Rivian bet the company on R2. RJ Scaringe told us almost everything

Rivian bet the company on R2. RJ Scaringe told us almost everything The Drivecast · Jun 10, 2026

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Brand

Rivian

Rivian is a newer electric-vehicle company. They make EVs that are meant to work for daily driving but also for outdoor adventures, and the episode talks about how hard it is to grow a car company.

Concept

EV

EV means electric vehicle. Instead of using gasoline, the car runs on electricity from a battery.

Concept

adventure vehicle

An “adventure vehicle” is a car meant for trips outside the city—like road trips and getting to outdoor places—while still being usable day to day.

Concept

cash burn

Cash burn means how fast a company is spending money. If a company isn’t making enough profit yet, it has to keep using cash to keep going.

Concept

recall

A recall is when a car company says, “We need to fix something on these cars.” It’s usually because of a safety issue or a problem that could affect how the car works.

Concept

slow ramp on service departments

This means how quickly the company can set up places and people to fix and maintain the cars. If that grows slowly, owners may have trouble getting service when they need it.

Concept

pricing spectrum

A pricing spectrum just means the prices go from lower to higher across the lineup. The point here is that Rivian’s cars cost a lot compared with many other EVs.

Term

compact crossover SUV market

This phrase means the popular category of smaller SUVs that most people shop for. The host is saying the Rivian R2 is aimed at that big, competitive group of buyers.

Car

Tesla Model Y

The Tesla Model Y is a very popular electric SUV. The episode compares it to the Rivian R2 to show they’re targeting the same general size and buyer interest.

Car

Toyota RAV4

The Toyota RAV4 is a very popular compact SUV. In this segment, it’s mentioned mainly to help you picture the Rivian R2’s size by comparing their lengths.

Concept

mass market arena

“Mass market” just means selling to a lot of regular customers, not only car enthusiasts. The host is saying Rivian is trying to compete in the biggest, most competitive part of the market.

Term

lifted

“Lifted” here means the car sits higher than stock. That helps it handle bumps and uneven ground without hitting the bottom.

Term

“Rally spec” means a car is set up for rally-style stages—typically with changes aimed at durability and traction on loose surfaces. In practice, that often includes things like increased ride height, stronger suspension components, and tires suited to dirt or gravel.

Car

Porsche 911 (993)

The Porsche 911 (993) is a specific generation of the 911. It’s especially loved because it was the last air-cooled 911, and people think it’s a great mix of classic feel and everyday usability.

Term

Turbo

“Turbo” means the engine uses a turbocharger to make more power. It pushes extra air into the engine so it can burn more fuel and accelerate harder.

Term

4S

“4S” is a Porsche trim designation that typically indicates all-wheel drive (four-wheel drive) combined with a sportier specification than the base model. In this segment, it’s used as a choice for a Porsche 911 (993) variant.

Term

2S

“2S” is a Porsche badge for a specific trim. It usually means a simpler setup than the “4S” version, while still being a sporty choice.

Term

gross profit margin

Gross profit margin is a way to measure how much money is left after paying the direct costs to build and deliver the product. Higher margin usually means the product is making money more easily.

Term

chips

“Chips” are the computer parts inside the car that run the AI and driving software. If those chips are expensive or in short supply, they can make the car cost more to build.

Concept

profitability

Profitability means the company expects to make real money from selling the cars. They’re talking about when R2 will start showing that profit, not just when it launches.

Car

Volvo EX60

The Volvo EX60 is an upcoming electric Volvo. They bring it up because Volvo is claiming their EV can make profit right away when it starts selling.

Term

vertically integrate

Vertically integrate means the company makes more of the stuff itself instead of buying it from other companies. In Rivian’s case, that includes software and key electrical/drivetrain parts, so they can improve the product and lower costs when they sell a lot of cars.

Term

power electronics

Power electronics are the EV’s electrical “control hardware.” They take electricity from the battery and convert/control it so the motors can use it efficiently.

Term

drive line

Drive line is the “power path” from the battery to the wheels. It includes the motor and the electrical parts that make the motor work.

Term

inverters

An inverter is a device that changes battery electricity into the type of electricity the motor needs. Without it, the motor can’t run the way an EV motor is designed to.

Concept

direct to consumer

Direct to consumer means the company sells the car to you directly, not through a traditional dealership network. It can give the company more control, but it also means they have to run their own sales and service setup.

Brand

R2

R2 is Rivian’s next car. The idea here is that Rivian spent a lot of money preparing for the higher sales volume that R2 is expected to bring.

Concept

preloading

Preloading means spending ahead of time. Rivian invested early so it would be ready to handle the bigger sales volume expected from R2.

Concept

pull forward investment

Pull forward investment means they’re choosing to spend sooner rather than later. The idea is to get the support systems ready ahead of time for when more cars are being produced.

Term

service infrastructure

Service infrastructure refers to the physical and operational setup needed to maintain and repair vehicles—like service centers, staffing, tools, and logistics. For an EV maker, it’s often planned alongside vehicle production so customers can get support without long delays.

Term

distribution network

A distribution network is how the company gets cars (and sometimes parts) from where they’re made to where customers can receive them. It’s basically the delivery and logistics setup.

Term

autonomy

Autonomy here means technology that helps the car drive. It can include features that assist with steering, speed, and other tasks—depending on how advanced the system is.

Term

software

Software is the car’s computer programs. It controls features and behavior, and in modern EVs it can often be updated to add or improve functions.

Concept

make or break product

“Make or break” means the product is so important that it could decide whether the company does well or struggles. Here, they’re saying R2 is that crucial.

Term

reservations

Reservations are like an early sign-up showing you want to buy the car when it’s available. Companies track them to estimate how many customers they can expect.

Concept

ramping production

Ramping production means the factory is gradually increasing how many cars it can build. Even if lots of people want the car, the company can’t deliver them all at once until production is up to speed.

Concept

backlog

A backlog means there are more people waiting for cars than the factory can build right now. It’s basically the “waiting list” created by limited production early on.

Concept

roll out the volume, deliver vehicles

This refers to the operational plan for scaling from initial launch builds to higher-volume production while still delivering cars in a controlled, predictable way. It’s essentially launch logistics: deciding how to allocate limited early capacity across customers.

Term

single launch edition

A single launch edition means the company starts by selling one specific version of the car. That makes it easier to build and deliver cars early, before offering lots of different options.

Concept

lead times

Lead time is how long you have to wait. Here it means the time between asking for service and actually getting the parts or repair done.

Concept

non-critical items

“Non-critical items” are issues that don’t prevent the vehicle from being driven safely or normally. The speaker contrasts these with critical problems, explaining that even when the car is still operable, customers can wait weeks if parts or service capacity aren’t ready.

Concept

launching R2

R2 is Rivian’s upcoming vehicle. The speaker is saying that before it launches, Rivian needs enough service locations and support so repairs don’t take forever.

Concept

service location

A service location is the specific shop or facility where a vehicle is taken for maintenance or repairs. The discussion contrasts different service outcomes depending on where the work is performed, highlighting how service execution can vary.

Term

loaner car

A loaner car is a temporary car you can use while your own car is being repaired. It helps you keep driving instead of being stuck without a vehicle.

Term

mobile service

Mobile service means the repair team comes to you. Instead of you driving the car to a shop, they show up at your house (or wherever you are) and handle the fix there.

Term

charging anxiety

Charging anxiety is the worry about whether you’ll be able to charge your EV when you stop. Even if the car can go far, it’s still stressful if chargers are broken or full.

Term

range anxiety

Range anxiety is the fear that your electric car won’t have enough battery to get to the next charger. Here, they’re saying the bigger problem is whether chargers are actually working when you need them.

Term

EPA rated

“EPA rated” is an official way the government estimates how far an electric car can go on a full charge. Your actual range can be less or more depending on how you drive and the weather.

Term

uptime

Uptime here means how often charging stations are actually working. If you pull up and the charger is broken, it doesn’t matter what the car’s range is.

Term

RAN network

RAN network means Rivian’s network of charging stations. They’re saying Rivian is still adding new charging locations steadily, not stopping to focus elsewhere.

Term

RAD wrap

A “wrap” is a sticker-like covering that goes over the outside of a car. Here, the RAD wrap is basically a way to show that a specific team or project (RAD) is involved with R2.

Concept

trade-offs and compromises

When building a car, you can’t usually maximize everything at once. If you spend more on one part, you often have to save money or accept limits somewhere else.

Concept

vehicle feels really cohesive

“Cohesive” means the car feels like everything matches—like the design and parts all work together. The goal is that cost-saving choices don’t make the car feel mismatched.

Term

price point

A “price point” is the price the company is aiming to sell the car for. If the car has to cost a certain amount, that limits what expensive parts or features you can afford.

Term

allocate the bill of materials

The “bill of materials” is basically the cost breakdown of all the parts that go into the car. “Allocating” it means deciding where the money goes—like spending more on the structure versus spending more on the interior.

Concept

dynamically

Here, “dynamically” means the car can change what it’s doing as conditions change. Instead of one fixed driving mode, it can adapt on the fly for street driving versus off-road driving.

Term

tri-motor

“Tri-motor” means the car has three electric motors. That can help it put power down better and feel more responsive, but it usually costs more to build than a simpler setup.

Term

dual motor

“Dual motor” means there are two electric motors. Usually one handles the front wheels and one handles the rear, which helps the car manage grip and acceleration.

Term

single motor

“Single motor” means the EV has one electric motor. It’s usually simpler and cheaper, but it may not give the same level of control as setups with two or three motors.

Concept

performance sub-brand

A performance sub-brand is a separate label a car company uses for its more performance-oriented models. Instead of treating every vehicle the same, they group the “more aggressive” ones together so it’s easier to understand what they’re aiming for. In this segment, that label is what becomes “RAD.”

Term

track is wider

“Track” means how far apart the wheels are on the same side-to-side axle. Making it wider usually helps the car feel more stable when turning, because it has a broader stance. That’s one reason performance and rally-style vehicles often look wider.

Term

vehicle's sitting a little higher

“Sitting a little higher” refers to increased ride height (ground clearance and/or suspension geometry). Raising the vehicle can improve off-road and rally-style capability by giving more clearance over obstacles and changing how the suspension works under load.

Term

wheels are... larger in diameter

Bigger wheels usually mean the tires are sized differently. That can change how the car grips the road and how it rides over bumps. Performance and rally-style setups often use larger wheels to help with stability and traction.

Car

Bmws M

BMW has a special performance department called M. It makes the faster, sportier versions of BMW cars with better tuning for driving hard.

Brand

Mercedes AMG

AMG is Mercedes’ performance label. Cars with AMG badges are tuned to be quicker and more fun to drive than regular Mercedes models.

Concept

Skunk work programs

A “skunk works” program is like a small group inside a company that’s allowed to move fast and try unusual ideas. In cars, it often means developing something new before it becomes a regular model.

Concept

Skunkworks team

A “Skunkworks team” is a special team formed to chase a tough goal quickly. It usually has more freedom to try aggressive ideas—like making a car more extreme and performance-focused.

Car

R3X

R3X sounds like a more exciting, niche Rivian electric vehicle that people want to see next. The host suggests it’ll come later because Rivian needs the more affordable, higher-selling models first.

Concept

mass market cars

In this context, “mass market cars” means cars meant to be sold to a lot of people at a lower cost. The host is saying Rivian needs those big-selling models to make money before it can afford to build the smaller, more special ones.

Car

R3

R3 is another Rivian electric vehicle platform. In this conversation, they’re basically saying R2 and R3 are the main platform names, while the “S” and “T” naming shows up on a different platform (R1).

Term

quad motor setup

A quad motor setup means there are four electric motors working together. More motors can help the car put power to the wheels more intelligently, which can improve grip and acceleration.

Car

R1S

R1S is one of Rivian’s R1 versions. In this segment, they’re using R1S and R1T to explain how Rivian names different versions of the same underlying platform.

Car

Rivian R1T

The Rivian R1T is an all-electric pickup truck. It uses a battery and electric motors instead of a gas engine. The podcast is clarifying that the R1T is one of Rivian’s main early models, separate from the R1S SUV.

Car

Ford Maverick

The Ford Maverick is a smaller pickup truck from Ford. The hosts mention it because it sells a lot and represents the kind of compact pickup Rivian wants to compete with.

Car

Rampage Ram Rampage

Rampage is being talked about as a pickup truck model. The podcast compares it to another small pickup to explain who it’s meant to compete with. The focus is on selling a lot of them, not just being a rare or specialty vehicle.

Car

Rivian R1

Rivian’s R1 is the earlier, bigger electric vehicle lineup. The point being made is that R1 is too large to go after the same buyer segment as the smaller R2.

Car

R2T

R2T is the rumored/desired idea of an R2 pickup truck version. The host is saying fans want one, but Rivian’s current plan is organized around R1 and R2 rather than an R2 pickup.

Car

R2S

R2S is mentioned as a version that doesn’t exist in Rivian’s current R2 lineup. The host says that’s on purpose, because it affects what kind of vehicles Rivian will build and sell.

Term

platform

A “platform” is the shared base design a company reuses across multiple cars. It lets the automaker make different models without starting from zero every time.

Concept

portfolio

In this context, “portfolio” just means the lineup of products a company plans to sell. Here, it’s about which vehicles Rivian will focus on next.

Concept

electric pickup

An electric pickup is a truck that runs on electricity instead of gas. They’re asking whether there’s enough demand for a smaller version of that kind of truck.

Concept

electrified products

“Electrified products” just means vehicles that use electricity in how they drive. In this conversation, it’s about which types of cars still don’t have good electric choices yet.

Concept

true mid-sized SUV

A “true mid-sized SUV” means the normal SUV size in between small crossovers and big full-size SUVs. The point here is that the market has lots of crossover options, but fewer vehicles that feel like a real mid-sized SUV.

Concept

adventure-oriented crossovers

This means a crossover SUV that’s set up for “go do stuff” trips—like dirt roads and rougher paths—not just city driving. Think of it as the kind of vehicle you’d take on adventures, with extra toughness and capability.

Term

R4

R4 is a later Rivian vehicle idea they’re not ready to detail yet. They’re basically saying it could be different types of vehicles, and they’re still figuring out what shape it will take.

Term

brush guards

Brush guards are protective front-end bars (often steel or heavy-duty metal) designed to shield lights and the grille from impacts with branches or low obstacles. They’re commonly associated with off-road or adventure-focused builds.

Term

winches

A winch is a powered tool that winds a cable in and out. Off-road, it can help pull a stuck vehicle out or pull something heavy to safety.

Concept

patent the idea

They’re talking about protecting a new idea legally. A company can patent something even if it decides not to sell it right away, so others can’t copy it.

Term

incompressible metal

They’re saying the winch hardware is made of rigid metal that doesn’t crumple easily. That can make crashes and pedestrian safety harder to manage, because the car’s front needs to behave in a specific way.

Term

crash and pedestrian protection

This is about how the car is designed to protect people in a crash—both the occupants and pedestrians outside the car. If you add hardware to the front, it can change how the front end behaves, so the safety design has to be reworked.

Term

OEM

OEM means the company that originally makes the car. They’re saying it’s harder for the car maker to add accessories themselves because everything has to still meet safety rules.

Term

components that are, that screw together

This is talking about headlights that are made in pieces. If one part fails, you can unbolt it and replace just that part instead of replacing the whole headlight.

Term

repairability

Repairability means how easy it is to fix the car after something breaks or gets damaged. The speaker is saying they want parts to be easier to replace without huge labor costs.

Term

manufactability

Manufactability is about whether a car design is easy to build in large numbers. In this clip, it’s connected to keeping repairs manageable and not overly expensive.

Term

safety cell

The safety cell is the part of the car that’s meant to protect people in a crash. It’s built to stay strong, while other parts of the car crumple to help slow you down.

Term

absorb energy

In a crash, the car has energy from moving. Crash parts are designed to crumple so they soak up that energy instead of sending it all into the people.

Term

high-pressure die castings

High-pressure die castings are metal parts made by pouring molten metal into a mold and squeezing it in under pressure. The point is you can make bigger parts that replace several smaller ones.

Term

stamped parts

Stamped parts are made from sheet metal that gets pressed into shape using a tool. Cars often use lots of these smaller pieces, which then have to be assembled together.

Term

five-star

A “five-star” safety rating means the car scored at the very top level in crash testing. The host is saying the vehicle is being designed to achieve that highest safety tier.

Term

one-piece body side

This means the car’s side panel is made as one big piece. If you damage part of it, the shop may have to repair a larger section (and sometimes cut and weld) instead of swapping just the damaged piece.

Term

service parts for collision centers

This is about the replacement parts that body shops can buy to fix crash damage. The point here is that Rivian can supply smaller sections of the panel, so the shop doesn’t always have to replace the whole side of the car.

Concept

ravine collision centers

The host is joking about random body shops that don’t really know the car. If they don’t understand the vehicle, they may guess high repair costs, and insurance can end up approving them.

Term

collision repair

Collision repair is what a body shop does to fix a car after it gets damaged in an accident. Depending on what was hit, it can mean replacing parts and doing a lot of labor, which is why it can cost a lot.

Term

panels

Panels are the outer parts of the car’s body. If they get damaged, body shops can often replace specific panels instead of doing a bigger repair to the whole car.

Term

structural

Structural means the car’s main strength parts—what keeps it rigid and helps protect you in a crash. If those are damaged, repairs are usually more complicated and costly than fixing just the outer body pieces.

Term

Apple CarPlay

Apple CarPlay is a smartphone-integration system that mirrors select iPhone apps onto the car’s infotainment screen. It’s commonly used for navigation, music, calls, and messages, and it affects how drivers interact with the vehicle’s interface.

Term

Halo wheels

“Halo wheels” is Rivian’s steering-wheel control setup. They’re talking about adding physical-feeling controls (so it feels more tactile) based on what drivers said they wanted.

Term

haptic wheels

Haptic wheels create a “click” feeling using the car’s electronics, not by using real mechanical notches. That way, the steering-wheel controls can feel physical even though the behavior is controlled by software.

Term

torque rise and torque fall

This is how the car’s pulling force (torque) ramps up and then eases back. The goal is to make the car feel smooth and predictable when you accelerate or change load.

Term

haptic clicks

Haptic clicks are the “touch feedback” you feel, usually through vibration. It’s how the car can make a screen control feel like a real button.

Term

multi-touch screen

A multi-touch screen can recognize more than one finger at once. That lets you use gestures—like zooming in or swiping—to control the car’s interface.

Term

PCBA

PCBA is the car’s electronics board—the part with the circuits and components soldered onto it. It’s basically the “brains and wiring” for that feature.

Term

motor driver

A motor driver is the electronics that control the motor’s power. It helps the motor vibrate in a controlled way instead of just turning on/off.

Term

cooling systems

Cooling systems are what keep electronics from getting too hot. That helps the device work reliably over time.

Term

self driving mode

“Self driving mode” means the car is doing more of the driving for you. Even then, the driver typically needs ways to adjust things like speed, which is why the controls matter.

Term

voice

In-car voice control is the use of spoken commands to operate functions like climate and garage access. The speaker argues voice will take time for consumers to adopt, but R2 is designed to make it more natural by interpreting commands conversationally on-board.

Concept

cloud

“The cloud” here means internet servers that can do computing for the car. The advantage of doing it onboard is that the car can understand you without relying as much on the internet.

Concept

mass market realm

“Mass market realm” means Rivian is aiming for a lot more customers, not just a small group of enthusiasts. It usually comes with a focus on making the cars more affordable and easier to buy in larger numbers.

Concept

sum of its parts

This phrase means the car feels better as a whole than you’d expect just by looking at its individual pieces. It’s about how everything is put together to work smoothly, not just about having good parts.

Car

Rivian R2

The Rivian R2 is an electric SUV that Rivian is trying to make cheaper than their bigger models, but still feel like a high-end car. The discussion here is basically about how they managed to keep the price down without making it feel cheap.

Term

zero to 60

“Zero to 60” is how fast a car can go from standing still to 60 mph. It’s a quick way to compare how punchy different cars feel in a straight line.

Car

the 993 turbo

The “993 Turbo” is a Porsche 911 Turbo from a specific older generation. They’re using it as a reference point to show how quick the acceleration feels.

Term

front trunk

A front trunk (frunk) is a storage compartment in the front of the car. On many electric cars, it exists because there’s no big engine taking up that space.

Term

50 to 80

50 to 80 is a test of how quickly a car speeds up when you’re already going. It’s meant to show how strong the car feels for passing or merging, not just launching from a stop.

Term

stability

In this context, “stability” refers to the car’s traction-control and stability-control systems that help keep the vehicle from sliding or spinning when grip is limited. The host is saying the R2 can be adjusted to feel more playful while still managing control.

Concept

embargo

In car reviews, an embargo is a rule that says you can’t publish certain details until a specific date/time. The host is saying that deadline has passed.

Term

zero to 30

“Zero to 30” is a short acceleration test measuring how quickly a car goes from a standstill to 30 mph. The host is using it to explain why many EVs feel especially impressive at low speeds, even if they don’t stay as strong at higher speeds.

Car

Chevy Bolt

The Chevy Bolt is an electric car. The host is joking that it can feel almost as quick as a Corvette in the first short burst from a stop.

Car

Chevrolet Corvette

The Chevrolet Corvette is a fast sports car made by Chevrolet. People often talk about how quickly it can speed up, measured in seconds from a stop. The podcast is comparing how it performs after the car gets past the initial launch.

Concept

diminishing returns

“Diminishing returns” means the car’s acceleration feels great at first, but the benefit doesn’t keep getting bigger as you speed up. In other words, the car may feel less impressive once you’re already moving faster.

Car

Lucid Air

The Lucid Air is a fast electric sedan. The point of mentioning it here is that it can keep accelerating strongly even after you’re already going at highway speeds.

Term

hang the tail out

“Hang the tail out” means the back of the car slides outward a bit while you’re turning. It’s basically a controlled skid/oversteer, and the host says it’s possible when stability control is reduced.

Term

tossable

“Tossable” is a compliment meaning the car feels nimble and easy to steer quickly. It suggests the car responds readily when you change direction.

LIVE

Hello, everyone, and welcome to The Drive Cast.

I'm Joel Fyder, Director of Content and Product at The Drive, and The Drive Cast is our weekly

podcast giving you an inside behind-the-scenes look at the biggest stories, controversies,

and people shaping the automotive industry.

Today we have another special episode for you.

Once again, we are taking you with us and sharing our inside access with you.

Today's topic is Rivian, and I'll be joined by a special guest that to anyone in the automotive

autonomy, robotics, mobility, or business world needs no introduction.

RJ Skeringe, who is the founder and CEO of Rivian, among other things, and I sat down

while in Park City, Utah together to discuss the startup automaker's big plans as the

automaker goes from a niche player to the mainstream market.

Rivian, by many accounts, has become the darling of the automotive industry.

It's a hot topic despite its current volume and scale.

There's good reason for this.

Rivian came out of thin air and debuted its vehicles less than 10 years ago,

and is actually only producing vehicles for about four years now, and immediately it reset

benchmarks on multiple fronts.

It helped open an entirely new segment of what an EV is and or can be,

a true adventure vehicle that doubles as a daily driver.

But startup life is hard, and even as a darling Rivian hasn't had it easy.

The cash burn could induce heartburn to even the strongest of stomachs.

A recall here, slow ramp on service departments there, and the fact that, to date,

the automaker's vehicles sit at the upper end of the pricing spectrum,

with base prices starting at over $70,000 while spanning all the way up to $125,000 plus.

That's before addressing launching a vehicle during a pandemic and having a tornado literally

rip apart part of the automaker's factory days before production began on the new R2.

Take a stroll across the internet, and it's not hard to find a community,

whether it be on Reddit, forums, or various social media platforms,

that is both vocal and passionate about the brand.

To date, it's not a mainstream brand with a mass market offering,

but that changed yesterday with the launch of the R2,

which cost between $45,000 and $60,000, while hitting at the absolute heart

of the compact crossover SUV market at 186 inches long.

That's the size of a Toyota RAV4 and a Tesla Model Y.

The former is one of the best-selling vehicles,

period, while the latter is one of the best-selling EVs by the widest of margins.

It's not even funny.

Now, it's Rivian's turn to step into the arena and aim for the masses.

This is the moment RJ and his team have been building towards for years.

Everything is riding on this.

Here to dissect it all with me and give us some deeper insights from Utah is RJ himself.

So today is behind the scenes on Rivian, going into the mass market arena,

what that looks like, how it plays out, and dressing how the automaker aims to tackle it all.

By the way, if you like what we're doing here,

do us a favor and hit us with a five-star review on Spotify or Apple Podcasts.

It really does help get the drive cast in front of more people.

Okay, let's go.

So RJ, I've known you a long time.

You're the founder-CEO of Rivian.

I still remember with you when I met you at the LA Auto Show.

I think it was 2018, and we were supposed to have a 30-minute interview.

After an hour and a half, you and I got ripped out of the room.

They're like, you're done.

We're having enough.

But we were asking all these questions.

And at the time, I mean, Rivian was super young, right?

He was at the coming out party.

And you were so honest with so many of the answers.

It was like, you know, I don't really know yet because it was day one.

And you're like, we could do this, that.

It was kind of refreshing.

But for people that don't know who you are, you're actually a true car enthusiast.

If I remember correctly, one of your favorite cars is a Porsche 911 from the 80s

rally spec, lifted and all that stuff for dirt roads.

Do you remember this correctly?

I don't know if I have a favorite, but that's an interesting car for sure.

But I did pick a 911.

I'd probably pick a 993.

993?

Okay.

Which spec?

I would go Carrot 4S or Turbo.

Okay.

Or Carrot 2S is pretty cool as well.

I mean, they're all great.

So you're a true enthusiast on this stuff.

All right.

So I just drove R2.

R2 is literally launching, I mean, yesterday when this comes out,

obviously we're both tired yesterday.

It was a long day, but R2 is now getting in the hands of people.

Let's start with R2.

R2 is arguably making break.

We talked about this yesterday as a collective group at lunch.

This, you've bet the company on this and AI essentially, right?

Like this has to fly.

Right now, last year, you guys made gross profit margin on the actual R1s you were making.

But obviously you're not negative because you're spending all the money on autonomy

and chips and all the other stuff.

Talking about R2's profitability in the sense of when do we get to profitability

on the actual car?

And the reason I asked for context is Volvo CEO just told me a couple of months ago,

the EX60 that's coming out right now, which arguably starts at 60 grand,

a little more money, it's profitable on day one car one.

Less than their gas cars, but they're making a profit on their EV on day one.

So where do you guys stand on that?

R2 gets to profitability very quickly.

So we've said publicly, and I've been really emphatic on this work,

the R2 profit trajectory will start to shine through by Q4.

Of this year.

Of this year on a vehicle basis.

I think something you said though, which I do want to touch on, which is really important,

is really doesn't has not generated net profit as a business yet.

And we haven't been casual positive as a business, but that's not an accident.

It's actually a very intentional and methodical build out of a bunch of capabilities

in order to build a much larger business.

And on the product side, we've taken the decision to vertically integrate

in almost all technically important areas.

So software, electronics, all the high voltage systems.

So that's power electronics, the motors, everything associated with the drive line.

So gearbox, inverters.

And we've done that because we want to make both really capable products,

but we also wanted to have a structural cost advantage as we got to scale.

And so in addition to the product, we also vertically integrated on the rest of the business.

So we're a direct to consumer.

We build our own distribution network.

So our own sales channel, our own service channel.

And this is many, many billions of dollars to build this out.

Huge infrastructure to support distribution of the cars.

So lots of like parking lots and warehouses across the country.

And all that investment was happening over the last few years

as we built up to get ready for R2.

And what I think missed is that that investment was like,

think of it as like a preloading, anticipating the volume that comes with R2.

And so the volume of R2 is what ultimately allows everything that we've done to make

rational sense.

It'll be like, oh, that's why there's so much investment.

This pull forward investment in service infrastructure and distribution network.

And as you said, autonomy, electronics, software.

And so R2's scale is, people say this is a make or break product.

It's the product the whole business has been designed around.

And so we absolutely intend for this to be a high volume program.

We launch it first out of our normal facility where we have around 160,000 units of R2 capacity.

We then bring on another plant we're building in Georgia.

And we're building that across two phases.

The first phase is a 300,000 unit phase.

And the second phase is roughly the same.

But Georgia will build, importantly, R2.

It'll also build R3.

And it'll build a bunch of cool variants.

Whoa, you're getting way ahead of us.

Yeah, so much we haven't talked about yet.

We've got so much to cover here.

We can come back to that.

But there are a couple of things before we get to any of that stuff.

And I don't want you guys as PR people to come across the table and choke me.

But there's so much you said in there that we have to address quickly.

So just off the bat, we've heard various numbers,

some confirmations, but how many R2 reservations do we have today?

Reservations to be clear.

We've only given a number once, like 20 hours after the launch event in 2024.

So this is like March 7th or 8th in 2024.

We decided to give a number once just to make it clear that there's excitement.

And so the number was just under 70,000 reservations.

Long time ago.

Yeah, that was a long time ago.

So since then, we've accumulated more reservations.

We haven't said how many.

But no time like the present.

No, but I think the point is we have a lot of excitement.

And that's a wonderful thing.

It's exactly what we want to be launching into.

It also does present a challenge because there's a lot of people

that would like to get their car next week.

So when we say we start deliveries next week,

there's many, many thousands of people that would like to be among the first.

And there is no practical or realistic way to do that because we're ramping production.

And so we've learned some things because on R1, we had not as big of a challenge,

but a similar challenge where there was a lot of backlog or excitement

around the brand and around the product.

And so here we've put together a very intentional and thoughtful way to decide how we

roll out the volume, deliver vehicles.

We've simplified what we're launching with where we have a single launch edition.

But nonetheless, when there's any kind of line, whether it's at a restaurant

or whether it's at a launch of a piece of electronics

or whether it's a launch of a car, it is challenging to manage.

And so we're trying to be as transparent as we can on that.

And we also have to recognize that one of the things that makes it so difficult

is when you have a very large pool of reservations,

we have to make predictions as to what the conversion rate is.

And if we're off by just a small percent, it makes it very hard for being accurate

and predicting when the delivery windows can be for other folks

because the whole thing compresses or expands.

If 100% convert versus 80% convert,

it has a big swing on delivery windows that we provide folks.

So we need some data to help inform how we can predict those delivery windows.

And I know for context, for people listening who don't know how the launch stuff works,

to your point about simplifying the bill configurations,

you guys also have to do a prediction of, okay, we have this many reservations,

but you also have to do the context of the conversion rate,

how many of those are for the launch decision,

how many for a standard, how many are for a premium, et cetera.

And so when you're not building those cars,

those guys are automatically lower in the line because they're coming later.

And they know that because we've even talked about the later.

That's actually a helpful mechanism to help spread the line out,

if you will, to spread across time.

So the takeaway people should have is patience is a virtue,

even though it's not something I have as one of my virtues.

I understand.

So we don't have a solid number.

Would you say it's over 200,000?

Rather not get into it.

So moving on.

After this, I'll tell you off the record.

Okay, we can talk when we're no longer here and the people won't know.

So more to the point about other things you were saying,

let's talk about service.

So I know you're very active on the internet.

Anyone that strolls through a forum or Reddit or Twitter or X or whatever they call it now,

we'll see the frustrations some people have had with service.

And you know, I've talked about this before,

you've been very clear and you're very outspoken about we've had some shortcomings.

But we're about to launch a product that could have multiples,

exponential number of volume vehicles going out there, right?

And a positive customer experience on day one, forget recalls.

Like just if something happens, somebody's service,

a positive experience is required so that you have that love

and feeling continuing about your car.

How do you address what people have experienced

and how we go forward here as we grow as a company?

Yeah, the service challenges are, this is a really important topic.

And Rivian, when we first launched in 21,

we didn't have a lot of our service infrastructure built.

And so we were building it as we were scaling.

And we absolutely fell behind in a number of key markets

and a number of markets just had more volume than we had anticipated.

And so it overwhelmed the service infrastructure

and building service infrastructure.

It's not as if you sort of say,

oh, I want to add another service station in Seattle.

Let's add it next week.

It's a pretty long process.

You have to identify a site, you have to build the site,

you have to get permitting.

So it can take anywhere from nine to 18 months,

depending on the location, permitting process.

And so we got to a point where in a few of our markets,

there were lead times for non-critical items.

Let's say something that was broken,

but the vehicle was still fully operable

or something that was rattling or something along those lines.

Work would be 40, in some cases, 50 days.

So you'd say, I'd like my car service.

I'd say, yeah, we'll get it in a month and a half.

That was really critical for us just as a brand to work that down,

get that from tens of days down to at most a couple of days.

And we've done that across all of our locations today.

But it's taken us some time, but a key goal for launching R2

is to have our service network ready,

where we have weight times for non-critical items,

like with the vehicles inoperable, it's within hours.

That's just how we built the system.

But non-critical items we want to have within a couple of days.

And so that was a big lift.

And it was one of the things when we talk about launching R2

that's probably not, we think,

oh, product, manufacturing, supply chain.

But a lot of the rest of the business had to get ready as well.

But as you said, if you go scour Reddit

or you go scour social media,

there's a lot of hysteresis of past experiences,

not surprisingly, because we're such a young company.

That would have, if you think of other companies,

if you were to imagine what Toyota's service looked like in the 1960s,

you probably had some similar dynamics.

It's just that wasn't captured.

And it was such, it was like-

We live in a very real-time communication.

It was a long time ago.

So you don't see those growing pains

because they've already happened.

So I think what I'm happy to see though

is you are starting to see on a lot of those forums folks say,

when my service was terrible in 2023,

I had to wait for a month and a half.

It was this, this, and this went wrong.

And then you'll see somebody come back on and say,

well, I went to that same service location.

It worked out much, much better.

And so you're starting to see even the community

recognize that we're improving in service.

But it's a huge focus for us.

And with the R2, it's a mass market vehicle.

So unlike R1, where in many cases,

it's a second or third or maybe fourth vehicle,

R2 could be your primary vehicle,

or it may be one of two vehicles.

And so your willingness to have the vehicle out for service

or to have an issue like that for extended periods of time is much lower.

So Parley and that question real quick onto one more on service.

And I want to move on to a couple other topics real quick.

Right now, for the most part, historically,

if you have an R1 and it has service,

for the most part, you get a loaner car.

That's a pretty premium perk for usually a premium brand here in America.

I'm curious now that R2 is going to go into production,

that's a much more mass market car.

It's going to be a higher volume of those.

But to your point of this, usually someone's daily driver,

does that continue?

Do you guys have to figure out,

is this a critical error?

How long will the car, how does that get handled?

Well, one of the things about service that we have,

we've not talked about enough and I see it starting to emerge in customer forms,

is more than half of our service is done with mobile service.

And so the goal is for that to grow to a very high percentage.

We'd like that to be 75, 80% of our service activities.

And so what mobile service is for those that haven't experienced it,

you're car sitting in your driveway, it has an issue,

you flag a ticket or you said like to have it worked on.

And we send a technician to your house

and we have a fleet of around 800 mobile service vehicles.

So it's a comp mostly our vans,

which are like a service station inside of it.

We also, someone would be called RSTs, Rivian Service Trucks.

The cool thing about the trucks is they can go anywhere.

If you need service on the side of a mountain,

we can send a truck there.

But it's around, it's just under 60% of all service activities today happen with mobile.

And the beauty of that is you don't need a loaner,

you don't need to worry about dropping off,

you don't even need to be there.

We can let ourselves into the car, you can be out of town.

It's super convenient.

Now in the event that you need to bring the vehicle in for service,

we do have a loaner program, but given the scale,

this is something that depending on the location,

depending on the type of service, it will have to assess.

And so when you think of it broadly, the service is quick,

it can happen while you're there.

The service takes a while in which case you get a ride from somebody,

you use a rideshow service, we provide you a loaner,

or if you need a vehicle and we don't have a loaner available,

we provide a rental.

But ideally not do that.

But one, it's expensive to us too,

we're putting you in a car that's on a Rivian.

Who wants to get it in a gas-powered rental car?

Yeah, exactly.

Although it'll probably sell you more cars.

So okay, moving on to charging and then products.

So charging, we talked about the RAN Adventure Network,

the Rivian Adventure Network, no matter how good R2 is.

First off, just statistics, about 65% of America

lives in single-family homes.

Most America average drive 40 miles a day,

five miles in a shot.

Like these are just statistics, it is what it is, black and white.

But perception versus reality, we both know cars are emotional purchases,

they're not rational purchases,

and people think they're gonna tow 500 miles, 5,000 pounds in a shot.

I might buy a horse.

Yep, gonna buy a horse tomorrow.

Or I'm gonna drive the boat to the lake every day

and it's across the country, which, sure.

But that's like, we've seen it time and time again.

So with R2, and as we're going to our mass market,

people obviously have charging anxiety.

I wouldn't even call it range anxiety.

These cars have over 300 miles of range, EPA rated.

But charging anxiety, we've already talked about Tesla

as the best network in the country,

and you're right behind in terms of uptime, not even 9%.

Like that uptime is the key here, right?

You can as many charges as you want.

But if you pull up and it's broken, it doesn't matter.

How quickly are we building out the RAN network?

Are we still focusing on that?

Have we shifted resources away from that

as we're going to autonomy and R2 launch?

We're continuing to build it out.

It's a pretty linear build out as it is today,

meaning the rate at which we're adding new RAN locations.

No changes in plans as far as anything else.

Our changing world, that's what we've seen so far.

Now saying that, and we've got on the order of,

I guess I shouldn't know the exact number.

It's like 150 RAN locations.

But that'll continue growing,

where we will start to see a big inflection point

where we'll build out a lot faster

is when we launch what we call our power cabinet 2.0.

And so that's when we update all the power electronics

to go into the cabinet that sits behind the charging dispensers.

And the reason we're waiting for that big inflection

of ramping a lot faster is the power cabinet 2.0

has been optimized for cost and optimized.

It's being optimized in shape for cost

and for ease of installation.

It's like the R2 of Rivian invention network.

That's exactly right.

Yeah, it's exact.

And so when you think about building out the network,

we want to wait before we put a very large amount of investment.

But it's going to be,

you think of it as being timed around the launch of products

coming out of our Georgia facility.

So it's not going to happen in the next few months.

We're going to continue growing over the next,

call it two years, and then we'll see a notable step

in the rate at which we build this out.

But our goal is to be one of the largest networks

in the United States.

And so today, as you've said already,

there's two networks that have extremely high uptime.

Tesla, which is a great network.

And ours, Tesla's a much larger network.

It's, you know, our networks may be four or five percent

the size of Tesla's.

But as we think in the end state,

it's going to be important to have

more than one great network in the US.

And to be clear, we would love to have others.

Like this is not, we think, we'd love to say there's

ubiquitous great charging where uptime is 99 plus percent.

Locations are easy to access.

But unfortunately, it's taken a little longer

to get that built out than I think many of us

thought myself included.

Let's talk about product.

R2 is launching.

I was with you in February for the RAD debut.

The RAD is the Rivian Adventure Department, right?

And they make, they, Brian Gates and his team,

make the coolest stuff, right?

Yesterday on the drive for R2,

I saw and RAD wrapped R2.

It didn't look different, but it had a RAD wrap.

It was very clear indicator of like,

don't you forget, we've got a RAD department, right?

Talk to me about where RAD is going.

When will we, when will we see the first RAD product?

We haven't announced it.

RAD is, it's a, one of the most enjoyable parts

of developing a car, especially something like the R2

is you have all these trade-offs and compromises

you have to make.

And I think the magic is when you can balance those

trade-offs really beautifully,

such that the vehicle feels really cohesive.

But what that means is there's certain parts of the vehicle

where for, to hit a price point, you have to decide,

like you can only spend so many dollars.

And so where do you allocate the bill of materials?

Do you put it into, you know, if you,

if you put it all into the chassis,

that means you're going to suffer in other areas.

You put all into the interior and suffer in other areas.

So we've tried to really like evenly and thoughtfully

deploy dollars across the vehicle to,

to create the best possible combination of things.

But inherently with that, we, we make decisions

around certain aspects of performance

that we think satisfy the most people.

But we know that we could turn the dial up further.

So like, could we turn the dial to 11

and improve the performance of the vehicle dynamically?

Of course.

Like we have the, the, the engineering capabilities to do that.

And so RAD is an opportunity for us to take the vehicle,

which is really, it's fantastic.

I'm very happy with where we've landed with R2,

but turn it to 11.

And so what that means is thinking about it on-road,

off-road, dynamically thinking about it in terms of its,

even some of the things that, how it aesthetically appears.

So some of the, like the visual imagery around the vehicle.

And so we launched RAD really recognizing that

we create this really balanced set of vehicles.

But we actually want to have some vehicles

that are a little less balanced, if that makes sense,

where we really go a little further on excitement,

performance, and adventure.

And, and so that's what you'll see from us.

So I think when you see these, they're,

they're not just like new badging on them.

They'll, they're going to be-

Not sticker jobs.

Yeah. They're going to be like fundamentally improved

under the skin, but, but that'll add cost.

And so it's going to make them more expensive,

but it'll make them really, really exciting.

One of the things that the R3 and the R2 debut had

was a tri-motor model.

And I will note that on the spec sheet

that I have sitting on my computer,

there is, there's a dual motor and a single motor.

And there's variants of those.

There is no tri-motor.

Did it evaporate?

What happened to that?

What, when we, well, hence our discussion of RAD,

so there's a, you know, we'll stay tuned.

I think, you know, we showed R3X

and at that time we hadn't announced RAD.

Really glad that we're going down this path.

Keep going.

But when you think of RAD and what it embodies,

and R3X, R3X was spiritually representative

of the types of things we'll do with RAD.

And we, we just hadn't, when we launched,

when we showed R3X, we actually hadn't arrived at

and realized we want to create a performance sub-brand

as a way to categorize these vehicles.

But, you know, were we launching,

were we showing R3X today?

We would have called that a RAD vehicle.

And so if you look at that, the track is wider,

the vehicle's sitting a little higher, the wheels are,

you know, these are, they're, they're both larger in diameter,

larger in diameter and wider.

The interior was really dial-up.

Gotta love the cork and those seats are awesome.

Yeah, and those woven seats were just so cool.

But it really had a, like in a motorsports-inspired feel to it,

like a rally-inspired feel and capability.

And so that's just one example of what this could start to look like.

And by the way, if you look at the colors that were on R3X

and you look at the colors on the RAD products

or the way we've talked about RAD,

you can see how the inspiration like ties.

Like RAD is, it's the coolest thing about RAD

and having been a car enthusiast my whole life,

you know, growing up seeing like BMW's M division

or Mercedes AMG or, you know, the GT side of Porsche,

like GT2's, GT3's like, you see, you see these things

and they've evolved and turned into things.

And it's fun to read the stories of like,

how did M start or how did AMG start?

Skunk work programs.

And they are.

And they're like, you can see a lot of those

authentically were born out of that.

And RAD is really that.

It's like, like the combination of a few people

within the team, myself, like authentically recognized

a desire to make the vehicles even more capable.

And as I said, in some ways, like in balance,

where you wait, put more weight on performance and capability.

And I think that's really cool.

And so to now see it like,

have a way to describe it with RAD,

to have a product portfolio that we're thinking about

that's going to capture that, like assigning a Skunkworks team

whose objective is to make these cars more extreme is really cool.

And the people that are going to be involved in the program,

many of them, you know.

So you've already mentioned a few names, but folks.

I wasn't going to start naming names again.

But there's people like, you can probably imagine

from the cross-section of folks you've met at Rivian,

who will be on the, you know,

who's part of like the Skunkworks team.

So the number of people online,

the number of people that talk to me and they're like,

when's an R3X coming?

When am I going to get an R3X?

Is there any timeline?

Because obviously, mass market cars, R2, R3,

these cars that get you to scale,

like we were talking about earlier,

these cars that get you to mass market, lower price points.

These have to come first.

You have to make money.

You have to make money before you can make

really fun, low volume, cool stuff.

Again, it's how every company works.

Do we have any idea timeline for anyone that's waiting?

It's like,

Rivian has a really clear idea in terms of

we just haven't announced it yet.

But they'll come.

Yeah, they're coming.

They're just, we just haven't announced a date.

You know, it's a couple of years away.

Okay.

Yeah.

I mean, when you think about the product portfolio,

there's, there's R2, there's R3,

you can imagine there's things we do on

both of those platforms is how I describe it.

And there's of course R1, don't forget,

we also have R1.

Yeah.

Big fan.

And R1 has a lot of great,

like with the quad motor setup,

there's a lot of things we can push further on R1.

Also a big fan.

Yeah.

So speaking about R2,

but I'm glad you brought up R1,

R1 is R1S and R1T.

R2 has R2 and today we have R3,

which is R3 and there was R3X,

but you know, R2 and R3,

there's no S, there's no T,

there's no none of that, right?

There has been a lot of chatter.

I mean, Ford Maverick sells in big volume, right?

We're about to have a ram rampage,

which can compete against a Ford Maverick

in terms of that compact size.

R1 is not a small vehicle,

just the same reason that you're not

hitting the same market with R1S

that you might hit with an R2.

There are a lot of people that online

that have chatted like, man,

an R2T would be awesome.

And but it's set up right now

where it's an R1 or R2.

There's no R2S, right?

That's obviously a purposeful decision.

Could we see an R2 pickup?

Can we see a smaller pickup?

Like how does it work?

Because we've set it up with R2, not S.

Yeah, that was intentional.

And we've of course thought about

all the things you're referencing here.

We've thought about R2Ts

and even things beyond that.

I would just say the platform's

capable of doing a lot.

The real challenge we have

is deciding what to do.

And so there's so many

different cool things we could create.

And so we, as a company,

need to be focused on

what's the next product we do

or the next set of products we do

that creates the most value,

generates the most excitement

around the company.

And that led to the portfolio

that we've talked about publicly.

So R2 and R3.

I think the R3X was a really good,

like it was intended to be

and probably was picked up less

but was intended to be a signal

of the types of things that could come

to say like off the R2 platform,

there could, or off the R3 platform,

there was a unique variant

and off the R2 platform,

there could be unique variants.

There's a lot of things you could do.

And so in the fullness of time,

I wouldn't rule anything out.

But in the immediate future,

I wouldn't hold out for any of those

like very different variants.

It'll stay R2.

Do you see a market,

viable market, for a smaller than R1

electric pickup?

Because we don't have a smaller than R1

electric pickup right now at the market.

Oh, I think there's,

I mean, you've heard me talk about this before.

I think in the world of

electrified products,

there's a lot of different segments

that just have not been addressed yet.

The first, like that really hasn't been addressed

is the true mid-sized SUV.

Like we don't have a great mid-sized SUV

that consumers can buy today.

There's mid-sized crossovers,

but not true SUVs.

Like the smaller truck space,

I think there's a big opportunity

and like the idea of adventure-oriented crossovers,

I think there's a big opportunity

hence R3.

There's R4.

So we also recognize is on the platform,

there's going to be things that come

beyond R2 and R3

that we also have to make a trade-off against

in terms of what's the next set of things that we do.

What form factor might R4 take?

Oh, we haven't.

That's, it's very cool,

but not yet, not ready to talk about it yet.

Could it be a pickup?

It could be a lot of things.

We, yeah, we can't, can't.

It could be a pile of goo, it could be anything.

Anything your mind wants.

Yeah.

So talk to me, there's been cool patents

that you guys have filed specifically,

there were earlier patents for like R1

or whatever with like brush guards and winches

and like canopies and all these other things.

Are these just ideas?

Are these things we can see in accessories?

Are these things that, that could come to market?

Or is just like, we got a patent this

because we came up with an idea, but.

A little bit of both.

And sometimes we develop something

when we decide not to launch it,

but we still patent the idea.

You know, winch is something we've long wanted

to put on an R1.

It is a bit challenging though,

because it's a, it really impacts the,

from a regulatory point of view,

it's, you know, it's a challenge to put a big chunk

of like incompressible metal on the front of the car.

So it affects crash and pedestrian protection.

And so the way that, that historically happens

is third parties do that work.

And so the aftermarket can, can, can do these things.

Because we create our own accessories

when we are the OEM, it is a bit more challenging,

but we've, we've thought about it a lot.

To come back to rad, I think they're again,

remember that discussion.

I think there's a lot of cool things that can come.

When we talk about rad, we, the second word adventure,

we intentionally use the word adventure department

as opposed to like performance.

The performance is an element of adventure,

but adventure is a broader category.

So that means that can enable a whole host of things,

things like winches I'd, I'd put.

So the, the rad department doesn't have to necessarily

be vehicles, it can components.

Vehicles, but plus things that make the vehicles more exciting.

Okay. Let's talk about repairability.

So if you go online, then this is a two-part thing,

that's a two-part setup.

One, if you go online and you see chatter,

people are complaining just in general,

forget Rivian, like for a second,

just in general in the marketplace,

cars are complicated, consumers don't understand

how complicated to be frank.

And cars cost a fortune to fix.

I can't do it myself.

The days of taking a headlight bulb out

and changing myself, forget about it.

And you know, I see people, whether they have an R1,

they had that little plastic trim right below the grill

and it cracks like you got to go bumper off

and set the three-piece thing or whatever.

Mercedes just announced new headlights

that are going to be components that are,

that screw together, that actually screw together

and you can take them apart and there's certain components

you could change a certain component and not the whole thing.

Whereas, you know, a Hummery V got a $9,000 tail light, right?

Rivians, you got the tail lights, they're expensive.

Like if you go online anywhere, I crack a tail light,

there's three grand.

And then to my rear quarter panel, it's 14 grand.

They're aluminum.

How do we address repairability in this era

with vehicles that are frankly really complicated,

but they have to be really complicated

to be this capable and full of tech?

I mean, that was a big driver of R2.

We designed for manufactability.

We also designed for repairability and cost for repair.

That's, and there's sort of two elements for repairability.

One is like something breaking, something wearing out,

something being damaged through use.

And then there's also collision and they're a bit different.

And on the braking side, that's a pretty trackable problem.

On the collision side, it can be challenging

because a lot of the things you do in the vehicle,

you design it for safety.

So there's a combination of manufacturing, safety,

and then repairability.

And often those things are pulling in different directions.

So safety, you want things to crush around the safety cell.

Yeah, like think of like if you run into a brick wall,

you actually don't want the car to not crush.

You actually want it to collapse and absorb energy.

And so by virtue of that, you're absorbing energy

into a lot of content and you break a lot of content.

But by virtue of that, it's a safer vehicle.

And on the other side of the coin,

if you're thinking about it for manufactability,

you want to console the parts.

You want to have a smaller number of parts.

And so the best example of this is the use of very large,

high-pressure die castings to replace assemblages of stamped parts.

And the benefit as you have less parts have to go together.

The challenge is if you break that one part,

it's like it can be a lot of the car is embodied there.

And so we've tried to balance between those three competing

objectives, cost, safety, and repairability.

Of course, as you balance safety,

we didn't reduce.

We've said the car has to be a five-star.

So we're targeting for this to be one of the safest vehicles on the road.

But we did make some decisions differently.

On R1, we used a one-piece body side.

And so that means if you damage the rear fender,

the repair operation, depending on the level of damage,

you can either do body work or you have to cut out a portion of the panel

or re-weld the new panel on.

And we actually, as part of our service parts for collision centers,

we have subsets of the full panel.

So we don't have to replace the full body side.

And one of the challenges on collision

is you don't go to ravine collision centers.

This is actually used third parties.

And so third parties, the reason you saw some of these really high numbers

is we're like, a ravine?

What's a ravine?

So they don't know the car.

And they quote an enormously high number.

The insurance company agrees to it.

And then that happens.

Like we have standard procedures.

And there's no collision repair that should cost tens of thousands of dollars.

These are like very unique anomalies that are a specific,

probably a mom and pop collision center has not seen a ravine before,

didn't phone us, call us as ravine to say, hey, what's the process?

Didn't look at the parts, like sort of quoted a really high number

because they probably didn't want to do the work.

But on R2, the way we've broken up the body in terms of panels

has been very intentional for the types of collision.

So if you look at the rear face on the car,

it actually wraps around pretty far.

And the faces, it's made of plastic.

So it's actually more resistant for like,

you know, basketball hits it, it's not going to damage it.

Whereas the body side is made of metal.

So if you dent that, it's something else.

And so we've been very thoughtful on trying to create

a vehicle that has less need for body repairs,

for like day to day usage, shopping cart hits it,

back into something like a basketball pole or something.

But also recognizing that when damage does happen,

we've sort of partitioned the vehicle in a way

that's more thoughtful for those collision repairs.

Got it. Let's talk one last time about future product,

that particularly around screens and controls.

So we've been very clear,

while scenes have been very clear,

your chief software officer has been very clear about Apple CarPlay.

We've been very clear about new Rivian OS 2.0,

which is launching on R2, the simplified unit face,

feedback from consumers, bringing that bar,

I think it's called the vertical bar on the left side,

bringing those controls closer to the driver.

But now we have Halo wheels, right?

And a bunch of your team was talking to me about,

that was driven by consumer feedback.

We want some tactility.

The stocks have a bunch of buttons now and roller knobs.

Talk to me a little about integrating that consumer feedback

to bring controls while keeping the touchscreen interface

into the future.

Yeah, the haptic wheels that are on the steering wheel,

that was a very large engineering effort

because when you're rotating those,

and you hear the feel that haptic clicks.

Click, they're clicking.

That's actually software.

So there's not actually, there's no like indents,

like you'd have in a typical wheel that has that click.

Which is trippy because I can feel the click,

click, click in my fingers.

What it is is it's a little motor,

that's creating that torque rise and torque fall.

Similar to an iPhone,

how it vibrates with the little motor thing.

Yeah, so it's all software driven.

And the beauty of that is that those wheels now

are completely configurable.

So while they have all the haptic clicks,

when you go to a different screen,

the wheels update or if we have an over the year update,

we're going to change some of the capabilities of the vehicle

and have those haptic wheels do something different

or behave in a different way.

That's entirely possible.

And so that was one of the reasons we initially were so

philosophically aligned with using a multi-touch screen

is we liked the ability to continually refresh and update it.

But as you said,

we wanted to have some more haptic experience.

And so creating those wheels was a big,

a big part of that and a huge engineering effort,

far bigger engineering effort than it looks when you see it finished.

It was like a whole inside that wheel.

There's a PCBA, there's a motor, there's a motor driver,

there's like cooling systems.

It's like quite complex.

And then as you said, on the stocks,

we put more thoughtful design into some of the controls

or as you said, a little knob rotating up and down on the speed

when you're in self driving mode.

But I think the element beyond touch,

beyond some of the physical controls

and then beyond the multi-touches,

we also see voice starting to play a role.

I think that's going to take some time

for consumers to start to adopt it.

R2 is going to be a higher level of adoption

than what we saw in,

than what I think you'll see in even R1

because the way we've developed in R2

is we have an onboard, really capable inference platform.

So 200 tops platform just for your user interface.

And the beauty of that is we can run

fairly large models on the vehicle

and so we don't have to go up to the cloud for voice.

And so if you say, open my garage or I'm hot,

the vehicle can interpret that in a very conversational way

to respond.

The garage opens or the AC comes on.

But I do think that that's going to layer in over time.

We look at those as having, being a parallel path.

So you can either go through the screen,

you can go through the physical controls,

or you can talk to the car and it'll respond.

Like different demographics respond differently to this.

It's right at an inflection point,

I think from a society point of view,

we're starting to use voice more

because it's suddenly become a lot more capable.

That's fair. I remember when Siri first launched,

it was kind of a mess.

Yeah, it was very hard to use.

It's like, turn on the music.

But you didn't use the right command.

You didn't use the password.

You got to have the right handshake.

All right, so I want to be respectful of your time.

You're busy.

One last question.

If you were talking to Rivian owners

who are either frustrated, Rivian potentials,

Rivian enthusiasts, and any demographic you choose,

what would you say to them

if they were sitting across from you

of like the future of Rivian, the message?

What would you tell someone who's

an enthusiast about Rivian

to look forward to to be excited about whatever?

I've never been as excited about something that we built.

This is, even with R1 being our first car,

and so many years of time going into that vehicle,

R2 represents all the learnings

and so much progress as a company.

And so I've never been as excited

as I am about this vehicle.

I think it's a really beautiful combination

of performance capability and engineering

to achieve a price point that I'm excited

for people to experience.

And so that's the beginning of us

moving into this mass market realm

and then the things that can come off those platforms.

So for an enthusiast, imagining the rad versions

of those cars is pretty exciting,

putting aside the fact that these

are already high performance cars.

But even looking beyond that,

just the number of things that the vehicles can do

and the experiences they can enable,

it's really exciting.

It's funny, and I don't know if this is a bonus question

or whatever, but it's funny you mentioned that

because yesterday when I was driving the car,

the thought that kept coming to my head is,

how did you make this car cost what it costs

and feel, look, and drive the way it does?

That's what kept coming to my head of like,

what am I missing here in this contextual equation

of all the cars I've ever driven?

I'm like, I don't understand how we got here

because this feels greater than the sum of its parts

is what I like.

The Rivian R1 feels like an expensive car

and it is an expensive car, right?

And it feels like it and it is.

The R2, it feels more than it costs

and that's the thing that bewilders me.

Yeah, that was the goal.

But yet you're going to make money on it is the goal.

It costs a lot less than it can.

It's truly, it is an impressive feat.

Oh, well, thank you.

Yeah, well, thanks, yeah.

Yeah, it's wild.

I mean, growing up, I remember reading car magazines

and getting so excited to see a car

that broke the four second mark, zero to 60.

Yeah, and the, like the, that we referenced

that the start of this, like the 993 turbo

when it hit 3.6 seconds, it was like,

oh my gosh, that is so fast.

I wonder what that feels like, I would think to myself.

And now, and you know, these are like a super car.

And now our, you know, $50,000 R2, which can carry your kids,

it can go off road, it's got a front trunk,

it's got all this capability.

It not only does zero to 16, 3.6 seconds,

but that's actually the less impressive part

about the performance.

It's like the 50 to 80 or the 60 to 90,

it's so quick at higher speed.

And then dynamically, it's beautifully balanced.

I think we've dialed it in a way that it's very neutral

for when you want to be neutral,

but if you want to drive it quickly and reduce stability,

you can, you can let it slide around a little bit.

And to do all that on a midsize actually,

it's just so, it's so cool.

I mean, we're not in an embargo anymore.

So I will say as someone who doesn't work for Rivian,

I can confirm that it is, like a lot of EVs,

people may have not driven EVs, you know,

the zero to 30 is the party trick, right?

There was the joke that like there were Chevy Bolts

that could do zero to 30 as quick as Corvette, right?

But then after you hit 30 and really 60,

speed in a lot of these cars drop off, right?

It's diminishing returns.

But unless you're getting something like a Rivian R1

or a Lucid Air or whatever, that 60 to 100 or whatever,

it's not as quick.

It's not dangerous on the highway, but it's not as quick.

I will say, you know, I was on the highway yesterday

doing 65 and then I just put it all the way to the floor.

And I mean, you can easily go to jail speeds very quickly.

And I'm like, all right, that's impressive.

And you've reduced stability control a little.

You can absolutely hang the tail out.

Not that you should do that on public roads,

but it is controllable.

It is fun. It is tossable.

It's a really complete package.

I'm truly in awe.

Yeah, well, thank you. Thanks.

Thank you for taking the time.

Really appreciate you having on the podcast.

We'll be back.

That's it for this week's episode of The Drive Cast.

Thanks to Rivian for stepping into the mass market arena

to RJ for his time and insights.

Thanks to our editor, Tyler Mark.

And thank you for listening.

We'll be back next Wednesday.

Be sure to check out TheDrive.com

for our full coverage of the R2 and a whole lot more.

Subscribe to one of our fine newsletters.

They are free, by the way.

And subscribe to us on YouTube

where we've got a lot of cool videos coming up.

We'll see you next week. Bye, everyone.

About this episode

Rivian’s rise is framed as a rapid reset of EV benchmarks, followed by the R2 reveal: a compact crossover aimed at mainstream buyers, priced around $45,000–$60,000 and sized like a RAV4/Model Y. RJ Scaringe explains why Rivian “bet the company” on R2, including a plan to vertically integrate, build direct-to-consumer infrastructure, and reach a profit trajectory by Q4. The conversation also covers reservations-to-delivery forecasting, service scaling, and charging-network uptime—plus how RAD turns “adventure” into a performance-and-design philosophy.

50 to 80 absorb energy adventure-oriented crossovers adventure vehicle allocate the bill of materials Apple CarPlay autonomy backlog brush guards cash burn

BMW M Coupe (E36) Chevrolet Bolt Chevrolet Corvette Ford Maverick Lucid Air Porsche 911 Ram Rampage Rivian R1S Rivian R1T Rivian R2 Rivian R3 Tesla Model Y Toyota RAV4 Volvo EX60

Original notes

Rivian, by many accounts, has become the darling of the automotive industry. It’s a hot topic despite its current volume and scale. To date, it’s not a mainstream brand with a mass-market offering. But that changed yesterday with the launch of the R2, which costs between $45,000 and $60,000 while hitting at the absolute heart of the compact crossover SUV market at 186 inches long, which is the size of the Toyota RAV4 and Tesla Model Y. The former is one of the best selling vehicles period while the latter is one of the best-selling EVs by the widest of margins it’s not even funny. Now it’s Rivian’s turn to step into the arena and aim for the masses. This is the moment RJ Scaringe and his team has been building towards for years. Everything is riding on this. This week, The Drive's Director of Content and Product, Joel Feder, is joined by Rivian Founder and CEO RJ Scaringe to dissect how we got here, missteps, where the company is today, and what's about to happen in both the immediate and longer-term future. So, today, it’s behind-the-scenes on Rivian going into the mass market arena, what that looks like, how it plays out, and addressing how the automaker aims to tackle it all. Stories mentioned in today's episode: 2027 Rivian R2 First Drive Review: The Perfect Car for So Many PeopleSomehow, Rivian’s Cheaper R2 Is Its Most Refined Vehicle The Rivian R2 Needed a Rear Wiper That Didn’t Exist. So Rivian Invented One 2026 Rivian R1T Quad First Drive Review: When Too Much Is Just Enough Rivian Is Going RAD. But Can It Stick the Landing? Rivian Won’t Talk About the Missing R2 Tri-Motor. The Reason Why Is Big Rivian Sidesteps Apple CarPlay With Built-In Texting 00:00 Intro 04:05 R2 profitability 07:43 R2 launch 10:49 Service 16:54 Rivian Adventure Network 20:03 RAD 25:47 R3X 26:25 R2T? 29:13 R4 29:31 Patents and a winch for R1 30:57 Repairability 35:32 Buttons, knobs, and the Halo wheels 37:43 Voice controls 39:07 RJ's final thoughts Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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