The All Porsche Episode: Our Favorites, Best Buys and More

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I'm Hannah Elliott and I'm Matt Miller. This is Hot Pursuit.

Coming up today, it is a special episode that we have been teasing for weeks.

We've heard you. We have heard. We've got the emails. Everyone agrees. We need to do a very

special, Porsche special, and we have, I think, two of the best guests we could possibly have found.

Yeah, we have someone who's close to me, Magnus Walker. I happen to be married to him.

That's the disclaimer. I happen to be a lifelong fan, well, at least for over a decade, been

watching Magnus's content and listening to what he says. I have recently discovered a Porsche expert,

Nathan Mertz, who owns a dealership and is also the chair of appraisals. Is that right?

Appraisal chair at the Porsche Club of America? That's fairly close. Valuations and appraisals,

absolutely. Valuations and appraisals. Nathan Mertz, a lot of people, you are going to know him

from YouTube, and Magnus Walker. We talk about you, Magnus, every day, probably.

Much appreciated. Or every week that we record this. What I wanted to do, and Hannah, you tell

me what you wanted to do also, but what I wanted to do is just get the take of these two guys who

know Porsche 911s inside and out and have been buying and selling and working on and modifying

and driving, most importantly, these cars for decades. I wanted to get their take on whether

or not I should buy a classic air-cooled Porsche, if so, which one, or if I should just get one of

the new ones, try and find it with three pedals, obviously. What was your thought?

My thought was, finally, we can get to the bottom of this, because we've all been listening to you,

Matt, go on and on and on about 997.1 versus .2. Finally, we can have some clarity. I think

with this panel of guests, we might get a bit of a point counterpoint, because it seems like

from what you've told me about Nathan, he comes from, and Nathan, obviously, you can speak for

yourself, but might come from a different side of the spectrum in the Porsche world. I'm very

curious to hear voices from all sides, shall we say, to help Matt, really, in your quest.

It'll be interesting to see which side of the spectrums they come from. I don't know how that's

going to work out, but Magnus, not everyone, I think everyone knows who you are and what you do

and how you've become you, but I could be wrong. Do you have a short little origin story?

Sure. I got short versions. Short version, I'm just a man with a beard. I'm a Porsche enthusiast.

I'm not a specialist at all. I like to drive. I like to build. I like to collect. I like variety

of cars. I fell in love with Porsche when I was 10 years old and that was back in the 70s and wrote

a letter to Porsche and said, I want to design cars for them. They wrote me a letter back and here I

am almost 50 years later, still in love with the brand Porsche and the Porsche experience and cars

in general and the whole community. I joke that we all speak Porsche. It is a language that brings

like-minded car enthusiasts together and that's what I'm passionate about, really.

I feel like you guys are actually on the same side of the street here except for Nathan.

By the way, can you tell us, Nathan, your origin story because you have been trading

Porsches I gather for a long time and you, I think, own a dealership plus you do these YouTube

like Porsche expertise videos. How do you get into it and what's your deal?

Yeah, I mean, probably like a lot of car people. I just popped out just with a passion for cars

for whatever reason. I kind of joke that it was probably a good thing. They didn't have a

Osburger's diagnosis when I was a kid in the 70s because I was that kid who was just super obsessed

with Porsche and I was the little kid who just wanted to talk to anyone who had a car and I

could tell them every detail about their car. I read every magazine and I can get my hands on

every book. I can get my hands on and just was always around cars. Cars were kind of my thing

and so I bought my first Volkswagen when I was 13 years old and kind of figured out how to work on

that, how to make money selling that. I used to basically buy them out of the classifies out of

the newspaper back when people would try to get an inexpensive car so you used to have to buy it

by the word. Matt, I don't know if you're old enough to remember that but you have to buy

a classified ad by the amount of words there. Sadly, I'm old enough, yes.

Okay, so people would have something like, you know, it would be like 1967 Volkswagen runs

and a phone number and I would think, well, that's no way to sell something and so

the 13-year-old me would take my paper route money and I convinced my mom or dad to take me

out there and I'd buy this old Volkswagen for $300, $400 drag at home, figure out how to make it run

and then my first business investment was a Polaroid camera and I would take my little Polaroid

camera and I would get a front three-quarter view with the wheel turned and I would write my 50 words

of ad copy in the old AutoTrader magazine and I would take my $300 Volkswagen and I'd write some,

you know, Robo's ad copy and get someone to pay me $2,500 for said car and so I did that all through

13, 14, 15 years old, translated that into a job eventually at a Porsche dealer when I got my driver's

license and then bought my first 911 which was a 75, I think Magnus can identify with this story,

mine was not a great car, it was a base 911 which they didn't even have in the US and I was a rest

of world originally a German market or derogatory at that time called a gray market car so it was a

75 base 911 with rusty doors and broken head studs and I bought that car for $6,500 and I'm not the

world's best mechanic but I was broke and so I translated what I thought I knew about working

on Volkswagen to working on Porsches and of course I had a job at a Porsche dealership and so I got

to do a little bit of time with some of the old guard there and learning how to work on the cars

and I've had Porsches in my life ever since so that's kind of my where I come from I guess.

Nathan I know that you sometimes focus on making sure everything is like period correct and I guess

with appraisals and valuations that's part of it right so whereas I think of Magnus as an outlaw

I guess you would be like the inlaw, the inlaw. Well I was going to say the cops.

Everyone's got an inner outlaw let's put it that way. How do you think of it Nathan?

You know actually what's interesting is one of the things I actually somewhat hate is the fact

with my title a lot of people think that first and foremost all I care about is the values of the

cars. I'm an expert on the values but I could care less about the values, as little sense as that

makes and the same thing with my content I'll make a video showing what the cars once were because I

want to give someone a reference standard that's not to state that that's necessarily what I think

they should own nor do I necessarily think or is that necessarily what's in my own garage. So if you

come to my own garage I do have some reference standard cars but I also own many cars that are

100% built and used and driven to my taste regardless of whether someone else wants that.

So that's the hard part with making content around what's correct as people assume I'm making a value

judgment that they should have that. It's basically just telling what it once was as a reference.

That makes a lot of sense. So I think we've got some topics that we want to discuss and

Matt is the first one we just want to ask each of you guys what your favorite Porsche is or what

you think the best Porsche is if you're just going to have one. Matt maybe you want to say that slightly.

No I agree like just give us like if there's one that you're going to have and I want I want to

avoid like if we're sticking in the 911 realm and I know that obviously I think Magnus you had

it you know some dodge muscle cars when you started getting into four wheels and Nathan I know you have

like I think you have like a 928 or maybe a few of those and other cars I want to keep this inside

911 but otherwise I don't care. So and I know that you probably will love all your children equally

but like if you had a Desert Island 911 if you could pick Nathan we'll start with you one generation

that you if it was the only one you could have is there a choice.

Absolutely there is so you know so no one gives me hate I do have at least one of every generation

of 911 built with that said yeah if I could only have one my my primary love I like the 1970 and

71 cars those are kind of my peak cars in fact I have a video out there called driving

early 911s I think and there's a white kind of a hot rod 71T in that video I've owned that car for

many many years if I could only have one car that's the car that's staying in my garage.

What about you Magnus? Well how big is the Desert Island where is it is it flat is it

hilly you know can you get off it or are you stuck on it I mean it's there is no for me one car

fits all you know there is no best of for me it's like stepping back in time you know we all know

the 911 debuted in 64 you know it's been around over 60 years it's eight generations of it they

all do the same thing differently ironically the car that when I get asked this question not so much

what's the best but which one am I keeping out of my garage it's always car number 277 which

ironically is a 1971 911T that's very weird modified so that is the keeper car but that's not

necessarily the most practical car or the best car but you both pick the same one and the same year

well yeah 277 is a special car for me I acquired that at the Pomona Swamp meet in 1999 so that car

now is 55 years old and by my math I've owned it 27 almost 28 years so I've owned it for over half

its life and that's the one I'm most sort of connected to it's the favorite pair of old shoes

broken in jeans it's got character sole patina and everything that I love about vintage cars not

just vintage Porsches but that's not the car Hannah and I drove from LA to Denver in a day and did

that 1,050 mile journey through five states and you know over the Rockies at 10,000 feet in snow

the day after Christmas you know the 71T just doesn't work in that environment you know first of all

that car there's no heat in it the wipers don't work the defrost doesn't work so for me it's a tough

question because like I say it depends where the desert island is so well but what you're saying

is the car that we drove was a 991.1 is that what you're trying to say that's not what I'm trying

to say you know the daily driver for me like today we drove a vintage Rolls Royce and we drove the

vintage Rolls Royce because the daily driver for me in the Porsche world is a 991.1 Turbo S it

currently has 203 200 and 300,000 miles it rolled over 200,000 miles a couple of months ago I get

in it today and this annoying you know engine coolant light comes on you know engine running

excessive we're in the car and I just started it out so you know I do talk about the 991.1 Turbo

S is the swiss army knife of 9-11 but I'll tell you and that is the car that I daily and it's never

parked in a garage it's parked outside I'm the second owner I ramble on it all about that car

all the time rhodium silver metallic red interior 2014 launch color you couldn't get a really a

more practical badass swiss army knife 9-11 used car than that that I bought for pennies on the

dollar only two pedals though dude only two pedals yeah I mean there's super annoying things with

it when I first got it that was it it's the only I've probably owned a hundred nine eleven it's

not just Porsches you know I own other Porsches front engine mid engine rear engine air and

water cooled but yeah two-pedal and I'm like wow you know I wasn't even looking for that car I was

looking for a 997 turbo because you know I'd never owned one and I've actually never owned a 997

but yeah two-pedal car which I thought oh I'm gonna miss shifting gears but I don't but the other

really annoying thing about that car is sent a lot wheels completely impractical I've probably had

at least five flats or punches in the three four years of ownership you know it's hard to get those

wheels off on the side of the road it's hard to get back on no one has a correct torque wrench

you have to get the car you have it's just a pain in the neck it left me stranded in the middle of

nowhere one so nothing's nothing's perfect and what I've realized is nothing needs to be perfect

that 991.1 turbo s like I say it's never parked in a garage it's parked outside it's been dinged on

the side of the road I don't worry about it I don't even lock it I let valley parkers park it

it's the only car I'll let a valley parker get in and drive and park because for me it's an appliance

it's a very very efficient appliance it's as quick as a gt3 on any spirited mountain road

if you're stuck in bumper to bumper traffic doing a 10 mile an hour commute it's it's not

it's practical you don't have to worry about gears and stuff radios on everything works in it

so it is the swiss army knife in 911s but that's not the one that I'm really right it's tools for

the job I mean yeah horses for course I've asked I mean I've asked you in the past you know what

what you want if you could only have one and you say like if it's a thousand miles we'll take

that turbo s if it's 100 then any pre 1974 I have the evidence here but I want to ask

about the t spec and Nathan you know last episode that we did we were talking about my car of the

year I love the new Carrera t because I think it's so perfect but it's not basic it's got

you know rear wheel steering and it's uh it's it's the only one that comes with a stick that's

not a gt car nowadays what was the t spec back in you know the 1971 year that you and Magnus both

prize so in that era portion basically had three trim levels for the car the t was their entry level

car the e was sort of the one in the middle and the s was their highest performance model outside

of the rs although it's kind of laughable now because of course by today's standards all those

cars are very very simple so I think in today's world to me why you want to buy a t is frankly

you're not paying the collector premium particularly of an s and for a car you're going to use drive

and you know like the the t that I have is is heavily modified it was built the way I wanted

a car to be and when I started with a car it wasn't a particularly valuable car to start with and so

I don't have a lot of concerns about the car like I've driven that car across the us and back

um I wouldn't necessarily do that in the same way with a you know 71 s so I think that's probably

the big thing um it's just it's a car I can use much like Magnus talked about with his 991 turbo s

it's a great appliance for for a given use case but what is the you both mentioned modifications

Magnus yours is modified and you Nathan called yours a hot rod right what what do you do do you

do you change out the torsion bars put on shocks um did you modify the engine what are what are the

modifications that people or that you like to do that other people like to do with these

cars to make them more drivable today it comes down to use case I think I mean that's what I

look at so I have four early cars in my collection all of which have a different use case or your

on rust so I have a car that's you know in all original what's called 73 naps CIS T so it's

sort of a cruiser um I do have a car with a 2.8 liter twin plug MFI kind of mega motor that's

real high strong and kind of like a kid with 80 hd and then I've got a car with a 27 rs spec motor

and then this driver I have it has a fairly stock uh 3.2 liter uh essentially for a 3 2 motor in it

and the reason I like that is it's plug and play it's got motronic fuel injection so when I'm in

the middle of Kansas the car is not likely to suffer from bad fuel or elevation or anything

like that I can find parts in my local Napa so it makes it a really easy car to live with but

doesn't necessarily have the character of like my higher revving MFI car would have or so so

Magnus what about you well for me the great thing about early Porsches is there are easy to

modify you know people have been modifying Porsches since James Dean in the 50s and you

know all the way through so modifying Porsches is nothing new you know when the T came out in 1970

as the entry level as Nathan stated you know at a 2.2 liter model a motor with 130 horsepower

and the great thing about these cars is you can quite easily make them handle better stop shorter

go faster it's plug and play there's four bolts that hold that motor and transmission in and

as Nathan said you know he's got a 270 he's got a 2.8 twin plug which is a great MFI motor and

he's got his 3.2 so you know it's easy to modify these cars to your own aesthetic taste and use

code like Nathan said for me with my 71 T when I bought at the Pomona Swampmeat ironically it had a

2.7 in it but a CIS motor and I just made it look like a 73 RS it was pretty easy change the front

and rear bumpers put a duck tail on it and get some RS flares welded on and you got to remember

back in the 90s you could pick these cars up all day long for five grand six grand you know under

10 grand 20 grand bought you a three-liter turbo you know it wasn't super duper valuable at one time

I had five 67 S's for example 67 was the first year the S motor came out two liter 160 horsepower

but back then these were just old cars you know I bought an S for 9500 bucks so you know when the

motor would get tired and someone would say well it's going to cost five grand in six months to

rebuild that two liter 30 years ago or I can put that 2.2 T motor in the corner in for 1500 bucks

and you can have it on the road in two weeks time these things were just another used car they

hadn't reached this iconic status like Lamborghinis and Friars and Aston's and other European sports

cars of that era and I always used to say the great thing about Porsches is they were built to be

driven and that's what separated early 911s from other European cars of that vintage i.e. Friars

and Aston's and Lambo's but that's also what kept Porsches affordable at this entry level price

point which was relatable where I bought a lot of cars for four grand five grand six grand you

couldn't do that with Friars and stuff but today unfortunately what I see is people don't want to

devalue quote-unquote the 911s by putting mileage on them you know it's more of my pet peeve flex at

a cars and coffee with your super rare paint to sample deviated stitching I don't want to devalue

and it's become this I guess investment when people say to me hey what's the you know it's the first

time Porsche only syndrome looking by a car what's the best investment I go well unless you're

investing in smiles per mile and memorable moments I cannot answer this question for you

because I've never bought a car as investment I've been fortunate that I acquired things I

wanted to experience before they became trendy valuable and doubled and tripled and you know

20 grand turbos became 200 grand turbos I'm not buying them today but what I see today is things

like STs right 992 STs that came out with a sticker price of call it $290,000 two years ago

and for some reason people are asking six seven hundred thousand dollars for these cars that

aren't even rare aren't even limited I mean has no reference to the original ST which was a 70 71 72

never official model sort of ordered from the skunk works parts been of the Porsche sports

purpose race treatable car and it's a completely different it's a completely different topic

actually yeah because like when I'm going through bring a trailer I'm looking at everything that's

like the air cooled cars and the 997s and even some of the 991s but I don't even bother if it's

a GT3 or an ST or um a Dakar like I don't even look I don't certainly don't click the star

icon because it's a different class of people and let's take a pause and that can be our next

topic yeah let's let's break because I'm getting the producer saying I was just getting started on

the slippery slope of Porsche run put a pin in that because I think actually Nathan probably

will have some interesting insights too about how prices have changed and and I know our listeners

want to hear about also the investment side of it so let's go to a break and then next up

we'll talk about that this is hot pursuit support for the show comes from public on public you can

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Nathan I know you walk people you know clients through all different levels of you know budget

but I've noticed when I look across the spectrum of what's available if I want a good driver that

I don't need to instantly do you know 20 or $30,000 worth of work on the 997 is my best entry point

and as long as there's no IMS or bore scoring problems at least as far as I've read on the

internet it seems like the 997.1 is the best deal what do you think about that?

Oh best deal let's say most affordable I would actually I'm gonna push back and go 996 if we're

gonna go most affordable bingo first water maybe the 997 might be a sweet spot how about that good

why do you say that Nathan tell us tell us more about your sweet spot yeah let's hit the sweet

spot yeah so I mean a couple things you know so then I'm a big fan of the 996 I like I like

early 996's I believe Magnus had an arrow kid early 996 I do as well I really enjoy that car

and you know I like the purity of that originalism and I like the controversy around it I like the

fact that it feels a little bit more akin to my early experience a little bit getting giving a

finger to the Porsche Peris if you will and since the 996 and 997 are built on the same platform

from a driving experience standpoint they're going to deliver a very very similar feel so

predominantly what you're getting with the 997 is a different aesthetic in terms of exterior and

interior and if call me crazy when the 997 debuted in 2005 I omit I was a 993 owner at the time I

thought oh of course I got this right and I was very very excited about the car now in 2026 when

I look back I actually think the 996 is aging better I think the design language of the 996

is actually more pure to the original 64 911 you know it's unadorned it's slabs sided

whereas the 997 is a little bit plays in my mind a little bit like when Volkswagen

released the new Beetle in 98 like they were so desperate because it's painful they drew inspiration

from the past so probably an offensive 997 owners there and I own a 997 so it's not that I'm a

hater I just I don't think they're worth the premium in the market versus a 996 for an entry level

buyer I just wouldn't be able to put up with the headlight I can't listen there's so much plastic

on the front of that car because the headlights are like the size of Texas each one it's two

texas is right on the hood and I just there's too much here you go we all like fried eggs right you

know whether you take them over easy you take them scrambled I mean the 996 was my first water

cooled 911 and I bought a 2004 996 GT3 10 years ago in 2016 I was late to the water cooled party

I didn't really care too much about being in the GT3 owners club but this kind of fell into my lap

it was close to my buddy's sharp works up in San Jose and that was when I joked about my garage

got its first water leak there was a leak in the roof and water came into the garage and it came in

in a format of a 996.2 GT3 which to me is a special special car and if you really want a really

really special GT3 it's a 996.2 GT3 RS or a 996.1 GT3 which unfortunately the US market never got

and probably five years ago I was chasing a .1 GT3 in Europe where they were super affordable

Canada I was trying to sneak one in through you know South America and bring it in through the DR

and I really really really wanted a .1 because for me I like the beginning of everything like I

owned a 64 911 I had to have it was a Bertha 911 I had to have a 75 turbo which Porsche only made

284 of them I ended up with two of them left hand drive right hand drive so I like the beginning

of every generation and without a question of a doubt I I'm so bored to death with people talking

about fried egg likes and boar score and an IMS bearings and I don't care about any of that stuff

when you're driving a 996 you don't see the headlights first of all that's by the way can I just say

that's one of my problems with it because I want to have that gunrail fender I want to be able to

see the two wings at the end of the hood and if I'm not mistaken the 996 was the first time you

no longer could although I don't like how the 993 makes them a little bit too I want them to be

proud you know well it's interesting because I owned a gen one and gen two that was how I ended

up in that aero kit car was I couldn't find a gen one GT3 so I ended up with a aero kit car

C2 and then a GT2 and a GT3 and when you park gen one gen two next to each other and just look at

the headlights gen one headlights now 25 plus years later look better than gen two headlights

and no one ever mentions that headlight when it's on a GT1 right the holy grail car no one ever talks

about the ugly headlight from a 996 if it's on a a GT1 so for me the 996 still is affordable

entry level well that was my question five years ago are they affordable actually they're obtainable

yes what price are we talking well Nathan's right here I think 30 grand get you into you can get one

for 30 grand you get one in the 20s what do you think Nathan yeah I mean probably for a coupe you're

gonna want to budget you know on the low side 30 I mean you can get them cheap you know 40 is

going to get you an amazing car 25 edgy so if it starts with a three it's probably a decent car

in a in a coupe format I still I can't deal with like the hazing like the hazing of the headlights

that are that old because there's so much plastic I just I guess you're worrying about the wrong

thing here yeah what you really needed to get was a 996 turbo five years ago when these were in

in the 30s that was the deal nobody seemed to realize you got one but I still won't drive it

even if Ted does you know even if he has it shipped to Stodd or wherever he lives you know

996 turbo to me is is is the car I mean I've got the GT2 version two-wheel drive I also don't need

any GTs I just need a Carrera S frankly well that's all you need I also I always like the end of

something because that means the engineers have worked every single work and kink out of it so

like that's why I feel like 997.2 is probably the best I mean affordable car out there for someone

like me who doesn't want to spend a hundred grand like I could get one still for in the

Nathan correct me if I'm wrong 80s or 90s plus it's got the 981 motor so it's going to last forever

and even if Magnus doesn't care about bore scoring and doing IMS work I don't want to drop that money

at demand here in New Jersey even if I could have my engine board out to four liters you'll be driving

your pickup truck in your Harley anyway so it won't matter what do you think about that whole

what do you think about the whole issue with the mechanical problems Nathan you know I think the

reality is if you're if mechanical concern I always tell people you know what's your what's

your tolerance for risk and that's one of the leading questions I'll give someone because

their tolerance of risk will guide where I direct them and so someone who has a zero or a near zero

tolerance for risk I just advise them this is not the brand for them you know if you're a zero

tolerance for risk person they make something called a Toyota a fabulous product right doesn't

have a passion of Porsche but it has zero risk profile and so every Porsche you buy is going to

have some some risk some generations more so than others but I think it's a little bit foolish when

people say well I'm going to buy for example a 997.2 because I have low tolerance for risk

and I say well first off don't let anybody tell you otherwise 981 motors can bore score so throw

that out the window yes they don't have IMS failure but certainly they have other things that crop up

and at the end of the day the newest 997 second generation is now a 15 year old European car

so let's not kid ourselves that it's going to be a low risk proposition so whichever car you

enter into you know drives love and experience it and part of the experience is one day it's

going to piss you off and cost you money I I mean I got to push back against that a little bit

because I had my 991 for 10 years and it has never had any kind of mechanical problem like

the only thing I've ever had it in the shop for is oil changes and the tires and it just has been

the most unbreakable vehicle I've ever owned including you know Ford trucks and Mercedes

bends you know I mean I've had issues with everything else except for the 911 maybe I just

got lucky but it seems to me that they're so well made that it differentiates at least the new cars

from I have never had a Toyota but from other American and and European cars yeah but you

gotta realize okay what year is your 991 2013 okay so if you had it for 10 years you've had it

since it was two years old so the risk profile on a two to 10 year old car is very different than

it is on a 15 to 25 year old car so things fail even on a well engineered product just for time

if nothing else right fair fair I also I gravitate towards the M97 motor anyway because

um and I don't know this because I haven't driven them back to back but I hear and it

makes me want it more I hear that it's more like mechanically pure that the intake sound is better

and what do you think about that idea like if you are going to pick between one generation or the

other and you had a high risk tolerance and you didn't mind doing any of the work you needed to

do which would you choose Magnus but he's never had a 997 which is weird by the way let me ask why

is that why is that why is that well you know that was when I was looking for the 997 when I

stumbled into the 991 Turbo s you know it was just for me you know I haven't lusted after a 997

you know unless I just haven't lusted after him you know I've never owned a new car it's not

something that's really high up on my wish list it was ticking a box of owning one of every generation

you know I don't have to own them to experience them that's what I call OPP other people's

Porsches where you get to drive them without necessarily owning them but if it was a choice

between a 996 and a 997 to me I'm taking the 996 just because it's the the beginning of the

water cooled era of Porsche 911s you know it's more historical it's more character it's more soul

it's it's definitive the 997 just came after it's the next one it's the follow-up it's not as

unique it's not going to go down in history I don't care about these things that you're talking

about it's irrelevant to me because it's not the only car that I have 997s don't seem special 996s

fried eggs all day long IMS bearings bring it on it's unique it defined the modern era of Porsche

I'm not a 993 fan you know it's the last era of air cooled you know I own one you know in me

I call the 993 in stock form not that it needs to be stock but it's the Cadillac of 911s it's

he doesn't mean that as a compliment by the way yeah you know it's like the Cadillac of minivans

and get shorty when you know Travolta says to DeVito when they pull up the restaurant and he goes

he's in the minivan and he goes it's the Cadillac of minivans so you know to me in the 993 to some

purists it's the last of the air cooled I don't care you know same with the 996 it was like 20

years ago nobody cared about 996s I will say Hannah you know what I'm gonna say Frank Stefan Walliser

yes who has developed all of those GT cars you love so much the current head of Bentley for

anybody listening he I asked him what he thought about me getting a 964 because I did and I still

kind of think well I don't know I think that I don't think that would be wrong might be a good

what did Frank say Dr. Walliser he essentially said and I'm paraphrasing so don't yell at me for

misquoting but he apparently or he essentially said all of those other air cooled Porsches are

like trash only the 993 is what you want because it handles like a real sports car just to be

clear he didn't say the word trash no he didn't at all but I mean his point his point was he has

he has no need for torsion bars and he likes that multilingual suspension um well Nathan let

let me get your take on the 993 yeah so I have an entry I should have a video out you can you

can find it online it's me my speed yellow 993 next to my speed yellow dot one 996 air kit car

recommend watching that it got a lot of flak and I basically lay out in that video that I probably

drive my 996 20 times for every time I drive my 993 I think the 993 is a is a beautiful car it's a

seminal work for Porsche I used to love it more than I love it now my issue with it is I call it

five degrees right of center it's actually too good to be an air cooled 911 and not good enough to

be a water cooled 911 and so if I could only have one it might be a good choice for someone

but I just find that when the mood strikes to drive a classic Porsche I'm going to grab

one of my 964s or one of my early cars and if I want a little bit more capability but

still raw I'm going to draw my 996 and so I just rarely choose the 993 um it's a the build quality

is much better than my 996 it's a much more valuable car but just which one I feel better

getting out of 996 I hate to say it all right that's a good place to take a break here I want to come

back and um talk about the valuation of these vehicles I think then and now it's going to be

interesting I mean then they were affordable and you won't believe it now um you can't afford one

so you also won't believe how exactly it's unbelievable we'll be right back with Nathan

Merz and Magnus Walker this is hot pursuit support for the show comes from public on public you can

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disclosures available at public.com slash disclosures welcome back this has been I feel

like it's been enlightening but I also don't know if we're convincing Matt every I feel like all of

us are are are trying to convince you Matt you can lead a whole story yeah but you can't make him

drink but let's talk about the values here for a second because one of your big criteria Matt is

something that you can afford which for Porsche used to be a big part of the appeal but that has

really changed I'm curious Nathan specifically where do you see any opportunities to come into

the Porsche family for something with something affordable that might gain value I mean does that

even exist anymore that's a tough question particularly because we decided this topic was

going to be exclusive to the 9-11 so oftentimes I make recommendations outside the 9-11 family

but if we're going to stick to the 9-11 family or topic I certainly think that there's cars that

are going to still have opportunity to gain value and I think there are actually cars I think that

are newly of value because of market demographic shift and so I still believe in my heart that

996 cars are a good value I think that particularly like 996 Turbo and 6 GT3 even though the

affordable per se they're still within a reasonable number for enthusiasts who's committed to the cause

what about the older cars Nathan I mean like my problem is I can if I look at 996 or I look

at 997 you can get a great one for 50 or 60 but if I look at I say okay I want a Carrera 3.2

with a G50 or I want a 964 and in that case I'd be willing to take a cab relay because I feel

like it's stiff enough already we should talk about that also but those are only those are those are

already a hundred thousand like if you want to have a nice driver example or am I wrong

yeah no you're not wrong and that's actually one of the challenges I tell people like Magnus

I'm not a wealthy guy I feel so oh my gosh you have all these cars and I said no I bought them

when they were inexpensive or if I bought them recently I have Magnus and I used the same

accounting method in our brain which is well I may have paid this for the car today but I sold

a car I only paid 20 grand for so essentially I paid 20 grand I know that's bad math but that's

how my brain works whereas a lot of my cars today I wouldn't go out and rebuy that car for its current

market value and that's how I feel for example like a decent quality G53 2 coupe if you call that

100k do in my heart do I think that car delivers a hundred thousand dollars worth of joy and ownership

experience no that kills me to say it but I don't think so I mean for that scenario here's what I

would do you got a hundred grand to spend and I'm going to be the the Mustang that doesn't follow

the rules here because I know we're talking about 9-11 I mean go buy a 9-6-8 go buy a 9-2-8 you know

there's plenty of value there outside of the 9-11 world I mean for me I've actually never

owned a 3-2 Carrera it's another G-Buddy car that I've never owned you know I've driven a lot of

G-Buddy cars you know G-Buddy cars came out in 74 and they went all the way up to 89 when the 9-6-4

replaced it for me the sweet spot really is a 3-liter SC over a 3-2 Carrera and I also don't

buy into this 3-2 Carrera it's got to have a G-50 transmission I really really like the 9-15

so my brother says too have I mentioned my brother-in-law he likes it he likes it what I do

he sounds like the smart one I think these people are getting hung up on G-53 2s that are

same people that are worried about IMS but you're right he has he has uh 19 I think it's a 1982

3-liter SC yeah and he I mean he loves it he loves it right we're talking about Luis we're

on some text to it yes hello hello he's he's a smart one to me the 3-liter SC which debuted in

78 you know it's the same case as a 3-liter turbo you know they just seem more throttle responsive

they seem a little snappier you know I'm just more in connect a little rower you know but these are

the cars that were affordable that were you know I guess it's irrelevant to say they're all affordable

back then but it comes back to this does a 3-2 Carrera with its irrelevant and painful painful

when you say how grams worth of value no not from a driving experience at all I have to say a 9

928 or a 968 or whatever to me that doesn't work because I want the engine to be behind me

so and I know Nathan I've seen some videos where where you say um like look at a Cayman

or a Boxster which makes more sense to me because then you have the mid-engine feel

and it makes sense but I still want to be able to put my kids in the back so that's just also

like my my only option really is is a 911 I think um I think I I think I would would prefer to

go with something that I'm not going to have to work on too much that I know you're I know

it's an old car but I feel like mechanical simplicity is is is probably a really important

part of the decision and I guess in that case the older G body cars make more sense than maybe a

964 right I mean to me they represent a better event are you I'm with Magnus I'm a 915 fan so

my only pivot and I own SC's as well I've got an video you can watch about the SC but

I like the 8040 8632 because what they do offer is they're still 915 a little bit lighter they

sell at a discount versus the G50 cars but you get the Motronic motor which Magnus is blessed

he's in LA I'm blessed I'm in Seattle we have great independent forces support but for large

swaths of the country they don't have great support and so CIS is a really good robust fuel

injection system but it's mechanical and so you still have to have you know an old guy with

knurled hands and probably has a German accent to work on it we should talk about convertibles

for a second because Matt I feel like sometimes Matt goes he'll like send me pictures of you

know speedster america type 911's and I know there's something in you that really wants a

convertible Matt well I also know the like let's hear about the value proposition of a convertible

versus a coupe and just just get a soft window toggle that's a real flex 67 soft window toggle

912 and does that even work in seattle I mean Magnus always tells me uh well Magnus obviously

um ridicules convertibles and my brother also says no get a coupe and I know that would be

we gotta get your brother on the podcast I know that would be a purist idea but you know what my

when I the Porsche in my neighborhood when I was growing up there was a doctor who had a convertible

Carrera 3 2 with the whale tail I don't necessarily need that part but I wouldn't be wrong you know

it's a mystic pizza it's a mystic pizza part it's in my head and also like I would be using this

car as a weekend car right driving it around with the kids in the back for ice cream like the top

down is fun and I and they're more affordable right Nathan yeah I mean the cabriolet I mean

essentially because people a little bit like Magnus and I we shun the convertible as an

impure expression of form that was not really fair it's still a wonderful car and as a result

the values are absolutely I mean it depends on the generation but for example you know

in a 3 2 generation the cabriolet itself are literally half the price of a similar quality

coupe there so it is a little bit compelling and even me who um although I will tell you Matt like

even me like I own these cars every so often I get the handkerchief I'll like I'll go you know

off the plotted chart and then I drive one and I think it's a good car it just isn't the car

I'm seeing Matt Miller in a in a like 86 red slant nose convertible yes you know taking the

kids to get ice cream this is your best life red slant nose 930 convertible no slant nose for me

remember I need those gun rails dude I need the that's why I like the America Roadster to me that

would be really great America Roadster I just like it because it's got the wider rear end and you

know the springs very bad boys um Nathan I wanted to ask about uh Columbia Valley luxury cars and

this is your your dealership right your shop and because I wonder how you would recommend somebody

and maybe not specifically about your shop but how would you recommend to somebody to go about buying

finding and buying a 911 like should I be on bring a trailer all day should I go on car gurus

should I find someone like you that because I don't know how much inventory you have it seems

to me like you walk people through it you find them a car and then and also who do you know how

how do you know who to trust yeah I think it's a good because there are a lot of shady people out

there oh those are those are million dollar questions and I try to help people with this all

the time to the best of my ability I do have a consulting model so people would call in and

you know buy my time and help me oh help them walk them through the market but yeah unfortunately the

market is very frustrating it used to be it was just sort of a you knew people and it was an

enthusiast network and you bought cars because you both shared the love and the passion and

you know cars really didn't have significant value so it was just fun and easy and now because

the cars are sort of a hot commodity in the car market and even take bring a trailer as an example

something like 30 somewhat percent of their cars on that platform Porsche well clearly Porsche isn't

30 percent of the collector car market but you would think it is it just happens to be the hottest

zip code in the Porsche or in the car real estate right now and so when that happens you get a lot

of you know so-called experts you know whether they want to be influencers or whether they're

trying to sell you something you know trying to tell people what they should or shouldn't do or

which cars are good and I always tell people first and foremost buy what you love you know it's

extravagance no matter what you spend it's an extravagance to have a car that's not as functional

as a modern car so when you walk out to your garage or to your car you should you should have a little

tickle like you're 10 years old and it's Christmas morning if you don't have that sense you probably

bought the wrong car I think you should also you know go into it with the thought of what your use

case is going to be and everyone's use case is different and I don't judge you know there's a

lot of judgment in the Porsche world you know some some people love to race their cars some people

like to work on their cars some people like to show their cars some of them like to never use them

and just have them in their garage and all those use cases are just fine with me but understand

what your use case is going to be so in your case you have this vision I want to take my kids out of

my car that's a different use case than you know I don't have kids at home anymore so that's not my

use case and so there's that in terms of who to trust very very few people you know in this world

sadly that kind of kills me to say that but I also think in some ways it's somewhat unfair I've

actually recently had to go to a disclaimer on bring a trailer where I basically tell people

hey yes I'm well known in the Porsche space yes I operate from a place of integrity

but I'm still selling a 40 year old or 20 year old or whatever German car that is going to break

you know is going to you know like Magnus is saying he's got a flat tire somewhere and the car has

got to be flat bedded that's kind of part of the experience and so it's a long-winded answer and I

don't know if I gave you good information no you did it's very sensible honestly I mean look

there's just no easy answer I didn't expect you to say like oh go to P car market and then you'll be

fine you know or I guess obviously if I'm willing to pay for your time you're going to help me to

the best of your ability or I mean Magnus what do you do it seems like you you just have cars

fall into your lap all the time I'm the complete opposite I'm the guy that's owned a lot of vehicles

you know I take a leap of faith how bad can it be I've only once ever did I get a PPI done on a car

that happened to be a 1975 right-hand drive 930 turbo that was in Australia so you know

you had it Borsko seemed like you know it's on the other side of the world maybe I should have

someone look at it before I blindly just say yeah I'll buy it because generally that's how I jump

into things it's a very emotional connection that starts with the thrill of the chase that's it

it's raw emotion it's waking up at three in the morning just obsessing over it have to have it

and then once I've decided it's then you know work the deal and then as quickly as I can get the

seller paid before he changes his mind with seller remorse I'm wiring him the money that same day

and you know it's a lesson in patients time kills the deal I've acquired a lot of rare cars

a 64 9 11 was the deal I put together over six nine months Porsche only made 232 of those so

I take a leap of faith I just dive in I don't ask anyone's opinions I'm not I don't spend any time

on the internet looking up videos I've kind of stopped making my own videos it's irrelevant to me

I don't need no distraction no one else's negative frequency or opinion it's irrelevant

and I've always been that way I just if it if it makes my heart sort of miss a beat and I'm that

10 year old kid that wrote the letter to Porsche and this is a familiar story Porsche's always making

this same promotional video with the 10 year old kid at school and watches the 9 11 go buy and

gets on his bicycle and goes down on the dealership and meets the dealer and the dealer gives him a

business card and I'll be back in 20 years scenario Porsche's been making that commercial

for a long long time because it's reality these dreams start at an early age everyone falls in

love with a car at an early age so for me it's purely emotional well you know I'm not looking

at spreadsheets and getting opinions and figuring stuff out but you also do your research obviously

you're not you I used to I don't think I do anymore because you now have life experience

it's like I did zero research when I bought the 991 turbo s it was zero it wasn't even on my radar

it wasn't even something I wanted the cars are big and bulkier and you know you're parking an

early car next to it and it was just maybe I'm getting old and I think that could be the case

dude yeah I'm pushing 60 I'm okay with it I have spreadsheets and I've got like two different chat

GPT accounts that you're very analytical I'm the complete I've seen all of your videos Magnus

and I'm watching all of Nathan's now so I still do I for me watching the videos is a part of the

whole experience like that's that's part of what I want to be doing I want to be spending an hour

a day on bring a trailer double checking P car market and and looking at elfer spot and all this

stuff but um listen I really appreciate your time and I probably will just call up Columbia Valley

luxury cars and have them help me out because why don't you go buy one and drive it down to LA

just go buy a nine nine scope go buy a nine nine six and be done with it because all of these

talking about it you could be driving it this weekend all right well I I will I will try and

you know uh I will try nine six try and and and and do it and do it soon and I'll do it uh

um with with you guys because you're people that I actually let me just say before we wrap

but I know we're going to wrap but we're we're telling you to buy a nine nine six but we're

also all telling you don't listen to anybody else yeah and everyone definitely not going to buy

a nine nine six and and Magnus have said don't listen to anyone don't even listen to us yeah

don't listen it's gotta make you happy I think if I'm going to spend a hundred grand because I really

do want to see those gun rails I really do want like a the original body shape I'm gonna have to

do it with someone like Nathan who I feel like I can trust we can trust him or uh hopefully one

falls into Magnus's lap and he passes it on to me but dude I really appreciate your time Nathan thank

you so much uh for joining us Magnus you as well and Hannah it's always well yeah to spend the time

with you it's been emotional thank you thank you so much thank you very much I just want to give a

shout out to Dennis because he actually messaged me last night and was saying uh he listened to

podcast on his drive home and he wrote in earlier about his nine nine seven point two manual c4s

purchased last year it's his forever car oh he loves it yeah and uh he he he linked to one of

Nathan's videos so I was even better this is like wow small world he got that last night

serendipity yeah totally the universe um we don't uh I guess we could wrap this up completely but

yes you're in Vegas and you're headed back and do you have anything cool coming up so I I left

Vegas last night actually I was at this my first CES um ever which was how hellish was it it wasn't

as bad as everyone said honestly it it honestly because it was shiny and new it was not bad I

really just focused on car stuff I know you can walk the floor and see endless robots for everything

but um beetles it wasn't that bad what is a veto vertical takeoff and landing you I don't okay so

there's that I also learned a new term fud do you know what fud means that's a Trumpy thing right

I don't know if it's Trumpy um someone in a meeting I was in what kept saying it so I had to look it up

it means uncertainty and doubt anyway um it was really interesting and coming up let's see

oh you know what next week I'm gonna be in New York sweet yeah so I'll see you live and in person

we have our annual edit meeting where we plan on as much as I can you know that I'll be here

most of the week but I'm going to Motor City on Thursday oh Detroit oh oh for Ford I'm gonna

hang out with you Barley oh that's great that's really great and uh I'm gonna hang out with Max

Frisch Dappen from uh Red Bull yes I will be interviewing Ford F1 announcement yes I will

be interviewing those dudes but you know what I'm most excited about most of all what Dax Shepard

is gonna be there oh Magnus have you seen hit and run have you seen the movie hit and run no we've

got to put it on the list I think dude it is such a good movie Dax wrote and directed it

Kristen Bell stars in it with him and it's a car dude and do that movie like he has his old Lincoln

Continental which is actually his uh he has um uh a Cadillac uh CTSV wagon with a stick that Bradley

Cooper drives Bradley Cooper and oh boy this is the link you the clip you sent me a clip from it

um there's a Corvette in it there's like a Pontiac Solstice this is what we're watching tonight

it's so good so so good I highly recommend it so I'm hoping that I can convince Dax Shepard to

join us on this podcast please do that does it for this week show remember to follow and subscribe

to the Hot Pursuit podcast on Apple Spotify and anywhere else you listen you can also send us

your comments and we do read them and really appreciate the comments and the pictures and

the links to things you've seen also shout out to my sister who sent us a link with some very cool

vintage uh car clothing email us at hot pursuit at bloomberg.net check out Hannah's columns as

well and stories on bloomberg.com and on the bloomberg business app go there for car reviews

events and stories that you won't find anywhere else find it at bloomberg.com

slash pursuits slash autos I'm Matt and I'm Hannah Elliott we'll be back in your podcast feed again

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The All Porsche Episode: Our Favorites, Best Buys and More

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