Most Fun Family Cars, Letting Go Of Emotions, Quantifying Track Records | Episode 1,017

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Hi, everybody.

We're back with another episode of the podcast, and honestly, this is kind of becoming one

of the highlights of our week.

I mean, when we were doing two podcasts a week, we enjoyed ourselves, but the fact that it

was kind of spread out a little more, I think it felt a little bit more like a treadmill.

The once-a-week thing, we build up so much commentary about news and adventures that

we've had and so much stuff.

We want to share it so much with you guys, so we're thrilled that you're here.

Thanks for being back with us.

We have lots of news up front, actually, a really, really good topic Tuesday.

Some car debates, car conclusions, questions from you guys.

We have all of it in this.

We have to dive right in, but we've just gotten back from a cool press launch.

I was just going to say, tomorrow drops the film for the 2026 RAV4, so we just drove

that.

We were at the press event in Arizona, and thank you, Toyota, for funding that,

for flying us out, hotels, meals, providing the cars, everything, and so that was a

lot of fun to go out there and drive the new RAV4, 2026 RAV4.

It's big news for them, so we were just there.

That video, that review from us, again, comes out tomorrow on this channel.

Yes, it does.

Now, keep in mind, that means tomorrow, Wednesday, the 22nd, is RAV4 day, so your

feed is going to be bombarded with RAV4 videos.

We did one unique to us.

We thought about the fact that what you know us for is comparison, so we did

something very unique to us.

It's not just a test drive.

It's more than that.

We're excited for you to be right back here watching that tomorrow.

We're going to drop that right as soon as the embargo lifts with everybody else on

the planet, but it was a huge event in Arizona, and they had, I think, more cars

at that event than I've ever seen, as far as, like, available cars.

They had so many.

Well, this is the bestseller for, I mean, the single bestseller for Toyota,

and so they treated it with a lot of waves of journalists, and they put

eyes on, and they had a lot of people from Japan, a lot of engineers

fly over for this event because this is a very big deal, a very big

launch for them.

So watch for that.

We're looking forward to sharing, and yeah, hopefully you enjoy that

because we certainly did.

We have a bunch of really cool comparisons happening between now and

early January of next year that we already have either filmed or about

to be filmed like the next week or so.

We've been stacking content up because the weather is starting to turn

here in Park City, so we have to be ahead of that, so we have a bunch

of stuff coming.

I'm so excited about so much of the stuff we have coming, and we got

done with our cool Kota road trip series.

Thank you to all of you that interacted with that.

Share that.

Just share that with somebody else, but all these comparisons coming

up as well, of course, in addition to this podcast, which is every

Tuesday, so thank you for being with us.

We're going to jump into news that is unexpected, that got covered

a lot, but first off, I want to talk about there are a lot of

still in the U.S. still a lot of really great craftsmen out there

that make amazing things and make things I couldn't begin to make.

Okay, and one of them that we just discovered because of

the car news, stay with me, is a cut above buckles, cutabovebuckles.com

is a company based in southern Utah, so even close to us.

So there's a lot of connective tissue here, and what they make

is they make custom belt buckles, like the big belt buckles you

see for rodeo.

They make custom ones, and if you go to their site, the

craftsmanship's incredible, right?

They do like handmade stuff that is unbelievable.

However, it connects to cars, and I cannot believe this is

actually a thing, but it connects to cars.

It's the truckle.

The actual word, like they're selling this called the truckle.

I've got the website on the screen, a cut above buckles,

and look, again, the craftsmanship's fine here.

It is already sold out for 200 bucks a piece.

I'm going to read right off the website.

The first ever Ford key fob locker buckle.

Finally, we've connected the word truck and buckle with the

truckle.

Finally, it's happened.

Lock it up, truckle up, then giddy up, and go do some

truck stuff.

The truckle, trademark, by the way, is limited edition

key fob locker at Cutabove.

It's a combination of Cutabove and Ford Motor Company to

honor 50 years of the Ford F-150 legacy.

I just can't believe this exists.

I love the hat, by the way.

It's very good.

Only Stetson.

The truckle, the truckle TM, is built by master

buckle maker, rodeo legend and lifelong Ford truck

customer, Andy Andrews.

It will house any universal Ford fob from 2018 and

onward.

What they've really done here is you can wear a belt

buckle that, of course, it has the Ford F-150 on it.

It's celebrating the F-150 from 1975 to 2025, 50 years

of the Ford F-150.

Here's the crazy thing.

Behind it, everybody, is your actual Ford key fob.

It is hidden on the backside of the buckle.

So what this means is we're going to have old cowboys

hip thrust in toward their Ford pickup.

It's going to happen.

It's what's happening.

You're going to watch a cowboy walk up to his Ford F-150

and hip thrust.

It's going to be the most action he's gotten in a while.

I'll never want to see that.

Never want to see that.

But it's going to happen.

So if somebody sees you wearing the truckle, again,

thank God, we've combined truck and buckle.

If somebody sees you wearing the truckle, they know

that you are a Ford F-150 lover.

And they actually could steal your belt and steal your truck.

That's also a real thing.

But I can't believe this exists.

I can't believe it's sold out.

They say, hold your horses, because more are coming.

Talk about leaning into an idea.

They have leaned in.

I don't even know what to say, except the truckle exists,

everybody.

This was on car news this week.

The truckle.

Truckle.

It's perfect.

It is.

It is perfect, actually.

It's perfect.

It's been a long time since we've heard the Wrangler voice.

That was fantastic.

I just, you know, I can't believe this exists.

So there seemed to be no other proper voice

to get that done correctly.

Wow.

Well, in other news, Cadillac has

decided that they are no longer going

to be producing the black wings, the CT5V black wing,

and the CT4V black wing.

Two of the best cars, I guess.

Two of the best sedans headed toward the topic

that we've got coming, which is good family cars.

They've been discontinued, except Cadillac has confirmed

that the CT5 will eventually be replaced

by a next-generation vehicle with a gas-powered engine, which

I would like to think they do a next-generation,

and that will continue on.

And they'll at least give us a gas-powered

with a manual transmission, because at that point,

they would almost stand alone in the marketplace,

just about globally.

Just about.

They are one of the only ones offering a four-door real

sedan with good dynamics, front-engine, rear-drive manual

transmission.

They're almost by themselves there.

And the fact that this is going away

is definitely a loss for all of us,

like any of the things I've just mentioned.

If they bring it back with a gas-powered train,

which they say they're going to,

let's hope it also means a manual.

I'm also holding out, hope that the next Corvette's

going to be a manual.

But anyway, GM's heard.

Let's just see if they act.

It'd be good.

In other sedan-related news, I guess, Lexus,

as we've heard.

We've talked about it recently on the podcast.

LS is being discontinued.

Now, this is the car that put Lexus on the map.

They're big LS sedan.

Which seems like a really big loss.

But there's a lot of Tokyo-related motor show

and all this kind of stuff going on

in the next few weeks, all right?

Announced ahead of that, Toyota has said

they are going to put the Century brand, which

has Toyota history, above Lexus.

And the concept here is that it's

going to actually be super luxurious.

And above the Lexus, there was an SUV

that they dropped at one of the other Japanese motor shows

that was very boxy and super luxurious.

This is actually a picture that I'm

showing of the super nice interior,

like they do with some of the vans that you've seen over

there that are really nice.

It's that kind of stuff.

The press people was talking about freeing up Lexus

to be Lexus, whichever that means.

But the concept here is this is chasing roles, Bentley,

the Maibach versions of the S-Class.

This is what they're going up market.

And all of their taglines are one of one.

They're trying to make hyper luxurious,

super customized, wildly nice vehicles for the right buyer.

Yeah, I've got a thought on this.

And that is because Lexus has become

almost synonymous with motorsports now.

Toyota does racing, but because the Lexus brand

has not devolved is the wrong word.

They've actually embraced motorsports

and they're very successful at it.

Trying to do a high-end luxury vehicle

that Lexus is known for,

but also have the motorsports heritage

that they're building, I think is in direct conflict.

And so they almost needed to go up.

Century is a Toyota brand in my mind.

It is for sure.

But if they go really high and you're right.

That's where they're headed.

They're talking about roles in Bentley.

Yes. High end and that separates,

that allows Lexus to be motorsports is what it is.

I think I'm reading in,

but I think that allows Lexus to be even more high-end

luxury performance and motorsports

because of that new Lexus car, a hypercar coming out.

The hypercar that supposedly followed to the LFA

that they're about to announce.

Okay, interesting.

Because I guess what you're saying.

That wouldn't ever be branded a Century.

You wouldn't see that.

No, it wouldn't.

Branded at a very high end

because it's a two-seater high-end.

It's got motorsports heritage, but also luxurious.

It allows Lexus to do cars like that

and then leave Century way up here

for the almost to show fur market.

Yeah, one of the critiques we've had against Lexus for years

is that their stuff was too isolating

and they've started to move away from that a little bit.

You might make a great point.

That might be what we do with the isolation chambers here

is we leave that at Century, which might make sense.

Can you imagine a $300,000 Toyota product?

I mean, granted, the LFA was super expensive

but it came out.

We had to imagine a $300,000 Cadillac.

And Mustang, as we think about it.

Hasn't the Celesteak kind of come out at this point?

It's out, apparently, and apparently.

The entire world has stopped talking about it already.

I don't think they ever really started.

But that's interesting because this feels like

Toyota Lexus following Cadillac,

but that Celesteak is a non-thing.

Well, now that I think about it,

Cadillac is synonymous with racing as well.

Exactly.

I agree.

Specifically because of Formula One in 2026.

Agreed.

So they've got racing heritage now.

They're winning race team.

But they're also trying to do the high end luxury thing too.

So I'm wondering if that's causing them problems

because the Celesteak.

I mean, there's a handful of buyers

but I don't know what that proved to the world.

Yeah, especially with Cadillac going racing.

Yeah, and I don't think, obviously Cadillac,

that's their big EV flagship

and everybody's pulling back from EV flagships.

I doubt that Century is going to be EV

though I do expect it to be hybrid

because that's Toyota's thing.

But what is this?

How many will they make?

I mean, with a tagline like one of one,

they're leaning into coach building.

They're leaning into bring us your pile of cash.

We will make you a one of one car.

So this is a very interesting thing.

Which is a thing.

It's a market.

Absolutely, of course it is.

That's a market.

Other news that we've seen is that the average new car

in the US now costs more than 50,000

or right about $50,000.

That is the average.

It's crazy.

Average across the board

and the listener Nate wrote to us.

He saw that headline as well.

He said there's a lot of great values in the market

that don't even come close to the $50,000 price point

while not being a penalty box to drive.

Agreed, agreed.

Pretty funny, Nate.

He says the Honda Civic is a good example.

Barring the type R,

he's not sure you can spec one over 35,000.

He also gives the example of the Buick and Vista

as a great example of getting a lot for your money.

True, we've talked about it.

Which is true.

And you will even see that now the Toyota RAV4,

it's been a bargain.

It will continue to be a bargain.

There's many cars in the marketplace.

He's identifying that.

What I've got on screen is the new BMW X3

because this starting is $50,000.

And my thought here is that all of us consumers

have wanted SUVs, which makers have brought to market.

But we've also wanted something pretty luxurious

and were willing to spend for it.

I think it's simply the willingness of the market

and this was about the best example

that I can think of.

Near luxury, it's not high-end luxury

but it's a luxurious brand and it's an SUV

starts right at 50.

That is the X3, that is the market here.

But there's tons of cars from Hyundai, Kia, across the board.

Mazda, Toyota, Honda, you're right, Nate.

It's not a penalty box.

There's so many great ones that we can still buy

even sports cars that aren't close to 50.

True, and the thing you have to think about here, Nate,

also is, in current dollars, inflation averaged

is $50,000 for the average price any more of your income

than when the average price was 20.

What's the inflation variable there?

So that's interesting to see.

But here's the thing you have to think about.

In order to get that to be the average,

that means there have to be a lot of cars

selling above 50.

And that seems, to your point, it seems impossible.

It seems like, well, there can't be very many.

Until you think about, in the US,

how many pickup sell?

Yeah.

And how hard it is to find a pickup less than 50K.

You don't even have to buy a big hillot even base.

You can do the Ranger and the Tacoma,

which are the small pickups.

And the way you want it is probably 50 grand or more.

If you go for the F-150, get a trucker.

If you go for the F-150, or you go for the Sierra,

or the Silverado, or whatever, the Tundra,

the one you want of that is 60 to 70 grand.

I think there's gonna be belt buckles

for the Texas edition, anythings?

There probably should be.

This is a huge untapped market, people.

It's an untapped market, the Trukel for the Tundra.

The Tundra Trukel.

It's the Ice Trukel.

The Ice Trukel, yes.

And then we got the Silver Trukel for the Silverado.

We could just keep going, man.

It's endless.

What other, it seems goofy, but it's sold out.

The boat themed Trukel for your Armada.

Come on, I can keep going.

Oh my gosh.

I keep going, the Trukel's here to stay.

Anyway, but the point I'm making here

is trucks are the thing that sell,

the only thing that competes with SUVs like the RAV4

for actual total amount sold in the US

are these full-size pickups, and they're all over 50.

So when you consider the sheer volume of those going on,

I mean, what's the Ford F-150?

It's like a new one every 60 seconds.

When you consider the volume.

51 seconds.

And they all need Trukels.

They all do.

Ford should make them a supplier.

They should just, well, in partnership with Ford,

you absolutely should.

The King Rancher just comes with a Trukel.

Comes with a Trukel.

That's just right there on your price build.

You just open up the glove box.

There's your Trukel.

There's your Trukel included.

Trukel's waiting for you.

Anyway, but my point is,

when you think about how much those trucks all cost,

it's not surprising, even though you're right,

there's so much good stuff below 50,

and I also wanna argue that most of the stuff

good below 50 isn't a five-seat SUV.

I have taken a lot of heat over the years

for recommending and pushing on people's budgets,

and I do it not for just entertainment value,

but I do it simply because there's what I think

the budget and your wants will entertain.

And then there's just a step outside of that

that I think will make you happier

because these are such large investments.

But privately, I've had a lot of conversations

with people who have said, yeah, by the way,

my brother-in-law or my friend,

yeah, they kind of pushed on their budget

and they ended up getting blank for five or 10 grand more.

It happens way more than you think.

For sure, for sure.

I think this new average price reflects cars

being one of the only products that pull on emotions

as much as it pulls on your needs.

I agree.

It's one of the only products that does that,

that you're willing to justify

and in the heat of purchase, in the heat of battle,

and you see one that just has a little bit more,

it's got this package,

and wouldn't you like to really have that?

You would, yes.

Suddenly, in a moment of weakness,

you cave and you spend more and all of us are doing it,

and it's hard to just stick to.

I mean, how often I'm sticking to my guns,

I'm not going a penny above $30,000.

Yes, I hear you.

Now, when you're buying used, it's a lot easier.

Sure, yeah, yeah.

But this average is based on a lot of new car sales too.

Absolutely, it's based on new car sales.

And so consumers are just willing to go a little bit more

and car manufacturers have us right where they want us.

True, I'm gonna add to your point.

I do think it's the only two big purchases in your life

that you're looking at with a long-term view.

It is a car and it is a house.

I don't know a single person who was going house shopping

and got a house for less than they hoped for.

I don't know a single person.

Everybody I know that's bought a house

in the last 10, 15 years, here was our budget.

Here's the house we bought

because you found the right one at the right time

and you realized, oh, we gotta push a little.

How much money can we move around?

And in every case, and I'm not saying people

are spending necessarily beyond their budget,

sometimes we do, but I'm hoping to spend this much

on my house, you spent more.

I just, everyone I know, everyone I know,

which is by the time you found the right house

with the right day and you're thinking long-term.

Correct.

Okay, and the same thing happens with cars.

So it is amazing how much money

we're all spending on these things many times too much,

but hopefully we got something we love.

That's why we're all here on this podcast with this show

is to try to get you something you love to drive

that when the bill comes every month,

even if it's frightening, you go, yeah,

I have that thing and it's awesome.

I love my car.

Yes.

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So our topic Tuesday today

actually builds on one we did recently.

Many of you, when we did our most fun car at every price point,

we obviously were focused on just fun cars,

but most of those aren't family cars.

So this is fun family car,

and I gave myself extra rules, okay?

But we're gonna do the same price points as before.

So again, it's five grand, 10 grand, 20 grand,

$50,000, $75,000, and $100,000.

This is the most fun or best fun family car

at each of those price points.

I also, look, I wanna acknowledge

GTI's work here, Civic SI's work, WRX's work,

Elantra N's work, the Integra is a great four-door family car,

but I specifically went four-door, four-seat,

rear-wheel drive.

For every category.

Wow.

Also, less than 20 years old,

because I mean, if you go back far enough,

everything becomes affordable.

Of course.

I did less than 20 years old,

and I didn't duplicate a manufacturer,

and that was hard.

If I used a manufacturer, I couldn't use it again.

That's very hard actually.

And I also wanna say to you

that some of these you're gonna hear me run up against,

and I'm gonna use it at a price point,

but you could find it at four or five

of the price points, that model.

Of course.

I'm not gonna come back around.

You could say that.

Sure.

Yeah, so these were my rules.

I gave myself lots of rules,

but I have a different car at every price point,

and I have a couple that genuinely surprised me.

I was like, oh, those are that price now.

I can put that right there.

So it's very exciting.

I'm looking forward to this.

I love this.

I've got some rules for myself as well.

They must be interesting to drive.

Love it.

Or very enthusiast-oriented.

They have to have some element of we've driven them,

we've liked them for a reason,

and you know what, this is fun.

It doesn't have to be absolutely

the most mind-bending thing

because four doors, four seats,

generally precludes a car

from being the most fun thing ever driven.

But we're trying for fun with the family.

We've got family needs, kids.

I allow SUVs, but I actually didn't choose any.

Good.

And there's some fun SUVs,

and I had considered a few,

but I decided, you know what?

I'm with you.

It's gotta be four doors.

There are no, you can make two doors work.

Of course, yeah.

But generally speaking, fun for the family.

For me, mileage is irrelevant.

Okay.

I'm also 20, well, 21 years at this point.

Okay, good, all right, got it.

And four doors only, like I mentioned,

potential maintenance or known problems.

Anybody says, you know, well,

don't buy one of those because of blank.

I'm ignoring those.

Okay.

And putting fun in the place of that.

You know, mom and dad being an enthusiast driver

and having fun at any price point.

You could drop off the kids at school

and take the fun way home by yourself

and have a great time.

Yeah.

I didn't duplicate models,

but I did duplicate manufacturers.

All right.

Cool.

All good.

I say dive right in.

Okay, I will dive in.

This was interesting because I had one of those moments

where this first car on my list

is one of those where you could do it

at almost every price point,

but I decided to start with it at five grand,

and that is the BMW 3 Series.

Did you know that the non-M, E90 generation,

the 2009 and up BMW 3 Series,

these are all over the place for $5,000.

Are they really?

That's fantastic.

Go shop.

Yes, the mileage varies wildly.

The condition varies wildly,

but they sold so many of these.

And this is a great, genuinely great chassis.

You can get it in small engines,

but you can get it in the 328 with an actual,

it's like straight six.

The 330 exists, or 335.

I think it was 335 on this one.

I'm gonna get that wrong.

But anyway, there's good engines.

There's good chassis.

Here's the thing.

If you buy a $5,000 BMW 3 Series

that even looks halfway decent,

no one's going to think you spent five grand.

That's true.

And I also think, even though,

even in these-

Five grand, they're all five grand.

That's amazing.

But there's a lot of them.

That's what I'm saying.

Looking at five grand,

I put my absolute max at seven

and I didn't even have to go that high.

That's amazing.

I was looking on autotempus.com slash every day,

it was amazing how many were out there.

I think this is one of those cars that when you get it

and you get it and you make sure it's got tires

and oil and maintenance and all that kind of stuff,

you're gonna drive it every day

and no part of you is going to think,

yeah, this was a cheap car.

It's gonna feel like a lot of car for the money.

So $5,000 BMW 3 Series moving up to $10,000.

The Infiniti G37 sedan, you remember these?

I do.

These are less than 20 years old.

This was a good looking sedan and it's time.

This was not the most amazing thing dynamically

but I think in most trims,

these were more fun to drive than the 3 Series.

This is when Infiniti was getting it right.

So the G37 sedan, four doors, four seats,

the tech was not cutting edge

at the time these cars were released.

So now it does seem old, but who cares?

This is a great car dynamically for $10,000.

You have your choice of these cars and they're out there.

So I really think the Infiniti is a great choice at 10 grand.

I will also acknowledge many of you

are gonna write your own list into the comments.

We love that.

We are not claiming these are the only options there.

These are just the ones that stand out for us

but I had to go to Infiniti.

I just love that one there.

Jumping up to $20,000, the Kia Stinger GT.

That's cool.

We've had a few of these join us

on many of our adventure trips.

Are these really 20 grand now?

You can find them.

Or GTs.

You can find them.

Now, there's a lot of lower models.

A lot of lower models.

I was gonna say, yeah.

But the GTs, if you shop carefully,

I found multiple out there that are the GT1s.

You can do rear wheel drive.

This has a surprising amount of,

this is real four seat space here.

Now the G37 Genesis is another great card.

You can get down into these prices

but that's got a smaller back seat.

This has a full size adult back seat and a hatch.

That's excellent.

You're gonna have more space in a Kia Stinger GT

than a lot of SUVs, frankly.

And it is a genuinely fun chassis.

When these have come on our adventures,

every time we've driven one,

you and I are both surprised by,

this drives even better than we expected.

Every time we drive one, they just drive well.

You get it with that great three,

I think it's a 3.3 or a 3.6 motor.

That turbo is excellent.

You cannot go wrong here.

Kia Stinger, $20,000, get a GT.

For 20 grand, I didn't realize this went down that far.

That's amazing.

Here's the thing,

you go a couple thousand dollars in either direction.

We're talking about stretch and budgets

but 20,000 as the target,

you can get into these for sure.

Jumping up to 50,

you knew it was coming,

the Alpha Giulia Quadrifoglio.

If I had $50,000 and somebody said buy a sedan,

I would run right over to the Alpha Giulia Quadrifoglio.

I'm showing a green one on screen right now.

This comes in a gorgeous blue,

a gorgeous green, a great red.

There's like a coppery orange color.

We've seen an RSR has that one.

Which is a very unique color.

This is a spectacular looking car

and thankfully it's also a spectacular driving car.

Incredible horsepower in that Quadrifoglio, great engine.

You've all heard me talk about it arguably too much.

But for $50,000,

I go right here and I stop.

I don't want an M car.

I want the Alpha and I'm done.

We've known two or three close friends that have owned them.

They have loved them.

Yeah.

So this is my car for sure.

I would totally own one of these.

Jumping up to $75,000.

Tons of options of the Porsche Panamera.

It's great.

Pick your spec.

I don't even care.

This was designed originally

to have room for four, six footers.

Yeah.

Okay, this is a genuine 4C car.

Now it isn't, here's the downside.

This is not a five seat car.

This is a four seat car.

The hatch isn't huge, okay?

But I think the 911,

below the GT cars,

drives more like the two door version of the Panamera.

Then the Panamera feels like a bigger 911.

This is a, these are great dynamically.

And the Panamera also,

I have a weird thought here that these started ugly

and then they became quite attractive.

And now they've gone ugly again.

The new ones with the really big boxy headlights

and the weird front end.

I mean, I'm showing one here

that is right when they start to turn.

The current ones I have seen pictures of.

Because they're right.

And then it turned ugly.

And then they over corrected.

That's funny.

It's, they've gone ugly.

They've gotten like big and bulky and weird looking now.

The front end on them is not attractive.

The front end on them worked on the first gen.

The signature lighting now is.

And now it's just gone bulky and strange.

Well, that signature is going for

the new Cayman and Boxster, I believe.

And I'm not convinced.

It looks big and weird.

So the Panamera's you can afford for $75,000.

You take your pick.

What is the spec you'd like?

And this is a fantastic family car

that when the family is out of it,

you can drive it as hard as you ever want.

Bring it to an HOD track day.

These things are great on track.

And then you pick up the kids and the groceries

and the hatchback and the whole thing.

Love these to 75.

A hundred is interesting.

You're not going to believe, my friend,

what I found at $100,000.

Really?

I'm going to go off book for a second and come back.

I'm going to go crazy for a minute

because it's only two doors.

But I am showing a 2024 Maserati Gran Turismo Modena.

Now this is a step down from the Trofeo that we drove.

We drove the Trofeo, which has the huge, huge engine.

But this still.

It's not that far of a step.

Has like 480 horsepower and 450 pound feet of torque.

It's still as a car that does under four seconds,

zero to 60.

Only two door.

But it does have arguably usable back seats.

But the point I'm making here is,

this was originally like $180,000, $200,000 car.

The one I'm showing right now has 2400 miles

and they're asking $107,000.

And I wish this was enough of a joke

that I could be like, this is the only one.

It's not.

There's a lot of them.

I mean, I've seriously entertained these.

I can't afford them.

Of course not.

The Modena for this price, this is all wheel drive.

The chassis is superb.

This is an excellent four seat car

that is supposed to be twice the price they're selling for.

If they're 100,000 now, next year they're like 75.

Yeah.

I'm already sold.

These are dropping like stones.

And this Modena version, again, plenty of power.

It's not the big Trofeo, but plenty of power.

What do you need here?

I cannot believe this exists at this price.

This is amazing.

I think they set it up as a joke

thinking they've got at least be 150.

And I was just scrolling through like between 99 and 110.

It was like, what color would you like, sir?

I couldn't believe it.

So anyway, that doesn't really work

because it's not four door, but all wheel drive four seats

and it's the Maserati Gran Turismo Modena.

Yes, please.

Moving on to reality at $100,000,

I have to bring up this car, the Cadillac CT5V Blackwing.

The car we're all dreaming about in this entire category,

that we all have in our head is like the icon

is the E39 M5.

Pretty much.

It's a full size, four door, four seat sedan.

It's just slightly too old.

Exactly.

It's rear wheel drive, manual transmission.

This is what this Cadillac is.

It's all of the things the E39 did.

I like they found at least a couple photos

of these cars doing burnouts.

That was important to me.

I was just digging around.

But the CT5 comes in cool colors.

It's not just all the shades of gray and black.

Cool colors, great power, interesting engine,

fantastic dynamics, the CT4 and 5 are both excellent.

These right now, 100 grand new,

like go out and buy a brand new one.

Spec one for yourself and maybe break $100,000, maybe.

Get it under the 107 of the Maserati.

But my point here is, these are gonna go away.

You can find used ones for under 100K,

but I don't think you can do a better four door, four seat,

family car, rear wheel drive, manual transmission.

It's all of the things, $100,000.

I like that you were definitive

with one car in each category

because I have a lot of runners up for my categories.

I really tried to pair my list down

because you're right.

You can have, there's a ton I've missed

and I'm sure you're bringing a lot of them up.

There's others in every one of these categories.

But again, to my rules, I was trying to stay

rear wheel drive and never duplicate a manufacturer.

That's really good.

I couldn't believe how much fun it was.

And every one of these cars,

I think you would get in any of these cars

at any of these prices and be like,

I only spent how much?

Even at 100 grand for that Cadillac,

I think it's still a, I only spent how much?

They're that level good.

So intrigued by our different approaches

and how we positioned,

because I've got some duplicates in here.

I'm sure, I'm sure you have some of the same ones

that I did.

But there are different spots.

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Diving in with my list here, very different.

You did very well with the rear wheel drive three series.

I didn't know they were down that far.

That's excellent.

I was very surprised actually,

but there's a lot of them, yeah.

Like I mentioned, I've got runners up

for all of these categories, well, all except one,

just because there were cars

that I couldn't not acknowledge.

But for five or $6,000,

a Volvo S60 from 2012, the T5.

Five or six grand.

Here's one that's just under seven with 65,000 miles.

250 horsepower and 266 pound feet of torque.

I always did love how Volvos drove.

I agree, I agree.

I thought they were just great, fun, solid,

great seats.

I think this is a great choice.

And I'm finding out a lot of them with high miles,

which I know I threw out mileage,

but that just tells me these have longevity.

Okay, fair, fair.

The following for these cars,

the runner up just 21 years old is the Lexus IS 300.

The original, you could find these with manuals.

They were light, rear wheel drive, chuckable, fun.

That's great.

Great cars to drive.

That's a great one.

And I also had toyed with the Acura TL.

That 05 to 08, we always liked.

Those were good.

This I'm showing here is a 2012 TL, which.

When they added the chrome beak.

Yeah, the beak is not ideal, but the longevity.

And you know what?

These are just solid cars for families.

They're decent to drive.

So in the five to 7,000 range.

That's three, four, if you add the BMW,

I've got the four excellent cars

we're talking about in that range.

Yeah, I mean, I realize some of these are,

well, these are front wheel drive cars

except for the Lexus, but I still good.

I think they're still fun to drive.

And I think they're still viable.

Moving on to the $10,000 range, I just have one.

And that is a 2014 Subaru Impreza WRX wagon

for $9,900 straight up 100,000 miles.

I think your family, young kids,

I think you're just gonna want to take this car.

At any time, let's go for a ride.

Does the family stuff.

It's a small wagon, hatch.

That's good.

That's really good.

You really need to bring this back

and Subaru is already teasing us with,

hey, here's more cool stuff like they always do.

We'll see.

We're not gonna build it.

We're just gonna tease you.

All right, moving on to the $20,000 range.

I think you're gonna be surprised

when I show you a 2017.

There you go.

Infinity Q50 Red Sport 400.

I can't believe those are that cheap.

They're 20 grand all day long.

Sometimes less for a red sport.

400 horsepower, 375 pound feet of torque.

That's a superb engine.

Yeah.

That engine went on to be in the current Z.

Yes.

And when we drove it, we talked about

this is the engine the Z needs

and that's eventually what they did.

That is a great version.

So I had the G35 below.

You have this here.

That's superb.

Did you realize they built these

all the way up until 2024?

They built these forever.

There's new ones practically for 50 grand

but you can get one exactly like the new ones

from 2017 or earlier.

That's a great point.

For 20.

That is so much sedan for that amount of money.

That's really excellent.

It's kind of what I was thinking.

I have the Honda Civic Si,

the current generation for 20 grand.

That's very good.

The Honda Civic Hybrid in the 20,

well it's closer to 2025.

Somewhere in there.

Yeah.

Liked that car.

I can't not say Mazda 3 Turbo.

I love this thing.

Very good.

We just had those two together.

It's really good.

$20, $25,000.

Here's where Alpha fits for me at the $20,000 range.

I see it.

The Julia, not the Quad.

Yep, absolutely.

But just straight up Julia.

Yeah, I thought of that as well, yeah.

And finally the Hyundai Elantra

and all of these are great family cars.

Yes.

Space, groceries, kids, dogs.

And fun.

People and all of them are fun.

All right, moving on to the $50,000 range.

You had Quad here.

I did, yeah.

For me, it is the Integra Type S,

hands down all day long.

It's a superb car.

Brand new.

52.

It is the new, this is the 2024

blue Integra Type S that I'm showing up here.

But the runners up include an Audi RS3 for 50K.

That's a lot of cars.

Compelling for me.

The Quad goes here as a runner up for me,

which I also, I love and acknowledge.

The F80, BMW M3, I cannot leave alone.

I have to mention this car.

I hear it deserves to be there for sure.

That's for sure.

The Portamale Track, the Genesis G70, 2.5.

Excellent.

And finally, again, Volvo S60.

Well, I guess this is one duplicate,

but you know what, I'll give myself a moment.

Keep going.

Yeah, you've got a great list.

S60 Black Edition, this is the recharge.

This was just so entertaining.

This was the ultimate sleeper car.

Yeah.

You just did know how powerful it was,

and you were just ensconced in luxury.

It was great.

I find your Cadillac placed very interestingly.

Okay.

Because at $75,000, I'm going CT4V Blackwing.

Okay, yeah.

For the $75,000 mark, which is the ultimate

family sedan at 75K.

It's great.

Look no further.

It's great.

You know what?

I have to acknowledge, oh, here it is in the Cyber Yellow.

Here's that CT4.

That is craziness.

The Cyber Yellow is obnoxious and absurd and cool.

Cadillac, who's known to be staid,

is somehow offering some of the best colors ever

on one of the best sedans ever.

What bizarro world are we in?

They're about to leave that behind.

Well, I guess the CT5's coming back.

Let's hope so.

All right, so that's the Cyber Yellow color.

I'd never actually seen one in photos or in person.

It's obnoxious in a good way.

I have to put for, well, this is under 70,

just under 70, the Hyundai Ioniq 5N.

I think this could absolutely be your family car

because it's a hot hatch, but it's bigger than a hatch.

It is.

It's bigger than the hot hatch segment.

It's the smallest SUV, yeah, yeah.

Where does it fit?

But it's enough for all the family duties

and it's a riot to drive.

I love this thing.

A lot of high performance electric vehicles

could make this list.

But the problem is high performance

doesn't necessarily equal fun.

True.

And generally, the EVs that I've driven

have been very powerful and sometimes very fast,

but rarely fun.

Your Ioniq in here is the exception.

The Ioniq 5N is genuinely fun.

It's fun whenever you'd like it to be at whatever speed.

And that's a real success.

Agreed.

You know something else that, for me,

I kind of had a bad attitude about.

That was the Polestar 2.

I found this to also be fun.

I dove harder into driving this and kind of enjoyed myself

and I thought, am I allowed to change my mind?

Yes.

So I say Polestar 2, the $75,000 mark

and less so than that right now, quite a bit less.

Which all brings me to the $100,000 mark

and I just couldn't decide.

There is my definitive.

OK, all right, I'm ready.

And here it is.

Oh, OK.

The Mercedes estate, the E63S estate with 600 horsepower.

That's hard to argue.

This is the family fun car.

You're right.

Absolutely.

I could not.

I had to go shopping and shop I did for 93,951.

At Paul Miller Audi, you can get yourself a 2021

with 38,000 miles under $100,000 now.

In great blue and that is a rocket ship family vehicle.

I want this.

I'm not surprised.

I want it just.

Full wagon, blue, amazing.

That's great.

That is great.

You'll find yourself making up excuses to take the mark.

Can we go?

Can we just?

Yes.

I want to hear it.

I want to drive it.

I want to be in it.

Can we just take it to go do made up reason?

Yep, I love it.

That is the definitive for me $100,000.

But of course, I could not leave that $100,000

level alone because this for me

is where the brand new Panamera goes.

Well, I guess it's not the new one with the different lights.

This is where a GTS goes for me.

Sure.

Hunter K, boom, Panamera.

They're great.

I think this is fantastic.

I don't understand how that car is turning ugly again.

They'd gotten it right.

You're right.

They did get it right.

Like the 2020 Sport Turismo extra wagon

was Panamera perfected.

And then it's just started to slide since then,

which is really too bad.

It's a totally different styling direction.

And we're going to see that reflected

on the upcoming Cayenne.

It's, of course, part of the Macan design language.

See it on the Cayenne.

And 911s need elliptical headlights.

They cannot take on this new design language.

I think sales will tank if they do.

You know what it feels like to me?

It feels like the 996 generation 911

when that and the Boxter and everything

had that headlight shape, including the first-gen Cayens.

And it didn't work on anything.

And they had to correct.

I think this new headlight boxy direction

of the vents and all that.

I think it's kind of the egg headlights 2.0

where it's not going to look right on any of their models.

And the next-gen refresh is going to have to fix it.

Every photo I've seen, new Cayenne, new Macan,

the Boxter in camo, this Panamera,

it makes the cars look big, which is weird.

What I like is that that design language used

on the Taycan I'm all about.

I can see it.

I don't know if it's because it's EV or not,

but I can see that, all right, I do like it on here,

but not across the board,

but that's what car companies love to do

is introduce it on a flagship

and then copy it across the board.

I don't think it's going to work on Cayenne and Boxter

and certainly not on 911.

Very interesting.

A couple more here.

We've actually been to this particular photo location,

this particular spot.

Yeah, that's very cool.

At $100,000, I mean, I'm choosing Merck.

That's my top choice.

But whenever we see an RS6,

whenever we all see an RS6,

doesn't everybody just go, oh, oh, if only.

This has superb.

The look of this has a style and a vibe to it

that's much better than the Mercedes.

This has an anger about just the styling

that the Mercedes can't match.

Have you ever seen them with the aerodynamic roof box

on top and you just think,

they're off to some cool adventure?

Let's hope so.

My life is not like that.

I wish my life were like that.

I want to do whatever they're doing in that car.

Exactly, that's very good.

Where are you guys going?

Coolness, so you're gonna go do.

That's awesome, I love it.

And then finally, here is the G80.

Of course, I could not show the front end.

So I'm showing the rear of the G80.

Excellent.

M3, it does drive very well.

You know what, this is at $100,000 for a family car.

Let's take the M3.

Let's just drive it.

They are the reference point.

The M3 and M5 are the reference point.

I'm not surprised you brought it back.

That's very good.

I could not help myself with the runners up

because I think they needed to be acknowledged.

I think that's excellent.

I love the differences in our selections here.

All of them, I think are valid.

And I'm amazed that there still can be fun to be had

way down on the lower price levels.

That's fantastic.

I'm shocked that, hey, depreciation is our friend.

I'm shocked at some of the stuff we find.

And again, depreciation is our friend

because we're all gonna get

Maserati Grand Trees, most in a few years.

I'm all about that.

And have a spectacular four seat,

two door all wheel drive thing.

That drives so much better than it deserves to.

Yes, they drive great and I seriously think

that is a Netuno engine designed, developed

and manufactured only by Maserati.

It's not shared.

It's just a Maserati engine.

They put it in everything.

I haven't heard anything bad about it.

Very curious about it.

All right.

Continue to write to us with lists.

What do you want us to go through?

Post your lists, yeah.

Yes, definitely post your lists

and then what do you want us to cover in the future?

EverydayDriverTV at gmail.com.

Send Annie a voice note.

Hey, sis.

So, okay, you know that cozy hoodie

you always steal from Charlie after your workouts?

Well, I just went to Lululemon

and saw they have the same one for women now.

I think it's called Steady State.

Just throwing the idea out there

since you haven't added your wish list

in the group chat yet.

Plus, I know how much you love matching Charlie.

Anyway, talk later.

I'll see you at RunClub.

Shop women Steady State now at Lululemon.com.

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We just got finished with a huge week

and hooked on driving.

We had an event all over the nation.

We had one at Pacific Northwest,

we had one in Northern California,

we had one in the Midwest.

We have a whole lot more events coming.

The year is winding down,

but you can't tell it based on the stuff

happening pretty much in the next four or five weeks.

Yeah, we had a great time

at the recent Northeast Watkins Glen Day,

that was fantastic, we attended that.

And we were told by Cody there, he said,

after 3 p.m. on Saturday, there were 1,000 people

at the gate.

It was awesome.

Fantastic, for the food trucks, the live music,

it was just, it was really something to see.

It was really cool.

Can't fire and hang out after the track,

it was really, really awesome, it was a great event.

Coming up in NorCal, Saturday, November 1st

and Sunday, November 2nd at Laguna Seca,

that is a 92 decibel day, but that is no bad thing

because of the new noise restrictions.

They're actually a little bit friendlier,

so that is good.

NGMP Lightning Track in the Northeast,

Saturday, November 1, Sunday, November 2,

same weekend, and then Pit Race in Pennsylvania,

that is closing.

We have learned that that is no longer going

to be in existence.

After Saturday, November 8th

and Sunday, November 9th,

HOD has the distinction of being the last ever track day,

track weekend at Pit Race.

After that weekend, the locks will go on the gates

and apparently that is it for Pit Race.

Apparently it's going to be a data center.

That's what we've learned.

Here's the thing, I didn't think,

I didn't think close the racetrack and build condos.

I didn't think there was a step worse than that.

It's a data center.

Close the racetrack and be a data center

is even more of a bummer than condos.

That's what's happening.

I guess.

Moving on to Saturday, November 15th

and Sunday, November 16th, back in NorCal

for Thunder Hill Raceway Three Mile.

And then moving out to the Mid-Atlantic region,

Saturday, November 29th and Sunday, November 30th.

That is Thanksgiving weekend,

the Saturday, Sunday of Thanksgiving weekend, 2025.

VIR, Virginia International Raceway for Mid-Atlantic.

That sounds epic.

Fantastic.

We got to make it out to VIR at some point.

We do for sure.

And then coming up in 2026, I am teasing you all.

We have stood up Spain and Portugal for April 24th

through the 29th, 2026, at Circuit de Sevilla

in Spain, in Sevilla, Spain, and Porto Mal

in Portugal, Southern Portugal, right on the coast there.

And we would love to have you.

It'd be great.

It'd be crazy.

It's absolutely an adventure.

Going to be a day at Sevilla

and two days at Portugal, I believe.

Yes, with a day in between for transit,

which is also going to be a little bit of a touristy day.

Keep in mind, this is Southern Spain

and the coast of Portugal.

That sounds amazing by itself.

These two tracks are very cool.

The Circuit de Sevilla has just opened the last few years,

and apparently everybody's driven it says it's awesome.

This is partnered with our partner in Europe anyway, RSR.

So this is one of these all-inclusive trips

where all of your lodging and your car

and your instructor and everything is included.

So that's on the Hooked On Driving site right now.

HookedOnDriving.com for a track day near you.

Our first car debate brings to us Josh W.

in Michigan.

It brings to us about being a passionate,

emotional over-thinker.

He's got a sentimental debate for us.

In 2017, his brother-in-law, Jesse,

suddenly passed away at the age of 26.

Oh man, we're sorry to hear that, Josh.

That's hard.

Several months prior, he had bought

a bright red 2015 Ford Focus SE automatic,

that dual clutch nightmare of a transmission,

and the car was left to his parents

along with all of his other belongings.

In 2018, Josh got a new job

that required a significant amount of driving

and his in-laws graciously gifted Jesse's car to Josh.

Interesting.

He's been driving it ever since and he loves it.

He's done upgrades.

He says, it's a fantastic little car,

surprisingly attractive.

He does a fun annual autocross,

getting 40 miles to the gallon,

but now it's got 185,000 miles

and starting to show at its age.

Josh's main concern is the transmission,

which edges closer to failure every day.

Probably one clutch replaced, apparently.

So now I guess he's ready for a more powerful car

with a few more creature comforts.

Josh is married with two boys, ages 10 and 12.

He's currently got a 2022 Ram 2500 as the tow vehicle,

but financially it doesn't make sense to drive it

because he gets 12 miles per gallon downhill

with the engine off and a tailwind.

So it does quite well.

Remember when we had what was at the TRX

and I think we got six?

We worked hard at that tow.

That was made.

Yes, I think it was six was our average.

Moving on, yes.

Josh plans to keep this truck for a long time.

He keeps the Michigan salt and miles off of it.

So he doesn't drive it too much

and his wife has a 2018 Cadillac XT5.

That's paid off and working great,

but she's apparently ready for something else as well.

But this isn't even her car debate.

That apparently we're gonna circle back for.

Yeah, moving on.

You'll have to write back.

So this car, this means something to him he writes.

He connects with cars on a very emotional level

and he's actually tearing up

while he writes to us this email.

Josh's youngest son Landon inherited this trait.

He loves the focus and told him the day before

Josh wrote this email

that he'd rather have him pass the focus down to him

instead of a Porsche.

Those are tall words.

His wife hates the car though.

Your wife, Josh, sees the car for what it is.

I hate to say that to you,

especially to you and your son,

but she says it's loud, it's small,

it's bumpy, super tight suspension from lowering it.

It's just not a nice place to be.

And she has told Josh, even though it was her brother's car,

that her brother was not a car guy

and she is freeing him up to sell it.

He doesn't have to keep it

for any emotional, sentimental reasons.

So the difficulty becomes Josh

and especially his son Landon

who have connected to this car.

Now let me give you a thought here.

You have a young son.

When my son was young,

the coolest car he'd ever seen

was whatever cool car we had.

Good point.

Okay, so while he says right now,

please give me the Focus ST

at probably at that point, 300,000 miles.

I'd rather have that than a Porsche.

And Porsche's not the point here,

but he's never been in a Porsche.

You've never had a Porsche.

You've never had an actual,

more focused sports car.

And I think if you went and bought something right,

I'll give you an example

and I'm not recommending this car in this case.

If you went and bought a first Gen 86 and FRS

in a color, he would probably nickname it the race car.

And in under a month,

he would decide it was the coolest car ever.

And we all can agree that that car is old

and underpowered compared to what even

the GR86 second gen is.

So I submit to you that you and your son

can and should move on, even though it's hard.

Josh has envisioned doing an ST type of conversion

to make the Focus more legitimate,

especially as an autocross car.

185,000 miles, Josh.

185,000 miles and a questionable transmission.

I mean, he's saying he could do a comprehensive restoration.

I've never heard of a Focus being restored.

No, uh-uh, sorry.

I know this is tough love, but sorry, no.

He said he could work on it over the years

with his kids and store it in his barn during that time

because they'll both need a car in a few years.

But realistically, Josh, you even write

that your son would get over it quickly

if you sent the Focus down the road.

You'd look back with longing and nostalgia,

but even Josh admits he could get past it too.

I'm glad that you feel that way,

because that's where you're headed.

I think that's the right call.

The final part of this problem is that Josh

is an enthusiast without an enthusiast car.

Life is too short to drive boring cars.

We hardly agree.

So he loves the Focus, but the parts

are worth more than the whole, but he could do it.

So it sounds like by writing the email

you've already started to let it go.

This is the first step in letting the car go.

Everybody in your family, and like I said,

I think your boys will get over it real quick

when you bring something cool home.

He wants something new.

Josh wants something more powerful,

sporty that he can drive daily

through all four Michigan seasons.

He likes the compact size of the Focus,

but he's open to going a size up or down.

He gives us a list of things.

Sub-5 second, zero to 60, aggressive exhaust tone,

something to tackle a few cones.

He'd be happy for out-of-crossing.

He needs four seats, but not necessarily four doors.

I like it.

He calls an oversized hockey bag and stick.

Right now his budget is about 20K or under.

Okay, that's good.

And he'd like heated seats, steering wheel,

decent radio with carplay, you know, all the good stuff.

He even says a quiet cabin.

I mean, the thing is, what you're looking for,

I don't mean this to be tacky,

what you're looking for is everything

the Focus doesn't do.

You're looking for a genuine upgrade here,

but 20 grand is an okay budget for it.

He admits to needing an automatic

at this point in his life.

And Josh, I just want to brag on you

for the list of cars that have come to your mind.

He said, not all of these are in his budget,

but he's got a great list of stuff going.

I want to brag on you for your list

of really starting to think this through.

I feel like I've got two suggestions

that will be additions to this list,

but in any case, take your boys

shopping and test driving with you.

Ooh, I like that.

Because for Landon, for your sons to let the car go,

to move on, they need to be intimately involved

in the buying process and they can't be surprised.

You can't, hey, because then you're gonna have to sell them.

No, no, it's great because of all these reasons.

If they're not involved intimately in the buying process,

I think you'll lose them

and they'll look back at the Focus and wish and wonder,

but if you help them divest yourselves of the car

and what are the steps?

First of all, it's an email to the guys.

Second of all, we're going test driving.

Third, it's starting to feel out buyers

and who might want this?

You know what, your autocross community

actually might want to take it from you.

Take it off your hands and then involve them

with news of every step as a new car

is kind of coming on board.

Share with them the budget.

Talk to them about the value of a dollar.

Talk to them where you're getting the money from

and how you're pulling it all together

and whether it's cash or financing or a mix.

Tell them everything about this new car.

That's cool.

So they have ownership because this new car

might be the one that those boys drive

as their first car.

Or it might be one of those things

I mean my son's been driving long before he was supposed to.

Anyway, it might be one of those cars

where you give them the opportunity

to drive in a parking lot even before they get a license

and I will say, don't make the mistake I did

and I learned this the hard way.

When I got rid of my Sabaru,

which by the way is a Saab 9 2X,

not me mispronouncing Subaru.

When I got rid of my Sabaru, I just got rid of it.

I mean, my son knew we were selling it,

but he didn't know the day it was going.

And when it went down the drive,

he was like, dad, I didn't get a chance

to say goodbye and it kind of broke his heart.

And I was like, oh, I screwed up here.

And every car since then, when we've sold it,

I gave him time.

I was like, buddy, sometime between here and this date,

this car is gonna go.

When do you wanna go out and just get time with it?

So the FRS, the Lancer, the Mini Cooper,

all the ones that have gone through since,

I gave him some time to say goodbye to the car.

He sat in the Mitsubishi for a long time as I recall.

He sat in the Mitsubishi at the mechanic

with a blown engine knowing it was leaving

and I just said, do you sit here till you're done?

Yeah.

And that's the thing I learned the hard way.

That's right to what you're saying.

Involve your boys in it

and then they'll understand the transition.

And I think that new life experience

of test driving some of these cars,

don't buy the car that your sons say you should buy.

Don't do that, but ask their opinion anyway.

Don't discount it though.

Yeah, because they even at a young age,

they could be right.

What did they like and why?

If they like the car you're already leaning toward, done.

I recommended a four-door sports car,

the Nissan Maxima in 1990,

when I was in junior high and I was right.

These memories stick.

And my parents didn't buy it.

These memories stick.

There's many times that you've,

many of you have written into us

when you're in your like late teens and early 20s

and you said before you were driving,

you told your parents to buy car X.

They didn't, and you're still angry about it.

It happens for sure, yeah.

I'm not angry, I'm just noting.

Yeah, you're just making it, okay.

Onward, trying to help you, Josh.

All right, Josh, at the top of his list,

Audi S3, S4 and TTS.

These are at the very top, BMW 2 or 3 series.

I want to brag on you again.

These are excellent choices.

Gotta go drive these.

Kia K5 GT, okay, good, but I like the Stinger GT2

and the GTS, yes, I like those better.

Elantra N, Giulia TI, Alfa Romeo.

Excellent.

Some Mini Cooper, JCW Clubman, something in there.

That'd be very good, yeah.

In there.

Volkswagen Golf R, GTI, or Jetta GLI.

I will XNA the GLI, do not get a Jetta GLI.

Don't do it.

We've never enjoyed anyone they've sent us.

I know there are those of you that love it

and you're gonna tell me all the things

you have to do to make it awesome.

We've never enjoyed a single one they've sent us.

Lexus IS350F is good, CT4V, well, of course it's good.

Even suggests a Tesla Model 3 performance.

No exhaust drama, he admits,

and that might be important to your boys right now.

And the speed will be impressive.

If you took your boys in a Model 3 and your wife,

you would all be wowed by the speed.

The dynamics, no, but the speed, yes.

Focus RS or ST, Fiesta ST, Civic Si and Type R,

any manual variants of these cars he loves

but just can't justify right now.

Totally got it, because they're manual

and some of them are of his budget too.

BMW, Audi, yes.

Go drive those, start in on your list.

Now is the time to do that.

But the two I wanna add for the 20K price range

are the Mazda 3 Turbo hatch, automatic only.

It's almost designed for what you've told us.

Fair point, fair point.

Small, fun, chuckable, go autocross it.

Love it.

Turbo, yeah, fast, fun, plenty of power, luxurious.

I think you'll really like that car.

And the 2020 to 2022 Acura TLX.

Actually that 2022, the TLX,

these are generally weirdly all under 20.

And that 2022, that is the new body style.

That's great actually, that's a lot of car for the money.

Yes.

A lot of car.

Those aren't the autocross cars, I realize that.

And some of them are front wheel drive at that price point.

I'm finding also a lot with high miles

but new cars with very high miles

just tells me you commuted.

They're barely used, practically untouched.

And that means you can get a deal for that

but I understand the autocross

so that's why I'm leaving the Mazda 3 Turbo hatch

up there at the top of my list.

That's very good, that's very good.

Josh, I've got a few for you here.

First off, I'm going to acknowledge

that yes, you can get it out for Mayo Julia.

I love that that's on your list.

I'm going to start with an interesting thing

I discovered today and that is

you already had it on your list.

The Volkswagen GTI would be a great solve for you.

But you know what's interesting about $20,000?

For $20,000, you get an older, more beat on GTI

than if you get an Audi S3.

You can get a newer, better Audi S3 for 20 grand

than you can a GTI.

That says to me that the S3 is hiding

as the car people don't think about getting

and I think this is the more interesting choice of the two.

The Golf is more usable with the hatch, I get it

but an S3 for 20 grand,

I was finding like 2018s, 2019s for that kind of money

and the GTIs for that were like 15, 16 and lots of miles.

So S3 is a great choice here.

I like that very much.

I'm moving on for you as well, the WRX.

Now this might not be nice enough

but this has just personality, okay?

$20,000, go get yourself a Subaru WRX.

I think your boys would love this.

I think your wife less so.

Your wife would prefer the S3, I bet you.

I think you'd all like the S3

but the WRX is interesting.

The CVT is acceptable.

Not good, I can't go good.

It's acceptable.

So you could go with that if you get a reason.

It depends on the day.

It is the best CVT out there.

Depends on my mood.

Yeah, there's that.

So there's the WRX, I have to bring it up

because otherwise it's obvious if it's missing here.

So I have to go with that one.

The Elantra N.

Sweet.

The problem is, you can't even go for $20,000

but you know what you can do?

The Veloster N.

That might be actually, that's a great choice.

The Veloster N all day long at $20,000.

You can get it with the DCT, you can get it in color.

I'm showing a black one here from one of our shoots

but you can get it in red.

You can get it in there crazy blue.

These are out there, they're manual.

They're also DCT.

So that is awesome and then you've joked before

about how I think the three door is just like

this extra little carnival ride for kids.

She's like, I have my own door.

It's a door just for kids in the back.

His sons would love this car.

I think it'd be very, very fun.

So while the, because I thought Elantra,

and then I went, oh too expensive.

Then I went, not the Veloster isn't.

Veloster N, everybody works.

But I think the best one here for you

because I keep thinking about commute car.

You want modern amenities.

You want it to be nice and quiet

and luxurious if you road trip, but you still want fun.

$20,000 gets you an M235 BMW.

They're all over the place at this price.

The M235 has a straight six BMW engine.

It has m-badging all over the place.

It has m-dynamics, but it is not, by the way,

there's a plague going on right now on Auto Tempest.

If you look up the M2, sorry,

the two series of this generation,

almost all the cars that are M235Is

are listed in the title on Auto Tempest as M2.

Are you serious?

They're not M2s.

The M235Is is an excellent car.

I think this is your car, Josh,

because when you want to have a luxurious car,

you want to take your wife out for a nice night

or you want to have a road trip, this is a great car.

It's all the modern tech, heated seats, heated wheel,

all the things you want.

If you find yourself on a back road, incredibly fun.

And I think your boys would love it too.

So that is where I'm landing is the BMW M235Is.

Love it.

Josh, thank you for your great email.

Really appreciate it.

And start your journey, autotempest.com slash everyday.

That's where a great place to start.

And yeah, involve your boys.

Topic Tuesdays, car conclusions, car debates,

everydaydriverTV at gmail.com.

John Jay writes to us

because he's in a pickle of what car to buy.

He's owned his 2015 Mark 7 GTI for nine years.

He's been all of the U.S. with it

and lived, he lived for four years in the Fatherland

when he was stationed in Germany.

He lived just south of the ring

and a reasonable distance

to all the world's best racetracks.

He's had more than a hundred laps

doing Tourist and Farton on the ring.

Love it.

Couple spa track days, Hockenheim rings,

Zolder, Zandvoort.

He started feeling the need

to get something more focused.

But then John moved to South Dakota

and ordered a GR86.

He loves it, but it's a six plus hour drive

to the nearest track.

And while he's got another move on the horizon,

he's moving to a new base.

So John, we get the idea that you're in the military.

And you want a truck and trailer

to tow the GR86, which is the fun sports car,

to your local track.

So he's thinking at this point,

it might be best to buy a truck.

He said he's towed before.

He's driven a lot of trucks

being from South Dakota originally,

but he's never seen himself as a truck person.

Are you allowed to say that out loud?

I'm just kind of curious, John.

Can you say that publicly?

Give me a moment.

South Dakota, I'm very impressed.

There are actually, watch our South Dakota road trip piece.

We did 2,000 miles in the C8 and Milotis Elise,

and we went all the way across the northern end of Wyoming

and wound up in the northwestern corner of South Dakota

on truly some of the most surprising best roads

I've driven.

So there is some great stuff in South Dakota,

but again, your closest track is six plus hours away.

I'm curious what track does it, is it UMC where we are?

Is it something that Lonnie Services in the Midwest?

Oh, I wonder if it's Road America.

South Dakota over to Road, well, you have to go around.

I'm not sure, I'm very, very curious.

I mean, theoretically I see where you're going,

but I'm very curious what the track is

at six and a half hours away.

I'm wondering if HOD Services is probably,

but you're just thinking, do I have to be a truck person?

That's what I read this as.

Do I have to be a truck person to haul my sports car

because you don't want to do what I admit this.

I understand, a six plus hour drive in the G86

to get to the track.

The problem that keeps him from diving head first

into buying a truck is that he's never considered

himself a truck guy, and the GTIs paid off

and his wife's Tiguan is plenty for road trips

and winter driving.

Okay.

So he's a Volkswagen guy.

His budget for a truck is 50 to $55,000,

but instead of a Sierra or a Tundra and a trailer,

maybe he should just buy a trailer and rent a truck

for the handful of times that he gets away to a track.

You have listened to this podcast.

Bravo, man.

Yes.

So right now he's looking at a BMW 330iX,

the F chassis, or an Alfa Romeo Giulia Quad.

Love it.

And a trailer for about $5,000 to $8,000.

So that will tow the GRD6 and then money left over

from mods and renting a truck two to three times a year.

So you bought an Alfa Giulia, a Quadrifolia, love it.

And a trailer.

You have the 86 waiting on track days.

You'll rent a truck when you need it.

Interesting, all right.

Or he says wait a couple years and just get the trailer.

He could keep with his trusty GTI

and blow out the budget for whatever wild cards

that we call for later on.

I've noted you're a Volkswagen guy, GTI in the tick one,

but I'm scrolling back up in your email

because you said you've got another move on the horizon

to a new base somewhere.

We don't know where.

He doesn't either,

which means he might be close to a track.

Right, which leads me to my choices.

John, you should sell the GTI

and I recommend that you drive the GR86

to whatever track you're going to go to in the future.

We're hearing great things actually John

about Hoosier's new track attack pro tire,

which is a street legal 200 tread wear tire

designed specifically for track use for HPDEs.

This is the balance between being street legal

and still being a nice 200 tread by tire.

Get some 18 inch wheels and the track track

track attacks and drive the GR86

because unless it's a dedicated track car

or unless it's only wearing slicks

or it isn't street legal,

I say drive your car to the track

and in your situation right now,

I don't want you to buy a truck and maybe a trailer

and then your situation changes.

You move and suddenly you're close to a new track.

I think he has to do the move first.

I agree with you.

Yes, but for right now,

maybe you can find somebody on forums

or we don't know when this move is happening

but I feel like it's closer than you think

and once you move,

I think the situation will change completely.

So I say going through a set of tires

is much cheaper than buying a truck or SUV

for the future potential track day

because again, what if you move closer to a track

and you then don't need the trailer or the truck?

I agree.

If he's gonna move,

I understand the six plus hours in a GR86.

That's loud and not fun.

If it's just sawing miles.

I mean, I do it,

but you're gonna have to wear the noise canceling headphones

and do all the things I do to survive an lease.

I get it.

But if he's gonna be two hours or less

from a track after the move,

then yeah, I agree with you.

Just drive the GR86.

I think that is an excellent point.

I'm gonna go through some usual suspects here

and then I'm going to wind up a place

that kind of surprised me,

a place I didn't expect to be.

So let me jump in this real quick.

You did bring up some great options here

as actual sedans that you could buy

and then get a trailer, rent a truck.

I have to go the obvious place.

The obvious sedan you brought up is the three series.

You can get a really nice three series for you

but don't even spend your whole 50 grand.

Spend 35, 40.

Get yourself a nice three series.

That's obvious.

Of course, you brought up the Alpha Giulia Quadrifoglio.

I can't take the opportunity.

I don't have enough to mention that car

because it is wonderful and of course you brought it up

so I'm acknowledging it as excellent as well.

Also the Acura Integra Type S.

This is a fantastic daily manual transmission.

It's also a worthwhile dad car.

You had it on your list.

It deserves to be there.

This is a great, great car

that you could get new for your budget and love it.

You don't have the money left over for trailer

but it's a separate thing.

But I actually solved the truck problem.

Oh really?

I can't believe this.

I solved the truck problem.

Really?

He's not a truck guy.

He wants something more dynamic than a truck.

But the reason to get a truck is to tow the GR86

on a trailer.

So the GR86 weighs less than 3,000 pounds.

The trailer's gonna weigh less than 1,000.

I'd say 1,500 tops.

Yes, so we need a 5,000 pound towing capacity.

Most of your SUVs don't do it.

And also you get into something

that starts to be less fun.

Okay, you don't want a truck

but you kind of feel like you need a truck.

I've solved it.

Really?

You need to get yourself.

Again, I stand with Paul.

If you move, I think you should move,

figure out where you're gonna be.

If you're less than two hours from the track,

just drive the GR86.

Get one of these fun sedans for your daily.

Drive the GR86, don't even get a truck.

For whatever reason, I tasked myself

with solving the truck problem

and I think I've done it.

Really?

The Santa Cruz tows 5,000 pounds.

And what it is is a normal truck.

When we drove this, the upper spec,

when we were genuinely surprised

at how nice it was inside

and how much it didn't drive like a truck.

And how surprisingly dynamic it was.

And the biggest strike we had against it was,

knew it was 40 something thousand dollars,

but by this point you could get a used one.

And the bed was small.

But he doesn't need a truck for normal truck things.

He needs a truck for towing capacity.

Interesting.

These tows 5,000 pounds.

And I think this is not fun,

not gonna go as far as fun,

but this is an acceptable daily.

When you're not towing.

It's not bad.

I think it's a decent daily.

It doesn't give truck driving vibes.

It doesn't feel nearly like that.

I mean, I like it for that reason.

It drives surprisingly dynamic and small.

But then when you need to hook up your trailer,

5,000 pounds worth of towing capacity

in your Santa Cruz.

Now, I don't recommend you move

somewhere like the Rocky Mountains

and you use this to haul up and down mountains.

But if you're doing what I think you're doing,

which is South Dakota flat road towing,

all day long with this.

Although get the turbo,

but what's pricing on used Santa Cruises these days?

Well, that's the thing.

The new ones are within his budget.

The new ones are like 45.

Yeah, new ones are 45.

So the point is just get a little bit used one

and go with the Santa Cruz.

I've solved the truck problem

you didn't know you needed.

Even though I prefer the fun sedans,

but Santa Cruz tows what you need.

And then it becomes a good daily

and a truck when you need it.

That's actually quite a solve.

I think you I think you've got it there for truck.

I stood on my don't get the truck now

because I think you'll get rid of it too soon.

I hear that.

And you're a Volkswagen guy.

And I think you've extracted all there is out of that GTI.

I think you know it inside and out.

You said it's paid off and you're,

you love Volkswagen's,

but I think it's time to step out up to Audi

with an RS3 for 50 to $55,000.

You have a choice of really late model RS3s all day long.

I went and checked on Auto Tempest.

These cars are fantastic to drive, all wheel drive.

You can track them even though I know you've got the GR86,

but this is going to be your daily.

And then when you do end up wherever you're going to live,

you'll have an awesome daily that fits in

with your Volkswagen love and the GR86.

And you'll be close enough hopefully to a good track

where hooked on driving has events.

This is my Sol for you.

That's my top choice, but also the Integra Type S.

It's great.

So good.

It's really good.

It's such a fun car.

So this is my other choice.

Again, you could track this too.

It's a Civic Type R in, you know,

with a little bit more leather, but again.

It's better.

This now ties in with, you know,

your Japanese cars.

You've got the Toyota, you've got the Acura.

I think you'd like this a lot too.

So you've got many choices.

You've got both equations solved.

I feel like you've got scenarios.

This is what we do here.

This is exactly what we do here.

This is interesting.

All right.

Well, right to us.

EverydayDriverTV at gmail.com for your car conclusions.

We'd love to know what you bought.

We're going to run through some car conclusions

pretty quick, but there's a question from Bruce B.

That's just like a brain worm for me right now.

He's like, if we had unlimited budget

and a warehouse for storage,

how big would our car collection be?

Now I think if we could all be Jay Leno,

we'd have Jay Leno's car collection,

but I'm wondering for a topic Tuesday,

maybe you and I do like our 12 car garage.

That's pretty good.

That's a large collection in my mind.

Because I really feel like anything beyond 10

I would just not drive them.

But what is our 12 car garage?

Money, no object.

Space and maintenance, no object.

What's our 12 car garage?

That I'm kind of on my brain for later.

We'll come back to it right now.

We've got some car conclusions to run through.

We got a couple of really good ones,

but they are quick.

Kevin's riding in in Washington

and he had a soon to be driver in the house.

This is quite a while ago.

This was episode 959.

So sometime last year or so.

For her, he was considering an E36 M3

because he thought, okay,

that sounds like a performance car,

but it only had 240 horsepower in the modern time.

It's not a big deal.

His wife and daughter were looking around

and they wound up by getting her a 1986 E30 BMW.

The E25 ES with a manual.

He says with the pokey inline six motor

designed for fuel efficiency,

and they all love it for her.

She loves it, they love it.

It doesn't have analog brakes,

trash control or airbags,

but it's done very well in real life crash data.

And she just loves it.

And so do they.

And he's realizing he's driven a Miata.

And this car feels a lot like a Miata experience.

So now he's wondering, should he get himself an M3

or maybe an E30 or who knows?

What I like about this is,

this has reconnected you and your family, Kevin,

to small, lightweight, simple.

I mean, you thought-

Spawning ideas.

240 horsepower was gonna be just enough.

You went even less than that in the 86, 325 E30,

but those are so light and chuckable

that has to be crazy fun for her to drive.

That is cool.

Second car conclusion from Matthew E writes to us,

he's 28 years old and a process engineer in Las Vegas.

Thank you for writing, Matthew, really appreciate it.

He says he's been watching videos since 2012

when we released the FRS versus Genesis Coupe

versus the Lotus Elise.

Love it.

He moved here to the US from the Philippines with his wife.

They're approaching two years living here this October.

He's always been a car guy.

In the Philippines, he drove a 1995 Honda Civic,

the sedan, and he learned how to drive, fix,

and love cars with having that particular car.

He also drove a 2020 MG5 Alpha with the 1.5

and the CVT, that family car.

He owns a couple of bikes.

And now here in the US, he dailies a 2006 Toyota Avalon XLS

with 189,000 miles.

When he got it, he could drive it.

When he got it, he used to drive from Vegas to LA

to visit family every month.

He says it's a good road trip car,

but then he got inspired by her budget sports car film

under 8K, under 8,000.

He started to look at all those cars.

He wanted an FRS or a BRZ,

but didn't see anything in good condition

or even at $10,000.

Because a lot of the ones that are that cheap,

and there's a lot of them,

they look like they've had hard lives.

They've been road hard, for sure.

So after searching for months,

he found an 07 Pontiac Solstice GXP in gray,

five-speed manual with 90,000 miles,

one owner car with full service history

for $8,000 in San Diego.

Come on now, that's an excellent buy.

He said he flew to San Diego,

he bought the car, drove it back to Vegas,

instantly fell in love with it.

He says it feels like a lot of car for $8,000

and his wife totally loves it.

So he says, do we think he did well?

I think he did excellent.

That is a great choice.

And will we do an under $8,000 sports car video again?

What cars would we bring?

We have a cheap car challenge video

coming up for the end of the year.

That's coming in December.

We decided to go under 12,

but we have a really cool comparison video

coming up here in the next month or so.

But Solstice GXP is underappreciated.

We didn't even have the GXP on our shoot.

We had the non-turbo.

The turbo was excellent.

Yeah, I love that you got that.

That was a great buy.

Well, last question before we wrap up for this episode,

Phillip J writes to us,

he's asking about horsepower and track records.

Do people normalize track records

by the amount of horsepower a car has

or by some other index that is a combination of horsepower

or torque and or weight

or something like time per horsepower?

And I feel like we could go on for hours about this,

but I feel like people always need

some sort of benchmark they understand.

We've all driven a car and, okay, that has 200 horsepower.

Okay, that has 400 horsepower.

That has the level of acceleration,

how you feel, how the car looks,

the tires, all of that feeling.

All of us start to get a sense of, wow, that's a fast car.

And then when it comes to track records,

we think, oh, well, for a track record

with that much horsepower either,

it wasn't really the driver.

It was the car doing all the work

because it has so much horsepower.

Or, holy cow, a driver extracted that much

and was that brave and had 1,000 plus horsepower

and set track records.

Oh my gosh, we all have to have some sort of,

we've related to horsepower.

I know what horsepower feels like.

The two measurements that seem to be the most common

are zero to 60, which most people will never ever do.

And then ring time.

Oh, and the other one is top speed,

which most people will also never do.

So the three things that people won't do,

do a really fast lap on the ring,

go zero to 60 and drive the car as fast as it can go.

These are the things that we quantify by.

I mean, your concept here, Phillip,

that people will actually categorize based on horsepower

per weight or something like that, nobody cares.

I hate to say it, nobody cares.

All that they care about is how big is the number

on the spreadsheet or how small, depending upon which,

like zero to 60 number is really small

because the horsepower number is really big.

I realize our zero to 60s are the same,

but my horsepower is bigger than yours.

Really?

I mean, we're all just, here's the thing.

We're all playing.

This is all forums, everywhere.

We're all playing car fantasy football.

That's what we're all doing.

We're just sitting there going,

well, mine did better than yours because of,

and our big thing here is go drive the fun thing

and drive it well.

And we make the joke every time the guy at the track,

at some point, if you pass a Miata, it's a victory

because the Miata's probably gonna pass you.

That's the reality.

I mean, it's all about the fun driving

and you can get the fun driving at any horsepower point.

It's a big deal.

Fantasy track lap, fantasy horsepower.

Yes, for sure.

I like all of this.

K-Bliss has one question I wanna cover real quick.

You mentioned it in passing

and that is, have we seen the new Subaru STI

hatchback teasers?

Looks like it'll get some level of electrified

and combustion engine.

Now for the fun part, he's giving us a list of levels.

He says, pick two, will it be the new STI?

Japan only, CVT only, over $50,000 price tag

or entirely fake news.

He says, you really hope Subaru gets a win.

K-Bliss, here's the problem.

Subaru has so much of a reputation,

it's become cliche that they show a really cool concept

and then the actual car comes out and we go,

oh, well that's okay, but did you not see your own concept?

And many times, you look at the concept

next to the real car and you go,

but it's not that far away, you could have done that.

It's not like the concept flew

and then the actual car is like, it's a real car.

The concept looks like they took the real thing

and then just went crazy one night.

So it's like, why didn't you do that?

Subaru, it's a cliche at this point,

how many times I've done it.

I think it won't look like the teasers.

That's the first problem.

It probably will be $50,000

and I'll be very surprised

if it doesn't have a CVT option.

Not only, but option.

I don't suspect it'll be Japan only.

It'll have to be a worldwide car.

It will have to be.

Sports cars don't generally fit

Subaru's product lineup anymore.

True, true.

I mean, they've got the WRX, the STIs in their past.

They've got it and we would welcome that.

Yeah, for sure.

But generally speaking, you look at the Subaru website

and it's just SUVs and underpowered and okay.

And then there's not fun, fast sports car drivers.

Here's the BRZ over here going,

what am I doing here?

There's an outlier and of course,

we're hearing the rumors too.

You've probably read the article,

you've seen the rumors that the BRZ,

the Toyota Fuji Heavy Industries relationship

is dissolving, maybe going towards Mazda.

We'll see.

And that would be the future GR86 plus Mazda mashup,

which makes a lot of sense.

There is, those are unfounded rumors.

We're just hugely unfounded.

We hear things just like you do,

but we'll see because yeah,

you look at the lineup and the BRZ like,

what is that doing there on the product lineup?

We were at a Toyota event this past week.

And okay, the source that said the Mazda Toyota partnership

to do a new Miata and 86,

we all, this sounds like a Reddit idea

that found its way onto a news article

and it is that level of shady too.

So there's that going on.

So somebody actually had the wherewithal

to ask somebody very high up at Toyota.

We were sitting at dinner with them.

Somebody very happy Toyota, who we like,

he's a great guy.

They asked him if he would like to confirm or deny

that it was Mazda and Toyota getting together to make this.

And he gave the world's greatest smile and said,

oh yeah, I read that article too.

So even Toyota is like, are you kidding?

So we'll see what reality is,

but I don't think the STI is gonna look like the teaser.

That's the sad part.

So you're just saying Subaru continues to tease us

with awesome stuff that doesn't fit in their portfolio.

We'll never be built.

And when it finally comes out,

the world will collectively go, huh.

I would love for them to prove us wrong.

I would love it.

I would love for them to have a new STI that it drops

and we all go, where's everybody else?

Mitsubishi, Toyota, where's your car to compete with this?

Because this is super cool.

I want that very much for Subaru.

Agreed.

All right, well, we'll stop there.

We'll end the podcast there.

Thank you guys for all your questions.

Thank you for your social media questions.

We've got a few we'll get to for the next episode.

For sure, yeah.

And we'll continue with our lists,

continue with the car debates,

and of course, car conclusions.

Write to us everydaydrivertv at gmail.com

and go to hookedondriving.com

to find a track day near you.

And by the end of 2025,

schedules are gonna be starting to be posted

for next year's dates.

So watch each region for cool schedules.

We're hearing all of the regions

are starting to populate their schedules for 2026.

It's going to be an incredible year.

Fantastic.

Looking forward to it

and looking forward to next time as always.

Cheers, everyone.

Most Fun Family Cars, Letting Go Of Emotions, Quantifying Track Records | Episode 1,017

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