A seamless shift gearbox is a special kind of racing transmission that changes gears with almost no “power break.” That means the car keeps pulling smoothly instead of feeling like it pauses between gears.
A “Grand Prix” is a big, high-profile car race. The host is talking about the weekend format: qualifying first, then the main race.
Person
Lance Droll
The host is congratulating a race driver for winning. The name in the transcript looks a bit off, but it’s clearly someone who just won a Grand Prix race.
This is a BMW M3, but in a wagon/estate body style (the “Touring”). It’s special because the E46 M3 Touring is uncommon, and this one is being recreated/updated by Petroil rather than just being an original factory car.
The BMW 3 Series is a popular BMW car line that’s meant to be comfortable but still fun to drive. The E46 M3 Touring is a special, rare version that’s shaped like a wagon but uses a high-performance M3 engine. The podcast is bringing it up because it’s uncommon and has been newly built by a custom shop.
The BMW M3 is a high-performance version of the BMW 3 Series. It’s made to be faster and more fun to drive than the regular versions. The episode is talking about a special M3 variant (the E46 M3 CSL), which is rarer and more performance-focused.
The Nürburgring is a well-known race track in Germany. Car makers use it to test how fast and how well a car handles under real racing conditions.
Term
arrow advantage
They’re talking about aerodynamics—how the car’s shape can help it stay stable and go faster. A longer roofline can change airflow over the car, which can help or hurt depending on design.
SPX is a race class—basically a category of cars that are allowed to compete together under a specific rule set. The host is saying it’s a more open “anything goes” style class.
Brand
HWA EVO
HWA is a company that makes and supports race cars. “EVO” sounds like a particular version of one of their cars that was competing in the same race class.
Brand
Glickenhouse
Glickenhaus is a car brand tied to special, high-performance vehicles and racing. Here, the host is saying it may have entered cars in the same SPX-style race class.
“Running gear” means the key mechanical parts that actually make the car drive and handle. In this case, people swap in the M3’s parts so the wagon feels much more like an M3.
This is the wagon version of the BMW E46 3 Series. People use it as the base car because it already has the estate body, then they modify it to make it feel like an M3.
Carbon fibre is a strong, lightweight material used in performance cars. Here, it’s used to make parts for the touring conversion, aiming to keep the build light and rigid.
Torsional rigidity means how much the car’s body resists twisting. If it’s stiffer, the wheels can stay more “in control,” which usually helps the car handle better.
CSL is BMW’s name for a more hardcore, lighter M3. Here, they’re saying you can spec the touring to look like that CSL vibe, such as with a carbon roof.
The S54 is a BMW performance engine that comes from an inline-six design (six cylinders in a straight line). People like it because it’s a popular engine for swaps and builds.
A donor car is a car you buy or keep just so you can take parts off it. People do this when they want to build or repair another car using those parts.
“Zero-mile” means an engine (or car) that has essentially never been used—no real break-in or wear. Enthusiasts sometimes pay a premium for zero-mile parts because they expect maximum longevity and originality.
The S65 is a specific BMW performance V8 engine. A V8 means eight cylinders, and it’s the kind of engine people choose when they want a bigger, punchier setup for a build.
They’re talking about making the car’s outer panels from carbon fiber. Carbon fiber is a lightweight material, but making custom panels is costly and labor-intensive.
A prototype is an early build of a car used to test it. It might work well, but it still might never be sold if the project is too expensive or complicated.
A V12 engine has 12 cylinders arranged in two groups that form a V shape. More cylinders like this can make the engine feel smoother and produce lots of power.
Paddle shifters are little levers behind or on the steering wheel. You pull them to tell the car to change gears, usually without using a clutch pedal.
Mid-engine cars put the engine near the middle of the vehicle to help balance the weight. Rear-wheel drive sends power to the back wheels, which changes how the car accelerates and turns.
The Chevrolet Corvette is a sports car made by Chevrolet. It’s known for being fast and exciting to drive. The episode mentions the newer C8 generation, which changed the car’s engine placement to a more modern layout.
Synthetic fuel is made in a factory rather than pumped from the ground. The idea is that it can be produced to reduce the climate impact compared with regular gasoline or diesel.
A Le Mans program is a carmaker’s effort to race at the famous 24-hour race in France. It usually means a lot of specialized engineering and team support.
Lotus is a British company that makes sports cars. The hosts are talking about how Lotus had plans for new models, but those plans got derailed.
Car
Lotus M250
The Lotus M250 is a name for a planned Lotus sports car. In this discussion, it’s described as a concept that would have been positioned above the Elise and below an Esprit, with a V6 and about 250 horsepower.
The Lotus Elise is one of Lotus’s smaller, lighter sports cars. In this segment, it’s used as the baseline “entry-level” model in Lotus’s planned lineup.
The Lotus Esprit is a more upscale Lotus sports car than the Elise. The hosts are saying it would have been the top model in a lineup that also included the M250.
They’re quoting the concept’s goal: about 250 horsepower from a 3.0-liter V6 engine. That’s basically the engine size and how much power it was supposed to make.
The Renault Clio V6 is a special version of the Clio that uses a V6 engine. That’s unusual because most Clio models use smaller engines. The episode brings it up because it’s a rare, experimental performance car.
“Creature comforts” means the convenience features that make a car feel more comfortable and easy to use. In this discussion, they’re talking about things like air conditioning, power windows, and central locking.
“Grand tour-esque” means the car is meant to feel good for long trips, not just for quick drives. The idea is comfort and ease for cruising, not a bare-bones setup.
A concept car is like a one-off prototype that shows off a new design. It’s often not meant to drive or be sold, but it can inspire real production cars.
“Single exit exhaust” means the exhaust comes out through one pipe/outlet. The hosts are using that shape and placement to describe how distinctive the rear design is.
The Renault Wind is a small Renault model with a name that sounds like “wind.” The episode is talking about the name and how it was marketed. It’s not being discussed as a performance benchmark, but more as a distinctive, unusual car.
A six-speed manual is a car where you change gears yourself using a clutch. The host is saying they chose six gears, but the engine’s torque meant fewer gears could still work fine.
DSG is a type of automatic transmission that shifts gears quickly using two clutches. Here, the point is that the early DSG design couldn’t cope with the engine’s strong twisting force, so they used a manual.
Torque is the engine’s pulling/twisting force. More torque usually means stronger acceleration, and it can also stress the gearbox if it’s too much for the transmission to handle.
A low-revving engine doesn’t need to spin very fast to work well. The host is saying this kind of engine can make strong pulling power without high RPM.
Car
Lancia Forvia
The Lancia Forvia is a famous Lancia concept car. The key thing about it is its classic shape: a long front hood, a small cabin, and a separate rear section. The host is saying people wanted to bring that look back in the mid-2000s.
A three-box design is a car shape that looks like it has three separate parts: the front hood area, the middle where people sit, and the rear trunk area. It’s a classic styling formula that helps a car look traditional.
The Fiat Punto Mark II is a small Fiat car. They’re talking about using its underpinnings (the chassis) for an idea, but it turned out to be the wrong fit.
The Alfa Romeo Spider is a roadster, and its chassis is the car’s main frame/underbody. They’re saying that chassis was a better starting point for the project than the Fiat Punto.
A financial crisis is when the economy gets hit hard and money becomes harder to borrow or spend. The hosts are saying that kind of economic pressure helped kill the project.
The Fiat 124 GT Abarth is a sportier version of the Fiat 124. Abarth is known for making cars feel more performance-focused. The episode connects it to the idea of Fiat and Mazda working together on a modern 124-style roadster.
The Fiat 124 Spider is a small sports car designed for open-top driving. It’s meant to be fun and light rather than a big, heavy cruiser. The podcast mentions it was made with help from Mazda, which explains why it drives the way it does.
The Opel Astra is a compact car meant for everyday driving. The episode mentions it because the headlights stood out to the speaker. It’s being brought up for a styling detail rather than a technical feature.
The A-pillar is the vertical metal support near the front of the car, by the windshield. It helps hold the roof up and defines the front edge of the side window area.
Mercedes CL is a Mercedes luxury coupe model line. The speaker is using it as a visual comparison for the Rover’s roof shape—basically saying the roofline looks similar in style.
The Acura CL is a luxury coupe, meaning it’s a nicer-looking two-door car. The episode mentions its shape, especially the curved design details. It’s brought up because it looks distinctive as a luxury car.
The B-pillar is the vertical support in the middle of the car’s side, between the front and rear doors. It’s part of what shapes the side windows and roof structure.
“Pillarless doors” means the door opening doesn’t have a fixed vertical post in the way. It can make the side look cleaner and more open, but the car has to be built strong enough to compensate.
Concept
financial troubles in 2005
The speaker is saying Rover ran into serious money problems around 2005. Because of that, the plan for this kind of car didn’t continue and was stopped.
The speaker is talking about making a “concept” car idea real, even if the original plan never got produced. It’s basically a custom build based on a design someone wanted but couldn’t buy.
The Range Rover is a large luxury SUV from Land Rover. The SV Coupe is a special version with a coupe-like roofline instead of the usual SUV shape. It’s mentioned because it’s uncommon and different from the standard Range Rover.
This is a special two-door version of the Range Rover. It’s meant to look more sporty than a normal SUV, and it’s positioned as a very premium, limited kind of vehicle.
A production run is the planned quantity of vehicles a manufacturer builds for a specific model or special edition. In limited-edition discussions, it’s often tied to rarity, pricing, and how quickly demand can be met.
A supercharged V8 is a V-shaped engine with eight cylinders, and it has a device that pushes more air into the engine. More air usually means more power.
The Audi S8 is a high-performance luxury sedan. It’s meant to be comfortable like a big car, but with stronger power than a regular model. The episode references it as a benchmark for what a performance luxury sedan could be like.
The Porsche 911 is a well-known sports car from Porsche. It’s famous for its distinctive shape and rear-engine layout. The episode is suggesting a possible link to an RSR-style 911, which would be a more race-inspired version.
Car
Porsche 919 Street
The Porsche 919 Street is a special Porsche concept that’s based on the company’s famous Le Mans race car. It’s basically a “street version” headline car that shows what Porsche’s racing tech could look like on the road.
Car
Porsche 919
The Porsche 919 is Porsche’s famous race car from the 24 Hours of Le Mans. It won multiple years and used advanced hybrid technology, which helped it stay fast and efficient over long races.
“Laboratories on wheels” is a way of saying the race car is basically a rolling test platform. Teams use it to try new tech and learn fast because racing puts everything under extreme conditions.
“V4 hybrid” means the car has a four-cylinder engine arranged in a V shape, and it also uses electricity to help power the car. Race teams use this to get more efficient power and better control during long races.
The Bentley Bentayga is a very expensive luxury SUV from Bentley. It’s the kind of car that’s built to feel comfortable and upscale, and this one is a 2018 model with a V8 engine.
Term
Euler's compliant
“Euler’s compliant” is the idea that the car meets the latest rules it needs to be allowed on the road. The host is saying that even though it’s older, it still qualifies because it meets those requirements.
Infotainment systems are the car’s touchscreen and electronics for music, maps, and phone features. The host is saying those screens and menus can get old faster than the rest of the car.
CarPlay lets you connect an iPhone to the car and use apps like maps and music on the car’s screen. The host is saying this Bentayga should still have that modern phone feature.
A “four-litre V8” is a powerful engine with eight cylinders. It’s described as four liters total, and the host is saying it’s a great-sounding, smooth engine for this Bentayga.
A W12 is a type of car engine with 12 cylinders arranged in a special compact shape. It usually feels smooth and powerful, but it can cost more to run and maintain than smaller engines.
A V8 diesel is a big engine with eight cylinders that uses diesel fuel. Diesel engines are often valued for good pulling power at low speeds, especially in heavy vehicles.
“Hold their value” means the car doesn’t lose much money when you sell it later. The speaker is saying these Land Cruisers stay desirable, so buyers still pay good prices.
LIVE
Welcome back to The Gassing Station, the podcast that ventures into the Piston Heads forums.
Like I have just ventured, ventured, ventured to Monaco co-host Sam Sheehan.
Very, very jealous.
I've just come back from the Monaco Grand Prix.
Oh, so bloody jealous.
Actually, it's not true.
Yeah, I haven't gone yet.
We're actually recording this just beforehand.
In the past.
But by the time that you listen to this, I would have come back and I'm not going to be able to tell my story.
First of all, because this will be out of date.
Yeah.
And second of all, the next time we do a podcast, we record one will be at Le Mans.
Oh, yeah, live at Le Mans.
Well, not quite, but yeah, as we go, sort of will be live and then it will go out a couple of days later.
But Le Mans feels like a much more PHE event than the Monaco Grand Prix.
Yeah.
I, however, I'm a massive Formula One fan.
I have been for decades and I've never been before and I'm actually going out to drive
the day before.
The new Formula One car.
No, Le Mans car.
It's the dream.
Yeah.
It's the apps I'd love to drive in.
I don't want one of the hybrids.
No, give me a V8.
My ultimate dream Formula One car to drive 2007 McLaren.
Yeah.
Because then the howl of that V8 is ridiculous or a V10 of any sort.
Yeah.
Of any sort.
An O4 V10 is peak.
Yes, absolutely.
I'd take an O5 McLaren.
Yeah.
Just for personal preference of the way it looks.
But, you know, if they throw me the keys to a Monardi, I'll go, why not?
Is that a bit of a dig at Monardi having low budget?
Do they still have a key?
They're whoop, and then they're off.
And everyone else had their electric, well, they were manual starts from there.
Well, it's kind of funny because when you go, obviously like Formula One moves in technology
and it's like you go back to that time period of where some, do you remember the term seamless shift?
Yeah.
Where it's like, oh, they had a seamless shift gearbox where the ones at the back of the bridge.
And their heads stopped doing that.
Yeah, exactly.
Stopped rocking for the listeners.
Oh, my God.
You could just imagine, yeah, that they were looking at a Formula One car from 20 years ago now.
And at the time, they were so advanced and now they look ancient.
Yeah.
So, no, I'm very much looking forward to driving the Audi RS5 the day before.
I went to the launch of it and I think it'd be a lot of fun to drive.
I'm going to take on some nice twisty roads and then I'm going to watch somebody put it on pole.
And I'm not going to be there for the Grand Prix, but it doesn't matter because whoever is on pole on the Saturday, 99% of the time is the person who wins it on Sunday.
Well done, Lance Droll. Good win. Good win.
So that's an estate car I'm very excited about, but there's another estate that I'm even more excited about that I can't drive.
And it's actually considerably older, but it's brand new.
It is the E46 M3 Touring that has been built by Petroil.
Yeah.
I don't know how you actually pronounce it properly.
Did you, did Royal Petroil, did you go to the, because I was supposed to go to the reveal of this, but I couldn't make it a clash in the event.
So I couldn't go either, but our very own Matt Bird has just driven it.
Oh, genius.
And annoyingly, this is the case of where we, I know he's just driven it and it's, I think the story is coming out tomorrow, the day after we're recording this.
But I can almost guarantee he would have had an absolutely magnificent time driving it.
But this is, for those who don't know, BMW in 2000 created a E46 M3 Touring.
It's not something they just drove on paper.
They actually created the concept car.
It then emerged several to many years later as a, oh, we built one of these and didn't put it into production.
Quite recently.
Yeah.
Yeah.
It was, it was really, because there was, there's a load of M projects that it's kind of once in a blue moon.
They go, oh, by the way, you could have had this, but we never built it in the end.
And it's like, it's a bit like they made a S62 V8 version of the M, the E46 M3 CSL.
Yeah, yeah.
And they put like 10,000 miles on it or something.
It drove it really far.
Never put it into production, but they were like, it was really tail happy and fun.
Plus various other things.
The G81 M3 Touring GT3 car where they were like, huh, it's a joke.
And it's like, that's, it's not a joke if it, if it's something we really want.
And then they went, okay, well, we'll go and build it.
And then obviously they race it at the Nürburgring and it finished fifth at the end 24.
Did it have an arrow?
Because they always have arrow advantages, don't know the longer the roof.
I bet it had a bit of an arrow advantage.
I don't know how it works.
It was in a class called SPX, which is kind of like an anything goes class.
So that it was joined by the HWA EVO and I think maybe the Glickenhouse used to raise an SPX.
But anyway, so they put this, they showed it off and they were like, we built this and you're going to love it,
but we never put it into production.
And the reason being is that if I understand correctly, they showed it to a load of executives
and I think some press who went, this is the best thing ever, you absolutely have to build this.
So they got quite excited and went, what do potential customers think?
So they showed loads of their top customers who went, don't care.
Probably because I guess, you know, having an estate car, if you, if you're buying a normally 46,
you don't need an estate.
So you shouldn't have shown it to your existing customers.
You should show it to people who buy your normal tourists.
That is the whole point.
Hindsight is always, 2020 is the American say.
So they never put it into production for obvious reasons.
Several decades later, the G81 turns up, everybody loves the M3 Touring and BMW is now going,
you know, maybe we should have done it, you know, but obviously they can't do that.
So Petroil comes in and says, we've gone and made it happen.
Now, if you're into this sort of thing, like I very much am, there are lots and of people who have made
E46 M3 Tourings.
Most famously, maybe, is Alex Kirsten, formerly of Carthrottle and now of his own name.
Of Alex Kirsten.
He built one and I believe it cost him many tens of thousands.
Many tens of thousands to make that happen.
But, you know, he ended up with what would have been a one of one.
Obviously, a few people have made them since this thing, though, is it's a little bit more comprehensive.
So the usual thing that people do is they'll take an E46 Touring,
330 or whatever.
And then they'll shove M3 running gear in it and voila, you've got that.
Whereas what the guys at Petroil have done is they've actually fabricated a lot of the touring parts out of carbon fibre.
Oh, yeah.
That's the way to do it.
Because apparently it's just as expensive as it would have been to make it out of steel.
Really?
If not cheaper.
I suppose because you've got to make all the presses and for a low production run.
But I mean, with carbon fibre, you still got to surely make moulds and stuff.
Okay, fair enough.
That's very impressive.
It's a bold thing to do.
So they've made it all out of carbon fibre, which means it's not far off the weight of an original M3 coupe.
1570 kg for the old coupe.
And it means that the torsional rigidity is incredible.
So it's much stiffer and super light should drive brilliantly.
But because it's essentially a rest-o-mod, although not in the traditional sense of where what we're looking at here is the...
It looks like a stock M3 touring.
I'll put pictures up of it.
The original car is in Laguna Seca Blue, one of my absolute favourite colours on a BMW.
This one's got a kind of like a caramel-y tan interior, but obviously you can have it in pretty much whatever you want.
So the ones that we've seen, standard M3 style.
However, they are going to do a carbon roof if you want a CSL style M3 touring.
Kind of defeats them.
Not really a CSL.
You're not going to put your roof rack on that, are you?
But a CS, anyway.
I'm being a pedantic.
But it's not only that.
You can also get different engine options.
So you could either take a...
You know, if it's a donor car, you could use the S54 from that, straight six.
They also apparently have some zero-mile S54 straight sixes.
Crazy.
Zero miles.
Zero miles.
Were they just hanging around in the back of the shirt?
No idea who's got zero-mile S54s lying around.
But apparently, if you fancy something a little bit crazier, you can get an S65 V8 or an S85 V10.
Now, that would be an all-rounder, wouldn't it?
A V10 and an E46 M3 touring.
That is going to be...
This is why I love the E46.
It's just that you can do so much to them.
And they're brilliant.
Just fantastic.
I'd love to drive this.
I'd love to own one.
That is going to be a lot easier said than done, because there's £130,000.
But you know what?
Given what you've just said and the spec of this car and the fact that they've had to custom make bodywork out of carbon,
that's actually, when you think about this world, not a massively insane number.
Well, think of it like this.
You can get a G81 for...
Well, not just any old G81.
That's kind of a G81 CS money, really, for that kind of...
And that is an exceptionally good car.
Obviously, this isn't nearly as powerful, but what it does have is a manual gearbox.
You can have a manual gearbox with it.
And it also has a normal face.
Yeah, it's genuinely quite a pretty car now.
It always was, but it looks especially so now.
Yeah, the thing is, a G81 CS is an exceptionally rare thing.
BMW never released production numbers for them, but when I spoke to them, I think it's in the low hundreds.
Really, really rare car.
They're only making 50 of these, so it's going to be even rarer.
And I guarantee you, wherever you go with an E46 M3 touring, Jaws will be slack.
Yeah, yeah.
And if you go for the V10 in that, wow, that's going to be a good car.
Really freaking cool.
Guaranteed, if they're only making it, they're going to stop production at that number,
and they won't then say, oh, we're going to do a second run.
Whoever goes for the rare respect of that, I mean, that's guaranteed return.
Not that you're going to do it for the money.
Obviously, you're going to drive it and love it.
Oh, yeah, exactly.
I think this is the sort of thing of where it's a lifer.
Yeah.
You buy it and you just go, that's my M3 touring now.
So I can't wait to read what Matt Bird has written about that.
But in the meantime, what I thought we could do is maybe have a look at what other cars
that were shown as concepts at some point in their life.
And we went, yes, I really want that.
And then the manufacturer said, no, no, not again.
And kind of with hindsight, maybe they should have done it.
Yeah.
So we built up a little bit of a list.
I've got a few.
You've got a few, Sam.
So I'm going to, I'm going to let you serve in sports terms.
That means you can go first.
So I actually, this was a real nostalgic one for me because I immediately thought of the
cars you could get in the early Gran Turismo games where they were like, oh, here's your
car.
Because it's a bit busy.
You are talking my language.
Yeah.
Well, because now, I mean, these vision Gran Turismo's are coming out, you know, left,
right?
There was a period, wasn't there, where every three days another one landed.
But in the early 2000s, there were a few concept cars that have been revealed that the game
got.
And you're like, this is so cool.
I can drive the concept.
And one I remember really well because of the way it looked.
And I hope I'm saying this right, but the Cadillac CN.
That's what I call it.
Yeah.
That's how I, that's how I was said it.
But anyway, that was a car that actually when I played the game, I never knew it was
ever intended for production, but it turns out it was.
I thought that it was a real car and then growing up and knowing that it was, well,
I think they made one.
They made a prototype.
I think it ran.
A prototype.
It ran.
But basically it was intended for production.
I think it was 2002 and it was the 100th anniversary celebration for Cadillac, 7.5
litre V12, 750 horsepower, semi-auto six speed, you know, paddle shifter stuff.
It was probably quite a violent paddle shift in those days.
God, I imagine.
Not a seamless shift in 2002.
Yeah.
But mid-engine, rear-wheel drive, three and a half seconds to 60, 217 miles per hour,
ticks all the supercar boxes and it looks fantastic, but they canned it due to costs.
I mean, I'm not surprised because it probably was going to be quite an expensive project.
Could you imagine filling up a 7.5 litre V12 with bloody Ron 88 or whatever they have
in the States?
This was, this was genuinely, there were two supercar concepts that came out of America
at this time.
I've actually mentioned the CN on the pod before many, many months ago.
But so it was the CN and the Mi 412 by Chrysler.
Yeah.
Two genuinely staggering looking cars.
Because I mean, up until that point, America was putting out some proper dogs.
Yeah.
You know, it was peak American cars are rubbish.
Especially in that period where it's plasticky and cheap.
I was just about to throw a defense and I was going to be like, because obviously in
the 60s and stuff, the American car world was amazing.
Oh yeah.
And it was so cool and they had these groundbreaking designs.
Yeah.
At that point, it had gone a little bit rubbish.
It kind of went downhill in the 70s with the fuel crisis and then was slowly recovering.
Yeah.
And then obviously now there are some incredible American cars.
We've sung the C8 praises on here.
But this kind of felt like a real like, oh, yeah, these are really cool looking cars.
But yeah, costs meant that they never put that into production.
Same with the Mi 412.
I think had those cars come out now, they would have made it into production.
Yeah, I think so.
Yeah, yeah.
Because there's such an appetite now for super cars that weirdly wasn't their pre-financial
crisis.
Yeah.
I mean, maybe it would have ended up being like a V6 hybrid or something nowadays.
But you can certainly, I mean, a V12 would definitely sell these days.
Seven and a half litre V12.
Yeah.
I mean, they could go, well, it's synthetic fuel.
So it's all right.
Well, Cadillac's making a, you know, has made a mega comeback in the last few years.
Le Mans program, Formula One program.
Yeah.
In America, they got the Black Wings.
Bring back the CN, I say.
Bring back the CN, America.
Yeah, I totally agree.
Now, another one that potentially was killed off because of money and the brand associated
you won't be surprised to hear is Lotus.
The M250.
It was actually, I didn't know this because Lotus in the early 2000s again was planning
on having the Elise at the entry level and then having this, whatever the M250 would
end up being called and then an Esprit.
Right.
Yes.
To sit above it.
And so they had given this car in concept form a 250 horsepower, three litre V6.
They hadn't decided which engine yet, but it was going to be probably a Renault or an
Opel engine.
Obviously, Renault's V6 went into the Clio V6 and obviously Vox or Opel were putting
theirs in there.
They put in the Vectra, didn't they?
I think from correctly.
Yeah, I think so.
They both had engines available, so that wouldn't have been a problem.
But, you know, this was supposed to be a car that was going to build on the creature
comforts of a Lotus Elise.
Basically, there were no creature comforts in a Lotus Elise.
I like in the listing I found online, it said, the creature comforts would include air conditioning,
central locking, and electric windows.
So it was kind of pretty basic stuff.
Oh, yeah.
But by Lotus standards, it's like a Rolls-Royce.
Yeah, exactly, exactly.
But it wasn't going to be quite as comfortable and grand tour-esque as what the Esprit that
they were intending to also produce of the day would be.
So that's a massive shame they didn't make production because, all right, yes, it does
look a little bit like an S2 Elise that's slightly swelled up on the face.
But I like it.
I think that's really good.
First of all, mouth agog because I don't think I've ever seen this before.
And look at the arrow on the rear.
So the front is genuinely so striking.
Yeah.
I think that's a really cool looking thing.
This, however, I think did make production, or at least in some form, because that back
end is of aura.
Yeah, yeah.
So 2000, this concept came out, didn't make it anywhere.
Obviously, bits would have been used for the S2 Elise because this predates S2.
Does it not?
Yeah, I think it does actually.
And obviously with those front headlights, clearly this has significant inspiration.
So you've got some S2 Elise bits on there.
The back end is of aura through and through, right down to the triangular shaped exhaust,
single exit exhaust.
And obviously Lotus did try and do something similar to that with the Europa.
Yeah, exactly.
So that's proper Lotus right there.
One concept car, three production cars out of it.
Really getting some mileage out of them.
I'd just like to point out that the concept, the full-size concept, it's a clay model,
so it didn't actually move.
But I would love to have owned this and tried to copy the bodywork.
Yeah, yeah.
And I sold 14 years ago on another auction platform.
I don't know what this is, but it sold for four and a half thousand pounds.
Oh, wow.
That's someone's like coffee table now.
It probably sits somewhere in the back garden.
That is a really cool thing.
Hopefully not in the back garden.
That she has clay wood.
Clay wood.
Very quickly, yeah, into the soil.
Yes.
A very contrasting car, but one that feels, and these are all quite of similar era,
but I promise you my final one isn't the same era.
This is in the 90s, 1992, to be exact.
So just before those two cars, we have ourselves possibly the maddest car on my list,
but potentially also one of the funnest ones,
not least because of the press pictures associated with it,
where people are, I'm not kidding, if you can use the image, hopefully you can.
People are dressed in what looked to be like morph suits,
but chrome in an alien-esque style.
It was very like looking forward to the future.
Yeah.
It was exciting times in the 90s.
I mean, I was only, I was like, you're a baby.
I was seven when Millennium hit.
Yeah.
You know, it was still exciting times.
Exactly.
I was going to say, this actually predates me by a year.
Yeah.
But I, for some reason, I remember this car really quite well.
Oh, interesting.
I didn't know much about it.
Seeing it on old Toki or whatever, maybe something was involved.
But the things that stand out to me.
It's a Renault Zoom, by the way.
Yes.
I haven't announced.
Oh my God, we didn't announce the car.
The car is the Renault Zoom.
Renault Zoom.
The things that stand out to me when you look at it the most,
other than the ladies in chrome cat suits,
is it's a car that is perfectly built for Paris.
In fact, I think it has been designed exclusively for Paris.
Parisian life.
Yes.
Because first of all, the rear axle kind of moves.
Yeah.
It kind of folds.
There's a pivot.
Pivots.
Yeah.
Kind of pivot inwards so that the arse kind of goes up in the air.
Yeah.
And the wheels come inwards.
Yeah.
And then the wheelbase, not the wheelbase, the full length shrinks to 2.3 meters.
That's very short.
Which obviously is quite helpful for reversing into small Parisian spaces.
And this is pre-smart car.
Yes.
So this kind of very core focus on squeezing into tight spaces.
I mean, I'm sure you could consider most old cars were capable of doing that by default.
But it was even in 92 at a point where cars were maybe in Paris,
at least getting a little bit trickier to park.
So this was there to save that.
And also it had plastic bumpers.
That's it.
Because we all know that Parisians really struggle to park and drive.
Yes.
Without hitting something.
Yeah.
It was electric as well, by the way.
Really?
Yeah.
That's amazing.
No, I actually found two power figures for it.
But the higher one, which is the one I'm going to put in,
because it's the one that would be, the other one was in the 30s.
Very PHE.
Yeah.
Well, the other one, they're both pretty low.
But it's 61 horsepower in a car that weighs a few hundred kilograms.
Nice.
So, you know, it's a little electric car just for popping down the shops and squeezing into the spaces,
wherever you can get a spot outside.
So I thought it was really cool.
And the name Renault Zoom, I know it doesn't sound like wind,
but it was like they clearly had a bit of an obsession with single syllable words like zoom.
Wait, Zoom Zoom was master, wasn't it?
Oh yeah.
Yeah.
So that's out the window.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Anyway, high contrast with the next one.
Because, again, in the noughties,
well, the other, that one was in the noughties, but back into the noughties,
Audi was doing quite well at Le Mans with some diesel cars, back when diesel was cool.
And the R-rate was actually produced as, or a demonstration of what they were thinking was produced
using the V12 turbo diesel injection engine, or an inspired engine.
I don't know if it was the exact engine actually.
Oh yeah, it says derived in my notes.
So there you go.
I think it was derived from Le Mans.
Six-litre twin turbocharged diesel V12 engine derived from the R-rate Le Mans winner.
Sorry, the R-10 Le Mans winner.
£738 foot.
That was shoehorned, I think it's fair to say shoehorned,
because it's a fair bit bigger than the V10, isn't it?
Yeah.
Yeah.
So they've got a whole litre.
Yeah.
And two cylinders.
Yeah, shoehorned into the R-rate with just £738 foot,
£493 brake horsepower, and best of all, a six-speed manual,
not because they thought it was cool,
because the DSG of the day just couldn't handle the torque.
So they were like, well, we'll have to give it a manual.
That is quite funny.
I remember the Le Mans cars were five-speed,
because they were so torquey, but they just didn't need six speeds to work.
Just long five-speed.
The other thing is that that would be a very low-reving engine.
It would.
You'd have to short-shift, or what would feel like short-shifting?
I think that's one of the few instances where I'm like,
would I want a manual?
Yeah.
Maybe not.
V12.
I remember when the Audi went to diesels and being like,
oh, so boring.
Yeah.
And now, look, and I'm just like, the V12 diesel is such a bonkers idea.
Yeah.
And they sounded good.
Like, they're big engine diesels.
I mean, the Le Mans cars sounded good, didn't they?
Yeah.
I would still rather the cars that we have now.
Yeah.
Valkyries and Caddies, especially.
But they were really cool.
And they actually built this car, did they not?
I think they built a running, operating prototype.
Yeah.
And I remember them, it was genuinely going to be a production car
until it wasn't.
Yeah.
Which is a shame, because now they might be,
well, could it go either way, really?
They could have been the rare option, and therefore,
there would be so few that they'd be the most expensive,
or one of the more expensive ones.
Or they could be the ones we're going,
so for our buying challenge, 15K supercars,
then we'd be going, oh, an R8 TDI, you know?
That's it.
Yes, because no one bought them.
Yeah, because they'd be, or they were,
few of them were made, but they were also not very desirable.
I don't know, it could go either way, really.
But anyway, the next car, now, this is much more recent.
In fact, this was in the, I think it was 2018,
it was certainly the last decade, the Peugeot E-Legend.
Now, you might be thinking, I don't know what that is,
because I actually had forgotten about this car,
but when I reminded myself of it,
I realized I'd written a news story on it
when I was at Autocar.
You can say the name of the publication.
Yeah, I was at Autocar.
Back in the 2010s,
and basically, this was always supposed to be a concept car,
but it looked so good, especially from the front.
It had this kind of retro, almost cartoonish design.
It was a purely electric car,
back before everything was going purely electric.
But it was more about the design,
and it was so popular with people.
Not only did loads of people at the show it was revealed at,
say, I'd buy one of those,
but there was also a petition started,
and there were tens of thousands of signatures,
so much so that the execs at Peugeot were like,
oh, maybe we should actually do this.
Yes.
And so they did actually look into doing it,
and they had, apparently,
it was basically there were news stories being put out,
and I reminded myself with some research.
Several motoring journalists,
proper ones, not silly ones,
were saying this is coming, 2020 expected,
then it was canned.
It might have had,
I don't think it was because of the big thing that happened in 2020,
because I think it was canned in 2020,
or maybe just before,
if they were going to do it and it was going to launch them,
they'd be quite far down the development line.
Yes, they went,
why build this really cool little sports car
when we could build something like a 508 PSC?
Nothing against the 508 PSC, sort of.
But I mean, it's...
Well, if you saw one of those on the road the other day.
Yeah, I mean, to be fair,
Peugeot designs can look good.
Like, you know, this was an illustration of...
They can do.
It's just that they're just averse to doing anything
that's remotely interesting beyond saloons and SUVs.
Yeah.
Well, this could have been a fix of that,
and unfortunately, it wasn't so.
That is a real disappointment,
because I think the e-legend,
oh, le gend, being French,
could have been a proper marker of being like,
right, we're doing electric,
we're going to create a little electric sports car coupe
that I think that would have worked really well as an EV.
Yeah.
But you didn't do it, Peugeot.
So, yes, that's why you've made it onto our list of disappointments.
Yeah.
On that note,
what could have worked hand in hand with that
is the first concept of my list,
which is the Lancia Forvia.
Oh, yes.
I am a huge Lancia fanboy.
I think they're my favorite car maker ever,
which is why it really hurts when people say,
oh, you can't say Lancia, probably.
All right, Lancia.
I love them.
They were cars I idolized when growing up,
and the Forvia was very much one of them.
So, in the mid-2000s,
what would have been FCA at the time said,
we're going to bring the Lancia Forvia back,
and I saw the pictures, and I was like, this is a stunner.
Yeah.
Because it retained that very distinct three-box design
of the original Forvia.
You know, lovely long bonnet,
tiny little cockpit,
and then a little kind of like oxy rear at the end.
Yeah.
It was beautiful,
and it was delayed and delayed and delayed.
The original plan was to put it on the Fiat Punto Mark II.
Oh, wow.
That's, I mean, I had a Mark II Punto on my first car.
It gets better.
Interesting.
Because they went,
we probably shouldn't put it on a Punto chassis.
Yeah.
Let's put it on the Alfa Romeo Spider chassis instead.
Yeah.
Yeah.
Also famously a brilliant chassis.
For road drive.
Yes.
And then, unfortunately, it was canned around about the time
the whole world was involved in a financial crisis.
I remember that.
Which is deeply disappointing.
However, it's a car that I really think
should make a comeback,
because Lancia is making a comeback at the moment.
There's been plenty of opportunities
to do something along the Forvia lines
that they've not done.
First of all, it was when they did
Stellantis
buddied up with Mazda
to go and do the Fiat 124 Spider.
Yeah.
That was based on an MX-5,
which seemed like such a great opportunity.
Go and make a good car out of this.
They could have done
124 Spider and Forvia.
Yeah, yeah.
Didn't do it.
Yeah.
Fixed roof.
Could have just been, yeah.
Great idea.
Didn't do it.
That was a real shame.
And then you've got this,
the legend that you've just bought up.
Yeah.
Very, very similar proportionately.
Perfect proportions.
And we know how much
Stellantis loves to share
its platforms.
You could have the legend on that.
You could have the Forvia.
You could have an electric 124.
Yeah.
You could have...
Well, the other brands.
A Plurial.
No.
There's all sorts of things
you could have done with it.
Yeah.
So...
Squishy Citroen version.
Yeah, but that would be an easy one.
That would have been really cool.
Yeah.
The only thing with this Forvia,
because I agree it's a pretty thing,
but I just can't unsee
the Naughty's Astra headlights on it.
I know that it's just a coincidence.
I know what you mean.
But I don't know why.
I look at it and I go,
oh, that's an Astra that's been cut up,
but no.
I've got that kind of vision
of when I see something with a lancy
about a badge on the front.
Everything changes.
Everything.
I could just go,
I love it anyway.
Next up,
Sam and people of Piston Heads,
I really don't like the Rover 75.
I really don't like the Rover 75.
I think it...
For me, in bodies,
everything that is...
it was wrong
about perceptions of British culture
at the time of where it was between
and old hat when it arrived,
even though it was built on much better platform.
However, in 2004,
Rover did something ridiculous
and actually made a desirable version
of the Rover 75 called Coupe,
and it was genuinely a really cool
well-designed little machine.
It had...
the roofline was almost a bit like
a Mercedes,
a second-generation Mercedes CL,
so it was kind of this beautiful arch,
kind of single arch that ran from A pillar to B,
or C pillar.
Yeah.
I think there were...
Pillars.
Because I have pillarless doors.
Yeah.
It was a really very beautiful looking thing.
The only problem is that Rover went into
quite severe financial troubles in 2005.
Into the red.
As everyone knew.
Yeah.
And it was ultimately canned.
However, someone has built one.
Oh.
There's someone who's actually built one,
so they...
because Rover was buddying up with...
or was owned by BMW,
they actually used the basis of a
BMW 3-series Coupe
and then built the Rover around that,
and they made...
and it looks absolutely fantastic.
The aforementioned car magazine
that you mentioned earlier,
they ran a piece on it,
and you can go,
if you type it in,
you'll find their piece on it,
and it's really well worth a read
because I just love people
that do that kind of thing.
Building concepts that was...
they never made it.
He really wanted one,
and he just went,
well, I'm going to build it myself.
On a car that was considerably cooler
and a Coupe,
was the Range Rover SV Coupe.
Yeah.
This feels like a car that should
absolutely be put into production,
and I'm not really sure why.
But, yeah, so this was first shown
at Geneva, I think, in 2018.
Remember the Geneva Motor Show?
Yeah.
God, I mean...
I actually still remember when it was busy,
and now it's, you know...
I went to the last ever one in 2019.
Wow.
I remember when it was so busy,
you had to, like,
run through crowds
to get from car A to car B.
Yeah.
And that's not that long ago.
It was a cool, cool thing.
But, yes, so they...
2018, Range Rover showed off...
Land Rover showed off
the Range Rover SV Coupe.
It was, as it sounds,
an SV...
Oh, sorry, a Range Rover,
but two-doors Coupe-style
Land Rover had done something similar
to that before with the very early Range Rovers.
Yeah.
It seemed like the ultimate win.
You know, people were lining up
to go and buy something like this.
I think the only problem, maybe,
is how they actually planned on doing it.
Yeah.
Because the idea was that it was going to be
hand-assembled by SVO.
So it was going to be a very special thing, indeed.
Prices were going to start at 240,000 pounds.
And that was then...
That was in 2018.
That's a lot of money.
You can add, like, 50K to that now
to give the equivalent...
100%.
100%.
God, that's depressing, isn't it?
Yeah.
Maybe not that much.
They planned on doing a production run
of 999 examples.
So we're gonna...
Well, so...
And it had a 5.0-litre supercharged V8, obviously.
I had to have that.
I wonder if they shouldn't have announced...
I wonder if that's too many.
Yeah.
To say, like, we're gonna make a thousand of these
and they're a quarter of a million each.
I'm not sure how many people were dropping
a quarter of a million pounds on a Range Rover.
They obviously are now.
People are more than willing to fork out
that kind of money.
But back in 2018, I'm not sure,
there would have been quite the uptake
as they were now.
So ultimately, it was canned a year later.
Another car that I think struggled
to generate much customer interest,
and I'm kind of baffled to think,
understand why.
Lamborghini Astoke.
So this is something that I was talking about
recently in my...
So there'll be a feature on the PH Home page.
You might have to scroll down a little bit
to read it, but I had an interview with
CEO Stefan Winkelman,
and we're talking about the new 2 Plus 2
that they're working on,
and they've always kind of been like
toying with the idea of a GT of some sort.
So there was the...
They did a 2C to GT a few years back
that looked really very cool.
The Asteron or something like that.
And then before then, it was the Astoke.
The Astoke was a four-door saloon.
Sounds like when an Italian person goes,
they're going to Stoke.
They...
I'm going to Astoke.
Astoke.
Maybe that's where they canned it.
That's where it was named after.
Yeah.
But I mean, this thing was like...
Rebenton...
Yeah.
Styling.
It was so freaking cool, man.
Such a freaking cool car.
Original plan was to put a V10 in it,
but I've also seen, you know,
that people would like it could have had a V8,
or a V12, or a V6.
Like a front-engined V10,
like that motor up front, interesting.
And it was 100% a villains car.
You looked at it and it looks like you were evil.
Which is what all Lamborghini buyers want,
is to look like the bad guy.
So, it ticked so many boxes.
However, it looks like it was a bit of uncertainty
that meant that they never put it into production.
It arrived in 2008.
There was a huge amount of uncertainty back then,
because that was right in the thick of the financial crisis.
Nobody had a lot of money to go and spend on a V10 engine saloon.
And I think Lamborghini got spooked.
Yeah.
But if you look at what came later,
Euro's concept was announced four years later.
Obviously, that was good enough.
Yeah, 2012 was the Euro's concept.
I think it looked considerably better than what the car ultimately was.
So, that proved popular enough for them to go,
yes, it's going to put it into production.
They're now obviously toying with the 2 Plus 2.
Whether it would have worked back then,
I don't know.
But the astoke feels like something that really,
I feel like we were robbed.
Not getting that.
There was a timing thing on that, wasn't it?
It's got to be.
In years prior to that, they might have taken a few risks.
Because they were probably feeling pretty buoyed up after having Audi
turn them around and make them a really successful car maker.
Exactly.
They could have based it on an S8.
Yeah.
Yeah, but never happened.
Neither did the Porsche 919 Street.
I'd forgotten about this, but my god, it was pretty.
It was such a pretty thing and such a cool thing.
So, if you aren't familiar,
like we were talking about with BMW, how they just go,
here's a load of concepts that we never made.
Porsche likes to do this as well.
I asked them about it last year
and I think they're due a new batch of concepts
that's going to be announced.
And I'm hoping there's something,
maybe RSR 911 related.
I don't know.
They haven't confirmed anything to me,
but when I said that, they were like,
but the last time they did a massive drop,
the headline car was the 919 Street.
The 919 was the Le Mans car that won Le Mans
in 2015, 16 and 17.
Also did a pretty good showing on its debut in 2014.
Just a ridiculously cool car.
I think the idea behind it was,
these cars were laboratories on wheels.
Laboratory, not laboratory.
And they had a tiny little V4 hybrid
that had to basically,
I think it was kind of rapid re-charge
and discharge of the battery.
So you're kind of like having Formula 1.
But 10 years ago, more than 10 years ago.
Yeah, exactly.
So hitting the anchors really hard into your corner,
charging up the battery and then it fires you out,
spits you out the other side.
Which I mean, Formula was also doing at the time as well.
So they wanted to put that into a street car
to basically say, look at the technology transfer
from race track to road.
And I think this is such a good marketing idea
for car manufacturers to do.
Even if it's just a one off or a few off,
I think it's enough to kind of go like,
we really made this happen.
Like Mercedes doing with the AMG1,
which was a pain in the backside.
But they made it work.
Yeah, it was all the slow speed stuff.
They were like, it's great at high speed.
Not surprisingly, very successful engine.
But the slow speed stuff was an issue.
But these Le Mans engines are developed
to survive such a wide range of scenarios, right?
That's from the one engine's arm, typically.
They can handle a couple of starts and off they go.
So this probably would have been a much easier car
to engineer in terms of the engine
for road use.
I don't know.
I think it was such a complicated car that they went,
I don't really think we can give this over to the public.
But they made a model of it.
It looks beautiful.
I'd love to see it in person one day.
Very, very, very cool car.
There are obviously going to be many, many, many more.
So head on to the Piston Heads homepage.
Go and click on the article of this podcast.
Let us know which ones.
That's not an engagement finding.
That's a genuinely really want to know what we've missed
because there's a distinction between concept cars
that we love versus concept cars
that really should have been made into production cars.
Change of pace.
We have a buying challenge, obviously.
This week it comes from B14.
And they say, what would you get that has seven seats
but the rear two seats can be suitable for children and adults
so that they're a little bit spacious?
Budget between 45,000 and 60,000.
Remember, we always go for the higher end of the budget
depending on what's out there, probably two to three years old.
Below 30,000 miles.
I know there are a ton of options out there
at the Peugeot Kia Skoda level.
Would prefer something more interesting
but willing to be told, I'm missing a trick.
And they've listed various options
but want to know what the pH massive things.
So we've been having a look.
We have definitely stuck to the seven seat criteria.
I'm not sure if we've stuck to the age-related criteria.
I think my first one definitely hasn't.
But actually, no, I have actually.
I'm feeling a little bit more smug now.
So what have you got?
I've gone for something that definitely breaks the age limit
but is really lovely.
And then I've gone for something that's a bit of a wild card
but is really cool.
And then the other one I've gone for, I've just realized,
you've taken, so I'm going to...
Let's just get cracking with the one that I actually really like
but breaks one of the rules.
It's a Bentley Bentayga because...
Amazing to think we can get one of those in budget.
I know. I know.
It's 52,995 pounds.
It is 88,000 miles
and also it's a 2018 car
which massively breaks that two-three-year limit.
But, I mean, as the seller here says,
it's Euler's compliant, so it's still modern in that sense.
And also, being a Bentley,
I mean, it's not going to feel dated massively
because you're going to have all of the luxury equipment aboard.
I mean, naturally, infotainment systems get aged quite fast.
But, you know, it'll be fine.
It'll have carplay, all the essentials.
It's a Bentley.
It's a Bentley.
And...
Yeah, it's a Bentley.
And it's a four-litre V8 one
which is not massive for a Bentley,
but it's a lovely motor.
It's amazing how the four-litre V8 is the small engine option.
I know, yeah.
Yes, the W12.
The W12 is definitely the more desirable one,
but from a running cost perspective,
it's obviously considerably better
and at 52,995,
that gives you much budget left
to run the thing.
Exactly.
I mean, I'm not so keen on white Bentley's.
I think it works in maybe a 70s Bentley,
but an SUV.
White with black wheels and black trim
potentially isn't my cup of tea.
Yeah, it's not the great,
but it was the only one I found in budget.
And I think it's good to bring that up.
Yeah.
I think, personally,
I would, if I were to change the wheels
for something chromey or silvery.
Silvery, yeah.
And would I replace the black trim for chrome?
Probably.
Yeah.
I don't think I would feel quite as...
I feel like that would kind of tone it down a little bit
because it does have a black interior.
Yeah.
So you've got quite a...
It's got black interior with red stitching.
Exactly.
So it's quite a nice interior.
Yeah, it's a nice interior.
Yeah.
And the rear seats in these are pretty spacious.
I mean, I've actually not sat in the back of a Bentley,
not surprisingly, but it's, you know,
I did my quick search online.
People seem to think it was pretty comfortable in there.
Look, he's mentioned some budget options on there
that he's obviously not keen on.
Those seats will be practically,
like, you know, sitting directly on plastic.
Whereas these ones have not quilted
but padded leather.
Yeah, still very nice.
Very nice.
Yeah.
Adult sized seats.
Now by pure contrast, my other choice,
it's big, it's tough, but it's not luxurious.
Although it depends how you class luxury
because these still come with a ton of equipment on them.
Well, they certainly did.
I've also broken the years allowance on this as well.
But in keeping with the other car was a big white
Abu Dhabi-esque car.
This is also Abu Dhabi-esque
because it's a Toyota Land Cruiser.
With a big old V8.
V8 diesel as well.
Now, yes, I appreciate that this is a bit of an oddball.
But, I mean, the proof isn't the pudding.
It's $58,999.
It's worth more than the Bentley.
All right, it's 46,000 miles.
That is absolutely wild.
But these really hold their value
because they just seem to be super cool, right?
Oh, 100%.
And they have loads of space in the back
and they come with a ton of equipment.
Good sound systems, you know, loads of electric bits,
lots of buttons as well.
So as far as carrying people around long distances,
everyone being comfortable, you being entertained,
and also it being the only one you've seen in the last year,
this ticks all those boxes.
I've just seen how grey the plastics are in this interior.
It's grey.
But there's also wood veneer.
It is grey.
I mean, that's the...
You know, I've bought up my wife's Toyota Camry
on multiple occasions.
The interior is...
Because it's from the same era.
The interior is pretty much identical.
I can tell you, though,
that will be so wafty and soft.
Oh, yeah.
It'll be lovely.
And look at the size.
Look at the length of the handles to pull and lower the seats.
Yeah.
Like, it's got...
It's just equipped for convenience and comfort and practicality.
And, yeah, it's just...
It's one of those cars where I've never wanted one.
But if I had multiple cars, I'd definitely have one of these.
Yeah.
I mean, look, it's an old car, right?
It's a...
It's a 2013 car.
It's expensive.
It's £60,000 or just a grand shy.
However, if things ever turned south...
Yeah.
And the world was...
100%.
Let's just say there was a nuclear apocalypse.
You're going to want a Toyota Land Cruiser.
Well, that phrase isn't all that saying.
I think it's some regions of the world where they'll say,
like, if you do a safari,
the defenders are there for the tourists.
Because they're like,
oh, we're associated with it.
But the actual guys who...
Guys and girls who work on the...
They've got a Land Cruiser.
They've got a Land Cruiser.
Because they want to get home tonight.
That's...
You know what?
Obviously at Le Mans,
you've got all these different marks racing against each other
to show who's the fastest over 24 hours.
I would love to see a point-to-point
where I have mostly stock Land Cruisers, defenders,
and whatever.
I'd be like, right, whoever gets to the end wins.
I know there's the Dakar for that kind of thing,
but even those are a little bit too prepared for my liking.
Now, I know I've just insulted the defender,
but that was the old defender,
which I do love,
but am I going to drive it far away from civilization?
I don't know.
Old cars.
But of course, Land Rover makes a modern defender.
And that can be had with seven seats.
It can also be had in 110 or 130 form.
And if you get the seven seats or 130,
the rear space is actually pretty good.
You can literally swing your legs around.
You can swing.
The 110, it's all right.
But I felt I had to choose one,
because the defender is cool.
The new defender is great.
The interior is lovely.
I absolutely love the new defender.
I've only driven the Octa,
but I had the most fun when I was driving the Octa.
That's the best one.
And observing how quickly the fuel gauge went down.
Yes.
They are fantastic.
Absolutely massive beasts.
And I just think, you know, it's a car for all occasions.
Exactly.
And this one is a, it says one previous owner.
So potentially this is, you know,
the first time it's been sold from the person
who ordered it originally.
And it's been ordered in a lovely, very discreet black on black
or gray on black potentially with a dark interior as well.
56,306 miles on the clock.
And it's the three liter mild hybrid diesel.
So it's 300 horsepower and mild hybrid diesel.
So, you know, you're going to get a bit of torque,
quite a bit of torque actually.
So it's lovely.
It's got air suspension and panoramic sunroof,
sliding panoramic as well.
So you can open it up.
So it's got all the bits on it.
This is a lovely car.
And I mean, these are, I think the biggest risk with defenders
is just how in demand they are with thieves.
But, you know, they are a lovely car to drive.
And as you said with the Octo, that's the peak.
But even the standard ones, the interiors are really lovely.
They ride well.
They're so different to the original, obviously.
Yeah.
But great car.
By the way, if you're listening to this
and it sounds like there's a lot of people falling over
and dropping cutlery everywhere,
it's because the office opposite our studio
is currently emptying out
and there's no chance that we're going to be able to stop them
from making this noise.
So hopefully our waffling is covering it up.
But anyway, I'm going to start off with the car
that you have already mentioned, the Volvo XC90.
It seems like an obvious choice, which is why Sam went for it.
And if you kind of read between the lines,
it's probably the best car of the ones that we're going to suggest.
The one that I've got here is the Ultra T8.
So it's plug-in hybrid, 306 horsepower,
which means I think it's the twin charge.
I think that's the supercharged and turbocharged,
which we all love because of the Lancia Delta S4, obviously.
But you've got seven seats in this.
I'm pretty sure these are quite roomy in the back.
Yeah, they are.
I've not driven a XC90 for a very long time,
but these new ones are so lovely.
And the impressive thing is because it's so desirable.
Well, yeah, and it's a plug-in hybrid.
Normally, you don't get seven seat plug-in hybrids
because the batteries are in the boot.
Precisely.
What's even better is that this one is in a sort of
very, very dark maroon-y color.
It's annoyingly kind of ideal this car.
It is really cool.
I really love this one.
It's 57590, 10,500 miles, zero previous owners.
It's a really lovely car.
I think this is the most sensible option.
But I don't do sensible.
So the next one is the least sensible option,
but the most PHE option.
It's NSQ7.
I love the Q7.
I think this generation is just a fantastic car.
They're so versatile.
They drive really nicely.
I think they're brilliant.
The SQ7 throws a four-litre twin-tile V8 into that
with 500 horsepower.
So it's not going to be the most frugal of cars.
If frugality is what you're after,
go for the XC90 for my last option, actually.
But this one's a very smart one,
unlike your Bentley, which is white with black wheels.
Mine is black with silver wheels.
Silver door mirrors.
Silver door mirrors.
Very, very tasteful.
Black diamond-quilted leather interior.
It's not quite the Bentley, though, inside.
It's not.
It's Audi.
It's very volsprung to technique.
It's inoffensive.
You get into it and you just go,
ah, that's efficient.
That's it.
That's good.
That's good.
So it will be a super practical car
that will just sprinkle a little bit of enjoyment
onto your daily drives.
But I do understand if that is going to be
a bit too much money to run.
So I've gone four to end off.
This seemed like a car where I kind of brushed it off at first
and then I thought, you know,
I actually really quite like the idea of this.
It's a BMW X7 XDrive 30D M Sport.
And it's the long name.
It's got the nicer face.
It has got the nicer face.
The double headlight one that came after, I think.
The double stack headlight.
The only thing that troubled me a bit with the X7
and all of the BMW rebrands before they went full on nostril nose
is that they went, right, we've got to make the grilles bigger
without really changing the rest of the design of the car.
So the top of the grille kind of spills over to the top of the bonnet.
It looked horrific on the seven series.
It looks much better on the X7.
Yeah, it's the right shape to absorb that kind of feature, isn't it?
Absolutely, yeah.
And I mean, so you've got something that is,
it's kind of got that air of premium,
which is exactly what they were after.
Very, very premium feeling, almost luxurious car.
This one's dark blue with the cream leather interior.
So it is really quite sumptuous.
It is.
That is a very, very sensible spec.
It is lovely.
You've also got the kind of the crystal gear lever,
which looked really smart on these and a bit gaudy when they went to the XM.
But I feel like it's that nice kind of balance of traditional BMW
where they were starting to sprinkle a bit more luxury in
before it got a bit, again, gaudy.
Diesel power means that it's going to be nice and frugal.
I don't think a diesel is a bad thing, especially when it's in a nice big car like this.
23,500 miles is basically a diesel-powered Rolls-Royce Cullinan.
For an eighth of the price.
Yeah.
And so it is really, I mean, it just highlights everything I think about the IX3's interior.
Like this is, this X7 shows you like peak BMW,
but if they could have put the latest in digital tech,
but retained all of that switch gear,
you'd have in today's world an optimal BMW interior,
but they bend all that stuff and they put it all in the bloody screens.
I know.
Why, why, why?
So if you want to experience the best of BMW before all the screens,
go for this.
I think I can't believe I'm picking this over an XC90 and an SQ7,
but it's the one that spoke to me the most.
I mean, I'm breaking rules.
I want to choose the Bentley, but it's too old,
but I'm just going to put it, I'm just going to choose that one
because it's a lot of car, it needs some chroming,
which is not something I ever, not something I'd ever thought I'd say.
Yeah, get some more chrome on that to tone it down a bit.
But you've got a Bentley.
So there you have it.
If you're listening to this on Spotify,
I will put up a poll that you can choose either my car or Sam's car.
And, you know, it's just something I like to point out in his face.
Next time I see him, if I've won or he's won, he usually wins annoyingly.
Is that right?
I'm surprised by that.
You do actually, yes.
I've won the last few.
There we go.
I've seen a few of those.
But you have won a lot of them annoyingly.
Or you can head on to the Pistened's home page,
go and click on the article link, head into the topic
and put your own suggestions down and then maybe say,
Cam Sam, you suck.
Now we always have a look at the Pistened's options as well
to see if something fits.
We do actually have a defender coming up for auction.
However, it's a little bit outside the,
they wanted something a little bit more modern.
This one falls a bit outside of that because it's from 2014.
I mean,
So bang on what your,
I was about to say.
My definition of modern is that it's an excess.
Sorry.
So 110 excess commercial with a mere 122 horsepower,
but it'll be nice and talky and a good workhorse.
I think the key thing about it not being modern is it's the old defender,
isn't it?
Yes.
It's a modern old defender.
It's a new old defender.
26 or 27,000 miles on the clock as well.
So one previous owner.
It's really lovely.
Yeah.
I love that.
So maybe,
maybe that's the one that people should vote on.
Is that,
that's the seven seats of that one.
I believe so.
Wait commercial.
Ah, might not be.
I just grew a pair of deck chairs in the video.
Well, there you go.
I see pH.
We're always thinking practically.
Shouldn't admit that,
but I used to get driven to school in the back of my dad's van
with my mate sometimes,
not every time we'd normally walk,
but yeah,
he'd throw a couple of sun loungers in the back.
I was going to say,
that is,
it is definitely not a seven seater,
but you could lay in there.
You could seat some people in the back.
You could just screw a couple of chairs and you'd be right.
Okay.
So to finish things off,
I've got a topic that I think I could probably talk about
for ages and ages and ages.
It's by Starsky 80 and it's called cars
that you disliked the styling of when new,
but like now,
and it goes...
Pitch in the tone there.
You went Australian.
Because there's a question mark at the end.
And they say,
what are the cars you dislike the styling of
when they were released,
but have come to like the look of in subsequent years?
The two that most immediately spring to mind
are two humble family cars from the early 2000s,
namely the Mark I Ford Focus and Renault McGahn.
At the time,
I thought what were they thinking
as they both were very out there in terms of styling
compared to the more conservative competitors
like the Astra Golf A3
and more conventionally good looking cars
like the Peugeot 306 and Alfa Romeo 147.
Oh, I love a 147, especially GTA.
I'm always aware that the Mark I Focus
was a vastly superior car to the Escort
that it replaced,
but I never loved the looks
and it probably took a few years
until the comparatively dull Mark II Focus came out
for me to learn to like its looks
and the styling still looks very crisp to me now.
In hindsight,
these two cars have probably dated less in terms of styling
than all their contemporary competition
and still look quite modern today.
Mark I Focus interior definitely looks dated.
Yeah, well, the exteriors are on that car look great, right?
Yeah, I think so.
But you're right, the interior,
I think the same for the McGahn,
actually the interior is dated pretty bad.
All old Renault's interiors.
But that McGahn, I think, looks fantastic.
I liked it when it was new as well.
I just love the advert.
Shaggin' an ass.
Oh, great advert.
What, great advert?
See, it sticks with you.
It was back in the days of the optimistic ad.
Now it's been trying to be cool.
It's just trying to be way too cool.
Or some of them.
Or you look at the Peugeot adverts
where it's just like neon lions running around
and a family, I don't know.
It's quite a long post, so I've cut it short a bit,
but they say,
so what cars do you hate
strongly dislike the styling of when they were new
but have come to appreciate open time?
So Genius of Love says,
many cars that looked like dog's breakfast
20 years ago look really great now
because everything is such a mess.
I also find that as my appreciation
for detail proportion
and some of the more technical aspects of design
has gone from a nonexistent
to ladybird book of car design level,
I find a lot of appreciation
in what I thought were very bland designs
when I was younger.
Stuff like the W124E class Mercedes,
which I used to think was a dull block,
now absolutely woos me
with its fabulous attention to detail
and design rigor.
True, those are.
I love a solid block of murk.
And there's actually like having that simple
just the lines that flow into the necks
and a straight line from the front
way to the rear.
I'm the same.
I used to think all that stuff was just boring
and now I'm like, it's actually really nice.
Clean, clean.
Not like every panel has nine different angles in it,
which a lot of cars these days do.
Oh, 100%.
Swansea Boy says,
oh my God.
Nissan Figaro hated them when they came out,
but I don't love them now.
Thoughts on the Figaro, Sam?
Yeah, I'm not sure I can agree with that.
I don't think I love them much.
You know what, they have a real cult following now.
Isn't there like a modified scene
of the Figaro as well?
Oh my God.
Because there's one near me in that pink as well.
I'm sure there's like a stance.
That's the word I'm looking for.
Okay, that hasn't ended up with me going,
they actually look quite good.
No, I think they're better when they are left alone.
I'm pretty sure in Japan there's like a,
they went down the whole route of like
American modified, you know, hot rod stuff.
Oh, that I would like to see.
But the Figaro, you know, he's still around.
Robert B says Ferrari F430.
I agree with that.
I thought this looked like an overweight dog's breakfast
after the slippery modern 360
and the drop dead gorgeous F355.
I really like them now.
I always like that.
But Catch Your Rob B,
I think it's exactly the same thing.
Yeah, I always liked them,
but again, I think I've said it on the pod before,
it's because Schumacher was in the marketing material.
And I was just, you know,
I just kind of was like,
oh, it looks a bit flabby and chunky.
And now I think they are dead cool.
Mark 1 KN, for some reason,
I've started to warm to them.
Bingo.
I'm Robert B.
Yeah, exactly.
I used to think they looked pants.
And now I'm like, oh, it's quite good now.
Exactly.
Although there's something always,
maybe because I've not seen a tidy turbo for a long time,
but whenever I see an old KN Mark 1 turbo,
I'm like, that looks expensive to run.
Oh, they absolutely will be.
But they're so over-engineered as well.
True.
All of them, the Mark 1s.
Arguably more than any ones come after,
because Porsche were like,
the quote I got when they were like,
well, we've got to get it right,
we don't know who the buyer is.
Is it going to be a performance car buyer
that wants an SUV,
or is it going to be an off-roady,
enthusiastic wants a premium car?
So they made it for everyone.
Is it going to be the same for the Ferrari Lucci?
I mean, honestly, I was a little too young
to really have an opinion when the Cayenne came out,
but I mean, I could see myself throwing my toys out the pram
if they did that now.
Oh, and people did, didn't they?
I think largely because of the way it looked.
But I think it was easier in those days
because you could have multiple engine variants and stuff,
whereas the Lucci, you know, all right,
they might have more power in a later version,
but it's still going to be just a very fast EV.
So I don't know, it's easier in those days.
The turbo versus the base model
were very different cars than the Cayenne.
I realized I'm going to get us onto a Luce chat,
so I'm going to push things on to Leicester H,
who says Bentayga for me.
Yes.
I agree.
Bentayga, the concept, which was the EXP something,
I can't remember what it was,
but the concept of that was a really cool looking thing.
Then the original Bentayga came out,
and it was a bit like, then they facelifted it,
and it looked a bit more like the EXP9F.
There we go.
Very nice.
And yeah, and facelifted Bentayga in that spec for me
is sublime.
Finally, deranged Rover, the E60 Dame Edna BMW 5 Series.
Dame Edna.
Dame Edna, I'm just...
Is it because I don't remember that?
It's kind of like the eye...
It's quite like kind of flicky eyes.
It must be.
I don't know.
So, yeah, I never really had a problem with the Bangalira.
Also, they've said the Fiat Multipla.
I always quite liked the Fiat Multipla.
I thought it was kind of fun,
but again, I was a child when it came out,
so it's kind of a bit more like a toy.
What I don't agree with is that they also quite like the Tesla Cybertruck.
Yeah.
I mean, the panel gaps alone are just horrendous to observe.
It's just...
Yeah.
I can't even be bothered to talk about it to be honest.
I saw loads of them when I was in the States last in Texas.
I literally saw like one every 10 minutes.
They love them out there.
But we just kind of says everything really.
Thank you ever so much for listening to this episode
of the Gassing Station podcast.
If you like what you listen to,
please can you leave us a five-star review
and maybe some nice words
because it helps get the name of the Gassing Station out
to more people.
Because the more listeners we have,
the more rubbish we can keep rambling on.
That's it for this week.
Sam, anything you'd like to add?
No, I'm just really excited to hear your true updates
of the Monaco Grand Prix
so we can then declare whether Lance Troll
did in fact qualify and poem win.
Not to rub it in,
but we can talk about that when we're at Le Mans.
Yes.
Oh, yeah.
Which is brilliant.
So bring your sun cream.
It's going to be a hot one.
Oh, yeah.
Well, in that case then, see you next Tuesday.
About this episode
Monaco and Le Mans set the tone, with the hosts daydreaming about F1 tech like “seamless shift” and chasing engine sounds. The conversation then lands on BMW estates: the rare Petroil-built E46 M3 Touring, why an M3 Touring sounded like a joke at first, and how carbon-fibre fabrication plus possible V10 swaps make it feel like a proper lifer. Along the way, they debate concept cars, “once-hated” designs, and wrap with more motorsport teases.
What if BMW put the E46 M3 Touring into production? Cam and Sam explore the ultimate automotive what-ifs, starting with Petroyle's incredible restomod before exploring the greatest concept cars that never made production.
Then it's on to a £60,000 premium seven-seater challenge, pitting Sam’s plush Bentley Bentayga against Cam’s sensible diesel BMW X7. Finally, they hit the forums to look at the controversial car designs that actually aged surprisingly well.
🏎️ Sell your car on PistonHeads auctions: https://www.pistonheads.com/sell/auctions
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