Ford, Subaru & Mazda Can't Lower Prices FAST ENOUGH | Episode 1025

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It's noon here in Ventner City, New Jersey, and our nation's capital, Washington, D.C.

And this is Carage Live for another rainy, miserable day here at the Jersey Shore with

your hosts, me, Ray, here in Ventner City and Zach hanging out with his apartment in

D.C. How are you feeling today, handsome, better, I hope?

You know, I went for another run this morning and I got to tell you, I am not 100%.

I am definitely sick.

My heart rate was super frigate high.

Yeah, anyway, I'm getting better.

Maybe I need to give myself some rest.

We do not rest here, however, at CarEdge.com, the sponsor of today's program.

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Dad, you ready to jump into today's show?

With both feet, buddy.

All right, pops.

We had a really, really, really rough February for the auto industry and that is starting

to show up in particular with a handful of brands.

Use US New Car Market loses traction again in February.

There are a couple brands in particular, Dad.

Ford, Subaru and Mazda that are heading backwards, not forwards in terms of vehicle sales.

I want to spend time on each of these as well as, I didn't even put it in the title of today's

show, but we're going to talk about it, Stellantis, Dad.

Stellantis is coming out with a big, big, big promotion for the month of March 90 days

without payments to try and celebrate the 250th anniversary of the United States of

America.

Let's start here, Dad.

You're overall synopsis of February New Car Sales in the United States of America.

What is your read on what happened?

It was a tough month.

January and February, one of those months is going to be the slowest month of the year.

It always is.

It always has been.

My prediction is it always will be.

And so February was a bad month.

It was not a good month and part of it was weather related.

Part of it is affordability related.

Part of it is incentive related.

And part of it just absolutely remains a mystery to me.

And the reason I say that is I know we're going to look, say, at Ford sales.

And one of the reasons that Ford's sales were down is the sale of their F-series pickup

trucks were down considerably.

And then you look at Toyota, whose sales were up.

And the main reason their sales were up was because their pickup truck sales were up.

So why suddenly is the F-series finding difficulty in getting additional traction?

And Toyota is gaining traction.

So there's really some interesting data within this subset of data.

All right, well, let's start here, Dad.

Let's just go through the numbers of how various automakers performed.

There are the three that I named in the title of today's show.

One of those is Ford, Dad.

Ford sales year over year for the month of February down 5.5%.

And so far for the year, they're down 5.3%.

That's a big, big deal, especially because, obviously, like you mentioned,

some of their competitors, Toyota, for example, not seeing sales declines like that.

So, Dad, Ford down 5.5%, what was most surprising in that, obviously,

your take was on the F-150s.

We know Ford still has 10,000 plus leftover 2025 F-150s out there for sale right now.

So Ford's struggling to sell the leftover F-150s as well as, obviously, the new F-150s.

Their sales being down, though, 5.5% year over year, was that a surprise to you?

Yeah, because we know that the F-series pickup truck traditionally has been

the number one volume selling vehicle in America forever.

There was one year where I think Toyota beat them out with either a RAV4 or I think it was the RAV4.

So it's unusual for the number one volume pickup truck in America and we're talking about America

where pickup trucks and SUVs are the main mode of transportation for many, many people.

So it just seemed odd to me that the decline for Ford would be in their most popular vehicle.

That didn't necessarily make a lot of sense to me.

Now, could it be because they're just so damn expensive?

I mean, the average transaction price on Ford pickup trucks, if I remember correctly,

excuse me, was approaching $68,000?

Yeah, for F-series pickups, yep.

That's a lot of damn money.

But then again, Toyota pickup trucks aren't cheap and their sales gain,

one of their sales gains was in their pickup truck.

One of their big sales declines at Toyota was in RAV4.

But that's because there isn't enough of the 2026 newer model that's available yet.

So you can understand why there would be a decline in RAV4 sales

when there's an availability issue.

But there's not an availability issue for the F-series.

Let's pick up trucks for a second here.

There's two things that I want to highlight.

One is, I just said there are more than 10,000 left over 2025 F-150s.

I'm light. I'm very light.

We have this back on thecaredge.com slash guides.

That's where we publish all of our free guides.

2025 Ford F-150 dead.

Not only are they offering 0% financing for 60 months,

plus $1,000 truck month cash, plus no payments for 90 days.

So Solantis is not the only automaker right now offering no payments for 90 days.

There are 28,000 left over 2025 models left unsold in 2026.

That's a huge problem for Ford.

Justin on our team pulled together an incredible blog earlier this week.

Truck prices are rising 40% faster than blue collar wages.

This is at its core why truck sales are finally starting to slow down

here in the United States of America for the domestic automakers.

Dad, look at this chart.

Not only is this showing you average truck MSRPs versus the average blue collar wage

in the United States of America, the red line is average truck MSRPs.

The blue line is the average blue collar wage.

Those used to have a gap between them.

Now they do not. So that's obviously concerning.

Even more concerning, Dad, is this chart that Justin pulled in here.

Look at this, Dad.

This is your MSRP increases over the past decade from 2014 to 2024.

The F-150 Lariat increased in price 77%.

Oh my goodness.

From $38,155 to $67,490 again to tie it all back together.

Ford, Subaru, and Mazda can't lower prices fast enough.

We're going to talk about Subaru and Mazda in a second here.

Just sticking with Ford, sales down over 5% year over year.

Their truck prices, at least in the F-150 Lariat's case,

up 77% over a decade.

No wonder we're in the situation that we're in.

Well, yeah, and wages haven't increased 77% in the last decade.

This can also tie into what yesterday's conversation was,

and that is that more and more people are looking at extended loan terms

in order to make these vehicle purchases appear to be affordable, even though they're not.

But it gives the appearance of having an affordable monthly payment.

It's just stretched over seven or eight years as opposed to five or six years.

So, yeah, I guess to a certain degree, Ford has shot themselves in the foot a little bit

when it comes to how dramatically over the last decade, they have raised the prices of.

77% man.

I mean, that's absolutely nuts.

And to your point around loan terms, this is another headline in automotive news this morning.

More people are talking about it.

More buyers look to longer auto loan terms to afford record new vehicle prices.

And before you go off on this headline, Dad, the first subheading here is,

savings now doesn't pay off in the long term.

So, obviously, there are people getting the message.

But let's continue here, Dad.

Back to February, new vehicle sales in the United States of America.

So, that's the Ford story.

Tremendous price increases.

So far in 2026, a slowdown in sales.

Let's turn our attention, Dad.

We'll do Mazda next because Mazda's right here.

Their sales flat year over year.

And when we look for the first two months of the year, January and February,

they're down 7.1%.

So, Dad, Mazda, what's the story at Mazda?

Maybe this is a good moment for us to think about asking Joe Lewis from J.C. Lewis Mazda

to come back on the program sometime soon.

What's the story at Mazda?

Did they run into the same conundrum here of raising their prices,

and now they're not selling as many vehicles?

Well, I think that's part of it.

And they've limited the imports of some of their lesser expensive vehicles,

like the CX-30s.

They've limited that inventory and the imports of those

because of additional tariff costs associated with them.

Sure.

What I would say, just at first blush, if you would go back to that chart.

Yeah, of course.

And the reason I'm going to ask you to do that

is sales for Mazda were down one-tenth of a percent.

For February.

February.

For the first two months.

7.1% for the year.

So, February was a much stronger month for them than what January had been.

The bulk of their sales decline for this year occurred in January.

So, maybe, just maybe, they're seeing a slight uptick in purchases and customers coming into

the showrooms.

I think when we look at these numbers in April, that will give us a clear indication as to

whether or not that's the actual case.

But it appears as if that February for Mazda was a month where they made up the deficit that

they had seen in January to some degree.

I'm now curious.

So, I just ran over to the car edge, car search dad.

100,000, 101,235 new Mazdas for sale nationwide right now.

I'm curious how many leftovers there are.

You know me.

I love the leftovers.

You are the leftover king.

19,000.

20% of their inventory, 19% of their inventory are leftover model year vehicles.

These would be the ones that the manufacturer, the dealer, everyone involved is going to be most

interested in trying to sell quickly, bigger discounts, etc.

So, yeah, I mean, they still have a significant amount of their inventory, dad,

leftover not too dissimilar from Ford, the story that we were just talking about there.

And we know, even though sales showed improvement in February over their January sales,

we know they're not being particularly aggressive in their incentives for the month of March.

I think it was the CX-50, which has a very unhealthy day supply,

which I think was approaching somewhere around 150-day supply of 2026 CX-50s.

And if I remember correctly, they were offering, was it 3.9% for 36 months or 1.9% for 36 months?

But let's face it, if you're looking at a vehicle that's ultimately going to come in

around $40,000 with taxes and everything else, you know, a 36-month note is going to put those

payments well in excess of $1,000 a month. Yeah, 155-day supply, 16,000 unsold CX-50s,

and the offer from Mazda is 1.9% financing for 36 months. The issue there, obviously,

hey, if you can afford a monthly payment stretched out over only 36 months, that's great, but many

people we know, even at 1.9%, would not be able to afford that. That'd be $1,000 a month most

likely. Yes, or slightly in excess of $1,000 a month. So yeah, that would be difficult for most

people to be able to afford. So are they not incentivizing sales as much in March because

they saw that uptick in February? Or are they not incentivizing sales as much in March because

they're still trying to cover the costs of tariffs that impacted their earnings last year?

Some manufacturers have more cash on hand than others and can weather a storm

like this better than others. And Mazda is still a relatively small player

in worldwide when it comes to manufacturing automobiles. And God knows, let me say this,

if I may. Yeah, sure. Nobody wants Mazda to be more successful than I do in the sense that,

as you know, I drive a CX-30. I happen to love it. I think for the most part, Mazdas are a great

value. You get typically more bang for the buck. And we know that two years ago, two and a half,

three years ago, Mazda decided that they were going to go more upscale. They wanted to increase

their profit margins. And so we started seeing the updated CX-90 and the CX-70 and those are

larger vehicles with higher profit margins. And Mazda was gracious enough to give you a

press vehicle to use last year, which was a CX-90 Phev. And that was as disappointing

a vehicle as I've ever been in from a brand that I was rooting for so hard. So I think they've made

some errors in judgment along the way. And I think that is part of their issue as well.

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Until the season changes and suddenly you lose your motivation to get out of bed. In fact,

one in five people experience some form of depression no matter the season or time of year.

At the American Psychiatric Association Foundation, our vision is to build a mentally

healthy nation for all, because we want you to live your best life and be your best you all year

round. Please visit mentallyhealthynation.org to learn more. Now let's turn our attention to

Subaru. This is probably the most surprising and concerning data on the chart. Actually,

Volvo being down 41% is probably the most surprising, not that surprising, but concerning.

Subaru is surprising because their sales were down 8.2% year over year for the month of February

and they're down 8.6% so far in 2026 compared to 2025. The reason this is surprising and concerning

is because Subaru has come out and said that their playbook moving forward is to sell more

volume. They're trying to sell more vehicles and quote, make it up in volume. Well, Dad,

they're moving backwards. The strategy is to get their cars sold and sell more of them,

but the data that we have is that it's not working. Maybe they have to cut even deeper

on price and incentives. This is super interesting. We do know that Subaru was one of the most

aggressive brands when it came to raising MSRP's in relationship to how tariffs were impacting

the cost of their vehicles because the vast majority of their vehicles are manufactured in

Japan. They have the facility in Indiana where they build vehicles and they're going to increase

production there to help offset some of the tariff costs, but they were one of the most

aggressive when it came to raising prices to cover the costs of those tariffs.

It seems to be coming back to bite them. They are another brand that is typically known for

their quality. It's a niche brand in the sense that those who have Subaru's love Subaru's,

they have a cult-like following, but even their prices have gotten to the point where

it is not as affordable an option as it had been. Now, the other concept of what we're going to

make it up in volume only works when, well, you actually make it up in volume and they're not

doing that. Yeah, look at this coming from space. Space runs the community forum back at CarAge.com

slash community. Told you about Subaru, incredible to see cars sit even with 0% financing for 75

months and 10% off MSRP. Again, the title of today's show was Ford Subaru Mazda can't lower prices

fast enough. I think all three automakers that we've covered dead, they can't lower their prices

fast enough. That's what this all indicates to me is they've operated in a way that has set

themselves up for failure. That's the reason they're selling fewer vehicles. You've been doing this

longer than anyone in history. How do you sell more cars? You're lower the price. You got to lower

and I've told this story. I worked for a regional vice president at the Penske organization and he

said, well, if your customer hasn't said yes yet, it's only because you haven't lowered the price

enough yet. At a certain point, you'll lower the price enough where the customer will go, okay,

I'll take it. You can be aggressive with your incentives like Subaru is,

but I am not sure that potential Subaru customers see that aggressiveness as covering the

increase in price enough to still make it seem like a fair value. I think even in today's world,

what they offer and what you get with a Subaru at their price point is still a fantastic value

compared to some of their competitors. For instance, the Forester Hybrid, which they're

moving production of that to Indiana because they want to compete directly against the RAV-4

hybrid and the Subaru will come in several thousand dollars less than the RAV-4

and the RAV-4 will outsell it, I don't know, three to four to one. It is so hard to figure out

consumer sentiment and why suddenly they abandoned one brand that they've been extremely loyal to

and moved to another. Even with higher prices, they're still relatively inexpensive compared

to their competitors in their segments. I want to show you an example data of how you can use the

new CarEdge dealer ratings program product to help you make a smart Subaru buying decision.

Go to caredge.com slash dealer dash ratings and under dealers, click on browse by brand. From there,

click on Subaru. We have 279 dealers nationwide ranked from over 1,088 verified OTD quotes.

I went ahead and I scrolled down and I clicked on one in particular dad, Sarasota Subaru. They

have a C grade in terms of transparency down there in Florida. The reason I clicked on this one though,

however, is this negotiated amount. You can scroll down to recent quotes on all these pages

and from the recent quote section, you can see the amount that was saved. You can then also click

on and view the original quotes. For this particular dealership dad, this is back in January,

so about two months ago, they were selling a new 2026 Subaru Outback and you can see the first

Out the Door price quote they gave a customer was $49,071.83. If I go back here, I can see

after negotiations, the final Out the Door price was $45,833.53. This is the type of intelligence

that you can find and information you can find back on the dealer ratings program.

Again, you just scroll down to the recent quotes and you can actually view the quotes

showing the savings from first pencil to last pencil, first Out the Door price quote to last

Out the Door price quote and you can even obviously see what type of fees the dealerships are adding

on so you can know to maybe avoid a dealership or do business with a different dealership.

That type of big discount though dad, you can have the prices I was talking about. That's

what's necessary to sell these cars. I get it, but let me temper that with one thing.

Sure. It is so much easier to discount a vehicle $1,600 some dollars when you're adding $998 in

your profit in a dealer dock fee. That's why that dealership has a C grade in there in Florida,

for sure. So you can look at it and you can say, well, you're being kind of transparent.

But they have, when it comes to offering a larger discount, they have a $1,000 cushion to play with

before you say hello. For sure. For sure. For sure. But the point being,

they're dealers trying to make deals on these vehicles. Let's come here dad. Yes.

From Lego Joe, we appreciate the kind contribution. Thank you Joe. I've bought,

sold and traded Subaru's from 2000 to 2025. 2026 Outback fully loaded is $55,000, no thanks.

Ascent can hit almost 60,000 yikes. That's crazy. I mean, I would have never guessed

an Outback could be $55,000. And at $55,000, I agree with you. I ain't buying an Outback.

I'll go buy something else. Look at this dad. Look at this from Bourbon. Thanks for the kind

contribution, Bourbon. Exactly Lego Joe. I saw the same and bought a 2025 Acura RDX Advanced

Spec cheaper and through CarEdge. Cross shopping a Subaru with an Acura, what a time to be alive.

Yeah, that is kind of crazy. That is an indication where, to a certain degree,

a manufacturer has lost their way. Thinking that their customers, I mean, it's got to take

extremely loyal customers to suddenly be willing to pay $55,000 for an Outback.

Now, I get that that's the most loaded Outback you could get, but still, $55,000, that's just,

that's beyond belief. Especially when you, I think of an Outback and I'm thinking,

okay, top-end trim might be 40 grand. I'm only off by $15,000. That's an astronomical sum of

money to be spending for an Outback, in my opinion. Well, dad, it's not just your opinion. The data

suggests that it is that way too. 8% sales decline year over year over at Subaru when

they've made it their mandate to sell more volume of vehicles. It's not just you saying

that that's an astronomical sum of money. It's our own community. It's obviously the shoppers at

large. And quite frankly, it's a wake-up call for Subaru and for Ford and Mazda as well.

The only thing we know that can ultimately help them sell more cars, lower the prices.

Yeah, but you know, at $55,000 for the top-end Outback, I don't know that you can lower the

price enough. It just seems like it is so far removed from what a Subaru Outback should cost

that you'd have to drop it 10 grand or more to get somebody to go, yeah, okay, I could entertain that.

That leads us to the other story that I wanted to bring up today, which is a brand we haven't

mentioned yet, but Stellantis, dad, they're doing this big push for the month of March,

which remember a moment ago, we were talking about over at Ford and to be clear here,

all these incentives and things like that, Carage.com slash guides, or if you have a

Carage account, you get our weekly newsletter email. We actually just sent it out today, dad.

Did you know there are 49, 0% financing offers for the month of March?

I did not. I do now. 49. The most we had last year was December and I think we had 41 or 40.

We have the most 0% financing offers we've seen in the past year and dad,

Stellantis is getting it on the fund as well. They're offering a bunch of finance incentives,

but they're also doing no payments for 90 days. They're branding this the Declaration of Deals

promotion. I don't want to call this desperate because this is just leveraging a milestone,

leveraging a holiday, but they're coming up with creative ways and offering these deferred payments

for 90 days. Obviously, 49 other 0% financing offers out there right now. They're not just

Ford, Subaru, and Mazda who can't lower prices fast enough. This is being felt more broadly

throughout the auto industry. When you do the 90-day delayed first payment,

what you're saying is we understand the vehicles themselves are not affordable.

We can create the belief that they are affordable by not charging you any interest on the loan

and then giving you 90 days before you even have to make that first payment.

I think the hope is that the customer is going to save up over those 90 days so they'll be able

to afford to make that first month's payment. The reality is the customer will not and will just

think to themselves, well, I'm driving this car for free for the first three months.

It's a marketing ploy that works. Let's face it. I saw a comment today and somebody asked,

well, when they give you a 0% interest rate, what's the buy rate? Well, okay, I'll help you. It's 0.

Okay. So, I mean, they are doing their best to create the illusion of affordable payments.

Ford's doing it. Stalantis is doing it. Yeah. I mean, everybody's doing it. I think it's

remarkable and wonderful that these manufacturers, especially one like Stalantis who's

headquartered somewhere in Europe that wants to do deals celebrating the 250th anniversary

of the United States of America. I see the humor in that. Most people probably don't.

But listen, if you're not waving the American flag during our 250th anniversary celebration,

you're doing something completely wrong from a marketing standpoint.

Good luck selling your pickup trucks if you're not offering some incentives around the 250th

anniversary. Hey, shocker, Dad, we'll probably be offering some sort of incentive back at caredge.com.

We're going to come back to the chat here in just a second. But again, a friendly reminder,

my dad and I for six years now with our incredible team have been offering a car buying service.

We take care of the research, dealer outreach, and even negotiation on behalf of customers.

For you to know what matters to you, contact dealers, compare real offers, and help you get

the best deal without the stress. I encourage everyone to learn more about our services

back at caredge.com. Dad, last year in July, we launched an AI negotiation service. I just

want to put it in the perspective here, y'all. We're up to $18 million saved for caredge customers

that are using Car Edge Pro. That means from the first outdoor price quote to the last outdoor

price quote, $18 million saved for caredge customers. Just yesterday, Dad, 421 new AI

negotiations got started and 102,797 dollars in savings were realized from first out the

door quote to last out the door quote. It's really incredible what we've built here. We've

negotiated on 384 million dollars worth of vehicles. Guys, we are super transparent here.

29% of customers that didn't get savings, $0 in savings. The AI agent tried its best,

humans tried their best, the dealers didn't budge on price. The other 71%, you can see

the distribution in savings right here. It's pretty cool the time-as-money concept as well,

the fees getting taken off, the accessories, et cetera. Really awesome stuff that we provide

under reports and the negotiation impact reports. I encourage everyone to take a peek at that.

Dad, let's come here from Rich. We'll end the show on the note. Appreciate this, Rich.

I found a vehicle that Ray may enter with Elam in style. No doors you climb through the windshield.

The Dodge Diora. You ready for this? Yeah. Here we go. I'm waiting for Rich to suggest the

Lotus Europa. I almost bought one of those ones. Dad, this thing looks crazy.

Yeah, probably explains why it didn't sell.

Yeah, no, that must have been one of those future project cars. Yeah, that must be

their take on the El Camino without doors. Yeah, interesting. Thank you, Rich.

Hey, Rich, do you spend your evenings just trying Google searching cars Ray would never know about?

Hey, I can't wait for tomorrow to see what happens. Folks, speaking of tomorrow,

we'll be back at 12 p.m. Eastern with more Car Edge Live. Please tune in. Subscribe to the channel

if you haven't already. Check out the website. We appreciate everyone that supports me and my dad

and our awesome team. We're back tomorrow with more pops. You look good and green. Enjoy the

afternoon. Well, thank you. You look good in whatever color that is and you enjoy the afternoon as

well. The sun's shining. Birds are singing and all feels right in the world until the season

changes and suddenly you lose your motivation to get out of bed. In fact, one in five people

experience some form of depression no matter the season or time of year at the American

Psychiatric Association Foundation. Our vision is to build a mentally healthy nation for all

because we want you to live your best life and be your best you all year round. Please visit

mentallyhealthynation.org to learn more.

Ford, Subaru & Mazda Can't Lower Prices FAST ENOUGH | Episode 1025

About this episode

Kia

dealer reviews

transparent pricing

add-ons

Stellantis

90 days without payments

promotion

New Car Sales

new car incentives

Ford F-Series pickup trucks

Ford F150S

Ford F-Series pickups

Toyota RAV4

0% financing

no payments for 90 days

domestic automakers

MSRP

Ford F-150 Lariat

Mazda Cx30S

tariff costs

day supply

Mazda Cx50

financing rate

36-month note

incentivizing sales

tariffs

Mazda Cx90

Mazda Cx70

Volvo

Subaru Outback

Subaru Ascent

Acura Rdx

deferred payments

Lotus Europa

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