01:03
It's time to save. The Firestone Black Friday and Cyber Monday sale is on. Get 15% off all tires
01:10
and $40 off a lifetime will alignment when you buy two or more eligible tires. Visit
01:14
FirestoneCompleteAutoCare.com for details and more deals. With Venmo Stash, a tag on one hand
01:20
and ordering a ride in the other means you're stacking cash back. With Venmo Stash, get up to
01:24
5% cash back when you pick a bundle of your favorite brands. Earn more cash when you do
01:28
more with Stash. Venmo Stash terms and exclusions apply. Max $100 cash back per month. See terms at
01:32
Venmo.me slash Stash terms. Bob Evans creamy mac and cheese and buttery mashed potatoes are made
01:37
for the moments you can't plan. Like last minute school costumes, glitter explosions, or when little
01:44
Liam brings three friends for dinner. No plan, no problem. Say hello to Plan B.O.B. from Bob Evans.
01:51
Because when you bring out the Bob, you can take comfort in knowing you'll always have something
01:56
delicious on the table, no matter what the day brings. When you need comfort, bring out the Bob.
02:01
Available now in your refrigerated section. It's noon here in Ventnor City in New Jersey
02:06
and our nation's capital, Washington, D.C., and this is Car Edge Live for Friday, November 28th,
02:13
with your hosts, me, Ray in Ventnor, and well, Zach in Washington. How are you today, handsome?
02:21
Doing fantastic. Grateful to be with you here today, Pops, and thank you everyone for tuning in.
02:25
We're grateful for you joining us as well. Today's show is brought to you by CarEdge.com.
02:32
Dad, our Black Friday promotion, it is live. And I don't know about you, man.
02:36
But it seems like the marketing of Black Friday promotions this year is a level I've never seen
02:40
before. I'm getting texted like every 30 minutes by a different brand. So sorry, y'all. I know
02:46
everyone's getting hit with the promos, but the offers are significant. We're offering $300 off
02:51
our car buying service and 30% off Car Edge Pro. Please take a peek back at CarEdge.com.
02:57
Remember, for the car buying service, you can schedule a consultation call with our team to
03:01
see if it's a good fit. And of course, meet the folks on our team who are helping our customers
03:06
save thousands of dollars every single day. You can learn some of their stats, like how long they've
03:11
worked in the auto industry, what types of deals they like to work on, how much they've saved
03:15
cumulatively, how many deals they've done, and see those recent transactions they've helped our
03:19
community members with. All back at CarEdge.com. Now, Dad, the big story I wanted to talk about
03:25
Can I ask you a question first?
03:27
Yeah, of course, Dad.
03:29
Do you know why today is called Black Friday?
03:32
No. Why is it called Black Friday? I have no clue.
03:37
The reason it's called Black Friday is because historically, traditionally, because of sales
03:44
today, this is the day that businesses went into the black when they became profitable. And that
03:53
is why it's called Black Friday. So in honor of Black Friday, because of all the green that's
04:00
going to be spent, I am wearing a green outer shell and a black t-shirt to signify all that
04:09
green is going to turn these retailers profitable for the remainder of the year.
04:15
For those that are interested, we compress here at CarEdge our profit margin
04:20
significantly, like significantly, significantly. We pay people a lot of money to do the concierge
04:25
service. And yeah, when we take $300 off, we make a hell of a lot less profit, but that's okay.
04:33
So are you telling me for us, Black Friday is Red Friday?
04:37
Well, not the red, but a lot less black. Here we go, folks. The big story this morning. This
04:44
is what happens when people stop buying cars. There's a really awesome X account. Also speaking
04:49
of which, sorry, I got to do this right now. My Twitter account got hacked last night. I can no
04:53
longer log into it. I've reached out to X now three times. Each time they say they can't verify
04:58
me. If anyone in our community knows anyone at formerly Twitter X, my email address is
05:05
Zach at CarEdge.com. Please, I'm trying to get my account back. I hope they don't start
05:10
spamming crap. Anyway, all right. But there is a great, great follow over here. The car dealer.
05:17
In this tweet that this guy runs multiple dealerships,
05:20
November has been a blank for the car business. A used car market with prices propped up by
05:27
scarcity from the chip shortage. Then we have at the same time, the consumer stretched in retail
05:33
used car demand is soft. That's good for a heavy dose of margin compression. So you can see here,
05:38
he's talking about what's going on in the used car market, which you and I, every single month,
05:43
we look at the latest and greatest data when it comes to the used car market. And we know used
05:46
vehicle inventory climbs in November as sales and prices edge higher. But the same exact thing
05:51
is going on on the new car side as well. New vehicle inventory rising ahead of holiday sales
05:56
season. And we got the latest and greatest data over on new vehicle sales, expected to be down
06:02
8% year over year. So let's talk about it, dad. What happens when people stop buying cars?
06:08
The car dealer over here on X is saying, quote, that's a, that's good for a heavy dose of margin
06:14
compression. Price has got to go down, right? Profit. We were just talking about being in the
06:17
black profits got a decrease, correct?
06:20
One would think, I don't know any other way to get people to continue to buy cars
06:30
other than make them less expensive. And so there's a couple of ways you can make them less
06:36
expensive. You can build cars that aren't equipped as heavily as what has been built in the past
06:43
and lower the prices that way. You can continue to build the cars that you've been building,
06:49
and you can offer larger incentives as the manufacturer and the dealer recognizing the
06:57
fact that they're not moving as quickly as they had been can then decide to offer larger discounts
07:06
alongside of those increased incentives from the manufacturers to make the prices cheaper.
07:12
So yes, margin compression is a thing and it happens. And we're going to continue to see it
07:21
happen with new car sales being off 8% year over year. It's just that simple inventory.
07:28
This message from this particular dealer is all about used cars. And when you go to use cars,
07:33
there is no manufacturer incentive you can lean on maybe with certified pre-owned,
07:36
but that's the exception, not the rule. There is no other party you can look to,
07:41
to help you get the price down. This is just at the dealership level. Margin compression,
07:45
new cars, obviously there's a couple more dynamics with incentives and things like that, but
07:49
this is the broad based story for this industry. And this is what happens when people stop buying
07:54
cars. The prices have nowhere to go except for down. And we'll do a bunch of live experiments
07:59
on the Car Edge Car Search today and just look at some price histories of used vehicles,
08:03
new vehicles, things like that. But this is going to be the trend for the foreseeable future
08:07
is that prices will have to go down. And it's not just us saying it. That's what I love about
08:11
this message. November has been a blank in the car business. That's not us. That's a guy who
08:17
runs multiple dealerships and you don't have to look that far to find other people saying the
08:20
exact same thing. And dad, you've run dealerships during periods of time where it was a blank. And
08:25
what do you do? You got to get creative to sell cars. During the beginning of the financial crisis,
08:33
the great recession, I started noticing trends and I noticed inventories building up.
08:44
In particular, at that time, it was the TL at the Acura store that my turn and earn system,
08:52
what I was turning was suddenly no longer equaling what I was earning. I was earning
09:00
way more than I was turning, which was an indication to me that A, my sales were down,
09:06
but Acura was still producing at the levels at which sales had been. And so even though I wasn't
09:15
earning as many cars as they were allocating, they were allocating those cars because they
09:21
had too many. And so I noticed that happening. I noticed TLs building up. Obviously, I noticed
09:30
sales declining dramatically. So what do you do? I put up a whiteboard in the showroom by
09:40
the reception desk. I made it real simple. I listed each model, TL, MDX, RL, whatever the
09:50
hell it was at that time. And I said, here's the pricing. It's invoice plus $200 less any factory
10:02
incentives. You pick the car, give us the stock number. We'll give you the invoice. So you can
10:10
see what invoice is. You add $200 to that and then subtract whatever rebates or incentives we have
10:17
from the manufacturer. Now, did my salespeople like that? They hated it because they couldn't
10:24
hold any gross profit. And well, the way salespeople get paid is off a gross profit.
10:28
So the complaint was Ray's taking away our ability to make any commission, any money. And
10:38
I guess to a degree I was, but I wanted to make it as easy as possible for people to pick out a car
10:47
and then show them the invoice and allow them to make the buying decision based on the fact that
10:54
they knew exactly what they were paying. They saw what we paid for the vehicle.
11:00
Now, was that the ultimate cost in the vehicle for us? No, there was holding back in this and that,
11:04
but working on a $200 gross profit per vehicle sold.
11:12
Yeah. Not a lot, but that's what I figured I would do in order to make it easier for the
11:18
customers and to spur interest.
11:22
So for a lot of people that are out there right now, dad, please, if you're in the market to buy
11:27
a car, let us know in the chat what vehicle you're interested in, new or used, and a zip code. And
11:32
we'll go to the CarEdge car search today and we'll spend some time talking about how negotiable your
11:36
market area is, expectations that you should have for that particular vehicle. We also have
11:41
some questions from the community forum that we're going to be addressing on today's show
11:44
as well. But let us know if you're in the market and you're out there, let us know where you are,
11:48
what you're up to, new or used, and a zip code, and we will do our best to provide some insights
11:54
here. But no matter how you slice it, dad, all the data suggests that it is very much that buyer's
11:59
market. We'll start here. All right. We've got a first one from Astrowise. You ready, dad?
12:04
Yes. And may I say one thing first? Even though it is a buyer's market,
12:10
okay, the vehicles, most vehicles are still out of reach for the vast majority of people
12:19
who might like to be able to take advantage of that buyer's market.
12:24
There's still an affordability crisis, but I don't want to talk about the affordability crisis
12:28
today. Today's show, we're focused on the people who are in market and we're going to help them
12:32
out as much as we can. That does not take away from our stance on vehicle affordability. Sound
12:36
good, dad? Yes. All right. That sounds perfect. All right. Here we go. So we're looking for,
12:42
this is for Astrowise. We're in Memphis, Tennessee. The Electris 350RX. Let me get
12:47
that off the screen so we can look. 350RX3. Does Astrowise remember many, many, many, many,
12:56
many, many years ago, a fine men's and ladies' and children's department store called Julius
13:05
Lewis in Memphis, Tennessee, where at one time they had three locations. Just curious if you
13:11
remember the Julius Lewis stores. That was my uncle Julius, by the way. Very cool. We got a
13:18
Memphis connection. All right, dad. So here we are. I'm within a hundred miles of Memphis. We've only
13:24
got 20 Lexus RX. So this is a great first vehicle to start with. And I see some other people asking
13:28
about the Lexus RX hybrid in some other locations. So here's the deal. Lexus is one of those
13:34
manufacturers that does not have a particularly large amount of inventory on the ground. I don't
13:39
even think any of these, we have a single real image of one. No, we only have the stock images.
13:46
And look at the days on market, 21 days, 21 days, 30 days, six days, one day, 55 days, 20 days,
13:52
14 days, one day, 21 days, 47 days, 21 days. Dad, if you're in the market, so you're Astroworld.
13:59
And you're looking for this particular vehicle.
14:02
What are you thinking when you walk into a dealership? Because this is one of those vehicles
14:06
that people have not stopped buying. This is one of those vehicles that is in
14:10
high demand and low supply.
14:12
I am thinking, if I'm looking at one of those vehicles, that I hope that the dealer hasn't
14:20
added mandatory dealer installed accessories already, and that they haven't added a market
14:27
adjustment. Because A, I'm going to fight them on the market adjustment. And B, I'm not going to
14:33
want to pay for things that I didn't ask to have installed on the car. Now, knowing that there are
14:40
only 20 of these in a hundred mile radius of Memphis does not give me, as the customer,
14:49
a tremendous amount of leverage. We could almost say zero leverage.
14:54
So you're pretty much begging and hoping that they won't try to take advantage of you like many
15:02
Yeah. And I agree with this. Discounts are going to be very regional. That's one of the nice
15:06
things about having the target discount back on the CarEdge website. You can shoot for that
15:10
in your particular area. All right. Let's do another one here, Dad. Let me come back up.
15:14
Let's see here. This is from G Money. Love that. 2025 Tucson, Hyundai Tucson Hybrid Limited.
15:21
We're in 32817. All right. Give me a second. It's 32. Whoops. Yeah.
15:30
817. Okay. And what are we looking for again, Dad?
15:35
2025 Tucson Hybrid.
15:39
Hyundai Tucson. Okay. So this is so fascinating already. And I haven't done just 2025s yet.
15:47
I'll do that in a second. But there's 2,261. So just think about this for a second. Are we
15:51
just looked in Memphis?
15:53
Car shopping is so regionalized, brand-specific, model-specific. In Memphis, there were 20 Lexus
16:01
There were within 100 miles. Here we're in Orlando, Florida. There's 2,200 of them.
16:07
What are you saying?
16:09
All right. So now let's go limited. Let's go trim over here. Give me a second. Trim. There's 451
16:15
Limiteds. And now we'll go year. 2025. 2025. Okay. We're down to 99. We're down to 99. Now,
16:27
Dad, this first row that we're looking at right here, 57 days, 111 days, 61 days.
16:34
If you want the best deal, you're looking at the one that's 111 days, right? Or maybe,
16:38
how about I do this? Let me sort by oldest.
16:40
Here we go. Here's one that's been on the lot for 306 days, 286 days, 281 days. What are you
16:46
thinking about some of these, Pops?
16:48
Those that have been sitting the longest should be able to garner you the biggest discount.
16:58
And it indicates to me, if there were 451 or whatever that number was,
17:05
And then when you took out 2026s, it came down to 99.
17:10
So that would indicate to me that there's plenty of 2026 inventory on hand,
17:15
and the dealers would be even more motivated to rid themselves of the remaining 2025s.
17:24
They don't want to get stuck with 2025s on the lot as the 2026s continue to come in.
17:30
So I would think the fact that you're looking at a 2025, when there's way more 2026s available,
17:39
that the dealers would be more motivated to move one of those 2025s
17:44
than they would to move one of the 2026s.
17:48
And this is one of the nice things that there's 0% financing right now. Yes, for 36 months,
17:52
but still 0% financing offer on top of the fact that you're probably going to get this
17:56
at or below invoice price.
17:58
I think this is a perfect example of this is a great vehicle to be targeting for a deal.
18:02
This is kind of unlike the first one we looked at, the Lexus RX,
18:06
a prior model year, Hyundai Tucson.
18:09
That's a great one.
18:10
That's one where you're going to have a lot of leverage.
18:11
Yeah, I would think between dealer discount and manufacturer incentives,
18:18
you're probably looking at probably close to 10% off of MSRP.
18:24
I think somewhere between 8% and 10% for sure.
18:26
Now, dad, this isn't another part of the world, but we've got a community member,
18:30
Anissa, excuse me, Hyundai Tucson Hybrid Limited 2025,
18:33
new or slightly used if I can get a deal, San Jose, California.
18:35
So let's now put ourselves in Anissa's shoes.
18:38
Are you going new or are you going used, dad?
18:40
We've had this conversation a bunch recently.
18:42
I've got my opinion. What do you think?
18:43
Well, it depends on if there is a significant
18:47
price difference between the slightly used and the brand new.
18:52
Which we know is...
18:54
Which we know there typically hasn't been.
18:58
And we know that Hyundai is doing a great job of maintaining their momentum
19:07
by increasing many of their incentives.
19:11
So we know that they're playing the long game.
19:14
They want to keep building that momentum,
19:18
and they have stepped up their incentive game in order to do that.
19:21
So if you know that you can get somewhere between 8% and 10% off
19:26
on a brand new one off of MSRP,
19:30
and you can take advantage of some specialized financing,
19:34
then it would seem to me new would be the way to go.
19:37
That's the dynamic in today's market, especially with a brand like Hyundai,
19:40
which is offering the 0% financing on not only
19:44
internal combustion engine powertrains, but also hybrid,
19:46
and not just 2025s, also 26s.
19:48
Hyundai is probably the most aggressive right now with Black Friday deals,
19:52
as well as end of year deals.
19:53
And I don't even think it's a question,
19:54
because you're not getting 0% financing on a used car.
19:57
You're not getting anywhere close to that.
19:59
And then obviously the warranty piece you touched on.
20:02
So I definitely think it's a total 180 from the traditional approach,
20:06
which is you want a better value, you go used.
20:09
If you want a better value, you go new.
20:12
Dad, let's do a couple more here.
20:14
Actually, we've got an interesting question here from Chrome user Pops.
20:17
Why did my leased car that I turned in three months ago
20:20
still have me listed as the registered owner?
20:25
Well, did you turn in the license plates and the registration to the vehicle,
20:31
to your motor vehicle agency?
20:34
Because typically that's your responsibility,
20:37
is to return the plates and the registration to motor vehicle.
20:41
And if you don't do that, then well,
20:43
motor vehicle doesn't necessarily know that, well, you're not the owner anymore.
20:49
And then I would also check and make sure with the dealership where you turned it into,
20:56
that you want to ask them for a receipt showing that it was turned in.
21:01
And you want to make sure that the leasing company has indicated that the lease is done.
21:09
And once you've done all that, then you can take all that information to motor vehicle,
21:15
along with your license plate for that vehicle.
21:18
And that way that should clear up the situation.
21:21
The day you need to use your insurance is rarely a good one.
21:24
It's when the ceiling leaks or a storm takes out your roof and your plans.
21:28
Cincinnati Insurance understands for 75 years,
21:31
they've shown up with expertise and personal attention that make bad days better.
21:35
From protecting your home to ensuring your most valuable possessions,
21:39
they're there when it matters most.
21:40
Because when the unexpected happens, you deserve support.
21:43
You deserve the Cincinnati Insurance Companies.
21:46
Let us make your bad day better.
21:48
Find an independent agent at cinfin.com.
21:53
They're the only part of your vehicle that touches the road.
21:56
Tread confidently with new tires from Tire Rack.
21:59
Whether you're looking for expert recommendations or know exactly what you want,
22:03
Tire Rack makes it easy, fast, free shipping,
22:06
free road hazard protection, and convenient installation options.
22:10
Go to TireRack.com to see tire test results, tire ratings, and consumer reviews.
22:15
And be sure to check out all the special offers.
22:19
The way tire buying should be.
22:22
Struggling to fall asleep?
22:23
Meet the Ergo Pro Smart Base from Tempur-Pedic.
22:25
Its gentle massage and relaxing sounds help calm your mind every night.
22:28
During the Tempur-Pedic Black Friday event,
22:29
save up to $500 on select adjustable mattress sets
22:32
and $50 off select pillow sets at Tempur-Pedic.com.
22:35
Select adjustable mattress sets only.
22:36
Lesser savings may apply.
22:37
If you are a fighter, Medela is your reward.
22:43
And every last drop of this rich, golden Medela is yours.
22:46
So raise it up high because you've earned it.
22:48
Medela, the mark of a fighter.
22:50
We are imported by Garland Ports, Chicago, Illinois.
22:52
Love putting pops on the spot to help people out.
22:54
Now let's do one more here.
22:56
We've got from AAXVMY.
22:59
I need a 2019 to 2022 Honda CRV, less than 60,000 miles,
23:05
Charlotte and Charleston area.
23:06
So I've pulled up here, Charleston, South Carolina,
23:10
or I guess Charlotte, North Carolina, whatever.
23:11
We're going to stick with Charleston
23:12
because I've already got it pulled up.
23:14
And we want a 2019 to 2022.
23:18
Honda CRV, less than 60,000 miles.
23:21
Less than 60,000 miles.
23:24
Give me a second here.
23:25
And year was 2019 to 2022?
23:30
Not good memory, but decent memory.
23:33
And mileage was under 60.
23:38
We are down to 73 matches.
23:40
So let's look at this, dad.
23:42
And then I want you to put your used car manager hat on here.
23:45
And why don't we sort this?
23:47
Is there a particular sort you want to look at?
23:51
All right, we'll do oldest.
23:52
We'll see the ones that have been sitting around the longest.
23:55
355 days at a Mazda dealership.
23:57
Get rid of the doggone thing.
23:59
All right, that seems absurd, but we'll do this row right here.
24:06
224 days on the market.
24:09
Let's go over here.
24:10
Actually, I like this one.
24:11
I got a good feeling about this one.
24:13
What I'm interested in seeing 2020 Honda CRV touring.
24:17
I'm interested in seeing the price history.
24:20
Yeah, that was kind of what I was expecting to see a little bit of a down
24:23
into the right trend going on here.
24:25
I'd be interested in seeing the original MSRP.
24:29
I can help you out with that.
24:30
I can click to view the window sticker.
24:38
And so this was a 2020.
24:40
This was a 2020 and it's got, wait for it, 55,000 miles on it.
24:46
And what are they asking for it?
24:49
Dealers asking 24,420.
24:52
So it's $13,000 less today than when it was brand new.
25:01
Doesn't seem to me as if it's depreciated enough, but having said that,
25:08
based on all the information we understand,
25:13
these things aren't depreciating as much as they had in the past,
25:18
especially a relatively low mileage five-year-old car.
25:22
And that is a low mileage five-year-old car because it only has 55,000 miles.
25:28
And an average mileage would be about 75,000 miles.
25:33
So the mileage is below normal.
25:37
The price seems a tad bit high to me,
25:41
but that doesn't mean you can't take a shot and try and get it for less.
25:47
Can we talk for a second about that price history, Dad?
25:49
Sorry to cut you off, but I mean, I'm coming down here to the price history.
25:51
They've already come down, but they haven't come down much.
25:53
I mean, 1,500 bucks since July.
25:55
Like there's margin built into the selling price, correct?
25:59
Well, there was, there's 1,500 hours less margin in that selling price today
26:05
than there was in July.
26:08
How much lower can they go?
26:10
A car dealer guy said, hey, margins are being compressed
26:16
just because they bought this car in July
26:20
and they own it for too much based on today's market
26:26
doesn't mean that they can still get what they're asking for.
26:29
It's simply because, well, we own it for X.
26:32
Well, you bought it for too much.
26:34
Well, let me put you on the spot.
26:35
What are you offering for this vehicle?
26:37
Again, they're asking $24,420.
26:40
What are you going to offer on this, Dad?
26:42
I would say somewhere between 22 and 22.7, somewhere around there.
26:50
What's the worst they can say?
26:55
You can see the algorithm we have.
26:57
The target price range is at 22,383.
27:00
My dad, a little more aggressive than that.
27:02
I like being a little bit more aggressive than that.
27:05
And a friendly reminder with Car Edge Pro,
27:07
you can use our AI agent to actually reach out to the dealership
27:10
and begin negotiations on your behalf.
27:12
So give that a try.
27:13
We've got the promo running there as well.
27:17
Shall we turn our attention over to the questions
27:19
that have been asked over in the community forum?
27:21
Well, we should, and we shall, and we will, and we are.
27:26
One more question, though.
27:26
How many 2023 or 2024 models are still in the lots?
27:29
Justin on our team was looking at this the other day.
27:31
There's like, I think he said 10% more 2024s on dealer lots today
27:36
than there were 2023s on dealer lots this time last year.
27:39
So there is more aged inventory out there,
27:41
prior model year inventory out there right now
27:43
than there was this time last year.
27:46
For those of you that are unfamiliar, we have a community forum.
27:48
I think it's over 40 or 50,000 people are on the community forum,
27:51
caredge.com slash community.
27:53
And every single week, Space, Mario on our team,
27:56
shares a question and answer thread
27:58
where we're going to go through each week and answer these questions.
28:01
So let's come here, Dad.
28:02
We'll go, excuse me, one by one from Anne first.
28:06
Thoughts on buying a used Toyota 2024 Venza Limited
28:09
that has a safety recall, the 12.3 inch display,
28:12
freezing issue with no software fix in time of purchase.
28:15
The other recall, the rear camera recall has a software fix.
28:18
Should a person buying a used car with a pending safety recall,
28:21
one that does not have a software fix yet, but supposedly is pending.
28:24
I know it's illegal to sell a car with an unresolved recall
28:26
and that used cars are a loophole.
28:28
We love the car, but don't want the hassle of the safety risk.
28:32
Talk about this, Pops.
28:33
Well, it's not necessarily illegal to sell a car with a unresolved recall.
28:42
There are stop sales for some recalls because the issue is so egregious.
28:50
A display freezing, to me, would be pretty egregious
28:54
because there's so many things that are controlled in those displays.
28:59
I would at least try and speak to a factory service representative from Toyota
29:09
to ask when they might anticipate that there is a fix for this problem.
29:16
And if you can get the vehicle with significant enough savings
29:20
and you can utilize the vehicle even though it has this issue,
29:29
if the savings are big enough and the anticipated fix is sooner rather than later,
29:35
then it might make sense to do.
29:40
Haven't we do things in the old days before we had these giant ass displays?
29:45
Let's go here, Dad, from Mario.
29:47
I'd like your guys' opinion on this.
29:49
A 2026 Mercedes GLC 300 factory order, AMG line night package,
29:54
exclusive package, interior wheels, paint, a few other bits of the factory order,
29:58
all in all, MSRP of $64,000.
30:00
With it being a, quote, luxury brand and factory ordered,
30:03
how does a discount of $1,200 sound to you?
30:06
So let's talk a little bit about when do I negotiate a factory order
30:09
and then, Dad, on a vehicle like this.
30:11
Mercedes-Benz brand that we know has a bit of an oversupply of inventory.
30:15
We've got $64,000 MSRP.
30:17
Are you feeling good about $1,200 off?
30:21
You negotiate a factory order the same way you negotiate a vehicle that's on the ground.
30:27
You know, we used to do factory orders at our BMW and MINI stores,
30:32
and discounts could be very sizable, 8%, 10%.
30:37
And the reason for that is because we knew the moment the car came in,
30:41
we were making all the back-end money, all the holdback money,
30:45
all the floor plan assistance money, all of the marketing assistance money.
30:51
So I would think you should be able to get 8% to 10% off on a factory order,
30:59
and they know they're still going to be making quite a bit of money
31:04
because they're turning it so quickly
31:06
that there will be no interest charges on their floor plan for that vehicle.
31:11
So yeah, you negotiate it as if it were actually on the ground now,
31:18
and $1,200 is nowhere near enough.
31:22
Yeah, I completely agree.
31:23
We have, for those of you that are interested, Google search factory order car edge,
31:27
and we've got a guide back on our website, how to factory order a car in 2025.
31:32
And then I will also mention our concierge service works for factory orders as well.
31:37
So for those of you that are interested,
31:38
we can handle the factory order process for you too.
31:41
Dad, let's keep it going here.
31:42
We've got from Chris,
31:44
what on earth is a running fee?
31:47
All right, here we go.
31:49
We've got $8,900 car price.
31:51
I love this because people still sometimes give us a hard time too.
31:54
Dealers write things down on a napkin.
31:57
This is some ripped paper.
31:58
$8,900 is the car price, $300 dealer doc fee, sales tax, plate, title, registration,
32:05
$150 running fee, $35 state inspection fee.
32:09
This is on a 2019 Subaru Ascent, $10,101.25 Thanksgiving discount, $9,900 total with the
32:18
This is the second time this week we've seen a handwritten smiley face and people still
32:21
give us a hard time about four squares and crap like this.
32:25
Dad, what is a running fee?
32:27
What are we looking at here?
32:30
What the hell is a running fee?
32:33
Is that the fee they're charging to run to motor vehicle on your behalf?
32:40
I'm thinking it's on running means you pay extra if it runs.
32:46
Is that the fee you pay to join the neighborhood running club and you're now going to start
32:58
Maybe it's $150 because the dealer was surprised that the damn car runs.
33:04
I think this is a good moment to remind everyone that if a fee is taxable, that means it's
33:09
What I mean here, it's hard to see in this breakdown, that being said, realistically,
33:13
the title and registration fees are not taxable.
33:16
That's coming from the state.
33:18
They're the ones charging.
33:19
The dock fee is taxable.
33:22
That would be the question I'd be asking here is, hey, that $150 running fee, is that a
33:26
taxable fee or is that something the state's charging?
33:29
If it's taxable, then you can negotiate it.
33:31
It's part of the out-the-door price.
33:32
If it's not taxable, it's not negotiable.
33:35
The state's charging you for that and that's what it is.
33:37
Definitely ask for some clarification there, though.
33:40
This is kind of chaotic to see.
33:42
Actually, whoever printed this, that has really good handwriting.
33:47
Very nice printing.
33:49
I would also ask for gravy on my mashed potatoes.
33:54
I'm currently looking for a used car in North Carolina.
33:57
Price for this Honda is $17,000.
33:59
It's not a clean title and reported as a theft, but no accident or damage.
34:02
What's the best price for this car?
34:05
Going to grab this VIN here.
34:07
Let me come back over.
34:08
We had this tab open for the Car Edge.
34:21
I wonder if the car sold.
34:22
I'm starting to think the car sold.
34:27
You know, and it's got a branded title which negatively impacts the value of the vehicle.
34:35
Even though it was only a theft and no damage was reported, the fact that it is not a clean
34:43
title does impact the future value of that vehicle as far as, well, if you were to ever
34:49
go trade it in somewhere for another vehicle.
34:53
So I just Googled the VIN and like this is the page that comes up, which looks super
34:59
Also, this looks like it's at some sort of like copart, almost like auction.
35:04
Could be, you know, where where recovered stolen vehicles get stored until they get
35:13
Yeah, I don't know.
35:14
Just something about this feels like off to me.
35:17
So I think when you don't have a clean title, that's like a big, yeah, big.
35:23
Oh, Mario says he put the details below.
35:29
MMR clean is $21,900, retails at $25,000.
35:33
Want to know what a fair retail value would be with a branded title?
35:36
Yeah, because it's sold at auction for $10,800.
35:40
I mean, what do you think, Pops?
35:43
Igor saying 50% or less in value.
35:48
Yeah, I'm afraid so.
35:49
That's that's the way car people look at it.
35:53
So if it retails at $25,000, it's worth no more than $12,500.
35:56
Yeah, 12 and a half.
35:59
Something like that.
36:01
Don't be buying salvage title vehicles, folks.
36:03
That's our humble advice here from Robert.
36:06
Thank you for that, Mario.
36:06
Thanks for the screenshots.
36:08
I'm looking at getting a new 2026 Subaru Outback Touring XT.
36:11
It looks like all the cars in my area are still in transit.
36:15
I'm wondering how much of a deal you can really expect as it's a redesigned year.
36:18
Inventory is low and basically non-existent at the moment, I guess, where they live.
36:21
But we are at the end of November heading into the holiday season and end of the year.
36:24
They get the real prices showing $100 showing less than $100 over invoice.
36:29
If they are flying off the showroom floor, is that even reasonable?
36:32
Lots of great info in the videos and online.
36:34
So, Deb, highly in demand vehicle where this person is, is it realistic to be shooting for
36:39
invoice price or a couple hundred dollars over invoice price on a brand new vehicle like this?
36:44
You know, typically dealers try to
36:48
try not to be quite as motivated when a brand new redesign comes out.
36:53
Doesn't mean that if a dealer is trying to hit a year-end sales goal and what you're looking for
37:01
will be coming in between now and the end of the year and it would be able to count as a
37:07
sale for this year that they might need.
37:09
It doesn't mean that you can't work a deal.
37:14
It's just going to be a little more difficult.
37:16
But I know that they went up in price quite a bit because it's a completely redesigned model.
37:26
So, I don't know how strong the demand is for those just yet.
37:34
Here's some space in our community, Dad.
37:36
Everyone is getting hot deals on Subaru's even on the ugly 2026 Outback redesign.
37:41
And I want to pull this up from James, who's been with us all day today.
37:44
Dude, I got below invoice on a 2026 and they haven't even started making them yet.
37:47
He's talking about F-150 plus rebates and dealer discounts.
37:50
So, yeah, I do think even though it might feel aggressive because of market conditions,
37:55
there's an opportunity there with the Subaru Outback to be able to still get something
37:59
at or near invoice price.
38:01
Let's keep it moving.
38:02
Pops from Brian here.
38:03
I'm looking to buy an SUV or car.
38:05
Is there a list of vehicles with adaptive suspension?
38:07
I tried googling adaptive suspension, but the list is incomplete.
38:11
Oh, I don't think I have a good answer for this.
38:13
But, well, I know I don't have a good answer for this.
38:18
I don't even know who's offering adaptive suspensions anymore.
38:24
The last ones, every time I saw a vehicle with an adaptive suspension, the only reason I noticed
38:32
is because the suspension had given way and the damn thing was like the ass end of it was real
38:38
low because, well, the suspension wasn't working properly anymore.
38:42
So, yeah, I have no idea.
38:46
Wish we could be more helpful.
38:47
That's something maybe like AI can help with.
38:50
I really don't know.
38:52
I'm currently negotiating with a dealer on a 2021 Toyota RAV4 Hybrid Limited.
38:57
I saw that the car was already being offered at the low end of KDB's fair market value
39:01
on the base price, so I didn't negotiate that.
39:03
And instead, I just pushed for them to remove the add-ons, $2,000 in add-ons.
39:08
Did I do the right thing or could I have asked them to go from $31,888 to $31,000?
39:13
I'm most likely going to buy the car if it clears the PPI.
39:16
But I wanted to learn for next time.
39:17
This is actually, and I see Space here asking for the VIN.
39:20
Unfortunately, we didn't get that.
39:21
But I do think that this is a fantastic question because this is why we preach out the door price.
39:26
Yes, and what I would recommend just for poops and giggles is if that gentleman has the VIN,
39:43
if they have the VIN, put it into the CarMax car offer on our website and find out what CarMax
39:50
would pay you for that vehicle.
39:52
So that'll give you some idea as to what they think the wholesale value of that vehicle is.
39:57
And that would either confirm or reject your theory as to how you're trying to
40:05
approach the pricing of it.
40:07
The fact that there's $2,000 worth of add-ons on a used vehicle is absurd.
40:14
So that's just a tactic for them to raise the asking price.
40:19
That's what allows them to advertise it at what they think is a cheap price
40:23
because they know they're going to add $2,000 worth of stuff.
40:27
So, Dad, I don't see this one the same way as you.
40:29
I don't think going to CarMax has anything to do with this.
40:31
I don't think getting an offer has anything to do with this.
40:34
The question is, if I were to do this all over again, did I negotiate the right thing?
40:38
Selling price versus add-ons.
40:39
You negotiate the out-the-door price.
40:41
That's honestly what Salish did perfectly here.
40:45
They did this perfectly.
40:46
Hey, you get the out-the-door price, out-the-door price, to your point.
40:48
Now, it's $2,000 more than what they had advertised online.
40:52
It doesn't matter where you get the $2,000 off from.
40:54
They can actually keep the $2,000 in add-ons on the vehicle but then reduce the selling price by $2,000.
41:00
This is the follow the...
41:03
It's the magic trick.
41:04
And so for Salish, I just want to be really clear here.
41:08
I think they did great.
41:08
They negotiated probably the easiest thing to negotiate because getting a dealer to go
41:12
down $2,000 on their selling price and then keep the $2,000 add-ons, that's just a little wonky.
41:19
Is it a fairer price?
41:20
That's a different question.
41:21
But did you negotiate the right way?
41:22
I think you negotiated the right way.
41:23
You did a great job.
41:24
Yeah, it felt right.
41:28
Hey, glad you agreed.
41:33
Let's see here from Lori.
41:35
Good morning, guys.
41:36
Do you help with car buying over in California?
41:41
We can help you out wherever you are.
41:44
Dad, let's do a friendly reminder to everyone that we have our Black Friday promo running now
41:50
We're running it all the way through, let's see here, for another three days, 20 hours,
41:55
So take advantage of that back at caredge.com.
41:58
If we can assist you with anything, we'd be thrilled to.
42:01
We'll be back on Monday with more Car Edge Live.
42:03
We've got a video dropping over on the main Car Edge channel tomorrow, a really kind of
42:08
boring but educational video on how to negotiate your year-end car deal.
42:11
Please check that out.
42:13
Hope everyone had a good Thanksgiving yesterday.
42:15
We're going to enjoy a nice weekend.
42:17
We're going to try, that's for damn sure.
42:21
I know I had a lovely Thanksgiving.
42:25
I ate too much turkey, too much stuffing, and too much mashed potatoes, but that's how
42:32
We'll see you on Monday.
42:34
Love you too, handsome.
42:35
Thank you, everybody, for being here.
42:36
Have a great weekend.
42:41
That's the fresh mountain air.
42:44
And that's you in the mountains, able to hear your own thoughts, which are telling you how
42:51
glad you are that you went to visitparkcity.com, because the mountains might just be the place
42:58
you were always meant to be.
43:01
Park City, Utah, for the mountain kind.
43:09
They're the only part of your vehicle that touches the road.
43:12
Tread confidently with new tires from Tire Rack.
43:16
Whether you're looking for expert recommendations or know exactly what you want, Tire Rack makes
43:21
Fast, free shipping, free road hazard protection, and convenient installation options.
43:27
Go to TireRack.com to see tire test results, tire ratings, and consumer reviews.
43:32
And be sure to check out all the special offers.
43:35
TireRack.com, the way tire buying should be.
43:38
Suffering from aches and pains?
43:40
The Tempur-Pedic Adapt mattress eases your pressure points all night, every night.
43:44
Now save up to $500 on select adjustable mattress sets and $50 off select pillow sets at
43:50
Select adjustable mattress sets only.
43:52
Lesser savings may apply.
43:53
If you are a fighter, Medela is your reward.
43:59
And every last drop of this rich, golden Medela is yours.
44:02
So raise it up high, because you've earned it.
44:04
Medela, the mark of a fighter.
44:06
Beer imported by Garland Ports, Chicago, Illinois.
44:08
When your company works with PNC's corporate banking, you'll gain a smart and steady foundation
44:13
to help you carry out all your bold ideas.
44:15
But while your business might not be shaky, you might still experience shakiness in other ways.
44:20
You might be outbid on the perfect summer house.
44:22
Your kid might not attend your alma mater.
44:24
Or your yacht might be jostled by stormy waters.
44:27
No amount of responsible banking can prevent these things.
44:30
Except maybe the yacht, because we tell you boats are generally a bad investment.
44:34
Brilliantly boring since 1865.
44:36
The PNC Financial Services Group, Inc.
44:38
All right deserved.
