The Porsche 911 is a famous sports car that many people love for its speed and unique shape. It's been around for a long time and has many different versions.
The 997.1 and 997.2 are different versions of the Porsche 911 that were made in the mid-2000s. The second version has some upgrades that make it better than the first one.
Volkswagen is a car company from Germany that makes popular cars like the Beetle and Golf. They are known for their reliable and well-designed vehicles.
The Porsche 928 is a type of car made by Porsche that is designed for long drives. It has a powerful engine and is more comfortable than some other sports cars.
The Porsche 911 Turbo S is a super-fast version of the 911 that uses turbo power to go really quickly. It’s great for people who want a powerful car that can handle all kinds of weather.
The Porsche 911 GT3 is a super-fast sports car that's built for people who love driving. It has a powerful engine and special features that help it handle really well on winding roads.
The T spec is a version of the Porsche 911 that is designed to be simpler and lighter than other models. It's meant for drivers who want a fun driving experience without all the extra features.
The Porsche Carrera GT is a super-fast sports car that’s very rare and special. It has a powerful engine and is loved by car enthusiasts for how well it drives.
A hot rod is a car that's been changed to make it faster and look cooler. People usually take older cars and add new parts to make them better for driving.
MFI means Mechanical Fuel Injection, which is a way to deliver fuel to the engine. It uses mechanical parts instead of electronics, and it's good for performance cars.
Motronic fuel injection is a system that helps cars mix fuel and air properly for better performance. It uses electronics to make adjustments for different driving conditions.
Modifying Porsches means changing or upgrading parts of the car to make it look better or go faster. Many people enjoy customizing their Porsches to fit their style.
The Cadillac STS is a luxury car that’s designed to be very comfortable and stylish. It has a powerful engine and lots of nice features inside.
Car
Porsche 992 ST
The Porsche 992 ST is a special version of the 911 sports car, designed for better performance. It's part of the latest generation of 911s, which have new features and a modern look.
IMS problems refer to issues with a part in some Porsche engines that can cause serious damage if it fails. It's something buyers of certain models should be aware of.
Bore scoring is when the inside of an engine's cylinder gets scratched or damaged, which can cause the engine to not work properly. It's a concern for some Porsche models.
Platform sharing means that different car models use the same basic structure. For example, the Porsche 996 and 997 are built on the same foundation, which helps with production and design.
The Porsche 911 GT3 RS is a super high-performance version of the 911 that’s made for racing. It has special features that make it faster and lighter than regular models.
The Porsche 911 Turbo is a faster version of the regular 911 that has a turbocharged engine. The 930 is a specific version of this car that was made in the late '70s and '80s, and it is quite rare.
The Porsche GT2 is another high-performance version of the 911 that has a turbocharged engine, making it very fast. It's built for people who love speed and racing.
Tolerance for risk is how much risk someone is okay with when making decisions, like buying a car. Some people want to avoid problems, while others are more willing to take chances.
IMS failure is a problem that can happen in some Porsche engines where a part called the Intermediate Shaft Bearing breaks, which can cause serious engine damage. It's something buyers should be aware of.
Water-cooled means the engine uses water to keep it cool instead of just air. This helps the engine run better and last longer, especially in fast cars.
Air-cooled means the engine stays cool by using air instead of liquid. Older Porsches, like the 911, had this type of engine, which is different from most modern cars that use liquid to cool the engine.
GT cars are special cars made for fast driving and long trips. They are powerful and comfortable, so you can enjoy driving them on highways or racetracks.
Car
Porsche 996 Turbo
The Porsche 996 Turbo is a powerful version of the 911 sports car that has a turbocharged engine, making it faster and more exciting to drive. It's seen as a good deal compared to other sports cars.
The Ford Mustang is a classic American car that's known for being fast and fun to drive. It's popular because it looks cool and has a lot of power under the hood.
The G50 transmission is a special kind of manual gear system used in some Porsche cars. It helps the car change gears smoothly and is considered very reliable.
A 3-liter turbo is an engine that has a size of 3 liters and uses a turbocharger to boost its power. This makes the car feel more responsive and powerful.
The Porsche Cayman is a sporty car that’s fun to drive and easy to handle. It’s designed to be a bit more practical than some other sports cars while still being very fast.
The Porsche Boxster is a small convertible sports car that lets you enjoy driving with the top down. It’s known for being fun to drive and has a stylish look.
The Ford Flex is a big family car that has a lot of space inside. It has a different shape than most SUVs, making it easy to recognize.
Car
Porsche 930
The Porsche 930 is a model of the 911 that features a turbocharged engine. It was produced for many years and is recognized for its unique styling and performance.
The Ford F1 is about Ford's racing cars that compete in Formula 1, which is a big car racing series. It shows how Ford is involved in high-performance racing.
The Pontiac Solstice is a small sports car that looks cool and is fun to drive. It’s a two-seater, which makes it great for people who want a sporty ride.
Support for the show comes from public. On public, you can build a multi-asset portfolio of stocks,
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That's public.com slash market.
I'm Hannah Elliott and I'm Matt Miller. This is Hot Pursuit.
Coming up today, it is a special episode that we have been teasing for weeks.
We've heard you. We have heard. We've got the emails. Everyone agrees. We need to do a very
special, Porsche special, and we have, I think, two of the best guests we could possibly have found.
Yeah, we have someone who's close to me, Magnus Walker. I happen to be married to him.
That's the disclaimer. I happen to be a lifelong fan, well, at least for over a decade, been
watching Magnus's content and listening to what he says. I have recently discovered a Porsche expert,
Nathan Mertz, who owns a dealership and is also the chair of appraisals. Is that right?
Appraisal chair at the Porsche Club of America? That's fairly close. Valuations and appraisals,
absolutely. Valuations and appraisals. Nathan Mertz, a lot of people, you are going to know him
from YouTube, and Magnus Walker. We talk about you, Magnus, every day, probably.
Much appreciated. Or every week that we record this. What I wanted to do, and Hannah, you tell
me what you wanted to do also, but what I wanted to do is just get the take of these two guys who
know Porsche 911s inside and out and have been buying and selling and working on and modifying
and driving, most importantly, these cars for decades. I wanted to get their take on whether
or not I should buy a classic air-cooled Porsche, if so, which one, or if I should just get one of
the new ones, try and find it with three pedals, obviously. What was your thought?
My thought was, finally, we can get to the bottom of this, because we've all been listening to you,
Matt, go on and on and on about 997.1 versus .2. Finally, we can have some clarity. I think
with this panel of guests, we might get a bit of a point counterpoint, because it seems like
from what you've told me about Nathan, he comes from, and Nathan, obviously, you can speak for
yourself, but might come from a different side of the spectrum in the Porsche world. I'm very
curious to hear voices from all sides, shall we say, to help Matt, really, in your quest.
It'll be interesting to see which side of the spectrums they come from. I don't know how that's
going to work out, but Magnus, not everyone, I think everyone knows who you are and what you do
and how you've become you, but I could be wrong. Do you have a short little origin story?
Sure. I got short versions. Short version, I'm just a man with a beard. I'm a Porsche enthusiast.
I'm not a specialist at all. I like to drive. I like to build. I like to collect. I like variety
of cars. I fell in love with Porsche when I was 10 years old and that was back in the 70s and wrote
a letter to Porsche and said, I want to design cars for them. They wrote me a letter back and here I
am almost 50 years later, still in love with the brand Porsche and the Porsche experience and cars
in general and the whole community. I joke that we all speak Porsche. It is a language that brings
like-minded car enthusiasts together and that's what I'm passionate about, really.
I feel like you guys are actually on the same side of the street here except for Nathan.
By the way, can you tell us, Nathan, your origin story because you have been trading
Porsches I gather for a long time and you, I think, own a dealership plus you do these YouTube
like Porsche expertise videos. How do you get into it and what's your deal?
Yeah, I mean, probably like a lot of car people. I just popped out just with a passion for cars
for whatever reason. I kind of joke that it was probably a good thing. They didn't have a
Osburger's diagnosis when I was a kid in the 70s because I was that kid who was just super obsessed
with Porsche and I was the little kid who just wanted to talk to anyone who had a car and I
could tell them every detail about their car. I read every magazine and I can get my hands on
every book. I can get my hands on and just was always around cars. Cars were kind of my thing
and so I bought my first Volkswagen when I was 13 years old and kind of figured out how to work on
that, how to make money selling that. I used to basically buy them out of the classifies out of
the newspaper back when people would try to get an inexpensive car so you used to have to buy it
by the word. Matt, I don't know if you're old enough to remember that but you have to buy
a classified ad by the amount of words there. Sadly, I'm old enough, yes.
Okay, so people would have something like, you know, it would be like 1967 Volkswagen runs
and a phone number and I would think, well, that's no way to sell something and so
the 13-year-old me would take my paper route money and I convinced my mom or dad to take me
out there and I'd buy this old Volkswagen for $300, $400 drag at home, figure out how to make it run
and then my first business investment was a Polaroid camera and I would take my little Polaroid
camera and I would get a front three-quarter view with the wheel turned and I would write my 50 words
of ad copy in the old AutoTrader magazine and I would take my $300 Volkswagen and I'd write some,
you know, Robo's ad copy and get someone to pay me $2,500 for said car and so I did that all through
13, 14, 15 years old, translated that into a job eventually at a Porsche dealer when I got my driver's
license and then bought my first 911 which was a 75, I think Magnus can identify with this story,
mine was not a great car, it was a base 911 which they didn't even have in the US and I was a rest
of world originally a German market or derogatory at that time called a gray market car so it was a
75 base 911 with rusty doors and broken head studs and I bought that car for $6,500 and I'm not the
world's best mechanic but I was broke and so I translated what I thought I knew about working
on Volkswagen to working on Porsches and of course I had a job at a Porsche dealership and so I got
to do a little bit of time with some of the old guard there and learning how to work on the cars
and I've had Porsches in my life ever since so that's kind of my where I come from I guess.
Nathan I know that you sometimes focus on making sure everything is like period correct and I guess
with appraisals and valuations that's part of it right so whereas I think of Magnus as an outlaw
I guess you would be like the inlaw, the inlaw. Well I was going to say the cops.
Everyone's got an inner outlaw let's put it that way. How do you think of it Nathan?
You know actually what's interesting is one of the things I actually somewhat hate is the fact
with my title a lot of people think that first and foremost all I care about is the values of the
cars. I'm an expert on the values but I could care less about the values, as little sense as that
makes and the same thing with my content I'll make a video showing what the cars once were because I
want to give someone a reference standard that's not to state that that's necessarily what I think
they should own nor do I necessarily think or is that necessarily what's in my own garage. So if you
come to my own garage I do have some reference standard cars but I also own many cars that are
100% built and used and driven to my taste regardless of whether someone else wants that.
So that's the hard part with making content around what's correct as people assume I'm making a value
judgment that they should have that. It's basically just telling what it once was as a reference.
That makes a lot of sense. So I think we've got some topics that we want to discuss and
Matt is the first one we just want to ask each of you guys what your favorite Porsche is or what
you think the best Porsche is if you're just going to have one. Matt maybe you want to say that slightly.
No I agree like just give us like if there's one that you're going to have and I want I want to
avoid like if we're sticking in the 911 realm and I know that obviously I think Magnus you had
it you know some dodge muscle cars when you started getting into four wheels and Nathan I know you have
like I think you have like a 928 or maybe a few of those and other cars I want to keep this inside
911 but otherwise I don't care. So and I know that you probably will love all your children equally
but like if you had a Desert Island 911 if you could pick Nathan we'll start with you one generation
that you if it was the only one you could have is there a choice.
Absolutely there is so you know so no one gives me hate I do have at least one of every generation
of 911 built with that said yeah if I could only have one my my primary love I like the 1970 and
71 cars those are kind of my peak cars in fact I have a video out there called driving
early 911s I think and there's a white kind of a hot rod 71T in that video I've owned that car for
many many years if I could only have one car that's the car that's staying in my garage.
What about you Magnus? Well how big is the Desert Island where is it is it flat is it
hilly you know can you get off it or are you stuck on it I mean it's there is no for me one car
fits all you know there is no best of for me it's like stepping back in time you know we all know
the 911 debuted in 64 you know it's been around over 60 years it's eight generations of it they
all do the same thing differently ironically the car that when I get asked this question not so much
what's the best but which one am I keeping out of my garage it's always car number 277 which
ironically is a 1971 911T that's very weird modified so that is the keeper car but that's not
necessarily the most practical car or the best car but you both pick the same one and the same year
well yeah 277 is a special car for me I acquired that at the Pomona Swamp meet in 1999 so that car
now is 55 years old and by my math I've owned it 27 almost 28 years so I've owned it for over half
its life and that's the one I'm most sort of connected to it's the favorite pair of old shoes
broken in jeans it's got character sole patina and everything that I love about vintage cars not
just vintage Porsches but that's not the car Hannah and I drove from LA to Denver in a day and did
that 1,050 mile journey through five states and you know over the Rockies at 10,000 feet in snow
the day after Christmas you know the 71T just doesn't work in that environment you know first of all
that car there's no heat in it the wipers don't work the defrost doesn't work so for me it's a tough
question because like I say it depends where the desert island is so well but what you're saying
is the car that we drove was a 991.1 is that what you're trying to say that's not what I'm trying
to say you know the daily driver for me like today we drove a vintage Rolls Royce and we drove the
vintage Rolls Royce because the daily driver for me in the Porsche world is a 991.1 Turbo S it
currently has 203 200 and 300,000 miles it rolled over 200,000 miles a couple of months ago I get
in it today and this annoying you know engine coolant light comes on you know engine running
excessive we're in the car and I just started it out so you know I do talk about the 991.1 Turbo
S is the swiss army knife of 9-11 but I'll tell you and that is the car that I daily and it's never
parked in a garage it's parked outside I'm the second owner I ramble on it all about that car
all the time rhodium silver metallic red interior 2014 launch color you couldn't get a really a
more practical badass swiss army knife 9-11 used car than that that I bought for pennies on the
dollar only two pedals though dude only two pedals yeah I mean there's super annoying things with
it when I first got it that was it it's the only I've probably owned a hundred nine eleven it's
not just Porsches you know I own other Porsches front engine mid engine rear engine air and
water cooled but yeah two-pedal and I'm like wow you know I wasn't even looking for that car I was
looking for a 997 turbo because you know I'd never owned one and I've actually never owned a 997
but yeah two-pedal car which I thought oh I'm gonna miss shifting gears but I don't but the other
really annoying thing about that car is sent a lot wheels completely impractical I've probably had
at least five flats or punches in the three four years of ownership you know it's hard to get those
wheels off on the side of the road it's hard to get back on no one has a correct torque wrench
you have to get the car you have it's just a pain in the neck it left me stranded in the middle of
nowhere one so nothing's nothing's perfect and what I've realized is nothing needs to be perfect
that 991.1 turbo s like I say it's never parked in a garage it's parked outside it's been dinged on
the side of the road I don't worry about it I don't even lock it I let valley parkers park it
it's the only car I'll let a valley parker get in and drive and park because for me it's an appliance
it's a very very efficient appliance it's as quick as a gt3 on any spirited mountain road
if you're stuck in bumper to bumper traffic doing a 10 mile an hour commute it's it's not
it's practical you don't have to worry about gears and stuff radios on everything works in it
so it is the swiss army knife in 911s but that's not the one that I'm really right it's tools for
the job I mean yeah horses for course I've asked I mean I've asked you in the past you know what
what you want if you could only have one and you say like if it's a thousand miles we'll take
that turbo s if it's 100 then any pre 1974 I have the evidence here but I want to ask
about the t spec and Nathan you know last episode that we did we were talking about my car of the
year I love the new Carrera t because I think it's so perfect but it's not basic it's got
you know rear wheel steering and it's uh it's it's the only one that comes with a stick that's
not a gt car nowadays what was the t spec back in you know the 1971 year that you and Magnus both
prize so in that era portion basically had three trim levels for the car the t was their entry level
car the e was sort of the one in the middle and the s was their highest performance model outside
of the rs although it's kind of laughable now because of course by today's standards all those
cars are very very simple so I think in today's world to me why you want to buy a t is frankly
you're not paying the collector premium particularly of an s and for a car you're going to use drive
and you know like the the t that I have is is heavily modified it was built the way I wanted
a car to be and when I started with a car it wasn't a particularly valuable car to start with and so
I don't have a lot of concerns about the car like I've driven that car across the us and back
um I wouldn't necessarily do that in the same way with a you know 71 s so I think that's probably
the big thing um it's just it's a car I can use much like Magnus talked about with his 991 turbo s
it's a great appliance for for a given use case but what is the you both mentioned modifications
Magnus yours is modified and you Nathan called yours a hot rod right what what do you do do you
do you change out the torsion bars put on shocks um did you modify the engine what are what are the
modifications that people or that you like to do that other people like to do with these
cars to make them more drivable today it comes down to use case I think I mean that's what I
look at so I have four early cars in my collection all of which have a different use case or your
on rust so I have a car that's you know in all original what's called 73 naps CIS T so it's
sort of a cruiser um I do have a car with a 2.8 liter twin plug MFI kind of mega motor that's
real high strong and kind of like a kid with 80 hd and then I've got a car with a 27 rs spec motor
and then this driver I have it has a fairly stock uh 3.2 liter uh essentially for a 3 2 motor in it
and the reason I like that is it's plug and play it's got motronic fuel injection so when I'm in
the middle of Kansas the car is not likely to suffer from bad fuel or elevation or anything
like that I can find parts in my local Napa so it makes it a really easy car to live with but
doesn't necessarily have the character of like my higher revving MFI car would have or so so
Magnus what about you well for me the great thing about early Porsches is there are easy to
modify you know people have been modifying Porsches since James Dean in the 50s and you
know all the way through so modifying Porsches is nothing new you know when the T came out in 1970
as the entry level as Nathan stated you know at a 2.2 liter model a motor with 130 horsepower
and the great thing about these cars is you can quite easily make them handle better stop shorter
go faster it's plug and play there's four bolts that hold that motor and transmission in and
as Nathan said you know he's got a 270 he's got a 2.8 twin plug which is a great MFI motor and
he's got his 3.2 so you know it's easy to modify these cars to your own aesthetic taste and use
code like Nathan said for me with my 71 T when I bought at the Pomona Swampmeat ironically it had a
2.7 in it but a CIS motor and I just made it look like a 73 RS it was pretty easy change the front
and rear bumpers put a duck tail on it and get some RS flares welded on and you got to remember
back in the 90s you could pick these cars up all day long for five grand six grand you know under
10 grand 20 grand bought you a three-liter turbo you know it wasn't super duper valuable at one time
I had five 67 S's for example 67 was the first year the S motor came out two liter 160 horsepower
but back then these were just old cars you know I bought an S for 9500 bucks so you know when the
motor would get tired and someone would say well it's going to cost five grand in six months to
rebuild that two liter 30 years ago or I can put that 2.2 T motor in the corner in for 1500 bucks
and you can have it on the road in two weeks time these things were just another used car they
hadn't reached this iconic status like Lamborghinis and Friars and Aston's and other European sports
cars of that era and I always used to say the great thing about Porsches is they were built to be
driven and that's what separated early 911s from other European cars of that vintage i.e. Friars
and Aston's and Lambo's but that's also what kept Porsches affordable at this entry level price
point which was relatable where I bought a lot of cars for four grand five grand six grand you
couldn't do that with Friars and stuff but today unfortunately what I see is people don't want to
devalue quote-unquote the 911s by putting mileage on them you know it's more of my pet peeve flex at
a cars and coffee with your super rare paint to sample deviated stitching I don't want to devalue
and it's become this I guess investment when people say to me hey what's the you know it's the first
time Porsche only syndrome looking by a car what's the best investment I go well unless you're
investing in smiles per mile and memorable moments I cannot answer this question for you
because I've never bought a car as investment I've been fortunate that I acquired things I
wanted to experience before they became trendy valuable and doubled and tripled and you know
20 grand turbos became 200 grand turbos I'm not buying them today but what I see today is things
like STs right 992 STs that came out with a sticker price of call it $290,000 two years ago
and for some reason people are asking six seven hundred thousand dollars for these cars that
aren't even rare aren't even limited I mean has no reference to the original ST which was a 70 71 72
never official model sort of ordered from the skunk works parts been of the Porsche sports
purpose race treatable car and it's a completely different it's a completely different topic
actually yeah because like when I'm going through bring a trailer I'm looking at everything that's
like the air cooled cars and the 997s and even some of the 991s but I don't even bother if it's
a GT3 or an ST or um a Dakar like I don't even look I don't certainly don't click the star
icon because it's a different class of people and let's take a pause and that can be our next
topic yeah let's let's break because I'm getting the producer saying I was just getting started on
the slippery slope of Porsche run put a pin in that because I think actually Nathan probably
will have some interesting insights too about how prices have changed and and I know our listeners
want to hear about also the investment side of it so let's go to a break and then next up
we'll talk about that this is hot pursuit support for the show comes from public on public you can
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Nathan I know you walk people you know clients through all different levels of you know budget
but I've noticed when I look across the spectrum of what's available if I want a good driver that
I don't need to instantly do you know 20 or $30,000 worth of work on the 997 is my best entry point
and as long as there's no IMS or bore scoring problems at least as far as I've read on the
internet it seems like the 997.1 is the best deal what do you think about that?
Oh best deal let's say most affordable I would actually I'm gonna push back and go 996 if we're
gonna go most affordable bingo first water maybe the 997 might be a sweet spot how about that good
why do you say that Nathan tell us tell us more about your sweet spot yeah let's hit the sweet
spot yeah so I mean a couple things you know so then I'm a big fan of the 996 I like I like
early 996's I believe Magnus had an arrow kid early 996 I do as well I really enjoy that car
and you know I like the purity of that originalism and I like the controversy around it I like the
fact that it feels a little bit more akin to my early experience a little bit getting giving a
finger to the Porsche Peris if you will and since the 996 and 997 are built on the same platform
from a driving experience standpoint they're going to deliver a very very similar feel so
predominantly what you're getting with the 997 is a different aesthetic in terms of exterior and
interior and if call me crazy when the 997 debuted in 2005 I omit I was a 993 owner at the time I
thought oh of course I got this right and I was very very excited about the car now in 2026 when
I look back I actually think the 996 is aging better I think the design language of the 996
is actually more pure to the original 64 911 you know it's unadorned it's slabs sided
whereas the 997 is a little bit plays in my mind a little bit like when Volkswagen
released the new Beetle in 98 like they were so desperate because it's painful they drew inspiration
from the past so probably an offensive 997 owners there and I own a 997 so it's not that I'm a
hater I just I don't think they're worth the premium in the market versus a 996 for an entry level
buyer I just wouldn't be able to put up with the headlight I can't listen there's so much plastic
on the front of that car because the headlights are like the size of Texas each one it's two
texas is right on the hood and I just there's too much here you go we all like fried eggs right you
know whether you take them over easy you take them scrambled I mean the 996 was my first water
cooled 911 and I bought a 2004 996 GT3 10 years ago in 2016 I was late to the water cooled party
I didn't really care too much about being in the GT3 owners club but this kind of fell into my lap
it was close to my buddy's sharp works up in San Jose and that was when I joked about my garage
got its first water leak there was a leak in the roof and water came into the garage and it came in
in a format of a 996.2 GT3 which to me is a special special car and if you really want a really
really special GT3 it's a 996.2 GT3 RS or a 996.1 GT3 which unfortunately the US market never got
and probably five years ago I was chasing a .1 GT3 in Europe where they were super affordable
Canada I was trying to sneak one in through you know South America and bring it in through the DR
and I really really really wanted a .1 because for me I like the beginning of everything like I
owned a 64 911 I had to have it was a Bertha 911 I had to have a 75 turbo which Porsche only made
284 of them I ended up with two of them left hand drive right hand drive so I like the beginning
of every generation and without a question of a doubt I I'm so bored to death with people talking
about fried egg likes and boar score and an IMS bearings and I don't care about any of that stuff
when you're driving a 996 you don't see the headlights first of all that's by the way can I just say
that's one of my problems with it because I want to have that gunrail fender I want to be able to
see the two wings at the end of the hood and if I'm not mistaken the 996 was the first time you
no longer could although I don't like how the 993 makes them a little bit too I want them to be
proud you know well it's interesting because I owned a gen one and gen two that was how I ended
up in that aero kit car was I couldn't find a gen one GT3 so I ended up with a aero kit car
C2 and then a GT2 and a GT3 and when you park gen one gen two next to each other and just look at
the headlights gen one headlights now 25 plus years later look better than gen two headlights
and no one ever mentions that headlight when it's on a GT1 right the holy grail car no one ever talks
about the ugly headlight from a 996 if it's on a a GT1 so for me the 996 still is affordable
entry level well that was my question five years ago are they affordable actually they're obtainable
yes what price are we talking well Nathan's right here I think 30 grand get you into you can get one
for 30 grand you get one in the 20s what do you think Nathan yeah I mean probably for a coupe you're
gonna want to budget you know on the low side 30 I mean you can get them cheap you know 40 is
going to get you an amazing car 25 edgy so if it starts with a three it's probably a decent car
in a in a coupe format I still I can't deal with like the hazing like the hazing of the headlights
that are that old because there's so much plastic I just I guess you're worrying about the wrong
thing here yeah what you really needed to get was a 996 turbo five years ago when these were in
in the 30s that was the deal nobody seemed to realize you got one but I still won't drive it
even if Ted does you know even if he has it shipped to Stodd or wherever he lives you know
996 turbo to me is is is the car I mean I've got the GT2 version two-wheel drive I also don't need
any GTs I just need a Carrera S frankly well that's all you need I also I always like the end of
something because that means the engineers have worked every single work and kink out of it so
like that's why I feel like 997.2 is probably the best I mean affordable car out there for someone
like me who doesn't want to spend a hundred grand like I could get one still for in the
Nathan correct me if I'm wrong 80s or 90s plus it's got the 981 motor so it's going to last forever
and even if Magnus doesn't care about bore scoring and doing IMS work I don't want to drop that money
at demand here in New Jersey even if I could have my engine board out to four liters you'll be driving
your pickup truck in your Harley anyway so it won't matter what do you think about that whole
what do you think about the whole issue with the mechanical problems Nathan you know I think the
reality is if you're if mechanical concern I always tell people you know what's your what's
your tolerance for risk and that's one of the leading questions I'll give someone because
their tolerance of risk will guide where I direct them and so someone who has a zero or a near zero
tolerance for risk I just advise them this is not the brand for them you know if you're a zero
tolerance for risk person they make something called a Toyota a fabulous product right doesn't
have a passion of Porsche but it has zero risk profile and so every Porsche you buy is going to
have some some risk some generations more so than others but I think it's a little bit foolish when
people say well I'm going to buy for example a 997.2 because I have low tolerance for risk
and I say well first off don't let anybody tell you otherwise 981 motors can bore score so throw
that out the window yes they don't have IMS failure but certainly they have other things that crop up
and at the end of the day the newest 997 second generation is now a 15 year old European car
so let's not kid ourselves that it's going to be a low risk proposition so whichever car you
enter into you know drives love and experience it and part of the experience is one day it's
going to piss you off and cost you money I I mean I got to push back against that a little bit
because I had my 991 for 10 years and it has never had any kind of mechanical problem like
the only thing I've ever had it in the shop for is oil changes and the tires and it just has been
the most unbreakable vehicle I've ever owned including you know Ford trucks and Mercedes
bends you know I mean I've had issues with everything else except for the 911 maybe I just
got lucky but it seems to me that they're so well made that it differentiates at least the new cars
from I have never had a Toyota but from other American and and European cars yeah but you
gotta realize okay what year is your 991 2013 okay so if you had it for 10 years you've had it
since it was two years old so the risk profile on a two to 10 year old car is very different than
it is on a 15 to 25 year old car so things fail even on a well engineered product just for time
if nothing else right fair fair I also I gravitate towards the M97 motor anyway because
um and I don't know this because I haven't driven them back to back but I hear and it
makes me want it more I hear that it's more like mechanically pure that the intake sound is better
and what do you think about that idea like if you are going to pick between one generation or the
other and you had a high risk tolerance and you didn't mind doing any of the work you needed to
do which would you choose Magnus but he's never had a 997 which is weird by the way let me ask why
is that why is that why is that well you know that was when I was looking for the 997 when I
stumbled into the 991 Turbo s you know it was just for me you know I haven't lusted after a 997
you know unless I just haven't lusted after him you know I've never owned a new car it's not
something that's really high up on my wish list it was ticking a box of owning one of every generation
you know I don't have to own them to experience them that's what I call OPP other people's
Porsches where you get to drive them without necessarily owning them but if it was a choice
between a 996 and a 997 to me I'm taking the 996 just because it's the the beginning of the
water cooled era of Porsche 911s you know it's more historical it's more character it's more soul
it's it's definitive the 997 just came after it's the next one it's the follow-up it's not as
unique it's not going to go down in history I don't care about these things that you're talking
about it's irrelevant to me because it's not the only car that I have 997s don't seem special 996s
fried eggs all day long IMS bearings bring it on it's unique it defined the modern era of Porsche
I'm not a 993 fan you know it's the last era of air cooled you know I own one you know in me
I call the 993 in stock form not that it needs to be stock but it's the Cadillac of 911s it's
he doesn't mean that as a compliment by the way yeah you know it's like the Cadillac of minivans
and get shorty when you know Travolta says to DeVito when they pull up the restaurant and he goes
he's in the minivan and he goes it's the Cadillac of minivans so you know to me in the 993 to some
purists it's the last of the air cooled I don't care you know same with the 996 it was like 20
years ago nobody cared about 996s I will say Hannah you know what I'm gonna say Frank Stefan Walliser
yes who has developed all of those GT cars you love so much the current head of Bentley for
anybody listening he I asked him what he thought about me getting a 964 because I did and I still
kind of think well I don't know I think that I don't think that would be wrong might be a good
what did Frank say Dr. Walliser he essentially said and I'm paraphrasing so don't yell at me for
misquoting but he apparently or he essentially said all of those other air cooled Porsches are
like trash only the 993 is what you want because it handles like a real sports car just to be
clear he didn't say the word trash no he didn't at all but I mean his point his point was he has
he has no need for torsion bars and he likes that multilingual suspension um well Nathan let
let me get your take on the 993 yeah so I have an entry I should have a video out you can you
can find it online it's me my speed yellow 993 next to my speed yellow dot one 996 air kit car
recommend watching that it got a lot of flak and I basically lay out in that video that I probably
drive my 996 20 times for every time I drive my 993 I think the 993 is a is a beautiful car it's a
seminal work for Porsche I used to love it more than I love it now my issue with it is I call it
five degrees right of center it's actually too good to be an air cooled 911 and not good enough to
be a water cooled 911 and so if I could only have one it might be a good choice for someone
but I just find that when the mood strikes to drive a classic Porsche I'm going to grab
one of my 964s or one of my early cars and if I want a little bit more capability but
still raw I'm going to draw my 996 and so I just rarely choose the 993 um it's a the build quality
is much better than my 996 it's a much more valuable car but just which one I feel better
getting out of 996 I hate to say it all right that's a good place to take a break here I want to come
back and um talk about the valuation of these vehicles I think then and now it's going to be
interesting I mean then they were affordable and you won't believe it now um you can't afford one
so you also won't believe how exactly it's unbelievable we'll be right back with Nathan
Merz and Magnus Walker this is hot pursuit support for the show comes from public on public you can
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disclosures available at public.com slash disclosures welcome back this has been I feel
like it's been enlightening but I also don't know if we're convincing Matt every I feel like all of
us are are are trying to convince you Matt you can lead a whole story yeah but you can't make him
drink but let's talk about the values here for a second because one of your big criteria Matt is
something that you can afford which for Porsche used to be a big part of the appeal but that has
really changed I'm curious Nathan specifically where do you see any opportunities to come into
the Porsche family for something with something affordable that might gain value I mean does that
even exist anymore that's a tough question particularly because we decided this topic was
going to be exclusive to the 9-11 so oftentimes I make recommendations outside the 9-11 family
but if we're going to stick to the 9-11 family or topic I certainly think that there's cars that
are going to still have opportunity to gain value and I think there are actually cars I think that
are newly of value because of market demographic shift and so I still believe in my heart that
996 cars are a good value I think that particularly like 996 Turbo and 6 GT3 even though the
affordable per se they're still within a reasonable number for enthusiasts who's committed to the cause
what about the older cars Nathan I mean like my problem is I can if I look at 996 or I look
at 997 you can get a great one for 50 or 60 but if I look at I say okay I want a Carrera 3.2
with a G50 or I want a 964 and in that case I'd be willing to take a cab relay because I feel
like it's stiff enough already we should talk about that also but those are only those are those are
already a hundred thousand like if you want to have a nice driver example or am I wrong
yeah no you're not wrong and that's actually one of the challenges I tell people like Magnus
I'm not a wealthy guy I feel so oh my gosh you have all these cars and I said no I bought them
when they were inexpensive or if I bought them recently I have Magnus and I used the same
accounting method in our brain which is well I may have paid this for the car today but I sold
a car I only paid 20 grand for so essentially I paid 20 grand I know that's bad math but that's
how my brain works whereas a lot of my cars today I wouldn't go out and rebuy that car for its current
market value and that's how I feel for example like a decent quality G53 2 coupe if you call that
100k do in my heart do I think that car delivers a hundred thousand dollars worth of joy and ownership
experience no that kills me to say it but I don't think so I mean for that scenario here's what I
would do you got a hundred grand to spend and I'm going to be the the Mustang that doesn't follow
the rules here because I know we're talking about 9-11 I mean go buy a 9-6-8 go buy a 9-2-8 you know
there's plenty of value there outside of the 9-11 world I mean for me I've actually never
owned a 3-2 Carrera it's another G-Buddy car that I've never owned you know I've driven a lot of
G-Buddy cars you know G-Buddy cars came out in 74 and they went all the way up to 89 when the 9-6-4
replaced it for me the sweet spot really is a 3-liter SC over a 3-2 Carrera and I also don't
buy into this 3-2 Carrera it's got to have a G-50 transmission I really really like the 9-15
so my brother says too have I mentioned my brother-in-law he likes it he likes it what I do
he sounds like the smart one I think these people are getting hung up on G-53 2s that are
same people that are worried about IMS but you're right he has he has uh 19 I think it's a 1982
3-liter SC yeah and he I mean he loves it he loves it right we're talking about Luis we're
on some text to it yes hello hello he's he's a smart one to me the 3-liter SC which debuted in
78 you know it's the same case as a 3-liter turbo you know they just seem more throttle responsive
they seem a little snappier you know I'm just more in connect a little rower you know but these are
the cars that were affordable that were you know I guess it's irrelevant to say they're all affordable
back then but it comes back to this does a 3-2 Carrera with its irrelevant and painful painful
when you say how grams worth of value no not from a driving experience at all I have to say a 9
928 or a 968 or whatever to me that doesn't work because I want the engine to be behind me
so and I know Nathan I've seen some videos where where you say um like look at a Cayman
or a Boxster which makes more sense to me because then you have the mid-engine feel
and it makes sense but I still want to be able to put my kids in the back so that's just also
like my my only option really is is a 911 I think um I think I I think I would would prefer to
go with something that I'm not going to have to work on too much that I know you're I know
it's an old car but I feel like mechanical simplicity is is is probably a really important
part of the decision and I guess in that case the older G body cars make more sense than maybe a
964 right I mean to me they represent a better event are you I'm with Magnus I'm a 915 fan so
my only pivot and I own SC's as well I've got an video you can watch about the SC but
I like the 8040 8632 because what they do offer is they're still 915 a little bit lighter they
sell at a discount versus the G50 cars but you get the Motronic motor which Magnus is blessed
he's in LA I'm blessed I'm in Seattle we have great independent forces support but for large
swaths of the country they don't have great support and so CIS is a really good robust fuel
injection system but it's mechanical and so you still have to have you know an old guy with
knurled hands and probably has a German accent to work on it we should talk about convertibles
for a second because Matt I feel like sometimes Matt goes he'll like send me pictures of you
know speedster america type 911's and I know there's something in you that really wants a
convertible Matt well I also know the like let's hear about the value proposition of a convertible
versus a coupe and just just get a soft window toggle that's a real flex 67 soft window toggle
912 and does that even work in seattle I mean Magnus always tells me uh well Magnus obviously
um ridicules convertibles and my brother also says no get a coupe and I know that would be
we gotta get your brother on the podcast I know that would be a purist idea but you know what my
when I the Porsche in my neighborhood when I was growing up there was a doctor who had a convertible
Carrera 3 2 with the whale tail I don't necessarily need that part but I wouldn't be wrong you know
it's a mystic pizza it's a mystic pizza part it's in my head and also like I would be using this
car as a weekend car right driving it around with the kids in the back for ice cream like the top
down is fun and I and they're more affordable right Nathan yeah I mean the cabriolet I mean
essentially because people a little bit like Magnus and I we shun the convertible as an
impure expression of form that was not really fair it's still a wonderful car and as a result
the values are absolutely I mean it depends on the generation but for example you know
in a 3 2 generation the cabriolet itself are literally half the price of a similar quality
coupe there so it is a little bit compelling and even me who um although I will tell you Matt like
even me like I own these cars every so often I get the handkerchief I'll like I'll go you know
off the plotted chart and then I drive one and I think it's a good car it just isn't the car
I'm seeing Matt Miller in a in a like 86 red slant nose convertible yes you know taking the
kids to get ice cream this is your best life red slant nose 930 convertible no slant nose for me
remember I need those gun rails dude I need the that's why I like the America Roadster to me that
would be really great America Roadster I just like it because it's got the wider rear end and you
know the springs very bad boys um Nathan I wanted to ask about uh Columbia Valley luxury cars and
this is your your dealership right your shop and because I wonder how you would recommend somebody
and maybe not specifically about your shop but how would you recommend to somebody to go about buying
finding and buying a 911 like should I be on bring a trailer all day should I go on car gurus
should I find someone like you that because I don't know how much inventory you have it seems
to me like you walk people through it you find them a car and then and also who do you know how
how do you know who to trust yeah I think it's a good because there are a lot of shady people out
there oh those are those are million dollar questions and I try to help people with this all
the time to the best of my ability I do have a consulting model so people would call in and
you know buy my time and help me oh help them walk them through the market but yeah unfortunately the
market is very frustrating it used to be it was just sort of a you knew people and it was an
enthusiast network and you bought cars because you both shared the love and the passion and
you know cars really didn't have significant value so it was just fun and easy and now because
the cars are sort of a hot commodity in the car market and even take bring a trailer as an example
something like 30 somewhat percent of their cars on that platform Porsche well clearly Porsche isn't
30 percent of the collector car market but you would think it is it just happens to be the hottest
zip code in the Porsche or in the car real estate right now and so when that happens you get a lot
of you know so-called experts you know whether they want to be influencers or whether they're
trying to sell you something you know trying to tell people what they should or shouldn't do or
which cars are good and I always tell people first and foremost buy what you love you know it's
extravagance no matter what you spend it's an extravagance to have a car that's not as functional
as a modern car so when you walk out to your garage or to your car you should you should have a little
tickle like you're 10 years old and it's Christmas morning if you don't have that sense you probably
bought the wrong car I think you should also you know go into it with the thought of what your use
case is going to be and everyone's use case is different and I don't judge you know there's a
lot of judgment in the Porsche world you know some some people love to race their cars some people
like to work on their cars some people like to show their cars some of them like to never use them
and just have them in their garage and all those use cases are just fine with me but understand
what your use case is going to be so in your case you have this vision I want to take my kids out of
my car that's a different use case than you know I don't have kids at home anymore so that's not my
use case and so there's that in terms of who to trust very very few people you know in this world
sadly that kind of kills me to say that but I also think in some ways it's somewhat unfair I've
actually recently had to go to a disclaimer on bring a trailer where I basically tell people
hey yes I'm well known in the Porsche space yes I operate from a place of integrity
but I'm still selling a 40 year old or 20 year old or whatever German car that is going to break
you know is going to you know like Magnus is saying he's got a flat tire somewhere and the car has
got to be flat bedded that's kind of part of the experience and so it's a long-winded answer and I
don't know if I gave you good information no you did it's very sensible honestly I mean look
there's just no easy answer I didn't expect you to say like oh go to P car market and then you'll be
fine you know or I guess obviously if I'm willing to pay for your time you're going to help me to
the best of your ability or I mean Magnus what do you do it seems like you you just have cars
fall into your lap all the time I'm the complete opposite I'm the guy that's owned a lot of vehicles
you know I take a leap of faith how bad can it be I've only once ever did I get a PPI done on a car
that happened to be a 1975 right-hand drive 930 turbo that was in Australia so you know
you had it Borsko seemed like you know it's on the other side of the world maybe I should have
someone look at it before I blindly just say yeah I'll buy it because generally that's how I jump
into things it's a very emotional connection that starts with the thrill of the chase that's it
it's raw emotion it's waking up at three in the morning just obsessing over it have to have it
and then once I've decided it's then you know work the deal and then as quickly as I can get the
seller paid before he changes his mind with seller remorse I'm wiring him the money that same day
and you know it's a lesson in patients time kills the deal I've acquired a lot of rare cars
a 64 9 11 was the deal I put together over six nine months Porsche only made 232 of those so
I take a leap of faith I just dive in I don't ask anyone's opinions I'm not I don't spend any time
on the internet looking up videos I've kind of stopped making my own videos it's irrelevant to me
I don't need no distraction no one else's negative frequency or opinion it's irrelevant
and I've always been that way I just if it if it makes my heart sort of miss a beat and I'm that
10 year old kid that wrote the letter to Porsche and this is a familiar story Porsche's always making
this same promotional video with the 10 year old kid at school and watches the 9 11 go buy and
gets on his bicycle and goes down on the dealership and meets the dealer and the dealer gives him a
business card and I'll be back in 20 years scenario Porsche's been making that commercial
for a long long time because it's reality these dreams start at an early age everyone falls in
love with a car at an early age so for me it's purely emotional well you know I'm not looking
at spreadsheets and getting opinions and figuring stuff out but you also do your research obviously
you're not you I used to I don't think I do anymore because you now have life experience
it's like I did zero research when I bought the 991 turbo s it was zero it wasn't even on my radar
it wasn't even something I wanted the cars are big and bulkier and you know you're parking an
early car next to it and it was just maybe I'm getting old and I think that could be the case
dude yeah I'm pushing 60 I'm okay with it I have spreadsheets and I've got like two different chat
GPT accounts that you're very analytical I'm the complete I've seen all of your videos Magnus
and I'm watching all of Nathan's now so I still do I for me watching the videos is a part of the
whole experience like that's that's part of what I want to be doing I want to be spending an hour
a day on bring a trailer double checking P car market and and looking at elfer spot and all this
stuff but um listen I really appreciate your time and I probably will just call up Columbia Valley
luxury cars and have them help me out because why don't you go buy one and drive it down to LA
just go buy a nine nine scope go buy a nine nine six and be done with it because all of these
talking about it you could be driving it this weekend all right well I I will I will try and
you know uh I will try nine six try and and and and do it and do it soon and I'll do it uh
um with with you guys because you're people that I actually let me just say before we wrap
but I know we're going to wrap but we're we're telling you to buy a nine nine six but we're
also all telling you don't listen to anybody else yeah and everyone definitely not going to buy
a nine nine six and and Magnus have said don't listen to anyone don't even listen to us yeah
don't listen it's gotta make you happy I think if I'm going to spend a hundred grand because I really
do want to see those gun rails I really do want like a the original body shape I'm gonna have to
do it with someone like Nathan who I feel like I can trust we can trust him or uh hopefully one
falls into Magnus's lap and he passes it on to me but dude I really appreciate your time Nathan thank
you so much uh for joining us Magnus you as well and Hannah it's always well yeah to spend the time
with you it's been emotional thank you thank you so much thank you very much I just want to give a
shout out to Dennis because he actually messaged me last night and was saying uh he listened to
podcast on his drive home and he wrote in earlier about his nine nine seven point two manual c4s
purchased last year it's his forever car oh he loves it yeah and uh he he he linked to one of
Nathan's videos so I was even better this is like wow small world he got that last night
serendipity yeah totally the universe um we don't uh I guess we could wrap this up completely but
yes you're in Vegas and you're headed back and do you have anything cool coming up so I I left
Vegas last night actually I was at this my first CES um ever which was how hellish was it it wasn't
as bad as everyone said honestly it it honestly because it was shiny and new it was not bad I
really just focused on car stuff I know you can walk the floor and see endless robots for everything
but um beetles it wasn't that bad what is a veto vertical takeoff and landing you I don't okay so
there's that I also learned a new term fud do you know what fud means that's a Trumpy thing right
I don't know if it's Trumpy um someone in a meeting I was in what kept saying it so I had to look it up
it means uncertainty and doubt anyway um it was really interesting and coming up let's see
oh you know what next week I'm gonna be in New York sweet yeah so I'll see you live and in person
we have our annual edit meeting where we plan on as much as I can you know that I'll be here
most of the week but I'm going to Motor City on Thursday oh Detroit oh oh for Ford I'm gonna
hang out with you Barley oh that's great that's really great and uh I'm gonna hang out with Max
Frisch Dappen from uh Red Bull yes I will be interviewing Ford F1 announcement yes I will
be interviewing those dudes but you know what I'm most excited about most of all what Dax Shepard
is gonna be there oh Magnus have you seen hit and run have you seen the movie hit and run no we've
got to put it on the list I think dude it is such a good movie Dax wrote and directed it
Kristen Bell stars in it with him and it's a car dude and do that movie like he has his old Lincoln
Continental which is actually his uh he has um uh a Cadillac uh CTSV wagon with a stick that Bradley
Cooper drives Bradley Cooper and oh boy this is the link you the clip you sent me a clip from it
um there's a Corvette in it there's like a Pontiac Solstice this is what we're watching tonight
it's so good so so good I highly recommend it so I'm hoping that I can convince Dax Shepard to
join us on this podcast please do that does it for this week show remember to follow and subscribe
to the Hot Pursuit podcast on Apple Spotify and anywhere else you listen you can also send us
your comments and we do read them and really appreciate the comments and the pictures and
the links to things you've seen also shout out to my sister who sent us a link with some very cool
vintage uh car clothing email us at hot pursuit at bloomberg.net check out Hannah's columns as
well and stories on bloomberg.com and on the bloomberg business app go there for car reviews
events and stories that you won't find anywhere else find it at bloomberg.com
slash pursuits slash autos I'm Matt and I'm Hannah Elliott we'll be back in your podcast feed again
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About this episode
A deep dive into the world of Porsche, featuring enthusiasts Magnus Walker and Nathan Mertz, who share their expertise on classic and modern models. The discussion covers the merits of air-cooled versus water-cooled Porsches, favorite models, and the evolving market values of these iconic cars. Listeners gain insights on buying advice, including the appeal of the 996 and 997 generations, and the importance of personal connection to a vehicle. The episode balances technical knowledge with personal anecdotes, making it a rich resource for anyone considering a Porsche purchase.
The listeners have asked and we have answered. This week we give you our special episode on All Things Porsche. Matt and Hannah are joined by Porsche enthusiasts and experts Magnus Walker and Nathan Merz for our roundtable discussion.
