to get into a public setting and just start talking to people. Now, if I so happen to fall into a conversation with you, I can talk to you for hours, but I'm not the guy that's gonna be like, hey, my name's David. How you doing? You know?
Yeah.
So we go to the a sog dinner, and I'm just over in the corner, like, curled up, and she's like, come on, we gotta go talk to people. Who's this? Who's that? And I'm like, well, that's Lucas, that's David, that's Scott, that's Mark. And we go, actually, she went to the bar to go get a drink. She started talking to Scott Palava and got to chatting with him, and she's explaining a little bit, a little bit about my situation on. He's like, oh, he should sign up for the mastermind group. And she was like, well, he did. He just hadn't heard anything back. So he comes over the table, we start talking.
Mark Perkins comes over, we start talking, and they're like, resubmit your stuff, and when you get back, submit it straight to me. We'll go through it. We'll get you in the group. I said, okay, cool. So I joined the mastermind group, and, man, talk about an eye opening experience. Like, these guys were giving me advice on stuff to do, and I was just like, you're going to run me out of business. There's no way I can charge this much for that. There's no way I can charge for testing.
And, like, there's no Way. There's not a chance. Like, I'll be out of business in weeks. So a few weeks of them just constantly pushing into my head. I finally started making little changes. Like, I think when I got into the mastermind group, my labor rate was 104 an hour.
Wow.
Yeah. Doing diesel work and, um.
Bargain.
Yeah. We got into a meeting, and they were like, you better jump into 140, like, now, right away you like, and you need to be higher than that, but let's just go to that for now.
Yeah.
And they poked and they poked and they poked, and finally I upped it and I was like, man, I'm going to be meeting with you guys in a few weeks about how I'm going out of business. I hope you guys got opening. Well, surprisingly, or I guess unsurprisingly, being on the back end of this whole deal. I didn't lose customers. I didn't lose work. I started working on parts, matrixes and all that stuff and charging appropriately and, you know, I upped my warranty to give people that warm and fuzzy about, you know, paying an increased price and all. And, yeah, we lost customers like they said I would, but it was the exact customers they said I would lose. The bottom feeders, the ones that were, every time they come in, they're pain the ass.
The ones that are trying to bring their own parts, stuff like that. Like, I also stopped that cold back then, too. I mean, I was something I would do from time to time, and nine times out of ten, they supply their own parts, and it bites you. And I made all these changes, and all of a sudden, the business started to flourish. It was insane. I couldn't believe it. So then I'm in the meetings with these people, you know, my peers, and I'm starting to give them some advice about, you know, the changes that they helped me make. And I'm like, hey, do this, do that, do this, do that.
Like, you know, these roles, they're telling you this because it works. I'm an example. Six months ago, I was a mess. I'm not perfect now, but, like, I've got money in the bank. Like, we're buying new equipment. We're doing this. I'm about to, you know, I'm ready to hire somebody. Like, we're.
We're taking off.
Yeah.
And they ended up approaching me about moving into, like, a leadership role within the mastermind group.
Very cool.
Oh, I gladly, you know, accepted and started being able to help my fellow peers on a weekly basis. And I like to think that I offered some good advice, but it was all stuff that I'm regurgitating that had been given to me. I'm not coming up with anything new. I'm telling you what other people told me that had been told by other people to them. And that's kind of what I started trying to do in the Asaw group more was, see these people that are making these choices. I'm like, hey, I was, you do this and then you see them not make it. And I get frustrated because I, I like, if they could only understand I was you, I was doing the exact same stuff, and I was burying myself in the same exact hole. And I literally only had to change a handful of things that are easy physically to do, tough mentally to do, and everything turned around literally almost overnight.
Just listen to these people. They're trying to help you not make mistakes that they've made.
Yeah. You know, you finally get to hire somebody to help you out. Right? And then I think that's a such a crucial first step. Young Chris Enright. Young Chris Enright's not young, but he's younger than me. He's talking about he's going to be hiring his first employee really soon. You know what I mean? And it's, I think for you, probably, and I want to say that likely it's going to be the same for him after that. There is no ceiling, you know what I mean? Like, it's because it's just that little bit of help.
You get to focus on even more of the important things. Right. You don't have to fix every car. Right. Somebody else is fixing the cars. You're then focusing on just a little tweaks of what's got to be done in the business. So. Must have been exciting, eh?
It was. It was exciting. It was very nerve wracking. I had ended up, I'd ended up bringing my wife on temper again. At the time, she was my girlfriend, or she might have been fiance that time, but I brought her into the office because she was working, but she was going from one job to another job. So she had a little lapse, and I was like, hey, just come run the office for a little bit, you know, until you're into the next position or whatever. And I never had anybody work with me. She came in, started handling stuff in the office, and I was able to stay out in the shop and do what I do best.
And I was like, man, this is amazing. For years, I thought I needed a technician, and here I had somebody in the office, and it made my life as a technician so much easier. So I preach that now, too. Like, you know, all you guys that think you need techs, you probably don't need a tech if you don't have somebody up front. You need somebody handling customers. You're a tech because you're a tech guy.
Yeah.
You know, if you were more of a people person, you would have opened up, been a service advisor and hired a good tech to work for you off the bat.
Yep.
And, you know, that was a big game changer for me once I realized, like, you know, I just needed somebody upfront to deal with the part that I don't like doing again. I'm not a social person. I don't like dealing with people. And it was an immediate relief. Well, she started her new job, and I lost her as a service advisor, and I had to be the guy back in the office and back in the shop, and I was like, man, this is awful. Why did I do this to myself? So I had a friend of mine, and I know they say don't hire friends. I've got two stories of this. One of each side of the coin.
Hired a friend to work the office. His wife had her own mobile dog grooming company and kind of like, worked in the background, helping with, like, the paperwork and stuff of that. But he was full. His full time job was working for a bus company, doing like, their safety coordination stuff and all. And he just, it was a toxic environment. He got tired of it. So he eventually was like, you know, I don't know what I'm gonna do, but I'm gonna leave here. I can't do it anymore.
So he left. I brought him on board here, back to awesomeness. He's a great people person. I didn't have to deal with the people. I could deal with the shop. Over time, he started to learn what I would do with certain situations, how I would handle stuff. So then he became his own, like, independent person in office, you know, if it came to needing to handle situation in the shop, he knew, hey, I can call and order this part. Dave's not going to be mad at me, because this is exactly what Dave would do.
This is how we need to handle it. We have policies in place, and I know how to follow those policies. Phenomenal employee. Still one of my best friends to this day. I knew I only had him temporarily because his wife was taking the mobile business to a fixed location. So I knew I was going to lose him when the fixed location opened up. So worked with him for a few months. It was just him and I, and I ended up getting another friend of mine that I had gotten into my old dealership years prior.
I got him from the dealership and brought him in here, and we did pretty well. He ended up being the person I had left several years prior. Like, I got him into the dealership to try and help build him up. Hopefully he could be very familiar with the brand and the testing procedures, and eventually just know it like the back of his hand. Well, he didn't really do a whole lot of growth in that time and was pretty much the same guy I had left several years prior. But talking to him, he would tell you that he was the man, you know? So I didn't know any better till I got him in the shop. He was good overall. Just kind of lazy.
A little lazy. Just, you know, didn't have a lot of follow through.
Brought some bad habits, probably, with him from the dealer.
Exactly, exactly. And I thought, no problem, you know, we'll work those out of you. We'll figure it out. You know, we've got these policies in place. Once you learn how to do these and do it the way that I want it done here in this shop, like, we'll be good. Overall, it was a good experience. Just. There was a lot of frustration.
He was with me for a little over a year, and it just got to the point where I had the. Had to sit down and have a come to Jesus talk with him on Friday, because we just had so many little issues, like him not doing a DVI on a vehicle, but we do a DVI on every vehicle, you know, unless I'd say otherwise. Yeah, there are some that, you know, they'll come in. They've been here, you know, last week, and they came in for another issue this week. I'm not gonna redo a DVI. We just had it, you know, and he backed this vehicle out and, you know, hadn't done the DVI, asked him about. And he was like, oh, I didn't know. You want me to, you know, not do one on that? Or.
I didn't know. You want me to do one? I said, well, we do one on every vehicle. Why wouldn't you do one on that? He's like, well, sometimes you don't have me do them. I'm like, well, is. Are there sometimes that I don't have you do them? Do I tell you specifically not to do it? He said, well, yeah, okay, so you know that you're supposed to do one on this one because I didn't tell you not to do one. Well, he did a DVI on it, and there was a few thousand hours worth of work that was found on the vehicle that it needed, and it sold, and it got done. And there were a couple other issues that week. So that Friday, I sat him down, and I was like, hey, you know, let me go over all this stuff with you.
Like, you know, part of the purpose of that DVI is to find us some work. You know, we're not going to make stuff up. There's always legitimate stuff you can find. Yeah. Especially with these diesel trucks. There's always something. I was like, but the other thing is, it's. It's a CYA setup.
You know, we can. If we see a problem, we can document it, we can quote it to them. If they decline it, we gave them the option to do it and they said no. So if something happens after they leave here, we're relieved from liability. We told you that you needed this and you didn't do it. Yeah, not our problem, you know, so I just kind of laid that out to him. I told him, you know, it's. It's one of those things.
If I have to go behind you all the time for stuff, I might as well just do it myself, right? At this point, I was back in the office because my, my buddy that was the advisor up front, he had left to go help his wife set up that. So, you know, we had. Me and my tech have been working together solo for probably like four or five months at this point. And I was doing some of the diag work, but I was mostly focused on, like, the business stuff. He was pretty much in the shop working alone. I do some of the more complicated diags for him. You know, we. And I'll say we had a heck of a year.
I mean, it was the best year we'd ever had. And, you know, it turned out great overall, but it was a lot of frustrations that came from hiring a friend because there are so many instances where if it was anybody else, I would have fired them on the spot and I would have been justified in doing so, you know, doing a steering and suspension inspection that were paid for, missing that it needed upper and lower ball joints on both sides. On a Ram 2500, which is, you know, it's not uncommon at all. Tie rod end. That was literally about to fall out of it. It was so bad. You know, we. We'd done all this.
We'd done a bunch of other work. He'd done the steering and suspension inspection. Missed that stuff. Customer goes off to have it aligned because at the time, we didn't have alignment equipment. He comes back from the alignment shop and says, they told me I need ball joints. I need a tie rod end. I just paid you guys to inspect the steering and on this thing. So he brings it in.
I check it. Ball joints are bad. Tie rod ends about to fall apart. I said, you know what? We're gonna take care of that for you. We're not gonna make you like we charged you to check it. We missed it all that's gonna be on us. We're gonna take care of it for free. So he left it with us.
I did all the ball joints, did the towel rod end on it, and also had a sway bar and link that was jacked up on it did that. You know, if it was a ticket item, that probably would have been a $3,000 ticket.
Yeah.
You know, and that was money out the door that we lost. And also a customer. The more important thing to me was that it was a customer that had been coming to me for years. And because of what my technician did or didn't do, I risked losing him.
Yeah.
Because it's a huge trip. It's a val. Violation of trust at that point. You know, I paid you guys to do this. You told me all was good, I go somewhere else, and it is not good.
Yep.
So, you know, that's why I went through the extreme of doing everything out of my own pocket, because I wanted to. To keep his trust, you know, hey, we screwed up. Not, you know, I'll take care of you. I got it. And honestly, I haven't seen that customer since then, so we probably lost them. Well, because of this, you know, so stuff like that. And, you know, I can argue for both sides of the hire a friend or don't hire a friend coin, because I had an amazing service advisor that knew the difference between professional and personal. And if I had, you know, it's not like I never had to correct him or never had to go over anything with him.
He just knew at the end of the day, it was business. It wasn't, you know, I'm gonna correct you on the things you did wrong, and we can go out and have, you know, they dinner and a beer later, like, we're cool. It's fine. Works work.
Yeah.
Technician, not so much. Everything was personal with him, and that's why he ended up leaving after I. I had that talk on that Friday, told him, you know, these things you've missed, like, these are some serious issues and all that. Monday, he came in and gave me his two weeks notice. It's just, you know, it. It was a sigh of relief on my part because I didn't have to fire him. But it was also frustrating because we were also three weeks booked out on work, and then now that means I had to go back to doing the office, doing the tech work all by myself.
It leaves you an alert, for sure. I mean, it's, it's the right thing to happen. You know, I don't, I don't want to say right thing to do because you didn't, you didn't do it, but you kind of good on you for at least making it clear to him that, like, this can't continue. Right? And this is what it really costs me when, when the process is not followed, because that's, that's, it's one thing to just, like, we sometimes, you know, you see it all the time.
Right?
Well, somebody broke something, I'm gonna fire that person. That's so not like it doesn't, it doesn't make anything better. It's like you recite what the process is and this is what happens. And, you know, breaking stuff is a whole other thing. There isn't a decent mechanic out there that hasn't broke stuff. I don't care who you are, if you claim you've never broken anything, you're a liar. But when we, when we go back to, it's like, okay, so why did it break? Okay. You were rushing or you didn't follow service procedure.
Okay, so why didn't you look up service procedure? Right. That's when we get to the big, the real reason why. I feel too rushed. Like, I don't have time to read the service information. Okay, so why do you feel so rushed? Well, did you come in late or, you know, am I overbooking? That's the thing. Like, guys get mad at me sometimes or they look at me like I crazy when I say the why is so important. It is. Let's talk about why it happened.
Right. If you're just being negligent. Didn't bother, didn't see the screw, whatever. That's a different thing. You broke the door panel. But when it's like, well, because, you know, we're backed up today because of something that happened and you're still over promising. You're still over promising. I'm trying at that point.
Yeah, it breaks, but they're, it's breaking because they have your best intentions in mind, and it doesn't seem like it at the time. They think you're going around just trying to break shit. I'm trying to rescue you. I'm trying to get the workload done today so that you don't become more stressed tomorrow. And it just builds and builds and builds and builds. That's the part that, like, when people don't want to have the why discussion, it just makes me want to pull my hair out. It's the same as the way you react, because we know that a lot of the time, that's what's happening. That's the backstory of the why is.
Ah, well, you know, we, we. Things ran low. I over promised. They're just trying to get the work done. You know, it's, it's too bad. I, you know, I've never had to hire or fire, you know, I've. But I've been very fortunate that a lot of people I've worked with, we've become friends, but there's also been some times where it's like, you know, or you, not so much friends mentorship that develops into friends, and sometimes you come over and they're like, they're asking you for your help and you're giving them guidance, and it's like you see the same thing happening again and again and again and again, and it's like, okay, so are you effing with me or what? Like, I mean, how do I make this clear? This is, this is the process that will help you. And sometimes I just, I struggle with that.
I'm not the best instructor. I'm not the best. It's the reason I don't put up technical stuff in content is because, like, I can show you how. What I found and how I fixed it. But for me to sometimes explain, as soon as there's any kind of pushback at all, I, I take it, like, right to the ego, where it's just like, want to say. I want to say, shut up and let's, like the way I was raised. Don't talk. Now.
When you're done listening, you probably won't have to ask the question. That's how I was raised. So it's like when somebody, when I, when I say to do something that somebody wants to come at me with, why, it's a really hard thing for me. I say it all the time, but it's really hard for thing for me to implement. It's tough, really? Yes. So the friend thing is like, you know, it's tough. I'm glad I don't have to be in the hiring and firing, you know, position.
It requires a lot of patience to train somebody. And, like, I I think that most good techs have problems training people because we're, we're in a mindset that, you know, I just want to get in. I know how to do this. I don't, I don't want to stop and slow myself down and teach you how to do this or deal with questions or like, you know, and for me, a lot of the times, it's, I see these guys that want to learn, but they don't want to put the effort in to do it. You know, it's, you know, oh, well, how'd you learn this? Well, you know, when I worked at Ford, I sat down in the evenings. If I had a problem vehicle during the day, and I'd go through the wiring diagrams in the evening and I'd go through the pinpoint test and, like, why do they want me to, what are they trying to get me to find? That's what I want to do. And I'm at the point now, or, and I have been for years. Nine times out of ten, I don't even need to use a pinpoint test.
If it's electrical issue, I jump right to the wiring diagram and I know exactly what I'm looking for and how to get there. I don't need to go test all this other stuff that isn't going to lead me or at the end it's going to tell me to put a PCM in it. And that's not what the problem is, you know?
Yeah.
And. But a lot of people don't have that hunger anymore. They don't want to. They don't want to take the hours to learn how to do it. And I'm not the person to spoon feed you if you're not going to take the time to do it, I'm not going to take the time to do it for you.
Yeah. Brian and I had a, had an interesting conversation the other day about that, because he pointed out how, because again, the conversations always pop up about, you know, why we're losing text to other industries. Right. Or why we're losing young people to other skill traits. And, you know, he talked about what you got to be, to be in that top 1015 percent. Like he is. The top 5% of ability is, you know, all those hours that you've got to spend, like you said, just like the example. And I had to do, obsessing over, I have to fix it, I have to know.
So I would go home and rack my brain until I found the problem. Right. And so I talked to him about it, and it's like, for us, it's normalized. It's just what we do, it's normalized. But the idea that it scares me that the narrative in this industry is becoming is that it's expected that you have to do that. You know what I mean? Like there's all this free training and I used to say it, there's all this free training. There's no excuse to be untrained and there isn't. But to normalize it, to say that you're just going to have to come home from your job and then tune into, you know, training for 2 hours every night.
Um, a lot of us are not in the dynamic of maybe the family where our spouse is okay with that or our responsibilities don't allow it. So, you know, I want to be, I'm slightly changing my perspectives as I, as I age out to realize that, like the young people, I shouldn't be telling them what I used to tell them ten years ago, which is you're going to have to go home and you're going to have to obsess over this if you want to be good. The reality is the industry needs to, like, really bring their game up. So it's like you're giving them the training where it's lucrative and it's paid for and it's at a time where they don't have to sacrifice so much because, you know, there's, it's, it's not by accident that so many technicians have a divorce story. And why is that? Well, because I either I work 72 hours a week, right. I worked till 1011 at night. So I had a spouse, but I never saw her except when I, you know, laid down next to her and she was already asleep or, you know, I did all this to provide for her or I stared at my phone and my computer at night after I got home, racked about the vehicle that's still sitting in my bay. That's not a good environment that everybody's spouse is necessarily going to be okay for.
They can't understand it and we shouldn't be doing it. So I struggle with that. I really do now in my career because I don't want to do it, you know.
No, and there's a counterpoint to what you're saying about how, you know, people shouldn't be expected to, if they want to be a good tech, to go home and do this free, you know, free training and rack their brain about this stuff. There's only, they should be good technicians. People that want to be good technicians should absolutely be paid for the training that they do. It should be on the clock, it should be on the job. But their caveat here is that to be a, what you'd consider probably top 1015 percent of the industry technician. Those guys, us, you know, we're not going to go home and do it because we have to, we're going to do it because, like you said, we obsess about it. Like, there is something broken in me that makes me obsess about this stuff and have to know. I don't know what it is.
I don't think there's a medical diagnosis for it. But a lot, there's a reason why a lot of the good, the great technicians all vibe so well. It's because it's the same mentality and we're not like that because people made us that way. That's who we were. That's how we got into this industry, is obsession. That's why we did it. We didn't fall into this because it was the only thing that we could get a job at. It's because we had some technical obsession and it turned into a career like this.
So I'm not going to say that you should expect guys to go home and do this because most, you know, 90% of the people that get into this field are not going to become that level of skilled and, you know, a good diagnostician and stuff like that. Like, some people get it, some people don't.
Yeah.
The people that want to be the average technician shouldn't have to go home and do that. It shouldn't be expected. And those that are going to be good, great technicians, they're not going to be expected to do it, but they're going to do it anyway because that's just who they are. That's what they want to do.
Yeah. And it's tough because everybody, I think when they think about, I want to hire a diagnostic technician and I make this point all the time. If you. When, when I got out of the dealership and I started selling myself and, you know, people would say, can you do diag? Yep. Because where I came from, I could, I did that, but I wasn't at the level that, like, so many of the other guys were, where it's like, I came home and I obsessed about this, you know what I mean? Like, I was always learning little things on the side just because I, I watch more YouTube than I watch tv. So it was like I would sit there bored and it's like, oh, scanner Danner, cool. But, like, I didn't come home and obsess over Chrysler. When I left the dealer at the end of the day, you know what I mean? Like, I didn't because it was like, the information that I needed was there at the dealership the next day, it was going to be another day.
I was going to work and keep plugging away at it. I came home and to unplug from work, I still was looking at car stuff, but it was like how to fix a different make and model or fundamentals that I wasn't getting taught on the job. When people want to go and hire these diagnostic techs, I think it just becomes accepted now that what we're really trying to find is that guy or gal that's obsessed and spends that kind of those hours. And here's the thing people, not all of them do. They come to work and they can do the job and they can diagnose most of the cars, but they might diagnose 85%, the other 15%, nobody's perfect. If you want that guy that can diagnose 100% there, you're not probably ever going to see one in your career. A lot of people, because it's just, they're just not out there. You know, we call them unicorns for a reason.
I mean, we could name who they are, right. And, and why? It's just like you said, it's that obsession, so it's tough, man. It really is. And I, you know, I don't want to think that. Tell everybody that you have to do that. I used to say that you got to go and be sick about this stuff. No, man, you just got to come to work and it's like, do the. Be the best that you can be when you come in.
But our lives need to be healthy and happy away from the job.
Absolutely.
And that's what's really key. I lived a life where I would stay at work and tackle complex problems because I didn't want to be home. I was in a relationship. I didn't want to be there. I didn't like where I lived. I didn't like the relationship. It was a retreat for me. It was an escape.
But that's not healthy, you know? So you can't use work that way.
Either, you know, because eventually, you know, most people do get to a happy point in their life where they do want to be home, that you do want to be fishing, you don't want to be obsessing about it after hours, you know, and that wouldn't have been sustainable for you because you, you're not always going to not want to be home.
Yeah. And, you know, there's so many variables. Like, I don't, I hate to think of the people that, like, missed out on so many things with their kids and their wives and whatnot, because they were trying to build the business. It's, it's it's not that it's not admirable, but I, you know, I hope that everybody can. Can survive it and realizes that sacrifice is what it actually does, you know, because it's one thing, you know, your kids don't care if they wear the nicest shoes to school, you know, if they never saw you.
Yep.
Right. Like, or they only saw you one day a week. Right. I grew up like that. My. My father would do side work. He was an auto body collision guy, so he would do stuff in the garage on weekends. We were always doing that.
And so did I see my dad on weekends. Yeah, I saw him when he came in for supper, you know, or if I went out into the garage, he was working on something, but he wasn't like, you know, every weekend he was available. You know what I mean? Mom was, but not dad. It was just part of what we went through. And there's so many, there's so many techs in this industry that that's their backstory. And it's crazy to me. And I think that's why when we have the conversations about what's so much more expected of people in our industry versus other skilled trades, I think that's the part that sometimes people are not remembering. Is that it? Just.
Whether you want to say we all overspend, you know, we live above our means, whatever it is, or we just all, like, are sick in the head about cars and we want to work on them all the time because we find it easy. We all do that so much more than, like, I don't know of an electrician that comes home on Friday night and goes and wires another house for somebody on Saturday for cash. I don't know them. They just don't. They seem to be able to make enough money Monday to Friday. They don't have to. And that's what, nobody likes to hear it, but we have to fix this industry to where they don't have to do that.
Yeah, I mean, I've met a couple guys in the other trades that do it on the side, but that's. Most of the guys that do that are guys that want to eventually have their own deal.
Yes.
They're just kind of building up a client base, you know, and I think a lot of techs do do that, even in the automotive field, thinking they're going to open a business one day. And most of them don't. It just, you know, it takes a special person to be able to do it. Not everybody's built to own a business, you know, not everybody's built to be a great tech. Like, there are certain things that you just have to have a certain act to be able to do it. And, you know, not that I'm a great business owner by any means, but I'm trying.
But, you know, go, how many people are at your facility now? Like, did you ever.
So we have reeled back and honestly, thankfully, so like I said, last year was a fantastic year. I mean, we steamrolled even with the issues with my tech and stuff. I mean, we had some expenditures for, you know, fixing mistakes and stuff like that. But we, we had an amazing year for, especially when it was pretty much just one tech, you know, just him in there for the whole year, minus me doing some, like, extensive diags or maybe jumping in, do a few jobs here and there when we were, like, really overwhelmed. But then he left in August. I carried us through the rest of the year completely solo, except for my wife came into the office after that and, or came back into the office, I should say. And it allowed me to really focus on finishing up the year strong, which we did. But towards the end of December, I noticed a shift and we seemed to slow down quite a bit.
Now, we were still steady, like, we'd have work every week, but we weren't two to three weeks out booked on work anymore.
Right.
And, you know, most people are going to hear all two or three weeks booked out. Like, you're not scheduling, right, you're too cheap, blah, blah, blah. No, I am probably the most expensive. I'm more expensive than the dealerships in the area. Like, you know, it's just the type of work we do is going to, you know, and the reputation that we have gets us that kind of schedule and we have people that wait for it, you know. But then, you know, like I said, towards the end December, we were like, you know, we had work for the week and then the next week came and we had work for that week. And then when that was all, that was pretty much the same all the way up until about mid April. And then it's like the floodgates open and we are slammed again two, three weeks out.
And I'm just like, I can't keep up with these mood swings. You know, it was a nice little break for a minute, but I was kind of concerned. But I see a lot of other people in the industry seeing the same thing. Was there having a lot of slow periods and stuff like that. And it seems that a lot of guys are starting to pick up now again as well.
Is that political.
Because we. I think part of it is.
Yes, because up here, that has no bearing. Like, not only your, like, your election doesn't really have a bearing, but even. Or where it is your political landscape, I shouldn't say election, but even up here, it doesn't change anything. You know what I mean? Like, we don't. Business doesn't ebb and flow that way. Like, we just continue to get taxed and tax and tax, then we just have less money and. But it doesn't change. Like, you know, people, we still continue to do it.
I just think it. Whereas maybe people take it out of their bank account now people are putting it on a credit card. You know what I mean? Like, it's just a different. We're not. But when I see people where it's like, oh, yeah, it's an election year, and I see those talks in AsAG, and it's like, you know, it's always been like that. I just. I don't understand that.
I've never taken note of it. I've never taken out of it. You know, I mean, I've. You know, this would be the second election year I've been on since I've been open, and I've never, I've never noticed that. But then again, I wasn't really running a tip top shape business back during the last one. I was, you know, in for and being the team guy in town, of course I was gonna be overwhelmed with work. I see, same thing, guys on a song. It's an election year.
You know, this happens all the time. This, that, and the other. And I'm just over here, like, is this how. If this is how it always is, I don't want, like, I don't really reel in my spending and the stuff that I need to get fixed because it's an election year. If my roof needs to be replaced, my roof needs to be replaced. If my car is broke, my car is broke. It does. It doesn't matter if we're electing somebody.
The stuff still needs to be done. The business still needs to happen. So I don't get the bearing on it, other than the fact that I know a lot of people start getting funny about their money and they want to hold on to more if they think the tough times are ahead, especially with the way inflation is going. I mean, our interest rates on homes and car loans and stuff are through the roof now. So, you know, I guess, unfortunately, and fortunately, that's. That's kind of going to help us out some, at least in the auto loan part, it's not going to be as easy for people to go out and buy a new hundred thousand dollar car with a 9% interest rate. Like, you just. You're not going to go do that as you would if it was 2%, you know? So it helps us keep people fixing the stuff they have.
Now, of course, if you have a total bucket that's just absolutely not worth the money, we're going to let you know, because I don't want you dumping $12,000 into a $2,500 vehicle if it's not going to be a good vehicle. At the end of the day, we had people. We've. We've had people that have spent $10,000 on a $5,000 truck, but that $10,000 they spend is going to get them five, six, seven years worth of reliability tacked onto it, you know?
Yeah, it's. It's a funny thing because, I mean, I see it all the time, too. And I look at. I'm still used to being, you know, at the dealer where it's like, I was just saying it yesterday, like, I've seen cars at the dealer that had these intermittent nongoing issues, and the customer just traded it. You know what I mean? It was just, it just went away. Like, they just traded it. They got rid of it. Cool.
You know, my problem, not their problem. Somebody's problem, but not mine. I wouldn't. I care, but I struggle now. I don't struggle, but I keep it. I have to keep it more at the forefront of my brain when I'm dealing with these people in our shop. Is this because it's like they're. They're facing a transmission failure or they're facing an engine failure or something like that on something they're not even on paying for yet.
Yep.
So there's no warranty. Right. So it's like, where does that money come from? Well, you're not taking that vacation next year, right? You're. You're. You're unfortunately having to be saddled with this.
Yep.
What, um. How is the technician shortage affecting you? Or is it at all?
So, um, actually, I. Sorry, I'm all over the place. I never got earlier finished saying. So now it's back to just my wife in office and just me in the shop. And I'm glad that my tech left when he did because he left right before. Like, we slowed down. Like, we probably would have been able to carry him fine, but it would have been more. It would have been more taxing on the business to carry him through those times and me and my wife.
So, you know, it was kind of a blessing disguise that he left when he did it allowed us to, you know, me to just finish out the year really strong and then kind of coast into the beginning of this one. And now we're picking back up. I am at the point now where I'm trying to look for a helper that not isn't, that isn't necessarily experienced, but someone that has drive and motivation, which is a super difficult combo to come across these days. I've put out multiple ads for good techs, you know, Atec B tech level offering, you know, over $100,000 a year. Our pay plan is hourly, plus a production incentive is the way I like to go because I don't want somebody flat rating the crap out of everything. I want. I want you to come to work knowing you can make a living wage if you even just sit on your stool all week. Now, I'm not going to let you sit on your stool all week, but if you had to, you could, and you could still pay your bills.
But I do want to give people that extra drive, extra motivation to, hey, you know what? If I do work a little bit harder, I can make some more money, a considerable amount more money. You know, you got to make carrot a good size, but I don't want you to have to produce a lot just to live. That's the part about flat rate I hate, is that, you know, they work you like a dog just to hit a livable wage.
Yeah. And it's been normalized for so long in our industry. That's the thing that people take it. Like we talked earlier, people assume that I'm so anti flat rate. I'm not. But it's been like, wow. You know what I mean? It's been so normalized, like you said that it's like, oh, it's February. You all only made 30 hours.
All friggin well. Right? Like, that was their attitude. And it's like, my lifestyle is set up to where I make 44. That's kind of how I pay my bills, right? Knowing that, which is anyone else that goes to work, right? We, you know, we work, we calculate roughly we're going to be at 44 hours a week. That's where we're going to apply. That's how I set my life up. They never seem to give two craps if it was like February and, you know, you only made 30. Yeah, well, you know this.
How many years you worked here? That's normal.
Yep.
Dude.
Brand better for this.
Offsetted it. Last year was like, I made 62 weeks. Right? Well, this year I'm not making 60 because there's two more guys across the shop.
Yep.
And they go, oh, well, like, just work harder, hustle more. Come on, dude. There's only so many hours in a day, so many cars. So much like, you just can't, you just can't. Um, that's the thing that's like with the new people I'm seeing is that it's like, you know, they'll, they'll go to work. Flat rape. They want that guarantee. You know, the guys, dealer.
Now when I left the dealer four years ago, there was a guarantee, but it wasn't like even, you know, you're going to be here 40 hours and you're going to get a 40 hours guarantee. Now it's like, just like you said, they get a pretty much a 40 hours guarantee. A lot of them at an okay rate. But it's, you know, they're incentivizing all the time to push, push, push. And I, I couldn't go back and do it because if I'm going to sit there and it's nice out and there's no work, I'll give up my guarantee to go home.
Yep.
It's better for my mental health, right. It really is. I'd rather be fishing. I'll come to work the next morning with a much better attitude than if I sat at my stool with no work. And the next day. I know this is we already, because you know how it goes. Everybody knows the schedule for tomorrow. And guys do that.
They go, oh, look, there's only six appointments for tomorrow. There's ten of us. Like, I don't want that in my head. You know what I mean? I don't want it. I'd rather not be there. So that the whole guarantee thing, I can't get on board with it now. I just like the fact that I show up to work. It's a busy shop.
They pay me really good an hour. And if we get the appointments done, or we have some cancellations and it's 2 hours before I get done, I can go to my boss and say, hey, do you want me to, you know, everything's cleaned up. Do you want me to stick around? Do you want me to go early? And he'll be like. Cause I'm helping him at that point, but go early. Yeah, he's, he's saving later that he doesn't have to pay.
Something you enjoy.
Yeah. Last last Wednesday I left 2 hours early, went and had dinner with the family. Like, I mean with my parents that I don't always get to do that because the twelve hour shift, well not twelve, but eleven is like I get done at six, then I get home. By then my parents are, they're up there in age, so they're already, you know, getting ready to watch wheel of fortune and fall asleep. Like, you know, that age demographic, right. So if I can get it, catch out early and go grab dinner with my family, that's a, that's a well worth the locks, awesome hour.
Getting paid, stuff that money cannot replace. And that is one thing that, as you know, as you were saying earlier, you know, a lot of technicians sacrifice family time and this, that and the other. And honestly I see a lot of guys and I used to be the same way, so I can speak on this. A lot of guys wear it as a badge of honor. I suffer and I work so much and I don't get to see my family, but I'm providing for them. So it's, you know, it's okay, I'm a better man because I'm providing for my family. My kids don't know me, they don't get to see me. This or you.
I might get to go tuck them in. No, because you know what? That customer's car you fixed, they're not going to remember that you fixed your car 15 years from now, but your kids gonna remember. Well, dad wasn't there for my soccer game or, you know, dad only came in to eat dinner and then went back out in the garage. That's what they'll remember. And they don't. They deserve more than that.
Yeah. So you're trying to hire, not necessarily a super established tech, you'd, you kind of want somebody you can mentor, almost like a helper.
Then that's kind of where I'm at because I just, like I said, I put out good job ads, you know, with good pay, 40 hours, weeks, no weekends, stuff like that, you know, and the people I got applying or your, I didn't even get official applications, I just had people message me, you know, well, what's the hourly pay? You know, how much is there? You know, do you, do you provide tools or do I have to provide tools? I'm like, well, you know, I, I have a toolbox, but you know, the amount of pay is going to be commensurate based upon what you have to bring to the table. And if you're coming here with no tools at all, I'm going to assume you're more of like an apprentice type position or something like that. You know, you're obviously not a very skilled guy if you don't have some set of tools. I don't have a problem providing tools for you, but I'm not going to give you master tech pay with no tool set. You know, it's, it's.
I see that with the younger people, and it just makes. I. I can't wrap my head around it. We're just talking about it this week because it's like, there were so many Monday mornings I walked in carrying a bag of new tools that I bought at, like, either up here, canadian tire or Princess Auto, which is kind of like, same idea as, like, lowe's or harbor freight. Like, there was always, I was buying a set of sockets or a breaker bar or, you know, a hammer or something like that. Like, it was every Monday I was coming in with tools. These kids, they walk in on Monday the same thing. You know, they go over to the shop owner's box and they get the same thing out.
Or they come and ask me, and I'm to the point where it's like, no. You know, no, you got to start buying some extensions, some ratcheting wrenches, some, you know, like, if you need a pair of oil filter pliers with those different offsets, you can get that filter. You need to be buying that. That's your job. You change oil here, like, you know, and it's. It's so different now. They drive cars that are only three, four years old, drive stuff newer than what I drive, but tools. And I'm like, I have yet in my whole career to buy a brand new car.
You know, this 2015 that I own is the newest thing I've ever owned in my life. And yet they're driving around in 2020, one's twenty, twenty two s. Twenty two, three s. And they're making the payment on that.
Yeah.
And I just shake my head and I go, you really want to get upset some days and go, go sell that car and start buying tools? Like every other mechanic I ever knew that drove junk and bought tools. That's another thing when we, when we start to say in our industry is sometimes what the. In the tool bill. It was an interesting conversation just popped up, like yesterday with Chris and the guy that, you know, was trying to blame the tool trucks. We, we put such a emphasis on what they have to come with for tools, yet they can go be an electrician and $500 will buy them a meter and all the screwdrivers they need, they put it in a bag and wear it around their waist and then they start making a truck payment. And our people, it's like expected that. It's like you're gonna drive some crap box, almost 20 year old hunk of junk because you're buying tools every weekend. It's.
I don't know how to get ahead of it. I'd like to see, I like the idea that the shops are starting out with a toolkit for the people they hire. I like that. I wish the government somehow would. Up here, when you're an enrolled apprentice, I think you get 5000 or 10,000 a year that you can write off as tool purchase, which is, I think is great.
Yeah, that's a good setup.
You have to have the money in the first place, obviously to buy it. And of course then that means that everybody goes on a snap on truck and buys sunglasses and pocket and Red Bulls and puts it on their account. You know, the end of the year you don't really have tools. You just got $10,000 in beef jerky and sunglasses. But, you know, I mean, at the same. So you get your tax break nonetheless. It just, it's tough, man. I.
David, I don't know how we fix that.
I don't either. Cause again, that's another double edged sword. It's, you know, it's just like the, you know, needing to go home and do training on your own time thing versus doing it on the clock. Like, I don't. I'm not saying you have to go out and buy $50,000 worth of tools, but if you're going to be a good tech in this industry, chances are you're going to be self motivated enough to, like, you're going to. I never wanted to borrow people stuff. If I borrowed it once, I bought it because it was, I borrowed it because I was in a pinch. I was going to make sure I wasn't ever in a pinch again and need that tool and not have it because I hate lending my stuff out because it never comes back in the condition it was or it never comes back at all.
And, you know, I don't want to put it on people where you have to buy all these tools, which is why I have a small snap on box that has basic hand tools and some power tools and stuff in it that, you know, an apprentice could definitely get started in. Now, is that your toolbox when you leave? Absolutely not. That's a shop toolbox. I have no problem keeping that stocked. But I would like to see, over time, as you grow, and if you do show that you want to stay in this industry, that you start to collect your own tools. Like, I think with most mechanics, it's a point of pride. Like, hey, I have this nice box with my nice tools in it, and, you know, and also, if I ever need to use anything, these are mine to do with what I want. I don't.
I don't want to go somewhere and rely on someone else's tool set. And then when I leave, I don't have anything that is.
Is a. Is a dealer tech fallout? Because, I mean, I'm sure part of it for me is the fact that, like, you might work with 18 other guys in a dealership. It's a high number, but say, ten other guys, and if it was really sharky shark, you, they weren't gonna lend you what you needed. No job done. They're gonna go, like I used to say, go tell them, put my number on it. You know, like, I. Guys have to remember, can I borrow a compression gauge? Don't. Nope.
It's got a misfire. Okay, put my number on. I'll go inspect it. You know, I'll do the day. Like, they got. Yeah, a lot of people cursed me for that, but it's like, I had to spend $100 to buy that. Not you. Why should I? Whereas now I see guys coming in, and it's like some apprentices.
It's like they have no tools, and whatever they land, wherever they land is. I didn't bring anything with me, and I don't take anything when I go, and I just hope that whatever they provide is what I can get the job done with. And I think that's. I can't wrap my head around that. I can't. You know, it's. It's a. It's a definitely a generational thing.
That's, like you said, doesn't seem to be that pride of ownership of tools. There doesn't seem to be that almost like that stigma of having to borrow something so many times, like, my guy has.
He.
He'd have no. Yeah, no qualms borrowing something ten times. None, you know, none. We. We. I just. I don't know how to. I don't know how to navigate it.
It's something I'm struggling with very recently about how to. How to approach the conversation. You know, it's tough. It's.
Yeah. And that's kind of why I'm looking. I'm looking at, you know, the apprentice side now versus someone that's established and all because it's just, I don't, I don't want to get somebody else's problems at this point, to put it just blunt. Like, you know, I don't want to get the guy that's been doing this for 20 years or ten years that has their way of doing it. That's not the way that I want the shop to put it out. You know, I see hack job stuff guys posted online with no shame all the time. I'm like, if that happened in my shop, no, sir, absolutely not, you would not be here on Monday. It's not happening.
You know, and so I'm at the point now where guys, I think a lot of the good guys have left and have gone to other industries because they've been abused by this system for far too long. And I don't blame them. I know a lot of guys have gone to other trades and like you said, you go to be an electrician, you spend $500 on a little tackle box of tools and you can go be an electrician. They give you a van, you know, you know, you're not dumping money into your career and you're making the same or more money doing that.
I, I was a whisker away from doing it, literally. Like, you know, I did the three interviews and they, they knew my personality, but I mean, like, I was right on the tipping edge. I was like, listen, I'm done. I can't, I can't do the dealer thing anymore. I can't do, you know, thank God. I used to say around, you know, my area was a wasteland in terms of independent shops. And it's, it's not, but there's like five good ones.
Yeah.
And the rest are, you know, and of those five good ones, they probably all know ASOG and all know changing history. And that leaves, what, a 105 in my area that probably don't.
Yep.
There's something wrong with that.
And they don't do, they never will.
No, no, it's, it's, they're just, they're going through the emotions, man. You know, they're, they're doing the same thing they always did, some of them doing. They're what their dad did. And, you know, it worked, right? Like, I never had to work for somebody else. I just came here and I started busting tires when I was 15 in school, and I worked here every summer. And then it's, you know, it's mine.
And, you know, I saw a couple guys like that in the mastermind group. There was a guy who. It was a family store, and his dad ran it, and his dad was working his way out of the business, and he kind of came into the leadership role in there, and, you know, started making some. Like, they. They made it, but they weren't doing well for years. You know, it's one of those things is like a lot of people, look, I've done this for 20 years. Well, just because you've done it for 20 years doesn't mean you've done it well or that you couldn't have done it better. You know, just because you've made it, that doesn't mean anything.
I'm sure you went without a lot of stuff throughout that time. And this guy came into the mastermind group, and, you know, we started suggesting some very uncomfortable changes for him, and also was very against the way his dad ran the store for years. And eventually he started getting through and making some changes, and then the business turned around, and the money started coming in, and his dad backed off a bit. He was like, you know what? You're doing things the way I would never have done, but it's working. So I'm gonna let you go. You know, I'm gonna let you do it. And if people were only just willing to try new stuff and try new ways of doing things, you know, the. The.
One of the phrases I hate the most is, well, we've always done it this way. Why would we change anything?
Yeah.
Yeah.
Drives me crazy, too. I hear it. I don't hear it. Thank God. My. My boss, he's. I don't think he's ever said that to me. We've always done it that way because he's very forward thinking, too.
Right. Um. It's like anything else. Fear is such a factor, man. It really is. You know, everybody is so scared to. Because it is. It's terrifying.
It's. You know, I'm learning to appreciate more every week how. What a balancing act it is to. To not alienate your customers, to not all of a sudden change that perception. Just like you said, you know, that that customer doesn't come back to you now. He had complete trust in you, that when he was paying for is what he got, one thing showed him that he wasn't getting what he paid for, even though it was probably only the one time. Right. It just sours the whole relationship.
That drives me crazy, because it's like, at the end of the day, I'm still like, okay, that customer doesn't understand what happens in our. In our world, and nobody's perfect. But to be, to make that an unforgivable act, I mean, you went above and beyond to make it right, but at the end of the day, it still cost you, you know, and it sucks and it's, it's a, it's a heavy burden to carry. And in closing, what do you, what do you, what's your message for people that are going to hear this and they're going to read, you know, continue to see you online, you know, interact with us in the group? What's your, what's your kind of the, what's your advice? What's your closing remarks?
Just be open. I mean, I, like you said, fear is a huge thing. I mean, in the beginning of me making changes a few years ago, that was the thing that held me back, was the fear of the unknown, the fear of something new. I've never done it this way, but, you know, if, if you're struggling and you're having problems, and a lot of people come to AsOG for help, you know, and then they get very strong advice that they're scared to do. Well, the way that you've been doing it hasn't been working, or else you would not be coming here for advice.
Amen.
So just try something new. You know, if it doesn't work, you can always change it back, but you just, just keep, just try, try something new. If you have something that isn't working for you, just try it a different way. See what works for other people and try that. You know, no one has it dialed down to a science perfectly, you know, and my shop, the way it operates, isn't going to operate the same as it does up there in Canada. I'd have to change some things to make it work up there, too. And same way as if I went to California, I'd have to change for that, too. Or Texas.
Like, it's, nobody has the recipe for the shop to operate anywhere, everywhere. Just try something new.
Yeah. I mean, when they told you to go from 104 to 140, you probably heard the same thing. If it doesn't work, you can go back down a little bit. But look at that one little thing. You never had to go back.
No, we went up.
So, I mean, you know, people laugh at me, and I keep saying, you know, the answer isn't to throw money at everything, but it's a good first step on a lot of the problems that it's just, unfortunately, we're just gonna have to throw money at it. You know, the technician shortage thing, it's going to take a lot of money thrown at that to make some of it stick to the wall and solve some of the problems. And we know that that's the reality. It just sucks because it's like, how do we do it? What's the best investment, best return on the investment to do it right? You can't, you can't just wow a whole bunch of stuff. Because if all of a sudden we start saying we're going to pay every technician out there $45 an hour, well, you've got some really established killers out there, great people that are all of a sudden gonna go, that I'm gonna need way more than that because I've been under that for so long, right, that I'm gonna need. And so you can't just do it that way. It's, I always make the laugh when it's like, you know, shops put out that, that signing bonus thing. So this guy's only got to stay here one year and he gets five grand.
I'd be the first guy to walk into the office to go, I've been here five years, you owe me five grand.
Yeah, like, where's my staying bonus? Where's that at? You know?
Yeah. And it's such a, they go, what a stupid thing. It's not, you just showed me that, like, you had 5000 extra to pay somebody for wages at the end of the year. Five grand, whatever. The number doesn't matter. So, hello, I've been underpaid for five years and, you know, so that's not going to work. People that, if you're reading, if you're hearing this, if you think that's going to get you a person in the door, be very careful about how you do it because I, I would be the first to walk in there and go, okay, I need that. You know, and they'll go, well, it's not how that works.
Okay, I'll go quit now and I'll go to somebody that'll give it to me.
Yeah.
Because I, you know, do you want to hire me back next week, next month? I got, I'm going to, I'm going.
To quit and get the sign on next week. So let me get that.
But David, we know that's probably happened somewhere in this industry.
I'm sure it's been attempted at least.
Oh, yeah, for sure. And it should. It really should.
You know, it's a difference if you have a guy that's been there and, you know, he hasn't had a pay raise in three years and he's constantly improving and doing better like, yeah, that guy's behind on raises. He's behind on bonus potential, stuff like that. Like, if you got five grand to give somebody new that you, that could just be a total, a total waste. You can get this guy five grand, and he's a bum. He's not worth anything. He's as good as your oil change guy. You know, it's, it's obviously a situationally based, you know, decision. But I I'm absolutely sure there are shops out there where there's a guy that's been there just being a rock star for years and hasn't asked for money because he's just comfortable where he is, and, and then they're offering somebody more money to come in and a bonus on top of it, and it's insulting.
Again, it's another poke in the eye. Like, this industry is full of it.
Death by a thousand paper cuts.
Yep.
I want to thank you for coming on. I won't keep any more of your time away from your family. It's, you know, I appreciate you coming in here on a Sunday and doing with us. This was, I was really looking forward to this one, too. And, you know, I appreciate because, you know, we've talked back and forth about some people, you know, and we're talking about some upcoming projects, and, I mean, we're really excited to get that going. And, I mean, I'll be leaning on you for some feedback for that as well. You know, maybe some potential involvement, because, you know, with you, with the contacts that you have and your insight, you know, it's very valuable to what we're trying to do here. And, I mean, I appreciate, you know, people that are listening that if you're in the mastermind group, you know, listen to what he has to say because, I mean, he's, he's, you know, he's done it.
He's been, been where a lot of us are, and he's going places that a lot of us want to go. So, you know, I appreciate you being on and doing this. Anyone else that's listening to this, like, if you, you know, we're trying to get a bunch of recordings done because as we come into the summer season, it's going to be harder to get people to commit. You know, I don't want to be taking up people's time during vacations to do record episodes and stuff like that. So if anybody's listening to this and you want, by all means, please get a hold of me. You know, I keep saying it. It's going to happen, you know, people that have been on, you're going to start to see some of the familiar names come back because it's just, you know, we're. We've.
We have an excellent record of bringing people that really instigate conversation. And they always. People ask me all the time, it's like, you know, what's happening with this person since. Since the episode, and they'll be coming back. You know, people. People want to be involved. We get emotionally invested in people's stories. And I wanted to thank you, David, for sharing yours.
So have a great Sunday. We'll talk to everybody. Thank you, man. It's. It's a pleasure. We'll talk to you soon.
All righty.
Hey, if you could do me a favor real quick and, like, comment on and share this episode, I'd really appreciate it. And please, most importantly, set the podcast to automatically download every Tuesday morning. As always, I'd like to thank our amazing guests for their perspectives and expertise, and I hope that you'll please join us again next week on this journey of change. Thank you to my partners in the ASA group and to the changing the industry podcast. Remember what I always say, in this industry, you get what you pay for. Here's hoping everyone finds their missing ten millimeter, and we'll see you all again next time.
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