Getting A Kick Out Of Kicks

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you do.

[SPEAKER_02]: You think it will be done if they do this?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Because for thirty thousand dollars, you're getting compactish to mid-sized electric pickup truck with probably two hundred and fifty miles of range.

[SPEAKER_05]: It will have four doors, seating for five.

[SPEAKER_05]: It will have power windows.

[SPEAKER_05]: It will have an infotainment system.

[SPEAKER_05]: None of which are included in the twenty-seven thousand dollars slate to door pickup.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think there will be some people that will want the minimalist slate, but I think there will be a lot more people that would be the number of people that will want to pay twenty-seven thousand dollars for a two-door slate with no radio in it and manual windows.

[SPEAKER_05]: versus the number of people that will say three thousand dollars more to get a truck that's painted already that I don't have to apply the rap to that don't have to stick a radio and that it don't have you know that I can you know that take carry my friends and not have to spend the money to install extra seats or you know anything else [SPEAKER_05]: I think Slate is going to have a really hard time competing with us.

[SPEAKER_02]: I thought this, when I saw the Slate, I thought it was neat.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a really interesting idea.

[SPEAKER_02]: The thing was people who were excited about it were just super excited about everything.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: I couldn't tell those, you know, like, when people who were like the early adopters of any new company, any new whatever, always super excited about it, I mean, I remember guys feeling that way about this girl.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look at that one, you know.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, well, we'll get to Fiskar a little bit later.

[SPEAKER_05]: Or the descendants of Fiskar.

[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, I mean, it's going to be interesting to watch.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think it, I think Slate's going to have a hard time.

[SPEAKER_05]: Unless they can sell that truck for.

[SPEAKER_05]: If they can sell it for twenty grand, the original plan was based on having tax credits, which would have brought the base price down down to about twenty thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_05]: With those gone, you know, Ford designed this to be sold at thirty thousand dollars before credits.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I think it's going to be, I think Ford is probably going to have a lot easier time selling their trucks and it's late.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think especially, you know, if it's, if it's a maverick size truck, I mean, we'll call popular maverick is.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, absolutely.

[SPEAKER_02]: No, it's a, it's a, that's a great size.

[SPEAKER_02]: And, you know, to have an EV in that category would be, it's affordable.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's the key.

[SPEAKER_02]: Having an EV that's affordable, that would be a big deal.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do it if they can do it.

[SPEAKER_05]: All right, Cadillac announced a new program this week, called Curated by Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_05]: So the German automakers all have these customization programs.

[SPEAKER_05]: Porsche does it, BMW does it, Mercedes-Benz does it, Audi does it, where, you know, [SPEAKER_05]: if you don't like the color options that are available, or you want a different interior on your car, or pretty much anything else, they will build it for you.

[SPEAKER_05]: They'll cost you, but they'll build it for you.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it's only on the CT five, twenty twenty six CT five, the black wing.

[SPEAKER_05]: Right.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, yeah, to start with for Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_05]: When you said the Germans, you know, do it on most of their models.

[SPEAKER_05]: They have, you know, there's BMW individual and Mercedes manufacturer.

[SPEAKER_05]: I forget what Porsche calls their program.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: But now, Cadillac is doing this, and they're starting with the CT-FI Blackwing.

[SPEAKER_05]: My guess is if it's even reasonably successful, they will add this to other models.

[SPEAKER_05]: And the next year or two.

[SPEAKER_05]: So what you end up with is a CT-FI Blackwing that is essentially hand-built, and they will [SPEAKER_05]: Customize it for you.

[SPEAKER_05]: You can have a pallet of more than a hundred and sixty colors.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it's a hundred including high-gloss and frost each hand painted by artisans to show quality standards.

[SPEAKER_02]: You have a hand painted gar.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So they're going to be building these in a separate facility from the normal plant in Lansing.

[SPEAKER_05]: And instead of going through the normal paint shop, they will build up the body and they'll have guys out there spraying, you know, painting these cars by hand and finishing, you know, buffing them and painting, you know, finishing them off.

[SPEAKER_05]: So, you know, and they will have an expanded selection of colors and materials.

[SPEAKER_05]: It can be mixed and matched.

[SPEAKER_05]: Access to elevated client experience.

[SPEAKER_02]: That was kind of for this kind of experience.

[SPEAKER_02]: They talk about the concierge and it's not just a random person from Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're saying these are true like design experts who worked in, what do they say fashion entertainment, a fine arts design.

[SPEAKER_02]: And they're the ones who are going to be helping you advise on your curated by Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_02]: Presumably so you don't think that two things look great together that designers are going to say.

[SPEAKER_05]: They'll provide some feedback for you.

[SPEAKER_05]: But I think ultimately, you know, the goal is to have the customer be the customer have what they want.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, you know, they will... To note what the starting price is to have what you want.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you see that number?

[SPEAKER_02]: Famous?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_05]: It is elevated from the standard CTI five black wing.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's a hundred and fifty eight thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's the start.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Depending on how fancy you get with your interior, [SPEAKER_02]: That's the start, but it does include the destination fee.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, they're going to build these in Warren.

[SPEAKER_05]: There's a building at the GM, Tech Center in Warren, Michigan, which is where they also assemble the, the Celestec.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's where they're going to be building these black wings, the CT-FI black wings.

[SPEAKER_02]: And they do have a couple of images, presumably, of one of the ideas you could get.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a, what is they, they're calling, they have an interior in Morello red that looks incredible.

[SPEAKER_02]: And an exterior in deep, amethyst metallic.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, they look cool.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I mean, people, it's gonna let you come up with some pretty slick looking cars.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I always thought it was cool to make your own car, like to really pick like, I don't just want one of these three color schemes you have.

[SPEAKER_02]: I want this.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's kind of neat.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, these one of one programs, I think are pretty interesting.

[SPEAKER_05]: Dodge did it with the last run of Viper's, the last few hundred Viper's, a few years back.

[SPEAKER_05]: They did a one of one program, so each customer could order and customize theirs, however they wanted, and then whatever combination they picked, that was off the table for any subsequent customers.

[SPEAKER_05]: So no other customer could order the exact same car.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, so nobody could ever do because you literally were driving at one of one that could have been done with anyone else.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's cool.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they also just announced that they're doing the same thing now with the Durango for twenty twenty six.

[SPEAKER_05]: They're offering a one of one program with the Durango.

[SPEAKER_05]: Forget what exactly what they call it.

[SPEAKER_05]: But you know, they've got a bunch of special colors that you can order.

[SPEAKER_05]: Different color combinations and stripes and different other other things.

[SPEAKER_05]: And now Cadillacs doing this.

[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know if the Cadillac [SPEAKER_05]: program is exclusive.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's not clear if they will let multiple customers choose the same combination.

[SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't say anything in there about them saying once it's designed, that's it.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it doesn't look like it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It has any way to keep that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Although the chances are pretty slim that you probably get two of you who picked exactly the same crazy design.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, you know, unless you wanted, you know, his and hers or his and his, you know, for you and your partner or hers and hers.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Do you see that?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's see.

[SPEAKER_05]: What is a CT five black one start at anyway right now?

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that's right.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, that's a tan.

[SPEAKER_05]: The CT five V series black wing.

[SPEAKER_05]: Starts at ninety nine thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_01]: That's a good chunk more for this.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So you're looking, almost about sixty grand, sixty thousand dollars more to start with.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So maybe you might want to consider ordering one of these two as your next vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: I, you know, maybe a thousand dollars, maybe a order too, you know?

[UNKNOWN]: You know?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, this box we're talking about your vehicles.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Do you want to provide us any potentially final update on the wagon you're asking?

[SPEAKER_02]: At the moment, the wagon you're asking is, it's going as it should.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is in my drive.

[SPEAKER_02]: We actually took it on a big little road trip yesterday up to the beach to have lobster rolls and a charge when it was supposed to charge and unplugged it and it was ready to go.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's going as it should.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just got it back this past week.

[SPEAKER_02]: And there's still a couple of issues that have nothing to do with the battery.

[SPEAKER_02]: But we're working on those.

[SPEAKER_02]: But for the moment, she runs.

[SPEAKER_02]: The swagonier is going.

[SPEAKER_02]: She runs.

[SPEAKER_05]: So is it going to be in your possession for much longer?

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm unsure.

[SPEAKER_02]: How about we leave that game?

[SPEAKER_05]: So you haven't finally.

[SPEAKER_05]: So there could be a further update.

[SPEAKER_02]: There could be a further update.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I am unsure how things are going to roll out at this point.

[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, there will probably be one more update, at least one more update.

[SPEAKER_02]: But it's running right now.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't want all day yesterday was fabulous.

[SPEAKER_02]: I do love it.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's good.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's that's important because even even when your car's frustrating you if you still love it, you know, then we do, which is at least what some part of this Sam is that I don't hate the car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love this car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just hate when it doesn't work.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I love the car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love driving it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's really fun.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's really quiet.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's really peppy.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love the car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like I have a little bit of an abusive relationship with my wife and Eras.

[SPEAKER_05]: I am familiar with that.

[SPEAKER_05]: We had the same scenario with a couple of Volkswagen's, so for many years.

[SPEAKER_00]: I love it and you keep me like, oh gosh, I know it's gonna do this to me and I love it anyway.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, especially with our two thousand facade.

[SPEAKER_05]: We had exactly that kind of relationship.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, so we'll see.

[SPEAKER_02]: Things are a little bit up in the air, but I'll keep you guys all updated about how that rolls out.

[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's talk about some of the stuff that's happening at Monterey.

[SPEAKER_05]: This weekend as we're recording the, let's see, a lot of the events at Monterey car week are winding down the concours at Pebble Beach is still going on today.

[SPEAKER_05]: At least here in the US, Monterey car week is actually kind of in many ways become the most important auto show.

[SPEAKER_05]: And this is where we see a lot of, at least at the higher end of the market, a lot of debuts, a lot of interesting concepts.

[SPEAKER_05]: that, you know, if you happen to be, well, probably by the time you hear this, it's probably too late, but, you know, they were, they were actually showing one of those CT, curated CT five black wings at Monterey, but there's a bunch of other stuff.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's start with Akira.

[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: So last year at Monterey, Akira showed off a concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: They called the precision electric concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: That was, it's funny, when we saw it, they had already launched the ZDX.

[SPEAKER_05]: The original ZDX was, was Akira's first [SPEAKER_05]: SUV coupe, you know, the first fastback, you know, utility vehicle.

[SPEAKER_05]: And it's like it seemed like if they were going to build something like this, that's the car they should have called the ZDX, but they didn't.

[SPEAKER_05]: They put that name on a car on a utility based on the Cadillac lyric, a more wagon-like vehicle.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then in earlier this year, they released an image of a chemo-wrapped prototype that Akira announced would be their first in-house-built EV.

[SPEAKER_05]: And now this week in Monterey, they have showed it as the RSX prototype.

[SPEAKER_05]: So, you know, in Honda and Acura's terminology, when they call something a prototype, as opposed to a concept, what you are seeing is effectively the production vehicle with only very minor tweaks.

[SPEAKER_05]: Like in this case, you know, probably the mirror, you know, you'll probably get, you know, standard optical mirrors instead of the digital mirrors around this one.

[SPEAKER_05]: But otherwise, what we see here is basically the new RSX that will go into production late this year in Mary'sville, Ohio.

[SPEAKER_05]: Go on sale early in twenty twenty six.

[SPEAKER_05]: At based on the new Honda EV platform that will also be used for the Honda Zero Series vehicles.

[SPEAKER_05]: What do you think?

[SPEAKER_02]: I like it.

[SPEAKER_02]: This color that they have they're showing us in is sort of a yellowy gold color that's actually really cool and it looks neat with the black accents in the car.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it looks good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like the design of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like that it's not too fussy in the front.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's it's got just enough angles.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it's a sleek looking little car.

[SPEAKER_02]: What do you think?

[SPEAKER_05]: I agree, I like it a lot.

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm generally not a huge fan of these SUV coups, but I think this one's pretty well executed.

[SPEAKER_05]: The main difference, it's actually stuck surprisingly close to last year's concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's been toned down.

[SPEAKER_05]: a little bit, but not a whole lot.

[SPEAKER_05]: The biggest difference, I think, you know, from looking, I was looking back and forth at the images the other day of the last year's concept and this one.

[SPEAKER_05]: And the concept, the greenhouse was smaller.

[SPEAKER_05]: So the roof line was a little bit lower, the whole greenhouse area was kind of squished down a little bit to give it a more out there appearance, but other than making the greenhouse a little bit bigger, [SPEAKER_05]: You know, so you actually have some volume for passengers, which the concept didn't have to accommodate.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's, it's not bad.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love the profile.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like it's good for my, you know, it's nice from the front.

[SPEAKER_02]: Good three quarter or three quarter, but that profile.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love how they've done, how they've done that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Could like you said the coup hatchback, the SUV coupe thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like how this one is executed.

[SPEAKER_02]: It doesn't look [SPEAKER_02]: Sometimes they look like you just took an SUV and messed with it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like we have this as a perfect little SUV now as a coupe.

[SPEAKER_02]: This one just looks like it was designed to look this way.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks good.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, it does look like it was purpose designed for this profile.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's like they messed with something they had and tried to make it work.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I expect we'll probably see the final production version of this.

[SPEAKER_05]: perhaps at the LA Auto Show in November.

[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe it's CES, but I think it'll probably be at LA is where we'll see the production, the actual production version.

[SPEAKER_05]: But it's basically going to be what you see here.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is it.

[SPEAKER_01]: Yeah, I like it.

[SPEAKER_01]: It looks good.

[SPEAKER_05]: Next up from Monterey.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's do infinity.

[SPEAKER_00]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: So infinity showed a couple of different things.

[SPEAKER_05]: They have the QX-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six-Six [SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Another sport back SUV, which you don't generally like, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Isn't that in your category, not liking?

[SPEAKER_05]: Generally, yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: When do you think of this one, compared to the Accura?

[SPEAKER_05]: It's not bad.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, I actually saw this almost two years ago, for your first time when I was in Japan.

[SPEAKER_05]: When I was at I went to the twenty twenty three Japan mobility show with Nissan and it took us to their their headquarters or their design center and they I'll sponsor a buyer who's the head of design for Nissan global head of design for Nissan [SPEAKER_05]: basically walked us down this row of prototypes and clay models and fiberglass models of everything Nissan had planned for its global lineup over the next four years.

[SPEAKER_05]: And among those, we've now seen several of those vehicles come to market.

[SPEAKER_05]: The kicks, was there.

[SPEAKER_05]: The new Nissan Micro that is launching overseas, unfortunately we don't get.

[SPEAKER_05]: The Morano, who's there.

[SPEAKER_05]: And now the QX-Sixie-Five is the latest one.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, and the leaf.

[SPEAKER_05]: They showed us the new leaf, which we'll be driving in a few weeks for the first time.

[SPEAKER_05]: But the QX-Sixy-Five.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is basically the QX-Sixy, which is an infinities version of the Nissan Pathfinder, with the third row removed, and the roof chopped off at the back.

[SPEAKER_05]: So give you a coupe.

[SPEAKER_05]: What do you think?

[SPEAKER_02]: I like how it looks.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think the girls a little on the aggressive side.

[SPEAKER_02]: From the front I'm not, it's a lot.

[SPEAKER_01]: Did you look at the front picture?

[SPEAKER_01]: It's a lot.

[SPEAKER_05]: It is a lot.

[SPEAKER_05]: But I think, you know, this is the direction they're trying to go with infinity, you know, to make it bolder and set it apart even more from the side.

[SPEAKER_02]: It makes it bolder and makes it stand out more.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it gives it more.

[SPEAKER_02]: distinctive character, especially the lightning across the front.

[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like they're really trying to give it something that's distinctively infinity, which I think is a good call.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it needs that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Other than the girl being a little bit on the out there side, like even the lighting pattern in the back when you look at it.

[SPEAKER_02]: They've done a lot with lights, which you know who does that Kia does so much cool stuff with the lighting signatures on their cars.

[SPEAKER_02]: It just becomes such a neat aspect of their vehicles.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks like Infinity's doing something kind of similar with that.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I think that's a good call.

[SPEAKER_02]: The vehicle overall, like the, you know, the dimensions of it and the, you know, the profile and everything.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks a little more traditional SUV coupe profile, I think.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I like this one.

[SPEAKER_02]: Actually, like the actors sort of slope your [SPEAKER_02]: It's a smoother back to the the the the accurate just talking about then about then this one, but I do like what they did with this.

[SPEAKER_02]: What do you think Sam?

[SPEAKER_02]: How do you think?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I agree with which said like the the roof line, you know, it's not it's not cut down quite as aggressively as the accurate, you know, the the accurate I think is going for even more of the the coupe thing, you know, where the the you know, they're less worried about backseat.

[SPEAKER_05]: headroom, whereas in this one, you know, you've got, there's a metal trim piece that goes across the top of the side glass that kind of gives you that sort of profile.

[SPEAKER_05]: But then the actual metal, which, at least on this concept, is done in black to contrast from the rest of it.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's similar to the idea that Ford did with the Mustang Machi.

[SPEAKER_05]: which was, you know, to have a contrast and color for, you know, like a black for the roof and to kind of hide the fact that the roof line actually extends back a little bit more.

[SPEAKER_05]: So you have some extra rear seat headroom.

[SPEAKER_05]: So this one I think will probably be a little bit more usable for multiple passengers than the [SPEAKER_05]: But, you know, aside from that, and I think this one, you know, a couple of years ago when they launched the QX-fifty five, they talked about it being inspired by the old Infinity FX from the early two thousands.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I don't think it ever quite really fit with that.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think at least from a design perspective, I think this is a lot closer to the sort of feel we had from the FX than the QX-fifty-five was.

[SPEAKER_05]: Although, from a performance standpoint, I don't think this will match what the FX did, because the FX was built on a rear drive platform with a longitudinal V-six head or was also available with a V-eight engine.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, this is based on the Pathfinder QX-V-V.

[SPEAKER_05]: So it's a front drive, all-wheel drive platform.

[SPEAKER_05]: So I think, you know, it'll do fine, but, you know, it's, I do like, I think the design's pretty good.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think they've done a decent job on it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, it does look good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like it too.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: All right.

[SPEAKER_05]: Then the other thing that infinity is showing, [SPEAKER_05]: There's a pair of QxAdes, which also have very large girls, by the way.

[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, large girls, that's kind of the theme, isn't it?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like, but I don't find it as much on the QxAdes, at least the track spec one, the terrain spec one is wild.

[SPEAKER_02]: The track spec one I actually really like.

[SPEAKER_02]: The terrain spec is...

[SPEAKER_02]: That's wild the front end of that car.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look at that.

[SPEAKER_02]: Between the lights on the roof and the lights that are just the lights and there's so many lines.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, a lot of vertical and slightly diagonal lines.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's lines, it's lines everywhere.

[SPEAKER_02]: I do like the tracks back one though.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, my problem with the trackspeck.

[SPEAKER_05]: The QXA is a big, three-row body-on-frame full-size SUV.

[SPEAKER_05]: Not much different from the expedition you were driving.

[SPEAKER_01]: Correct.

[SPEAKER_05]: The idea of making a trackspeck version of such a vehicle just seems anathema to me.

[SPEAKER_05]: Why would I, why would I want a vehicle like this on a track?

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, well, there was the, there was the Durango SRT Helcat, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's a three.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was in the three was, there was a two.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a three, well, yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, so the Durango, that's a track where the car, did you like that one?

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, you didn't like it.

[SPEAKER_05]: Not a huge fan of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh, see, and then what else?

[SPEAKER_05]: It was the Cherokee or the Grand Cherokee track hoc.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Just in a few row, but it's still big.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's just, this one, even compared to the Durango, this is a larger vehicle than the Durango.

[SPEAKER_05]: The grand Cherokee was the smallest of that group.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I think that's probably a more reasonable size to have a high performance model.

[SPEAKER_05]: The tracks back, this tracks back.

[SPEAKER_05]: QXAD, I don't know, it just, it doesn't do it for me.

[SPEAKER_02]: What about, so do you like the terrain spec better?

[SPEAKER_05]: I think the terrain spec makes more sense for this kind of vehicle.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it's basically an overlanding version of the QXAD.

[SPEAKER_02]: Probably makes more sense, but I don't like the, there's so many lines on the front of the grill it hurts my head.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's a little diagonal lines in the grill.

[SPEAKER_02]: They go a different way of the lines that make up the headlights.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's a different set of lines in the trim at the edge of the hood.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's lines that go a different direction underneath.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then it looks like there's lines that are on the skid plate possibly.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's lines along there's so many lines.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's like I'm having a visual aura from like in a mic.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's lines everywhere.

[SPEAKER_05]: That's fair enough.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, I mean, you can have the tracks back.

[SPEAKER_05]: I'll take the trains back.

[SPEAKER_02]: Hey, this is fair.

[SPEAKER_02]: We'll get one of each.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: We'll just trade off and see which we like better in the real world.

[SPEAKER_05]: That works.

[SPEAKER_05]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's see.

[SPEAKER_05]: What else?

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_05]: In addition to showing the curated CT-Five Blacks back, they had an actual concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: What a wild concept, too.

[SPEAKER_05]: The elevated velocity.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, the first thing I think about this when I look at this and that mean pictures of Delorean.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's all I see when I look at this, like Delorean for twenty twenty five.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you see it?

[SPEAKER_05]: I do, I do, because it's finished in silver.

[SPEAKER_05]: It almost looks like it could be, you know, bare stainless steel.

[SPEAKER_05]: I don't, it's not, but it's not.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's got going doors, big, huge going door.

[SPEAKER_05]: In enormous going doors.

[SPEAKER_02]: Look at the, it's of that door.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they're also very long.

[SPEAKER_05]: When you look at it from the side profile, they're very long doors, because unlike a Dolorin, which was a two-seat vehicle, this is a big four-seat utility, you know, technically an SUV.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, I thought something that was interesting, I was on the briefing call, the backgrounder for this on Monday.

[SPEAKER_05]: And when they showed us these images, I thought it took me back to New York this year when we saw the Genesis concept, which, I mean, it's a very different vehicle from this, but it's also, it's got some interesting similarities in that these are both very large.

[SPEAKER_05]: very high riding, lots of ground clearance, big wheels and tires, very long hood profile.

[SPEAKER_05]: In the case of the Genesis, the greenhouse is more upright, more boxy, you know, whereas this is much sleeker.

[SPEAKER_05]: than the genesis, but this idea of these high-end luxury SUVs, very long hood, you know, very big wheels, lots of ground clearance, is going to be interesting to watch in the next...

[SPEAKER_05]: Three, four or five years to see if we actually start seeing vehicles of this form factor start to come to market.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, because this is a concept, so this doesn't exist.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's not even a prototype like you're talking about earlier.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is purely a concept, which means we could see something kind of sort of maybe like this or not even remotely at all.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, you know, and Cadillac [SPEAKER_05]: You know, over the last twenty, twenty-five years has been less inclined to bring concept ideas like this to production than I think Genesis has.

[SPEAKER_05]: Genesis, you know, more of the concepts that Genesis has shown have filtered their way into production in some form.

[SPEAKER_05]: So I think if either company, if either brand is likely to do it, it seems like it's more likely Genesis will do it.

[SPEAKER_05]: But, you know, both of these are also electric, which is interesting.

[SPEAKER_02]: Did you see that there is a bespoke polo set in the rear of the Cadillac elevated velocity concept?

[SPEAKER_02]: It's literally a polo set in a little light case.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay, when I first look at this though, it makes me think a Harry Potter with a niche that's a little thing, like the little the red.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's actually a helmet and the helmet should sprout wings.

[SPEAKER_05]: Is that with that supposed to be the helmet?

[SPEAKER_02]: It was supposed to, right?

[SPEAKER_02]: So there's gloves.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: And sunglasses.

[SPEAKER_02]: The polo balls.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then there's, I guess those two other pieces.

[SPEAKER_04]: Do they supposed to be the mallet?

[SPEAKER_02]: The mallet together.

[SPEAKER_04]: They're standing mallet.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think that's those make the mallet.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I feel like that peace in the middle has to be the helmet.

[SPEAKER_04]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Or the golden snitch for Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_05]: Who knows?

[SPEAKER_05]: It's an interesting concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: I think it is.

[SPEAKER_05]: If nothing else, even if they don't build a vehicle like this, there's some interesting design ideas that I think we will see filter into future catalogs.

[SPEAKER_05]: When you look at the back, the lighting, especially in the center section, it's got this depth to it.

[SPEAKER_05]: It looks like there's a tunnel that's lit up when you look at it.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's got these light bars in there.

[SPEAKER_05]: Actually, Honda did something very similar last year with their zero-series saloon concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: Had a similar kind of idea there.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, that's the takeaway from the concepts.

[SPEAKER_02]: You don't generally see something this.

[SPEAKER_02]: It really looks like this coming to production, but you'll see elements of it.

[SPEAKER_02]: It does show you what the designers at a given company are thinking.

[SPEAKER_02]: It shows you what they're putting to focus on and where they might.

[SPEAKER_02]: So you're not might let's see this, but you could see something that has that sort of lighting in the back or has that sort of curving to the sheet metal.

[SPEAKER_02]: It does give you hint at where their minds are.

[SPEAKER_02]: This would be their wildest ideas here, but tone that down and you can get bits and pieces of this in production cars, which would be sort of neat to see.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I think it's going to be very interesting to watch Cadillac over the next five, ten years, because in a couple of recent briefings I've been in with them.

[SPEAKER_05]: They've talked a lot about a few weeks ago, was on one with John Roth, the president of Cadillac, or whatever his current title is.

[SPEAKER_05]: They had a Cadillac.

[SPEAKER_05]: And you talked about wanting, really, there's a lot of emphasis on expanding the brand globally.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, Cadillac had some good success in China, but that is faltering as it is for all non-Chinese OEMs.

[SPEAKER_05]: And so they're looking, okay, where can we make up for that lost market share in China?

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, looking at the rest of the world, looking at Europe, South Asia, and everywhere else.

[SPEAKER_05]: And, you know, this is part of what's behind their strategy with racing as well.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, in the last couple of years, they've gone into the world of DERS Championship with the GTP car.

[SPEAKER_05]: They are running, they're going to be joining Formula One next year.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's going to be a Cadillac Formula One team starting in twenty twenty six.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, those are not insignificant investments.

[SPEAKER_05]: And the reason why you do that is to promote your brand outside of the US.

[SPEAKER_05]: You're not going to go into Formula One and into World Endurance Championship, you know, just to sell more cars in Omaha.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, that's something we'll come back to coming.

[SPEAKER_05]: Where was that coming from?

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is something open up behind me.

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe I was watching the screen.

[SPEAKER_02]: Maybe that was a bit of.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Because I had windows open looking at all this stuff we were talking about.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, it'll be interesting to see what other sorts of products Cadillac comes out with over the next few years.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then finally, on the US side, you remember the Fiskart Karma?

[SPEAKER_02]: I do remember the fiscal crime that they came before the fiscal ocean, the first iteration of fiscal that failed, before the second iteration of fiscal that failed, is this the third iteration of fiscal, what is this?

[SPEAKER_05]: So when fiscal automotive, which was the company that built the fiscal karma, went bankrupt.

[SPEAKER_05]: Unlike Fiskor Inc., which built the ocean, Fiskor Inc.

[SPEAKER_05]: just got liquidated.

[SPEAKER_05]: Nobody bought up the assets and tried to keep the company going.

[SPEAKER_05]: Fiskar Automotive got acquired by a Chinese company called Langshang Group, which is a major Chinese supplier.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they have kept company more or less in business for the last fifteen years, or twelve years, twelve years since they bought it.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is a twenty-twenty-three I think.

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm sorry, twenty-thirteen when they acquired it.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they have continued to build cars based on the karma ever since then in very small volumes, but they're still there, they're still kicking.

[SPEAKER_05]: And last year they showed a new variant of this.

[SPEAKER_05]: They had been selling, they had been selling a modified version of the original karma as the karma Rivera.

[SPEAKER_05]: So the company is called karma automotive now.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they had the Rivera, which they were selling for a number of years.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then that transitioned into the GS-Six, which was a further modified version of that.

[SPEAKER_05]: And now the latest iteration of the original karma is called the Gaia Serra, which when they first showed it, you know, it's got some styling updates to it, a new interior on it, compared to the original karma, a fiscar karma.

[SPEAKER_05]: And when they first showed it last year, they talked about it being all electric.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, as the market has shifted around a little bit, they have opted to, for at least for now, keep it as an extended range EV, which is what the original Fiscal Karma was the first really somewhat volume production E-REV.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it was, you know, it had at the time originally a GM, four-seater turbo, two-liter engine that was driving a generator and had a battery and a couple of electric motors driving the rear wheels.

[SPEAKER_05]: The engine was not in any way connected to the wheels and they still have that same basic power train architecture, although they don't really get much into specs [SPEAKER_05]: on the new one but I'm guessing when I the last time that I drove one I drove a Rivera back in twenty nineteen they had switched from the the GM engine to a BMW one point five liter three cylinder turbo as the range extender engine and I'm guessing they're probably still using that because that engine is actually still available unlike the GM engine that they used to use

[SPEAKER_05]: And so, but when you look at this, you can clearly see the lineage, especially in the center section of the car to the original karma.

[SPEAKER_05]: What do you think of these updates?

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, I think it looks good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like how it looks.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think it makes for neat looking sedan.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't know.

[SPEAKER_02]: If I've caught the starting price in there right, it's like a hundred and sixty five thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yes.

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, not for hundred sixty five thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_02]: That is a lot.

[SPEAKER_02]: And then the Ameris Emirates, I don't know who the mayor is.

[SPEAKER_03]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's going to be next year.

[SPEAKER_02]: Two hundred thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_05]: Uh, I. Five hundred sixty six horsepower for the, uh, they, uh,

[SPEAKER_05]: That's Sarah.

[SPEAKER_05]: However you're supposed to come to get Sarah.

[SPEAKER_02]: I Sarah works for me.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was, I was pronouncing it in my head.

[SPEAKER_02]: I was trying to figure it out.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's great.

[SPEAKER_02]: hundred sixty five thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_02]: For a car from a company that is sort of in flux and I mean I don't think there is in the same kind of flux that fiscal the recent fiscal ink was in before it became fistic or done.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I mean it looks okay the pictures the limited number of photos that they have here it it's it's a pretty looking car it's [SPEAKER_05]: The new interior is much better.

[SPEAKER_02]: The interior is better.

[SPEAKER_02]: It has a nice interior, nice and streamlined.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's one of those very clean EV style interiors that just doesn't have a lot of fessiness, you know, that can either look plain or they look sort of pleasantly uncluttered depending on your point of view.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks like there's things to move the vent, Sam.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: When you look close up, [SPEAKER_05]: And it's got eighty miles of electric range.

[SPEAKER_05]: I did before we started this morning.

[SPEAKER_05]: I went in and pulled up the sales numbers for karma automotive over the last four years.

[SPEAKER_05]: I see in in twenty twenty one they sold a hundred and two cars.

[SPEAKER_05]: Uh, in twenty two, they sold a hundred and ninety five.

[SPEAKER_02]: Ooh, that's a big increase.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then in twenty three, they sold thirty nine.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then last year it was fifty two.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, that's not really the direction over all you want your sales going.

[SPEAKER_05]: Well, this is why they need to refresh it.

[SPEAKER_05]: Bring out the the guy Sarah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Do you think that this year is going to bump them back into the one hundredths?

[SPEAKER_02]: maybe you know you visit in August of twenty six so I made this a last year yeah we'll see I think it's a neat concept and but you know I think the challenge with the fiscal and just [SPEAKER_02]: the brand has gone through so much and you know two companies with almost the same name and it's it's hard to get back what you've lost when you people feel like you've had a car not made it you know and to so even though it's not the company that actually went under the fiscal ink it still has a little bit of a black stain on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, although, you know, the basic design that Hendrick came up with back almost twenty, you know, probably eighteen years, seventeen, eighteen years ago now when they first showed it, you know, that basic design is actually holding up pretty well.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's still still a good looking car.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a, it was never designed that was the company's problem.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, exactly.

[SPEAKER_02]: Design and style was not much everything else.

[SPEAKER_02]: Everything else.

[SPEAKER_02]: But yeah, that was never their problem.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, design, the design's still a good physical.

[SPEAKER_02]: Henrik can make a nice looking car.

[SPEAKER_05]: All right.

[SPEAKER_05]: Oh, one, one last one from Monterey that I forgot about.

[SPEAKER_05]: I missed it here on the list.

[SPEAKER_05]: The, the Lexus Sport concept.

[SPEAKER_02]: Lexus Sport concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: So this is a vehicle.

[SPEAKER_05]: Back in twenty twenty two Toyota first showed a concept called the GR GT three concept.

[SPEAKER_05]: So this was a concept for their next generation GT three race car.

[SPEAKER_05]: So currently in the GT three class sports car racing they run the RCF.

[SPEAKER_05]: And you know, that car is, you know, the RC's going away.

[SPEAKER_05]: It's, it's, you know, kind of old now.

[SPEAKER_05]: And so the original GT-III concept was as long nose, front engine, car, pretty, pretty wild look and almost batmobile like.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they have been working since then to develop a production version that at the goodwood festival of speed last month.

[SPEAKER_05]: they had the race car and the production the road car wrapped in camel that were shown off at goodwood and now they're showing the road car in its you know in uncammed form you know they're calling this a concept but I think this basically is [SPEAKER_05]: the new Lexus sports car.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is probably going to replace the LC and sort of a spiritual successor to the old LFA.

[SPEAKER_05]: And this is going to be the basis for the new race car as well.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love this car.

[SPEAKER_05]: It is pretty spectacular.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is such a good looking car.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's beautiful.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's so sleek.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is the all the random concepts and stuff we've been looking at today from on Ray and such.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is my favorite.

[SPEAKER_02]: I just I just absolutely love how this looks from every angle too when you're looking at profile in from the front.

[SPEAKER_02]: Oh my gosh.

[SPEAKER_02]: It is such a pretty car.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks like it should be mean and fast.

[SPEAKER_02]: It just looks fabulous.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and the announcement says this progressively styled future focused yet truly authentic sports car signals the way forward for Lexus design.

[SPEAKER_05]: And there's elements of this.

[SPEAKER_05]: First of all, looks like they're moving away from the spindle grill.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, which I was never a big fan of, so yeah, I'm not sorry about that.

[SPEAKER_05]: And you still have, you know, this sort of all theme in the headlamps or the, you know, the daytime running lights anyway.

[SPEAKER_05]: And then the, but some, you know, some of the design elements like the sharp crease in the side and the event behind the front wheels.

[SPEAKER_05]: Some of that, you know, we've already seen already in the new Lexus ES that's coming next year.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I think, you know, there's more, you know, from this car, you know, that signals the direction of future Lexus models.

[SPEAKER_05]: So we're going to see.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, for that, I'm excited because I like how this looks and if the designers take this and incorporate it into some production vehicles, I would not be at all disappointed because I think this is a really just beautifully designed, very sleek looking sports car.

[SPEAKER_02]: It just looks like what you feel like a sports car should look like right now.

[SPEAKER_05]: Absolutely.

[SPEAKER_05]: All right, one last one that I want to get to.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is a car that's going to be shown in a couple of weeks at the IA mobility show in Munich.

[SPEAKER_05]: Hyundai Ionic II.

[SPEAKER_01]: Another Ionic.

[SPEAKER_05]: Another Ionic, a baby Ionic.

[SPEAKER_01]: A baby Ionic.

[SPEAKER_05]: I wish they would sell this car in the US.

[SPEAKER_02]: Let's see, this isn't coming here.

[SPEAKER_02]: We're not going to get this, right?

[SPEAKER_05]: Probably not.

[SPEAKER_05]: Almost certainly not.

[SPEAKER_02]: because he's me with this kind of news now that I have to look at.

[SPEAKER_05]: But we do have listeners outside of North America.

[SPEAKER_02]: Okay fine for you guys you're getting really cool car we can have.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_05]: So yeah, this is a little little four door hatchback or five door hatchback.

[SPEAKER_05]: Um, tended to be very affordable.

[SPEAKER_05]: Um, and I, I like this a lot.

[SPEAKER_02]: It looks good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think this is good.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, it's a fun little car.

[SPEAKER_02]: You're going to be honest.

[SPEAKER_02]: We don't sell a lot.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like this is not a popular segment in here in the US.

[SPEAKER_02]: It makes sense that they're not bringing him here if they're not.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I mean, if I lived in Europe, sure, it's really cute.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a fun looking little car.

[SPEAKER_05]: I would, I would drive a car like this here.

[SPEAKER_02]: I would.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm not saying I wouldn't drive it.

[SPEAKER_02]: What I'm saying is the people.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah.

[SPEAKER_02]: Don't tend to buy this kind of car here.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know?

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_05]: They say it's expected to have the same or somewhere set up to the Kia EV-III, which we are getting early next year, which will have either a fifty eight point three kilowatt hour or eighty one point four kilowatt hour battery pack range of two hundred sixty seven or three hundred and seventy two miles.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they're saying this is from AutoCar.

[SPEAKER_05]: They're saying that the price for the EV-II is expected to be about twenty-five thousand pounds, which if it were sold here in dollars would probably be somewhere in the mid-twenty thousand dollar range, like twenty-five, twenty-four, twenty-five thousand dollars.

[SPEAKER_05]: Maybe a little bit more than that.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I'd like what they've done with this car.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I think it looks really quite good.

[SPEAKER_02]: They're on a roll with their designs, so I'm liking what Hyundai's doing lately.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yep.

[SPEAKER_05]: All right, we have one email this week.

[SPEAKER_05]: So let's see.

[SPEAKER_05]: This is from Rado, or Rado.

[SPEAKER_05]: I'm not quite sure I pronounce your name, sorry.

[SPEAKER_05]: Let's know if you want to just another email, give me some guidance on pronunciation.

[SPEAKER_05]: As Robby said, some cars just have problems.

[SPEAKER_05]: There is a reason Toyota dealerships can't keep new cars on their lots.

[SPEAKER_05]: Estalantis has been topping the slowest selling cars, rankings in every category for the last, you choose how many years.

[SPEAKER_05]: Please don't talk about things you can't say or your opinion about.

[SPEAKER_05]: Every normal person would be done with the crap Nicole bought.

[SPEAKER_05]: You still are trying to tiptoe around the fact that cheap makes crappy cars.

[SPEAKER_05]: What I mean is this.

[SPEAKER_05]: Nicole's car has been dead longer than has been undead.

[SPEAKER_05]: I do not think it has ever been alive.

[SPEAKER_05]: Just say it as it is.

[SPEAKER_05]: Stalantis cars suck or do not mention them.

[SPEAKER_05]: I've been listening to Wilburring since its inception and been a fan of the podcast.

[SPEAKER_05]: Please get back to your roots and give us your unfiltered opinions.

[SPEAKER_05]: I don't know that we've necessarily been filtering our opinions.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, I'm not filtering my opinion.

[SPEAKER_02]: I've said very much that I am really sad that the cars having these problems and I expected to have some quirky issues going on with it because it's a Jeep and I knew that when I bought that.

[SPEAKER_02]: We have a Wrangler.

[SPEAKER_02]: He have, and it's had problems often on since the minute we bought it and rust loves that thing.

[SPEAKER_02]: He absolutely loves that thing, even with all of its quirks, the difference being that he's having quirks at his car still runs.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'm having quirks and mine is dead.

[SPEAKER_02]: It has, it's actually like I said earlier in the podcast, it is running right now.

[SPEAKER_02]: We'll see what we're going to do with it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I don't think, [SPEAKER_02]: I think you're being harder than needs to be, like, like, stilantis has issues with with, um, when am I trying to say with quality?

[SPEAKER_02]: Um, but it's not the first stilantis vehicle I've had.

[SPEAKER_02]: I've had their vehicles before.

[SPEAKER_02]: I had a charger.

[SPEAKER_02]: We had a Cherokee and, you know, we've, [SPEAKER_02]: I like the vehicles, and I'm aware of the quality issues.

[SPEAKER_02]: But to be fair, I'll just add this in because I have been to several programs from other OEMs over the time that my car has been having troubles.

[SPEAKER_02]: And my car has come up in a couple of those conversations.

[SPEAKER_02]: And uniformly, every single one of those automakers, every single one, has said, yeah, you know what the total battery is a problem.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a problem, not for Jeep.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's a problem.

[SPEAKER_02]: They all have issues with it.

[SPEAKER_02]: Last, do me just talk about it last week.

[SPEAKER_02]: It was the Toyota, um, two days or I saw one Toyota and Subaru had an issue with a twelve volt battery.

[SPEAKER_05]: Almost every automaker has had twelve volt issues with exactly somewhere all of their EVs.

[SPEAKER_02]: And that's not what I'm tip to, if that's what you think I'm tip-toeing around.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not a tip-toeing.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's more me trying to say, there's a legit challenge with EVs, with the twelve volt batteries.

[SPEAKER_02]: And it's happened to enough automakers.

[SPEAKER_02]: I mean, you bought a car, a Sam that was recalled, and the recall was fixed.

[SPEAKER_02]: They took it back and now you, and it was because of twelve volt batteries.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, and I'm not, you know, that's great.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, that's Kia, that's Hyundai, that's Toyota, that's Subaru, that's Jeep.

[SPEAKER_02]: They all have problems with this.

[SPEAKER_02]: So, I think what I was trying to point out was that, yeah, this Jeep... Even Tesla has had issues... Right?

[SPEAKER_02]: So, it's not that I think that Jeep should be on the hook for it?

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, yeah, this car is absolutely not doing what it's supposed to.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I think my point was, like, this twelve-volt thing is something, all the OEMs are having a little bit of trouble figuring out.

[SPEAKER_02]: None of them have really got it nailed.

[SPEAKER_02]: There's enough problems out there that it strikes you as sort of this, like, there's something we haven't quite figured out here yet.

[SPEAKER_02]: Like, there's something, enough of them are having problems, enough to think about all the engineers, all the quality control, all the everything.

[SPEAKER_02]: At all of these companies, and yet.

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's not in-house to one company.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's sort of an EV, [SPEAKER_02]: thing that hasn't entirely been resolved.

[SPEAKER_02]: That was my point.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, and as you said, you know, the Kiwi VI, we bought a used EV VI just over a month ago.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I got a great deal on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: And the reason why I got such a good deal on it, you know, I'll be honest, I paid, they had eighteen and a half thousand miles on it, twenty twenty three EV VI.

[SPEAKER_05]: paid twenty four thousand dollars for it, which is about four to five thousand less than the typical price today right now for an EV six with that, you know, a twenty three EV six with that kind of mileage on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, typically they're going for about twenty seven to twenty nine for for that mileage.

[SPEAKER_05]: The reason why we got it for that price, you know, and I called it before we bought it, I called the dealer and said, you know, so what's the deal with this car?

[SPEAKER_05]: I wanted to know why why did it seem to be price so low?

[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, and he told me, you know, they have to, you know, they have to be on the title anyway and on the, the minority.

[SPEAKER_05]: you know that it was a it was a it was a buyback it was a lemon buyback the original owner had purchased it in twenty twenty three um had after some months similar to yours you know had the twelve-volt battery die you know had died on a couple times um and uh this is a problem that Hyundai Motor Group among many other automakers uh have had the similar issues uh and they had a recall [SPEAKER_05]: I'm going to recall, the problem was found to be with the integrated charge control unit that manages charging of the high voltage battery, but it also handles charging, it has the DC to DC converter that takes those from your high voltage battery to your twelve volt battery.

[SPEAKER_05]: And there were some issues with it.

[SPEAKER_05]: Hyundai Motor Group redesigned it, they revamped it, and they have been doing a recall replacing the units on cars in the field.

[SPEAKER_05]: And I checked on the VIN number of the car that we ultimately ended up buying.

[SPEAKER_05]: It had had the ICCU replaced.

[SPEAKER_05]: And that's why, and it also still had several years of warranty left on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: And so, decided to take the chance on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, it would be fine, you know, it's not our only car.

[SPEAKER_05]: And so, you know, we took the risk of buying that and we got a fantastic deal on it.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, so you're right, you know, Stalantis has had and particularly in the last few years has had some significant quality issues, but so is Ford.

[SPEAKER_05]: You know, Ford, Ford has had something like ninety recalls since the beginning of this year.

[SPEAKER_02]: Right.

[SPEAKER_02]: They were like holding the crown for the most recalls.

[SPEAKER_02]: They did like, you know, one month they had, like, there was one month where the number of recalls they had was insane.

[SPEAKER_02]: Yeah, right.

[SPEAKER_05]: And they, you know, they've had to recall, you know, I think.

[SPEAKER_05]: somewhere between one and two million vehicles because of cracked fuel injector and fuel injectors Toyota had a big recall on the tundra for the three point four liter twin turbo V-sixes that were failing in the tundra's and they're replacing all the engines and all of those trucks GM had a big recall on their six point two liter V-eight's [SPEAKER_05]: So we don't talk a lot about recalls just because there are so many of them.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's like practically a daily occurrence of his recall on some vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: The number of them that are out there.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I think it's not, I think, like, I'm not trying to defend Stylantus, but saying that their vehicles are a crap because there's problems with this one.

[SPEAKER_02]: Well, then you could say that, you know, Sam's Kia Kia's crap.

[SPEAKER_02]: You could say that anybody who's ever had a problem with a vehicle, it's crap.

[SPEAKER_02]: To make it, like, that's the thing that automakers [SPEAKER_02]: It says someone has a bad experience with a vehicle.

[SPEAKER_02]: It's not indicative of every car, every owner, every experience.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can have good experiences and bad experiences with an automaker depending on the car and even depending on the one that you get.

[SPEAKER_02]: You can have one that's a lemon.

[SPEAKER_02]: That might be what the issue is going on with mine.

[SPEAKER_02]: We don't really know, but I think it's just I would not say that Jeep makes crappy cars.

[SPEAKER_02]: I like jeeps.

[SPEAKER_02]: I'll, I do like them.

[SPEAKER_02]: They have their quirks.

[SPEAKER_02]: They have their challenges, but we've bought more than one.

[SPEAKER_02]: This is the first one that we've really had significant issues with.

[SPEAKER_02]: Everything else has been quirky, but like my, you know, Dodge is part of the Stylian Disbrand.

[SPEAKER_02]: I had my Dodge charger.

[SPEAKER_02]: I bought that in twenty ten.

[SPEAKER_02]: That's what I traded when I got this one.

[SPEAKER_02]: I think I changed the tires.

[SPEAKER_02]: I may have fixed the brakes once and the battery a timer to over the course of fifteen years.

[SPEAKER_02]: Not bad.

[SPEAKER_02]: You know what I mean?

[SPEAKER_02]: So it's not like I just think I think that's too harsh.

[SPEAKER_02]: I wouldn't say any company just makes crappy cars.

[SPEAKER_02]: I feel like that's harsh.

[SPEAKER_05]: Yeah, I mean, we've had good and bad experiences with vehicles from multiple brands in our household, you know, and everybody said, everybody's every company's built lemons at various points in time.

[SPEAKER_05]: And as far as being, you know, unfiltered, [SPEAKER_05]: I think we give pretty honest opinions.

[SPEAKER_05]: I know I do.

[SPEAKER_05]: I've gotten criticized for my opinions.

[SPEAKER_05]: We will continue to try and give honest opinions to the degree that we hedge on anything.

[SPEAKER_05]: it's it may be because we don't know we don't know what the root causes and if we can find out you know and if there's an explanation for an experience we had you know we will try we'll do our best to share that with you but you know we tried we do try to give you our honest opinions on everything we drive if I was really hedging you wouldn't know I'd had a problem with it that's yeah sure we wouldn't have talked about it at all [SPEAKER_02]: I would have just said like that Sam and Robbie would know and you guys would have no idea.

[SPEAKER_02]: But I chose to say something.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I just chose not to be that harsh because I feel like I'm never going to say.

[SPEAKER_05]: Because there are a lot of good aspects of the wagon your ass.

[SPEAKER_02]: Mm-hmm.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love it.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love it except for the problem since I'm having with a twelve-voltness associated issues.

[SPEAKER_05]: I mean, you know, as I was telling the caller earlier, we had a two thousand Volkswagen Passat wagon with the one point eight leader for cylinder turbo.

[SPEAKER_05]: We bought it in two thousand.

[SPEAKER_05]: That car spent more time in the shop and I spent more money on repairs on that engine than on any car I've ever owned in my life.

[SPEAKER_05]: And yet my wife loved driving that car.

[SPEAKER_05]: And we kept it for nine years despite all the problems.

[SPEAKER_05]: And what did we replace it with?

[SPEAKER_05]: Another Volkswagen.

[SPEAKER_05]: We bought a jet a TDI wagon with the quote unquote clean diesel.

[SPEAKER_02]: And you see, you're going to, and I've had, I had a Volkswagen Beetle.

[SPEAKER_02]: I had a, I had a Jetta once, and then I replaced it with a Beetle.

[SPEAKER_02]: And I never had significant problems with either one.

[SPEAKER_02]: I love them.

[SPEAKER_02]: So I wouldn't have, you had a crappy experience.